You Can Build A Better Career By Staying Flexible

A million-dollar home used to signal one thing. Now it can mean almost anything, which is why we wanted a straight, behind-the-scenes look at what “luxury” actually means when you’re designing and building a true custom home. We’re joined by John Fleming, VP of Sales and Marketing for AR Homes Richmond, and he walks us through how a luxury custom builder thinks about design, finishes, timelines, and client experience in the Richmond, VA market.

We talk about the AR Homes model as a franchise business with local custom builder ownership, plus why that blend can deliver both big-builder capabilities and local craftsmanship. John breaks down “everything’s included” custom building, how full transparency pricing works with detailed fixed-price quotes, and what that clarity changes for buyers comparing custom home builder pricing. Then we get into the fun stuff: Tesla solar roofs, custom fixtures shipped from New York, a bathtub and chandelier shipped from England, putting greens, movie rooms, outdoor kitchens, pools, and the growing demand for golf simulator spaces.

The conversation goes deeper into careers, too. John shares what he learned from mentors, why executive coaching can be a smart investment, and how the 2008 housing crash forced a career pivot that ultimately made him more capable. We also dig into the reality of schedules in real estate and homebuilding, how to protect family time, and why modern sales and marketing now includes consistent social media testing on Instagram, LinkedIn, Facebook, and TikTok.

If you got value from this, subscribe, share it with a friend in real estate or homebuilding, and leave a review. What would you build into your dream home first?

Transcript

Welcome And Guest Introduction

SPEAKER_01 0:04

Welcome to the You Can't Afford Me podcast. If the Fluff and Real Entrepreneur, real property, and the unfiltered journey. Hey guys, thanks for joining us on another episode of the You Can't Afford Me Podcast. So our guest today here in the studio. Do you like million-dollar homes? Because this guy is in that space. We met, geez, how long ago? I would say at least five, six years that we've known each other.

SPEAKER_00 0:34

Then about five years ago, you did a video with the realtor in one of our sales offices. Okay. And uh we've just kind of stayed in touch from there.

SPEAKER_01 0:43

That was it there. And then he's kind of branched into a different career path as well, too, alongside was working with the company that you've been with. Um and we're just gonna get right into it. So today in the studio, we have John in the in the studio. How are you doing today?

SPEAKER_00 0:57

I'm good, I'm good, and thanks very much for having me, Sam. Always enjoy talking to you and spend the time together. So this is fun. So give everybody a quick rundown of who

What Sets AR Homes Apart

SPEAKER_00 1:05

you are and what you do. Yeah, so I am John Fleming. I'm the VP of sales and marketing for AR Homes in Richmond. I'm responsible for our all of our sales, marketing, and branding efforts. And can I give you the quick 30 seconds on AR Homes? So um, AR Homes, there's several things that set AR Homes apart as a luxury custom builder. First, we're a franchise business model, so very entrepreneurial. So I did not know that. Yeah, AR Homes is founded in 1953. We operate in 10 different states. In each of our markets, there's a local custom builder that owns the AR Homes franchise in that market. So in our case, it's Matt Ellington and Ellington Custom Homes. Matt's been building custom homes for over 20 years and just he's he's built a really quality reputation for building a great home. So AR Homes offers our customers, the big builder abilities of AR Homes, but also that local customer, uh local custom builder expertise. So we have full design capabilities. We offer over a hundred different floor plans, all can be fully customized. Um we can design a home for our clients from a blank sheet of paper. If our clients are already working with an architect or bringing somebody plans with them, we can build those plans as well. We consider ourselves an everything's included custom builder. So just our included features and and what we finishes and what we offer in our homes is just very, very high. So other than the customizations that our customers make and maybe some of the outdoor package type of things, like um pools, uh outdoor kitchens, fireplaces, things like that, our customers don't really need to add a lot to their homes. For instance, we've we've all been in a model home where the model home included over $100,000 in options, and you're trying to figure out what's included and what's not. We try to make it very, very easy. Um, another factor is we we call it full transparency pricing. It's essentially fixed pricing. So we provide our customers with a very detailed price quote up front. Yeah, 22 to 25 pages, and list every single home and every single item in the home right down to the towel bar holders. So versus most custom builders take an allowance style approach where everything's allowanced or uh cost plus approach. And you never really know how much the home's gonna cost until you get to the very end. Um and then finally we do uh operate in communities, but we're also an on-your lot builder. So if we're working with a client that already owns their land or has an area of preference, we can certainly help them with that. So uh yeah, so those are the biggest things that really I think set us apart in the market.

SPEAKER_01 3:33

Love it. And did you correct me if I'm wrong, did you get your real estate license not too long ago?

SPEAKER_00 3:38

I do have my real estate license. We'll probably get into that a little further in the conversation, but um, I also uh am a member of Shaheen Ruth Martin Fawnville Real Estate, better known as FRM F R E, and specifically with the brand group and Kristen Baran. So so we're having fun with that relationship.

SPEAKER_01 3:54

Perfect, perfect. And if I can just add a caveat to the the homes you guys built, some of the most beautiful homes me and my team have ever been able to film. Like you guys at that price point, you know, now you remember growing up and somebody's like, I live in a million-dollar home, you're expecting like basketball courts and tennis courts and pools and stuff like that. Now a million-dollar home can be like a little three-bedroom shack, but like you guys are one of the only ones that when I'm looking in that price point tier, I'm like, this is what luxury living looks like. Like, especially those outdoor spaces in the kitchens. Like, you guys just have a beautiful product with that. Um, so

John’s Path Into Homebuilding

SPEAKER_01 4:28

let's take it back. Appreciate that, yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Let's take it back. Let's go back to where did all this start for you? Did you go to college after high school? Where did you grow up? All that good stuff.

SPEAKER_00 4:37

Oh man. Um, so uh yes, I went to college. Um, after college, I got into the home building industry. I have been in the home building industry for over 30 years and just have loved my time in the industry. I've held a variety of positions in the uh in the industry. It's a hard business, it's a challenging business, but it's a very rewarding business. What I love about the business, the home building business, is um at the end of the day, you can see what's been accomplished. So maybe there's a foundation that wasn't there yesterday, um, or maybe we've just framed a house. I can go back to communities that I was a part of 30 years ago, and I still have those memories of what I was doing at that point in my life and just knowing that that I was a part of that. So I love that. Um, I love being a part of new communities and neighborhoods. I love building homes and watching people move into their new homes and become friends and neighbors and sometimes really create lifelong relationships. Yeah. Uh with AR Homes, it's just been amazing because truly every one of our homes is uniquely designed for our particular client. So to get to go on that journey with our client, kind of bringing their vision to life and bringing a dream home to life for them, it's a really cool experience. And just kind of the quality of the products that we get to work with and the quality of home that we deliver. It's uh it's great.

SPEAKER_01 5:59

What what did you major in in school that kind of led you into this field?

SPEAKER_00 6:03

Yeah, I guess it helps a little bit. So I'm I majored in mass communications. Okay. So public relations, uh, advertising. Where'd you go to school? Um, I went to Towson University in Baltimore. I'm originally from uh the Southern Maryland area. Oh man, you're not a Ravens fan, are you? Uh, you know what? I grew up a commander's fan. Okay, I can live with that. But I will say, because I know you're a Steelers fan, uh our two daughters grew up being Ravens fans because we lived in Columbia, Maryland for a long time. Yeah. And when the Ravens started up, our daughters gravitated toward that, but I tend to gravitate toward the commanders.

SPEAKER_01 6:36

Nice. Uh so what what was it? Did you have any jobs before you got into this space? Was it straight from college and you went straight into the home building space?

SPEAKER_00 6:44

You know, I knocked around a little bit right after college, and uh I mean I'll share a funny story. So um there was a company, a corporation at the time called U.S. Home Corporation. They were the largest home building corporation in the United States. And I took a position with them as a superintendent trainee. And honestly, they were gonna pay me a lot of money for that time for knowing absolutely nothing. So the less I knew, the more valuable I was to them. Their philosophy was they were the only builder who really knew how to build a home. So if you didn't know anything about home building, um, the less fewer bad habits they had to break you off.

SPEAKER_01 7:18

Come in green, they can train you how they want you.

SPEAKER_00 7:20

Yeah, so they did. So um, U.S. Home had a great career path. They took you from superintendent all the way up to what they called vice president of construction. Then you got into their management development program where they really trained you to be a PL profit and loss manager. Uh, and from there I did that, um, got into some division president roles uh in a variety of roles in the industry, uh, and just had a great journey of doing that. So that's kind of the short story of my career path.

SPEAKER_01 7:46

How did you talk to us about? Because I think anybody that's been in the same industry for over 30 years, like you have to have some strong connections. So talk like if somebody's listening to this and they're like, you know, this is always an industry I've thought about going into, talk about how you were able to cultivate what relationships were important for you to continue in your career, and how did you get and cultivate those relationships?

Finding Mentors And Keeping Learning

SPEAKER_00 8:09

You know, for me, I I promote for anyone. Um, if you're interested in a particular industry, you need to find a strong mentor. So I was fortunate enough in my career that I had a uh uh my supervisor uh early in my career. He loved working with younger people when I was young at the time. Yeah, and he loved mentoring people and watching people grow and just seeing their careers, you know, push forward and and grow forward. Uh and those are really important relationships that I had. And I had some other mentoring type relationships and people that I could look up to and people that, you know, if I was having a struggle with something, just something was was very challenging, you know, I could pick up the phone and say, Hey, how do you do this? You know, what what do you think about this? Um I I always think of a person, uh, he was um my controller in one of my divisions, and he was a younger guy. So, and he would seek out mentors in different industries um and just really to find out about their business model, how their business worked, and how he could grow as a person. The other side of that is um continue your education. You gotta continue learning and growing. And I've done some of that myself, but this particular person I I think about, you know, he went to the Darden Business School, and and now he's he's a division president for one of the larger public uh builders in the nation and one of their largest divisions, so he's doing really, really well. So you know, I would say find mentors and continue improving and growing. You don't have to necessarily go to a business school or get your master's, yeah. You know, there's courses, there's certifications. For me, even just um getting my real estate license and kind of introducing myself to that aspect of the industry. Yeah, there are some sales, uh, some sales leaders, gurus I call them in the uh new home industry that I follow um and I attend their seminars. You know, I'm always looking for ways to grow and get better. You know, for me, um I've been in the the workforce for a long time now. It's keeping up with the technologies and making sure, you know, that I know how to do the social media, Instagram, LinkedIn, you know, Facebook, all of those things, and and that I can stay relevant. So those things are important to me.

SPEAKER_01 10:17

Absolutely. Here's a question I get from people all the time like, because you can't just walk up to a guy and be like, hey man, will you be my mentor?

SPEAKER_02 10:24

Uh-huh.

SPEAKER_01 10:25

How did you find because oftentimes like the mentors that have come into my life, it wasn't necessarily that I was looking for a mentor, uh-huh, but once I engaged with them, it was like, okay, I think I can learn a lot from this person. So how did you navigate even finding mentors along the way?

SPEAKER_00 10:40

You know, it's very much like you did. You know, back when I was coming up, uh, mentoring was still kind of a new thing, believe it or not. So uh again, my first supervisor just kind of took me under his wing. You know, I think he saw some potential, and I'm glad he did, and he just helped me grow. And then as I went through my career, kind of like you, I would just see certain people that I would say, you know, I can really learn from this person. I'm gonna I'm gonna stay close to them and I'm gonna, you know, learn from them and do what I can do. And then uh, you know, that applies to your personal life too. Um, you know, my faith is very important to me. Um, and there's some some faith leaders and some groups that I participate in that I'm I just learn so much from those people. So I think, you know, if you're looking, if you're alert, you can learn from a lot of people in your life. Oh, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 11:24

And it can be from afar. Like, I try to have a mentor in every aspect of my life, whether it's the spiritual piece, the the physical health, the business, the relationships. Like, there's always someone that's going down the path that you're going down. And why bang your head up against a brick wall if there's somebody that can show you how to avoid those mistakes?

SPEAKER_00 11:42

Absolutely. And another huge thing right now that I would always promote is uh again, it wasn't available maybe in earlier in my career, but executive coaching. So there are some really good executive coaches out there, and the great thing about them is they're outside of your business, they're outside of what you're doing. So you're they're looking at your circumstance and your business objectively and kind of coaching you. Um, sometimes it's coaching you how to manage people, how to be a better leader. Um sometimes it's coaching you how to be more profitable or more successful. But I think that's another form of mentoring. I mean, you have to pay for those services, but it's a good investment. Um,

The Real Hours In Housing

SPEAKER_00 12:20

but there's a lot of coaches out there now.

SPEAKER_01 12:21

Yeah, making that investment in yourself. Yeah. Um, talk about because, like, especially in I'm not sure if it's as much on this with the builder side of things as it is in terms of like an agent or broker. Um, what does the scheduling look like? Because like when I talk to my real estate friends, it's like the weekends they're Super Bowl. Like they may be able to take off on a Monday or something like that, but like Saturday and Sunday is when they're out showing homes. Is it the same in the building industry or are you guys typically just like nine to five?

SPEAKER_00 12:48

Um, it's it's the same in the building industry. It really is. Um, we don't have an open model right now, so my schedule's a little bit different. But uh in the new home industry, they say that after the Super Bowl, the spring market starts. So for new home builders, we're right in the middle of the spring market. So it's a busy time. And for those who have models open, you know, you need to have your models open. But um it is very much like real estate. You know, if it happens to be your day off and somebody wants to meet you to buy a $2 million home, then that's probably a worthwhile investment. Um, or staying later to help a client or a customer because, you know, again, um, people are working and a lot of people want to meet in the evenings and the weekends. So you have to be available to take care of your customers if you're gonna be successful. Um, new home construction, uh, real estate is not a nine to five job.

SPEAKER_01 13:35

Yeah.

Luxury Custom Versus Production Building

SPEAKER_01 13:36

I'm gonna I'm gonna make an assumption, so correct me here if I'm wrong. Um, I'm assuming some of the other home building companies that you work for, they didn't necessarily have the same tier of clientele that you're currently dealing with. So if that is the case, kind of talk to us about the difference in terms of building homes in, you know, the four, five, six hundred thousand dollar range versus once you get over a million.

SPEAKER_00 14:00

Yeah, so this this has been uh a unique experience for me and a great experience for me. So um kind of backing up a little bit. So I joined AR Homes in 2019. I was really looking to make a career change or just go in a different direction and develop some new skills. So I really liked the AR Homes business model. AR Homes enrichment, they opened in the market about mid-2018, and I joined them in early 2019. So I was pretty early in the process. Um but anyway, I really liked the business model. I liked I knew Matt and I knew uh his partner, uh, so I liked the investors. Um I like the entrepreneurial spirit of it because it is a franchise, and while you've got the main AR Homes Corporation, yeah, each building company, each franchise has to be able to stand on their own. They've got to learn how to grow the business, manage the business property, properly, um, be profitable. So, and I love being a part of a startup. So that's a really cool experience. For my background, I've really been more involved with production style builders. So, you know, I've managed divisions that have done 400 homes a year, you know, those types of things. Um and you know, it's it's all about production and getting the next home built, you know, building and delivering a quality product, but getting the homeowner in that home and then kind of moving on to the next one. What I love about AR homes is our cycle time right now is about 18 months. You know, from the time that we sign a home building agreement. So I might be working with somebody for two years before we hand them the keys. And you build, when you're with someone that long, you really build some very personal relationships and you're with that person through a really long journey. And the nice thing about it is we are able to stay in touch with our buyers after that journey. You know, as a luxury custom builder, high-end custom builder, you know, our goal is to do about 10 homes a month. We're not trying to do 400 a year. So 10 10 homes a year versus like 400 a year. Yeah, and that really allows you to go on that journey with each customer and and spend time. So I love that part of it. I love the products we get to work with. So we have some very uh, you know, again, all of our products are very high-end products. So it's quartz countertops, it's semi-custom cabinets, it's upgrade engineered hardwood floors, it's tile, um, it's sub-zero and wolf uh appliances, and it can go on and on. And then we get to deal with or work with really cool things. So one buyer always jumps to mind. They had a custom bathtub and chandelier shipped from England for their home. So we were very, very careful installing those things. Yeah, we had another buyer who had all of their fixtures made, their lighting fixtures made for them in New York and shipped to us. Um, we recently installed a Tesla roof, which is kind of the next level of solar. Oh, not talk to me about that. I know, yeah, that's right. You got a Tesla recently. So the shingles actually act as the solar panels. So now you don't have the big solar panels on a roof, and the shingles just look like typical shingles and just an amazing product. Um, you would also love this. We just installed our first putting green recently. Yeah, yeah. So we've done movie rooms, uh, exercise rooms, all the outdoor spaces, the outdoor kitchens,

Wild Features Buyers Actually Request

SPEAKER_00 17:20

uh, fireplaces, pools, things like that.

SPEAKER_01 17:22

So, out of all those, you listed some pretty cool things. Can you recall what would be probably your most favorite room that you guys have ever done?

SPEAKER_00 17:31

Favorite room.

SPEAKER_01 17:32

Um Because I need a room with a golf simulator. I've been preaching that to my wife. It's happening on the next house.

SPEAKER_00 17:39

Um, I you know, I I love that putting green. It was just it was really cool. Um, there's been so many great spaces and so many great rooms that we did the the in-home movie theater in a home that we did. That was pretty cool. But so here's the deal. Um, so we do we build new homes, but sometimes our clients, our customers, call us back when they want to start adding things to their existing home. So right now we are working on a 2300 square foot uh guest house, pool house. Nice. Um, but when you go in, there's a big, large open area, it's gonna have a kitchenette, uh bathroom for the pool, golf simulator. So when that gets a little further along, we'll we'll do a shoot over there. Yeah, for sure. You can try out the golf simulator. And we just had another buyer come to us recently that wants to do specifically a golf simulator building in their rear yard. So um, so that's really the difference, I think, um, between the production side and the custom side, the relationships that you have an opportunity to build and just the unique products and experiences that you get to have.

SPEAKER_01 18:40

Love

Family Time And Career Balance

SPEAKER_01 18:41

that. Let's talk about you talked about how the schedule for you guys is pretty similar to your traditional real estate agent where you know you need to go do something on a Saturday or Sunday, client calls and needs to get done. Um talk to us about the balance of you you have kids?

SPEAKER_00 18:58

Um, I have adult children, yeah. Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 19:00

So talk to us about the difference or the balancing of being in a career this long. Because here's my struggle as a father is you know, I have me and my wife have very young kids. Like our girl's about to turn six this week, and then our boy will be turning five in July.

SPEAKER_02 19:16

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 19:16

So I always struggle with, you know, working hard enough to ensure that they get a much better life than what I grew up in.

SPEAKER_02 19:24

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 19:25

But also making sure that I'm present enough for them. It's not just like dad was always out working, like that I'm being present. So talk to us in terms of like the lessons that you learn in terms of balancing being a husband and a father while you were building your career.

SPEAKER_00 19:38

Yeah, um, really good points. And honestly, Sam, I think we have similar values. So early in my career, working for a public home production home builder, I mean it's it's very demanding. And yeah, you have to be all in, especially at the levels that you know I was able to go to. So um, you know, there's a time in my career I was probably working 50, 60 hours a week. Um and and sometimes it is hard to find that balance. Uh, what I would kind of demand myself or my family is Saturday afternoons. Like I would go in and work for a little bit on Saturdays, but Saturday afternoons and Sundays you know just you know, no work, uh, and really focusing and and being present with the family. And then trying to be present when I get home in the evening. It's very easy to bring when you have that kind of job, it's very easy to bring that home with you every night. So, you know, you might be there with your family, but you're a hundred miles away. So uh you know, through the years, just really, really uh trying to balance that. Um being honest, I I wish I had been a little more present when my children were younger. So um that's good advice for anybody. I'll I will tell you I have an amazing wife and a great partner. We've uh we're gonna celebrate our 39th anniversary this year. So I couldn't have done it without her. Um and that's you know, when I said I was kind of looking to make a change when I went to AR Homes. For me, I'm at a point in my career when when I don't need to kind of work at that level, but I still want to be productive. I want to have fun and enjoy what I'm doing. Um we work hard at AR Homes, no question, but it's not that same level of stress and hours that I've worked in the past. So now I've got more time to spend with my wife, uh, and we love seeing our adult daughters when we can. And we became grandparents for the first time in August. So we're we're enjoying that time.

SPEAKER_01 21:26

Man, there's a flip that switches there, man. Because like the way my mom interacts with our kids and like all the snacks and this and that, whatever they want. Yeah, I'm like, you realize how much you told me no, and we're just like, Yeah, but that's different. Like, it's just fun to watch that switch between parent to grandparent, like, because you get to spoil them and then send them home.

SPEAKER_00 21:50

We do, we don't have to be the parents, you know. We can just enjoy the person, and uh man, we're we're enjoying it so much right now, it's wonderful. And uh, you know, I'm finding time to uh take better care of myself. So um so yeah, I think there's a point in your career where you kind of get to enjoy those things. But um yeah, very early in my life it was about building a career, kind of like you. I came from a very middle class, hardworking family, kind of some humble roots type of thing. You know, I was one of the first kids in my family to graduate high school, much less college. Oh wow. Um, so um both my parents worked very hard and they provided for us well. But um, yeah, it was all from my wife and I it was always about providing more opportunities for our daughters, and I think we've successfully done that, and they're they're out conquering the world, and I'm really proud of them. Love it, love it.

Why He Got A Real Estate License

SPEAKER_01 22:38

Let's talk about the the addition or the pivot that you made in getting your real estate license. So, why after all this time now did you decide to go out and get your real estate license?

SPEAKER_00 22:49

So um being candid, I don't actively I don't actively um sell real estate. Um I have my real estate license primarily um to manage AR homes listings in the MLS. Yeah. So just if we want to list a home or property and managing that, but my focus all day, every day is on um AR homes and and selling those homes. We did partner with um the brand group because 80% of our transactions are realtor assisted. So those relationships are super important to us. When we came into the market, we really had to um educate the uh realtor community about us and who AR Homes is because nobody knew who we were. We had to earn their trust, we had to demonstrate that we were gonna take care of their clients. Um working with Kristen's group, she provides us some connections and some inroads that we wouldn't otherwise enjoy. So, for instance, the Cosantino event that you attended and you did the social media workshop for us, and that was fantastic. Uh, that was not a space. Yeah, and we were able to get some top producing uh realtors there, um, and that that worked out really well for us. But but you know, since you've asked me that question, I will share with you. It's um it was really there was a time in my life I had to make a career pivot. So most people listening probably aren't gonna be old enough to remember the real estate downturn in 2008, 2009. Um and I have to up to that point I had been in the home building industry for 24 years and found myself out of the home building industry. And it was really interesting. Up until that point in my life, all my background had been very operational, managing divisions, managing construction, those types of things. So I knew I wanted to get back into the home building industry, um, and I had to figure out how to do that. And part of it was expanding my resume. So I got my real estate license in Williamsburg, actually in practice, actively practiced real estate for about three years. Uh became an associate broker with um with that brokerage and accomplished some really nice things. And the plan worked because it's always good when the plan works. So there was a builder in Cincinnati that was looking for a division manager. Um they were very sound operationally, but um they were struggling with sales and they needed a division manager who understood sales and could drive sales. So that sales background that I picked up in participating or you know, being active in real estate helped me to accomplish other things in in my life. So so sometimes you're taking a position uh for the experience and looking if you can look at things long term, it's gonna get you to where you want to be.

SPEAKER_01 25:24

Yeah, absolutely.

SPEAKER_00 25:24

So I always tell if if I'm ever mentoring someone, it's always, you know, where do you want to be five years from now? And where's the path to get there? And it may not always be a straight path. So um, so that's originally how I got into real estate, and I got so comfortable with it that I am very comfortable having my real estate license, having relationships with, you know, SRM, FRE, and uh the brand group, those types of things. So those are great relationships.

SPEAKER_01 25:48

No, that's all because a lot of people think they they get into a certain role or they take a certain career path, and there's no you can't go wide. Most people are just looking to go up instead of uh also being able to look at going wide.

SPEAKER_00 25:59

Yeah, I I believe in today's world you you have to be flexible. So, you know, I shared that experience of being really an operational type person to getting that sales background and participating, you know, in real estate. And then even this last turn, going at from a production builder mindset to um a luxury custom home builder and being the sales and marketing representative, that's another turn. Yeah, and I've had to learn a lot as I've I've gone, and again, I've reached out to different people, um, both on a national level and a local level to learn from and to learn how to do that. So I think in any career, you just have to be flexible.

SPEAKER_01 26:36

Yeah, no, 1000%.

The 2008 Crash And The Comeback

SPEAKER_01 26:38

This is this is the final question I ask every guest on this on this show is describe to us your most difficult time in your career, like as you were scaling up, and what did you do to overcome that?

SPEAKER_00 26:52

Well, we've kind of talked about it. Um, so I was with US Home Corporation, I went from superintendent trainee to division president um 2006 to 2008 hit, and uh it it was just a became a very, very challenging environment. So I I kind of left that. Um and I really had to take a step back, um, both career-wise and even financially, you know, getting into the real estate. I was entering into real estate in probably the most difficult real estate market that we've ever ever had to learn that experience. Um so number one, there was the financial challenges, there was the career challenges, you know, where's my career going from up here and what does the future look like? Um, and I just really worked very hard to be diligent, to be focused, to just have faith that there would be other opportunities available. Um, and that opportunity came in the form of a builder, a regional builder in Cincinnati. Uh great organization, great outfit. I was there for three years, and the only reason we came back to Richmond was uh just life was kind of calling us back to Richmond for some other things. But you know, navigating that, because that was a huge turn of my career. You know, everything was moving along really, really well for about 24 years, and then all of a sudden, almost like overnight, uh everything was different, everything was upside down. But you know, I think if you can kind of stay strong, stay focused, uh, create some goals and just have some faith, you know, you can work through it.

SPEAKER_01 28:25

Yeah. Now I think those moments in history, like you know, the big crash of 2008, and you look at it as most recently is COVID. Um, I wasn't I wasn't necessarily moving up the corporate ladder in 2008. That wasn't too far after college for me. Um, I think I was working a warehouse job at that moment. Like I hadn't come into my entrepreneurial skin quite yet. Yeah. Um, but now looking back, like you know, the one I did go through was COVID and realizing that number one, if you keep your head down and keep working, like you can make it through just about anything. And two is being open to the changes. Right. Like immediately I went into once COVID was real, I was like, yo, things are getting shut down, you can't go in person and do XYZ. And I'm like, holy crap. Like, and this was just when I started like building a little team at my company and things like that. I'm like, I'm responsible for these people's paycheck. What are we gonna do? And yeah, this before Chat GPT or Claude or anything like that. And I was just like, Well, what if I got clients to film their own content? I needed to, I need them to do it at a certain level. So let me pop in the studio. I can still come into the office. I'm gonna make a how-to video on how to properly shoot. Here's the proper lighting you need. And I'm telling people, take this lamp in your bedroom, put it over here so we have the right shading, um, how to get the right audio, all that kind of stuff. So I just had them sending in all their content, and we were going out and about getting B-roll for stuff that they could be at, but like you just figure it out. So I think every time one of those major uh things have happened in the economy and in the world, like if you just stay, if you're willing to pivot, you keep an open mind, you can get through just about anything.

SPEAKER_00 30:03

Yeah, you can, and and I will add one other thing to that. So, as I said, I was with this one company for 24 years, had a great career. Had I stayed with that company for another six years and retired at 30 years, I wouldn't be the person I am today. I wouldn't be nearly as capable. The experiences that I got to enjoy and that I had to create because of that stepback have made me just a much more capable person. So since leaving that environment, I've I've worked for two other production builders and now a custom home builder, done a little bit more in real estate, and uh and now I'm a sales manager, and just all of those different experiences. So um, so it was scary at the time, but looking back on it, I there's really very little that I would change.

SPEAKER_01 30:53

So actually, I lied, I got one more question for you.

Why People Stay Or Quit Jobs

SPEAKER_01 30:56

Okay, so you just prompted a thought. Why? Because staying with the company, you said the one company you were with over 20 years.

SPEAKER_02 31:03

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 31:05

From your perspective, why was it so much easier for people to stay longer with the company back then versus they? It seems like uh now I'm gonna start telling like the old guy, like this generation, like it seems like they just stick around for a year to three years and they're out. Um, what's the big difference you've seen?

SPEAKER_00 31:23

Yeah, yeah. There's it there's a number of things. So I stayed with the same company for so long because at every step of the way, they were always providing me education and opportunity to learn and grow and progress my career forward. So, like I said, I I there were probably about seven positions I held from superintendent trainee to division president. Um and I could always see that clear path. So it made sense for me at the time to stay um for that long. Um you know, there were a lot of people around me who would leave because somebody was gonna pay them a dollar an hour more. So and I I think those are big decisions to make. You know, again, if you're trying to look five years ahead, like I can go over here and this person's gonna pay me a little bit more, but where am I gonna be with that person in five years versus where I am right now? Um the other thing I will say is you know, I came from an era when companies were much more loyal to the employees. So, for instance, when I was with this builder US Home Corporation, it was nothing to look around me and see people who had been with the company 25, 30 years. People work their entire careers there. Um unfortunately, I think in the world that we live in today, everything's so fast. When the market changes, the home builders, you know, they lay off staff, they cut staff. There's there's not as much loyalty. So I think if the companies aren't going to be as loyal to the employees and to the associates, then the associates aren't gonna be as loyal to you know the companies and things. So I I think that's a big shift. Um and but I would also argue you know, there are benefits to being at the same place for 22 to 24 years, but had I moved around a little bit more, I you know, again, I think I would have experienced some growth earlier in my career. Like I said, after after I left, I grew as I've grown as much in the last 10 years of my career as I did in the first you know, 20. So uh so there's there's different sides.

SPEAKER_01 33:16

Yeah, I think a lot of people always think like whether it's business or relationships, they always think the grass is always greener on the other side. And uh yeah, my favorite saying is the grass is greenest where you order it. Like if you're if you're taking care of your situation and the people that are around you, your situation's always gonna be better than just jumping here or there. But I do think that's a great point. That I do feel, and I'm always looking at that in terms of my company, like, how can I keep great people here for the long haul?

SPEAKER_00 33:40

Yeah, absolutely. You you need the good people that you can count on. So um, can I throw a plug out to your company?

Growing A Brand With Social Media

SPEAKER_00 33:46

Absolutely. So it's interesting. You did a great media post on social media this morning, and it's was so relevant to where we are now. So when we opened in 2019 in the Richmond market, no one had ever heard of AR Home. So a big challenge for us is like um creating a brand, you know, letting people know who we are in the Richmond markets. Again, a big part of that has been, you know, establishing those relationships with the um realtor community, but also we've tried to be much more um intentional and consistent in our social media over the past year and a half or so. So um, you know, we've been doing really well. We've got 1,700 Instagram followers, we've got about a thousand LinkedIn followers, or probably more about 1,500 and just under a thousand, I'm sorry, 1,500 Facebook followers, just under about a thousand LinkedIn followers. But we're getting those interactions, we're getting those likes, people are starting to follow us, people are starting to see us. And then as you pointed out in your social media, so what next? You know, how do we best engage with those people? How do we develop relationships and how do we hopefully become um they become our customers? So I just I thought that was a great piece that you put out. Yeah, no, I appreciate it. So hopefully people will see that.

SPEAKER_01 34:59

And I'm I'm gonna push it a little bit. Getting our homes on TikTok, telling people to the fastest growing demographic on TikTok right now is people between the ages of 32 to 54.

SPEAKER_00 35:10

Right, right.

SPEAKER_01 35:11

It is growing rapidly, and you can get discovered faster on TikTok than any other social media platform. Like I have a video right now. Keep in mind, I've been going hard at this for 11 years. And you've seen the stuff, I've been experimenting a little bit going harder at some of the things with my social media the last couple months. Um, I got a video on Instagram now that's creeping towards a million. Um I think it's at like 980,000 views right now. Okay. It took me 11 years to get a video to get that kind of attention.

SPEAKER_00 35:38

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 35:39

But it's under the biggest thing I've learned in this last 60 days, because I've really been experiment experimenting with some things on social media. Really, what I've learned most in the last 60 days is doing a lot and trying a lot of different things. Right. The audience will tell you what they want to see more of. Like I have a I have a series like you talked about. Um I'll just say we're both believers. Um, and I have a series I grew up with, my dad was a pastor since the day I was born. Oh, wow. So I wanted to start this quick series where from a comical standpoint, like black Baptist preachers are just their characters in the bullpen. Like my dad's like sweating like he's like been working out like at the beginning of the sermon, uh, and just the mannerisms and the way they talk. And something hit me, and it wasn't something I saw, because normally I do get most of my ideas from other things that I see, and I kind of build off of that. But this one I was like, hmm, I was listening to an old 90s sitcom theme song, and I was like, this would be hilarious if like a Baptist preacher was like saying these lyrics from the perspective of like a sermon in the pulpit. So I started doing this this quick series. I've only done two of them, and certain platforms got much better response than other ones did. Um, and then a bunch of people, I say a bunch, like maybe like seven or eight people like DM me and were like, you know, this is hilarious, man. I hope you keep doing this. But the numbers haven't reflected it. Like, and I had to go out and buy a pastor's robe and like do all these different things. I had to make a little investment in it, yeah, and it hasn't been the way I would expect people to respond, especially after some of the initial responses. So you have to be able to look at some of those things and understand, okay, there is an audience here, but now I know, okay, if people really want to see this, and there's some things I gotta tweak if I'm gonna keep doing this because it's not landing the way I want it to. So it doesn't necessarily mean you just stop doing something because oh, this video only got 400 views, like it's not worth my time anymore. No, there's some meat there, you just have to figure out what that is. So that's one reason why I'm pushing every all businesses toward TikTok, is because we have had the perception that only 16 to 24-year-olds are using TikTok. It has changed dramatically. Major brands are on TikTok, and the way that algorithm functions, unlike anything else, it's allowed me to test content on TikTok, and I can ultimately determine what the response is going to be on other platforms. If this video on TikTok is getting 25,000 views, I know it's gonna crush on Instagram or Facebook. So like I can play those little things, and then there's certain things that I've seen that will get like 400 views on TikTok, but I know it's gonna get a few thousand views on my Instagram page. Yeah, so it just allows you some playing with that, and that's the thing that I've heard from your stories that you've been willing to pivot, you've been willing to try different things because a lot of people just say, uh, we've gotten this far without doing all the social media stuff. What's the point of even trying this? But you're like, no, I'm actively trying to learn new things and put this in place.

SPEAKER_00 38:31

We are, and your points are really good because we're just now at the point where and and you do this, you've got all the statistics, you can see how things are performing, and we're just getting to that point of seeing, you know, how many people view a post and then how many people like it, share it, kind of whatever. Um, and it's really interesting because there are times when I'll post something and I'm like, this is really good. This is nothing, you know. And nobody, yeah, and then there are other times when I'll be like, you know, I'm just I don't know if this is any good. I'm just gonna put it out there and blow the blow. Yeah, it's so it it is crazy. But like you said, you get to that point, and you're much better at this than than I am, but um, of seeing what's respond you people are responding to, and then being able to pivot and adjust and to continue to grow that business. So uh it's great you're doing that.

SPEAKER_01 39:14

It's it's all playing and trial and efforts and all these different things. Yeah, yeah. John, this was an awesome conversation,

Where To Find AR Homes

SPEAKER_01 39:20

man. Greatly appreciate you coming on here. If people now, when I tell y'all AR homes are some of the most beautiful homes here in the Richmond area, I can't speak for the other markets. I know here in Richmond, these are some of the most beautiful homes I've ever been able to be in, film, uh, and capture content. If people want to engage you guys with your services, they want more information, where can they go to check you guys out?

SPEAKER_00 39:42

Uh ARHomes.com. Um, and then when you're on the website, you can find our AR Homes uh Richmond page, uh, or they can uh email us or reach out to me directly.

SPEAKER_01 39:50

And look out for their TikTok page coming soon. There you go.

SPEAKER_00 39:53

Got it.

SPEAKER_01 39:54

Appreciate you jumping.

SPEAKER_00 39:55

Thanks, Sam. Really, really enjoyed it.

SPEAKER_01 39:57

Absolutely.

SPEAKER_00 39:57

We'll see you guys on the next episode.