Kelly Smith: Why talking openly about mental health is so important

Can you take me back to your life growing up in Watford, and your earliest memories of playing football? 

Probably from the age of about 6 or 7. I was just in my back garden juggling the ball by myself, kicking it against the garage, and just enjoying myself with a football. With my brother in our front room, we would put the couches together and pretend that they were goals, a few times we would break ornaments and my mum would get mad, so we weren’t allowed a ball, so we would use a tennis ball, and then more ornaments would get broken so we would actually end up using our sock, that we have wrapped up. 

So, yeah it is probably from around that age, and I just loved having the ball at my feet and then my brother played for Garston Boy’s a few years after that, and I wanted to play on his team, obviously I was two years older than him but wasn’t allowed because I was a girl. 

So, I would always go and watch him play and train over the local park and I would collect the balls when the ball went down the hill and I would dribble it back up and try and get seen by the coaches, by just impressing them with my skills, dribbling skills back up and I was hoping that one of them would ask me to come and play. 

Were there other girls playing, did you play with other girls at all at that time? 

No, I was the only girl in my whole school, must of the girls would be off doing hopscotch and jump rope and stuff like that, and every time the bell would ring for play time I was with the boys, the only girl, jumpers down for goal posts, and just playing until the bell rung and then we had to go back in for class, and as soon as school was over we were back out again on the playground. 

I would actually come home just when it was starting to get dark for dinner, and then I couldn’t wait to get back to school again to play football. 

It is interesting isn’t it, because we talk a lot about that whole if you can’t see it, you can’t be it, but you didn’t really see anyone. Have you ever wondered why it was do you think that you had that passion? 

Yeah, I never really had a female football role model, because it wasn’t really the thing to do back then. I didn’t know that England had a womens football team, it was never on TV, it was never in the papers, but it was just something that I was really kind of comfortable with and good at, and just wanted to do it every single day. 

Even when I was at school, I would kick a stone home all the way to my front door. From the moment I left school, I would kick a stone down the pavement and just work on kicking it, and yeah, I don’t know it was just inbred in me from a very young age. 

I believe you were kicked of not one, but two boys’ teams, for being a girl. Why was that at the time?

I played for Garston Boys, I eventually got the call to go and play. I think my Dad had a word with the coach of the upper age group so I started playing with them, and made loads of friends which I still have today. I was a bit of a tomboy back then, I had quite short hair and looked like a boy, and word got out that there was this really good lad on the team, scoring loads of goals, and I became a problem when the oppositions parents found out that I was a girl. 

They would start shouting some nasty stuff at me on the side lines, and yeah they said that they weren’t going to field a team against me and my team, because I was the wrong sex and that it was a boys sport, and that I shouldn’t be playing, I should be going and playing netball, or hockey or something like that. 

So, my dad sat me down and said look you can’t play anymore, we will find you another team. I was devastated because I am only eight or nine at this time, and I just wanted to do something that I was passionate about and good at and being told that I couldn’t do it was soul destroying. 

So, we found another team in the same town, Heron’s FC, same thing happened again. I’d be scoring lots of girls per game, and it was never my team mates or the boys I was playing against, it was the parents of the opposition that had a problem with it. I think they were a little bit embarrassed by their sons getting a little made fun of by me taking a ball around them, and scoring numerous goals. 

You must have been so devastated at the time, but did it change attitude to the game? Did you think about going to play netball or other sports?

No, not really. I think that kind of fuelled the fire in my belly kind of thing, because I didn’t want anyone else to tell me that I couldn’t do something that I was really good at and loved. I didn’t understand it, as a kid you wouldn’t, when you’re being told that you can’t do this. 

So yeah, I think that hunger and that desire to prove people wrong, started from then really. 

I have seen that fabulous dads and daughter’s campaign with SSE a couple of years ago, and that supportive relationship of your dad is so clear. So, was he a big influence in that starting out of your career?

Yeah, massively. He has always been my number one fan, and advocate and followed me all of the world. He has seen me play in China, and the tournaments I have played in, so he was at the Olympics, every England home game he would make, not so much the away games, but yeah he has always been there, taking me to training, driven me up and down the country in tournaments. 

So, yeah, he is my number one fan and I love him so much for doing that, because if he hadn’t of done that, then I probably wouldn’t have reached the hights that I had. 

I love the element also of you and him in the car, and that time talking and analysing, I think that is so important as parents of children that are playing sport. It is not just being on the side lines; it is the valuable time you get to share together? 

Yeah, obviously the car journeys up and down the country, we would talk, we would chat, we’d connect. He wouldn’t ever really judge me on my football performance, he would just be supportive and encouraging. 

Whereas, a lot of parents now are kind of like quite aggressive on the side lines and hard on their children, he was never really like that with me. Don’t get me wrong, he would tell me when I did wrong or good in a positive way, but yeah he was always very, very supportive, and my mother also has never really loved football, or liked football but she was supportive in a different way, in terms of washing the kit, and having the dinner ready on  Sunday afternoon when we would come in. 

She hated coming to the games when it was cold, she didn’t like to see me get fouled or injured, so I was quite lucky that I had two parents that were there for me. 

You have obviously dedicated so much time as a girl to football, so do you ever feel that you missed out or did you feel that you missed out as a teenager on other stuff when you were training so hard?

I missed out on loads of birthday parties, social events, family events, weddings, as I started taking it more seriously, because I realised that I couldn’t be out partying and doing that kind of thing, because I really wanted to focus on myself getting the right amount of sleep, and in bed on time, and feeling fresh, but, I wouldn’t change it for the world, because I love my career. 

20 odd years I got the chance to travel the world, I obviously played in American professionally, played for England, travelled, played in two world cups, four European Championships, and an Olympics. Looking back now, now I get that, those sacrifices that you made all those years ago, I can get that now. Football is a short career, and I wanted to throw my whole being into it and be ready and focused, and I have got those parties, and weddings, and celebrations now because I’m still young enough to do that, and I am at home now and retired. 

You were incredibly young, just 16 when you to off to the US. How did that come about?

I was playing in the Watford football festival, which is a tournament that is close to my house, and we were playing against an American girls side in the final, and I was playing for a team called Wembley at the time, and I got notice by a scout that was watching the game, and the scout got talking to my father on the side lines, and said your daughter is really good, would she be interested in pursuing a soccer scholarship out in America, and at that point in my being, I was studying a BTEC sports degree for two years, and not really knowing where my career was going. 

Women’s football in this country, I was only training two nights a week, and I wanted to be training more, and really focus on being a professional, and that couldn’t have happened in England, and so I was fortunate enough that timing were right, my dad and myself sat down with the scout after, and mapped out how to give my contact details out there, and a few universities got in contact and I kind of pursued it that way, just via the phone, and then they flew me out to the university just to have a look, and yeah it was all done pretty much soon after, after a year of negotiations and getting me over there. 

Had it been on your radar, the opportunity for scholarships at the time? Were other girls going out there?

Yeah, I was aware of it because it was kind of like, for me that was more like a professional setting because you are training every day, whilst going to university and getting a degree, but you are training 5, 6 days a week. Whereas, as I said in England, we were only training two night a week, and it wasn’t very popular at the time. 

So, for me to get this opportunity I jumped at it, as scared and yeah just really scared because I was taking myself out of my comfort zone, and taking myself to country that I knew nothing about, and a coach that I had built up kind of a relationship over the phone, but I didn’t know anybody, and was just throwing myself into that situation. 

But, I was following a dream, because for me that was being a professional athlete training every day, there was no professional league there, but off the back of me going to university, the professional league started in 2001. So, I had a dream, that I couldn’t see, but it happened when I was out there, it started to happen. 

It must have been quite overwhelming to go from Watford, to New Jersey at 16, a lot to adjust too. You have talked about in your fabulous autobiography, the difference in the attitude of the game in the US then in the 90’s, to the UK, and the difference in perhaps the fitness levels and so on of players. Do you think that still exists today? 

No, I think it has changed whole heartedly, full 360 in terms of professionalism. You know, I took myself to the US because I was unhappy with the way the game was developing in this country. Now I look how all the players now are on centralised contracts, you are getting paid to play, all the players are focused full-time professionals in the league. 

Yeah, I has just come full circle, and now when youngsters come to me and say should I go to America on a soccer scholarship, I’m like well you don’t need to know. If you want to be a professional in this country, this is probably the best league in the world now, so you don’t need to go to America like I did. You can stay here, and if your dreams and ambitions are too play for England, then play in the WSL because it is a fantastic league, very competitive, and everything is there for you now.

And, you have certainly had, across your career, your fair share of injuries I think it is fair to say. Can you share how it feels at the time? So, for non-athletes like me, you get injured and that is a bit of a bummer, but actually for you that is so much more. So how does it feel when you are at the peak of your fitness and an elite player?

Yeah, it is very hard to deal with. Any player that is injured for a long period of time will tell you that it is very self-isolating because you are obviously use to training with the team every day on the pitch, seeing them in the changing rooms, and then all of a sudden you are in a cast or you have had surgery and you are on crutches and you are unable to move and do certain things, you are just house bound for a few weeks, and you are in the rehab room by yourself, you aren’t out with team, you see them going out, and you want to be doing that, and yeah it is a very lonely place to be. 

So, it is important that players in this day and age are able to speak to a sports phycologist, just to off load what there are thinking, and feeling, because it is just all natural thoughts of feeling sad, and not poor me, but it is hard to deal with, because you can’t do something that you are paid and love to do. 

Then I guess without the endorphins that sport and physical activity brings to you also? 

Yeah, I found it very hard watching the team, because I had to be out there, as soon as your rehab was done you would be out watching the team perform and that. So, it was just like hammering you into the ground even more. 

Then when you pull yourself away from it, then you are isolating yourself from the players, when you are in it and you are watching them it is hard to take and it is hurtful. So, it is important that you actually communicate and speak to someone about how you are feeling, which I didn’t do at the time and that is why I got into my problems. 

I was going to move onto that, if that is okay? So, you have been really open, which is fantastic, about your struggle with alcohol when you were in the states, can you use just talk us through how that difficult relationship began? And, I guess it is through injury really that started that is it? 

Yeah, I just felt like I lost my identity, because I couldn’t play anymore and I wasn’t the most confident person off the football pitch, I communicated when I had the ball at my feet, and was playing, so when I couldn’t communicate on the pitch, I just felt like I was nothing, and injured, and self-excluding myself it just was a lonely place, and alcohol made me feel better. 

I would kind of drink on a daily basis, after my rehab sessions just to numb the pain that I was feeling, and forget about the fact that I couldn’t play football, and that was kind of where it started. Then I had injury, after injury, as soon as I would get back from my first injury, another one would hit, and it would be like a small muscle tare or something like that, that would be a couple of weeks, it would be like a long lay off again. 

I felt like I was just getting myself back, and fit, and healthy, and playing, and then bang another injury would happen, and I was right back to where I was when that first injury happened. Just really low, and pulling myself away again. 

And away from home, and away from family, and comforts as well? 

Yeah, and wasn’t really speaking with my family that much when I was out there, because of the time difference. It was like we would set a certain time on a Sunday to chat, and then when I wasn’t feeling that well, I didn’t want to talk. 

So, I was even excluding myself and pulling myself away from my family, and they didn’t really know what was going on with me, because I am so far away, so I just kind of spiralled a little bit. 

You talked about you spent a bit of time at the Sporting Chance Clinic, which is set up obviously by Arsenal and England captain, Tony Adams. What was that experience like, it obviously positively helped you?

Yeah, I mean that was the second stint, I was actually in the Priory for a few weeks before that, then didn’t really complete the whole programme, pulled myself out of there, and then yeah Tony Adams. If was more athlete related rehab, where you sit down one on one with a councillor and you talk about your demons and how you are feeling, and there were yoga sessions, gym sessions, it was just kind of getting you back on track. 

I still have a repour with Tony and people at the clinic now.

I think addiction seems to be such a huge issue for people who have played sport at elite level, and not just alcohol and drugs, but gambling as well. It feels like it is a bit more prevalent in football, do you think that is the case? In terms of professional footballer and so on post career?

Yeah, I don’t know why it is, because you play at such a high level for so long, and you get the buzz and the feeling, and then when that is taking away, or you can’t do that anymore you are kind of looking for something else, somewhere else and when you get that through gambling, or that buzz, if you have that addictive personality, like I do, then you get yourself in problems. 

Do you feel now, people are more able to talk about those insecurities and those mental health issues that they might have post game, or around injury? 

Yeah, I think in this day and age now it is important that we do talk about mental health. I think it is more acceptable in this day and age now, I think it important that the Sporting Chance Clinic, all the football clubs know about it, and they have done a lot of work within the clubs to promote themselves, and if you are struggling the phone numbers there, or the emails there to get in contact with them. 

I did an appearance the other day with Prince William for the Mind charity, in terms of mental health and talking and opening up, and it is really prevalent in men, especially suicide. 

I’m very passionate about it, because I have had my struggles in the past, so I really want to be talking about it, and show it is okay to talk about it, it helps. Whereas, when I was going through my problems, I just shut down and didn’t. It was weak to talk, it was weak to have a problem, but it is the reverse of that, everyone has problems, everyone is human. 

Men are talking about it, and there is a lot of support around that, but is great to see you happy to step forward and speak about it too. 

Yeah, I think it is important that you talk especially as I have a platform, a profile, from my playing days. You know, I could’ve just pretended that everything was okay, and I started to do that in the early part of my career when I would do interviews, and they would say how did you deal with your injury I would just brush it under the carpet, not really feeling comfortable talking about my addiction, and how I really did deal with my injuries. 

Then, as I got a bit older, I thought I need to honest, it is hurting me to lie, and I want to help other people.

I have looked back lots of your interviews and your goals in preparing to talk to you, and it does feel like, you mentioned it earlier, you almost have this different personality on the pitch, to off the pitch, would you agree with? 

Yeah, I always so I’m kind of Jekyll and Hyde, when I was playing as soon as I stepped on that pitch I was just shoulders back, proud, whether it be for Arsenal or England, and just really wanted to win, and do everything I could to help my team in that situation, and I would kind of probably get into a few too many scraps, in my day, but I was just so passionate about winning and performing and trying to get my teams mates up for it. 

Then, when I stepped off the pitch, I was really quite not that person, quite shy, kept myself to myself, and a little bit reserved. So, when I was Kelly Smith the footballer, I was really confident, when I was Kelly Smith off the pitch, I was quite quiet. 

Interesting isn’t it. I love the story of you hiding in a bathroom once, rather than being there to make an acceptance speech as an award’s, and yet years on you were a studio pundit for Fox during the world cup, and BT sport and Sky and so on. How have you made that change? That must have taken something for you to put yourself out there?

I think it is just growing up, having a family, being comfortable within my own skin, yeah just putting yourself in situations where you are not comfortable. 

I remember that time in America, I was just so shy, the thought of getting up and speaking in front of this whole banquet and accepting this award, I just felt like I could not do it. I froze, and as soon as I knew that my name was going to be called, I was out the door, but now I don’t mind doing it. 

I did a speech the other day for the England youth team, and it is just talking about your experience now and being comfortable with who you are. 

Do you feel the world has changed a lot in terms of female pundits? Obviously, more commentators and pundits for both the men’s and women’s game as well?

Yeah, massively. Over the past 4, 5 years I have seen it, I think it is great to see females on there talking about the women’s game and the men’s game. Especially the men’s game because you get more credibility about it because there are male pundits and there are male coaches in the women’s game, so why can’t we transfer our skills into the men’s game? We have got just as much experience playing football at tournaments. 

Some of the men’s pundits haven’t played in half as many tournaments as some of my colleagues, such Eniola, Alex Scott, Rachel Brown, Sue Smith, they have played in many, many tournaments across a number of years. So, I think it is great to see, and I think it is also good that young boys and girls see female role models talking about football on TV, it is great. 

Amongst your amazing football achievements, you also played, you mentioned earlier at London 2012. So, I guess how did being part of an Olympic games compare to other Championships?

I didn’t know what to expect, because the opportunity has never been there the GB side, it was just the fact that it was in London we were allowed this once off Great Britain side. So, it was kind of put together all kind of last minute, but it was fantastic, just to be in the athletes village, it was something that you would never experience before, and to see Usain Bolt or Mo Farah just walking about in the big dinner hall, and different athletes just going off and walking to their events. It was just unreal, because when you are playing international football you are so far removed from all that kind of thing, you are just in a hotel by your self with your team, on a  training pitch, and then back in and you are just focused there for that one game. 

Whereas, this was just whole different experience, mixing with different athletes, and you were allowed to go and watch other events. That would never really happen when you were in tournament football in a world cup, you would just be focused in your team hotel, recovering, eating the right foods, watching a video of the team, or how you can just perform and be better. 

The Olympics was just a whole different ball game, in terms of just experiencing different things and being relaxed, and having the freedom to go out and watch other things. 

In terms of games, because you almost kicked off the Olympics in terms of the first game at Cardiff, that was the first? 

Yeah, we actually missed the opening ceremony. We didn’t get a chance to be in that because we had to be in Cardiff. It was weird because we were wearing a different kit, the blue and red kiT, so it was just a different feeling about it, and we had obviously different nationalities, Kim Little from Scotland, Jane Ross and Ifem from Scotland, so it was just different, but really, really enjoyable. 

The brazil game at Wembley, and obviously we have broken some of those records now, but at the time having that many people coming to watch women’s football in the UK? 

Yeah, 75,000 at Wembley, you know I remember walking out, and Wembley for me has always been the best stadium I have ever played in, in terms of what it means to be from England, and play at the national stadium, and the grass, and the seats, everything about it is just phenomenal. 

You walk out and you are just like wow. Then, to see all the people there, you know nearly a full house, I remember we scored quite early and the nerves were settled. It was just built up because Marta was one of the big names at the time, and we obviously won the game, but then got knocked out in the quarter final against Canada, it wasn’t meant to be. 

We have talked a lot about how sport builds resilience over time, and it certainly seems like that is something that you have got in spades overtime, so having over come so many injuries and challenges, did you think about giving up? Were there times in your career when you thought this is it, I need to stop now? Or, did you always know you were doing to keep on? 

Yeah, there were times when I was really low, and depressed and sad, you know two knee surgeries, two broken legs, three ligaments ripped of my ankle. I think after each injury, it just makes you stronger and more hungry to get back and prove people wrong, because after a serious injury like that, people start doubting you, and you hear that, and it just adds fire in your belly, and makes you think I want to come back fitter, faster and stronger, and prove people wrong. 

I always knew that I could come back from an injury, because I had that positive mindset in terms of pushing myself to be back, but yeah there were times when I wanted to quit, when I was really low, but I didn’t and that is what I am most proud of because there were some really dark time, but yeah  my resilience really shone through in that.

I am not going to lie, there were times when I just wanted to say enough now, I need to focus on a different career, but there was just something in me. You would have a couple of days at rehab where it would be really tough, and really hard and emotional, and then the next day you would feel really good and you would see progress. 

So, those days where you would see progress, were really uplifting and I use those more than the negative days to push me through. 

And, you were retired in 2017? 

2015, it was. Just before the World Cup.

Well obviously, it is always a tough decision, but was it a particularly tough decision or did it just feel like the right time for you then?

Yeah, it just felt like the right time. I had an injury just before that and I wanted to come back from that. I tore those three ligaments off my ankle bone, and I knew I wasn’t done then, I still knew I had a lot to give, and I knew I could get back from that. 

So, I managed to play for Arsenal for that one season, one the FA Cup, and for me that was just the final goodbye, because it was at Wembley and I had so much drive, and energy to perform in that game, and lucky enough we won the trophy. 

Then that season I knew it in the back of my mind, I wanted to hang my boots up, because I wanted to start a family too, and my age was pushing on, and my body clock was ticking, and I felt like I had done everything in my career. I retired from England to focus on that one year left playing at Arsenal, and yeah, I was lucky enough that as soon as I as I retired, I got pregnant straight away, so I was quite lucky. 

And, it was on your terms, I guess it is that thing as well it psychologically just helps you, you’re not in control, but you have made that decision rather than it being made for you? 

yeah, I mean I was fortunate enough, you are right, I got to decide when I retired, some players, some athletes don’t. They have to retire through injury, or whatever, I was lucky enough it was all on my terms, and I had that final say. 

Going onto start a family, is kind of a fabulous next stage of your life, but what was the hardest part have you missed elements of giving up playing competitively? What’s the bits that you miss most?

I miss seeing all my team mates on a daily basis, you know having the banter in the changing rooms, going away on the team bus, and connecting with everyone there, and I mean just putting the shirt on and playing on a Sunday. 

They are the main bits, but I really with two kids now I don’t get a chance to miss it too much. When I see games on TV, especially the England games, I think oh I would like to do that again obviously. 

Do you miss the ball at your feet? Do you miss the physical feeling of playing football?

I don’t right now, especially the last two years, but when I would play in a charity game or anything like that, like I played in Switzerland for a FIFA legends game a couple of years back, and I training a little bit for it and then when I was on that pitch I was like oh my god, I want to come back, I want to come out of retirement and do that. 

But, do you know what I played 60 minutes, and then for a week later, I couldn’t actually move, my knee swelled up, my ankle swelled, my hamstrings, it hurt to sit on the toilet. When I was playing for those 60 minutes, I was like I’m coming back, I’m doing it, but for a week literally I was in bits, so there is no way I could. 

And, do you think in enough is being done now to help female footballers to prepare for that retirement, life after football? 

No, I don’t think there is, maybe that is a gap in the market. I think it is very difficult for a number of players when they have dedicated their whole life to playing football, and then you don’t know how to be after, because you are not that footballer anymore, that identity that you have. 

And, almost professionalism almost make it harder in that becomes all absorbing, you are able just to have that as your career. Many more women will be able to do that in the future, but they’re not juggling studying or another career alongside playing? 

Yeah, I think it is important that the last couple of years that you are coming to the end, that you start looking and assessing, and getting those coaching qualifications, or whatever interests that you have in the after life of football, but it is kind of a worrying time, when you don’t have those qualifications, and all you have done is play football, you kind of start thinking what am I going to do next? 

There are a few players that have had problems coming to the end. 

You seem incredibly modest talking about your achievements, but how does it feel when people are talking about you as being a trail blazer for the women’s game?

Yeah, I got a little bit embarrassed by it, if I’m honest because you just feel like you are just normal and just had a great career, but there are a number of us, not just me and my generation, there is Faye White, Casey Stoney, Rachel Yankey, and even players that come before me, Hope Powell, Mo Marley, I could list a load of other females that have helped progress the womens game along the way, and made it where it is today. 

I think that is important that the youngsters know, the way the game is right now, it has not been like that forever. We had to fight for so much, to get paid, to have better pitches, to have better changing rooms, and obviously now St George’s Park is there for the senior side, for the England side, and we didn’t have that. We were training on really crappy pitches. 

I try and make it known, that the womens game is in a fantastic place now and it is going to reach more, better, heights, but it hasn’t been like that for a number of years. So, for us to help that game along the way, I feel quite proud to be named as a trail blazer as you say. 

Before you had the children, you were coaching at Arsenal, is that something you would like to return too?

Erm, right now, I just literally raising these two little rug rats that I have on a daily basis has all my focus, all my attention. That is not to say that I won’t get back into coaching, but right now the next few years I am just going to focus on them, until they are at school, and then see what options are out there. 

I would like to get back eventually. 

Do you enjoy the coaching? 

Erm, yeah. I wouldn’t say it comes naturally to me, I think football, I mean the ball is at your feet, I was loving it and enjoying my career so much, but I have to really practice and get the hours coaching, because it is a difficult thing to do, I am not going to lie, managing a team and a group of players, but I have to be fully committed to it, like I was as a player, just through everything into it, and right now I can’t do that, but neve say never. 

At the height of your career, I think you were earning about £25,000 a year or almost a fraction of what some of the male professional players earn in a week, how did that make you feel at the time?

It never really bothered me; I never really took that as a negative. It was like small little movements within the game, a lot of my team mate before that, were losing money to play for England and club football, were only getting paid minimum wage just to play. 

So, yeah when I was making that amount of money, I was just pleased to be earning a salary, and living off of that, because a lot of my other team mates, were struggling. I wasn’t struggling fortunately. 

Do you think there will come a time when women are commanding similar salaries to the male professional players?

The highest end? I’m not sure about that. I think little improvements each year, I think that it is great that now the whole league in this country is full-time professional, that is a massive progression, because when I was playing it was only a couple of teams that were professional and getting payed, so the parity within the league wasn’t very fair, now the competition is there, a lot of the top international players want to come over and perform in this league. 

They are realising that it is very competitive, and that is where America use to be, all the top International players use to go over to the states, now they are coming to England. There are so many nationalities now in the FA WSL, and all the spectators get to see top level players within our country. 

Are there elements of the men’s game that you wouldn’t want to be replicated in the womens game as it grows and develops?

VAR! All the troubles along with that right now, that is a big topic. No, I just like the way the womens game is, it is very pure, there is no real diving or antics to try and get people sent off, I think there is way too much of that in the men’s game, and I don’t see the women’s game going that way. 

I love the fact that the women’s players spend time with the fans after, and engage with them, and take photographs and autographs, and communicate with them after and build that repour. I love that within the women’s game, I don’t see that at all in the men’s game. As soon as the final whistle goes, they are off. 

Excellent, that is really good to hear and hopefully that will continue, and I know that you are an ambassador with Barclays, and working with them around the FA Schools Partnership. What does that involve and why have you decided to get involved?

I just think it is important that we get into schools, and try and get as many girls interested in football as possible because that is the drop off rate. Whether it is senior school or primary school they loose interest, so if I can get in and take some sessions, and share my story. 

Barclays have put a lot of money into the game to help promote it, and that is just one of the small aspects of me being an ambassador, and going into these schools and encouraging girls to play, and there is a career in it now. 

Not just if they want to play football, you can be a referee, you can be a coach, you can be a journalist, anything within the football game now, a pundit. A good few years ago the opportunities probably weren’t there. 

I love that idea that actually it is not just about playing, actually there is so many different options…

Yeah, it is really good for self-confidence, resilience, leadership, it is not just about playing, it can bring you so many other aspects to growing up as a young individual in school setting, I think it is important that there is a role model there for them. 

Like I said before, there was no role models for me, a female role model. So, if I can go in and just ignite or do something to a few female players out there, then it is great. 

And finally, we have seen so many incredible developments that you have alluded to in womens football in the last few years, but obviously we have still got a long way to go. So, if I could wave a magic wand and you were sort of head of the FA, for a month or so, what are the first things you would like to change in the women’s game do you think?

That is a very, very broad question, you need to ask Sue Campbell that! I don’t really know, I think we are heading in the right direction in terms of product, I think the product on the pitch is probably the best it has ever been, the resources now, the FA have so many people in position, marketing, comms, the games o TV, accessibility to the general public. I think the players now are house hold names, which is important because then you have an identity, you can follow that female. 

I don’t know, obviously attendances we still want to get more bums on seats, and keep them coming back, the attendances are up every year. The pure fact that the England team have done well over the last couple of years, and they have had that accessibility on TV, it really, really helps, so people can tune in and watch and follow, but yeah I’m not sure I’m actually fully qualified to move the game forward in that way. 

But it is going in the right direction? 

Oh yeah, massively. I just pinch myself, because from when I first started playing. We were playing in big baggy kits, the ankle sock bit I remember was up to my calves, now they have their own England female fitted kit. That is just a small part of it, they just get so much now from when I first started playing, there is youth teams now, and school teams, and it is just brilliant to see from when I first started with nothing, to where the game is now.