Ep.58 Confiding with Confidence

We all want a friend who is trustworthy, in whom we can confide with confidence, but the truth is that, while we can try to be discerning about who we share what with, at the end of the day, friendship demands trust. 

So how can we lead the way in being a friend who is trustworthy for our people? 

Kimber and series guest co-host Meghan Fravel look at three areas of friendship that demand trust: in the moment, behind your back, and down the road. Check out this  episode to learn how we can grow as trustworthy friends in each of these areas.

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Transcript

Kimber: 0:09

Hey friends. Welcome to the, your sister Kimber podcast. My name is Kimberly Gilbert, and I'm so glad you're here. My summer guest co-host Megan frable. And I are talking today about what it looks like to be a friend who is trustworthy in all areas of our relationships. We get into harsh judgment gossip and not keeping a record of wrongs in today's conversation. And I know it challenged me in how I honor my friends with my words, with my actions and even with my silence sometimes. I wish we could all talk this out over coffee today, but this is the next best thing. I'm so glad you here, friend. Let's get started. Hey friends. Please welcome back. My guest co-host for the summer series, Megan phrasal. How are you doing Megan?

Meghan: 0:59

I'm doing great. How are.

Kimber: 1:01

Yeah, I'm good. We have been on a bit of a summer break here at the podcast for just the last few weeks. And so, I'm happy to be back talking with you. It's been so fun. Um, we've talked about like all the things, I feel like

Meghan: 1:15

all thanks.

Kimber: 1:16

Yeah. So, and we're gonna get a few more of all the things.

Meghan: 1:19

Yes.

Kimber: 1:20

up in these next few weeks. but we haven't talked in a little bit, what is like one fun summer thing that you've done. Since we last talked, we've had approximately like four days of summer.

Meghan: 1:30

I was gonna, I was just gonna say, well, summer, um,

Kimber: 1:34

that.

Meghan: 1:35

currently raining, um, yes. The other, so Monday, it was beautiful. I was gorgeous out and so I went out, um, I couldn't get out early in the morning, so I went out hiking around like afternoon, like 12 o'clock. It was so, it was so hot. So hot. I'm like, this is why I hike at like five in the morning and not at noon. but I took out a book. I brought a book out with me and like my boom speaker, and I just found this like big, big rock, like nobody was around me. And I literally just put on some music and laid in the sun for probably over an hour and read a little bit and just like took a nap out in the woods with country music. it. was awesome.

Kimber: 2:15

And, you got, if only it worked like this, we could get like a whole week's worth of vitamin D in one sitting like.

Meghan: 2:22

Yeah. I didn't even wear

Kimber: 2:23

by the smart people, it doesn't work that way.

Meghan: 2:26

No, I didn't even wear sunblock. I'm like, burn, burn, burn me.

Kimber: 2:31

So true. So true. This is going to be coming out like mid to late July. So this conversation, and so, man, I'm hoping.

Meghan: 2:41

We

Kimber: 2:41

keep saying this, I feel like, like maybe by this time it'll be study.

Meghan: 2:46

I feel like every day I'm like, we're about to turn a corner. The corner's not next corner.

Kimber: 2:51

like start wearing shorts. I'm like, I'm just sending it and it's too cold for this, but it's fine.

Meghan: 2:57

You know what? it's fine. Yep. I'm wearing my sandals right now. I'm like, I don't care. It's raining. I don't

Kimber: 3:02

all good. Well, I love it. Well, we have been, if you were listening and just kind of hopping in randomly, we have been in a series here on the podcast called being the friend you need. And we've been going through this all summer so far. I really encourage you if you're just jumping into like go back and listen to the intro episode. It was episode 52. And it's called being the friends you need. And in that conversation, Megan, and I kind of just talk about like the vision for this series and, like kind of where this idea came from what we mean by it. And. Um, just like where we hope that these conversations will invite you guys listening to, it's been kind of all about just how our relationship with Jesus can spill out into our friendships and help us grow in being that kind of friend that we want in our lives. So this isn't really about just like try harder, do better, but it's more about how these things that we want to pursue at Jesus, um, actually impact our friendships in some really cool ways. And so Megan, I would love to hear at this point kind. In our conversations. What do you feel like is an area of friendship that you've just seen growing this summer? Or like, what do you feel like God is kind of working on in your relationships right now?

Meghan: 4:11

Um, I think that one of the big things is just taking it to a deeper level has been really good. Like, ha making more space for authentic, deeper conversations and not just like, while it's great and I love, like, hey, let's just go hike. And sometimes you can have deeper talks or whatever, but we're usually doing something different, you know, so just making that space of like, I really wanna like get together with you and. Like really invest in like what's going on in your life. Um, and so just kind of more communicating that of, hey, this is what, like one of my goals is for us to get together. Um, so that's been really wonderful just to, to do that. We've been, I've been meeting with a friend like once a week and we've just been like walking the track and it's like to go deep with each other. So that's been really fun.

Kimber: 4:55

That's cool. How did you like, express that that was something that you wanted? Because I think that's something some people struggle with is like, they want that kind of, those kinds of conversations in their friendships, but they're like, How do I initiate

Meghan: 5:07

yeah, yeah. Um, I just say it. like, yeah, I Just said it. Yeah. Yeah.

Kimber: 5:13

Yeah. Absolutely.

Meghan: 5:15

I don't have a problem expressing, but just, uh, Yeah. I was like, Hey, I wanna, I was thinking about doing this or you know, are you cool with that? And I dunno. Yeah.

Kimber: 5:23

Yeah, absolutely. What is like Ben, your favorite? Fruit that's come out of that kind of intentional time to like go deeper with that person.

Meghan: 5:31

I think that it's brought me like, well, just our friendship closer together. I feel like it's been really wonderful to kind of see a different piece of Jesus through my friend, like when we're talking and what, like what she feels like the Holy Spirit's telling her or opinions or kind of like their advice, whatever it is. Um, just to kind of hear that different perspective of it has been. Yeah, really life giving and wonderful, so yeah.

Kimber: 5:56

before, the break that we took the past few weeks with, from these conversations we were talking about. Um, how we can like grow spiritual intimacy in our relationships with people just meaning like that closeness in spiritual matters, because I think it's, it can be easy to go through a friendship and like, maybe even, you know, that you're both Christians, but like, do you talk about your spirituality with each other, you know, and. And sometimes it can be hard to like kind of, bridge into that, those kinds of conversations. And so I really love that you're creating some intentional space for that and that then you're seeing the fruit of that. I feel like a big part of that is what we're talking about today. And that is. Um, being in relationships that you feel like you can trust the person in that, and then vice versa, being a trustworthy friend. And I think that, you know, we all want that, like, of course. My friends who are trustworthy. and so I think that it is something that we could demystify a little bit. And so today I want to talk a little bit about just like what this looks like. Like, what are some of the. some of the fruit that we should look for in people that are potentially going to be like trustworthy people that we could lean into those relationships. And then how do we demonstrate that in practical ways to our people. And as far as like our series kind of concept, I feel like this trustworthiness is just like such a reflection of the character of God. And just that idea that like the ways that. He interacts with us. Like he is trustworthy, right. that can be a model for how we do friendship. And so this is kind of an aspect of that relationship that we like, see how God behaves towards us. Even when we dropped the ball on, you know, honoring him and stuff. and then how we can like be friends who are trustworthy, even when our friends maybe drop the ball. On us in that regard. And so, one thing that I was kind of thinking about with this is just the idea of girl hurt, um, and kind of that. Not a relevant topic at all. I'm sure. To any of us, um, But I was thinking about this, like, you know, I hear P I've heard people say before, and I've experienced this too. Like It's a struggle to trust a friend sometimes in a relationship because of previous hurt, like it, your inability, or like a challenge to trust someone in a new friendship might have very little to do with that friendship. In fact, probably has very little do with that. It's probably previous. Would you agree with that?

Meghan: 8:21

Absolutely. Oh yeah, absolutely. Yeah.

Kimber: 8:24

so so I would love to hear kind of, you know, have you experienced girl hurt? Um, how do you feel like that has impacted your friendships down the road? Like. You know, what is kind of the dynamic here of how past hurt? Impacts our ability to trust our friends today.

Meghan: 8:42

Yeah, yeah. Yes, I've experienced lots of girl hurt. Um, you know, I think just my whole life and I'm, and I've been the one that's done it too. Like it's not just, you know, me or that I'm the one that's. Been hurt the most, but, um, yeah, absolutely. And I find for me, I tend to be a pretty trusting person upfront. It's when I start to get closer to people that I feel that like, that will trigger of, of past hurt starting to kind of flare up a little bit. Like, the what ifs. Yep. Yep. It's like oh, now I'm getting close to this person. Are they gonna leave? You know, is that, that's that for me, that is what will always go through my brain. Um, and a lot of that is just my past. Her and I have found that that has made like a chasm between my friendships because I'm projecting something onto them that they. Have not done to me. You know? Um, and they're like, Hey, I'm trying to get close, but if you're like, waiting for the shoe to drop, basically, you know, like, how's that going to help our friendship? I'm like, no, it's, you're right. Like it's 100% true. Um,

Kimber: 9:47

I feel like I do the same thing, but, but then like the challenges. You're like you said there you're like, yeah, it won't help, but I still do it.

Meghan: 9:57

but I still do it.

Kimber: 9:58

It's like, I think we intellectually acknowledged this and that. I think there is space obviously here for things like counseling and. You

Meghan: 10:05

100%. 100%.

Kimber: 10:07

through. Your your junk. Um, but in the midst of it, it still impacts right. Even as we're working through that.

Meghan: 10:15

yep. And so I think it's really important to, I would say, be honest with your friends of like, Hey, I've experienced some of her and this is where like maybe I still have some woundings that haven't been fully healed over yet. Um, And it has nothing really. It's that whole, like, it's me, it's not me. It's, or it's you. It's not whatever. Um, It's me. Um,

Kimber: 10:39

me

Meghan: 10:39

and it's me not you.

Kimber: 10:41

No way. Oh, wait. What's the phrase.

Meghan: 10:43

what is that the phrase. It's me. It's not you it's me. Yeah. Som like, what? It's not you, it's

Kimber: 10:48

We were close.

Meghan: 10:49

you're close. Um, and yeah, I think just being really open and honest about that too. And because then that gives them the ability of knowing where you're at and how they can maybe love you well through that and maybe even walk you through, okay, well how can we, how can we get this part of you healed? You know, maybe that is you going to counseling, maybe that is just, Hey, I have a heads up and I. When I feel that like wall go up, I, I know what that is.

Kimber: 11:15

Yeah, absolutely. I feel like I'm the same way. Like I usually give trust pretty easily until I feel like someone mishandles.

Meghan: 11:25

Yeah.

Kimber: 11:25

I've trusted with them in some way. And I recognize fully that that a lot of that is informed by past hurt. And

Meghan: 11:34

Mm-hmm.

Kimber: 11:35

as I try to work through that, you know, in healthy ways, that can always be growing, but the reality is that. I experienced things from friends. And like you said, I. am the perpetrator of, you know, these things too at times. That that break down trust in my relationship. And I feel like when that happens, It's obviously then harming our relationships in lots of different ways. And so, as I was kind of thinking about some different ways that I feel like this can happen, I sort of thought of kind of three areas that. I would love to pick your brain on how we can try to kind of flip the tables on this and like, how can I be someone who is trustworthy in this kind of moment? Not just, how do I need my friends to serve me here, um, as, as trustworthy people, but how can I lead the way in this? And so as we get into those kind of three areas, I would love to start with just like broad picture. Um, what do you feel like? It means to be a trustworthy. Worthy friends. So if we're like acknowledging our hurt, right. And how we hope that people will, treat us as trustworthy people, we can't really control that. We can only lead the way in it. And so, um, what do you feel like that looks like if you described someone as a trustworthy friend, what do you think would kind of be the outward manifestations of that?

Meghan: 12:57

Uh, I think if I was to describe a trustworthy friend, it'd be someone that? keeps our issues between each other. that tells me the truth isn't. So, it's not only just like keeping things private between us, but also isn't afraid to step on my toes a little bit either. Um, And that they can trust my response, you know, I know it's not always gonna be awesome or vice versa, that we're able to have that kind of iron sharpening iron conversation if it needs to happen. I think that it means protecting your name behind your, your back, you know, in group settings if your name were to come up, um, someone that's not gonna just go with the flow of what's happening, but say, oh yeah, you know, let's change that subject, or, She's not, you know? Um, so for me, that would be some of the qualities, definitions I look for.

Kimber: 13:46

would think of. Yeah. I feel like the, the behind my back gossiping one is definitely one that came to mind for me, as well as like, uh, you said, like, tell me the truth in the moment. Like, to me. That in the there's an in the moment trustworthiness. That happens. and I think the flip side of that is. Judgmentalism, like in the moment, you know, um, there's a behind my back. Like trustworthiness and it's happened when I have no idea what's happening. And I can't really know about that unless I hear about it on the road. but I have to trust that. And then I think there's like a down the road kind of. One as well, where for me the idea of like weaponizing things that I share can come in. So, um,

Meghan: 14:30

yeah. That's good.

Kimber: 14:31

Yeah. So let's kind of get into the, like in the moment when, so like that responding, um, you know, you share something with someone or someone, I guess we should say it from the perspective of someone shares something with me. In a moment that maybe is like a little bit hard to receive or maybe. I just, I hear it. And I'm like, oh wow. I have lots of opinions about that. Like,

Meghan: 14:54

Yes.

Kimber: 14:55

You know what I mean? Like in that moment, how can we protect ourselves against a harsh judgment, you know? And instead respond in a manner that's going to demonstrate that we're a trustworthy friend to our people. So what comes to your mind for that idea of like in the moment, how can we demonstrate ourselves as trustworthy?

Meghan: 15:14

yeah, I think taking a deep breath first, and. I think that also recognizing that none of us are perfect and if like my friend is coming sits me down and says like, I need to tell you about something that's going on in my life, like in that moment, I also need to remember that it could so easily be me on the other side of that, or I'm not, I'm not the only one that like, I'm not perfect here in any, and I got my stuff too, and so how can I like be the body of Christ in that moment for her of just giving her grace. Not, not necessarily like being like, oh, you know, talking or like, it's, everything's fine. It's fine. But meeting her in that moment with like mercy and grace and just, and love for her, for love for that person to be like, I'm here for you. How, like, what can I do to help? And having that posture of humility and not this one of like, oh, you know, like you really messed up. Now sometimes it's be like, Yeah. you messed up. Okay, so what can we do to fix this? But there's, but there's that. Yeah. That judgmentalism isn't, isn't there? And so, and I think and praying together, being like, Hey, you know what, like, let's just pray about this real quick and then maybe start kind of dissecting what we need to figure out, you know, and asking questions. I always feel like taking the posture of asking questions more than just gabbling off things. Um, Yeah.

Kimber: 16:37

I think that listen, like being good listeners is so key in that moment. And that encapsulates what you're saying there, like asking good questions. Like if you're listening, you can be in a posture to do that. Um, and then I love the prayer, you know, like if you don't know, like how should I respond here or. You feel like your initial response is. Um, harsh judgment then. Like pray about it and ask the Lord to show you the way through this conversation.

Meghan: 17:05

Yeah, and I think it's totally okay to be like, you know what? I might need a little bit of time, like, maybe give me to the end of the day to process this and think about it, and can, can we like revisit it if it, if you're feeling like I'm just feeling like this is too much or I'm, I dunno if I can have this conversation in love, whatever that is, it is okay to push the brakes a little and you know, so that you don't. Say something that you're gonna look back and regret, and it's gonna make that, gap bigger or be something that could be a friendship ender. So, um,

Kimber: 17:39

That's such good advice. And if we, if a friend does that to us, not taking it as judgment, like, like, because I'm like, I love that. advice, but I also very honestly recognized that if someone did that to me, I would have, I would have a really hard time with that. Like,

Meghan: 17:57

Oh yeah.

Kimber: 17:57

You know,

Meghan: 17:58

yeah. I'd be like, O okay. What? You know? Okay. But, but so prefacing it with, I love you and I'm like, not judging you, but let me just figure out, let me get my thoughts together here and like, you know, we're good. Like, I don't know, I would just gloss it over really nice.

Kimber: 18:14

But, and the truth of that is though that, like, I mean, this does come back to the whole idea of trustworthiness because it's like, in that moment, if. My friend says that to me. And that's actually like her wanting to honor me, um, by not responding in a way that's. like unloving or an, you know, just the results of like unprocessed. You know, word vomit, but rather if I like can receive that as, okay, I'm not going to jump to conclusions before my friend has responded. Like I trusted her with telling her this. And instead of reacting out of my wounds and being like, oh, see, this is evidence that, you know, she's judging me or whatever, she's shutting down on me, whatever the wounds are. Instead of like feeding into that. I think trying to trust our friend in that moment that she asked for space and that's to process it. And that's actually what she means, because like, I feel like a lot of times I will read into stuff like where I'm like, oh, well she said that she gives me a space to process, but probably she just thinks I'm a terrible person is never going to talk to me again.

Meghan: 19:15

Yep.

Kimber: 19:15

when when that's not what she said at all. And so that takes some trust. Of that relationship in that moment. And ultimately trust of the Lord that, like he holds my heart, my friend doesn't, you know, What about, the, the more behind the back side. Like behind my bag. That's the whole gossiping conversation, I think to me. And, you know, if I trust my friend with something and then. Later it. Comes out in a forum that is not appropriate in my opinion. that can be so, so hard. And I will confess that that is something that I have struggled with. just because not from a malicious spirit, just because I. Tend to overshare in my own personal life. And sometimes I forget that not everyone. like shares like that. And so as we're like receiving things from people, how do you think we guard ourselves? In keeping their information like private or at least in the realm that they intended it to remain in. You know, how do we guard ourselves against. Even that like unintentional gossiping behind our friends' backs.

Meghan: 20:25

Yeah. That's so hard cuz I've, Yeah. I've been on both ends of that and, It's, so I don't know. but as an external processor it is very easy for me to be like, I need to get advice on something. You know, or like that's my, and not meaning it to be gossip, but trying to figure out how, like what do I say, what do I do? And so my always my like challenge is that I always need to go to God first and not other people because, Because I trust my friends and I like their advice and, you know, so it's very much easier to go to that, instead of God first. So for me, it's always my challenge of like, I need to process this and pray through this journal, whatever that is, get up into the mountains and kind of process out, whatever that information is. Um, and then like if I'm in a setting where, Maybe other people know something that's going on with that friend and that gets brought up. Like not becoming part of the conversation or not being afraid to like say, Hey guys, like, you know, let's shut it down. Like that's, she's not here, you know, and she's our friend and we love her. And because I think sometimes as girls, as women, what we can do is be like, I just, you know, like, how can we best support or how can we like, Pray about this or I'm not, you know, and it's like, that's still gossip.

Kimber: 21:45

girls know how to gossip. Yeah, in that way. Right. We cloak it.

Meghan: 21:51

uh, yeah, we, we cloth it under like I'm concerned.

Kimber: 21:54

yup. Yep. And it's it doesn't honor God. And. Yeah. And it's like, no matter how we say it, it is what it is. And so I, something that has helped me with that is trying to get some vocabulary for how I can shut down those moments or pivot them. And I've talked about that on the podcast and like my social media and stuff before. And so. You know, if that's something that you really struggle with friends listening, go back and find some episodes about gossiping and stuff, because that's something that is super challenged to me because like, we can talk about it all day. Oh yeah. We don't want to gossip, but then in the moment that's so it's so hard to change it without sounding. Like a jerk to the people you're talking

Meghan: 22:39

Yeah. Like I'm better than you And, Yeah.

Kimber: 22:42

Yes. And, and like sh you know, shaming them or something. Like, that's not what we want to do, but. Um, well, I think that if we, if we can have that. Bravery. And in those moments to say, like you said, like, I'm kind of uncomfortable talking about this since that person's not here or just, Hey, can we talk about something else? You know, this feels a little gossipy. However we say it, I think that that will feel awkward and a little bit painful in the moment. But I think that down the road, we'll see. Fruit in our, in our friendships, because you are honoring the trustworthiness

Meghan: 23:17

Yes. Yeah.

Kimber: 23:18

your, your friendships. And so it's like keeping that big picture in

Meghan: 23:22

Mm-hmm. And it also like tells everybody else like, Hey, I'm a trustworthy person and I'm not. I'm gonna honor your name too. Like, when you are not in the room. And so, yeah. So I think that that also just breeds like, oh, I, I know I can tell this person because she's got my back.

Kimber: 23:37

Yes. Yeah. I love that. That's such a challenge for me, but I feel like that is an integral part of being a trustworthy friend is like, Guarding your mouth guarding your lips. In, In, those kinds of moments. And, um, for me, it also comes with the overshare, you know, that's like where I'm, I'm always trying to figure that out because. Like just because I would tell someone that part of my life doesn't mean that my friend is that open,

Meghan: 24:07

Yeah. Yep.

Kimber: 24:08

And. like, it's such a slippery slope because it's like, you know, and we, we have those prayer, the prayer thing, like. Are we bringing this to our friends to pray about? Or are we gossiping? Like, you know, it's like, how do we navigate that? It's a challenge for sure. Um, Do you have like kind of a guiding principle? Like how do you, I guess, how would you give us like some guardrails for knowing those moments when it's like, is this mine to share. Or not.

Meghan: 24:39

for me, my big one is if they were sitting in the room with you, would you want that to be said?

Kimber: 24:45

Hm.

Meghan: 24:46

So what's being talked about is that something that if they were sitting right there, you know, you would want them to hear, you know? And so, um, Yeah. cuz I, I, I call myself like the, I don't have t m I, like, there's nothing that's too much information for me. Um, but. I also, but that's not always, like, I don't mind sharing my own information. I don't necessarily want everyone else sharing it with other people when I'm not around, you know? So it, it is, I'm in that same boat of like, yeah, I'm an open book and you can literally ask me anything. Um, but still protect my name too. Like I'll try to protect yours. So for me, Yeah. there's just been times where I've been in situations where people have talked and I'm like, man, if they were to walk in right now, like,

Kimber: 25:29

Would I stop talking or would I feel

Meghan: 25:30

Would, yeah. Would they, would they, would you want them to hear this conversation? And if the answer is no, then you need to keep'em mouth shut. Like so, yeah. So for me, that's, that's been one of my,

Kimber: 25:41

Yeah, I think of also like, just thinking like, what is the context in which this was shared with me? Because. You know, something was like shared with me in a one-on-one conversation. Like. It's just us. In the room or like, you know, on a coffee date or whatever. that's probably not the same as if that idea or story or whatever it was was shared with me in like a small group setting or if it was shared with me, like, In a public setting, like, oh, we're just in the church for year after service. And someone tells me like, I think that where we share. Things and how we share them. Like, what was the person's. Manner as they communicated this to

Meghan: 26:24

Right.

Kimber: 26:25

I think that if we think about that, that probably gives us some clues as to how that person feels about this information. And then still at the end of that even, is it mine to share like a lot of times the answer is

Meghan: 26:38

it's not. Yeah.

Kimber: 26:39

be the first to admit I've crossed that line.

Meghan: 26:41

Oh, same.

Kimber: 26:43

it's like, it's something that I want to grow in because I, I know that that then causes people to not want to share, you know, in the future when they start to see a pattern of that. So that's definitely an area that I want to grow in as well.

Meghan: 26:56

Yeah. Yeah. And I think that's important in a small group setting too. Like our small group, we have the rule of like, what's, what's shared in here? Like, doesn't leave the room, it doesn't even get spoken between each other. Like it's um, like just

Kimber: 27:08

Oh, like after the fact

Meghan: 27:09

Yep. So if someone shared, yep. So if someone shared something with the whole group and then I'm with, you know, another person in the group and we start talking like, that's gossip. You know, does it really? And so that's one of like our small group rules, is that. it doesn't even, and you know, and if it does, like as our leaders, it comes to us, we're the leaders that we'll have that conversation with that person.

Kimber: 27:31

Hm.

Meghan: 27:31

You know, if there needs to be, but um, so just, just having like good Yeah. Boundaries and settings. Even in those places where it might have been a bigger group and not necessarily just a one-on-one thing of, just not be like, well, since she shared it with two of us, We get to talk about it you know,

Kimber: 27:47

about it later. Yeah. Not so. much. I love, I love that distinction. That's really helpful for me. Yeah. Um, and then the other area I was thinking of with this idea of trustworthiness is like down the road. Like I think another way that sometimes I want to hold things closer to the vest than maybe I should with my friendships is because I'm worried that a person might weaponize it down the road. And so like, you know, like if I share like a sin, struggle with someone, let's say who I'm trusting in that moment, I maybe they receive it well, right. Um, you know, they're not going to gossip about it behind my back, but then what if down the road, they somehow turn that around to, Like be unkind to me or to say, well, this is evidence for you being a terrible presenter. I don't know. Like, I don't always think it's even well founded. This fear, but I feel like that is an area too. That we should be really careful with. Um, as we're receiving things from our friends, making sure that we're not creating this like running mental list of evaluating, um, or, kind of judging them just over the long term. I saw this come up in an area in my life where I sort of responded to a friend out of. Some frustration for past hurts. And then it was like, it was like I said, something. Pretty bitter. And it was really not much to do with that moment. It was kind of like, It was keeping a record of wrongs, you know, and I was weaponizing the past wrongs in that moment to like be unkind. And I feel like that is breaking down trust in our relationship because like, why would someone continue to share with me. If I'm just going to bring those things up later. Yeah. Like why would, why would he do that? So, um, how have you seen that kind of dynamic, play out in relationships in your life? Or, um, how do you think that we can. Avoid that kind of thing and be trustworthy just like down the road. Long-term in our friendships with what people share with us.

Meghan: 29:51

Yeah, I, yeah, it's hard. I've been. Yeah, I've been on the receiving end of that where things get thrown back and you're like, that was out of left field. Like, where'd that come from? You know? And it's, it's always, sometimes it's the issue under the issue, like what

Kimber: 30:05

Right.

Meghan: 30:07

brought it up? Is it really the problem? It's like when you get mad at your husband not taking out the trash is like, is it really about the trash? Is there something else here?

Kimber: 30:15

Yeah. Yeah.

Meghan: 30:17

Um, and so it's kinda like that moment where you goes, is there like something. That we need to talk about that's a little bit deeper than whatever this is. you know, and then having that, Having that conversation. and I think it's too, it's just laying it down to the Lord of like, taking that our hurts to him and not letting him be the one that's gonna heal that and not putting it in. How that person's supposed to treat me or the things that they're supposed to say. And these expectations just kind of keep, because they're always going to disappoint you. They're always gonna mess up. I'm always gonna mess up. I'm gonna disappoint. And so again, I think it's just that we need to be going to God first with that and, and not keeping a record of wrongs. Cuz praise the Lord. He doesn't do that with us, you know? So, and so, yeah, for me that's been praying about it. Talking to my spouse about it if I need to. and, and even going back to them if I'm like, Hey, I'm still feeling this, hurt over something that was said or something that was done and I just haven't quite moved past it. And that's really hard to do. But I've, I've had to do that a couple times where I'm like, I just can't quite get past this hurt. And how can we do this together? You know?

Kimber: 31:29

so good. It's a brave conversation, but I think that you're right, that not bearing it. Like if you just let it hang around, it's going to come up later in some capacity. And so dealing with that rather than letting it resurface through a smaller issue, I love that advice.

Meghan: 31:47

Because there's been times where, you know, I've, I've had conversations with a friend where it was, it became like this word vomit, a little bit of just like pa of pain coming out and you're just like, what what just happened and like needing to process that, but then going back and being like, okay, so you said this. What did you mean by that? Like,

Kimber: 32:08

That's

Meghan: 32:08

this what you meant to say? You know, and they're like, oh no, actually I was just, I didn't take time to stop and think about it, and it was just got defensive, Whatever. it was, you know? Um, and so allowing that, like, it's so easy for us to go just like push away and say, I'm done with that. She was rude. Instead of being like, Yeah. Instead of just being like, Hey, you know, like, let's talk about this a

Kimber: 32:29

Yeah. I love that. That phrase that you said of like, Hey, you said this, it hurt me. Like, can we talk more about that? Or is that what you meant or. Whatever, because. It's so true that like we speak carelessly at times. And so rather than like letting that inform, then our identity moving forward. Um, addressing it and, you know, in a way that could lead to working through it. I also love that you brought in the Lord to that because I feel like at the end of the day, like we can try to be trustworthy people, but like you said, we're going to fail and we're going to let people down and disappoint them and hurt them. And so I feel like there's a point where we can. we can try at this and we can, you know, seek to be trustworthy friends. But at the end of the day, I don't think that we should, um, we can hold this too much ourselves. Like we have to trust God with our friendships and I think. That, that looks like at the end of the day. I can't trust, my friend completely because she's a flawed human, but I can like trust my friendships to God. And that through the hurt that I experienced in the avenue of friendship. Um, that he'll hold my heart and work in, sanctifying me through that. So I feel like it's, it's kind of a shift of my expectations, my expectations. Aren't on my friend to be perfect or to. hold any kind of statement on my identity and who I am, but, God holds that and therefore I can trust him with that relationship.

Meghan: 34:04

Yeah,

Kimber: 34:05

you see, how do you see like your relationship with God impacting kind of that trustworthiness and friendship for you? Where do you see this coming up?

Meghan: 34:13

I think that knowing that God's never gonna fail me and that I can always trust him, becomes that like foundation to where I can open up my heart more to other people. Knowing, knowing with the expectation that they are going to mess up? I am going to mess up. Um, but knowing that, like when you have that, like we had talked about like that triangle piece. And that God's up here, and then it's you and me. Like we, if we are both kind of doing this, it's gonna get itself figured out and cause we're both wanting to honor the Lord and honor each other, even when we slip up and mess up, like if that's our heart, then Yeah. it's gonna build trust. Um, it's just talking about it and praying about it together, praying about it separately,

Kimber: 34:57

And working through that, honestly. Yeah. I love that. So as we're kind of like looking out in this, like, those are kind of some of the things I feel like that we can avoid and like we should watch for, and, you know, as we're trying to be that friend that we need. but on the flip side, like when we're looking for a trustworthy friend, I feel like there are some things that we can look for. some things that can help us see. Oh like that person seems like a trustworthy person. I want to lean into that friendship a little bit more. And one thing that we talked about earlier that I think is. Uh, a good indicator for me is that person who shuts down gossip in the moment. Like that's, that's such, I have so much respect for someone who, who does that in the moment. And. Can do it kindly like, um, I had a friend the other day who said just that exactly. She was like, this conversation makes me uncomfortable. Can we talk about something else?

Meghan: 35:52

Wow.

Kimber: 35:52

like, yeah. And I love that she trusted our small group of girls that were having that conversation in that moment to say that. Um, and then, and we pivoted and, and that made me respect her more. And. And I know that she is a trustworthy person, not because of just that one instance, but, um, because of, you know, what I've seen like that. And so that's one thing that comes to mind for me. What are some other things that you think, you know, we could be looking for?

Meghan: 36:22

Yeah, I love that. Cause that's, yeah, that was what I was gonna say. It's like if I know in the public setting, like you have my back, like that's a huge indicator. cuz what, you know, you, there's private, but then it's also in that, in that public place that you kind of get to show it. Um, I think it so speaks the truth to you that. you're able to speak the truth. Um, That shows trust of like, you know, like I, I just had a friend that was like, Hey, I need to talk to you about something that. I'm like kind of seeing. And I might be completely off base here, but this is kind of like, here's what I'm just like, as an outsider looking in what I'm seeing. And, I, you know, years ago for me, I would've been like, oh heck no. Like, I don't, don't you dare, you know? And instead I saw that as like, she loves me so much. That she's like willing to say the really, really hard thing. And that for me builds trust of like, I can come to her and it makes me wanna be that person too, of like, Hey, you know, like, what's going on here? Like, I just wanna get like a check-in, you know? And, and so for me that's like a huge piece too, is, and that my, my, so my name is protected, like, you're not afraid to tell me the truth. And I know like in those moments of like, Hey, like I want you to know that there's confidentiality here. I'm gonna keep my mouth shut. Or how is it that we can like work through this and bring you closer to God and me closer to God in the process?

Kimber: 37:38

Yeah. I love that. Maybe even with a new friendship, like articulating that more than feels

Meghan: 37:42

Mm-hmm.

Kimber: 37:43

Because I think a lot of times we're just like, oh, we assume that. But like, Does everyone assume that I don't

Meghan: 37:49

Right. I yeah. Yeah. One of the things I always, I would say is when I know like I've built trust with someone is when they don't have to say to me like, can you keep this between us?

Kimber: 37:59

Hm, that's

Meghan: 38:00

Like when they know, like they can just tell me and it's not gonna go anywhere or vice versa. When I can like talk to you, if I talk to you about something I don't have to say, can you just make sure this stays between us?

Kimber: 38:09

Um,

Meghan: 38:10

Because when that, when that gets said, I feel like there is that sliver of can I trust you? Like am I'm still building that trust. So when it's like, Hey, it's what's going on, and I know it's not leaving That table or wherever. To not have to say that for me is like a huge indicator of like, I've, we've felt trust together.

Kimber: 38:27

Mm, that's so good to look for. I love that. That's good. Well, friends listening. We've been kind of wrapping up our summer series episodes with, um, just a little challenge for you guys to help take this from just talk to actual, like living it out. And so, um, just with this idea of like being trustworthy, what's our challenge for this week, Megan, with like putting this into practice.

Meghan: 38:52

Uh, I'm gonna, since our, I had a different one, but our conversation kinda went a little different direction. So I'm changing it to, um, be the bold person that when the conversation gets uncomfortable or you're feeling like this is petering to be the one that stops it. You know, and that. can be like, this makes me uncomfortable. It can be like, Hey guys, like she's not here. Can we not, you know, however you feel like you need to phrase that, um, in a kind, loving way, but take that step.

Kimber: 39:18

Um, I love that. And friends listening, I will try to share when this comes out on the podcast, I'll share on social media that week. Some of those. Uh, resources about gossip, um, and just like some practical language too, of like sidestep those kinds of conversations and shut them down. Um, that I've kind of gathered from people in my life and from my own study and stuff that can help us to be able to articulate that. Because for me, at least when I have those kinds of phrases in my back pocket and they're, they feel pretty natural because. you know, I've either used them before or I've at least thought about them. Uh, I'm more likely to say that in the moment, because for me, a lot of times, the thing that keeps me from speaking is I'm like, oh, I don't know how to say this. I don't know what to say.

Meghan: 40:00

Right.

Kimber: 40:01

If I have something to say that can help. So yes, I love it. Well, thank you so much, Megan. Thanks for hanging out friends listening. man, I pray that this can move from our conversation here to live in it out this week in your friendships. Thanks Megan. Friends. I'm so glad you could join me and Megan on the show this week Being a trustworthy friend is something that takes intentionality and a commitment honoring our people. But I really do believe that it's going to have big payoffs down the road in our friendships. And if you're loving this series so far, would you tell a friend about the podcast, the seek. Just shoot her a DM with a post from social media or text her and episode Lincoln. Ask if she listens so that you guys can talk about it. The next time you hang out. So great way to jumpstart those conversations that we are praying. This series sparks in your friendships this summer, as you were out doing all the summer fun. I've read this conversation and the ones that come from it. Bless your friendships this summer. And speaking of, I do know how busy summer can get, so make sure that you've subscribed to the podcast wherever you listen, so that you don't miss an episode. You can also sign up to be part of my newsletter crews so that you get a weekly preview directly to your email inbox of what will be on the podcast that week. Just visit your sister kimber.com to subscribe there. Friends. Thank you so much for spending part of your day with us until next time. It's your sister Kimber.