From Dysfunctional Entrance to Stunning Space for $800K

Asking a doorman to watch packages and the front door simultaneously has become unsustainable in today’s package-happy world, but that’s the reality in many buildings. Marilyn Sygrove, president of Sygrove Associates, recounts how one Upper East Side co-op tackled a dysfunctional lobby that was set up so the doorman had to do both — a security nightmare that frustrated everyone. In this episode Sygrove shares her three-step approach to solving design challenges such as this one, breaks down the financial reality of a lobby renovation and provides strategies for financial planning including assessments and payment schedules. Habitat’s Carol Ott conducts the interview. 

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Transcript

Carol Ott (00:39)
Welcome to Problem Solved, a conversation about challenges facing New York co-op and condo board directors. I'm Carol Ott with Habitat Magazine, and I'm joined today by Marilyn Sygrove, president of Sygrove Associates, an interior design firm specializing in the design of public spaces in co-ops and condos. Marilyn, thanks for joining us today.

Marilyn Sygrove (01:01)
Absolutely a pleasure. Thanks for inviting me.

Carol Ott (01:03)
More than a space to walk through, lobbies and hallways make the first impression on anyone walking into a co-op or condo building. If you live in a brand new building, that public space already reflects the values of the apartments. However, if you live in an older building, there may be a disconnect between the two. We're going to talk about how to narrow that disconnect. Marilyn, you worked with an Upper East Side post-war co-op that had a tired lobby and a doorman. The configuration of the space must have been from another era because when the doorman was dealing with packages, he couldn't keep an eye on the front door. Clearly not a good situation and probably very frustrating for both the doorman and residents. When you got there, how did you sort the building out?

Marilyn Sygrove (01:51)
Well, it's a process. First, we have to learn about the building and how it functions and what the expectations are of the door staff. Some door staff needs to be right near the door and help residents from the curb. Others, we have found that they are more almost concierge-like in a way where they are not necessarily near the door, but really close to the package area.

And sometimes it's the combination and this particular lobby

had an either or. this lobby, the doorman was well inside the building. So the doors, the front doors needed to be dealt with in order for convenience for residents, convenience for the door staff to be able to manage and monitor security, as well as, you know, call upstairs and announce guests and also retrieve packages. So it was a little bit of an unusual situation for us.

Carol Ott (02:45)
Is the reason the board contacted you because the lobby didn't look good or because there was a problem with the doorman and the packages and letting people in or a combination of everything?

Marilyn Sygrove (02:57)
Generally, it's a combination of both. They recognize that, if you haven't done your lobby in 25, 30 years, that, the band-aids of, putting in a new piece of furniture doesn't solve all the problems. So that's when they call and say, help, we need to make this a viable modern building that competes with other new construction or other recently renovated buildings.

Carol Ott (03:23)
So let me ask, designing any public space engenders lots of opinions, and it can be one of the most contentious things in a building. Before we talk about this particular project, how do you typically handle that or smooth things out?

Marilyn Sygrove (03:39)
The word I would use is if the board can be as respectful as possible, understanding that everyone does have an opinion. We have, you I've been doing this since 1982 and you listen a lot and in that time you learn what will help the residents get through the project and the board get through the project smoothly.

Surveys are done, whether they're done through us or by the board itself about opinions. when we prepare a survey, we always leave an area for opinions. So it's one thing to ask, what color do you like? It's another thing to ask how much seating she'd you have in the lobby, but to give a space for opinions.

Venting constructive ideas is really welcomed by the community. Secondly, I also do something that is unique, I believe, which is I will do a virtual Meet the Designer night. for one hour, one night, I'm not showing anything, I'm not presenting anything, but I am there to listen. And it's one hour.

People generally just come and look at me, but they, but the fact that the board has given this opportunity for them to speak goes miles, miles and miles and miles. So those are two things that I recommend highly.

Carol Ott (04:59)
And once you get that feedback, you incorporate it? Do you let the residents know that you are listening and have incorporated it? Do you just move on with what actually needs to be done? How is that handled?

Marilyn Sygrove (05:11)
you're asking insider questions. What happens is I find that generally the board is the governing body on the design. And sometimes the design committee, also that there's always a board presence. And I have always found that no matter what a survey says or what I hear, that the board is generally a pretty good representative of the building. And I really haven't found anything that's been so divergent or out there and it's different. And then also to protect myself and the board when I have these meetings and when we do the survey is I always say, I apologize and say, look, I cannot appeal to everyone's individual tastes. We will do our best, but I know. And so this is a heartfelt blanket apology to those of you who are not gonna be 100 % happy. And it seems to be, you know, just being human and saying that goes a long way.

Carol Ott (06:08)
So let's look at this particular building. When you got there, what did you find?

Marilyn Sygrove (06:13)
dear. Poor lighting, doorman facing the wrong direction, a package room that thankfully for them wasn't down the first floor hallway. It was in close proximity, but it was a big room that whenever the door staff went in there, they were lost. as you introduced this, they couldn't see what was going on in the lobby at the same time.

The building also was a 1959 mid-century building that the decor really didn't reflect that. There were dated, you know, 12 by 12 marble tile on the floor, which is pretty indicative of a certain period. And so there was, there was a lot, there were functional issues and there were aesthetic issues. And the mail room was a maze. It was just not comfortable and open and ADA compliant. So there were a bunch of things.

Carol Ott (07:02)
So talk to me about your solution.

Marilyn Sygrove (07:04)
Well, when we are hired, we actually come back with more than one solution. We come back with three, three alternative layouts. And the one that was selected was, and rightly so, was we actually put in electronic sliding doors on the exterior. So that allowed residents and guests and deliveries to come in without getting soaked in the rain.

While waiting for this door person to come around and go outside. The interior door was facing a different direction and the doorman's desk was in a new position where it could actually see the vestibule and oversee the entire lobby at the same time. there was a very kind of funky rounded room that was maybe an old compactor scenario that we discovered we were able to demolish and create relatively shallow package storage space, but adequate for hanging in closets and packages directly behind the doorman. So any of his immediate needs in terms of him retrieving packages was right behind him. We also had an opportunity to put another package area to his side.

I'd say 85 % of the packages, he did not need to go into this cavernous package room. So that was a solution. And then from aesthetic solution, had designed the hallways along with the lobby in this project and the elevator cab. So we offered mid-century modern geometric patterns to the client. So the lobby, which had a beautiful, step down lounge off to the side, we were able to do a very luxurious mid-century inspired area rug and then appropriate furniture as well. And then that pattern also is referenced upstairs in the hallway. So the building is cohesive.

Carol Ott (08:50)
And give me a sense of how long a project like this takes.

Marilyn Sygrove (08:54)
there's two parts of it. There's the date of hire of a design firm, and then there's the actual scope and execution of the project. So I generally say that those two parts are a year to a year and a half. So it's roughly six months of design time.

Then there is bidding procurement and then the actual commencement of the construction, which can be another six to eight months. So it's a process.

Carol Ott (09:24)
And we're not going to identify the building, but give me a sense of cost. I mean, this was a pretty big project.

Marilyn Sygrove (09:31)
Yes, because it had to do with the entry doors, which sometimes can be unusual. Often buildings will keep their entry doors. So the entry doors, the doorman desk, flooring, lighting, wall treatments, the new package, cabinetry, the mailroom, and the first floor hallway wound up being something in the neighborhood of 1,300 square feet.

The whole project was about $600 a square foot. That's including design fees, filing fees, whatever, what all in 100%. So what's the math on that? It was in the close to $800,000 for the whole thing.

Carol Ott (10:10)
And let me just ask for for a building's financial planning. So let's say they want to do a project of this size and it's between 800,000 or a million dollars, but it's going to take a year and a half.

Does a building actually have to have that money in hand? Can they make assessments? Are there payments over that time period?

Marilyn Sygrove (10:30)
From our perspective, they don't have to, you know, in the olden days there was reserve funds and they had the money and that was it. Today I hear the a word a lot more. and there's, you know, tremors when you say the a word. I believe that they do assess for example, a contractor would want 25 % of their cost.

As a down payment. And then there are progress payments along the way for both the contractors, designer, and then of course, any outside professionals that you need. So assessing is certainly something that's done, I hear is done all the time.

Carol Ott (11:03)
For other board directors contemplating this, what would be your three top pieces of advice?

Marilyn Sygrove (11:10)
I really believe engaging the community passively in some way and I gave you two examples. I think is extremely effective and helps a project go very smoothly. I think that communications, regular communications as to what's going on, hey, we just hired a design firm, hey, you know, in the month of June, we're going to break ground or January often is another time of year when it happens. and then also we have weekly meetings where there is constant communication and we say, hey, the residents should know that their doors are gonna be opened or for painting. Communication is very important. And the third, I think the partnership with the property management company and expediting payments, that's another dreaded A word, which is avid. know, the old days of having a bookkeeper in the back room writing checks is gone. And so therefore property managers really need to be on top of that cashflow. So those are the things that I would recommend.

Carol Ott (12:16)
Thank you very much. Those are really important takeaways for other boards. We've been talking today with Marilyn Sygrove, Sygrove Design Associates. Thanks, Marilyn.

Marilyn Sygrove (12:26)
Thanks, Carol.