Suprise, HAPPY FRIDAY!: Here is an extra episode, this episode was originally from our patreon. This is going to be the last episode from our patreon that is released into the regular feed. moving forward the patreon eps will only be kept in the patreon feed. In Patreon, we still have 4 or 5 more spots for listeners to join the patreon, for a free week, and following that it would only be $4 (American) per month, that will get you all of te extra episodes. For $5 (American) a month, you will get that, as well as other bonuses. check out our patreon, if you're interested.
This is The Sleepwalking Murderer.
This case is a huge point of reference when it comes to Canadian homicide cases.
Let us know your thoughts!
If you’re interested in receiving bonus episodes, early release dates, an everything scary sticker and ‘thank you’ as well as a shout out on our regular feed! Please join at Patreon//everythingscarypod571
Suprise, HAPPY FRIDAY!: Here is an extra episode, this episode was originally from our patreon. This is going to be the last episode from our patreon that is released into the regular feed. moving forward the patreon eps will only be kept in the patreon feed. In Patreon, we still have 4 or 5 more spots for listeners to join the patreon, for a free week, and following that it would only be $4 (American) per month, that will get you all of te extra episodes. For $5 (American) a month, you will get that, as well as other bonuses. check out our patreon, if you're interested.
This is The Sleepwalking Murderer.
This case is a huge point of reference when it comes to Canadian homicide cases.
Let us know your thoughts!
If you’re interested in receiving bonus episodes, early release dates, an everything scary sticker and ‘thank you’ as well as a shout out on our regular feed! Please join at Patreon//everythingscarypod571
Welcome to Everything Scary. My name is Lynn and I'm here with my co-host local celebrity, sorry, sorry, international celebrity. Thank you, matt McClain.
Speaker 2:Hello, hello.
Speaker 1:Every Tuesday we release a new episode, mostly true crime, but we've also been known to cover a pandemic, a haunting, a super mad, super strong chimpanzee. We'll cover anything and everything scary. Please rate us five stars and join us on Instagram at Everything Scary Pod. Here we go. Hello, hello Hello hello, how's it going?
Speaker 2:Good, happy New Year. We're just hanging in 2023. We're not getting ahead of ourselves. Not one little bet.
Speaker 1:So I have a story for you today, but I wanted to ask you first have you ever had any weird sleeping habits Like walking, talking, eating?
Speaker 2:driving. No, I have sleep apnea.
Speaker 1:Okay.
Speaker 2:Ladies, single and orderly lineup please. So I do wear a mask and I have a mouth guard? No, I don't think so. Like I heard that I've spoken to my sleep, but nothing too cray.
Speaker 1:You. Oh yeah, I've done a bunch of weird stuff.
Speaker 2:Three kids.
Speaker 1:When I was in college, I was working at a bar at night, and then I had to be up at 8 o'clock in the morning to go to school, and so I would take those, you know, those like just over the counter, like sleepies.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, yeah yeah.
Speaker 1:Well, what they do is they put your body to sleep, but your mind is still just rip-roared. Oh no, so I used to. When I lived with my parents, we had rooms downstairs. Mine and my brothers were right beside each other, and then on the other side of my brothers was so it's like on the far left was the bathroom, then my brothers and then my room. And so he said one night he heard me wake up and I went to the washroom and then he said, instead of going back into my room, I just came into his room and I tried to jump into his twin size bed with him. Oh, and he goes through me and his blanket off the bed and he's like what are you doing? And I was like I'm sleeping.
Speaker 2:I'm sleeping.
Speaker 1:And then so I didn't know about this I came home from school the next day and my mom's like, hey, so do you remember last night? And I was like what happened last night? And she was like what's your brother? I was like what happened with B? And she tells me this whole story and I'm like really, and he looks at me and he's appalled and he's like, yeah, like he's just so grossed out by me. But then from then on in, this was like my destination spot, like I was like I'm sleeping, gotta go hang out with B. And so the one night, he says, I just stuck my hand in and I turned his light on and off oh my God. And another time he said that I was standing at the end of his bed.
Speaker 1:And so I woke up the next day and I went upstairs and he's sitting on the couch upstairs and he goes the night stalker struck again last night and I was like, oh no, I'm so sorry, were you mad? And he goes. Honestly, nowadays it's weird when you're not there.
Speaker 2:Oh, my God.
Speaker 1:I think it happens to me when I'm like under a lot of stress, because I also remember I started working for a different doctor when I was dating my ex and he found me up in the middle of the night like sitting in the kitchen and he was like what are you doing? It's like three o'clock in the morning. I was like, what are you doing? I was like I need to talk to Dr Han and he was like is he fucking here? It's in the kitchen, okay. So the story I'm telling you today is the sleepwalking murderer.
Speaker 2:It can't be scarier than the story about the lady that went and shared the bed with her brother in the middle of the night and was elected to.
Speaker 1:To be fair, I like that point. I wasn't a lady Like I wasn't like you know, I was a lady, I was a broad still. I was like a mom, Like I was like hi, you're full of grown adults. No, I was like still young and hip, Not that it matters to my brother. Yeah, still young and hip.
Speaker 2:They were trying to justify this. It was starting to get like sleepwalking your brother's room. You're like I was still young and hip.
Speaker 1:Like you're welcome, he's like you fucking creep. So all that to say. Do you remember any of that? No, I know. No, none of it. And it was only when I took these sleepies. That was like I was like this is great because I can just conk right out as soon as. Like I don't. Do you have the capability of just falling asleep as soon as you hit the pillow?
Speaker 2:No, there's usually. You know there's something I could do to make me a little sleepier, but this I don't know the devil's lettuce. No, not the devil's lettuce.
Speaker 1:Oh my God, what do you do? Well, I mean Okay, okay, okay. I regret asking.
Speaker 2:Yeah, no, I'm.
Speaker 1:Oh. God save it for Caitlin the devil's lettuce. Yeah, no, I'm like one of these people that I'm like. I have 8,000 things going on in the back of my brain all the time, so, like my husband, can fall asleep in the middle of a sentence.
Speaker 2:Oh, I hate people like that.
Speaker 1:I want to stab him, I know, but he also talks in his sleep, like every single night of the week.
Speaker 2:Like just a conversation or like a full blown conversation, and it is never been anything juicy it's never been entertaining.
Speaker 1:His mom said when he moved out when he was 18 and she was like, thank God, because I couldn't get a fucking good night's sleep with him Just yammering on in the next room, like sometimes it'll just be like in the in. Like the dead of night he just starts laughing. Oh my God, it's awful. The one time he goes he was sleeping and all of a sudden he goes. Hey man, nope, just hanging out with my wang out.
Speaker 2:Oh my.
Speaker 1:Who are you talking to like this? And he wasn't even young and hip Like I was when.
Speaker 2:I was doing my stuff. No, you were very young and hip.
Speaker 1:Yeah, just ask my brother. He's got a therapy, but you know, he's fine, he's doing fine guys.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and you know his therapy and your coffee cause I like to picture health. Would you like to open up your Christmas present?
Speaker 1:Sure Did this wrapping paper. Did you get it like for me, Amazon, or did you actually get it from like no for us?
Speaker 2:No, I got it at at Loblaws, so it's real. It is legit. Yeah, if one of our generic friends and brand up here in Canada, beautiful, yeah, they have no name oh my God, gif wrap and I figure what better gift to get Lynn than a book about the forensic science?
Speaker 1:To be fair, you told me before I opened this that it was a re-gift.
Speaker 2:It is a re-gift. So who gave this to you is what I want to know. My mother gave it to me. Oh, she's like I got it for you cause you were really into JFK. I'm like that's CIA. This book is CSI. This is Gil Grissom, Did you?
Speaker 1:read it, though no oh.
Speaker 2:But enjoy.
Speaker 1:Thank you.
Speaker 2:Thank you. As you can see, there is not one crease.
Speaker 1:No, no, this is a, this is brand spanking new.
Speaker 2:It has survived probably four or five moves.
Speaker 1:I have ordered you a Christmas present. I don't know when it's going to get here to be honest with you but it has to do, it's brand new. Well, it's used, but I had to order it.
Speaker 2:Oh, ordering something used? Yeah, is this somebody's bathwater?
Speaker 1:We were talking about this the other day.
Speaker 2:I knew it. I knew you were going to do that.
Speaker 1:No, it has to do with true crime and wrestling all wrapped in two. Oh my God. You know what? I was going to get? A Chris Benoit thing. And then I was like that's dark, oh, that's burning half bad. I'll leave it to your imagination.
Speaker 2:Okay, cool True crime and wrestling.
Speaker 1:Yeah. I mean, there's a lot that went on because all of the concussions and future true crime. Yeah, exactly, I've actually. Just I've taken it upon myself to assume who's going to be next. And Dwayne Johnson, I'm looking at you, he's adorable. Okay, so we're talking about Ken Parks today. Sleepwalker, sleepwalker and he is local to us. Okay, he's basically in your backyard with that weird train.
Speaker 2:Oh, my God.
Speaker 1:So we're going to go back to May, the 23rd of 1987. You're just knee high to a grasshopper at that point.
Speaker 2:Yep, I was five.
Speaker 1:I was three Lose arm Basically a baby.
Speaker 2:You're beating a crap at you, so you're sold it to me.
Speaker 1:I would have been like whoops, you could probably beat the crap out of me right now. You like that no?
Speaker 2:I never underestimate a mother. Well, I mean just you got three kids, yeah, no way.
Speaker 1:I mean, if you pick on the least fit. Yeah, that's true. Yeah, that's true?
Speaker 2:Oh yeah, keep going. I'm going to get them really mad.
Speaker 1:I'm really mad. So we're in Pickering Ontario.
Speaker 2:Heard of it Yep. It's a Chamin Descoutre.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, you're right about that.
Speaker 2:Look at us, we're so like we're so into it.
Speaker 1:And this is all in Ontario too. Jim Carrey, ever heard of him? Yeah, ace Ventura.
Speaker 2:Doug Ford, rob Ford, ever heard of them?
Speaker 1:Rob Ford Went south.
Speaker 2:He is going to get a stadium near after him.
Speaker 1:I'm back and we're back and we're back. And we're back. I think everybody in the states knew about him. You're like Toronto's got this crack, crack out there.
Speaker 2:I will say this I did agree with what he said, that he didn't lie when he said he doesn't do crack. But he did crack and everybody said, well, if you do crack, you do crack. And I'm like, no, we probably you don't do it all the time.
Speaker 1:Everybody thought he was a liar. I mean if you were murdered.
Speaker 2:Are you a murderer? Well, that's the big question.
Speaker 1:If I'm not actively murdering Right now. Yeah, am I still a murderer, right? So who knows? I guess we'll leave that up to the. You know, there's people out there that are smarter than us, rob Ford was one of those.
Speaker 2:There's a lot of people, yeah, there's about six billion out there.
Speaker 1:So you know Ken Parks and his wife Karen, karen and Ken young couple. They met in high school. They'd been going through some pretty serious marital issues. A few nights before the one that's in question at this moment, karen had received a call from her bank advising her of a check, with her signature on it, that had bounced.
Speaker 2:Oh yeah, no bueno, that sucks.
Speaker 1:Karen was confused because she had not written any checks. Recently, when she confronted her husband, ken, he fasted up to having forged her signature on a check in order to get money for gambling. Oh, which I would be like. That's fine then. If you're just responsibly gambling, is it Forge away?
Speaker 2:Yeah, you can't forge, even in a marriage, like if you have a joint bank account. No, no, right, no no, no. It's a general rule.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:I mean, you're not even supposed to open the other person's mail.
Speaker 2:Really. Yeah, mom opened my CAA renewal the other day, so Holy shit, feds get a little pat on the back of my claim.
Speaker 1:You're like granted, I wasn't a ditch, I needed that information, that's right, that's right, that's right. So in order to understand how we got here to this gambling forgery, we're going to go back Just a year prior, so 1986, you were four, I was two. We established them younger than you. Good Moving on, karen had been pregnant with a couple's first child, who was due in December of 1986. Ken's friends had taken him to a woodbine racetrack, hey-o In Etobicoke.
Speaker 2:Been there. Yeah, it's fun.
Speaker 1:I've been to the one just off the highway. What is that one?
Speaker 2:That's in thisville.
Speaker 1:Is it called in thisville? No, it's called.
Speaker 2:Gateway Casino.
Speaker 1:Whatever it is called, I don't understand how it works. Okay, what are?
Speaker 2:your questions.
Speaker 1:I just thought, hey, we just give a name and then we watch and see if they win. But that is apparently not the case. There's like odds and, quite frankly, I was confused. I was upset. I just wanted to go to the slot machines.
Speaker 2:I will say this you are both right and wrong. Okay, it is very confusing, but you can also just go up and give a name, and that's what I did. I picked.
Speaker 1:What if it's my own name?
Speaker 2:Well, unless you're a horse or somebody a rich guy named his horse after you.
Speaker 1:Oh, that would be sweet.
Speaker 2:Yeah, the shank Imagine a lynn, a lynn horse, nobody would ever pick a horse named Lynne. Here comes Lynne, not the back. Lynne, Lynne, Lynne, Lynne, Lynne, Lynne, Lynne, Lynne. And the winner of the Kentucky Term is the greatest sports moment in history. It's. Lynne, Lynne the horse it's like she needs one of those beaten saddles, you know, like the bus drivers have on the back of their chairs. The crown, the crown air freshener.
Speaker 1:So you know, Kenneth gone to this racetrack and he had what a lot of people experience, which is beginner's luck, and he had won a horse.
Speaker 2:No, that's over. That's always a second. He's the winner of the horse, okay.
Speaker 1:So he won some money. I guess his horse maybe won. I don't fucking know how it works.
Speaker 2:Well, yeah, he either gambled, yeah, he bet on the horse to win or the horse to come into a certain place, or yeah, you just want to take the horse home with you though. Is that not that's?
Speaker 1:horse napping. Oh, this was the 80s, so anything goes.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that's fine. Yeah, you can horse nap.
Speaker 1:Yeah, they can be latchkey horses, yeah not all horses are great.
Speaker 2:Throw brits. They're like people there are someone's dick horses.
Speaker 1:Lynne is not a great throw.
Speaker 2:Lynne is a dick horse.
Speaker 1:She's half pony something went wrong.
Speaker 2:Yeah, like Lynne eats the flowers they give her when she wins and not the oats. It's like Lynne, go on.
Speaker 1:Go on. I'm like Bart's horse on the Simpsons, yeah.
Speaker 2:Lynne's always shaking her horse head to get the bangs right.
Speaker 1:The Bieber of horses. So he won, and he won a pot of cash, I assume. And that was when Ken's eyes did those like the dollar symbols and he thought you know, he thought about all these hours that he was working as a project coordinator at Revere Electric. Cool, have you heard?
Speaker 2:of it. Probably not with that phonetic Revere Electric. Oh, is there a question mark at the end of there?
Speaker 1:Yeah, that's actually Hi Revere Electional. Well, nope, it's erectional. It's Revere Erectional, it's just. It's a weird joint. We do weird things here in Canada. But you know, he began to think about all those long hours on the job and they had this baby on the way and he was just thinking to himself you know, if I could win a jackpot big enough, I could just pay down my mortgage and then I wouldn't have to work all these long hours, I could spend more time with my baby and Karen and Lynn the horse.
Speaker 1:And Lynn, the horse that he just won with the beaded saddle, and at this time Ken was only 22 years old, so like kind of responsible.
Speaker 2:That's a little early to be a degenerate gambler.
Speaker 1:Listen, he's not a degenerate.
Speaker 2:He's got big plans to do a big deal on the mortgage. Yeah, my bad.
Speaker 1:And you know, him and Karen had bought a car together. They were dating since high school. They bought a car together. They put a damn payment on a house Like these two had their shit together. They put a damn payment on a house for like $600 then.
Speaker 2:Yeah, really I wanted to have a membership to Costco back then. It's probably the price club.
Speaker 1:When did Costco begin?
Speaker 2:You would know, costco started the year zero. Oh my God, costco is 2,023 years old.
Speaker 1:That's incredible. Yes, jesus went to Costco.
Speaker 2:Jesus was born in like. Where do you think they got them? You think you could just buy a manger. No, where do you think they got the manger? Costco wholesale. That was a Kirkland manger.
Speaker 1:That's why they were the wise men, because they fucking knew a bargain when they saw one. Right, these guys aren't idiots, they're like a bunch of fucking malarkey.
Speaker 2:They got a little bit of frankincense and a little bit of myrrh. No, they were tubs. Okay, and where are you going to get tubs of frankincense and tubs of myrrh? Costco Boom.
Speaker 1:Jesus. It's all coming together right in this Christmas season, this nativity scene brought to you by Kirkland Kirkland nativity scene, so he was only 22. You know he's being responsible. He's like I'm going to, I have this bulletproof plan, yeah. You do gambling Got a baby on the way, baby on the way. Got this horse that he's on the car. She's a surefire winner every single time Just going to pay you on the mortgage Easy peasy.
Speaker 2:Yeah, going to get a good night's sleep, no issues there.
Speaker 1:So here's the thing this plan had holes in it Really. Yeah, I'm sorry. I hate to be the one to fucking bear the bad news.
Speaker 2:Oh no.
Speaker 1:And so Ken would become a regular at the ponies. That's what the know what I'll say. Yeah, big guys.
Speaker 2:There is a few places where I mean. Gambling to me, okay, is a sad addiction to see. It's a very visual when you're going through the casino. I hate it.
Speaker 1:And you smell poop because people are wearing diapers.
Speaker 2:Well, no, but I just see like old people gambling and then it's a Kirkland diaper.
Speaker 1:It all circling back it's called a callback guys.
Speaker 2:It's a Kirkland diaper. Oh shit, I completely forgot my train of thought. I'm just thinking why is?
Speaker 1:Kirkland not marketing. What a sad addiction gambling is. And I had to disagree because where else can you see grown people consciously pooping?
Speaker 2:themselves. Well, there are different levels of the sadness. Right Like the casinos is right there. Right, that's pretty sad, but you know, but it's like flashing, there's restaurants, but then there's like the horse track there's nothing there, it's like an office.
Speaker 1:Even the horses are like why are we here? Yeah, like, are you getting betting on us? Yeah, do you think we can fuck with them? Yeah, I'm going to look real fast, I'm going to limp.
Speaker 2:No, don't, limp, don't. I'm going to do this. Watch, watch. Look at this guy. He's looking at me. He's going to bet on me. Look at the guy. He's totally bet on me.
Speaker 1:So you know he's betting on the ponies. People would know his name. It was like Cheers, but like really badly planned out Cheers.
Speaker 2:Oh, the worst.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and as a saying goes, the house always takes a cut.
Speaker 2:That's not the saying at all.
Speaker 1:Oh, what is it?
Speaker 2:The house always wins.
Speaker 1:Oh, oh. Do you know that I had that originally? And then I was like, well, that's not always true. Ken won the first time.
Speaker 2:But it doesn't mean it doesn't have to be true, but it is what they say. It's like. It's like what's happening in Vegas stays in Vegas, not true? So you know what they say.
Speaker 1:It's like my little guy. Whenever he goes to bed he has to say and don't let the bed bugs come in Every time. It's so fucking cute.
Speaker 2:Oh, my God.
Speaker 1:Stay out of here, you guys.
Speaker 2:That's not it.
Speaker 1:So you know, Ken eventually found himself in the deficit. Uh-oh, he was in the red by the time their daughter was born in December. Ken had actually not only been using his money from his bank account that he shared with Karen, but he'd actually been stealing from his workplace.
Speaker 2:Oh well, what do you do? What was the job again?
Speaker 1:He was a project coordinator at Revere Erections, oh yeah.
Speaker 2:Erections. Yes, how do you steal money from an elect? Oh, I guess it was the 80s. All cash, everything's cash, right, everything's cash.
Speaker 1:Or check.
Speaker 2:Yeah, Ford's signature.
Speaker 1:Bingo bongo. And so by March of 1987, March of 1987, I believe Taylor Hansen was just turning four.
Speaker 2:I believe also in March of 87 that most commonly people think for the first time it was actually the third time, I believe, that Hulk Hogan lifted up Andre the Giant Gateman Slam Pontiac Michigan. A lot of people don't know that.
Speaker 1:Do you know that, ever since I watched that, the Hulk Hogan. Do you know that ever since I watched Hulk Hogan with Mr T?
Speaker 2:Yes, on that, richard Belzer. Yes, yeah.
Speaker 1:And Hulk Hogan is like I'm gonna make him squeal like a pig. Hulk Hogan is psycho. And then he fucking slammed this little tiny dude down, like the guy was probably. He probably weighed the same as I do. Yes, he was very, very, very slender, and he just let this guy lose consciousness and then dropped to the ground. He was seven feet tall and the size of a pencil.
Speaker 2:I do like it. I like this guy. He looked just like me. He was very, very skinny, very attractive. Me and him were like twins, I am. We were body doubles, I am. He was gorgeous here.
Speaker 1:He had beautiful hair, the curves that would pay the bills is what they said about Richard, whatever he's got. No, I'm fucking five, five. He was like seven and a half feet tall and we had the same BMI.
Speaker 2:I think that yeah listen, hulk Hogan was coked up asshole.
Speaker 1:And Mr T was like you know, he was the bigger asshole in that interview. If anybody doesn't know what I'm talking about, please go Google it, because it was so awful to watch. And he's like Apparently they had told this Richard fellow before the show yeah, Bell, Mr T's in a bad mood today, so you might want to watch it and he was antagonizing him Well, and Bell's is a comedian right.
Speaker 2:Oh yeah, he's like a hardened New York City comic.
Speaker 1:And he's like Mr T's, like I didn't even want to be here today. They told me that there was going to be all these disabled kids there's 50 disabled kids in wheelchairs, and that's why I'm here today. Oh my.
Speaker 2:God.
Speaker 1:Jesus Murphy. But yeah, that's not neither here nor there in this story. I don't know.
Speaker 2:Were the disabled kids there or did they? Yeah, because they told.
Speaker 1:they said Mr T will not do the show unless it's a whole audience of disabled children. And then this guy, fucking the whole, drops the sky and smashes his head open.
Speaker 2:In front of all the poor kids. So anyhow Did they just like bring Bells over to that section.
Speaker 1:They're like OK, here he goes.
Speaker 2:No, Matt Chris pulled it.
Speaker 1:So you know he was stealing from his work. March of 1987, he had embezzled nearly $32,000. Wow, in 1980s money. So this is like $407,000. But you can go to Trill and he'd lost it, betting it all on the bones Oof yeah.
Speaker 2:So because they all have horses have weird names, so it's not a cool sport to lose money on. You're like God damn it, moon catcher.
Speaker 1:Green buff you, motherfucker.
Speaker 2:Mother fucking sparkle galaxy. I swear to God.
Speaker 1:So you know, most people would have thought this. What he was doing here, what Ken was doing, was a foolproof plan, right? Sometimes, you have to borrow from Peter to pay Paul, as they say. So you steal from your job, bring it to the bones. I'm just cutting it down. I'm getting even cooler with this.
Speaker 2:Yeah, soon, he'll just be betting on.
Speaker 1:But in this case you know Kenneth Parks. He had kind of officially failed and his employer finally realized what Ken was doing and not only did they fire him but they were pressing charges and they wanted all of that money to be paid back. Ooh, hopefully he can get a checking account for his new daughter or a signature Do you think maybe just like a refund, like Costco, well, you can bring them back to the fucking bottom of salsa and they're like yes, you deserve your full $7 back.
Speaker 1:Yes, Even though this was a two pack and you fucking ate the other one.
Speaker 2:You want him to return the baby.
Speaker 1:The baby, no, because I think that customer service window closes after certain number of days, I think you go back to Woodbine you say listen, this didn't work out the way I was expecting it to. Can I please get my investment back?
Speaker 2:Look, I dropped some money here. I didn't know I was going to get an apesiaotomy and I want to take the baby back. I thought I was getting a horse and I have a baby now. Yeah, apesiaotomy, oh no, so I've looked that up. By the way, if you want everything scary, not you. I know you're a smart lady and you work for a doctor. I'm sure you know that.
Speaker 1:Well, I work for a denturist and she does not do apesiaotomy. I'm not. I have an opnion. The one time I walked in there and she just had a needle and thread down there and I was like Nata, you can't be doing this shit, you are not qualified.
Speaker 2:It looks so good, I came in for a cavity.
Speaker 1:I guess the guy's teeth looked great. I'll tell you that. So you know Kevin had to come clean. He lost his job. Like he's being charged Legally, which is the worst kind of being charged- if you ask me, I agree, I agree.
Speaker 1:So he had to come clean to his wife, karen, and her parents, because he was really really close with her parents. So, you know, she decided that she was going to stick it out with her husband because when they met they were both still in high school and she was actually going through a pretty rough time in her life and she had been a teenage runaway. Oh, that's kind of cool. I know it's really cool actually.
Speaker 2:Yeah, right, I mean, you don't ever do it at kids, but Super cool.
Speaker 1:I mean, this is for the patrons, that's cool right.
Speaker 2:Yeah, totally. I just think, like Kristen Stewart, like smoking darts.
Speaker 1:Oh yeah, and like yeah, totally Having fun.
Speaker 1:Yeah, just not wearing the same underpants day in and day out, got it. So you know they had fallen in love and Ken convinced Karen. He said you know, the safest, best place for you to be right now is like with your loving family. So her family adored Ken for that. And now Ken and Karen had a child together. So Karen decided that she was going to stick it out with her husband and Ken mentioned he was six-five. That's kind of like I don't know, it's a good height, it's a good height, it's just a good height.
Speaker 2:Yeah, so so you could overlook it.
Speaker 1:If he was like five-four? Underlook it is more like it, hello. What if he was five-four?
Speaker 2:You become a little bit of a grandad kicking him in the face.
Speaker 1:That's exactly right. Bye, yeah, you're going to give you a noogie on the way out, little bugger.
Speaker 2:Right off your little scamp.
Speaker 1:So she's going to stick it out and as a family, you know, there we're all going to work through it. But sadly, losing his job and being charged with stealing was not quite rock bottom for Ken. Yet After the dust had settled from the charges and the loss of his job, ken had to come home one day with great news He'd gotten a new job. The only problem was that he was actually lying and he hadn't gotten a new job.
Speaker 2:Why do you freeze things like that in so great? I think you're terrific. I get felt like sometimes. And then she came home with the greatest news possible.
Speaker 1:He got a great new job. The only problem was it wasn't real and he was a fucking filthy liar. So all he was really doing was taking the little bits of money that they had left and he was going to the race tracks Would buying.
Speaker 2:Yeah, man, he likes that would buy.
Speaker 1:He does. I mean, like you, probably can't afford gas to go anywhere else. He's not getting a fucking bury. I'll tell you that right now, not with no money, nope. So he was continuing to gamble and right now we're going to go back to exactly where we started off the beginning of the story. We're in May 1987. Okay, karen's check is bail.
Speaker 2:Stay updated since high school.
Speaker 1:Yeah, bingo, bungo. So she immediately knew what was going on. She confronted her husband and he fast up to the gambling and he also confessed that he didn't have a job. And at this point you got to be like what the fuck are you talking about? Yeah, like you just shaved five inches off your height. So you know, karen must have had the absolute patience of a saint. She said okay, here's what we're going to do. We're going to sell our home and we have to do this because you've gotten us into this bind. So we're going to sell our home, we'll rent and we'll start from scratch.
Speaker 2:Oh my, can we put this? No, I was going to say give us a lady a medal, but maybe a statue.
Speaker 1:We can make a statue after this. Yeah, I have statue material in my trunk. Nice, lucky for us.
Speaker 2:You still have the bronze casters? Yeah, please.
Speaker 1:Do I go anywhere?
Speaker 2:without them. That's my bag. Yeah, I sound like an asshole.
Speaker 1:So the reason I mentioned all this was that Ken would have to be the one to tell her parents and his grandmother, because Ken had never been particularly close with his own parents. I think they split up and his dad moved away and then his mom moved to a different city and he didn't want to live there. So, regardless, he lived with his grandmother and then, when he'd started dating Karen, her parents had welcomed him into their home with open arms and at six foot five. I've gone off script a couple of times.
Speaker 1:I mentioned that Karen's mother, barbara Ann, would even call Ken her gentle giant. So these were the main people in their life and that's you know, who would need to know about the situation that Ken had created for him.
Speaker 2:The scene has been set.
Speaker 1:You got it. We know the players Did this bring any?
Speaker 2:bells to you at all. Yeah, not any of all of the back store, but yeah, the. I do feel that for some reason, this is.
Speaker 1:Going to turn out well.
Speaker 2:No, that this isn't like the like geographically with like the Russell Williams case.
Speaker 1:Not geographically but like as far as big Canadian historical cases, it kind of fits into that scene, maybe that's. Yeah maybe that's why there's similarities, just because there's like, and I mean they're both in Ontario, right yeah?
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, that's true. And listen, I hate to brag here, America, but when you've got like only four people that kill the whole scene, it makes the news.
Speaker 1:Let's not brag about it.
Speaker 2:We've got a couple of doozies, can we do?
Speaker 1:Let's post the picture of Russell William again in his naked lache, and then we'll talk about how great we are over here. Post the picture of Paul Bernardo. We're doing great guys. We gave you Shawn Mendes and Justin Bieber, though.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:Yeah, they're the serial killers of pop stars. So now we're on May the 23rd, which was a Saturday, ken and Karen planned a visit to his grandmother and they were going to break the news and they would go have a barbecue, because it's May 24. Oh, yeah.
Speaker 1:They were going to that's. We have Victoria Day over here. It's usually a long weekend. They were going to have a barbecue at her parents' home and they had already asked Ken to take a look and try to fix their furnace. Like what do 22-year-old guys do nowadays, like 22-year-old guys were fixing furnaces back in the 80s.
Speaker 2:No, they're like resetting routers, looking at printers doing the Wi-Fi changing. Hdmi. That's about it, actually. You know what? No, they're not doing that. They're on their phone while you're asking them to help. Yeah, hello, hello, hello, hello.
Speaker 1:That's my husband. Now he's going to be 40, and he's now just at this stage of his life he's decided that he is going to be a gamer. Oh nice and he's going to play station. I don't know what the games are nowadays, but he's running around with a gun, talking to his friends on a headset and he's like did you just shoot me? Who's shooting me? Like he, because his friends are so more advanced than he is.
Speaker 2:Oh well.
Speaker 1:And, like he doesn't know, it's a fucking nightmare. My son's like Mom. I heard dad gaming last night. Sorry guys, we'll talk about it.
Speaker 2:Hey, dad's just playing with children as far as your odds, he's just playing with children.
Speaker 1:Oh no. Anyhow back to this lovely story. So he was going to fix the furnace and you know they would go there and they'd tell them what was up and that way everybody important would know. However, on the Friday Ken did not sleep for even a minute. He was always known to have kind of sleeping issues. He would get typically between four to six hours a night.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that's welcome to the club.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it really didn't sound like the end of the world to me, and every time I read it I was like okay.
Speaker 2:You're like okay, so you're bragging about a good night's sleep.
Speaker 1:Mother of three in.
Speaker 2:December.
Speaker 1:Okay, then Ken Four hours of what Weird flex, but all right. So you know he said that he had sleeping issues, but he stayed up that night and he was worrying and anxiously dreading having these conversations. I mean, he just kind of had this conversation in March but he had to do it again. He didn't want to be disappointing the people that he cared about.
Speaker 2:Dude, you got them by the balls. You're fixing their furnace.
Speaker 1:And you're super tall. Yeah, come on, get over yourself, you're six-five the world's your oyster buddy. But on Saturday morning he told Karen that he didn't want to go today. He wanted to push it off until Sunday because he really wanted to go and play rugby. You know, idiot Right, and Karen is like I don't know.
Speaker 2:What are you, Ross, from that shitty season of Friends?
Speaker 1:So I can't even fathom having this conversation Like I would become a legit murderer. I would kill my husband.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:And then I would wear his skin and I would go and confess to everybody.
Speaker 2:I knew I would wear his skin, and then I would game with his friends as him.
Speaker 1:Exactly, and I'd probably be better than him because he thinks everyone's shooting him all the time. Why are you putting yourself in that position, idiot? Anywho, so you know, with zero sleep, he went to play rugby. He would later say that he did take a hit during the game that like rocked his noodle a little bit.
Speaker 2:Give him a good shake around. That's rugby.
Speaker 1:Yes, it's not a weak me in sport. Yeah, I don't know anything but rugby.
Speaker 2:That's right, that's all you really need to know.
Speaker 1:So I just can say Although you know what's interesting?
Speaker 2:Rugby and like NFL football, compared to rugby, there's a lot of injuries in sports that have a lot of padding, but in rugby there's not a lot of injuries Like I mean. People get hurt.
Speaker 1:Because you know what it is Is that they do that big hug before the game.
Speaker 2:They're like I don't want to hurt you Listen. No, that's not it at all.
Speaker 1:I can't quit you.
Speaker 2:Listen, I'm going to go out there. I love you so much. I'm thinking about you.
Speaker 1:The whole time I'm out there. Okay, they just they huddle together and they sing a little T-Swaygity Like alright, guys. You're on the phone with your friends.
Speaker 2:Did you see?
Speaker 1:her get booed at the game recently.
Speaker 2:No, where was it?
Speaker 1:He was in Kansas.
Speaker 2:Oh, that's interesting.
Speaker 1:Yeah, because I think she made a.
Speaker 2:she said Well, she called it the Chad's Dads and the Frats the dads, yeah.
Speaker 1:Fuck them. But then they booted her when she was on the big thing, and it's not even her fault, the big thing. Do you see how good it is as far as I am? And yeah, she's just kind of like that's what it is. Her dad was sitting right there with her Like it was a bummer.
Speaker 2:Yeah, well.
Speaker 1:Big Tron, bigotron.
Speaker 2:Jumbotron, the Jontron. Big screen, big TV, the Jontron.
Speaker 1:So you know we're back to this case again. So he went home after he got his noodle rocked. He obviously had a really tense evening with his wife, because you're fucking up everything in our life. So at the end of the night Karen would go to bed with their five-month-old daughter. Well, ken stayed up and watched SNL oh nice. And he could blame him because this was the season 12 finale.
Speaker 2:Oh, you know though.
Speaker 1:And it was hosted by Dennis Hopper and the musical guest was the one and only Roy Orbison. Get the fuck out of here.
Speaker 2:I'm so proud. That's amazing.
Speaker 1:This was also the episode that the late great Phil Hartman debuted his Jack Nicholson impersonation.
Speaker 2:No shit the big glasses.
Speaker 1:I don't know. Yeah, big glasses, but despite all of this Silver suit At some point during the sketch, so Ken had slipped into an extremely deep sleep. He was actually known to be an extremely deep sleeper Once, when he was 11 years old. What?
Speaker 2:I just love it. I didn't know so much. He was known to be a deep sleeper. If I was like, I object to you actually.
Speaker 1:One time Matt when he was 11, he was dangling his feet out of his six-story high bedroom window when his mom came and interrupted him because she heard him getting into the window preparing to jump.
Speaker 2:Alexa play air-clap.
Speaker 1:No, no, no, don't do that. I have a deep connection with Connor. Please don't do it. I still make me cry. You know, I always used to listen to that song when I was a kid and ever since we've researched it, I'm like and then I'm like one of those people that I'm like. That didn't hurt bad enough this time, so I have to play it again. I'm going to pull the picture on this.
Speaker 2:Oh my God, yeah, I'm fucked. I don't know. I had too much fun listening to that song. I need to feel something.
Speaker 1:I feel like I need it to like split my heart in two, which, unfortunately, is what happens to his mother along the story Whoopie doodle, what so? Luckily, his mother had heard the commotion in the window and was able to get him back down to safety. But on this night in May, just before 4 am, from, what the evidence shows us happened was that Ken had put on his shoes, he grabbed his keys, he left both the front door to his home and the garage door wide open, because I mean, he's got to sell it anyways, right? He was not wearing any underwear or socks when he left his home early in that morning.
Speaker 1:Play it, go and play and he'd gotten behind the wheel of his car and he started to drive. And in this whole telling of the part of the story that I'm going to tell you, we're going to go ahead and assume that Ken was sleepwalking. There's obviously the team that says he's faking it. There's obviously the team that thinks he's.
Speaker 2:So we're going to assume, for argument's sake, we're just saying he was sleepwalking. Yes, was he wearing a shirt? He was wearing a shirt, so full Winnie the Pooh mode Shirt, no pants.
Speaker 1:I think he had pants on. He just didn't have underpants underneath those.
Speaker 2:Oh, okay, I was thinking he can't go to a gas station, he's so tall.
Speaker 1:It's just so high off the ground. If we didn't just assume that he was sleepwalking, this would be a pretty black and white kind of situation that happened here, but Ken had driven this very familiar route. It was like just 23 kilometers. So easy sleep drive on 401, naturally. So he was driving Never Eat, shredded West on Highway 401. Which is a major highway here in Canada.
Speaker 2:What.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:I think it is the biggest in North America. Wow, At one point I think it's a 1632 lane highway.
Speaker 1:Do you hear that, americans? Not only do we have the better serial killers.
Speaker 2:No less. We have way less. We have way less. Okay, so you guys went on serial killers.
Speaker 1:We went on highways. Okay, Well, that evens itself out and I think that all comes out the same in the wash. So he was driving. He had done this a hundred times. He was actually planning on doing it later that same day to go and fix some urnices.
Speaker 2:Let's go on the 401.
Speaker 1:He was on his way to his in-laws home in Scarborough. Upon arriving at his in-laws, he parked his car, went to his trunk and retrieved a tire iron. Then he led himself in with the key that he had to their home. Again, from here until about 445, we can only really piece together the evidence and kind of guess as to what happened. What we know is that Ken retrieved the tire iron out of his trunk. It's unclear what he thought he was going to do with it. Maybe he had the subconscious remembering that he had to fix the furnace and maybe this is a tool that would help him. Help assist him in that.
Speaker 2:That's more how I think you or I would fix a furnace Just smash it with a tire. Iron yeah, he seemed like he knew what he was doing.
Speaker 1:Did we unplug it? Yeah, has anyone tried unplugging?
Speaker 2:it. We did that earlier. All right, grab the tire.
Speaker 1:So again, we don't really know the chain of events, but maybe he was sleep repairing and Barbara had startled him, and maybe it turned violent. Who knows right, she could have tried to get a knife to defend herself, but it would appear as though Ken had attempted to smother his father-in-law, Dennis. This guy killed these people, Matt. What kind of a podcast do you think you're on?
Speaker 2:Well, I know, but you said it was like a, like a. Well, maybe you didn't sit me, you know what. Maybe actually you just said it wasn't as heavy as I'm thinking. I said there was a murder.
Speaker 1:I said it was kind of like true crime, a diet true crime. There's not kids involved. Right, that's what it was, and in my mind I'm thinking it's like diet yeah. I'm like okay.
Speaker 2:I'm a little sleep walking. I'm like, oh, I wonder what the crime is. Yeah it was stealing. A horse it was gambling.
Speaker 1:It was a gambling podcast.
Speaker 2:It's a gambling podcast. We had a lot of fun. We had a lot of fun.
Speaker 1:We had actually. We really contemplated, guys on starting a Christmas movie podcast, because every single time I come to record, matt is in the middle of another.
Speaker 2:I am hooked, it is. You want to talk about addiction to gambling. I can relate.
Speaker 1:It's all the same premise.
Speaker 2:Well, yeah, for the most part.
Speaker 1:I mean there was one, it was Can I just first of all say I don't understand why people say that we go off track a lot, because that's it was so weird, you idiots. Anyways, tell me about the-.
Speaker 2:Yeah, homography, it was the Christmas cookie catastrophe and um Naturally, and it was so a lot riding on this bacon contest. Oh yes, and we were playing bakery, but there was so much sabotage coming on.
Speaker 1:Was it the big wave? No, no, it was some it was.
Speaker 2:Kirkland, it was, kirkland, it was SS.
Speaker 1:Kirkland, jj, kirkland, that evil Tycoon.
Speaker 2:It was the new believe in Christmas Jesus.
Speaker 1:Jesus was born in the Costco.
Speaker 2:Jesus was born in the Costco. That's the shirt that I want to get.
Speaker 1:Yeah, well, I know just a girl that can make one. Jesus was born in the.
Speaker 2:Costco. Uh, yeah, I forgot.
Speaker 1:It's about Christmas movies, but you know what? We will get back to the murder.
Speaker 2:Oh yeah, and then I was just watching one here with Jenny Garth.
Speaker 1:Jenny Garth Kelly from number 210.
Speaker 2:So anyway-, oh, so let me just rest and wrap up with the Christmas cookie catastrophe. So there's so much sabotage at her own place, nobody could be trusted, so she had to go in arrivals.
Speaker 1:They were putting raisins in the cookies, weren't they these?
Speaker 2:fuckers, little dudes. They were putting little rabbit shits on there.
Speaker 1:So you know, Ken had tried to smother his father-in-law, Dennis, and he'd stabbed him with a knife, once in the back, once in the head, and when Dennis lost consciousness he I guess maybe Ken assumed he was dead and he moved on. Barbara had been hit in the head with the tire iron and it appeared as though she had attempted to run and to get to a phone, because she was found in another room where it looked as if she was reaching for the phone. Unfortunately it was no use to her, because fucking landlines, if their phone's up the hook in another room, they're not making a call.
Speaker 1:Oh yeah, and it had been knocked off in the bedroom.
Speaker 2:The parents came. Oh shit, Hopefully nobody was on the internet. Oh God, I'm gonna knock it right out.
Speaker 1:So sadly. Barbara Ann had been stabbed six times, and one of those stabbing had pierced her heart.
Speaker 2:We're still saying that he was sleepwalking. Yeah, okay. So why are we not saying that?
Speaker 1:We're always saying that why don't you ask the Supreme Court of Ontario?
Speaker 2:Because I am not speaking with them.
Speaker 1:So so in the house we're also Karen's two teenage sisters, who could hear all the commotion that was transpiring. Oh, that's terrible, woof right. And in their rooms they had the door closed and when they would yell, ken would respond to them in groans growling, kind of like sleepy noises.
Speaker 2:What are you doing down there?
Speaker 1:All right so thankfully, ken did leave these two girls alone, and after his unprovoked attacks on his beloved in-laws, ken then left the house, got back in his vehicle, and Ken would later say that when he got into the car he kind of started to rouse. All he could see in his head was a vision of his mother-in-law's face and he could see that he was standing over her, like he was like looming over her, and she had a look of fear and sadness. He then looked down and he saw that he had the knife in his hands and his hands were completely covered in blood. He was remembering in flashes his wife's sisters, like screaming and crying, and he were called, trying to yell out to them. And he was in there and in his mind what was coming out was kids, kids, kids. He wanted them to know that he was there and he was protecting them. They were going to be okay. What the?
Speaker 2:freak, I'm just going to write it in here. Supreme Court of Ontario follow-up.
Speaker 1:So he then realized some shit has gone down. Good call, ken. He decided what he was going to do was drive himself right to a Toronto police station. That's what he did. When he got to the police station he was still super out of it and he just kept yelling to the officers like I killed two people with my hands. With my hands, he kept saying, and he just kept repeating it. In quotes it says he said I kill them. I don't know why. Like he was sleeping, like me, when I said I seeping and I jumped into bed with my brother I'm seeping, I know seeping, it's okay.
Speaker 1:I'm young and hip.
Speaker 2:We're moving to Keswick. That's like an Alabama joke.
Speaker 1:Oh God, don't insult the Alabama people.
Speaker 2:Well, I just mean, people know Alabama more than they would know a Keswick reference.
Speaker 1:What is the reference? Matt, go ahead, install all the Alabamans.
Speaker 2:Do you want? Well, no.
Speaker 1:It's an ancestral joke, you guys.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I shouldn't take that.
Speaker 1:Do you need a minute? But I just I had to prove it to the Batron, so I'm actually really sick. I wasn't just fucking phoning it in, but I didn't have to do my homework. So while he was ranting on and on about his hands, the officers noticed that his hands had been severely injured. He actually had nearly severed his flexor tendons in both hands. So just fingies just flopping.
Speaker 2:Really.
Speaker 1:Floppy fingies. Yeah, so this could easily be explained if maybe Barbara had gone and gotten a knife and maybe he grabbed the blade to get it away from her. It makes more sense to me that if she had the knife and he grabbed it with both hands, as opposed to like if he had the knife, it would be mostly, you would think, it would be in his prominent hand that he would have the injuries, right, if it's slid down over the handle.
Speaker 2:Yeah, hang on one second. I'm just going to throw up real quick, and then I'll be right back. You're asking some great questions, though, and I really want to get to that, but I'm really going to be sick.
Speaker 1:I don't know. Really quick vomit break. Okay, I'm going to pee.
Speaker 2:I don't know, Like when you stab somebody, is it a lot of effort to pull the knife back out, Like maybe could you slip.
Speaker 1:Yeah, Well you could With both hands, oh, you mean.
Speaker 2:And then he's like oh damn, I screwed up with my right hand. All right, now I'll try stabbing with my left hand.
Speaker 1:Oh damn it. No, no, no flexors.
Speaker 2:I've ruined both my flexors.
Speaker 1:There goes my wedding ring. No, but I think, like I don't know, there's probably people in our Patreon that would know this better than me. But when you stab down, you would think that that's when you would like lose your grip on the handle and yeah you're dragged, not pulling it out.
Speaker 2:I don't know. What do I know? Yeah?
Speaker 1:so, you know, he had done some pretty serious damage to his hands and he did not look as if he was experiencing any pain and he didn't even look as though he recognized what was happening with his hands. Hmm, so they actually immediately ended up having to rush him in surgery for this, and While they were taking care of that, they had officers go to the home of his in-laws and check out his claims. When they arrived, they found that Barbara Ann was deceased and Dennis, although he was critically injured, had survived the attack. Oh nice, all right, big Dennis. And an hour after Kenneth had barged into the police station, they were having to wake Karen and inform her that her mother had been killed and her husband had been the one that killed her. Jesus, like, what more can this fucking do in this marriage? Like, are you kidding me, dr Phil? Couldn't fucking repair this marriage.
Speaker 2:You take the biggest gamble of your life and guess what? The house always wins.
Speaker 1:Always takes a cut.
Speaker 2:You know the most famous saying in gambling you gotta know when to hold them. Then you go, hit that buffet.
Speaker 1:No matter how flat pancake, it's always got too sad. So Naturally, karen was horrified, more than anything, confused. Ken loved her parents and in particular her mother, like why would he ever do something like this? Well, his grandmother for one did not believe that he had. Ken was the exact opposite of a violent person and she knew him better than anyone. So you know, grandma pulled through and got him the cream of the crop as far as defense attorneys in Canada go, oh yeah yeah, green span a little heavy hitter named Marlise Edwards from the Ruby and Edwards law office.
Speaker 1:Ever heard of them?
Speaker 2:Bay Street lawyers.
Speaker 1:But you know, marlis, she was a pretty good lawyer and in turn she hired Ronald Billings, who specialized in forensic psychiatry, and he determined that Ken was not experiencing any mental health issues. Naturally, since the murder he had been experiencing depression and when he noticed you know what he had done he was being held at the Toronto East Detention Center awaiting his trial and he was barely eating anything at all. They said that he lost like a remarkable amount of weight. But before all of this transpired he was fine and you know they tested him and he was expressing all of his normal reactions and emotions and Well, no mental health issues no mental health issues.
Speaker 2:No one likes a branker. It's courtroom psychologist if he suffers from no mental health.
Speaker 1:Imagine yeah, that's the dream. Set is the dream you are living the life, my man somebody putting a damn payment on a house at 22. No mental health issues on half of it. Okay, ferry tails what that is. So next, merylis would arrange to have a sleep lab Put together in a parole office at the police station. Okay, cool, she hired neurologist Roger Broughton to study Ken. He's not the cream of the crop like Marlis Edwards, if you know what I'm saying.
Speaker 2:Your budget on Edwards.
Speaker 1:He, you know he would study the eye movements and the breathing behaviors and basically what I learned, and now I think I'm just I'm right up there with Roger Broughton. There's four stages of non REM sleep before you go into aria okay so REM for anyone who doesn't know, which I'm sure everybody does that's. It's rapid eye movement, so Before being in this, you have to go through those four stages we just saying that, or you believe they are a real good band.
Speaker 1:I mean, I only know that one. Oh, they are a terrific. Yeah, I mean the song itself is great. Mm-hmm, I can't speak for the rest of their catalog might be one of those bands, right. Oh yeah, they did this one.
Speaker 2:Oh yeah, that's the Eagles to me.
Speaker 1:Oh yeah. Well, they also do every rock song ever like the Eagles are, like you see, like one of those infomercials on like in between.
Speaker 1:Yes, fucking late night court TV I call classic rock and then like and then this and this, and I'm like oh, oh, it's like just a pleasant surprise, and every turn of the corner. So four stages before our yeah, the deepest part, obviously, part four, yeah, and then after part four you go into your REM sleep. So sleep walking typically happens in the deepest part of non REM sleep, but you have to Like a stairway to send into that. But what they notice with Ken is that he frequently would jump from one to four and then from four to one, which is very abnormal. So you know he was going from essentially being in a deep sleep to basically awake Like wow, and it was batting back and forth like that. So this had to be taken into consideration.
Speaker 1:And as well, his grandfather on his mother's side used to sleep cook. He would get up in the middle of the night and he would grunt as he was doing it and its family knew not to wake him. He'd this man's fucking. I watched a reenactment and he was like baking like pork and fucking potatoes and shit, like you know how many people died back then from like fires.
Speaker 2:Yeah, because everybody was cooking. Yeah, like what?
Speaker 1:Yeah, do you know, skip the you sleep, skip the dishes I would love it if somebody would sleep, cook and then sleep, put it in Tupperware and put it away, and then I could just come home and warm it up the next day. Yes dad made dinner again, guys.
Speaker 2:Thanks, sleep walking dad. Sleep walking dad's the best.
Speaker 1:So you know the grunting that this grandfather would do and then, like, the family was like we can't wake him up because he gets really aggressive if you try to wake him up. But remember Ken was grunting when he was saying kids. Too many. Didn't just fucking come over to his in-laws and cook? That would have been way better. Yeah yeah, maybe tried to, would have been way better.
Speaker 2:Good hot, take Him making them. Food was way better than that, and almost double murder.
Speaker 1:So you know, his defense was actually quite simple. They were gonna essentially plead insanity without being insane. So the actual defense was called non insane Antomatism okay got it, love it, which sleep walking does fall into this category. And you know Ken love these people. They were like his family and there was no money to inherit. There was no motive.
Speaker 2:What about the shame of like confrontation?
Speaker 1:They didn't know yet, right? If he's gonna kill anybody, kill your wife.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:New, you know what I mean. Like it's not like he fucking, yeah, like Karen, but Karen's fucking saying.
Speaker 2:Good, I'm killing it, Karen. You know they can't be killed. A lot of people don't know that Manager.
Speaker 1:He's here by the manager, but like he didn't even try to hide it, right, like he's fucking, yeah, the knife in his back seat.
Speaker 2:Their.
Speaker 1:DNA is everywhere. At the 80s I don't know if anybody cared about- the kids there. Yeah, like everybody witnessed it like it's not drove to the police station.
Speaker 1:Yeah, he went and fucking turned himself in. So Ken was held in jail for two years awaiting for his trial, and when he finally got before the judge, his defense attorney did a really good job of pointing out all these facts. And you know, going in with the sleepwalking defense, the main contributing factor to sleepwalking were exhaustion check. Personal circumstances whoa double-check, oh shit. And family history. Grandpa, pop a cook over here. You know what I mean? He's a cook. So other symptoms of a sleep disorder were sleep terrors, sleep talking, falling into a deep sleep, all of which can experienced, hmm. So she further went on to state that Ken had been since medicated For his sleeping issues with clonazepam, which is a sedative and it's also an anti-anxiety medication, hmm, and he was no longer sleepwalking or doing any fucking weird shit in his sleep, so he no longer posed a risk.
Speaker 2:They should have just let him sleepwalk in jail. See what happens. What if it was like you? Hops to his cellmates room.
Speaker 1:Oh, did you forget to look? I was sheeping.
Speaker 2:Excuse me um.
Speaker 1:I'm seepy, I'm just young and hip, he is 22. So the jury deliberated for nine hours and they came back with the not guilty verdict. Wow, the verdict would naturally be appealed, because in Canada we can do that Mm-hmm and imagine the double jeopardy movie. Here would just be. I think you can appeal in the States. No, it's double jeopardy.
Speaker 2:No, no, no, if you're guilty. No, an appeal is different than double jeopardy.
Speaker 1:Oh well, apparently you're a lawyer, double jeopardy is a retrial.
Speaker 2:It's being tried for the same thing. I appeal is not a different trial? I think it's appealing.
Speaker 1:That's correct For super spark. I just take all of your legal advice. That's right. We're no Marley's Edwards.
Speaker 2:I said that a million times while saying I would like to give a shout out to our editor, chris, who is now sitting with a giant book of legal terms, as he's holding the edit button. Skimming through can wait.
Speaker 1:I'm on Statute this has to say this is a patron. You get us raw.
Speaker 2:Oh yeah, we are, that's right.
Speaker 1:So, oh, you know, they would appeal this innocent verdict. It's not guilty. And it would be in 1992, the first year, I do believe, the blue jays won the world series you're correct. They would uphold his non guilty verdict and he was completely exonerated. Wow and Karen. Wow Stayed with him.
Speaker 2:He did not, she did, karen but they did end up divorcing.
Speaker 1:Some sources I read said that he was still gambling which is like, of course, I know. Like. Can you imagine just being like?
Speaker 2:Hey.
Speaker 1:So did you take your conass a panda? No, you're gambling with that too. I can't think that's a great choice, okay.
Speaker 2:Jesus.
Speaker 1:So you know, you're just probably picturing your demise as you're lying down. Wow, and Ken would go on to remarry. You have another five kids, cuz.
Speaker 2:Oh my god, he was sleep-banging. He got a lot of rest.
Speaker 1:He would even run to be a school trustee in Durham region.
Speaker 2:Okay, what wait?
Speaker 1:okay, go ahead, so you continue but as one of the silver servants in Durham would say in quotes Sleepwalking perhaps a medical thing, but not the embezzlement. He's got a hit that with a bingo bongo right at the end like boom, that's a good one. Yeah, and that is the rather notable case in Canadian history, the case of Kenneth Parks and the sleepwalking murder.
Speaker 2:Wow yeah, crazy, that is wild imagine being Karen's new husband.
Speaker 1:Like what.
Speaker 2:Yeah, you do anything, you want anything, yeah she's like are you cheating on me again?
Speaker 1:He's like did I kill your mom?
Speaker 2:Yeah, yes, I'm cheating on you and I'm pooping on the floor now I'm no longer making my way to the Turlet. I'm sorry, did I? Was it me that murdered your mother? Oh, no, that's right, that was that piece of shit I'm gonna yours I'm the good guy Dishes and the four pieces to use the Turlet.
Speaker 1:Just imagine like a world where that was like you're like you know what? I don't want to be husband.
Speaker 2:That's right. That's right, I've decided.
Speaker 1:I have actually been thinking on oh boy, I don't know what you're just into sitting down every time I pee. Okay, it's okay.
Speaker 2:Don't do.
Speaker 1:I mean, you're within your rights and you know what. You don't even have to tell you that I do it at night.
Speaker 2:Okay, my whole life I've always sat when I'm in the middle of the night.
Speaker 1:This is the section of the podcast that answers to questions. Never so my parents, and this is way too much information. I'm sorry for anybody that has to listen to this, but you guys, I mean you're here on On purpose.
Speaker 2:Yeah, you're a bunch of creeps and weirdos. We love you.
Speaker 1:So my daughter, like my kids, I mean I didn't think I was super strict with their Diets until they go to my parents house and they always come home sick because my parents like how many desserts do you guys want? Oh, yeah, do you want juice or no, you just want. Okay, you want juice in your chocolate milk, right? Do you want pop on top of that or ice cream in the pop?
Speaker 2:You know what? They were really good. They didn't have any pop. We just had a lot of juice but no pop. So I'm not them prime. Well, they'll prime the water, no, the energy drink.
Speaker 1:Not the energy drink, it was the hydration. Yeah, that's just water, it's not. It tastes like pure sugar. Oh yeah, it tastes like shit, yeah, so.
Speaker 2:But it's not the energy stuff. My nephews love that shit. It's so bad. It's all that guy. Logan Paul, my man.
Speaker 1:So my parents, because we were there for dinner and by the time I got there my brother had already given my daughter like three lollipops. She got like my mom was like, do you want ice cream or do you want cake? And then my daughter's like, can I have both my mom's? Like you, betcha.
Speaker 2:Yeah, your daughter seems pretty fucking goo.
Speaker 1:But you know what here's? The deal is that she can't handle that kind of stuff right. So she slipped over at their house and she had a sore tummy.
Speaker 2:Red guy.
Speaker 1:And she maybe, who knows, she could have fucking ingested anything, nobody knows, nobody knows, it's Thunderdome over there.
Speaker 1:But she went into the bathroom and she relieved her sore tummy and then she went back to bed and my dad got up in the middle of the night and I was like, when I went to pick her up the next day, my dad's like, and I was like, what's going on? Like what happened? He goes. Well, you know how all the kids think that grandma's the best. Grandma takes him out and grandma does all this fun stuff and blah, blah, blah, and I'm like, yeah, and he's like grandma's like a concert and then like I'm like the person that sets up the concert and has to clean up the concert.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that's right yeah.
Speaker 1:He goes, so I go into the bathroom. Last night it's the middle of the night so I don't even turn the light on and I sit down because it's middle of the night and my dad's justifying to me why he sits down when he pees and I'm like there's not a fucking planet that I would want to know this information.
Speaker 2:I'd like to talk to your dad. I'd like to have another opinion.
Speaker 1:Okay, well, you fucking link up with him.
Speaker 2:He seems to be where I'm at.
Speaker 1:Well, here's the deal is that my daughter had expelled and just it had gone everywhere and he sat down and then he got up and he said and then I felt like wetness on my bottom, and then he went and he turned on the light and he realized by the light switch I guess Olivia had hit the light switch with her poopy hand and there was poop all over.
Speaker 1:Oh, oh, my God so he's like it's four o'clock in the morning. He jumps in the shower. He's like I literally had like a bristle patch trying to like scrub my body. He's like I poured bleach all over the toilet and so he gets all clean. He cleans up the toilet and everything and then he goes out and he hadn't turned off the or hadn't cleaned the light switch. He got on his hands.
Speaker 2:Oh, that's terrific. I live my girl. That's awesome.
Speaker 1:Well, that's what you guys get Like, and that's every time we go over there now and they're giving her like three desserts. I'm like you're fucking sleeping here tonight.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that's right.
Speaker 1:It's a goddamn disaster. When they come home, they sleep over there. All three of them come home. They're miserable because they've crashed. It's like I would love to say. I felt bad, but my mom was laughing so hard at this thing, that had befallen my poor father, that she couldn't even catch her breath when she was talking to me, like it was to the point where she had tears coming out of her eyes.
Speaker 2:Do you love when adults like and your mom, I would just assume. Like you know, it's like a lady right Like, and so when, like, classy people laugh about farts and poops and pee, it tickles me to no end.
Speaker 1:Do you know that my dad had to? And this was years ago, but he still brings it up because it's traumatizing for everybody. He had to go for a colonoscopy. I had a colonoscopy when they check your prostate. Oh, prostate exam.
Speaker 1:Just two fingers the doctor said something to him along the lines of like well, because you haven't been here in however many years you've earned yourself. And my dad said when he was retelling the story later, he's like. The man had hands on him like shack and my mom was sitting beside him in the doctor's appointment and they had to ask her to leave because she was crying. That's hysterical.
Speaker 1:And he's like my dad's, like going through like this actual medical procedure. My mom was like I couldn't catch my breath. I was trying so hard to get it together. She had to go the hallway and the retelling of the story was a bloody nightmare for her. Oh, man.
Speaker 2:But it's like I never really bought into you know sugar, making kids hyper and stuff, because I don't really think it's like actually sugar. I think it's all the fake shit that surrounds it and my nephew's got that right now that they're monitoring what he eats and it's a lot of red dye stuff. Oh yeah, and it's funny because my brother told me and I laughed because it was kind of funny, but it also just took me back a second. But ketchup chips are red, right here again and he's like I don't know, every time you hold a bag of ketchup chips I just feel sad. I'm like well, that's kind of everybody. When you polish off a big bag of chips, you don't usually feel pretty funny. But like I'm, my sister-in-law, like you and like everybody, especially if you've got young kids is super stressed. So I'm like anything I can do, take your, you know anything I can make that up to me.
Speaker 1:Yeah Well, you know, like go fuck yourself.
Speaker 2:That's right, that's right, and so I'm like you know, let me do some shopping or whatever, and so I'm doing the stockings. It is so hard to avoid shit. I know Crap candy and shit for stockings. I know it's everywhere and it's, and the worse it is, the cheaper it is.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it's very, very true. I tried to steer I don't think I really got them too many candies this year Did a lot of coloring books I mean, your nephews are older than coloring books right yeah, Very intense. Yeah. So I mean it's kind of I don't know. I mean, did they do the? Okay, everybody, any kids, are listening to this. First of all, what?
Speaker 2:are you kids listening to?
Speaker 1:First of all, you're a terrible parent, but like did they do the elves?
Speaker 2:Right, I know they don't have an elf on the shelf. No, they used to. I think my brother killed it. I think they had a serum, I think because it has to be official. Right, Like you can't just leave.
Speaker 1:What the fuck are you talking about?
Speaker 2:The elf on the shelf. You kill it, well, or you have to I don't know end its reign somehow. It's not a zombie, well. I mean because they were like, hey, where'd Rick go?
Speaker 1:Rick went back to the North Pole. He's going to go with another kid next year. You're fine, oh yeah.
Speaker 2:Yeah, like that. But then they're like I don't know, maybe it was a big, elaborate story For the boys your brother murdered an elf on the shelf. Well, I don't think I actually murdered it.
Speaker 1:Christmas is ruined. It's never that scary. Everything really scary We've got. I'm so stupid that I have a full.
Speaker 2:Do you do an elf on?
Speaker 1:the shelf. Are you kidding Psycho? My sister does it too. An elf, I have an elf friend, and then I have three elf babies.
Speaker 2:You are a psycho.
Speaker 1:Two toddlers and a newborn Boy.
Speaker 2:even your elf on the shelf is stressed.
Speaker 1:Yes, yeah, no kidding, every fucking night there's a.
Speaker 2:YouTube channel you can go to. It's like if you go on YouTube and you type elf stuck in the TV, oh, yeah, I saw that there's an elf on the shelf. You just run the video.
Speaker 1:My kid would fucking. She would tear that apart in no time at all. Like she's like fake. She's like. I've already looked up at Santa's re-elan and I'm like, okay, can you do me a favor and not talk about it in front of your fucking simple brothers? We've got Max here. He's going to believe it until it and he's like fucking 15.
Speaker 2:You know what, mom? I'm done my own research. Okay, I do my own research.
Speaker 1:Okay, you sure I've heard of it All right.
Speaker 2:Why don't you stop being a sheep?
Speaker 1:A sheeple. I'm woke, mom, I'm woke, all right. Well, I don't really know if we even really touched on true crime in this episode.
Speaker 2:There was some crime.
Speaker 1:I mean, we've learned where Jesus was born, which is pretty important right about now.
Speaker 2:Yeah, In a Costco.
Speaker 1:In a Costco In a major. In a major. Yeah, All right guys. Thanks, sir. Please don't end your membership.
Speaker 2:Yes, actually double it.
Speaker 1:And the next one we're going to be doing. This one was fun because the next one we're doing is going to be poly class, and I have read the books.
Speaker 2:I have, and by read the books you mean.
Speaker 1:Listened to someone else read it, but she does voices, so nice Kind of counts.
Speaker 2:Nice, like me reading to my nephews. And then Batman came in here. I can't. Oh no, it's the Joker. Run everybody. What book is that? I don't know. I would love to read it, batman goes.
Speaker 1:It's called Batman's Suck Metro. These skinny jeans are what they were made. All right, guys. Thanks for listening. Bye, and we'll see you soon, next time again.