What does it take to be a lodge master juggling countless responsibilities while navigating the intricate world of Freemasonry and its symbolism? We keep things light-hearted with a few chuckles about the pressures of being a Worshipful Master and pay our respects to the ever-amazing Jimmy Kamastro at Sound Lounge.
Our conversations stretch far and wide, deep into the realms of anti-Masonry, the misconceptions about Free Masons and what the 'All-Seeing Eye' truly signifies. We venture back in time, tracing the influence of the Protestant Reformation, the Christian faith that guided many of the Founding Fathers of the United States, and the birth of the separation of church and state. As we traverse through time and the vast expanse of Freemasonry, we never lose sight of the virtues that hold us together - silence, circumspection, justice, and the perpetual quest of spreading light.
In this journey, we take a moment to acknowledge the Grand Lodge's marketing reimbursement program and its potential to shape the future of Masonry. Symbols of time and life, the power of appreciation, and the importance of Masonic virtues in our daily lives are also given their due focus. As we wrap up this enlightening conversation with our guest, we reflect on the growth experienced throughout his Masonic journey and express gratitude for the opportunity to discuss Freemasonry. Join us on this fascinating exploration, and let's continue to spread the light together.
#freemasonry #podcast #mastermasondegree #mastermason #bluelodge
Connect with us on:
Email us directly!
What does it take to be a lodge master juggling countless responsibilities while navigating the intricate world of Freemasonry and its symbolism? We keep things light-hearted with a few chuckles about the pressures of being a Worshipful Master and pay our respects to the ever-amazing Jimmy Kamastro at Sound Lounge.
Our conversations stretch far and wide, deep into the realms of anti-Masonry, the misconceptions about Free Masons and what the 'All-Seeing Eye' truly signifies. We venture back in time, tracing the influence of the Protestant Reformation, the Christian faith that guided many of the Founding Fathers of the United States, and the birth of the separation of church and state. As we traverse through time and the vast expanse of Freemasonry, we never lose sight of the virtues that hold us together - silence, circumspection, justice, and the perpetual quest of spreading light.
In this journey, we take a moment to acknowledge the Grand Lodge's marketing reimbursement program and its potential to shape the future of Masonry. Symbols of time and life, the power of appreciation, and the importance of Masonic virtues in our daily lives are also given their due focus. As we wrap up this enlightening conversation with our guest, we reflect on the growth experienced throughout his Masonic journey and express gratitude for the opportunity to discuss Freemasonry. Join us on this fascinating exploration, and let's continue to spread the light together.
#freemasonry #podcast #mastermasondegree #mastermason #bluelodge
Connect with us on:
Email us directly!
Hey, chris, yeah, fred, what's a Mason?
Speaker 2:That's a really good question, fred.
Speaker 1:You've reached the internet's home for all things masonry. Join Chris and I as we plumb the depths of our ancient craft, from the common gavel to the trowel. Nothing is off the table, so grab your tools and let's get to work. This is On the Level. Yes, we are back. I love that intro.
Speaker 2:Reminds me of Friends.
Speaker 1:I know it kind of does, or maybe that baseline kind of reminds you of Seinfeld a little bit Right.
Speaker 2:That's what I'm thinking, yeah, right.
Speaker 1:Shout out to Jimmy Kamastro over at Sound Lounge, who created it for us. What's up, jimmy? Jimmy does not listen to our podcast.
Speaker 2:No.
Speaker 1:He drinks. He's in the band and he drinks rum every night, so he's not up this early.
Speaker 2:I've seen him play. He's a good band, oh yeah, well, he's amazing.
Speaker 1:He's an amazing guitar player and musician, for sure.
Speaker 2:He's had an amazing life. Yes, sometimes you can look at people and you're like he enjoyed his life. Wow, like Keith Richards, you know. Oh, yeah, yeah, it's like wow, Keith Whoa. Yeah, you had some good times. You had some good times baby.
Speaker 1:Yeah Well, what's been going on, brother? How's life?
Speaker 2:A lot. As always, life is busy.
Speaker 1:Yeah, you seem extremely more busy than usual lately.
Speaker 2:I apologize for that. I mean no, that's true, and I have been.
Speaker 1:Yeah, don't apologize, it's the way life is.
Speaker 2:I'm trying this. I took a lot off. I bit a lot off this year, more than I could chew, and I've been trying to walk, chew bubble gum and juggle. Well, I kick a ball with my back foot. Got you Helping down the highway this year. That's been my year.
Speaker 1:And a fine job you're doing, sir.
Speaker 2:I should Might I say she like I'm dropping balls everywhere.
Speaker 1:Man, I'm trying, I'm trying.
Speaker 2:It's busy and I'm loving it. It's fun. That's why it's not a big deal, because it's fun. Most of this is fun.
Speaker 1:Well, today is the first day of your ninth month as we're master of large. Sarasota Lodge 147. So.
Speaker 2:I was at a meeting last night Shout out to Orange Blossom Trail and I was invited by right Worshifl, John Miles.
Speaker 1:Shout out again, shout out again.
Speaker 2:Right, worshifl, john Miles, and he connected me with Patrick Hall and Patrick Tessier who were helping they. They piped me in to an MLT session. They were doing an Orange Blossom trail and they're like 50 guys there and some presenters and I couldn't drive there. It got all messed up All my fault. So they were kind enough to pipe me in via zoom.
Speaker 1:Right.
Speaker 2:And yeah, I'm doing this presentation and at the end I couldn't hear anything the guys were saying. So Patrick Tessier was sitting near the mic so I could he could translate basically to me.
Speaker 2:Right. I was like, oh, this guy's just talking about, he's about to become Worshifl master and I say, hey, don't get too excited about that. And I could literally hear all 50 people start cracking up. I'm like it's a joke that only the Worshifl masters get. I think everyone understands it. You know, oh, that's ha ha ha. But I was like, man, this is a job that was way more difficult than I anticipated.
Speaker 1:And I anticipated it to be hard. You did, you did. We talked about it on the show. We had a show about it. You're right, you're becoming the Worshifl master. I was like oh, I'm prepared.
Speaker 2:Blah, blah, blah. Yeah, it was hard, and and so brother Tessier said the good thing, it's the, it's the best job. No one ever wants to do it twice, right.
Speaker 1:Right.
Speaker 2:And I. We meet guys who are like oh, I'm going to be a third time Worshifl master and I'm in my second lodge I'll be the master of and I'm, in my mind, thinking man, I wonder if he goes home and like plucks on his fingernails for fun, or just like jabs metal in his teeth for fun.
Speaker 1:Who wants to see that? Two or three?
Speaker 2:times. That's insane.
Speaker 1:Well, you know, I would imagine that it's it's more necessity.
Speaker 2:Yeah, desire for the good ones.
Speaker 1:You know, if they don't do it then no one's going to be there and the lodge will suffer for it. So they probably step up and do it.
Speaker 2:That's true Also. We're in a very active lodge. We have a lot of people yeah, a lot coming in a lot of issues, a lot of different kinds of people.
Speaker 1:So, yeah, yeah, it's probably a little different than some lodges. Yeah, so what? What was the the gist of your talk down there? What were you talking about?
Speaker 2:We were talking about the Grand Lodge marketing reimbursement program. You don't say yeah, there's a Fred Packwood has already spoken to a future grandmaster. Yes, and. I think there's something in the works there for you.
Speaker 1:Yes, I'm going to be part of it next year and actually I'm actually looking forward to it. That's why I need to get out there with you and go on these, these adventures with you.
Speaker 2:So that I can you absolutely love it I know, I do, I do love that stuff. You're somewhat representing Grand Lodge not really, but you're more representing the future and the hope for Masonry.
Speaker 1:Yeah Right, that's what's exciting about it and a winning program, a program that actually is actually beneficial, it does, it works. It works, man. I mean, every time it's tried correctly, it works.
Speaker 2:The reason that I think you were asked to become a Grand Lodge comedian is because you've proven yourself to be concerned with Masonry at its core, at its heart, and the future of it.
Speaker 1:Oh God, is that what I've done?
Speaker 2:Uh-huh and people hear that and you know it's good because it really does dovetail well with what we're trying to do with this podcast.
Speaker 1:That's right, that's right.
Speaker 2:We're really trying to motivate, empower and really provoke activity in free Masonry for members, that's right. And the Grand Lodge marketing reimbursement program is a really great extension of that. You're giving power to the lodges to survive and grow into the future.
Speaker 1:Right and, as we say all the time, now we're finding that the system works well. It brings fellas in, but then now we're all looking at the result of bringing fellas in and starting to work on. Hey guys, we need to talk about mentorship. We need to talk about catechism. We had a catechism instruction class scheduled on the 30th, but our hurricane no it happened.
Speaker 2:It did happen. Yeah, I didn't go. I was disappointed because only one person from our lodge went. I was planning to be in a speaker there, but because it was the day after the hurricane, there was confusion.
Speaker 1:There was some confusion. I thought it was cancelled. I thought it was too. It wasn't.
Speaker 2:I guess they were just saying be careful we might cancel it.
Speaker 1:Worshipful Ferdon, my apologies. Yeah, shout out, man, just reschedule that thing, we will get there.
Speaker 2:This is a Worshipful Tim Ferdon and right honorable Justin Broom, both from Venice Lodge number 301 in district 23. They put on a catechism instructors mentor class. Basically they had 15 people show up. Oh, good One of ours went and he reported back to me that it was very informative, really helpful, and I think we got a new catechism instructor out of that Do we know who? Brother Mario Patrick Charles.
Speaker 1:Mario. Shout out to Mario Mario that man he's amazing, man, he's amazing. Do not get in Mario's way, oh no. I think there's some sort of video game reference there.
Speaker 2:Don't get in Mario's way, super Mario, super Mario, and he's a brother.
Speaker 1:Uh-oh brother Super Mario. I think we're going to have to go with that brother.
Speaker 2:Sorry, that's going to be your name.
Speaker 1:Super Mario.
Speaker 2:Right on, he is. He's a great. This is the guy who came in from the program, I think.
Speaker 1:He did absolutely came in through the program.
Speaker 2:It's funny because they want to know about you and they asked me about the podcast at this grand lodge thing which is awkward for me. I don't like to cross those things.
Speaker 1:You're normal. You don't like to hear yourself talk like that.
Speaker 2:No, but I was the only one there, so they were asking about you and I said actually Fred came in through the program.
Speaker 1:Absolutely did.
Speaker 2:And now you see what happened, like what an asset pre-nasonry received from that, and it happens in your lodge too. You know you can bring in 20 guys, and if you get one good one, it was all worth it.
Speaker 1:It was all worth it, absolutely. It was free to you anyway. Yeah, that's right, because in incoming dues and the reimbursement in itself, there's really no reason not to do this For every worshipful master out there who's on the fence. Please get off the fence and get in touch with Chris and let's get it going, because we have 32,000 masons in Florida. There was a time in this state we had over 80,000. Let's get there, guys. We need to get there. That's what we do, and I know there's a lot of people out there right now recruitment, recruitment, recruitment. They're yelling at their phone right now, yelling at me.
Speaker 2:It shouldn't be about numbers. We shouldn't be about numbers.
Speaker 1:We got to get used to small lodges. We hear this stuff all the time and at the end of the day we say it all the time all's we're doing is we're doing the same thing. This is the modern. This is a digital bumper sticker. That's all. This is we're going to, where the people are to say if you're in, if you have an idea in your head to join Masonry, here we are.
Speaker 2:Here we are. Well, if you've been to a district deputy grandmaster official visit, if you've been to the grandmaster's official visit, our grandmaster says to every member of Florida, blue lodges exist. With the expectation that you're going to make masons, that's right.
Speaker 1:That's why.
Speaker 2:Grand Lodge gave you a charter. That's right, and if you're not making masons, why should you have a charter?
Speaker 1:Yeah, that, that, yeah, don't. I'm just telling you right now don't mess with this guy man, okay, he means it.
Speaker 2:I'm telling you you can't tell me that we don't need numbers when the grandmaster is telling us that, yeah, that's right Numbers obviously, and why wouldn't we be trying to grow our numbers respectfully, with you know, with dignity?
Speaker 1:but we need to grow it because Masonry has something to offer man, it has something to offer. The state of Florida will be a better place if more men come together under, you know, the banner of making themselves better men for their community. Come on, man, Come on. Is this thing on Hello? Apparently Orange Blossom.
Speaker 2:Trail, used it to great effect. Yeah, and when we travel and talk about this stuff, there's usually a lodge in every district that everyone points to and they had a great experience with it. And then there's always one lodge somebody knows of that says, oh, it didn't work, it's a wasted time. Well but then when you ask one or two questions, it becomes a light very quickly. Why didn't work for them?
Speaker 1:Right.
Speaker 2:So we spend a lot more time talking about the culture of your lodge than we do the nuts and bolts of how the program works. Really, now I talk way more about bed towards catechism instructors. Do you have clicks? Yes, kill the clicks, kill the clicks. Do you welcome your new guys? Do you sit with them? That's the important stuff. Does your lodge fall on the part? Maybe you should start working on that. Yeah, that's right.
Speaker 1:That's right, and I think you said the word right there Culture. What is the culture in your lodge? You know, if I walk into your lodge for the first time, you don't know who I am. What am I going to see? What am I going to hear? Is, am I going to get a handshake from every man that sees me, walks over and talks to me and asks me who I am, where I'm from?
Speaker 2:Yeah, they're going to welcome me in a couple of hugs maybe, Although I'm not a huggy guy, I know Not even a half hug I can do the Mason hug yeah the shoulder to shoulder hug. I like that one yeah.
Speaker 1:That I like. That I like because it looks cool. Yeah, when you meet a brother in public and you do that, your cool factor goes up a little bit.
Speaker 2:You know everybody's like whoa, that was cool yeah.
Speaker 1:But a sloppy. You know I love you.
Speaker 2:Hug, you know where you're just kind of like humping on his leg. Not a big fan, oh wow. No, no, I'm not.
Speaker 1:I don't think anyone's a big fan, Not a fan those kind of hugs yeah don't do that, that's not cool. So before we get into our the little blue book over there that's next to me, I want to write a couple wrongs.
Speaker 2:Oh, oh boy.
Speaker 1:So the first one is is I got an email. I have no idea what Fred's doing. No, you have no idea, so I'm springing this on you, brother. I got an email from a brother. Now, brother, I'm looking for him again. Sorry, oh, right here, brother Fasio E Okay.
Speaker 2:His last name's E.
Speaker 1:Well, his first name is Fasio, and he just gives us E.
Speaker 2:Oh, fasio E. Okay, he didn't want to divulge his last name.
Speaker 1:Right, and if I'm messing that up and it's Faso, forgive me, brother, but if it's Fasio E, that is a cool name, bro, that is, that's a cool. That name will sell Fasio E E. Brother, fasio E E emailed me and I'm just going to read the email because he's. I want to comment on the way he wrote this and the way he approached this whole thing. Okay, so there's two paragraphs here. The first one's just an introduction. Hey brother, fred, firstly, I love the podcast and I'm very sorry to hear about the loss of your son. I'm sure you have all the support you need, but you have another guy on your team here and and brother, you, you. You absolutely bless me with that, because I do. I have brothers all over, all over the world who stepped up to show me a lot of love in my family. Much love out to you and your family. As far as myself, I am an FC on my way to being raised.
Speaker 1:I have listened to all your episodes, except those of the MM degree lecture, waiting on those. Good on you, brother, good on you. You don't all of the stuff is published, but I think it's. You know, I think it's pretty cool that you've decided to wait to listen to them, and I'm hoping by now, because this came in a little while ago, early August. I'm hoping by now you've been raised and you've had a chance to listen to them All right onto the last paragraph. Here One thing has stood out to me that I wanted to bring to your attention.
Speaker 2:Uh-oh.
Speaker 1:Not a big deal, but I thought I would give you my two cents. You tend to bring up Alex Jones a lot as an example of an anti-Mason.
Speaker 2:You do do that I do.
Speaker 1:Yeah, while I would really consider my, while I wouldn't really consider myself a fan of his, and while he does promote several conspiracy theories that can be quite out there, you might be surprised at his views on Masonry. And then he gives me a YouTube link here which I did watch. You can ignore the flashy title on the video and take just three to four minutes to see what he actually has to say on the matter as he responds to a caller. It's quite far from your assumption, from what your assumptions might be. Just just thought that you might want to know that he may not be the best example to use as an anti-Mason, because he really isn't one A conspiracy theorist. A conspiracy theorist most definitely, a wacko potentially, but an anti-Mason not at all. Anyway, just thought I might. Just thought you might want to know, wishing you and Chris a great Friday and weekend. My brothers, I will catch you guys on the next episode. You absolutely will, fasio, and I really like the way you worded this, brother. This is, this is a great example on how to, on how to present an opposing, an opposing argument. You were cordial, you were, you know, you were professional, cordial, you, you, you knew what you wanted to say and you said it in a way that did not threaten me in any way. So so I listened, I went and I watched the video and, though I am persuaded slightly and I told you in my response that I would listen to it and then I would do a little more research and, if I found that I was wrong in any way, that I would in fact talk about it on the podcast, because we are, first and foremost, all about learning here. Even Chris and I want to learn and we want to. You know, change for the better on a constant level. And the one thing I would say about it and I wish I could share the link with everybody here, maybe Chris can figure out a way to do that it's a YouTube short of on the Alex Jones channel.
Speaker 1:But anyways, one of the things that I notice about Alex Jones when he does these shorts is they're highly edited, and this one is no exception. They are edit every five words, breaks to another 10 words, that breaks to another three words, that breaks to another 12 words, and and that's a and. There's two reasons for that One. Is it they're doing it for content? Because the short is trying to make a point in this short. The point that they're trying to make is that, you know, alex Jones is not necessarily anti free Mason and he's answering to a caller and it's highly edited, probably for content to keep it on track, because he's probably they edit out all the rabbit trails and things that don't pertain to the topic. Potentially, the other reason why is because it's not necessarily true and they're just trying to. You know, they're just trying to push an agenda there.
Speaker 1:I don't think this is the case here. I think Alex Jones admits in this piece that his grandfather was a free Mason and and I respect, and I respect that for him, I'm glad he's not a free Mason. But here's, here's the other side of the coin. Fascio is, if you and I'm sorry to subject you to this, but if you listen to the last Joe Rogan interview of Alex Jones now, forgive me, brother, it's three and a half hours long, so please don't listen to the whole thing. That's too many F bombs for one week, okay, but but in that, in that thing, jones goes into a pretty long explanation of what he sees are the evils of free masonry and he says about people like you and me, fascio, that we don't know, we can't know and we don't know what our top officers are up to, which is all these nefarious things. You've heard all of them. I won't go into them again.
Speaker 1:So, and that was the most recent podcast on the Joe Rogan show that Jones did and that on the show they were mostly talking about that giant lawsuit that he lost stuff and that all that was going on. He's being canceled and has almost been completely canceled, but anyway, which I'm not, I'm not a big fan of canceling anybody. I don't care what they say, it doesn't matter to me. Free speeches, free speech in my opinion. But the point I'm trying to make, fascio, is that I agree with you.
Speaker 1:I use him too much to explain anti masonry people who are anti masonry. He's not a fan of ours and he vacillates back and forth. He'll go to well, I'm not. I'm not against it, I'm neutral. I have family that were them and then he'll go on this diatribe about, you know, about the Illuminati and all this other stuff on Joe Rogan. So I guess, at the end of the day, alex Jones is not a reliable source in my opinion when it comes to free masonry. Therefore, I don't think he's a good person, for I'll probably exclude him from my commentary going forward just because I agree with you, brother. He's, you know he's. He's not the best ex, he's not the best example of an anti masonry person, because he's just vacillates back and forth too much. What do you think about?
Speaker 2:that, chris? Well, I have a short video here where Alex Jones openly admits he's a free mason. Is that right? So there's a third one now. So and this person is saying is it shocking that truth on his show.
Speaker 1:Oh, okay.
Speaker 2:He says shocking things to get ratings.
Speaker 1:Right, right. He doesn't believe in what he's saying, and I have to say that that's basically it. Now, lately, people are saying here we go with the rabbit hole, the Alex Jones rabbit hole.
Speaker 2:I knew this was possible. You could have took us here. Sorry, you can't blame this one on me.
Speaker 1:Let's just go back to the point I brought it up in the first place. I probably won't use him because of your email, brother. You're right, that's not a good example. There's lots of anti-Masonry people out there. I was going through YouTube the other day and I found a pastor and the tagline on his short video was why free Masonry is anti-Christian. And I went to click on it and for some reason it wouldn't come up. So I tried to save it because I wanted to go back and study it and maybe do a little show or maybe write on my sub-stack about it a little bit to find out what this guy was saying. There's plenty of other examples out there of people who are legitimately anti-Mason and the truth is is that the people who are anti-Mason out there just don't know Masonry. They don't get it, they don't understand us. But if you took the time, whoever you are, if you're listening in to us, to find things about us to talk negative about, here's one, here's the secret.
Speaker 2:Here's one.
Speaker 1:Here's the secret. I'm going to reveal to you our secret, what we're doing in the lodge. We're making good men better. That's what we're doing. That's the big secret, bro.
Speaker 2:That doesn't sell news media that doesn't sell.
Speaker 1:I know they're not going to get a lot of clicks off of that one, but that's the big secret, guys. We're making good men better. We want to see this country filled with men who keep their word, who work hard, who are honest, who seek truth from the heart. That's our desire as Masons, and if that is nefarious, well then nefarious I am.
Speaker 2:It's not nefarious. It's not nefarious at all.
Speaker 1:And then the second right I'd like to. The second wrong. I'd like to write yes. Last podcast, my partner Chris asked me a direct question and he said what is your opinion of Christian purity? And I gave the worst answer of my life.
Speaker 1:Hold the definition of purity, the definition of purity from a Christian perspective, and I couldn't get it out and what I realized is I don't know, I don't know. So I kind of looked into it a little bit and the word purity is not a word that's exclusive to any kind of Christian context.
Speaker 2:No, definitely not yeah it's not.
Speaker 1:For instance, in 1 Timothy 4-12,. It says don't let anyone this is the apostle Paul talking to his protege Timothy, who's a very young man who he's raised up, and Timothy ended up growing up to pastor a church in the early, early days of Christianity in Palestine. So he's writing him a letter in 1 Timothy. He wrote him two letters, the one we call 1 Timothy, and it says don't let anyone look down on you because you are young, but set an example for the believers in speech, in conduct, in love, in faith and in purity. And what he's saying is that whatever standard you live by, truly live by it, and that's what purity is.
Speaker 1:Purity is simply like if you purify water, right, so I'm taking out the contaminants, I'm making the water beneficial to those who drink it, I'm purifying it, and that's what that's. For me, that's purity. So if I want to live a life of purity, it means I'm trying to take the contaminants out of my life, I'm trying to take those things out of my life that are negative, that are not pure. So for me you ask, from a Christian context I don't think there's any difference. Acting or striving for purity in your thoughts and deeds is a universal concept. Everyone should be trying to be pure in their motives.
Speaker 1:How about your motives and somebody asks you are my motives pure in this issue? Am I going at this thing with pure motives? I need to look at myself and see if my motives are pure and if they're not, I need to decontaminate my motives and move forward. So that's. I did the study on it. I won't bore you with any of the background stuff, where the word comes from and all that stuff. That's just boring. But I wanted to give a decent answer because I felt like I just absolutely didn't know. And my rule is and I share this with everybody out there If you don't know, research and return, research and return.
Speaker 1:I don't know everything. It's certainly true in masonry. I know nothing in masonry. People, because of the podcast, ask me questions about masonry all the time and a lot of times I have to tell them I don't know, brother, but I can find out and there's no shame in that. As a matter of fact, that is your glory, that makes you a mason, the reason we're here, the Florida Masonic Monitor. We have been going through the Master Mason lecture.
Speaker 2:And the last.
Speaker 1:This is our last one. We'll be going through that and it's just going through some of the symbols and the last few. There's just there's one, two, three, four, five, six, seven of them that none of it is encoded. All of it is published. So well, at the end of the synth there is. So we'll probably skip that one, but the rest of it is all published. Anyone can read this. It's all on the website. So the first one is the Book of Constitutions Guarded by the Tyler Sword. Can you remember that one?
Speaker 2:It reminds us that we should be watchful. Oh, I messed up already. The Book of Constitutions, guarded by the Tyler Sword, reminds us that we should be watchful and guarded in our thoughts, words and actions.
Speaker 1:Particularly when before the enemies of masonry, ever bearing in remembrance those truly masonic virtues silence and circumspection. I love that man, I absolutely love that, particularly when before the enemies of masonry. So this, the constitutions guarded by the Tyler sword reminds us to be guarded in our thoughts and words and actions, particularly when we're around people who are anti-masonry, ever bearing in remembrance those truly masonic virtues silence and circumspection.
Speaker 2:Circumspection, that's a new one. Do you know that one? It seems like a combination of words that is ultimately meaning keep your passions within due balance. Circumstrab your passions, yeah, watchful and guarded in our thoughts, words and actions. So it's not enough to not say something.
Speaker 1:Ooh.
Speaker 2:Okay, now we're saying don't even think negatively. We have to be watchful and guarded in our thoughts too.
Speaker 1:Now Right yeah.
Speaker 2:That's going further than we've ever gone in Freemasonry, who just in the past has always told us just do good stuff.
Speaker 1:Right.
Speaker 2:Now we have to be watchful and guarded of our thoughts. We can't go, let our mind go to negative, dark places or bad places.
Speaker 1:Right, because out of the abundance of the heart does the mouth speak, right? So what's in your heart, what's in your mind, the things you think will event, they come out. They come out and sometimes, involuntarily so your thought life in one way or another will come out.
Speaker 1:People will know the things you think if they hang around you long enough, because out of your heart, the things you hold in your heart, they will come out of your mouth eventually Now. So circumspection in the Oxford dictionary is the quality of being wary or unwilling to take risks. Prudence so there's the word prudence, which is a Masonic concept as well. Being prudent.
Speaker 2:That comes from the inner apprentice lecture. That's right. We talk about prudence.
Speaker 1:And in this way, being prudent and or silent when necessary, when you're around people who are anti-Masonic. You know I have family members and I know you do too, brother who are not necessarily friends of the craft. No, yeah. And that's good advice, isn't it? Yeah, you don't want to get into an argument with them over Masonry, because it's just, it's not going to go anywhere, it's not helpful in any way.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I'm not the best person to argue Freemasonry's case to a religious zealot.
Speaker 1:No, right, yeah, that's, that's a little. I mean?
Speaker 2:no, in reality, I don't think any individual is. You know, no one person's going to be able to defend this system, Right? Because it's colored by your own actions in your own past and they view you as the whole of Freemasonry. So it's almost pointless to try to convince them otherwise, Right?
Speaker 1:And religious zealotry tends to be closed off to any outside views anyway. So you know, you're not going to change them by, you know, by simply arguing with them, because that just hardens the other, that just hardens them in their position, arguing, you know back and forth. No, no, it's not that it's this. No, no, it's not that it's this. It's no, no, it's like forget it, let's, let's have a drink.
Speaker 2:Well, I mean, let's let's enjoy our time together, and the first thing I can tell them is I have so many friends in Freemasonry and the fast majority go to the church that you go to, or one just like it.
Speaker 1:Right, right. I mean it ain't that crazy, it's full of people like you.
Speaker 2:So I don't understand. You know, it's really is just you don't understand and that's okay.
Speaker 1:Right.
Speaker 2:It's like sports You're never going to convince somebody that their team isn't the best team in the world.
Speaker 1:Doesn't matter how many statues, you're never going to talk. John Schaefer out of the Philadelphia Eagles. No, exactly it's not going to happen. Man Shout out to John it's just not going to happen.
Speaker 2:The guy bleeds. Green man, mario, that the Metsucker, or whatever.
Speaker 1:Oh yeah, that's not going to happen. Man, why do it? Mike, punch you in the face In that case, silence and circumspection would be highly advised. Yeah, how about the sword? That's next the sword.
Speaker 2:The sword pointing to a naked heart demonstrates justice.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that justice.
Speaker 2:The sword pointing to a naked heart to Right.
Speaker 1:The sword pointing to a naked heart demonstrates that justice will sooner or later overtake us, and although our thoughts, words and actions may be hidden from the eyes of man, yet that? And then we move into the all seeing eye.
Speaker 2:So why would a sword pointed to a naked heart demonstrate justice?
Speaker 1:Well, because well, because the sword is oh, it's like your heart's bare. Well the authority whatever that authority is, does not bear the sword in vain. So they bear the sword. Lady Justice bears a sword because the penalty for violating justice, for injustice, is death. So that's, that's the reason right here. This is very this they're. They're pulling a lot of this straight from that Bible that's on your altar, guys. Is is where this is all coming from.
Speaker 2:Interesting.
Speaker 1:Right, because, well, that's, it's true to the the. You don't break the law, all right. There's a famous saying, and I think it was Calvin who said it you don't break the law, the law breaks you. The law is unmovable, it doesn't move, so you hit against the law, you hit against the law, you hit against the law and eventually it breaks you. And that's the way the law works. So we don't technically break the law, the law breaks us.
Speaker 1:And it's a, it's a concept that requires a lot of thought. But if you guys are out there, if your head is is hurting from that statement, think it through how many times you you can break the law if you, if you constantly are speeding down the highway and you get your third or fourth ticket.
Speaker 2:Okay, catch me first.
Speaker 1:Yeah, when they do catch you, what happens? You go to jail, you lose your license, your insurance rates are high forever and ever and ever, and your life is ruined. See, the law broke you, you. You thought you were breaking the law, but you didn't break the law. The law remained the same. It's still illegal to drive like a maniac down the highway. You know over and over again and get these tickets over and over again. That's still illegal. The law didn't change. What changed was you. You got broken and and that's I think that's the point here that the sword pointing to the naked heart demonstrates that justice will sooner or later take over. It will, it will overtake us. If you're pushing against the law, it will break you. I think that's that's the point that's being made here.
Speaker 2:The point that I'm taking is, like you know, I'm bearing my heart. Like you're seeing into my soul, my heart is bare and you got a sword pointed at me like I have to be honest or you run me through. That's, that's that's good.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that's the same thing, right. Yeah, it's kind of the same idea you. The only, the only sensible course before the bar of justice is to bear your heart and be honest.
Speaker 2:Tell the truth, tell the truth.
Speaker 1:Tell the truth, because otherwise it'll just break you, you know, and and that's that's a great point. So then this one just kind of moves right into all seeing eye pervades the inmost recesses of the human heart.
Speaker 2:I'm sure there's more. That's awesome if you read the optional stuff.
Speaker 1:Yet that this is from the sword part. Yet that whom the sun, moon and star obey and under whose watchful care even comets perform their their stupendous revolutions, pervades the inmost recess of the human heart and will reward us according to our merits, so that there's a it's it's punishment and reward. Right, hope, hope, fear of punishment, hope of reward is what's what's being explained here. Right, and there's nothing wrong with a hope of reward. Doing doing what's right as a child makes your parents happy, it pleases them, and there's nothing wrong with that.
Speaker 2:Right, we, we right.
Speaker 1:We tend to think that somehow this is you know, we're supposed to.
Speaker 2:I don't want to go down the road, never mind. That's a rabbit trail. That's a very like Eastern philosophy. If you study any any Eastern philosophy, it's very familial and their motivations aren't you're going to go to hell. Their motivations are about don't dishonor your parents.
Speaker 1:Oh right.
Speaker 2:Don't dishonor your grandparents, don't dishonor the legacy, and they don't do bad things out of fear that they will hurt the reputation of their ancestors. Right so there is fear in every kind of culture, in the, in our little Western Christian culture that's born from Catholicism, fear is a big part of it, right?
Speaker 1:Fear from Roman Catholicism. Fear is a huge fact. Yeah they use fear to to wield. You know the sword of the, you know that that sword and that's that's between protest. The difference between Protestant and Roman Catholic is that less fear. Well, it's no fear, it is. It is gratitude for what's been done for you See. So I, I try my best, every day, before God, to do what is right, not out of fear but because of gratitude.
Speaker 2:Yeah thankfulness.
Speaker 1:I'm thankful for all that he has already done for me and because of that gratitude I do, I don't want to do anything that would offend him because of my gratitude towards him. That's the difference and I think that's. You know, in Christian circles, I get, I get, I get this all the time because in Christian circles it's it's grace, not law. So we are under grace, not under law. And because we're under grace, we're, we're grateful and out of a grateful heart, we obey the law. That's that's the point. So when Masonry talks about being rewarded according to our merits, they say things like you know, it's a works, works based righteousness where you, you work your way into God's presence. Now, that's true for some religious structures. That's true. Islam is that way. You have to work, you have to accomplish certain goals in life to be accepted by by Allah. That's, that's Islam. Islam believes that. And Mormonism is the same thing. Mormonism is the same way Job was witnessed, the same way. You have to behave a certain way.
Speaker 2:Well, you can do work for dead relatives that didn't do the work, even in some faiths.
Speaker 1:Yeah, mormonism, you can. You can pray for the dead and you can right, you can act on behalf of the dead. Yeah, correct.
Speaker 2:And earn their spot in favor and even older faiths. You had the karma system right. Right, yeah, that would be where you do good things and good things happen to you, which is kind of around.
Speaker 1:Hinduism Right Would be right.
Speaker 2:And do bad things, and bad things happen to you. So that's a somewhat fear based system that's rewards oriented as well.
Speaker 1:I think that fear is. It's funny because we want to blame religion for fear based systems, but if you've ever seen a child who has never been disciplined, they're, they're nothing but afraid. If there's no discipline in a child's life whatsoever, there are no boundaries. If there is no set goals for life, they grow up not knowing who they are and they're the most fearful people you've ever met. So fear is is simply part of the human experience. It just all depends on where you, how you use that fear.
Speaker 2:I think that the child is kind of in a natural state of being and we domesticate them at some point and I think the child who learns from the book of nature is going to learn humbleness sooner or later. They're going to get it Like you aren't the center of this universe.
Speaker 1:Right.
Speaker 2:You can't go around doing and saying whatever you want. You're going to need help, like it's going to be a harder path for the person, but they'll learn those lessons.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that's right.
Speaker 2:When the book of nature is going to teach them the reality of life.
Speaker 1:Well, and you take two. You take a six month old child and a one and a half year old child, boy and girl, and you sit them down. They're playing with their toys and the next thing you know the little boy is is taking all the toys from the little girl and he's he's keeping all of them. He won't let her move, he won't let her do anything. He's completely oppressing her. Now this child is not even two years old. This child was not taught that. No, this child, this is what's inside this child.
Speaker 2:And it's it's.
Speaker 1:It requires a bar of justice, a set of disciplines, a set of standards to teach this child as they grow up, like you said, to, to, to, to learn how to be a decent human being, a good human being. Otherwise, that law of nature will be very negative to them, because the consequences of becoming 18 years old and still has a lot of, and still having a year and a half old mentality are grave.
Speaker 2:Yeah, you might become president. You might be definitely, definitely qualifies you for a senator or congressman at least, at least.
Speaker 1:Yeah, especially if your dad leaves you $5 or $6 million.
Speaker 2:You know small loans. Yeah, Okay, All right.
Speaker 1:The all seeing eye. We're going to go pass at the anchor and the arc.
Speaker 2:Well, the all seeing eye. An interesting bid on that is if you look at your dollar bill.
Speaker 1:Right, yeah, tell me about that. You see an all seeing eye on there, yeah.
Speaker 2:And people always wonder, like I had a friend at work and he was. He brought money to me and he said look at this, this is a Masonic thing, I know that. What does it mean? And it's one of those things where I was being cheeky and I'm like, well, you got to join to find out. I can't tell you the secret.
Speaker 2:Really, it's not a secret. It's telling you the all seeing eye pervades the inmost recesses of the human heart and on a back of a $1 bill you'll see an all seeing eye at the top of an unfinished pyramid, Right. So what does this mean, Masonically? Well, let us tell you these. There's no secrets to this symbolism. The unfinished pyramid you'll find at the Scottish right building in DC.
Speaker 1:Oh, okay.
Speaker 2:It's built to be an unfinished pyramid as well. An unfinished pyramid represents that pursuit of perfection that is never finished. A pyramid is completely perfect in geometry, in its beauty, in its perfection of its conceptualization as a design, but the fact that it's unfinished represents the fact that our country's work is unfinished in perfecting itself and the all. Seeing eye at the top of the unfinished pyramid means you better be careful as you continue to do your work, because the creator is looking into your soul and so you need to have a pure heart as you do the work of perfecting your building. It's all right there. That's a Masonic, highly Masonic symbol on our currency and you can't tell me otherwise. No, no, I'm a free mason.
Speaker 1:Yeah, no, it's absolutely free. Mason and a new conceptus which is over the top. It means Providence has favored our undertakings. And below is Novus everyone's heard. Novus ordu Scythlorum, which means a new order of the ages.
Speaker 2:And that's where we get this new world order.
Speaker 1:Well, that's right, that's where that comes from, and all the conspiracy theories, but what they were talking about was that Providence God Providence has blessed our endeavors to bring about a new world, the new world through the Providence of God. And all of the concepts, all of them were based on the goodness of man being good to man, a system of checks and balances, recognizing those three Ruffians that are within every man and creating a system where all of us could explore our best selves by helping each other and growing with each other within a community of free speech and love, and getting through differences and national sins and national crimes, and all this stuff, and that's it's unfinished.
Speaker 2:It's unfinished. Sure, we got some work to do, yeah.
Speaker 1:It's always unfinished. I love the imagery there, yeah.
Speaker 2:And if you look to God, you'll stay on the right path.
Speaker 1:And how come this country is in such denial over the masonic roots of the Washington DC and the? I wonder why it's in such denial. I think it's because it's such a force for good that the enemies of good don't really want a system of self-government based on brotherly love and relief and truth that encompasses all religious belief systems into one house. That's really powerful and oppressive. Tyrannical governments cannot tolerate that.
Speaker 2:Well, I think this is you know for how many hundreds of years we've had a country that has taught a certain history, and so there's obviously we're many generations of people down the line. We aren't taught this stuff in school.
Speaker 1:Our parents don't talk about it.
Speaker 2:Our churches don't mention it. So when a weirdo comes up and says, oh, you know, this is a Masonic experiment, of course your reaction is gonna be like nut job.
Speaker 1:Right right.
Speaker 2:What are you talking about? Everyone I've ever known says otherwise.
Speaker 1:Right, right, and who are you to?
Speaker 2:challenge my you know entire belief system, so I get that aspect of it. It's not something I can ever tell someone out of the blue, right, or would, now that I'm a little more experienced in Freemasonry, because they don't receive it well and you sound like a crazy person to them. But if it's somebody in my life, like my wife's family and I can slowly get them used to the idea of.
Speaker 2:Freemasonry and they start to see it as not a bad thing. Then at some point I can inject. Well, you know, this is a Masonic experiment, right? And they're a little more open to hearing more.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and just fly a helicopter over Washington DC and look at the way the streets are laid out. I mean look at the way the monuments are laid out.
Speaker 2:This is a country that people say it's a Christian country, a Christian nation, but it's well. I probably agree with you that most of the founders were Christian. I don't think it was intended to be a specific faith-based religion. I do believe, if you read any of our works, that it is meant to be a spiritual-based country.
Speaker 1:Right.
Speaker 2:We admit there is a creator and a God and that we all are endowed with the same rights from our creator. It's in our constitution.
Speaker 1:That's right, that's right.
Speaker 2:The belief in a Supreme being is part of the makeup of our country, I think. I agree, it is. It is. You gotta go Calling it Christian might be taking it a little bit too far, but I get it because it was the predominant faith. But I think their slant was a little more Masonic in nature, that they wanted this place to be a bigger tent for all people of faith to come together and live in union under law.
Speaker 1:Right, it had to be because they left England and France and Holland where the church had become part of the government and the government had become part of the church. And as soon as that happens, it only takes about a generation to where the guillotines are set up and the gallows are set up out front of the church buildings and people are being hung and murdered.
Speaker 2:For heresy.
Speaker 1:And for heresy, and so they came here to get away from that and to pursue their religious structures and beliefs as they understood them. Now, the bulk of them most of them were Christian. Yeah, very faithfully, because the Protestant Reformation in the mid 1500s had spurred this exodus out of England I mean, I'm sorry, out of Europe to come across to the New World to be left alone to do what they wanted to do. The 13 colonies believe it or not, all 13 colonies had state churches.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:They did. Rhode Island was. I believe Rhode Island was the only one, not the only one. It was Quaker, but Virginia was Presbyterian. The official church of the state of Virginia was the Presbyterian church and this went on for 100 years. Man and all of these, all of these and the constitution of the United States was written to make sure that that state church does not become the federal government church. Right, and the federal government church would become an oppressive tyrant, like it always does, whether it's Christian or not. It could be secular. Right now there's a lot of people who believe our federal government is becoming a religion unto itself and now it's pushing its own agenda religiously and fervently upon everybody, because big, giant centralized systems always become oppressive, they always become tyrannical and it always mimics religion. It looks and feels like a religion, it just absolutely does?
Speaker 2:Any system of control is gonna share common attributes, I guess.
Speaker 1:That's right and that's why our founding fathers, who were Masonic and happened to be Christian men, most of them, but held these Masonic principles was we need to separate this. There needs to be checks and balances and we already know the law. If you look at the mural above the Supreme Court, in the center of it is Moses, but if I'm not mistaken somebody email me if I'm wrong on this but I think Aristotle's in there and Plato's in there. I think there's all these great thinkers of all time are found on that building, on the Supreme Court, building up there, on that apex. Now, that's not no Christian organization would do that. This was a Masonic idea that all the thoughts, all the thought processes, all the belief structures of the entire world come together under this system of government that was created and it's tough to deny, yes, most of them were Christians because they were fleeing Europe as Europe was expelling all the Protestants out of there.
Speaker 2:There's nothing wrong with that. Look at most of your lodges here in Florida. Most of the people in them are Christian.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I mean we have by far, by far, it's a huge number. You get a Christian Bible, yeah, as part of your master's degree. We have it on the altar of everything that we do. That's important.
Speaker 2:But it's not a church right.
Speaker 1:No, it's not a church, nor is it a religion. You have a place for that.
Speaker 2:That's right and it's important in the lives of most of our members, the church and they do participate, like you. We'll continue to probably get more involved the more you get into Freemasonry in your church.
Speaker 1:Oh, absolutely, it's happening now. It's already happening.
Speaker 2:They strengthen each other, but if you try to merge them together, things are gonna get ugly.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, that's right and that's why I don't believe in the separation of church and state was a letter written by Jefferson to the Danbury Baptist. It was just a comment that he made in passing. The gist of the letter was something totally different. It was an out of context thing and people have used that comment to say not freedom from religion, but freedom from religion, that the federal government's job is to make sure there's no religion anywhere ever.
Speaker 2:No, that's not true.
Speaker 1:Right and that's just ridiculous, but they are purging all the semilances of religion out of their midst.
Speaker 2:As far as the government's concern, and the funny thing is I couldn't disagree more on that one.
Speaker 1:The more they do it, the harder it gets for them, because people are not gonna be forced out of any of their beliefs. You can't force people to not believe something Right and it's just not gonna work. No, it's not gonna work. You have to embrace people's beliefs. That's right, not encourage them.
Speaker 2:But it works well in masonry because I do have good friends in my own lodge that are Muslim, pagan, buddhist every other flavor you can imagine and we sometimes sit together and talk about the big questions. We just did this the other night and it's an awesome experience. It is, it is. It is not to be missed.
Speaker 2:When you love someone and respect them you're curious what their viewpoint is when it's different than yours. If you are a thinking person and you wanna learn your mind, you gotta be watchful and guarded in your thoughts. If your mind is automatically taking somebody else's statements and trying to tear them down to fit into your personal belief system instead of listening and trying to understand what they're talking about, you gotta check your thoughts, Because this is how we grow. When somebody else is talking and they're saying something that doesn't compute with your own thinking, you gotta be listening and, instead of tearing it down, thinking about what's the follow-up question to ask to understand this better, so saying well, you know you're wrong, because my book says this.
Speaker 1:Your mind needs to go to a place of this.
Speaker 2:You know what? Let me ask you, because what I was taught is way different than what you're saying. What I was taught was this what?
Speaker 1:do you think?
Speaker 2:about that or how do you address that? Like that's how you have a civil discourse is approach it from a place of learning, not from a place of judgment and trying to make somebody else fit into your box. Right, that's right. And the fun thing is, as you talk, you're more open to moving. We've had conversations and I've moved closer to your opinion. Right, yeah, after we've talked about them Right, and someday, sooner or later you'll move closer to mine at some point. Absolutely, and that's what it's all about.
Speaker 1:Remember I say it all the time know what you believe and know why you believe it. These are important issues and you have to take the time to study them. It's not that hard. We're meeting in the middle.
Speaker 2:We're meeting in the middle. Neither one of us are sitting on the other edge of our streams, yelling at each other.
Speaker 1:No, no, because now we're bathing in the waters together.
Speaker 2:Now we're bathing in the waters hopefully with our swim trunks on, obviously.
Speaker 1:Well, the tide hasn't gone out yet so, who knows, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no no no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no no please don't hug me真的很. You know that.
Speaker 2:If you're bugged and no close hugging please.
Speaker 1:Well, that was quite a that was quite a rabbit trail goes some symbolism for you.
Speaker 2:There goes a little symbolism Welcome that was exciting actually it's true and you know, I, you, you, you tell people I'm a center-left person and that you're center-right person and I think that's fair.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I agree with.
Speaker 2:Yeah and it's hard, just hard in these, this political climate right to label yourself that way, because you become the enemy of a lot of people.
Speaker 1:It's true, it's oh, I believe me, man. I I absolutely know to call myself Center-right.
Speaker 2:By a bunch of. Christians Well even the right hates you. Oh they hate. Oh they hate is gonna hate you more. Oh they. You're losing everywhere when you label yourself these days right.
Speaker 1:And and if you'd know me, you know that I'm not a political person anymore. I used to be. I used to be very much a political person. I worked in the political system, I did my precinct work, I did all that stuff and I have checked out of it and I've never been happier now a lot of people say well, you have a responsibility to stay in there and be miserable. You know it's like no, I don't. I don't have to participate.
Speaker 1:Don't with you and your insanity. I just don't. It's not a suicide pact. I don't have to go down this road with you.
Speaker 2:You don't? I mean you don't have to like watch the news channel. Nope like you don't have to watch the debates you don't have to every time someone in the office says something, throw your two cents in. You don't have to do no. However, I think, as a citizen of our country, we owe it to people to participate in the political process, and I know you don't have to, but I don't think it hurts to At least kind of, like you know, stay up on the minimum of what's happening.
Speaker 1:I and I do, I do. I know you very much.
Speaker 2:So and you're totally capable of voting. I know you know in your mind who's who's the least, least of the evils that you have. I'm still registered as an independent, yeah and so I mean I would encourage you to participate, at least in the form of voting, but definitely not tell me.
Speaker 1:I would vote for JFK Jr I. Okay, I would have to, I would have to actually become a Democrat. I think I don't think it. In the no I didn't appendic, can vote for Jeff.
Speaker 2:Do you do you know? I would just don't vote in the primaries right, right, that's right.
Speaker 1:sit out the primary. Yes, that's why I stopped being an independent, cuz I was like man, I'm missing out on a half of this process. Yeah, I don't know, they're pretty much. It's pretty much fade it complete, isn't it?
Speaker 2:it is at this point.
Speaker 1:Yeah, almost a joke. Yeah, the primary process is a good job.
Speaker 2:Yeah, all the political system is now all my Republican.
Speaker 1:People that I know they're all big on. You know super Tuesday is coming for Iowa and the Iowa caucus is coming. It's like guys.
Speaker 2:Yeah, seriously wait when it's over first thing the front-runner isn't going to Iowa this year.
Speaker 1:Okay, so he's already said he's and he's not gonna do any debates this year. So what do you? What are we talking about here? Why even bother, I think? Anyway, I don't want to go down that road. But at.
Speaker 2:We know there is a road to go down there, though, which is there's a his a lot of historical things happening right now, whether whichever side of the road you're on, but you can't deny that we're living in crazy times like crazy literally are standing on the precipice of electing a president who may be serving from prison and I'm not saying he should and I'm not saying that I Advocate for this or that, but this is a possibility right now.
Speaker 2:That this could happen you could never have. No one in our past could ever have imagined we'd be at this place. We have a really good Chance of electing a president who also has a really good chance of potentially serving from prison or From an ALF, if we go the other way you know, an assisted living facility.
Speaker 1:I saw. Biden on the news the other day and I voted for Biden, just being clear.
Speaker 2:I would. I would vote for a wombat over the other guy, and that's the thing. It's not like you're voting for the best. They're not giving you good options.
Speaker 1:No, that's the problem.
Speaker 2:Even my party, at which I am a member of I'm so frustrated with everyone is frustrated with every party. That's the best we can do. The Crip Keeper Is the best we have to produce out of all the people alive and working in our government today. Get your crap together, people Well, I.
Speaker 1:Think that the only way our crap comes together is through some, some pain and suffering, because humans respond to that when, when we can, when we have to deal with the day-to-day Necessities of taking care of each other, then all of a sudden this stuff matters again and I think you know, if you look down through history, societies have changed for the better by going through a storm and you guys know I've talked about all the time.
Speaker 1:Rough seas make good sailors rough seas make good sailors and and I've said it before and I know there's a lot of brothers out there that agree with me, masonic brothers that agree with me that we're in. We're in for some rough seas. It's gonna get tough and this is a great time for masonry.
Speaker 2:Yeah, step up.
Speaker 1:We need shine more than ever more than ever, we need a multiplex of People in the Florida community who are willing to come together and help each other in what I believe is going to be a very tough time Maybe as tough as the Great Depression, in my opinion. But I hope not, but but I know I hope not to. I hope I'm wrong. I hope I have to apologize to all my family for all the things.
Speaker 1:I've been putting them through these past five years, but I Don't think I am. But let's not talk about that. Let's move on to our next topic. Let's see here the anchor and the arc.
Speaker 2:Oh, that's an interesting one because it's such a biblical reference.
Speaker 1:Oh, is it really? I didn't know anything about. You want me to read or you want to do it?
Speaker 2:You don't get the arc as a biblical reference. Oh, the arc I do, absolutely yeah the anchor and arc are emblems of a well-grounded hope and a well-spent life.
Speaker 1:They are emblematic of that divine arc which safely Waffs us over the temptuous seas of trouble, and the anchor which shall safely moor us to a peaceful harbor when the, where the wicked sees from troubling and the weary shall find rest. Oh, that's beautiful man, that's really great.
Speaker 2:So these people who eat babies and worship Satan are actually showing you symbols from the book that you know of revelation. Here, and we're talking about the arc, is a Masonic symbol. That the arc it in Mason Is a Masonic symbol. Here it is the arc.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that's I love. I let me read the whole thing again, because it's really beautifully written. The anchor and the arc are emblems of a well-grounded hope and a well-spent life. They are emblematic of that divine arc which safely warfs us over this to Temptuous sea of troubles, and that anchor which safely, which shall safely, moor us to a peaceful harbor when the wicked sees from troubling and the weary shall find rest. That's pretty good man Now the arc it's. This is the Masonic interpretation.
Speaker 2:Yeah of Noah's. Ark yes, so right, yeah, it's a symbol of hope and I love the for the future.
Speaker 1:I love how Masonry takes these, these concepts and ideas, and and and uses them for all of these different you know, stories and and allegories, yeah, that they use, you know. There's a, there's a lot of theology behind the art, you know.
Speaker 2:But I mean, this is so simple. Christian, yeah, absolutely.
Speaker 1:And Jewish, judeo, christian perspective Absolutely. Yeah, that's Old Testament, right, this is a this would be yeah, yeah, of course, it is six seven, and it is a symbol of hope.
Speaker 2:Right like one man got word. Hey, yeah, yeah, this isn't going well. We have to reset here, and it's a symbol of hope that even in that kind of a purge we can survive. We can last the storm and come out the other side Hopefully better, if we remember how we got here in the first place.
Speaker 1:Right, it's it is the absolute picture of grace and mercy to start over again, to begin again, you know, because it let's. Let's be honest the story of the ark is a story of judgment and. Judgment carried out and only eight were saved. And from the those eight, a Second new chance, a new chance to do it again, you know, by grace and by mercy was given, and from that line you know that son Seth, from that line came the line Of, of Abraham, and and all of that stuff that goes forward.
Speaker 2:So think about grace and mercy when you think about the fact that God killed millions of people.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I mean, we could get into that.
Speaker 2:It's the grace and mercy don't seem to go well with that story. I guess it does for the survivors.
Speaker 1:Well, I mean it's that's a deep conversation and there's a lot of theology behind it. Yeah let's pass that one over for this broadcast.
Speaker 2:We'll go, we'll go for that next, but it look it's a very interesting subject of conversation right.
Speaker 1:Well, and that suffice it to say on my part, is that the scripture says that mercy, justice without mercy, is an abomination to God. Justice without mercy is an abomination to God. So take that concept and and Filter all of this, this whole idea of judgment versus mercy. You know, and and all of that, and and you begin, you can begin to understand that you know, without judgment, I mean, I Love my children, I love them to death and I I don't want anyone to harm them or hurt them. Those who would do harm to them, I'm gonna stop them. Mm-hmm, I'm gonna judge them. Judgment, my judgment is gonna come down upon the man who is trying to harm my children.
Speaker 2:Mm-hmm right.
Speaker 1:So if you got to look at, you got to kind of get the concept from that point. Yeah societies that go down these roads. They get to the point where it gets like like the, the Aztec society.
Speaker 2:They absolutely in hearts out. They're ripping hearts out.
Speaker 1:They're killing their own children. Yeah because the harvest wasn't going well. They're throwing their children into a fire, right, you know. And the drums? The reason they play the drums loud, the drum circle, you know why to drown out the screams of the children. You know here the babies, so you don't hear the baby screaming as they throw them in the fire. So when societies go down these roads and they get to that point, well then, that's not good then judgment and justice comes in and and starts it anew and brings a new Loving mercy.
Speaker 1:That's the best I can do here in this context.
Speaker 2:I hope.
Speaker 1:I hope I haven't peed off every single person out there Not everyone, but I'm sure there's a couple of people that understand it. But to me and the anchor, the anchor is grunting yourself right.
Speaker 2:You're not floating willy-nilly on the oceans forever.
Speaker 1:Like you need an anchor and anchor right, truth, truth and and goodness right. We, we all desire the good things in life, that we desire them, and and to find them in truth, and to know who we are in truth. These are the, the good things that God has given us, and we do well to guard ourselves, to circumscribe our passions and to keep in check our vices. That we would not go down those roads but we would go down a higher road, yeah, a better road to better things, to that providence would bless us and give us that bounty that we all look for. You know those relationships I have a great relationship with you. I am grateful to God for it every day, see, and and that relationship was built. You know, I don't know where I'm going with this, but that relationship was built over time that the two of us now have together.
Speaker 1:Yeah, as a it was given to us. I don't know where I'm going.
Speaker 2:We kind of took it from our families and our work. Ain't nobody given us anything here.
Speaker 1:The build-up was great though, wasn't it? I was just going there, I was going, going, going and a powerful finishing.
Speaker 2:Gonna rip the head off at the end, see.
Speaker 1:Do we want to keep going? Yeah, we're almost there. We're almost there. We got a little time left. On the table. Our arc are, oh, the anchor in the arc our beautiful symbols of Freemasonry. And the anchor in the arc is that as the okay. So the next one is the 47th problem of Euclid which is also known as the Pythagorean theorem.
Speaker 2:Correct. That's what you were taught in school was the Pythagorean theorem. We call it the 47th problem of Euclid, but is an emblem of education to us.
Speaker 1:Yep, you only read it, the 40 yeah. I've 47th problem of Euclid was an invention of our ancient friend and brother, of our ancient friend and brother, the great Pythagoras, who, in his travels through Asia, africa and Europe, was Initiated into several orders of priesthood and raised to the sublime degree of master Mason. This wise philosopher Enriched his mind abundantly in a general knowledge of things.
Speaker 2:He was raised to the sublime degree of master Mason.
Speaker 1:He was indeed.
Speaker 2:Pythagoras.
Speaker 1:Pythagoras who lived in it doesn't give us a date, but well, what would you guess his life? When he lived. Yeah, I'm gonna say probably like 400 BC. Okay, right around that time now Freemasonry in Florida.
Speaker 2:Teaching teaches us that.
Speaker 1:I I like what you did there, but here we are saying that he was raised.
Speaker 2:This is a person Some 1300 years before Freemasonry teaches us Freemasonry started is now admitting that this man was a master.
Speaker 1:Should we look it up?
Speaker 2:interesting, yeah, okay, so while you're doing that, you haven't been in school in a while. We all know of the Pythagorean theorem, but what is it? It basically Establishes that any right angle, in any right angle, the square of two sides connected to the right angle is Equal to the square of the third side, correct?
Speaker 1:the hypotenuse and I've used that equation many times in building to square corners, large corners. Oh yeah, absolutely yeah, and we called it the the 6 8 10, the 6 8 10 rule. So six foot on the square, six foot, eight foot and then across the. The connection Would be ten feet and if you create that, it's always square. That corner is a hundred percent square, and that could be, that could be, that could be inches, feet, miles, or it doesn't matter. It's always the same. But guess what?
Speaker 2:this is also called the 3, 4, 5 triangle 3, 4, 5 as well.
Speaker 1:Yep 6, 8, 10. 3, 4, 5, 6, 8, 10 it's, it's in multiples of three.
Speaker 2:This is the a squared plus b squared equals c squared, correct?
Speaker 1:So the different references, that's the equation right, that's the how the equation is written out. But Pythagoras he died in 570 BC, so I was right around 400 in that era.
Speaker 2:Between 400 and 500 is when he there you go, yeah, yeah, and still that's a good 1200 years before Freemason re-existed and according to the Grand Lodge of England shall I read that again?
Speaker 1:then let's see Africa. Asia was initiated into several orders of priesthood and Raised to the sublime degree of master Mason.
Speaker 2:So, having died at the rut in 570 BC, one could say, perhaps he was an operative Mason, because Understanding this science was right it still is and always will be science will look like magic to people that don't understand it. So imagine there is no public school system, right? Only the few have knowledge, few. And when you have knowledge like this that always a Squared plus b squared will equal c squared, that is magic to people that understand science right.
Speaker 2:You, as an Operative Mason, can walk into a building and you know the 6, 8, 9 rule, right 6, 8, 10.
Speaker 1:Yeah, 6 8, 10, right, or you can look at it, go mm-hmm.
Speaker 2:Oh, needs to be that and to someone else They'd be like. Is he talking to God? How does he? Know how Like yeah in a way he is because he studied the book of nature.
Speaker 1:Well, I showed that this is how it works and it makes people mad too, because I remember being Superintendent on a job and going out to a giant slab and Pulling six foot one direction, six foot another direction, off the corner and then stretching my tape across from end to end, hoping to find ten feet and finding nine foot three, 9 foot 6 inches, which makes that thing four inches out of square good not good. Not good on a slab that big. That was a bad day for those guys. They had to fix that.
Speaker 2:Well, today it's common knowledge. Today we teach this to kids in school.
Speaker 1:This is how we right, right yeah.
Speaker 2:There was a time when this would have been sacred knowledge.
Speaker 1:So you only buy a huge right. And it was a lovely by master mason, master mason's, and it was a trade secret. Yeah, it was a trade secret.
Speaker 2:Yeah, trade secret is a better way to say it. Yeah, scary way to say it. Right, I love that. That's a great point.
Speaker 1:That's a great point. So so if Pythagoras was raised to the sublime degree of master mason and he died in 570 BC, well, we'll just leave that there. This wise philosopher enriched his mind abundantly in a general knowledge of things, and more especially in geometry or Masonry, making the distinction there, masonry and geometry being the same thing. On this subject, he drew out many problems and theorems, and among the most distinguished, he erected this which, in the joy of his heart, is called Yucra Eureka In the generic language, signifying. I have found it and upon the discovery of which he said he said is to have sacrificed a hektadome. It teaches masons to be general lovers of arts and sign. I'm going to have to read that one again, everybody. Page 122 in the Masonic Monitor. This is your homework. Get it out and read page 122, the 47th problem of Euclid, because this is huge man, I dig this, this is huge Right.
Speaker 1:Oh, I'm jumping in, I'm jumping in. I'll have more on this later.
Speaker 2:Yeah, this is great. So what is the 345?
Speaker 1:Yeah right, you said different numbers, right, 345.
Speaker 2:Like if you use the lowest common.
Speaker 1:Is 345. Yeah, 3 foot, 4 foot equals 5 foot.
Speaker 2:So what is 3 plus 4 plus 5 equal 12. 12. So they're alluding to the fact that they started with a gauge that had 12 equal parts.
Speaker 1:Oh right.
Speaker 2:And that they divided those 12 parts into a perfect triangle and then understood that that 345 was the secret, the secret to everything Geometry related, and in building it's the foundation of all measurement systems. To this day. It comes to life when determining what computer size you want to buy, measuring space for your new TV using a ladder. Even if you don't have a strong knowledge today of geometry, you use that. You use it at some point in your life every day. We all do, and so obviously it was an important theorem that this person created, and master masons would have used it every day too, but it would absolutely have been something they would have kept secret in their day.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2:Yeah, way too powerful for everyone to have access to this information.
Speaker 1:That's just so good. All right, the hourglass. And we can't do the synth because it's coded.
Speaker 2:Oh really.
Speaker 1:Yeah, we can do the hourglass.
Speaker 2:The whole thing's coded or just the optional?
Speaker 1:The bottom half of it.
Speaker 2:Yeah, Probably best to stay away from it. Okay.
Speaker 1:Anyway, the synth is cool and if you're not amazing, you don't get the synth. We get that. That's ours.
Speaker 2:I don't even know how to pronounce that properly. Is it sys?
Speaker 1:Right the sys.
Speaker 2:It's.
Speaker 1:S-Y-T-H-E. S-c-y-t-h-e.
Speaker 2:Okay, scythe, scythe. Oh, it could be, scythe.
Speaker 1:Boy, what Boy duh.
Speaker 2:I didn't know either, hey folks, folks.
Speaker 1:did we ever tell you we were geniuses? We've told you over and over again we have no idea what we're doing. This is just more proof of it. Scythe. Right and the one thing we can say about this he is an emblem of time. He's an emblem of time. That's all you get. That's all you're going to get from us.
Speaker 2:Well, you know what a scythe is in the real world, Just like basically used for harvesting things right, Right yeah. Everything has its time, including its end time.
Speaker 1:Right. We call that a sickle right. Is that the sickle, the sickle?
Speaker 2:I just Googled scythe and it says a scythe is an agricultural hand tool for mowing grass or harvesting crops. Right, it's historically used to cut down or reap edible grains before the process of threshing.
Speaker 1:Threshing. Oh right, okay, wow, tying things up here nicely, aren't we All right? The hourglass let's end it on the hourglass. It's an emblem of human life.
Speaker 2:Right.
Speaker 1:Hourglass is an emblem of human life. Behold how swiftly the sands run and how rapidly our lives are drawing to a close. We cannot without astonishment behold the little particles which are contained in this machine, how they pass away almost imperceptibly, and yet, to our surprise, in the short space of an hour they are all exhausted. Thus wastes man. Today he puts forth the tender leaves of hope. Tomorrow blossoms and bears his blushing honors thick upon him. The next day comes a frost which nips the shoot, and when he thinks his greatness is still aspiring, he falls like autumn leaves to enrich the Mother Earth.
Speaker 2:So beautiful.
Speaker 1:That is so good.
Speaker 2:Man, we know how to use words.
Speaker 1:That is so good, and you know, wow, masonry's not afraid to talk about death. We're not afraid to talk, we're afraid to have a room of contemplation about death, but we're not afraid to actually talk about death.
Speaker 2:We need to fix that. Rules don't always make sense.
Speaker 1:I was talking to a brother. My granddaughter's such a tangled web. We weave with all this stuff in life, but my granddaughter is my adopted granddaughter. My son adopted her from a previous marriage, from my daughter-in-law, but they're still in contact with their original grandparents, so they were out visiting the other day and I met them at my one. My other granddaughter is a cheerleader, so we went out to you know, to hang out with her and see her do her thing, and turns out he's a Mason. Oh, no way, yeah, and he's a Mason at that. The downtown Denver Lodge that I showed you those pictures of, that I was trying to get in and there was nobody there. It's a very famous old lodge in downtown Denver on the 16th Street Mall. Anyway, he is an ancient and accepted Mason. They are ancient and accepted masons.
Speaker 2:Ancient, free and accepted. Free and accepted AFNM. I think AFNM right.
Speaker 1:And it was just, it was really just an interesting, you know, conversation that I was, you know, able to have with him. I don't know where I was going with that, but thank you for getting to the end here. We ended on the hourglass.
Speaker 2:That is a beautiful explanation of time and why it's a symbol of human life.
Speaker 1:Yeah, oh where I was going is that the ancient and accepted Freemasons still use the chamber of reflection.
Speaker 2:Oh yeah, do they, yeah, they still do. I think it's a jurisdictional thing. I think each state decides that.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I think so. But they, he says they use all of them, the coffin, all that stuff. They do all of it.
Speaker 2:Maybe they'll bring it back to Florida someday.
Speaker 1:I hope so. I hope so too yeah.
Speaker 2:I think it was a mistake. Through, you know, we say that we're not going to change the system. And then we go and change the system.
Speaker 1:Right right.
Speaker 2:Why Let it be? It's there like for a reason.
Speaker 1:I think every single man should contemplate the day of his death. We should be Memento more man. Remember that you must die. Remember every day. Remember it, because you will live your life differently. I guarantee.
Speaker 2:That's true. People don't think about their demise and their death enough.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that's for sure, I know you shouldn't have it always on your mind.
Speaker 2:That can be negative too, but it doesn't hurt to remind yourself of and stay humble being. It's a fight to stay humble in life.
Speaker 1:Yes, especially when you're so good. Is it hard to be humble when you're perfect? I don't know. I haven't met that person yet.
Speaker 2:I mean, I met some better people than others, and that just shows you who's doing the work.
Speaker 1:That's right.
Speaker 2:It's like the ritual. You've been doing the work. When you see the ritual perform, it's the same in life. You know who's done the work on themselves. When you see how they behave in the world. Yeah, that's right, man, and staying humble is hard. It takes a hard work to always remember I have an hourglass on my desk.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I remember seeing that yeah.
Speaker 2:I do look at it sometimes when I flip it I think about that. I never thought about it quite in the way it was described, how imperceptible the movement of the grains are as individuals. It's happening.
Speaker 1:Right.
Speaker 2:And then that plays out in all of time and all of reality. That's happening, time is passing and sometimes it's imperceptible as it does, but you'll notice the effects sooner or later, so don't waste your time. How many times can Freemason re hammer that home, especially in the Master Mason degree, especially?
Speaker 1:in this one.
Speaker 2:Don't waste your time. Don't waste your time.
Speaker 1:Don't waste your time.
Speaker 2:Your time is limited and it's not like you're doing it because your fear something bad is going to happen if you don't do all this good stuff. You're doing it because your time is limited and we all want to do as much good stuff as we can with the time that we have Right. It's not a fear-based thing.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I feel compelled to just tell everybody out there are you separated from somebody because of pride or ego or offense? The hourglass continues to drop that sand man. Every grain keeps going by. Don't let that happen. Don't let that happen. Humble yourself, don't put yourself in a dangerous situation, but don't let time go by over an offense. Mend the fences, man. You only have one life. This is the only life you get. The hourglass continues to run. Mend those fences. Do it today, whatever it is. Are you separated from someone? Has something happened in your life where?
Speaker 1:the only thing that has to happen for healing is for you to change your opinion. Then change it, Then get out there and do it, do it today. I don't know who that's for, but it's for you, brother, if you're listening.
Speaker 2:It's a good message. And that really is the end of the explanation of the emblems of the Master Mason degree that we can talk about. There are other emblems.
Speaker 1:There's many others, and if you're a Master Mason, you have every reason to go to your open books class in the 23rd District here in Florida, because our most worshipful broom is turning our open books class into an actual what instruct the time of instruction.
Speaker 2:I believe that he has said that's going to happen, yeah.
Speaker 1:So get down there and open those books and understand your craft man.
Speaker 2:Listen, we were at open books a couple of weeks ago. There's a picture out there on the internet. It's a bunch of guys sitting around a book and really trying our best to learn this stuff, the right way.
Speaker 1:Oh yeah, I've seen that picture.
Speaker 2:It was difficult in the beginning, our instructor. It was kind of like a read-through on a play. It certainly was we all had the open books and the instructors looking at what the words say, and we're reading the words from our books, which we never do. We always try to see how much we know from memory and so when you do that, you know what you know, right, and you don't know what you don't know.
Speaker 2:But when you read it you're getting it right. And so his thing was read each letter, stop doing it from memory. And he could hear when somebody was doing it from memory and say go back and read it this time.
Speaker 1:I know you're doing it from memory.
Speaker 2:That was me and I know you know it, but I need you to look at those letters and read them to me one at a time. And it was like a laborious process.
Speaker 1:But it made a difference Wow. Big difference? I think Big difference yeah.
Speaker 2:I mean, I corrected so many wrongs and I didn't even tell people I was just making little dots next to words that I was like oh, I haven't seen that one wrong, Holy cow. And I repeat, could you repeat what that word was?
Speaker 1:That's what I thought you said. Okay, dot next to that word. Got to remember that one.
Speaker 2:You need to do that to perfect your ritual work, and that is the proper way to study it is. It's one letter at a time.
Speaker 1:It's called mindfulness.
Speaker 2:Mindfulness. Mindfulness to practice in a mindful way. Right.
Speaker 1:To actually consider every last jot tittle, every single one. Yeah, that's right. So, brother, once again another podcast that I'm really into. Man, this was great. Yeah, I really enjoyed it, man.
Speaker 2:We've now done bits from all three degrees to learn more about the exploration of how you can apply them to your life.
Speaker 1:And now the three lectures. Right.
Speaker 2:Bits from the three lectures and how you can apply some of that to your life.
Speaker 1:Now, we've always said that we're going to go back and pick a big one, big one and really dissect it. Do some homework.
Speaker 2:I think we're ready for that now. I think so too. To just take one thing and just really look at it from every angle.
Speaker 1:We'll talk about that this week and we'll put something together.
Speaker 2:Okay, and then next week let's put out a If you have any suggestions, email Fred at bondilevelwithfredandchristcom and tell him what to do. Tell me what to do, that's right. I'm the boss of Fred, that's right.
Speaker 1:And another shout out to our guy Fazio E.
Speaker 2:Brother, thanks.
Speaker 1:Thanks for the email, man. I really appreciate it. And you guys, the other emails I'm getting to you. I'm getting better at answering them. I apologize, it's just there's so much on our plates these days we don't get paid to do this, so this is a part-time gig that's becoming a full-time gig, our second full-time job. So we're doing the best we can. Please always know that we love you guys. Man, we're so grateful that you guys continue to listen and if you listen to the very end here you can hear the music coming on.
Speaker 1:You are our hero, man. Thanks for hanging with us to the very end. It means a lot to us. We love you, yeah, chris. So anything you want to say before we go out, brother, I just want a big hug from a friend. Okay, I knew that was coming. I knew that was coming.
Speaker 2:He's looking at me like okay, Anything else from Chris no. I do appreciate today. Every day that we get to talk about Freemasonry is special to me, and you're a big part of spreading light in Freemasonry now, so it's great to watch you grow as a Mason and spread your wings.
Speaker 1:I appreciate it. Thank you for everything that you're doing Well, it's my pleasure and it's my honor. And it's our honor to sign off one more time. This has been a production of on the level with Fred and Chris. We'll see you guys next time.