Ep.48 When Grief is Coming + Jeanette Tapley

Walking toward grief that we know is likely just around the corner adds a new layer of complexity to this already nuanced journey. Kimber talks with podcaster, writer, and speaker Jeanette Tapley about her family’s journey alongside her father-in-law through stage-four cancer. 

They discuss the encouraging highs and lonely lows of preemptive grief, what her conversations with God have looked like through that, and how they’ve survived when the hits keep on coming in other areas of life too. Whether you’re walking this road yourself or alongside a friend, Jeanette’s honesty and heart for loving our friends well will encourage you on this road. 

For more encouragement in friendship, faith, and parenting, follow Jeanette on Instagram or TikTok at @jeanettetapley or online at jeanettetapley.com.

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Transcript

kimber: 0:09

Hey friends. Welcome to the, your sister Kimber podcast. My name is Kimberly Gilbert, and I'm so glad you're here. Over the last few weeks in our series on loneliness, we've been talking about the real stuff. Grief is such a complex road and we need friends to walk it with us because the enemy is certainly going to try to use loneliness. We experience on our grief journeys to isolate and paralyze us. And for that reason, I'm really honored to be talking with my friend, Jeanette Tapley today. She is a podcaster author and speaker who also loves to speak to the ways friendship and faith intersect in our lives. And today we're talking about walking toward and through grief. With your friends. As Janette walks with her, father-in-law through cancer. She's learning that needing her people is actually a really good place to be. I'm so thankful that Jeanette is sharing her story and wisdom with us today. And I hope it helps you grow authentic, true community in your life and friendships that honor God and Dre, closer to Jesus. I wish we could get coffee with dinette today and talk this hard conversation face to face but this is the next best thing I'm so glad you're here friend let's get started Jeanette. Hello.

Jeanette: 1:28

Hey, how are you?

kimber: 1:30

I'm pretty good. I was telling you just a little bit ago that we just have had some sickness come through our house, but we are on the mend and doing pretty well. I'm excited to talk to you today. Thanks so much for being here.

Jeanette: 1:41

yeah. I'm so excited to hang out with you. It's so fun to like meet even online and like going from Instagram friends to like Zoom friends. I feel like that's a big deal for us.

kimber: 1:50

It is, this is like our first face-to-face conversation.

Jeanette: 1:53

Yes.

kimber: 1:54

It's cool. Yeah. Well go ahead and introduce yourself for our friends listening, and then we can, chat a little bit more about the weird way that we met and how we actually kind of have a lot of connections,

Jeanette: 2:06

That's so funny. Yeah. Uh, well, I'm Jeanette Tapley. I live in, uh, just south of Austin, Texas. I am born and raised Alaskan. So that's kind of fun. Jesse and I have been married for like seven 18 years. I think we're around 18 years. And then we have three kids. We have a 16 year old. A 14 year old and a 12 year old. Our 12 year old is Zoe and she's adopted and she's deaf. So we're kind of assigning family, not kind of, we are

kimber: 2:31

Yeah. You are Yes.

Jeanette: 2:34

we use a s l to communicate with her. And then, uh, for work, man, for work, it's kind of like this umbrella of things. I'm a podcaster myself. I have two shows, which is wild. Uh, and then I get to edit and produce other people's podcasts, which is like the most fun thing. I write and I speak, and I just try my best to encourage people and women just like us that are going through anything and everything, right? Like easy. But it's like if I'm going through it, then I'm sure somebody else's too. So like, let's speak to.

kimber: 3:02

Yeah. That's such like a realization that I feel like. I don't think I, I really got to this point realizing this until like maybe my late twenties, early thirties, because it's like before I would be going through things and it just felt like so isolating. Like, oh, I'm probably the only one going through this. And then I don't know. At some point I just started to realize like, that's not true. Like we're all going through like such similar things and yeah, they manifest in different ways, but like, it is really like universal, uh, a lot of the things we experience in one way or another. And so I love that you, have realized that too and that you're like speaking to it. I think that's really cool.

Jeanette: 3:38

Yeah, it's a lot of fun. I enjoy it so much. I enjoy it. All of all of the different things I get to do is really, really like a dream.

kimber: 3:44

Yeah, how long have you been doing the podcasting stuff? Because that's, we got connected on Instagram and that was how I, got to know you a little bit. Turned out we have a mutual friend, I guess, from where you grew up and like, just some weird random stuff. But, that's where I first got to see you working is in that realm. So how did you get into that stuff?

Jeanette: 4:04

Yeah, I started podcasting. It's time for coffee is almost five years old. and so it's wild to me that it's been that long, but it's been five years and so hundreds of conversations and just, like the beauty of that. And then, mom's at Work is about one year old now, and that is a conversation where we get to talk to working moms. A network that I worked with, uh, Christian Parenting was like, we need a podcast for working moms. I was like, that's a great idea. I love that. And they're like, no, can you do that? And I was like, oh, oh, I am a working mom. I can totally do that. like, okay. And so that's been a really fun place for me to, to teach and encourage and, uh, kind of, they both stemmed out of just kind of having idle hands After Zoe was home and started kindergarten, I didn't know what to do anymore because so much of my time in life had been adoption paperwork and then school paperwork. And then it was like done. And I'm like, well, what am I supposed to do

kimber: 4:52

Now what? Yeah.

Jeanette: 4:53

all right, God, what do you have from me? And he was just like, let's, take this gift that I've created you with, uh, the gifted conversation. My parents didn't think it was a gift when I was

kimber: 5:02

right? That's how many, how? So many of our gifts, I feel like work. It's like when you're a kid, they're really annoying and then they actually turn out to be like incredible

Jeanette: 5:10

Yes. I actually, our middle kiddo, when he was little, I was like, you are gonna be a great leader one day, but you have got to follow me right now. And so, so as a conversationalist, I was like, let's take this gift of conver of, being a good friend and being, conversationally based and move it into this platform and this media where we get to have conversations with people literally thousands of miles away from us and encourage people, whoever who, wherever they are.

kimber: 5:34

Yeah, it's incredible. I have really enjoyed it. I realized on Instagram, I just hit my one year of doing this stuff, which was just so fun and I don't know, to like realize Wow. Like I've been at it for a year and enjoying it and, um, growing a lot and so, yeah, it's been cool. But you have been a, a real inspiration to me, so I, appreciate you leading in, how you do online.

Jeanette: 5:59

Well, statistically speaking in the podcast world, lemme tell you this, if a podcaster can get past their first six months, the first six months are typically the hardest and they're the hardest to stay consistent in. And so if you can get past that first six months, you can kind of make your way.

kimber: 6:14

Yeah. that is encouraging to hear. I feel like it's such like a big world and such, like a, I mean, it was like the learning curve was astonishing for me. And, um, I never really thought that I would do this. I always saw myself as a writer and I still do, but felt like the Lord was like, Hey, like like you should do this. And I was like, what? so I feel like one way it's been really good for me is that it stretches me. You know, like, it's like, okay, this is not always a super easy comfort zone thing, but it's really good and I've been loving it, so

Jeanette: 6:48

that's awesome. That's so good. Well, congratulations. A year's a big.

kimber: 6:50

Yeah, thanks. Well, we are in a series right now, on the podcast about loneliness and just really talking about how this is such a universal experience. Kinda like we were saying with, you know, what we go through. It's like, I think, I used to think that loneliness was primarily based on circumstances and if my circumstances would change, then I wouldn't feel lonely anymore. I think that's maybe true to an extent. Like our circumstances certainly can impact it, but, I think it's not, it's not always true by any means. And so, what has been your experience with like loneliness and broad sweeping terms in your life? Like how have you seen God use loneliness in your life to, grow your faith or your intimacy with him? Or how have you seen this come into your story at.

Jeanette: 7:36

Yeah, man. I think part of being raised in the pastor's family that I was in, um, image was very important to my family and so we needed to make sure we were kind of pulled together or, that kind of thing. so that was already a little bit isolating growing up. And I kind of say in just now, like, I hate asking for prayer. Like that's just a pride issue. We're not gonna talk about pride. I don't wanna talk about loneliness. But it

kimber: 7:59

Well, we can go there if you want. I mean,

Jeanette: 8:01

But there, there's this, there's this thing within me that like I love championing my friends. I love being a good friend. I love all these things. And then when it's like, well, hey, how are you? I'm like, oh, I'm fine.

kimber: 8:12

I'm great.

Jeanette: 8:13

about me like all of that. And so, Sometimes my loneliness and the loneliness that I've experienced has been self-induced because I have not been willing to share what I'm going through or my heart or ask for help or ask for prayer. And so, To me, the way that God has really like shown up and like nurtured me through this has been really and truly, it feels like dragging me through things that I can't do without my friends. And so I said last year, I, I was gifted a beautiful necklace from my friend last year and she said, I just want you to know we love you, like we love you so much. And it was in that moment that I realized my friends have carried me to Jesus so many times for healing this last year. And, They carried me to Jesus, but I wasn't a paralyzed man laying on the mat. I was a thrashing idiot. Like, I don't wanna go to Jesus. I don't

kimber: 8:59

I don't want it.

Jeanette: 9:00

just like, like, they're like dragging me out of my loneliness and dragging me out of my own self so that I could find healing and, and they could be a part of it. And, and it's not by my faith that I'm healed. It's by, it's by Jesus and, and my friend's faith bringing me. And so that's kind of where I've experienced loneliness in the past year. Like that self-induced, like, I'll deal with this. I'll, I'll like, I'll be okay.

kimber: 9:24

Yeah. Have and like what a blessing to have friends who will do that, would you say you've always had that kind of friend around you to support you in that or not so much?

Jeanette: 9:35

Yeah. I am a very, I've always been very relational. Um, And the funny thing is like, I still have, if I, if I called two of my friends from fifth grade, they'd pick up.

kimber: 9:45

hmm.

Jeanette: 9:46

it's a gift to have relationships like that. Um, and it would be like, Hey, let me catch you up

kimber: 9:52

Yeah. We have a lot to talk about, but

Jeanette: 9:55

yeah. We don't talk often, but we do. And so I have, um, fostered really deep friendships and they've ebbed and changed and have, um, really grown over the years. And then there's been some relationships that have completely lost and died in, you know, the friendship breakup scenarios. Um, but for the most part, I have had, like in every season of my life I have, I've had at least one really, really solid, stable person, aside from my husband that has talked Very frank to me and has been really,

kimber: 10:23

Told you what's up,

Jeanette: 10:24

me. Hmm. Yeah. And I'm like, Hey, could we not? And she's like,

kimber: 10:28

We're going there.

Jeanette: 10:29

Yes. And so, yes, to answer your question, I've always had. Um, and in the seasons I haven't, I can tell you the darkness that I walked through.

kimber: 10:37

Yeah. I think it's such a blessing to have those kind of people around who will like call you. on your

Jeanette: 10:42

Yeah. Yeah.

kimber: 10:44

and like I have found myself needing to give friends permission to do that sometimes. Like, hey, if I'm like, Being a mess here or like, I'm not doing what I need to do or like, I'm missing it. you can tell me, you know? And I think man, giving people in your life permission to do that, or before you need them to do it, you know, can be, can be really huge and. I know you guys have been walking through a challenging season, as a family right now. And, that's one thing that we're gonna talk about today. And I just wanted to say thank you so much for being willing to, open up a little bit of your story to us and, what loneliness has looked like through this harder time. So, will you share with us a little bit about this hard season that your family is, is kind of going through right now with your dad? Yeah.

Jeanette: 11:30

Yeah, so it's my father-in-law actually. And, um, yeah. Yeah. And so, about this time last year, my father-in-law was diagnosed with, bladder cancer. And the crazy thing is, is he's had bladder cancer, or. He was diagnosed with bladder cancer when Jesse and I first got married or before we got married. So he's always had to do these scans. It's all, it's always been very routine. Uh, there was five years, so that puts you into remission probably more than five years. So in, well into remission that, um, we didn't have to worry about it for a long time. And, it was la this time last year we got a call that said it is spread. It's not only in his bladder, but it's like in his bladder, in his, his spread. And when you hear something like that, it just immediately humbles you. And it not only humbles you, but I am I have walked through a lot of grief in my life and I've had, I, my kid will quote me on this, which I dunno if it's a good thing or a bad thing, but, um, in every season of my life, I've experienced great loss and great death. and so I was just like, well, okay, this makes sense. Like, here we go again.

kimber: 12:33

hmm.

Jeanette: 12:34

The loss of a father-in-law is gonna, is gonna, is gonna happen. And we, have just walked really, tenderly with my father-in-law, my mother-in-law, and it has been a year of God showing up in the most miraculous ways. Like I, So while we, while we are dealing as children and my, I mean I've been in this family for 18 years, um, since I was 17 years old. So really and truly, like they are my parents. They are, they, I love them and they love me, and I know how deeply loved I am in this family. And so we have just walked out this like hard conversations to like, okay, what the, what ifs and what do you want? And what do we need to do and how do we care for this? And, uh, just really, really hard conversations. And my, my husband is, um, the youngest of two, and my brother-in-law is one of my best friends. And so just really kind of some awkward conversations between the three of us of like, all right, what do we need to do? How do we do this? And so that was, it was a weird season because. My father-in-law is still alive and he is actually doing very, very good right now. Um, praise God. He is, he told me, I was like, how you feeling? He's like, I'm actually like weirdly good right

kimber: 13:41

Aw, I love that

Jeanette: 13:42

God. Like, it's so

kimber: 13:43

Enjoy it. That's good.

Jeanette: 13:45

And so while, while his faith is being strengthened because he's seeing God answer his prayers, it's also really funny because he's like, well, now I'm getting. Nitpicky. Well, I told, I, you know, I prayed for this, I want this. And he's like, I have to remember that God's not a genie in a bottle,

kimber: 13:59

Right?

Jeanette: 14:00

see the praise and see the thanksgiving where it's at. And that's been a beautiful thing to kind of watch him, watch him do. And so While we are walking this really scary journey, probably last summer, um, my husband started experiencing anxiety for the first time, and was experiencing panic attacks. And our daughter started puberty, so she went crazy.

kimber: 14:21

Lots of, yep. That's a good way to describe it. Yeah.

Jeanette: 14:26

bananas. And so it was. our home has always been full of emotion because I'm a very, uh, emotion driven person. But we were just seeing emotion and, and honestly spiritual tech in all, in all shapes and forms. And so, we would catch our breath and be like, okay. And then it would just feel like another hit in another hit. And to be totally honest with you, here we are in a year later and we are still just like getting, getting hit. And it's, it is wildly humbling because it's like, It just sucks. And it, you know, you just wanna be like, okay, well, like, there was, there was a service at church a few months ago where we're singing like, about the goodness of God. And I was like, you know what?

kimber: 15:08

Not feeling

Jeanette: 15:08

I don't know. I don't know. Literally you could, you feel free to cut this if you on camera, but I was like, I'm gonna call BS here. Like I'm gonna call bs. Like, I do not see your goodness. I do not feel your faithfulness. And he just quietly whispered to me. My faithfulness is heaven. Like that is, that is the reward of our relationship. That that is what you, that is. This world is not my faithfulness, but my faithfulness lies in, in my goodness of heaven. And I was like, because I was mad at him, I was like, cool, you want me to die?

kimber: 15:39

That answer is terrible. Thank you,

Jeanette: 15:42

I was like, great. So if I wanna be your faithfulness. And so it was um, one of those moments where

kimber: 15:47

Hmm.

Jeanette: 15:47

I was like, it's just so, it was a word for me to hold onto like, will I see his faithfulness here on earth? Yes. And we. And sometimes it's through medication and sometimes it's through miraculous healing. And sometimes it's through friends, and sometimes it's just through surrender. But the, at the end of the day, this is not our home and, and I can hold on to my will and my way. I want to see it like this. And he's just gonna look at me and say like, okay, well I didn't make you God, so. What are we gonna do about that? And so it's just, um, it has been a rollercoaster of, um, trust.

kimber: 16:24

Yeah.

Jeanette: 16:24

I'm a big rollercoaster fan. I love roller coasters, but this is a ride. I would like to exit

kimber: 16:29

you're like, I'm not into this one. Thanks,

Jeanette: 16:32

I've got a lot of vertigo and I'm over it. Uh, so it's been, it's been a really wild season and probably, like I said, I, I have, Expert to, I've like tracked grief practice off of my list, like I know how to grieve, but my counselor and I had to have a long talk about like that preemptive grief. Like how do you know something or how do you prepare? Like, we don't know. I, I, I don't know my, the days of my father-in-law's life, but how do I prepare myself and my children and my husband walk alongside my mother-in-law? How do I do all of these things with. And well, like, I don't even know. And so we had a long talk about that, and it was just like sitting in the good moments and praying in the bad moments and laying aside worry when,

kimber: 17:17

Hmm.

Jeanette: 17:17

uh, I just heard somebody say like, what is true today? and that's really helped me recently. It was like, what is true today? Like I can worry about X, Y, Z, but that's actually. Maybe six months down the road. What is true today? Today my father-in-law feels good and he is able to exercise like he once couldn't. Um, his kidneys are fighting and they're doing a great job. Um, Zoe is on a great medication that is helping her control her moods. Um, my kids are, you know, walking in honesty and freedom from some sin. Um, my husband and I are like solid. So those are the truths that I can stand in today and be like, those are things that are true today, tomorrow. It might not be true, but today this

kimber: 17:57

are. Yeah.

Jeanette: 17:58

been, and that's been a really solid place for me to stand.

kimber: 18:01

Hmm. I love that cuz it, it almost reminds me of like, gratitude, but I love the perspective of what is true because it's not just, Okay, let me find like, what am I grateful for in this terrible situation? But it's also like it's grounding almost like these are the things that are true and it's okay that they're maybe only true today.

Jeanette: 18:21

Yeah,

kimber: 18:21

know?

Jeanette: 18:22

like whatever, whatever's noble, whatever's lovely, whatever's like, I, I have to go back to that verse because, because sometimes my thoughts are not noble of noble character. Sometimes my thoughts are not, uh, lovely. Sometimes I'm a doom and gloom person and God reminds me just every day like, That's not where we're supposed to think. Like, that's not where we're supposed to lie. Like, we can think those things and we can take him to the foot of the cross, because he's good there, like right. He, he can, he can carry it all. and so it's like, okay, whatever's true, whatever's noble of good character, lovely. Like think on these things. And so that's, that's been kind of my like go-to

kimber: 18:57

Yeah. I love that cuz it doesn't like, It doesn't deny that there are things that aren't lovely, you know, but it's like, but I can choose to focus on, on what is in this moment just as a way to bring me back to the goodness of God almost even when it doesn't feel like it. Yeah. How, how have you seen just this, like the drawn out nature? Grief that you were talking about that is something that feels like really hard for me. Like the impending, like knowing something is perhaps around the corner, like that feels so challenging to me, I think. And I think that's something that. Walking with a friend through that kind of a season can be really challenging because it's, it's not only like after a moment right, of grief and you're trying to help them grieve or be there for them. Right. But it's like this long, drawn out, um, season. How have you guys been kind of navigating that with friendships? Like where do you find like the boundaries for that to help you kind of, I guess like protect yourself from, you know, protect your friendships from just like always coming back to that or talking about that. Like how do you navigate those boundaries there of like walking a road of grief that's longer and more drawn?

Jeanette: 20:13

Yeah, I think the biggest thing for me has been to, to be really honest with our friends and like we are experiencing a season that we don't know it's gonna be like, and my in-laws live here in town, so that's been a great part. And so, So when we started this road of like, oh my gosh, my father-in-law's sick, we don't know what to do, our community group was like, okay, let us, like, let's make dinner for him. And so they went like two weeks on a two week rotation where somebody in our community group was bringing them dinner. And um, some of our dear friends did it too. And so it has been an exercise for me in not asking for help. But for receiving help for somebody else. So, um, it, it's been interesting cause my mother-in-law and father-in-law are not like prideful people at all, but they're, you know, a generation above and that it's a little bit different to like, look at these like young strangers, like, here's dinner. And they're like, we don't even know you. And so it's been really, really exciting to see their faith grow in that. But it's also been really humbling to walk, honestly. Um, and so it's like, Hey, how are you guys? And it's like, well, we got a really bad PET scan, or we, you know, like all of these things or, um, with kids' stuff, like there's, there's a certain group of people in our life who know, like the depths of our kids' stuff or our, um, Like the, pain that we're carrying. But then there's also a group of people who know, the level above and the level above. And so it's been interesting to like, protect our family, but also to walk completely open and be like, man, we are, we are broken. Which is part of, it's been a challenging thing. Online because so much of our content comes from our life, and this has been a season where I have been really content stunted because I don't feel like I can share a lot of what's going on within our home. And so as a mom, and not that I use my kids as content anyways, but like. It's just like a lot of the stuff we're walking through is like, well, like, you know, my father-in-law doesn't need me talking like what lessons I'm learning through his cancer, you know, that kind of thing. Um, but it's been a really sweet thing for me to sit with my community group and be honest and be, and be vulnerable and them, and them curious, like I said before. And so like learning just kind of even that lesson of. This is a season of like a contentment of like a season of quietness. Um, and it's also been a season of being poured into more than I've been poured out

kimber: 22:40

Hmm.

Jeanette: 22:41

and that, oh man, that is a humbling situation for me because I, like I said, I, I don't like asking for prayer for myself. I love praying for other people and serving other people, but like once you turn it around, it's like,

kimber: 22:53

Hmm.

Jeanette: 22:54

no, thank you so

kimber: 22:55

That's one thing that you do online that I love, is you ask, people how you can pray for them each month, which I think is really cool. But it's harder to receive, huh?

Jeanette: 23:04

it is hard to receive and I think that it's just a humility thing. It's just a, a, it's something like in humbling myself, but also in like, I don't know. It's a weird, it's a weird thing. I actually have a, a whole day in my devotional that I wrote about that like, It actually is like hindering me. I'm, I am hindering my friends from, like, loving me when I don't allow them to pray for me. And so there's always at least probably like five or six people who are like, how can I pray for you? After they said my, their prayer request. And I'm always like, how can you pray for me? This is like, okay, how can you not pray for me?

kimber: 23:38

Just send them all over, honestly.

Jeanette: 23:40

everything. Um, so, so yeah. I. it's been, it's been like, okay, who can we kind of like pour everything out to kind of

kimber: 23:49

Yeah.

Jeanette: 23:49

like that inner circle? Cause a lot of it is with our kids and then like, my father-in-law, he's a, you know, he's a big guy. He can, he can handle people showing up to hand him a, a free dinner. So that's a little bit better.

kimber: 23:59

It's like, it seems challenging to me though, because probably, lots of people know kind of what like your family's walking through and so it's like, some people, like you said, some people, you're going to go to a certain level of. deepness with, and some people you're not. And so how do, how have you like learned that walk that line of like, how do I be honest with people when they're asking like, how are things like, how's he doing? Like, what's going on? How can we help? Things like that with the people that you're not gonna go there with.

Jeanette: 24:32

Yeah, that's been a really interesting thing. And my, my oldest and I were just talking about it cuz he asked me how I was doing the other day and I was like, I'm not doing great. And he was like, oh. And he's like, I'm still getting used to people like answering that question honestly. And I'm like, I know. Isn't it funny? Like, cause we're just expect to hear like a good, oh, I'm good.

kimber: 24:51

I'm good. Yeah,

Jeanette: 24:52

Yeah, totally fine. And I said, and I was like, I think it does, it does our community, like whether, you know, they're close to us or not, kind of does'em a disservice. Um, now there is, like, I did ask a security guard, a gated community the other day, like, how are you? And he's like, terrible and, and just unloaded. And I was like, oh, I, I got his name. And I was like, sir, I'm gonna be praying for.

kimber: 25:13

Oh, that's

Jeanette: 25:14

And so, uh, so we did, but I was just like, so there's a, there's a little bit of like that boundary, right? I like that you're saying. And so I think that it's been, um, we had a neighbor stop me at a festival a couple, a couple weeks ago and she was like, Hey, how's your father-in-law? And I was like, you know, he's not great, but he's not terrible. Like it's, it's been a really bad season. And, and so I think it's just kind of, um, I have been told I have speed bumps around me, not walls. So like, I don't have great walls,

kimber: 25:43

speed bumps.

Jeanette: 25:44

so has to be bums, uh, So I think for the most part I'm like, well, he's not great, you know, and then it's like, but, but there's also like, good here too. And so I try to like, it's kind of like that, um, sandwich, like a compliment sandwich. Like he's doing a lot better. This, this seems to be working. He's got a lot of side effects right now, but, but overall, he's feeling much better than he

kimber: 26:05

hmm. Yeah. And that may be just different for everyone too, depending on whether they have like fortified walls or just speed bumps, you know,

Jeanette: 26:14

yeah. Yeah. Those speed bumps, they get me in trouble a lot, but I also feel like I'm serving my community.

kimber: 26:20

Yeah. They enable you to connect with people in a way that's is maybe harder for some people. Most likely, yeah. How do you think that, like as you've been walking just through this season of like that, I mean some grief in it, but also the. Preemptive um, as well. how have your friends like, loved you? Well, would you say, or, uh, ways that they have maybe not. um, you know, as we're like thinking about, okay, like for friends in my life, who are walking through a hard season like this where there is some kind of like drawn out grief, uh, that's either coming or it's, just a long season of it. Uh, how do you think that we can be good friends to each other?

Jeanette: 27:05

I love, I love this question. I just, I love encouraging us to be good friends and friends that show up, and friends that are aware.

kimber: 27:12

Yeah.

Jeanette: 27:13

I think the most hurtful thing is when you can tell somebody what's going on and they either compare like that, like compare, uh, what is it like hardship Olympics almost, where they're like, yeah, but this and this and this, and it's like, right. Well thank you. But then you also kind of learn like how much you can share, right? Like, that's kind of my gauge. It's like, oh man, this, this is going on. And it's like, oh, you're not a person. I'll just dump

kimber: 27:35

I shouldn't, yeah, I shouldn't share this kind of thing with you.

Jeanette: 27:38

Yeah, but that also is hurtful, right? So if you have somebody, and I know, you know, as a military spouse, like, you have to go deep fast. And so it's like and so as you start going deep and you're like, Ooh, I gotta pull back. Like that's a really hard, like, it's a grieving situation to be put in. And so I I think the hardest part has been people who haven't shown up like I had hoped they would, you know? Uh, and that feels a little bit needy. Uh, and I hate that part of myself, but it also is just like the, um, The real side where it's

kimber: 28:05

Yeah. you need things right now. Yeah. Yeah.

Jeanette: 28:08

Like, I thought this person would show up and they didn't. Or, um, or I didn't know what I needed at that moment and that kind of thing. And so, like I said, sometimes it's like you don't know what you need until you need it.

kimber: 28:18

mm

Jeanette: 28:19

But then you also have those people who anticipate those needs and who call you out, who call you out and say like, Hey, you're hiding. Like don't hide, don't pull back. Like lean in. Um, what can we do? What can, and and we had friends who while we were like in the beginning of this all, they were bringing us dinner and I'm like, I can cook dinner. She's like, you were sad. just let yourself be sad. Here's a, here's a dinner. And that was so, so kind. And so I think it's just like, the best part is when people show up And you don't expect it. Um, we had a friend back home, uh, who lost their five year old, and we still lived close by, and it was, to me, it was just the best thing that we could do just to show up with zero expectations, right? So it's like, Hey, I'm gonna come over and make dinner, and we would make dinner and clean up the house and just sit. Um, it was just about being there for them. Yeah, that presence matters so much. And I think that we overthink that. I know I overthink that a lot. I'm maybe they don't want me. Maybe this isn't helpful. Maybe this. And it's like sometimes just having an extra body there is really comforting. And I know that that's kind of what, speaks to me the most is just having somebody who answers the phone. um, having somebody that you tell yourself, I will always answer the phone when this person calls.

kimber: 29:29

Right,

Jeanette: 29:30

I have two people like that, um, that if they call me except for like in the middle of an interview or something like that, but if they call me, like I'll always call back or I'll always answer the phone because those are the people who bring life to me and bring me joy and bring me encouragement, but also like call me out. And so, I think the things that have helped me helping people like that, people who, who lean in and the things that have hurt me, is then the people who you thought they were gonna lean in and they didn't. but then at the same time, it's like kind of like taking that thought and kind of twisting it a little bit, but like, but who did show up? Like who was there? Who

kimber: 30:02

Focusing on that. Yeah. Because I think it's really easy, at least what, what like comes for me is I see lack. Like way quicker than I see abundance a lot of the time, and it's like easy to focus on like who didn't show up instead of who did and well, like what a gift that is.

Jeanette: 30:24

Yeah. And it's hard, it's hard to see who didn't show up or who did show up, you know, because they're there and, and most of the times they came in and out without making a sound right. Um, because that's their servant's heart. Um, and so the people who are always expected to be there, kind of the loud presence. And so you miss that, right? Like, it, it's easier to.

kimber: 30:44

Yeah, absolutely. Hey friend, forgive me for taking a quick moment in this conversation to ask a favor of you. I hope my conversation with Jeanette is blessing you today. And if so, it's you take a moment to rate and review the show on apple podcasts. Reviews are so helpful and encouraging new friends to find the show. And I do love reading. What is blessing you from the podcast? You can find the link to leave a review and the description of this episode. So thank you so much for doing that today. You guys have the best. Okay. Now back to the show. how have you seen loneliness come just for your heart in this time? Would you say,

Jeanette: 31:32

I think the loneliness in this season is probably actually more in motherhood than it is in, The preemptive grief with my father-in-law. Um, and like I said, there's, there's been like really great days with him and really bad days with him. Um, so I think that that's kind of ebbed and flowed, and I think within motherhood has actually been the hardest because like we said, like we don't share a lot of what our kids go through because sometimes it's their stories or sometimes there's shame on our own built into it. And that was even just yesterday, I told my husband's like, well, you know that this is not a reflection on us. And

kimber: 32:02

Hmm.

Jeanette: 32:04

I know we

kimber: 32:04

like it. A bit

Jeanette: 32:05

but I'm still looking for where we missed the mark. Um, what, you know, what did you, all of those things like all the questioning of myself. And so I think, uh, in this season, loneliness has, manifested in motherhood, thankfully. I have a husband who speaks truth to me, and I have a friend, I have multiple friends who know this, these situations. Um, and they love my kids no matter what. And that's been like the best, is like, I can handle my loneliness. I can handle my grief right now. Like, like I feel a little bit, Emptied out and poured out for the sake of my children. Like for the sake of like this, like massive care. Like it feels like the intensive care unit at our house, right? Like we're like dealing, dealing, dealing, putting out fires, like all of this stuff. And then I have friends kind of coming alongside my children saying like, we are speaking truth over you. We love you. We are doing this, we are doing that. Like really rallying around my kids. And that gives me the opportunity to. To rest myself in a sense, but it also makes for a very less lonely season because if if, I mean, I'm my kids. Are the best thing in the entire world. Like nobody could tell me any different. Um, however, they're they're rocking my world this season. And so it's like one of those things where I'm like, but they're so cute and I just love'em so much. And, and my friends are like, yes, that is absolutely true and they are good. And so I think it's having those kind of voices around me that's like the reminder of like, Hey, this is not who they are. Like this is not the final say this, all of that. It's been so, so helpful. Because I'm blind, because I love them so

kimber: 33:44

Yeah.

Jeanette: 33:45

but at the same time, I'm so mad, you know, I'm so like exhausted and mad and all those different

kimber: 33:49

Well, and it's like you're so close to it too, you know, you can't get perspective.

Jeanette: 33:54

And so I think that like when I allow the voice of the enemy to be like, yeah, this is because of you. Not, no, we live in a fallen world and sin is gonna come for our kids. Um, no, but this is, you missed some stuff. You allowed too much. You did this. That is where the, the loneliness for me is like, you know what? My kids probably don't need to see other people. My kids probably don't need to be around other people. They're probably gonna, you know, like all of these things and, and then, you know, I messed up. I shouldn't honestly, like, I, I am so thankful in my work. I have somebody, like a mentor in my, in my business and I was like, I don't know that I should be talking about parenting right now. and she's like, oh my gosh. She's like, absolutely not. And I was like, okay, because that's, because that's what the lie tells us, right? Like, if you're struggling, you can't talk about this. Or if you're not an expert. And I'm like, for the love of goodness, I've never claimed to be an expert in parenting or in marriage. I never want that title. Uh, but it's, it's those lies that creep in that get really loud, that tell you. You should just sit back and you should just be quiet and you should just not call your people because you're embarrassed or because you're this. And that has probably been the hardest part in this season.

kimber: 35:04

Yeah, it's like the, the silencing. It's like the enemy doesn't try to silence us just by, telling us to be quiet. It's always in those subtle ways that we like, don't realize until it's like, oh, like I've been sidelined here by believing the lies. And I love that you have someone in your life who can say like, Nope, that's not it. You know?

Jeanette: 35:27

Yeah, it's been a blessing. It's been really good.

kimber: 35:28

Yeah. What would you say that you know now about God that you didn't know before this crazy year hit you guys?

Jeanette: 35:38

I, I think I've always known how present he is. and I think like the hardest part in all of this has been when I'm like, in like a ship tossed at sea. And I'm just like, like, where are you? When is the, when is this storm gonna calm down? And, and all of those things. And it's kind of like that verse where he says like, where's your faith? Like, don't you know where I am? Don't you know who I am? so there's so many verses that come to mind with that. Like, be still and let the Lord fight for you. Like, like, here I am. And so that's kind of where I've grown the most and seen him the most is in those moments where I'm like, Thrashing around and like, just like, what's going on? And he's like, just chill. Like, I'm here. like I'm faithful. I am good. I am present. And I think that that's been the biggest thing is like doubting his presence has been really, really humbling because it's like, who am I to think that God would leave me? Like, like of all, you know, like it's one of those things. It was like I would never tell a friend that he would like, yeah, God's probably left your side. Like you've

kimber: 36:37

right. You would never say that and you wouldn't believe it about someone

Jeanette: 36:41

no, absolutely not. So then, but then it's like such a, um, it's almost like a pretentious or like, yeah, he would leave me like, no, like what a weird thing that you would believe Janette. Like, he would not leave you. He has not left you. he's right there. Like all you have to do is be still and the Lord will fight for you. And that's kind of like his presence, his presence has always been near. but trusting in that presence has been where I've lacked.

kimber: 37:06

Yeah, Cuz it doesn't always feel

Jeanette: 37:08

Yeah. And like how selfish am I to think that he would leave me? Like, you know, like, that sounds like very arrogant at the same time, but it's like, Of all the people in all the world, I'm gonna be like,

kimber: 37:17

You're the one exception

Jeanette: 37:18

What?

kimber: 37:19

Oh man. When you're in it, though, it, it's so hard not to think that,

Jeanette: 37:24

yeah, yeah. Because you can't see anything from it, right? You can't like, And we're still in the middle of some of this. And so it's like, I don't know what the outcomes are gonna be, but I can, I can stand like Chad, me Bendigo and say like, even if I believe the Lord is good, even if I believe God has a plan in this, I don't know what it is. I can't see where it could even be good all the time. But I trust his goodness and his, mercy and power and, And there was a, I was just listening to a podcast about, it was like reading through the gospels

kimber: 37:59

Mm-hmm.

Jeanette: 38:00

Peter walked on water. And believe, like trusted God enough to, to take a step out of a boat and walk on water. But he was so distracted by the winds and the waves that he started sinking. And I was like, okay, God. I'm distracted by the winds and the waves. Like, I need to focus, I need to refocus and set my eyes on you because I know you're here. I know that you're in this storm. but I've let the winds and ways distract me. I

kimber: 38:21

mm. Yeah, I love that story too because it's like, the wind and the waves, like it's a storm. Like it makes sense that it would be distracting. Like it's a weighty thing. And so it's not so much that like, oh, like I'm so silly for being distracted by this stuff. Like, you know, I just think that's such like the grace of God because it's like, yeah, it is hard. Like it is really terrible. but he's still there and he gives us a way. Through it.

Jeanette: 38:47

Yeah. It's so, so kind of him just to, just to be like, I'm here. Just keep your, like, yeah. It's terrifying. But at the same time, like I mean, honestly, like this world is pretty scary. Like, Like, I can imagine being distracted. I am easily distracted. Like, so keeping our eyes and focus on him is, is

kimber: 39:04

Hmm.

Jeanette: 39:04

I.

kimber: 39:04

Yeah. I would love to kind of wrap up our conversation with just some encouragement for our friends listening. Um, I feel like there's two kind of sides of this coin here. the first person I'm thinking of is a friend listening who she's like walking with a friend through this kind of a, a situation, and it's not her. it's not her life, it's not her story, but when you walk closely with someone through something, you're in it with them and you feel like some of that grief, I think. And, um, yet you wanna love'em, well, you wanna, you know, be there for them. so what do you think for a friend listening who's just trying to like, love her friend? Well, through this friend's journey on grief, especially like if it's a drawn out kind of thing, um, or a hard season, what do you you would tell her to keep in mind today?

Jeanette: 39:56

I think just the reminder of, It's longevity, right? Like we are, doing life together as friends. And I think that that's such a gift. Um, when you get to, when you get to season like, do multiple seasons with people, it's such a gift. And so, I think taking some time to be like, like asking your friend? Like, what do you need in this season? Like, what are some ways that I can serve you and love you and, and be with you in this season? And we've gotten to do that with some friends. And some friends have gotten to do that with us. It's such a. like I said, it's, it is just a gift to do that. But I think, I love putting reminders on my phone of like, Hey, check in with this person. Our friends are even friends with our my in-laws. And so they will check in, they'll, they will skip me and go

kimber: 40:35

That's

Jeanette: 40:35

in-laws, which is so kind. And we've done, we've done the same thing. Like it's just, it's just a gift to do life with people. And so, I think I always talk about my best friend Juliana. and we had that, A A D T R conversation. Like we determined our relationship or defined our relationship. and I think having those kind of conversations with your people is really, it deepens it. Cause it's like, I want this kind of relationship are you in? And then, and then you get to like, kind of make it, make it, make it look like what you want it to look like. And so it's such, it's really fun.

kimber: 41:07

Hmm,

Jeanette: 41:08

but then you get to do stuff like caring for each other's parents or caring for their grandparents. Um, carry their grief, uh, at the loss of somebody. And so I think setting reminders in their phone, I think, uh, determining their relationship or defining the relationship. And I think, sometimes bypassing, like if you don't know what they need, I'm sure you can guess,

kimber: 41:27

yeah,

Jeanette: 41:27

like just guess about it.

kimber: 41:28

yeah. Because your, your guess is probably close. And if it's like totally off, they'll probably tell you

Jeanette: 41:35

Yeah. Yeah. And really, Starbucks goes so far, most days anyways, so

kimber: 41:39

it's true. It's true. absolutely. I love too, just that, Like if you define the relationship, like you say, that's maybe a way also to maybe avoid some of the pitfall that comes from like the disappointment of a friend not showing up like you hoped they would. And I don't think it's, that's that. You can avoid that always. But that's maybe a way to say like, Hey, like this is what I really want from our friendship. Do you want that from our friendship? then I think you're on the same page, which can be such a. yeah.

Jeanette: 42:09

For.

kimber: 42:10

And what about the friend who is listening, who is on a long hard road, who is in it today? What would you tell her if you could, like, like look her in the eyes, grab her shoulders. What does she need to remember today?

Jeanette: 42:25

I think the thing I long to hear, and I'm so thankful that I have people whispering it to me. I have people shouting it at me. Um, we were sitting with our best friends and I said, I said, I'm really sorry that we're hard to be friends

kimber: 42:39

Hmm. Yeah.

Jeanette: 42:41

friend, very, she's a fiery red head, so this makes

kimber: 42:44

Hmm.

Jeanette: 42:45

She goes, I need you to shut up. Right. I was like,

kimber: 42:49

Yes,

Jeanette: 42:50

I was like, we're just, we're just really hard. Like we, like we cannot catch a break and we are really hard to carry and we are really hard just to love right now. And her husband, at the same time as she told me to shut up, her husband said, it's a, it's a joy to carry you guys. And she was like, shut it. And so I think that, to, to like hug a friend and say like, you are worth caring. You are, you are not alone. You are so deeply loved, not only by your father, but by your people. And if you are feeling lonely. Make that move. Like I know that you're already like, well great, I'm drowning and now you want me to find a friend. But yeah, I do Like I want you to find someone that you can be honest with. I want you to not wait for somebody to ask you how you're really doing. I want you to say, Hey, I'm not okay, or, Hey, we're really struggling. Um, cuz whether it's your marriage or your in-laws, or your children or your job or whatever it is like, You deserve to be held and loved and carried because you are create, you are created by our creator to do magnificent things, and you are worthy of being loved as a good friend and being a good friend to others. So I think if you have a friend that you're like, I don't know that I could say this too, um, I'm gonna challenge you to like do some work and find someone.

kimber: 44:09

Yeah.

Jeanette: 44:09

Or text a friend that you're, that you're like, that person's actually shown up for me a lot and I haven't, I haven't reciprocated. Um, because I bet you that person has been pursuing you and you've been kind of ignoring it because Kimberly, you know, friendships are a lot like dating relationships. Like I wish, I wish that we talked about it more like this because, because, if we were to look at it that way, our friendships would be a lot more like romantic relationships

kimber: 44:36

they would. And I think it would seem clearer because we are very familiar with like the dating

Jeanette: 44:41

Yeah, I'm gonna pursue you, you're gonna pursue me. And all of a sudden we're in love, right?

kimber: 44:46

right?

Jeanette: 44:47

And so, but, but that's how friendships need to be. I'm gonna pursue this friend, and if I'm getting shut down, then I'm gonna move to the next friend. Um, but if you find that relationship that you can kind of gel with or you're like, oh shoot, that person's asked me to coffee like five times and I've been too busy. It's like, You need to call that person. And that's, that's what we're saying, like find those people who love you and who'll carry you and who pursues you and pursue them back because doing this life alone is so impossible. And I know that you're a big proponent of that too. Like loneliness is a thief. But that's, that's honestly like where I lay with it and it's like,

kimber: 45:20

Hmm.

Jeanette: 45:20

um, Loneliness, fl to us, loneliness kind of sits in that like, woe is me poor and not, like, I'm not trying to say like, Every time we're lonely, we're feeling like selfish. But there is that level of like selfishness when it comes to loneliness, where it's like, I'm alone. No one likes me. It's kind of me focused. Mm-hmm. Where if we kind of like take that live captive and we're like, this is actually not what I'm called to be and where I'm supposed to be at, then we can kind of like dispel that very fast and be like, okay, I'm not called. To be alone, like we are called to carry one another. We are called to hold up one another's arms. We are like, where two or more are gathered and a court of three is not easily broken. All of those things, tell us the truth about loneliness, which is that loneliness isn't God's plan for us. Yeah,

kimber: 46:05

It's not what we're designed for. not at all. I love that. Mm, so good. Thank you so much for sharing with us today, Jeanette. I loved hearing just your wisdom on this from the context of your story and just, what you, I mean, friendship is what you get to share about all the time online, and so I know it's really close to your heart.

Jeanette: 46:23

It is. I do love it. And I'm just so thankful for you, for your ministry and everything that you're doing to share. it is not always easy to share your life on internet, but you're doing a great job and I'm, I'm

kimber: 46:34

encouraged by you. Thank you. Well, speaking of, will you tell our friends a little bit how they can connect with you further if they, they're like, I need to hear

Jeanette: 46:43

more from that girl. Oh, you're so sweet. Uh, I'm on TikTok. No, I'm, I am. Talk probably more than I should be. And that's a tapley. I'm on Instagram way more than I should be. And that's a tapley as well. Yeah. Um, and then if you wanna look up my podcast, I have two. Yeah. It's time for coffee where we sit down with people and we make sure that, you feel seen, heard, and never alone, no matter what stage of life you're in. And then work, uh, moms at work is for the working mom, which we always like side eye, and. All moms are working moms. Sure. Um, and we get to encourage, encourage one another in all of our work and just kind of talk about like helpful tips and and are encouraged by some really incredible people over there as well. Yeah. Uh, I get to teach over there more, so it's a lot, uh, a lot more of me like sitting behind the microphone alone, which I love. That's cool. And then, uh, yeah, my website, janet tapley.com. If you need anything, like, if, if Instagram didn't, like, if you didn't find what you needed on Instagram, janet tapley.com, it's on, on the website. We'll do it for you.

kimber: 47:40

Cool. Oh, well I love it. Well, friends listening, Jeanette is incredible. If you don't follow her, you should. and definitely check out her podcast cuz they're also really have, I've really enjoyed them at least, so. Mm-hmm. Thank you so much for what you do and for talking with us I loved it. Thanks friend. Thank you.

Jeanette: 47:56

Thank you so much. I appreciate it.

kimber: 48:03

Friends. I'm so glad you could join Janette and I, this week on the, your sister Kimber podcast. If you're walking a grief journey today, friend. I want you to know that I am so honored that you would join us. I pray Jeanette story and wisdom has blessed you as you pursue the Lord on this road. And if you're walking alongside a friend through such a time, I want to encourage you to look for ways to intentionally show up for them before they ask. My new digital resource might be just the tool. You need to get the details that can help you do this. It's called 20 facts to know about your friends. And these are the kinds of things that are just going to give you the ideas to bless and love on them in tangible ways. It's a free PDF. You can download and either print it out or just text it to a friend to fill out for you. Then save those ideas in your phone, under their contact card for when you need it. You can get this resource on my website, which is linked in the description of this episode. And if you haven't yet joined, my newsletter crew will leave is@yoursisterkimber.com to subscribe. When you join, you get my weekly newsletter to your email inbox, and it has a preview of what will be featured on the podcast that week. Plus a link to this month's blog post, and some other resources to help you grow friendships that honor God and draw closer to Jesus. Friends thank you so much for being part of this community until next time it's your sister kimber