The 2017 Bishop Airport Terror Attack: Chief Chris Miller Tells the Inside Story

In this episode of Radio Free Flint, retired Public Safety Director Chris Miller recounts one of the most shocking events in Flint’s recent history — the 2017 terrorist attack inside Bishop International Airport.

Miller describes the moment a Tunisian national stabbed an airport police officer and how he and an airport maintenance worker subdued the attacker, ultimately saving the officer’s life. The attacker was later convicted of multiple federal terrorism charges and is serving a life sentence.

Miller also reflects on how 9/11 permanently transformed airport security, including at Bishop Airport, where he led the security detail on September 11, 2001.

Across his nearly 40-year law enforcement career, Miller served with the Genesee County Sheriff’s Department, Mt. Morris Township Police Department, and Bishop Airport Public Safety. He retired in 2021 after receiving the City of Flint Lifetime Achievement Award and a key to the city.

Beyond law enforcement, Miller shares personal stories of growing up in a General Motors family, playing music around Flint, collecting Chevrolet Corvettes, and his experiences in the Flint Community Schools and Mott Community College.

Links Mentioned in This Episode:

Bishop International Airport
 🔗 https://www.bishopairport.org/

Profile on Chief Chris Miller – My City Magazine
🔗 https://www.mycitymag.com/a-lifetime-of-service-chief-christopher-miller/

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Transcript

Arthur Busch 0:16

This is Radio Free Flint. You're listening to Dr. Bush. Today I have former public safety chief at Bishop Airport, Christopher Miller. Welcome, uh Chief. It is very good to see you again. Thank you. Thank you for having me. You're a Flint native. You grew up in the area. Tell us about your background.

SPEAKER_01 0:36

I'm a product of uh General Motors' parents. Uh both my parents worked many, many years for General Motors. I grew up on the north end of Flint. You know, my dad worked for uh Chevrolet, and my mom worked for uh Fisher Body, the old Turnstead. I went to Flint Public Schools, attended Jefferson Elementary School as well as uh Bryant Junior High in Flint Northwestern and my community college and Oakland Community College. I uh ended up leaning more toward um music, and I became uh a musician in the Flint area uh before I started my law enforcement career. So started off playing uh upright bass, upright bass and uh orchestra at Northwestern. I learned how to play uh bass guitar, and I ended up having a high school band, if you will. I uh played at all the high schools, uh Flint Northwestern, Northern, Southwestern. I don't think we ever played over at Central, but um, I know we did some of the other area schools, you know, where they had dances for the young teenagers. That was fun, and that's what I did early on before lunch.

Chief Miller Tells the Story of a Terrorist Attack at Bishop International Airport, Flint, Michigan

Arthur Busch 1:42

But something significant happened in your career in uh 2017 that sort of rocked the community, and you were right center of it.

SPEAKER_01 1:52

Absolutely. Um, in June 2017, a gentleman by the name of I shouldn't call him a gentleman.

Arthur Busch 1:58

I I'm sorry, we don't need to mention his name. He's had enough.

SPEAKER_01 2:02

Yeah, I I I uh use that term loosely. This this person walked into the airport about 8:45, 8:40 a.m. He viciously attacked Lieutenant Neville. The attack was to the magnitude that it almost cost Lieutenant Neville his life. And thank God the people at Hurley Medical Center did one hell of a job taking care of him. But not only that, the responding um uh medics that came to his aid within our department, you know, our our guys, and then the Genesee County Sheriff's Department medics and the uh ambulance. But I tell you, the agencies that were involved transporting him, you know, I'm talking about the police agencies that shut down every light between Bishop Airport and Hurley Medical Center to make sure that that transport got to the hospital uh as fast as possible.

Arthur Busch 2:56

Let's step back for just a second. You were at work and you were on the second level of the airport. There was some kind of commotion. Tell us what you saw and what what you did.

SPEAKER_01 3:08

Well, well, at the at the time of the attack, on the day of the attack, we were planning to do some training. And the training had to do with contingency plans for anything that would that could or would happen at the airport, such as plane crash, fire, weather emergencies, uh, anything like that. We had the FBI, the state police, sheriff's department, and all the other law enforcement uh agencies, as well as fire fire agencies, uh fire department agencies to come to the airport so we could have a round table and talk about these things and um plan for things like this. We had a lot of help, needless to say, faster than we would normally have had, just because these people were already uh en route to the airport for a nine o'clock meeting. Well, myself and Lieutenant Dan Owen, who was a fire lieutenant, we were um in a conference room and we heard this commotion. We looked out the uh glass window and we could see there's a large glass window to this conference room. So we could see outside that Lieutenant Neville and uh one of the maintainers, uh Richard Kruell, were um fighting with an individual. And so Dan and I ran out to uh give aid, you know, to help. By the time we got there, we were all going to the to the floor. I don't know why we're fighting with this guy, but obviously um, you know, he he's trying to hurt hurt us because I see this large hunting knife, and then all of a sudden, I'm like, I'm I'm saying to myself, where's all this blood coming from? I didn't know if Jeff was had been stabbed or Rich Cruel had been stabbed. All I know is just a lot of blood. So we're trying to get this guy handcuffed. I get my handcuffs out, we get him handcuffed, you know, with the help of the other individuals, including Jeff, I get my handcuffs on him and we pat him down and make sure he doesn't have any other weapons or whatever, and we take him down to lockup in uh in the airport lockup. Basically, he attacked Jeff Neville's a lieutenant. I come to find out just a few minutes later because as soon as we took him downstairs and got him uh got him in the lockup. I came back upstairs because I knew somebody had got hurt, and I knew I had a crime scene, and I had to lock that crime scene down. Uh, I get up there, I realize that Jeff has a devastating wound. We've got our EMTs coming uh to give aid. I think someone from uh one of the restaurant workers uh ran and got a big towel to um put on him to help stop the bleeding. We had to lock the airport down. I gave orders to lock the airport down uh right away because I didn't know if this guy was by himself or if he had other people with him. I immediately

Terrorist is Arrested and Interrogated

SPEAKER_01 5:55

recognized him to be an Arab uh of Arab descent. Now I'm I'm flashing back to 9-11, some of the other things that have happened in the world. It was a difficult day, but we did what we needed to do to keep people safe.

Arthur Busch 6:10

I mean, you've been a police officer a long time at that point, and I assume having patrolled the streets of Mount Morris Township and some other places, you've encountered unruly people. Absolutely. He how's this dude rank on the list of yeah?

SPEAKER_01 6:25

He was he was pretty high up there because he he seemed to be running on pure adrenaline. Although he wasn't a very large man in stature, he was very, very strong, very powerful, and it took a lot to hold him down and get him handcuffed. He fought, you know, he fought to the end, you know, till we actually had him restrained where he couldn't fight anymore.

Arthur Busch 6:49

The action by you and your fellow officers saved Jeff Neville's life. Well, I mean, if it hadn't been that if he hadn't been there that quickly, this might not be the story it is.

SPEAKER_01 7:02

Well, there's some truth to that, but the person who I really want to give the credit to is Richard Cruell. What Rich Cruel did that day was awesome. He stepped in. This is a person who has no police background, no training in hand-to-hand combat, and he had no weapons to defend himself with. He's the one that got between this assailant and Jeff and stopped him from injuring Jeff even further because he came from behind and he stabbed Jeff from behind.

Arthur Busch 7:36

Okay.

SPEAKER_01 7:36

And as he as he went to stab him again, is that is when Richard Cruel threw his arm up and prevented him from stabbing Jeff any further, giving Jeff enough time to react and fight for his life. What was uh Rich's uh position with the airport?

Arthur Busch 7:56

He was a maintainer, a maintenance maintenance worker. Eventually, this terrorist, he was a terrorist, make no mistake about this. FBI deemed him as a terrorist. And his goal was essentially to come to the Flint airport to launch some kind of an attack on the airport. Actually, not.

SPEAKER_01 8:14

His his goal was to come to a large airport. He did not, through investigation, you know, as the FBI did their interrogation on him, talking to him and finding out why he did what he did, what his intent was, he divulged that he did not realize that the Bishop Airport was as small as it is. He thought he was coming to a major airport in Michigan. He actually Googled international airports in Michigan. And if you Google international airports in Michigan, Bishop, by virtue of alphabetical order, Bishop comes up first, or at least it did at that time. That is what he he ended up getting was Bishop Airport. And he didn't realize how that it was not the big category X airport until he actually got there. But by the time he got there and and um saw what he saw, he says, Well, you know, he's not gonna change his plans now. He just do it there. Now, this guy came from Canada, as I recall. That is correct. He came from uh Montreal, Canada, and his goal was to kill as many police officers, airport police officers as he could before he would eventually be killed himself. He wanted suicide by police, basically. Absolutely. That is pretty much what he um he divulged to the FBI. He wanted to die, but he wanted to die a martyr, but he wanted to kill some police officers before he died.

Arthur Busch 9:41

Uh while he was conducting this unprovoked attack on Officer Neville's, he was yelling and screaming, wasn't he? Yes, yes, uh, he was.

SPEAKER_01 9:50

You know, death to America. He said something about you that killed people in uh Pakistan and Afghanistan and said some other words. There was a Flint police captain who was walking in the door of the airport, the front door of the airport, when we were taking this guy down. And I told the captain, I said, This guy just attacked Lieutenant Neville. I need you to come with me because I'm gonna need your help. And so she uh immediately uh followed us. We got this guy to the lockup, and I come to find out later that he actually spit, you know, at her. His belief was that he he was he was very appalled that we had turned him over to a female police officer. He did not recognize this woman as being someone that should be in charge of him or over him. And later on in the investigation, I found out that that she she was smart. She actually pulled out her cell phone and recorded all the things that he was saying while he was in lockup. Things that he was saying to her, the same things that he was saying about you know the USA, some of those things. Well, that recording was used in federal court to help convict him. So I'm I was very grateful for her help. It all came together.

Arthur Busch 11:09

You know, when you look at that airport and your training, I mean obviously these things go on in other places, but you must have been stunned to see this happen in your hometown in Flint.

SPEAKER_01 11:22

Well, you know, every year, well, let me just back up and say this being a public safety chief at an airport, early on I joined an organization called Aileen. Aileen stands for Airport Law Enforcement Agencies Network. And that is a group of police chiefs and commanders from all over the country: New York, New Jersey, Chicago, LA, Seattle, you name it, and small airports, uh Charleston, uh, South Carolina, uh, Savannah, Georgia. Savannah is not much bigger than our airport. It doesn't matter how large or how small the airport is, if you have um general aviation security, if you have aviation at your airport, you know, commercial aviation, that's the word I'm looking for. If you have commercial aviation at your airport, um, you're in charge of people getting on aircraft, traveling from point A to point B and back to point A, and you want to keep them people, those people uh as safe as possible. So in this organization, we get together, we talk about how to do that because it can happen at any airport. I I met a good friend of mine, he was the chief at LAX, and he told me, he put me off to the side, and he says, Chris, the thing you you need to remember is that it doesn't matter how large or how small you are, it's not a matter of if, it's a matter of when. It can happen, he says, just just because you're from a small airport doesn't mean it can't happen to you. And he told me about that. I mean, he he made that statement to me just a few years before we got attacked in uh 2017, because LAX had been had been attacked. You know, they had had an active shooter at LAX where a uh TSA agent had been uh killed. And so he told me, he says it's not a matter of if it's a matter of when.

Arthur Busch 13:10

Obviously, that's an experience that's indelibly written in your minds and those of many of you

Chief Miller's Path to Leading the Airport Public Safety Department

Arthur Busch 13:17

worked at the airport for 10 years, and the airport at that time had gone through a lot of changes in the 90s, it had become essentially a brand new airport. It was rebuilt. There's a lot of support for it in the community. That airport then met with not just physical changes but some major changes uh in 2000. Tell us the story of how you got to be the public safety chief at Bishop Airport.

SPEAKER_01 13:45

Yes. Well, like I said, I started there in 1989. Jim Rice, who was the uh director at the airport, decided to put out a search for a new chief. And I came to work on Thursday one night, and one of the guys who I had known quite a quite a while, he said to me, He says, Um, did you see this? And it was a posting for the the position. And I said, uh, no, I hadn't seen that. He says, um, he said, you should put in for this. And I looked at him, I says, Why me? And he says, because I can work for you. He says, Um, you've always been a good leader. I can work for you. We can work for you. That inspired me. I went home and taught my wife about it, and she said, Absolutely, let's uh let's put together a resume. And we did. And I want to say they had about 29 applicants, including myself, for the position. And I ended up coming out number one. That is how I became the public safety chief. And at the time, I was an EMT, I was a certified police officer, but I was not a firefighter. I didn't know a whole lot about firefighting. So immediately I threw myself into learning what firefighters do and what that was all

9/11 2001 Terrorist Attacks, Action Taken in Flint to Respond to NYC Terrorism and Changes in Policies and Airport Security and Management

SPEAKER_01 14:56

about.

Arthur Busch 14:56

Now in 2000, something pretty significant happened. Well, 9-11 happened. And you want to you want to talk about 2001.

SPEAKER_01 15:03

Yeah, in 2001. A little more than a year after I became the chief, 9-11 hit. And boy, was that a day. I don't think there's any American that can say they didn't know where they were or what they were doing when they found out about um those towers getting struck and the uh the country being attacked. I know what I was doing. I know exactly what I was doing, I know exactly where I was. Where were you and what were you doing? I I was sitting at my desk doing paperwork. I was I was at the airport in my office doing paperwork, going over my dailies from the day before, you know, the daily reports from the officers and just uh typical routine stuff. I got a phone call and uh it was from um Jeff Neville, who later on became my lieutenant. Jeff Neville called me, he says, Chief, he says, uh, you need to get to a television. I said, Why? What's going on? He says, You need to get to a television right now. So I I jump up out of my office and I step into the um administrative office uh at the airport, you know, just outside my office, and there's nobody in the administration. I'm like, where's everybody at? And they're all in the conference room. And as soon as I walked in, that's when the second plane struck. The second aircraft struck the um the second tower in New York City. In New York City. Everybody was trying to figure out what was going on. People were thinking that it was just an accident until the second aircraft hit. When the second aircraft hit, okay, that this can't be just an accident. I I don't think it was um within two minutes later, you know, my cell phone started jumping off the hook, and it was the federal government calling me and telling me, Chief, shut it down, shut the airport down, shut everything down. Nothing go comes in, nothing goes out. Shut your airspace down, shut all aircraft down, go through your airport with a fine-toothed comb. We're sending people. It was less than 30 minutes. Um, I want to say less than less than 20 minutes. The state police was right there at the airport. Grand Plank Township showed up, Flint City showed up, the sheriff's department was there, Burton PD. We had it all. We locked the airport down, we went through it with a fine-toothed comb. We went through uh all the aircraft that were on the ground to make sure that no incendiary devices or bombs, if you will, were already planted on any of our aircraft. We did everything to make that airport safe. We uh followed all the security measures that the uh federal government asked us to do.

Arthur Busch 17:29

Now, after that, there were quite a bit of changes in the way people general aviation uh was pretty much shut down for a while. But it uh once it got back to to somewhat normal, if it was normal, there were a lot of changes that took place at the airport.

SPEAKER_01 17:45

Absolutely. The first big change came was that the FAA was no longer in charge of aviation security. Um, the newly created uh Transportation Security Administration, or as people know it, uh TSA, they became the security entity governing all airports throughout the um continental USA. We took our marching orders from them in reference to how we uh implemented the different security measures throughout the whole facility and the land, the property.

Arthur Busch 18:20

You adjusted to this new reality, which continued to this day, actually. What

Growing up in Flint, Michigan

Arthur Busch 18:25

part of town did you grow up in?

SPEAKER_01 18:26

The the north end, uh between Pearson, uh just south of Pearson Road, and I lived there my um my entire childhood. We were a steadfast family. We stayed there, and my family owned property there. I want to say my dad had three houses in a row right there. He had the one that we lived in, and then he had two rental houses next door. What kind of neighborhood was it? It was your typical General Motors family. Most of all the parents worked for General Motors, and we were probably the smallest family on the block uh because it was just two of us, my brother and I. But all the other kids that we grew up with had five, six, seven, eight, and nine kids to their family. Again, we were one of the smaller families uh in the neighborhood, but we were um we were well known. We were stable in the community. I not I not only had my mom and dad as as parents, but all of the families there were your parents, so to speak. Because in my day, if you were up the street and you were cutting up and doing something you weren't supposed to, those families, the mother, father, whichever saw you doing wrong, doing something that you had no business doing, they would get after you. You get smacked on the butt, and then they take you home and tell your parents, and then you got it again. You know, as I grew up with that mentality, that kept me, as I continued to you know, grow, it kept me out of trouble because the first thing I thought about when Whenever I thought about doing something that I had no business doing, you know, what would my dad say, or what would my mother say? You know, what were they gonna do to me if they found out? Is that different today than it was then? I think so. I now this is just my opinion, but I don't think that people have or parents has have as much control over their kids as my parents, my generation did. Because again, if my dad caught one of my buddies from another family across the street or up to up the street or down the street, whatever. If I mean if they were doing something, something mischievous, if they saw you doing something you weren't supposed to be doing, they would say something and they would get after you. You know, nowadays, I don't think you know, parents communicate as well as they did back then.

Arthur Busch 20:49

Between one another, you mean?

SPEAKER_01 20:51

Yeah, you know, and every everybody knew each other, all the families knew each other, and all the families were uh they had a relationship.

Arthur Busch 20:59

You uh

A Short-Lived Musical Career. Chris describes his life as a musician and his band

Arthur Busch 21:00

made your way into mock college, but before that you took a spin as a as a musician. Yes. Well, was what kind of music were you playing?

SPEAKER_01 21:10

Mostly, mostly RB, but there was some times that we were called to play polka and we were called to play uh country and western because it all depends on the gig. To us, it didn't matter because we were true music musicians and we could play anything. Do you still play? I don't know if you could see it in the background, but there's I have uh a bass guitar that I bought way back in 1976, and I I still have that. I have a number of uh bass guitars. I still play and I sing a little bit. Right now I'm currently not playing with any band or anything, um, but I have done that over the years. I made my living from 18 to uh I want to say 24 years old playing music. I I had little odd jobs, you know. I um at 18 years old, I worked for Hank Graft. You know, when Hank Graft uh Ford was downtown, a lot of people may not remember that. Uh I I do because they sponsored our baseball team. My first baseball team was Otto P. Graft. I met Hank by playing music because Hank and his wife uh Bonnie, they uh were um involved with uh what they call junior achievement back then. They would have these parties and they would need live entertainment. And somebody told them about us. They came up on the north end to see us uh play, you know, to see if we uh were actually good enough to do what they wanted us to do. And right on the spot, they hired us. We played uh parties for them for uh a couple of years, you know, on and off. I remember there was a guy in Flint by the name of Jack Hurlick. He was owner of all the Hurlick's drugstores. Jack came to one of the parties, and it was a black tie party, and we were in tuxedos and everything, and he walked up to us and he says, You guys are really good. He says, Oh my god. He says, Where he says, Where, where he says, Hey, where'd you get these guys from?

Arthur Busch 23:05

His wife was well known in Flint as a being a jazz uh aficionado, and she actually bought a building, uh the old peppermill, and turned it into a jazz club.

SPEAKER_01 23:15

Yeah, yeah. I think we uh even played um a few jazz songs uh that night for her. I remember we played uh The Girl from Empanema. That was an old jazz tune. Uh, and she wanted uh to hear us play, you know, because we were playing, you know, rock and roll and RB and just music to for people to dance to. Like you said, she was a jazz musician, or she she loved jazz, and she wanted to hear something that night, and we accommodated her. What was the name of the band? The band was actually uh it was a weird name, but it it actually caught on. It was made up of all of our names. Uh, the leader of our band, his name was John McCowan. John, Chris, Chuck, Lindsay, and Bernard, we were JCCLB movement. That name became infamous in the black community in Flint. And even, you know, before I got into law enforcement, I want to say in 1976, 75, 76, 77, we made really good money supporting ourselves as musicians. I would have a day job, but I made more money playing music than I did on my day job. And matter of fact, there was times when I would say, Hey, I got enough of this daytime stuff. I'm I'm doing music. As the 70s came to a close, the disco era kicked in, live entertainment began to die, and the DJ era became

The decision to pursue a career in law enforcement, getting hired by the Genesee County Sheriff's Department and the Bishop International Airport Authority

SPEAKER_01 24:46

more prevalent.

Arthur Busch 24:47

About that time, you met somebody who was working these in these joints where you were playing. Tell us about that person who had was somebody that had a hell of an influence on your life.

SPEAKER_01 24:58

Absolutely absolutely. Um, we were doing gigs at the old IMA auditorium downtown Flint, the bowler's ball, the Cotilian ball, things like that, and even some of the nightclubs that we played around in Flint. There was this guy that I used to always see him. And to come to find out he was a Flint police officer. And and I'm like, okay, why is this guy always hanging out? Come to find out he's security. He was working security, and he was like with doing what they call moonlighting, if you will. We got to know each other pretty good. And he would always come up to me and he'd say, Miller, when you come down to the police department. I'm like, huh? He says, when you come down to the police department, he says, you got to come join the police department. Come join, come, come join with us. And I looked at him and I cocked my head to the side. I says, You must be nuts. I says, I have no aspiration of being a cop. And he says, Man, I'm telling you, it's a great job. You know, you get to help people. Along with that, it's good pay, good benefits, and you'll have a retirement when it's all said and done. And all that sounded great, but as really not what I wanted to do. You know, I had it in my head. I wanted to be a rock star. Well, the good Lord uh had other plans for me. So by the way, that officer's name was Levester Cross. God rest his soul, he's passed away now. He went on to work for Flint PD for well over 30 years. Much respected officer uh in this community. Um, it wasn't very many people that didn't know Levester Croslin or Lee Croslin, as a lot of people called him. He finally talked me into it. By the time I got ready to join the Flint Police Department, that's when they had a big layoff, and I want to say 1980. You know, and I was going to school back and forth, you know, and I tried to join them, but again, they had this layoff. So he's the one that said, hey, the sheriff's department is hiring. I went over to the sheriff's department, they directed me to administration, I want to say personnel, over in the county administration building. And that is where I put in my application. I met a guy down there by the name of Captain Jack Spaulding, who took a liking to me. And Jack Spaulding said, um, he looked at his uh top lieutenant, I think his name was Dana Berry at that time. He looked at Dana and he says, uh, he says, I like this young man. He says, um, if he's got no record, he's not, you know, hasn't been in any trouble or anything. He says, I want to get this guy hired. And that is how I got into the sheriff's department. And when I started, John O'Brien was the sheriff.

Arthur Busch 27:26

And then later you worked for Sheriff Joe. Sheriff Joe was yes.

SPEAKER_01 27:30

Uh John O'Brien stuck around for about another year uh after I hired in, and then uh he didn't run again. And uh Joe Wilson ran for sheriff and became the sheriff, and that is who I spent most of my career under Joe Wilson.

Arthur Busch 27:44

So it was 1982 when you started with the sheriff's department, right? Yep. I retired in 2000. Yep. So you worked the Township Police Department in Mount Morris, yeah, and that gig lasted quite a number of years as well, didn't just a few years.

SPEAKER_01 28:00

I think I worked there from uh 1986 to 1989. And then you worked for uh Bishop Airport for a long time. Right, right. I left Mount Morris Township to go work for uh Chief Mike Ahern at uh at Bishop Airport. He had started a brand new police department there, and he asked me to come on work part-time for him.

Arthur Busch 28:23

Let's

Chris talks about Corvettes and his Collection of Flint, Michigan made cars.

Arthur Busch 28:24

switch gears here for a second uh while we've got a few minutes left. One of the things that I learned about you in preparing for this podcast was that you like Corvettes.

SPEAKER_01 28:34

Absolutely.

Arthur Busch 28:36

I am uh where does that come from?

SPEAKER_01 28:38

I've always liked cars. Is that because you're from Flint? Uh, probably, you know, because some of the world's best cars came out of Flint, Michigan. For those who don't know, uh the Corvette was born in Flint, Michigan in 1953. It came out of uh what is now uh truck and bus over in Van Slate. That's where the first Corvette was born. Some years, a year or two later, I I don't know exactly when, but uh at some point um the the manufacturing went down to uh bowling green.

Arthur Busch 29:09

That's Kentucky, not Ohio.

SPEAKER_01 29:11

Yes, yep. Yes, I am a big Corvette enthusiast. I own two of them. Uh yeah, I own I own uh a 2004 convertible and I own a 2017 uh C7 Grand Sport. I'm a part of a Corvette group. The my name of my Corvette group is um Corvettes of Distinction, or as we like to call it, the COD. And we have about 14 members um with various cars ranging back to uh 1989 all the way up to a 2021.

Arthur Busch 29:42

Playing a role with this group is is essentially its leader and back to the bricks and and creating a Corvette reunion at one point. Right.

SPEAKER_01 29:52

Well, I I am the vice president of COD, but I'm also a member along with my president. I'm a member of the Corvette reunion. I'm on the committee for the Corvette Reunion with uh Gary Drago.

Arthur Busch 30:05

Uh-huh, of Southwestern.

SPEAKER_01 30:07

Right. Gary Drago is the president of the uh Corvette Reunion, and we are uh committee members.

Arthur Busch 30:13

I I understand that there were quite a few Corvettes that went to the reunion.

SPEAKER_01 30:18

Every year we get an average of about 500 Corvettes downtown Flint. You must be in heaven when you see all those Corvettes. Oh my God, everything from a 53 all the way up to the the latest model. And for those that don't know, Corvettes are done in generations. You have a C1, which which represents the first generation Corvettes from 1953 to 1962. And then um 63, which is one of the most expensive Corvettes you'll ever find, because if you find one of those in uh mint condition, the 63 is the only one that they made with the split window. That car is well over six figures if it is in mint condition. But then you go on all the way through the C1, C2, C3, and all the way up to what is called now the C8. That's the latest Corvette that uh that body style was created um in 2020.

Arthur Busch 31:14

You also have been uh involved in police community relations activities throughout your career. You're a sound, steady fella from the city who's done some amazing things in your career. We I think you're qualified to tell us with some authority what's your assessment of police community relations in Flint and Genesee County, or as I like to call it, the Flint area.

SPEAKER_01 31:41

Are you are you asking as a relationship with the the community itself or the law enforcement agencies with with one another?

Arthur Busch 31:49

No, I they have to be, they have to get along with each other. I'm talking about the community and the police. Well, what what is the status of? I mean, what do you think the state of it is today? I mean, we we see things on television, we read things in newspapers, we watch movies. What's what's what's real life out there today? I mean, what is it that you look at Flint with all of its issues? We seem to be a city that, although we have had some problems here and there between citizens and police, most of our problems seem to be worked out pretty well. Looking at it objectively.

SPEAKER_01 32:26

My opinion is that we have a dynamic sheriff in Chris Swanson, and we have a dynamic police chief in Terrence Green, both of whom I've worked with, I go way back with. For those of you who don't know, Terrence Green came from the Genesee County Sheriff's Department. And I remember Chris Swanson when he hired on as a young deputy and watched him rise within the uh sheriff's department. So I I go way back with both of them. I know that they care about this community um very much. They want to see the best for Flint in Genesee County. And I think that they're doing the best that they can with what they have to work with. The community, you know, it's tough. You know, I'm I'm an African American. I understand both sides. I understand the fear that people uh have of the police, especially when you see things that happen to young African Americans, particularly males, and you see people being shot, you know, and killed. And here's what I say. When when I did it, I I did my best to treat everyone with respect. Because I feel like if I gave respect, I would get respect. And in in in most cases, I did. Every now and then you get that one idiot that there's just no way of doing it but to take this guy down. You know, once the handcuffs are on, it's over with. I never allowed anyone under my command or with me, whether it was a partner or whether it was uh whether I was the sergeant in in in control of the situation or in charge of the situation. I I never believed in allowing my officers to do anything that I knew was wrong. Um, I had a lieutenant tell me uh years ago, he says, um, when you're making a decision, if you think in terms of liability, nine times out of ten, you'll never go wrong. But even but even goes even further than that, just being a human and treating people like humans, like human beings. When I saw uh what Derek Chauvin did to George Floyd, I was ashamed. It it brought tears to my eyes because it didn't have to happen. You don't have to do things that way. And so I say to any young police officer or any any veteran out there that may hear this, do it right, do it the right way. Sure, we want to go home the same way we came to work. Absolutely. But we have a responsibility to do it the right way. I don't care if you're black, white, or polka dot, you have a responsibility to do it the right way. And when you do it the right way, then you can look at yourself in the mirror and and and look at anybody, and you can stand the red face test with anybody and say, Hey, I did it the right way.

Police-Community Relations in Flint, Michigan. Police Misconduct, Doing Policing the Right Way!

Arthur Busch 35:13

Let me ask you this question. You grew up in Flint, you lived there all your life, you've worked there in your career for 40 years or so. How would you describe Flint in one word or less? Struggling. And it's people struggling, and a lot of people in Flint have. We had a group of young kids way back in 2000 that played for Michigan State University and they became known as the Flintstones. And many people in Flint now have assumed that that identity. In other words, they believe they're tough, they're resilient, and they don't give up. Would you call yourself a Flintstone? Absolutely, absolutely.

SPEAKER_01 35:53

That name grew out of some fine athletes and what they had achieved playing sports in this community. The majority of people, myself included, have adapted that slogan, if you will. I'm from Flint. Yeah, I'm a Flintstone, absolutely. And I'm proud of it. I said a little while ago, or just a couple of minutes back, about the community struggling. You know, it's not just Flint, there's a lot of places. There's a lot of Flint throughout the United States. But all I can say is the people of Flint are resilient. They won't give up. I'm proud to say that that's where I'm

Closing: A Tribute to Flint Police Officer Levester Croslin, Miller's mentor. Final Goodbye to Chris Miller and Best Wishes on a Long and Happy Retirement

SPEAKER_01 36:31

from.

Arthur Busch 36:31

Well, Chris Miller, I call you a hero, and I've known you a long time. And uh you have made everyone in law enforcement proud with your carrying out of your responsibilities over all those years. And I wish you the very best in your retirement. And I hope that you get to spend many years with your wife doing some fun stuff.

SPEAKER_01 36:54

I'm gonna do my best. Before we end this uh conversation, I want to give a quick shout out to um that officer that talked me into um going into law enforcement. That guy, um, again, I mentioned his name, Levester Crosman. He's the guy that that that talked me into this because I I didn't see this for myself. Some years later, after he retired from the Flint City Police Department, he walked into my office around 2003, I think it was. 2003, maybe 2004. I I'm gonna say it's 2003. He walked in and he said, Um, Chief, how you doing? And I says, uh, Lee, I'm doing well. How you doing? I heard you retire from Flint City. He says, Yep. He says, uh he says, I'm all done. He says, but Chief, I'm uh I'm bored to death. He says, You got anything out here for me? You know, just show you how how God works, you know, because I couldn't hire everybody, but I had a position that uh one guy had just uh vacated. I knew I had a position open and I I looked at him and I stood up from behind my desk and I reached across to uh across my desk to shake his hand. I says, absolutely welcome aboard. I I didn't have to do an interview. I this guy's reputation um preceded him. I had known him. He's the guy that that talked me into it. And if it hadn't been for him doing that, you and I wouldn't be having this interview. So I got to I got to do something for him.

Arthur Busch 38:18

But he greeted many people, thousands and thousands of uh Flintstones as they got off the airplanes, including myself, as he stood there at that podium when you walked through those sliding doors. Levester Croslin was a good man. He's now passed away. He was a legend in Flint. Thank you, Chris. We have to run. I appreciate your time. So you all have a good day. Thank you for coming in. Thank you. Goodbye, friends.