Todd:
Well, welcome back to the podcast. We are thrilled to have Chad Makovsky here who is the director of Aviation Services for the City of Phoenix. Which is a really fancy way of saying he is the headman at the Phoenix Sky Harbor Airport, America's friendliest airport. We're thrilled to have you. Thanks for joining us.
Chad Makovsky:
It's great to be here, Todd.
Todd:
Well, we'd love to get to know you a little bit. I know you recently moved back to the Valley from from Dallas to Phoenix. You were here before. Tell us a little bit about yourself and then also something that we wouldn't find on your bio that would be interesting for those of us who listening and watching.
Chad Makovsky:
Oh sure. Absolutely. Absolutely. Yeah. I'm a bit of a boomerang. I spent 17 years here with the city of Phoenix and I left Phoenix to go to DFW Airport in Dallas, Texas. Spent four years there as executive vice president. But when the team called and said this opportunity was available to lead one of the best airports in the country, I couldn't help but come back. And I grew up in Wisconsin in North central Wisconsin. So I'm a Midwest guy by heart, but I've spent the greater part of my adult life right here in Phoenix, Arizona and I do consider Phoenix Home. So being able to come back to this airport has been great. My career has taken me through a number of different things. I've worked for America West Airlines for a short time here, the hometown airline in Phoenix.
Todd:
What'd you do for them?
Chad Makovsky:
I was actually ground up right out of college. I was loading bags and airplanes.
Todd:
You were a rampee.
Chad Makovsky:
Absolutely.
Todd:
Nice.
Chad Makovsky:
And worked my way into their hub operations control tower and some responsibilities there. But then I went to JFK, worked at JFK Airport for a bit, New York City. Went to the other coast and worked a little bit at Burbank Airport in California and then came back to Phoenix before going to DFW. But again, glad to be home and it's just so proud to be in a position to be able to lead an amazing team who's providing this tremendous asset for the community. Now, something that somebody may not know about me is I'm actually a Comptia A plus certified computer technician.
Todd:
Wow.
Chad Makovsky:
So there was a point in time in the.com era, so I'm dating myself a little bit. But the.com era where I thought, well, maybe I want to try my hands at the computer technology. So I am a certified hardware technician for computers. I find that I use that skill mostly for my in-laws and family members than anybody, but that's just a fun fact about me. I'm a bit of a computer geek.
Todd:
That's a good one. And an animal lover, yes?
Chad Makovsky:
I am. In fact, just recently I'm really proud to say I was brought onto the board of directors for the Arizona Humane Society. So my wife and I have been animal lovers our whole lives. And just the opportunity to give back to the community in that way. They're such an amazing team with the Arizona Humane Society. I'm proud to be a part of it.
Todd:
They are incredible. Absolutely. So most people don't really get into aviation. We go to the airport, we get it on a plane. Hopefully it's not too crowded, at least for us. I'm sure the airlines would disagree and then we get somewhere. How did you get into this? Was it just a lark out of college? "Hey, I got a job as a rampee and I'm going to work for America West," or was there some sort of love of aviation?
Chad Makovsky:
It goes back, actually. I'm glad you asked that. It goes back a long ways from when I was a real small child, small town Wisconsin. We used to have this community festival and my grandmother noticed that I used to watch airplanes taking off and landing at the airport. So she brought me out to the airport at this local community festival and a pilot was giving airplane rides. And so she made sure not only that I got a ride, but I got to sit in the right seat of that airplane right next to the pilot and I was hooked ever since.
I knew that's where my career was going to take me. I am actually a certified pilot, so I'm a private pilot and I did that in school. But as I thought about careers in aviation. Being in a pilot work, living out of a suitcase, I just didn't feel like that was the right choice for me. I'm really, really impressed with all the work the pilots do in our community. But for me, I wanted to be home in the evenings and moving into the airport side of the business. That's where I really found my joy and my passion.
Todd:
Do you still fly?
Chad Makovsky:
I do. Not that regularly though, so I'd have to get current again. It's been a few years since I've flown and when I think of that next chapter, perhaps after this career, I'm probably get back into flying again.
Todd:
Absolutely. Well, that's wonderful. Obviously Sky Harbor a major player. I think the large, largest store, the most busy third runway airport in the world. Is that correct?
Chad Makovsky:
Yeah, so if you think about the number of runways airports have. We have three runways at Sky Harbor Airport and you look at the numbers of takeoffs and landings at airports, no airport with three runways or less or running more takeoffs and landings and Sky Harbor Airport. We're an incredibly busy, incredibly efficient airport. And that's something that we focus on every day is making sure that we keep those runways open. And we can accommodate that growth and that demand that's coming to the valley.
Todd:
Given that we're at three, how do you project for that kind of growth? Clearly, when we watched... Actually I got one of my friends at Air Traffic controller, he sent me a video time-lapse video during Superbowl. And it was incredible to see how this just hundreds of planes moved in and out. How do we do that with the three runways versus a DFW that has many more?
Chad Makovsky:
Yeah, so that is a blessing and a curse. The fact that we're a very centrally located airport is a fantastic amenity for our region. But it also means that we're a bit constrained in terms of land. In fact, we're landlocked to the south by the river bottom to the east and west by freeways. We have very limited room for growth. And so we have to squeeze as much as we can out of that asset. And so we want to make sure that we are orchestrating everything perfectly. And what's important to know is that the airport is owned and operated by the city of Phoenix.
And I have about 950 employees in my organization as a department within the city that provides services. But we have over 57,000 employees on our airport campus. And in a perfect day as a customer, as a traveler, you wouldn't know the difference. You're going to just seamlessly go from one point to the other interfacing with all these wonderful employees and never know who works for who. But it takes an incredible amount of coordination with the FAA air traffic control tower, with our airline partners, with all of our staff that are out there maintaining those runways every night to make sure that they're ready to go the next morning. All of that works to make sure that we can provide the services to the community.
Todd:
It really is incredible and we, I think take for granted the fact that we have an airport within a few minutes reach from almost anywhere in the valley until you land in Denver, for instance. And I know we don't want to besmirch our friends in Denver, but that's a long ride. And we have it that asset right here in Phoenix.
Chad Makovsky:
I think that's really what makes Sky Harbor the crown jewel of Phoenix in my eyes. And I might may be a little bit biased here in my assessment of that, but Congressman Stanton once said this when he was giving a speech. He said One of the best qualities of Sky Harbor Airport is the fact that it's so centrally located. But that also means that land's a bit scarce and we have to really take care of the airport and the lands around the airport to make sure we can continue to grow it to meet future demand as well.
Todd:
And it is true. It's such an important asset. So speaking of that. Talk to us a little bit about the economic impact of Sky Harbor.
Chad Makovsky:
Yeah, 38 billion economic impact based on our last assessment with the W. P. Carey School of Business. And we are going to be going back out now that we're kind of on the backside of the pandemic and we're growing again to do an updated assessment. But we are the single largest economic engine for the state of Arizona. We support tourism, trade, travel, our business community, a healthy and thriving airport is really what helps to create the opportunities for a healthy and growing community. And you've probably seen Maricopa County is one of the busiest growing counties by population in the United States and may be the busiest, I think the last I checked.
And with that growth, we need to make sure that we are providing the amenities to connect this community to the world. And make sure that those business opportunities are out there. The employment opportunities, 13 billion dollar payroll for those 57,000 employees I talked about. So it's really an incredible responsibility. You might think I only oversee 950 employees, but I'm always thinking about how this whole community comes together in how we're making sure we're protecting the airport to support everybody, including all the businesses who benefit from it.
Todd:
It's such a staggering number for such a concentrated... I mean obviously it's a big airport, but when you think about it from its footprint, 38 billion is absolutely staggering. And to your point, and it was such an important asset for us here in Phoenix. You mentioned the pandemic. I remember when you came during the pandemic and then out of it. What have been some of your priorities as you've come into the job and had time to assess Sky Harbor and what you wanted to do going forward?
Chad Makovsky:
Well, one thing I would say is my predecessor did an amazing job with the team to really set us up for success. He, in 2019, moved through what was called a comprehensive asset management plan. It's another term for an airport master plan. It's really how we actually can grow this airport to be able to continue to support the needs of the community. And they identified in that plan six billion dollars in an investment that's going to be needed in our airport in terms of growing the number of gates we have. The terminals we have, how we balance the roadways versus the terminals versus the runways, and making sure we're properly investing in all three of those aspects of how our airport works. If any one of those is under invested, it will be the Achilles heel for the airport and we'll feel that. Good example of that is Sky Harbor Boulevard.
That was one of the things I was very focused on when I first came back is how do we make sure that we can continue to grow our airport knowing that we have this lifeline, this artery, this roadway that really can't be expanded much. And I was really happy to see the work that's been done on the SkyTrain, which you probably have seen at the end of last year.
Todd:
Yes.
Chad Makovsky:
We connected the SkyTrain from our terminals to our rental car center that took 80 buses off of our roadways. That freed up curb space, and that allowed us to actually be able to breathe again a little bit and freed up that capacity that we very much needed on Sky Harbor Boulevard. One example of that, the other thing I was really focused on was the health and wellness of my team, because going through the pandemic, that took an emotional toll on a lot of people work and your personal lives.
Todd:
They were essential. They were there.
Chad Makovsky:
When everybody else, it may have had opportunities to work from home. Many of my employees had to come in every day to provide those services. And they're heroes for doing that. They really are.
Todd:
Well, and it's easy to think there wasn't a lot of passenger traffic, but certainly there was a ton of cargo.
Chad Makovsky:
Absolutely.
Todd:
As we know, ordering from Amazon.
Chad Makovsky:
That's absolutely right. And that's what we saw was the uptick in cargo growth. Now that's settled down a little bit since things are starting to rationalize. But really making sure we're providing good services for those employees who were both working from home as well as those who were coming in every day to make sure they felt safe. That the built environment and the investments we made in that made our customers feel safe so they could continue to think about traveling via air again. And I'm happy to say this first quarter, the busiest first quarter we've ever had at Sky Harbor in the entire history of the airport. We had an amazing Superbowl season and I think we're back.
Todd:
And Final four, I heard the lottery for tickets for Final Four is going on right now.
Chad Makovsky:
It's out.
Todd:
So we're, we're going to be looking forward to that. And the SkyTrain huge, a huge thing for us all the way to the rental car center, not just to terminal four three. I think that's another thing for visitors that's going to be really nice not to worry about the bus system.
Chad Makovsky:
It's transformational. That's what the word I like to use is customers, if they've ever experienced what it was like. And again, our bus drivers and the operators that were providing that service did an amazing job, great customer service. But we knew we couldn't bus our way out of this. And we knew we had to have a more efficient, reliable connection between the terminals and the rental car center. And it's just fantastic. Even from a sustainability perspective, having an all electric train connecting those facilities is just, it's been really, really remarkable and our customers have told us they love it.
Todd:
Absolutely. Terminal three, also huge revamp there, which I think did start under your predecessor, but what a change. You wouldn't recognize it if you'd been out of the country for 10 years and came back.
Chad Makovsky:
Yeah. If you think about how we developed Sky Harbor Airport. We had a terminal one, believe it or not, you may remember it. And then we had a terminal two. It was built in the sixties.
Todd:
I love two.
Chad Makovsky:
Terminal... And it was a tough one to see it leave. We heard from the community. There were a lot of people who loved terminal two. It was so easy to use. Terminal three was built in the late seventies, and then terminal four as we continued to the east, was built in the late eighties and activated in the early nineties. And so we knew after we developed Terminal four, we needed to do some work to modernize Terminal three. You could feel it was just starting to get dated and it didn't represent what we wanted to share in terms of how... We view ourselves as being the front door of the community.
And we wanted to make sure when people came to Sky Harbor, they were really proud and our community was proud of that as well. So we actually did a major uplift in terminal three, and it's just a beautiful terminal. We get a lot of really great feedback about it. It serves us well. We're already planning a new concourse on the north side of terminal three. We're planning to connect terminal three and terminal four together. So when you go through security, you'll be able to move from terminal to terminal. But then the next big increment of development is going to be as we go back west again, what do we do in the place of that terminal two footprint? So there's a space there and we've been thinking about when the time's right, we'll be talking about another terminal again soon.
Todd:
There would it be an equal size to three and four? Generally speaking.
Chad Makovsky:
Yes, it's probably going to be right between the two in terms of size, number of gates. But remember, even with those gates, we always have to think about the runway capacity too. And the roadway capacity. And so with those gates, we have to make sure everything comes in balance. And that's what I have an amazing team that thinks about that all day for me.
Todd:
Ironically though, when you modernize three, all of a sudden four doesn't look as good, right? I mean, so any plans to do any work there?
Chad Makovsky:
Absolutely. It was great, great question. And over a half a billion dollars are planned in investments in Terminal four. Many of those investments the customer may not even see. So these are behind the scenes. This is plumbing, mechanical upgrades, electrical upgrades, switch gear, the things that we need to have working really well. Because let me tell you, if the power goes out in terminal four for any length of time, we're going to have a bad day. So we're going to be making some pretty significant investments behind the scenes, but we also are thinking as we're talking with our concessionaires and others about an aesthetic upgrade and refresh in the terminal itself, so it feels a little bit more modern. And I think about 80% of our traffic, the passengers every single day go through terminal four. And so that's a very heavily used terminal. And so it's due for an upgrade we're focused on.
Todd:
Yeah. Well, I mean, it was the late eighties I think, or early nineties. And so certainly time, but it's served us well and it'll look forward to that. Certainly three is beautiful. And then hopefully we'll be exciting to hear about a new... Well, so would it be terminal five because you haven't gotten rid of three and four, and I know people get here and they're confused and that's an FAA thing, correct?
Chad Makovsky:
No, it's not. Actually. This is something we have complete control over. And I don't know if we're going to do a community survey or if we're going to name it after somebody, maybe we'll just call it the West terminal that we'll have to see what the community thinks about that.
Todd:
To be determined, it's a little confusing for people I think when they get here. So obviously you have the major operations probably bigger than some towns. Talk about your leadership style. You obviously have a significant responsibility, a lot of people under you. What's your style?
Chad Makovsky:
I would say I like to think, and I don't know that I get to choose my style. I think my employees tell me what that style is. And so they get to let me know whether or not I'm behaving this way. But I like to consider myself to be a servant leader. I get my work done through others. A good day for me is when I'm providing the resources to my team so they can be successful in the work that they do. They are the subject matter experts. And so I listen to them. I'm not afraid to make a decision.
If we need to have a tiebreaker, I'll make that decision. But I know my team knows best. They're closest to the issues, and I really try to leverage them and their expertise to get our work done every day. And to me, I think what's more important to me than anything is what resonates with me is authenticity. I want to be thought of as an authentic leader, somebody who is very transparent with my team. I'm going to tell them the good news, I'm going to tell them the bad news too. Because if they know that and they know that I've got their back. I know that they're going to have my back as we continue to work together. So that's what I would say to me.
Todd:
Trust is important. Absolutely. Absolutely. So everybody lives in the valley knows that when you say Sky Harbor, you have to say, "America's friendliest airport." What does that really mean?
Chad Makovsky:
So it's funny, a lot of people say, how do you measure the friendliness? And what does that mean and how can you say that you're the friendliest? And really it came out of something that we didn't share. It was what our customers were telling us. And so as we would talk to our customers, they're like, "Wow, you have the friendliest people here." And we thought, "You know what if we trademark this? If we make this our brand, if you will. It's going to be infectious and our employees will hear it." And when you hear that we're the friendliest airport, you want to deliver friendly services to our customers. And it's really kind of caught onto itself. But we got so deep into this that we actually do passenger intercept surveys. And we asked our customers, would you consider us to be less friendly, as friendly, more friendly than other airports that you travel to? The vast majority say we're more friendly and exceptionally friendly as compared to other airports. And so I think that name's going to stick for a while.
Todd:
All right. I like it and I definitely use it. Speaking of sort of friendly, I think there's also wallet friendly because when you look at the restaurants in the airport, you have basically street pricing. Talk to us a little bit about that and the fact that you've got really good restaurants in our terminals.
Chad Makovsky:
Yeah. We're really proud. This is something that started many, many years ago. And we're one of the first in the country to do this, but we really heard from our customers and our community members that they wanted the best of Phoenix to be represented in our terminals. And that people traveling through our airports that they want a sense of place. When they come to Phoenix, they want to be able to feel and taste Phoenix. And so really that partnership with our major concessionaires to partner with local brands and bring that into the airport experience has just been fantastic. And we don't intend to stop that. We think that's a recipe for success for us.
Todd:
Agreed. I mean, you can get a chain anywhere, right? But when you have a local brand, it makes such a difference. And certainly the chains are great as well to get people choices, but it's nice to have something that's Arizona-based.
Chad Makovsky:
And in terms of cost, what I would say is if I were to frame our airport up, I'd call it three Cs, cost, climate and customer service. So cost is very important to us. We maintain low cost for our airlines. That makes us an attractive market for our airlines to serve. Climate, we have beautiful weather. So when we have that three runway, that very extremely constrained capacity that we have at the airport. Having that beautiful weather every day helps us move more planes in and out of our airport and our airlines love that. And then customer service, it goes right back to America's friendliest airport.
Todd:
Absolutely.
Chad Makovsky:
And we know if people remember our airport positively, they'll come back.
Todd:
Sure. So I'll ask you the pilot question, and you mention when you talked about weather. We don't have floods, we don't have earthquakes, but we do have heat. So it is that a factor sometimes for us or not necessarily?
Chad Makovsky:
So heat is always something that we think about, and climate change is something that we think about as well. And so you will see in one of our future capital projects, we're planning to extend one of our runways. It's our primary departure runway, our center runway. Planes need speed and air flow over their wings to be able to take off. And when air heats up, it becomes less dense and you need more of it to be able to get that same amount of lift to be able to pick a plane up off of the ground. And so what we need is our center runway is about 1100 feet shorter than our north runway. Our north and south runways are our arrival runways. And we're seeing more and more pilots are wanting to use that north runway for departures.
Todd:
They use that extra insurance.
Chad Makovsky:
The extra runway, they like that. And with that extra runway, that North runway, when they use that, that means that we constrain our arrival capacity to the airport. So we need to get those planes back on the center runway. And to do that, we want to extend it. So we're going to be adding about 1100 feet of length to that center runway.
Todd:
Excellent. Okay. Well good forward planning there.
Chad Makovsky:
Absolutely.
Todd:
And speaking of that, a lot of innovation, Waymo, we have a lot of other things going on. Talk to us a little bit about that.
Chad Makovsky:
So it was really a lot of fun. The mayor joined me as we brought Waymo to the airport for very first time. And she was the very first customer that came in and a funny story about that. So we did that up at our 44th Street Sky Train Station. And so the staff told me, "Okay, you stand right here. The vehicle's going to pull up, the mayor's going to get out, you're going to shake her hand. Everything was just perfect and we're going to go to the podium. She's going to give remarks." So waiting here, this Waymo car, no driver in it, mayor's in the back seat, comes up to me, drives right by me. And I'm like, "Where's this car going to take our mayor? What am I going to do? Fortunately, the car only stopped another 20 feet down the path. So I slid over, shook her hand, we brought her to the podium and she loved it.
Todd:
She's a good sport.
Chad Makovsky:
Absolutely. We were the first airport in the world to bring autonomous vehicles as an option for our customers. And so we're really proud of that. You might have heard that Waymo and Uber just announced a partnership Yes. Earlier this week. And we're going to be the first market where they actually launched that partnership. So if Waymo wants to go to scale, they want to do it here. Have you had a chance to ride it?
Todd:
I want do it. The, I think I'm a little far north for them to Google in the ring, but I'd love to do it.
Chad Makovsky:
Yeah, it's a great experience. I find the first time you ride, you're going to probably have a little bit of a backseat driver experience. You're going to want to push that brake that doesn't exist.
Todd:
Like when my kid's driving?
Chad Makovsky:
That's right. But once you do it's really cool. I think it's really, the future is here. The age of the Jetsons' is here.
Todd:
Absolutely. Mobile ID?
Chad Makovsky:
Yeah. Again, another first. So Sky Harbor worked with Arizona MVD. We're really proud to partner with them with Apple and with TSA. So if you're an Apple customer, you have an iPhone, you can actually download the digital ID into your Apple Wallet. And in doing that, when you go to the checkpoint, you'll be able to present that to the TSA in lieu of your physical driver's license.
Todd:
Oh, just on your phone?
Chad Makovsky:
That's right. It's on your phone. And what's nice about that is TSA will only pull from that digital ID, the information they need to vet your identity and nothing more. So they probably don't need to know a whole lot about your weight or your height necessarily.
Todd:
Plus I lied anyway.
Chad Makovsky:
So that's really, I think the wave of the future, it's going to provide more security. A lot of people worry about privacy when it comes to digital, but I think this is actually going to provide for more privacy, more security as opposed to less.
Todd:
Well, and I think what I like too is that you can actually reserve your line in security to get through.
Chad Makovsky:
Yeah. That's another new program, which is huge. Another new program we have, which is cool at no cost to our customers. So if you are not... We have programs called Global Entry and TSA pre-check. If you are in those programs, continue to use them because you're going to have the best experience there. But if you're not in global entry or pre-check and you want to make sure that you have a pretty quick experience at our security checkpoint a day or two before you fly out. You just go to our website. It's PHX reserve, so SkyHarbor.com/PHX reserve, and you'll be able to reserve your place in line. And what's good about that is you have now certainty that you're going to get through in a time. So that takes some of that anxiety away from your travels. That's great.
Todd:
Absolutely.
Chad Makovsky:
But for us, the benefit is we can depeak the peak. So if you were thinking about coming at 10:00, I might say, well come in at 10:15. You're still going to get to your gate in plenty of time. But that allows me to take that peak off of maybe that 10:00 bank.
Todd:
And it's nice that if you don't have to sign up for these other programs, you can just work with you guys.
Chad Makovsky:
Absolutely.
Todd:
And get through in a way that's predictable.
Chad Makovsky:
Exactly. Right.
Todd:
So I have to ask, excited to see our London flights start back up. How's that going?
Chad Makovsky:
Yeah, so we have two daily flights to London now. American Air Airlines is running one British Airlines, Airways I should say, is running the second flight. Both are doing very, very well. We're really pleased with it. Condor just started their Frankfurt service just last week. Their seasonal service, they added a day. So we have three days a week now that they're flying to Frankfurt. And our air service development team is just amazing. And we're really looking at those new opportunities. We think that there is going to be another opportunity in the European market for another destination, maybe two for us in the coming year or two.
Todd:
Any thoughts on countries that we might be hearing about?
Chad Makovsky:
So as we look at where customers from our market are traveling when they go to Europe, and these might be things that you would guess. So in addition to Frankfurt, in addition to London, we see heavy populations in France, Paris, Amsterdam is another really heavy destination for us. So those are two markets that we're really targeting. Then we're thinking about the Asian Pacific range.
Todd:
TSMC here as well. You think there'd be a good opportunity maybe Taiwan?
Chad Makovsky:
Exactly. We're capitalizing on that and we're telling that story to all of our carriers over in Asia as well. In fact, there's a delegation that is going to be going to Asia in the next month or two. We're going to participate in that. We're going to go visit a number of airline headquarters while we're over there. When we're thinking Taipei, it makes sense for TSMC. Of course, our number one destination in terms of where our market is traveling is Tokyo. So that's something, an area that we're targeting. And then while we're over there, we're going to check in with Seoul as well. With South Korea, we think that there's a potential for a market there as well.
Todd:
With the big jumbos going away and getting smaller planes that can go, the distance gives us a shot.
Chad Makovsky:
Absolutely.
Todd:
For some of these opportunities. Is that correct?
Chad Makovsky:
They're far more efficient and you don't have to have as many people traveling to be able to make that route work. So that's exactly why we think that's a viable opportunity for us.
Todd:
And I think part of the key there is you want to get the business community buying some of those seats.
Chad Makovsky:
Absolutely.
Todd:
In order to make that case. Now, I know that we've had, I know when Condor was looking, we'd worked a lot with the airport to identify business customers. But is there a way that when businesses that are hearing about this and they're traveling, these locations can work with you at Sky Harbor to say, "Hey, yeah, we're going to be going to Seoul. That's a destination for us, or Tokyo or Madrid or Paris."
Chad Makovsky:
We work a lot with groups like yours with GPAC. We work with Arizona Office of Tourism. We work with a number of different destination marketing venues to really kind of figure out who should we be talking to. And then there's the obvious ones. TSMC would be an obvious entity that we need to talk to. And the idea is, once you know that route's viable, then you start to lock in. You work with these companies and lock in and say, "How are you flying today? Are you connecting through LA? Are you connecting through San Francisco? What are the ways that you're getting to the Asian market?" And once we know what that is with them, and we can get them to give us some level of certainty that they'll take that route on, then we make that trip back over to the headquarters. And we might even bring that company with us to tell that story.
Todd:
Well, and I think there is the demand. And so just making sure that there's the coordination so that you can show that demand.
Chad Makovsky:
Absolutely. Yeah.
Todd:
Well, in terms of challenges and opportunities, if you were thinking about that for the next five years.
Chad Makovsky:
In terms of challenges, we are not out of the pandemic yet. I hate to say it. I mean in terms of the business, business is good, people are traveling. But from a mental health and wellness perspective, both from an employee perspective, but also from just the travelers, travelers are more on edge than they've ever been. And there's a mental health and wellness issue that we're working through. And one of the initiatives that our mayor and council have been very supportive of is ways that we can actually engage our travelers and help to deescalate that experience.
And I talked about some of the initiatives that we do with PHX Reserve and what have you. We have a great program, the Navigator Buddy program. Where we actually bring dogs around for those who aren't afraid of dogs. And it's amazing the response we get from people and how it could have a tense experience. It could be going traveling for something really good, a wedding. They could also be traveling for a funeral. And so we just don't know what their experience is at the time. But having something to maybe give them just a bit of a diversion really helps a lot in terms of providing a great experience here.
Todd:
You're right, it makes such a difference.
Chad Makovsky:
Oh my gosh.
Todd:
It turns somebody into a marshmallow immediately.
Chad Makovsky:
Yeah. So that's one of the challenges we are working towards. Infrastructure is always a challenge, especially. There's no such thing as green field development at Sky Harbor Airport. So as we think of that next new concourse, we think of that next new terminal. We typically have to move stuff out of the way to make that happen. And it's a bit of a challenge for us. So those are things that we're working hard on every single day. Is to try to figure out when in the timing of when. Airlines they're planning, Horizon generally isn't as long as ours. If an airline told me they needed 10 gates tomorrow, it would probably take me three, four years to be able to deliver that. So we're always talking to the airlines to make sure that we're getting those assets to them just in time for the demand.
Todd:
And as you talk about infrastructure, it seems like everyone now has a lounge. Every credit card has a lounge. I know we have an Amex lounge now, Centurion Lounge, the other lounges are packed. Is there thoughts to add more those type of amenities for business travelers?
Chad Makovsky:
That is the hot topic it seems lately. So we have more requests for lounge space in Terminal Four than we have space to provide it. So we're thinking about that. We're going to be opening up a brand new common use lounge in... It's a Chase Sapphire lounge in the new Terminal Four S1 concourse, the brand new concourse we just opened. And we're looking at as we build this new concourse at Terminal Three to actually create another new lounge space as well. So that seems to be a trend that's going to sustain. So we're making sure that we're providing space to do that in the future.
Todd:
Traveling around the country and there are people in lines to get in these lounges.
Chad Makovsky:
Absolutely.
Todd:
There's definitely a lot of demand. Well, I want to thank you for taking so much time with us today, and also for the incredible work that you're doing and continue to do at Sky Harbor. As we close out, we're going to do a quick lightning round.
Chad Makovsky:
Okay.
Todd:
I promise this is easy. So what was your first job? Was it the rampee job or?
Chad Makovsky:
First job ever was 16 years old working at a grocery store. We had a local grocery store in a very small community I grew up in and stocking shelves and bagging groceries first.
Todd:
What'd you learn?
Chad Makovsky:
I learned that... My dad told me this. At that point, I didn't know what my profession was going to be. He's like, "Everybody has to eat Chad. So if you ever want to get a profession, know that." So I thought about a career in the grocery business. I'm like, "Nah, that just isn't for me." I mean, it's a very important career, but aviation was just drawing me there.
Todd:
Yeah. Well, everyone has to move at some point.
Chad Makovsky:
Absolutely.
Todd:
You're helping that happen.
Chad Makovsky:
That's true. That's true.
Todd:
So obviously this is an incredible job, no doubt about it. But the rules are we can't say your current job. What's the dream job?
Chad Makovsky:
Oh, wow. For me, and this might be a job that I would say I just, I'll never know. And that was to be a pilot. So that was something that was my dream as a child growing up. And there are days when I wonder what that career would've been like. So I would say that if not for this, it would've been that.
Todd:
Yeah. Well, I also say that except for I'm dyslexic, so we know how that would've gone.
Chad Makovsky:
Yeah.
Todd:
Not good. No. And the final one, and there is a right answer, by the way. Favorite airplane.
Chad Makovsky:
Oh, I know. The queen of the sky is 747.
Todd:
All right. Absolutely. A hundred percent. You just aced it. All right. All right. Thank you. We really appreciate it, and we look to have you back sometime soon.
Chad Makovsky:
It's my pleasure. Thank you, Todd.
Todd:
Take care.