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You Can't Afford Me
Making the leap from employment to entrepreneurship can be a scary time. The biggest fear people have is the unknown. Here on the “You Can’t Afford Me Podast” we speak with hustlers and innovators on how to make the most of your journey. If you have questions we have answers.
You Can't Afford Me
From Broke To Booked: A Salon Owner’s Grit Journey
The glossy version of entrepreneurship skips the chapters that actually build empires: selling your car to fund fixtures, skipping paychecks to make payroll, and showing up at the front desk the day your team walks out. Natalie takes us into those rooms—how she left a legal career after harassment, turned weekend makeup gigs into a thriving salon brand, and rebuilt with a clearer culture and a steadier hand.
We get into the mechanics of sustainable growth: starting from a spare room, moving clients into a $900 downtown space, and using auctions, paint, and stubborn optimism to craft a premium experience on a tight budget. When the exodus hit, she learned hard lessons fast: fire quicker, protect culture, move good people into the right seats, and lead from calm, not fear. She also shares the expansion blueprint—why parking and neighborhood fit matter, how salon suites create owner-operators, and the upside of partnerships like bringing a luxury spray tan studio in-house to share acquisition costs.
If you’ve been burned by “experts,” the marketing section will feel like a deep breath. We talk real ROI vs. pretty grids, iPhone-first content that can outperform $7,000 rigs, monthly reporting that sparks iteration, and starting clients on smaller packages that scale only when revenue does. It’s practical, honest, and built on relationships. We also explore the personal engine behind it all: a marriage where a visionary founder pairs with a financially minded partner, kids learning tradeoffs in real time, and a community-first mission that makes clients feel seen through weddings, losses, and everyday life.
Subscribe for more unfiltered founder stories, share this with a friend who needs a push, and leave a review to tell us your biggest takeaway—and the one risk you’re finally ready to take.
www.themrpreneur.com
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unknown:Good.
SPEAKER_00:How are you? All right. Natalie told me she had to take a little shot of something to get ready for the podcast.
SPEAKER_02:One of my girlfriends, she uh has a podcast and she was like, girl, just just have a champagne or a shot before you go on. You'll be fine. I'm like, okay, well, I guess I can't.
SPEAKER_00:Calm the nerves, just having a conversation. Uh, real quick, just give everybody a quick rundown of who you are and what you do.
SPEAKER_02:Um, my name is Natalie Dunton. I own, um, I have kind of a, I don't know, portfolio now, but it's didn't start that way. But started with a salon and then had grown to have five Airbnbs, salon owner, couple locations, and then I own salon suites as well. Um, feels weird, you know, to say all that. But yeah, like I have a diversified kind of uh portfolio in the beauty industry, and then I got into Airbnbs, which I feel like everybody did kind of.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:I'm not unique in that way. Um, but had some property and it was just easier to do Airbnb than long-term tenants, so it's been kind of fun.
SPEAKER_00:Nice. Um, I wanted to kick this episode off with how we first met, and I asked you real quick off camera before if you remembered, and you said no. So I've I've been dying to tell you the story. So we probably got connected on social media like 10 years ago, which is right when I started my business. So I'm sure you do not remember this, but uh when I left my last full-time job 10 years ago, um, I was Ubering, and Uber had just come to Richmond. And uh night I picked up a ride, picked up a shift, and I go stopped at your salon, and like you and like maybe four of your stylists like came out in the car. And I mean, I think y'all were going downtown.
SPEAKER_02:Oh my god, I would have never thought that Uber was the thing. Yeah, I thought we met at some like business networking thing.
SPEAKER_00:Nah, it was me Ubering. So you guys got in the car. I saw you coming out of the salon, it was like eight, nine o'clock at night or something like that. So I was like, what do you guys do? And you were like, oh, I own the salon, blah blah blah. These are stylists on my team, blah blah. And at the time when I was Ubering, like it was just straight for now. I was doing it for the catch because I was broke as shit.
SPEAKER_02:Right. But uh we were both broke as shit. I was hiding it, but I was definitely broke.
SPEAKER_00:I could tell you weren't like overzealous about it, like in terms of like, well, hey, I'm a own this salon.
SPEAKER_02:I was just like I think perfected the art of wearing designer shoes with all target clubs. There you go. You know, and then nobody can like figure you out.
SPEAKER_00:It doesn't take a lot to look like. I mean, because now I you look at guys like Zuckerberg and guys like that, they're wearing basic t-shirts, jeans, and some decent shoes.
SPEAKER_02:Like, I am like the queen of you throw one luxury item in that you can wear over and over and over, and you just fake it so you make it.
SPEAKER_00:Yep, that's it. Yeah, but you guys got in the car. I remember just chatting it up, like everybody had my car, like, hey, what do you do? Blah blah blah. And then the notorious question most people ask their Uber driver is, at least at the time, was uh, is this all you do? Do you do anything else? And I was like, Oh. At the time I had my bubble soccer business, I had a ballet laundry company. And then before you got out of the car, I was like, hey, we'd just love to connect with you and like talk business one day. And you're like, yeah, here's my car, and you guys got out and partied. And I remember when you got out of the car, uh thinking, like, damn, that's what I'm trying to be. Like, I'm trying to get to this level where I don't have to Uber, where you know, I'm able to go out and enjoy myself. Because in those days it was like, man, I didn't have the cash to even go out and party on a regular basis or anything. And I was like, man, there's no way she remembers that.
SPEAKER_02:Dude, I don't, but I mean, I've I've taken a lot of Ubers, but man, it was you know how it is in the early days of your business. You're you're like presenting um a person to the world where and then behind the scenes, it's all grind.
SPEAKER_00:Yep.
SPEAKER_02:It is all grind.
SPEAKER_00:The late nights.
SPEAKER_02:Oh my god, and like I even it was so funny. I was going to my downtown location recently, and I even remember applying to be a school bus driver in the morning to make enough money to cover my payroll. I'm not kidding.
SPEAKER_00:Because I was like, People don't understand the payroll keeps a business owner up late at nights in the early days where you have to skip your paycheck just to make sure your people are covered.
SPEAKER_02:The number of things I pawned downtown used to have like a bunch of pawn shops.
SPEAKER_00:I remember those.
SPEAKER_02:I was there probably every other week.
SPEAKER_00:Yep.
SPEAKER_02:And I can't even tell you the things that I pawned, but it didn't matter because when you have a dream, everything is more important. Everything is like nothing is more important than the dream. Yeah. And like parting my parting with stuff didn't matter to me at the time because I was like, I know this is gonna work.
SPEAKER_01:Yep.
SPEAKER_02:But yeah, I mean, they probably thought I was like a crackhead. Right.
SPEAKER_00:I need that on a t-shirt. Entrepreneur, they probably thought I was a crackhead.
SPEAKER_02:I mean, like, if you have not pawned something as an entrepreneur, then I feel like you're privileged.
SPEAKER_00:I I was probably more of a Facebook marketplace flipping stuff. Because that was what like it was just giving me.
SPEAKER_02:If you had sold something of your own to pay your payroll, then I'm like, you're not, you can't sit with us.
SPEAKER_00:So obligated now that we've been going down that road, I'll tell you the one thing I remember selling as I was building my business. Um I'm I call myself a recovering sneakerhead now. So I've had like a massive collection. Like I just before we moved to this office in February, I sold my entire sneaker collection, which was probably like 150 pairs of shoes.
SPEAKER_01:Oh my god, I love sneakers.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, I I've I've been obsessed. Like at one point, I was spending like a thousand bucks a month on kids. I was. I'm that's why it's like I'm a recovery. I'm a recovering sneaker addict. So there was one pair of shoes. The the sneaker that got it all started for me was Jordan 13. Like back in the day, one of my friends, we were playing basketball on the block, and uh I saw my friend wearing the Jordan 13 flints, and I ran to my parents, like, hey, you gotta buy me these shoes, and they're like, Boy, your foot's growing an inch every other day. We're not spending this much money on the pair of shoes. So the thought was always in my head, when I make it, and I I have my own money, I'm gonna buy myself as many shoes as I want. So that's where that kind of came from. But I finally got my first pair of Jordan 13s that were like true retros. Prize of my collection, this is when I had like four pairs of sneakers. Um, I remember it came down to me being able to buy a new piece of camera equipment to produce something for a client or keeping the shoes. Yeah. I was at the time was one of the toughest decisions because so much of my identity was in that. But I was like, my dream's more important than this.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, and it's also if if you show any crack in the foundation to your people, yeah, you can't recover from that.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:And I can't tell you how many times, you know, in Richmond, especially, the salon industry, I mean, since I've been doing this, there have been multiple salons that lock the doors, lock the employees out, nobody has a clue. And most recently, bombshell and the people were like, Well, you didn't get paid for a couple weeks, and I'm like, I can't imagine. Like, I I've never I I think I one at one point when I was pregnant with my first child, I was a couple days late on a payroll. And that killed me. It killed me. That's the only time that's happened. And I just, you know, I don't take it lightly that I'm this is it's this is my livelihood, but it is other people's livelihood.
SPEAKER_00:Like they're depending on us to pay their bills and all these other things.
SPEAKER_02:So like and like I I really I take a huge responsibility in making sure that they feel safe.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:Like I I know what it's like to not feel safe. I grew up in a house with that didn't have like running water or electricity. Um and so I I'm like, I never want anyone to feel insecurity like that. Um so I I take it really seriously, and I think that that's something people don't understand about entrepreneurs and and the business owner. People think that we're just over your accounting money.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:And yeah, if you're if you're good at what you do and you do it long enough, sure, it should have a reward.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:But we're like, we're the ones taking the risks so that we can build something where you can feel safe.
SPEAKER_00:Absolutely.
SPEAKER_02:You know?
SPEAKER_00:Absolutely.
SPEAKER_02:And you can do what you love to do and not worry. Um, people are like, I want to go out on my own. I'm like, please, by all means, do it.
SPEAKER_00:I've supported people leaving your if someone comes to me and says, Hey, I have a dream to start up my own marketing firm, number one, like the people that are wanting to do something, just because we're in the same industry doesn't mean we're doing the same thing or going after the same clients. Like, they may want to focus on music videos and stuff like that, and that's just not an industry that I'm taking this business to. Um, if I can give them some sort of knowledge or some uh some guidance along the way and help them be successful, like to me, you become successful by making other people successful.
SPEAKER_02:You do, and it it it builds this network uh and a legacy where it also it exercises the muscle of running your business out of passion and not out of fear.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:You know, like I don't fear people leaving.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:I just had a girl this morning um who was doing my hair, and we have this apprentice right now, and and it's it's unclear if she wants to stay after she gets her license or not. And I feel like whatever she chooses to do, that's her decision. She needs to do what's best for her. But there was a time when that would keep me up at night.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:Where I'd be like, what am I gonna do? And also, I mean, my second year of business, I had literally everyone but one person walk out and start their own salon. Like, and that was when I met you, that was probably right after that situation and I was rebuilding.
SPEAKER_00:So you were like, I gotta go out and let my hair down, cut loose tonight.
SPEAKER_02:I mean, and that's another thing I realized is like you can't you can't get too close to your people. Yes. I used to want to be friends with everybody, and now I I hide my private life, my personal life. You know, you you can know what's going on, but you're never gonna be in my intimate self.
SPEAKER_00:Yes. Because they'll often look, and it's I've probably come to that realization more than ever over the course of the last 12 months. And that's the funny thing about entrepreneurship, is like so many years I feel like, man, I'm just getting started. Even though I've been doing this a decade, it's like I feel like I'm just now becoming that CEO that I've always wanted to be. But it's like when you open up those other parts of your life, like I'll say this publicly on the podcast, like I'm an avid golfer now. Um, actually have a tea time later today at 3:30. It's primarily with some bit Salisbury.
SPEAKER_01:Love Salisbury.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, gorgeous course. But it's primarily like this is a big networking piece that I do. But like on the outside, people look at that and say, Oh, Sam's just F and off today and he's out playing golf, like he's not working, and staff may be looking at that saying, like, we're in here working like dogs, and Sam's out enjoying the good life playing on the golf course. So now I don't post any golf content I get today, I won't post till the weekend.
SPEAKER_01:Right.
SPEAKER_00:So that on the surface it looks like, hey, like he's not screwing off. But like people don't realize that's also work. That's part of my job is out there developing connections.
SPEAKER_02:I play tennis.
SPEAKER_00:Yep.
SPEAKER_02:And I am I probably play tennis four or five times a week.
SPEAKER_00:Nice.
SPEAKER_02:It's something I do I do and I enjoy it for just like the physical exercise, but the mental piece. How many of the people that I play tennis with are clients of the salon?
SPEAKER_00:Yes.
SPEAKER_02:They all come to the salon. I am out there marketing myself, the business. I wear the hat of Avenue 42 in my salon all day long. Everything I do, and the amount, like while they're behind the chair in the salon, which I've done that too, you're bringing in the business. And so I don't feel bad about it anymore. And I finally hired a manager. She used to own her own salon, and she gets it. She's like, You send me the best client. And I'm like, Yeah, I'm I send you people that are the target market. They have like disposable income, they are loyal, they have a high, like they have a high um standard of service, but they're extremely loyal. Yep. And they tell everybody when they're happy. And you know, Richmond's like that.
SPEAKER_00:Oh, this is this is a very big small town.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, like when people are happy with something, they tell everyone. Yes. And everyone wants to work with the same trusted group. Um so it's hard to get into it, but once you're in, I feel like you it's it's hard to mess it up. Like if you do a good job, you're you're gonna not mess it up.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah. Let's get into the early days because a big part of this podcast is because entrepreneurship has very much been glamorized. Like we're playing tennis, we're golfing all day long, like we're doing all these things, like we're sipping champagne, like we're doing nothing but the fun stuff. Um, let's talk about the early days. So before you got into business for yourself, what did life look like for you? What were you doing?
SPEAKER_02:Um, so I was working in law. That was a paralegal going into law school. And I had one of those moments where I thought I had everything figured out. I don't know if you it's so funny. I'm kind of in like one of those moments right now where it's like, you think you have everything figured out and then life happens. Life's gonna life. And you have to pivot in a major way. Um so I was working for this law firm, and I I pretty much had it all figured out with how I was gonna be in criminal defense. I was clerking for the um who a woman who's now a Commonwealth attorney. Um, but I was on the defense side at that point before she switched over, and I I just felt so good. Like I knew I was 23, I had everything planned, and um I they hired this new lawyer. And he was like a murder trial attorney, and he came from Colorado, and he was like this big wig guy, and part of my job was to to help him get upset up with like his. I mean, I was just like an assistant. Yeah, I was like get your they at that point they did company cell phones, and um you know, I had to get him set up on his technology, and he was driving across the country, he had two dogs, and I don't know, I mean you're 23. Like I'm in conversation with him, like, hey, do you need help? Like, where do you put your dogs? Like, do you have an apartment? I was uh an assistant, yeah. And so this guy comes on, and I remember I was in um like on 17th Street where the farmer's market is, is where our offices were, and so I would walk all the way up. It was like a five-floor building over there, and I walked all the way up to introduce myself, and he like locked the door, tried to lock me in his office. It was a whole sexual harassment puzzle situation. And I he one of my biggest regrets was not pushing that forward more. Um, but what it did do for me was it taught me that I don't want to do, I don't want to put myself in this position ever again. And I got out of there, I ran downstairs, I went to my car, I called the female attorney that I worked for, and I said, Is this something that you deal with regularly as a female attorney? And she was like, You're gonna have to get used to this behavior. And this was like before me too.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, it was like the era of like madmen, like that's what that was making me think about.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, it was like, I don't know, maybe 2010. It was before me too. I think too I think me too was 2013, something like that. And I just remember um being like like shaking. Yeah, I'd never had that, I'd never felt like crushed that way. And this guy would say the most horrific he he said the most vulgar things, and I I just remember being like, I'm having an out-of-body experience right now.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:So it was in that moment that I said, I don't know if I can do this.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:And I had been doing hair and makeup on the weekends to pay my way through school. And so I kind of like I I left that job. Well, first of all, they told me that I could leave for a week and I have paid leave. And here was the thing that broke me. Um and this the guy that owned this practice has since been to jail, so I know that it was not being run very well. Um I go back a week later, they told me that they had they had a zero um tolerance policy for sexual harassment. I go back, they put the first day I'm back, they put me in a conference room with every employee in the firm, and he was there. And they wanted to talk about it. I was like, what?
SPEAKER_00:Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:Little did I know, while I was gone that week, he had brought in like a$10,000 retainer on a murder trial. Yeah.
SPEAKER_00:They were like, this is our golden boy, we're gonna take care of him.
SPEAKER_02:Like I said, being 23, I did not know that I had any choices. I went to a lawyer, he said, Well, my son went to law school with him, so I can't represent you.
SPEAKER_00:Jeez.
SPEAKER_02:So then I went to the Virginia State Bar and I wrote my own complaint, and I went in there, and they said, Who what lawyer wrote this for you? I was like, I wrote it myself. I'm 23. I'm like preparing to be a lawyer. And she said the detective went in and interviewed people and said, um, yes, there was like some egregious behavior here, but we can't prove that it's something that was horrible. And like they interviewed all my colleagues and they'd all heard him say horrible things. And and just talking about women's bodies and and he was just he was so awful, but I just remember thinking for the first time in my adult life that I have to take care of myself and and I need to choose wisely what I decide to dedicate myself to. Um and like I said, like I grew up in a really weird situation where I I grew up in a house in like the suburbs where no one would think that there was anything wrong. But my mom, after my parents got divorced, she like was addicted to Xanax and would black out for days and disappear. And I perfected the art of making everything look perfect so no one would think anything. Yeah. And I would end up in social services or child protective services. So I lived in a house in a really nice neighborhood with no running water or electricity. And my mom to this day doesn't remember any of it, and that's been a really good thing. But I remember being 10 years old, looking out the window of this beautiful home with no electricity and thinking I have to take care of myself.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:And it was the same feeling. So after that, I was like, you know what? I'm going hard into whatever I can control. I'm gonna control my own life. I don't want to rely on anybody ever again. I feel like most people have that moment where they realize that the world is not what you thought it was.
SPEAKER_00:Oh yeah. Every entrepreneur has a chip on their shoulder. Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:It's like I'm not ever gonna let you determine my happiness or my security. And also why I feel like those entrepreneurs that are the best entrepreneurs have a pain point where they actually care about other people.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah. You know, and you also look at from like the Hollywood perspective, every superhero has some deep story that like made them say, I'm gonna fight for good instead of evil.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, and it's funny because like I don't talk about this ever to anyone, but I feel like I should more because my the people who work for me should know that it's not rainbows and butterflies. Like this has been a hard, hard journey. And I did work so hard in my twenties so that I could not have to be behind the chair or with clients as I raise my children. Yeah. But you you do there's no escaping the work. Yeah, you do it in your twenties or you do it later. Like there's no everybody ends up putting in the same and there's no way around it.
SPEAKER_01:Yep.
SPEAKER_02:But one of one of my friends was like, you know what, now you need to talk about you know the struggle more, and I think sometimes you're just like that line where you're like, I don't want to let people too into my life.
SPEAKER_00:For sure. But how did that like hearing your upbringing, hearing the terrible things that you had to deal with at the law firm, how do you think those negative points in your life helped you where you are today?
SPEAKER_02:I'm fiercely independent and I have never, like I said, when we were talking about pawning stuff and selling things, I have never, I've never once doubted that I was gonna make it. I just knew this is a stepping stone for me. And that's I think that's probably the biggest the biggest thing I see with entrepreneurs now is there's so many options.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:Like, oh, if I don't make it, I'm like, I never had a choice. This was the only option.
SPEAKER_00:Exactly.
SPEAKER_02:And my parents thought it was insane. Um when I was in my twenties, I'm out there hustling, everyone's out partying. I was in the salon at one o'clock in the morning rearranging the furniture, like mopping. Um what I can say is if you believe in something so much, there's just not gonna be a setback big enough for you to stop.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, no, it's it's hit after hit after hit where I've always looked at those moments and said, like, there now that I look back over the last 10 years, like there's never been a moment where there was like some major obstacle that I thought was gonna break me in business, that once I got through that on the other side, you've realized how much more that's preparing you for where you're at. Like, where I sit today, I'm not saying like I'm a the I'm the king of the hill and I have the greatest media firm in the world, but I mean it's a far cry from where I started out. But like where I sit today and the clients we work with and the people I employ, five years ago I couldn't handle this.
SPEAKER_01:No.
SPEAKER_00:It's like the thought process of like, you know, people who win the lottery. Like if you come from poverty and you don't have any financial literacy, like I think it's like 90% of people who win the lottery end up going more broke than they were before they bought the lottery because you didn't have the skill set to manage that.
unknown:Right.
SPEAKER_00:So it's those things that like are preparing you for the next level. I think a lot of people just don't realize. So, how did you get from talk about that conversion? You know, you leave your job at the law firm, you've been doing hair on the side, talk to us about how you start to build that up and and the things you had to do.
SPEAKER_02:So I was actually doing makeup, but I I realized that I could get more work if I found a hairstylist that was proficient.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:And at that time, Instagram did not exist.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:So if someone was trying to find a hairstylist that did really good updos or whatever, like they can't just type in written updos. Like I found some really talented people. And I said in the beginning, I was like, I'm not gonna take a cut from you at all. I'm gonna pay you 100%. I just can't book as much work as I could if I didn't have you. And also the quality of your work reflects on mine. So the first year or so I basically just booked everything myself, worked all of it out, and then had a couple of hair stylists from Carrytown.
SPEAKER_00:Do you have a shop at this point or are you doing this from home?
SPEAKER_02:I was doing this from my home in Bellevue. I was I had a little house in Bellevue. Um and I had a little office and a little makeup station, and I would organize every trial, all the you know, the hair and makeup trials for brides and stuff. So I would book that with the stylist. And they were so happy for me to do that because they're like, I want to make some side money, but I don't want to deal with all of the other stuff. And then we got so popular that we needed a space because I couldn't have people coming in and out of my house.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:And I found this building downtown. Um, it was$900 a month. This first floor, this row house, and it was a church office. It had blue industrial carpet, yellow walls, like halogen light.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:And I went to, I mean, I I sold my car. So my dad gave me a car when I graduated from college. I had a Jeep. I sold my Jeep, I leased a Volkswagen Jetta in the name of my company$185 a month.
SPEAKER_00:Nice.
SPEAKER_02:And I used the money from my Jeep to outfit the salon. And I'm not gonna lie, I was very proud of it. Like it was I went to an auction to buy chandeliers that are still in my salon to this day, and I have had people stop on the street and offer me like$5,000 for each of these chandeliers. They're beautiful crystal chandeliers, and they were at this auction, and I had to stay until 1 30 in the morning. My boyfriend at the time went with me, and I remember I'll never forget, like, I'd never done an auction before, and they were like, someone else was bidding, and they were like, number 99, number 99. I'm like, oh my god, oh my god, I have to have these chandeliers, like this is perfect. And finally, it was almost one of those like God moments where they stopped bidding and I got them. Nice, and then I had to take them all, I had to like transport them all. So I think there's they're huge, there's like six of them.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah. And I had to load those in the Jetta.
SPEAKER_02:I thank God my boyfriend at the time, he had like a suburban. God bless him. He was a good guy. Um, yeah, it was just humble and but now you have that as a reminder constantly sitting in your soul. Yes, and I painted it myself and I did all the things and um well.
SPEAKER_00:One moment there too, I want to pause on is that here's where I think a lot of entrepreneurs mess up is we want to have the facade of success without actually being successful. Like most people that are driving around in a in a nice vehicle, not everybody, but most people that are driving around in a nice vehicle or have the best-looking houses or the best-looking clothes are typically the brokest people. Like they're in, you know, dead up to their eyeballs and things like that. So I've seen so many people in my space in the media uh industry where within their first year of business, they got to have the studio and they gotta have the perfect lights and all this other kind of stuff. And it's like you haven't built up a client base, and then within another year, they're out of business. Yeah. I did the same thing you did where like I ran this business out of my house as long as I possibly could. Once I started to bring on staff, I'm like, I can't have people running through my house. Like, I'm now forced to get the space. But what you did was I think the right step in terms of wait as long as you possibly can before you have to make that jump.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, and I'll be honest, um, if you do a good job, people were so kind. Yeah. I I never once felt embarrassed. Like my house was always very together, and um, and I I had made a nice space for them, but they knew I was just starting. And I I tell people all the time that your customers they want to be part of your success story, they want to engage with you when you're building. Everybody wants to be part of someone else's success story. It's just something that like it's innate. Yeah, um, so it was it was like really special. I think I spent$20,000 on the whole thing. Yeah, that was every penny I had. And then, like I said, two years in, I had my entirety. Team leave to start their own salon and my house got foreclosed on. I moved into the apartment above my salon and then ended up buying that building later.
SPEAKER_00:Who uh look at God. All right, hold on a second, hold on a second, hold on a second. You just you just unpacked a ton there. One, let's talk about all the people leaving because I know in that state of mind, because this happened to me before, where like I'll never forget, like the first person I fully employed when they came to me and told me that they were leaving, I felt like my world had just ended. Like I was putting so much value on this person to make my business successful. Now, looking back, you realize like you're the curator, like, you know, not to sound insensitive, but like sometimes people are just in your life for a season where like they're help they're here to help you build to this point, and then it's time for them to move on. Um, earlier on in those days, a lot of times I think the employees are making those calls, and as entrepreneurs, like we're too focused on the business to even be aware of those things. Now it's more like I'll earlier this year, I had two people that I hired, one videographer, one social media. I fired them both of them the first two weeks because it was evident to me they were not gonna fit well here. Now, years ago, I would have tried to make that square peg fit in the circle for the longest time.
SPEAKER_02:I think that is the proof of evolution with like being an entrepreneur. If you're willing to fire somebody like that and you don't look back, especially when they're talented, that shows me that you're evolved. And I still struggle with that. I mean, I had somebody in my organization for four months, and I kept her in there thinking things are gonna change. And it doesn't change.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah. I will say this.
SPEAKER_02:Sometimes the culture.
SPEAKER_00:Oh, that that's the biggest piece. I will say this. Sometimes we often have good people, we just have them in the wrong seat on the bus. Right. So, like, I recently I don't think I've said this publicly. There's one gentleman on my team right now, he's now our social media strategist. Previously, I had him as a social media manager, and somebody else that I had overseeing him was just like, he's not getting the job done, like he's not good at this, blah, blah, blah. And I was about to let him go, and then I was like, hey man, come in my office, let's chat a little bit. And once I started talking to him, I realized he has this whole other skill set that we were not utilizing at all. And then once I put him in that position, he flourished, he took off, he started training other people, and it was realizing that you know, I have to keep tabs on people enough to know am I g enabling you with the skill sets that you have.
SPEAKER_02:Well, one of my favorite American entrepreneurs is Mary Kay Ash, Mary Kay, the Mary Kay lady.
SPEAKER_01:Yep.
SPEAKER_02:And I learned, I don't know if you've ever read her books, she is she was so ahead of her time.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:She thought she was a gangster. Oh my gosh, she was such a gangster. And you know what? Her her ability to motivate people and her just her transparency. Yeah, but one of her biggest things was that if you find somebody that's good, you don't throw people away. We move them around within the organization until we find where they fit. And I always tell my people, I'm like, we do not throw people away here. We are dedicated to you. Now, yeah, if you disrespect me, disrespect the business, that's different. But if you're a good person and you want to be here and you are committed to the brand, we don't throw you away.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:We're gonna figure it out.
SPEAKER_00:Because it's also hard to find those people that are committed. So when they are, you need to find a spot if you can.
SPEAKER_02:And they're on a journey too. Like they don't know they don't know necessarily what their assets are, they don't know what their strengths and weaknesses are. And I think that is part of being a good leader, is that okay, no, like and then they feel they feel a level of comfort and security with you where it it frees them up to explore what their talents are. Absolutely. And that's the thing that's what we're supposed to do is figure out where people are supposed to be and the highest and best use for each person.
SPEAKER_00:Absolutely.
SPEAKER_02:Um so it's it's it's it's an art form. I mean it and it's it truly is. I never thought when I got into this that it would continually change and evolve as I have grown and changed and evolved.
SPEAKER_00:Absolutely.
SPEAKER_02:Right? It's like it's never the same. And I never wanted I'm I'm ADD, like I can't be in the same job over and over again.
SPEAKER_00:Every entrepreneur is ADD.
SPEAKER_02:We're so ADD.
SPEAKER_00:I've never been formally diagnosed, but I'm like, there's no way I don't have it.
SPEAKER_02:I used to be on the medicine for it, and I'm not gonna lie, I miss Adderall some days, but I I stopped taking it when I got pregnant, my first child, and I've never gone back on it. But I swear I was like, I I could get so much done, but I don't think I was as relatable because I was so focused, yeah. And now the people in my life who understand me know that we'll have a conversation and I start like drifting around. Like, okay, I'm like, I can't help it. It's just me.
SPEAKER_00:Yep. I tell I tell my people all the time, like when I first start somebody within their first week of them, I tell them, look, let me tell you something about my personality. I have ideas out the ass nonstop. I'm going to come to you and I'm gonna be like, hey, I got this idea, let's do this. When I tell you that, it does not mean drop everything that you're doing and focus on that. I'm just unloading what's in my head right now, giving you part of the vision. Just make a note and we'll circle back to this later.
SPEAKER_02:And thank God for the people who love us, because I was just I had it in my head that I was gonna sell my house last week and and buy this other house that needs so much work, but I saw the vision. And I have two kids, we're in a smallish house, but we've renovated it and it's perfect. Yeah. But I was like, I just think I think I need more space. No, and I went, God bless him. He my husband went with me. We looked at this house and he was like, Natalie, what are you doing? Why? Why? We're opening a new location and shore pump. It's like, can you just one thing before we do another thing? And I'm like, I actually don't know how to do that. Yeah, I'm just built differently. I can handle, I'm actually more productive when I have more going on.
SPEAKER_00:That's see, and when I took on like the serial entrepreneurial role, like similar to what you're doing, like properties, salons, all this. I don't think I'd be at the level I'm at now if I wasn't doing multiple things at the same time. Like if I had just focused on bubble soccer, if I just focused on my laundry business, I don't those were also catalysts for me to learn the things I needed to learn to get to where I'm today. But also, those were also different soapboxes and platforms for me to reach a different audience and start entering certain circles. Because I think with the bubble soccer thing, it was like this is goofy enough to get enough attention in Richmond that some of the people I want to connect with on another level of business are gonna be like, who the hell is this guy that brought bubble soccer to Richmond, Virginia? And I had a great business partner along with that as well, too. But um, you know, sometimes, because for me right now, like I'm I've just recently lifted up the hood on my business and I'm pulling out all the pieces of the engine. I'm like, okay, that part works, let's keep that. But this, this can go. We need to redo this. And I know some of the things I'm working on right now are gonna be revolutionary for what we're doing. And I was ready to roll this out. Luckily, again, trusted advisors and having the right people in your circle. I call up one of my advisors, I'm like, dude, this is gonna be amazing. Nobody in the country's doing this, and Richmond's like the catalyst for something like this, and blah blah blah. And I'm gonna have 15 clients under this like umbrella by the time we even oh man.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah.
SPEAKER_00:Let's get one client first.
SPEAKER_01:I know.
SPEAKER_00:And then once you get the one client, let's do this for a quarter, see how it goes, work out, work out the kinks, and then once you got a model that you know is gonna work with this, then let's go gangbusters.
SPEAKER_01:Right.
SPEAKER_00:And I'm finally mature enough and at the point in my life where I'm like, you know what, man, you are absolutely right. And recognizing, like, when you have those people in your life that can see things from a different perspective, like my best friend who is also an advisor, um, he's actually my financial advisor as well, too. He knows me sometimes better than I know myself. And he'll hear the ideas. He'll, Sam, I got you. That's awesome. I think that's gonna be wildly successful, but bruh, you're doing too much. Like doing too much. Put that put that to the side for a minute. Um, getting back to where you where you're opened up your salon, like you're dropping gym after gym right now. This may this may have to be a two-part episode. Um, your team basically left you.
unknown:Oh my god.
SPEAKER_00:Talk about starting, starting over, which quote unquote, it's never starting over because you have a new base of knowledge and a skill set at this point, so you're not truly starting over, but what was your mindset at that point and where did you decide to take the business? Are you trying to reach decision makers, entrepreneurs, and sales professionals? Then you can't afford your next marketing move. With six episodes a month and a growing audience of CEOs and industry leaders, your brand won't just be heard, it'll be remembered. Advertisers can place audio ads on our podcast and even secure visual placements in our full-length YouTube videos. This is where smart brands earn attention. Lock in your ad spot today before your competitor does. Email Sam at NzomediaFirm.com to receive more information.
SPEAKER_02:It was really hurtful at the time. I'm never I I've never felt quite as low as I felt in that moment. It was kind of a every business owner, at least female, if you're a female business owner who employs other women, there will come a time where you have a character assassination. And for me, it was I was like you, an entrepreneur, we love to support other entrepreneurs. So I had a girl that worked for me and her husband had a a training business. And I was in that space of my life, and I still love to work out, but I used to like to work out doing like CrossFit or it was called well, I don't want to say it. Um it was a it was a business that was kind of the CrossFit-like thing, but it was more on one-on-one or one on one and two people. So I was working with this person, and then they accused me of having a sexual relationship with her husband, which never happened. And that was spread throughout my organization, and it was just a pervasive um threat.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:And it's happened, you know, I with women especially.
SPEAKER_00:Women can be gay.
SPEAKER_02:The thing that they will choose is to slash email. Yeah. You know, and and in that listen, I have done something. But in this particular situation, I did not do anything.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:And I was everything I everything I thought I knew the trajectory of my business, and everything was pulled out from under me overnight. And I remember sitting at the front desk because I was like, hi, welcome to Avenue 42, and like, let me get you water, and I'm also gonna be doing your service today. Like, I'm a whole mom and show. One of my best girlfriends walked in and saw that the salon was empty, and she was like, What is going on?
SPEAKER_01:No.
SPEAKER_02:I'll never forget that moment in my whole life because she's still a client to this day. But she's been through it. You know, we have these people who believe in us that can keep us going. And I rebuilt. I had one girl who was uh an assistant, and I rebuilt from the ground up, and now I don't um I'm not afraid of that happening.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:And it's probably never going to happen again.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah. But because once you've been through it once, you know, okay, I did it before, I can do it again.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, there there's not much you can tell me that would scare me. And what's so ironic about this situation is that group went and opened a salon, they fell apart, and now I run a salon out of that space.
SPEAKER_00:Mmm. Mmm. Here, I gotta share my petty story with you because that speaks that speaks to my core. I don't believe in zodiac signs and all that. Do you happen to be a Gemini?
SPEAKER_02:I'm a Leo.
SPEAKER_00:Okay. I'm a Gemini, so I'm like, is this a trait of Geminis?
SPEAKER_02:No, but we get along. I've I have a girl in my salon right now that is um like into all that stuff. Yeah. And she's like, you and Geminis and like Leo's. I don't know, Leo's, I'm on the cush of Leo and Cancer.
SPEAKER_01:Okay.
SPEAKER_02:So I read both of them and I decide which one, which one I like better, which is a typical Leo move. But um, but I've heard that Leo's and Geminis work well together.
SPEAKER_00:So I don't know if you particularly went after that location out of pettiness. I totally would have in that situation. But uh the last employer I had was a mental health agency. This is still a dream of mine that I'm gonna make happen one day. So, like once I once I decided to become an entrepreneur, I'm getting pressed in Rich and Business with the bubble soccer business and the and the valet laundry. And I chose not to share that with the CEO of the company. Um, I didn't know he subscribed to Rich and Business, and he gets wind of it, runs in my office one day. Man, like he's all excited. He's like, Man, you didn't tell me you were an entrepreneur, like we could have been talking, blah, blah, blah. I could have helped you with X, Y, and Z, blah, blah, blah. Next thing I know, he's going behind my back, and you know, I'm starting to make that move to part ways. And I'm one thing I I'm really good at is creating genuine relationships with people. Same. So everyone there at the office, like, that's my dog, that's my girl, like everybody's gonna come talk to me. So he told somebody on the high level, he's like in a private meeting, he was like, uh, who Sam think he is? He's gonna go out and start these companies, like he needs me. Like, all right, big Sam, blah, blah, blah. So, number one, my best friend told me, He's like, Man, you gotta get a business car one time that just says big Sam. Like, that's that's all you put on it. But here is my goal, and I check up on this every year to make sure this guy's still in business and know where the location is. Um, this is my plan. One day, because I know he leases his office, I'm gonna buy that property. I'm just gonna pop in one day and he's Sam, what are you doing here, man? I ain't seen you in years. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I don't need all the small talk. Uh, I just came to pick up the rent check. What are you talking about, man? Well, I own this building now, so I don't want any electronic deposits. I don't want I will be here the first of the month to collect the check. And that's just a level of pettiness that I can never get over.
SPEAKER_02:It's it is crazy if you if you just trust, and for me, like I'm I'm a Christian, I believe that that God will reward our faithfulness. Absolutely. Not just like to be the perfect, you know, person without sin because that is not me. Like I no matter what, every time I'm in a in a desperate place, I always turn back to God and I allow him to lead me, and I trust that my life is being directed by him and and it's in the most imperfect way. And all the imperfection is me. And I just I have this belief that you know, it gives you little postcards like that where I'm in the space of the people that cause me the greatest pain. And I get IRS letters they from like directed to them all the time. I have forwarded them, I have taken them to their new place. They they're all in different places now.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:But like the IRS is sending a letter every day. And I'm like, guys, you know you think you think that you're doing something wrong. No, but you just gotta like keep going.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:Because if you're gonna get to a place where the people that hurt you, you're gonna see the real truth about them.
SPEAKER_00:Absolutely.
SPEAKER_02:And no no shame to them if they I don't I they're all in good place, like I think individually, because they've all disbanded.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:And I get referrals from them sometimes, which is crazy. Um, but you just have to like you have to keep going and to know and trust that you're doing what you're meant to do. Absolutely. And as long as you don't give up, you will be successful.
SPEAKER_00:I I fully believe at this point in my life, 90% of success is just not stopping. Yeah, just because I look at some of the people that have fallen, because I've I've come up with a lot of other companies that had similar business models. We provide the same service. They're gone and I'm still here. And when I look at the talent that they possess, most of them were more talented than me, better looking than me. Like just from the perspective of being a man of color, they have certain advantages that I didn't walk into certain rooms. And I'm still here, and it's not because I'm more talented, it's not because I look better, it's not because I had a better education. I just chose not to stop.
SPEAKER_02:Dude, and honestly, in your job, because I have employed so many people for marketing, your job, I swear, has the most phony people in it. Everybody says a marketing expert, social media expert. I cannot tell you the thousands and thousands of dollars that I have spent on marketing PR for people who and what's so funny is online they present themselves like they are some gods. Yes, and they have all these fake followers and like I can't even tell you. And it it's a it's but it has allowed the this new environment where the real ones can be lived at.
SPEAKER_00:Yes.
SPEAKER_02:I I just the last 10 years, I feel like the marketing world has been infiltrated by anybody who has an Instagram thinks that they're now an expert.
SPEAKER_00:And it's like you can pick out, I mean, I've been doing this long enough where I can pick out the fakes and the real ones. Um when you can sit down and talk, because like I first lead when I'm meeting with someone, I'm first here sitting down with you to educate you.
SPEAKER_01:Right.
SPEAKER_00:If you walk out of here and we never end up doing business, my number one goal is that now you know what to look for in a marketing agency. Whether you may just not like me. I gave you the right information, but we just ain't vibing. Um so number one, walking out of there with an education, but I think no matter what industry you're in, if you leave with value first, people respond to that. And I can sit down with someone and explain, they realize, hey, this guy, majority of clients we start out with, you know, I typically do things in tiers of threes with our packages. I normally refer to or defer to go into the first lowest end package with someone. Hey, we're just meeting for the first time, we're just starting a relationship. Hey, you can always go up in a package. Let's make sure that this is a good fit for us. Yeah, I could sell you in the$10,000 a month package. Let's start with this$2,000 a month package and make sure that this is the right fit. And as we continue to scale you up, I don't want you just pulling your money out of your pocket and you know you're going broke paying me. No, the money you pay our firm, I want that to be from the residual incomes that you're now seeing because of the work that we've done for you.
SPEAKER_02:I last year, so I'm only I only know about this because I'm going through a new location and I had to get a commercial loan, and they wanted explanation of some expenses from last year or the year before. And I paid this one PR agency$65,000 in a year. Do I have anything to show for that? No. It was all smoke and mirrors, and now I think what's happening is there are actual analytics that can prove that where we didn't have that before, where you can be like, hey, this isn't increasing my visibility at all. My engagement is not increasing. And now it's funny that PR agency now is like an ex hair extension brand, like they rebranded. Because I'm like, well, everybody knows that you're not doing what you said you were gonna do. And you have like a pretty Instagram, but that doesn't mean that you're actually value added to me.
SPEAKER_00:People don't care about the visual, like, here's what I've been preaching my staff last couple months. I don't care because, like, I told you I'm pulling up the hood and we're taking everything apart. There are some clients that we may do 32 posts a month for. Where my mindset is now is a client doesn't care how many posts we're doing for them a month. If we did one post a month and I charge them$5,000, but they got$60,000 worth of new business, they're gonna continue to pay that tab. They don't care about what they look like online, they just want the results. And I think the real ones, like what we do is every single month we give all of our clients a full report on their social media. Here are the things that are working, here are the things that are not, here are the things that we're gonna improve for the next month, here's a 30-day game plan for that. So we're always tinkering and moving things where like even now, like um over the last couple months, we've realized, you know, these cameras are like$7,000 rigs. But you look at like a food blogger, they're filming on their iPhone and getting 100,000 views. So in certain circumstances, these cameras are no longer valued as much. So, like, you know, when I first got started, it was all about having the look of a professional agency. Man, I'm gonna come in with as many bags as I possibly can and lights and all this stuff. And it just doesn't call for for sometimes. So now, even with high-end paying clients, I'm like, hey, we're trying something out new this month. We're not gonna shoot you on the$7,000 rig. We have a$1,000 rig that we're gonna work with and see if that changes anything with the algorithms. And I think most clients, as long as you're constantly innovating, they don't just kind of see you sitting back and checking off boxes, like, hey, we're gonna try this, we're gonna try that. Now we're doing micro-influencing uh marketing with clients. And it's like they just appreciate the fact that you're trying so many different ways to make them successful, that's all they're looking for at the end of the day.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, they don't care. I just had some new headshots done, and especially with the with the post like editing. I had some headshots taken of my team on an iPhone and in post, I can make it look very professional. I don't need to pay$2,500 for someone to come in for three hours and do some headshots. Like that. And for Richmond Business, that's what I did. I I do have some professional photos of my space done, but I mean, people come and go all the time. We're constantly asking to take new headshots. So it's like, no, snap a picture on a phone, we'll edit it. There's so many great editing apps.
SPEAKER_00:Absolutely. We're fine. Yep, we're good. I I'll refer there have been people to come to me and I'm like, I'd I'd love to have you as a client. It doesn't make any sense for me to charge you this amount. This is some stuff that you can be doing on your own. So I'll tell you what, you pay me 500 bucks, I'll sit down with you for the next two hours. I'll show you exactly what you need to do. I'll show you the software you need to use. I'll charge you a one-time fee of 500 instead of charging you monthly two grand.
SPEAKER_02:You know what business I think is so big right now, which I would love to hire, is just having like a an on-staff content creator.
SPEAKER_00:Oh, girl. All right, we're gonna wait till that when I talked about pulling the hood up, that's exactly what I'm doing right now.
SPEAKER_02:I just need a college student to come in and make four reels a month. I would grow my business so much, but I don't want to sit there for my business. I need to sit there from start to finish of a like a full highlight, a transformation. I don't want to sit there for four hours. Like my time is that more valuable than sitting there and you don't want to manage the talent of the creator doing this stuff. But if somebody wanted to come in and be a our like in-house content creator, oh my god.
SPEAKER_00:Okay, I'm not I I'm we're gonna talk about that as soon as the mics are off. I'm gonna run something by you. Okay, but uh I don't wanna because I haven't made this public announcement on that service yet, but we're gonna talk after this. Talk to us about um going from one location. How many locations do you have now?
SPEAKER_01:Three. Well soon to be three.
SPEAKER_00:So what what was even the thought behind the expansion? Because a lot of people, number one, it's it's a headache enough in itself managing one location. What was it about your business model that you said this is the the next evolution, this is the next step I need to take?
SPEAKER_02:I think it's just fits pretty clear. I had gotten to that point before and I got too scared and I pulled out at the last minute, just like just freaked out. I had two people leave, and this is what we were talking about before. Um, I'm not afraid of people leaving anymore, but I used to rely heavily on thinking that everyone's gonna stay, you know. And so I had two stylists right before I was gonna sign a lease on um a place in the near West End, which is where I am now. Um I'm downtown near West End at Shore Bomb, and then I have a font suit at Charles. So right before I was about to sign on this place, I had two of my best stylists leave and start their own place. They're since now out of business, as always.
SPEAKER_00:Um not to cut you off, the greatest quote I heard from Jordan was the biggest disservice I I brought to the game of the basket of basketball is I made it look too easy.
SPEAKER_01:Right.
SPEAKER_00:People don't see you in the gym at night, people don't see you staying up studying tape, and they look at what you're doing and they say, Oh, I can do that.
SPEAKER_02:Right.
SPEAKER_00:And you get out on your own, realize there were some things I didn't expose you to.
SPEAKER_02:What's so funny is even my the rep that I used for salon products and things, he came back to me and he was like, Yeah, they just you know, they they really wanted to just like do hair and not worry about you know probably cause and all that, and that got ahead of them, and then they were like, No, we don't want to do this anymore. And uh one of them is now like a fitness person, and the other one she's still doing hair but has not been able to hold down in a consistent place. But they're all too proud to come back to me. It's hilarious. Um I I got to the point where I just was maxed out and I needed a new location, and then I got too scared, so then I dialed it back in. I should have, in retrospect, made that move despite their actions, but I didn't and I learned a lot when I moved into the the space on Patterson Avenue. It was a no-brainer, and it was the space that my people had taken over and then they went out of business. So then I was like, okay. I mean, the petty part of me, the petty mentioned me and like I gotta do this.
SPEAKER_00:I'm so for that. Oh my god, I love that part of your.
SPEAKER_02:Um it's just it's growing at an astronomical rate. And I was like, you know, you're just gonna you're gonna have those moments in business where you second guess yourself, and I don't know that it was a mistake, it's just it was I just really don't like making decisions based on fear. Yeah, you know, and I don't ever think that's the right move, but at the at the same time, I still had a lot more to learn. Um, I ended up opening my salon suites in Charlottesville in that in the interim. I learned a ton with that.
SPEAKER_00:So is that more like people come in with their own businesses and you have the structure?
SPEAKER_02:I took a building and separated it into rooms and outfitted them and designed them, and then have been like a business coach and mentor to independent businesses. They're not part of my brand.
SPEAKER_01:Nice.
SPEAKER_02:So I did that in Charlottesville and I I really that was a great opportunity and like just a different thing.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:And then I came back to Richmond and we were bursting at the seams of the downtown location. The downtown parking is such a nightmare. Yeah. Such a nightmare. And I realized there was no way we can like operate a full a fully booked salon down here. People get tickets. They developed our parking lot into some townhomes, and it was just a whole hot mess. We signed a deal on Patterson, it was the best idea, and now we just signed a deal in Westbrook Village and Short Pump, which is a like a suburban area. But very excited to be out there because there were just there's there weren't many many salons out there, which is shocking to me. There's like hair cutteries and things like that, but there aren't there aren't any like high-end salons. So I already had so many people reach out saying they're excited about it. And then we're partnering with NudeFX, which is a luxury spray tan business. Nice. So they'll have a room in our space, and we can both we can both have the complementary access of one another's clients. Yep. Which will be good.
SPEAKER_00:Nice. Um I want to ask you two more things, we gotta wrap up. Um what is it about this space that brings you joy? Like for me, when I look at like we recently just signed a client, moved here from Massachusetts in November, and I mean this guy is like a dog. Like he knows how to just he could you could drop him in the middle of the desert and he'll build a three million dollar revenue business in the first year. Like he just has one of those personalities. And to me, that brings me so much joy when someone's like, number one, the fact that you trust me to take that on for you. But number two, to just be on that journey with them, like you were talking before, people want to be part of that successful journey and just to have a little part of that as they're continuing to build. What is it for you in this space that that brings you joy that still has you that you still have passion for?
SPEAKER_02:Mm now my passion is when I walk into my salon, I see and interact with customers that are in the community. They are all so amazing. I love hearing their stories. It's it's two parts. I love being part of the community and and giving them a business that they enjoy being a participant in. And then I love my staff being able to celebrate them getting married, buying homes, buying cars, going on vacations. I I can't tell you how many people have told me, like I'm so grateful to work here. I feel so happy to work here. And that's the thing that keeps me going now is creating a really healthy business for them that they never feel unsafe or like they're not gonna get paid. You know what I mean? And then I love just coming into the salon. Like the other day, I have this one client, she's this older woman, she's widowed, and she's our favorite client. She comes in, she's like a smart plug, and just her name's Susie. I love her so much that she lights up the room. And you know, I don't know if she's widowed her daughter past, I don't actually know how many times she's able to feel like everybody in the room loves her. Yeah. You know, I think that when you own a business, you have the opportunity to really see people and make them feel like I acknowledge your present. Yeah. Because as we get older, you can become kind of invisible. And maybe not even older. Like you can be you can feel invisible. And I want everyone who walks into my business to feel like they are seen, they are worthy, they're valued, and you know, not we're not gonna take a bunch of crap from people, but like we want people to feel better when they leave.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:And that's salons, marketing, all that. Like they want to feel that their time was spent in a positive way. And they leave and like they feel better after leaving.
SPEAKER_00:I'm sure in your space too, like it's almost being part therapist too. Like you're really getting to know these people when they're sitting in your chair. Like when I go to the bar, that's that's what dude, especially black dudes. I'm not sure what it's like at other barbershops. Black dudes, man, we talk some shit in the barbershop. Like, I mean, we're talking about life, like there are uh some barbers in there at the shop I go to now are like they're ready to branch out on their own and start doing some. And like when I'm sitting in the chair, hey man, here's what you need to do with marketing, here's what you need to do with this, blah, blah, blah. And it's just like a true culture. Um, I'm sure you guys see that in terms of like everything about what's going on in people's lives.
SPEAKER_02:I mean, I've had two clients recently who lost their spouses very suddenly. And I had I myself had reached out to this medium, and I have passed that on to them, even paid for a session for them to connect with their spouse, and and not in like a you know, spooky anti-religious way, but there are mediums out there who who are not it's not like like witchcraft or anything. They just can't do it. Not Miss Cleo type thing. And and they like I value them and I they know that this is a relationship. I see them, I love them. They come in and we do their hair and makeup for the funeral. I mean it it it is we're there in the high highs and the low low. And anytime you support people, especially you're supporting entrepreneurs, I mean you're gonna be going through everything they go through. And it's all it's like on a we're on a like a micro level.
SPEAKER_00:Oh, absolutely.
SPEAKER_02:We i you ask a hairstylist, they'll be able to tell you everything about their their clients. It's amazing. It's so cool. And it's like that beauty parlor thing, you know? Yeah. Like everybody knows everything. And we try to be very confidential, um, but it's funny how it's a community. People overlap. You're like, oh wow, okay.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, you built a community.
SPEAKER_02:Everyone, especially in Richmond, there's like one degree of generation to be homeless all the time.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah. All right, I lied before. I said this was gonna be the final question, but I got one more. Oh bad. I'd I'd be remiss if I didn't bring this up, and I try to bring this up um every episode um work-life balance. And as parent, how old are your kids?
SPEAKER_02:Three and five.
SPEAKER_00:Okay, so we're right at the same spot. My yeah, our daughter is five, our son is three, and he's turning four in July. So yeah, we had kids at the exact same time. Um to me, there's no such thing as work-life balance when you're an entrepreneur. It does not exist. But particularly from the viewpoint of a woman, where society tells you guys you can't have it all. Like, it's okay for me as dad, like for dads, I can get a trophy doing the bare minimum in terms of being present in my children's life. Um, and I do feel the bar needs to be set a little bit higher. Like, somebody sees me out with my daughter taking ice cream, they look at me like I'm the world's greatest dad. Like, no, this is a normal thing. I should be spending time with my daughter. Um, what's that like for you in terms of making sure that you're giving because there are certain things that only a mother can provide. Like my kids love me, but certain things happen, they're crying for mom, they're not crying for dad.
SPEAKER_02:They are. I mean, I'm not gonna lie, when I was leaving to come here, my three-year-old was crying, like, I don't want you to go. And I I try to explain to them, like, we're going on a Disney cruise in October for their birthdays. My kids' birthdays are September, October, so I'm combining their birthdays and doing a Disney cruise.
SPEAKER_00:They're in the gotta hope my wife doesn't listen to this episode because she's gonna try to push me on that.
SPEAKER_02:I am not, hey, I'm gonna tell you, I am not a Disney person and I am not a cruise person. But I my kids are in this moment of magic with that stuff, and I know that I can't take them to Disney World because A, the when you ride a ride, it's two people. My husband refuses to do any Disney related activities, which is fine. And my best girlfriend isn't gonna have a baby in September, and so she was always my person that was gonna go with me. And I was like, all right, well, you know what? We're gonna do a Disney cruise, and it's I'm I'm gonna get the nicest room on the boat and we're gonna make it a thing. And so I tell them this is really expensive, mommy has to work. Um, and I I try to teach them how money is earned. Yeah. But when they do chores or like things aren't free. And so it's funny how when I explain to them, hey, do you want to go on that Disney cruise? Okay, well then I have to go to work now.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:And they get it. They totally understand. Like, okay, mom working means we get to do fun things. But they still cry in there and they still they're it's one of the most beautiful things. Uh we go through all this hard work of growing a child. I mean, we should get something in return where they they want us first. And my husband will say, like, he knows they love him, but they cry for me first.
SPEAKER_01:Oh yeah.
SPEAKER_02:And he has a special relationship with both kids, but they they need their mom. And it's I mean, God, we deserve it because we go through a lot.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah. No, absolutely.
SPEAKER_02:And we're growing babies, like, oh no, we stinks.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah. My my wife will be the first to tell you, like, when I get a cold, it's like, she's like, You act like you're dying. She's like, I'm a stay-at-home mom. Like, if I have a cold, I still gotta take the kids to do this and do X, Y, and Z and blah blah blah. I'm like, look, I'm not arguing with you. Women are just built different. Like, if a man had to have a period every single month, like we would there's no way in the world we could deal with it.
SPEAKER_02:We're just we are and women are wonderful. And but men are great too. And I think that they're when you find someone, especially as an entrepreneur, when you can find a partner who understands what you do and they can support you.
SPEAKER_00:Absolutely.
SPEAKER_02:Like my husband, he they call him the snack daddy. He has taken on, he's taken on a million roles with the salon. He restocks all the snacks.
SPEAKER_00:Snack daddy.
SPEAKER_02:Snack daddy's here, and he loves it. Loves it. He does a lot of financial stuff too, because that's his his skill. And but you know, if you can find somebody who is enrolled in your dream and understands you as the creative person, yeah. It's I feel like we're kind of a power couple. I'm sure that's how you feel too, because there's gotta be someone like if you want to have a family and be an entrepreneur, like you gotta have support. Absolutely. There's no way you can do it.
SPEAKER_00:The biggest decision anyone can ever make as an entrepreneur is who you choose to spend the rest of your life with.
SPEAKER_02:It's true. Hands down. And and it's not always sunshine and rainbows. And when I met my husband, I had I owed taxes, like I was I was a hot mess. And he he is such a organized spreadsheet person.
SPEAKER_00:That's my wife.
SPEAKER_02:He helped me get back on track, and he's he laughs at me. He's like, It's nice to be able for one person in your life. I can't show that to my team, but I mean they all know. Like, I'm not the most organization is not my skill.
SPEAKER_01:Same.
SPEAKER_02:So I'm I have to bring people into my onto my team in my corner who have that skill.
SPEAKER_01:Yes.
SPEAKER_02:Now, the creative side, he can't pick out a paint color to save his life. I can, I'm like walk in, I'm like, this is how it needs to look.
SPEAKER_00:Yep. Sounds like our our relationships with our spouse are very similar. I'm visionary, I'm a dreamer. You asked me to organize things. So I just recently, two weeks ago, brought my wife on as executive assistant for the business.
SPEAKER_02:I saw her invit invitation for this meeting. I was like, Holly, is that she's your scrunchie girl.
SPEAKER_00:Best decision ever made. And for the longest time, I always said, like, I don't know how couples work together. I'm like, I don't think me and my wife's marriage would survive if, you know, X, Y, and Z. Because we've always said, she's the CEO of our house, I'm the CEO of the businesses. Like, all the money that comes in the house, I don't pay the mortgage, I don't do this, I don't, but that is all you, baby girl. Like, you handle that. Um sounds like me and your husband need to hang out together.
SPEAKER_02:I know we need to go to dinner.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, he likes snacks, he doesn't like Disney. Does he golf?
SPEAKER_02:Loves golf.
SPEAKER_00:Oh, that's my dog. Yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_02:Loves golf. You guys would be friends. He and he would probably benefit a lot from talking to you because he could understand. I mean, God bless him. He has he has found his way with me, but like it is hard to crack into the entrepreneur mind and he does a good job, but he's just, you know, I'm impulsive.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah. And I try I try to get my wife around the wives of the entrepreneurs I roll with because then the conversation she has when when this lady's like, oh, he was doing this till nine o'clock at night, and then he's got this talking, and she realizes, oh, it's not just my husband. This is how entrepreneurs roll.
SPEAKER_02:We're just a weird, we have like the entrepreneur blood type. I don't know what it is.
SPEAKER_00:Like she'll go to bed most nights around nine o'clock. I can't go to bed before 11. And I'm up at 5 a.m. to go to the gym.
SPEAKER_02:I used to be, after having kids, I I I used to be up at four, I did hot yoga at six. After having kids, and this is the one thing I think that I struggle with most because I actually prefer to be that way.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:But when I put my kids to bed, I fall asleep reading them books at nine o'clock, and then I wake up and I'm like, I'll actually get up at three in the morning and do like a couple hours of work and then go back to bed. Yeah. It I my my routine is off right now with little kids, and I don't know about yours, but mine will some they'll get up in the middle of the night and like we don't deal with we're not dealing with that anymore, thank God. So my three-year-old, she's trying to kill me.
SPEAKER_00:Like, nobody tells you before you become a parent that you're gonna have little terrorists in your house for the next like ten years. Like it's not till I mean, we neither one of us has gotten to that point yet, but I'm assuming around nine or ten, they want to sleep in late, and then of course you get to teenage years and this attitude, and they don't want to be around you anymore.
SPEAKER_02:My daughter's almost six, the five year old, and she I'm like, I just want to hang out with you. You're cool, you sleep all night. When you wake up, you come down with clothes on. Yeah. It it's like we talk, we have discussions. This is nice. My three-year-old is then over in the corner, completely naked, trying to light something on fire. Girl.
SPEAKER_00:Oh, wow.
SPEAKER_02:You would think it was a boy. She's crazy.
SPEAKER_00:As I've definitely learned, boys and girls are major differences. Yes. Major difference.
SPEAKER_01:Totally different.
SPEAKER_00:Last question. I promise this is the last question. It's a question I ask every guest on the podcast now. And you may have already stated this, so um, you may not have to think too much about this. I want you to describe to us your lowest moment as an entrepreneur. And it may have been selling your Jeep or like your team leaving, but like, what was that moment where you're like, I don't know if I'm gonna make it on the other end of this?
SPEAKER_02:I think it was definitely that day that they all it was a Saturday in May, which is the historically our busiest time, and they all walked out. And I had known, I knew they were leaving, like I heard conversations and they kept saying, No, we're not, we're not, and I ignored all the signs, and then they all left on a Saturday. And what's so funny is uh the girl that was in the chair she was there to get an updo for like the debutante. And I had to just do it, and I'm not a hairstylist. Like I I faked it into love. I did that up to and that girl And this is what I I want people to know about your lowest time is that pay attention, stay in it. Because that girl, Kate, she got married. I ended up doing her wedding hair and makeup. She moved to LA. She sent me a girl from LA was moving to Richmond, hair and makeup person. She sent me the best employee that I have. That girl in that moment. You just don't know what God is doing for you. You know what? You just have to like one foot in front of the other. And that was my lowest point, but it isn't that such like a beautiful thing that God does for us, is that in our lowest moments, he weaves in this thread of perfection.
SPEAKER_00:Yes.
SPEAKER_02:That and if you were to just throw in the towel and walk away, I never would have gotten to see that gift. And I'm not gonna lie, it took ten years. Yeah, but that person stayed with me, and she had, I told her later, I told her 10 years later, she had no idea that was happening. She had no idea that my entire team had just walked out. Yeah, and I just walked out there and I did an updo, and by the grace of God, I did an updo that was to her liking. And she's still, it's funny, her parents live uh one street over from me. Like she's still in my life. Nice, she's amazing, and it's just like you it's the little things that you do, the little daily like suiting up and showing up that I think matters.
SPEAKER_01:Yep.
SPEAKER_02:It's not the big dynamic moments. I mean, we wish they were already really please, somebody like glorify these big moments, but it's really not. It's it's the little day in, day out things that make you successful.
SPEAKER_00:It's that 1% every day. Love it. This has been an awesome conversation. Thank you so much for coming on. If people want to reach out to you, come check out your salon, how can they reach out to you?
SPEAKER_02:Uh, probably my Instagram, Natty Boo42, and then Avenue 42, so at 42 salon. Yeah. Ave42 Salon is our Instagram. But Natty Boo42 is mine, and I I run that one solely. So if anybody has questions about business or like salon services, and I've just started doing some like business mentoring and and consulting, I love talking about this, obviously. So uh I'm open to that.
SPEAKER_00:Nice. Please tell me your husband's Instagram is SnackDaddy.
SPEAKER_02:He doesn't have social media, but I kind of love that about him.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, that is a good when one person is out in front. He has no idea. My wife keeps her Instagram on private, and I'm like, she jokes around now, like, hey, if I jumped on your TikTok, like we'd be I'm like, I don't know if I want that.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, no, he doesn't have any of it, and honestly, I I I like that. He doesn't have Facebook, he never has. I put him on Instagram one time, and he started getting like reached out to by people he knew, and he was like, This is too much. I can't. I was like, all right, well.
SPEAKER_00:All right, tell Snag Daddy me and him are heading golf course pretty soon.
SPEAKER_02:Yes, I'll set that up.
SPEAKER_00:All right, guys, thanks for watching. We'll see you on the next episode. Are you an aspiring entrepreneur? Our one-on-one coaching tailor strategies to your unique business goals. Dive into interactive workshops, fostering skills and potential for success. Looking for an inspirational speaker for your next event?com to learn more and embark on your path to entrepreneurial success. Mr.preneur, empowering your entrepreneurial spirit.