We examine how a being small business can have big advantages in the world of government contracting.
We examine how a being small business can have big advantages in the world of government contracting.
Spencer:
Hello everyone, and welcome back to the Country Intelligence Report. We are your hosts, Spencer Bentley, Tarell Cummings, and Devin Florczak. Today we're going to be discussing how the post-pandemic world has impacted the defense contracting sector, and more specifically, how different trends have developed in light of the COVID pandemic. basically reshaping most of American life for the foreseeable future. I came into defense contracting at the height of the pandemic. So this is definitely something that is immediately sort of salient for myself. And I know Devin and Terrell, we both, or all three of us, part of me, had to navigate these changes in real time. And we're still really navigating a lot of the changes that have... taken effect. It's definitely been a game changer in terms of the orientation of the government as a whole, as well as adopting new standards of working, working remotely, all these different changes that have been brought about that we've had to figure out sort of on the fly while still trying to grow the business and remain compliant sort of across the board. So this is definitely something that is very topical for us today and we'll just dive right into it. So on the topic of post-pandemic changes in the defense industry, and I'll just pose this to the group here, how do we feel that COVID-19 has reshaped the defense industry, you know, in terms of operations, bidding, demand? Can we identify any new trends or shifts? that businesses have needed to adapt or should be adapting in this post pandemic world. And, you know, how can we think about navigating these shifts while still trying to grow as a business, specifically, you know, small business in our case.
Devon F (PC):
As far as post pandemic goes, I think the largest change in how bidding for contracting services in general to the government is that, you know, everyone always talks about remote work, but really I think the largest change is the type of companies and location of companies. that are now allowed to bid on things that aren't really in their local area. And I think that's something that we've definitely experienced where if a lot of this work is remote and you might have to either attend a startup symposium when an award is granted and then after that, if you're not required to be in that area and you can just manage the work remotely. I think that just broadens the scope in the type of companies that are allowed to apply for contracts. And I think it's sort of two-sided where that might make competition a little bit more tougher as far as the companies that are now able to essentially apply for work and no matter the location. But that can also be a benefit. And I think that's especially been a benefit for us, where we've been able to reach out of our core locations as a company and sort of broaden our scope into a more national company instead of where we've truly been located before, as far as where most of the company has been.
Terrell Cummings:
And to kind of piggyback on that, when we were, there were times when we had, like you said, you came on in the height of the pandemic, when we were thinking about the whole process of bringing everybody in, the teams that we were putting together, we were also thinking about locations as well. So there were some individuals that we were thinking that needed to be probably closer to like, to say like closer to Huntsville, Alabama, because there's an army base that's down there in Huntsville. So we want someone that was closer to that area. that was part of the team, part of the makeup. Just in case after pandemic, if that organization we're working with wanted us to have a physical presence there in the office, if that was gonna be the case, I think. we were trying to make sure we were prepared on all fronts in different locations, whether it was there in the National Capital Region or where I'm at in the Dayton area, Dayton, Ohio area. You know, we had people that were in proximity to different locations where our client would be. So if we needed to be there in person after the pandemic took place, if we didn't know how it was gonna end up, but we were prepared with individuals in those locations to have a physical presence there if it was necessary. And I think during the pandemic it showed that a lot of times we can function very well, at least for our company, we can function very well remotely. But I think that was probably a tougher transition for some of those government organizations just because of the restrictions they have on. sorry, I'm gonna lose my train of thought, but on the internet there and everything, and security and all of that, they had to take more of that into place, how they were gonna communicate, how they were gonna get different documents from one place to another. They had more steps that they were gonna have to take and be more careful of before just resuming their normal course of business, if that makes sense.
Spencer:
Yeah, that makes a lot of sense and it seems like what I'm hearing is one of the sort of unintended consequences of the pandemic and how it forced everyone to... basically shelter in place for some time was that it sort of democratized the government workspace and really kind of showed the strength of the private sector because a lot of the smaller businesses like country intelligence groups were already sort of primed to be working remotely and already had those systems in place that accounted for... sort of constant interconnectivity as well as security around communications and things like that. You know, we already had those in place because we were already a very remote first oriented organization even though we had those assets in place physically where we needed them to be. of the company was already working remotely. So I'm sure that was the case for a lot of at least private contractors that had to ensure that they had basically a deeper level of sophistication in terms of being able to work remotely than government agencies and employees do. As we all know, the government systems can be quite antiquated just because there are so many restrictions and laws in place around what they can and can't do. But the private sector, as is always the case, is a few steps ahead in terms of the technology that they utilize. So... It definitely showed its utility there and it's continued to sort of bear fruit for us because we have that ultimate sort of flexibility and adaptability as an organization that we can offer, you know, the quick, reliable services as well as being sort of on the spot whenever we need to be. So yeah, that's definitely an interesting development and I can see how that... has strengthened the case for private contractors to take up a lot of this government work and take it off the hands of organizations.
Terrell Cummings:
Right, I definitely agree with you that I think for private companies, private contractors, it was definitely, you know, companies like ours were able to get ahead of the curve. You know, we were previously, every day in the office we'd have a president in the office one way or another as far as that. We were able to maneuver fairly quickly as far as trying to adapt to the new situation. Obviously we were smaller than a lot of these organizations so it's easy to do that. Our resources are a little bit different as far as doing that. communicate where previously you know typically communication is going to take place through conference calls or what not. But now it's like they needed a way to really interact more with each other on a regular basis rather because they're used to being able to you know like send emails whatever a lot of times they can just walk down the hall and go to the office and ask their question which is typically how we interacted with our client. Well now things are different so that's when you saw the evolution of you know whether it's zoom which it was originally or Microsoft Teams or any other kind of resource. like similar to those, they're trying to figure out what's going to work best and who's going to come up with the product or the resource that's going to be able to handle the security needed for federal government organizations. So that was really, it was a little trial and error period as far as that. I think that was huge as far as during the pandemic. Once they got that kind of hammered out, then things kind of, you see like things, things didn't stop or come to a halt, but definitely slowed down because the organization, at least you know for our client, they had to pivot. and try to figure out what's gonna be the next direction we're gonna go. You know, so they had to figure out communication wise, how they're gonna do everything. Then, you know, for our client, one of our clients, whatnot, a lot of times they had classes or courses in person. So they'd be bringing people in or bringing individuals in from, whether it was, you know, just, um, just within the country or globally bringing them in. Like, okay, how's this gonna be different? What are we gonna have to do? You know, how are we gonna learn to... get this information out to the students that would be in the classes normally. We had goals of creating online courses, but now we're going to have to expand upon that and ramp up that process if we want to have this whole organization, whole program continue. So they got on it and they created these online courses really fast as far as putting everything together, having all the information there, how they're going to deliver those courses, to get feedback on those courses so they can improve them because they know obviously the first iteration is not gonna be perfect, so they figure out how they're going to deliver those courses to those individuals that would need that training. So it was just interesting seeing that process on the inside. So obviously we were adjusting on our end, being the contractor, but they were also adjusting on their end, being the client, because they had to kind of change the way they do business, but still do business and go in the same direction, but just how they're implementing that, that's how it was a big change for them.
Devon F (PC):
Yeah, that's definitely interesting because I think there might be a point of conflict now with some of these government organizations where they're trying to measure and see if, you know, the processes that were established during COVID, are they actually good or were they just established of a need for them being, you know, having to be established. And I think that's something that... you know, us as a contracting agency, you know, we could definitely help inform whether or not, you know, the client should be doing certain things and continue doing certain things those ways, especially the virtual ways. And I think that's something that, you know, we're seeing for sure within some of our stuff as well.
Spencer:
Yeah, definitely. You know, I think we as a private organization, definitely are in a good position to inform, you know, government client on best practices, we have much more flexibility and ability to sort of cut through the red tape a lot quicker than the federal government does in terms of implementing new technologies and finding best business practices for a lot of these tools that have proliferated in the wake of the COVID pandemic that allow us to work remotely or have more of a digital presence through more niche tools around. data storage and things like that. So yeah, that's definitely something that's come to light and a great source of opportunity for businesses. But just sort of pivoting or maybe drilling down is more apt to the phenomenon of remote work in defense contracting. This is something that... It's just been the state of the world for me. I don't have any experience in any other situation so I'm not completely in tune with how maybe prolific this change has been. But given the necessity of remote work during the pandemic, how do we feel the trend has influenced the defense industry? Have there been any unique challenges or opportunities that remote work? presents, especially in such a sensitive and secure field as working with the DOD, with highly sensitive information regarding national defense, things like that. Just generally, how do we feel that the remote work phenomena has impacted the defense industry?
Terrell Cummings:
I would say, just this just from the personal experience there, I think we're able to, I think it makes us a little more flexible on how we're able to do the work. So I think we're able to, I guess. have more of an output as far as what we need to get done, showing them exactly what we need to do. But I think what it does hurt in general was kind of the relationship aspect of it. You know, just seeing people every day in the office, getting building those relationships, especially if there's turnover and change, which sometimes tends to happen in government jobs, or if there's military that was working in the office or whatnot a lot of times. They're there for a shorter period of time, so they might come and go. So just, it's harder to have those relationships, which a lot of times, to be honest, as a contractor, especially in the National Capital Region, there's certain stigmas about contractors that you have to overcome, and I think that's easier to overcome those stigmas when you're there in person. So you show them, A, here's what we do. good company or moral company, here's how we're trying to work and bring things to the table, here's the quality work that we do, and here's the kind of people that we are that's doing performing this work for you. So we are a trustworthy resource for your organization. In that aspect, I think that's one thing that was probably taken away a little bit was just that relationship building and being able to show A, we're not the stereotype as far as that. I think that's probably harder. then maybe organizations are also looking at it now, so okay, we need to have these contractors come in, who can get the job done? You know, and it might give them that opportunity where they may not want, they certainly want that relationship as close, they just want to know who can get the job done the best way possible. So, there's kind of both sides of the coin there as far as that, but I think for us, a lot of what got us into the door and got us, you know, more work with certain clients or whatnot was the fact that we had good relationships with them, they knew we have quality work and they recommended our work parts of the organization or to their parent organization or whatever that was for us to expand and go from there. Then it was kind of on us to be able to train the individuals during the pandemic, which like Spencer, you experienced that. So on our end, we've always thought we could do this. It was just a matter of executing it. So it was something that I thought we were able to execute, especially in a short period of time, doing everything within like a month or whatever, a month and a half, which is a little crazy, heavier lift. I don't wish that upon anybody, 15 to 17 people at one time, onboarding them and then training them up real quick and everything like that. But I thought it went pretty smooth overall, to be honest with you, considering what it could have been. But like I said, as far as on the defense side, I'm not exactly sure how, I'm sure it was definitely hard for the defense industry. as far as making those updates and necessary updates or trying to test out what updates were necessary to be in compliance with security. I mean that had to have been the largest thing they were worried about. And if what they were doing, because they were doing it so fast, was it as secure as it needed to be, I'm sure they're still, to this day, probably still running tests, updating to see if everything is working like it should and if the systems are as secure as they need to be.
Devon F (PC):
Yeah, Trell, more to your point about making sure that the stigma of being a contractor isn't too supported. And, you know, that could be shown by your quality of work, but I think as I forget who said it, but the best ability is your availability. And I think that especially in an online age, making sure that... your client knows that you are available at all times during the working hours, making sure that you're online, on Teams, if an email comes in and it's rather urgent that you're getting back to it right away, I think that's definitely key to maintaining a really good working relationship and also helping to enforce the fact that maybe you can start to make your client think that you're better off. working remote instead of in the office where there might be more distractions in the office versus if you're sitting by a computer and you might be working on a spreadsheet or whatever, then all of a sudden you hear that webmail notification come through and you're right on it. So I think again just being available and making sure that your presence is known by the client is is definitely one way to show that you're effective and enforce that you can handle. remotely.
Spencer:
makes a lot of sense. I could definitely see that being sort of a double-edged sword of sorts. That the flexibility that comes with remote work also definitely brings about a, let's say, a handicap in terms of building relationships. you know that's something that was not apparent to me really until we sort of got into a lot of the work and we started as is often the case seeing changes you know on the client side and expansions upon contracts and things like that that required us to you know sort of expand our scope of of responsibility and meet new stakeholders, things like that, and just seeing how difficult it can be to try to build business relationships without having ever met the person. And I can definitely see that being something that that can, you know, potentially hold a business back in terms of, you know, taking advantage of every opportunity available. There's really no substitute for the... building that those and sort of informal connections that definitely helps with with building a foundation of trust with your co-workers and in our case with co-workers and the client so that makes a lot of sense you know it's definitely not all a positive thing but I do think that Companies that pay really sharp attention to instituting strong business practices in terms of expectations around remote work, expectations around availability, expectations around communication with clients, those are the ones that will be able to bridge that gap and sort of overcome that because while I do think, this is just me personally, while I do think building those... those informal connections are important, very important. In my mind, the bottom line is always, can you do the work? Can you do the work quickly? Can you do the work accurately, effectively? Can you be available? If you can check all those boxes, I think that you'll be able to overcome the communication deficit that exists with remote work. But it's really about having a strong. foundation in terms of your business operations.
Terrell Cummings:
I definitely agree with you there on that. I think one of the hardest things, I think, for businesses is, I would say, for younger generations or someone that's just entering the workforce, that may not have the previous work experience, where they can kind of see how things are, like, can see the company culture kind of like... all the time, there in the flesh, in person, like how the interaction is, how the interaction is with the client, with certain clients of certain levels or whatnot, you're gonna react or act differently when there's a general walkin' in a room versus just someone that's a government civilian that's a different position as far as that. There's just, you're gonna conduct yourself differently as far as that. interaction with the team and then obviously like how you integrate them into doing the work, you know, they can kind of if you're there in person, you can show them, you know, exactly they're sitting next to you exactly how you're doing the work Which you can you do now through teams and you bring them in, you know, you can share your screen and whatnot there But there's just another thing where it's like you're seeing them if it's something that's kind of intricate you're seeing exactly how they're trying to do it and if they're doing it the way that that the company expects as far as that kind of work or what not or even the availability. Obviously that's kind of thing that's that's easier to see you know when you have someone there in person in the office right and but you know for us we're not someone we're not a company that's going to micromanage at all either we're not going to want to sit over your shoulder or anything like that so I think there's that trust whereas you're going to come here you're going to be ready and available for work for the client and everything like that and you're going to do the best you can to represent this company the best you can to show that we are doing everything we can to the best of our ability to the highest capability for us and for the client. So I think that adjustment though I think it's harder for younger individuals that may not have already been in the workforce previously where Spencer you were in the workforce previously and so you have been in the office environment and so making the transition to remote work may not have been as difficult for you or maybe something that you're looking for and it was ideal for you. it was ideal for me, you know, to kind of free me up a little bit to do other things, but also know that certain times of day I need to be focusing and doing everything and being available for the client as well. So just because you kind of know what that work environment is where someone may be younger, they're coming out of school, it may be difficult for them to have that transition as well.
Devon F (PC):
And I think a good way for the younger folks who are just hiring the workforce to sort of, I guess I wouldn't say make a name for themselves, but at least make themselves available is reaching out to people in the company and asking what they're doing. And maybe that could go for the client side and the company side as well. where I think the best way that, at least what I learned was asking, you know, you, Terrell, you know, what you're up to, what's going on. And obviously, that was sort of my job as well. But I think, you know, the more that lines of communication are established and, you know, that we're able to openly talk about things that we're working on, that definitely encourages, you know, the newer employees to. at least offer their services and offer a hand in something to better understand it. I think that's a way that I definitely was able to learn on the job and come up to speed with what you guys were doing.
Spencer:
Yeah, I remember early on in the pandemic, really kind of right after I started here, I became acutely aware of the gap between the more experienced workers and their sort of, I guess, you know, habits in terms of, you know, how they went about getting their work done. those that were just coming into the workforce, you know, during the COVID outbreak and the disadvantage that I saw that a lot of them were coming into. Well, I guess, you know, my feelings have obviously been informed by time and they vacillated back and forth, but I still think that there is something that was lost in terms of the ability to... foster mentorship and establish really good working habits in terms of communication, in terms of, this is a little inside baseball, but inside office politics, things like that, being able to just kind of play the game, the corporate game. People that were thrust into this remote environment as their first experience really kind of don't have the opportunity to flex those muscles and build out that understanding. And it's really, I think initially it was a disadvantage and it still may have some disadvantages to it, but what I've seen sort of evolve over time is that There's been more of an emphasis on being a strong self-starter in a remote first environment. A lot of the younger workers have found that they have to be less reliant on others and become more autonomous in themselves and take more of a more of a driver's seat role in the development of their own careers. Which over time may be a good thing, fostering that independence while also being, still adhering to requirements for your job. But it's definitely a change, it's definitely an adjustment. And we'll see how that plays out over time.
Terrell Cummings:
I personally think that especially younger individuals that are coming in and they're trying to get their foot in the company and like what you were just saying, I think that's kind of scary to be honest with you. I can't imagine being 22, 23 years old starting a newer company, you know, and then you're trying to have, obviously you love to have the autonomy, but you also probably like to have your hand held a little bit going through certain processes, you know, so there's that aspect, plus you're doing stuff for, you know, under contract for the federal government. So I think that's another, level as well that you know that's to me even more you know a little more daunting just a little more daunting in general if you have not worked in federal government or whatnot with federal government organizations and you're just getting in that world you know you're talking about office politics there's a lot going on as far as trying to read the room and when to say what you say what to when to know when to speak up when to stay quiet on certain things and who you can do that with you know there's obviously there's just like do when you're there in person. Whereas I think when you're not there in person you take more remote role. Like Devin said, good to ask questions but sometimes it's good to sit back too. It's like okay how do I like before I act like what do I need to know who do I need to know about whose personalities are certain ways or whatever because some people's personalities are how they are and you know, unless you have regular interaction with them, like you would normally do in person, you're probably not really gonna understand that individual like you probably normally would in an office setting as far as that. But for those younger individuals, I can definitely see it. That's a really, like I said, you brought a good point. That's a really tough step, in my opinion, to be more autonomous and to be the self-starter and to take more responsibility, you know, just in general in a new office job or a new office type position, but also, with the federal government too and taking more of those roles because I think both are daunting in their own ways.
Spencer:
Definitely, yeah. It's an evolving circumstance for sure. You know, and just sort of, I guess, building upon the idea of how small businesses have sort of adapted. You know, how do we think that specifically small businesses have fared in this environment? You know, how has the shifting sort of horizon of contracting work been able to benefit small businesses, if at all? because I think that there's definitely been, not only due to the pandemic, but due to other mitigating factors in terms of international conflicts, the war in Russia and Ukraine, obviously different political changes that go on within our own domestic system here have all fed. into this now evolving sort of narrative and reality that there's been an increased emphasis on small businesses. There's been, I guess, more of a spotlight shown on the importance of small businesses and I'm wondering how you all think this is playing out specifically in terms of, you know, defense contracting for small business in this current environment.
Terrell Cummings:
I would say it's from the small business side. I think it probably is going to depend on their leadership and kind of the company culture that they are presenting to everybody else from the top down. And I think that leadership that's more controlling. or likes to have hands on where I think it's harder, it's probably harder for them to adjust to the new environment because they don't have as much control, they don't have as much, they can't be big brother all the time watching over what everybody's doing and whatnot. I think that would be a hindrance to the small business to be honest with you, but those were leadership where they kind of embraced that change, had already kind of prepared their company for those kind of changes and being able to adapt quickly. I think they're able to adapt more quickly then those with leadership that had more of a, I'll call it a more of a hands-on approach. I think they were able to adapt more quickly as far as that. And I think that helped overall for small business contractors, because they could be adaptable in multiple situations and they could adjust. And so when those different contracting opportunities came up and they maybe they part of those larger companies or whatever, or they went after and they got those contracts themselves, and I think that that makes them more appealing because they can adjust as needed quickly and come with those quick solutions versus going through all the different bureaucratic tape that I would have to normally go through or those other office politics you have to go through or whatever other steps you have to go through from larger organizations or larger contractors. I think small businesses are able to pivot more quickly and adjust to be able to get the work done that's needed in this situation.
Devon F (PC):
Yeah, I agree with you, Trill, that as far as being big brother per se and making sure that your contractors aren't just being the typical, stereotypical contractor is definitely a challenge and sort of goes back to the point where I was saying the one way to sort of dispel that notion as a contracting group is to make sure that you're just always there. you're ready to support the client with whatever they might need for that certain day or week. And I think that's something that we definitely do pretty well. And I think that's a credit to sort of the culture that we've built around from the company side where if something is pressing on the company side as far as marketing or business development goes, I think that we're pretty quick to respond to it ourselves. and that sort of translates over to the work that we do for the client as well. So I think it's a two-way road where, you know, the habits that we've sort of instilled for our own company and making sure that, you know, we're all doing well on this side is something that easily translates over to the work that we do for the
Spencer:
Yeah, I can see how a lot of the, I guess, potential or traditional sort of handicaps for small businesses have been sort of turned on their head and leveraged for the better. Being small. had a connotation of being limited in what one can do. But now that I think the small nature of a small business is actually a plus in terms of the ability to be flexible and the ability to be adaptable and responsive to the client in a way that other larger entities maybe can't or are unwilling to be. depending on the contract. So that's definitely something that, you know, is of the moment right now. I think that politically we have to, you know, always keep our eyes on what's going on in terms of how, you know, the national discourse around small business is evolving. But for right now, I think that... you know, given all of these different confluence of factors, you know, small businesses are winning. especially in terms of contracting with the government, it's quite an advantage to be smaller and to have a few more sort of notches on your belt in terms of inclusivity and who you're hiring and how you're bidding for contracts and things like that. So definitely a good time to be a small business in the contracting space. So, yeah. Great talk, gentlemen. We will definitely be harping on these discussions more as we go along here. Any parting words? Thank you all for tuning in. We'll talk to you next time.