The D2Z Podcast
Gen Z entrepreneur and DTC agency leader Brandon Amoroso talks with some of the best in the marketing world. Brandon and guests reveal their top business-growth strategies for anyone in the online space–whether you are a brick-and-mortar business looking to scale or an established online business trying to grow. Consumer marketing is under constant and dramatic change, so Brandon aims to tackle new problems with a fresh Gen Z mindset. The D2Z Podcast delivers insights, strategies, and tactics that you can use and aims to shift how you think about business and your relationships with your teams, partners, and customers.
The D2Z Podcast
Mastering the Startup Game: Strategic Insights with Hamlet Azarian - 115
In this episode of the D2Z podcast, Brandon Amoroso dives into the entrepreneurial journey with Hamlet Azarian, CEO of Azarian Growth Agency. With a deep dive into the trials of starting and growing businesses, Hamlet shares invaluable insights from his decades of helping startups strategize and succeed. From the importance of initial market strategies to understanding the critical role of customer feedback and the nuances of remote team management, this episode is a trove of wisdom for entrepreneurs at all stages.
Here's what you'll learn:
🚀 The transformative impact of customer retention strategies in business growth.
🧭 How to navigate and influence company culture and processes in large and small firms alike.
💻 The role of technology in enhancing customer engagement and the strategic use of data for business evolution.
🔄 Insights on transitioning from traditional business roles to tech-centric positions and the opportunities it presents.
📈 Practical strategies for handling growth, scaling challenges, and the importance of aligning brand perception with reality.
Brandon Amoroso:
LinkedIn - https://www.linkedin.com/in/brandonamoroso/
Web - https://brandonamoroso.com/
Instagram - https://www.instagram.com/bamoroso11/
X - https://twitter.com/AmorosoBrandon
Scalis.ai - https://scalis.ai/
Mentioned resources
I'm Brandon Amoroso, and this is the D2Z Podcast building and growing your business from a Gen Z perspective. Hey everyone, thanks for tuning into D2Z, a podcast about using the Gen Z mindset to grow your business. I'm Gen Z entrepreneur Brandon Amoroso, founder and president of Retention as a Service Agency Electric, as well as the co-founder of Scaless, and today I'm talking with Hamlet Azarian, who's the CEO of Azarian Growth Agency. Thanks for coming on the show.
Speaker 2:Brandon, thanks for having me on. Really excited to be here today.
Speaker 1:So before we dive into things, can you give everybody just a brief background on yourself and what you've done up until this point?
Speaker 2:No, of course. So we've been working with venture-backed startups for the last decade and a half or so. We come in and we help develop go-to-market strategies and go-to-market teams, and we work in a variety of spaces, from SaaS to e-commerce to D2C, you name it. We've kind of operated in it and we help develop the initial go-to-market strategies, allowing the founders to be focused on the core product itself.
Speaker 1:And what are a few of the, let's say, companies that you've worked with over the past 10, 15 years that our audience might be familiar with?
Speaker 2:There is a company called Camino Financial, which is a B2B lender, came in early on and helped build and scale up their team. It was me and the initial founders. They recently got acquired via a merger. Another company that we were also involved with was called Disco. They are an ad tech platform. A third company we helped as well was called CBDFX, which was in the early days of them, figuring out their overall e-commerce strategy and their go-to-market strategy. We came in and helped provide guidance on their SEO strategy, as well as their analytics platforms.
Speaker 1:What got you into this business to begin with? What got you into this business to begin with and what gave you the entrepreneurial bug?
Speaker 2:Great question. I think it's something that has always been with me since I was a little kid. I've been always curious on working and helping other people and that naturally led to continuously seeing problems. And then that led me to join the USC Entrepreneur Program and now I'm dating myself or aging myself. This was roughly around 98, 99.
Speaker 2:At the time, com was a new thing and my business plan, which we had to do back then you know, we weren't doing pitch decks, we were doing business plans was around the concept of basically building what would become similar to like an Uber meets or a Postmates. We called it Hungry Fingers. Back then you didn't have phones, you had to order with your keyboard and you would be ordering online and have it have the food delivered to your home right Through the laptop, through your computer. I struggled, I did not know anything. I was way, way, way, way too early for me as a leader, as an entrepreneur. Right, I tried, I did try to actually do it. I failed miserably and then that eventually led me to start working for what felt like an entrepreneurial program, which was at Robinson's May and their executive training program as a buyer, and I started learning about retail. I started learning about more or less commerce. I started learning more about just consumer behavior as a whole, and I started falling more in love with the idea of all right, can this new skill set that I'm developing later on be transformed into something else? I then came across that I did that for several years four or five years or so Right.
Speaker 2:At the same time, I tried my own business. I failed again. So this was my second complete, disastrous failure. This time it was on a company called Lightheaded, and what we were producing were LED lights that you would put in your hair and you can use to go to raves, and raves were starting to occur all over the place. We had found a manufacturer out of China. We started creating these LEDs. We started going to trade shows. It actually, in the grand scheme of things, was an incredible lesson for me, because the product itself sold really, really well. We went from like zero to $100,000 in sales in like month two or month three, and it was really really quick growth that we were starting to get. But the foundation wasn't there. Like I was side hustling this, I was doing this while.
Speaker 2:I had a full-time job. I was traveling to trade shows, I was going out and trying to run a business that was booming, but at the same time, I was keeping my regular day job because I didn't know how long this would last or what would go about, what would happen with it. That also ended up getting to a point where it was just not sustainable. I ended up shutting it down. But it taught me incredible lessons that the foundation of the business is really, really important and understanding the strategy of where you're taking it. Early sales might not necessarily mean victory for you in the long run if you don't have everything put in place from your logistics, from your operations, from your inventory management and so on and so forth. And then, lastly, eventually, as I did these two things, I wanted still to get into the startup ecosystem and I started meeting this is now I'm fast forwarding another decade or so a gentleman. I was a buyer at Saks Fifth Avenue at this point and then there was a story of a gentleman named Tony Hsieh that kept on coming up over and over again and he was the founder of Zappos, and I heard literally his story through my colleagues, right Like here I am. Here is a guy who was also a buyer right, he was also a founder of an online company.
Speaker 2:And here I was a buyer at Saks Fifth Avenue, of a traditional large retailer, and I was hearing stories of him showing up to the showroom with a box and a camera, taking photos and then literally listing the products online, literally starting to sell inventory. I was like man, something's off here. What I'm destined to be doing someone else is doing right there, right in front of me, and that was, I think, a moment for me where I'm like okay, I need to get back into the startup ecosystem, I need to get back into entrepreneurship, startup ecosystem, I need to get back into entrepreneurship. So I left Saks, I went full throttle into getting back into the ecosystem and that was probably the best decision I made and that has allowed me to transform into where I am, where I started, initially as a growth advisor, had opportunity to work for two or three really, really amazing companies, and now we have a growth agency where we're partnered with VCs as well as different startups themselves and we're helping develop their go-to-market strategies.
Speaker 1:What were some of the learning lessons from your first companies that you weren't expecting and came as a surprise.
Speaker 2:Some of the gotchas weren't expecting and you know, came as a surprise, some of the, some of the gotchas, oh, great question. So let's see. So from the lightheaded company, uh, let's start with the start with the one I started at usc.
Speaker 2:Right, the hungry fingers hungry fingers I made technology feel like it was simpler than it really was. I I think it was like one of those things where, like I'm like I I'm pretty good at the computer. You know I I'm a self taught programmer, so I'm like I could try to figure this out. I mean, how complicated can this be? And then when you actually got into the doing of it, you're like, oh wow, the learning curve and the time and iteration cycle that it takes to get this going was just too much, and I knew at that point that I was not ready at all for it. Right? So that was one important learning lesson early on that you need to make sure before you go out and just start getting customers and we actually got our first customer, by the way so we literally had gotten a customer who was interested in working with us. They were willing to start paying us, but we hadn't built the product out fully. So we're like, at least you need to get to an MVP, you need to get to a base bear point of a component that you're not selling an idea, or you're not selling the idea of something, but you need to get a working prototype that actually, when you go and sell the customer, it doesn't feel so daunting that you can't actually produce and build it. That was lesson one. Lesson one also in that was surround yourself with the people that the skills that you don't have, pretty pretty quickly, like I did.
Speaker 2:As much as I knew about engineering, I wasn't fully ready yet. As much as I knew about marketing, I wasn't fully ready yet. I thought I knew it, but I was not there. So it's really really important that you're never going to know everything. You're going to always be learning and you're always going to be learning not by yourself. You're going to be learning as a team, and the more you are surrounded by advisors, the more you're surrounded by incredible team members, by advisors. The more you're surrounded by incredible team members, the more you are open to asking questions, taking information in and then trying to apply it. That's when the learning is over, on the lightheaded one, I think, and sales can hide problems that you just don't see. So it's the opposite side of the coin. It's like when you're really like cranking and you're really moving a lot of volume at a really, really quick pace. There's things that you're just not ready for, one of which would be inventory management, one of which would be. How do you keep track of all of the receivables coming in and going?
Speaker 1:out All the not sexy stuff. All the not sexy stuff Quality control, like?
Speaker 2:the list goes on and on and on. Right, like supply relationships. Do you have it really embedded where your product all of a sudden is not going to show up in the market? You're like, god damn it, I finally got this thing to sell. Now everybody else is selling it.
Speaker 2:What happened here? What's going on, like all of those things that you don't necessarily think about can really start biting you when you have an incredibly successful product and you didn't do a great job of protecting it early on. So that was what I learned in that process and then working with some of the startups, it's really been be open to the market. Really, I think if you look at the successful startups I've been with, it's we all don't know the answer and the only person that is actually right is the customer right. So it's how much are you willing to listen to the feedback, direct or indirect? Most of the time it's indirect through data on what are they trying to tell you? Do they actually appreciate the value proposition that you're proposing to them? And from that, what are you learning? And what experiments are you running and at what pace are you running these experiments for you to be able to learn and have scientifically proven data that suggests that this is the right path, and then really, really pushing and going after.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I think that indirect feedback is really critical because more often than not your customers won't explicitly tell you what they want or what they're upset about, or you know that's not. It is much harder to be able to extract that from from people, and it's the same way when you know you don't ask your friends or family to look at your product and they give you feedback, because you're not going to get real feedback.
Speaker 2:Oh, they all love it.
Speaker 1:It's like the best product in the whole wide world when you ask Exactly, I mean, this will never fail, how could it? I mean you know, but then you're showing the product to your mom, so not exactly the best stress test that you could do for it.
Speaker 2:Yeah. So the best, at least, of what we learn is just put up a landing page, right, Like, literally, put up a landing page, even if you don't have the product built or don't have any inventory in it or anything of that sort, and just run a small test. Run a small, really hyper-focused test, both on, you know, get the traffic from Instagram, get it from TikTok wherever you want to get the traffic, depending on who your audience is, and see how do they react to the ad creatives, how do they react to the value proposition on the landing page, and then pause it, like literally, like, if you see positive signals and you have a really good early read, right, so like you're like okay, cool, they appreciate what this is all about. I have a really high click-through rates, I have really good conversion rates on the landing page, and that should be enough for you then say okay, I want to invest in whatever this, whatever the skew is, whatever the software platform is.
Speaker 1:It's been kind of one of the little hacks that we've been using over the years to get smarter before we heavily go into something yeah, like you know, test before you make the big bet, versus making the big bet and then being surprised about what the result ends up being exactly yeah. Yeah, I think you know getting a product out into market sooner rather than later is incredibly important because you know you can sort of exist within an echo chamber, Even if you are bringing in other people to look at it. It's a whole lot different to get you know an external party to start paying for something and to actually use it and then, once you have that feedback loop, I think things get a lot easier. I think it's actually a lot harder to get it to that point, but once you're there and you have people using it, then I found it a lot easier to iterate and be able to grow from there.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and at that point, keep on getting them to use it. Right. How do you get them to use it more?
Speaker 1:no-transcript. Yeah, definitely. What are some of the things that you've had to deal with when it comes to building teams, and are you fully remote or are you in office? Great question, we're fully remote.
Speaker 2:We are now 25 people and man it's been a challenge. People and man it's been a challenge. So the agency itself started in the middle of COVID and so we were naturally had to be remote because we started during COVID. But to continue our growth, I think what's really helped if I reflect back on it is obviously Zoom and Google Me. Google meets all of those we use that religiously right. So we also do a great job of communicating on Slack, using Asana as our project management board. But, more importantly, we're really open to constantly looking at our workflows and and really understanding what's working, what's not working and what needs to be iterated.
Speaker 2:If I think about it, it was much easier when we were smaller. So when we were like five people, super easy to be in touch and understand what's going on. When we got to 10, it got a little bit harder. 15, incredibly harder. 25, it continues to get even harder, right, but I think the way you overcome that is just the constant communication and being really great at it and checking in on people, making sure that everything outside of work is also good too, like what's going on outside of work. How are you doing? What are you up to? How was your weekend, all of those normal conversations you would have in the office, I think, sometimes gets lost in a remote environment because everyone is just so like all right, it's the meeting, what's the meeting about? And you just want to get the meeting done so you can get back to doing your thing.
Speaker 2:Right, but but I think it's, I think it's equally as important in a remote situation.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I think the like having some sort of a culture is very difficult, remote first. I've I've found it's been harder than when we are all in office together. You know, getting to go out for drinks or dinner afterwards, things like that. Do you do anything around like bringing the team all together in person and stuff like that?
Speaker 2:Yeah, so most of the team lives near each other. So most of my team is based in armenia, which is an eastern european country, so they all live within a few miles of each other. But I would have, I would have loved to tell you that they get together more often than they should. I encourage them to get and, if they're listening to this, you guys need to get together more. I keep on telling you guys what they did, which was incredible is in summers it's really beautiful there. So, like in the summers, they try to do half days where they'll go to the park right and hang out. Wintertime, when I'm there, we all try to work together at co-working spaces. We go to restaurants and, you know, start to build our bond together even more restaurants. And, you know, start to build our bonds, our bond together even more. The smaller teams do coffee time, or coffee and dinner time together, and so on and so forth. So so I I do encourage it. It's it's really important to do that. The. It's ironic though, even though everyone is so close to, I don't know if we will ever go back to, I try to think of, like the workforce and what my son will have to go through. I think the workforce of the future will be what it is today, which I think the closest thing we'll get to is sort of like a hybrid world. Like there is an office. It's sort of like a co-working office. People can go in when they want to go in. There might be some hours that on certain days everybody's got to go in, right. It's like the meeting days, right. Like we'll learn that it's much more efficient if we're all together in one room talking through the stuff before trying to do it on zoom.
Speaker 2:But I don't foresee a world where people are not working remotely or working from wherever they want to work. You know, I see that continuously occurring. Just, the benefits outweigh it for everybody, for both the employer as well as the employee, right. So like being able to. For example, one of our team members was traveling and they wanted to be able to work out of Dubai. Yeah, not an issue, you can go to Dubai and work from there. If you want to work from there, you get to be with your husband, you get to see the country and, at the same time, the few hours that you got to get things done, you execute on those, the meetings that you do and the rest of the time you're working at your own schedule. Totally fine, not a problem at all, and I think that's where the world will evolve to, if it hasn't already.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and I think employers are benefiting or starting to see the benefits more and more of things like nearshoring or things like that.
Speaker 1:Where you know my new business, we have four people here in Miami, but then we've got 18 in Brazil, of which those 14 of them are within 15 minutes driving of one another in the same little region. So it's still kind of a hub approach, but we are technically a distributed team and it would be fully remote. But we'll definitely move towards that hybrid model where you know you're, you're going in and out of the office, at least in some regard, because I just enjoy, you know, getting that person to person interaction and I think it's. I think it's pretty valuable, but I also think it depends on the you know how long the business has been around for, like you know, you've obviously been established for for quite some time. We're just getting this one off the ground and running, so I think it's pretty important for people to be in person at that inception stage in a way that it probably isn't you know if you're, if you're Google or something like that, to use the opposite extreme.
Speaker 2:Yeah, one day, right, one day, we will be Google.
Speaker 1:Yes, one day. One day Only, in like three years, though Not too long.
Speaker 2:Not too long. Not too long, no.
Speaker 1:Yeah, exactly. Well, what are you excited about the most? You obviously work with a variety of different companies at your business, so you must see a lot of different types of software companies come across your business, so you must see a lot of different types of you know software companies come across your your desk. What are some of the more like interesting? Uh, you know trends that you're seeing or you know things to look out for going into next year that you think should be top of mind for people.
Speaker 2:Great question. So so the companies we work with, even though they're software companies, they're, you know, software companies, they're regular businesses, right. So it's the utilization of solving problems. That's what they do. So what I'll tell you what we as an agency, overall, are really excited about, you know, four years ago we got into AI. So if people know their AI timeline, that's roughly when OpenAI released their endpoints, right? So that's when we got into it, and so we started playing with that super early on, and I think we're just at the, like, the really early, early stages of what all of this is gonna, what all of this is going to do, right? So what we're playing with in this new iteration of the multimodals is video components of it, and it's phenomenal, like how much you, how far you can get what video now and what are you able to do there. In addition to that, like, I don't know how much you've played with the image recognition of the.
Speaker 2:Now it's like the world of augmented reality is going to be scary the world of where we have glasses on and we're walking, or even contact lenses and our eyes are able to search and find and get information and showcase it. I don't even know how far away. I literally think for maybe five years, maybe 10. Like something crazy has to go for it to be 10. I I really think we're like five years away from this where we're all walking around with these glasses. I mean ray ban just trying with their, you know, meta glasses and google tried a few years ago with their version of the glasses, and obviously apple now with the vision pros, but.
Speaker 2:But this whole world of augmentation is exciting for me.
Speaker 2:What other things are we nerding out on? Also, we're definitely nerding out on the full utilization of being able to use tools like Clay, which we love. So what we've noticed is the new level of ai application software, where it's smart enough to pull in different data sources and really get as close to the level of marketing or personalization of one right, like where it's able to understand what did you just post on LinkedIn, go read and process that and be able to tell you or suggest to you as an SDR or as a marketer what would be a good approach for this particular person. Sequence it and the messaging doesn't feel like the generic sales pitch. It feels like much more like hey, I noticed you went to USC in 1999. By the way, I went to USC as well. You know it already starts the early phases of what a normal conversation would be to build a relationship, so it does feel like you've spent some time researching them versus just, you know, putting them in a queue and starting sending emails out.
Speaker 1:Yes, the bar has been raised pretty substantially, I think, when it comes to cold outreach and things like that, from because of AI and also with AI, the volume is so much higher than it was even four years ago.
Speaker 1:I mean, I just get emails and LinkedIn's literally 24 seven and I don't know if I've replied to a single one in the last like year and a half. No, every once in a while I'll forward one because you know it might be relevant for for somebody else on on the team, but I do not. I do not envy the BDRs of the world currently.
Speaker 2:No, and what's interesting is the simpler ones are working right. Like literally just add them and then say, hey, connect Like a simple thing of having the wrong profile and connecting that way seems to work better, and then actually having a message. That's very, very, not even sales at all, like more. Like, hey, cool, I read your post about this. Really interesting stuff you said here Look forward to getting to know you better. That's it Like as simple as that is more than enough for them to re-engage and say, hey, thanks man, nice to meet you. And then you begin the conversation Cool, hey, you want to grab coffee in the next week or two? Here's my calendar. Feel free to grab one. As casual, as that seems to be the approach that we're using with a few of our clients that seems to do really well.
Speaker 1:Yeah, we launched a podcast underneath one of the subsidiaries of the new business and I didn't even think about this necessarily when we first launched it, but it's essentially like a sales engine for the people that are coming on that particular podcast, because it's all about HR and early careers and internships and things like that.
Speaker 1:And the people that are speaking on the podcast with me are the ones that we would actually be selling into, like our main software, and so you know we're talking to like we had somebody on from Uber a couple of weeks ago. Our software can't support Uber at this point yet, but also Uber would never even talk to us unless we had that podcast. So we're seeing that more and more where it's almost like a soft sales approach. We're getting more of that brand awareness, that recognition, and then, inherently, in our 30-minute conversation that I have with them, the topic of what the hell are you doing comes up, and then you have that conversation and you already have that face-to-face interaction too. So when you do reach back out, you know three weeks later, hey, you know, do you think we could do five, 10 minutes? And I'll show you what I've got going on. It's so much easier than just going direct like here cold sales pitch. Please sign up for this type of deal.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I love that. You're adding value, right, you're adding value in terms of the conversation. You're giving them an opportunity, a medium for them to talk about their product and their customer base and what they're trying to do. You're help promoting them but at the same time, you're building a relationship, and that is like the proper way of doing B2B sales right. So that's one avenue of it. Another way would be similar to like inviting them to a webinar. If you were to be host a webinar or fireside chat, or if you were to do an in-person event at a conference or or ask the conference or hey, I want to be able to host a fireside chat. These are the type of guests that I'm going to be inviting to your conference, things of that sort friends, things of that sort.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I think the thing that people get tripped up on is wanting that like instant.
Speaker 1:You know, gratification and no. Building up a sales funnel and pipeline takes, takes time, and I experienced that the hard way with the with the previous business because, um, you know we would go on these really big tears of outbounding and getting meetings booked and then you know we'd start doing those meetings but then we'd stop the outbounding. So then once that meeting period ended and then you're like, oh shit, you know, here's three weeks of nothing because we didn't keep the engine running. You know there's a lag to when you start and when you actually start to see things begin to trickle in. So you never want to be in a position where you want, like, you know, I need to sail tomorrow, that's, this is not going to happen. You just sail in three months. Great, you know, let's get things going. We can have it be running and have that in a good place. But that definitely happened a couple of times to me in the previous business and because you was just doing too much to like there's only so much that could be done at one time.
Speaker 2:There's only so much one person can do, right. So this is where you this is. This is a common problem, by the way. So this is a common problem for B2B companies is. This is where you start thinking about how do you break up and delegate certain type parts of the sales process? How do you introduce an SDR into the process that can begin the initial sales process? How do you improve overall the sales cycle? Right, Like, does it take?
Speaker 2:If it takes three months, why is it taking three months? Is that the natural part of the sales cycle or is there something that you could be doing that can speed it up from three months two months, from two months to one month? Is there something that you're missing in your presentation that's forcing it to take three months? Things of that sort that you need to think through. Is there an early soft sale you can do?
Speaker 2:That's not necessarily the big purchase. One example would be if you're selling like a $10,000 a month software, can you sell them sort of an audit? Hey, can we come and just do a tech audit for you and kind of let you know what we see overall in the process? The audit's going to cost you $2,500 to $5,000, or whatever it is. We have to do it anyways, right, Like you're going to have to do this when you start with them, At least it gives you an entryway into really understanding the business early on and building the relationship even more, getting paid for it and then be able to sell the, the, the bigger enterprise solution you want to sell at the tail end of it.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and I think that that enterprise sales motion is so much different than what it looks like for SMB or self-service products or things like that and just because you're good at one doesn't mean that you're good at the other, and there's so much more that goes into selling an enterprise business than goes into selling an SMB.
Speaker 2:Yeah, we have two different playbooks. So we break it down into B2B, which is the enterprise level, which is the bigger ticket, and then B2C, which is the consumer-facing one, which is typically a much shorter ticket, faster, less decision makers involved in the process. Right On the enterprise one, there might be a whole committee that needs to make a choice where, on the B2C, you're really selling to the consumer or you're selling to the business owner. That it's the one person that you're selling to, and it's a much more of a try. Let me see if this will work versus all right, this is a big undertaking. I need to get X amount of people to buy into this before we make a choice on it.
Speaker 1:That makes sense. That's something that we haven't had to tackle yet and we will at some point, and that'll be an interesting path for us to embark on. You know, moving more to like that account-based marketing than necessarily, you know, a little bit more low-level approach to sales Very cool. Well, I got one last question for you here. If there was one thing that you would tell your younger self you know, you're about to start your first business what would it be?
Speaker 2:Oh, great question. Things take longer than you anticipate. It's probably the best thing I would and I I have the least amount of patience. So this is a good thing for my younger self to be hearing uh, even though you want it to be done tomorrow, it most likely will take a week. And if you want it to be done in a week, it will most likely take two weeks. If you want it to be done in two weeks, most likely a month. So just, most likely take two weeks. If you want it to be done in two weeks, most likely a month.
Speaker 2:So just be ready for the natural cycle of things, especially when there is so much going on in growth organizations and growth companies, and nothing will ever be done perfectly, ever be done perfectly. So so get ready for a constant world of imperfection and iteration is what I would call myself like. I have a tendency to want it to have it just right, just great, just perfect, and it's totally fine if it. If the landing page is not as great as you want it to be, or something is broken and you're launching with it knowing it's broken, all these are. It's a better form of learning by just releasing and fixing releasing and fixing versus trying to get it perfectly done, then releasing.
Speaker 1:I think there's some saying like perfection is the enemy of of something that I'm blanking on, but uh, it goes in that same vein. You know where you you have to be able to ship things without it being 110%. You know all buttoned up and I agree with you on the timing. 110%. I mean especially now being on the software side, and the agency was a little bit different Cause, like you know, I could brute force things a little bit more. Uh, on a software side, I'm really at the you know the mercy of our development team and the trials and tribulations that go with that and, like you know, having a roadmap and having ownership of said roadmap. There's like a million things that you know I want done today and that's just. That's just not the reality. Exactly. Well, I appreciate you taking the time and coming on today, but before we hop off, can you let folks know where they can find you online? Yeah, of course.
Speaker 2:You can easily get a hold of me on LinkedIn. Just go there, hamlet Azarian, or you can go to our website, azarian Growth Agency Awesome.
Speaker 1:Well, again, I appreciate it For everybody listening. Azarian. Or you can go to our website Azarian Growth Agency Awesome. Well, again, I appreciate it For everybody listening. As always, this is Brandon Amoroso. You can find me at brandonamorosocom and scalistai. Thanks for listening and we'll see you next time.