Working Girls and Psycho with Ryan Luis Rodriguez - Talking Pondo

 In this episode, Ryan Luis Rodriguez from Reels of Justice joins the podcast. He brings along the movie Working Girls. Marty and Clif give Ryan the movie Psycho to watch.

First up is Psycho, Alfred Hitchcock's legendary shocker that changed horror movies forever. Clif, Marty, and Ryan discuss Norman Bates, the famous shower scene, and why the film still works even when everyone already knows the ending.

Then it's on to Working Girls, Lizzie Borden's low-key but fascinating look at a day in the life of sex workers. The conversation covers the film's resemblance to Sean Baker's slice-of-life approach, its sense of humor, then finally, it's matter-of-fact tone and humanity.

Along the way: Norman Bates business management strategies, courtroom podcast updates, arguments over cult classics, and the realization that some movies are a lot stranger than their reputations suggest.

Transcript

00:00:00.31
Clifton Campbell
all right, Marty, that's us.

00:00:01.75
Marty Ketola
Mrs. Bates needs her payout for the night will not be seen this week, so we may bring you the following desperate measure.

00:00:11.29
Clifton Campbell
Mrs. Bates running the, of course, the, ah what do you call it?

00:00:13.56
Marty Ketola
Yeah.

00:00:15.73
Clifton Campbell
i don't want to call it a whorehouse. I guess it's a ah brothel.

00:00:17.82
ryan luis rodriguez
brothel.

00:00:17.76
Marty Ketola
Norman, can you just stay one more hour, Norman? One more hour. I'll get a replacement for you. And then he eventually snapped and started...

00:00:24.82
Clifton Campbell
Started killing everybody, including his mother. That makes sense.

00:00:27.29
ryan luis rodriguez
you That was a deleted scene.

00:00:28.98
Clifton Campbell
Yeah. I mean, that's little more compelling than, know, what we've got, I think. Anyway, welcome back.

00:00:37.30
Marty Ketola
All right. So we're back. It's Talking Pondo. Once again, I'm Marty.

00:00:41.59
Clifton Campbell
And I'm Cliff.

00:00:42.52
Marty Ketola
And we have another guest this week because we just keep cramming the guests on because we have a lot of people that want to be on the show. And it's, we have more fun having somebody on the show than just doing it ourselves.

00:00:55.70
Marty Ketola
I think we do enjoy doing it ourselves, but it always seems to be a little bit more something to it. And the guests always bring us a movie that we probably never would have gotten around to, which is also something I enjoy.

00:01:06.19
Marty Ketola
But you've

00:01:06.66
Clifton Campbell
It keeps us on our best behavior too, you know.

00:01:08.98
Marty Ketola
Oh, is that the whole thing? Like when people know the cameras on them, they, well, I let that go years ago.

00:01:13.08
Clifton Campbell
Exactly.

00:01:14.18
ryan luis rodriguez
Wait, there's a camera on me? No.

00:01:15.70
Clifton Campbell
Yes, right now.

00:01:16.60
ryan luis rodriguez
No.

00:01:16.66
Clifton Campbell
Yes.

00:01:17.27
ryan luis rodriguez
I can't deal with this.

00:01:17.58
Marty Ketola
Or a microphone.

00:01:18.43
ryan luis rodriguez
I'm out.

00:01:18.83
Marty Ketola
Yeah.

00:01:20.75
Clifton Campbell
Well, they said the Beatles during the last like two or three albums, they had to keep bringing in guests, you know, like Clapton and and the guy Billy Preston and so on to keep the so they wouldn't fight amongst themselves.

00:01:20.50
Marty Ketola
Well, having.

00:01:28.11
ryan luis rodriguez
Billy Preston.

00:01:31.82
Clifton Campbell
They were like, we have a guest here. We can't fight. Not that Marty and I fight, but I'm just saying it keeps us on our best behavior.

00:01:34.46
Marty Ketola
Well,

00:01:37.14
Marty Ketola
Having ah a mic or a camera on in front of us since 1990, I've kind of left the whole best behavior thing way behind the dust, and I'm pretty much just myself at this rate in front of the mic.

00:01:46.78
Clifton Campbell
Hey!

00:01:49.49
Marty Ketola
But today, you've heard you've heard today's guest on his podcast, One Track Mine, and of course the classic, The Coolness Chronicles. If you don't know that one, you've got to look it up. It's Ryan Luis Rodriguez.

00:02:02.69
ryan luis rodriguez
Hello!

00:02:04.50
Marty Ketola
Yes.

00:02:10.55
Clifton Campbell
oh but sorry that's a like and subscribe moment my apologies welcome welcome to the show ryan thanks for coming on buddy

00:02:12.44
Marty Ketola
Like and subscribe. Here, Zuzu Vela noises.

00:02:17.70
ryan luis rodriguez
Of course. I'm so happy you guys invited me back.

00:02:21.14
Clifton Campbell
yeah oh well we yeah we've been we keep saying we're gonna we gotta to come around and get the get the voice back on again and so it's finally happening we just had um

00:02:21.41
Marty Ketola
Good to have you back.

00:02:29.49
Marty Ketola
It took a while, yeah.

00:02:30.71
Clifton Campbell
Just had Rob on and so you and I think Ben Big Ben's coming up.

00:02:34.03
Marty Ketola
Mm-hmm.

00:02:35.68
ryan luis rodriguez
Now you need to get Dylan to finish out the quadrilogy. That's

00:02:39.13
Clifton Campbell
Yes, exactly.

00:02:38.97
Marty Ketola
Exactly. He's a probably coming in for the holiday episode again.

00:02:45.50
ryan luis rodriguez
right. Figgy Pondo.

00:02:46.84
Clifton Campbell
Figgy Pondo, yeah.

00:02:46.62
Marty Ketola
yeah he seemed to love doing that so much that I'll have to bring him back for a couple more weird ones.

00:02:46.86
ryan luis rodriguez
That's right.

00:02:50.52
ryan luis rodriguez
He talks about it before every recording that we do.

00:02:54.20
Marty Ketola
Wow.

00:02:56.31
Clifton Campbell
Well, I mean, he offered to do it, so we gave him, you know, and then he bit, he kind of mildly complained through the whole episode, which I found very endearing where he was just like I didn't actually think we'd do this.

00:03:03.35
Marty Ketola
the

00:03:05.84
Clifton Campbell
And was like yes.

00:03:05.91
Marty Ketola
He did have to watch Mixed Nuts, so...

00:03:08.89
Clifton Campbell
Oh, that's, ah that's now a Christmas classic. Come on.

00:03:10.81
Marty Ketola
And then we'll make him watch Mixed Nuts again this year, but don't tell him. But this speaking of ah Mixed Nuts and the Schlenzoverse, we ah have some listener mail that we can get to real quick here.

00:03:23.71
Clifton Campbell
Oh, sweet.

00:03:24.47
Marty Ketola
ah Both of these responses were about the ah Send Help and the Quiet Earth episode we just did with Rob Maynard a few weeks back. So the first response was from Daniel Hoy from the Hoy's over at Bravo with the B-side.

00:03:38.65
Clifton Campbell
Hey, we love.

00:03:39.91
Marty Ketola
And she says, I feel like our movie watching habits overlap a lot.

00:03:45.53
Clifton Campbell
Oh, yeah.

00:03:47.16
Marty Ketola
So apparently she's watching stuff and then we talk about it on the show next week. That's always kind of funny how that ties in. And we also have, Hey, imagine this Dylan J. Schlender writes in and says, Maynard's idea of a unit of a unified Schlenzoverse intrigues me for reasons. I cannot quite put my finger on, which is a responded by Rob Maynard saying, Whoa. And your name Schlenzo. What are the odds? Yeah.

00:04:17.11
Marty Ketola
And Dylan says, i think the idea came from a truck. So that was our listener mail for the week that I keep wanting to call viewer mail, but nobody can actually see us.

00:04:27.38
Clifton Campbell
I love how we're somehow in the Schlenzo-verse. Like, we didn't start the podcast to be in it, but we just – there was enough gravity that we just got so caught in the orbit, you know?

00:04:35.26
Marty Ketola
pool, right?

00:04:36.55
Clifton Campbell
and

00:04:37.00
ryan luis rodriguez
It's like the Sony Spider-Man universe where you're kind of on the side. You're in Venom right now, but then when you step up to to the Shlendoverse, then you're in the Avengers all of a sudden.

00:04:45.13
Clifton Campbell
Then you're – okay.

00:04:45.69
Marty Ketola
ah

00:04:48.07
Clifton Campbell
Venom's not – I mean, I'll take that over Madam Webber.

00:04:52.13
ryan luis rodriguez
I don't know. Madame Web's kind of fun.

00:04:55.13
Marty Ketola
Next week, Madam

00:04:57.56
Clifton Campbell
Um,

00:04:57.56
ryan luis rodriguez
Oh, God. I would love next time I bring it and i bring that on. Oh, man.

00:05:01.40
Clifton Campbell
Oh my goodness.

00:05:01.76
ryan luis rodriguez
That'd be amazing. You guys would hate me so much.

00:05:02.38
Marty Ketola
Web.

00:05:05.27
Clifton Campbell
Probably, but I haven't, I mean, look, man, I'll hate watch something and then talk 20 minutes about how much I can't stand it.

00:05:06.33
Marty Ketola
I still haven't watched that one.

00:05:12.90
Clifton Campbell
No problem. Yeah. I'm all about that.

00:05:14.04
Marty Ketola
Makes for a good thought.

00:05:14.52
ryan luis rodriguez
Oh, there's there's more than 20 minutes worth there. Trust It's the only sarcastic recommendation I've ever given on Reels of Justice.

00:05:17.75
Clifton Campbell
Yeah.

00:05:18.33
Marty Ketola
but

00:05:19.31
Clifton Campbell
I believe it. Um,

00:05:24.25
Marty Ketola
yeah So Cliff, what are what movies do we have this week?

00:05:29.71
Clifton Campbell
wellop So today, all right, so today we, this is pretty great. So Marty gave, Ryan a couple choices and he chose Psycho from 1960, which was awesome.

00:05:40.14
Clifton Campbell
So we finally getting some hitch on here, which is pretty good.

00:05:39.96
Marty Ketola
Mm-hmm.

00:05:42.58
Clifton Campbell
That's where this will be our first Hitchcock.

00:05:42.82
Marty Ketola
Mm-hmm.

00:05:44.38
Clifton Campbell
And then he gave us Working Girls, which is from 1986. And, is you know, it it reminded me a lot of the last movie he gave us because it's kind of a slice of life day in the life of type of thing, you know, with it's basically about a girl who works in a brothel, you know, and and a a nice one and it run out of an apartment.

00:06:01.64
Clifton Campbell
So,

00:06:02.08
Marty Ketola
It wasn't Melanie Griffith with Harrison Ford?

00:06:03.99
Clifton Campbell
No, that's working girl.

00:06:05.75
Marty Ketola
No, I watched the right movie, I know, but...

00:06:06.29
Clifton Campbell
That's working. Okay. I've already done that once. were supposed to watch Pelham one, two, three. watch, or assault on precinct 13.

00:06:16.12
Marty Ketola
Assault on Precinct 13, and you watched The Taking of Bellum 1, 2, 3.

00:06:18.17
Clifton Campbell
Yes. Pelham one, two, three.

00:06:20.32
Marty Ketola
I guess the numbers got mixed up, but that's in the past, Cliff.

00:06:22.99
Clifton Campbell
Yeah.

00:06:25.85
Marty Ketola
let's ah Let's see what Ryan wants to start with today, as we usually like to let the guests pick the first film.

00:06:33.34
Clifton Campbell
Mr. Rodriguez.

00:06:33.73
ryan luis rodriguez
Oh. but Well, this is a film that I discovered about two or three years ago, and I did ah a just a random search on Criterion Channel, because it was streaming there.

00:06:45.18
ryan luis rodriguez
And I was intrigued by the premise, and i watched it thinking, this oh, there's going to be some, some like... um This is going to be like sensationalist.

00:06:56.13
ryan luis rodriguez
It's going to be exploitive. It's going to be something like that. But then I found this very human, empathetic story about sex workers that, just like the last movie that I brought over, Starlet, it humanizes them and shows that sex work is just that.

00:07:09.20
Marty Ketola
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

00:07:11.83
ryan luis rodriguez
It's work. And it wasn't until I started taking notes and watching this movie again that I realized how much it had in common with Starlet. And it made me wonder, should I have chosen a different movie? And I thought, well, maybe it too late. So, now you guys are stuck with it.

00:07:25.66
Clifton Campbell
I literally said that to him before we started the show. I was like, this is very much like, it reminds me so much like, star although Starlet, ah Do we want to start with Working girl then Girls then? Yeah. yeah Okay, great. So um i'll read the I'll read the description real quick before we get started because I have a lot to say about Working Girls actually. So a lesbian college graduate trying to bankroll her own photography business works as a high-priced New York City escort. Unrated from 1986 and it's an hour and 33 minutes long.

00:07:54.30
Clifton Campbell
Let me get you storyline.

00:07:54.90
ryan luis rodriguez
No fat on it. No fat on it whatsoever.

00:07:56.31
Clifton Campbell
I don't know. Now, A Day in the Life of Several Prostitutes in an upscale Manhattan Whorehouse. The film is a stark portrayal of the women, prostitutes, the male customers, and the motivations of both. Watch as the madam manipulates her girls. Watch as she answers the phone by saying, hello, John, what's new and different? Watch as the Johns try to manipulate the girls. Part nudie exploitation, part sociological thesis.

00:08:18.17
Clifton Campbell
Working Girls, 1986.

00:08:21.02
Clifton Campbell
So the first thing I have to say about this is, yeah, I was telling him this feels a lot like Starlet, only Starlet... I feel like Sean was like, I really need the the gritty realism of working in porn in this.

00:08:32.25
Clifton Campbell
Right. So we've got to have some penetration. I need to get some porn stars in the background actually doing this.

00:08:34.94
Marty Ketola
One has different storylines. This is just in the house.

00:08:36.79
Clifton Campbell
it does and it does And it does have a different, but but this, mean, they're both working in the sex industry. Right. Whereas working girls is she's like, it's enough to just kind of do a lot of implied there's, of course there's nudity all throughout the movie, but but you know, there's, it's more implied, you know, uh, condoms being wrapped into new Kleenex and thrown into trash, things of that nature,

00:08:41.05
Marty Ketola
um Yeah, yeah, yeah.

00:08:56.10
ryan luis rodriguez
And there was originally an up-close handjob that they had to cut out because of ratings, so that fits in again with Starlet's pornography sequence.

00:09:01.45
Marty Ketola
Yeah,

00:09:02.52
Clifton Campbell
Okay, that makes sense. Okay, that makes sense. It reminds me a bit of short bus to where short bus was like, we're going to put a lot of that in there, or at least a bit of that in there to sell it.

00:09:05.78
Marty Ketola
being 86...

00:09:10.58
ryan luis rodriguez
Yeah. Yeah, totally.

00:09:13.01
Clifton Campbell
Yeah.

00:09:13.59
ryan luis rodriguez
That earned nine songs.

00:09:15.70
Clifton Campbell
That one I haven't seen.

00:09:17.43
ryan luis rodriguez
Michael Winterbottom. It's basically five concerts interspersed with two actors having unsimulated sex.

00:09:26.31
Clifton Campbell
Interesting. Okay.

00:09:27.08
ryan luis rodriguez
I've seen the scenes before. I've never seen the movie.

00:09:33.53
Clifton Campbell
Gotcha. Interesting. um The soundtrack in the beginning kind of drove me crazy. I have to admit, I wasn't a fan of the ah the sort of, it's it's very bing bong bong.

00:09:42.42
Marty Ketola
Well, it's very 86, you know.

00:09:46.26
ryan luis rodriguez
It's Seinfeld, but with moaning.

00:09:46.62
Clifton Campbell
track Yeah, it's trying to be that, that i I don't want to say artistic, but it's trying to, it it sounds like somebody in college doing an artistic soundtrack for a movie, right?

00:09:58.32
ryan luis rodriguez
Yeah.

00:09:58.65
Clifton Campbell
But it

00:09:58.74
ryan luis rodriguez
Somebody just got a Moog synthesizer and they're just like testing it out.

00:10:02.33
Clifton Campbell
Yeah, but quickly it kind of mellows itself out. Like it quickly gets out of that. Like once the story starts going, it's like, all right, this is just for certain pieces to set the atmosphere. And then here comes the rest of the story. And it I was grateful for that because i i I actually enjoyed the film quite a bit.

00:10:18.90
Clifton Campbell
um Like you said, it tends to humanize the work. There's more humor in it that you think. And um the pacing of it is very, very, very good. Like.

00:10:29.43
ryan luis rodriguez
Yeah.

00:10:30.17
Clifton Campbell
I was an hour and 10 minutes in before I looked up and went, how much more this movie's got? 20 minutes. Holy shit. Okay. This is over.

00:10:38.01
ryan luis rodriguez
Yeah.

00:10:39.38
Marty Ketola
Yeah, I look at it like a if Clerks was about prostitutes.

00:10:46.58
Clifton Campbell
ah

00:10:46.90
Marty Ketola
It almost feels like if Dante and Randall were just, yeah, right?

00:10:47.70
ryan luis rodriguez
Just because they serve you doesn't mean they like you.

00:10:52.04
Marty Ketola
And they talk about the stuff in between and another customer comes in and And I was like, oh okay.

00:11:02.07
Clifton Campbell
Just because they serve you doesn't mean they like you.

00:11:04.38
Marty Ketola
Exactly.

00:11:04.92
Clifton Campbell
Oh, shit. That's funny. So, go ahead.

00:11:06.39
Marty Ketola
Now, I thought I had seen every movie from 1986 that was even close to mainstream, but I hadn't seen this one. I remember seeing it in the video store, seeing the Charter Home Entertainment logo on the box.

00:11:13.30
Clifton Campbell
Mmm.

00:11:20.54
Marty Ketola
Because for some reason or another, I memorized details like that back then. But watching this movie ah the other day, realizing, no, this is a a first time viewing for me of this.

00:11:30.51
Clifton Campbell
Oh, there was no internet.

00:11:31.46
Marty Ketola
Is that what it is?

00:11:31.86
Clifton Campbell
That's why you remember things from back there that. Yeah, thanks so I so. So I'm watching this and I'm about 25 minutes in and I go, I've seen this before.

00:11:43.74
Clifton Campbell
i can't remember i don't i can't get a clear memory of it, but something about this seems super, super familiar.

00:11:44.62
Marty Ketola
Hmm.

00:11:51.05
Clifton Campbell
I'm sure I saw this on Cinemax, of the movie channel late at night in the 80s, blah, blah, blah. And then finally we get to the scene where Uh, she's, she gets hired by that dude and he wants her to play a blind girl and he wants to be the doctor that cures her blindness.

00:12:08.95
Clifton Campbell
And I started laughing so fucking hard because that's the scene I remember. Like, it all came like like a water, like somebody just dumped water.

00:12:12.79
Marty Ketola
Ah.

00:12:15.55
Clifton Campbell
i was like, I've seen this movie. I remember this now. Because I remember as a kid, i was probably 13 or 14 watching this scene laughing hysterically because, of course, you know, as soon as she says, Doctor, I can see he comes.

00:12:21.16
Marty Ketola
Mm-hmm.

00:12:27.02
Clifton Campbell
And that's fucking so funny. So funny and ridiculous all at the same time. fact I laughed for a good, I had to pause the movie. I was laughing for like five minutes, both from the memory and from the scene itself. It was fantastic.

00:12:40.60
ryan luis rodriguez
And according to the commentary, the one Japanese John that comes in apparently came off right off the street and apparently smelled very bad, but they had to put him in the scene anyway because he was the only one that would actually perform.

00:12:49.45
Marty Ketola
Oh, my.

00:12:53.38
Clifton Campbell
Oh, wow. Ooh.

00:12:55.42
Marty Ketola
Well, that explains the realism.

00:12:57.37
Clifton Campbell
Yeah, to put him in the shower. Jesus. um Do we know how much this movie costs?

00:13:04.47
ryan luis rodriguez
ah Like 700,000? Around there?

00:13:07.26
Clifton Campbell
three Okay, im d IMDb says 300.

00:13:07.26
ryan luis rodriguez
around there

00:13:07.30
Marty Ketola
Yeah.

00:13:10.49
ryan luis rodriguez
I believe that better. Yeah.

00:13:11.67
Clifton Campbell
um

00:13:12.09
Marty Ketola
Mm-hmm.

00:13:12.88
Clifton Campbell
1.7 million worldwide. Hell, she made eight times her money back on the thing.

00:13:14.97
Marty Ketola
Yeah, yeah.

00:13:15.94
Clifton Campbell
That's really well done.

00:13:16.92
Marty Ketola
This is a textbook er example of how to make a low budget movie as a first time director.

00:13:26.44
Clifton Campbell
Mm-hmm.

00:13:26.67
Marty Ketola
It's a perfect example of limited locations, limited actors, limited wardrobe. Hell, even limited coverage shots. There's a lot of just full, you know, it's almost like an assembl assembly edit, but it it goes it it pulls off exactly what it's trying to do, right?

00:13:46.08
Clifton Campbell
Totally agree.

00:13:46.42
Marty Ketola
Yeah.

00:13:46.68
ryan luis rodriguez
Just a brief correction, it's her second film.

00:13:46.70
Marty Ketola
and Oh, second.

00:13:49.65
Clifton Campbell
Oh.

00:13:49.53
Marty Ketola
Well, it feels still right around in that, you know.

00:13:51.97
Clifton Campbell
Yeah, it still definitely feels like an early film for a filmmaker.

00:13:52.13
Marty Ketola
Mm-hmm.

00:13:55.83
ryan luis rodriguez
Yes.

00:13:55.86
Clifton Campbell
um

00:13:58.55
Clifton Campbell
I think it's a very smart film. i agree I agree with you that, that, you know, again, it's limited locations, limited blah, blah, blah, so on.

00:13:59.98
Marty Ketola
Mm-hmm, mm-hmm.

00:14:04.91
Clifton Campbell
But she's also smart enough to write a ah script that's highbrow enough ah that you can follow it and kind of get intrigued with what's going on. This push pull with the madam where they're stealing from her by reporting halves instead of holes.

00:14:17.61
Clifton Campbell
And, and then the madam showing up and throwing a fucking fit about, you know, with the blonde girl that she hates. um You know, there's the great quote in there is we have a blonde, a college girl, and we have Gina.

00:14:27.88
Clifton Campbell
Yeah. you know, which I thought was fucking hilarious. I was just like, damn, you know, like way to just, I mean, throw shade at one of your, one of your girls.

00:14:30.41
ryan luis rodriguez
Bye.

00:14:35.56
Clifton Campbell
Right. ah But very smart. And so you can, it you can get in it. all It also in the eighties, this type of art, art house type stuff, it always had nudity in it. Right.

00:14:45.75
Clifton Campbell
So she gets everything in there. That's going to hit all the, hit all the buttons to play in those art house cinemas. This is never going to probably play in a big theater, get a big run. Right.

00:14:54.61
Marty Ketola
oh not in 86 yeah

00:14:55.86
Clifton Campbell
But it is going to be intriguing to people who are into these kind of artistic films in the 80s, in my opinion.

00:14:59.77
Marty Ketola
who

00:15:00.30
Clifton Campbell
Very smartly done.

00:15:01.56
ryan luis rodriguez
And it's not nudity that's sexualized.

00:15:04.02
Clifton Campbell
No, exactly.

00:15:03.83
Marty Ketola
oh not at all the movie's not erotic

00:15:04.12
ryan luis rodriguez
she made She made a big effort to film the nudity from a female gaze.

00:15:10.05
Clifton Campbell
Yeah, absolutely.

00:15:09.82
Marty Ketola
her

00:15:10.89
Clifton Campbell
Well, it's, you know, if you're 12 and you've never seen boobs or you're looking see boobs, you might find it erotic. But if you're, Jesus Christ, if you're an adult of any kind, you're like, oh, this isn't really what they're going for at all.

00:15:20.39
ryan luis rodriguez
Right.

00:15:20.57
Clifton Campbell
Like, this is just, you know,

00:15:22.03
Marty Ketola
It's neutral, right?

00:15:23.24
Clifton Campbell
It's neutral. Yeah. Yeah.

00:15:24.41
Marty Ketola
I feel like the the whole thing, it's

00:15:25.81
Clifton Campbell
It's, it's very matter of fact.

00:15:27.58
Marty Ketola
It's so clinical, so transactional. It's like it's not erotic.

00:15:30.68
Clifton Campbell
one

00:15:31.70
Marty Ketola
So the question is, why? Well, we all know the answer. Some guys are wired to, you know, this strange cuck level of kink. You know, humanity is weird, but they are just people.

00:15:44.57
Marty Ketola
But why are we as humans so weird about the act that is essentially just making more people? Yeah. that you can't connect with another human.

00:15:55.04
Marty Ketola
So you have to go to the prostitute and, and all they really, it seems like this movie portrays them as people who just want to have a connection, but they don't know how to talk to people. And so there's ah a layer of sadness over the whole film, I thought, which gave it that kind of dramatic pool as well.

00:16:10.64
Marty Ketola
Cause it doesn't, it doesn't provide answers. It's just very matter of fact, like this is an example of the high scale, you know?

00:16:15.19
Clifton Campbell
This is what it is. Yeah.

00:16:19.10
Marty Ketola
and And also since it's the 80s, a lot of her Johns are these older guys that come from that older time period where women were more subjugated. Like remember when we watched the How to Murder Your Wife, Jack Lemmon movie, and then we watched Save the Tiger, which this kind of has vibes of. The only thing this movie is missing is Jack Lemmon being one of the Johns showing up.

00:16:43.45
Marty Ketola
You have a little bit more of that air of s sadness to it, you know.

00:16:44.91
Clifton Campbell
Now that would be fucking interesting.

00:16:47.76
ryan luis rodriguez
And you got to keep in mind, this is like as AIDS was beginning to bloom.

00:16:50.97
Marty Ketola
Yeah. Okay.

00:16:52.25
Clifton Campbell
Yeah.

00:16:52.25
ryan luis rodriguez
i guess bloom is the terrible word. Bloom naturally has good connotations. and when AIDS was beginning to infect.

00:16:56.53
Clifton Campbell
Explode. Yeah.

00:17:00.02
ryan luis rodriguez
And so it being a being a sex worker all of a sudden now took on an an extra level of risk that wasn't there before.

00:17:10.43
Clifton Campbell
Mm-hmm. Yeah. Well, you know, I've read that yeah and different things ah about prostitution. And what I've read is that a lot of men, while they are seeking sex, some of them are just seeking companionship.

00:17:21.91
Marty Ketola
And there's some assholes that show up.

00:17:22.58
Clifton Campbell
You know, absolutely.

00:17:23.59
Marty Ketola
She gets assaulted like three or four times during this.

00:17:25.39
Clifton Campbell
There's a that's what one of the things I like about the movie is that it shows a broad spectrum of people and why they're there rather than just everybody's just like, you know, all right, next one, pull your panties off.

00:17:26.39
Marty Ketola
so

00:17:29.72
Marty Ketola
Yeah.

00:17:35.90
Clifton Campbell
Let's go. It's not that at all.

00:17:36.18
Marty Ketola
And yet there's the similarity of, can you see me on the outside?

00:17:38.20
Clifton Campbell
But there is some of it.

00:17:40.47
Marty Ketola
You know, the nice guy says it, the jerk says it.

00:17:41.14
Clifton Campbell
yeah

00:17:43.35
Marty Ketola
They all have that same similarity there.

00:17:45.64
Clifton Campbell
Yeah. Yeah. Mm-hmm.

00:17:47.54
Marty Ketola
Not all of them, but a bunch of them.

00:17:48.00
ryan luis rodriguez
And I love how mundane everything is.

00:17:50.52
Marty Ketola
Mm-hmm.

00:17:51.32
ryan luis rodriguez
Like there's ah a moment towards the end of the movie where they're celebrating a birthday and they give out a birthday cake. and And on the commentary, Lizzie Borden's like, the only difference between this and a corporate environment is the fact that there are prostitutes here.

00:18:07.50
ryan luis rodriguez
It's like, but it's a corporate environment. I'm pretty sure there are prostitutes there too, but still it's just a different environment.

00:18:11.22
Marty Ketola
Exactly.

00:18:13.94
Clifton Campbell
If it was corporate environment, it would be pizza, probably, a instead of cake. Corporate environments like to order a lot of pizza.

00:18:21.08
ryan luis rodriguez
Yeah. one

00:18:22.68
Clifton Campbell
I think that's cool.

00:18:22.49
Marty Ketola
And who drank all the Gatorade?

00:18:24.50
Clifton Campbell
Right.

00:18:27.72
Clifton Campbell
Shoe polished melon, motherfucker.

00:18:29.64
Marty Ketola
That's funny because, you know, I bring up clerks. And if you remember on when we covered that episode, I had this whole rant where I focused on one aspect of the movie that nobody else in the history of the film has ever focused on. Dante stealing newspapers from the newspaper machine and how much that irritated me as a newspaper delivery driver at the time. But then I realized his driver wasn't giving him his paper. So what other choice did he have?

00:18:52.60
Marty Ketola
Well, the weird thing that happened in this movie is and You're going to to let me know if you if you remember this phenomenon, Ryan. At the very end of the movie, she deposits cash into an ATM and she puts the cash into an envelope first.

00:19:04.73
Clifton Campbell
Yes.

00:19:08.41
Marty Ketola
Remember when that was the norm, Cliff, before they switched the ATMs over?

00:19:10.42
Clifton Campbell
Yes.

00:19:10.52
ryan luis rodriguez
I do oh my god you're taking me back man taking me back 15 years and oh my god

00:19:11.32
Clifton Campbell
Yes. you Yeah.

00:19:13.73
Marty Ketola
blew my mind. I'm like, I they forgot all about that.

00:19:15.64
Clifton Campbell
Yeah. Yeah. And there were different, different ATMs had different types of envelopes because some of the ATMs had that envelope where you had to pop the the so end of it open like you were trying to get a apple pie out from McDonald's out, you know, like, and then you'd slide the money in then then you put that in.

00:19:17.50
Marty Ketola
Mm-hmm.

00:19:27.22
Marty Ketola
Oh, yeah, yeah.

00:19:30.23
Clifton Campbell
and then others, you had just had the envelope that you'd put the money in and bam.

00:19:34.20
ryan luis rodriguez
And they actually had the envelope dispenser on them, which, my God, I cannot find an ATM that has any semblance of that whatsoever now.

00:19:34.02
Marty Ketola
Wow.

00:19:37.78
Clifton Campbell
Yes.

00:19:37.65
Marty Ketola
Mm-hmm.

00:19:38.58
Clifton Campbell
Yes.

00:19:42.52
ryan luis rodriguez
even not Even in gas stations.

00:19:42.30
Marty Ketola
Yeah.

00:19:42.65
Clifton Campbell
I can't even, I can't even imagine putting fucking cash into an ATM now. I can't even, imagine like I just can't even I wouldn't do it.

00:19:46.78
Marty Ketola
No.

00:19:47.32
ryan luis rodriguez
No. Yeah.

00:19:49.67
Clifton Campbell
I'd just go to the bank. I think

00:19:50.78
Marty Ketola
Yeah.

00:19:51.09
ryan luis rodriguez
Yeah.

00:19:51.91
Marty Ketola
It's just the cool thing about these older movies.

00:19:54.30
Clifton Campbell
that's a great poll.

00:19:54.26
Marty Ketola
it was mundane at the time, but they captured a piece of history without even realizing the technology that stayed it.

00:19:54.86
Clifton Campbell
I completely missed that. Mm-hmm.

00:20:01.74
ryan luis rodriguez
It's all cultural anthropology.

00:20:04.10
Clifton Campbell
Well, that's from what I understand, that's why a lot of these like sixties and seventies home movies are very, very popular with people and and they're archived on archive.org a lot because a lot of it is just like, look, this is people at the beach.

00:20:17.06
Clifton Campbell
This is what the beach looked like in the sixties. This is what the fucking beach house, this is what the, um, the lifeguard shack looked like, or this is what you want to, you know, whatever. I thought that's really, really interesting.

00:20:26.07
ryan luis rodriguez
I don't know if you guys saw the movie Model Shop, but it it takes place in 1969.

00:20:29.11
Marty Ketola
Oh,

00:20:30.81
Clifton Campbell
Sounds familiar.

00:20:32.14
ryan luis rodriguez
It was shot in 1969. It covers a lot of the same locations as Once Upon a Time in Hollywood.

00:20:37.24
Marty Ketola
OK.

00:20:37.58
ryan luis rodriguez
It's one of those things where it's like it it it feels like the documentary approach to a Tarantino film.

00:20:43.40
Clifton Campbell
Oh, okay.

00:20:44.06
ryan luis rodriguez
And you get to see what all these locations actually looked like before they redressed them for his film.

00:20:49.13
Marty Ketola
I can save the tiger.

00:20:49.40
Clifton Campbell
That's, yeah, let's, when when we watched Save the Tiger, we were talking to Daniel Roebuck and we and and we were all just like, Jesus Christ, the the LA in the 70s on that, especially on that strip is just perfectly preserved in that film.

00:20:50.10
Marty Ketola
Yeah.

00:21:01.77
Clifton Campbell
It's amazing.

00:21:02.36
ryan luis rodriguez
You got Daniel Roebuck on this podcast?

00:21:05.02
Clifton Campbell
Yes, sir.

00:21:05.18
Marty Ketola
Oh yeah, that one probably hasn't dropped yet.

00:21:06.04
ryan luis rodriguez
Oh my god.

00:21:07.10
Marty Ketola
But yeah, he was cool.

00:21:07.61
Clifton Campbell
Yeah.

00:21:07.86
ryan luis rodriguez
That's awesome.

00:21:08.10
Marty Ketola
yeah

00:21:09.02
Clifton Campbell
Yeah, yeah, it'll be out coming out real soon. He was ah just a gem, just a peach of a guy, man.

00:21:12.31
Marty Ketola
her

00:21:13.46
Clifton Campbell
He was so nice. Oh, yeah, we did a Talking Lemon with him. So we did two Jack Lemmon movies.

00:21:20.25
Marty Ketola
Jack women movies, yeah.

00:21:23.35
Clifton Campbell
Yeah, set to set to come out soon.

00:21:23.29
Marty Ketola
That was fun. Mm-hmm. Okay.

00:21:28.82
Clifton Campbell
um Usually the old wake up to the alarm clock going off. and the person sleeping in the hand hits the alarm is a bad sign in a movie for me.

00:21:42.00
Clifton Campbell
Cause he it's, it's, it's the opening of, ah of some of a few movies, but usually it's the, it's the opening of a bad movie.

00:21:41.77
Marty Ketola
That's the opening of Clerks, isn't it? Yeah.

00:21:49.30
Clifton Campbell
It sometimes the the movie overcomes it. This one definitely does. But every time I see the opening movie, I go, Oh,

00:21:53.11
Marty Ketola
who

00:21:55.70
Clifton Campbell
And then the rest of the movie is like, okay, it climbs out of that hole or it doesn't.

00:21:59.96
Marty Ketola
yeah

00:22:00.65
Clifton Campbell
Right. And so for me that it just, it's one of those things I think we learned in class where it was like, don't film class was like, don't do that. It's so overdone. Don't do it. It's, you know, type of thing.

00:22:10.79
Clifton Campbell
So every time I see it, I'm like, Hmm, is the movie going to overcome it or not? And this one definitely does. um I like that slow pull down to where she's just laying with her girlfriend and you're like,

00:22:21.36
Clifton Campbell
She's just that moment before she gets up. And then later on, of course, you find out, oh, sure his girlfriend girlfriend doesn't even know she does this. Well, that's interesting.

00:22:27.48
Marty Ketola
Mm-hmm.

00:22:28.44
ryan luis rodriguez
She hides her clothes in a and a drawer and says that she's just taking photographs during the day.

00:22:32.98
Clifton Campbell
Yeah.

00:22:36.11
ryan luis rodriguez
It's kind of like, I mean, i can understand why you would be embarrassed about something like this, especially when it's as stigmatized as it is.

00:22:36.35
Clifton Campbell
Yep.

00:22:36.34
Marty Ketola
Mm-hmm.

00:22:43.00
Clifton Campbell
Yeah.

00:22:42.94
Marty Ketola
Mm-hmm.

00:22:43.99
Clifton Campbell
But then again, if your partner finds out, that's going to fucking be really bad for you. You know? Yeah.

00:22:49.98
Marty Ketola
Do you think she genuinely quit the job at the end? Because the movie kind of, with that last shot, with the credits rolling with her eye open, gives the, is she wondering or not? And the credits end, and her eye closes.

00:23:02.58
Marty Ketola
And it's like, oh, there is hope. That's how I took that. Mm-hmm.

00:23:06.58
ryan luis rodriguez
I personally believe that she would go in the next day.

00:23:06.50
Marty Ketola
That's what it seemed like.

00:23:11.22
ryan luis rodriguez
Maybe give her two weeks notice. i don't know if that's how it works in a brothel, but, you know.

00:23:15.48
Marty Ketola
Mm-hmm. Working Girls 2, The Next Day.

00:23:17.29
Clifton Campbell
I'll give you two weeks to replace me and then I'm out of here. um It's a weird thing for a brothel, but I guess it depends. Yeah. i I don't know. I feel like she, to me, it felt like she was just like, I've had enough.

00:23:28.50
Clifton Campbell
um And that, you know, maybe she's you know going to try to get her own clients or maybe do her own thing.

00:23:34.66
Marty Ketola
It's ambiguous, definitely.

00:23:35.61
Clifton Campbell
it It is, but it is ambiguous. I like that you can kind of take your own ending from it.

00:23:36.92
Marty Ketola
But she does tell the other person you should find something else to do if this, you know, distresses you, and is that a foreshadowing that she's feeling the same way, perhaps?

00:23:46.74
Clifton Campbell
that new girl was just a freaking nightmare and that it was just like oh god what is she doing here like that you know ah she seemed so ah shiny and fresh and innocent compared to the other three girls that were there it was just like oh this is not gonna go well for you you can tell right away this is not gonna be good

00:24:05.23
ryan luis rodriguez
Yeah. And the the African-American sex worker who but who basically gets told, listen, a lot of guys are not going to want to sleep with you. It's like, well, that's a great first day.

00:24:14.81
Clifton Campbell
yep

00:24:16.23
ryan luis rodriguez
Wow.

00:24:17.69
Clifton Campbell
Yeah. Yeah.

00:24:18.07
Marty Ketola
horrible bosses.

00:24:19.38
Clifton Campbell
Well, and you could tell she's hurting for because she's just like, you

00:24:19.96
ryan luis rodriguez
By the way, I'm a racist. Welcome to the industry.

00:24:23.00
Marty Ketola
And my boyfriend would take you upstairs right now, so.

00:24:26.28
Clifton Campbell
know. Maybe that's why she said it, because she's jealous that her that is boyfriend her boyfriend wants her. Hmm.

00:24:33.86
Marty Ketola
Well, I'm sure there's a multitude of reasons why that character does what she does. She's a handful. She's good actress, but my God, she's not that character, of that madam. Yeah.

00:24:44.95
Clifton Campbell
Yeah, she's she's definitely a a terrible person. Let's put it that way. Mild, to put it mildly, she's terrible person.

00:24:56.18
Marty Ketola
So compared to Starlet, what did, i mean, because there were, i thought Starlet was, this is it's similarities, but of course that one has the whole different story about the daughter that the older woman never had or she left or whatever that story was with that. And this one is more contained just to the slice of life one day.

00:25:15.58
Marty Ketola
Like I thought, oh, this movie is not really going have an ending. It's just going to stop. Right. And it's like, no, the day ended and she went home. So I guess that was.

00:25:23.03
ryan luis rodriguez
And Starlet's more of a comedy than anything else.

00:25:24.96
Marty Ketola
Mm-hmm.

00:25:25.94
ryan luis rodriguez
Like that that whole relationship between the older woman and Dree Hemingway's character. it it has a there's a There's a lot of levity to it. that Even though you're dealing with heavy issues. there's like when when she gets and When she finds out that there's been a stripper pole installed in her in her house.

00:25:45.85
ryan luis rodriguez
We don't have a moment like that in Working Girls.

00:25:47.83
Marty Ketola
No.

00:25:48.33
Clifton Campbell
That's true.

00:25:48.57
ryan luis rodriguez
Nobody's going that far.

00:25:50.49
Clifton Campbell
True.

00:25:50.55
ryan luis rodriguez
But and especially the reaction is what I got this for you. i thought you would love this.

00:26:00.12
Clifton Campbell
um So the Madam is actually in maximum overdrive. She plays Wanda June in maximum overdrive.

00:26:06.60
Marty Ketola
Oh, that's right. She's the one who what runs out screaming, why are you doing this to us?

00:26:11.77
ryan luis rodriguez
We made you.

00:26:12.04
Marty Ketola
We made you.

00:26:13.25
Clifton Campbell
We made you. That's her.

00:26:14.18
Marty Ketola
that's hilarious.

00:26:16.03
Clifton Campbell
That's her. Yes.

00:26:17.03
Marty Ketola
Oh, it's funny when you make those connections you don't realize, oh, that's good.

00:26:20.41
Clifton Campbell
ah knew I ah knew I'd seen her in something else and I just couldn't figure it out. But yeah, that's her.

00:26:25.27
Marty Ketola
Same year.

00:26:26.65
Clifton Campbell
Yeah. That's hilarious. And then if the blonde Amanda is she's ah she's in Beach Girls, which I also thought was fucking hilarious.

00:26:34.49
Marty Ketola
Beach girls.

00:26:36.57
Clifton Campbell
assh She's in Beach Girls.

00:26:36.55
Marty Ketola
You're going to bring up the beach girls on this show before I bring up the beach girls? Yeah.

00:26:41.43
Clifton Campbell
Beach Girls. What do you want me to tell you?

00:26:43.00
Marty Ketola
The other day I was thinking, you know, on future Reels appearances, I think I'm just going start picking goofy shit just to make them watch it.

00:26:50.10
Clifton Campbell
Fuck yeah. Yes.

00:26:52.44
Marty Ketola
Why did you make us watch the Beach Girls? Oh, just because. Because I know you hadn't seen and you wouldn't have watched it. don't really care about it. I thought it mildly funny, but I want to subject you to it.

00:27:01.72
Clifton Campbell
I'm here to defend hamburger the motion picture. Let's get it done.

00:27:04.62
Marty Ketola
Hamburger versus hot dog.

00:27:05.33
ryan luis rodriguez
Hot dog the movie.

00:27:06.23
Marty Ketola
yeah

00:27:06.58
ryan luis rodriguez
Let's go with more food.

00:27:08.28
Marty Ketola
And David Naughton.

00:27:11.83
Marty Ketola
But I digress.

00:27:13.34
Clifton Campbell
Yes.

00:27:15.22
Marty Ketola
Well, do you have any more thoughts on working girls?

00:27:18.40
Clifton Campbell
No, other than i i I was pleasantly surprised. Ryan always tends to pick a pretty good movie and bring it on.

00:27:23.92
Marty Ketola
Mm-hmm.

00:27:24.20
Clifton Campbell
I think this is his second or third time bringing movies to the show. And every time he usually picks something really good. So i I really appreciate it.

00:27:29.00
Marty Ketola
Mm-hmm.

00:27:31.19
Clifton Campbell
i i I thought going in, i was like, oh, I don't know if I want to watch this. 86 Working Girls. Okay. It was fine. It was good. Like I said, I i looked up an hour and 10 minutes into it.

00:27:37.81
Marty Ketola
Mm-hmm.

00:27:40.91
Clifton Campbell
I was like, how much time have this got left? And oh, it's basically over. You know, which is usually the sign of a good movie that you're, you're gross and you're not checking your watch or thinking about anything else.

00:27:50.13
ryan luis rodriguez
And it's important to note before we wrap up that she had to deal with the Weinsteins to get this movie released.

00:27:49.98
Marty Ketola
i want Oh,

00:27:55.83
Clifton Campbell
Oh shit. Really?

00:27:56.79
Marty Ketola
the early days.

00:27:57.08
ryan luis rodriguez
Yeah, Harvey was apparently really intrusive, no pun intended, in the post-process.

00:28:01.91
Marty Ketola
Hmm.

00:28:02.44
Clifton Campbell
Shocker. I'm sure he wanted to be on set. Yeah. Oh, the post process. Yeah, sure.

00:28:05.93
Marty Ketola
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

00:28:07.14
Clifton Campbell
Yeah. Well, he's known to do that though. Go in and force you to cut your movie and get it to a certain point where you can distribute it. Right.

00:28:14.26
ryan luis rodriguez
Yeah, and but even though there's ah a shot of blood being washed out of a diaphragm that got them an X rating, so they instead went unrated so that they wouldn't have to cut that out.

00:28:24.99
Marty Ketola
Yeah.

00:28:25.91
ryan luis rodriguez
Which, of course, you know hamstrings your movie financially, because you can't add advertise in papers and do all that stuff.

00:28:28.47
Marty Ketola
yeah

00:28:31.74
Clifton Campbell
Yeah. Well, but but again, I think, you know, this is never going to do ah a big movie run, right? least never going to sit in AMC, never going to go to a multiplex, but it's going to go with the to the loft and it's going to go to arthouse cinemas and probably do pretty well, especially in 86 or 87 when this came out, I

00:28:38.73
ryan luis rodriguez
Right.

00:28:49.49
ryan luis rodriguez
Yeah.

00:28:49.88
Clifton Campbell
And this is also right up Miramax's alley, small art house, not very expensive back in the mid to late eighties when they were just getting going.

00:28:54.72
Marty Ketola
Mm-hmm.

00:28:55.92
ryan luis rodriguez
Pre-Disney.

00:28:58.10
Clifton Campbell
Sorry.

00:28:58.78
ryan luis rodriguez
Pre-Disney.

00:28:59.74
Clifton Campbell
Pre Disney. Yeah.

00:29:00.10
Marty Ketola
Mm-hmm.

00:29:01.02
Clifton Campbell
Yep.

00:29:02.04
Marty Ketola
It reminds me of, a in a way, Henry Portrait of a Serial Killer, because that was 86, and that was you know doomed with its unrated status because it was a little gritty, and then it had to take until 90 to come out.

00:29:13.50
ryan luis rodriguez
And now everyone heralds it as the scariest movie ever made.

00:29:16.50
Marty Ketola
Yeah, I still think so, too.

00:29:16.94
Clifton Campbell
It's fucking goods awesome.

00:29:17.90
Marty Ketola
Mm-hmm.

00:29:18.58
ryan luis rodriguez
yeah it's ah It's amazing.

00:29:18.62
Clifton Campbell
It's, it's, It's fucking awesome.

00:29:21.99
ryan luis rodriguez
rooker Rooker in that movie is a fucking force of nature. Just incredible.

00:29:24.82
Marty Ketola
Oh, yeah.

00:29:25.30
Clifton Campbell
Dude, the, the, the way he completely tells how he killed his mother differently. Every time he killed, every time he tells how he killed his mother, it it freaks me out every time I watch the movie.

00:29:35.14
Marty Ketola
Mm-hmm.

00:29:36.07
Clifton Campbell
Cause I'm like, he doesn't even know. I don't even believe he even knows how he killed his own mother anymore.

00:29:40.44
Marty Ketola
No, that's the whole thing.

00:29:40.76
Clifton Campbell
I think it's in his, in his fucking head.

00:29:41.48
Marty Ketola
Yeah.

00:29:42.16
Clifton Campbell
He's so gone. He has no idea.

00:29:43.57
Marty Ketola
There's so many people.

00:29:43.99
Clifton Campbell
He just tells whatever.

00:29:44.47
Marty Ketola
he Yeah.

00:29:45.27
Clifton Campbell
Yeah. o Anyway.

00:29:46.94
ryan luis rodriguez
And speaking of the Kevin Smith connection, he was the bad guy in Mallrats.

00:29:50.74
Clifton Campbell
That's right.

00:29:50.55
Marty Ketola
See? All rolls around.

00:29:51.14
ryan luis rodriguez
So it all comes full circle.

00:29:52.66
Marty Ketola
who

00:29:53.34
Clifton Campbell
Done it.

00:29:54.94
Marty Ketola
And so I just got a projector. I haven't had one in a while. And so the first movie I watched on the giant wall was Working Girls. And about halfway through, I thought, oh, I hope the neighbors aren't looking in at this protracted sequence of this guy's stomach while something is going on below it. But it did make me feel like I was at the art house watching it, though.

00:30:20.82
Marty Ketola
So Cliff, what do you give this one on a scale of one to five or the 10 gentlemen's scale?

00:30:27.83
Clifton Campbell
I'm going to I'm going to go seven.

00:30:31.68
Marty Ketola
OK, so that's three and a half.

00:30:32.83
Clifton Campbell
Gentlemen, seven. going to three and a half. It's not something that I'm going to watch a lot. I don't, I don't know that I'm going have a lot of rewatch ability with it, but I think it's really fucking well-made and I think it's well-written I enjoyed it, you know, and if somebody put it on again, I, I wouldn't, you know, probably fuss over that, but I don't know that I'm going to, you know, like, Hey, going watch that again.

00:30:42.94
Marty Ketola
Yeah.

00:30:53.71
Clifton Campbell
Boom. You know, type of thing. So three and a half.

00:30:56.63
Marty Ketola
Yeah, I'm right there with you with three and a half. I really enjoyed it. It didn't like knock my socks off, but I don't think it was intended to do that. I think it was one of these look, I'm a competent filmmaker. Look what I can do. And I would think that any competent filmmaker with a decent budget should be able to make something like Working Girls. You know, you hear the old adage of the, oh, my five-year-old could do better than that. Your five-year-old could not do better than that because your five-year-old doesn't know how to light or to frame a shot or story sequence or anything. But a filmmaker with any kind of, you know, know-how and what they're doing in a decent budget and a nice cast and a good script,

00:31:38.36
Marty Ketola
you should be able to make a working girl. So I'm very, very happy with that.

00:31:43.63
Clifton Campbell
Brian, what about you, man?

00:31:44.88
ryan luis rodriguez
I'm going to go Gentleman's 8.

00:31:46.69
Clifton Campbell
Gentlemen's eight.

00:31:46.48
Marty Ketola
Mm-hmm.

00:31:47.34
Clifton Campbell
All right.

00:31:47.58
ryan luis rodriguez
I've seen this movie three times. The first time I gave it Gentleman's 7. Second time i was like, no this is better than I thought it was.

00:31:54.88
Marty Ketola
Mm-hmm.

00:31:55.27
ryan luis rodriguez
And then now this most recent viewing, I have nothing but esteem for it.

00:32:00.00
Marty Ketola
Mm-hmm.

00:32:01.82
Clifton Campbell
and Maybe that's something if I catch it again, maybe I'll i'll feel the same way. um It's not that I won't watch it again. It's just, I don't know that I'll you know immediately reach for it. I've got so many other things in my queue, in my queue, so to speak.

00:32:12.70
Marty Ketola
Well, I would say as, as somebody who's also a screenwriter, Ryan, do do you want to if you had the chance to to make movies, would you want to be more of a Sean Baker type with the type of filmmaking you'd like to make?

00:32:28.59
ryan luis rodriguez
Um, that's a really good question.

00:32:31.47
Clifton Campbell
That's a good question.

00:32:32.79
Marty Ketola
Because, you know, you come up with a a halfway decent script of, you know, who knows what could happen between the three of us. So they're watching this movie going, Hmm.

00:32:39.77
ryan luis rodriguez
I think I would, I would hope to be as good as Sean Baker because he's very, he's hyper specific.

00:32:44.22
Marty Ketola
Yeah, yeah.

00:32:46.01
ryan luis rodriguez
And he knows exactly what kind of story that he's trying to tell. And and I'm not really, i'm I'm better at like character and dialogue, not story so much.

00:32:53.76
Marty Ketola
Hmm.

00:32:54.25
ryan luis rodriguez
So I guess that that's more in terms with a Sean Baker, who's not really interested in the story mechanics. He's interested in how the characters interact and communicate with each other.

00:33:02.42
Clifton Campbell
Mm hmm. Yeah, because.

00:33:04.31
ryan luis rodriguez
Communication is the biggest thing in a Sean Baker movie.

00:33:06.29
Clifton Campbell
Yeah, yeah, because Nora is is a very basic story, like the one that he swept the Oscars with.

00:33:09.75
ryan luis rodriguez
Yes.

00:33:11.27
Clifton Campbell
That's that is a basic ass story that is as simple as you could get structure wise.

00:33:16.02
ryan luis rodriguez
It's Snow White with sex workers.

00:33:17.75
Clifton Campbell
Right. Structure wise, that's exactly what it is. But everything it's it's the spaces in between where he really pulls it off.

00:33:25.34
ryan luis rodriguez
Right.

00:33:26.71
Clifton Campbell
Yeah. Love that movie. OK, so yeah, that's a damn good question.

00:33:27.42
ryan luis rodriguez
Good question, Marty. Damn.

00:33:31.03
Clifton Campbell
All right, well, that brings us to our next one.

00:33:33.24
Marty Ketola
Yes, the ah Ted Knight classic.

00:33:36.15
Clifton Campbell
Let's see here.

00:33:36.61
Marty Ketola
Because if you blink, you will miss Ted Knight at the very end. He is the security guard at the end of the movie. Psycho, 1960. Cliff, what is it?

00:33:48.20
Clifton Campbell
Let's see here. psycho nineteen sixty rated r one hour in forty nine minutes let's see here

00:33:52.95
Marty Ketola
Oh, R? Approved? I watched the unrated version myself for an extra four seconds.

00:33:56.82
ryan luis rodriguez
As did I. The extra eight seconds really made a lot of difference.

00:33:58.49
Marty Ketola
Yeah. You couldn't show a toilet back then or something, I think.

00:34:02.51
Clifton Campbell
A secretary on the run for embezzlement takes refuge at a secluded California motel owned by a repressed man and his overbearing mother. Of course, directed by Hitchcock, written by Stefano and Robert Block. Stars Anthony Perkins, Janet Levy, and Miles. Your storyline.

00:34:19.91
Clifton Campbell
Phoenix officer, office worker Marion Crane is fed up with the way life has treated her. She has to meet her lover Sam in lunch breaks and they cannot get married because Sam has to give most of his money away in alimony.

00:34:30.65
Clifton Campbell
One Friday, Marion is trusted to bank $40,000 by her employer. Seeing the opportunity to take the money and start a new life, Marion leaves town and heads towards Sam's California store. Tired after the long drive and caught up in a storm, she gets off the main highway and pulls into the Bates Motel.

00:34:45.75
Clifton Campbell
The motel is managed by a quiet young man called Norman, who seems to be dominated by his mother.

00:34:52.57
Marty Ketola
Yes, classic dirty money story. Could almost be ripped out of an EC comic, you know. And I was thinking while watching this movie for the umpteenth time, you could gender swap Psycho and it would play the same.

00:35:05.69
Marty Ketola
Because dirty money doesn't matter who you are. You take the money and run and bad things happen to you. yeah A lot of the time in these type of stories. I feel like this is like one of the all-time classics of that genre.

00:35:19.61
Clifton Campbell
Do you gender swap Norman and grandma or you do you just gender swap Norman?

00:35:22.78
Marty Ketola
You could gender swap Marion and Norman and the same thing happens because his, his dead, her dead father.

00:35:28.82
ryan luis rodriguez
So then, who would Norman be impersonating then?

00:35:34.49
ryan luis rodriguez
Okay.

00:35:38.59
ryan luis rodriguez
And all gotta to do is take off the end, Norma Bates.

00:35:38.39
Marty Ketola
Yeah.

00:35:40.69
ryan luis rodriguez
just It's already there.

00:35:40.63
Marty Ketola
yeah Yeah.

00:35:41.53
Clifton Campbell
Norma Bates.

00:35:42.69
Marty Ketola
Gus Van Sant, were you listening? Yeah.

00:35:45.53
ryan luis rodriguez
No, he just made that scene where Vince Vaughn masturbates while watching Anne Haitian the shower.

00:35:47.73
Marty Ketola
Yeah. And in the unrated version of Psycho, there's almost like a hint of that's going on too with the people. At least it seemed like that in one of the half a second Sextra.

00:35:57.32
Clifton Campbell
It kind of, it, I kind of feel like it's a, it's like alluded to that, you know, he he's, he kind of looks down and and and there's a pause or a brief moment.

00:36:02.01
Marty Ketola
As much as they could at the time, maybe

00:36:06.76
Clifton Campbell
I feel like Hitch is alluding to it without, but it's subtle. It's very subtle.

00:36:09.56
Marty Ketola
yeah But I could diverge into the whole Vince Vaughn thing as a whole separate pod, but let's let me try to stay on this one.

00:36:10.95
ryan luis rodriguez
It had to be.

00:36:17.69
Marty Ketola
ah yeah One of the things I like the most about this movie is... The whole movie, it's telling you exactly what's happening, but it's also at the same time deceiving you. It's going, well, it could be his mom. No, it's him. He's doing all of this, but it could be. Maybe he is just cleaning up after his mom. But, you know, and you watch it the second to third time, and you know exactly what's happening, so you can look for the twist. But I feel like that's that push-pull, that tautness that on the first viewing,

00:36:48.22
Marty Ketola
It's deceiving you while telling you the truth at the same time. and And you see that all the way up through things like Scream and etc.

00:36:57.59
Marty Ketola
One of the granddaddies of that formula. ah Hitchcock inventing the slasher film in a way.

00:37:05.11
Clifton Campbell
one of my favorite early quotes in the movie is I'll lick the stamps. Uh, I don't know why it just, it's just like, oh that's a weird fucking line. Um, I have a problem with her boyfriend at the beginning.

00:37:15.89
Clifton Campbell
It's weird because, and I never noticed it until now, but he's like, well, I, you know, i live in the back of a hardware store cause I give all my wife, my alimony money. Excuse me. I got to catch my flight back to my hardware store. And I'm like, if you're giving all your money, your wife to your alimony, how do you have money for a fucking flight in 1960?

00:37:36.05
Clifton Campbell
It's not like it's a bus. It's not like it's 10 bucks and then you fucking, you know, hop the fucking red eye. What the hell are you talking? So this dude's a liar. He's got money. He's stringing her along.

00:37:46.11
Marty Ketola
Mm-hmm.

00:37:46.97
Clifton Campbell
Anyway.

00:37:48.57
Marty Ketola
And he's Loomis, right?

00:37:51.70
Clifton Campbell
the He's the guy who owns the hardware store. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

00:37:54.36
Marty Ketola
And then then in Halloween, we get Dr. Loomis, and then we get Billy Loomis and Scream. It's all that just it just keeps flowing from from Psycho over and over again. Hmm.

00:38:06.10
Marty Ketola
And you don't even get to the Bates Motel until 27 minutes into the movie.

00:38:06.44
Clifton Campbell
Loomis.

00:38:10.55
Clifton Campbell
Yeah, it's

00:38:10.66
Marty Ketola
Inventing the genre and being lopsided right from the beginning to keep you off guard. the classic It's the classic.

00:38:16.18
Clifton Campbell
it's. It's it's it's 10 minutes of driving like it's a lot of her behind the fucking wheel and then pulling over like my one of my other.

00:38:18.55
Marty Ketola
Yeah.

00:38:23.42
Marty Ketola
It is a little long.

00:38:25.02
ryan luis rodriguez
That stuff with the cop is just tremendous.

00:38:24.95
Marty Ketola
I will say that. Yeah. Mm-hmm.

00:38:28.44
Clifton Campbell
Yeah, I like that. ah My favorite is the car salesman. I like the car salesman because ah like at one point he's like, what does he say? Do anything you have a mind to it. Being a woman, you will. And it's just like, that's good, man. Insult your customer your first customer of the fucking day. And you've already threatened her by saying, well, usually the first customer customer of the day is a fucking asshole.

00:38:48.79
Clifton Campbell
So please don't be an asshole. And then you basically say, well, you're a woman, so you're going to do whatever the hell you want to. Like, it's what kind of car salesman are you, dude?

00:38:55.62
Marty Ketola
You're finding the similarity between the films, desperate measures that women will go to.

00:39:00.38
ryan luis rodriguez
Misogynist Motors, that's the name of the...

00:39:00.18
Marty Ketola
Mm-hmm.

00:39:02.43
Clifton Campbell
Misogynist motors.

00:39:02.49
ryan luis rodriguez
i mean

00:39:03.31
Clifton Campbell
There you go. Yeah. Where we sell nothing but disdain for women. Here's your car. Anyway, I just thought it was very, very funny how that's so casually in the film. And and I'm sure that's not how it was all over in the 60s, but it is sort of a ah fun sort of jab or characterization. Right.

00:39:25.05
Clifton Campbell
And then we get to the point where she's just eating sandwiches and learning about how Norman Bates became to be crazy. She's just sitting there eating a fucking sandwich, watching him sort of fucking slowly unravel.

00:39:33.50
Marty Ketola
With all the birds behind him at these up anglers.

00:39:35.67
Clifton Campbell
Yeah, nothing creepy about that at all.

00:39:37.46
Marty Ketola
And the next movie Hitch would make would be the birds, right?

00:39:38.23
Clifton Campbell
Mm-mm.

00:39:40.06
Marty Ketola
So it's more of that thematic, like, Norman's one of these birds.

00:39:40.73
Clifton Campbell
Mm-mm.

00:39:41.00
ryan luis rodriguez
Yep.

00:39:43.45
ryan luis rodriguez
Took three years off to make that movie.

00:39:45.40
Marty Ketola
oh Mm-hmm.

00:39:50.30
Clifton Campbell
and look Okay. In all seriousness, who stands in this fucking shower under the shower head and then turns the fucking water on?

00:40:00.69
Clifton Campbell
What kind of psychotic woman is this? All right.

00:40:04.12
Marty Ketola
ah She's got issues.

00:40:05.30
ryan luis rodriguez
Very true. Very true.

00:40:06.23
Clifton Campbell
You know what I like? i like to get a fucking cold, cold ass blast of water before I so adjust the temperature of the water. Right. I want to make sure that happens.

00:40:14.17
ryan luis rodriguez
Before I know where it will spray, I just want to let it spray all over.

00:40:14.23
Clifton Campbell
It's just.

00:40:17.27
Clifton Campbell
Exactly. And then, i and she has this smile on her face.

00:40:17.88
Marty Ketola
Different generation. arrangement

00:40:20.15
Clifton Campbell
Like, she's just like, ah, refreshing. And I'm just like,

00:40:22.84
ryan luis rodriguez
Nothing better than a motel shower.

00:40:27.38
ryan luis rodriguez
And I gotta say, they kind of give away the fact that she dies early on by giving her the and credit, and giving giving Anthony Perkins the starring credit, and giving her the and credit suggests that she's not going to be sticking around for long.

00:40:27.70
Clifton Campbell
my.

00:40:33.75
Clifton Campbell
man

00:40:33.62
Marty Ketola
Mm-hmm.

00:40:37.46
Marty Ketola
Yeah.

00:40:38.46
Clifton Campbell
And yeah.

00:40:40.37
Marty Ketola
Mm-hmm.

00:40:41.30
Clifton Campbell
Yeah. Yeah.

00:40:41.46
Marty Ketola
it's It's more of the telling you exactly what's going to happen that goes, well, maybe she won't die.

00:40:42.06
Clifton Campbell
Yeah.

00:40:46.97
Marty Ketola
But yeah, she's totally going to die.

00:40:50.62
ryan luis rodriguez
It's one of those Damn You Actors Guild.

00:40:56.44
Clifton Campbell
We all go a little mad sometimes.

00:40:59.10
Marty Ketola
Scream. Well, he's quoting Psycho.

00:41:02.12
Clifton Campbell
Mm hmm. It's so it's properly creepy. It's one of the things I like about it is like once we get, you know, at first, you know, Hitch does a great job of subverting you and tricking you. You think you're going to watch a crime film with a woman who's stolen some money and they're on. the She's on the run. And then suddenly we arrive at the Bates Motel and and things start to get properly creepy right away.

00:41:23.83
Clifton Campbell
ah ah Perkins is excellent as Norman. He's very, very odd. He's kind of funny, but he's also very, very creepy.

00:41:33.94
ryan luis rodriguez
He has that stutter when he has words that he doesn't like saying.

00:41:37.24
Clifton Campbell
That fucking stutter.

00:41:37.66
ryan luis rodriguez
just

00:41:38.52
Clifton Campbell
Yes.

00:41:38.58
ryan luis rodriguez
a man.

00:41:39.08
Clifton Campbell
That smile, that that way that he he purses his lips. he Yeah. yeah

00:41:45.88
ryan luis rodriguez
Now, have you guys seen Psycho 2?

00:41:46.10
Clifton Campbell
alone

00:41:48.06
Marty Ketola
Oh, yeah.

00:41:48.57
Clifton Campbell
Yes.

00:41:49.50
ryan luis rodriguez
I would argue he actually gives a better performance in Psycho 2.

00:41:52.54
Marty Ketola
Right.

00:41:52.94
Clifton Campbell
I've heard this.

00:41:52.78
Marty Ketola
It's a little richer.

00:41:53.50
Clifton Campbell
I've heard some people say the same thing.

00:41:53.66
Marty Ketola
Yeah. important

00:41:57.02
ryan luis rodriguez
I don't think it's a better movie, but I think it's a better performance.

00:41:56.91
Marty Ketola
We'll have to get to that again.

00:41:57.17
Clifton Campbell
It's.

00:41:59.96
Marty Ketola
Yeah.

00:42:00.31
Clifton Campbell
Yeah.

00:42:00.32
Marty Ketola
Yeah.

00:42:01.56
Clifton Campbell
One of the, one of the things I will say about this movie is it does suffer a little bit from the M night Shyamalan, a ding dong syndrome, right? Where once she knows the twist. It's, it doesn't play as hard after that.

00:42:15.45
Clifton Campbell
Right. And I've seen this fucker like easily 20 times. Right.

00:42:18.33
Marty Ketola
na

00:42:18.70
Clifton Campbell
So now that I know that everything's coming, I just don't, it doesn't have the same oop for me anymore. It's still like shot wise. And some of those, when her head on the tile, as he, as he slowly cranks, the can't cranks, the camera from a 90 and pulls back is fucking just perfection.

00:42:29.91
Marty Ketola
Right.

00:42:33.24
Marty Ketola
Well, that whole sequence is immaculate.

00:42:36.42
Clifton Campbell
It's perfection. Right.

00:42:37.43
Marty Ketola
And then going back and watching Norman knowing what he's doing, you can enjoy his little quirks more.

00:42:40.34
Clifton Campbell
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, it's ah very true. But the thrill of it, like the tension of it is kind of gone for me, unfortunately.

00:42:43.92
Marty Ketola
Yeah.

00:42:47.61
Marty Ketola
Well, yeah, that's usually what happens with the slasher after of the first viewing.

00:42:48.27
Clifton Campbell
Right. Yeah. Yeah. I just, I just noticed it. I, you know, it's like, again, it's still got a rewatchability factor to it for sure. But I just, I, I, I lament that tension, you know, that, Oh, what happened?

00:42:59.10
Marty Ketola
Yeah.

00:42:59.44
ryan luis rodriguez
And that scene has been adopted into popular culture for the past 50 years. Like whenever anybody makes a psycho joke, there's always somebody in a shower. It's never a reference to anything else in the movie.

00:43:08.65
Marty Ketola
Mm-hmm.

00:43:09.40
Clifton Campbell
wait bre free breath bre Yep.

00:43:11.75
ryan luis rodriguez
It's always a reference to that. So I was terrified of seeing this movie when I was a kid because I was a chicken shit. But now I now I can handle horror movies. But back then I didn't want to watch it, but I knew that she died halfway through.

00:43:25.08
ryan luis rodriguez
Just because of cultural osmosis. That's the only way I would have found out.

00:43:27.30
Marty Ketola
Mm-hmm.

00:43:28.44
ryan luis rodriguez
because my parents don't talk to me about stuff like that. It's something I had to learn by watching a parody on TV and going, oh, so that's what it is. Gotcha.

00:43:35.62
Marty Ketola
Mm-hmm.

00:43:36.46
Clifton Campbell
Gotcha. Well, yeah, and it means it's definitely it's like Star Wars. I mean, it just it launched itself into zeitgeist and is part of everything, you know, references galore and it's just it's permeates everything.

00:43:44.30
Marty Ketola
Mm-hmm.

00:43:44.64
ryan luis rodriguez
Yeah.

00:43:48.12
Clifton Campbell
You know, you can't hardly make a horror movie without somehow fucking referencing this fucking horror movie in some way.

00:43:53.27
Marty Ketola
Yeah, it's the first Ed Gain story as well.

00:43:57.61
Clifton Campbell
Yeah. Oh.

00:43:57.61
Marty Ketola
I mean, going back and looking at it again, it's like maybe this might be the perfect example of that. Because, I mean, Texas Chainsaw is brilliant. Silence the Lambs is brilliant. Even Henry Portrait of a Serial Killer, as we were talking about.

00:44:08.81
Marty Ketola
But you go back to this one and it handles it in a creepy way. that's simple and still effective. Also, Deranged is another runner up for one of the creepier ones, where the guy from a a Christine is Ed Gain, the guy who sells the car, and Christine, and the old man, Robert's Blossom, I think.

00:44:26.49
ryan luis rodriguez
Keith Gordon? It's

00:44:28.46
Clifton Campbell
Oh. Yeah,

00:44:31.42
Marty Ketola
Yeah, it's kind of a, it's more of a grosser one, but that predates Texas Chainsaw.

00:44:32.22
Clifton Campbell
yeah.

00:44:35.42
Marty Ketola
But this one, I think it does the whole Ed Gain story in a way that's probably... one of the creepiest and yet the least gory.

00:44:43.06
Clifton Campbell
yeah

00:44:43.77
Marty Ketola
And I appreciate that in a way.

00:44:44.09
Clifton Campbell
yeah either the gore is you know for 60 of course it's shocking as all hell but for now it's just it's you know very complete you know very easy and trite yeah it's PG right but but still when you watch this the first time you still kind of go ooh ah

00:44:54.71
ryan luis rodriguez
pg

00:45:00.82
Clifton Campbell
you know you go ooh Jesus it looks a lot more violent than it actually is you know in my in my opinion

00:45:04.92
Marty Ketola
Yeah, he's stabbing Martin Balsam, you know.

00:45:05.18
ryan luis rodriguez
well martin balsam getting slashed on the face we don't actually see the slash but we just see the the blood in that line as he's tumbling down the stairs in a way that no human has ever tumbled down the stairs

00:45:12.60
Clifton Campbell
yeah

00:45:16.94
Clifton Campbell
it's it It reminds me of the of the opposite of Spike Lee. Spike Lee's got that shot where he'll put the actor on on a moving dolly and he'll put the camera on and then pull it really fast through the streets and the actor's doing that. It reminds me of the opposite of that, right? Where instead of going,

00:45:32.73
Clifton Campbell
pull it going away from the, you know, from the actor, we're going towards them and the actors falling backwards. I liked the shot a lot. I thought it was about a second too long, right. To really play, but it was fantastic.

00:45:43.00
Clifton Campbell
And you get to see, he, he does a great job of, of the, uh, being stabbed and falling and being shocked.

00:45:48.34
ryan luis rodriguez
And he's actually sitting in a chair as he's doing all that.

00:45:51.32
Clifton Campbell
Really fantastic.

00:45:52.02
ryan luis rodriguez
Yeah.

00:45:53.37
Clifton Campbell
Okay. So it is kind of like that then.

00:45:55.94
ryan luis rodriguez
Yeah.

00:45:56.06
Clifton Campbell
Interesting. Um, So my other small problem with the movie is, so the PI basically just talks to a couple of people and then ends up at the Bates Motel, right?

00:46:07.54
Clifton Campbell
Like just in the quickest montage ever, he's like, uh-huh, and, you know, uh-huh, and Bates Motel, you know?

00:46:12.30
Marty Ketola
He's good. He followed the trail, you know. Maybe

00:46:18.17
Clifton Campbell
Yeah, I just, it's it's very...

00:46:20.66
Marty Ketola
two and a half hours if he went to the car lot.

00:46:21.09
Clifton Campbell
um It's very, yeah, it's very, I would have loved to have seen him at the car lot, you know, but it's very hand wavy, man.

00:46:22.98
Marty Ketola
Although I wouldn't mind seeing that scene.

00:46:28.40
Clifton Campbell
And maybe, maybe they shot it and hitch put her, you know, put her on the cutting room floor. Who knows?

00:46:32.42
ryan luis rodriguez
Gotta watch out for fat guys picking up cars here.

00:46:37.08
Clifton Campbell
You know, any.

00:46:36.89
Marty Ketola
lot of money left.

00:46:37.15
ryan luis rodriguez
um'm sorry, you're my first customer of the day.

00:46:37.56
Clifton Campbell
That's

00:46:38.63
ryan luis rodriguez
I usually say the most offensive thing before I start.

00:46:40.90
Clifton Campbell
right. That's right. Had a lady here the other day. It was pretty sure she was going to do whatever she wanted.

00:46:46.26
Marty Ketola
Well,

00:46:48.57
Clifton Campbell
ah I love that the mom isn't a skeleton. i love that it's this sort of badly preserved kind of desiccated corpse, right? They're of stretched and dead skin.

00:46:56.49
Marty Ketola
yeah.

00:46:58.52
Clifton Campbell
it plays a lot better than if it was just a skeleton with a you know a wig on and clothes.

00:47:04.38
Marty Ketola
well yeah

00:47:06.04
ryan luis rodriguez
It looks like the leech woman.

00:47:07.67
Clifton Campbell
Yeah. Yeah, it looks like it' all. And I love the way they did the eyes. The eyes look so fucking creepy that with the shadows in them and the in the ocular cavities.

00:47:17.76
Clifton Campbell
I just thought, oh, that's.

00:47:18.52
ryan luis rodriguez
ah When the light starts reflecting on them, oh my god, looks so good.

00:47:19.12
Clifton Campbell
that's

00:47:21.59
Clifton Campbell
Yeah, really fucking well done. I like that a lot. Yeah. ah But then it ends with this like it reminded me of how to murder your wife where it's like, well, got to have a courtroom scene for the last 10 minutes where we explain everything and wrap it up.

00:47:38.10
Clifton Campbell
Right.

00:47:38.14
Marty Ketola
or

00:47:38.97
Clifton Campbell
And then here we come with the fucking psychiatrist who's like, let me explain to you what Norman Bates is all fucked up with.

00:47:43.48
Marty Ketola
And then like, who are you?

00:47:44.05
Clifton Campbell
Here we go.

00:47:44.60
Marty Ketola
You haven't been in the movie before.

00:47:45.24
Clifton Campbell
yeah Who are you? Oh, I'm the psychiatrist that's here to explain to you and tell you why this is all fine, and then you can leave the theater. Because not only is it horror, you've got an education, so we'll get approved for this and we can release it to theaters.

00:47:56.39
Clifton Campbell
you know It's very...

00:47:56.98
ryan luis rodriguez
Did he kill someone? Well, he did and he didn't.

00:48:00.03
Clifton Campbell
It's very Ed Wood, right? it It reminds me of Ed Wood where the guy comes out at the end and does the explanation. you know, what you've been watching is a man who's had a problem putting dresses on.

00:48:10.24
Clifton Campbell
And you're just like, you know, but it's okay. It's transvestite. You know, it's this weird sort of...

00:48:14.10
ryan luis rodriguez
A man fighting with an octopus is completely natural.

00:48:14.20
Clifton Campbell
so

00:48:17.25
Clifton Campbell
Exactly.

00:48:17.12
Marty Ketola
Mm-hmm.

00:48:18.68
Clifton Campbell
Exactly. So it was just like, that's to me, I don't know why it struck me this time, because again, I've seen this movie a bunch. But when i we got to the end, I was like, yeah, this is this weird, like, okay, we need to take a minute and sort of explain everything at the end, right?

00:48:31.24
Marty Ketola
Mm-hmm.

00:48:32.12
Clifton Campbell
Where...

00:48:32.35
ryan luis rodriguez
It's very didactic.

00:48:33.75
Clifton Campbell
We would never do that now. We would just be like, well, Norman's fucked up. We know he's got multiple personalities. He thinks he's his mother, you know, especially if you just cut to him at the end thinking where he's running in his head as his mom and he's looking around. Oh, they're watching me. You know, all that shit.

00:48:49.02
Clifton Campbell
You don't need it. But I guess in the 60, in 1960, you did,

00:48:52.47
Marty Ketola
hu

00:48:52.98
Clifton Campbell
you know

00:48:54.09
Marty Ketola
It's part of the ah odd lopsided nature of the plotting of the movie, and I think it helps still throw you off and make it extra creepy at the end that for some reason the movie hasn't stopped, and we have five minutes of a psychiatrist telling us what happened.

00:49:10.20
Clifton Campbell
Yeah, psychiatric discussion, basically. Yeah.

00:49:15.35
Marty Ketola
And it's funny because Norman doesn't show up until about a half hour into the movie. And then at that point you got what, maybe 75 minutes left or something like that. And so when you go into the sequels, they're about Norman through the whole movie.

00:49:27.27
Marty Ketola
So there, it's a little different where, and I guess Psycho 2 does have a little bit more to do with the other sister as well, but I guess, how are you going to make it hidden again?

00:49:35.42
Clifton Campbell
Is two the one where...

00:49:37.13
Marty Ketola
Right. That we already know who Norman is.

00:49:38.33
Clifton Campbell
Is... Is two the one where at the end he just hits that girl in the head with a shovel?

00:49:42.65
ryan luis rodriguez
Yes.

00:49:42.84
Marty Ketola
Yes.

00:49:43.45
Clifton Campbell
Okay, I thought so.

00:49:43.86
ryan luis rodriguez
Miss Spool.

00:49:44.14
Marty Ketola
Yes.

00:49:44.95
Clifton Campbell
Yes, gotcha.

00:49:44.90
Marty Ketola
Yeah.

00:49:46.02
ryan luis rodriguez
Supposedly his real mother.

00:49:46.94
Marty Ketola
Yeah, well, we'll have to bring that on at some point so we can talk about that because I'm sure you haven't seen that in ages.

00:49:51.29
Clifton Campbell
Will we?

00:49:52.54
Marty Ketola
So, well, you haven't seen that one as many times as this one, right?

00:49:55.48
Clifton Campbell
No, no, no, no.

00:49:55.66
Marty Ketola
So it'll be kind of fresh.

00:49:56.95
ryan luis rodriguez
You should do Psycho 3.

00:49:56.82
Marty Ketola
And I think you'll be like, this guy's interesting.

00:49:58.74
ryan luis rodriguez
Psycho 3 is fucking interesting.

00:50:00.27
Marty Ketola
That's a cool one, too. And then the book of Psycho 2, it was going to be a completely different movie where it was going to be on a film set and the director was trying to recreate the shower scene and he wanted to stab the actress himself.

00:50:06.94
ryan luis rodriguez
Psycho House.

00:50:13.89
Marty Ketola
And they found out Norman had died like at the beginning of the book. They're like, we're not making that into a movie. You have to make this.

00:50:20.66
ryan luis rodriguez
I tried to adapt it into a screenplay and I failed.

00:50:21.91
Marty Ketola
Yeah. and

00:50:24.50
ryan luis rodriguez
I gave up five pages in.

00:50:24.73
Clifton Campbell
It sounds like Scream 3, kind of, you know?

00:50:27.96
Marty Ketola
Well, see, it all keeps, it just keeps regurgitating itself. so

00:50:31.86
Clifton Campbell
Yeah. Make the movie stab, you know? um I enjoy this one.

00:50:36.86
Marty Ketola
He was making a movie, Stab. He was stabbed.

00:50:43.85
Clifton Campbell
Again, I've i've seen it a lot, um so it just ah it doesn't have that hit, but I still, you know, I end up getting... I ended getting mesmerized by it at some point and being impressed by it and going, that's, that's fucking guy.

00:50:53.59
Marty Ketola
And there's moments that are just impeccable, right?

00:50:55.66
Clifton Campbell
Yeah.

00:50:55.75
Marty Ketola
Yeah.

00:50:56.38
Clifton Campbell
They're just, they're impeccable. They're, they're hard to argue with, you know, and, and you just go, you know, i don't care how many times you see it. It's fucking it's hitch and it's him at his, at a really high point in his fucking career.

00:51:07.93
Clifton Campbell
You know,

00:51:08.23
ryan luis rodriguez
And he shot it in like less than 20 days with the television crew from Alfred Hitchcock Presents.

00:51:13.32
Marty Ketola
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

00:51:14.15
Clifton Campbell
that's insane.

00:51:14.14
ryan luis rodriguez
And Paramount was like, we don't want anything to do with this. And of course it blows up because he says, you can't come in after the movie started. And that's that that's the Rosetta Stone for everything related to Psycho.

00:51:26.01
Clifton Campbell
Yeah.

00:51:26.01
ryan luis rodriguez
And Paramount had to be kicking their fucking selves going like, oh my God, we should have just seen the film and actually known what he did. Because he was going to buy it and then put it as two episodes of Alfred Hitchcock Presents.

00:51:33.72
Clifton Campbell
I wonder.

00:51:38.42
ryan luis rodriguez
The first episode ending with Marion in the shower. And then the rest being the second episode. In case they couldn't go to the theaters.

00:51:46.80
Clifton Campbell
I wonder if. um oh That's interesting. Who put this out? Which, which, but which, um,

00:51:54.78
ryan luis rodriguez
Universal.

00:51:54.68
Marty Ketola
It was Paramount originally, but wasn't Universal?

00:51:57.21
ryan luis rodriguez
Universal bought it.

00:51:58.39
Clifton Campbell
Yeah, universal on it.

00:51:58.14
Marty Ketola
Universal. audit

00:51:58.81
ryan luis rodriguez
Because they bought the Hitchcock library.

00:52:00.28
Clifton Campbell
So I kind of wonder if, you know, ah i don't know. I just I wonder how what the reaction was upon seeing it of like, what the fuck are we going to do with it Are we going actually going to put this out on theater on a screen or, you know, do we bury this fucking thing? It's pretty for 60. It's pretty far out there, man.

00:52:19.60
ryan luis rodriguez
Yeah.

00:52:21.45
Clifton Campbell
It's like, hit like, it's like Henry portrait of a serial killer where it's not just that it's a horror movie. It's, it's at an elevated level.

00:52:28.80
Marty Ketola
It's a game changer.

00:52:30.07
Clifton Campbell
Yeah. Where you're just like, okay, you know, this isn't fucking Freddie running around in people's dreams or Jason with a fucking machete.

00:52:30.49
Marty Ketola
That's why they were scared of it. yeah

00:52:37.37
Clifton Campbell
This is some fucking scary ass.

00:52:37.40
Marty Ketola
Well, that doesn't happen without this.

00:52:39.61
Clifton Campbell
Absolutely not.

00:52:39.38
Marty Ketola
so

00:52:40.49
Clifton Campbell
But this is more grounded in reality and super fucking scary.

00:52:42.33
Marty Ketola
Yeah, of course.

00:52:43.61
Clifton Campbell
You know what i mean?

00:52:44.66
Marty Ketola
yeah There's no supernatural in the psycho universe that I think of.

00:52:45.08
Clifton Campbell
Um,

00:52:48.02
Clifton Campbell
No. When I was, when I was a fucking kid, that's how I, I rationalized a lot of like, uh, going to sleep without fucking check, you know, like thinking, cause you know, when you're and you see all those Freddy fucking movies and all those slasher movies, you think they're under the bed or in the closet or they're going to come get you or whatever in the all night. And that's how I always rationalized it was I was like, well, okay, it's not Halloween. So Michael Myers can't get me. Uh, I'm not at the lake at the, with the cabins. So Jason can't get me. And then Friday and then Freddy came out and I was like, fuck.

00:53:16.79
Marty Ketola
you can get you in your sleep, no matter where you are.

00:53:17.43
Clifton Campbell
because hate to get me much sleep.

00:53:19.15
ryan luis rodriguez
I can't stay up for three days to make sure he won't kill me in my dreams.

00:53:21.08
Clifton Campbell
Exactly. Exactly. Fuck. Anyway, that was hilarious. That's, that's, yeah, my rationalization at that point fell apart. I think I was 11 or 12. I was like, well, now what am I going to do?

00:53:33.14
Clifton Campbell
And then I ended up just kind of seeing through, you get to old enough to where you see through it, you know, the blood packs and the, uh, the latex and the fakeness of it.

00:53:40.09
ryan luis rodriguez
And i guess all you got to do is watch the sequels where he's like wearing sunglasses and like hanging out on the beach crashing pool parties.

00:53:47.51
Clifton Campbell
The fucking,

00:53:47.74
ryan luis rodriguez
And like, I don't think if I can be afraid of him anymore, but that's, you know, that's okay for other people.

00:53:49.91
Marty Ketola
but

00:53:51.19
Clifton Campbell
the fucking the the claws through the as the jaws through the sand was one of was where I was just like um I think this is where you lost me i think yeah good call

00:53:51.12
Marty Ketola
He's a comedian.

00:53:55.06
Marty Ketola
Yeah.

00:53:58.39
Marty Ketola
He literally jumped his own shark. Yeah.

00:54:02.01
Marty Ketola
help

00:54:06.62
Clifton Campbell
good go

00:54:07.00
Marty Ketola
I think everybody went to go see Elm Street 4 and then nobody went back to Elm Street 5. So what does that tell you about Elm Street 4? Look, it's got some interesting kills, but not to go off on a tangent on that, but the last 20 minutes of them running around in a circle over and over and over again.

00:54:19.75
ryan luis rodriguez
It's no Nightmare 3. Yeah, that

00:54:23.30
Clifton Campbell
Yeah. Three's Dream Warriors, right?

00:54:24.66
ryan luis rodriguez
yeah I love 3.

00:54:24.62
Marty Ketola
DreamWorks, I like that one.

00:54:25.72
Clifton Campbell
Yeah. Yeah, like them lot too.

00:54:27.90
ryan luis rodriguez
I think if you took the first one, the third one, and New Nightmare, you'd have a perfect trilogy.

00:54:31.80
Marty Ketola
Mm-hmm. Yeah. Everything else is Freddy's Nightmares, the movies.

00:54:34.42
Clifton Campbell
Okay.

00:54:36.80
Marty Ketola
It's the goofy, cartoony Freddy.

00:54:39.51
Clifton Campbell
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

00:54:40.48
Marty Ketola
Although Freddy vs. Jason is amusing.

00:54:42.97
Clifton Campbell
Mm-hmm.

00:54:42.78
Marty Ketola
if If more like a kaiju film.

00:54:43.13
Clifton Campbell
Well, it's weird because Jason X came up on the last program or when we were talking with ah Rob.

00:54:48.75
Marty Ketola
Oh, yeah.

00:54:49.77
Clifton Campbell
Jason X came up up and...

00:54:51.05
Marty Ketola
Mm-hmm.

00:54:52.33
Clifton Campbell
I'm a big fan of that one. It's my favorite Jason movie, I think. Well, besides two.

00:54:56.22
Marty Ketola
Norman Bates in space. That'd be...

00:54:58.29
Clifton Campbell
Yeah.

00:55:00.86
ryan luis rodriguez
Norman X.

00:55:00.63
Marty Ketola
<unk>s pitched that yet.

00:55:02.66
Clifton Campbell
Norman X. There you go.

00:55:03.89
Marty Ketola
borman

00:55:04.31
Clifton Campbell
Yeah. That's great. Yeah.

00:55:06.45
Marty Ketola
Directed by Spike Lee and he can do those camera effects, right?

00:55:12.16
Clifton Campbell
They unthaw him and there he is looking for a wig and a fucking dress to put on. yep

00:55:18.39
ryan luis rodriguez
Just imagine Norman X, a Spike Lee joint. that just That's going to be stuck in my head forever.

00:55:24.06
Marty Ketola
going to sweep the Oscars next year.

00:55:26.55
Clifton Campbell
Hollywood, that's our idea. Spike, you have to call us about that one. That's ours.

00:55:31.14
ryan luis rodriguez
I know you're busy teaching at NYU, but come on, take some time. Listen to our pitch.

00:55:34.42
Marty Ketola
This is gold.

00:55:35.46
ryan luis rodriguez
We don't really have one, but we havet we have a title.

00:55:38.36
Clifton Campbell
If you could take the timeout for a Knicks game, you can take the timeout to hear an elevator pitch. All right. That's all going to say.

00:55:47.16
Clifton Campbell
What else, guys?

00:55:50.19
Marty Ketola
That's all my thoughts on this one.

00:55:54.87
Clifton Campbell
Yeah, same.

00:55:54.78
Marty Ketola
Anything?

00:55:55.39
Clifton Campbell
I think... I think that's all it, yeah.

00:55:59.92
Marty Ketola
It's hard to come up with new things to say about this one.

00:56:02.90
Clifton Campbell
the ah The last thing I'll say, though, I have one more note. You know when he dumps the car in the swamp?

00:56:07.66
Marty Ketola
Mm-hmm.

00:56:08.31
Clifton Campbell
It looks like he's fucking dumping it in, like, the La Brea tar pits. Like, it just, that it looks like he's just, you know, dumped it in, like, just, it's just black. It doesn't look like a swamp. It looks like like ah like a giant pool of motor oil or something.

00:56:16.93
Marty Ketola
Right.

00:56:21.80
Clifton Campbell
I don't know.

00:56:21.60
Marty Ketola
He's cleansing it in the...

00:56:22.46
ryan luis rodriguez
It looks more like a swamp when they're taking the car out at the end of the movie.

00:56:22.52
Clifton Campbell
It's just like...

00:56:25.78
Marty Ketola
Mm-hmm.

00:56:26.17
Clifton Campbell
There you go

00:56:25.94
Marty Ketola
Mm-hmm.

00:56:26.84
Clifton Campbell
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

00:56:27.42
ryan luis rodriguez
Kind of looks like oatmeal at that point.

00:56:29.14
Clifton Campbell
Yeah, it's just dark and like it looks like in like that that dark consistency.

00:56:29.21
Marty Ketola
yeah

00:56:32.50
Clifton Campbell
just I was just like, what is this? The La Brea Tar Pits? What the

00:56:35.35
Marty Ketola
He was purifying the car in the waters of Lake Minnetonka.

00:56:43.35
Marty Ketola
I didn't say that was Lake Minnetonka.

00:56:45.01
Clifton Campbell
That's not Lake Minnetonka.

00:56:46.66
Marty Ketola
That's where Norman dumps the bodies.

00:56:47.00
Clifton Campbell
Boy, Charlotte was charlot was not happy about that. She did not like that. She did not like Prince play tricking Apollonia into that.

00:56:56.15
Marty Ketola
ah Purple Rain 3. Norman Bates. I don't know how we're gonna mix that together, but you know a remake of

00:57:04.70
ryan luis rodriguez
Under the Norman Moon.

00:57:05.72
Marty Ketola
see See, there you

00:57:07.27
Clifton Campbell
Oh, there you

00:57:07.70
ryan luis rodriguez
Graffiti Norman.

00:57:08.77
Clifton Campbell
The graffiti Norman. Yeah, she wore a raspberry beret.

00:57:12.28
Marty Ketola
go.

00:57:13.39
Clifton Campbell
It's a song about his mother.

00:57:17.47
Clifton Campbell
Yep, yep, yep, yep.

00:57:19.71
ryan luis rodriguez
should have been called Darling Norma.

00:57:21.50
Clifton Campbell
Darling Norma.

00:57:21.87
Marty Ketola
Drawing Norma.

00:57:22.43
Clifton Campbell
Yeah.

00:57:23.06
Marty Ketola
but and then See, if we did song parodies on here, we probably would have had that already. to open the show with.

00:57:32.31
Marty Ketola
Oh, my. Well, what do you give this one, Cliff?

00:57:34.36
Clifton Campbell
cool

00:57:36.19
Marty Ketola
Let's start.

00:57:37.78
Clifton Campbell
Um, I think overall, I mean, and it's just hard to argue with it. Um, I have a, you know, I have a, like I said, I have a few little itty bitty tiny little grumbles with it.

00:57:43.45
Marty Ketola
It is hard. Yeah.

00:57:49.14
Clifton Campbell
The, uh, the hand wave with the, with the PI, um, the, uh, the sort of the long psychiatry, psychiatry explanation at the end feels very dated, feels very sixties.

00:58:00.44
Clifton Campbell
Um, but shit, I mean, It's a really great fucking movie and it's a classic. I'm going to go four and a half just to take the one half off for my little tiny little complaints.

00:58:10.74
Marty Ketola
Yeah, I'm in the same boat with you again. Four and a half.

00:58:13.62
Clifton Campbell
Yeah. Yeah.

00:58:14.87
Marty Ketola
it's Parts of it are absolutely perfection. And then there's other parts that are a little long by today's standards. But, you know, it's funny how we keep bringing movies on the show and the guests tend to say, well, if I judge this movie against movies of its ilk, I would give it a five. But if I judge it against every other movie in the world, I'd give it a two and a half. Yeah.

00:58:38.46
Clifton Campbell
Right.

00:58:38.81
Marty Ketola
And so as far as, you know, all-time horror movies go, it's a five. But as far as like just every other movie, I'll say four and a half. It almost makes me think, should we just switch to a thumbs up, thumbs down system on the show?

00:58:50.45
Marty Ketola
Because the star rating is so difficult.

00:58:51.05
Clifton Campbell
What we Cisco neighbor?

00:58:52.49
Marty Ketola
Well, in a way.

00:58:54.39
ryan luis rodriguez
Well, no, because you'd both be dead, and that wouldn't be fun.

00:58:57.18
Clifton Campbell
Now that's true.

00:58:56.98
Marty Ketola
That's true.

00:58:58.49
Clifton Campbell
It's a good point, right? What about you, sir?

00:59:01.68
ryan luis rodriguez
Uh, this was a movie that was kind of an awakening for me as a young cinephile. So I can't really judge the flaws of it anymore. And it's easily, it's, I, I've, I'm tied for three in terms of my favorite Hitchcock movies. You got Strangers on a Train, North by Northwest, and this.

00:59:21.46
ryan luis rodriguez
So I'm going to go ahead and just, I'm going to be the nice guy and say Gentleman's Ten right there.

00:59:25.88
Marty Ketola
Yeah.

00:59:26.53
Clifton Campbell
Gentleman's 10.

00:59:29.38
Clifton Campbell
Gentleman's 10. Well, I won't fight you on it, that's for sure.

00:59:30.90
Marty Ketola
Yeah.

00:59:31.50
Clifton Campbell
I mean, I i mean i completely understand everybody calling it classic.

00:59:31.61
Marty Ketola
comment

00:59:34.94
Clifton Campbell
There's a reason why. Watch it. You'll see. um And it's hard to argue with, you know, I just found found yeah this final viewing.

00:59:40.09
Marty Ketola
Definitely.

00:59:42.76
Clifton Campbell
I was like, yeah, here's a little thing, know, a little thing, but that's honestly, sometimes the best meal is the one that has the one thing wrong with it that you can kind of complain about. You know, everything else is delicious, you know?

00:59:51.47
Marty Ketola
it's the It gives it the personality if it would be too slick in a way.

00:59:59.77
Clifton Campbell
Well, Ryan, appreciate you coming on the show, man.

00:59:59.69
Marty Ketola
Oh, yeah. You got anything you want to plug?

01:00:02.85
ryan luis rodriguez
Oh, of course. Yeah, so I have two podcasts. One of them is called One Track Mind, where I review not movies, but the audio commentaries for movies and what we learn about the movies from them.

01:00:12.82
Clifton Campbell
Fascinating.

01:00:15.38
ryan luis rodriguez
ah You can find that anywhere you listen to podcasts. We have a new guest every... it's We publish it every other week. We have a new guest each time. Marty's going to be on in about a month and a half.

01:00:26.07
Marty Ketola
Sweet.

01:00:27.35
ryan luis rodriguez
If you want to find that on social media, I'm on Instagram at one. That is the numeral one track mind podcast because somebody took O-N-E. One track mind dot B sky dot social on blue sky. We're on Facebook. We're on Podchaser.

01:00:40.82
ryan luis rodriguez
And if you go to the official Patreon page at patreon dot com slash one track mind podcast, you can get up to 500 hours of bonus content, including the episodes that Marty was mentioning, the Coolness Chronicles, all hundred of which are up there for your perusal.

01:00:52.50
Clifton Campbell
Wow.

01:00:56.73
ryan luis rodriguez
And I also do another podcast that I technically co-host that Marty and Cliff have both been on multiple times, Reels of Justice, where we have a fake court of opinion. It's a prosecutor, a defendant, judge, and jury try to conclude whether or not a movie is guilty of being a bad movie.

01:01:13.94
ryan luis rodriguez
ah You can find that anywhere you find OneTrackMind. You can find it on Instagram and Twitter, of all places, at Reels of Justice.

01:01:21.09
Clifton Campbell
Twitter. Nice. Well, we good. I'm glad you still call it Twitter.

01:01:29.05
Marty Ketola
right

01:01:31.39
Clifton Campbell
Good.

01:01:31.24
Marty Ketola
That's what I still call it.

01:01:32.33
Clifton Campbell
That's what it deserves to always be called Twitter. um Listen to the, Hey, I'll say this. Listen to reels of justice. It's a great show. Listen to Marty and I on it. We were recently on it prosecuting paranormal activity and we swayed Ryan to our opinion. He was kind enough to see it our way. And we won that one. It was a fun, fun episode.

01:01:50.97
Marty Ketola
Well, he feels the same way about the movie as we do.

01:01:55.06
Clifton Campbell
yeah i was was trying to make it I was trying to make it sound like, what?

01:01:55.83
Marty Ketola
But that's all in the past.

01:01:56.18
ryan luis rodriguez
And unfortunately, the verdict was overturned.

01:01:57.41
Marty Ketola
Yeah.

01:02:00.44
ryan luis rodriguez
Yeah, on our appeals episode that aired on Thursday, the ruling on paranormal activity, Rob got it reversed.

01:02:08.28
Marty Ketola
Yeah, I didn't want to tell you about it, Cliff. I just wanted to just pass it on by because it's in the past.

01:02:12.92
Clifton Campbell
And we had him on the show again? what

01:02:15.00
Marty Ketola
ah He must really like that movie. That's how I thought when I heard that.

01:02:21.56
Clifton Campbell
Give me a break. did he Did he talk more about his love for ghost hunters when he got it?

01:02:26.71
ryan luis rodriguez
It came up briefly.

01:02:26.90
Clifton Campbell
when he got it Yeah, okay, i figured.

01:02:28.01
Marty Ketola
Yeah. So it just, you know...

01:02:32.82
Clifton Campbell
Congratulations, Rob.

01:02:32.92
Marty Ketola
Yeah, we we did a good enough job we did a good enough job that it made it to appeals.

01:02:34.03
Clifton Campbell
You're wrong, but congratulations.

01:02:37.48
Marty Ketola
So that's how I look at that. But they overturned a couple of other weird ones too that day. So I'm looking forward to the new season starting.

01:02:45.47
Clifton Campbell
How come we weren't brought back in to re-prosecute?

01:02:48.02
Marty Ketola
Oh, because the appeals, the people that were part of the case, they don't get a chance to re-defend anything.

01:02:54.11
Clifton Campbell
Oh, gotcha. I'll have to listen to that episode.

01:02:58.48
Marty Ketola
It's amusing. you know It's a show. That's how I think of it, yeah. I don't care about paranormal activity that much to be butthurt about it.

01:03:05.62
Clifton Campbell
I don't either. I don't either.

01:03:07.93
Marty Ketola
it's It's a movie.

01:03:09.56
Clifton Campbell
I don't like my having my convictions overturned because it hurts my, my record, which then hurts my client base.

01:03:15.19
Marty Ketola
Well, it's an asterisk.

01:03:16.12
Clifton Campbell
You know, you don't get to be Johnny Cochran by having your thick convictions overturned.

01:03:16.23
Marty Ketola
Great. Great.

01:03:20.24
Clifton Campbell
You know,

01:03:23.50
ryan luis rodriguez
Yeah, you get to be Johnny Cochran by representing murderers.

01:03:26.90
Clifton Campbell
Exactly.

01:03:27.54
Marty Ketola
right

01:03:28.38
ryan luis rodriguez
The way that the legal system should work.

01:03:28.54
Clifton Campbell
And winning. Exactly.

01:03:32.73
Marty Ketola
And then they overturned the Superman verdict as well.

01:03:33.11
Clifton Campbell
Thank you. I'm glad you understand.

01:03:36.13
Marty Ketola
So it was it's an interesting episode, to say the very least.

01:03:38.87
ryan luis rodriguez
That one I'm happy about.

01:03:39.69
Marty Ketola
Yeah.

01:03:40.50
ryan luis rodriguez
Because I thought they were being unfair. But that's okay.

01:03:42.11
Marty Ketola
Mm-hmm.

01:03:43.03
Clifton Campbell
Which Superman?

01:03:43.64
Marty Ketola
The new one, yeah.

01:03:44.25
ryan luis rodriguez
The new one.

01:03:45.19
Clifton Campbell
Ah, okay.

01:03:46.33
ryan luis rodriguez
Which I like.

01:03:46.69
Clifton Campbell
All right. It was fine. it was I mean, it's not I don't think it's something to be prosecuted for being bad.

01:03:50.57
Marty Ketola
Mm-hmm. And Jason Takes Manhattan is now rightfully considered a bad film.

01:03:54.42
ryan luis rodriguez
Yes, my first case is now considered guilty.

01:03:55.77
Clifton Campbell
Fantastic.

01:03:56.34
Marty Ketola
yeah

01:03:57.50
ryan luis rodriguez
I'm so happy because I fought so hard on that one and it was only our second episode.

01:03:58.33
Marty Ketola
Sorry, Addison. ha, ha.

01:04:04.50
ryan luis rodriguez
oh man.

01:04:04.63
Marty Ketola
It was fun times, though.

01:04:05.22
ryan luis rodriguez
and when i When I lost that, i was I was just ruined for a week. I was just like, I don't want a fucking podcast anymore. I don't like this.

01:04:11.57
Marty Ketola
No.

01:04:12.56
ryan luis rodriguez
It's not fun.

01:04:12.70
Marty Ketola
No.

01:04:14.40
Clifton Campbell
That movie is shit and you know it.

01:04:16.58
ryan luis rodriguez
it's Jason Goes to Vancouver and we're all aware.

01:04:21.85
Clifton Campbell
Oh, shit. um well Well, you wanna guys want to get out of here on a quote?

01:04:26.90
Marty Ketola
sure. yeah

01:04:28.06
Clifton Campbell
You got quote?

01:04:29.30
Marty Ketola
My mother, she isn't quite herself today.

01:04:35.04
Clifton Campbell
Ryan, what do

01:04:36.89
ryan luis rodriguez
am Am I like giving a verdict or am I giving my own quote?

01:04:39.56
Marty Ketola
Oh, quote from one of the films.

01:04:39.90
Clifton Campbell
you think?

01:04:40.69
Marty Ketola
Yeah.

01:04:41.11
Clifton Campbell
Yeah, you're on quote from one of the films.

01:04:43.03
ryan luis rodriguez
We all go a little mad sometimes.

01:04:45.37
Clifton Campbell
Love that one. Love that one. Mine is, we have a blonde, a college girl, and we have Gina.

01:04:51.05
Marty Ketola
Yeah.

01:04:53.53
ryan luis rodriguez
Poor Gina.

01:04:53.64
Clifton Campbell
All right, Ryan. Thanks so much for being on the show, bud. We'll have you be back again sometime soon.

01:04:56.86
Marty Ketola
yeah

01:04:57.14
ryan luis rodriguez
Oh, of course.

01:05:00.18
Clifton Campbell
Laters.