The Turpin House of Horrors Part 1

 David and Louise Turpin, met through the church when Louise was barely a teenager. Despite her father, telling the two that the age gap was inappropriate, and the two should not date, Louise's mother felt as though David was a catch, because he came from a 'good Christian family'. When David was 25, and Louise was only 16, he would disguise himself as her father, so that he was able to sign her out of high school. Once the two were married, they had big plans, to have 12 children, Louise considered the ability to carry children, to be a 'gift from God' and she planned to carry as many as the good Lord would let her.... what could possibly go wrong? 

Chapters

• 0:04 Reddit Am I the Asshole?
• 13:09 Beauty Queen and the Hot Lawyer
• 20:11 Dating Beauty Queen and Attorney Ryan
• 24:50 Family Bonds and Legal Aspirations
• 34:54 Beauty Queen and the Legal Aspirant
• 44:31 Struggling Relationship and Unwanted Advancements
• 54:49 Legal Drama and Romantic Woes
• 1:03:43 Veneers, Dentures, and Office Drama
• 1:14:05 Hypothetical Jokes and Real Dangers
• 1:24:24 Fatal Confrontation and Police Interrogation
• 1:35:57 Interrogation Room Revelations
• 1:42:58 Interrogation Room Ballet and Confession
• 1:51:37 Conviction and Legal Drama
• 2:02:40 Sexual Allegations and Relationship Trouble
• 2:06:11 Tragic Case of Shana Hubers
• 2:16:53 Home Renovation Plans and Video Filming

Transcript

Lynn: 0:04

Welcome to Everything Scary. My name is Lynn and I'm here with my co-host local celebrity, Sorry, sorry, international celebrity. Thank you, Matt McClain.

Matt: 0:12

Hello, hello.

Lynn: 0:13

Every Tuesday we release a new episode, mostly true crime, but we've also been known to cover a pandemic, a haunting, a super mad, super strong chimpanzee. We'll cover anything and everything scary. Please rate us five stars and join us on Instagram at Everything Scary Pod. Here we go. Okay, here we go. We're back in action. So this is a case that was suggested by one of our Patreons, Jenny.

Matt: 0:41

Jenny C. I have her on my list as Jenny C From the block, or Jenny Craig. I have her on my list as Jenny C From the block, or Jenny Craig? Yeah, no for sure, and does all the Gens that I know.

Lynn: 0:54

Jenny Craig's just trying to like weasel her way in here. Like you know, you can lose a few.

Matt: 0:56

I'm like Jesus. Hey guys, I've been watching some of your social Love the content, but I can help you guys.

Lynn: 1:05

I mean how?

Matt: 1:05

about New Year, New you. What do you think? Wouldn't you like to be here longer to see the fruits of your labor come to fruition?

Lynn: 1:09

and enjoy your successes. We are on to you, Jenny C.

Matt: 1:13

I want to thank Heather B.

Lynn: 1:14

Whoa, you're just jumping right into the thank yous, damn right.

Matt: 1:16

Get in there. I'm a big thank you guy. It's on my Matt to thank list. I believe it is Mary Louise P. That's right. Which did you ever watch the show Weeds?

Lynn: 1:28

I was thinking Mary, is it Mary Louise Gallagher? Mary Catherine Gallagher?

Matt: 1:32

I was thinking Mary Louise Parker.

Lynn: 1:33

Oh, okay, I don't know who that is.

Matt: 1:35

Super hottie TV superstar Allison S, want to give her a shout out. These are all of our new Patreon members You're just jumping in. You should say that Allison asked if you have a kidney, so thank you so thank you for signing up and subscribing, and we do a couple of these every chance that we get, so we are a little behind in the last one that we did over the holidays. I missed Asian Becky. Oh my God, you're such a fool. How could you For?

Matt: 2:03

all of our Patreon members we have a Patreon only Facebook page which my sister is on. She is, yeah, We've allowed my sister.

Lynn: 2:10

She got mad at you about Asian Becky.

Matt: 2:12

Yeah, she went and told my mom that I had left out Asian Becky. My mom's like did you leave out Becky? And I'm like who the hell is Becky? She's like Asian Becky. And I'm like, oh yeah, mom was like, well, I didn't want to say that part because it kind of sounds racist. I'm like, yeah, it does, but that's her name.

Lynn: 2:28

She says that Her name is Asian.

Matt: 2:29

Becky. She's like, oh okay, well then it's okay. Your mom's like she's whispering to you.

Lynn: 2:36

Yeah, she's like is there an Asian?

Matt: 2:38

Becky, that you are aware of your dad on down there clan meeting in the house. Jesus, uh, but yes, and the photo, if anybody is listening that is on our patreon and has not seen it. Please go to our patreon only facebook page. Uh, you do have an invite and see this picture of asian becky. Just a young kid, unimpressed with matt shit super unimpressed, like a childhood photo big bouffant, beautiful dress and just frowny face am I crazy to say I looked a little bit like a mullet?

Matt: 3:09

uh, no, not crazy. There was some discussion of it was if it was in the mullet family and I believe, if it wasn't a direct mullet, it was in the.

Lynn: 3:17

It was definitely a cousin yeah, cousin of mullet so before we get started, in today's case, we're going to try something new, and this is actually. I got a DM on Instagram.

Matt: 3:27

Whoa dick pic.

Lynn: 3:28

Yes, and I'm leaving my family now.

Matt: 3:30

Nice, it works, guys, dick pics work, they do. This is the one example.

Lynn: 3:35

Guys, girls love dick pics. There's nothing more that we dream of than just seeing your veiny dick. If I can go in on a, limb and get you one step further.

Matt: 3:46

an unsolicited is probably the way to go. Why discuss it first and expect it when you can just unsolicited?

Lynn: 3:55

Go in hard is what I, or flaccid, I don't know. I'm not sure what the appeal is. Either way, is it?

Matt: 4:00

illegal to send an unsolicited dick pic? It should be. It should be Because, essentially, sending a dick pic is flashing somebody, is it not? Yes, yes, it is so I mean, I don't know, before I was married that part perfectly clear.

Lynn: 4:16

I was on like Tinder or something. And so there's this one guy that I met once and like he was, he's from around here actually. It was when I lived in Bradford, though, and he sent me like he didn't send it unsolicited, but it was like a Wednesday morning and he's like do you want to see my nudes? And I was like I'm actually pretty okay right now.

Matt: 4:34

Yeah.

Lynn: 4:34

I haven't even had lunch yet. And he sent me back a sad face, like he was like.

Matt: 4:40

Oh, my God.

Lynn: 4:45

Like there's nothing less appealing.

Matt: 4:45

Instantly, I'm picturing this sad little fellow with his dick in his hand. Yeah, a nude sulker.

Lynn: 4:49

What am I going to do with this now? Oh my God.

Matt: 4:52

I'm taking all these pictures of my ween. I got different angles. He's got a ring camera, got a little top hat on it for formal settings, just in case I need to take a dick pic at a wedding or a funeral.

Lynn: 5:05

Oh God, but yeah, no, like. If I mean, if you're going to send a question saying do you want to see my nudes, At least stand by it. Yeah, don't be just like all right.

Matt: 5:15

Yeah, no, be like. Hey, totally get it, it's Wednesday morning.

Lynn: 5:17

Yeah, maybe on a fucking Friday, thursday some call it Friday Junior Maybe then?

Matt: 5:23

Friday, Thursday, some call it Friday Junior Maybe. Then I mean look, the dick pics are here. When you are ready for them, you let me know, because there will be an avalanche.

Lynn: 5:29

You know, I heard this once and I think it's very and I think guys should really listen to this piece of advice. All right, I'm listening. Majority of the time, guys get horny and then they have sex.

Matt: 5:42

Yeah.

Lynn: 5:42

Girls get horny during sex.

Matt: 5:44

Oh.

Lynn: 5:45

You're not just like, ooh, look at that picture. Yes, right Now I've got to go back to crunching some numbers.

Matt: 5:50

You've got to preheat the oven. That's what you're saying.

Lynn: 5:53

Yeah, I don't think it's giving what a lot of guys think it's giving.

Matt: 6:05

I'm wondering if we think that, because we would like to see a photo of your boobs at any time, that we think our boobs is our wiener and we would just like you would want to see that like, because why wouldn't we?

Lynn: 6:10

want to see it. Can I see your boobs, and my boobs I mean can I see your, uh, your wiener boobs.

Matt: 6:16

Please do you mind, oh god.

Lynn: 6:21

Well, it is wednesday morning here yes, it is Wednesday morning here. Yes, it is, we're off to a rocky start, so yeah, so this was all because I was just trying to thank the person who suggested that we do this yeah. So we got a DM from one of our longtime listeners Her name is Taylor R and she thought that it would be fun if we went, you know, down the Reddit hole and pulled out usually one or two. Am I the assholes?

Lynn: 6:49

and we'll get your opinion on it. I just think that you have great advice, oh lovely.

Matt: 6:57

Take it from me, the 42 year old living in his parents basement. If I know anything, it is how to live your life.

Lynn: 7:04

Hey, listen, they say 42 is the new 18, so this is perfectly right.

Matt: 7:09

Hopefully it's the new 17, because I always go. I swear to God, as soon as I'm 43, I am out of here.

Lynn: 7:14

Oh God, okay. So I think, going forward, we're going to incorporate especially, you know, with some of the harder ones.

Matt: 7:20

Yeah.

Lynn: 7:20

I think JonBenet could have used like, especially after all that fucking John Mark Carr talk. Oh, yeah, just a little bit of a palate cleanser before you just go out into society.

Matt: 7:31

Oh, so this isn't necessarily true crime. It's not like I killed JonBenet Ramsey. Am I the asshole? It's like, yes, that's an easy one.

Lynn: 7:39

Also call the Boulder police.

Matt: 7:40

Yeah.

Lynn: 7:41

Yeah. So I don't know. You know what this one? I just kind of did on a whim because I was here until some god awful hour last night finishing up this script, and so I just pulled the first one up. That didn't make me feel uncomfortable.

Matt: 7:52

I like it.

Lynn: 7:53

So here we go, and I want you to give it some thought, don't just hop right in Okay, fine. So this one starts off. My fiance, 27 female, and I, 27 male, were together for almost nine years. I proposed to her a couple of years ago and I really loved her a lot. After my proposal, she started her weight loss journey and asked if we could set the wedding date only after she reached her goal.

Lynn: 8:18

I supported her through her journey and I was really proud of the progress that she made. She lost more than 100 pounds and while she still looked great before, she looked gorgeous after her journey. She was also upfront with me and admitted she was getting a lot more attention now and it was more than any attention she had ever gotten before in her life. It did make me somewhat insecure, and she even said that a really cute guy at the grocery store complimented her tattoo once and asked for her number, even though he could see her engagement ring. However, my fiance told me she rejected him, but one night, when she was super drunk, she admitted she sometimes gets dreams of getting a hot, tall finance guy oh finance that Finance guy that's really specific yeah.

Matt: 9:06

It's like looking for a man in finance.

Lynn: 9:07

He's like I'm actually a plumber. She's like sorry, I want numbers. Trust fund Six five. So he says but after seeing my reaction to that, my fiance instantly apologized. What did you think was his reaction going to be?

Matt: 9:21

Yeah.

Lynn: 9:21

He then says a lot of these insecurities were building up on me and I did speak with my best friend and asked her if this was normal and she said it wasn't normal at all and what my fiance was doing was not okay. Last week I admitted to my fiance I couldn't do it anymore. My fiance was shocked and apologized and started crying. I was surprised with her reaction because she did admit to wanting a better guy than me. My fiance told me that she was just proud of the progress that she had made and that I was the only one that she loved and would ever love.

Lynn: 9:54

She did kind of freak out a lot and asked if I was influenced by my best friend and I told her, yes, I did seek external advice because my insecurities were just eating me up inside my my fiance did tell me that she would never do it again. She was crying a lot and it looked like she was having a panic attack and I honestly was worried about her. So I just told her I would think about it, because I just wanted my fiance to calm down at that moment and I think I just shocked her a lot. However, the next day, when she did calm down a bit. I told her that my decision was final and that I just have lost a lot of love for her. Am I the asshole?

Matt: 10:27

Yeah, essentially you are, but I mean that's a complicated situation for sure. Yeah, I mean, if I'm a big once that bell has been rung, you can't unring it, you can't unring it. So the second that he heard that, I'm sure he fell out of love. Wow, that's a really big leap, you can't unring it. So the second that he heard that, I'm sure he fell out of love.

Lynn: 10:45

Wow, that's a really big leap. Like how do you fall out of love that quickly, especially on a drunken thing?

Matt: 10:51

Well, I think that you know, if that's, if you're already insecure. I guess, and you've got those thoughts already.

Lynn: 10:59

I mean when I'm drunk I think I'm a fucking pop star, though it doesn't make it happen the next day.

Matt: 11:06

Yeah, I think that that was probably something that was weighing on him, and then that was the confirmation that he needed. I think that he definitely could have handled it a lot better, and I don't necessarily think that she wanted to leave him. No, I mean I don't know what time relationship but it sounds like this this is more his insecurities and he wanted to bail before she broke it up with him wow, I mean, I don't know.

Lynn: 11:29

I think that you shouldn't. You shouldn't be like, your whole person shouldn't be based on one drunken comment yeah, 100 like I mean, I'm sure if you ask my husband about some of the things that I've said when I was drunk, he'd probably be like, oh yeah, she's evil, oh yeah that Mitch Cray. And the same goes for him, like I. Just, people say stupid shit when they're fucking drunk and people are like the true, you comes out when you're drunk, that's not true.

Matt: 11:56

I don't agree with that at all. That is not true.

Lynn: 11:58

I've seen texts that I've sent when I was drunk and I was like what on fucking planet earth were you trying to say?

Matt: 12:03

Right yeah.

Lynn: 12:05

So I mean, I don't think that's true. I mean in some situations it'll make it easier to say the truth, but it's not always.

Matt: 12:11

I thought it was going to be like she was on this weight loss journey and then, and then she cheated on him or she gained a bunch of weight and then he wanted to break up with her. That's what I thought it was going to be. And I'm like, oh, and then you're like is this guy the asshole? No, no, he did a great thing.

Lynn: 12:24

Yeah, no, no, no. This is pretty cut and dry actually. Yeah, so I don't know, I don't think that ending an engagement of a relationship of nine years based on something but again, like you said, probably he it was something that was probably building up for this entire weight loss of hers.

Matt: 12:39

And no matter what she says, you can't go back, no matter what she says you can't go back. His mind was made up, unfortunately. So what's her deal now? Where's she at? What's her? What's she saying? Can I, can your boy holla?

Lynn: 12:49

Should we? Okay, you know what? Actually, as soon as we're done with this episode, let's follow up with this poor guy. Yeah.

Matt: 12:54

Send him a response.

Lynn: 12:56

Hey, so really sorry about your broken engagement.

Matt: 13:00

Can we get what is she up?

Lynn: 13:02

to Do? You have a pet.

Matt: 13:04

Do you have a pet?

Lynn: 13:06

So let's get into today's case.

Matt: 13:07

All righty.

Lynn: 13:09

A lot of the information that I got from this case I got from actual court proceedings. So there was a bail hearing in 2014, and then there's two trials. One will be in 2015, 2018. And I also got some information from 2020.

Matt: 13:25

Whoa the show or the year the show? Okay.

Lynn: 13:28

An ID documentary called Signs of a Psychopath.

Matt: 13:31

Oh nice.

Lynn: 13:32

The episode was called I'm Not your Typical Murderer, I'm not your typical murderer. I'm a fun murderer.

Matt: 13:39

So no is it cool mom, I'm a cool murderer.

Lynn: 13:42

I got a lot of uh unfortunately from uh legacycom, which is obituaries.

Matt: 13:49

Oh.

Lynn: 13:49

Uh, law and crime, and the best documentary that I saw on this is the two-parter that was done by the first 48.

Matt: 13:55

Oh yeah, janie, okay, I never watched that show.

Lynn: 13:58

So here we go. It's all the time I should, should get into it. Yeah, but you're too busy watching 90 Day, which apparently is on 24 hours a day, seven days a week.

Matt: 14:04

There are so many different. I am on right now. What I just finished yesterday was 90 Day Fiance, the Last Resort Between the Sheets, which is so far beyond the 90 Day proper. Like the flagship episode, this is couples that are on the rocks.

Lynn: 14:24

So they're just fucking all the time and you watch it.

Matt: 14:26

No, they're all broken up in real life. I follow them all on Instagram. Of course, so they're all I know and even like friends of friends and stuff online and stuff like people that have one episode.

Lynn: 14:33

So why is it called Between the Sheets?

Matt: 14:35

Because it's them reacting to the show. So they watch the show on a screen behind them and then they're Kill me.

Lynn: 14:42

I would rather die than see that.

Matt: 14:43

It's the great. It's like if you and I were talking about a podcast. How stupid we think true crime podcasts are and how dumb we think true crime podcasters are not realizing that you and I, in fact, are true crime podcasters. That is the level of lack of self-awareness that this show exhibits, and it's just the greatest.

Lynn: 15:05

Sometimes I try to listen back to episodes and I'm like, oh, I know what's coming up here. I don't want to listen to myself say that Skip, skip, skip skip.

Matt: 15:11

I can never.

Lynn: 15:14

So I do need to take a second here, because I would be remiss if I didn't mention and I said this to you earlier, but one of the people that I'm going to be speaking about in this episode.

Lynn: 15:25

I tried to reach out to her and ask her a question and get like an actual answer, because I don't like putting out things that I'm not sure are true. Yeah, and I received a response back. Let's just say that you know, she's absolutely had enough of this case. It happened in 2012. So I mean, it's been 14 years of her life now and she's kind of so. Basically, her role in this whole thing was that she just kind of played a flirty back and forth with our main guy in this and they were supposed to meet for their first date and that never ended up happening. Okay, really, it was so small. I did tell her that I would take out her name, where she is from, but I am going to be referring to her as, uh, the beauty queen, because she was a beauty queen oh jackpot so, uh, yeah, I mean she's obviously innocent.

Matt: 16:15

I mean we don't have to go.

Lynn: 16:16

Well, she is actually innocent, rest my case, your honor but she, uh, yeah, I guess she's had like death threats and stuff, which is so bizarre to me because she really didn't have anything to do with it.

Matt: 16:28

I don't know why anybody but the internet's a fucked up place I know, could you ever imagine yourself like like writing on somebody, like like you should kill yourself for, and like could you imagine typing that ever? Not I like under any circumstance.

Lynn: 16:42

I know there is nothing that someone could do to make me say something like that. I just don't understand it. I know, furthermore, cannot understand what angle somebody would be approaching this at to say this to this woman because she didn't even meet with the guy that she was supposed to meet with Right right yeah. So it's very bizarre, but I mean, everybody is a little bit fucked up in their own way, I guess.

Matt: 17:04

And we love judging. Yeah, why have the facts?

Lynn: 17:07

Yeah, why have the facts? That's exactly right, like Hanson says, in an oom-bop. It's gone. You don't want to fucking squander this moment?

Matt: 17:14

Do they say that in an?

Lynn: 17:15

oom-bop. Oom-bop is a fragment of time, Matt. It is Is that what that is all about. In an oom-bop. They're gone In an oom-bop. They're not there.

Matt: 17:22

Oh my God, I just thought it was something like a non-sickle First and foremost. Wow All right. Lyrical geniuses.

Lynn: 17:30

But I mean, I'm not here to debate the talents.

Matt: 17:33

Oom-bop. It's gone in a doom-bop, yeah it's really good.

Lynn: 17:39

You have some many relations in this life. Only one or two will last. Oh my God, yeah.

Matt: 17:46

Okay.

Lynn: 17:46

So, anywho, yeah, so this beauty queen that I was speaking of had initially set a time with the fellow that we'll get into in a moment for 9.30 on the day that they were supposed to be meeting up. So this was on October, the 12th of 2012.

Matt: 18:00

That is like for a date, right, that's a late date. Is he Europe?

Lynn: 18:05

He's 23 at the time oh okay. He's 29,. So like yeah, right, so that's still it's early for them.

Matt: 18:13

They are wiling out. They still pregame before going to the bar, probably.

Lynn: 18:15

I know like it's 11.14 now and I have to start making dinner. So yeah, they're going to meet up at 9.30 pm, but due to other obligations they had to kind of push it out a little bit and they decided they were going to meet closer to 10 or 10.30. Okay, she had shown up for her date and was waiting. The man that she was waiting for was an extremely handsome 29-year-old attorney who had just recently opened up his own practice in Ohio.

Matt: 18:42

Damn it.

Lynn: 18:43

His name was Ryan Poston, and when I say this guy is good looking.

Matt: 18:51

Yeah, I could tell by. He didn't have to come back to it. I could tell when you were like, extremely Like, there's 19 syllables in extremely Listen here. Okay, a-c-u-s-t-r-e-m-l-e-h. Holy shit, that's like a guy from a soap. That's an attorney on a soap opera.

Lynn: 19:08

Um.

Matt: 19:09

Oh my.

Lynn: 19:11

Lord, I just fell in love, could you?

Matt: 19:13

imagine being uh needing a public defender and that drink of water rolls through. I would be like whatever you say I would like to plead my love for you.

Lynn: 19:23

How can we postpone this so we can talk more than normal?

Matt: 19:26

I would like to join you in this jail cell.

Lynn: 19:31

So yeah, so this is Ryan Poston. Good looking dude, but sadly, on this Friday night of October 12th, it would appear as though the beauty queen was being stood up. Oh no, by the hot lawyer beauty queen was being stood up, oh no, by the hot lawyer.

Lynn: 19:47

But when I say it would appear as though, because it was only you know, it would seem that way from her sitting there in that moment because, the person that she was supposed to meet that day would have never been there, because he was actually, uh, lying dead on his dining room floor, oh, at the time that he was supposed to be meeting the Speedy Queen.

Matt: 20:04

I wonder if she was like what? Yeah, he better have a good fucking excuse for making me wait.

Lynn: 20:11

One of the documentaries I watched. They were like so were you like? What the hell? Like, what are you doing? She's like well, you know I'm a girl, so like I was getting, I was getting annoyed, but like the one and I think it was law and crime, maybe they made her reenact everything, so she's like sitting at the bar and then like looking at the door and then they're like by 1030, she had reapplied her makeup and she's like in the bathroom Reapply your makeup. I was like that she must be like come on.

Matt: 20:39

How long do you wait? Not an hour.

Lynn: 20:41

Well, she ended up leaving pretty close after 1030. So an hour. Well, she ended up leaving pretty close after 1030. So I think like they decided like 10, 1030. So I don't think she was waiting around for two, two Half hour tops, and then I'm out of there. Oh, as a beauty queen.

Matt: 20:51

Oh, a beauty queen, five minutes. You don't have to wait Four minutes. I would leave when the date's supposed to start, because if you're not early for me, the beauty you basic, you broke, you burnt.

Lynn: 21:02

You always do say that about yourself, yep.

Matt: 21:09

If you're not waiting there for me the beauty queen.

Lynn: 21:12

I'm like Matt say, king, he's like no.

Matt: 21:14

No. You can't tell me what to do.

Lynn: 21:18

You're not my real mom and you never will be. So you know, the way these two had started talking was that Ryan had sent her a request on Facebook. Now listen, ryan is kind of and I mean that because there's two other, there's two females in this story. Both of these, you know, talking ships. What are they called?

Matt: 21:37

Situation ships Situation ships yeah. Talking ships, I'm thinking like two ships being like. What do you think of this water? Pretty, pretty wavy. There's an iceberg Fun in the ocean. Eh, A little salty for my day.

Lynn: 21:53

But yeah, ryan had met both of these women through messaging them on Facebook, because he saw a picture that he liked.

Matt: 21:59

Oh, the joys of being a good looking guy. Imagine just friending people.

Lynn: 22:03

If I got that guy, I'd be like this is a catfish. There's no way, it's not. I'd willingly be catfished?

Matt: 22:11

I would. I'd be like I don't care. This is how people get catfished. I get it. I love you.

Lynn: 22:16

The person shows up, it's actually a potato.

Matt: 22:18

Yeah, I'm like hello Ryan.

Lynn: 22:22

So, yeah, so he had, you know, seen her on Facebook, the beauty queen, and he sent her a message and you know they had a friend in common which was actually Ryan's step cousin.

Matt: 22:34

Okay.

Lynn: 22:37

And they started talking back and forth and she said like he was really funny and he was obviously very intelligent, and they kind of hit it off. They had great banter. So they arranged to meet and you know, sadly that meeting would never come to fruition what kind of banter would you have with a beauty queen?

Matt: 22:51

like what are your talents? What would you? Uh, do you have any advice for a piece in the middle?

Lynn: 22:57

did you ever see that one? Oh my maps, the access to maps, such as the americas and such as here as the uh is that just filler words like is that?

Matt: 23:07

did someone train her to just like say she just panicked yeah, no, I would have panicked um I think it's just, yeah, just starting to fill the gaps, because that dead air would have been, although a lot better than such as um the maps, and people don't have a budget for maps such as the Americas and so forth and such as oh God such as. And I'm just watching Mario Lopez.

Lynn: 23:31

Pretend like he knows what the fuck is happening. Yeah, so I would have been like you're smart.

Matt: 23:39

You know what? I think we found her. Did you guys see her?

Lynn: 23:43

answer. Do you hear how many times she said such as oh my God she must know what she's talking about. Wipey Switch out that such as and put hence in there somewhere Hence forth, yeah, hence forth. So, after 1030 had passed, this beauty queen left, yeah, and she was confused. You know what went wrong?

Matt: 23:59

Well, she obviously saw my pictures?

Lynn: 24:01

No, it's definitely not her pictures. Like I was saying to you, I showed my husband her picture and he was getting something out of like a lower cupboard.

Matt: 24:17

And like he looked, and it was like he was one of those Looney.

Lynn: 24:19

Tunes characters where, like his eyes rolled out of his head but then he was like I could see that he was just like clamoring on to like pick out, trying to pick a flaw or something he's like, yeah, there's something weird about her chin. I'm like you just realized I was here, didn't you?

Matt: 24:28

He's like oh my God. She's like tall and beautiful, and he does hate that.

Lynn: 24:36

He says it. So you know we'll circle back to this date, but first I want to tell you a little bit about who this 29-year-old attorney is. His name is Ryan Carter Poston. Ryan was born on December 30th 1982. Boop boop, same age as you. Yeah, what is your animal? What is your like? 1982, what are you?

Matt: 24:59

Aries.

Lynn: 25:00

That's your zodiac sign, oh. There's a year, so I'm the rat, which is lovely. Yeah, but what are you? You don't know, no idea, okay, well.

Matt: 25:08

Maybe the dog. You just can't. You're the D-A-W-G.

Lynn: 25:11

Oh.

Matt: 25:12

Oh, oh, oh, oh, where my dog's at.

Lynn: 25:15

So yes, born December 30th to his parents, Lisa and Jay Poston. Unfortunately, they ended up getting divorced not long after Ryan was born, but these parents did something that was so incredibly rare and really remarkable. Lisa would move on after the divorce and marry again. Her second husband's name was Peter Carter, and together Lisa and Peter would have three daughters. So Ryan's sisters and their names were Allison, Katie and Elizabeth Would have three daughters. So Ryan's sisters and their names were Allison, Katie and Elizabeth. And this whole family would come together, including first husband Jay, and it was almost seamless, Like it almost kind of seemed like this is the way it was supposed to be.

Matt: 25:56

Oh, like when Demi Moore was married to Ashton Kutcher, better than that, and they would go on vacation with Bruce Willis and his new wife and their kids, yeah, yeah, kind of like that, but I think better.

Lynn: 26:09

Because you know Ryan would live full time with his mom and Peter and the girls. But his dad, jay, only lived up the street a bit and he said that he was always obviously just a phone call away, nice, and Ryan loved and respected both of his father figures so much he called them both dad and he would actually legally change his middle name so that it was Ryan Carter Poston, so he had his stepdad's last name and his dad dad's last name.

Matt: 26:35

Do you ever watch those videos of the step parent that adopts the kid for like Christmas?

Lynn: 26:39

It makes you cry.

Matt: 26:40

Like and it's always like a dad in like a football jersey or something like, kind of like a gruff guy. And then he gets like two words and he just like melts into it and the mom's like read the rest of it, dan. Read the rest of the card. What does it say? And he's like it's just nice to know that what we're doing is making an impact.

Lynn: 27:00

Your eyes are actually watering as you're telling the story. Holy shit, Okay well.

Matt: 27:06

But yes, that's, lovely.

Lynn: 27:09

So yeah, so he had both of his dad's last names, peter. His stepdad remembers when Ryan did this, like got his name legally changed, he came home and he just said to him this is who I am, so this is what I wanted to have. His sisters would actually refer to Ryan's biological dad, jay, as Uncle Jay, and they would celebrate all holidays and birthdays as one big family. During his high school years, though, peter and Lisa would take the kids to live in the Philippines and Europe. Jay said that during this time it was extremely difficult. Of course he was away from his only child, but the Philippines, they start celebrating Christmas in September.

Matt: 27:50

This is my Filipino fun fact, okay. As soon as September hits.

Lynn: 27:54

You know what I hope you are extremely sure of this because our editor is from the Philippines.

Matt: 27:59

Yep, if you're wrong, chris, you know it.

Lynn: 28:02

Chris.

Matt: 28:03

As soon as, like September, hits all the malls, stores, everything, it's shot right up until the end of December.

Lynn: 28:11

What happens when September ends?

Matt: 28:13

I hate you, you're going to wake me up Right? Is that what it is? Yeah?

Lynn: 28:21

Wake me up. Okay, so they were in the Philippines and Europe and Jay said, like I said, very hard time for him, but of course they were able to still maintain a good relationship. And I am going to read you half a quote right now from Jay Poston Okay, and at the very end of this episode, I'm going to bring it right down by reading you the whole thing. And at the very end of this episode, I'm going to bring it right down by reading you the whole thing. When speaking about his only child, Jay said since Ryan's birth, I gauged my well-being by his. My plan in life was I would always be with my son. I'm going to leave it there right now.

Matt: 28:55

Okay.

Lynn: 28:58

But that was his goal, right? Like he was like instead of trying to remarry and have more kids, he was like listen, I'm putting all my eggs in this basket. I just want him to be the best version of himself, and I want to be with him and give him 100% of me, and that's what he did. So when Ryan returned to America to say that he was in it to win it what the fuck? Who writes these scripts?

Matt: 29:21

I think you.

Lynn: 29:22

Yeah, it was me At like 3 o'clock in the morning To grips like uh, I think you.

Matt: 29:26

Yeah, it was me at like three o'clock in the morning was to say that he was in it to win. It is an understatement.

Lynn: 29:30

Oh my god, shut the fuck up doing what I don't know life. I guess he he was really, he was killing it. Oh, he, uh, craved knowledge. That's what his dad said. Is that he, uh, he just wanted to learn things. And he was like one of these guys that, no matter what the conversation was, no matter what the topic, he always had something valuable to contribute to a conversation.

Matt: 29:51

No, not just the useless storyteller.

Lynn: 29:52

Yeah, like not just like me. Like let's talk about Taylor Swift, people are like actually we're talking about politics. I'm like yeah, she likes politics.

Matt: 30:00

She's voted. She's voted.

Lynn: 30:02

So you know, like he was just, he was very easy to get along with and he was one of these people that when they walked into a room, he kind of demanded the room's attention.

Matt: 30:11

Right Commanded. The room's attention Demanded would be like look at me, get over here. He walked, he was so sweet he would walk into a room and say everybody, stop what you're doing and look at me now. Oh my God, all eyes were on us. This is embarrassing, hey, babe.

Lynn: 30:26

But he is really good looking. That's like with his face. He was demanding, so Ryan would fall. He would fall in line with his uncle, who was an attorney, and his grandfather, james, who had been an attorney for 54 years Whoa, and he set his sights on law. According to his parents, the sky was the limit for Ryan. He could have done absolutely anything he set his mind to.

Matt: 30:53

He would go to Salmon.

Lynn: 30:54

P Case. College of Law, which is a fucking medical, and it's the law school of Northern Kentucky University, oh shit. Well, what we got here is a case that can be dismissed.

Matt: 31:08

y'all know that's like more Louisiana Down here on the bayou, just us.

Lynn: 31:11

That's Louisiana, for sure. Yeah, that's right.

Matt: 31:12

That's right on the bayou.

Lynn: 31:14

So that's what Tripsy Rose sounds like. Now, all of a sudden, Really, oh my gosh. She's super Louisian.

Matt: 31:20

She got that kid yet, or where's she at with that?

Lynn: 31:22

Oh yeah, they just had their kid oh god, yeah, and I think there there was, I don't know. I just kind of caught the tail end of her saying that like the rumor that they have come to like child services or whatever has come to check out the baby is not true. I think that of course people are gonna lean, you know, say something like that.

Matt: 31:42

We just want to make sure the kids getting all our checkups. Oh my God.

Lynn: 31:46

Or maybe too many.

Matt: 31:47

We don't know.

Lynn: 31:48

Just, do you have the normal amount of checkups?

Matt: 31:50

Are you going to the bare minimum? You're the maximum. Where are we at?

Lynn: 31:53

Oh God, poor gypsy Rose.

Matt: 31:54

What a story with that dude and the.

Lynn: 31:57

Ken Uckler.

Matt: 31:58

Yeah, and then they was getting all tattoos and going to pro wrestling and then they made this new guy.

Lynn: 32:05

I got to say I really did not like her husband at all.

Matt: 32:08

He was just yeah, he seemed opportunistic, not opportunistic, but he just seemed like he wasn't. He loved the limelight, yeah, yeah.

Lynn: 32:28

Like he, he's always like trying to. He always seemed like he was trying to hide from the limelight and then they like went through a drive-thru and he's like you see, I got my car here's gypsy rose. Yeah, I don't know, I didn't like it very much, but who the fuck cares what I like? So, yeah, like I said, ryan was brilliant and, uh, he was just kind of a light in everyone in his family's life. His sisters absolutely had nothing but just adoring things to say about him. Ryan had a license to carry and he exercised that right. You know, I think this is so foreign to us so we kind of always get a little bit weird about it.

Matt: 32:50

I love it. A lawyer packing heat yeah, object this motherfucker, that lawyer too, yeah.

Lynn: 32:55

Like forget it. But yeah, so he owned multiple firearms. Firearms, yeah, it's like a really hot iron.

Matt: 33:04

I like it. He just carried it around. It's like.

Lynn: 33:05

Home Alone. He just put it in people's faces. He even had, like, on his bookshelf in his dining room. He had a whole bunch of different bullets and they like stood on end. It was just kind of like a display.

Matt: 33:17

Oh, that's lovely. Just loose bullets.

Lynn: 33:20

Used, actually no. So every day when he returned home, he would, you know, take his gun out of its holster and he would put it on his dining room table.

Matt: 33:29

As one does.

Lynn: 33:31

Is that what one does? I do it's like when.

Matt: 33:36

I'm moving my bra after a tough day at work I'm like, oh, it's so good to get my holster off.

Lynn: 33:38

You just slide it through one arm and fling it onto the table.

Matt: 33:46

Yeah, so that's what he did.

Lynn: 33:47

He was a passionate gun owner, which I think is fine if you're responsible with it. Right In 2009,. While he was still in law school, he met a girl named Lauren Worley and the chemistry was instant. She was also going to law school at the same school as Ryan, so the short form was Chase College of Law. She found the fact that Ryan carried a gun with him super hot.

Matt: 34:10

She always felt very safe, she said, when she was with him I mean a guy looks like anything he does is going to be super hot literally, if you had a nerf gun on him, I'd be like this is the hottest thing I've ever seen in my life yeah, he uh ran over a bunch of kittens and backed over them. Oh my god, stop it, stop it. I am flustered right now, like, yeah, you murdered your grandparents. Oh my God, stop it. What was he wearing when he was doing it?

Lynn: 34:29

Oh my God, I love it. That's classic. You guys can't see that, but he is fanning himself. I was yes.

Matt: 34:34

Very theatrical, like a southern belle, I do declare.

Lynn: 34:38

Yeah, you are a southern belle, thank you. Like about um, she is like I said, she always felt like she was safe and they were together for actually, like somewhere in between 18 months to two years and they lived together and they even got two dogs, uh, whose names were lily and max. That's cute. I've watched a couple interviews with lauren and she, first of all, is just still starry-eyed about him. She, she said and it's kind of sad actually, because she said she could not believe that Ryan wanted to date her. She's selling herself short because she's also gorgeous, right, but I mean, yeah, I just I don't know how I wouldn't think that person was human.

Matt: 35:17

Right, yeah, like. Oh my God, he can't be wanting to date me. Who that man dime that 10 with the smoldering eyes?

Lynn: 35:23

Does it say Calvin Klein somewhere near his feet? Because that looks like a walking ad to me, so she just felt as though he was so gorgeous, he's so smart, like really, and funny Right.

Lynn: 35:33

And he literally could have gotten anyone. But as young love goes and I imagine combining that with both of them being in law school, it all just became too much and the couple ended things amicably and Lauren said that in her mind and in her heart and she kind of felt like he felt the same, that this wasn't where it was going to end for them.

Matt: 35:53

Ooh, somewhere down the road.

Lynn: 35:56

She still held a space for him when she, you know, she always thought that was endgame. Was them back together when things were less hectic? And she always thought that was endgame. Was them back together when things were less hectic and they both matured. But sadly, obviously that's not going to be an option anymore. In early 2011, 18-year-old Shana Hubers would receive a friend request on Facebook from Ryan Uh-oh. His step-cousin, carissa Carlisle was a mutual friend between the two.

Matt: 36:23

Again with the step-cousin as the go-between.

Lynn: 36:25

No, this is always the one. Yeah, she was the mutual friend for Shayna and Ryan. The one for the beauty queen was one of his female friends who was also in the beauty pageant. World Arena Arena, yeah, yes, so yeah, this is his step. I'm sure you know what I do think I said that it was his step-cousin before, because that's such a random title for someone.

Matt: 36:52

I want to go to the Beauty Queen Arena.

Lynn: 36:56

Okay, yeah.

Matt: 36:57

I just want to go and hang.

Lynn: 36:59

Do you think that they Do? We have that kind of stuff here.

Matt: 37:01

Like there's fashion shows and stuff.

Lynn: 37:03

What would Miss Barry be like?

Matt: 37:06

Probably a smoker for starters and probably not like DeMaurier, probably driving up to Aurelia.

Lynn: 37:15

Yeah, like most people, just a bag. Just a bag of darts.

Matt: 37:22

Maybe a stroller.

Lynn: 37:29

You can't, a beauty queen can't have a kid. Yes, fucking asshole Anywho. So yeah, his step cousin was their mutual go-between. Ryan had liked a bikini picture of Shana from spring break, which as all good romances, do they had struck up a conversation.

Matt: 37:46

Which is fine. It just depends on how soon the picture was posted, Like. If it's in the last two batches, you're fine. Anything lower than that you can look, but don't touch, don't like, don't engage. It's creepy. We all know you're doing a deep dive, but you don't have to make it known.

Lynn: 38:05

You know what's great, though. If you ever like just creeping someone's Facebook, go back to like 2006. Like when Facebook first became a thing and just comment on one of their pictures and say I wish I was there.

Matt: 38:16

Oh, my God, or what happened? What happened to your face? You were so pretty back then. Just be a dick.

Lynn: 38:24

Just start liking random bitches. Oh my God.

Matt: 38:29

We would have had so much fun if I was in your life back then. I wish I was there to take you to prom.

Lynn: 38:36

You would have had the night that you deserve Just really weird, weird stuff, for sure. So Shana Hubers, like I said, she was only 18 at this moment that they started talking, but she was also very intelligent. People that knew her from high school said she was in mostly AP classes.

Matt: 38:52

AP.

Lynn: 38:53

Yeah, so in the States it's basically college level classes that high school students take, so that they can get ahead of their education.

Matt: 39:00

Wow, we have that in Canada. It's just called a nerd alert. No, I don't. I'm sure we have that.

Lynn: 39:06

What are you taking this year, grade 12, nerd alert.

Matt: 39:10

Yeah, I'm in a nerd alert program. Wow.

Lynn: 39:12

Oh, look at you, somebody's getting ahead of me. My bad. So Shana always almost got straight A's. Now I want to show you a picture of Shana too, because she is also very gorgeous.

Matt: 39:23

Really Okay.

Lynn: 39:24

And.

Matt: 39:25

Beauty brains, you know what Remind me.

Lynn: 39:27

To come back to what I want to tell you about inmate pen pals.

Matt: 39:33

Inmate. All right, I'll bet you, as a avid watcher of Love After Lockup, I know most everything about inmate pen pals.

Lynn: 39:41

I would be willing to bet I've sent the person you're talking about an email.

Matt: 39:47

I follow a ton of these inmate dating programs on Instagram and they're just. I'm going to start forwarding some of my favorites to you.

Lynn: 39:55

Please don't.

Matt: 39:56

Because they're like hey, what's up, I'm Rocco, I'm here in jail upstate New York for robbery. I get out in a year and I'm just looking for somebody to settle down with and I can share my stuff with. It's like you just stole a bunch of stuff.

Lynn: 40:10

You should have tons of stuff. Okay, so this is Shana. This is the picture that he liked.

Matt: 40:15

All right, oh, that's the actual one that he liked. Yeah, all right. Oh my God, like what is You're like boner alert? What is that all about? Wow, it is a weird picture. Just to like it, just it's not. It seems like it's like a gun to your head. Okay, can you pose for this bikini photo? What's pose, I don't care, just I'm taking the picture.

Lynn: 40:36

Yeah, put these high heels on. Yeah, like okay, Mom.

Matt: 40:39

Should I smile? No, oh, taking a picture.

Lynn: 40:42

It does actually look a little forced.

Matt: 40:43

Yeah.

Lynn: 40:44

But we're going to come to find out that Shana really loves herself, so she was probably not fighting it too hard. Oh okay, yeah. So she graduated from the University of Kentucky with a bachelor in science degree. She had made the Dean's List in 2010 and 2011. And she had completed an undergrad in only three years. Doesn't seem like that short of a time to me.

Matt: 41:04

Yeah, that seems like a long time. That seems like a long time for an undergrad. I don't know what program you're taking, but it seems like it's way too much for you. I don't want to sound like I'm judgy without all the facts, but it seems like a lot.

Lynn: 41:19

I don't hold on to that bikini body. She's actually very smart, but she's not great, so it's okay that we're saying this shit.

Matt: 41:25

Will you tell me more about inmate pen pals now?

Lynn: 41:27

I have to wait until the end because I don't want to give it away, even though I'm not doing a very good job hiding things At the end.

Matt: 41:33

I'm making a note here.

Lynn: 41:34

Do you know where we're going Like if you had to guess, you already know that we're losing Ryan, sadly.

Matt: 41:40

I'm assuming one of these attractive ladies has got to be the killer, but that is all that I am aware of.

Lynn: 41:45

Okay, well, let's find out.

Matt: 41:47

I like the halfway checkpoint. Well, yeah, what do you think so?

Lynn: 41:50

have you been listening or just looking at bikini pics? What do you think?

Matt: 41:54

I'm really excited for WrestleMania. I'm sorry, have you been on your phone looking at WrestleMania? Fun facts yes.

Lynn: 42:01

We have your super fly.

Matt: 42:04

Yeah, super fly, super killer.

Lynn: 42:07

And he's next to Matt's beautiful sister. She's so sweet and she sent. Well, she gifted Matt some serial killer spoons.

Matt: 42:17

Yeah.

Lynn: 42:18

But like serial with a C.

Matt: 42:19

Uh-huh.

Lynn: 42:21

And it's perfect Like there's two of them, and I was like this is so cute. They're going to be look so nice in the studio. The funny thing about just random spoons lying around, though, is that you do look like you have a crack cocaine.

Matt: 42:31

I assume that we do meth and heroin and coke and all the fun stuff.

Lynn: 42:37

Can you imagine just someone who doesn't know just coming in and we have a spoon?

Matt: 42:41

I'm going to bring a lighter and burn the spoon. Get some burn. Get some char marks on there, really authentic.

Lynn: 42:47

I kind of like tape them together in an X and put them beside the superfly, because I don't want to give anyone the message that this is a crack den.

Matt: 42:54

Yeah, I put them next to a superfly who was a pro wrestler in the eighties, who basically assembled and climbed the mountain of cocaine to fight.

Lynn: 43:04

I went cause we covered his case yeah.

Matt: 43:07

Dick.

Lynn: 43:08

And it actually when. The one thing I remember well, I remember who, what happened, but more than anything, I remember like near the end of his career and it just was him at an outdoor wrestling match and it was like there's like eight or nine people around him and they just kept over the loudspeaker. It was like super fly.

Matt: 43:27

Yeah.

Lynn: 43:28

And it just kept going and going and going. He's just walking around the ring and I was like this is a very sad ending to a career, and one of those people was you.

Matt: 43:36

Yeah, you know what I thought it was quite a fitting end.

Lynn: 43:39

Yeah, no he.

Matt: 43:40

I you know the thing that obviously the murder is the absolute worst part, but the celebration of him afterwards.

Lynn: 43:47

Yeah.

Matt: 43:47

You think of the families, right, and what you know, even if they're not pro wrestling fans, right. But you're flipping the TV. It's the 80s, it's the biggest thing You're going to and you stumble across it and you see him hanging out with like Mr T on SNL or whatever.

Lynn: 44:02

It is right Well that's the thing too, like Mr T on SNL or whatever it is right. Well, that's the thing too, and I don't. It was well over a year ago that we did this case, but one thing that comes to mind was that Vince McMahon went into an interrogation room, with police, with a briefcase of money, and then it was just all swept under their old rug.

Lynn: 44:21

As it happens, so yes, back to this rug. As it happens, so yes, back to this. She was in the midst of obtaining her master's degree at this time in 2011.

Matt: 44:33

Master's yeah, oh, my God.

Lynn: 44:36

So Ryan and Shana would meet for the first time on Shana's 20th birthday, which was April, the 8th of 2011. That's awkward, she didn't have a lot going on then.

Matt: 44:45

Yeah, you must, you're a loser, right, I guess Like, and there's nothing wrong, I'm a loser, I have no friends, no, but you know, I always say by choice.

Lynn: 44:58

You know it's like well, I'm not dating by choice too Well, to be fair, I mean. And then you were like friend podcast co-host, I mean, and I was like what the fuck?

Matt: 45:05

Yeah, you know, because we're friends. Co-host Jesus Christ. Sorry, really awkward.

Lynn: 45:14

So just for the record, like I said, Shana is beautiful as well on the outside. I'll post a picture of her but she does have big, beautiful blue eyes, she has long brown hair and she has have big, beautiful blue eyes, she has long brown hair and she has a big pretty smile with super white teeth, which is, I think, that when you're like 20, your teeth are always just white, though. Yeah, so clearly this is a match made in heaven, right? Super smart, super beautiful. Yeah, what could possibly go wrong?

Matt: 45:40

Nothing. Well, guess what? That's not this podcast, what the?

Lynn: 45:43

hell. So Ryan's friends would say that he really quickly lost interest in Shana, and yet their relationship would still go on and off for another 18 months.

Matt: 45:56

Ooh, that's tough.

Lynn: 45:58

So later on, text from Ryan to Shana would come out, as well as text from Ryan to his friends. Shana would come out as well as text from Ryan to his friends.

Matt: 46:16

Even Shana herself would message a friend and say that in regards to times that Ryan would try to end things with her, she would say he says he's only with me because I make him feel awful when I cry. Okay, look, I 100% sympathize with him on that. I know that that is wrong and you should never kind of string along, but 100% like that, as has that happened to you Generally, not specifically, but I mean.

Lynn: 46:35

You stayed in a relationship because someone made you feel bad.

Matt: 46:38

I think that you stay in things and try to work on them a little more because you don't want to hurt that person Matt hasn't smiled in 13 years. We're thriving. Yeah, I mean, you never want to make you never want to hurt anybody's feelings, I mean. In a relationship. I mean, if you're fighting sure you know try to go blow the belt.

Lynn: 47:01

Yeah, just literally, punch him right in the dick. That's what I always say. Just punch him right below the belt. Yeah, literally, just sting him a little bit, punch him right in the dick.

Matt: 47:04

That's what I always say. Just punch him right in the cock.

Lynn: 47:06

So yeah, so she was like to me, okay, and the fact that she's aware of this and she's still like let's carry on with this relationship, to me that would just be so awful.

Matt: 47:20

I feel that, yeah, you're probably manipulating the situation.

Lynn: 47:23

And for what?

Matt: 47:24

And then he's like hey, listen, I think we need to talk, Okay.

Lynn: 47:26

Yeah, what do you want to talk about? Nothing. It's like you're almost catfishing yourself because you're like, yes, you have this beautiful man who's smart, and like it's not going to get better.

Matt: 47:36

No.

Lynn: 47:38

It's not like he's already made the coffin, like there's no point. What are you doing?

Matt: 47:43

Yeah, why would you want to trap anybody and force anybody to do anything they're not into?

Lynn: 47:48

What's the best case scenario? He's just not going to ignore you one day.

Matt: 47:53

Yeah or you'll. You'll look over and all of a sudden he's going to look over you and the light will catch perfectly and you'll fall right back in love.

Lynn: 47:58

I mean, she's gorgeous, it's not your looks. Yeah, it must be your terrible personality, it must be your shitty personality. So you know, no one could deny that Shani Hubers was clearly infatuated with Ryan Poston. She tried everything she could think of to reignite that flame, however short-lived it had been in the first place, like it was like a match. So I'm not sure on the exact timeline where this comes into play, but at some point either. You know he gave her a key to just open up his condo door at one point. I don't think he gave her a key to like hold on to.

Matt: 48:38

Hey roomie.

Lynn: 48:39

Long term.

Matt: 48:40

Right. But, she had a key.

Lynn: 48:42

She had a key. That's the bottom line.

Matt: 48:44

Jesus.

Lynn: 48:47

And she would later tell friends that he'd forgotten to take it back. And she, you know, every now and then would just show up and she would just be naked on his couch when he got home.

Matt: 48:54

Well, that's not the worst thing I've ever heard, Okay listen.

Lynn: 48:57

This case is so.

Matt: 48:59

I've come into the studio. We have a couch right there. We have a couch right there. I've come to the studio 10 times. How? Many times have you been naked? Never.

Lynn: 49:04

You know what Fine.

Matt: 49:06

I hated here.

Lynn: 49:08

I was just going to be like putting pictures up, yeah, yeah.

Matt: 49:12

What is happening? What I?

Lynn: 49:18

thought last time you said I would be oh my, oh God. Yeah, that'd be a pretty picture, all right. So she would just go in, she'd be naked and like.

Matt: 49:26

Sometimes he'd be like okay can you put a towel down?

Lynn: 49:34

like, imagine being ryan, though, like 29 year old hot guy, he's got friends, tons of friends. How transparent would you have to be with your friends? Like, listen, hey guys, we're about to go in this door here. There's a 50-50 shot where you see someone's clams.

Matt: 49:50

Oh, my god, the clam. What kind of pose is she like in the stirrups? Or what's the thing for it's stirrups?

Lynn: 49:58

It's just dead eye with vagina.

Matt: 50:02

Oh my god, birthing position.

Lynn: 50:06

Okay, that is the equivalent of a dick bag.

Matt: 50:09

Yes, birthing position Just knees in the air, like you just don't care, hey, what's up. And then what do you say when they walk in? Do you even say hello? Could you imagine, though, what's up, hey?

Lynn: 50:23

what's going on? Aren't you in school? What's happening?

Matt: 50:27

Hey, hungry.

Lynn: 50:33

Did you put it down? It's my favorite thing you've ever said. So the thing is, ryan's apartment was over 80 miles away from Shana's oh, my god. So I did a couple calculations because I just want you to fully understand. So it's 130 kilometers, just over 130 kilometers, which would be from here, here in Barrie to Whitby.

Matt: 50:58

Oh my God, On the 401.

Lynn: 51:00

Like Niagara Falls. I looked up Buffalo, new York. Okay, that's 220 kilometers away from here, so it's like a pretty, like it's a good distance.

Matt: 51:09

So like an hour and a half.

Lynn: 51:11

Just to have your vagina on someone's couch. Wow Just take a cushion home with you oh my God, that is awesome.

Matt: 51:18

Does she watch TV, read a book? Is she on her phone? She's probably on her phone, just scrolling with her.

Lynn: 51:25

It's 2011, though. Like is that?

Matt: 51:27

No, that's not Blackberry, still no smartphone was 2009.

Lynn: 51:33

Good old farts phone, Farts phone. So in February oh God, I love this In February of 2012,. Ryan texted her after multiple times trying to break up with her. Hey, the heat's off in my apartment. You might want to use a blanket. He said and I don't know you know what conversation that this came, but he did text her in February of 2012 and said you can tell people that you broke up with me Like he was, like you know, fuck my pride. Tell anyone you want Just be gone.

Matt: 52:05

Yes.

Lynn: 52:06

So he just wanted to be able to peacefully let it die.

Matt: 52:10

Yeah.

Lynn: 52:11

But like everybody he knew and like even his messages to his friends were like he just he was trying to be kind, but like, at what point Is it like it's gone too far.

Matt: 52:24

I mean, trying to be kind is fine, but eventually you become an asshole because you are not being direct.

Lynn: 52:30

How could you not become an asshole right?

Matt: 52:33

Exactly. Somebody like this needs to be told hey, you can't just be like nah and kind of blowing it off. And blowing it off to be the nice guy to spare her feelings, I get that, again, I've been there. Blowing it off to be the nice guy to spare her feelings, I get that, again I've been there.

Lynn: 52:45

But you got to at some point be a bit of an asshole, so you're not the permanent asshole, right right and like you're wasting your youth with this person that you don't want to be with, just so that you cannot be an asshole. Like you got to also be selfish at some point too.

Matt: 53:02

Yeah, and you know this guy's a lawyer, so you'd think you'd be pretty good at these arguments and pleading a case and making statements.

Lynn: 53:09

That's actually a really valid point. I didn't even think about that. Imagine being one of his clients. Yeah.

Matt: 53:16

I'd be like wait, can you not even break up with your girlfriend?

Lynn: 53:19

I'm going to the fucking public defender so he even said to his step cousin. He said to her like I'm really worried about her, like he's like and I'm not just saying that to be like, you know, mean he's like I think like she needs actual clinical help. Wow, like he was very At least a robe or a house coat. A robe and maybe a good episode of Dr Fel could do.

Matt: 53:41

That's right, let's see.

Lynn: 53:43

So, like I said, just want to be able to leave things. He didn't want to hurt her, but he wanted out so very badly. It actually would have been easy for someone who didn't know either Ryan or Shana to figure out the dynamic of this couple just by looking at their text messages alone. In one message to his friends, Ryan would message his step cousin, Carissa, and said this is getting to be restraining level, crazy. She's shown up at my condo three times and refused to leave each time.

Matt: 54:13

Well, I mean, he is omitting the nudity.

Lynn: 54:16

Well, he at one point just went to his dad's house because she was there. He like packed himself a wee little bag, went to his dad's house and he was like can I just stay in my childhood room? And Jay was like you always have a room here.

Matt: 54:30

I would have been like look, dad, do you want to do a little apartment swap for a little bit? Oh Lord Now keep your keep your camera with you, dad. Oh my God. That's all I'm going to say.

Lynn: 54:40

But Jay said that he then listened to Ryan's phone beep like multiple times per minute all throughout the night.

Matt: 54:48

Wow, I like that ping.

Lynn: 54:49

Yeah, so you know, at this time now, ryan had finished law school and he was entering into his field Right out of the gate. He had actually joined on as a partner to a law firm in Hamilton County, but something within his partnership ended up going horribly wrong Hamilton County, but something within his partnership ended up going horribly wrong. This comes up and that's the only reason I am bringing it up but they don't say what actually happened His law partner, so he had joined on to another firm, but they were going to be partners, so it was called like a Levy L-E-V-Y is that?

Matt: 55:25

Levy, yeah, eugene Levy. So Levy-V-Y Is that? Levy, yeah, eugene Levy.

Lynn: 55:27

So Levy and Poston firm. Oh yeah, and then his other. This partner ended up suing him for I have it written down here injunctive relief in damages.

Matt: 55:39

Oh yeah, that's a big one.

Lynn: 55:40

I actually don't know what it means. Wow, I did look it up, but the explanation was harder than the words. Just know that he was fucking stressed out. Yeah, Like he's just probably spent I don't know what $300,000 to become a lawyer, Probably somewhere around there.

Matt: 55:58

I don't know. Does it cost money to be a lawyer?

Lynn: 56:00

Well, it costs money to go to school, to be a lawyer.

Matt: 56:01

Oh yeah, great Phenomen. Oh yeah, great phenomenal point. Thank you so much.

Lynn: 56:04

Yep, yep yep, you know what? That's not a great job if you have to pay that. That's actually not how jobs work. You're not supposed to go in debt when you just be working.

Matt: 56:18

Lawyers, idiots, get a clue. You should actually be getting paid to work, wow.

Lynn: 56:23

We're here to help the lawyers, that's right.

Matt: 56:25

Thank God they have us.

Lynn: 56:27

So yeah, you know he was very stressed and the reason I bring this up is because it is going to come up at the end of the case. He says he has a couple of really horrific messages that he sends and it's in response to this lawsuit. So I just wanted to put it in some type of context before I actually repeat the message.

Matt: 56:51

The lawsuit of the partner Right.

Lynn: 56:53

Right, so yeah, and they're going to try to kind of paint him with a certain color and it's not, it's just he's going through a tough time. Yeah, so let's just try to keep that in mind. But I mean he, yeah, so let's just try to keep that in mind.

Matt: 57:05

But I mean he's having a tough go.

Lynn: 57:06

He's having a tough go Now. He's got this fucking chick that will not go anywhere. So he's got Shana, he's got this lawsuit and, in a matter of like, only two days from the one year anniversary. Okay, so he met Shana on the 8th of April 2011. And on the 10th of April 2012 was when this lawsuit got filed.

Matt: 57:27

Oh geez.

Lynn: 57:28

So the middle of April is not great for him. No, ryan sent a message to a friend uh, andrew and he said I'm starting to think that life has passed me by while I was busy making grand plans for it. So he's sitting stagnant right now, yeah Right.

Matt: 57:44

Yeah, kind of having a bit of a pity party, and I don't think it's a raw the bad thing necessarily. Sometimes you got to yeah.

Lynn: 57:50

No one else will do it for you. Just don't invite people. No, because you got a naked chick on your couch.

Matt: 57:54

Yes, Hello, like I can't, I can't, like, okay, I can't separate how great that would be to the actual horrificness and the scariness of this case of like the reality of, uh, essentially not essentially a literal stalker breaking into your apartment is very scary.

Lynn: 58:15

Yeah.

Matt: 58:15

But I can't separate you coming home to a naked lady Like it would just be like, Well, he can he can and he does.

Lynn: 58:24

It gets old fast.

Matt: 58:26

Oh, okay.

Lynn: 58:27

Yeah, like, like, I don't know. I mean, aren't there certain people though that like they can be super attractive?

Matt: 58:33

physically and you're just like something about you makes you un-attractive.

Lynn: 58:37

Yes, yes, so I think that is kind of where he stood. Um, there is another part later on in the script where she sends him messages saying that she has all these corsets that she's never worn before and she was like why don't we role play? And blah, blah, blah. And his response was I just don't think I'd be that into that.

Matt: 58:57

Yeah. His response would have been yeah, yeah, no problem, yeah, I can't wait here, get one on. No, it's good, it's good.

Lynn: 59:07

Oh whoa.

Lynn: 59:08

So after you know, during this whole lawsuit period of time, he had joined a new firm. So once again, he was working and that part of his life started to stabilize at least, and he was trying to end things with Shana peacefully. He basically had said it all at this point and he tried to be delicate with her and that wasn't working. He basically had said it all at this point and he tried to be delicate with her and that wasn't working. He'd even tried leaving his own home. Like I said, he had gone to his father's house, like he was really just exhausting his options. And after I finished this case and after I finished watching it and reading about it and everything, I was like it would have been. So, like hindsight, of course, 2020, right, ryan is not going to in his wildest dreams, probably didn't ever think that it was going to come to what it came to, but like in hindsight, it's like God, I wish he had just moved, like, just move.

Matt: 1:00:00

Yeah.

Lynn: 1:00:00

And don't tell her where you went. Like you know what I mean. It's not really as though you have a lot of friends that run together. You have this one step, cousin. Like that's one person, you can just cease and desist her. You're a lawyer.

Matt: 1:00:13

Yeah, and you know, I think you know probably a ton of small red flags, that on their own you can dismiss yeah. Right, you know what? It's no big deal because it's just a one-off.

Lynn: 1:00:30

But you know what?

Matt: 1:00:31

it's no big deal because it's just a one-off, and but, uh, you know how many one-offs does it take before you're like all right, this is actually a personality and I start documenting some of these red flags and taking it a little seriously.

Lynn: 1:00:37

Young, little beautiful college student like is she really dangerous? Yeah she's fucking annoying.

Matt: 1:00:43

Yeah.

Lynn: 1:00:43

But like is she going to hurt me?

Matt: 1:00:46

No Right.

Lynn: 1:00:46

That's crazy.

Matt: 1:00:47

Well, like I can see it, I can see her.

Lynn: 1:00:50

Yeah, she's not hiding a gun. I can see all of her.

Matt: 1:00:52

She's not hiding any weapon.

Lynn: 1:00:55

So, yeah, she was relentless when it came to him and it would later come out in court that during 2012, shana had relations with 10 men Sexual. Shana had relations with 10 men Sexual relations, which is fine 2012.

Matt: 1:01:08

What's that? One a month give or take.

Lynn: 1:01:10

Yeah, I mean, you know.

Matt: 1:01:11

Busy month.

Lynn: 1:01:12

But here's the thing.

Matt: 1:01:13

I aspire to those numbers.

Lynn: 1:01:16

I'm not here to slut shame anybody. You fucking want to do it, but don't force him into this relationship with you.

Matt: 1:01:24

Yeah, if you want to get all up in a bunch of dudes, get up in the dudes, get up in them, but don't string along this dude it's not even stringing him along right, it's like yeah, you're right, yeah, yeah so that's the only thing that really bothers me.

Lynn: 1:01:37

And it does come out in court and like she's cheating on him. No, I don't think so.

Matt: 1:01:41

I don't know what I guess I know, because they're not really together, like I think if she was like I've had sex with 10 other dudes.

Lynn: 1:01:48

He'd be like that's fucking great, he's like awesome do you, can I start dialing the number for you or?

Matt: 1:01:53

how do we?

Lynn: 1:01:53

get the ball rolling on you being with literally any one of those other guys I've talked to listen.

Matt: 1:01:59

I've called them yeah we're having a sit down they all seem great, fucking dealer's choice listen, I've assembled everybody that we've slept with combined and we have a baseball team.

Lynn: 1:02:11

So to be relentlessly badgering this poor guy who's just like trying his best not to hurt your fucking feelings? Meanwhile they're getting you know.

Matt: 1:02:18

Rails. Yeah, love made, love made, love made too. That's beautiful.

Lynn: 1:02:24

You should write home more cards.

Matt: 1:02:25

Thank you.

Lynn: 1:02:25

So she even told a friend that there was another dude that she was like interested in, interested in. This other guy's name is Patrick and she would hide him in her phone under Patricia, like Ryan would give a fuck.

Matt: 1:02:39

Yeah, it could be like.

Lynn: 1:02:40

Like he's going through her phone.

Matt: 1:02:42

Yeah, I'd be like dude, I want a bang. Yeah, you're right, he's not even looking at her.

Lynn: 1:02:45

He probably didn't even know she has a phone. Oh, he's been looking at her vulva for fucking everything oh my god, her vulva woof so, yeah, I, I, you know she's like, oh god, he shouldn't see this. Like I don't think that decision's in your hands anymore, he doesn't care. Yeah, like you're fooling yourself to think that he cares yeah, he's super jealous like no. So yeah, even after all this and after Patrick and all that kind of stuff, like he's still texting her, or sorry, she's texting him.

Matt: 1:03:10

Honey, I went through your phone. Patricia sent you a picture of her dick. It's kind of odd. I thought it was weird. Patricia has such a large God. Listen, I know it's, I know it's, hey, I know it's. What's the? Year 2012 and you know, we can identify who we want. And I'm just saying, but I'm just saying I didn't know that patricia had such a huge guy oh god.

Lynn: 1:03:43

So ryan would text a friend like even after all these other guys this patrick, patricia, whatever, uh, ryan would say that he had received 75 texts from her in the last hour without a response, like that's more than a text a minute, yeah response she. Maybe she's like a one-word texter like I'm bell, let's first of all, those people should be fucking put out on an island far, far away I kind of do that.

Matt: 1:04:08

I batch text a little bit, I'll send actually what you do, but it's like three or four.

Lynn: 1:04:12

Yeah, it's not like 12. No, yeah, I usually send three instead of one long yeah, I break it up a bit. Yeah, well, that is a lot of excluding you from the island, so hey, sup, what are you doing?

Matt: 1:04:23

sup you up, sup and then just question marks K. Lol yeah, emojis. And then angry emojis.

Lynn: 1:04:32

You're not responding.

Matt: 1:04:33

Yeah.

Lynn: 1:04:34

So yeah, Shana would tell her friend Christy Christy's going to play a big part in this. Okay, so Christy is a dentist and Shana likes to confide in Christy a lot, so she told Christy that she was in love with Patrick.

Matt: 1:04:50

Oh, wow yeah New guy.

Lynn: 1:04:52

Christy would later read a lot of their texts on the stand.

Matt: 1:04:57

Oh no.

Lynn: 1:04:58

So this one in particular said that she was in love with Patrick, and the quote is it's going to be hard for me to one day choose between him and Ryan.

Matt: 1:05:06

Well, Ryan has a say.

Lynn: 1:05:08

No, he doesn't apparently.

Matt: 1:05:09

Okay.

Lynn: 1:05:10

And then she continues. One means a future and one means being with someone who doesn't love me as much. Sounds like a pro and a con. I believe you made your own argument there, sister 1,000%. Mm-hmm, I mean, look at his face.

Matt: 1:05:24

Yeah, I know, yeah, probably. And plus, we always want what we don't, we can't get.

Lynn: 1:05:28

Right, right, yeah, which is, you know, she's not learned anything from her own scenario because she's made herself very readily available.

Matt: 1:05:35

Very available.

Lynn: 1:05:37

Very, very available. So yeah, and then she says he doesn't love me as much and I just think that's being generous.

Matt: 1:05:47

As much I even maybe just stop it at love me. I put the period after the word me and then say I think he doesn't love me Hard stop.

Lynn: 1:05:56

Right after that. And that, my friend, is your sentence, so I think, you know, I think maybe Ryan would have thrown a party if she openly chose Patrick. Yeah, she's like bye, Patricia. Nice Ryan would have thrown a party if she openly chose Patrick. Yeah, she's like bye, patricia, nice, I loved your dick.

Matt: 1:06:08

It looks great, see you fucking later.

Lynn: 1:06:12

So she, like I just said I just am going back into the Patricia thing, but yeah, she's listed him in her phone as Patricia. She would also text Christy about Ryan. If he loved me half as much, I'd be forever faithful, but I know he doesn't.

Matt: 1:06:28

I mean half as much, as zero is still zero. Yeah, yeah, no, it is, it is Also if he loved me 10 times as much as he does now, it would still be zero.

Lynn: 1:06:39

Multiplication. I'm learning grade two multiplication right now. So that one I know Booyah. So Christy, like I said, she was a dentist and I think that all the other things that I have said from this point back have kind of just showed Shana, as you know, she's sad, she loves him, he doesn't love her Horned up, misses him, stalkerish.

Matt: 1:07:03

Yeah, a little like a hopeless romantic, yeah, yeah like, okay, poor girl.

Lynn: 1:07:08

But like I said, she's a dentist and Shana would send her another message saying Ryan's been begging me to ask you to do his veneers. Please F them up and make him ugly so he'll never get another girl. I hate him. Listen, it's not a bad strategy. I mean teeth can be fixed.

Matt: 1:07:25

But shit that's fucking like. And first of all, no dentist worth their weight in any, I'm sure there's Imagine. I'm sure there's a society like a college of dentists, like there is, with like a governing body, a thousand percent.

Lynn: 1:07:37

And also you're going to fucking do that to a lawyer. Yeah, yeah right right right, not only your business is going to have a fucking horrible reputation, you're going to get your pantsuit off.

Matt: 1:07:48

Plus their teeth is essentially the business card for that dentist's office.

Lynn: 1:07:51

Plus, I don't think there's much you could do to make that guy ugly.

Matt: 1:07:54

Yeah, that is true.

Lynn: 1:07:57

And finally, less than two weeks.

Matt: 1:07:59

How would you wreck veneers? Just make them not even, oh God, make them vampire teeth.

Lynn: 1:08:03

You could make ugly veneers.

Matt: 1:08:06

You could make them vampire teeth. You could make ugly veneers. Do you want to know what happened? I'd give them vampire teeth.

Lynn: 1:08:08

That'd be fun Fucking wicked, yeah, when I worked at a dental office in Richmond Hill, there was this one girl she's a lady, okay, she was in her 50s, she had children. She, okay, first of all, she either felt one way or another about me. Either way, it was passion, like she either fucking oh yeah, at the time that I worked with her, like two and a half years, she either fucking hated me and made my life torture yeah, I could see that or sorry, continue or she was like so clingy, like it was like my kids, like I want to put your face against my face.

Lynn: 1:08:45

No, the one time she was like we were all sitting at the front desk, it was a Saturday and like I was like three rows down from her, we were just like doing paperwork, catching up on stuff, and she goes oh Lenny, you're so far away, You've got to come closer to me. All the other people were like what the fuck is going on? And two weeks before that she literally would have set my body on fire and watch me burn I don't know what her deal was.

Lynn: 1:09:14

But she ended up, uh, she had to get. Well, she didn't have to, but she did get veneers, yeah, and through our office, and she had her own lab guy. So usually it's the dental work plus the lab cost. So she got all of her teeth were like I think she did from. Like her, I think she did 10 on top, 10 on bottom.

Matt: 1:09:26

Yeah.

Lynn: 1:09:27

And it ended up costing her something like $320, which is insane. Usually well back at that time. That was.

Matt: 1:09:35

There's no lab fees.

Lynn: 1:09:37

Well, she paid only the lab, because our dentist did it all for free.

Matt: 1:09:40

Oh, okay.

Lynn: 1:09:41

But then she ended up getting fired because she went. We worked in a mall it was a dental office in a mall and she would leave and just go shopping for like an hour oh, she worked with you.

Lynn: 1:09:51

Yeah, yeah, okay, and so she would just leave and she'd go and walk around the mall for an hour and, like someone, ended up telling on her and she had been no, it wasn't me, but she had been there for seven years and she'd always really pushed the limits Like she. Even they had to send her to sensitivity training because, as I just described.

Lynn: 1:10:12

she was off kilter Like she was there was something off about her and uh, they so they sent her like they paid for a sensitivity training and they put her through this and whatnot. But then so they fired her and like they were like listen, we've written you up like 45,000 times, like you have to go. And then she left and then something happened where one of her veneers popped off, these free veneers that they had done for her. She got an insane deal through the lab and she had the audacity to come back in and ask them to put it back on for free. I'm like at what point do you just fucking pay?

Matt: 1:10:44

someone else to do it. Yeah, yeah, don't come back.

Lynn: 1:10:46

You went to sensitivity training. You fucked off for an hour and shopped in the mall like multiple times.

Matt: 1:10:50

Yeah.

Lynn: 1:10:51

And then you have the audacity to come back into your old that fired you, yeah. Like with your tail, and her tail was not immature like small no. She was like it was wagging. Yeah, it was just out there I think of when I think of veneers, but um, do they have to?

Matt: 1:11:04

pull your teeth for veneers.

Lynn: 1:11:05

No, they just shave down the front of it.

Matt: 1:11:07

What's the difference between veneers and dentures then?

Lynn: 1:11:09

A lot, oh, really, oh yeah.

Matt: 1:11:11

So what, why? Why would you get veneers over dentures or dentures over veneers? Well you, still.

Lynn: 1:11:16

Your teeth are still in your mouth when so veneers are, it goes over your teeth. It doesn't go over your teeth, that's a crown. Oh okay, a crown would be. They shave it kind of into like a cone kind of, and then they bond the crown. The whole thing on it, veneer, is like it goes on the front of your tooth.

Matt: 1:11:48

And is it? Do you get a veneer and have like 10 teeth?

Lynn: 1:11:49

attached to it, or it's one on every one at a time. You got to put one over every single tooth, yes, and then it's bonded, so they shave it down so that it's a rough surface, so that they can bond it on and cure it to your natural tooth if I took all of my veneers off, would you and smile?

Matt: 1:11:59

could you still see my teeth as regular looking, or are they kind of shaved to like posts or that?

Lynn: 1:12:04

would. That would be a crown, a veneer is shaved down the front of your tooth. So like it'll be a rough surface.

Matt: 1:12:11

Yeah, you know what? Because I have grinded off all of my enamel and I was thinking about veneers or something at some point if I need to.

Lynn: 1:12:21

Yeah, I mean you could do veneers, or something. That would probably be your best option.

Matt: 1:12:25

They are extremely expensive though you just said $300, so that was $325 for 10. Oh yeah, which is not normal. It's usually like the lab.

Lynn: 1:12:37

When she was getting it done it was usually like $600 lab cost alone for one tooth Right, so she was playing an absurdly low amount of money. Wow, wow. And that's why I was like you know what fucking you just saved bajillions of dollars.

Matt: 1:12:52

Yeah.

Lynn: 1:12:53

Go to another dentist and have them put it back on. But anyways, yeah so she wanted Ryan to get his teeth ruined. There's a million ways they could have done that, even just for perfect example. Example, she could have just not bonded it on properly, and then he could be you know in front of a court and all of a sudden, his tooth pops up but no your honor, oh listen.

Matt: 1:13:12

I'd like to object to this. Please like a continuance.

Lynn: 1:13:15

so, finally, less than two weeks from the day that ryan would sadly be killed, on the day that his beauty queen date waited for him, Shana would send a text to her friend Ryan, and her had made a date to go to a shooting range later that night. And so Shana wrote to her friend Christy when I go to the shooting range with Ryan tonight, I want to turn around, shoot him and kill him and play like it was an accident.

Matt: 1:13:44

All right, Listen. Just a quick heads up to all killers out there If you're going to kill, shut the fuck up about it beforehand.

Lynn: 1:13:51

Matt, you know what Stop being on the side of the killer.

Matt: 1:13:54

You always give advice to the killers I do Right. Never mind If you're going to kill, tell a bunch of people beforehand.

Lynn: 1:13:59

So, like I said, like now you can see, shane is not just this poor young girl who's having a hard time moving on from a guy that she really cared about. Like this is dangerous, now even though it's joking and you know what the difference between I mean. Do women joke about killing their significant others? Yes, it's Wednesday and I've said it 17,000 times this week. But the only difference between me and Shayna is that my husband's not dead.

Matt: 1:14:26

Right.

Lynn: 1:14:27

And that's what distinguishes a joke from reality.

Matt: 1:14:30

And the lack of nudity on your part in your daily life is atrocious. You know what I have a lot of kids and I just don't.

Lynn: 1:14:36

My goal right now is not fuck them up by being naked on a couch.

Matt: 1:14:39

On a couch so here we are.

Lynn: 1:14:42

Can we watch?

Matt: 1:14:42

Bluey. Oh my God.

Lynn: 1:14:45

Why are you painting what the hell? So you know, like I said to Matt this morning, I think that I was going to murder him.

Matt: 1:14:55

I said I will shoot you in the face.

Lynn: 1:14:56

I said her exact quote I've never held a gun, so I don't even know fucking how to do that. And he's still very much alive. Yep For now.

Matt: 1:15:04

Oh, my God.

Lynn: 1:15:08

So on Thursday, October the 11th, which, if you remember, is the day before Ryan was killed for whatever reason, shana accompanied Ryan to his parents' home to watch the presidential debate. All right, what year is this? 2012. So it was Biden and Ryan, ryan, ryan.

Matt: 1:15:29

It's a last name 2012.

Lynn: 1:15:32

Yeah, and it wasn't Biden, for it would be him for Vice.

Matt: 1:15:35

Oh, so it was Barack, and.

Lynn: 1:15:38

Yeah, barack was 2008 to 2016,. Right, so McCain was John McCain back then. Then, oh god, we can't talk american politics right now. Yeah, good point. This isn't taylor swift hour.

Matt: 1:15:52

I don't know anything that we're talking about I was just curious to see what debate that was but it doesn't really matter, let's look it up. All right um hey siri, who are the candidates for president of the United States of America in 2012.

Lynn: 1:16:04

I'm going to do October 11th 2012 presidential debate.

Matt: 1:16:10

Thank you, I'm going to say Biden, and what's her name, biden?

Lynn: 1:16:16

versus Ryan.

Matt: 1:16:17

Ryan, yeah, who the hell is?

Lynn: 1:16:18

Ryan. I'll tell you in one second here. Joe Biden and Paul Ryan.

Matt: 1:16:23

Okay, so he was probably that Mitt Romney romney's guy okay, well that answers that question, all right uh, america, fuck.

Matt: 1:16:33

Yeah. Also, we should announce some good news for our american subscribers that the tariff war has ceased and therefore prices will remain the same for our american customers, as we were going to double them for retaliatory purposes, to start a trade war we just all of a sudden, in the middle of a case, we just started talking about american politics, because we're definitely in a position to talk about american politics hell yeah so, for whatever reason, ryan ended up having shana accompany him to his parents house, which kind of seems like a mixed signal to me.

Matt: 1:17:08

Yeah, that's a big commitment actually, especially a debate. It's not like coming over for dinner and we're going to shoot this shit. You've got to watch TV Fully closed. Yeah, fully closed, which is not easy Not her wheelhouse.

Lynn: 1:17:18

It's not how I like to watch a debate, Especially when it's a Trump debate, especially when it's a Trump debate. So you know, something happened later on we don't know really and at about three in the morning Shana called her mother crying and, like her mom, her name is Sharon. She's a retired teacher. I've watched a bunch of interviews with her and she said like she could hear the pain in her voice. And again, her mother lives 80 miles away. So she said she was worried for her daughter. So she started driving out there and at about five 30 in the morning she made her way to Ryan's condo, but Shana, of course, wouldn't go home with her. Sharon said that Shana wanted her mom to come inside and she just wanted them to lie on the couch together and for her mom to rub her feet.

Matt: 1:18:08

Oh, I was like hey, mom, let's get comfortable. Wait, what are we? Why are we just going to get naked?

Lynn: 1:18:14

You know, you're always such a naked baby, you never grow out of it, but could you imagine me waking up the next day, and not only as a girl? You don't want your mother-in-law, your mom is rubbing your feet.

Matt: 1:18:25

Oh, I see you've made yourself extremely at home and comfortable like I just I don't.

Lynn: 1:18:31

That would be so overwhelming. I think so personally. If I had to guess, I would think that after ryan went to sleep, based on everything else we know about shana, including the fact that you know she also would brag to her friends that she would break into his Facebook account all the time and would block females and she would like pictures of hers.

Matt: 1:18:55

But he didn't.

Lynn: 1:18:57

And she would comment random things.

Matt: 1:19:00

Desperation is a stinky cologne, In this case perfume.

Lynn: 1:19:06

If I had to guess and put my money on something, I would think that she probably saw the beauty queen conversation. Oh, yes, and maybe that was why she was hyperventilating and calling him at 3 o'clock in the morning.

Matt: 1:19:21

Right, mom, he's going on a date. I'm sorry. Did you not just bang like 10 dudes, like over the last 365?

Lynn: 1:19:30

Yeah, patrick's here, so you know that's conjecture on my end. I don't know that.

Matt: 1:19:37

What is conjecture?

Lynn: 1:19:38

Just like my own opinion, my own spin on things.

Matt: 1:19:39

No, what was that? Patrick was there.

Lynn: 1:19:41

No, the fact that maybe she saw that conversation.

Matt: 1:19:45

Oh, yes, yes, yes, a hundred percent, yeah, but I, I would. That's a pretty logical yeah.

Lynn: 1:19:51

So, ryan, would awake to all fucking sorts of weirdness. And well you know, it's probably not his favorite way to wake up. So he just was like all right, I'm going to go to work then.

Matt: 1:20:03

Yeah.

Lynn: 1:20:04

No one thing I didn't put in my script here. But Ryan lived in a two-bedroom apartment and because no one else lived with him, he had one room for just his ties.

Matt: 1:20:13

Oh.

Lynn: 1:20:13

And he had a fucking lot of ties, oh my God. So, yeah, he would go to work. And Shana was, I think, trying to get attention. She said that her mom was there because she had to take her to the hospital because she was having heart problems not heart problems she was saying her chest hurt and she said that she had high blood pressure. So they were running tests. And da, da, da, da. I don't know if they ever went to the hospital. What I do know I'm going to assume. No, they went to the mall.

Matt: 1:20:40

Wow, that's right up there. It's the same there was probably a pharmacy in the mall.

Lynn: 1:20:44

Six one half dozen of the other Right. One of the mall workers would later be called on to testify because she had actually like kind of clocked, like she was watching her because she was like very upset and then she was on the phone and the retail worker kept hearing her say I'm going to kill him, I'm going to kill him, I'm going to kill him.

Matt: 1:21:07

Oh, going to kill him, I'm going to kill him, I'm going to kill him.

Lynn: 1:21:09

Oh my god, maybe poker face? What store do we know? I don't know. Like what does she?

Matt: 1:21:11

she doesn't have a lot of, probably wasn't the food court.

Lynn: 1:21:13

Nobody's upset in the food court it's probably a clothing store, if there's a burrito anywhere near me or a colonel's wasn't a colonel's no, god, please.

Lynn: 1:21:20

So, yeah, she said she had high blood pressure and, uh, that her mom was there to take her and later on in that night, which was so. This is Friday, october the 12th. Sadly, ryan only has a few hours left to live and he was excited to be meeting up with this beauty queen and he was leaving work that day and a fellow attorney and friend of his whose name was Ken Hawley he was saying like okay, bye, like I'm going on my date and his administrative assistant, her name was Lori Zimmerman. She said that as he was leaving that day, he looked so excited and he was like, lori, I have a date with the beauty queen tonight.

Lynn: 1:22:01

And Lori was like, hey, she's like I got a bad feeling. She's like I've seen firsthand. She's like if Shana can't get a hold of Ryan on his cell phone, she would call the reception desk, and if she couldn't get a hold of the reception desk she would show up and she's like she would cause a scene sometimes. So she's like you know, I don't think this is going to end well and that's how she felt. And his last words were to her don't be worried about me, I got this.

Matt: 1:22:28

So she voiced her concerns.

Lynn: 1:22:30

Yes, she did.

Matt: 1:22:31

God, that's got to be such a tough spot for her. Well, I mean he said those exact things too right, yeah.

Lynn: 1:22:37

Like he said, like she's not like she clinically needs help. I'm not just saying that to be like making a what is it? A mountain out of a molehill.

Matt: 1:22:45

But what if? Even if you went to the police and said, hey, like I mean.

Lynn: 1:22:48

There's nothing? No, I wouldn't think. And also in Kentucky law. So yesterday, we don't get. You have to live with someone in order to get a protective order on them. Oh, I love it, which is insanity to me right.

Matt: 1:23:02

Oh, I'd like the protective order.

Lynn: 1:23:08

Sure, what did this person do? I tried to kill me all. Right, where's his?

Matt: 1:23:10

residence down the street. No, we're not gonna be able to do that, so that's crazy. What do you? Um, just lock your door? Yeah, uh, get in a relationship with him, marry him, move in, and then we'll get you you know we'll help you then, which is insane to me, like that just seems so I'm sorry, we only get protective orders to roommates yeah, you're fucking get off.

Lynn: 1:23:24

You're wasting my time. There's a married couple here that we have time for, so Ryan had messaged Shana and he told her that he was going to need some time on his own this weekend. Not good. She seemingly took this quite well.

Matt: 1:23:38

That's the biggest red flag of all Wave that flag she's so easygoing. Oh, that's cool. I don't even, I'm not even nude in your couch right now.

Lynn: 1:23:47

I definitely don't think you're seeing a beauty queen later on today Definitely didn't creep into your Facebook and like a bunch of my own pics.

Matt: 1:23:52

Anyways, I'm getting more palpitations in my heart. Better get back to the hospital with my mom.

Lynn: 1:23:58

So yeah, like when she took it well, I got to wonder if she was actually taking it well.

Matt: 1:24:04

Yeah, her go-to for her character should have been like oh, you have a date, that's fine. I wish I could date. I can't because I'm in the hospital dying of heart disease, but that's cool. I'm glad that you are strong enough to have fun. I'm actually jealous because I can't walk because of all this heart disease I have.

Lynn: 1:24:24

Ladies, he's not passive-aggressive, that's fun. Like I said before, she lived quite a distance away, right? So she told him okay, that's fine, that's great. I'm just going to come by and I'm going to grab some things. I want to get some bath stuff and I'm just going to go to the Marriott for the night.

Matt: 1:24:41

Okay, so you're going to drive an hour and a half, pick up a couple of things and then just stay in the hotel again.

Lynn: 1:24:47

Yeah, no issues here. Yeah, everything seems great. Why don't you just grab your um Pantene, provi, I don't know from.

Matt: 1:24:53

Pantene Provi Vito Sassoon Is that still his name. I think so. Pantene Provi.

Lynn: 1:25:01

Vidal Sassoon the last name, whoever it was the heir to that, used to be on well for one season on Beverly Hills.

Matt: 1:25:09

The Sassoon, the Sassoons, oh my God, hi, we're the Sassoons. Oh, from Vidal, that's correct. This is my wife. She's a Sassoon. It does feel weird.

Lynn: 1:25:21

eh. What happened next? We can only speculate, because I mean, we have Shana's word, but she is a fucking liar, so I mean that means nothing. At 8.53 pm, though, shana Hubers called 911 from Ryan's condo, and the first line that she said to the dispatcher was ma'am, I killed my boyfriend in self-defense.

Matt: 1:25:41

Oh, okay, that's not really. You could mention that I wouldn't open with it.

Lynn: 1:25:48

You really don't. You just don't know. I could sit here all day and say I don't think me. Giving my defense first would be the way I would have that conversation. But again.

Matt: 1:25:59

I mean, ideally you'd be freaking out over somebody who's dying or dead. Yeah, and that's your primary concern.

Lynn: 1:26:06

Well, ideally, we also's your primary concern. Well, ideally, we also will find out. Shana's first call wasn't to 911. It was to her mom.

Matt: 1:26:11

Yeah, her mom's like girl.

Lynn: 1:26:13

you got to stop calling me Mom.

Matt: 1:26:14

This is fucking annoying. First of all, I'm tired from last night, mom, I got great news my heart problem's gone. Yeah, all of a sudden I I can breathe fine.

Lynn: 1:26:23

So bad, though Like it's actually it's so sad. So when the dispatcher asks her how long ago she killed him, she says 15 minutes ago, and the reason, like I said, was because she called her mom first. Her mom was like okay, can you please call 911? What would also become clear was that Ryan had come home that day and once again found Shana in his condo. He likely had taken his gun out of the holster, as he always did, and laid it on the dining room table. At one point he fled and he locked himself in his bedroom, which does not seem like she was doing anything in self-defense. He fled, yeah, and she Googled how to pick a house lock with a bobby pin.

Matt: 1:27:05

Well, I mean you just kind of stick it in Right and interior doors, it's just got the little hole. I guess sometimes yeah, but like to actually pick a lock. You need a couple of tools.

Lynn: 1:27:17

Really, yeah, okay, I don't know, you need a screwdriver and then you need a picker. Okay, easy, no big deal, so obviously she was successful. The table that Ryan had laid his gun on Okay, I was trying to figure out the best way to explain this to you. But so when you walk in, say his door is right here, okay, and in his dining room this is not great for audio. I'll post a picture. Yeah, maybe I'll post it.

Matt: 1:27:47

I'll draw a picture.

Lynn: 1:27:48

It's a lot better than posting what it actually looked like. He had an oval table.

Matt: 1:27:53

Yeah.

Lynn: 1:27:53

And it had four chairs. Two of the chairs were backed onto a wall.

Matt: 1:27:58

Okay, okay, you can picture yeah, a little corner table. Yeah, exactly.

Lynn: 1:28:01

Ryan was at the chair, that his back had a wall to it and the right side of him had a wall to him. Okay, does not sound like somebody who's the aggressor. You know what I mean? No, he's literally backed into a corner. Yep, and Shana was even in her own story, in her own version of things. She had her back to the door. So she's going to give us a couple different stories and one of them she said that know, she had left, he had asked her to leave, she had left. Then she came back to get stuff. I just don't think you can, even in her version, which is always a lie. You can't go back into that situation. You know what I mean.

Matt: 1:28:47

Like no, you're just kind of looking for trouble.

Lynn: 1:28:49

Exactly.

Matt: 1:28:50

I mean you can rearrange a time later, but I think you're done for the day. Exactly the one visit, that's enough.

Lynn: 1:28:56

So she said she had left and then she showed back up and when she went in there she goes. He was right there, the gun was sitting in away from him and then she shot him. Ryan's downstairs neighbors, vernon and Doris West, would say that they heard two gunshots, which at first they thought were fireworks, but after a very short pause they then heard four more. Oh, wow, yes, and they knew like that's when they knew it was gunshots. When asked if they had heard anything like a scuffle or a loud argument, they said that they had not and they confirmed that they had heard things in the past.

Matt: 1:29:36

So they would have you know, recognized it for what it was but not that night.

Lynn: 1:29:40

They only heard those, those gunshots. When the police arrived, shana was immediately taken to the Highland Heights police department, where she was put into interrogation room 116 and read her Miranda rights. I mean, I guess, due to the fact that she was forcefully putting herself upon a lawyer, she at least knew that she should instantly request an attorney, and she did.

Matt: 1:30:05

No, no, I don't want it. Wait, who'd she kill?

Lynn: 1:30:09

Nope you know the second that someone requests an attorney, all questions stops, yeah. So when Lieutenant Dave Fornash sat down with her, she said I want an attorney, and he informed her Okay, we're ceasing all questioning. Then, however, shana would not shut the fuck up.

Matt: 1:30:31

They never do. I'm always shocked at how much people fucking talk when they shouldn't. You know what.

Lynn: 1:30:38

It's ego, I think I can absolutely agree with you and know what you're talking about. This is so far beyond that. They said they had to start switching out officers because they were getting tired of being in the room with her talking that much. Oh my God, they were literally like I can't fucking listen, my ears are bleeding, and like they, and they couldn't ask any questions right, which I think would be second nature.

Matt: 1:31:01

Oh, you can't.

Lynn: 1:31:03

They cannot ask her any questions.

Matt: 1:31:04

I thought if they continue to talk then it's back on the table. But only she's talking, only she's talking, so they can't investigate until the lawyer gets there.

Lynn: 1:31:14

They don't need to no.

Matt: 1:31:16

Yeah, yeah, you're right yeah.

Lynn: 1:31:17

Yeah, you're right, they're just, she's literally yeah.

Matt: 1:31:21

One cop just got his feet up, hand me that confession form and get, give me a pen me a pen, literally and like okay she's gonna say later on that she has the iq of einstein.

Lynn: 1:31:34

Oh boy. She says she was gonna try to claim insanity, but she has the iq of einstein, so she couldn't I think einstein's first theory was e equals naked on the couch instead of mc square. I'm never gonna shut the fuck up after I ask for an attorney science for naked on so like it's actually insane to watch, because it's like two hours and 40 minutes and at the end of it they're like okay, well, we're just gonna take you in now, because you've literally said everything so way to invoke your right to counsel insane.

Lynn: 1:32:01

It's like she was smart enough to get that far, yeah, and then it just all went to shit oh man so at first it was for Nash, the, the Lieutenant there, and he at first he's like, he seems like a really sweet guy. He just I could not see him being a cop when he he was the one to finally tell her that they were going to charge her with murder. And he's like okay, so we're just going to, we're going to charge it with murder, and he just kind of seemed like he was tripping over himself a little bit.

Matt: 1:32:28

But he could not believe. Yeah, no, you're right, you're right, fair enough I have been to restaurants that have not served me food like this. No, exactly, has been served to me on a platter.

Lynn: 1:32:37

He's like so when he's leaving the room he's like do you smoke? And she goes, I will if I can. And then they have like this little chuckle between the two of them.

Matt: 1:32:57

Okay, this is so fucking diabolical.

Lynn: 1:32:57

And so he's like, ha, ha, and he goes to leave and she's like, and she like starts like she's sobbing, yeah. And so it's literally like this and he goes, you're okay, you're okay. And he closes. She goes as soon as the door closes. She sits up straight, starts looking at her fingernails and then a smirk goes on her face. It's literally like she turned it right off wow, and it's like you fucking you gotta seriously don't know.

Lynn: 1:33:16

These rooms are being recorded, yeah right the fucking chief is in the next room watching everything in real time giant mirror, yeah, and you're like you don't have the moving mirror with those shadows behind it. Is anything Insane though Like she, just she's like, and then just looks at her fingernails. It was crazy, wow. So, like I said, they had to switch out officers because these guys fucking couldn't listen or talk that long.

Matt: 1:33:43

Hey, sarge, I got to go on leave. Oh my God, were you shot at Worse. I was in this room with a fucking mouthpiece. Oh say no more.

Lynn: 1:33:50

You're done 30 days You're good bro, but can you imagine, though, like your instinct as a cop is probably to make them go on Like let's ask you a question, Like it's gotta be so difficult to not just say something.

Matt: 1:34:02

Yeah, well, I mean, sure I'm wrong, but you want to get them talking Right, you want to get them comfortable Right. And she's, she went zero to 60.

Lynn: 1:34:12

She's fine, she started at 60.

Matt: 1:34:14

So, yeah, they're good.

Lynn: 1:34:18

And yeah so it just it's so crazy and you can watch the entire thing on Cops are laughing and high-fiving in the back Can you believe this shit.

Matt: 1:34:23

We don't have to do, my God right, like it's a huge case.

Lynn: 1:34:27

They literally had to hand it to them on a silver platter. Wow, she goes on and on and on about how you know it was self-defense. Now she's saying remember, before she just had come back into the apartment and he was there, reached for his gun, oh yeah. Now she's saying that he was throwing her all around the apartment, he threw her into the bookcase, he was ramming her head and face into things. But do you remember at the beginning of the case.

Matt: 1:34:52

She must be very bruised up then I would think Her face has got to be battered and bruised.

Lynn: 1:34:56

Do you remember at the beginning of the case, when I told you about all the bullets that Ryan had on display?

Matt: 1:34:59

Yes, that were sitting on their base.

Lynn: 1:35:01

Yes, they were still perfectly upright.

Matt: 1:35:04

Wait. So then, after he hit her head into the bookcase, you're telling me, you then rearrange his bullets again.

Lynn: 1:35:10

Yes, gotcha, all right, no none of it fucking happened because she is a liar.

Matt: 1:35:15

Oh my God.

Lynn: 1:35:15

So you know, she fucking clearly is a moron.

Matt: 1:35:21

I mean ideally, you know body, check the bookcase and maybe smash your head up against the wall a little bit. Again, I don't want to give advice to the killers, but you just did.

Lynn: 1:35:31

But in reality she but you just did. First of all, it took her 15 minutes to call 911. You shot this poor man.

Matt: 1:35:41

She did want to call her mom first, though.

Lynn: 1:35:43

There's so many, thank God. She's a fucking idiot, but in all that time that she was doing all these horrific things, she could have at least staged something, but no she's stupid and thank God Like keep being stupid.

Lynn: 1:35:57

Later on in the interrogation room, which, unbeknownst to Shana, is being watched in real time, she would say that she was sitting on the floor in the dining room and Ryan was where they had found him, but he was, you know, gesturing wildly and then he reached across the table and she didn't know if he was going to go for her face or the gun. But then she reached up and she grabbed the gun and she shot up to him. But the problem with that is that there's a trajectory.

Matt: 1:36:26

Oh, yes, bullets go.

Lynn: 1:36:27

You know what?

Matt: 1:36:28

I mean Angles.

Lynn: 1:36:30

And that trajectory. Oh yeah, bullets go. You know what I mean angles, and that's not the way ryan was shot downward. Oh so she was standing above him when it happened. But you know, either way, she grabbed his six sour semi-automatic, turned the safety off and she shot this poor man six times total. But she said that her reasoning was because he she had to keep shooting because he was still moving towards her.

Matt: 1:36:57

The people like has nobody ever watched one episode of?

Lynn: 1:37:01

CSI. I think at this point you could just watch fucking Brooklyn Nine-Nine and figure it out.

Matt: 1:37:07

Like this isn't. You know, I know this is so rudimentary, Basic, it's basic. I know this is so rudimentary, Basic, it's basic.

Lynn: 1:37:11

I know, but so yeah, so he's still moving forward, right, oh God. The problem with that is that the first shot that she did went into his head and there was no blood on the front of his shirt because his head went down on the table instantly. Gravity would have drawn that blood down onto his shirt.

Lynn: 1:37:30

Yes, but because his head went down on his table instantly and there was a puddle which exactly fit that logic. Yeah, he wasn't. Ryan was never fucking moving towards her. Yeah, she's a bullshit artist. I would not call her an artist, I would call her Right.

Matt: 1:37:44

It's a. It's offensive to people that work at Subway. It's offensive to people that work at Subway. True sandwich.

Lynn: 1:37:48

Artists of our time, they're skilled individuals, yeah right. So you know, Shana, I'm going to say this verbatim because, fuck, I couldn't say it better. If I tried, she would say hold on, give me one second. I just got to plug my.

Matt: 1:38:01

I will give you no seconds and call you out for your unprofessional behavior.

Lynn: 1:38:07

I was like for sure I'm going to have enough time that I have a full charge and everything's going to be fine.

Matt: 1:38:13

But no.

Lynn: 1:38:14

And now my battery savers on because it's like you're an idiot.

Matt: 1:38:16

It's like, hey, we're going to save this battery for you.

Lynn: 1:38:19

Because obviously you're not smart enough to do it on your own.

Matt: 1:38:24

Can I just ask you an off topic question? Sure, will you be watching the Super Bowl this weekend with Taylor? Of course I will. And this is bullshit, by the way, that they only show her now when he makes a play, the same amount of times they show his mom. It's garbage.

Lynn: 1:38:41

Well, I mean, what are we looking at really? Just Taylor looking at something.

Matt: 1:38:43

Yes, that's all I want to see. That's the only reason I watch football.

Lynn: 1:38:47

Did you see how smoking hot she looked at the Grammys? Jesus H, that dress. Oh my God, she's a complete dime.

Matt: 1:38:55

Yeah.

Lynn: 1:38:55

And she was so happy for everybody that was winning, and she didn't win any. She was nominated for six things and was the first person to stand up when someone else won out of one of the categories that she yeah, she's an angel.

Matt: 1:39:09

Yeah, she always talks about how people always make fun of her award shows. Fuck them For dancing and singing along. And she's like she said these award shows that I go to, I'm like front row and these are the greatest performers of the year.

Lynn: 1:39:25

Right.

Matt: 1:39:25

And people just sit on their hands. That's so disrespectful.

Lynn: 1:39:29

I love being so close to the live music and not to mention I mean not for anything, but I mean if Taylor Swift goes to a concert, even if she is in like a VIP box kind of thing, it's just a bunch of people staring up at her, like as it is at the football games.

Matt: 1:39:41

I'm sure.

Lynn: 1:39:42

At least this is kind of. She's amongst her peers.

Matt: 1:39:44

Yeah.

Lynn: 1:39:44

These people are also famous in their own right, so fuck, she can just let loose and just do what she wants to do.

Matt: 1:39:50

Yeah.

Lynn: 1:39:51

So this is what Shayna said verbatim.

Matt: 1:39:53

I wish you'd shut up about Taylor Swift. You're always bringing it up.

Lynn: 1:39:56

I know and I will not stop. So don't try to stifle me. I'm like Shayna.

Matt: 1:40:01

Show up on Taylor Swift's couch Cannot be stifled. I will be nude, however, on a couch. So did you see the tea that she had for travis on her upper thigh? Was that a tea for her or tea for him? Well, one of her songs.

Lynn: 1:40:15

The lyrics are um what if he's written mine on my upper thigh, only in my mind? So it's like on her upper thigh. It's got like his little and I think it is for him for sure. Why would she have it for her?

Matt: 1:40:24

yeah, and they're doing, they're doing scx right?

Lynn: 1:40:27

yeah, for sure, it's a full relationship, yeah All right, I will not discuss sweet angel baby Taylor Swift's love life.

Matt: 1:40:33

I was just curious if you think they do stuff like that.

Lynn: 1:40:35

Oh my God, of course Any fetishes no. Stop it. Don't talk about her like that, just standard stuff. I'm not getting into this with you. Whoa, what do you think worst part of this case? You're talking about Taylor and Travis.

Matt: 1:40:47

I wonder if he's in anything weird Huh. I wonder if he's in anything weird.

Lynn: 1:40:51

They're beautiful and perfect and maybe she likes that.

Matt: 1:40:55

he's into that weird sex thing. Great, that's good for them.

Lynn: 1:40:58

Fucking, let this die.

Matt: 1:40:59

I wonder what it is though.

Lynn: 1:41:02

It's none of your fucking business.

Lynn: 1:41:09

So you know, she said, and I quote I couldn't stand to watch him twitch. I knew he was going to die or have a completely deformed face. He's very vain. One of our last conversations we had that was good was that he wanted my best friend to do his veneers and he wants to get a nose job just that kind of person. And I shot him right here, gesturing to the middle of her face. I gave him that nose job just that kind of person. And I shot him right here, gesturing to the middle of her face. I gave him that nose job he wanted oh, holy shit, like she's a psycho she's.

Matt: 1:41:38

Like it's not just like a scorned, like, uh, passion or crime of passion, like this is a methodical wow and all of these seasoned cops are in the other room like what the fuck did she?

Lynn: 1:41:50

just say Wow I gave him that nose job he wanted, and then she giggles. That's fucking diabolical.

Matt: 1:41:58

You know, the nude on the couch thing should have been a red flag for me. I saw it as a green flag. Should have been a red one.

Lynn: 1:42:05

What did Jodi Arias do, remember? She used to go in the doggy door and fucking vacuum in the middle of the night. One what did jodi aries do, remember? She used to go in the doggy door and fucking vacuum in the middle of the night. Like that's a good move, ma'am. You're making yourself too available. If you can't see that, then there's something.

Matt: 1:42:16

Not, you're not firing on all eight you don't have to play games to play the game here's the thing with guys yeah we overanalyze men too much yes what you see is what you get yes they're not for the.

Lynn: 1:42:31

I mean. Mean, I'm sure there's exceptions to every rule, but I've come to know what my husband's saying and thinking usually one and the same, Aside from when I show him beauty queens and he picks out an invisible flaw so that I don't kick him in the face.

Matt: 1:42:44

Oh, she's way too tall. What's your six one?

Lynn: 1:42:48

Oh my God, are Way too tall, which is 6'1".

Matt: 1:42:51

Oh, my god, are those hip bones Woof? Oh, look at those giant perfectly round boobs.

Lynn: 1:42:54

Ew, so, after this, after this. So this was a woman cop that was in there with her at this point in time. She was probably like, okay, what the fuck did she just?

Matt: 1:43:04

say the horror.

Lynn: 1:43:06

So she leaves Sheena's in the room all by herself and you know, throughout this entire two hours and 40 minutes she's crying. There's never any fucking tears. She laughs a bunch. It's a fucking horrific interrogation to watch. But she starts, so this woman cop leaves and then Shayna's walking around and she's singing.

Matt: 1:43:33

It's like pacing in the room.

Lynn: 1:43:35

She's pacing no, not really pacing, she's doing ballet, she's beauty Literal. I swear to God, matt, I will show you the Come off it Nude.

Matt: 1:43:44

No clothes probably.

Lynn: 1:43:46

Definitely clothes and boring clothes. It's like jeans and like a hoodie.

Matt: 1:43:49

Oh my God, who would wear a fucking hoodie? What a loser Shut up.

Lynn: 1:43:54

So do you remember when Jodi Ears was doing her thing and she was singing? Oh Holy Night.

Matt: 1:43:57

Yeah.

Lynn: 1:43:58

In July, uh-huh. That's fucking normal. Some Dido song she sang too.

Matt: 1:44:02

Was it? Thank you, no Tears gone cold. I'm wondering why.

Lynn: 1:44:07

And then she just starts doing the Eminem part.

Matt: 1:44:08

Yeah, I was singing, dido. Thank you, but I don't do the Eminem part.

Lynn: 1:44:14

I'm like that's not. Yeah, jodi, do you remember she was like God? You could have at least done your makeup.

Matt: 1:44:18

Jodi Geez, who said that Jodi did when she was in hers.

Lynn: 1:44:23

So this fucking piece of shit. Honestly she might even be.

Matt: 1:44:26

Hall of Famer.

Lynn: 1:44:27

I think she might be worse than Jodi Arias. She was doing ballet, she was doing pirouettes, she sang Amazing Grace. She just kept asking for water. After two and a half hours there was like six paper cups of water and at one point, which you have to see this I'll get Krista included here, actually, because it is only a tidbit, but she's walking and she goes. I did it, yes, I did it.

Lynn: 1:44:54

I can't believe I did that like a, like a cheer almost like then she makes direct eye contact with the camera like is this the sequel? To bring it on, bring it on again no, she says she's a great actress, like she looks at the fucking camera.

Matt: 1:45:10

Like you're saying she's saying this. Who is she saying this to? Like she's still alone. She's alone and she's making statements Mm-hmm.

Lynn: 1:45:18

So I'm going to have Cuckoo, cuckoo, cuckoo. I'm going to have Chris put it in here, but I'm just going to show it to you because I think you just need to see it.

Matt: 1:45:28

Wowzers.

Lynn: 1:45:29

Yeah.

Matt: 1:45:31

So here, why don't you? What's the move in an interrogation room? Just sit there and shut the fuck. Just shut up until they talk to you and then sit and answer their questions and say less.

Lynn: 1:45:38

Okay, here Press play.

Matt: 1:45:40

When you have a second like you're doing something.

Lynn: 1:45:43

Listen when you get done painting.

Matt: 1:45:44

This looks, oh okay, yes, Sorry, it looks like I'm going to watch a sponsored clip for Matt Locke at first.

Lynn: 1:45:51

What on earth are you doing?

Matt: 1:45:53

I don't know. I went to hit play and something horrible happened.

Lynn: 1:45:57

Oh yeah, that's because sometimes when I have to get books on not Audible Kindle, I don't like having to read myself.

Matt: 1:46:06

Oh, so you make it into an Audible book by highlighting it. Yes, this is a commercial for Matlock, which, by the way, if you are looking, for a good show for the family.

Lynn: 1:46:15

She's been the same age for like 20 years.

Matt: 1:46:16

She is outstanding.

Lynn: 1:46:18

She may have looked older in Psycho.

Matt: 1:46:20

Yeah, in, not Psycho in Misery Sure. Yeah, so good. I love it. We watch it at the house. It's one of our family shows the cups of water Within hours putting six bullets and watching him die. She danced and sang oh.

Lynn: 1:46:43

Wait until she says I did it. Yeah, I did it. Oh, yeah, is she pirouetting, I did it. Yeah, I did it. Oh yeah, is she pirouetting?

Matt: 1:46:53

No, she's just right now she's singing. I hate when people sing Amazing Grace and really lean into it. Oh yeah.

Lynn: 1:47:02

She's going full, like Aguilera.

Matt: 1:47:04

Like Christina Aguilera doing the scales.

Lynn: 1:47:06

Yeah, she does like the Taylor Pose, just right back. Another doing the scales yeah, she does like the Taylor pose, just right back.

Matt: 1:47:12

Oh, another thing of water.

Lynn: 1:47:14

Watch. Oh, it's in two seconds. She'll say I did it. Shut up, lady.

Matt: 1:47:21

She's wearing flip-flops. What an idiot Like who kills in flip-flop Cover your yeah.

Lynn: 1:47:27

Nobody wants to see your fucking little piggy. You can't have exposed. This one went to the market. This one went to fucking kill a guy. Bitch.

Matt: 1:47:36

Not a terrible voice. Yeah, there it is. She is pirouetting, wait, I believe.

Lynn: 1:47:46

Yeah.

Matt: 1:47:47

I believe, I can't believe I did that. Ew, she looked right at me.

Lynn: 1:47:56

It wasn't you that? Is you go home later. She's on your couch naked.

Matt: 1:48:00

I have said this before I don't think that you should be able to convict people on circumstantial evidence. But if that was the only piece of evidence, I would throw her away for life, okay.

Lynn: 1:48:10

Okay, so the defense, or sorry, the prosecution, we're just going to have to get this out of the way right now, because her last name is.

Matt: 1:48:18

Snodgrass, Snodgrass, oh shit. So the defense was like listen.

Lynn: 1:48:24

It's Snodgrass. But yes, every time they said it I heard Snodgrass. But yeah, she's like everybody grieves differently, but nobody pirouettes when they grieve.

Matt: 1:48:33

Oh my.

Lynn: 1:48:34

Damn sis.

Matt: 1:48:36

Shit. We don't know how Baryshnikov grieves. That's true. And he probably pirouettes. Basically right after that they came in and were like all right we're charging you with murder, and she goes.

Lynn: 1:48:51

she doesn't change at all. She isn't like, oh, not, nothing like that she goes what degree? Oh my God, the cop doesn't decide what degree, though. He's just like there's enough evidence that you fucking killed this guy. We'll let the court decide. If there was premeditation, what the fuck are you talking about? Why would I know that?

Lynn: 1:49:05

oh really, oh wow so, yeah, so you know she, and throughout the thing too, like she's saying, like you know, I have to live with the fact that I did this to somebody that I used to say I loved to, I loved every single day. It's like she never, ever, said what about his family?

Matt: 1:49:22

yeah, what about his mom? What?

Lynn: 1:49:24

about his three little sisters? What about anybody other than my fucking stupid self?

Matt: 1:49:29

Yes.

Lynn: 1:49:29

She was, everything was. I didn't want to watch him suffer. He was twitching and I couldn't watch it anymore. So I she didn't even say like I wanted to put him out of his suffering.

Matt: 1:49:40

She couldn't even stand it. It was so annoying.

Lynn: 1:49:42

Um, I was trying to be naked on the couch and this guy's over here dying Like no dying like no she was such a fucking barbarian yeah, that's a good word like just a calculated piece of shit. Yeah like honest to god, it's actually so like we joke and whatever, but this is a fucking. This man had a family that loved him so fucking much. His little sisters they're adults now.

Lynn: 1:50:08

They're all destroyed by this like if could you imagine the one boy, like the one brother, that they all look up to and like his friends would even say like he was insanely protective over his baby sisters, His dad, his stepdad, everybody fucking loved this guy so much, and that's one thing that everybody that knew him will say he had a heart of gold. He was one of the kindest fucking people you'll ever meet. And his, his dad, Jay, says you know, when people ask me about my son, I don't say he's gorgeous, even though he was. I don't say he's brilliant, even though he was. I say he's got the kindest heart and in the end that's what got him killed.

Matt: 1:50:44

I was just thinking that, which fucking gives me goosebumps because it's like fuck. Yeah.

Lynn: 1:50:48

Like if he had just been an asshole.

Matt: 1:50:50

Yes, and he should have been. He had heard that right.

Lynn: 1:50:53

Yep, I agree, I think so I fucking hate this broad.

Matt: 1:50:57

You know, you, you, I swear to God. And she has like this is my uncle, it is because of the mouthy broad.

Lynn: 1:51:02

I just crack a butt like yeah, fuck.

Matt: 1:51:05

Yeah, it's so sad. I mean you obviously want to treat people with most respect whenever you can, especially in relationships, but at some point there's no time. You've tried and I know that you want to be a nice guy, but the phrase nice guys finish last is a phrase for a reason, unfortunately.

Lynn: 1:51:27

And listen. Here's the thing. At the end of the day, maybe and fuck, you can see it in this video and she says in one of her text messages to a friend my love has turned to hate. Be that as it may, is there nothing in you, even if you hate him, which you don't? Fucking? You do not. You don't have that right. Yeah, I'm sorry, but he's fucking treated you like a human being when you didn't deserve it.

Matt: 1:51:48

Yeah.

Lynn: 1:51:48

But isn't there anything in you that says he's got a family? No, you know what I may have, I don't have that connection with him. I don't care about him as a person anymore. He's got a family that's going to hear about this and it's going to destroy them.

Matt: 1:52:03

No, they're blind. I think that when a lot of criminals have like blinders on, like you just don't think of that. Like you just don't like people that want to like harm themselves, they just don't consider the thoughts of and the concerns of people that love them the most. You just you're blinded by whatever emotion.

Lynn: 1:52:21

I just think it's so fucking vile.

Matt: 1:52:24

Yes.

Lynn: 1:52:25

Like, what, like he couldn't be with somebody else, so now you've taken him away from everyone.

Matt: 1:52:30

Yeah.

Lynn: 1:52:31

And then, and then I think back to his text message and he said you know, I think life is passing me by while I was busy making grand plans and it's so fucking sad because he's 29. Like, does your life even start?

Matt: 1:52:42

Right, yeah, and I mean you know this happens like this is like. Domestic violence is unfortunately super common. I mean it, not so much the female on male, like that's the exception to me in this case, and she's fucking psychotic, yeah, and like from every.

Lynn: 1:53:00

And I've done a lot of research on this case and I just I haven't been able to find anywhere else or anywhere that aside from this one date with the beauty queen like I don't think he was out there, you know.

Matt: 1:53:10

Dating it up.

Lynn: 1:53:11

Dating it up Exactly. She's getting railed by every guy in town and then she's got the audacity to come at him Like.

Matt: 1:53:18

Yeah.

Lynn: 1:53:18

I, just I. It really is very upsetting.

Matt: 1:53:21

What was the beauty queen being dragged online for Like for?

Lynn: 1:53:25

what. That's a great question Like for stealing him away from her or Everybody's got a fucking thing to say nowadays.

Matt: 1:53:31

Maybe, if you're trying to be like, put your mind in the hater. What would you hate her about in this she?

Lynn: 1:53:36

really didn't do anything wrong. Yeah, I couldn't tell you and I was in no position to ask.

Matt: 1:53:43

Imagine I was like hey, listen, hey quick question. Why do people hate you so much?

Lynn: 1:53:46

because I mean like, let me get on board if that's a thing? No, I don't think I don't think she did anything wrong people are just assholes, maybe just because she's gorgeous and yeah, people want to hate on you.

Lynn: 1:53:57

Yeah, you know we can relate to that every goddamn day it's hard to leave the house. But yeah, so you know the cops. They told her like okay, you're, you're gonna be held. So basically this happened in 2012 and she was held until her trial in 2015. Like I said, she did go in for a bail hearing in 2014, but like she'd fucking made a whole bunch of comments about any chance she saw an open door, she'd run. So they're like yeah, no, you're a pretty big flight risk.

Lynn: 1:54:28

So we're just going to fucking keep here.

Matt: 1:54:29

Yeah, good.

Lynn: 1:54:30

And then in her trial in 2015, they wanted to come at like her defense attorney wanted to come at it with the battered wife, kind of thing.

Matt: 1:54:42

Any evidence to support that? Any calls to 911? There?

Lynn: 1:54:46

was one person and it was Ryan's neighbor. Her name was Nikki Carnes. She said that she had seen Shana crying outside of Ryan's house and she had a big red mark on her arm. She said that it looked like he had manhandled her and Shana was crying. And she, just Nikki, said, you know, she did everything for this guy. She would take his laundry, get his laundry done, she would buy him food, she would do this, that and the other, which of course she did, because she's a fucking stalker.

Matt: 1:55:17

But then oh yeah, those are nice things, those are things to control him.

Lynn: 1:55:20

Exactly and to manipulate. I have your clothes. Now I am. I have to come back. You need me to help you with your daily life, but here's the thing. So she said, yeah, I saw this red mark on her arm. Four inmates that were cellmates of Shana's would come up and they would talk about things that Shana had talked about. They were not offered anything as to come forward. They said that she would laugh at the fact that Ryan, she'd killed him. She was not upset about it at all, and she also said that she would self-inflict wounds on her arms and then would make a point to roll up her sleeves in front of other people.

Matt: 1:55:55

Wow.

Lynn: 1:55:55

So that she could play it off as though Ryan was laying hands on her. Like I said, the bullet was in a Diabolical she's fucking nuts.

Matt: 1:56:04

That's evil man, evil man.

Lynn: 1:56:05

But you think that you have that forward thinking, but you don't know the trajectory of a bullet. Yeah, that's right. Like just throw a ball, you can fucking figure it out. Yeah, yeah, yeah, so of course. Yeah, there was that. The interrogation room confessions were pretty great. All of their texts would come out. You know, like I said, the bookshelf that Shana alleged. Ryan threw into, everything was still in order, bullets were standing Bullets are standing Like that is not something that's going to fucking still stand, yeah.

Lynn: 1:56:31

He also had a completed Rubik's Cube, which really upsets me, because I bought a Rubik's Cube. I'm like you know what? I tried it when I was younger, couldn't do it. There's YouTube. Nowadays I can fucking figure out how to do a Rubik's Cube Wow, no. So I would assume that he'd finished it. Maybe he bought it brand new. I could see myself doing something like that, but he's a lot smarter than I am Do they come solved Probably.

Matt: 1:56:52

You got to scramble it up.

Lynn: 1:56:53

Yeah, if anyone in my house is going to complete a Rubik's cube, it's going to be Jacob.

Matt: 1:56:58

You ever see those kids do it behind the back. Oh yeah, I'm like okay.

Lynn: 1:57:11

Yeah, and I think so. It always has something to do with the middle piece. You always got to match. Because the middle piece doesn't move, you got to match the colors to that middle piece. Take my advice.

Matt: 1:57:19

I don't know. I just see some of these kids and it's like how do you, how do you know how to solve it so quick? He's mind I can disassemble it and cross-section it and then figure out where to go. So I just kind of reverse engineer it. I'm like, oh, okay, Cool, Makes sense, Cool young Sheldon. She's later.

Lynn: 1:57:35

So, yeah, nothing had been moved on the shelf. She did try to play that he had a drug problem. I think that there was something to that, like with the-.

Matt: 1:57:44

Well, lawyer, a little bit of nose beers.

Lynn: 1:57:46

It wasn't that. It was he said that he was taking Adderall to wake up and he was taking Xanax to go to sleep.

Matt: 1:57:51

Oh I mean.

Lynn: 1:57:54

I mean the housewives do that too, so whatever, and you know, at the end of the day they ended up. I mean the fact that Ryan locked himself in the room and she had Googled how to get into his room. She was never forced to stay there, so that's something even like where she was positioned in the house or in the apartment. So she obviously was found guilty of second degree murder and, uh, they gave her 40 years, nice. So basically the two options were if she was found guilty, she could either be given anywhere from 25 to 50 years or she could be given life. She got 40. Everybody wasn't thrilled with that because she could be eligible for parole after 20, which I mean she was 23 at this time, yeah, so like 45 with two years of trial or whatever, yeah.

Lynn: 1:58:45

Also, there is a law in Kentucky that if they found out that she was a domestic violence victim, she could be eligible for parole after eight years. Pretty fucking obvious that that's not the case though. So, yeah, she got 40 years, she went to jail and then she was given a new trial because one of the people on her jury was a convicted felon, and he forgot to. He's like oopsies, I forgot to say that stuff.

Matt: 1:59:12

I hate when that shit happens. Or like something was misspelled on the search warrant so they have to throw out the evidence they found in the closet and it's like, look, it was in there, let's just circumvent the rights for a second.

Lynn: 1:59:22

I hate it when I forget that I'm a felon. I'm like ugh, this again. But what was funny, before the second trial she wanted to get married. She had met someone. This person is transgender, so he had gone into jail as a man and he transitioned during, so they went by the name Unique Taylor.

Matt: 1:59:50

Because I think you get your property of the state, so you get health insurance, really yeah, so you can get the changeover when you're in jail.

Lynn: 1:59:59

Huh.

Matt: 1:59:59

Because you're in, you get like dental, you get free health care, right, Because you're. It's not called a warden of the state or something, it's something.

Lynn: 2:00:12

Whatever you are, you're the property of the state, essentially when you're a prisoner, really, yeah, and they got to take care of you with health benefits and stuff. So this individual she would contact Shannon, would. This is right before her second trial. It's highly speculated that she wanted to get eyes on her case again and hopefully somehow it would work out in her favor. So she was saying that you know they're infringing on her right to get married. It's, you know her, whatever amendment right.

Lynn: 2:00:35

She's supposed to be allowed to get married. And so the one of the news stations did go in and they interviewed her. She was like they're not letting us get married and we tried to file and get a license to get married. And so the guy's looking at it and he's like you only filed this seven days ago. He's like maybe they just haven't gotten to it, like it's like she didn't even she wasn't waiting.

Matt: 2:00:56

They're like we're refusing to get a lettuce.

Lynn: 2:00:58

Exactly. And then she's calling the news station. My wife is trans. And they're like listen.

Matt: 2:01:03

this is a paperwork issue, oh fuck.

Lynn: 2:01:05

She's making this whole issue. And she misgendered her fiance 55,000 times. She was literally calling his first name, his last name, oh fuck.

Matt: 2:01:19

Like dead naming. Oh no.

Lynn: 2:01:22

Yeah, she was all over the place with the names. It was insane. And she was like yeah, he, you know she, he, she. She literally said he she.

Matt: 2:01:32

Oh no.

Lynn: 2:01:33

And then she goes. I don't see them, I don't see unique as a male or a female.

Matt: 2:01:40

I'm in love with their soul.

Lynn: 2:01:42

But throughout this interview, I watched it and she misgendered them at least a dozen times. Oh my God so.

Matt: 2:01:48

I understand how, like you know people that aren't familiar with that community.

Lynn: 2:01:52

Sure, you know you're not used to speaking with pronouns If you're in love, this is your soulmate. Exactly, you figured it, the fuck out. Yeah, like you know, people Fucking Einstein.

Matt: 2:01:59

Yeah, People can make mistakes right and there's no hate involved it together. Not even for a fucking interview To community buddy, it's like and that's a thing too right, like it would be one thing if it was just like you know it was a mistake out on the fucking.

Lynn: 2:02:14

I don't know what's the yard, the prison yard.

Matt: 2:02:16

The yard.

Lynn: 2:02:17

But like you're sitting down for a seven minute interview, and you can't not say the wrong thing a fucking bunch of times I know Fantastic so the best is that in the second trial, shannon would get a new defense attorney and you're going to enjoy this, because that new defense attorney was like okay, listen here, the battered spouse thing was not working because there's no battery.

Matt: 2:02:35

And you're not a spouse. Yeah, so you're over right now. You're over too.

Lynn: 2:02:40

So they went with the orgasm defense.

Matt: 2:02:43

Now, I obviously am familiar with the orgasm defense, but just from our listeners, could you maybe refresh us?

Lynn: 2:02:49

you know it's okay not to be um up to date on the orgasm defense because, uh, it's the first time it's ever happened oh unlike shana's orgasms, which she said she never got not even from those 10 dudes who knows? It's all fucking bullshit anyways she said that ryan would get really, really mad because she was not able to achieve like okay, like every fucking yeah, listen, listen he was too giving like. What the fuck are we talking about here?

Matt: 2:03:21

he's like beating himself up out in the dressing room after the game like, come on, man, get your head in the game, get together come on, man.

Lynn: 2:03:28

Man, you've got to satisfy. But here's another. I have to give you another quote because Shana is just so fucking smart that I can't help but tell you all these things. So this is verbatim. Once again, he told me you're a fucked up person, and you're a fucked up person because you were touched when you were a little girl, and that's why you can't orgasm. And that's why I can't orgasm, and that's why I can't love you, and that's why no one will ever love you.

Matt: 2:03:50

Oh wow, I feel like if you went into chat GPT to create like, hey, give me a line that like a douche would say from like a shitty movie.

Lynn: 2:03:59

No, you go into chat, whatever it is, and say, hey, give me a line that AI would fuck up when talking about.

Matt: 2:04:05

Yeah, yeah.

Lynn: 2:04:07

So it's like the secondhand version of AI, but I mean, once again, who knows what she's even talking about? She said that Ryan also would insist that she got this thing called a G-shot. She goes and she looks out into the audience of people that probably want her to fry the jurors she's like all of you probably don't know what that means, because I didn't know what it meant either, until Ryan told me that it's a collagen shot that's administered into the side of your vagina. Oh, and it makes it easier for you to orgasm.

Matt: 2:04:37

How would that work? Oh, it would inflate, I guess, and it would have more tetrasectors.

Lynn: 2:04:43

No, I wouldn't think so. Your nerves aren't inflating.

Matt: 2:04:45

Yeah, you're right.

Lynn: 2:04:47

You just got a big blob of collagen.

Matt: 2:04:50

Easier to find.

Lynn: 2:04:52

I'm not too sure. Cartilage like an ear Cartilage collagen.

Matt: 2:04:57

Oh right, I'm sorry, cartilage.

Lynn: 2:05:01

It's actually a diver. It's like it's a nose that you have down there now.

Matt: 2:05:05

Chewing on a chicken bone down here I um but yeah, I really don't think.

Lynn: 2:05:11

I mean, she's like you know what and he was into really rough things, like super, into like kinky sex, and he made her really uncomfortable with the things that he wanted to do. I mean, let's not forget, Ryan didn't even want to see her in a corset.

Matt: 2:05:21

So uh, yeah.

Lynn: 2:05:23

And he was like Can you please put you know what I said about the plastic covering before you come over?

Matt: 2:05:28

Yeah, put it on my couch. Yeah. And speaking of plastic covering, can I put something in here for the night? I'm going to put some collagen.

Lynn: 2:05:38

He's just Brian's got fucking cans of just Scotchgard. So you know this is her again. Second defense the only thing the only person that ever stood in her defense is that Nicky Carnes, his neighbor, and I just you know none of it was fucking, it didn't make any sense.

Matt: 2:05:54

No.

Lynn: 2:05:56

None of it made any sense. And are you a completely different person from all these people that know you? You know, and your ex-girlfriend Lauren, and all these people that have seen who you are as a human? Are you that different with this fucking ding dong, who you don't even want around again? The verdict okay, this is my favorite. So the verdict in the second trial would come back and instead of the 25 to 50 year time frame, shana was given life. Oh, nice.

Matt: 2:06:23

So is that life, life like? Will she get executed she?

Lynn: 2:06:26

will, or is that?

Matt: 2:06:28

you die in jail.

Lynn: 2:06:29

Sadly, she will be up for parole on why call it life then? Who's living to be 20? And also it's like the, I think like in reality, when she would be eligible for parole from the 40 years to the life was roughly the same time. I mean his family. They liked it better that she got life, because that's what she would deserve, but they said there's no closure, there's never going to be any closure.

Lynn: 2:06:57

We've lost somebody who's so fucking fantastic in this world and his sister went up on the stand, his sister Katie, and it was heartbreaking.

Matt: 2:07:06

Oh, like a victim impact.

Lynn: 2:07:08

Yeah, they all got to go up, so his whole family would go up, and when Katie went up there, she had a teddy bear with her and she's like I'm a 30-year-old woman, I don't need a teddy bear. She goes, but this is all I have left of my brother and it's a shirt his shirt that's made into a teddy bear and she squeezes his what, and so just the voicemail was like that bitch is crazy it was like it was just his outgoing.

Lynn: 2:07:38

Yeah, it was probably like hey, every yeah yeah yeah, yeah, just a nice memory so then, as they continued questioning them um the dad jay would say like this was remember. I said this is only kid, like this is where he put all of his eggs. And when ryan and lauren broke up, ryan went and got a dog and his dad's like don't fucking get a dog, because you're a lawyer, you've got shit going on like you don't have time for a dog, and he's like jay's like. I honestly feel that part of Ryan's spirit is in this little dog, he's like and I fucking worship the grand at walk from now.

Lynn: 2:08:16

He literally is obsessed with this dog and I'm like God, you know what. It's really sad because, like what this was in 2018 was the second trial. So, like, hopefully the dog's doing well. He says that he wears Ryan's watch every single day and at the beginning I said that I was going to give you half of a quote and at the end I would give you the other half. So the other half of the quote, the whole quote, is since Ryan's birth, I gauged my wellbeing by his. My plan in life was always I would be with my son, I would be a doting grandfather and that would be my whole focus. My name ends with this he was my lineage and he's the last of me. He still celebrates all birthdays and holidays with his ex-wife and their family.

Lynn: 2:09:04

He continues to be Uncle Jay to Ryan's sisters that's sweet, shayna's in jail and fucking.

Matt: 2:09:12

May she rot forever?

Lynn: 2:09:13

yeah, for her I mean like, look at the life she's even this beauty queen who was like she should have had five minutes in this case and, like now, she's getting death threats from fucking randos, yeah.

Matt: 2:09:21

So, yeah, I mean that's that case and uh, it's really really sad.

Lynn: 2:09:24

It's funny, you know there's that hell hath no fury. It's really really sad.

Matt: 2:09:29

It's funny. You know there's that. Hell hath no fury like a woman scorned.

Lynn: 2:09:33

I don't even think she was scorned. How could she have been? He was like just shooting her with kid gloves.

Matt: 2:09:37

Like I'm trying to think of the trigger that would have set her off, Like what he did to set her off.

Lynn: 2:09:42

I mean, his face might've just been like he's just so good looking, so good looking. I know when you just want, yeah and like he's nice and he's smart and I mean like, yeah, he's a fucking catch, but you know what? You're not. Yeah, so that's not his fault. Maybe talk to your mom. Yeah, she didn't fucking put all of her eggs in your basket. No, no.

Lynn: 2:10:04

So I don't know, I, I do. I end up finding like not in all cases. In some cases, like when we did the Amber Halberling case, the one where she accidentally pushed her husband out the window- yeah. I didn't hate her.

Matt: 2:10:17

No.

Lynn: 2:10:17

And I found that in her interrogation that was grief and that's what she was. She was bawling and she was saying you know, not I lose my husband, but his mom lost his son and his grandmother's gonna have a heart attack. And she was devastated. Not this fucking oompa loompa, she's honest to god, the worst kind of person. Leave her in there, fucking, close the door. Oh, she got divorced seven months after they got married. So I mean, probably wasn't a real marriage, it was just her being fucking histrionic yeah.

Lynn: 2:10:51

Fucking hater. Wow, I was like I was oh. So anyways, you can speak with her if you'd like to.

Matt: 2:11:00

I would like to yeah.

Lynn: 2:11:01

She actually like writes it like she you know well she can't kill you. So I mean, there's that at least.

Matt: 2:11:08

But I am shocked at how many people date uh inmates.

Lynn: 2:11:13

I'm actually shocked how easy it was to find this, because like the video dating. Well, this isn't video, but hold on, I'm just going to read to you what her little blurb is. It's like write a prisonercom.

Matt: 2:11:29

Do you watch love After Lockup ever? No, you're going to have to get into it, I think, because, like it is, and not to generalize, but if I can, it's usually the male is in jail, the female is on the outside, right, right, and they you again, not to generalize, but usually they have some possessive issues, which is great if you're dating an inmate, the male has possessiveness.

Lynn: 2:11:46

No, if you're dating an inmate, the male has possessiveness.

Matt: 2:11:47

No, the female. Oh. So guess what If you got possessive issues and you're jealous? You're dating an inmate. You know where. He is, 24-7. He's not cheating on you by choice, he's not cheating on you and it all goes to show. And then they get out.

Lynn: 2:12:03

That's for sure what the show is. They get out. They just want to rail everybody.

Matt: 2:12:05

They just want to rail everybody. Yeah Well, yeah, there's a lot of like first sex. Some of them make it to the hotel, some of them just pull over at a restaurant. Ew and do it in oh it is that is so fucking nasty. It is so nasty All of it. Some people can't wait and they do it like a car wash A Mormon.

Lynn: 2:12:23

Like get out of the car.

Matt: 2:12:24

Andrea the Mormon, no, andrea the Mormon, no, while it was going through.

Lynn: 2:12:27

I mean, that's quick. Yeah true, so yeah, so these are all pictures of her. She looks still pretty I mean, she's dead on the inside, so whatever, but her thing says hello. My name is Shana Michelle Hubers. I'm a Lexington, kentucky native and a 2012 graduate of the University of Kentucky, with my Bachelor of Science degree, after making the Dean's List in 2010. Why?

Matt: 2:12:53

are you fucking bringing up all of these? What educational accomplishments do you put on your dating profile?

Lynn: 2:12:58

I mean, are you making slop for the other inmates?

Matt: 2:13:01

Because that's the fucking highest. Oh right, she's in jail.

Lynn: 2:13:03

She's fucking in jail.

Matt: 2:13:04

I stamp license plates like so good, oh my.

Lynn: 2:13:07

God. So it goes on and on. Music's always given me a productive and positive coping outlet While incarcerated. I taught myself guitar during COVID.

Matt: 2:13:15

I'm also really good at arts and crafts. In fact, I make my own shivs and sell them in. The commissary, are you?

Lynn: 2:13:19

allowed to have a string to a guitar, though? Like, isn't that some sort of a danger to people? Yeah, you'd think so. Oh, and then her physical description of herself. Okay, I'm tall and thin brunette standing at 5'9" and 115 pounds, with lots of long, wavy, golden brown hair, big steel, blue eyes and a wide, bright smile on a heart-shaped face. It has been almost 10 years now that I've been locked up away from the free world. I was tried twice on the same court case. I am praying for the best outcome, as my case is still under review.

Matt: 2:13:53

No, it's not. Who's reviewing it?

Lynn: 2:13:54

Yeah, double Jeopardy, lady. Is it your mom? Because she's a retired teacher, she's not doing anything. No one's reviewing this shit, except for me, actually, peer review. I mean, I can't do anything about this. Um, I have hope and faith for the future. Kentucky is also an interesting commonwealth state with ever-changing laws and sentences. I just don't think you can kill people, though.

Matt: 2:14:17

Yeah, I mean a lot of that is like financial crime and stuff like that and mandatory minimums.

Lynn: 2:14:22

Uh-huh.

Matt: 2:14:24

That's funny.

Lynn: 2:14:25

Yeah, and then she ends it off. She says I've grown so much since the 21-year-old girl I was in October of 2012. At the time of my arrest, I'm looking for someone who won't judge me by my past, but by the woman I've become.

Matt: 2:14:37

I have really matured. I mean, I would only use three bullets now to kill my lover One-sided lover and not the six that I used last time.

Lynn: 2:14:46

The lover that wasn't loving Anywho. So yeah, I mean that's basically it. She says she's waiting to hear from you, me. She says Matt.

Matt: 2:14:56

Jackpot.

Lynn: 2:14:57

Maybe you can bring her a bunch of water balls and leave half drinking ones all over the bridge.

Matt: 2:15:01

Jenny C, good call.

Lynn: 2:15:03

Yeah, it's a big one.

Matt: 2:15:05

Wow, a couple of beauty queens. Well, one for sure.

Lynn: 2:15:08

Yeah, one real beauty queen.

Matt: 2:15:09

and then this fucking piece of shit and one fake ass ratchet. I mean, she still looks pretty in her pictures. Which color?

Lynn: 2:15:13

Broad. Yeah, she's done broad, one broad. Her outside packaging doesn't fit the inside piece of trash.

Matt: 2:15:21

Right, I was almost.

Lynn: 2:15:22

I almost felt compelled to write to her, and then I was like I have nothing nice to say about this person so it was like I'd be like hey, I just wanted to get your side of the story.

Matt: 2:15:32

You never laid anything down on the couch, you just went full clam, clam out you didn't even bring your own scotch card, because it could get a little expensive. Vagina on cushion, yeah.

Lynn: 2:15:41

So I don't know. I didn't want to be like because we're Canadians, so I just have to have like a somewhat civil conversation with somebody and then she'd hear that I fucking loathe everything about her, oh yeah. You know, so I didn't reach out which.

Matt: 2:15:54

Good for you. Yeah, you know you reached out to the most important one anyways. Yeah, the true beauty queen.

Lynn: 2:15:59

The real beauty queen, yeah, who told me to fucking cease and desist, and we saw a photo of her. Oh my God, All the things Statuesque barf, yeah, perfect frame Literally the most gorgeous hair I've ever seen on a person Drop dead barf. Yeah, totally All right. Well, yeah, let's call it, and I think the next time we're in the studio, matt, I'm going to be coming at you with a big one the Turpin House of Horrors.

Matt: 2:16:27

Oh yes, the Riley hairdos.

Lynn: 2:16:30

Yeah, Riley yeah.

Matt: 2:16:33

Riley is one of our Patreon members and when we were discussing this episode in our Patreon-only Facebook page, she made the revelation that her mom gave her the Turpin hairdo back in the day.

Lynn: 2:16:45

David Turpin. Yeah, and I guess we're going to find out if Riley listens to the very end right, let us know it is on. But yeah, no, I thought I was gonna have this done like last recording such a big fucking case and there's just so much of it off with you.

Matt: 2:17:00

I was like, can you get your shit together for once, lady?

Lynn: 2:17:03

oh, my god, and our sign, matt, our sign is coming on monday I love it.

Matt: 2:17:08

So next week we'll do a little video. Oh my god, I cannot wait video. We gotta figure out something that'll like, really like.

Lynn: 2:17:15

I don't want to put those like the command strips no, no, we'll have to get we're fucking nailing shit in there like, yeah, that is not falling to the ground that your uh roommate there get to do.

Matt: 2:17:26

Some installs a steak. He seems.

Lynn: 2:17:29

he seems to put a steak right in there he seems to know.

Matt: 2:17:31

He knows what's up Construction stuff.

Lynn: 2:17:32

Well, he didn't really do a very good job with the vinyl.

Matt: 2:17:34

Oh, that's true.

Lynn: 2:17:36

But I mean vinyl's, not construction.

Matt: 2:17:37

so no, it is newt. Okay, alrighty then, bye, bye, bye, bye.