Ep.44 When Isolation Isn't Optional + Heather Betsayad

When seasons of life confine and isolate us, feeling trapped in our loneliness can be the result. It's great to talk about getting involved or planning a get-together, but what if you literally can't? 

Kimber talks with Heather Betsayad about seasons of forced isolation in her story, including a battle with cancer and challenges of growing her family. Heather shares the perspective these seasons of forced isolation have given her and how she sees God differently because of the loneliness she walked through in those times.

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Transcript

Kimber: 0:09

Hey friends. Welcome to the, your sister Kimber podcast. My name is Kimber Gilbert, and I'm so glad you're here. Now not to make you all flashback to COVID or anything. But today we are talking about the loneliness that can come from seasons of her life. When isolation is forced upon us, my friend, Heather is sharing with us today about her incredible story of how. God worked through several seasons in her life. When circumstances such as cancer in fertility and adoption. Moved her into times of forced isolation. Heather's trials have given her an incredible perspective on loneliness, friendship. And just the Lord and I hope this conversation helps you find new ways. Uh, to grow authentic community in your life and friendships honor God. And Dre closer to TCIs friend. I wish we could talk this out over coffee, but this is the next best thing. I'm so glad you're here. Let's get started. Heather. Hello.

Heather: 1:10

Hey, Ken bear.

Kimber: 1:11

Hey, thanks so much for being here today. I'm excited to chat.

Heather: 1:14

Yeah, absolutely. Yeah.

Kimber: 1:16

that'll be, it'll be good. You were a little bit nervous to come on the podcast. Is that right? Or it's just out of your comfort zone.

Heather: 1:22

Both. Definitely both.

Kimber: 1:24

Well, I thank you so much for, for putting it out there and being willing. I've only gotten to know you for like a short time, but, just the more I've gotten to know you, I've realized that I want to lean into our friendship a little bit more. Cause you seem to have a lot of wisdom to share with us. And so I'm excited that you were willing to come on today. So thank you

Heather: 1:45

That's it. So you thank you. Yes. Yes. I love our women's group. I feel like we get so much wisdom out of that.

Kimber: 1:50

I love it. It's been, especially our conversations lately. I feel like have just been really encouraging and the depth is really, is really just a blessing to me. So, yeah, it's all good. Well, would you just start by introducing yourself for our friends listening? Who may not know you?

Heather: 2:06

Yes, definitely. So I'm Heather. I am. Uh, mama's three kids. I have a six year old and a seven year old and a 13 year old. Um, We live in Alaska. I'm originally from Colorado, but we moved around a bunch and we've been here for now. This is our third winter. So we're going to say three years. Um, So we're getting it. We're getting. They used to it and figuring it out. it's wonderful up here. It's amazing.

Kimber: 2:32

your favorite part of being here? Would you say.

Heather: 2:34

Oh, Um, there's so many things like, I love how everybody's so active. I love that you drive places and you're just literally in awe.

Kimber: 2:43

Yeah, it's so beautiful all the time. Yeah. Do you find yourself ever getting like tired of the view or like you used to it, I guess not tired of it, but used to it or is it still like, oh, is breathtaking for you?

Heather: 2:55

I think. because it changes so

Kimber: 2:57

Yeah, that's a

Heather: 2:58

my kids to school about 20 minutes every day. And just because of the different light and the different seasons that are coming, like I drive over this one bridge every day and I always stop and look at the mountains and the distance. And like some days they're pink and sometimes it's like, just so snowy and beautiful that I'm just always amazed. And recently there's been bald Eagles flying over this spot and I'm just like, ah, You can't get more Alaskan.

Kimber: 3:22

Yes, then when there that's so

Heather: 3:24

Yes. Yes. And then like the moose and the animals. I just, it's really hard for me to choose my favorite thing about it, for sure.

Kimber: 3:31

It is, I am. I'm so thankful that we get to live here, especially having lived. Other places that I guess I would describe as like, quote, not as breathtaking. Um, Like some people might disagree, I guess, but like, you know, I'm really thankful that I get to live in a beautiful place. It, yeah, it's really good for muscle. I think.

Heather: 3:49

Yes. Yes. Completely,

Kimber: 3:51

Well, like I was saying, I am just now getting to know you a bit more. And so, I'm excited to ask this question. I like to kind of sometimes start with just a question to help our listeners kind of get to know a little bit more about you. And so, as I was thinking about one that I wanted to ask, I was like, Ooh, what is something that you think a new friend should know about? You? Like. I'm thinking like something that maybe wouldn't just like casually come up in conversation, but it's actually like a big part of your life. And so you're like, this is like something you should know about me, but it's like awkward to kinda sometimes bring those things up or just like insert them into conversation. But, I've had that kind of situation before where I'm like, people who know me really well don't know, always like. These important things about my life, because it's just like, it never came up. So what's like, if you were going to just tell us one thing like that, um, that you feel like a friend should know about you, what would, what would come to mind for that?

Heather: 4:44

Oh, okay. Uh, Okay. I have an awkward one.

Kimber: 4:48

Yeah.

Heather: 4:49

Well, yes. So I was thinking of something different, but I think I'm going to say this. So. I have a different blood type than it when I was born. Right. So we'll get into that more in the story, but like my, if I left a DNA sample somewhere, somebody would register it as not me and somebody else in the world.

Kimber: 5:10

oh

Heather: 5:10

And that somebody else would not. Uh, female it'd be a male, so I can go and like commit a crime somewhere. And not be traced back to me, just.

Kimber: 5:17

That is so crazy. And I, yes, we're going to, we're going to get to talk about yeah. About your medical story, but, um, I never thought about it from that aspect of like, DNA tracing and

Heather: 5:29

Right. Isn't that interesting.

Kimber: 5:31

That's freaky. You know, you, you have the freedom. But

Heather: 5:34

Isn't that funny? Sure. No, no.

Kimber: 5:38

Uh, that's a good fact. That's a great fact, like for, you know, when people are like, what's a fun fact about you.

Heather: 5:44

That's my fun fact. Yes, for sure.

Kimber: 5:46

Oh, that's awesome. That's so cool. Well, you know, that kind of leads us nicely into, getting to share a little bit of your story today. It's it's a good one. I, when I asked you to come on the podcast, I. I. didn't know a lot about your story. And I just kind of felt like the alert is like, you should talk to Heather. And I was like, okay, but I don't know about what, because I didn't know much about your story. And so when I. asked you, you were like, oh Yeah. like I've got a cool story. Let's talk. And so, come to find out. Yes, I would. I would say that you do it's. It's crazy. It's cool. So I'm excited to get to share that with our friends today, but especially through this lens of loneliness. So we've been talking about during the series. and what we're going to get to kind of zero. And I think for you today in your story, It's something that I haven't gotten to talk about much yet. And that is just loneliness that comes from a time of forced isolation, in our lives due to circumstances, things that happen. Like, what about this loneliness that comes, and it's not necessarily like something that we can avoid, you know, it's forced upon us maybe for good reasons or even just necessary reasons. and it doesn't, even if we know it's like necessary and good, that doesn't necessarily make it any easier, it's still hurts. And it's still something we have to deal with. Even if we know maybe it is for like a good reason. And I think to an extent, like, you know, maybe we all dealt with this a little bit during COVID like, you know, we were in forced isolation for a while. And I think generally, most people agree that that was like a wise thing to do. Um, but that didn't make it have any less impact on our hearts. Right.

Heather: 7:19

Absolutely.

Kimber: 7:20

I feel like we can all relate to your story a little bit just through that small way, um, in that small lens, but, you've dealt with this a lot in your life, right? So, um, in several different ways. And so, I would love if you could just kind of get us into that, like, what are some of these ways in your life that, that forced isolation and the loneliness that comes from it? How has that been part of your story?

Heather: 7:43

Yeah. Absolutely. I love that you brought up COVID cause that's exactly what I thought of too. It's like we all kind of had to go in this. Um, you know, in the signs everywhere where like we're in this alone together. Yeah. Yeah. It was just that slogan that you're like, okay. Okay. We're just kind of already to be done with it. But I think if we all look back on certain seasons during COVID like, you can see the good things that came out of it, or you can see. Um, what God was trying to do in your life through some of those seasons. So, um, I just love looking back at things where yeah, it wasn't, it wasn't what we planned. Wasn't what we expected, but like, you can see God through some of those things. So, um, yeah, so basic. Basically. When I was 25, my husband and I, we were, he was in the air force. We were. On our second military base in Montana. So Montana's kind of similar to Alaska. Very outdoors-y mountain skiing. You know, all the good things. and something about me is I love to do things. with people. So like get outside, go for hikes, go for walks. Like my friendships are a lot based on like things that we can go and do together. So we were just living in app. We loved it. so all of a sudden in January I came down. Uh, marae was diagnosed with acute leukemia. So it was a very fast, progressive leukemia or cancer. so it's like I went into the hospital and the next day I went into the cancer unit for 30 days and was in that in an isolation. Area. Um, and then. Two days later started chemo and just kind of all of a sudden. And everything in my life that was going all my community. Um, you know, Church, my work, my school, my kids, like everything was just collapsed. Nothing.

Kimber: 9:22

And in that loo, that leukemia, it's like, it's your immune system, right? Is that why you had to be in like that isolation? Is that right?

Heather: 9:29

Well, so the chemo actually. Yeah. Kind of, um, so what they do, the chemo actually will shut down your immune system. So it will kind of work in that way where it shuts things down so it can kill off the cancer. That's hurting your body. which is, you know, that's a good thing. We want it to kill off, but it's also not able to fight. Um, the stuff. That's also bad for you too.

Kimber: 9:49

yeah, the junk out there. Yeah.

Heather: 9:50

Yeah. So, you know, I was in the hospital and my amazing husband was there. And literally by my side the whole time, like, it was really hard for him to leave. but I had friends that I worked with. I was a kindergarten teacher at the time. And they all had little colds or this and that. And the doctor was like, it's probably best for them to stay away. Um, so we wasn't able to be with them and then, Um, you know, community members, and then we had this amazing group of air force people that just come to round and it was like, he couldn't really think out what those people either. And we weren't able to do anything cause it was just like, And everything shut down. Um, and there was a little bit of that same like fear with COVID like, you didn't want to get the germs and you're just kind of like little bit of fear. Um, based in that. but definitely that feeling of isolation, just kind of being trapped in that place. without able to go out or do anything that you typically would think.

Kimber: 10:43

Right. And did you know at the time, like how long of a timeframe that was? Or was it like undetermined? I don't know how long this is going to go on or did you know, like, okay, I've got 30 days. You know, here's, here's how long it's going to be.

Heather: 10:57

Yeah. After about five days. I kind of less now they're like, Okay. this first round of chemo is pretty intense and it stinks. So you're going to be here for a month or more. And as they're a little bit longer, but it was just kind of that time to really stop, like everything just ceased. and I do think during that time, because it was, it was like you stop and you get better.

Kimber: 11:18

Hm.

Heather: 11:19

We, I was able to truly like look at God and be like, okay. What, what, what are you doing here? You. You know, like what are what's going on? Is my life. and there was nothing else to focus on. There was no work. There was no. You know, community service or church groups or anything, it was just kind of like, okay, what do you want? Um, So it was definitely at that time that it was complete reliance of God and like, What are we doing here? and I think that was such a huge moment. And I in my life, because I could see. I could just stop and just kind of listen to God and not have to focus on the other things. which was a really neat time in my life. and I think that initial time was. Just waiting and resting and trying to get, trying to get healing, which was so neat.

Kimber: 12:01

Yeah. Did you, did it feel that way then? Like.

Heather: 12:05

Yes.

Kimber: 12:05

In the moment too. Okay.

Heather: 12:07

The first month definitely felt like that. So after that first month got a little different.

Kimber: 12:13

Yeah.

Heather: 12:14

so after that first month they said, okay, the type of chemo I had, I needed, what's called a stem cell transplant. So that's why I have a different type of blood. Was that somebody I had to get a donation from somebody and they gave me their, Stem cells. And I basically restarted my immune system and everything. but in Montana they didn't have that at all. So we had to, we literally found out and then we got in the airplane and flew down to. Um, Houston for me to start treatment down there. So, again, just kind of that like complete, like, okay, what, where are we going? What are we doing

Kimber: 12:48

Uprooting, no community there. Yeah.

Heather: 12:51

nothing. You know, we didn't know anybody. It was just kind of like, okay, we're just. Like, we're just going down there. We're going to get better. And then. Just trying to figure out. what were you doing in that situation? Um, during that situation, I was definitely a little more. Confused and frustrated and angry.

Kimber: 13:07

Hm. Why do you think that was like, where did that come from? Like, what was the shift for you?

Heather: 13:11

I think the time to process was kind of like that first month it was, there was nothing that was just complete reliance. Like I have to get, I have to get better or I'm not going to make it through this. And then that second shift was kind of like, what, what do you want? Like, what are you doing with this guide? You know, and just a little bit more confusion and anger. At some of the things that were going on. And I do think I was experiencing that loneliness and that kind of like craving for those. That normalicy of like being around my school friends or being around our small group or like we had a great core group of friends that we just. You know, we talked to them a little bit on the phone. FaceTime. Wasn't a thing. Cause that was a long time ago. Um, so it was just those things that weren't available and just having to really switch and figure out. How to do this. Um, and we were down there for six months. So it was a long period of time. It wasn't a short, like, oh, good. Just go down for a week and then come back. It was. Was a decent amount of time. yeah,

Kimber: 14:08

almost like you settle into. Kind of the. Well, the, like the hard season, you know, it's like that, sometimes those first, that first bit of time, I feel like you're like reacting, like you said, and you're in like the crisis mode sort of. And then it's like you said, you have time to process and you're like, oh, like I have more feelings. About this, like underneath the surface that, uh, are emerging. Yeah. And so you had six lonely months to process all of that.

Heather: 14:35

Yes. And I did, I did have a family. I came down and visited at kind of those moments that were like, okay, I need you, like, my parents were there. And. Um, we even had a friend that flew down from Montana and it was just for like a day or two and it was like, it just needed those people just for that little time. And you could tell, like, it just kind of refreshed your. I'm like, okay. Like we can get through this. and then towards the end, you can just definitely start to feel like God's peace through some of those experiences are like, okay, he's got this. He really does. Especially the way that like, He was answering prayers. like, I just, there are so many people just out there praying for me and my husband and just getting us through that. that towards the end, you could just start feeling that peace and it's like, okay. That has a planter. As he's figuring this out. And I be at the end of it, I was healed. You know, it was Just this amazing thing that God has healed me from this. Yes, it is. It's so amazing. Uh, so, it's such a cool story for God to be like, this is what he did. Like he, he took me out of my comfort soul. He made me completely dependable on him for everything. and then through that, he taught us to be like dependent on him. and then healing me too. So just so many amazing things that came out of that season

Kimber: 15:48

Yeah, that's incredible. When you like, look back on that season, what do you feel like is like the biggest thing that you learned about God?

Heather: 15:55

Uh, trust, like just to trust him, like there was, Different points where like stuff fell through or something didn't work. Right. Um, so like I had a donor that was like lined up for me to get donations or refer to me to get their stem cells. And then it came out like it didn't work. And we were like, oh, seriously. And then two days later, two days later they found a different donor that was a better match. And it was like, okay, like, God has this. And like, why are you questioning? Like, why are you guessing? And why are you. You know, wondering about this whole.

Kimber: 16:26

Like, whether it will happen or not. Yeah. Yeah.

Heather: 16:30

So, yeah,

Kimber: 16:31

incredible. And to go through, like to go through, I feel like such a formative experience like that. When you were, you were like pretty young, right? Like you were new. Were you newlyweds at that point? Or like how long had you guys been married?

Heather: 16:46

We'd been married for two years. It was definitely like, we're still figuring each other out. And, uh, my husband's a fighter, so he definitely was in there like fighting insurance and like, he was. He, yes. He found his job for me, for sure. So, um, Really figuring out how to do. do. marriage together and completely humbling myself. Cause like, you know, when you're sick and you don't look that great.

Kimber: 17:12

Right.

Heather: 17:14

Um, you know, like you're just completely humble. And so, And just to

Kimber: 17:17

on other aspects of your relationship, but to bring confidence and whatnot. Yeah. Wow. That's that's crazy. How did, like, would you say that through that. Time that your friendships sort of were put on pause or were you able to like, maintain some friendships through that? And like, if so for the friends that you feel like navigated that. season really well for you, what, what did they do? Like how did they love you? Well, during that time that you remember, um, I know it was a long time ago, but like, how did they like show up in that time when they couldn't be with you? and even didn't maybe have some of the ways we have now to like, Stay connected. Um, what are some things you remember that like made you feel really loved and cared for by your friends in that hard season for you?

Heather: 18:05

Yeah. I remember getting calls like just from some certain people. And it was just very, periodically that was, they were just kind of calling and check. Like we weren't texting back then very much. Um, But it was just like, they would actually call and talk to me and say, Hey, like, how's it going? Or just kind of like, tell me what was going on during that time. Um, and sometimes you just needed that. Like I did not want to talk about. What was going on with me, but like just hearing the ridiculous things that my students were doing was so entertaining.

Kimber: 18:34

Yeah, Cause you're like totally wrapped up in that world. Of sickness treatment. Yeah.

Heather: 18:41

And sometimes I think they've got that. I just needed to tell them about seven. I was like, I just, I need a break from cancer. Like. Tell me what's going on with you, which was so nice. Um, so yeah.

Kimber: 18:51

to pull you out of that.

Heather: 18:52

yeah. Um, and then I remember too, there was a group of women, I didn't know. Um, which is this. I'm trying to remember if I screw my mom's church or something. But they all got together and they sent cards.

Kimber: 19:05

Hm.

Heather: 19:06

they made a schedule and they sent cards like, and I was like, I don't. These people are, but I got a card almost like every week. Just this random prayer, that was just really neat to see like a God working through different people and just kind of the things that they would say to encourage and. Just kind of uplift me. And even though I didn't know that, like you could see God working through those things, um, which was really neat.

Kimber: 19:30

just like those small steps of encouragement. Yeah. That make a

Heather: 19:34

Yes. Completely completely. So, um, just a little things I think were really big. And then, like I said, we had one friend that like slew down and they just saw us. For literally like, I feel like it was one night. Um, and then they flew out, but it was just because we couldn't do very much and I was kind of embarrassed cause I love to do stuff. And it was like, we just couldn't do stuff, but they just came in and it was just kinda like, okay, like, You know, w we're going to get through this. We're going to move on to the next step too. So, um, yeah, it was a nice. a nice. way to connect again, too, and just kind of have that really extra, extra special thing.

Kimber: 20:08

Right. I feel like that would be really challenging when the way that you like to connect, like through doing stuff is how you described that. Like when that is no longer or not no longer, but for a time that's not an option. To you, and it forces you to kind of like relearn or like connect in different ways or, you know, just press into the relationships you do have, like, um, I mean, do you feel like your marriage was strengthened through that like time of isolation? I would think probably like, what was that? What was that like for you?

Heather: 20:39

We definitely like got thrown into the deep end really fast and figured out who each other were honeymoon was cut a little short, but Yeah. no, I, we are. Going through that has made us, like we can get there anything like we that's, it's just something we can say, like,

Kimber: 20:55

We went through that year, too.

Heather: 20:56

Yes. Yeah. Yeah. So we're fine. Well, we'll do the next thing. What's next. Um, so yeah, we definitely think, like I said, my husband's kind of a fighter. So he's just started just kind of like, okay, we got this.

Kimber: 21:07

Well, I knew you did have, you did have next things, right? Like. Like that was not the end of your story.

Heather: 21:14

No, no, I

Kimber: 21:16

else did this forced isolation come up for? You?

Heather: 21:19

Well, so he think we came home. Right. And I had a few friends that had stayed the same, but life was kind of changing. so when I came home, because my immune system started over. I wasn't able to go back to teaching for a year. So that was, that was kind of a big part of my identity and my community. Whereas my teaching friends, um, You know, Th those teaching friends are awesome. Um, but so it started to kind of lead us to a new community. and then at that time, you know, it was just kind of that age where all of our air first friends are starting to have kids and. Just kind of in this part where there's like, okay, there. I'll work on a baby shower at the baby shower and just kind

Kimber: 21:57

Yeah.

Heather: 21:58

and at that point I was still doing cancer checkups and things. So just kind of like, ah, I don't know, here. I'm starting to get this long in my heart that. I was like, I want to be part of that group. Like, I want to be part of that women that are having kids and like, I've always had this dream, you know, like I'm going to be a mother and this is going to be great. But that wasn't an option for me. So it was really hard and just kind of forced me to kind of like pull away from those people that were my kind of. those are my people. That was my group, but just kind of pulling away from them was really hard.

Kimber: 22:30

Yeah. Yeah. Do you feel like that was like a healthy shift? Like this is what I needed to do you know? Cause sometimes I feel like that is like, actually talked about this a couple of weeks on the podcast with a friend is like, sometimes there are times when it's like, I'm just not in the same season as you. And so I need to find some people who are, or was it more like that was. Like what you did, but not maybe what would've been best for you in that scenario. Like what was it for you? Would you say.

Heather: 22:55

Um, Um, probably was a little bit of pride that I was like having these feelings of like, you know, jealousy and that, and I was a little prideful that I was like, oh, this is how I feel. And then part of me also didn't need to find some other avenues. And once I did kind of find those other avenues, I was able to be happy with them. but I did have to go find that other part of my life. Yes, Yes, because it was, I was struggling and I was, you know, I was at home all day and I was like, what is going on? Um, so it really was more of a, a loneliness because I wasn't able to join in with some of their stuff, or I didn't feel like I was able to join in with them.

Kimber: 23:34

And that it wasn't even an option for you then, and you don't have anything to distract yourself because you're not working or you can't go work, you know?

Heather: 23:43

job. Yeah. and they did have to go find some things. Like I started like volunteering cause I was like, I just need to do Something. Yes. And I think through that, like I joined. Um, it was called Eagle mountain. It. We rafted and we skied with kids and that was, that was me. Right? Like I was, I was able to be active again, and I was able to like pour my energy, and kind of meet different people and almost. Create new groups through that change. That there's no way I would have done that. If I had been in that. same season before, Um, so it just kind of, it shifted everything and I was able to share kind of my story with new people and like engage with new people that. Really, I wouldn't have left my little air force bubble or my school bubble. If I hadn't been like.

Kimber: 24:29

unless you were forced

Heather: 24:30

out. Yeah. Yeah. And I think God works so much through our life and like opening doors and closing doors and opening doors and closing doors. I was like, okay. Yes, God. I see. I see what you were doing during that time for sure.

Kimber: 24:41

Yeah. absolutely. Um, man, what do you feel like in that season? Like you learned most about God looking back in that time? Like, what do you feel like he was teaching you then? Or what did you learn about him? Through that being forced out of your, your old bubbles.

Heather: 24:57

Yeah. no, I think trust for sure. And this one is definitely a harder lesson from God, because it was a darker time for me. It was definitely where I withdrew and I became a little more angry and questioning. And, you know, like, why are you giving me or why have I always had this desire to be a mom when like this isn't an option for me? Um, and like looking back, like I can see where everything was. He was weaving his plan through it. but like having to get through that time of waiting and understanding and just, even that rest kind of like what we talked about in our Bible study there, they just like resting in this time or it was like, God was like, just, just stop. I've got this. Yes. Yes, completely. So, and I, I'm still learning to rest and do all those things. It's not like we're done by any chance, but

Kimber: 25:39

Well, man, it's, it's So. hard though, because you're like, I mean, you feel these negative feelings and I was talking about this, uh, The other week with, um, our guests, Susie, who was on a couple of weeks ago. And like, you know, sh I think, I think I so often think of these negative. Emotions as like bad need to get rid of them, but what she talked about is like these negative feelings aren't necessarily like bad, get rid of kind of things. But like, if we can recognize them and allow them to push us toward better things, like toward community, towards stepping out of our comfort zone toward God. Sorta like whatever it is, then we're acknowledging them for what their purposes, like, you know, they're to help us be healthier. And sometimes we have to feel those negative things. To propel us. Into better places or into where God wants us to be in. And it feels like such a hard. Reality, I think to wrap my mind around because I'm like, okay, like, God is good, but you know, he will use these things that are hard in our lives to push us towards. Better things for us and that's man, when you're in it. That doesn't feel that doesn't feel

Heather: 26:44

Yeah. No, no. I went, that was a rough season, for sure. So, Um, Yeah. Got it. Got us doing amazing things, but sometimes getting through them is very, very difficult to, so Yeah.

Kimber: 26:54

And that led you guys then did that lead you down the road of adoption? Or how did you kind of get to that point in your, in your lives?

Heather: 27:02

Um, that was just kind of a cool. W well, so we ended up figuring out that I wasn't able to have kids. Um, some of it's due to the chemo and different things like that. But so my husband and I were like, okay, let's just leave. You know, we were just kind of ready to escape and like restart. Cause that's what you do at the military. So. I'm like, okay, let's go somewhere overseas. Let's do something good. And God took us to Alabama. And that was not where I wanted to go. I was so mad. Because I'm a Colorado girl. I need my mountains. Am I snow? You. You know, like, oh, I was not happy. Um, And then we went down there and we met this most amazing little boy who needed a mom and a dad. And, um, he's just the coolest kid. So he's 13 now. Um, he came to live with us when he was four. So I just I'm just so proud to be his mom. He's just such a cool kid. So, yeah. Yeah, definitely. Cool. Um, Cool story through there and God, again, like God took us to there. And just the way that he pushed us in her life was so amazing. So yeah. Yeah.

Kimber: 28:05

And as we were talking, you kind of. Give the impression that like that. And I don't know if it was the post-adoption season with him or with your other kiddos, but it talked a little bit about how, just like, again, that forced isolation came. After adoption, because it's like a time when you really need to like, help them feel safe and secure and your family and stuff. Will you share a little bit about just like how that theme came up again, through that time in your

Heather: 28:31

Yes, absolutely. so we had doctors on and then, um, our two daughters came to our house too, and they were a little bit younger, so they were ages two and three. When they came into our house. And, you know, they. They didn't know us before. It was a very fast transition for them. So, um, they kind of came in her house and life had to literally just shut down and we had to help them just feel safe and secure. So again, like I was, um, working at a school and I just, I quit my job and. Um, we weren't with friends and. stuff, or like, we're, we're just going to keep you outside. Like these girls need to know that this is their family. These are the people we can trust. So even we put a hold on our small group and our church and just kind of like really focused in word. Um, and just helping them know like, okay, you are safe here in this house and we are your people, you know, have having them figure that out. Cause if we're having people come in and out, like, they'd get. You know, like, oh, who is this? We just, we wanted them to feel safe in our house. so we definitely had a few months of that, where it was just us focusing on them. And having to say no to everything else was really hard for me, because again, like I want to get out, I want to take them to the park. I want to do

Kimber: 29:43

Yeah, I do the fun things. Right.

Heather: 29:45

Yes. Like, oh, let's take them to the music park and let's go to the beach and let's go do this. And it was not the time for that. They just needed to be in our house, playing in the backyard, you know? And that was, that was a season that I was like, okay, we can get through this.

Kimber: 29:58

Yeah. How long did you end up sort of having that season be like saying no to a lot more things than you might normally.

Heather: 30:06

So that kind of jumps into COVID too. So I'm not sure. how long it would have been. So we got them in September and then, so we pretty much shut down and we kind of started getting back in like January and then lifetime. I doubt, I guess. So, Yeah. about four months that we kind of were like, we just need to be here. And we just started like reaching out and like maybe meeting friends at the park or doing just like barely out a little bit.

Kimber: 30:33

you can kind of,

Heather: 30:34

Yeah, yeah. yeah. Just getting out a tiny bit. so we couldn't do the things that we were used to. Right. So, but this season was a little bit different where. We had friends that would just drop off like boxes and boxes of toys, because we didn't have anything for a little girls in our house. So we'd had friends that dropped us the most music, clothes and toys and food, and, um, I would have a friend that when we were having some hard times at the house, she would just talk in her phone and she would just tell me your prayer and send it as a text message. And it was like, oh, that's what I needed. Like, I just needed that encouragement. Um, because I couldn't go for a walk with her or get together at school, like we were doing. and it was just amazing to have those people support you, even though you weren't able to be in that community that you were, um, in the past, for

Kimber: 31:23

It it's such a, and that was probably such a shift to like, because you're when you were sick, that was forced on you. Like yes, you chose to comply, but like, cause you knew that was what you needed to do. But with this time being like more, uh, willing choice, like, okay, this is the decision, this is what we know we need to do. how did that like hit your heart differently? Like, did you find yourself having any kind of like, fears that came up from your previous experience in that kind of isolation, or was it just like you were motivated in that time and knew is the right thing. So it felt easier. You'd done it before. Like, what was your experience there?

Heather: 32:01

I think because it was other people. It was a little harder for me. So when it was just me like, okay, you know, like I can trust. God, I got this. Now when it was the girls, it was like, oh, like I'm in charge of these people. And it kind of had that weird mom push and pull with it where it would made it more difficult for me to be like, oh, am I doing this right? Is this right? Is this and like, Trusting God. And this has been more of a learning curve than it was when it was when I was sick. Like when you were sick, it was kind of like the doctors had the answers then this where parenting like. Ooh.

Kimber: 32:34

You feel like I sorta need the answers.

Heather: 32:37

Right. Sometimes it's just trial and error and yeah, sometimes. we're just flying by the seat of our pants, seeing what they need and, Um, you know, then beans a little, sometimes they didn't know what they need or they couldn't express it, or they didn't know the hurts that they had. Um, so they had a hard time with that and they didn't know why they're upset. Um, so helping them through that was much different. then going through it myself, where it was. I can put my trust in God for that, but with my daughters, it's much harder for me and I'm still learning it. To be honest, we're still working through this

Kimber: 33:09

there outside of you too. Like that, at least that's something I've experienced is unique with. Having a baby is like, trust is always a thing for me and God we're always working on it. I suck at it. And. Um, it's like when it's my life, that feels very different than also trusting him with my kid. And I'm not sure why that is. Do you know why that is for you? I don't know.

Heather: 33:33

I think it's a control thing for me. I want to, I want to make this perfect little life in this control and have everything great for them. And I do need to let it my trust, or I need to trust God that God loves him just as much. I do and way more. You know, I think a lot of times it's like, I know, I know it's best. I got this. Because I want to control how they are and everything that's going on. So I'm just remembering that. God loves them. He made them, he designed this and he has a plan just as much as I do or more, more than I do for sure. So.

Kimber: 34:05

Right. Friends, just interrupting the show for just a second to share a resource that I would love for you to leverage for your friendships. My new digital download is called 20 facts. You should know about your friends and it's a questionnaire style page that you can use to just generate some conversation. At your next get together. My intent with this resource was to give you an intentional way to learn some important aspects of your friends' personalities or likes. Key moments from their lives. All with the goal of being more intentional in loving our friends while. Do you want to drop off a surprise coffee? Well, you've got their order. Maybe you're bad at remembering birthdays. It's good. It's in your phone already. Or maybe you need gift ideas. Good thing. You already know all their faves. I hope that this will be a great resource for you to engage in conversation with your friends, get to know them better and have a place to save. And remember some of these important details. You can find this free PDF download on my website, which is linked in the description of this episode. Okay, friends back to the show. What would you say, like made the difference for you? Going through that, like initial season of isolation with the girls and then like rolling into COVID like, how did you, how did you make it through? Like, what would you say is like, one or two things that like made the difference for you that helped you get through that?

Heather: 35:31

It definitely, definitely the support of people, even though they weren't able to be there just like, but cards or letters or even emails. My grandma always email me and just was just so encouraging, uplifting. Um, she had four boys, so she's like, you can do this. You're going to be

Kimber: 35:46

You got this?

Heather: 35:47

Um, yeah, so I think there is some things that was like the outside perspective. and then I do think when we April. Again, we're able to collapse. And only the important things mattered. where we weren't as focused on you. you. know, that meeting I had to get to at school or this activity or This where it just kind of everything shifted or we could see this is what is important right now. This is what is needed. Yes. This is what, this is what my daughters need. This is what my son needs. This is what our family needs at this time. which was a huge thing because we get so busy with certain things or volunteering. Like I said, I love to volunteer and get out there and meet new people. And that wasn't the time for that, that wasn't the season for that at all. So figuring that out and having God say, okay, you're done. Just, just take a break. Um, it

Kimber: 36:33

Trusting him and being content where you're at. Yeah. That's such a, such a hard thing, especially when it's like, I didn't exactly sign up to be here. You know, even when you did, but yeah,

Heather: 36:43

I, yeah. and I did, I just, I didn't think it was a little different, um, with our two different adoptions, kind of where, where we went with my son, I was able to keep working and doing all the things and then their daughters, I just, I wasn't, and I wasn't completely prepared for that. but Where they were is what, that's, what I needed to do. Um, and then when our whole family was able to come together and just be alone. Um, and really that, that time was such an important time for us to grow as a family unit. Unit for sure. So,

Kimber: 37:15

Um, you saw at school that you were able to see the benefit of it, even as it was hard, because I feel like that sometimes gives us the motivation, you know,

Heather: 37:22

Yeah.

Kimber: 37:23

To get through it. If you could like go back to just your younger self in these different seasons and just say like, listen, like, here's what you need to know to get through this. Like in that moment, in those hard times, like, what would you say. To yourself, will you, your younger self to encourage her in that moment?

Heather: 37:43

Oh, I would, I would just say God's got a plan for you. Like God has this, like he knows this plan and there's times that it's not going to be easy and it's fine. And there's going to be tears. Um, but like hindsight's 2020, like, this is such a cool story. I love my family. I love that. He brought us all together. Like when you see us together, it's like, oh yeah, like you guys. Yeah. You're all supposed to be there together. and I, my husband and I had talked about it the other day and like, we've been. Like in a relationship for 20 years now. And we're like, oh my gosh. If I had that 20 years ago, when I met you, that this is where we'd be like, I don't know.

Kimber: 38:20

You wouldn't have believed it. Yeah.

Heather: 38:22

No, absolutely not. There's nothing about this that I was like, yep. We'll live in Alaska. We'll have. And these three kids, and this is what you'll be doing. It's Nope. Nope. Not at all. But like, God's got this, like he does, and it's not going to be your plan. And it's going to get some bumps and doors are going to be shot. But he's got you. He's got you all the way through it. So

Kimber: 38:41

I love that knowing like, like you say, hindsight's 20, 20, right? Like having this hindsight from these times and like knowing what you know now. looking forward to bumps that will come right? Like if you ever find yourself in this season, like a season of forced isolation again, what do you think? Like you'll do differently. This time, like what will be a priority to you in different ways? or what habits will you have like that you're like, oh, I need to do this better. Learning from what you, what, where you've.

Heather: 39:11

Yeah. I think getting older, I know more people right now, so like I can step out and almost kind of humble myself and ask friends or people say, Hey, you know, like, I need your help through this, or just kind of saying, like, what advice do you have because there's always somebody either can pray for you or who's been through something or. That can just kind of encourage you during these times and you can look ahead and see like, okay. They've done this, or they've been through this and, they can support you. So sometimes I, I rely on myself. A lot of times I rely on myself and I'm. I go look inward. I'm like, I can do this. It's fine. Just don't worry about it. Everybody walk away. Let me handle it. Where I need to reach out and I don't always reach out. So, Yeah. texting somebody, finding somebody or just even stepping out of your comfort zone and joining a women's Bible study. I mean, really don't have the time where you don't really want to, or, you know, it just feels a little awkward or volunteering for that thing. That's kind of tugging on your heart. if it's, you know, if you're able to, like those things will help push you and like,

Kimber: 40:14

Right.

Heather: 40:15

Take you into past that you may not have sought where for you, but maybe God's going to use that in a different way.

Kimber: 40:21

Mm, I love that you tie that mindset and like, uh, those actions to getting older because I really. I think you're right. Like I think we learn. The longer we spend as like adults trying to figure out. The friendship thing and like handling loneliness and navigating like the hard things of life. I think we do come to the conclusion that like, oh, I really can't do this alone. and I think some people that happens earlier, some it happens later in life, maybe depending on their unique stories. But, I love that you tie that to age because it's just such a reminder that like, we're all getting more and more equipped to realize that we need each other. And so it's like, as we're walking, our different roads. If you're realizing this more and more, I think that's like a very normal thing and like lean into that. You know, lean into those more relationships that you have, that you've accumulated over the course of your life so far, and don't be afraid to rely on them. even if you haven't before, because. Yeah, we need each other and it just, it becomes more and more apparent to me that. I don't got it on my own. I really don't. I really don't.

Heather: 41:27

Yeah, That's one of the reasons I love our mom's group. Cause we can get together and we can share those insecurities or those questions or those. What is God doing and why? Just cause, cause we all have those and we need each other through that to encourage each other and just build each other up. Um, Because sometimes we're our worst critic. so yeah. And we'll, we'll create that loneliness for sure.

Kimber: 41:49

Yeah. And it's like the more, I think the more you do practice that the more you realize, we all are kind of experiencing the same stuff. Like maybe not every single person, but like, even just in like our, our small moms group, the people who can relate to each other, like I, you know, we can't all relate to each other in every like, specific way. In general. I think, you know, we can, but there's usually someone, I feel like there's someone who has a connection in some way, and that's just in a small group of like, 10 to 12 people. And so, yeah, like we are so blessed these days with, I think, lots of ways to connect with each other and lots of resources if we. Choose to, you know, reach out to those things. And there's someone out there, like you said, that's, that's ready to walk with you. Which is such a

Heather: 42:35

even. even. if you haven't talked to them in a while, like it's okay. I've had texts from random people. It's like, oh, that's been a little bit. And I've text somebody recently that I probably haven't talked to in four years and we were able to reconnect and she was able to kind of provide me with some advice that was so valuable to me. Um, so again, I kind of humbling myself and be like, Hey, I need you. And. Um, figuring out that and she was, she was blessed by that and I was blessed and God's put those people in your life for a reason too. So

Kimber: 43:04

And don't be afraid to do that because, you know, I think about it and I'm sometimes I feel a little self conscious to do that because I'm like, oh, like maybe they'll think it's like weird because we haven't talked in a while or like, oh, I just like need you now. Or, you know, uh, not like 24, 7 or something, but really like, if someone reached out to me like that, I would like, that would bless me. Like, I wouldn't be, it wouldn't seem like, oh, you haven't talked to me in four years and now you need me. Okay. Like, no, it would be like, Yeah. like I want to meet you there in this neat in this space. Or he needs something. And so, and I think probably most people are like that. Maybe not everyone, but I think, I think we can probably have more confidence in doing that. Then maybe we do natural. We do like are afraid of, or whatever.

Heather: 43:45

Yeah,

Kimber: 43:45

So that's cool. Well, Heather, something that stood out to me since I first asked you, just to talk about with the podcast and everything, Like I mentioned at the beginning, you were like, I've got a cool story and that was true. I would say like, you do have a cool story, like you said, but. since I've heard it, I've just been thinking about like how you have come to see it that way, because, you know, it's like, you're telling us this story and like it's full of a hot, her really hard stuff. And, you know, it's like we can see sort of not the end end, but you know, an end of parts of it. And, so I would just love to hear kind of your perspective on like how you've come to see. Just like a lot of painful things in your story as like how you've come to describe that as like a cool story. A good story. So, when do you think, like that shifted for you? Like how did you begin seeing, you know, your cancer infertility struggled over your family? Like, how did you start seeing that pain? Through the lens of a good story, because I think a lot of times I just think of it as like, oh, these bad things happen to me and thank God I got through them, but I love that you describe it that way. So how did that shift like kind of happen for you?

Heather: 44:58

I think through every different season, I could see kind of where God worked. And a lot of times it was toward the end of it, where it was like, During the cancer. it was pretty hard, but like, when I got the last test for the cancer and they're like, you are healed. Like we don't ever want to see you again. You're like, okay, are you sure? You know? And then when they finalize the adoptions and when our family was, you know, like sometimes we'll sit at the dinner table and I'll just look around and be like, oh my gosh, this is so amazing that God has brought us through this. Like God gave me these longings And these desires. And yes, we went through this, but if we didn't go through this, this wouldn't be possible at this point. and I think he gives us as longing and. Desires any can fulfill them, or sometimes he changes them to. And we have to know that he is faithful through those things. and then I also think like, because of some of these stories or things that I've been through, like I've been able to connect with other women that I would never have connected with. and I think. Because of that, like we're able to work with each other and help each other, and it's just been so rewarding to see us or to see God's work. through that where we wouldn't necessarily. have been there if I didn't go through some of these experiences, um, Yeah. and God's not done. Like they're still hard seasons and we're still working on lots of trust and everything else. But I do think like it's just such a cool story. I love, I

Kimber: 46:17

Um, Oh, that's so cool because I love. That you're like acknowledge. Yes. Like sometimes it does come with the closure of a season. And it's like, sometimes I think it's hard to see when you're in that like messy middle, like in the middle of a season to see like, Hey, there's going to be an end to this at some point, or there's going to be some kind of closure. and so I love that reminder to just like, wait for that and like continue trusting him as we're looking forward to that time when he is gonna. Uh, we're going to see the fruit of his faithfulness.

Heather: 46:50

Right. Even if, even if it's not the way that we thought it would happen, like he is still faithful and he is still good. So yeah. Yeah.

Kimber: 46:58

that. Man Heather, that is, that perspective is just such like goals for me. It's. Oh, man. The trust thing is like so hard. I feel like everything in my story, like always comes back to that, that God's working on my heart. And so, um, I love hearing from you just how you've seen that and how he's grown your confidence in his faithfulness through, through those times when you had to, had to trust really actively. So thank you so much for sharing with us today and. Um, yeah, I love, I loved hearing your story the first time I got to, and then I'm hearing it through the lens here of just like how you kind of, in retrospect, what you've learned about God and. How it's established even more like your trust in him. that's just a really cool perspective. So thanks so

Heather: 47:43

Thanks for having me. I

Kimber: 47:44

absolutely. It was so fun. What are you, um, what are you doing for fun coming up in your life? How are you and your family, getting out there these days, because you're not in this forced isolation anymore,

Heather: 47:56

No. Um,

Kimber: 47:58

Or are

Heather: 47:59

We know you're out. We are in Alaska. Like, are you kidding me?

Kimber: 48:03

Yeah. What do you guys do for fun?

Heather: 48:05

so I love to downhill ski it's my, my thing is how I met my husband. Like we, we, the girls scheme, I S my son's no worries. Like we love to get out there. So if we can get out there as much as they can, as. But surely with all this new powder.

Kimber: 48:19

Yeah, we've gotten a

Heather: 48:20

there as much. Oh, my goodness so much. better. We went skiing the other day and it was, it was a little rough on the legs, but, um, yeah, as much as we can be outside, I love the winters here. Um, they're just, they're amazing. Summers are good too, but

Kimber: 48:34

cool. I love that God has brought you back to the time when you can get out and do stuff.

Heather: 48:39

Yeah, That's me too.

Kimber: 48:40

That's awesome. Very cool. Well, Heather, thanks so much for chatting with us today. I loved it. I'll talk to you later, friend.

Heather: 48:47

Thanks. Kimberly, I'll talk to you soon.

Kimber: 48:53

Friends. I'm so glad you could join Heather and I this week on the, your sister Kimber podcast. Heather does have such a goal story, and I really hope it spoke to your heart today. A message of encouragement, but maybe also some challenge like it did to me. When we're in it, it's so hard to zoom out and remember God's faithfulness. So I challenge you to take some time in prayer to do that today. To consider how he is writing such a cool story in your life to. If you enjoyed my conversation with Heather today, I would be so honored. If you would head over now to apple podcasts and leave a rating and review of the podcast. It not only blesses me to hear from you, my friends, but reviews Also help new friends find the show and know that it's worth their listen. Even if you don't listen on apple podcasts, you can find a direct link to rate the show there at the link in my bio, or if your favorite podcast player has the option to review, you can do that there too. And lastly, I want to make sure you know, that I want you to part of my newsletter crew. If you don't receive my weekly newsletter, go to my website now and subscribe. You'll just get one email a week in your inbox with a preview of what will be on the podcast that week, As well as the link to this month's blog post a tip of the week to help you grow your friendships in practical ways and a resource suggestion to check out such as a book, a podcast, Instagram account, things like that. Just people and things that are helping me grow as a friend that I want to share with you. So to get this email, just subscribe at the link in the description of this episode. Friends. Thank you so much for being part of this community until next time. It's your sister Kimber.