We’ve heard stories of Christian entrepreneurs facing the dilemma of having to choose between full-time business and full-time ministry. Not that there should be a tension point because as many entrepreneurs have proven, one can step into one’s purpose and pursue those entrepreneurial dreams while leading others to Christ and creating a far greater impact in the world.
Today, we hear the story of entrepreneurial dreams fulfilled while creating opportunities for people to thrive and engaging them for Kingdom initiatives. Pureflow’s Collin Wenrich and Jared Fulks offer us lessons on building a business, driven by faith and powered by people who are determined to set themselves free from oppressive business practices. Find out how through Pureflow’s lease-to-own motorcycle program in East Africa, hundreds of families have been wheeled out of poverty through financial literacy and living a life enriched by faith.
Key Points From This Episode:
Tweetables:
“When there are multiple believers gathered, we see some powerful things happen.” – Jared Fulks
“We build relationships. We become transparent. We share struggles and challenges.” – Jared Fulks
“The vision is to create opportunities for people to thrive. And the focus is that we finance income-generating assets for people who don't have access to affordable financing.” – Jared Fulks
“The higher the risk, the more intentional the relationships need to be.” – Jared Fulks
“Pureflow is a small little thread of a bigger canvas and a story that's being woven that we get the opportunity to be a part of.” – Jared Fulks
“We want to inspire other people with that same opportunity that God has laid upon our hearts.” – Collin Wenrich
Links Mentioned in Today’s Episode:
The Kingdom Investor Podcast on LinkedIn
About Collin Wenrich
Collin is the founder and CEO of Pureflow, a for-profit, social and spiritual impact company with operations in Uganda. His experience in non-profit leadership and international development with an emphasis on asset financing ignites his passion for job creation and social impact enterprises. Born and raised in California, Collin attended Liberty University and pursued commercial aviation until he was sent on an adventure and mission to Uganda where he started a ministry, and eventually founded Pureflow.
About Jared Fulks
Jared is a partner at Pureflow focusing on US growth and development. Growing up as a pastor’s kid in Columbus, Ohio, Jared went to college to play basketball but after an injury ended up moving to Liberty University in Virginia. Jared held sales and marketing posts in the tech industry in Atlanta but ministry work beckoned and he joined Collin at Pureflow in 2020.
We’ve heard stories of Christian entrepreneurs facing the dilemma of having to choose between full-time business and full-time ministry. Not that there should be a tension point because as many entrepreneurs have proven, one can step into one’s purpose and pursue those entrepreneurial dreams while leading others to Christ and creating a far greater impact in the world.
Today, we hear the story of entrepreneurial dreams fulfilled while creating opportunities for people to thrive and engaging them for Kingdom initiatives. Pureflow’s Collin Wenrich and Jared Fulks offer us lessons on building a business, driven by faith and powered by people who are determined to set themselves free from oppressive business practices. Find out how through Pureflow’s lease-to-own motorcycle program in East Africa, hundreds of families have been wheeled out of poverty through financial literacy and living a life enriched by faith.
Key Points From This Episode:
Tweetables:
“When there are multiple believers gathered, we see some powerful things happen.” – Jared Fulks
“We build relationships. We become transparent. We share struggles and challenges.” – Jared Fulks
“The vision is to create opportunities for people to thrive. And the focus is that we finance income-generating assets for people who don't have access to affordable financing.” – Jared Fulks
“The higher the risk, the more intentional the relationships need to be.” – Jared Fulks
“Pureflow is a small little thread of a bigger canvas and a story that's being woven that we get the opportunity to be a part of.” – Jared Fulks
“We want to inspire other people with that same opportunity that God has laid upon our hearts.” – Collin Wenrich
Links Mentioned in Today’s Episode:
The Kingdom Investor Podcast on LinkedIn
About Collin Wenrich
Collin is the founder and CEO of Pureflow, a for-profit, social and spiritual impact company with operations in Uganda. His experience in non-profit leadership and international development with an emphasis on asset financing ignites his passion for job creation and social impact enterprises. Born and raised in California, Collin attended Liberty University and pursued commercial aviation until he was sent on an adventure and mission to Uganda where he started a ministry, and eventually founded Pureflow.
About Jared Fulks
Jared is a partner at Pureflow focusing on US growth and development. Growing up as a pastor’s kid in Columbus, Ohio, Jared went to college to play basketball but after an injury ended up moving to Liberty University in Virginia. Jared held sales and marketing posts in the tech industry in Atlanta but ministry work beckoned and he joined Collin at Pureflow in 2020.
EPISODE 43
[INTRODUCTION]
ANNOUNCER: Imagine taking your generosity to the next level, impacting more lives, and leaving a godly legacy for generations to come. Get ideas and strategies to do just that when you listen to these personal stories from high-level Kingdom champions.
The Kingdom Investor Podcast showcases business leaders who have moved from success to significance, sharing how they use worldly wealth for kingdom impact. Discover how they grew in generosity, impacted more lives, and built godly legacies. You'll find motivation, inspiration, and practical steps to grow as a Kingdom Investor.
Daniel White (DW): Hello, and welcome to The Kingdom Investor Podcast. I'm your host Daniel White. Today we bring you an incredible story from Collin Wenrich and Jared Fulks. Collin is the founder and CEO of Pureflow. Jared is the development partner at Pureflow. Pureflow is a for-profit, social, and spiritual impact enterprise with operations in six locations in Uganda. They finance income-generating assets for people in East Africa, through your lease-to-own motorcycle program. Members participate in financial literacy training and weekly Bible studies.
If you enjoy this episode, follow us on LinkedIn at The Kingdom Investor Podcast.
And now without further ado, let's jump right into the show.
[INTERVIEW]
DW: Hey, guys, welcome to The Kingdom Investor Podcast today. I've got Collin with me. Collin, do you want to say hi?
Collin Wenrich (CW): How are we doing?
DW: And then I've also got Jared.
Jared Fulks (JF): Hey, Daniel. Yeah, man. Great. Great to be on here with you.
DW: Yeah, I'm excited to dive into Pureflow and what you guys are doing through Pureflow here this year, the background backstory, founder story, and then you know where you guys are, are going to take that. But before we do, do you just want to share maybe a little bit about, Collin, if you want to start just share a little bit about yourself, where you're coming to us from? Give us a little background.
CW: Yeah, absolutely. Thank you, Daniel. Currently, as I sit here, I am in North Carolina. And I have a beautiful wife. We've been married a year and a half and just gave birth to a beautiful baby boy as well. He's 10 weeks old. He just went on his first international adventure. And we're just excited about what God's doing in Uganda and the opportunity that he's presented to work alongside one of my best friends and serve Him in a space that we love so dearly.
DW: Jared, do you want to do the same?
JF: Yeah, man. So my wife, Megan, and I, we live in Atlanta. Just past five years, we've got a newborn coming in and February of 2023, to be our first and Collin and I went to university together at Liberty. We were just acquaintances. And it's pretty cool to see five years later, no contact, God realigned our paths and connected us again, different sides of the world. And it's been a fun last two and a half years growing and learning and just investing in this space.
DW: Yeah, absolutely. Collin, do you mind praying for our listeners before we get started?
CW: Absolutely. Absolutely. Let's pray. Heavenly gracious Father, just thank you so much for this time in this space. And we truly pray, Lord, that You would be honored and you would be glorified. God that your name would ring in the hearts of all who listen to all who inspired Father, we pray for a fresh wave of inspiration, as we see you move at scale across the globe. And just for this opportunity here that we get to see you and hear you at work in Uganda. So again, Father, I just pray that you are glorified. Today and forevermore, in Jesus' name. Amen.
DW: Amen. So I'm, I'm really excited to get into this and to hear the story. And I had David Simms, and Donald Simmons on previously, and they were both talking about how, how critical it is to invest in the developing world, and specifically in Africa, and some of the companies that they're investing in and really how they're leveraging that for Kingdom impact within those businesses. And so it's really cool to see kind of from the other perspective of, of people that are actually running a business in Africa and really impacting lives and changing lives. They're through business and leveraging The power of business. I'm really excited to hear, hear the story. So Collin, would you start us out and share the founder story and how this all came about?
CW: Yeah, absolutely. So if we go all the way back to 20, oh, no, yeah, it was 10 years ago now, so 201. I was in the middle of my studies at university, I was at the I was at Liberty University. And I was studying to be a commercial corporate pilot, so completely irrelevant to where we are here. But I took a semester off. And the Lord took me all the way across the globe to a small little town in Uganda, partnered with an organization actually based out of Gainesville. And there was 14 of us young adults, who had committed for months to serving in the small little town of Rukungiri in Uganda. And honestly, we had no idea what we were signing up for, it was really just a heart call and the Lord really guiding and directing that trip, but it was, it was really no agenda other than be ready to serve. And so we served in all different types of capacities with it in and out of schools, other local organizations, building wells, water tanks, rainwater catch tanks, you name it. But I'll tell you what, when I was there, I fell in love with the culture, the people, it was just a place where my heart was at peace. And at month three, I called my family and I said, hey, you got to better buckle up and get ready, because my life is gonna look dramatically different than what was expected and planned, and that this would be a significant part of my future, knowing that God had routed, invested me to be in this space.
CW: And so if you fast forward, a few more years, I actually moved. So as soon as I graduated at the university, I moved overseas and moved to Uganda. And had built a small partnership organization, a small little not-for-profit NGO, that was working in the southwestern region of Uganda, really focused on connecting and linking different organizations in this space of giving and generosity and reaching out to different communities within the southwestern region. Just being that linkage point of like, Hey, you have assets, and you have resources, you have people that we're we have the same vision here to serve the Lord in this capacity, let's come to the table. And let's, let's successfully reach these objectives together. So very simple concept. And within those two years, we really started to look at the sustainability of this organization and what it looked like because we were fully funded by private donors.
CW: And as soon as we started to touch on that sustainability question, that's where the business kind of started. There wasn't really any business aspect or any creative ideas floating was just like, okay, what's the sustainability of this? What can we, what can we do here, and back in 2017, and July, or June of 2017, Daniel, is really when the idea of Pureflow was birthed. And it happened very, very fast. It was like, alright, we need some sustainable approaches to moving forward and this organization to fund it and feel it so that we can keep pushing in. And that was, um, that question was really presented. And then within about 30 days, my savings account was emptied, and we bought six bikes. And we're like, alright, Lord, let's see if we can give these guys an access, an opportunity to own an asset, minister, then through this opportunity. And let's see if we can pour that interest back into the ministry and keep it fueled.
DW: So what is the significance of motorcycles in the context?
CW: Well, if you've ever been to East Africa, you'll quickly notice as soon as you get off the plane that these little 100-cc motorcycles, some 125, depending on what country you're in, are just zooming everywhere. And you'll see anything you're you could ever imagine, on the back of these motorcycles. You could see bunk beds, you could see goats and chickens, you can see a family of five going to church, you name it. And so really, it's in your face. I mean, it's everywhere. If you need to go anywhere quickly. I mean, you walk outside, you hop right on, you don't need to put your hand on, you just jump on the nearest motorcycle and you go. And so it was one of those things where it's like, okay, it's a part of society, it's all around you. It's always happening. Like, it's just, it just is, it's just being. And then when you stop there and you analyze, there's so many questions that you can ask around the people, around the asset itself, and what it does and its contribution to society. And so once I was really settled, and once I was more aware of what was happening around, I stopped and I started asking questions, and that's where that the question of ownership was brought to light of the fact that these guys, they weren't, they didn't own these motorcycles and they never had, and they paid them off four times. So it was a glaring issue right in front of my face. But it took a little bit of time before it was actually addressed. And that was our prayer that these first six, that we were addressing that issue.
DW: Do they lease those? Or buy them or rent them? Or how does that work?
CW: So in the context, so back in 2017, before as we identified these first six, they were renting them from loan sharks. So a few successful individuals in the town had owned, you know, a handful, sometimes 10 of these motorcycles and would rent them out either on daily or weekly rates for exorbitant rate. And, you know, it was very hard for them, because it was literally motorcycle cash in hand to table that it was hard for them to think of the future or plan because everything was just daily, it was daily thinking. And they didn't have an opportunity to own them. The price at that point to buy a motorcycle was around $1,100. US dollars. So it was just a high turnover on these motorcycles.
DW: Okay, and then so how did you create a business model out of that? That problem that you saw?
CW: Well, Daniel, that was the that was the beautiful, funny part, man is we had a desire to fly. So we jumped off a cliff and we're like, okay, let's, let's build a plane. Now let's keep flying. And so it was really like, okay, here's a huge problem. There's $6,000 in my bank account, let's, we can, we can, we can buy these, we can get six, we can give them an opportunity to own, let's just get them out there. Let's serve them. Let's put it in writing that, like we want to meet with you every week, the priority is, we're going to meet in the living room, we're gonna pray, we're going to open up the Bible, we're going to introduce you to the Gospel. We're going to teach you about Jesus, we're going to teach you about savings and finances. And then we want you to own this thing. And so it was really built in the first three months, that's when like, it started to gain structure because we didn't know how it was going to be received. And we didn't have tracking devices on it. It was like, okay, here's a motorcycle meet me next week. Should we start in Genesis? No, no, no. Let's start in Luke, let's start in John, like, let's start with something that's like chewable right? That we can, we can introduce, and then we're not going to start with investments, we're not going to start on raw, you know, or 401k or anything, we're going to start on like two plus two, right? If we have $2, we had two more dollars, what is that going to be? And how can we plan for our family with that? And so it really just took some time to build out that structure to that.
DW: Wow, that's really incredible. So can you give us a little bit of a progression of what did it look like from the six motorcycles that you started to lease or rent to own, right? So rent to own and what did that look like? And how did that grow?
CW: So, like I said, we started with six, and the program looked very different, it was all-inclusive. So we had an all-inclusive package where we would fix the motorcycles and replace all the spare parts, and it was completely included in their weekly payment. We slightly adjusted since then. But really, there was a small interest that was on that, on that two-year note that we had with them. So as soon as we had enough money with both principal and interest back from the payments, we'd reinvest it, buy another bike. And so as soon as we had enough money in the account, bike number seven was bought. And as soon as we opened it up to the public as well and started sharing the idea more. I mean, we had an influx, I had probably two to 300 different applications within less than a week. I mean, just flooding in with this opportunity to own and so it was, man, there's all this traction that's that's being gained in a small little town. And obviously, the funds are coming in and trickling in slowly because repayments are weekly and we have stick with small interest. So then, after you know, a few friends and few families that came in were like, you know, I'll get a bike? Like, this is awesome. I love this. So, we got bike number eight, and then I got an investment from two more bikes. Grandma came on and was like, come on, honey, like I see your work, and let's go Jesus. So there's bike number 10, 11, 12. And then from there, it was really organic. It was like hey, well, as soon as it comes. Let's pump it back in.
DW: Wow. So at what point does Jared come on to help you?
CW: Oh, Jared came on in a sweet sweet spot. So you know, it was, gosh, about two years in and we had been able to scale quote unquote scale a little bit. We had, we had a good number of bikes and we were able to actually move and start a second location in a different district. So we were able to see that the program was replicable. And that there was still a lot of excitement around it. I had also found my wife to be at that point. So I was really excited to pursue her. And that pursuit led me or brought me back to America for a hot second, and then COVID came. So then I got locked down. And we were building teams, and it just became, there was a lot all at once. And also with the growth that had been had. It was significant. But it was also like, okay, if I'm going to continue this journey, and I also am now thinking about family in the future, I was like, we either need to take this to the next level or also our at this point, I need to give it that to the team and pursue something. Those are the kind of thoughts in my head. And I really wanted to do this with somebody I wanted to, there was excitement. I mean, this is what God put on my heart. And it's something that I was thoroughly passionate about, excited about. But I wanted to share it. So then Mr. Jared comes floating in.
DW: So before we jump in to Jared's story, I wanted to ask a couple of more questions. Collin. So what did what did it look like on maybe like a day-to-day basis, kind of in that two-year window you talked about as, as things were starting to ramp up and growing and meeting with all of these people? And I guess maybe, can you give us a snapshot of what a day in the life would look like?
CW: Oh, yeah, absolutely. So at this point, most of our meetings were on Mondays. So we meet with every single person around the table, we share a meal, we open up Scripture, we pray. And so we had enough guys, and I think we had about 50-something at this point. So we were all meeting in cohorts of like 10 to 12 on Mondays. So most of our Monday's were spent fully around the table in fellowship, sharing meals, talking with these guys. And then Tuesday through Friday was really working specific with the team and engaging them to think and to dream about where this can go and how we can continue to serve new markets, we can continue to serve them in different capacities and think, I mean, really dream too. I mean, we didn't just sit there and be like, you know, alright, what's next. But also it was engaging them in a way of like, Hey, you're, you've got an opportunity here, even through this business, right? The revenues deriving in country, the interest is driving in country, like you are leaders in this capacity to engage your local people in the town and the places that you work, you sleep, you love, and you are going to take this journey with them. And so there's so much opportunity to foster relationships, to be a positive impact, to speak live to encourage. And so a lot of that, too, was also through leadership development. So the way that we would engage as a team, and dream and think and innovate in that space. And I was also working with the Oregonis I had not moved full time I was working with the nonprofit as well. So I was splitting my time back and forth.
DW: Gotcha. Okay. And then just quickly, capture the kind of business model. And because we talked a little bit about ministry, what is the business side of it look like at that point?
CW: Absolutely. So we had very low overhead. We were operating in a space and co-leasing with the organization that I was working with. And so hosting all the fellowships, and the food was very low cost. We had offered to one and a half and one year loan, or our rental loan periods with them. And so, you know, depending on how long they chose, that's the amount of money that they'd be paying broken up into weekly payments that were the same from day one all the way through, there was a small down payment that was required, because they didn't have collateral or usually it didn't really have anything to their name. So we would ask for at that point, a small downpayment, which was equivalent to about eight to 10% of the bike. And so that would help us you know, when when we were able to buy a second biker or a seventh biker, eighth bike, we were able to couple it with that downpayment and then yeah, the interest would be a small amount, they would pay principal and interest every single Monday and we would collect it in a bank account and just wait till we had that number and take a little of those expenses for the chapatis and for the milk tea every Monday and then with that number hit, boom, it was out the door and it was at the supplier's doorstep and we were getting a next bike.
DW: Wow, that's so cool that God just organically created this business, it seems. Yeah. That's really, really fascinating. All right, Jared, your turn?
JF: Love it. Yeah, where do you want me to start at? Because I can pick up where I came in or I can answer more questions directly if you prefer.
DW: Yeah, I think that it would be helpful to understand the size of the market and the opportunity there, and then maybe jump back into the story about, okay, how did it go from, you know, when you started and, and then build it out and maybe talk about where it's going to?
JF: Yeah, so the market, I could try to explain it. But I wouldn't do a justice, just like Collin couldn't do it justice to me until I got on a plane and walked out of the airport and then Tebah and saw Kampala for the first time. That was a day I had, the shock was not, was not really the culture, the shock was the amount of motorcycles. And I probably had, you know, heightened senses to look at the motorcycles' understanding what our business did, but I can't still explain it, clearly. I'll give you a little bit of scope just in Uganda. So there's approximately and this is on some more recent census censuses, which is, again, give or take a few million, but around 50 million people live in Uganda, and it's a size of about the state of Oregon.
JF: So I think listeners can understand that. And we've heard and we've seen that there's roughly around a million people that do this job every day, a million boda boda drivers in Uganda. So it's a very popular job. I don't know if popular is to be perceived in the same way that you and I would perceive something to be popular, but it's happening everywhere. And so big market, and that it's a representation of I think most of the world. Most of the world gets around on two and three wheels, for a lot of reasons. Overpopulation, bad infrastructure, low cost to operate, ease of access into the market. So if you're trying to compare this whole market to like Uber and yellow taxi cabs in New York City, you're on your way towards understanding of, but you're still about, I think, only about 10% of the way there and understanding how big the market is. So that's the market as I would, in layman's terms, describe it to someone listening to this podcast.
JF: So when I came onto the business, or when I got involved in the business in 20, early 2020, we had 80 motorcycles. Since then, we've grown just a few motorcycles, we've now got six locations and almost 2,000 loans out. And so most of that growth took place over the last 20, 22 months. So we had 110 motorcycles at the start of the 2021 year, and then we decided to prayerfully search and find partners that would not only invest capital, but their time and their resources and their networks, in order to see that not only more people would have access to affordable financing of an income generating asset like this motorcycle, but they would also have access to a seat at the table. And the coolest part about I think the scaling of this business that I've been really baffled by is that and it was nonnegotiable, but I'll be honest with you, I get a little pushback up front, probably with Collin, how can we make, how can I make these fellowships more efficient? Okay, everyone looks at the business and says, yeah, when there are 80 people in two locations, there's plenty of room at the table. And there are 1800 people in six locations, how much room really is there at the table?
JF: And that's something that we've been really focused on not compromising. And so that's the coolest part is that there's a seat at the table for all of our, our customers, we call them members, but for all of our members, they have a spot every week, when they make a payment that they can actually have a place and creating a place for people is important to us. Because it was modeled in Jesus's life very clearly. How often would we see him recline at table is what we read in the Bible. And what happens at the table. Probably has happened to you at the table. Daniel, I know it's happened to me. We build relationships, we become transparent. We share struggles and challenges. The Holy Spirit can meet us there. If we ask and when there's multiple believers gathered, we see some powerful things happen. And, there's food, you know, and who doesn't like food? So that's kind of been my synopsis of my experience with a lot of, a lot of things have happened in between 2020 and today, but that's kind of how I how I found Collin and Pureflow in 2020, and how I found the market and, and kind of where we've grown in the market over the last two and a half years.
DW: So with 2000 loans out, and you said over 1800 people, and...
JF: Yeah, just under 2000 loans out. And we've seen, I think we're coming up on the 500 number of people that have moved to ownership. So that's an additional 500 people that we've had the opportunity to serve, since the beginning of the business. And we'll see that number, obviously, if you kind of understand our model, right, if you have a one to two-year loan product that you offer. So customers can pick one, one year, one and a half year or two year, we're going to see a big uptick of that over the next 12 months of more and more people moving to ownership, which is the goal, that's what we want to see happen.
DW: So what does that relationship look like after they have gained ownership of the asset?
JF: Yeah, it's deeply rooted, that's the best way I can describe it. What comes in regards to adding value to that customer, we're still figuring out and we'll take advice from anyone. And we'd love to have that conversation. It's a conversation that we're having. And we've been having for the last 12 months, as we saw that number going to, we saw that number was going to increase in an exponential form. Because we grew 12 months previous and an exponential form, we had to look at what that looks like. What's our opportunity to serve these members and their families on a deeper level, within the focus of our business, so if as you as you talk to David, I'm sure he even probably went into some detail. But David and Don know, from many, many years and decades of experience, there's a lot more opportunity to serve people with affordable financing beyond just one motorcycle.
JF: Right now we see a lot of people come back for a second and third, which makes sense, they they own their first, they doubled their take home income, Daniel, that's a real number, they're doubling how much money they're able to take home every single day, because they're no longer paying for this asset. They're just paying to maintain it, which they're already doing while they were paying off the loan. And so they do some pretty basic things, same things you and I would do - they build things, they invest, they save, and they give. And, yes, we want to come alongside them and maybe help guide that a little bit. But it's instinctual. You know, and so so the future, I think is really exciting, because we're going to figure out how we can add more value to our customers who have developed immense trust in our team, at whatever branch they go to make their payment. Because what other business, I mean, let's think about this for a second.
JF: What other business do you sit down at a table with 104 times before you actually finish the transaction? And so to us, that's just smart business. Yeah, there's a bigger purpose at the table. And we're asking the Holy Spirit to do what only the Holy Spirit can do. We want to be used and we want to be salt and light as we're sitting there. And we want to create spaces. But if we flip it to the business side, if we just want to look and talk P&Ls for a second. It's not a bad business model. And that's what was appealing to me with 80 people was 80 people. Let's just keep serving them, and growing deep, deep relationships with them.
DW: So, maybe tell tell us a little bit about what a day in the life looks like with that, you know where I'm going with this, but around that table? What does that look like? And yeah, let me start there. And then maybe we'll follow that up.
CW: So, obviously, as Jared was saying to you got less a little less than 2,000, six locations very different because from the beginning, we wanted those intentional deep-rooted relationships built at the table. 104 different opportunities to serve, to pray to read to discuss life issues, like again, when structured and utilized well, there's so much growth that can happen. And we also didn't want these groups to grow so large that people didn't have the opportunity to actually speak, share, discuss. So we try and keep them anywhere from like, eight to 12, 14 sometimes. You never know what's happening, right? Somebody could be way out there. They get a ride at 9:50 and they were supposed to be at the office at 10:30. And they take somebody deep into the village. And they can only come back at 12. And so they come in with a different group. It's like, hey, our doors are open. So we want you just to join us when you can.
CW: But you're looking at Monday through Thursday, we have, we have cohorts and groups of guys coming into our office and sitting around the table. And so we've got chapatis flying through the door every single day, we've got gallons of milk tea being poured, and we have discussions that we hope and pray will, will be the seeds that are really harvested for the souls of the guys that we serve. And so it is every single day, there's ministry opportunities, and, and discussions and prayers being had within the walls of our office in six different locations. And we have specific people in roles who are designated and delegated to facilitate in these times, in terms of questions and responding. So it's just a whole different operation at this point, but still centric to the table as it was day one.
DW: Yeah, that's, that's really neat. And then what is the size of the team to operate this business with the six different locations?
JF: Yeah, so it's, it's growing at a similar scale that we're, we're growing as our customer base is growing. So I think we just passed 40. But we're gonna make nine more, I think, eight or nine more hires before the end of the year. So t-minus 10 days, those letters are going out today. So it's yeah, it's a big HR push, as we scale because we want to make sure that we serve people well. And so how we have it structured, Daniel, like, is we have an organizational, we have a branch structure. And then we have a corporate team that Collin and I sit on. And the corporate team really comes underneath the branches, not really over top, but underneath to support the work of all the branches. The branches are not franchised or, you know, operator-led specifically, but they have a branch director that is the leader at that branch. And then there are basically two departments in our business. As you can imagine, there's finance and there's Member Services. And so there's, there's multi-level management there. And so it's really cool, because for someone that joins our team, if they come in as a lead position, or a manager, they come in the corporate, there's a ton of vertical mobility for them within Pureflow. But there's also a lot of horizontal movements that they can, that they can achieve, as we try to find the best seat for them on the bus and, and really set them up to thrive.
JF: We have our vision that says "creating opportunities for people to thrive". And that doesn't just go for the members, I think a lot of times, we can think whether it's a business as mission business, or just a business in general, we think only about the customer. Because the customer drives the bottom line. But the reality is, that's not the end of the story, your people actually drive the bottom line, and your suppliers actually help drive the bottom line and your investors and partners help drive the bottom line. And so we want to look at all people in that ecosystem driving. So that means if Collin's wife is thriving, and he's thriving, then we think it's going to add a lot of value. The same goes for our suppliers if they're thriving, so so all that we said, we're really focused on our team thriving. And part of that is really ensuring that our who, which is our core value, is hired appropriately.
JF: As we have grown pretty fast, I think we had 12 full-time people to start 2022 and now we're over 40. So and with that, we formed a foundation that is led by awesome two leaders, Asante and they spent a lot of time in Uganda, and they have a team on the foundation that encompasses spiritual directors. And so their role is to help us in leading those fellowships because that's one of the things that again, it was not something we could compromise on as we scaled. But it was a responsibility that we could offload to someone else that had a different leader. And so that's how we engage people in the fellowships consistently across all branches. So they're all learning the same thing. They're opening up to the same passage of Scripture, having the same principle being taught, and that's led by our spiritual directors on the foundation side.
DW: So at what point did you guys take outside capital?
JF: So last year 2021, April, and that was right around we had 110 active ones in the portfolio.
DW: Can you tell me how that looks for investors?
JF: Yeah, so it's, it's pretty simple, um, or debt investments, and we want to find again, mission-aligned partners. And, like I said earlier, we want to create opportunities for all people to thrive. So if an investor is interested in investing in a business like this, and they want market rate returns, we want them to thrive. So we're creating that so we can give what we think are pretty, pretty fair, competitive returns to people's private capital or Donor Advised capital into our business, and it goes directly to, to our, you know, to finance assets, and to serve more people, and then we want to operate a very, you know, we want to run an excellent business that produces the profits that over time, we can go without that, or we can keep adding outside capital on the scale if the market continues to demand it.
DW: Gotcha. Okay. So are those short, is that short-term debt? Or?
JF: Yeah, so they're for your notes. So far, we've been raising four-year debt notes from investors, so some of its individuals, some of its impact funds, or foundations, or family funds. We've covered the gamut on that one.
DW: And then can you talk a little bit about the vision for Pureflow and future growth?
JF: Yeah, the vision is to create opportunities for people to thrive. And the focus is that we finance income-generating assets for people ages 18 to 80 who don't have access to affordable financing. So there are no country or continent restrictions on that. There, there really isn't, it's not tied to motorcycles. Like I said, earlier, there's and like, again, David and Don would have probably mentioned, there's a ton of opportunity to provide affordable financing, where you want to specifically do it for assets that we know will help people generate income, the thing, that's part of the challenge, if you're loaning money to something, or someone that doesn't really have a direct way to make an income off of it, it, it's hard, especially when you don't have credit, a credit bureau, and a credit score history of repayments to think that they're going to thrive and repaying that loan, if there's not a way for them to use it to generate income. So that's, that's kind of the framework in which we're trying to create opportunities for people to thrive. It's, I say that it's long enough to pull us it's not wide enough to distract us. So that that core focus is was put in place for a reason.
DW: As far as growth, what do you see happening in the next few years?
JF: Not sure. I'll let Collin answer that because he's not sure either but his answer might be better than mine.
CW: Oh, I mean, it really goes back to to the relationships that are being built, the way that we care. I mean, we enacted a hospitality model, as well, at every single branch and within our team that, you know, people genuinely care about every single person that walks through the door. And like our business, we open the doors we want you to come in, right? It's not because of, you know, a repayment issue or something that you're coming through the door to speak to us, you know, or you've been delinquent for three or four weeks, it's, there's an invitation always to come in to share. Because we care about personal growth, we care about your family's growth, we care about what financial freedom looks like for you and your life and further opportunities for affordable financing, as Jared was saying.
CW: And so, like with that, it really all the questions derived around the relationships that are built and being intentional with what these different assets could look like. And we could throw out, you know, and we have thrown out quite a few and, and weighed them and prayed on them. And some of them just don't make sense. And that's not really the direction that God is leading us. And then there are some presenting themselves, that looked like it might be something that we should pursue further. And I'd say one thing that I'm in, continually encouraged on, especially working with Jared is that prayer is at the forefront. And we are visionaries and we love to dream and we love to, to run and go after these things. But we also are very rooted in the fact that we do want to be led by the Spirit. And we do get the opportunities to pray and encourage each other in prayer and consult our father first before we do move. And I think that's really helped us in the way that we've moved towards solutions with issues that have arisen around growth and scaling, but then also in the way that we're going to move forward and move forward strategically. So that's a whole roundabout to say. Yeah, not quite sure. But very, very mindful and careful that there are things on the forefront that we're pursuing but just not there yet.
DW: And then what would you say are maybe some of the top challenges to scaling?
CW: Oh, man, I would say, people.
JF: People. I would say 100% it's people. And if in our business, I think I'm trying to think of some businesses that that's not the case, but I can't really think of any right now it's top of my head. Daniel, you're smarter than us, man, you pry, you probably know something. And so feel free to chime in. But it's got to be people. Because at the end of the day, it's about serving people well. And whatever our product or services people want product or service that's default-free, they want it on time, and they want it done with care, you get the first two, but not the third one, then they're not going to want to keep coming back, they might come back because they have to, but they don't want to maybe just care for them, but you don't have the first two, then they're not going to give you any more money. And that's just the reality.
JF: So the whole process requires people understanding. You know, care is a people thing, it's human relationships. On the other to, you know, you can systematize them, to some extent, but in our business, it's going to require people. So I think that's the biggest challenge. And and we're working through that, you know, when you have 12 people on your team, you have a, you have an organization run by people when you get 4x that, you have a people organization. And I think that's what Collin and I are really loving about this season and excited about the future, but also challenged as, as leaders and entrepreneurs right now is, is that how do you hire people from, you know, desks, 8000 miles away. First, it requires trust, and it also requires good people.
DW: So what is your process for onboarding employees?
JF: Yeah, I love it, man. It's, it's different than most people. We just had a conversation the other day about the interview process. And you'd be shocked. Daniel, I'll tell you what it is. But you'd be shocked by how many people are alarmed by it. They're shaken up, because it's not normal. So we have a four you have to you have to go through four interviews, before you would get an offer letter. And it starts with a screening call. There's a screening call, after you submit an application and your CV. And then there's four interviews, and Collin or I still participate in the final interview. But then we come together with the team that interviewed and we have a conversation around, really, there's four scores that we give. So we have score values, we have a skills score, we have a character score, and we have a people engagement score.
JF: So only one of the scores has to do with really what most people think the whole interview is going to be about. And that's the skills and experience that you can only get up to five points on that one out of 20. So it's good, if you have it, you know, you could potentially not get a job because you don't have the skills and experience but you're gonna win and be hired at Pureflow, you embody our core values. And you can show us that if you can relate with not only our team, but the people we serve, and engage with them well, and if you can prove that you have character. So trust, honesty and integrity are big things. And so that's kind of the process that we now have, that we've sent probably right and close to 100 people through them. And it's been fun to build that out and see how people respond to admin here. People hindsight, once they get hired, and they're on our team, we love to go back and ask them how the interview process was. And it's, it's not what they expected or anything that had been there before. But they really loved how they felt and how they felt cared for.
DW: Yeah, that's really good. I really liked that. The four key elements that you have there, that covers a lot, then kind of on that same note, what about your members? How do you onboard members? And how do you select the in-process that?
CW: Yeah, I can speak to that. So from the beginning, we've had an application. And so this application has a list of questions. Very simple, right? Like who you are, where you come from your family, and then goes into a little bit deeper sometimes you get surface-level answers but trying to dig at the depth of what this asset can provide a beat for your family. So what are your dreams? You know, your why? Why do you want a motorcycle? Why do you want access to capital to buy a motorcycle? Where do you want to see yourself in five years then there's required signatures from your Boda stage chairperson, which is like your taxi stage. You know, they'll have A leader there will need to sign off on for you, as you know, someone of integrity who hasn't misused, you know, assets or people's trust or anything like that. And then local government usually has like a local chairperson in that region or area or village, and they'll get a signature from them. And then a few stamps just to show that like, hey, you're serious. And you'll go out there and talk to the right people to show us that you'll take that next step. And then what we do, again, which is some say is a little bit crazy on our side is, we'll take that application, we'll read over it, we'll call them and we'll go visit them, and but will not just go visit them, we'll strike well, we'll structure a meeting with them and have them bring their family.
CW: And so we'll do a background check, but we get to meet the family. And that's one of the big things that really sets us apart as well as from day one, like we're, we're showing, and teaching about how big of an opportunity and journey this is that it's no small thing that you're gonna go access capital, and you're gonna, you're gonna move to ownership. But you're also going to have prayer partners and accountability partners along the way. And that's going to be us. But that's also going to be the people that love you and support you the most. And that's really been a huge for us and huge for our members. I mean, there are so often with our different competitors. We hear stories over and over again of how a man has taken a loan, and nobody else in the family knows. And you're wondering why there's, there's no, there's no food on the table, or you wonder why this or that. And it's one of those things where we want it to be transparent. And we wanted these guys to be honest and open, because we know the severity of what it looks like to take a loan. Yeah.
CW: And so from day one, right? When we go and we meet them, we ask them questions, we, we take a general consensus of the area of their surroundings. But what it also does, it gives us a very fresh perspective on ways that we can serve them in the foundation side as well. So our foundation does home visits, and we try and implement projects for the women of the men that we serve, on how we can give them you know, different types of skills and training. And it gives us, we get to go and visit them, we get to ask those questions to learn more about the people and the families that we serve. So that's really the process. And then from there, we get to make the call on who has been serious. And who's made it through the application process, and how many, how many actual motorcycles were able to deploy or launch that month. So we'll match that with the number of people that have made it through the application process and invite them into the journey with us.
DW: Wow, yeah, that's really neat. And it's amazing how you've thought through just any way that you can build relationships with even the community around that person. I really like that. That's really, makes it a community effort.
CW: Yeah. If you don't mind, then I'll share one more thing. I think, if we look at operations, and we look at efficiencies, right how people, yes, they have access to pay with their phone. But that doesn't negate the fact that we want them to join us at the table. Right. So you could say inefficient, but we also say relationships with the background checks, right? We can have, we can make phone calls, which we still do. And we can have all their documentation, they don't have credit scores. But you know, we go to them, sometimes it's far and we'll do a few sometimes it's inefficient, yes. But we care about the relationships that are being built at the family level. And I think with that, too, you know, being intentional, is very, it's just it's very important. And I think I could well there's a lot of things that I could speak about there's other issues but like yes, I just wanted to say I think the intentionality behind the relationship building from day one is like the forefront of what pushes us and how we serve our members.
DW: Yeah, that's that's really amazing and incredible what God is doing through Pureflow and your effort. And just I really, really like how relational you guys are with your members and the whole model even so that's really cool and the table ever getting everybody around the table that's that's really smart. So before we move into the mentor minute and wrap everything up, is there anything else that you guys want to share that would be helpful for our listeners?
JF: Yeah, just to finish off on what you guys are talking about the intentional piece. I want to speak kind of I think broader sense, to different industries. I was just thinking about this, as you guys were talking that, you know, we work in I think a riskier environment when it comes to managing capital and invested capital in our own cash flows and other things, like it's just, it's a riskier business, which is what prohibits a lot of people from going in. It also prohibits a lot of people from going in with a for-profit business model. And I would just say that I think across business in general, whether it's here or there, the higher the risk, the more I think, the more intentional the relationships need to be. So the riskier, it is. And that can be defined in a lot of ways. And if you're, if you're a salesperson, and you're selling, you know, Microsoft software to a large fortune 50 company, there's a lot of risk involved in that relationship, right, because there's a lot of money being transacted. And there's a lot of opportunity if they if they leave, that's a big chunk of your business that you just lost. And so there's, the stakes have been raised. And so what does that person do, they spend a lot of time in person building relationships. Amazon, there's not a ton of risk involved, and then losing my business. So there's not a ton of relationship that needs to be built.
JF: And so I think that there's a direct correlation with that across business in general. And so yeah, we say it's inefficient, but I would say it's highly effective, and what we do. And so I would just encourage people listening in that way, if you're even kind of thinking about taking this step, and I'm grateful that Collin pioneered this, specifically, this business model that I can kind of come behind his wakes and that and be a part of something that I think and have seen change people's lives, and it's changed, changed my life personally, and just reframed my, my thinking around business and in business overseas. But I would just encourage you, like, if it seems risky, doesn't mean you should shy away from it, I think it just means you get more intentional with the relationships that are involved in it, whether that's with your investors, or your customers, or your spouse, can whatever relationships are involved, just get deeper with them.
JF: And on that front, I think our partners have been huge, they've been huge advocates for us. It's amazing. I came from the startup technology space, which is exciting and fun. And we had raised angel investor money, and just being around that, and the VC world. And the stakes are so high. And there's a lot of pressure when it comes to raising capital. And I, I felt that it was going to be the same when we started having conversations and pitching our business. And it's been to my disbelief, a lot of days, so comforting to know that, that there are people that we can see that there's a greater mission unfolding. And there's a greater vision beyond Pureflow, or flow is a small little thread of a bigger canvas and a story that's being woven that we get the opportunity to be a part of. And so it's whether or not we say yes, to step into that. And I don't think that there's a way to do it. And there's, it's really hard to do that without other people without partnership. You can try to kind of write your own story on that bigger canvas. But at the end of the day, I don't think that that's really glorifying the father when he's given us the body to do it with. And so we've seen that and it's been so encouraging for us to drop our guard or it's not this high stakes game, but but reframe our thinking that the stakes are really on people's lives and their souls because that's the only thing that's gonna last a percent back on your debt is good. But at the end of the day, like people knowing Jesus is the thing that matters. And so when we can come to that as the kind of the bedrock of our partnership, man, it gets exciting. I mean, what can happen? We don't know all what could happen.
DW: Yeah, absolutely. That's so true. All right. Mentor minute, who is the most influential person that you know, and how have they impacted you?
CW: Oh, man, Jared, go ahead.
JF: The most influential person, I've got a few people that come to the top of my my mind. This is gonna sound super gimmicky. I actually think that like that Collin has been that to me. I've told my wife this for the last three years. And she's been a huge influence in my life too but and her family and my family. And but like I just said a second ago, Collin did something that most people wouldn't do. And that is he kind of paved the path. Pioneering is not easy. I don't know what's on the other side of the tree you're about to cut down. But he, he and kind of taking leaps of faith and spending years walking under trees and praying and, and meeting and doing the laying the groundwork now created I mean, it literally changed the trajectory of my career. And I think like my wife and I, my family's life and like, getting to know do something that I absolutely love that didn't even know was possible. So I don't know how much influence he has with people, but I'm just kidding. He's got a ton of influence with a lot of people that I don't think he'll ever know. But, but it's been huge in my life over the last three years to know that this is possible in that I get to do this every day for for a living. It's awesome.
DW: That's really good. And just in the members and their families that you've impacted. That's already thousands of people.
JF: Yeah, you talk about influence for the Kingdom. Collin can fly an airplane. I haven't gotten in one with him yet. But he's done some pretty, I think, cool things that you've probably never seen on this side of of eternity. And he’s led a lot of people to know who Jesus is, by the way, he works and serves people and again, just paving a path for people to come behind them.
DW: All right, Collin, your turn.
CW: Man, because then we know he's really just cracking jokes. Well, first, yeah, if your listeners can see me, I look like a honey crisp apple right now with my red face. And dude, that was, I really appreciate it, man. That's, uh, yeah, I mean, I will say first I'll preface it with this, I feel incredibly blessed and thankful to be surrounded by a team, that at the forefront of our conversations, our daily tasks, whatever it is, I mean, we are praying and challenging in church encouraging each other to look more like Jesus. And so to be immersed in a business and an opportunity that has that core-centric focus. I hope I never lose sight of how incredibly amazing that is. I will say, yeah, I could talk about Jared all day. And I'll do that after this call. But um, you know, I would go to actually one of my really, really good friends, Rob, Mr. Robert Morris, he, I went to school with him. And he was a roommate of mine for a little bit, grew up in South Africa. I lived actually in a house while I was at Liberty University with six other guys who grew up on the mission field. And I was this lone ranger who grew up in the Bay Area.
CW: And so I was surrounded by guys who had stories that were just out of this world and had a perspective that was so much broader and just just deeper as well then than I knew or could fathom. And it was a very interesting part. interesting moment of life. When I was I was a senior. So I was finishing up, I'd gone to Uganda came back, I really knew I wanted to move back, but didn't have general clarity on my life. And I was finishing my degree. So I was just back and forth to the airport a few times. And writing my honors thesis, Robert was, I don't think he was taking like one class, and really didn't have a whole lot going on either. And he was applying for jobs. So we could wake up for breakfast at 10 in the morning and just kind of look at each other and be like, alright, God, what's up, like, what are you doing today? What am I doing today, but it was just a fresh space for us to like, encourage one another as well and with with what he was pursuing and what God has taught him and showed him over the previous 21 years of life, he really got to share in an impart with me. And then when I left to go overseas and lived in Uganda, he actually got a job with hope. And they sent him over to Zambia. And he spent time in Zimbabwe he was in Malawi.
CW: And so we got to connect every story, every hurdle, every cultural shock, everything was filtered and run through this guy and, and he was a backbone. I mean, he was the first guy that ever invested any capital in Pureflow back when we were on seven bikes, and he's the guy that came in, visited as soon as we launched and stole 50 sheets of computer paper that were filled out with a five-year vision and said, You know what, dude? I think something I think there's something here. And he was on he was a he was on our board and he's just one of those guys that like has a heart for Jesus and also has the wherewithal and the heart to like know that investing time is one of the most important things and to be just gonna be that rock. So he's been an amazing just an amazing, pivotal, crucial role figure in my life.
DW: Wow. That's incredible. It this has been an incredible interview. And I thank you guys, both of you for coming on and investing your time in this. Is there anything that I can be or our listeners can be praying for you guys about maybe one or two specific things?
JF: Yeah, just to have clarity of the next steps of how we can better serve the people that that God's brought into our business. Yeah, I think it's something common I talk about often is, is that in helping our team. Think around those big questions with us.
DW: Collin, what about you?
CW: Yeah, I mean, I would piggyback off of that. I mean, continuing to build teams and leaders that are just core-centric at the mission of what Pureflow stands for, and what God has laid upon our hearts. And the opportunities to inspire others. I mean, right, if you boil it down, it's a lease to own model, but we've just jam packed it and infused it with gospel centric opportunities. And we said, there's no question like, that's, that's a non negotiable, that's a non negotiable, that's non negotiable. And then we do business on the side. And we want to inspire other people with that same opportunity that God has laid upon our hearts.
DW: I love it. All right, let's pray. God, I thank you and praise you for Collin and Jared and Pureflow, and the team, and, and all the members. God, I thank you for what you're doing there. I pray that you would continue to change lives impact lives, that there would be even more relationships that would be built, and that the relationships that have already been built would grow and flourish and reproduce and make more disciples. God, I pray that Your Word would go out that it would continue to change lives, and that your Holy Spirit would use this environment that they're creating, for exponential growth in in Gospel conversations, leading people to Christ and discipling. God, I thank you and praise you for this episode and all that we've learned about what is going on and what you're doing. We praise You for it, and and pray that we would continue to advance your kingdom here and around the world. In Christ's name, I pray. Amen.
Thank you guys for listening to another episode of The Kingdom Investor. We will catch you next time. Take care.
[END OF INTERVIEW]
[OUTRO]
ANNNOUNCER: What if you could take your generosity to the next level, impacting more lives in your community and around the world, creating a godly legacy for generations to come?
Now you can. Your first step is crafting your kingdom investing thesis. Reserve your spot in our next online workshop where we guide you through the process of discovering your passions, create a strategic plan and connect you to opportunities that will help you fulfill your God-given calling as a kingdom investor. Register today by clicking the link in the show notes.
Thanks for listening. Don't forget to subscribe and we'll see you next time for another episode of The Kingdom Investor Podcast.
[END]