The Readirect Podcast
Shifting the conversation back to books. Hosted by Abigail Freshley and Emily Rojas.
The Readirect Podcast
Book Talk: All the Young Dudes, Recent Reads, and PR Dumpster Fires
Travis, we gotta talk about it.
Eternal disclaimer that we do not support JK Rowling in any way, and encourage partaking in only fanfiction and avoiding her altogether. ANYWAYS!
When we tell you to, you can skip to 51:56 to miss all Marauders talk.
Abigail has FINALLY read All the Young Dudes by the legendary MsKingBean89, and WE GOTTA TALK ABOUT IT.
This is now a Wolfstar podcast, we will not be accepting comments, criticism, or negative reviews at this time. Good vibes only for our favorite gay wizards from the 1970s.
If you're only here for the links, here you go:
- All the Young Dudes by MsKingBean89
- All the Young Dudes - Sirius's Perspective by Rollercoasterwords
- Taylor Swift Songs as Books (Readirect Podcast Episode)
- Crimson Rivers by msamoony
- Choices by MesserMoon
- Five Times Draco Malfoy Accidentally Apparated into Hermione Granger's Bed... And the One Time He Meant To by thefrancakes
- Language Lessons by MsAlexWP
- wading in waist-high water by colgatebluemintygel
- Here We Go Again by Alison Cochrun
Books We've Read Recently:
Follow us on Instagram and TikTok at @readirectpodcast for much more fun and chaos!
Welcome to the Redirect Podcast. My name is Abigail Freshly and I'm Emily.
Speaker 2:Rojas. The Redirect Podcast is a show where we shift the conversation back to books. We discuss themes from some of our favorite books and how those themes relate to our real lived experiences.
Speaker 1:On today's episode we're doing a seasonal book talk, so strap in. It's going to be a crazy ride.
Speaker 2:But first, if you've been enjoying the show, we would love to ask you to support us in a few simple ways. First, you can leave us a five-star review on Apple Podcasts and just tell us how much you love our show.
Speaker 1:And if you really really love the show, follow us on Instagram at Redirect Podcast and on TikTok at redirect podcast. And if you really really love the show, we'd love for you to share with a friend. Sharing our show with a friend is by far the best way to help us grow our community of book loving nerds and it's truly the way that we've really grown our listeners. It's from word of mouth. It's been really fun to talk to my friends who listen to the show and, um, so yeah, share with a friend okay, yeah, share with a friend, and now we'll share with our friend.
Speaker 2:If you have a lot of friends that are mentally ill. They're gonna love this have I got a show for you maybe don't lead that, but you know, that's how you can spot someone in the wild, sure, sure, how have you been?
Speaker 1:How have I been? Good, I don't know if you can hear it in my nose I'm like a little congested, I'm getting over an illness, not COVID, not strep, but I did have. I took three days off work last week to kind of just recover and I was able to wrap up some reading during my sick time. So that was good.
Speaker 2:That's even better Sometimes reading is the best when you're sick too, because like screens are not like. I don't like looking at a screen, but if you can read a good book that isn't too tense or mentally taxing, that can be a good way to spend your sick time.
Speaker 1:And I can do it like horizontal.
Speaker 2:Yeah, exactly yeah, that's critical.
Speaker 1:So yeah, how about you? How are you?
Speaker 2:Great, yeah, I've been reading a lot Nice.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I've been having a great time. How are your reading goals coming?
Speaker 2:That's a great place to start. So I set my goals at the beginning of the year at 50. Because, as you guys know, last year I really struggled to even make 50. Honestly, it was kind of tough. But I am ahead by six books, according to Storygraph. So I have read 38 books so far this year. So I'm definitely on I'll get 50 and I always read more in the winter, so I'm sure I would say I feel like 60, 70 seems reasonable. Yeah, also, to be fair, a lot of these books are really, really, really really long like so aggressively long.
Speaker 2:The longest one, I think, says it's 4 000 pages oh my god. So I feel like that should count for more. But anyways, I feel like yeah, I feel really solid this year.
Speaker 1:Yeah, so what I mean? I have like a spreadsheet where I track things too, and I have, I think, maybe what I should add a column next year. That is word count. It's too late for me to go back and figure out the word count of all the books I've already read, because I don't want to.
Speaker 2:No, yeah, that's too much.
Speaker 1:But next year, because then I would love to know the average words.
Speaker 2:Yeah, Well, storygraph does, do they do word count? And I have my little graph so it breaks down like it goes. Okay, so it's less than 300 words, no pages, sorry, less than 300 words, no pages, sorry, less than 300 pages. For 300 to 499 pages and 500 plus pages.
Speaker 1:So it doesn't necessarily get words, but when you get up to the thousand pages, it's just like that needs to be a different category. So, yeah, yeah, no, I get that, I get that, I get that, so yeah, I feel like I'm feeling great, though I feel like I'm really on track.
Speaker 2:I've been reading a lot more this year than I did last year and um enjoying reading like having so much fun reading this year. So, like you know, that's that's what I worry, especially with our, with our podcast. Sometimes you're like, okay, I don't want this to feel like I have to read stuff. Sometimes we do have to read stuff for this that maybe we don't enjoy, but for the most part I feel like we read stuff we like and um, but you know it's easy to get burnt out sometimes.
Speaker 3:So I'm having a lot of fun reading this year, but good.
Speaker 1:What about you? How are you doing? Um, I'm good. I've been on a little bit of a I'm behind, but I did last year for sure. Yeah, um, I think you did went crazy last year. Respectfully, I did go crazy. I mean, I've still read a lot this year. I've read 61 books. That's, I'm behind what I did last year for sure, yeah, you went crazy last year. Respectfully, I did go crazy. I mean, I've still read a lot this year. I've read 61 books. That's a lot. It's maybe a stretch to get to 100 this year, but we'll see if I can do it.
Speaker 1:I don't know. I think recently I've been DNFing kind of quite a bit Me too. Yeah, which is good. Like we have a long time. We have long professed that you should not finish a book that you don't like because ultimately it's gonna kill your groove. Yeah, um, but yeah, I think recently, like I started a few books, I just like they were slowing me down and then, like like before I, before I got on my DNF sprint like thing, I was forcing myself to finish some books and you know that, just kill it yeah.
Speaker 1:It can just kill you.
Speaker 2:I really get them yeah.
Speaker 1:I get that. So, um, so, yeah, um, I recently I was actually, I had book club today and for the first time, ever I. Dnf'd our book club, book which is really saying something, because I'll book club today and, for the first time ever, I DNF'd our book club book Wow. Which is really saying something, because I'll tell you something it was a historical fiction. Oh, a historical romance. That's like my thing, wow.
Speaker 2:I DNF'd it, I know.
Speaker 1:And also we've read some trash books. Yeah, we've read some terrible books that like half the people didn't finish and I pushed through and I just was like to be fair. I was trying to. I mean, it took me. It wasn't a long book, it was maybe less than 300 pages probably, but I was trying to read it at the same time as reading all the young dudes and I just like I couldn't, I was like I every time I'm spending reading this historical romance yeah.
Speaker 1:I am not reading the thing I want to be reading, and I'm thinking about the other thing, in my mind yeah, so I'm just not going to do it.
Speaker 2:You're trying to push through. Yeah, I get that Respectfully, so yeah.
Speaker 1:So that's been the challenge, yeah, and obviously reading all the young dudes, which, to be clear, is not a book, it is a fiction. Right clear it's not a book, it's a fiction, right, but um, I mean, that took so much time yeah, that's an investment so long I understand, like it's the longest thing I've ever read, I think yeah, um, but even even yeah, so, um, yeah, so yeah, I quit that, and then I quit this other book called um a woman of no importance which was really good.
Speaker 1:It's a biography, like I might go back to another point in time, but it's a biography about this woman who is an american uh working for mi6 mi6 in world war ii and she was like a spy and nazi occupied france and it's really really interesting. But but it just wasn't the moment for me, yeah.
Speaker 2:I think I'm about to DNF this book. Have you read it? I see it all the time, but it's called this Is how you Lose the Time War.
Speaker 2:No, I have not heard of that I have essentially, for all intents and purposes, dnfed. I got it on. So for Christmas last year, in like Dirty Santa or whatever, with my family, I got a six month subscription to Audible, which is really just whatever, however many credits that is. So I've been kind of working my way through them because I'm not huge in audiobooks. But I got that on audiobook because it's short. It was like a three hour total book or maybe like close to four, I don't know, it's not very long and it's about this. I thought it would be interesting. It's about these two like um, I don't know, they're kind of like spies or time agents and they're each like moving through time, but there's some like romantic tension, but there's they write letters back and forth to each other. That's the whole book. I don't think that's for me. I don't think I'm a letter book girl really, um, and it's just so abstract.
Speaker 1:Anyways, I don't know if you guys like it just wasn't, it wasn't hitting the spot.
Speaker 2:I get it yeah but I've seen it a lot, but I've also seen a lot of people say they dnf'd it.
Speaker 2:I feel like it's a very like niche polarizing and I think honestly, it would probably be better reading it than listening to audiobook, because it's so like abstract there's not a lot of like world building. Um, it's really hard if you're not paying attention. I I feel like to understand what's going on, like when I do an audiobook, I like to just have it on while I'm working or like driving, and I feel like you kind of need to be locked in on this one. So that's my most recent DNF, but it's still there so I can finish it whenever I choose, if I choose, but I don't know if I will choose, but I feel like I wasted a credit on it.
Speaker 1:But credit on it. But you know you're right, like if it's, if it's slowing you down, dna, listen, we're. We're like over halfway through the year if you're hearing this. It's not too late. This, and there's a book that's coming to your mind right now about yeah, yeah, god, it's just been such a slog. Honestly, just quit to the side, yeah, and maybe you come back to it later. Some of my favorite books that are read. I had to come back to later, and that is okay.
Speaker 1:A book will find you at the right time and place.
Speaker 2:I agree.
Speaker 1:Like you cannot force, this Reading is for fun. This is a hobby. This is like a little treat Do not read something you're not enjoying.
Speaker 2:Exactly, and I feel like, yeah, like I'm such a mood reader, I feel like you do, you feel that way as well. So I feel like if I'm not in the mood, it doesn't matter how good the book is, if it's not hitting that specific mood. I'm in right at that moment.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:Then again I might read it later and love it, but just at that time I actually like.
Speaker 1:My controversial take is that everyone is a mood reader.
Speaker 2:Yeah, you're probably right.
Speaker 1:I actually like when people say that I'm like, yeah, I agree. And then I'm trying to think of anyone in the world who doesn't read what they're in the mood to read. That's true, I don't know. Rory Gilmore, I don't like.
Speaker 2:I feel like some people do just kind of lock in. They're like this is my book, I'm going to read it and that's it, like you know. But you know what? That's not me.
Speaker 1:But here's my other thing.
Speaker 2:I'm saying Like yeah because they're forcing themselves to read, like whatever it is that they pick up. Yeah, yeah, maybe you're right. Weigh in. If you guys feel like you're not a mood reader and you read a lot, please tell us, and we would love to hear from you.
Speaker 1:Tell us about your culture.
Speaker 2:Yeah. It's hard to meet people who don't like have a voice inside their head. You know like there's people like that, but you're like, yeah, what understand? What is?
Speaker 1:that if you are not a mood reader tell us.
Speaker 3:What do you stand for, what are your?
Speaker 1:beliefs. What are your values?
Speaker 3:who are you voting for? Literally, who are you and what's?
Speaker 1:what's going on up there?
Speaker 2:yeah, no again. Yeah, weigh in. Okay, well, it's crazy, there's a girl in my book club, my friend zippy.
Speaker 1:Uh, she has the thing where you can't picture things in your head, so she's like she reads books, and sometimes a book because it came up, because sometimes the book club will be like no, that was just really weird, like I was imagining that and it was just like I couldn't get past that, and she'll be like, you see, like I just take everything for what it is, like I literally don't see anything, so yeah, so like who knows?
Speaker 2:there are definitely people out there all kinds of minds are are beautiful and welcomed here at the redirect podcast. We just don't understand you.
Speaker 1:Yes, just tell us what you believe in. Okay, you know what I've been thinking about this whole day, actually this whole week, knowing we were gonna record and knowing what we wanted to talk about.
Speaker 2:You know how I don't listen to the New Heights podcast, but you know how every time they record Okay, well, you know, when they start stuff, jason will be like Trav. We got to talk about it. That's how I feel, okay.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it's time, so we're going to lock in here. And if you don't want to hear about some like mentally ill, really long Marauders fan fiction just go ahead and skip ahead.
Speaker 2:I will put the timestamp in the little info about this podcast and you can skip.
Speaker 1:But we're going to go hard in here. We're locking in, okay, so happy to be here.
Speaker 2:Me too, I feel God in this podcast.
Speaker 1:I feel God in this podcast, I feel god in this chilis, um all right so we've talked a little bit about all the young dudes on here before in the context of you have read it, but you didn't talk that much about it because, yeah, I was like oh, I'm gonna read it yeah so um, also, if you didn't listen, those old episodes, uh, all the youngudes is a fan fiction on Archive of Our Own. I think it is among the top ever visited, I believe so, most popular fan fictions on the internet.
Speaker 1:It is by one MissKingbean89.
Speaker 2:Which is how we got into this whole mess? Because we did our Taylor Swift episode so you can go back and listen to that if you haven't. Where I was like, okay, I'm going to read this for research because people jokingly somewhat seriously but somewhat jokingly have said that miss king, being 89, is taylor swift yes, so that's before we enter this rabbit hole before we enter into further discussion about this, just a few friendly reminders about how to engage with fan fiction in a good way.
Speaker 1:One these people are not getting paid for their work, so if you have something negative to say, do not say it in public forum. Just don't, yeah, because this is just what's the point somebody's fun little project that they did. Yeah, okay, they're not putting themselves out there. They're putting themselves out there to share what's in their little head and it's cute and fun. Yeah, and it's not to be critiqued. Um two, don't monetize it. Don't buy a printing of it. Don't sell a printing of it.
Speaker 2:Um, you know, one more, sir, to say yeah, it's not fun, and is there? Anything else um. We don't support jk rowling or her view oh, we don't think you know, that's one thing about fan fiction that's great is most people don't there, and it's a way to engage with the stuff and not deal with it.
Speaker 1:Actually, like in most like Harry Potter universe fan fictions, in that they'll start in the description. They'll be like oh, and, by the way, fuck JK Rowling, yeah, yeah. Because also yeah because also this it feels like also, she could never write this.
Speaker 2:No more would she, she. Well, it feels like the ultimate right?
Speaker 1:what?
Speaker 2:miss king bean 89 wrote she couldn't because you know why. It's like, um, like. Why am I having to explain to jk rowling that remus lupin is gay? Why do I have to be the one to tell her that? You know what I mean? So it's like she doesn't even know. She doesn't know what she's created because it's all there.
Speaker 3:She doesn't even know and the thing is, and it is so far with it she couldn't.
Speaker 1:The thing is, it is true that they are in a relationship. It is true that sirius, yeah and remus are canon because so many people have seen this and it's so obvious to so many people including the actors playing them Exactly, when they read the script thought they were boyfriends and they had already read the books at that point that this goes beyond the mind of JK Rowling. She no longer gets to say she doesn't know what she did.
Speaker 1:Yeah, she put this in the world and she didn't even know what was happening. It just happened. Know what she did? Yeah, she put this in the world and she didn't even know what was happening. It just happened and she created gay characters.
Speaker 2:They, you know yeah, that's not my problem they are gay yeah, anyways so this follows, okay.
Speaker 1:So now that we've talked about that, so yeah, don't make money off of it. Don't be mean to people who put the fan fiction online because they didn't ask for it and don't support. Jk Rowling Okay, so it follows the story of the Marauders, so James Peter, remus and Sirius, from their first year at Hogwarts to the events of the beginning of the Order of the Phoenix. Yeah, it is canon compliant, yeah, so, yeah, I mean it doesn't go against anything. There aren't any events that contradict what happened in canon.
Speaker 2:Right, yeah, I think the biggest thing is Remus Lupin's backstory. I don't remember that. I remember in the books I think his dad like he didn't live in a boy's home or whatever. Like I don't think that was part of his life, or maybe it was never even said, or I don't know if it was said, but that would be, I think, the biggest divergence, if anything.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and so it's told from Remus's point of view. Yes, although it's not in first-person point of view.
Speaker 2:No, but it's his life, it's third-person point of view through his perspective. Yeah, yeah, and I recently read Sirius' point of view, which actually goes. You've read the whole thing already.
Speaker 1:Jesus Christ. Okay, here's the thing. Wow, all right. So Sirius' point of view was written by another fan fiction author.
Speaker 2:Sorry, pull it up. And it is so good we can talk more about it after. You talk about your experience reading all the young dudes. But it actually goes even farther. It goes through the events of order well, not until sirius's death, but it goes into order of the phoenix, um. So there's some like even more devastating things that you want to break your heart even further.
Speaker 3:I don't know, but just so people know, people know that it's by roller coaster.
Speaker 1:Words on yes, and it is beautiful anyway.
Speaker 2:Anyways. So I'm familiar. I'm like I felt like, okay, you were texting me stuff about all the young dudes. I've read a lot, you know, in between me reading this and that, and now and so you're like I gotta refresh.
Speaker 2:I was like, oh man, I want to reread this, so bad. But then I'm like, oh, sirius's perspective. So I went and read that and it was just, it's like like I told you, I just finally got the Marauders off my TikTok for you page and now it's just, it's all back. I'm back, oh yeah, because I've just been spamming you for days.
Speaker 1:But I have read some of Sirius's point of view, like select chapters. I'll go and be like, oh man, I want to see, like, yeah, those thoughts. So the thing about reading a book that spans 30 years or not 30 years, 20 years, yeah is that I feel like I lived an entire life. Yeah, I read this. I was like, oh my god, and the thing is, you know how it's gonna end, like yeah, everybody who dies in the main in the main series, dies in the main series. You know what I'm saying?
Speaker 1:yeah, and there's one extra character, um, an original character named grant chapman um, which I would love to talk more about that because, yes, in the community people love grant chapman, people love grant, and as they should, and he is great. So basically, he's a muggle friend of sirius's remus who becomes, yeah, remus's that he met at this boy's home that he grew up in before coming to Hogwarts, and yeah, they Also have like an on and again, off again romantic relationship. Yeah, that's.
Speaker 2:He helps Remus find out who he really is and Is there for him in a lot of key moments in his life. And I think actually the Grant Chapman is very interesting because right now I'm reading a fan fiction that it okay. So it goes back to Prisoner of Azkaban and says what would happen if JK Rowling actually followed the actual lunar calendar for the full moons, because there wasn't a full moon on, like the night that you know, peter escapes sirius s. You know that wasn't actually a full moon in that year or whatever. So it's like a happier version. But in this version obviously there's no grant and it's like wait, you really think about what was remus doing for all these years. He was like he's not really a part of the wizarding world that we encounter through harry's point of view. He is a werewolf which allegedly is hard to find any kind of job, or like stability. You know, like what was he doing?
Speaker 1:and he's unregistered yeah, he's under and that's why you know, that's why I think all the young dudes like caught on so much, is that it's so believable it's very believable so essentially like the first few years at hogwarts, remus is, I mean, he's always known that he was magical and he knew that his dad was a wizard but died and that he's a werewolf um, but he's really like being reintroduced to the magical world, to the wizarding world and, um, it's about, you know, the early days of him and the marauders, the creation of the marauders map, so like there's some really great fan service nuggets in there.
Speaker 1:Um, and then like also a bunch of stuff about like the blacks and like narcissa and lucius and bellatrix and all them, and like the kind of seeing how the start of the first wizarding world went, which is just, you know, it's fans love that kind of stuff, yeah. And then over time he's realizing that he doesn't get why he doesn't like girls and he's realizing that he has feelings for serious and then the complications of their relationship and how their relationship grows over time, and then the events after they leave Hogwarts and it is so inexpressibly beautiful. I just it's so moving.
Speaker 1:I know it's it's so good, and then thinking about the implications for all of the Marauders, about not knowing that Peter was the one who sold out James yeah, and Lily, and what that experience must have been like for all of them.
Speaker 2:Yes, and also I think it puts in perspective like I've been thinking about this a lot, reading serieses also. I think it puts in perspective, like I've been thinking about this a lot, reading sirius's, because his also um has a lot more with his relationship with his brother, red regulus, and like just how young they were and I feel like jk, rowling among her many crimes like doesn't deal with ever in in canon how young harry's parents and sirius and Remus and Peter and Regulus like even when they find that little note, like in the horror crux from Regulus, it's like oh, he was like 18 or 19 years old, like he wasn't I don't know.
Speaker 1:Like you would think at some point. Yeah, and James and Lily were like 20. They were 20.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and Sirius goes to ask him and he's like 22.
Speaker 2:Like Remus is by himself and he's like 22, like remus is by himself and he's in his early 20s and like I just don't feel like part of it is casting in the movies, um, like they were all cast a lot older than they would have actually been.
Speaker 2:But also I feel like at some point you would have thought jake rolling would have dealt with it in terms of, like harry, when he gets to be 17, it's like, oh, my parents were like my age when this they were doing this, but I don't feel like there's any real like reckoning with that. And so when you're reading them actually grow up like I feel like when you're reading these fics, you feel the time passing because you know what's going to happen and you know they only have like by the time they get together is like before their seventh year, and you know as soon as that year's over they're going to the war and things are going to be bad. And so you feel it so aggressively, I think, being like, oh my gosh, like you see the time passing because you're like I've been with this character since they were 11. And now they're only 18 and they're having to deal with these really big things. So I feel like it just puts that into perspective more and is part of why it's even more tragic.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and like you have, have you see them in a childlike way? Yeah, it's like what you're saying, it's like it, or like a young adult way, you know, like they're dealing with loss, they're dealing with love and like other things that regular like 18, 19, 20 year olds have to deal with, where, like they don't understand each other's feelings, they don't know how to communicate in a relationship, yet they don't know how to manage jealousy and like the different ways people start their careers and it's like all of that and you've gotten thrust into a war.
Speaker 2:yeah, um, oh, but where you'll either be sent to a, by the way, like prison reform in the wizarding world.
Speaker 1:We gotta we gotta do something about it. Isian we gotta do something it is not, it's not chill at all.
Speaker 2:And also Sirius is sent there with no trial, Like that is not chill either. But Also they're just young, Like they're just babies when they're dealing with this. Stuff is also the problem. Also, what If?
Speaker 1:I ever catch this cheeky mother, dumbledore, dumbledore. I yeah abused them all like the way, like you know in in all the, in all the young dudes.
Speaker 1:They use remus as an envoy to the werewolves. Yeah, no, it's such a transactional way, without thinking about his feelings but offering him any emotional support. Yeah, and it's really just these. Like these four, four, five, I mean they have a friend group, so it's the four boys plus, like lily, marlene and mary, yeah, and they're all supporting each other, and then, like maybe james's parents a little bit, but that's it yeah, yeah, like well, yeah, and I um, in sirius's point of view.
Speaker 2:Obviously this is not necessarily what exactly happened, but in that version dumbledore is the one who suggests to sirius that remus is the spy. So he's like, hey, don't trust him. Like you, we don't know, like he's one of the only people it could be, and so stuff like that. We're like oh, he just like is so in everything. This is a fair characterization of dumbledore in canon and in fanon. He is so withholding and it feels like if he would have just told everyone what was going on, they could have put their minds together, work together and like defeated voldemort a lot sooner and maybe not had all this stuff happen.
Speaker 1:But because, like he is so unwilling to share what he knows with anyone, it's like this sucks and he's so unwilling, and he's so unwilling to change because he's on the same bullshit during the main series and he never makes right the things that he did wrong. You know he never apologizes. He never like sees people as human beings Like he just let this scrappy group of like early to mid-20-year-olds yeah, oh, I just I can't stand him, but anyways.
Speaker 1:Anyways, it's a lovely story. It is lovely. Albeit, devastating, I wonder. I feel like when reading it I resonate with Sirius a lot. That was the character I connected to the most. Yeah, I could see that I also fell in love with James as a character.
Speaker 1:Yes um, I also fell in love with james as a character. Um, just in the main series we get this one-sided perspective of james because, yes, really, the only memories that we get to see about james are through severus's point of view, yeah, and which clearly are negative, but we don't get to see from anyone else's point of view so taking this new on him. Like such like golden retriever, energy, heart of gold, like.
Speaker 2:Again just a kid, like when that's the, the prank stuff happened or the making fun of Snape, like that's not great, like to be a bully, but also maybe you deserved. And also like they were like 14 or 15. And it's like there's a lot more to a person than the worst thing they did when they were 14. You know like there's more sides to him and I think this again the thing I wondered too was like okay, I? I think obviously this is just poor writing, but in the in harry potter's life, like he, I feel like the relationship between him and Remus just makes no sense, because it just seems like I know he was only professor for a year and maybe he Lupin didn't want to like step on any toes, but it feels like he could have done more during that time to be like hey, harry, I would love to talk to you about your dad. Like I knew you when you were a baby.
Speaker 2:It just feels like, yeah, like he never gets anyone who like can tell him anything about his parents, and it's weird because he goes to the same school as them and they were only there 10 years prior. You know what I mean. Like barely 15 years maybe. So a lot of the professors are the same. Dumbledore's been there. It feels like people could have again. No one wants to like take him seriously or tell him anything and that's frustrating reading this because you're like, oh, james, you're so lovable, you know, yeah, what could have been.
Speaker 1:It's tough and like, yeah, the Marauder's Arc is heartbreaking, but also just so good.
Speaker 3:I love them I love all the characters.
Speaker 1:They're so interesting. Yes, through all of her bullshit, somehow JK Rowling references these characters in the past, who are such an amazing template.
Speaker 2:Yes, Well, okay, let's just address this. Okay, I've been, I've looked into this for content for this pod. There is okay in in the order of the phoenix when they're all at grimald place. It's serious as childhood home. Uh-huh, someone has broken down in the book. There are only two bedrooms left when everyone divides up the rooms in that house, and one of them is Regulus's room and one of them is Sirius's room, and no one can go into Regulus's room. So when Remus and Sirius what are they doing up there? They're sharing a room. Okay, she wrote that. So there's a lot of little nuggets in there that you just like. She wrote that. So I don't care what you think, jk, I really don't care what you think, actually, but if she intended it, or she didn't.
Speaker 1:It's there and and also like it makes sense, why it wouldn't. It makes sense even like, let's say, best case scenario, she did intend it right why they wouldn't be able to live that out loud with pride in the early 90s in the wizarding world, which already feels really regressive and like right behind on social stuff yeah, so I agree and I
Speaker 2:think, um, like I don't think she necessarily intended it, but I think that is what is so, because I'm like what is? I've been thinking about this. I'm like what is so because I'm like what is I've been thinking about this, like what is so appealing about this. But you know, what I like is, uh, like a couple, a pairing, a ship I can get on board with, where there's just enough there that you don't feel insane, you don't feel like I'm making this up out of nowhere. It's like stuff like I can't do, like people who are dreary ship like draco and harry, like that's me. I'm like okay, I can't follow you. Germani but, germani.
Speaker 2:I'm like there's enough here. Actually there is enough here where you don't feel insane, you feel like it's reasonable. So I feel like, um, I don't know like, one of my favorite tv ships of all time is tony and ziva from ncis and they never even like they maybe kiss on screen, I think, after I stopped watching one time. But there is enough there. There's enough little moments.
Speaker 1:That is not, it's not a lot, but there's enough where you just don't feel or just chemistry, whether platonic or not, like there's a potential I really think that, like I don't know, this is a controversial statement, but I think that anyone that is friends there is the potential for more always. Sure, probably, like if you have that, if you're able to have close friend chemistry, you could probably, if given like a spark of mutual attraction, right develop some sort of romantic relationship too yeah, that's valid.
Speaker 2:so, yeah, that's what makes me love this is that there is enough there in the real canon, which I have the background of, to believe this without even questioning it. Well, let me ask you this Again the actors themselves.
Speaker 1:What were you going to ask me? So, on the topic of ships that seem like there could be a kernel of believability there, how do we feel about Jegulus, james and?
Speaker 2:Regulus Okay, I don't love it, but I don't hate it.
Speaker 1:I want good things.
Speaker 2:I want good things for Reggie. I want him to not. I want to believe that in the canon he actually did have a change of heart and he went against Voldemort in the end. I I want to believe that. I think there's enough there to believe that, um, and so I want good things for him. I just like james and lily together, but I did read um crimson rivers which is I haven't read that one.
Speaker 2:Oh, don't, even you do not. This is the one that's 4 000 uh pages and longer than the Bible. It's a Hunger Games slash, harry Potter.
Speaker 1:Okay, wow, that's a lot.
Speaker 2:But in that James and Regulus are a main. They're the main couple in that and I really liked it. I think for me to like them it has to be a completely different setting.
Speaker 1:Not in the canon. Because here's what I'm gonna. Here's what I'm gonna say. I have just started, so I cannot form an opinion yet. I've just started. Choices by.
Speaker 2:Messer Moon, have you read Choices about that?
Speaker 1:no, okay, this is one that is also considered by some people in the fandom to be like fanon you know it's not like it's not technically canon, but because this does follow. It is canon, compliant to the point, because James does get with Lily, okay, and they do have Harry.
Speaker 3:Right.
Speaker 1:But also there is a James and Regulus component. Sure, so it's complicated, yeah, so it's complicated, yeah, and I think it explores because, like, it starts with the events of Sirius leaving the black household to live with James and his parents, and so it starts there and it's James's perspective on Regulus, based on, like, what he knows has happened in their house from Sirius.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and, but at the same time it starts yeah, yeah and um, but at the same time it starts where he's like oh gosh, I know I've been like going so hard after Lily the last like four years. I'm sick of getting turned down, so I'm just going to like pump the brakes a little bit and like yeah maybe I'd go back to her Like if she showed me some interest like at this point.
Speaker 1:So I have not read enough to really make an opinion yet, but I think that I could get on board with something like this yeah, and also there's Wolfstar in this. Yeah, that's what I there's Wolfstar in Crimson Rivers as well. Basically, it all needs to have the truth the gospel of.
Speaker 1:Sirius and Remus, but the tags for this one are Regulus and James, Sirius and Remus, James and Lily, and then all the individual characters Frank and Alice are in this, Lucius and Narcissa, so it's tied with Jagulus Wolfstar, Jilly Marauders, Cannon Compliant, Canonical Character, Death Angst Miner, Marlene McKinnon and Dorcas Meadows.
Speaker 3:Yeah, that's a big one.
Speaker 1:Or Crimson.
Speaker 2:Rivers as well. Look, crimson Rivers is crazy, it's crazy. But if you like the Hunger Games and you like the Marauders era, it's a perfect little mashup of those two. Excellent, excellent pairing. Yeah, I've read so much, so much.
Speaker 1:I've heard that Choices is like people consider it to be canon, like they consider all the Angus to be canon.
Speaker 2:Okay, let me know what you think I'll let you know what I think. I am not like hating on jagulus, I just don't like. I just like james and lily.
Speaker 1:So I feel like if that's there too, I could be persuaded right it's like it's james, it's, it's jagulus, but not at the expense of james and lily yeah, or even like I've read somewhere lily has someone else like I'm fine with that too.
Speaker 2:I want lily to be happy. I don't want her to be like discarded. You know I want her to be a fleshed out character and you know part of it.
Speaker 1:So also I saw this tiktok the other day. That was like it was um the clip from order of the phoenix, I think, where they're at um grimald place and like carrie gets up to hug sirius and then remus is like leaning against the door looking at them. You know, please? And someone in the no, please, I cannot, that is emblazoned into my corneas. But, um, I saw someone in the in the comments was like brb going to look up the um, the remus and sirius raise harry tag and I was like, yeah, oh see, I could read a one shot about remus and sirius raising harry. Yes, literally, give that to me on a intravenously, on a drip yes I will read anything about these two people.
Speaker 2:I've read so many like non-magical, uh, fan fictions where they're just like in completely different scenarios. I, like would read anything about remus and sirius. I love them, I would die for them.
Speaker 1:So yes, please, and I think for me, because I've read so many, or not so many, but several um, fix that could be canon, yeah, that that follow canon outside or like, or are extra canon. So like, yeah, like Manicled, for instance, well, right, that's not quite, but uh, it's kind of in the same world, though to a certain point and then diverges, yeah, like, I think I like that more. Um, with the exception of the example of them parenting here. Yeah, I would like you a short ones of that, but I will plug.
Speaker 1:my friend on AO3 is the Francakes. Her name is Francesca, so it's the Francakes. She has a really popular and really good one shot of it's Jermaine and it is called five times. Draco Malfoy accidentally apparated into hermione granger's bed and the one time he meant to, and it's 10 000 words, it's um, it's classic germany. It is really good so and it's like post. It's like post, uh book. They're like adult professionals, yes.
Speaker 2:So a quick little read if you're interested in that I will say here is my recommendation for you if you want another canon divergent one. Um, it's short, it is language lessons by miss alex wp. I actually love everything by miss alex wp, um, but this one, basically, instead of Peter doesn't betray. Peter never betrays James and Lily and Sirius makes it to their whatever, wherever their safe house is, as Voldemort's getting there to attack them and he kills Voldemort and they destroy all the Horcruxes in this timeline. So then the war is over earlier. There's no extra war, but it sounds like a fluffy little story. But the rewriting of there's a lot of flashbacks. So the rewriting of the war is super interesting too and it's not too long. So that would be my suggestion for anyone who wants more in the same world, um, but there's so many.
Speaker 2:There's so many I love.
Speaker 1:I can make a whole list for you guys that what you just described is a reason that I'm open to jegulus, because, um regulus, having taken, swapped the horcrux, the, and like having the note, it's like all right, maybe he did turn at the last second and like maybe this was, but he was again he was.
Speaker 2:He was 19. He was raised in an abusive house where he was right to be the black heir because serious left.
Speaker 3:So this is. What choice did he have?
Speaker 2:yeah, this isn't like his, like his dying action was to betray voldemort right, which is like.
Speaker 1:This is why I'm like okay, yeah, he probably didn't come up with that idea at the last second. He probably just felt like he didn't have choices. And so that's why I'm like, I'm persuadable and I'm open to a good Jaguars plot.
Speaker 2:Me too.
Speaker 1:As long as there's good things for Lily, and I do want to know that Harry is still born, you know, and I think that's why I'm like yeah, I, that's what.
Speaker 2:It's weird when Harry Harry isn't around too, but and I want good things for Lily, like you said. But anyways, I'll make a list to put out in this podcast for all my favorite things and we can include what we've read.
Speaker 1:And I'll let you know how choices goes. Yeah, please do. I'm interested.
Speaker 2:I feel like, at the very least I'm really gonna just still love the wolf star stuff. Would you say that all the young dudes is at the top of the marauders? Fix for you. Um, I feel like no, but yes, twofold. I feel like, um, I, you need to start there, in my opinion, to yeah, if you don't know anything about like the world and it's ground zero.
Speaker 2:Yeah, to me it's ground zero. It's important. I really actually think I liked Sirius's perspective more, because, I don't know, I just like I really like the stuff with Regulus it's really devastating and his like perspective on things. Maybe it just filled it out a little bit because I felt like God, how can he be so stupid and oblivious, like, why is he surprised when Remus says I'm gay. But then you read his perspective you're like, oh this, no, this actually makes perfect sense.
Speaker 1:Oh my god, oh my god, okay, the one. So I've read some chapters of Sirius's perspective and one of the ones I wanted to read was the missing scenes from All the Young Dudes, where he comes after James yes, me, yeah of all all the young dudes is um, when they're in the library and he's like, you know, he's got his hand on remus's shoulder to come with him, and then james realizes that like oh, that's weird. And and then he doesn't, he doesn't take it away to hide it he's just like yeah, no this is like like it's become important enough enough to him to risk his friendship with his best friend.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I mean, that was just like. I don't know why that hit me the way that it did. But I read that from Sirius's perspective and it was really great and also it made me love James in this world even more because he's just like so accepting and like so sweet.
Speaker 2:But the words Pete, a word will be engraved into my soul. I know, I know. Because that's like he's such an ally he is and it's like in a time Obviously he's not real, but in a time where that was really hard.
Speaker 3:That wasn't as common.
Speaker 2:And just to be like. So like Pete, a word, like he's not going to blow up, he's not going to like make a big scene, pete, a word, Like he's not gonna blow up, he's not gonna like make a big scene, he's gonna take him to the side and be like don't do that again, you know, and I just so. Anyways, I think, yeah, other Other than my, favorite Wolfstar moments, oh wait go ahead.
Speaker 2:No, I just don't think. I think I've read so many great things that maybe that's not even my top, but I did really like serious perspective and I think it was a great place to start like. This is what got me into the um wolf star life, so you know, I feel like you have to start there yeah, other favorite we'll start moments from all the young dudes um. You are magic, that just or tell me a secret, a nice one, and I'm. What did you say? Like I'm mental about you too. What?
Speaker 1:oh, I'm mental about you, that one also. Oh, one thing I read. I read the select, some chapters of sirius's pov.
Speaker 3:Uh-huh, how early into their relationship he knew that he loved remus yeah, but didn't say it because he knew that remus couldn't handle it yet yeah and he knew that he couldn't say it back, and he was like and then and from, oh my god.
Speaker 1:And then from remus's point of view, and he's like he like he knows he wants to say it, but like he doesn't have the words for it yet.
Speaker 1:He's like it's okay if you don't say it, if you feel it like it's about what you do, not what you say, and like the remus, that sirius, just like, accepts that and he's able to through all of the pain and the abuse he's experienced in his life and, like the lack of love and all this stuff, he's still able to accept remus where he's at, yeah, and the fact that, like he just isn't there, and just, and then like the way that, like Sirius wants to be let into Remus's life but like Remus wants to hide his pain from other people, I mean it's just so good. This is what I'm saying. How dare you publish a book and it not be good, and it'd be terrible and unreadable, yeah, when people are doing this for free.
Speaker 2:For free.
Speaker 1:On archiveofourowncom. Like please, yes.
Speaker 2:Also something very devastating about Sirius's point of view and this may like then, like maybe this is the last thing I'll say about that, but maybe not is like there's like like him, like Sirius, knowing what it's like to come from an abusive household, being taken in by the potters, and knowing how much that meant to him. And then he grows up and then he watches harry be in an abusive household and and sees how, like just a sliver of welcoming him into his like life as his godfather, how much that means to him, and then knowing he's not able to give that to him in the same way that it was given to sirius, and it's like how unfair it is that harry had people he should have had so many people who loved him, but he has no one because of freaking dumbledore and uh like that to me.
Speaker 1:It was like this is so too much for me yes, and like gosh, the thing that slays me on me on TikTok is the ones that are like, have you ever gotten everything you ever wanted? And it's like no, but I got really close and it's like for all three of them. It's like Remus and Sirius, they almost had everything and then I mean, okay, spoiler, spoiler, spoiler for all the young dudes at the end. But, like you know, they get back together, which that also slayed me. I get why people love Grant for being like he's, like.
Speaker 1:I loved him at his worst, I had him at his worst and you had him at his best, but like I had that part of him, so like, basically, like don't talk down on the time I had with him.
Speaker 2:Yeah, excuse me, I'm unwell.
Speaker 1:I'm so sick right now, but they, you know, are able to find, come, crawl back to one another and like love each other again, and they know that their lives are going to be short. It's like they kind of are resigned to the fact that they're probably going to die again.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:Yeah, going back into this war, they're going gonna die and they choose to love each other to the end, just like because, oh my god, and what has remus? Says at the end? Um, no grant. Says to sirius.
Speaker 2:He says he loved me, but I wasn't you like he was always waiting for you, I think something like that. Yeah, I can pull up the exact thing he said.
Speaker 1:He like we really loved each other, but I was never you and yeah, it hurts. That got me in a way. I think I like just whimpered. I think I just whimpered. Let me see if I can find it Get out of this little. Okay, I'm going to start from here. He loves you, grant said steadily. You have to love him back. I do love. No. Grant was shaking his head again. No, not like this. You have to be here, a real flesh and blood person, not a dog, not a ghost.
Speaker 1:Sirius couldn't meet Grant's eyes anymore. He bowed his head and nodded I will Good. Grant smiled again. His face gentle once more. Now, when he gets moody and he will get moody don't let him mope and don't let him drink. He'll want it after full moon, but it only takes him longer to get. Well, if he does, I know what he needs after full moon.
Speaker 1:Sirius growled, affronted. I've known him since I was 11. Who do you think you are telling me I'm? Who's been here at? Grant returned shortly. I don't think you get how hard it's been. I don't think you. Look, you had him at his best. Okay, I had his worst. He smiled a little and I was glad to do it. I have had. I have one part of him, you have the other. Can we agree? Serious stared at him a bit longer. Grant held out a hand to shake and serious took it Okay, he said him a bit longer. Grant held out a hand to shake and serious took it okay, he said lovely. Grant released him and stood up. He went to the bedroom and came back with a large hold, all which place very purposely by the door, going to have to leave a few books and things. But I'll be back from when I'm settled. Suppose you don't have a key? Blah, blah, blah. There was a.
Speaker 2:Let's see well, at the end of serious perspective, he says serious, as from remus, nothing on this earth could take me from you, do you understand? Not the fighting, not the war. If I died I think I'd love you even then. Do you understand, I can't leave you, not if I tried, not if I wanted to. And then Remus says you can't know that. And he says I can, remus, when I go, it's going to promise.
Speaker 1:I promise, mooney, I promise oh my god, please, no, I'm sorry. Okay, pain man. So so this is what grant says to remus. He says I'm in the kitchen, I'm just making things easier for you, grant said.
Speaker 1:And then, from anyone else, that might have sounded bitter, haven't? I always tried to do that, but I love you. I love you too, my darling, but I'm not sure. That's all there is to it. So you're just making the decision for me. I'm making the decision for me, me. Grant said very firmly. He looked at Remus, now dead in the eye, and Remus couldn't see where there would be no more arguing.
Speaker 1:Sirius needs you now and you'll go to war. Because that's who you are You're mad and brave and incredible. There isn't a place for me in all that. So I need you to let me go. We'll always be friends, won't we Care? Home yabs together. Remus wanted to wail. He wanted to fall to his knees and clutch Grant around the waist and hold him here forever to beg and plead. He knew that he was selfish. Grant was right. Remus had already decided to rejoin the Order. He decided the moment Sirius returned. It wasn't fair to keep Grant around for that. It was downright dangerous. But he needed him. Oh, he really, really needed Grant. You'll break my heart if you go now, remus said. Grant shook his head lightly, holding his ground. I'm sorry, love, but it's breaking my heart to stay. And then, um, I haven't always been fair to you. Remus said he wanted to say it for a long time now. He wanted some kind of forgiveness. You've been fine, gritsmile.
Speaker 2:You've been my little bit of magic kill me no, because it's like you've been my little bit of magic from grant and then like your magic with serious and it's just like that's. They're both fine, like they're both good, but you know, it hurts anyways, there's happier there's happier fanfics out there.
Speaker 2:You guys, if you want to be happy, that's what I had to do. As I said, I I um, my last recommendation, the first fan fiction I read after All the Young Dudes, because I was just too freaking depressed is let me find it. It is by Colgate Blue Minty Gel and it is called Waiting in Waste High Water and I talked about it on here, but it's where Remus is a contestant on the Great British Break Off, where remus is a contestant on the great british breakoff and serious is a celebrity guest judge and it's so happy and you'll just be like, this is a lovely, like, uh, antidote. So I would recommend that as a follow-up because I needed something like after you read those I it's just depressing, like to be frank, because because it's canon compliant and it ends before sirius dies, but you know, in just a few more days he's gonna die right in front of remus and remus is gonna have to like pretend to be okay with that. What?
Speaker 1:anyways, all right what else are we going to talk about? Um, well, one, so we so um, welcome back.
Speaker 2:If you skip that section what's it like to be mentally stable?
Speaker 1:yeah, uh, okay, so anyways, um one thing, we we recorded this episode before, but we lost half the audio. And one thing we talked about was the 30 thursday murder club movie is in production, which is very exciting. Yes, um, the cast is stacked.
Speaker 1:It's perfect, um, so we're really excited about that yes and I have pre-ordered richard osmond's new book series, or the new book that's starting like a new story um of a different cast of characters called we solve murders. It's coming out in a couple weeks, in september, so I'm excited about that and excited to maybe start reading some fall mood books to share on the podcast for like a fall recommendations episode.
Speaker 2:I agree I'm starting to transition to like more thriller murdery books um, so I think that would be.
Speaker 1:We have to read them in time to recommend them on this podcast for people who are appropriate.
Speaker 2:One thing I wanted to talk about too that got lost in that episode is here we Go Again by Alison Cochran, Not to be devastated again, because that was a little devastating. We just got devastated by all the young dudes. But I feel like we had to shout it out here because, um, we talked at length about it in the last episode.
Speaker 1:It's really, really, really good. Um, I would say major trigger warning. If, like you are sensitive about like end of life care, parental figures dying on the page, you know, maybe skip. It has like the emotional seriousness of like an emily henry book at times.
Speaker 2:But with the most lovable characters. Yes, it's a wonderful book. We both loved it, so all right, and if you love, a good road trip about it yeah, if you love a good road trip, that's a great book.
Speaker 1:There's a great playlist on spotify that has like, because a lot of music is referenced in this book. So you know, as soon as I got done reading the book, I went and like, wanted to listen to the spotify playlist, which you can also do with all the young dudes, because there's lots of music yes, and there's many playlists uh, yeah, um, and let's see, oh also, and it ends with us. The movie came out yeah, you saw it.
Speaker 2:What did you think?
Speaker 1:I did see it. Um, I saw it to you know, I don't I, I don't know if I made the right decision to see it. To be honest, okay, okay, should I have seen it like because, even though I do have amca list, and like it wasn't more money out of my pocket, it did support colleen hoover and this movie.
Speaker 1:I mean, um, I would say the movie is better than the book. Not a high bar to cross, um, it's, it's better. But like there were still times I had to look away, the ending is still the ending. The premise is still the premise. I think mostly there's just a lot of hot people in it. Yeah, so that helps, that's distracting. Yeah With, like it helps because people are so hot. Yeah, I mean, I don't think.
Speaker 1:I mean there's a lot of controversy about it right now Like there's lots of drama with the production team and Blake Lively and Justin Baldoni and everything, and I think one of the major critiques that I really can co-sign and agree with is that it was really not billed as a movie that was going to be about domestic violence and there is a sexual assault scene. Oh wow, as there is in the book. I mean, it's not, it is. Most of the abuse scenes are kind of she actually did something interesting. So the first time that you see the scene there's three instances of abuse, including this non-consensual sexual advance yeah between the main characters and the first time that you see them on the screen they look like accidents.
Speaker 1:But then, once the main character has realized what's going on, has come to terms with the fact that she needs to leave the relationship, she flashes back and she sees the incidents for what they really were. So that was an interesting and cool thing to do, but it was billed as like girls night movie, like at my amc when I booked my ticket there was like a special promotion.
Speaker 1:I was like if you go on wednesday at this showing, it's like the girls night showing, and I just don't think it was honest enough for people who were walking into that movie, who didn't know anything about it, to be able to understand like what kind of triggers were there were going to be yeah, um because I feel like I saw the um when I went to see, uh, the wolverine movie.
Speaker 2:I think that this trailer played before and it does not like it definitely doesn't seem like rom-com, like it doesn't seem happy. But I would not know from just watching the trailers or any of the marketing materials the extent of what I believe the domestic abuse like, just from knowing the controversy, like they when colleen hoover tried to put out the coloring book or whatever to go along with this and people were like that's weird, like that's the only reason. I even know there's any like domestic violence in these books or in the books in the movies and I definitely wouldn't have gotten it from the trailers.
Speaker 2:So I mean I might have got like, oh, he's like maybe a mean guy or like, but I feel like not to the extent it is. And knowing the graphic nature of verity, which is one of the things that bothered me the most about reading that book, I can see how she could probably like write graphically about domestic violence as well and yeah, and I mean in the movie feels like weird marketing.
Speaker 2:Yeah, because there are people who are like, hey, if I know there's going to be domestic violence or a man being violent or sexual assault, like I'm not going to go see that because it might be too difficult for me to watch and I feel like it's weird to not be very upfront that that's what's in this movie I mean, I knew what was coming and I still felt uncomfortable and kind of had to look away a few times, particularly like.
Speaker 1:So the the three instances of like any sort of physical abuse are quick, yeah, but like the tension between them, there's moments of like verbal abuse. It's kind of like, I mean, and it's not just them like the main female character and then like the secondary male character, um, who you see flashbacks to them when they were teenagers.
Speaker 3:Both of their sets of parents were abusive yeah, so you see these clips, so it's just it's just a very prevalent theme, sure, um, and I think that's, you know, rightfully.
Speaker 1:So some of the controversy and like the pushback that blake lively is getting, because it kind of seems like she's treated this like she, you know, in the press tours, like wearing all these flowers and, yeah, you know, like she wants this, she wanted to be like the star of a rom-com, yeah, and this is not that and um, so, yeah, I wouldn't recommend it and I don't know, I think it's unfortunate too, because like there's such a vacuum for, like, girly movies you know Not that this, whatever, not that movies are girly or whatever, but you know what I mean Like there's such a vacuum for those People want rom-coms to come back.
Speaker 2:They took the freaking Glenn Powell kiss from us in Twisters.
Speaker 3:But it's like why, does.
Speaker 2:Colleen Hoover have to be so popular that she's getting she's getting I mean, blake lively, justin baldoni those are like pretty big names in terms of book adaptations. Like normally don't get that treatment. Um, a lot of money was put into this, obviously. Like there's like a lot of promotional things going on. It sucks that she's so popular that she's getting this treatment when there are so many other like much better.
Speaker 2:Like girl like, if you want a girl's night and to wear flowers and stuff, there are better ways to do it than to support like this is not that plot? First of all, not that it shouldn't be talked about, but it needs to be marketed differently. But also like I feel like they're manipulating this desire for like rom-coms or like girly movies you know that you can go with your girlfriends to see and they're like using that to market this movie when it's really that's not what it is and I'd rather that be given to someone else who is deserving it more. And also like the plot lines up with like this should have been more, like this is a serious issue. We want to raise awareness Like here's the domestic violence information which, ironically, the director or the producer?
Speaker 1:yeah, I think it's directed by justin baldoni. Yes, he was the one. He's the only one who's been talking about that.
Speaker 2:That's why it's like I want to be on his side for all this, because it feels weird that no one else raf they would never make me hate you I know team r, team Raphael. I've always been on Team Raph.
Speaker 1:I mean we have a whole episode. I mean, if you're a newer listener, we have a whole episode about Colleen Hoover. So like go listen to that for more of our take on that. But I think it's just the rollout of this movie so mirrors the issues that we have with Colleen Hoover as an author because it's manufactured. It's like we want something to be dramatic but we can't just earn the drama. We have to like weaponize really serious topics and kind of use them in this cheap, half-baked way yes, to get people to like think that it's, trick people into thinking this book is good yes or to think, trick people into thinking this movie is good, like okay, was it really good?
Speaker 1:or were you just kind of traumatized by the?
Speaker 2:an insane assault like is this movie makes you sob cry doesn't mean it's good, but it's easy for that, like extreme emotional experience, to manipulate you into thinking that it was a good movie. Like how many?
Speaker 1:levels deep. Is it Like are you left actually thinking about something or are you just like extremely jarred by a very traumatic event? And I think that is why you and I one of the reasons that you and I don't really jive with Colleen Hoover is it's like you have tricked people who are kind of maybe coming back to reading for the first time into thinking that this book is good and is for women. But all you really did was take a couple like very buzzy, extreme plot points and like sprinkle them in without using good dialogue, without good character development, without being able to like have a nuanced conversation about their experiences yeah, exactly, there's just there's better stuff out there on archiveofourowncom that's what I was gonna say.
Speaker 2:Go back and I've been seeing people post a lot of like screenshots of the it ends with us book because I guess people are reading it and like read those and then go listen to what we read from uh, all the young dudes and you tell me who deserves to be written.
Speaker 1:It's just like to be a writer, I mean you know there's there's, there's better books out there, and I think we even did uh, we did, we did a carousel on our thing. That's like, yeah, read this instead of that calling over book, yeah, yeah I just I want us to demand better from her and other authors like especially when you're gonna.
Speaker 1:This is something that people do when they, when marketers do when they're marketing the women also it's like yeah, you're not very smart, let's just throw some like you know buzzy stuff at you and you'll just eat it up like, and we can, we don't have to try very hard you know?
Speaker 2:yeah, just stop doing that. Let's all raise our bar. Let's raise our bar collectively, and not even that much, like just a little bit, and move past calling hoover as a society. Get her off that bestseller list, please like there are better. Yeah, all right um, excellent.
Speaker 1:Do you want to round this out with a book we've read recently? I would love to okay.
Speaker 2:I read the plot which you recommend to me. How did you like it? Did you like it, I should say, but how?
Speaker 1:um, I guessed everything that was gonna happen. Yeah, um, so, unfortunately that. So it is a. It's emily's talked about on the podcast before it's the plot by uh jean or jean jean correlates uh-huh um, but uh, it is about uh, a writer who teaches, he's an author, a novelist, and he? Um borrows the plot line of a story one of the students that he taught at the summer symposium told him about and um, it becomes like this huge success, like oprah's book club type success, movie adaptation. And then what ensues after he does that? Um, it's twisty, it is. It is very readable. It's yeah, not very long. It's a. It's definitely like I want to keep reading this yeah but I guessed every plot point.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I feel like that's why I recommend well, because you asked for something that would suck you in and to me the plot is like actually the experience of reading.
Speaker 2:It is probably better than the book itself, because I feel like like it's by the time you get to the end yeah, okay, that was good, but it is one of those books where you're like oh, I really can't stop reading this for some reason, like the readability, like you said, so, um, or like see what's gonna happen next, it kind of keeps you going. So, yes, I wish that I.
Speaker 1:I was like oh man, if I had been shocked by this yeah twist, I would have really loved it. Like I but like there's like a big twist and then there's like a couple of small twists and I guessed all of them from like early on in the book, unfortunately.
Speaker 1:So that took away from it a little bit for me and I'm not typically somebody who guesses plot points, yeah, um. I'm usually just kind of like non-imaginative and like, yeah, living in the moment. Just yeah, exactly, um, but it did, it was readable and it got me a little bit of a slump after all, you know, dude, so pain what about you?
Speaker 2:I recently read a familiar stranger by ar torre um. This is recommended to me by my friend ashley, former colleague, and uh, it's very twisty. That's what she told me and she's right. So it's kind of about I don't really want to say too much, to not give anything away, but it's about like a housewife who she discovers her. Let me look up the, the synopsis, because I don't want to give anything away to hold up. I'm gonna cut this out dead space, okay. Okay. Yeah, it does say this in the. This isn't giving too much away then. Okay. So basically, this lady, lillian lillian smith, she, um, is an obituary writer, but then she meets this guy, david, in a coffee shop and she kind of finds out like her husband's having an affair. So then she kind of starts having an affair on with david because she's like, well, if you're gonna cheat on me, then I'm gonna cheat on you, and she like kind of invents this whole new life with him. Um, and then things start happening.
Speaker 2:Anyways, I'll just say it's been, it's been, it's not like. Okay, this isn't the best, best book I've ever read, but it's pretty good and it's like exactly like what you just said twisty, readable, but, um, it spends a long time setting up that premise. What I just described like finding out your husband's having an affair, you start having an affair with good david, you invent this new life a lot of lies, so there's like a lot. I would say like 70 of the book is like not exposition, but it's setting up all these different characters and putting things in place. And then the last bit, things really start picking up and like nothing is what you thought it was. No one is what they seemed they were. Everything is you know, starts coming out in little pieces. Um, it's a little weird some of the stuff in the end, I'll say without giving too much away, but it's definitely like a really super weird fast-paced twisty, especially like once you get like it took a while to get to the part where things started happening, just to be honest.
Speaker 1:But then once you, once you go, you're like bang bang like
Speaker 2:reveal, reveal, reveal. So it's like nothing amazing, but it it's like I said, I'm getting back into these thrillers. It's a good one, like it's just a good solid mystery.
Speaker 1:When you need to scratch that itch.
Speaker 2:Yeah, so I really I liked the audiobook, which I really liked. So I've been yeah, I got stuck in traffic for like three hours yesterday so this saved me a little bit while I was driving home. So, yeah, I liked it.
Speaker 1:Can I give you a little teaser for our next episode, because I just started reading this book for my, and you can get this out if you want to, but Sure, for my book club. We're doing Super Smutty September, oh, and so we picked this book called Priest by Sierra.
Speaker 3:Simone.
Speaker 1:Uh-huh, let me read you the. I just started it, okay. But, let me read you the synopsis. There are many rules a priest can't break. A priest cannot marry. A priest cannot abandon his flock. A priest cannot forsake his God. I've always been good at following rules until she came. My name is Tyler Anselm Bell. I'm 29 years old. Six months ago I broke my vow of celibacy on the altar of my own church. God help me, I would do it again. I am a priest and this is my confession.
Speaker 2:Please report back on that one.
Speaker 1:It's available on Kindle Unlimited course it is can't wait. I'm so excited, so please I will report back, fill us in, okay, and with that we'll catch you guys next time. Bye.