Epic Entrepreneurs

A Slow First Year Taught Him How To Price Jobs Hire Well And Keep Going with Joseph Johnson

• Bill Gilliland

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People love to say “just start a service business” like the hard part is buying a ladder and printing a logo. Then the phone goes quiet, the insurance bill hits, an employee calls out, and a commercial client still expects the job done on time. That is why our conversation with Joseph Johnson from JMJ Painting and Maintenance LLC lands so well. Joe is a combat veteran and Chattanooga painting contractor who tells the truth about what it takes to build a legitimate, professional business that can actually last.

We dig into the behind-the-scenes costs that customers rarely notice when they compare painting estimates: licensing, insurance, workers’ comp, scheduling risk, and the time it takes to price jobs fairly. Joe walks us through the marketing channels that bring real leads for local home services, including BNI networking, the Nextdoor app, Google Business Profile visibility, social media, and the simple power of finally getting a website. He also shares lessons learned the hard way about hiring, vetting, and adjusting leadership style so a team can meet high standards without burning out.

The most eye-opening part is what Joseph hears from customers right now: painters taking large deposits then not showing up, changing numbers, and disappearing. He explains how he protects customer trust by communicating clearly and asking for payment when the job is complete, plus a review and referral discount system that turns great service into steady word of mouth.

If you care about small business growth, local SEO, and building a contractor brand on integrity, listen through to the end for what’s next for JMJ and how to connect. Subscribe, share this with a business owner who needs it, and leave a review with your biggest takeaway.

Guest Contact info:

Email: honor1956.jj@gmail.com

Website: jmjpaintingandmaintenancellc.com

Thanks for Listening. You may contact me or our team at https://billgilliland.biz/

All the best!
Bill

Please hit the subscribe button, leave us a 5 star review,  and share this podcast. You can reach me at williamgilliland@actioncoach.com or at https://billgilliland.biz/


Welcome And Guest Introduction

SPEAKER_00

Hi everyone, welcome to this week's episode of Epic Entrepreneurs. I am Cliff McCray with Action Coach Business Growth Partners, where we work with local business owners to turn big ideas into real scalable growth. Today I'm excited to be joined by Joseph Johnson with JMJ Painting and Maintenance LLC. Joseph, thanks for being here. How are you doing today, sir?

SPEAKER_01

Thank you, Cliff. I'm doing great today.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, yeah, great. We're very happy to have you. So let's go ahead and jump right into things. And you know, for those of you who may not know it yet, you know, who are you, Joseph? Who is Joseph Johnson and what is JMJ painting and maintenance?

SPEAKER_01

Well, I'm a combat veteran. I served in the uh U.S. Army in 2001 and 2009. Uh, been overseas a few times, and um I moved to Chattanooga in 2011, and I've been here ever since. And uh I used to work for the biggest painting company in Chattanooga, and I'm a family man that wanted to venture out on my own uh and give more back to my community and uh give my skill set that I have learned uh back to people

Josephs Story And Why He Started

SPEAKER_01

that uh really want a small business um professional in their home or their business. Okay, okay.

SPEAKER_00

So, Joseph, let's get right into it. Real talk. What's something about running a business that people think is amazing, but it's actually a complete BS?

SPEAKER_01

I would say probably uh pricing out jobs and not seeing what's going on behind the scenes of uh like you know business-wise, uh, when it comes to the uh financial and uh the licensing and uh having insurance and your workmen's comp and things like that. Nice, nice.

SPEAKER_00

So, what was the

The Hard Parts Nobody Sees

SPEAKER_00

exact moment where you realized you know this could either really work or completely blow up in my face?

SPEAKER_01

When I first started, about the first two weeks, uh the phone kept ringing and then uh it stopped for a little bit uh uh because I was not advertising, and that was a scary moment at the time, and I just had to persevere through that and figure out ways to uh promote the business, and uh I found uh several ways to do that.

SPEAKER_00

Okay. What kind of ways do you know effectively market your business right now?

SPEAKER_01

Uh one part of a group that is in networking, which is BI. Uh, they're globally known. Uh that's about 20% of my business comes from that, and uh a few other uh websites, uh neighborhood app, uh which uh the next door app locally I get a lot of business from that, about 20 more percent there, and with having a Google page or um uh Instagram and Facebook as well helps out. And then somebody very wise

Marketing That Actually Works

SPEAKER_01

told me that I needed a website, so I went and got a website as well, and that doing those steps really helped out.

SPEAKER_00

Okay, okay. What about TikTok? You got one of those yet?

SPEAKER_01

Uh my wife does a lot of TikToking, but uh I'm not really into that. Uh not yet. I just don't seem to have the time to really get on the phone to do that.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, yeah, it's tough. But yeah, TikTok is like the man, it's like the number one way now to market your business. It's TikTok, it seems seems like everybody's on that thing these days. So, what would you say is the most stressful moment you've had as a business owner? Like a, you know, how am I going to get through this type of moment?

SPEAKER_01

I would say uh when you're on a deadline uh working for commercial um clients, uh they want to make money and have their business open, and when they shut down and they give you a specific date and it's getting close to that date, uh, it gets a little stressful. Um, when guys that you have employees, when they call out sick or something, that's also stressful. Or if

Stressful Moments And Staying Alive

SPEAKER_01

you just uh have like a freak accident, like I did the other day, I got rear-ended, and that just stopped all production for that day. I had to deal with that car accident. So those kind of things.

SPEAKER_00

Oh man, you yeah, we got to get into that a little bit more. What happened there? And I'm glad you're okay.

SPEAKER_01

Seems like it's thank you. Uh I was on that accident there. Yes, sir. I was Battlefield Parkway. I was on my way to go pick up my wife. On Sunday, she was on a women's retreat for our church, and I was going to pick her up, and I was at a red light, and then somebody slammed right into me and then took off. And the lady in front of me was my saving grace because she actually ran after him, took pictures of his car and his license plate, came back, found out that she was a nurse, she aided me and then got me to the hospital.

SPEAKER_00

Oh, nice, nice, nice. Well, see, I mean, I mean, you no big injuries or anything, right? You're you're good?

SPEAKER_01

No, nothing major, and uh I'm really good to go now. Nice, nice.

SPEAKER_00

That's a good blessing there.

unknown

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00

So have you ever thought about quitting your business? And if so, what stopped you?

SPEAKER_01

Uh one point I did um because I wasn't seeing a lot of income coming in the first year. I was trying to grow it and it discouraged me a little bit. And I uh went into a little bit of not much of a depression, but I talked to my wife about it and I was really scared. I don't know what we're gonna do. Um, and then I prayed about it, and the good lord uh made the phone ring, and the phone kept ringing since. So that discouragement was just for a moment of time.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, so just a temporary setback. Yes, sir. Yeah, nice, nice. So, what's a mistake you've made early on that cost you either serious money, time, or reputation in your business, would you say?

SPEAKER_01

Not vetting um employees when I wanted to hire some guys. I just got really quickly. I got excited when I put an ad on that I was hiring, and I jumped at the first person. They said they had a lot of experience. I got them on the job site, and they were not what they said. So they sold themselves pretty well during the interview, but in the long run, I had to let that person go and several others because of not proper vetting.

SPEAKER_00

Okay, okay. So, what's

Hiring Lessons And Managing Standards

SPEAKER_00

something about you personally that had to change in order for your business to grow, would you say?

SPEAKER_01

My attitude towards uh the employees that I have. Um, I come from a uh a military background, so I'm always have structure, but working for the best company in Chattanooga at the time, uh, before I went into business for myself, uh there was a lot of expectations on all of us. So I kind of had that in my head uh with my employees, and I demanded the same type of results, and I was not getting that. So I had to do a like a self-check of seeing what was going on and change my attitude and be more positive and give incentives for guys to work for me that would be very happy to work for my company.

SPEAKER_00

So you're saying, so to dig into that a little bit more, so you're saying you had very high expectations and you expected everybody to live up to them?

SPEAKER_01

Yes, I I took them at their word. So for instance, a man said he had 15 years experience. I get him on a job on day one, and he was rolling a wall out with a roller, and he was hitting the ceiling, and we were not painting the ceiling. It was popcorn, and the customer actually was watching during this time, and she was like, Are you gonna fix that? I was like, Yes, I will. And I had to take him and say, Okay, do something else. And so a lesson learned that you can't always take everybody at their word.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, yeah. No, that's it. That's kind of embarrassing, but I'm sure you made it right, right?

SPEAKER_01

Over the long run, I most definitely did, and uh, she gave me a good Google review after that. Nice.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, that's always the best way to handle it. You know, you know, you have an issue that comes up and you handle it professionally and you turn it around and it ends up being a positive experience at the end of the day. That's a sign of a really good business owner. I love that. I love hearing that. So let's say if someone shadowed you, and obviously this is hypothetical, but let's say if someone shadowed you for a full day, what would what would surprise them the most about how you operate?

SPEAKER_01

I guess I would say how uh neat I am. Um I'm very um when I go into a, for instance, a somebody's home, uh I treat it as like it's my own. Um my wife keeps a tidy house, so I expect uh the way I find um a room or somebody's home to look like that and much better after I get done with my work. So if I had somebody watching me, they would see that I'm putting down the proper um uh uh drop cloths or plastic or tape, and I'm putting everything perfectly so that there will be no imperfections. Obviously, no one's perfect, but during that time I don't get nervous if somebody is watching me and they would be like, oh wow, this guy takes everything seriously.

SPEAKER_00

Okay, okay. No, I love that, I love that. So let's talk numbers without getting too specific. You know, what would you say was the turning point where things started to scale and you became profitable in your business?

SPEAKER_01

Um, I would say when I landed uh my first commercial job, and uh it was a coffee shop uh out in Cleveland, and they called me and they said, Hey, we would like to have you come out and give us an estimate. And when I got there, I saw that there was a lot of work, and I gave them very fair pricing, and the lady, um, the customer was like, uh, that's

Pricing Profitability And Scaling

SPEAKER_01

really low. You should go up on your pricing. And at that moment, I was like, oh wow, so I guess I can, but I I don't want to, because I'm in competition with a lot of other people, I don't want to lose out on a job, but I do want to have to, I do want to make money myself.

SPEAKER_00

So what would you say actually moves the needle most in your business right now?

SPEAKER_01

Uh I'd have to say uh having faith in God that He will provide for me.

SPEAKER_00

Nice, I love it, I love it. So, what's one thing you're doing today that gives you an unfair advantage over your competitors, would you say?

SPEAKER_01

So I came up with a system that it's not trademarked or anything, but something that I really enjoy doing. So when I go to a customer and I look around and I'm assessing the situation and I bring it home to give them a proper estimate of uh detailed estimate sheet, what I do is at the end of it, after I tally everything up and I come up with a number, so let's say if it was a thousand dollars, I give them ten percent off. If they give me a Google review and or if they give me another referral

Integrity Discounts And Team Culture

SPEAKER_01

to another client, I give them ten percent off, and that's really big on what I've been doing, and I don't jack up the price to get that ten percent back either. Oh, nice, nice. Yeah, I'm sure people like that a lot. Yes, they do. They they enjoy getting a discount.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah. Anytime you can save some money is always good. So, yeah, let's let's go back to it. I mean, you did say you have a team of a team of guys that work with you. What would you say is the fastest way someone can lose their job working for you? Uh, other than what you said earlier about the guy kind of messing up and uh painting the ceiling there.

SPEAKER_01

Anything else? I would Yeah. Well, since I have integrity, and um, my number one thing I tell my guys before they start uh a story that my father told me a long time ago when I was working for him. There's a $100 bill sitting there on the person's counter and you're working, and you take that $100 bill and you put it in your pocket. At that moment, you just got $100, so you're $100 richer, but at the end of the week, you're not going to get the four or five hundred dollars or whatever your pay is at the end of the week. So theft to me would be the number one deal breaker because people trust me to be in their homes. That that hundred dollar bill will still be sitting there at the end of the job.

SPEAKER_00

Okay, okay. And then let's say hypothetically on the flip side, you know, what makes someone instantly valuable to your team?

SPEAKER_01

Their personality. So I have a guy, Hezekiah. He's the first guy I hired. Um, he is amazing. Uh, he's uh African American and he just is eager to learn. He goes, um, excuse my French, he goes balls to the wall. So I guess he really goes the extra mile to not only please my customers, but he's doing it to please me because he knows my expectations. But he is just his personality on the job site is so great that the people, my customers, and other people that are around, it has gotten me more business because they brag about him at the end of the job. So personality is a huge thing.

SPEAKER_00

All right, perfect. All right, so we're gonna head into what's called the quick fire round. So, how this works is I'm going to uh give you one word, and I just want you to tell me the first thing that comes to your mind. Your answer doesn't have to be one word, but it's just the first thing that comes to your mind when you hear each word in regards to running your business, and then you kind of expand upon why you chose that. Does that make sense? Yes, sir. All right, perfect. First word is success.

SPEAKER_01

Family. I'm sorry. The reason why I chose family is because uh the more successful that I am, uh the more lucrative it will be for my family.

SPEAKER_00

That's a fact, yeah. That is true. Next word is failure.

SPEAKER_01

Prayer. When I seem to think that I am failing, I will go to prayer and get a boost from God. Love it, love it. Burnout. Being on my side by side and spinning those tires in the mountains. I love it.

SPEAKER_00

Scaling.

SPEAKER_01

Trying to determine oh I'm sorry. Scaling, I say fishing. That's the only thing that pops in my head with scaling. Fishing is trying to get more uh employees, I guess, to perform for me. Yeah, okay.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, I mean you kinda you kinda just went into it, but yeah, hiring is the next word.

SPEAKER_01

Hiring. Um leadership. Uh I expect uh my guys to have uh a leadership role where they can uh help other guys to uh perform better. Competition There's a um uh undocumented. I'm sorry. Um There's a lot of folks out there that claim to be painters and they just don't take it seriously and they don't have legitimate businesses.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, yeah. No, I know I know where you're going with that. I got that. And the last word is freedom.

SPEAKER_01

Country. Yeah, I fought for it really hard, and uh I love it very much, and because I gave eight years of my life to it. Nice, nice.

SPEAKER_00

No, I love that. Thank you. Thank you for getting it for the quick fire round. I appreciate that. So, yeah, where do you think your industry is going now and and what are most people getting wrong about it right now, would you say?

SPEAKER_01

Well, a lot of uh the industry. Oh, I talk to a lot of customers because I ask them this question all the time. And what has been getting me the job more so lately is that there are some people out there that are claiming to have their business uh painting-wise. I can only speak for this, but uh they are taking 50% of the money, or if not all the money up front from the customer before they

Industry Scams And Customer Trust

SPEAKER_01

start, and then they are not showing up, and they are just taking advantage of people out there. So I come in and I do the job, and when my job is finished, I I ask for payment when the job is complete.

SPEAKER_00

Wait a minute, wait a minute. Okay, are you serious? They're asking for like a 50% down payment, I guess, is what you yeah.

SPEAKER_01

So most uh most of my customers, uh I would say about 80% so far, has said that the number one thing from painters right now in the Chattanooga area, that they are not showing up after they received half or full payment, and then they're changing their phone numbers and they're changing their email addresses and the name of their company as well. And the second most thing that is uh agitating to the customers is uh painters not showing up or calling back or going to uh someone's house to give them an estimate. So those are the two problems.

SPEAKER_00

Wow. That is that's wild. I have not heard that yet. That's why I was a little surprised. I've not heard that. But uh yeah, definitely keep it on the lookout. I did not know that was happening. Um, yeah, so if it, you know, if a business owner, and I want you to be as candid as you can on the next answer to this question, but let's say a small business owner is listening to the podcast episode today with you, Joseph. And you know, let's say they're they're they're feeling stuck or overwhelmed, and let's say, you know, they're having a bad day or let's even a bad week, or let's say they're having a bad 2026 so far. What's a piece of advice you'd want them to hear from you today?

SPEAKER_01

Give me a call and I'll come help you out. No, I'm just kidding. I would say uh just stick with it, and the best thing that you

Advice Future Plans And Contact Info

SPEAKER_01

can do is have a private moment with yourself. Uh get with God and just ask him for guidance and it he will uh show you the way. That's the number one thing I could say. But as for me, as what I would say is keep your head up, keep trying, and just always make sure that you put the customer first and you put your business as like that's your number one source of income. So you want to give your best, everything that you've got, because you have got a family or somebody counting on you to come home at the end of the day and bring that uh income.

SPEAKER_00

Nice, nice. I love it. I think that's good advice. So, what would you say is next for JMJ painting and maintenance? What should people be excited about coming up in the near future for your business?

SPEAKER_01

Um I'm probably hiring a few more people, and uh, we're gonna expand into uh different things other than just the painting part of it, uh, which is commercial, uh residential, and uh industrial. I I would like to do more like handyman stuff. Uh, a lot of my customers always ask me if I can do little odds and ends around the house, and I don't want to tell them no.

SPEAKER_00

Okay. So handyman stuff is coming up soon. Do you have any kind of timeline on when that'll happen?

SPEAKER_01

Uh probably uh I would say probably in about a month. Uh I do seldomly do little odds and ends like that now, but because I am in BI chapter, uh, I try to stay away from things if there is somebody in my chapter that does or performs that task. Gotcha, gotcha. All right, perfect.

SPEAKER_00

And you said you're hiring, so what are you hiring for? Did you want to put that out there on the podcast today?

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, uh just somebody with experience and that can be uh told one time what to do something. I would say five years experience at least, or have been in the construction field to know what's going on. Perfect, perfect.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, just reach out to them. And finally, what's the best way for someone to connect with you or learn more about what you do?

SPEAKER_01

Uh I'm old school like my father, who has taught me everything. So I like talking to person to a person one-on-one, um, in person. Uh, but for me, uh a phone call or a text message is really the best thing. Uh emails are okay, but it's it's a lot easier for me to just pick up the phone and just dial a number.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, and that's have the conversation. And what's that number? Uh in case anybody's reach interested in reaching out to you. Area code 423-320-5483. Perfect, perfect. And uh yeah, any social media. I know you said something about a website, but um, any other social media other than website.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, um besides Google, um, Facebook, uh JMJ at Facebook, however that goes, next door app. Um I'm on there at JMJ Painting and Maintenance, um Instagram, uh JMJ Painting and Maintenance LLC at Instagram. And then also our website, JMJ Painting and MaintenanceLLC.com.

SPEAKER_00

Okay, perfect. Perfect. All right, Joseph. Yeah, this has been fantastic. Yeah, thank you for coming on today and sharing your story, your perspective, and your real behind the scenes and building your business. Really appreciate you today, man. You were great. You're great, and I love your humor. You're wonderful. Thank you, Cliff.

SPEAKER_01

I really appreciate this opportunity.