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The Big Tex Ordnance Podcast
This is the official Big Tex Ordnance Podcast where we talk about gear, training, and all things related to firearms and firearm accessories. The crew at Big Tex Ordnance is uniquely positioned to be able to interact with individuals from all corners of the firearms industry. Join us!
The Big Tex Ordnance Podcast
Beyond Keys: What Your Deadbolt Isn't Telling You
Imagine having a skill that weighs nothing, costs little to learn, and could provide access when you need it most. Pat from Uncensored Tactical reveals the fascinating world of tactical lock picking—a discipline that's simultaneously practical, accessible, and surprisingly ethical.
With over a decade of law enforcement and Coast Guard experience, Pat has developed a curriculum that transforms this niche expertise into an invaluable tool for everyone from soccer moms to special forces operators. "The amount of time it takes to learn: very small. The amount of money to get involved: very small. The weight and price of tools: very small. But what they open: very big."
During this eye-opening conversation, Pat demonstrates how complete beginners can successfully pick their first lock within minutes using just two simple tools. But this skill set goes far beyond tools and techniques—it's about developing a strategic mindset that enhances problem-solving capabilities in unpredictable situations. Unlike linear skills such as marksmanship, lock picking requires you to make a machine accept an input it wasn't designed for, creating a unique cognitive challenge.
Addressing common misconceptions head-on, Pat explains why teaching tactical lock picking doesn't enable criminals (who overwhelmingly prefer breaking windows or kicking doors) and how understanding lock vulnerabilities actually leads to smarter security decisions. As he puts it, "Three-inch screws in your door frame are probably a better investment" than exotic locks for most homeowners.
The conversation explores the differences between hobby lock sport, locksmithing, penetration testing, and tactical applications, highlighting why Pat's approach—which combines practical techniques with operational decision-making—has attracted clients ranging from local law enforcement to international special forces units. Whether you're interested in self-reliance, professional development, or simply fascinated by physical security, this episode offers rare insights into a skill that combines immediate utility with endless depth.
Ready to develop skills that could save the day when traditional options fail? Listen now and discover why tactical lock picking might be the most practical security training you've never considered.
Find out more about Big Tex Ordnance at bigtexordnance.com
I now teach a curriculum that didn't exist before, but it's incredibly unique and powerful and useful. Whether you're a soccer mom or whether you're in a first responder or special forces, we teach people how to get through locked obstacles in a very fast and efficient manner. The stats here are so powerful that the amount of time it takes to learn very small, the amount of money it takes to get involved very small, the weight and the price of the tools to put in your pocket very small, but what they open very big. I found this kind of diamond in the rough of something that's just so hard to say no to it.
Speaker 2:Welcome to the Big Tech's Ordinance Podcast. I'm Ike, we have Tara as our co-host and our guest today is Pat from is it Uncensored Tactical?
Speaker 3:Uncensored Tactical.
Speaker 2:Perfect. So if you want to kind of tell us a little bit about yourself and kind of what you do and how you ended up there, and then we'll, I guess, go from there, sure.
Speaker 1:So there's like an eight-hour long story and there's like a 30-second version. So we'll start with the short one. So we'll start with the short one. I was in law enforcement for over a decade. I did international operations with the Coast Guard for, I think, 10, 11 years-ish. Oh wow, I also did some time as a local patrol officer in the state of Florida. So I did both those jobs and I just found, you know what. I had this story on my brain yesterday. I'm going to tell it because it's part of that. It's attached to my history.
Speaker 1:So I first got into the Coast Guard and I'm sure anyone that's ever attended any type of government or bureaucratic training. You finish the training and the instructor goes here's your printed printer sheet stapled together, packet of the slides. It's in black and white. You can keep that. There you go and everyone's like okay, I get it Cool, better than nothing. And a lot of those will say like there's a bunch of arrows pointing to an image and the arrow says, if this wire is red and everything's gray, that doesn't help me. So, coast Guard, the same thing.
Speaker 1:I got to a ship and it was like learning a whole new language. We're out in the middle of the ocean and I had to get qualified very quickly in order to be useful to the crew. So I needed to be able to stand watch by myself. So I had to learn what's the masthead light color and what's the port side and starboard side running light colors and you know how many of them can there be and what if there's two of them. And we had this packet that was black and white and there were arrows saying red, green, but they were just white circles in a black field. I'm like this is incredible. So I went out and got a highlighter and colored in the colors as best I could and I made it.
Speaker 1:I got qualified and then we got a new batch of people on the next deployment and I said you know what? I'm going to help these kids out. So I went into the computer room and I pulled up their PDF and I replaced their image with an updated image with colors in it, old MS paint, and I printed out the sheets myself and stapled them together myself and then we handed them. I handed them to the new guys and said here's your packet. You'll notice that these photos are in color. That should help you. They're pictures of colored lights. And they went oh yeah, duh, I'm like you have no idea how and I got in trouble. They were like, did you do this? I'm like, yeah, we were dealing with black and white and trying to explain colors to people and they went without asking.
Speaker 2:I said yeah, without asking.
Speaker 1:I did add color to something that doesn't have color. So that's my origin story. I saw that training was not what it should be and there was a very easy way to level that up. So fast forward, two decades. I now teach a curriculum that didn't exist before, but it's incredibly unique and powerful and useful whether you're a soccer mom or whether you're in a first responder or special forces. So it's kind of like people get excited about gunfighting stuff and then they go oh, I should also know medical too and I can use it if there's not a gunfight. So it's just, it's a very holistic thing that makes you a useful human, and it's not just reserved to gunfighting but can be helpful during the gunfight. My skill set's the same thing. We teach people how to get through locked obstacles in a very fast and efficient manner.
Speaker 1:The stats here are so powerful that the amount of time it takes to learn very small. The amount of money it takes to get involved very small. Like the weight and the price of the tools to put in your pocket very small, but what they open very big. So it's just, I found this kind of diamond in the rough of something that's just so hard to say no to it, but it's also, it's largely misunderstood. So it's kind of tough when you're talking to people and going, hey, do you want to take this course? And they go, oh, what is it? And I go well, it's not just lock picking, but it's lock picking. And they go and they just they go into their brain and they go pick a lock. I'm going to pay money to pick a lock and it's it's largely unknown. Right, tv and movies don't really help. They see the. You know there's, there's, what is it? Uh, what's that FBI show or whatever. They are NCIS. Oh yeah, take a pocket knife, put it in the keyway, blink, door opens up. God. So no, that's not it. But there are a lot of things and I'll teach you, live here if you want. There's a lot of things that, with limited tool, limited money, limited time, give you a huge output, and so I'm very systems oriented.
Speaker 1:It's not just about this tool and the technique, and that's really the first thing we show our operators. We sit operators down in a class and we go, hey, here's your lock, here's your tools. Go, here's your crash course. Just see what you can do. Throw you in the deep end, see what you do. Immediately. We don't do any PowerPoint or any slideshows, no lectures. Everything in the courses that I teach is all hands-on, nice, and I even created a high. I forgot to bring one man. I have two books out, volume one and volume two. Oh wow, and they're hardcover, full size, full color page photos, lots of descriptions. We don't even use them in the course. You get it when you sit down. I go, you can read it if you want. But we're right here, we're going to be working. So they pick up their tools, they pick up their lock and we'll have you try this here.
Speaker 1:Just set up oh no we had enough for everybody, so there's one.
Speaker 1:So here is your 60 second crash course, doing it live yeah, that's why I said oh no you take your hand and you put it around the lock like a fist and you just extend one finger and push down on this tension wrench here and that kind of spins this keyway just a little bit nice and light. You're not going to mash it down, just nice and light. Then you take another tool with a couple peaks or bumps on it and that goes in above that and the tops of these peaks touch the pins inside the lock and this tool just kind of like a toothbrush, up and and down, in and out, and you hold tension here, nice, springy tension, and you just rake up and down here and eventually that lock will open. That's it. That's the only two variables. You twist and then you rake.
Speaker 1:So I'll pass that over to you. That goes in your left hand and we'll set another one up for you. Same thing Left hand, one finger, hold some nice light tension the other hand. Look what I'm doing here with my fingers. Everything is nice and delicate, like you're playing an instrument Nice and loose, nice and delicate. You don't have to mash anything down.
Speaker 3:Got it.
Speaker 1:There it is. What was that? Like 15 seconds? Yeah, that's awesome here. All right, your turn, ike. These two locks should have pretty identical components on the inside, so they're about the same level, but even so, you could just get unlucky and it could be a bad lock.
Speaker 3:Or it could be better, or you could be much better.
Speaker 1:So welcome to the world of covert entry. You guys are now experts and we start almost every course this way. We go, you're in, you're live, you're doing it, and so it's very powerful, it's very useful and it's also great that you don't. I think simunitions is one of the best things to hit the firearm world in the last hundred years. Just live force on force. And the lock stuff is great because you don't need to have a shootout or a SWAT call out to get those field successes and to be a basically combat lock expert.
Speaker 3:Right. What's really fascinating to me is how quickly and easily, with you know two small tools, you're able just to bust that lock open.
Speaker 1:And it will open hundreds and hundreds of different locks. Right? So tons of makes and models, locks of locks on doors, locks on padlocks, all sorts of things, and so that teeny tiny crash course boom, explosion and skill set right having a rough go of it. That's great, so I plan that. Well, it's doable, um, and you could just be one degree away. You might need just a tiny bit less tension on your finger.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I can feel it binding on one of these yeah something's happening which is good, and the other unique thing here is this is a nonlinear skill set. So I think, for the most part, shooting is pretty linear, and what I mean by that is the more straight you hold your gun and the more confident your grip is and the more your eye sees the sights and the target when you push that trigger to the rear. It's pretty linear. You know what you're seeking. You want the bullet or the round to hit the target the right way, the right time, right. This is not that way. You can't just do another rep and push harder and get it to open faster. So you, actually, what you're doing is you're doing something that's not supposed to work. These locks are not supposed to be opened by something other than the key. So you actually I had a student once this is not my idea, but I've stolen it from this student.
Speaker 1:He was in one of my classes and I had a class full. Oh, there it goes. Hey, jackpot, there, it is Very good. That's not bad either. That's what? 60 seconds, two minutes, probably, probably closer to four.
Speaker 1:So it is a machine designed to work a certain way, and I had a class with some spooky secret asian people, and some of them were, um, kind of engineering, spooky people, and they all looked at each other and they saw what I was doing, I was teaching, and they were my students and they went hey that's? They said that's an engineering concept. They said you're taking machine a with input a to get output a. And they went you want machine a with input b to get output a. So they said you're, you're trying to make this machine do something other than the correct input to get the correct output.
Speaker 1:So it's just you're playing with variables that are not supposed to work. And that's, if I can get my students to understand, to not get frustrated if it doesn't open, but instead to go back to that list and go machine A, input B, output A no, input C no. What about input B and C together? No, so you're playing with variables and just like with your hand setup, one hand is a variable how much tension am I pushing? The other hand is a variable which is not as important, just that raking motion. You can get a monkey in here to do that.
Speaker 3:Right.
Speaker 1:The tension is a really important part To feel a little bit of feedback, kind of like a car If you're turning the corner and you feel the tire skid, that's feedback. So here you need to feel that feedback in your finger and go, oh, what could this mean? And because we can't see through the locks, we have to guess with lots of repetition, lots of homework, lots of knowledge. So it's a skillset that I like. Another useful kind of stat of this is it's a very low barrier to entry. You just started Right In 60 seconds, two minutes, you just got started, but the end point you can take this really deep and you can go with crazy nuance and crazy dedication. You can get really successful really quickly with lots of high percentages. So it's just, it's the coolest thing I've found in my life. It's just it's a really unique niche.
Speaker 3:Right, I can definitely see your passion around, but what actually sparked you to create this curriculum?
Speaker 1:Sure. So when I was a kid my father was in law enforcement and I always saw him, even off duty. This was back in the eighties and nineties, like pre nine 11. So he was always saw him, even off duty. This was back in the 80s and 90s, like pre-9-11. So he was always on duty even when he was off and we would drive in the family car and there'd be a car pulled over on the side of the road and dad would pull the car over and stop and go, oh, you locked out, hold on. He'd go to the back, grab a Slim Jim from the trunk and pop someone's door open and go hey, have a nice day, so have a nice day. So I knew that locks. I knew that they were susceptible to other types of entries. When I was a kid I saw it all the time in action. We get locked out of the house and credit card through the door.
Speaker 3:Damn, oh we're in Done that a hundred times.
Speaker 1:Awesome. So I knew of this. I was prepared for this when I got into the military I can't remember 19, 20 years old-ish A buddy of mine had gone to Sears School and this was post-9-11. And he came back and said oh well, they have this urban block in survival school, now that you know, they taught us how to pick a lock. So he grabbed one of these and two tension wrench and a rake two little tools, and he and I were hanging out and he popped this lock open and I went oh, that's right, I know that this is a thing. And so I went online. I ordered a lock pick set and I ordered a couple locks and seven days a week, multiple hours a day, I dove way into it. But at that time this must've been around. I know exactly when it was. It was late 2007,. I believe. There were almost no books on this. There were no video courses. That didn't exist back then. You didn't go online and find a video course. There were no training schools to go to, except like a locksmith school, which really doesn't fit what we're trying to accomplish here.
Speaker 1:So I had decades, decades worth of data, field experience, successes and a lot of failures, and I tried to dive as deep as I could into this skill set and I collected all that and then in the military and then in law enforcement work, I used this skill set quite a bit and I love to type too. So whenever I had a successful case or failure, I would go to my laptop, open up a notepad, just type, type, type, type, type and say what happened. Well, I used this tool, I used it this way, I thought the lock spun to the left, but I was wrong. It actually spins to the right. And as I was typing and learning I would go oh, I thought it went this way, it actually went that way. You know that's happened to me before file where I go common problems, check left and check right. If you're pretty sure it goes to the right and you're not getting it, just take some time, see if it spins left, and that would solve problems. So I created a field application curriculum that didn't previously exist.
Speaker 3:That's interesting, that's really interesting. That's life. So how does lock picking and locksmithing differ from each other?
Speaker 1:Sure. So there's actually about I don't know five or six or seven different fields of people professionally that will make entry through locks. Locksmithing is the biggest, but it has so much stuff involved in it that picking a lock open is less than 10% of the job. So I've worked with tactical companies that say, hey, we used to have a locksmith guy that kind of taught our SWAT guys, but it didn't really work out and I'd go oh yeah, because he's probably no offense to the people but probably teaching them to be locksmiths, which is what you can't do.
Speaker 1:There are penetration testers or red teamers or pen testers. They are security assessment personnel, so they assess the physical or digital security of your business, your house, your military base, whatever, and they also do lock picking and entry stuff. But they also have a bunch of stuff that's not relevant to a tactical entry. So they're doing things like draft they're called drafting behind someone through an open door or like a smoking door and they're doing things like calling on the phone and asking for entry, pretending to be someone else. But if you're a police officer or an EMS person and you're driving your truck but you're stopped at a gate and it's a rural gate, it's not electronic, it's just a padlock on a chain. That red teaming stuff of drafting in through an open door doesn't help you right. So there's a chunk of that stuff that doesn't apply to tactical operations. Chunk, there's a chunk that does but a chunk that doesn't. So there's locksmithing, there's pen testing.
Speaker 1:Um, there is the hobby of lock sport, which is incredibly popular and exploding. It's growing really quickly. Um, it's legal in almost all 50 states. I'm pretty sure anyone you have to check yourself but in most of the 50 states now I think you can own lock picks and carry them in public and as long as you're not also doing something illegal, you can have them. So people meet up in public at like bars and restaurants and public parks and they bring a bunch of padlocks and a bunch of picks and they'll just pick together and it's great, it's super.
Speaker 1:Even that doesn't apply to your first responder type operations, because you have all the time in the world and police officers and your other first responders can't just show up and take a whole bag and dump it out on the table and go which tool do I want? So your resources are limited, you're limited, your time is limited and in that hobby of lock sport. There is no mission, it's just. Here's the puzzle. Can I solve the puzzle In operations? Sometimes the right answer I teach my students all the time Sometimes the right answer is kick that door in, go.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 1:If the situation calls for it or it's, abandon this, don't make entry at all and leave. So there's all these answers that you still win if you don't pick the lock. So you have locksmithing, hobby lock picking, you have penetration testers, red teamers, and you have what I offer, which is tactical lock picking. It doesn't mean tactical, like there's a gunfight going on, but it means tactical, as in you're choosing a tactic because of an operation, and so there is a real curriculum. It's not just tools and techniques, it's also the application and the decision-making that really makes this stuff gold, which I'm sure you'll see in a couple of weeks here.
Speaker 3:So what can the students expect in the upcoming class in July?
Speaker 1:Sure, it's a two-day course, so most students that have no exposure to this. Your jaw is going to drop within the first hour once, maybe twice, and so I'll actually show you that second one, that second jaw drop moment, which is they're also going to learn a lot of case studies where they're going to succeed and they're going to fail, and that's okay and that's part of the class, and they're also going to get, which is really hard to quantify, but what I believe truly is world-class level instruction, regardless of the skill. It is so, so easy to find an instructor that just doesn't connect with students, yeah, just kind of phones it in, exactly, and I think most of the reasons that I've been able to operate at a high level with high-end clients is the instruction, is the product and the tools and techniques are kind of secondary. Yeah.
Speaker 3:And you have a passion for it.
Speaker 1:Oh my God, I love it that makes a huge difference. So let's try this. Let's say you struggle with that little brass lock again, Go ahead and close that shackle and so now you have those tools that worked but took a while. So that's a window scale. So now we're diving deeper into actual curriculum, not just the tools and techniques. You also have one of these in your wallet which you can take and if you identify the right make and model of lock and the right tool you can insert.
Speaker 1:Oh gosh you're just pushing up those pins. That's yeah, it's called an over lift with a comb tool and and you're in. That's crazy the timeline for that. If it's the right lock and if it's the right tool and if there are no exceptions, that technique should work in about five seconds or less. You get it lined up, you lift, you twist with a very, very high success rate, like 99%, plus your raking technique that you did earlier might never work. It might work right away, it might work in 30 seconds, it might work a minute later or you might be here all day with no answers.
Speaker 1:The real kicker is what if this tool is nearby, like out in the trunk of your car? What if you have the picks in your pocket and you're using them and you go oh, this has taken a while. If there's an operation, and you go, we need to get in very quickly. You have to go. Should I use these tools in my pocket or should I go out to my car and get a tool that's more likely to work faster? Right, and that's the application of the craft. It's not anyone could teach you how to take a lock and the right tool and open it.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 1:So that's. It is interesting and useful, but that's not what makes us special. What's special is taking an operator and going. Oh, it depends on the mission.
Speaker 3:Right.
Speaker 1:Or if there's two of us and maybe I know how to pick locks and you guys don't, I can go. Hey, I need you guys to go around the building, look for open doors. I'll start here. So now I'm stacking resources and I'll try to make entry now and if you guys see a door, take a picture of it with your phone and when you get back to me I can very quickly assess and go okay, that door, no, oh yeah, that one that looks really good. So I'm using my resources, data, and I'm stacking resources on the scene. I'm stacking my timeline in my favor. And it's way different than if you just go to a mediocre course and the instructor goes here's the pick, here's the lock. You graduated Right. That operator might not wrongfully, but they might just not know. So they might get to the front door and go all right, everybody, stop, I got this. Let me take one tool and try one technique until well, hey, there you go.
Speaker 2:That's a tough one, but once you get it, you'll start to get much more quickly I had to get it right on the pin, so I over inserted it first and it got locked up in there you can go too deep or too shallow.
Speaker 1:That's, that's the tough part, but that's my long, long answer. Um, what they can expect is exactly this it's you see a tool, you see a lock, you learn a technique, you get it to work, but then there's way more to it and the back end is what I think. It would be very hard to find another course at our level that do you twist it or just, or just break it you get the.
Speaker 1:So you're not. Uh, it's not random. You're just going to insert the tool and lift it up towards the pins and then, once you're lifted, rotate to the right. It's. It's very it's tough to do without a couple diagrams. Um, you might just get, get lucky. If you get it, it shouldn't take a lot of force.
Speaker 1:Actually, on my third book that I published, I just moved across the country so I don't have any stuff right now. The third book that I published. There's a really good diagram in there that explains what's happening in there and without seeing that, the learning curve is a lot more deep. But you're going to the correct distance with those prongs inside and lifting up and twisting. So now you have two tools for one lock. And what if neither of them work? What do you do next? So the thought process and the application is really what makes tactical lockpicking a very special art form.
Speaker 1:And now we do have curriculum, we have certifications. So back in the 2000s this stuff didn't exist, but now it does because of our work. So we work with high-level agencies. We work with special forces, international too. So we have students from international SF units that will fly across the globe to come train with us from international SF units that will fly across the globe to come train with us. And then we also get contracted to go out of country to go teach SF groups, foreign and allied and domestic. So we're very busy, we love it, we operate at a very high level and because I'm local and because we have a mutual friend, I thought you know what, let's do a little bit of work for the community here. We'll do a low impact course and we'll just share some of this with you guys yeah, I'm I'm excited, for I think it's gonna be great oh, me too, especially after hearing a little bit about it.
Speaker 2:I'm about to give up on this yeah, that one was a little bit more difficult. I was trying to get a, get it exactly lined up. So how long have you had uncensored? How long have you been doing like the?
Speaker 1:So I've been teaching people. Almost the same week I started learning, I started teaching and that's you know the phrase like what business are you in Like? So you think you're in the business of A, but you're actually in a business of B Like if you really like these trinkets but you sell a lot of them, you're in the sales business. You're not in the trinket business. Same thing here. Teaching is the business that I'm in. That's what makes us special. I've sold some tools. I've written some books. I love writing too. I love writing and publishing books, both my own and other tactical books for people.
Speaker 3:I'm working on two other projects for two other authors right now to help them bring their tactical books to life.
Speaker 1:That's actually a business that you have, is that correct? So the business started. I was actually in Guantanamo Bay on a deployment and I cracked open my laptop and I'd been teaching for a decade at that point, just privately and to other military units, just because we were in the same room. But officially, the business part of that started in 2016, 2017-ish.
Speaker 1:Oh wow, I was in Guantanamo Bay on a deployment and I said, okay, let's start a website. Okay, let's start writing articles. Okay, let's start a podcast. And I did all those things. And then I actually sold my first kind of public enrollment course to say, hey, would you like to pay me money and I'll teach you how to do this. So my first sale of the course, which was separate from hey, we're on a deployment, sit down, I'll teach you. That's a teaching experience. But selling the course the first one I actually sold was in Guantanamo Bay. So a bunch of the dudes I was deployed with I said it was, it was nerve wracking because I was not comfortable with money or sales or any of that stuff. And I told a bunch of dudes, hey, if you give me 50 bucks, hey, I got it. Now.
Speaker 3:He's a cheater, he's cheating.
Speaker 1:So I told the dudes you give me 50 bucks. We still got three or four months left on the deployment. I'll give you full access to me, daytime, nighttime. You'll have access to all my entry tools. If you're just bored, just come over to my little we call them hoochies the little hooch I live in. Just come on over, we'll hang out at the coffee table, we'll pick some locks. 50 bucks for like four months of one-on-one training. Yeah, I sold like eight or nine seats, which hooray, but that's what 400 bucks total. So that bought me dinner a couple of nights.
Speaker 2:No big deal Was that about like two cents an hour.
Speaker 1:Oh my God, yeah, break it up, but they enjoyed it, they learned a lot, I learned a lot. And then I did my. As soon as we got back in country, I did a real open enrollment course for the public. So I started probably within a year getting back, I had two courses back to back that I traveled across the country to go teach it, uh, which was great, um, one was in Ohio, one was in Indiana, I think. Um, but man, it's just been nonstop ever since, yeah, and we've almost, we've almost doubled the size and scope of our operations every single year since that year. So before it was two courses, the next year was four courses and it was X price, and that was X times two was the price, and then it was we have no books. We have one book, and the next year we wrote two more books, and so we've just been exploding. And I think it's just. I think it's because it's so powerful and unique and people just don't know about it.
Speaker 3:Right.
Speaker 1:And so the more we get all these touch points with different students in the classes, different agencies we work with, it just has such a huge return on investment that it's just been a wild ride.
Speaker 2:So you were talking about books. I counted three so far that you've authored a couple other projects and stuff. How many books do you have out?
Speaker 1:I have. If you go on Amazon, I have three books available there right now. The Amazon printing process isn't as high quality as the other companies I use. Oh yeah, so Amazon's print on demand Like the KDP stuff.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I don't have any control over that quality control, but the books, the content of the book is still good. It's you probably won't notice it but the pages for the Amazon books are kind of powdery or kind of matte, but the books that I get elsewhere that I sell are like high gloss pages, so little things like that. You probably won't notice unless you're a super nerd like me. I have those three books. It's volume one, which is tactical lock picking, which is this stuff you're seeing. Volume two, which is tactical lock picking, which is this stuff you're seeing. Volume two, which is key generation, field key generation, which is really sweet.
Speaker 1:So how to take someone's key, get the information from it, hand it back to them and then go cut your own copy, but not like a locksmith, actually to do so in field operations with limited gear, limited time, limited resources in a fast speed. So that's my second book is Key Generation. I have a tools and technique manual which is a little field spiral that just lists oh, that's cool, it's this lock, this tool. Go this lock, this tool.
Speaker 2:Oh, that's kind of like a little handy reference, right yeah.
Speaker 1:Oh, that's neat and that's really powerful. We started giving all the students in our courses get that book. Now I don't think this course is going to have it. We did a reduced price for you guys and I just moved across the country A lot of the printing stuff. When I do good orders from a good printing company could be two or three weeks for the books to arrive, so I don't even know if they'd get here in time. I have those three.
Speaker 1:I wrote one kind of philosophical book but I've taken it off the market since. I wrote that three or four years ago. It was just about the study of how large and small agencies operate with their incentive structure. Because I was frustrated with the military and with law enforcement, I just took a systems approach view of it, wrote basically my thesis on the findings. I published that One, two, three, four. And then I wrote two magazines covert entry magazine just with a couple articles about lockpicking stuff. I will be producing more of those. Oh wow, am I missing anything? And I'm currently juggling three writing projects right now, one for myself and two um for two separate friends of mine in the tactical world so you had mentioned in the back about that, that one project that you're writing for yourself I'm writing, writing for right now oh wow, can you talk about that, that fiction one, or is it?
Speaker 2:are you not ready? No, I can talk about it, okay um, I love.
Speaker 1:Do you? Do you guys do much reading? Do you know the richard marchenko books? I don't think so. Rogue Warrior, red Cell, green Team, orange Team. So he wrote.
Speaker 1:Former DevGrew guy wrote like 10 or 12 books. I loved him when I was a kid. Then there's the Vince Flynn book series. The character's name is Mitch Rapp. I read probably seven or eight of those books, loved them, loved them.
Speaker 1:And I do enjoy writing and I do enjoy fiction quite a bit. But my business supported much more nonfiction work. So I've been paying the bills with fiction, which I enjoy, but I've always wanted to get into nonfiction. Sorry, vice versa, my mistake, but I also, and it's the same way you talked about, there's some books that talk about gunfighting and they just miss the mark. They say the wrong thing.
Speaker 1:I read a book once. I had a lot of hate for it. I did a review of a leadership book and they said I racked my upper slide to the rear and I'm like I think there's just the slide. It's not maybe not the upper slide of a Beretta, it's just because there's no lower slide, there's no lower slide. But sometimes books miss the mark on purpose or an accident, or just they don't care about gunfighting, and I wanted to bring my version of accurate tactics but to a covert entry story. So I wanted to be the opposite of NCIS and go well, it would be stupid to shove my pocket knife into the keyway because that does nothing. So I wanted to kind of give details and proper tool names and proper techniques. But I wanted to teach a little bit kind of secretly in the book and go if you have read it, then you have learned on accident, and I thought that was kind of a cool concept, that's neat.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I like that.
Speaker 1:Like everyone knows that if you're going to store a key for a door, it's probably within arm's length of the door. It's probably not a mile away, right? If you're going to search, just do a quick search in this area. Or if there's a code for this lock, and if there's a hidden code nearby, it's also probably within arm's length. So let me just look. Oh, there's a four digit code written on the wall. Maybe that's it. Yeah, so you can say these things in a story and people will hear them and go oh, that makes sense. So we can kind of get people involved in this really unique skillset and kind of draw them into the world. So that's the fiction project I'm working on now. It probably won't be ready for another two years. It's a long project, but I'm really enjoying. It Sounds pretty cool. It'll be a lot of fun.
Speaker 3:So I want to jump back into the class portion. A lot of people think that, like doing these types of classes and, you know, offering these tools, like just teach criminals how to break into, you know, there's going to be somebody in the comments.
Speaker 2:I already know.
Speaker 3:Yeah, and that's that's really I really want to. You know, I want you to explain your your take on that.
Speaker 1:Sure, uh, sure, and this should not be unexpected from people that are in the gun world. Oh no, you're teaching people to murder people, teaching Exactly Deep breath. So I want to try and say this without being angry at someone, some invisible person. I'm having an invisible argument with me. If the person is willing to listen, I would ask them questions so that they can answer it. It's not me telling you that what I'm doing is right or wrong. It's asking a set of questions that, if the listener or watcher is willing to ask them to themselves, they can form their own opinion a little bit better.
Speaker 1:And the perspective is really important. So if you're mad that there are people teaching others to pick locks, then are you also mad that you could become a locksmith with a criminal record and with a $50 LLC and a stamp from the state? So that's the barrier to entry roughly. There's some exceptions here and there, but you could be a locksmith tomorrow and then you could be the secret special person with almost no barrier to entry. So I have a barrier to entry. My classes are. Yours is a discounted class, but my classes are more than a thousand dollars a seat. That's a very high barrier of entry for someone that just wants to be a street level criminal.
Speaker 3:Exactly.
Speaker 1:And I see your face. I get your name, I get your email, I get your phone number. You're in public with other people. I have photos of you, yeah, so there's quite a bit of high and low here, risk reward. So, number one are you also mad that it doesn't take much to be a locksmith? Probably not, oh, okay. So if you're mad that I'm teaching people, are you also mad that there are martial arts schools that you can go with no background check and that they could basically teach a criminal to beat people up?
Speaker 3:Exactly.
Speaker 1:Well, no, I'm probably not mad about that. I never thought about that. Okay, cool, we'll put a pin in that I'm not giving someone the answer, I'm just asking questions. Mm-hmm, put a pin in that I'm not giving someone the answer, I'm just asking questions. So if I like this one too, if you're locked out of your house and it's your house and it's your lock, and your keys are locked somewhere, do you have the right as a human to, even without training, just to guess and to put something into your keyway and hope it opens? You'd probably think, well, yeah, it's my house, okay, great, is it wrong for me to teach that same human to do that thing for their own house better? Well, probably no, but okay. And then there's exception, exception, exception. What if this, what if that? Yeah, of course.
Speaker 2:Yeah, you can play the what if game all day, yeah.
Speaker 1:Another big one that's really common in our field is these are not proprietary, meaning there's no secret information in here that's inaccessible. You could take this lock and you can cut it in half and you can look at it and go oh, I could probably push this thing and that'll open it, meaning anyone has access to learn how to do this, even without me.
Speaker 3:Right.
Speaker 1:If there's a 12-year-old at home that can open this with paperclips without any training, are you mad at that 12-year-old for trying, and are you mad at me for teaching adults how to be more prepared? So there's just so many things that I think and I don't think it's people's fault I'm not saying how dare you not know better? I screw stuff up all the time. I'm not saying how dare you not?
Speaker 1:know better. I screw stuff up all the time, right, and I get new perspective all the time and I go oh no, I was so wrong, whoops, but this stuff is, it's so very it's not it's another word, but neutral. Basically.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 1:It's so very neutral. I've been doing this for 20 years and I have a skill set that I think is top tier, without a doubt, and I still haven't pulled off a heist yet.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 1:There's probably no building in this county that I couldn't get into surreptitiously or covertly, and every single day I get a real paycheck. I don't go out and steal from people.
Speaker 2:Still haven't committed a crime yet.
Speaker 1:You know, haven't broken in anybody's house, so just it's. The perspective is tough and I don't blame people. It's something that you don't. If it's something that you don't understand, I get it. How people have a snap judgment. But, man, I'll throw one more in and then you know. Whatever. It's up to you guys where we go next.
Speaker 1:But the last one would be if you go to the FBI's website, they have what's called crime stats or crime statistics. It's all open source. They give you all these details. So every time even a local police officer they go on a call, they go there was a burglary and they're clicking buttons on their report form. And they go how did the burglar get in? Well, there's a smashed window, click, okay. Well, how'd they get out? They unlocked the front door from the inside, click, okay. What'd they take this? Click. What time did it happen? Click, and all these stats. They don't stay. At the end of every year they show their crime stats and the last time I checked the method of entry for burglaries in the US for things that were covert or lockpick related were less than 1% of 1%. So sure I'm teaching something that if a bad person wants to learn it, the chances of them doing it. If we look at it statistically, based off, the whole scale of burglaries is less than 1% of less than 1% Right. Much less than that too.
Speaker 2:Also, too, if you think about like your average criminal is trying to break in the front door or whatever, I would venture to guess that probably 99 times out of 100, maybe even 999 times out of 1,000, he's going to just be kicking the door or busting the window. I don't think they're really spending the time. Busting out a window takes a couple seconds. Picking a front door lock, I would imagine, takes at least maybe a minute, unless you really know what you're doing.
Speaker 1:So there's a lot of it depends, and this is not a good lock. Picking into a structure is not a good plan. Like we talked about earlier, it's engineering, it's input A, sorry, it's machine A. Input B hopefully can get output A. So you're guessing. Even the best people on the planet that have this skill set, that are super spies behind closed doors, they shouldn't be planning to pick a lock on the way in. They should really have a key or use some other very reliable method. We can get you more reliable with this, but at the end of the day, you're guessing Right. So if I look at the lock on the store over here and I go, oh, I know the make and model of that, I'll buy one on Amazon and I'll practice at home. I think that was featured in that Chris Pratt show recently. I'll practice at home. I think that was featured in that Chris Pratt show recently. So, yes, that would make me familiar with the lock in the privacy of my own training room and then when I came here, I would have a leg up. But there are still exceptions in which it's possible that I could pick this lock on my desk, this training lock that looks like that one, and I could still get to yours, and the pin stack could be different or the environment could be different, and for some reason I just can't open it. So it's not a guarantee. So it's a. It's a very bad plan. It's very useful to be folded into operations.
Speaker 1:If you have a split second to go, oh, should I kick the door? Or oh, let me try this other thing real quick. It's not working. Okay, cool, move on. Yeah, it's great for that, super great. If you come up to a keypad and you're going to smash the door, do you have a second to go? One, two, three, four. Oh, my God, it worked. If it works, use it, yeah. If it doesn't, you have a chance to go oh, should I do something different now? Should I use another covert entry method or another covert entry method, or you know what? Just bring the breacher, let's go. So it's really good in addition to it's not really good on its own and I fully acknowledge that. But the other thing is you could keep these in your pocket and you can't keep a battering ram in your pocket. So it's it's. It's got a really large spread of application, but at the end of the day, you're still the best people in the world. You're still guessing. Hopefully it works. I don't know if I got way off topic there.
Speaker 2:No, I think that was right on topic.
Speaker 3:Right on topic.
Speaker 2:Thorough answer. Thorough answers are good.
Speaker 3:So are there any locks that are unpickable?
Speaker 1:In theory? No, in theory, any lock, given enough time, some super smart person can find a way into it. The in practice answer is what's reasonable? So we get the operational scope. There's a guy that came out with another huge mammoth book recently on security and on insecurity, on locks and insecurity, something like that. Mark Weber, tobias, I think, is his name. I get those three names not in the right order. Sometimes it's a huge, big red and black encyclopedia. It's like 700 pages. He specializes in.
Speaker 1:A lock company will design a new lock, a very high-end, super secure lock, and they'll send it to him and his team and they'll say find out how to break into this covertly. And so he gets paid to do that. So there's people that specialize in that. But some of his methods and he'll even tell you in the book some of those methods are well, first you need a drill bit of this size and you need to go this specific depth into the lock and then you need to take a bobby pin and straighten it and hit it with a hairdryer and then poke through this plastic membrane.
Speaker 1:Yeah, which, yes, would open a high security lock. But no, if I just showed up to the lock, I wouldn't go oh, I have an idea, let me Right, I would not do those things Right. So every lock is susceptible in some way, even the huge government bunkers that can withstand a nuke Well, yeah, they can withstand a nuke but not a team with a bunch of drill bits and three months worth of time to just sit outside and drill, drill, drill drill.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 1:You'll get in eventually. So it really is a game of what is the purpose of the lock and what are the types of attackers you're trying to keep out. And a lot of these really high-level locks are not really primarily for security. A lot of them are really for insurance. So there's things like if you own a jewel store or a bank, you're not allowed to have a residential lock on the front door. It has to be a lock from a certain company, from a certain make and model, in order for your bank to have an insurance policy on the structure. So that means that people that take my course probably cannot pick into a vault. Sorry, there are people that can do that, but it's a different skill set.
Speaker 1:So a lot of this stuff is just man, just like gunfighting, or just not even gunfighting guns.
Speaker 1:There is so much width and depth to the gun world that you could be a hobbyist, you could be an Olympic sharpshooter, you could be a sniper in the military, you can be just a designated marksman, you can just be good with a rifle, like there's all these different things. There's revolvers, there's pistols, there's everything in between, and then each of those one things can go so deep you can be the world's best pistol shooter it's been 60 years at it but someone hands you a rifle and you can go. This is clunky. So we have the same thing here with covert entry and with lock picking. Every single one of these locks and every one of these tools and every one of these miniature skill sets can go so deep. It's incredible, and every day we're adding new locks to the field, new makes and models, new tools. People are discovering new techniques. So, um, it's just, it's amazing kind of being on this frontier of stretching the skill set and providing this to top tier operators. It's just, it's been super exciting for me.
Speaker 3:Yeah, Well, it also opens your eyes to. You know, a lot of people get kind of like a false sense of security, thinking, oh, I've got my deadbolt, I've got, you know, these locks on my doors, like I'm good, and even you know I've got locks like these on the shed in my backyard, you know. So I saw how easy that was. That was really kind of like an aha moment. Yeah, I think the class will definitely open your eyes to how insecure you actually are in your own home.
Speaker 1:So I'll give you a feedback response to that which is a lot of our students. The first thing they think when they pick open locks is they go. Oh no, I have to change my keyway on my door or change my lock on my door, Breathe. So yes, you could, but, like you brought up earlier, most criminals aren't picking locks, they're kicking doors in, Right? So, yes, your front door is probably that easy to get into.
Speaker 2:But if you want to be secure, you have to pair your security with your expected attacker. Three-inch screws are probably a better investment.
Speaker 1:Much better investment, much, much better. Yeah, and a camera, three-inch screws and a ring camera so they can see themselves as they walk up and go. Hmm, let me take a second thought. Should I do this? And they kick the door three times, four times, and they go, ooh, should I keep doing this? We'll go to the next one. You're buying time and you're pairing. Your defense and offense should be paired. If you're worried about Jason Bourne killing you in the middle of the night, there's probably nothing you can do. But if you want to keep out your street-level criminals, you probably want to harden your actual hardware of your door, not the lock exactly. Yeah, you can. You certainly can upgrade your lock. Yeah, um, but you probably don't have to for most attackers let's talk about, like the tools and the gear and stuff.
Speaker 2:oh yeah, um, do you have any favorite places to get the stuff from? Or like what if somebody's out there looking to jump into this? So I'll answer it very short.
Speaker 1:I don't buy any of my entry gear on Amazon, even the stuff on there that can work. There's just so many. There's so many quality websites that cater specifically to the covert entry crowd and the lock picking crowd, and the tools are so high quality and so low priced that really there's no reason for me to get stuff on Amazon that's punched out en masse. Yeah, and even if it might work, it's not worth the might, so I push that to the side. I don't get anything on Amazon. If you just Google lockpicking tools, you will find covert entry websites that offer all the stuff you saw here, just a little handheld sets and more. And you can even go to most locksmith websites here in the US and for the most part they will sell to you without any special licensing or permissions. And they do have lock entry tools.
Speaker 1:But you'll see on the sidebar they have a bunch of stuff that's not related to lock picking. It's lock setting, it's hardware, it's pins, it's upgrades. So one Google search will solve your problems. Oh, and YouTube. If you see something cool on YouTube, almost everyone in the lockpicking world that does YouTube videos they'll say hey, I'm using this new set, here's where I got it, go buy one. So YouTube is just your best friend if you're learning this skill set. Here's where I got it go buy one.
Speaker 2:So youtube is just your best friend if you're learning this skill set at home yeah, there's a couple uh, lock picking lawyer I'm sure you're probably familiar with all of them that and then there's another guy, um, like, is it? Is it bonsai bill?
Speaker 1:bosnian bill bosnia bill. Yeah, great instructor bosnian bills. Uh, a lot of his earlier works are are deep structured how-to videos and they're fantastic.
Speaker 2:Yeah, their stuff's always super interesting. He's always playing with like new locks and stuff and like trying to get into them.
Speaker 1:So when you see stuff like that and you go and you're learning and you go, oh, I saw this guy, bosnian Bill. He opened this one lock, all these different ways, but then this one really unique way. Okay, we'll try to find that padlock if you can find it by make and model and buy it. And then try and buy those tools that he had and line them up and just go through the video with them, just monkey, see monkey do so. It doesn't have to be super structured. If you want to learn this skill set, you can literally go. I saw this, let me try it. If it doesn't work.
Speaker 1:There's also a bunch of communities I know Reddit has a subreddit or lockpicking. They don't do any covert entry stuff or really any bypasses. They are specifically what happens in the keyway. Can we make this work? That's very restricted and they have very tight, very well-enforced rules. If you send them a picture of a lock that's in use, they kick you out. Or if you're like, hey, I locked my cabinet, they're like we don't care, you're booted. They are strictly.
Speaker 1:Here's the puzzle, inside this little keyway. Here's the tools. This is how we solve it, like it's very academic and very it's also a very hobby sport and they have very strict rules, but they give a lot of information for free. So if you want to learn how to pick each of those pins individually, go on Reddit, go to rlockpicking and just follow their rules. But it's free and they love answering questions. So a new person goes hey, I found this lock, but I can't get through this one spot. People will give you walls of tech and resources and digital PDFs and they'll just send them to you and they're happy to do it. Oh wow, so it's a really cool community.
Speaker 2:So you mentioned kind of bypassing and lockpicking. The course that we have coming up here in July is that kind of both or is it more?
Speaker 1:So we're doing three things in your course, which is my core curriculum. So, as far as the tools and techniques go, it's lock picking, it's bypassing and it's decoding. So three of the main ways that we teach are foundational entry methods. There's much more than that, but that's what we make our foundation. You also get the curriculum behind that, which is how to apply it. That's really the special stuff in getting that too.
Speaker 1:So you're getting lock picking, which is what happens in the keyway. You're getting bypassing, which means if there's a key or a code for this lock, we use anything except for the key and the code. Sorry. So that would be on like a simple residential or commercial office door. Here you have the keyway on the outside, but you have the doorframe where there's a latch that goes into the doorframe. But you have the door frame where there's a latch that goes into the door frame, so you can use a flexible or a rigid item to affect that latch and then just pull the door open without even touching the keyway. That's a bypass, or you can go under the door and pull that handle down. Oh, yeah, a little. Yeah, I've seen those.
Speaker 1:That's a bypass, and even bypasses have their own realms. So you have a lot of latch bypasses. That's kind of one area. You have, um, what's called a Rex bypass request to exit R E X, um, and those are all the types of bypasses where you're tricking a door or a lock into thinking that you're leaving. So, like a vehicle gate, if the gate has a passive automatic exit where they have a ground loop detector, so if you're driving out of a parking garage and there's that big metal loop and once you hit the loop the gate automatically opens, well, the gate has a request to exit from your car. Well, if you're on the outside of the gate trying to get in and you take an industrial magnet on a skateboard and you roll that skateboard over that loop, that gate will think there's a car there and it will open so you can drive out the in or sorry in.
Speaker 1:I'm a mess today so you can drive in the out. So that's a request to exit, bypass, and so again, just so much width and depth to all the skills. But you'll be picking locks, you'll be bypassing padlocks, you'll be picking and bypassing doors, We'll be decoding a couple locks. If we have time, we'll break into a vehicle or two and again you'll just it's a lot of. It is a foundational skill. Everyone's going to pick a lock, Everyone's going to decode a lock, Everyone's going to slip a latch.
Speaker 1:But behind that, so much of my class is fluid, meaning I have to watch two things at the same time. I have to watch individuals and say, does he get this? Okay, let me help him, or I have to go. Is the class bored and like, as a whole, did they dominate this and they're ready for the next thing? Or are they all like, oh hey, how about this lock, how about this lock? And they're like they're playing? Then I have to let that be. So that's also. That's the experience that we bring to our top tier clients, is it's not? We don't go down a checklist. So if I'm reading the class and some classes spend a lot of time in one area and a little time here and other classes flip it, but really that's the value. So as long as I can get them to understand the concept of how to fold this into operations, and as long as I can give them to understand the concept of how to fold this into operations, and as long as I can give them a pretty good foundation of different tools, different techniques, then we just we play for two days, three days.
Speaker 1:Most of my military and government clients, we do a five-day course, but it's a week of just as in-depth as we could possibly be and it's fun too. It is not. I don't do any yelling at people. I don't set my students up for failure. There's no pushups. One of my least favorite instructor traits is going to a class for topic A and the instructor turns it into a martial arts class and goes here, grab my arm. I get that in some places. There's a time and place for that. I don't like that. I don't do that. So there will be no secret karate moves. I won't be chopping anything. It'll be all professional, Just the same way. We've talked here is exactly what you get to classroom. Nice it is. Hey, try this. Oh, it didn't work, oh, cool. Well, let me go to the whiteboard and draw you a picture. Oh, okay, Do you get it Like this, is it?
Speaker 2:So on your podcast. If somebody wants to go look that up, where can they find it?
Speaker 1:You could still find some traces of it out there. I pulled it from production. Oh, okay, not a bad thing. We just we took a huge shift over the last two years, so we will be coming back with a fresh new podcast, but we're going to tighten up the focus of it and keep it strictly the craft of entry. We did a lot of kind of one-off episodes about different things that didn't really relate to the craft. If they wanted to find it, they can just search on Google and there will be some other types of production, kind of third parties that have traces of it out there Gotcha but it's probably not on Apple or Spotify or anything. Okay, but we'll be back. Nice, we've had 250-ish episodes.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that's a lot of episodes, man. We'll be back Nice. We've had 250-ish episodes. Yeah, that's a lot of episodes, man, Just curious what period of time did it?
Speaker 1:how long did it take you to amass 250? I aimed for God when I first started. I wanted to do five a week. That quickly didn't happen.
Speaker 2:Wow, I turned that into one a week. Still, that's a very aggressive schedule.
Speaker 1:Yeah, well, when I was on a deployment I had that time, yeah. And then post-deployment, I had that time and then when life caught up, I didn't have that. Yeah. Now that I'm much more experienced and now that my schedule is different, my living situation is different I can definitely do a podcast a week, especially audio, because that's just cut paste. There's almost for me, for what I want to achieve. There's almost no editing. I don't cut out the ands and ahs, the intro, outro, I just talk and I hit publish. So that's pretty quick. I will be back with more on this craft. Yeah, to answer your question, it took me maybe three or four years to hit 250.
Speaker 2:Still, that's pretty pretty quick.
Speaker 1:I think I don't remember if we had a quarter million downloads or a half a million downloads, but we were, I think, successful by most measures.
Speaker 2:I would definitely say so.
Speaker 1:We got a lot of very positive feedback, but again we went so off topic for so many episodes that, as a business, I think we're we'll be much better in the future, just refocusing, because we could cover a lot. Yeah, I don't know how long we've been here, but I could go for it.
Speaker 2:We're almost at an hour here and like I feel like we just got started. Yeah, I could.
Speaker 1:I could talk on this stuff.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it seems like you got a lot more in you but that's also a signal that there is a lot of depth to this. It is not just take this pick and this thing and make it open Like there's so much to it. What's your website? So I just started a new one. I have the old one, which is UTACio. You can type the whole thing. That's a shortcut. You can type the whole thing in uncensoredtacticalcom. It's where my gear store used to be. I used to host my podcast episodes on their own page there. That's mostly been gutted with a recent move across the country and with the restructuring of the business. It's really just a placeholder right now and I started a new website which is just tactical lockpickingio, and that's going to be our forum.
Speaker 2:Oh nice.
Speaker 1:And the purpose of that one is for the people that are doing this in a professional capacity to make real entry into real operational structures. That's going to be a place where we can share information and access in real time. It's a private, closed off forum that we're mostly going to offer to the alumni of our courses and it's not exclusively, but mostly, going to be government operators of some capacity, because it's a very, very niche field that you can't just take our course and fly back to wherever state you came from and go hey, who here wants to also share their other top tier secrets about covert entry. You walk into a bar and you say that you'll get zero response. You could say, hey, who in the area wants to shoot? And you can find a lot of shooters.
Speaker 1:But this stuff is so unique that this will be the only place that anywhere on the planet, you can have access to other people that do this same teeny, tiny niche thing as you. So we just started that last week. Oh, just popped up Nice. So it's brand new, it's ugly. We have a lot of work to do behind the scenes with the details and design, but it's up.
Speaker 2:That's the first first half of the battle. Well, thanks for coming on and chatting with us for a little bit and giving us a live in-person demonstration of raking, and I guess what was the other thing.
Speaker 1:So that's a comb tool, a comb Like you comb your hair. It's also known as an overlifting attack, but that's only specific to a very few make and models. The first technique you learn raking opens up thousands of different makes and models of locks. So again, that's the game of what are my resources, what are my options, how do I stack these things?
Speaker 2:and again, that's the skill set gotcha well, cool, uh, yeah, thanks again for coming on. This was fun. Appreciate you. Yeah, appreciate it. I think that should about do it. Uh, y'all like comment, subscribe all that good stuff, tell your mom, tell friends and we'll see you next time.