Hoorf! Radical Care in a Late-Capitalist Heckscape

it takes a village to break a spine: the unexpected journey through disability and creativity with Jordan Thornquest

• Elle Billing • Season 3 • Episode 7

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Content note: this episode contains swearing, and discussion of medical trauma

Elle Billing hosts Jordan Thornquest, a musician and game developer on the first episode of 2025. They exchange memories of Jordan's 2020 car accident in Twin Falls, which aside from being an insurance nightmare, left him with a spinal injury and a long recovery. Jordan reflects on how the accident changed his perspective on disability, pain, self-care, and creativity. Elle and Jordan illuminate the life-altering experience of acquired disability, highlighting the importance of empathy, patience, and understanding chronic pain.

Links to connect with Jordan, as well as all other resource links, are **in the full show notes at hoorfpodcast.com

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Elle Billing:

Hi. My name is Elle Billing. I am a chronically ill queer femme, and I'm tired. I'm here this episode and every episode to dig at the roots of our collective fatigue, explore ways to direct our care in compassionate and sustainable ways, and to harness creative expression to heal ourselves and to heal our world. Welcome to Hoorf, radical care in the late capitalist heckscape. My guest for this episode is Jordan Thornquest. Jordan Thornquist is a music maker and game developer living in Philadelphia. I'm excited to have him on the podcast today because he used to live with me, and now we live a time zone apart. Welcome to the podcast, Jordan. Hi, Jordan. Welcome to Hoorf.

Jordan Thornquest:

hello. Thanks for having me.

Elle Billing:

Yeah, thanks for being here. I'm so glad you're here.

Jordan Thornquest:

I'm excited to be here.

Elle Billing:

Yeah, I'm excited to well, the audience doesn't get to see you, but I do, and I'm excited to see you.

Jordan Thornquest:

Excited to see you.

Elle Billing:

That is a fabulous shirt, by the way.

Jordan Thornquest:

Thank you. This is a cute little vintage thrift store find.

Elle Billing:

It's very tropical. As I'm sitting here in my tall wool socks and I have a blanket.

Jordan Thornquest:

Oh, god, yeah, isn't it like stupid cold over there feels like negative 22 or something.

Elle Billing:

Let me check I have my phone right here. It is stupid cold. It is-- the ambient temperature is four. The high today was six, but it oh, it says it just feels like four. There must be no breeze right now. That, that seems like fake news. It's like, I know where I live, like

Jordan Thornquest:

that seems too cool.

Elle Billing:

That seems inaccurate.

Jordan Thornquest:

That's too comfy.

Elle Billing:

Yeah, that well, I'll be darned, there is no wind. We've entered the Twilight Zone. The dew point is negative six.

Jordan Thornquest:

The dew point, geez

Elle Billing:

yeah, I'm flabbergasted. My gast is flabbered. The high tomorrow is 15. Oh, it's supposed to actually warm up over the weekend before it gets cold again. warm up. But like, our house is a little chilly, and this is-- the room that I record in, is like in the back corner of the house. And I brought a blanket with me today because I have been cold all day.

Jordan Thornquest:

So, yeah, that sounds brutal. It's, uh, it's, I mean, as we're talking about weather, it's been mostly like 50 degrees here in Philly, but it just like, I think the cold snap has happened, like it's officially feeling like it's starting to be actually winter outside in December, which seems normal.

Elle Billing:

Yeah, that's normal winter time. Philly. I've never been there. I was gonna try to get out to visit you when you were still living in New York, and it didn't work out. And so now you're in Philly, so I still haven't got to visit you out there either.

Jordan Thornquest:

Well, what's cool about Philly is, like, I didn't really realize how good transit is on the east coast, like, when I moved to New York, that was one of the first things I learned about which was not just like the subway, but Amtrak is super legit. So like, you can go from Philly to New York in about 65, 70 minutes. So it's faster to go from Philly to New York than it is from when I was in Twin Falls. And like, you drive to Boise. So if you want to go to New York, it's just like a quick, you just hop over and you're like, oh, now I'm in a completely different place. And it's like, $15 it's amazing.

Elle Billing:

I just had to drive 60 miles one way to go get a mammogram. Speaking of the difference in how close things are, transit wise, there's a big difference between like, how close together and accessible relatively speaking, things in the east are compared to the Midwest the West. But even the difference between, like me rural and like being in Twin Falls, I was like, everything's so close together here, like towns are only six miles apart where we were in Idaho. But then it was like two hours to Boise, where some of my medical specialists were. And I'm like, well, that's a pain in the butt and but here it's like an hour, but the weather is usually worse in the winter.

Jordan Thornquest:

Yeah, how bad is the snow out there?

Elle Billing:

The roads were fine today.

Jordan Thornquest:

Good, good.

Elle Billing:

I also try to schedule everything afternoon, so I don't have to drive in the mornings in case the roads are bad.

Jordan Thornquest:

True, true. You have to wait for them to actually make it, so that's safe,

Elle Billing:

yeah, so either the frost to to burn off, or if any plowing needs to be done. We have plows here. We didn't have them in Twin Falls.

Jordan Thornquest:

No, didn't they get rid of them? They're like, Oh, we're gonna cut down

Elle Billing:

before I moved there. Like, because I moved there, I was like, Well, if we don't get a lot of snow, but we also don't plow it when it happens, it's kind of a problem.

Jordan Thornquest:

Oh, no.

Elle Billing:

So anyway, I'm gonna ask my first question.

Jordan Thornquest:

do that to it.

Elle Billing:

How have you received care this week?

Jordan Thornquest:

It's a good question. I don't know. Receiving care as in from someone else? Is that a fair way to put it?

Elle Billing:

from someone else, from yourself? How have you created space for care?

Jordan Thornquest:

I've been getting into baths lately.

Elle Billing:

Oh, I love baths.

Jordan Thornquest:

dude. I came late to the bath party. A part of it was just because I think all of the places that I've lived as a solo adult, especially was just showers. We didn't really have a lot of places that had bathtubs. So this, not this apartment in Philly, but the one I had just before in New York was the first apartment that had with just like my own bathtub in a long time. And I remember two months in, I was in New York, in that apartment with my sibling, my sibling's like, Yeah, I think I'm gonna take a bath. I've just been dancing all day. My body sore. And I was like, Man, I could do that. And so I did that in New York. And then when I came here in Philly, I was like, Oh, this apartment also has a bathtub. We're set. And so my feet have been really achy because I've been trying to break in these new boots and these new sandals, and so I've been taking baths more, and just like soaking in the hot water and it it rules. I'm really happy that it's, you know, that I have access to it. It feels like a privilege. It's very cozy.

Elle Billing:

Do you use Epsom salts when you take a hot bath?

Jordan Thornquest:

No, I've been meaning to, but I don't think I've really taken the plunge. I think part of me was like, I need to buy it. And I don't really know, like it, how, like, which ones are legit, or if there's, like, you know,

Elle Billing:

Epsom salt is Epsom salt, all it is is, what, magnesium sulfate. I mean, you can get some that have, like, lavender in them. I just buy the giant ass bag of plain Epsom salts, and I just dump that shit into my bath. It really helps me with like my muscle aches and my restless legs. Because what does it do? I know, like your body can absorb magnesium. As far as I understand. I am not a medical professional. I do not understand everything about anatomy, but as far as I understand, you can absorb magnesium through your skin,

Jordan Thornquest:

okay, well,

Elle Billing:

and it's really good for, like, muscle aches and stuff.

Jordan Thornquest:

I'm gonna do that. I didn't even know that I could. I was, I thought it was mostly scent based when I heard about Epsom salts, I thought it was mostly like aromatic in terms of what it

Elle Billing:

No, it's not like smelling salts or anything, and it's not like bath salts, the drug

Jordan Thornquest:

my brain made that connotation. I didn't even think about that. Yeah,

Elle Billing:

so I'm a very My sister has, when we were younger, once described me as book smart, but dumb to the world.

Jordan Thornquest:

Yes, totally.

Elle Billing:

I don't like to use that phrasing anymore, because of the ableist kind of, like, usage of dumb but I am. I have a history of being very naive to worldly things. So the first time I heard of bath salts, the drug, I was like, people are taking bath salts. Like, how do you like and trying to figure out how people were getting high on Epsom salts. Like, I'm like, There's no way, there's no way that I'm understanding this correctly. Can't fit that up your nose. But what other way can you understand it? Like, why would you call a drug that? that doesn't make sense?

Jordan Thornquest:

That's really funny.

Elle Billing:

I still don't think it makes sense.

Jordan Thornquest:

No, no, not at all.

Elle Billing:

Tell me that you take things literally, but selectively literally, because I'm also, I also love wordplay and stuff. But apparently that one was too much.

Jordan Thornquest:

Yeah, whenever I'd hang out with our friend Braden, like, yeah, just, I would make it so clear how absolutely not in tuned to drug culture I was. And it was just funny because he, he just, he knew me well, and so he'd know when I was either talking about something I had no idea what I was talking about, or, like bullshitting to pretend I knew what I was talking about when talking to somebody else, and he could just see his face just like, yeah, you've never done a drug in your life. You're adorable.

Elle Billing:

It's like you're just a cinnamon roll. So one of the reasons I wanted to talk to you on the podcast, like now, as opposed to any, like, some other time down the road, is because health insurance is in the news right now.

Jordan Thornquest:

Yes, it is.

Elle Billing:

For Reasons. Okay, so you used to live with me. You rented my basement when I was living in Twin Falls. And so this episode is actually going to come out. It'll be a first January episode, but right now, when we're recording it is, like, the middle of December. It's a very conspicuous anniversary for us.

Jordan Thornquest:

Yes, I didn't even think about it, wow. Yeah, it's, it's, yeah, it's like, wow.

Elle Billing:

Yeah, it's this week.

Jordan Thornquest:

Oh,my God,

Elle Billing:

so you lived with me for gosh, how long was it? I don't even remember

Jordan Thornquest:

think it was a few months. I think it was during the winter months, because I was, I was, yeah, I was living out of a, I was living out of a van at that time,

Elle Billing:

and it was cold and so you moved into my basement, where it was toasty

Jordan Thornquest:

exactly. I was like, I need to winterize in some place. And so, right, that was like September, October was when it was starting to get cold and I moved Yeah.

Elle Billing:

So you to give people a background of what happened before the scary phone call. I was in my studio, I was painting, and you came in and said, Hey, I'm gonna go walk the dog, your dog, not my dog,

Jordan Thornquest:

yes.

Elle Billing:

And I said, Okay, bye, and you left. And like, five minutes later, my phone rings, and it's you, and I answer the phone, and I say, Is this a butt dial? And it was not a butt dial.

Jordan Thornquest:

No, it was not

Elle Billing:

you said, I just got hit by a car. I'm laying in the street. I need you to come get my dog. And that was, like, I was in shock, obviously. But like, so are you?

Jordan Thornquest:

Yeah,

Elle Billing:

we're laughing about it now, because it was so it like it feels so long ago and so absurd, because, like, there were so many things about the situation that were just like, This shouldn't have happened.

Jordan Thornquest:

Yeah,

Elle Billing:

you shouldn't have been hit by a car. Like, to start with

Jordan Thornquest:

and it was, I mean, to start with, too. Like, I don't know if I ever asked you when we've talked about it, but like, it wasn't quite dark out, like it was getting a little dusky, is my recollection of it. And so, yeah, I mean, do you want me to start just with,

Elle Billing:

yeah, go ahead. So, like, my question is sort of like, Yeah, speaking of dogs, hey, there's Winky.

Jordan Thornquest:

I can hear her.

Elle Billing:

So, yeah, just your experience with the car accident and, like, the surgeries and then getting back on your feet and navigating the insurance and suddenly becoming disabled, or how much whatever you want to get into kind of around that, yeah, we should, yeah, let's talk through the because, I mean, you were a big part of it, like it was, like you said, I walked out with my dog, and she and I were going to this park that was pretty close to your apartment, and we were just going, kind of like we normally do, where we cross, we walk down the street, and then, yeah, your apartment is on the side of the street that you have to cross over to get to the park. And there's crosswalks on some corners of this park, and then no crosswalks on others. And so to get to where a crosswalk would be, you have to, like, basically, walk along the street around the park for a while before you get to a safe intersection. And so the only place for me to step off, otherwise, is the corner of your street and then crossing over to the basically the middle of the park. And so that was usually where we crossed, and it was like at a place where you can tell, like, if you're a car driving, it's a T intersection, so the car would have the right of way, but then anyone that's on your street would have to yield to the left or the right. And so I was crossing with my dog, and she stopped in the middle of the street. So I just, like looked over to my right as I was crossing the street, and there was a pair of headlights coming down. And so I like waved at them to kind of let them know that I was going to stop. And then I went to turn to, like, pick up my dog, because I think she had found something, something just caught her attention. And then I went to, like, kind of go and grab her, and then she ran, just like she basically was done smelling what she was smelling, and went across the street. But I was hunched over with my back turned to the car, and it had just hit me square in the butt, and it launched me across the intersection like, the part I remember most vividly was, like the sudden sense of, like, I could hear the car getting closer, and then it kept getting closer. I was like, oh, it's not gonna stop. And then I was in the air, and I flew across the intersection, and I landed on my butt, sort of just like in a sitting position, and I tried to, like, get up onto my feet. I was like, Oh, ouch. That really, really hurts. And so I just laid down, and I was laying in the road, just on a sheet of ice, and I think I did use my own phone. I was, yeah, you could I call you my phone? Yep, yeah, my glasses flew off. So, like, I couldn't see anything. I couldn't see where my dog was. I couldn't really tell, like, where everything was. I was just staring at the air, but I was wearing my coat, and my coat had my phone in my chest pocket, so it also didn't break. So I pulled it out, and I called you, and I just let you know, like, Hey, I can't get up and I need you to come get my dog. And pretty shortly after the person who hit me came out and someone behind them called the police, the police came and called an ambulance, and like, people were really helpful, like, I just remember seeing faces coming into my vision, and eventually I saw yours, yes, and by the time I got there, they were loading you into the ambulance. And someone had put your dog in a car to stay warm,

Jordan Thornquest:

yeah?

Elle Billing:

And they're like, Hey, are you the roommate? I'm like, I'm the roommate. And they're like, here's the dog. And like, I was in my pajamas, and by that point, and like, even though it wasn't super late, I just, I was home from work, and I put my jams,

Jordan Thornquest:

yeah, like, I'm done. I'm not going out again.

Elle Billing:

I'm done. I'm not going again. Just kidding. Oh, and then I had ordered takeout,

Jordan Thornquest:

oh no,

Elle Billing:

or delivery. And so like, the delivery driver was calling me as I was leaving the house, and they're like, hey, which house is? Like, I think I found your house. I'm like, Yeah, but my roommate just got hit by a car, so you Yeah. And I'm like, but, um, don't put that

Jordan Thornquest:

really? food in the house because my dog doesn't, like, like visitors, just like hanging on the doorknob. It'll be fine. I'm like, I'm this is not a good time. I have to go, yeah, it was just the whole thing. So then I get home with your dog and and I have to call your mom, yeah, oh gosh, I can't imagine being the person telling someone's mom, like, Hey, your kid is not okay.

Elle Billing:

He's on his way to the hospital in an ambulance.

Unknown:

Yeah, no. I mean, after that was kind of the blur they they put me in in an ambulance, and they're like, Yeah, we're pretty sure that it's your spine. And I was like, that's cool. That's what anyone wants to hear whenever something's broken. But they brought me to the local hospital in Twin and I remember being, like, on a, on a bed, and they were just kind of like, yeah, you can, you can roll over if you need to, just, like, try not to get up. And then after a while, they, like, checked a couple of X rays, and they're like, Okay, never mind. You can't move. You have to stay very still because you can't, we don't want you to break anything further. And my sister came in, and she was super helpful. And she was just like, basically the one that was telling me, like, Hey, we're talking to mom. We're letting her know what's happening. Talking to Danielle, you let me know that my dog was safe, which was, like, the thing I was most concerned about. I always tell people the story, and the first thing they hear is like, I was in the road with my dog, and they're like, oh my god, is your dog fine? I was like, yes, my dog is okay. But could you imagine if she wasn't? Because then this is like, a double whammy of, yeah, I got hit by a car. My dog is super dead. Thanks for asking.

Elle Billing:

Yeah, no, Jess is fine.

Jordan Thornquest:

She's safe. She's great.

Elle Billing:

She was grumpy about it,

Jordan Thornquest:

yeah, how was she I do want to ask, like, at this point, I'm gone,

Elle Billing:

like she she wouldn't eat and drink that night because you weren't home. But then when your sister and her husband came over to get her, she was like, Oh, thank god.

Jordan Thornquest:

Yeah, someone I know. She's so funny, she's very bitchy, but she also she's very obedient for other people, more so than with me, like she-- I would, I would always drop her off of people's homes and be like, she might, you know, do this or that, or be kind of difficult. And they're like, no, she was great. She just would sit at the door and wait for you to come home, but she'd eat her food and she'd play, but she's, he's, like, such a personality. the first time I'd ever been on a plane from Twin to Boise. I was on morphine. It felt great, but then I was in the hospital for for five days, and this was during kind of the year of 2020, of COVID. And so it was still during a time where the hospitals were full. So I was in a waiting room in Boise, I think, for like 10 hours, just waiting to get a doctor to come in. But two different doctors came in. One did work on my hip, one did work on my spine, and then there was just, like, a period of, I think I got hit on Monday. They did the surgeries on Tuesday, and then I was out

Elle Billing:

with that sweet back brace. of the hospital by Friday

Jordan Thornquest:

Yeah, they like, basically, fully, they gave me this back brace I had to learn how to put on. They taught me how to get out of bed a certain way. And then they kind of gave me some preliminary physical therapy. And then there's like, Okay, well, you can walk from one end of the room to the other with your back brace on. You can get in and out of the bed. We're gonna send you home. So I was just suddenly, I was at my mom's house. I was kind of in this new this new way of functioning. It was sudden. It was very fast.

Elle Billing:

Yes, it, I mean, you went from being, like, very spry and healthy to being disabled in like a snap, and had to adapt to that, like, immediately.

Unknown:

Yeah, I was 24 I didn't have any any physical disability other than my glasses. And so it was pretty sudden. And just like to not realize how, how much it took for granted until things became difficult.

Elle Billing:

So I have to say before I get into the next question, like you had. I remember when you texted, you're like, can you measure the shower? Because you needed, you needed a shower chair, and you needed to make sure it would fit in, speaking of like, bathrooms that didn't have tubs. You had, like, that weird shaped shower in the basement. So, like, I took a picture of this, of, like, the whole thing, and then I drew on it on my phone with all the little measurements and stuff, but I take seated showers now, and they've made a huge difference in my life. And I really think that knowing that you had had a shower chair when you were recovering made it easier for me to make that step for myself. I didn't know that. Wow. Yeah, showers. I can only shower like twice a week. They are exhausting. They use up all my energy. I have to recover after them. My dad came home one day when I was in my shower recovery pose, which is basically languishing on a couch. He's like, Oh my god, are you okay? Are you sick? I'm like, Oh no, I showered. This is normal. He goes. I don't think that's true. I'm like, oh, sorry, I just showered. This is my normal,

Jordan Thornquest:

yeah, this is how I have to process this.

Elle Billing:

And so I still need to recover after a shower, but I'm able to bounce back a little faster if I take a seated shower, and knowing that you had used a shower chair and that it like it was medically necessary, and that I was like, Wait, there is nothing that's stopping me from sitting down.

Jordan Thornquest:

Yeah?

Elle Billing:

And I was like, Oh, thank goodness I did this. Like, it's been such a relief,

Jordan Thornquest:

yeah?

Elle Billing:

So knowing that that was an option for me was

Jordan Thornquest:

I have a friend who I remember it was one helpful. of the first times I had a conversation about, like, just this idea of care as, like, just a thing that you-- if you are fully able bodied, you don't realize how much you take for granted. But also, conversely, if you're in any sort of high pain tolerance or pre existing sense of chronic pain, you don't realize how much you've normalized. And I was talking to this friend, and they were like, they I think they were very much also just learning about like, these concepts, and we're excited to share them. And they're like, do you take pain medication when you're in pain, like, when you have a headache? Do you take Excedrin? And like, no, actually, I think I haven't owned pain medication like in my apartment since I'd been, you know, an adult. So from 18 to at the time, like 25 I just never had, like, ibuprofen or anything, just where if my body ached, I would take it, because I was just kind of like, yeah, it's just, you know, it's how it is. And they're like, that's a form of self harm. Was their interpretation at the time was just this idea of, you don't identify, like this thing that you are allowed to give yourself, you don't let yourself, kind of say this is something that can be helpful, and it's not, it's not a form of failure or defeat to accept that care for yourself. And very similarly, there's a meme that would go around that, the first time I saw I was like, Oh, I never thought about this, which is like, this person was describing an experience of being at the hospital or at the doctors, and their doctor said, how is your pain like, how is it feeling? Like, oh, well, you know the normal amount? And they said, well, the normal amount is zero. And this person just had to pause and be like, Oh, shit. I don't think I knew that.

Elle Billing:

I I've actually had that conversation a few times recently. Well, first I found out that, like, growing isn't supposed to hurt, so like, growing pains,

Jordan Thornquest:

yes, growing pains. I've had the same thing blew my mind.

Elle Billing:

I was like, You mean I wasn't supposed to wake up in tears, crying and screaming because my legs hurt?

Jordan Thornquest:

Yeah.

Elle Billing:

And then it's like, from that, like, no, children aren't supposed to be in pain. Like, the normal amount of pain is zero, the normal number of headaches is zero. And I'm like, Oh, well, in that case, I've been in pain my whole life.

Jordan Thornquest:

Yep,

Elle Billing:

I should probably talk to a like, I already see several doctors, but like, I think I should tell a doctor that, like, actually, my pain history is my whole life,

Jordan Thornquest:

yeah

Elle Billing:

Because before I just sort of was like, Oh, well, high school, maybe. But no, it's been since I was three.

Jordan Thornquest:

Wow, yeah.

Elle Billing:

Like, from what I can remember, right? But that's when I remember waking up with horrible growing pains, and doctors call them growing pains, but that physical act of growing isn't supposed to cause pain,

Jordan Thornquest:

yeah.

Elle Billing:

And that was so mind blowing to me, because that type of pain had been so normalized in our family, it's like, well, actually, that's probably a connective tissue disorder.

Jordan Thornquest:

Yeah. No, my legs. I mean, I like, I said, like, quote, unquote, anyone. Like, when I grew taller, I just assumed that that was growing pains. And I remember, especially when I was, like, 16, 17, I would get really bad Charlie horses all the time. I would be my bed, my bedroom was in the basement of this house that we were renting, and I would just be laying on my bed, I'd be watching Netflix, or I'd be playing guitar, and I would just get this seizing, shocking pain in my in my lower, what is that silly? My calf? I always get my calves and my thighs mixed up my lower calf. And I just would, like, I. Be like a soundless scream. Like I didn't want to yell to alarm anybody, but it hurts so bad that I wanted to yell. And I just assumed that that was like, part of, well, I'm getting taller, so my body's just gonna hurt sometimes. And I it was really strange to read that in just like, I think I was Googling something, and it was like, Oh yeah, the concept of growing pains isn't a real thing. I was like, That's not. That's bullshit. And then I was like, reading about it. I couldn't believe it, and I posted it in this group chat with me and all my friends. And all my friends were like, No, I experienced growing pains. And I was like, I guess it's something else. It's not just a normal thing that happens.

Elle Billing:

Yeah, the nor like, no, like, the normal amount of pain, the healthy amount of pain is none. Pain is a warning sign, like, pain exists to alert us to something being wrong. And like, Oh no, we just normalized that.

Jordan Thornquest:

Yeah,

Elle Billing:

so you are a musician and a developer of computery things.

Jordan Thornquest:

Yes,

Elle Billing:

I can't keep up with what you're doing computer wise. Sorry.

Jordan Thornquest:

That's okay. Developer of computery things, is how I'm going to describe it.

Elle Billing:

Yeah, yeah, you're welcome. You can, you can steal that. So did your approach to your creative practices of singing and music creation, because you you also, you don't just play music, you write music. Did your approach to your creative practice change after your accident?

Unknown:

This is the, when I read this question ahead of time and was like processing it, I realized I hadn't really thought

Elle Billing:

right. You didn't have PTO and you didn't have about how the pain influenced my process. But I do remember that the injury and the, you know, the thing that I think anyone that's going to go through, you know, having to deal with going to the hospital and getting, you know, having to go through the health insurance process like any sudden injury, even if the injury itself may not immediately affect what you do, the process of getting injured in recovery did change my mindset. So, like, thankfully, what I did is mostly involved with my hands, so working on the computer, I actually was able to work pretty shortly after I got hit. Was like, that's its own whole fucked up thing. My job was very supportive, but it was also like, well, we can't. I wasn't I wasn't full time, so they weren't able to, like, pay me, insurance through your work, which is was a whole nightmare unto itself.

Unknown:

Yeah, so I had to just work. I mean, I just had to, I mean, I had to pull up my laptop and just sit up the best I could. And I could do that. And so thankfully, it didn't change the fact that I could still work on my computer. And then, music wise, playing guitar is pretty easy to do in a sitting position. But what did happen is, just with the process of recovery, I was just laying down a lot. I couldn't, you know, get up and drive and go places and like, be as active as I was. And a pretty running theme of when I talk about my life at that point in time, up till then, was just being perpetually far too busy, and also just the fact that I was able to tolerate a lot of pain, or otherwise, was able to just kind of move as I saw fit. I mean, I was living in a van. That was the first thing that had to change was like, I can't live in this tight little cramped quarters of this van anymore, because I need space to be able to take a real shower and get in and out of bed. I can't drive during this time that it's hard for me to, like, sit up and, you know, be able to function quickly. If I'm driving a vehicle, like, I had to just sell the van. I couldn't really use it as a place to live, and so I had to go apartment instead.

Elle Billing:

And that whole, like, romanticized dream that you had of like, I'm gonna live in a van and just like, move around to different places and be like a remote worker and live wherever I want to and just have this van life was gone, yeah? Like,

Jordan Thornquest:

totally

Elle Billing:

that couldn't be a thing anymore.

Jordan Thornquest:

It's like, I need to someone needs to help take care of me, because it's hard for me to do this myself, and I need some pretty standard creature comforts. I need, like a home with heating and air conditioning, and I need a shower, and, yeah, you can't rough it nearly as easily when you need to recover, especially for what ended up taking from December to March to really do the most recovery. And then I was given sort of a year of you just have to not use your body a lot. You can't lift things, you can't jump, you can't run, you just have to lay low for a year. And that was the thing that, like it forced me to slow down, and it helped me realize how much I was always pushing myself. And when your body hurts, your body tells you to stop and slow down. Tells you that it is hurt more loudly when you're debilitated,

Elle Billing:

you took a lot more naps.

Jordan Thornquest:

Yes, yeah. I was like, Oh, I'm tired,

Elle Billing:

which is also something that I have learned how to do, too.

Unknown:

Yeah, I'm tired, and my body hurts and I can't ignore it now. Otherwise I just can't move.

Elle Billing:

So I remember there was an article in the paper well before your accident. You know where this is going, because you saw the questions, I'm just giving some background, you were pretty well known in Twin Falls. You worked at a very popular coffee shop. You were probably one of the most popular baristas, I would say, among women who went to the coffee shop. Women of all generations actually probably had a crush on you.

Jordan Thornquest:

Yeah, oh yeah. The owner's wife loved me.

Elle Billing:

Yeah. I mean you were you're friendly, you're personable, you make everybody feel like they're important.

Jordan Thornquest:

Thank you.

Elle Billing:

And you were also doing cool things with music in the downtown area, and an article came out that dubbed you The Happiest Man in Town, which was, possibly, yes, an oversimplification of, I think, who you are and what you're about. It wasn't wrong. I think it was just, in my opinion, I don't think it was wrong, I just think it was an oversimplification of who you are, which, how can you capture as a person in one article, right?

Jordan Thornquest:

Yeah. Well, there was similarly, there was this person at the at the Wendy's in Twin Falls. Do you remember this person who they they also got a similar sort of coverage. I don't know if it was by the same reporter or for like, the same quote, unquote series, but they would sing in the drive through. And so they, they would just, like this, this really enthusiastic Wendy's worker was just spotlighted by the news because people would come through and they would, like, always have a new song for whoever was driving through, and people loved them because they were just a delight to talk to. But you know, then the news articles, like, check out this person who sings at the drive through. And you're like, cool, but like, what else do they do

Elle Billing:

but like, who are they as a person? Yeah,

Jordan Thornquest:

what do they like to do when they go home? Do they also sing? Do they, you know? What do their friends think of them like? Yeah, you just only get this picture of like, hey, check out this person. They do this thing. They're like this. And that is a very small snippet of that person.

Elle Billing:

Yeah, exactly. Did you ever feel any kind of pressure to keep living up to that moniker, or, like, conversely, pressured to grow past like that limiting view of who you were as a person and as an artist, whether or not the accident played into like you growing beyond that.

Jordan Thornquest:

Yeah, not at first. I remember at first I thought it was like I was very proud of it. I was like, it was a cool summation of how I wanted to be perceived, especially because I was very religious at that point, like I was kind of freshly on my own as an adult, and grew up in a very Christian home, and hadn't really been out in the world outside of that. And so when it first happened, I was like, yeah, so I want to be, I want to be this, you know, joyful, like presenting the quote, like the love of Jesus, kind of person. And I was, I didn't think about it much at the time. And then a couple years later, when I started to challenge a lot of those things and sort of grow past a lot of that, and start describing myself as, like, post-Christian and feeling other feelings, and like, kind of becoming more emotionally mature and complex, I remember I wrote a song specifically named after that article,

Elle Billing:

The Happiest Man in Town, Yeah,

Jordan Thornquest:

yeah, yeah.

Elle Billing:

Wasn't it the last one on your EP?

Unknown:

than being happy, and then it was kind of outwardly, just shedding that identity. Because it felt like it was reductive. I was just like, I was very self aware of the fact that I was not put together or particularly inspirational to myself, and I was a lot more frustrated and wanted to be able to be other things. And so then that song was a reflection of that. And then since then, it is funny just to to see that article and be like, gosh, I am glad that I'm not just that anymore. Yeah, speak of a lot more than that.

Elle Billing:

Obviously, music has shaped a lot of how you process things. I mean, you use you just talked about how you that EP, EP, yeah, that EP was, like, all your emotions other than happy, like, after being the face of a happy Jesus person for so long,

Jordan Thornquest:

yeah, yeah yeah yeah

Elle Billing:

in a town where that's kind of expected. So music has shaped your life, both before and after the injury and recovery. What can you tell us about, like, your current projects? What are you working on right now,

Unknown:

right now? So since that whole kind of the fun part of that whole arc of like, post happiest man was, I realized at the time when I had that article done, I was like, oh, I want to live in Twin Falls, and I want to run a recording studio, and I want to be the music guy here. And then sort of moved away from that,

Elle Billing:

well, you did that for quite a while.

Jordan Thornquest:

I did, yeah, that was, that was my identity. And then I was like, I've never really questioned my identity when I did, I was like, Oh, I think I don't want to try to be that guy, especially in this place, like trying to create and run a community that I don't think was looking for that at the time, it was very hard to, like, have the fuel and the energy to basically try and build a culture out of nothing. And then, you know, I got hit and ran out of that energy, and I was like, I think I am ready to go somewhere new and to participate in a culture that has been built in another place. Like to not have to be the one person trying to run it, and to instead be able to participate with other artists. I think I needed that, because in Twin Falls, I had built a very small community of people around me that I was creating with, but we were all sort of like trying to figure out our process. And I was like, I need to go find a bunch of people who are way better at this than I am, and be intimidated and trying to make something by learning

Elle Billing:

Yeah,

Jordan Thornquest:

and so to answer your question, like at this point now, I'm in Philadelphia. I moved to the east coast because there's a lot of really great music culture here, and there's actual venues, and there's actual concerts, and so many recording studios like I've just been sort of gleaning from that culture and watching these shows and been listening to a lot of music, because I have been sort of wrestling with this thing that I've noticed, where I feel like, when I listen to a lot of great music and art and read the lyrics that I feel like a lot of artists feel things differently than I do, and feel very deeply, in a way that I'm still sort of learning how to feel and thinking deeply and expressing things creatively, like I feel like I have a very sort of narrow, shallow understanding of the depth of human emotion, and so I've just been trying to feel it a lot more. While I'm focusing on the craft of putting together a home, has kind of been my current art project. I've been trying to do like thrift shopping and furniture hunting and thinking about how to make a space, because in all of this, like when I was running a studio, and when I was living in a van and living with you, like I was, I call myself a recovering minimalist, because I just I shed things. I mostly put all my money and time into a recording studio. And so every apartment that I had was just like a bed and like a couch and a TV and so, like recently, I bought art from you, and I've been just like, trying to build a space in a home that like, feels like it reflects the vibrancy I want to reflect, and the life that I've lived up to this point, a place that I want to be in. And I've been learning video game development, which has been a fun, new sort of direction of creativity, which I've been very excited about. It implements music, but also implements computer work, which I've done for a long time, and storytelling and visual art. And it's, it's a great way to just sort of stretch all of the art forms that I've sort of dabbled with, but I've not tried to get too deeply into, and it forces you to put them all together into something. So that's what I've been working on lately has been listening music, listening to music, more than playing music, and then building a home and making games. And it's been fun, but it's been different because I've always been like being a music maker as the motivating version of myself. And so I just after I got hit, I was I slowed way down, and I was like, If I lived a different life other than the one I was living, how would I feel about it, and what would I learn? And then I know eventually I'm gonna get a bunch of music equipment, I'm gonna start going into these recording studios in Philly, and I'm gonna get back into it and be like, Ah, I do like this actually. This is really fun, but I've been doing something very different, which has been really cool, that is really cool and directly influenced by the slowdown that I had from getting injured, it led me in a different direction.

Elle Billing:

Yeah, I think kind of those life altering moments do that. I don't have anything profound to say about it. It's just that that happens. You know, my life is divided into, like, the time before and the time after, to where, like, I was forced to slow down and, yeah, really evaluate, What am I doing? What do I want to be doing? Are the things that I'm doing worth the energy and the angst? What do I want to still hang on to? You mentioned like, that you're taking the time to feel things more deeply, and I think that's really, that's something I can resonate with too. I've always felt things bigly, but it wasn't really until I left my job in Idaho and moved back home, and, like, slowed down enough to, like, recover from burnout that I could feel things in real time. You know where before I was so stressed and again, like, making myself do all these, like I was hyper driven and, like, really busy all the time,

Jordan Thornquest:

yes

Elle Billing:

so like, I felt big things, but usually it was, like, big stress.

Unknown:

Oh, man, the portion of my life that I can define as being stress motivated is too much of it, like, I think the last three years, I could say, have not been motivated by stress, because up until I got hit, it was just like I was running sort of on stress. That's where a lot of my energy came from. I think,

Elle Billing:

yeah, but like being able to slow down and feel deeply other things at the time that I'm experiencing them. I still joke that it takes me three to five business days to process and fully understand my anger, but that's because I swallowed it and didn't let myself experience anger for so many years. I still need time to figure it out, but most of my other emotions I can tap into pretty much as they're happening, and it really took slowing down to be able to do that, to make space for them.

Jordan Thornquest:

Yeah, I think that that's the, you know, for for anyone who listens to this and is curious about, like, the insight of grappling with, you know, changes in your health, but also just wanting to empathize if you're not in that place, is like one, I think that it's really important to to recognize how hard it is when you're in pain to do things. And I don't think I knew that until I had a very sudden shift, you know, as if you as a listener, are somebody who is doing well,

and hearing this:

slowing down feels really nice, and it can be kind of amazing. If you've never done it, you should try it.

Elle Billing:

But also, like, don't wait for your body to make you do it.

Jordan Thornquest:

Yeah, totally. And I think that now I'm in this place of, like, just still trying to kind of get to a place where I understand what my limits are. Because in the process of recovery, you start with, like, a very, very small amount of energy, because your body is just in the healing process, and then getting to a point where, like, I'm recognizing, and I've been thinking about this, this last couple these last couple months, is like I have less capacity than I did before, and I don't like how that feels. And I still have to decide how I feel about that and what to do now, like I I think that it's, it's something that is important to grapple with and to not despair about. But I still feel like this is new. It's new to be able to to say that I can do less than I could before, physically, because my body, my spine, hurts when I'm walking all day. Ah, I was in New York at a show, and I was on my feet, and I had a great time. And then when the show was over, I like, bent over so that I could, like, relax. I was like, Oh, I I'm done. My body is done. I have to go home because I can't walk anymore.

Elle Billing:

Yeah. Like, I am in pain, yes, yeah, yeah. Once it we had pretty nice weather through the fall. It stayed really nice. Once we got that first real cold snap, my body went, nope. I am hurting. Oh, man, just when it gets once it gets really cold. I mean, I'm, I'm in pain all the time, yeah, but it's fairly, I say it's tolerable, like, I don't know. Maybe it would not some, like, somebody who doesn't experience it all the time, it would probably knock them on their

Jordan Thornquest:

yeah, totally, ass,

Elle Billing:

um, but, like, I just live with it. But, like, my winter pain is, like, totally different,

Jordan Thornquest:

yeah.

Elle Billing:

Like, that cold gets in your bones and it's just hurt my like, the little, all little bones in my feet hurt and my knees hurt and the little bones in my hand hurt and my ankles hurt, and it's just all of it,

Jordan Thornquest:

yeah,

Elle Billing:

places I didn't know could hurt hurt, and I just feel like I can't get warm. And I'm like, Wait, why did I, why did I move back somewhere

Jordan Thornquest:

that really loves to be cold?

Elle Billing:

Oh, God, where this where the cold hurts your face and everything else below it?

Jordan Thornquest:

Yeah? It gives me a lot more patience,

Elle Billing:

like, oh yeah. Because the rest of everything, the support and the slowing down and the family and yeah, oh, it makes it worth it. Yeah,

Jordan Thornquest:

you were very helpful for that, too. I appreciate that. Thank you for helping with that recovery process.

Elle Billing:

I forgot to turn my phone off. That was my nap alarm.

Jordan Thornquest:

Oh yeah. Is it time? You're an hour behind me, right?

Elle Billing:

Yeah, it's time to wake up, actually.

Jordan Thornquest:

Oh no.

Elle Billing:

Today's all messed up. It's all right. Sorry you were saying,

Jordan Thornquest:

Yeah, I think that was the gist of it. Is like, Man, I very thankful for that part. Like, I think it's, it's really good to to have people that were just like during the recovery process, but also, just like understanding the patience needed for somebody in pain be like, Oh yeah, it's gonna take Jordan a little longer for us to get ready and go somewhere. And it gave me greater empathy for like, my grandparents and my dad, like my dad had a really debilitating injury, he was just in pain all the time, and he didn't need to be as mean about it as he was. But like, part of me was also like, Oh, I get it too. Like, he was in excruciating pain, and we wanted to be on our feet all day doing stuff, and he literally couldn't, but we didn't understand, like, how much he couldn't, because we didn't take it very seriously

Elle Billing:

when I've had several bad days, like, really bad days in a row, I do get really cranky and very short, and I recognize it usually after the fact, and I'm like, Oh, I'm really sorry. I'm in a lot of pain. I don't have any patience. Shouldn't be snapped like, I don't get -- maybe I do get mean, and I don't notice. I do get really short, though. it's sometimes very hard to be nice when I'm in pain. Yeah. I get that, all right, I have one more question, what is one true thing that you have learned from your creative practice?

Jordan Thornquest:

This is a good question. When I when I was looking at this and thinking about it, I didn't, I didn't quite have a great answer for it, but I think I have a decent answer for it, which is, there's a there's a musician and video maker. His name is Adam Neely, and I really like some of the stuff he's talked about because it's connected to some other conversations I've had with other people about music in particular. But I think this goes for any craft which is like when you're making art, especially if it is an art that is music, or any sort of physical or digital art, anything that involves your motor, muscles, your body. It is as much a form of athleticism as it is a form of like creative

Elle Billing:

Awesome. Thank you. outpouring, and it is something that you can improve with regular practice, like any form of athleticism or activity, like the the thing that I think I hear a lot of people talk about, like, especially older people, is like, Oh, I can't, you know, I can't play guitar my hands, just like, it doesn't fit, or like, I'm, I didn't do it when I was 12, so it's too late for me. And it's like, well, one that's not true. You can, you can start any time, because I talked to this friend of mine who's a neurosurgeon, and they said, our body's capacity, like to to learn something and achieve muscle mastery doesn't begin to decline until you're in your late 60s. Like your ability to pick up and get good at something that is like learning an instrument or learning to paint, like in terms of physical capacity, barring the limitations of disability, which is always something that you want to be patient with yourself about, like you could just pick up a new skill and get really good at it. It's not something that's just, you know, gated for youth. That is the truth that you you can pick up and do that thing that you want to do. Your body has the capacity for it and can learn that you're not you're not too late. I think that's a very important truth. And also, just like the best thing I think

Jordan Thornquest:

Yeah, you can do for your craft is to do it even when you don't feel particularly inspired in that same mindset of the way that our bodies and brains learn our muscles learn the craft of getting better at, you know, playing an instrument or painting something, just doing it as a regular thing that you train yourself to do is really, really healthy, because when the inspiration hits, you'll be ready for it, and it's really

Elle Billing:

thanks for being here. important to just let yourself do it anyways, even when you're not ready for it, because you don't want to just sit and wait for the right moment, otherwise you'll never do it. So you should just do it even when it doesn't feel perfect. Perfectionism is something that does not have to, you don't have to give it your time. You can just do it because you like it, doesn't have to be perfect. It probably won't, but if you just do it anyways, then when the inspiration hits, it'll feel great, because you're like, Oh, I've already been practicing. I already know how to draw. I didn't wait to learn how to draw until I had an idea.

Jordan Thornquest:

That was super fun. Thanks for having me.

Elle Billing:

Yeah. Thank you for joining us on this episode of Hoorf. To get the complete show notes and all the links mentioned on today's episode, or to get a full transcript of the episode, visit Hoorf podcast.com . Join the BlessedHerd of St Winkus. By signing up for our newsletter, you can get Hoorf episodes delivered directly to your inbox. What's more, you get invitations to our monthly Coffee and Biscuits Chat, where you get to hang out with Ricki and Elle, talk about the show, and connect on the topics that mean the most to you. You can sign up for that at hoorfpodcast dot com. If you become a patron for only $3 a month, you can support the creation of this podcast, help pay my editor, and join a community of caregivers out here, just doing our best. Thank you again for joining me, Elle Billing the chronically ill queer femme who is very tired, on this episode of Hoorf. Until next time, be excellent to each other. Hoorf is hosted by Elle Billing @elleandwink, audio editing by Ricki Cummings@rickiep00h music composed by Ricki Cummings. Hoorf is a production of Elle & Wink ArtStudio, LLC, all rights reserved. Hoorf can be found on all social media platforms.@hoorfpodcast at H, O, O, R, F, podcast,

Jordan Thornquest:

oh, God, I have to fix everything.

Contributor

Ricki Cummings

Producer