Two Chicks and a Hoe
We’re gonna dig deep into some really amazing people and topics — cultivating ideas about nature, the environment and conservation — in your backyard and globally. We want to share stories with you where the only intention may be for you to say,“Wow, I didn’t know that!”…and now that you do, maybe you might think about your relationship with it differently, share the information with a friend or get involved.
Two Chicks and a Hoe
"Buzzin’ Through Life: How Bees Turn Flowers into Liquid Gold
Get ready to embark on an incredible journey into the world of honey with our special guest, Steve Demkowski, also known as the Bee Guy! Ever wondered how bees create that sweet, golden nectar we all love? Steve's expertise will guide us through the fascinating process of honey production, from the types of flowers bees visit to the distance they travel from the hive – all factors that affect the final product. And if that's not enough, prepare to have your mind blown by the amazing abilities of bees, such as sensing the charge of a flower and knowing when and where to collect nectar.
Not only will we delve into the world of honey production, but we'll also uncover the secrets of beekeeping and how it's crucial to provide bees with enough room to store their honey. We'll dive into the role of the queen bee and how honey serves as a fuel source for bees to survive the winter. Plus, don't miss out on learning about the medicinal properties of raw, unprocessed honey – a true gift from nature.
With Steve's help, we'll also explore the labor involved in harvesting and extracting honey, and why it's so important to support your local beekeeper and buy local honey. Discover the unique flavor profiles of honey, depending on the type of flowers the bees collect nectar from. And to top it off, learn about a project at Happy Hollow Zoo that's selling local honey to benefit gorilla conservation. Join us for this sweet episode filled with fascinating insights into the world of honey and bees!
Willow Glen Honey
Xerces Society for Invertebrate Conservation
National Wildlife Federation - Backyard Habitat Program
Pollinator Partnership
Pollinator Friendly Plant lists
Things that make you say "Wow"!
For more episodes and additional information visit the Two Chicks and a Hoe website and our Facebook page.
Big thanks to our Producer, Casey Kennedy.
Can I ask you a question? What is the first thing you think of when I ask you? What do you think honey is, bees treasure is basically the savings account They like go out and collect it.
Speaker 2:I think they fly like a thousand miles for every tablespoon. Yeah, it's pretty crazy.
Speaker 1:I always think of like a little pet name, like on some of honey, because I call people honey.
Speaker 2:A lot of work. Honey is super yummy, super good for us, But boy even get a little bit grueling.
Speaker 1:I appreciate the beekeepers for sure. I'm thinking about breakfast tea with honey. I'm thinking about bees and all the kind of products used with honey, and I think also about some cocktails. Honey, oh, sugar, sugar, but you know we love that song, but honey isn't sugar. And when I asked four other people, i got four different answers about what, when I said the word honey, anywhere from a term of endearment to all the food that they put it in and on and how much they enjoyed it, to the work that the bees put into it and how important it is to the bees.
Speaker 1:So, hi everybody, it's Vanessa from Two Chicks in a Hole, and as we continue our series on bees, once again we were Steve Dymkowski, lovingly known as the bee guy, and we're going to talk about honey because I know it's more than just what I described there in terms of you know the fact that how much we use it on our foods and enjoy it, but I know there's so much more about honey. So, hi Steve, hi Vanessa. So, as we continue, we've talked about the plight of pollinators and bees sex, and now I am quite fascinated myself with everything we've talked about. But honey, i love it as well, and you and I over the years have talked about its importance, not beyond the taste of it. But let's talk about honey especially. How is it made? I can't quite get that down.
Speaker 2:A lot of people think that honey it comes from the flowers. But what comes from the flowers is sucrose, just like the refined sugar that you have on your table. It's the same like corn syrup. Those are all sucrose. So what happened? and I'm not a scientist, i just know that by reading through the years.
Speaker 2:So what happens is the bee goes and she's either collecting well, she can collect both She's collecting pollen, which is their protein, and she puts it on her little baskets on her back of her leg and her hind legs, and then she'll take the nectar and they have two stomachs, and one's for them and the one is like a crop, like a chicken crop, and where they hold that extra nectar that gives them fuel. It's actually just thinking about like little gas station stops. It keeps them going, so that nectar is for them, that nectar is feeding them while they're going from one flower to flower and they're collecting extra to take back to the hive. And so that's why there's a limit to how far a bee can fly from their hive, because after so many miles they think it's around five miles. So if it goes beyond five miles it's not really able to bring any nectar back to the hive Because it's used enough, because it's used it all up, coming back on that five miles. So they it has to be closer.
Speaker 2:So the closer the nectar source, the more honey you're going to get in the hives. And that's what beekeepers do. They put them close to the nectar source And so they're getting back to how the honey is made. The bee collects the nectar, which is the sucrose, and it adds an enzyme to it And it's got an. It's an amphitase enzyme And the enzyme breaks that sucrose into two simple sugars, which is glucose you know the stuff they put it intervenously And fructose.
Speaker 1:So wait a minute So they breaks it down.
Speaker 2:It breaks the sucrose into fructose and glucose and some other minor dextrose and some others. So other simple sugars. But just a little minute. But they've brought that back to the hive, the nectar is breaking it down as they're flying back, oh, oh, and they actually don't, they actually don't take it and put it in. They don't themselves, the foragers, don't take it up and put it in the cell, normally, you know. I'm not saying they never do that, because they probably do that when you know it's fine.
Speaker 1:When we're not looking. When we're not looking.
Speaker 2:So we you know, but they actually pass it to another bee And now are those bees specifically. Yes, they have a job, they're there, they're there waiting, and they'll take it. And then they add even more of those enzymes into the, into that nectar from their, from their, bodies, their bodies Yeah.
Speaker 2:And that's what makes it, that's what truly makes it the honey. And they, they know, you have to realize that this is a real liquidy. It's not thick, it's very liquid. You know different flowers has, you know different, different levels of the, of the, of the sucrose, so they have their favorites, you know, and of course they, you know these they want to go to the ones that have the most sugar in them And they do want to go to the ones.
Speaker 2:Yes, okay, so they, you know they, they'll go to those first. So all these plants are competition with each other. So they're, you know so, through millions of years. You know they, they, these plants have come up with a flower that you know, that invites the bee. It has little landing pads on it that the bee can see through ultraviolet, and it sees these when it lands on the flowers it has. It tells the bee exactly where to go. And not only that. It so when you see a bee, when the bee collects that, that nectar from that flower, it changes its polarity from the ground to the bee. The bee flies, would say I'm not sure which one is negative, positive, but I believe the bee is positive and the flower is negative. And then so is it like a magnet? It's. It has a bee, has hair all over its body in. It really feels the. It's like a, like a magnet.
Speaker 1:So energy is in it.
Speaker 2:Yes, it feels that, that it has nectar. It feels it before he lands on the flower. Whoa, it does not. This helps the bee, so it flies close to the flower and it knows that it has nectar. It doesn't have nectar when it lands on it, so it does a waste all its energy.
Speaker 1:Because I see bees flying around my yard. Yeah, And, and I always think too, why that flower and not the one right next to it? Because you looked at it but you went faster.
Speaker 2:So that charge has changed on that flower. So I mean, isn't that amazing?
Speaker 1:Wow.
Speaker 2:That's really amazing.
Speaker 1:The language that we have no clue is even happening.
Speaker 2:I mean, there's people that sit for days in these fields and watch these. We're talking about scientists, right And then and they have figured this out, you know and and the charge of the, you know the.
Speaker 1:Did they measure that charge?
Speaker 2:They what? I don't know how they did it, but they, they, they. they feel the theory, it's all theories, you know all the sciences. They feel that the the hair moves to the direction of that charge.
Speaker 1:Wow, On the beat the hair, on the beat the hair on the beat, the hair on the beat, wow, and they.
Speaker 2:The bee knows that that flower has got nectar in it. Now, all the flowers are not meant for the honey bee. You know, with short they have a short tongue, so there's other pollinators out there. Well, like a bumblebee has a longer tongue, hummingbirds, of course, have the line for different for different flowers.
Speaker 1:There's a kind of flower. There's a kind of flower Like a solid tubular flower.
Speaker 2:Now the honey bee can't get that. But what it does is, like a carpenter bee will make a little slit at the bottom. You'll notice the honey bee doesn't go into the, into the front of the flower, It goes. It knows that that carpenter bee made a slit down there.
Speaker 1:Because it can't get its round body in the tube either.
Speaker 2:It can't get it in there, so it it still actually steals the nectar. That's that is stealing, wow, the nectar from a little slit down there towards the base where the nectar is. So you can, you can see that on the tubular flowers. You know, like the vine on what did they?
Speaker 1:call it the selvia is the the penstemons, yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2:Those are really good for the natives and hummingbirds and stuff like that. But the bees have figured out how to steal the honey. Honey bees are just so.
Speaker 1:So wait a minute. So the carpenter bee puts a little slit in there.
Speaker 2:Bites a little slit. Okay, does its thing. Yeah, it goes to flower to flower and does it.
Speaker 1:But what is the honey bee?
Speaker 2:Honey bee through all these years knows. So it knows that that carbonara meat and it goes behind it and it Oh, with its short little tongue, short little tongue. You can get that. So you still can get these salvia you know the long tubular flower salvia's into your honey and it adds a flavor. That's how we're getting into the honey the different flavors.
Speaker 1:Okay, we'll get into that.
Speaker 2:What's really good about them, them collecting all these different florals. People go, oh, that's wild, that's wild flower, that is the best honey that you could be eating, because it has every flower in your area, every nectar, all blended together, you know, instead of having a monoculture type honey like 70% of the honey that you buy in the grocery store or that's sold worldwide, 70% is clover honey.
Speaker 1:Oh, I have no idea, Yeah only 30%.
Speaker 2:You know I'm surprised that I even remember having this stuff. I'm going wow. So you know I might be off a few percent, five percent, but I know that You understand the majority of it. Yeah, the majority of it, but it's all made the same, so it's healthier for our native bees and for the honey bees to have a variety of nectar.
Speaker 1:So okay, so they've gone around now and collected nectar So they've collected nectar let me make in their, in one of, in their both, their guts in their both their gut.
Speaker 2:Yeah, they'll take what they need, one for their own source. Yeah, they'll take what they need To go back to the hive. They'll take a little bit of honey with them to take to get them to the source. You know, just remember in the morning now you got these scouts that go out. They don't want to all just go out and just say, okay, let's go out there and get some, find some flowers. They send scouts out and the scouts find the flowers And they save their resources. That honey is their resources, that's their livelihood, is that honey And that keeps them alive And that's their carbohydrates. That gives them the energy to fly.
Speaker 2:The scouts leave the hive with the, with the just a minute amount of honey. They only take a, a enough to last them a couple hours, maybe an hour, and they'll go out and they'll search, they'll go. Of course they want to find the closest source. Just think of the closest source. So we'll give them more honey, cause they'll less travel time, less burning up their carbohydrates to get to where they're going And they'll find a flower and they'll come back. And we talked about the dance, you know, in the total darkness They'll tell the other bees where the flowers are, and then these bees will go, fly out And and what? what's amazing I don't know if I talked about this before, but by the time they find the flowers and they come back, and there was always this noise. This is the city, but actually a city we're talking. Since we're talking about the city, it's best place to have bees, because you get this great variety.
Speaker 1:Because of all the different flowers available. Yes, Makes total sense.
Speaker 2:Man, it's just, it's just, it's amazing. Anyway, they'll come back. they do their little dance And when I was saying, what's a really amazing is that the the earth is already moved and they take a fix on the sun. The scouts do with the three. I have three eyes on the top of their head. They have actually five eyes. They have to compromise. if three eyes on the top of their head And they believe that the bees take a fix, they take a fix on the sun.
Speaker 1:Kind of like a photo memory.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and they'll follow, they. they use the light, they can actually, it's all, provided They can actually see the sun through clouds too. So I mean they can, they can forge on cloudy days And they'll come back to the hive. Do this, do this dance, and so for some, some reasons, somehow, that they calculate that the flowers are going to be in a different position, the sun's going to be in a different position, so it's calculated that they will still find those flowers, even though that the earth, earth, has moved.
Speaker 1:So everything's moved from their journey, but they somehow communicate that to the the ones that are going to go out to the field, so to speak.
Speaker 2:Can you imagine? the math?
Speaker 1:No, i can't I.
Speaker 2:I, you know, i I mean just that's like the most complicated word problem ever.
Speaker 2:But they, they, it's actually calculated that they'll be back. And we're talking within. You know six, seven inches We're not talking feet. You know, and they also do. They also pick land. You know landmarks. You know for their hives. They find their hives when they're. They call us orientation flights. You know the young bees. So the young bees just don't fly out of the hive, they, they'll fly out, turn around, look at the hive, check the hive out and just fly a little farther away. a little farther away. Up up, come back down. Those are called orientation flights And you can tell those orientation flights because they're flying, looking at the hive, they're staring at their hive. So those are young bees going on their first forging flights. So those are the young ones And it's just. It's just to get it all in perspective. We only have two weeks to live. Oh my gosh, yeah.
Speaker 2:So, that is their last job And that that is, when you see a bee flying around, that she's on her last job that she's going to do. She's done all her other jobs in her hive, which is eight. 90% of her life is done inside the hive.
Speaker 1:Really.
Speaker 2:And the first bee, yes, as an undertaker bee, as a cleaner, as a, you know, feeding the queen, you know just all these different jobs that they have in their hive. They that most of it takes place inside that hive. It's a social, it's a perfect social entity. Wow, that I mean. it's just. and the foragers do not mix with the, they don't go anywhere near the nursery, so nothing is exposed to the nursery.
Speaker 1:Oh, they're not bringing things back to the babies.
Speaker 2:Yes, And that's why it's passed to these other bees.
Speaker 2:It was passed to the other bees, so those bees are in the hive and it's kept clean of viruses and bacteria. I mean, they've got it, they've got it down And so so the nectar's being broken down. Now, now you have this nectar, the sugary water, as sucrose, has already started breaking down, it's already got some enzymes added to it And they put it in these cells, which are they're not upside down, you know, they're not facing up, they're facing at a 10 degree angle, off of the off, out of level. So when the bee regurgitates the nectar into that cell, it's really liquid And it'll just I mean, we're talking like almost like water, right? Okay, so they have to remove 87% of the water that is in that nectar. So how do they do that?
Speaker 1:Wait why?
Speaker 2:That's Because otherwise it would ferment. They have to make it the pure food that will not spoil, that will have enzymes in there. It'll kill any other bacteria or virus that enter enter.
Speaker 1:So that's part of this That started already in the first bee that actually got the nectar, that's right started.
Speaker 2:But then the bees will pull it in, even when it's in the cell, and put it back in. pull it in, put it back in, really Put it in, put it yep, and then they will also. then they'll start fanning. Is that the humming?
Speaker 1:Yeah, the humming you hear, The sound you hear.
Speaker 2:You hear from the. You walk by the hive and you hear this hum, yes, and they're in there fanning the nectar And you'll see bees on the front of the hive and they're actually blowing that that heavy, moist, humid air out and bees on the other side are blowing air in. Now our bees in California have kind of made because we don't have rain in the summertime.
Speaker 1:Yeah, we know, yeah, we know, we don't have rain.
Speaker 2:It's really good for making honey because the bees, and especially when the Oh, the lack of moisture, Yeah the humid is very.
Speaker 2:It's not humid here like it is in the Midwest, right east coast, so so they have it easier. They have a better, not easier, right, it's a lot of work. Yeah, so they. So they actually have bees on one side of the hive that's blowing air out, and a bees on the other side blowing air in, and at the same time They're cooling your hive down too. So they're taking. If it's too hot outside, they're dropping the temperature down inside their hive. With their moisture They're bringing in cheese. So they're actually they're drying, drying this nectar down. They'll get it to the point where you could take a frame out. You know a honey super. We put a queen excluder, keep the queen from going up into the honey super and that honey We use for us and we don't take it. We don't take it all off. A good beekeeper doesn't take it all off.
Speaker 1:You have to leave it on because it's theirs too right.
Speaker 2:It's there, but they, they are so busy. If you give them the space, they'll fill it. So you could put Six boxes on top, and if the hive is strong enough and there's enough nectar out there, they'll fill it all up. They don't need it on, they mean they make more, they'll just keep making it, making it, making it make. And so beekeepers, through all these you know, thousands of years they have actually been beekeeping will. Actually, they've taken advantage of this and just given more and more room, more, more room, and they'll just keep filling it up.
Speaker 1:So that was one of my questions though too, so I think you're kind of already answered it the idea that when we as humans, beekeepers or whoever goes in and and takes their honey Right, are we doing damage to them, are we? I mean, i kind of feel it as we're stealing from them?
Speaker 2:Well, we are, but they there's no way We're not consuming all this. You have to leave enough honey on the in that hive to get them through the winter Got it. Their honey is better than sugar water, but but there's some years that it gets so bad That they don't even have enough of themselves because there's not enough flowers out there.
Speaker 2:I'm not moving out there. We're in a drought, for instance, like right, we are right now And so the honey will be. You know, there won't be that much honey I during this drought and you don't want to take it all off. So that's why you pull the excess honey off.
Speaker 1:So it's not detrimental to them to take the honey?
Speaker 2:No, because if you don't take the honey and This is so you don't you don't Give them enough room to store their honey in another area. They will start filling that nectar up in where the queen should be laying eggs. Oh and what? oh she doesn't have any place to lay eggs little overzealous, aren't they?
Speaker 1:Yeah, let's fill it all up, fill it all up.
Speaker 2:They make these cups and they're called queen cups and they they have the queen lay an egg in there and Then they start the egg hatches in three days and they start feeling it rodeo a royal jelly. That That little baby gets nothing but royal jelly right and that becomes that makes the queen Right. So they that that. That when you they become honey bound, they call that that makes the hive swarm oh.
Speaker 1:So that's when you know because the honey bound, meaning they filled everything up.
Speaker 2:She has no place lay eggs, so that that that is so, that So well, everybody says, oh, that's a natural thing, yes, it is a natural thing, but in the city You don't want that happening, because 90, over 90% of the swarms that leave hives do not make it in the city Anywhere, anywhere, really, yes, anywhere. They do not make it. So what beekeepers do they want to catch the swarms? or you want to call a beekeeper to catch the swarm, or they move into somebody's house, right chimney and it becomes a problem.
Speaker 2:The problem right. The first, so the first swarm control is to give the bees enough room for them to store their honey. So that so then, taking the honey away, it's not a bad thing.
Speaker 1:No, it's not okay. That's good, that's important. I know a lot of people are concerned about that word surplus.
Speaker 2:Okay, so the bees, the bees honey is below the queen excluder and our honey Hopefully it'll be our honey is above the queen excluder. And so when you take it off, you pick up the hive and you make sure that the hive is. You could barely pick it up.
Speaker 1:So wait, let me ask you, okay. So it's heavy, okay. So let me ask you though. So back to everybody's in there, taking the humidity out of it, the water out of this right, there's a tons of different enzymes that honey is alive. Okay so, but when is it honey? It's honey when it well it's because they've been doing all of this stuff. Cured honey.
Speaker 2:It's cured honey when they, when the bee caps it Wax that's when it's done. That's what it's done and that capping that they cap it with that is they consider that virgin wax and That the wax comes from the bee, from the female, from the girls, and they comes from their thorax. They have these two sets of glands.
Speaker 1:They produce it or do they go somewhere?
Speaker 2:No, they produce away and they only produce the wax when there is a nectar flow, so when they're, you know so they're, they're eating their. Their byproduct is this wax, wow, which which they pull up from their hind leg, they're Hind the middle legs up to the fourth leg, up to their mandibles, and they form these little hexagon cells. They build that's, that's it a little home. That's their vessel for their babies, that's a vessel for the honey.
Speaker 1:It's the same vessel, same same, so they build that as well.
Speaker 2:They build that as they're collecting. You have bees inside the hive. That's their job, they're. They're builders, they're building their wax, got it? Yeah, bees out there. I mean, we're talking about a perfect social society. You have ones out there doing the work out there in the fields. You got the nurses doing their Their nursing job, taking care of their babies. Got the queen, who is an egg-laying slave? Actually, she's not, she doesn't. That's all she does. That's all she does. It's just people think that she's the queen, but she's really not.
Speaker 1:Not the queen as we perceive it right, got a lay.
Speaker 2:She lays her own weight in Every day in the summertime. Wow, weight in a Wow. So I mean it's like, it's like You know, she's like she'll like anywhere from a thousand to seventeen or two thousand eggs, you know. A day, wow, one. A minute, wow, yeah. So that's like a hundred twenty four, 100. Well, that's like a one-way is about a hundred twenty four, twenty five pounds having 24 Five-pound babies every day, oh my gosh. So I mean, oh my gosh, just imagine, just imagine, and we just get it all summer long In the heat of it all.
Speaker 2:Wow, that's, that's her job. You just imagine it. How excruciating it must be. And she's got. She's storing this sperm, keeping the sperm alive, fertilizing eggs as they come down, you know which we talked about in the bees sex episode. Yeah, so this honey is fed To the worker larva, you know, not to the queen larva got it.
Speaker 2:Queen larva only gets royal jelly, which comes from a fair genial, glands of the nurse, bees that are five to ten days old, because they're there, a fair genial, they don't develop until their fifth or tenth day, i know.
Speaker 1:I know, but it is so fascinating. Pull it all together, it all comes together.
Speaker 2:This all only happens when flowers are blooming.
Speaker 1:So wintertime, this is not happening. This is not happening in the wintertime She'll lay a few eggs.
Speaker 2:I mean especially when it's cold. You know we're talking about the cold winners. They rely on that honey stores.
Speaker 1:I got it. This is where they use their honey.
Speaker 2:They disconnect their wings Whoa, from their muscle, wing muscles and they Vibrate them to build the heat in their hive, to keep the hive warm Inside that hive, and all honey is their fuel to do this, to survive over the winter. So with this honey, you know they found we're talking going way back in Egyptian times that they found things about this honey that was so important that they actually They used it in.
Speaker 2:The physicians used it in their bags to to for wounds right and a bacterial and a viral in the rules, because when it, when the honey went and we're talking now, we're not talking about any. We're not talking about a store-bought honey that comes from, you know, a high-processed company that Filters that everything out, heats it up to 160 degrees.
Speaker 1:You've killed it then, haven't?
Speaker 2:you It's considered dead honey.
Speaker 1:Let's, let's let's Continue, but I want to get back to that to make sure that everybody understands that that honey is alive. It's alive.
Speaker 2:Yes, it has live enzymes in it. So when you put that, you take that teaspoon of honey, smell it first, put it in your mouth, hold it in your mouth, hold it to the roof of your mouth, just hold. You, let that flavor roll down your tongue, get in all the different taste buds all around your tongue, feel it, go down Your throat and you get that smell, adds to that flavor, right, and so you, you get that and then you have it. You have a beginning, just like you're tasting wine, just, and you have that, that first impression. What, what do you taste when you first put it in your mouth, besides the sweetness? right, sometimes you, you'll, you'll get that, you'll get the sweetness. And then, as it comes down now, is it have? does it have a butterscotch taste? does have a caramel taste? doesn't have, i mean, the different flavors? I mean, does it? does it smell like a flower? does it smell like Mint? does it smell me?
Speaker 1:there, and you can taste all those things too in the honey right. It doesn't have a woody taste and it's all based upon where where the bees got their nectar, exactly.
Speaker 2:So it all tastes. And then the blends. Then you get these different blends. They they say there's over, there's 200 or more different types of honey, but there's more than that, because the bees blend Different. Usually you get all these different blends so they're not varietal, you know, right, right, you know varietal. Like our varietal wines have to have 50% of that Grape in it to make that the varietal wine. You know, you only have to have a little over 50% for it to be called Cabernet.
Speaker 2:So, same thing with. You know a beekeeper say well, this is this all honey? Well, they can, if they can, fly five miles out and bring the honey back. It could be from any flower, but maybe mostly this because there was by chance.
Speaker 1:There was a thistle field nearby.
Speaker 2:There's thistle, thistle field or clover field, or, and there's no other flowers blooming, then it's going to be predominantly that Flower, i think clover honey Well, i was raised on clover honey, just like most of the people work.
Speaker 2:I loved honey, but when I got the first taste of beekeepers Raw honey that was just filtered not filtered, but run through a screen just to remove the big particles right the pollen and not that, you know, i little wax particles don't bother me and Just be able to taste that and taste all the different flavors Of the honey, i just, i was in love, but I didn't start beekeeping because of honey.
Speaker 1:I started beekeeping because of bees, right, but Yeah, you've told me several times, the honey part of it is your least favorite, favorite part not eating it, of course right right, but harvesting it and extracting it And pulling it is is so much work.
Speaker 2:I mean people really think, oh, it's free, you know they have bees, bring it back. It's just as free as milk out of a cow, it's just as free as as Lettuce out of a field. I mean it takes It's work to get it out. And and I and people say, well, you know, the honey is so expensive. I think if you're getting honey for anything less than a hundred dollars a pound, you're getting a deal, because I'm telling you that I We've we've tracked the labor and how much labor it takes to put it in alive and how much. You know How much effort you work on these hives all year long to keep those bees alive, keep them healthy, don't give them, don't you keep them away from pesticides, all these, and it's a lot of work. You have to work on these bees every week. You know It takes hours and hours and hours, all the, and then they get this honey at the end of the year Harvesting, and you, just you, have to harvest it.
Speaker 2:You've been there right have helped you do that He's 90 degrees in the room, in a room because you want the honey to flow and you're just perspiring and it's just unbelievable How much work it is and you're eating stung.
Speaker 1:Yeah, so, so and fascinating as that is because that's your end of it Yeah, but I think about when the conversation first started here. You told me that the bee has like two stomachs, is going out. We all know how little a bee is so I can't imagine how big, how small their stomach is and then to come back and have to fill That little bees life, yeah, one twelve.
Speaker 2:And some people tell you it's a teaspoon. It's not a teaspoon. One little bees life, yes, one twelfth of a teaspoon. So I mean, and that's only if it lives, doesn't get eaten by a spider or a bird or so.
Speaker 2:They work from a beekeeper, but So Yeah just think of the of the honey, the bottle of honey, a 16 ounce bottle of honey. It is anywhere, depending on what type of flower they get it from, how much nectar comes from that flower. They're all different right anywhere from a million to two million flowers to make that one pound, and it takes 12 bees to make one teaspoon of honey. So all that work, it's just on. It's unfathomable. It's just trying to figure out how you know. I mean, don't get me wrong, i don't know all the figures but but that's pretty impressive.
Speaker 2:Wow, how much work they put in and they store it and To to think that they the honey that they make. They don't even get the taste, they don't even get to eat it. It's, it's for the next generation. Wow they're doing something for another generation of bees. Wow, total, total, social. I mean, wow, got it down. Wow, it's just in. Just so, i got, i have a color wheel. On that color wheel, i got a flavor.
Speaker 1:It looks like a color wheel, like a traditional color wheel.
Speaker 2:Yes, they come from. It came from UC Davis and Just that. Just to let you know all the different flavors, i'll just go over some of them really quick. They got berries, citrus, dried fruit. Some of them taste like a tree fruit, some of them taste like tropical fruit. You have a floral taste. A lot of people taste the floral taste. Then you have a herbaceous which is fresh or dry You can take. You can take a taste of grass, a grass, grassy flavor, a clover favorite mint.
Speaker 1:Peppermint.
Speaker 2:Wow, eucalyptus, hey, you can have any taste like a straw. You have any taste like tea, malt, tobacco. You have a taste taste like dry graph alfalfa. I don't know if you don't know what broccolis tastes like, but you have bees that taste honey. It tastes like broccolis, pine, oak, cedar. How can you taste like trees? because the bees are collecting a, not nectar, but actually do from other insects, and they bring that back and they make and they call it honey. But it's actually it's, it's actually a do insect, do.
Speaker 1:Okay, okay, okay, wait a minute. So you told me this before. This is my interpretation of what you just said that there's little bugs up in that tree that are actually pooping out. Are peeing out some kind of liquid that the bees are collecting as a form of nectar. Yeah, because it's.
Speaker 2:Sugar. Wow, yeah, they'll. They'll collect it off of pine general. In Italy They have this pine honey that actually comes from me from an insect Releases this do because it's just Taking so much of this sap in right, right, right.
Speaker 2:Be comes and collects in. It tastes just like it, tastes like pine, tastes like oak. You know people go well, how did they get the oak flavor? Well, there's a I. You know I don't, i'm not a, i don't know the name of the insect, but it attacks the oak Acorn. Yes, and this little, this little larva that's in there, this little grub, it secretes a nectar and that be collects that And that goes back and it gives that little oaky taste. I love it. I love that flavor. It adds a little. It's like a shard in a Honey. I love it. You can get all these different flavors and people.
Speaker 1:I think that's amazing.
Speaker 2:Instead of buying the same, oh honey, get a local beekeeper. Find the local, local beekeeper in your area and then Taste their honey. Yes, you'll find one. Different areas give different honeys and they're there. They'll be truthful. You know they, they, these people, beekeepers that are, are. They're not in it for that, they're just one trying to pay for their hobby, to pay for, you know, the.
Speaker 1:Which you can see now is a lot of work.
Speaker 2:It costs like good $600 to get a hive going, you know for a new beekeeper. I mean it's wow. So you have to write to pay. You know like $16 for $15, $16 or $20 for a pound of honey, that's really, really a good deal, wow. People don't think of it. I mean a grocery store. They have to pay their help and everything inside the store. So I mean, of course, of course, but you there beekeepers are not in. And then a competition with the grocery store, right?
Speaker 1:right.
Speaker 2:You shouldn't compare the price of a grocery store to a beekeepers price.
Speaker 1:Let me and clearly you can see that it's all the effort that's going- into it, it's totally different on both sides.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it's a better for you to have to have your own.
Speaker 1:So let's. I'm gonna ask about that because you've always told me, too, that when people have allergies, that they should be taking a Teaspoon of local honey, because it has the pollen and the nectar's from the local flowers.
Speaker 2:It doesn't have to be in your neighborhood, it could be They. you know, i keep in UC Davis, did a study on it Within 50 miles of where you live. So and even if you buy honey we're in San Jose, for instance You can buy honey from San Francisco. It's still good for you. You can buy it all the way down. You know Gilroy, morgan Hill, half Moon Bay, you know Santa Cruz right right.
Speaker 2:The all that honey is all gonna taste different, right? you know, in fact, the honey from right here. Even though the bees cross in willow gland I saw the willow gland honey They'll cross with bees, like, for instance, happy hollow zoo, and that honey tastes completely different, which is what I gave you today. Right, it tastes completely different than the honey which is only that's only two miles away from here, and I mean so it's and it tastes totally different. So, but it helps with allergies, correct? Yes? And now the the reason, and? And? they're not sure, and there are people gonna say, oh no, it really doesn't, but It helps build your immune system up. Number one Got it.
Speaker 2:I think it's the pollen that's in that honey. There's a lot of pollen in the honey and that's how they test for honey to make sure that it's honey. If they don't see any pollen in it, they feel it's adulterated. They've something that's added syrup or rice syrup or corn syrup. You're not buying honey. The word honey doesn't mean it comes from bees. It could be corn syrup, sugar syrup, it could be any kind of syrup and they can sell it under the name honey. Really, Yeah, there's no law that says that has to have anything from a bee in it.
Speaker 1:How do you know if you're getting adulterated honey? You don't.
Speaker 2:You don't know, i'm not going to say that the honey that you buy in the store is adulterated, but I bet you, i would bet, that a lot of the honey is, unless you know the beekeeper not saying that that honey's bad. But if you should know the beekeeper, trust the beekeeper, know that person and support that.
Speaker 1:Support that beekeeper. I think that's the biggest thing right there. Support that.
Speaker 2:Support your local beekeeper.
Speaker 1:He can afford to do this.
Speaker 2:You're scared that he's going to make a couple of dollars after you know that you can buy a beer or something with it After he pays for his bees. I mean, I've taught a lot of beekeepers get started and I don't make any money from the bees And they do pay for themselves. Now, Right, And others are Jack out. He lives out in Palo Alto area and a Cupertino in Palo Alto And it took him six years for him just to break even. And now this cost of the bottles are just one.
Speaker 1:They've doubled the prices, Everything, the cost of everything has gone up.
Speaker 2:Yeah they've gone up 6%, 8%, they've doubled. We used to cost a dollar, we used to figure a dollar for the bottle and the cap. Now it's $2. And even those little teeny two ounce little honey bear things. They're a dollar and a quarter, wow. So it's just awful. But not that all honey tastes good either. So we have some that taste like animals, some that taste like What? Why? Because of what plant they got it from, has the flavor, has this flavor. We're talking honey that tastes sweaty, honey that tastes like leather Honey that tastes like a barnyard. It has that smell so it's going to put that taste in your mouth. Honey that tastes like a locker room, honey that tastes like goat or dog. And then you have primary tastes like sweet, sour, salty, bitter. Wow, right Now, the honey that we get from Oak Hill Cemetery.
Speaker 2:They have these linden trees And they bloom in June And their blossoms hang down And going back, let's go with. The trees are more important, actually, and shrubs are a really more important nectar source. Then flowers, then flowers in their yard. Those are important, but they're not as important as trees. Street elms, maples, willows, lindens, give them tons. That's what gets them through the year. That's what gets them through the winter is those trees, the trees. And so you get these tastes from these trees. Wow, the linden tree, which is a basswood tree, it has a little bite at the end of the taste of the honey. So when you take the honey in your mouth and it has that lint, you feel this bite. And the pepper trees, the California pepper trees, they have that, but the pepper tree has a really solid bite.
Speaker 1:Wow, i never would have imagined that, because you always think sweet, sweet, sweet.
Speaker 2:They're all tasting different sages, all these different flavors. You know I'm going on these different flavors of honey but I don't want to miss out on. of course. we have the orange blossom honey, which is delicious. I think that's a great honey, but the oranges actually don't need the bees. They actually there's grows down there that don't want them in their tangerines, because when they pollinate the plant they add a seed to the tangerine And they don't want seeds in their tangerines. They want.
Speaker 2:Oh, interesting They want seedless And the bee. if you get a seed in your tangerine is because a bee got in there and pollinated the plant. They don't want bees in there, but the beekeepers want them because that's great honey.
Speaker 1:Right, that's great honey.
Speaker 2:Wow, so there's this big fight going on down in Southern California. It's really funny. So it's not funny to them, but it's funny to me.
Speaker 1:So let me just ask you real quick, because we've touched on it a couple times now, that honey is alive. Yes, it's alive, And you've told me over the years and I think it's important for everybody to understand this too is don't microwave your honey.
Speaker 2:Oh, absolutely not Do that. Your beekeeper can warm it up so he can bottle it, Because sometimes in a winter time they'll have it in a five gallon bucket.
Speaker 1:It's kind of hard.
Speaker 2:And it's starting to get hard. They'll have to warm it up As long as they don't take it over 125 degrees, 150. I don't warm, i try not to warm mine up over 100 to 110. You've got to realize that the bees have it anywhere from 90 to. It'll get up to 100 degrees in their hive with the honey in there, but they need to keep it at 90. And usually the honey is above them so that heat is going up And that keeps the honey from granulating. Ok.
Speaker 1:So let's say, when I get honey It doesn't turn to sugar. Ok. So let's say, when I get honey and it starts to granulate and I can't get it out of the bottle anymore, how am I supposed to get it out? Well, you either eat it in that form, which would be better, right, and out of a jar you put it in between, because people think when it gets kind of solid or granulated, they think it's turned to sugar, they think it's bad, they think it's gone bad.
Speaker 2:No, all it is is granulated sugar. It's honey crystals. Because what I just think of in honey crystals and what causes this? some honey granulates fast, some doesn't. So what causes this is? remember when I told you about when the bees are flying back with the sucrose and they're breaking it down into glucose and fructose. Well, the higher the glucose content in the honey, the higher the chance of it granulating fast. And now there's different granulations too. There's big crystals and there's tiny crystals. There's really small crystals, very small, so small that it feels like in your mouth, feels like frosting off a cake.
Speaker 1:And then some of it feels like rock candy. Right, right.
Speaker 2:But the one that granulates really small, which also comes from the zoo and from, not from here, from Willow Glen. mine granulates really coarse But the zoo's granulates just so fine. I can't tell you what it's coming off of that makes it that small. But I love the honey. In Europe they will not buy the honey unless it's granulated.
Speaker 1:Oh.
Speaker 2:Because they feel that it's not natural raw honey. So the only way that keeps that liquid in the store is that they've heated it to 165 degrees. They've run it through paper filters that remove every particle of pollen, everything that's in that that the glucose and fructose molecules will attach to and start making crystals on. So that's when it's unfiltered honey Right. It will granulate fast.
Speaker 1:But in essence, though, when you talk about the process that you just said heating it up to 160 with the paper filters- you're taking the enzymes.
Speaker 2:But you're taking out everything beneficial correct Everything that's beneficial, anything that does you any good. You've taken it out of that honey.
Speaker 1:So don't stick your honey in the microwave or overheat it You're killing it.
Speaker 2:No, it's absolutely dead. Now you can bring water. you could put it in hot water because, just remember, it doesn't matter how hot the water is, it matters how hot the honey is. Got it So you can put it in hot water. You just pull it out, stir it around, stir it around, pull it as long as you don't get that honey over a hundred and fifteen hundred twenty twenty five degrees. Got it, it's going to be fine.
Speaker 1:We've been talking about how they make honey and I see these bees I mentioned. I've been watching these bees in my yard and they're going to the California poppies and they got these big sacks of like pollen on their legs and I'm like like big sacks and I'm like wow, that's how they make honey. But you're telling me that's not it. So okay, so now we understand how they make honey, but what?
Speaker 2:is all that orange pollen on their legs for honey is their carbohydrates right, and so they need protein and their babies need protein so that they make. They make bread from that pollen that they collect, and that's what makes them good pollinators. They collect all this pollen.
Speaker 1:They usually stick to the same species of flower right so they do a good cross pollination on their, on their uh, from one flower to the next, so that that pollen on their legs when they go to the next flower some of it rubs off falls off and they're pulling. Well, no, they get it on their hair, okay, and then?
Speaker 2:they brush, they, they have comb, they have a comb on their leg, on each one of their legs, and they they're four leg and then they comb their hair and then they collect that and then they move it down and they put a little nectar and they move it down to their uh little bad, just the two little hairs that come out of their legs. They call it a honey basket. It's really not a basket, but they put it on there and they gather that and you can see these they get that's what I see.
Speaker 2:Yes, size of a lentil, yes, big they get really big, and so they take that, they collect that, and they also ask that they have to process that too. They cannot, they cannot eat this raw pollen. It will not digest us in their, in their gut. So they have to take that back to their hive and they actually knock, they actually go to the comb on this one and they'll knock, knock the, uh, the pollen off their legs into the, into the cell, and then they'll take their head and they pack it down in there and then they add. They'll add a little nectar, they'll add, but what they do is they, they have to let that pollen ferment, or what's the better word? bacteria yeast make an actual bee bread. Ah, okay, they make a bread and that bread, uh, is, uh, they'll they're able to digest it, everybody eats that bread yes, they have to feed that to their.
Speaker 2:They cannot have larva, uh, a larvae in the in the hive. That larvae needs that pollen besides their royal jelly that they get the first first. Got it, got it. Okay, they start getting honey and, uh, bee bread. They say pollen, but it's bee bread, got it if you really wanted to take something really nutritious for you. It tastes real sour, like sour. It tastes like sourdough bread. You can actually there's some people have made starters, a bread starter really with that. Yeah, pull that out because it has a yeast, a natural yeast, in it so the pollen you see on the bees legs makes the bee bread.
Speaker 2:Yes, the stuff that we don't see, but that's in their gut, that's the nectar that makes the honey correct okay now i now i got it and so the to make that bread, to, to make that bread last long, to keep it, to keep it natural, they'll cap it with honey to keep that bread fresh. Wow, i know, amazing, they're unbelievable, amazing. So, and we and we so you know, going back, i know we didn't talk that much about you know the history, but they actually embalmed the bodies, you know, in egypt, with it. It uh, they uh, during the roman times, when they had, uh, the goers to send a, uh, a guy out to hunt down a criminal, uh, for him, the bounty hunter, uh they, he would go into. I mean, he'd be gone for like six months sometimes you know, because they had.
Speaker 2:They would actually cut the head off of the uh, of the criminal, put it in a bucket, fill the bucket up with honey, so they would prove, when they pull the bucket out, that that head would still be in perfect condition so they could see who it was yeah, when they because the honey preserved it the honey, preserved the head.
Speaker 1:I'm like i never heard that and i heard too.
Speaker 2:The great was buried in no, yeah and uh, well, i believe us. And then this is some of this stuff, might you know, uh be stories be keeper stories but, uh, he was buried in a, i believe, a lead casket, uh in uh, uh filled with honey to preserve him. To preserve him. Yeah, so they, they and the egyptians. You actually used that in the they're preserving uh process i heard they found dried honey.
Speaker 1:Dried honey in the tombs.
Speaker 2:That was an egypt actually still edible, but it wasn't liquid. I mean it's got right right dust, right right.
Speaker 1:But i heard it was edible, but it was honey but it was honey.
Speaker 2:Yeah, wow amazing it was still in the in the pot, in the honey pots they get. Now the egyptians, you know, the egyptians had a, they had a crush their honey. They, they actually uh, a lot of the old beekeepers when they first, they actually killed the hives. The beekeepers today do not kill the bees to get the honey out, right, right. So i mean we are so much more humane now than they were then. Everybody was, oh, you know, it's not natural as it used to be. You know, these, they used to kill those hives to get those uh bees. You know, when you saw those skep hives, those bees were destroyed. It was all about the honey, it was all about just the honey.
Speaker 1:Yeah, we're all about bees so quite fascinating and i can't believe how much we've actually talked about honey and i know there's so so much more yeah there is, but i do want to touch on one thing.
Speaker 1:Okay, one more thing. Years ago, we started a project at, and had happy hollow zoo, which is located here in san josec, california, and, uh, you actually started selling local honey to benefit guerrilla conservation in the democratic republic of congo right, well, it is actually to benefit the fallen rangers widows, correct, correct, because i'm really not a guerrilla guy yes, he is a girl, but i wasn't at the time, right, i wasn't at the time.
Speaker 2:And and until we went to africa and i met all those beautiful people, i fell in love with the right, right and, uh, i was just unbelievable, unbelievable happy with absolutely nothing, right, i mean, you know, to have that happiness. It was just unbelievable so wonderful.
Speaker 1:So yes, it was, and i totally agree with you that i know our initial push was to protect gorillas and it it's still it does, it does, yes, it does but it's to protect the people that are protecting the gorillas. Yes, yes, so, um, that honey is actually still being sold, so you can go to the, you can go to happy hollow zoo, right, you can go. Where can you get this honey? i want to push this out there because it's still available, and a hundred percent of the proceeds from buying this honey go directly to the rangers in the congo that are protecting the mountain gorillas right.
Speaker 2:We take the money with that, we sell when we sell bees or we make money anywhere else doing, you know, propolis wax. We use that to buy the bottles, to buy the lids, to buy the labels, to buy. We don't use any of the honey money for anything so where can i get?
Speaker 1:so where i know where to get it, but where can somebody get this honey?
Speaker 2:so you, get this honey at, uh, the three sister store.
Speaker 1:Okay, three sisters is a store in willow glenn, which is a neighborhood in san jose, california but right now we're running low, so i mean we're.
Speaker 2:In fact i just bottled a hundred bears that i'm taking to the zoo, so they'll sell it in there at the zoo so they can, you can buy it happy hollow zoo at the discovery.
Speaker 1:But let's say i don't live in the bay area, right, well, i know, maybe that's a little bit more challenging. You should go to your own. You should go to your own local beekeeper. Yes, you should go to your go.
Speaker 2:Go to your local, by the time, yeah you want to keep the idea of sending i. I feel that sending honey or uh, you're actually burning up more carbon your carbon footprint is much bigger much bigger agreed.
Speaker 1:So if you're local here in the bay area, you can get gorilla honey. Yes, get gorilla, you can get three sister store.
Speaker 2:Also sam's downtown feed sells it, but right now they are out within two days.
Speaker 1:Well, have more honey.
Speaker 2:We always have honey, then we, yeah, we got we, but we took 2000 pounds off last year.
Speaker 1:Wow so 2000 pounds, yeah, that's a ton so you can see where steve has done incredible things for the bees and then expanded that out into a much larger global reach to, you know, to to benefit conservation in the central africa region. So it's it's been amazing. It's been amazing, it's been an amazing experience working with you, steve.
Speaker 2:But thanks, thank you for everything you do for the bees and for conservation i had no idea, honey, but uh, that would actually lead me, the bees would actually lead me in this direction. You have to realize that when that swarm came to my backyard that's starting on bees brought me. That was almost 30 years ago brought me from that, from that point, all the way around to to the gorillas, to the zoo, to pollinators. I mean unbelievable and just took my whole life in a different spin.
Speaker 1:I'm so grateful that you got involved in that swarm.
Speaker 2:I just love it just to think i think of. Every time i think of a swarm. You have to think of a swarm as a new beginning. It was a new beginning for me, it was a new beginning. People have to look at that swarm and think of a new beginning. I mean, it's just an amazing thing, amazing awesome.
Speaker 1:Thank you so much, steve. Thank you, vanessa, it was fun.