Reviving Enrollment and Ensuring Stability Through Bold Planning

In this episode of Telling Our Story, Leticia chats with three guests from Elizabeth City State University in North Carolina. They share how ECSU overcame declining enrollment and the threat of shutting down a decade ago, on its way to being recognized in Third Way's Economic Mobility Index as one of the most outstanding historically black universities in the country.

Guests include:

• Farrah J. Ward, provost and vice chancellor for academic affairs
• Dana Poole, executive director of the Office of Student Success and Retention
• Omar Richardson, alumnus (2023, aviation science) and current graduate student

Read ECSU’s Promising Practice article here: www.aascutellingourstory.org/promising-practice/reviving-enrollment-and-ensuring-stability-through-bold-planning

www.aascutellingourstory.org
www.aascu.org/policy-advocacy/presidential-postsecondary-value-commission-task-force 
www.aascu.org

Music by RomanSenykMusic from Pixabay

Transcript

DR. FARAH WARD, PROVOST (00:05):

I always know the goal, but that can't be just the sole motivator. If the motivation is really about how can we improve, how can we make sure students are getting with their need, I thoroughly believe that if that is what you're focused on, the outcomes will come.

HOST LETICIA MALDONADO (00:23):

Welcome to the Ask You Telling Our Story podcast. I am your host, Leticia Maldonado, a proud member of the Post-Secondary Value team at the American Association of State Colleges and Universities. In this series, we share stories from state colleges and universities that have taken bold steps to successfully serve underrepresented students and their communities. As we speak with the experts who shape these programs, we'll get an inside look on how they are fostering greater accessibility and affordability, closing completion gaps, and creating a more just and equitable society. Greetings to all of our listeners. In this episode of the Ask You Telling A Story podcast, we'll be chatting with guests from Elizabeth City State University, which was facing closure in 2014 by the North Carolina State legislature amid financial instability and low student enrollment. With so much wane in the balance, ECSU had to act decisively to respond to these unprecedented challenges.

(01:36):

In this episode, we'll share the remarkable story of how ECSU not only survived, but has since thrived to the point of being named the number one historically black university for helping students from lower income households achieve economic success and the number one most affordable four year HBCU. This is simply a can't miss episode and I'm beyond honored to welcome our guest today. Joining us are Dr. Farra Ward, Elizabeth City Provost and Vice Chancellor for Academic Affairs. Dana Poole, Elizabeth City Executive Director for the Office of Student Success and Retention. And Omar Richardson. Elizabeth City Alumnus graduate of the 2023 Aviation Science Program and a current graduate student, Dr. Ward. Dana. Omar, welcome.

DR. FARAH WARD, PROVOST (02:29):

Thank you. Thank you so much for having us.

HOST DANA POOLE, EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR (02:31):

Thank you.

STUDENT OMAR RICHARDSON (02:32):

Thank you. Thank you.

HOST LETICIA MALDONADO (02:34):

So I would like to start with you, Dr. Ward, and ask you to please tell us a little bit about Elizabeth City State University.

DR. FARAH WARD, PROVOST (02:42):

Well, thank you again for having us and Elizabeth City State University. We are a historically black university. We're located in Northeastern North Carolina. We're one of the 16 public universities in the UNC system. We were founded in 1891, so we definitely have a rich history. Right now. Our enrollment is 2261, so yes, I know exactly to the T, I count every single student and we have 27 undergraduate degree programs and four graduate degree programs here. I think our main mission is really to focus on student success as well as our student-centered experiential learning. That's one of our real focuses this year and it's really in our actual mission statement. Northeastern North Carolina is an interesting place. We're in a rural community, some may say, but we're the big city to some of the 21 counties that we serve. And for us, the university is really a pillar of our community. We're one of the largest employers in this section of Northeastern North Carolina.

HOST LETICIA MALDONADO (03:46):

Now, I want to go back for a second to something that I mentioned at the beginning. So ECSU is without a doubt thriving and I want to share just a little bit of data to illustrate the extent to which ECSU is succeeding. So your four year graduation rates, your five year graduation rates, your first year retention rates, and your second to third year student retention rates have all increased between 4% and 8% in the last 10 years. And your pre-registration enrollment rates increased a staggering 35% in the last 10 years going from 46 to 81%. So this is huge. Now, when I met you, Dr. Ward, you shared with me what I feel is a remarkable story. If you could please take us back to 2014, what challenges was ECSU facing?

DR. FARAH WARD, PROVOST (04:47):

Yeah, absolutely. One thing is I've been here at ECSU for 17 years, and so I have the privilege of understanding how far we really have come. So between 2010 and 2016, ECSU’s enrollment declined from 3,300 students to 1300 students. So yes, we lost 2000 students in six years, and there were a variety of factors that led to that. One was an increase in the UNC systems GPA requirement. They moved it over three years from a 2.0, I think over five years actually from a 2.0 to a 2.5. We also had some different things going on negative press around some of the Title IX issues that we were having. So there were just a lot of combination that led to that decline in enrollment. But as you can imagine, when you lose 2000 students, that quickly the campus is going to feel the effects of what's going on from, of course, we had reduction in force, we had to lay individuals off many times, key individuals, administrative assistants we had schools, but then we lost schools and merged departments together. And so those were a variety of things that we really experienced during that time. It was definitely a tough time. One of the things you don't think about, but we had residence halls that went vacant, and so after, as we come out right now, we have since had to tear those residence halls down because they sat vacant for so many years when our enrollment declined. So it was a tough time. I look back and think about it, but we're definitely on the other side, but it was a rough time for ECSU.

HOST LETICIA MALDONADO (06:36):

Now, you mentioned when I first interviewed you what a potential closure would mean to the community. Do you want to share a little bit more about that?

DR. FARAH WARD, PROVOST (06:54):

Yeah, and I will never forget it. In May, 2014, that's when the legislature, the Senate, had put a bill to really shut down ECSU and it didn't name us by name. It really was about closing any institution that had experienced a 20% decline in enrollment. And at that time, ECSU had experienced a 37% decline in enrollment. So we knew that we were at the top of the list, but the one thing that I will tell you is extra special about that time is the whole community really got together. We all rallied together. It didn't matter the race of individuals, the political affiliation. I think that the one thing that was clear was that this community understood how valuable this institution was to Elizabeth City and to northeastern North Carolina. And so going without this institution meant the small businesses were going to feel the effects. The individual, the housing market was going to experience a decline because again, as the third largest employer in this area, there are ripple effects.

(08:00):

The students are no longer here, the campus and the university and the community knows when the students go away from the summer and they know when they're here during the semester. And so not having them constantly coming back will really, really affect it. I mean, the painters, it's so many small businesses, that's really what pushes this area, and they would've really had a negative effect. And so there was really a rallying. And so luckily the legislature that Bill never passed, and instead we started our path on a path upward just a few years later after being on the chopping block for closure.

HOST LETICIA MALDONADO (08:38):

So I would love to ask you if you can please talk a little bit about your approach and how did you decide what needed to be prioritized?

DR. FARAH WARD, PROVOST (09:07):

So one thing I neglected to say is that kind of what contributed to the decrease in enrollment is we also were on sax warning. I forget about so many things. It was the perfect storm in the wrong way. And so we were on sax warning, and one of the main reasons we were on warning was for our admissions standards and not meeting them, not documenting the actual students. And so one of the first things we did was went from paper to electronic. So that was a very small kind of process, but I think it was really the integration in the beginning of us using technology and figuring out what was wrong. I'll say in our campus redesign, one of the things and the reasons I believe that we were so successful is we really did a deep dive to figure out what was wrong with ECSU.

(09:55):

And so one of the things we looked at was just our curriculums. So at that time, we had curriculums between 124 and 128 credits. And so we got together and said, can we streamline our curriculums to all being 120 credits? And so that means that again, every student would have to take 30 credits in a year and then they would be able to finish in four years. So that was probably one of the things that we focused on first. And then after that, we really started talking about academic advising. And because again, you got the curriculum, but how are the students going to be advised? And so we looked into academic advising again, when we eliminated schools and eliminated departments. You can imagine that the structure that we had in place when we had 3,300 students was no longer in place. And so we really had to rebuild all that from the ground up.

(10:48):

And then one of the pivotal moments was really an introduction of a system that back then it used to be called Grades First. It's since been bought over by EAB. And so they call it Navigate. Now, the system office and the legislature had given us money. And so we had implemented this new piece of technology grades first in 2013 at the height of our enrollment going down to try to actually help us. And I'll tell you, it was a horrible rollout. It was not worth it at all. But then about 2015, we remembered that we had that piece of technology and we said, how can we make this work for us? And so we relaunched that same piece of software in 2016. We got buy-in from our faculty, figured out we started it off with early alert system, and we also just started tackling things that were irritants that was our former chancellor used to say a lot like remove the irritants in the actual atmosphere. And so whether it was athletics, students who were gone being marked as absent, we really focused on that. But early alerts was really the main point. And so I think about it now. We gave early alerts twice a semester, third week and seventh week we send stuff to students. But Omar, I never thought, how do students interpret these early alerts? They seem to be effective, but I don't know. I'll be curious to hear Omar's perspective on how he felt about the early alerts.

STUDENT OMAR RICHARDSON (12:22):

Okay, so I'm going to tell him myself a little bit. During my first semester of college, I received an alert that I was at risk. Now those who don't understand what at risk is, that means you're at risk of failing a course if you don't get yourself together. So I was on track to have, I actually ended up getting a D when I got that at risk email and I was like, oh my God. And my mother has have access to all my emails, so I'm terrified. I'm beyond scared, scared straight. Every TV show imaginable. I'm terrified. So in that case, that was the first time I was made aware of, Hey, I'm in jeopardy of failing. Is there tutoring I can get? Is there something, is there some assignments? I could reach out and talk to my professor? It gave me somewhat of an alertness to now I have to fix this. Now I know what I'm wrong, I know what I'm doing wrong now, how can I fix it? And I think that's what E for U was very good at doing.

DR. FARAH WARD, PROVOST (13:20):

I'm glad to hear we felt it. And again, that was 2016, so we've been using a platform for so time, so we feel like it's effective, but hearing Obar tell that story from the student's perspective really just validates that that was one of the reasons. And the one thing I will say is there, of course, the secret sauce is that there is no one thing in the secret sauce. There's always a lot of things, but I definitely think, and Omar calls it E for you, that it's EAB Navigate, but we've branded it E for you. And the truth is we still use that platform. Dana oversees it a lot. I don't know, Dana, you want to share some of the things. We still use E for UA lot on campus, and we think that it is been a pivotal part of why we've been successful in recent years.

HOST DANA POOLE, EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR (14:07):

Yeah, absolutely. And so we do use E for you. And so we did brand navigate system. So we have our four E's that are for the students. And so effective, enriching, empowering, engaging. And so we use the system to do just that for the students to make sure that they're empowered, to make sure they know what they're supposed to do, and also to let faculty and staff have ways that we can help the students. In the beginning, it was used to identify those students who are at risk or to do a little scare tactic, I should say, to get them in line so they could do what they were supposed to do. But now it's grown into so much more than that. We use E for U across campus. Financial aid uses the system. The library attracts students coming into the library with it, and they use it for check-ins for their programming, athletics use it, even departments use it. When students go on trips, they use the system to send out travel notices that they'll be away from campus. And more recently, because of our use of E four U, particularly with the progress reporting, the at-risk reporting that we do, EAB Navigate had us to participate in a webinar because our faculty use it almost all the time, at least at minimum 98% of the time. So we have a high faculty buy-in for the system so that we give the students the support they need.

HOST LETICIA MALDONADO (15:27):

As a follow-up to that, if you could just share a little bit about how the student voice was incorporated into the redesign.

HOST DANA POOLE, EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR (15:35):

The students come to student Success, and so students know me, I don't even know how I know Omar, but I know Omar, I know all my students. I could be anywhere and they know me. And so I talk to students. And so whenever students give me information, I listen and I bring those back into those meetings that I have. I always try to speak from that student perspective so that their voice is heard. And I think that's the role that we have in student success and retention. We're their first stop shop. Like Omar said, he came in through trio, that's a program that we work with as well. And so he had people in that area that he was able to talk to specifically that were first gen students, but we were giving them strategies. He may not have known it came from Student Success, but we were over, they teach the courses the first year course that we have and we collaborate and work together.

(16:28):

So in everything, student success, particularly in that office, we are the voice of the students. The students, they come to us, they tell us everything, everything. And so I try to do my best. My team, they try to do the best. They'll communicate to me because they know that when Dr. Ward calls her meetings in person, not on Zoom, that I'll be at the table. And so I can speak for those students and I think that's an important reason to why student success is a part of those meetings so that I can communicate that information for the student. Dana's saying that she is the voice

DR. FARAH WARD, PROVOST (17:02):

Of students is 100% accurate because she will tell us exactly what the students are saying and then we react for that. And they know, again, I don't know how she knows Omar or either, but they know. And we redesign one of the buildings, they were, I don't know where you are, what building you are in at first, but we designed a whole building Moore Hall on campus and it houses her whole unit. It used to be an academic building for social and behavior sciences, but now it houses student success, it houses the honors program, study abroad, undergraduate research. So we put it all in a building and there's a little hangout. This is one day when we were looking for Omar, we call it the garage. It has a garage door. He was over there,

HOST DANA POOLE, EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR (17:49):

Laid

DR. FARAH WARD, PROVOST (17:49):

Out, laid out, knocked out. But it's a hangout spot and that's how we design it right there where the advisors are right there where the Office of Retention is right there where study abroad and learning about experiences. So it was intentional. And I tell you, it is kind of good to hear. I was happy to hear that Omar was hanging out in the garage area,

STUDENT OMAR RICHARDSON (18:10):

Ms. Pool. I actually didn't know that you guys were feeding TRIO information, so thank you. Thank you. Thank you so

HOST LETICIA MALDONADO (18:17):

Much.

HOST DANA POOLE, EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR (18:18):

Absolutely.

HOST LETICIA MALDONADO (19:09):

Great, thank you. Now if were us housed under the Office of Student Success and Retention, which was established as part of the campus wide redesigns, Dan, can you tell us a little bit more about the Office since you oversee it and the role that it has played in enhancing student success?

HOST DANA POOLE, EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR (19:26):

So the Office of Student Success and Retention, it centralizes first year advising. We provide support to transfer and returning students. It's also the academic hub of support on campus. The office supports retention initiatives through collaborations with departments and other campus partners. And so prior to its inception instead of the Office of Student Success and Retention, it was just the Office of General studies and this office was housed by specialists who taught developmental courses. So all the advising prior to this was done by major advisors and we would just assist the specialists. I was one of those specialists. We would assist with helping students get to their ge, these 48 GE credits that they needed. And so one day Dr. Ward came along and was like, Hey, stop. This is new, do this. And so she just came over and we're like, but we had training and things, but I'm going to let her tell that part of the story of the day of stop. Let's redirect.

DR. FARAH WARD, PROVOST (20:22):

Yeah, I reflect back on that. I almost remember, I don't remember vividly that day, but I definitely remember that time of redirect. And so Dana talked about how they used to be called Department of General Studies and they used to teach developmental courses. And so the system office and the board of governors had said that no longer will developmental courses be taught at four year universities if individual needed a developmental course, they were to go to a community college. And so again, painting the pictures, this was the time when we were losing faculty, we were losing staff. And so at that time, Dana's office, the specialist would've went away because they no longer had a need to teach. We no longer had a need to teach any developmental courses. But it was during this, you went back and asked how did we evolve? And of course I talked about the journey to one 20 for 120 credits and things like that.

(21:19):

But it was at that time that I thought, how could we create an office to really support students, which was really needed. And so again, we were receiving some funding and so we created the Office of Student Success and Retention, and it was important that we kept key staff. So we knew that the staff, again, of course every staff is important, but we knew that that office had done so much. They had already had so much experience working with our students. And so instead of letting them, allowing them to lose their job, we really restructure. We had to get them training, but they became the Office of Student Success and Retention. So it's almost like a little baby that was born and that we gave birth to, and now it's a full grown adult, well, maybe not an adult, maybe about 25. Okay. Almost a young adult. A young adult. A young adult. But again, I remember birthing it as from this inception. So that's interesting. And she thinks of it. I just showed up one day, but there was a lot of behind it. But that was the really idea,

HOST DANA POOLE, EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR (22:26):

Right? And like I said, it was a redirection and it was a hard time. There were a lot of staff that were with me that were let go and laid off. And like Dr. Ward has said, there were key positions that remain because I remember becoming, I was a math specialist, so I was taught one of those developmental courses, and I became the coordinator for tutorial services. And so that's something that we still have today in the Office of Student Success and Retention. But the office now is, again, so much more we do, we work with students with their curriculum. So now a part of that redesign was like she stated the one 20, but now students have curriculum balance sheets, and they have plans to study. So we make sure that they understand that. I say we say 15 to finish, or sometime I say 15 and eight and you'll be great.

(23:14):

That's what I tell my students, 15 eight and you'll be great or go be great is what I say. You got to leave. But those are the things that we do in student success. We push those students to get to graduation completion. We work with departments. I know even this morning I was collaborating with department chairs and we were talking about how we can use our at-risk information to help build their programs so that they can make changes. And so no longer is that information just housed in one space. We actively work with our department so that we can give the best resources and support to our students because maybe if everybody's at risk in this class, maybe it's not the student. And so we use the data that we're collecting with that system inside of OSSR. And so a culmination of all these things have led to the increase in student success to shared by our provost ward.

HOST LETICIA MALDONADO (24:06):

Wow. I love what I'm hearing because I think there was a lot of pivoting, a lot of creative thinking of how can we repurpose certain infrastructures that we already have and do it in a way that focuses on our student success. I also see a lot of intentionality and commitment to avoid layoffs if possible, and to really keep the staff. So that's great. Thank you for sharing that. Omar. I would love to turn to you and get your student perspective. So for our listeners, we did a prep call before today's podcast, and one of my favorite things of that call was Omar sharing how he met Dr. Ward. So Omar, I'm going to turn to you and ask you a couple of things. One is if you could share a little bit more about your student experience at Elizabeth City and how it has impacted your life. And then of course, to please share the story of how you met Dr. Ward.

STUDENT OMAR RICHARDSON (25:08):

Okay. I'll share the story of how I met Dr. Ward just simply because I'll never forget this. So context. I just received the scholarship to study abroad in Costa Rica For that summer. I was just returning and I was heading back into the routine of football workout. Summer camp was here, and I'm walking back from the cafeteria and as I'm walking, I hear a car go by, welcome back on. We're glad to have you. And now mind you, I've never heard this voice a day in my life, never seen this card. So I'm like, who in the world was that? I had no idea. And then come to find later, what was it? It was like two or three months later. Yeah, we ended up at an event, I think it was

DR. FARAH WARD, PROVOST (25:55):

A chancellor, it was a

STUDENT OMAR RICHARDSON (25:56):

Chancellor's event. And then I ended up meeting Dr. Ward. She was like, yeah, that was me yelling at you that day. We're so proud of you. And I was like, oh, nice to meet you, Dr. Ward. I will never forget it.

DR. FARAH WARD, PROVOST (26:09):

And now I'm going to let him go back to telling about himself. But I will say that day I remember, I vividly remember. And so this just talks about ECSU. So the reason I knew Omar is because at board of trustees, we were really focusing on all our students who study abroad again years ago that had law. When we lost enrollment, like study abroad was not on our radar, but we really began to focus on it. Our director of international programs really began to focus. And so I had just done a board of trustees presentation and Omar's picture was on it. And so I remembered all the students. So when I saw him, and I didn't even think this person probably has no idea who I am, so the fact that he remembers that day is just priceless for me.

STUDENT OMAR RICHARDSON (26:56):

I will never forget that day for as long as I live. But no, that kind of just going back into the first question you asked me, that's just a testament of what this community has been for me. I can't tell you how many times teachers, professors, staff on this campus has looked out for me in anything I needed, whether that's student trio services. I'm also a first generation student, so my very first semester I was very much in communication with them. Never been any of my family members have never been to college. So this was not only new for me, but this was new for them as well. So I took full advantage of that student support service group and that trio center that they had anything from pencils to somebody to just talk to about being away from home, being homesick, my grades, how I'm going to get this D up, I'm here today. I didn't think I was going to make it. I thought my mom was going to kill me to this day. I thought I was gone talking to them and just giving me a plan to actually work back and how I'm going to fix this. And I can't even tell you. I still go to barbershops out here. And that's just the community part that was so great for me and that was so essential to why I decided to come back and do my graduate program as well.

HOST LETICIA MALDONADO (28:15):

Thank you, Omar. Now going back to what you just mentioned. So you graduated with a bachelor's in aviation science with a concentration in management from ECSU. And now you're working on your master's in education with a concentration in elementary education also at ECSU, right?

STUDENT OMAR RICHARDSON (28:31):

Yes, ma'am. That's correct.

HOST LETICIA MALDONADO (28:32):

Now what inspired you to stay?

STUDENT OMAR RICHARDSON (28:36):

What inspired me to stay the people in the community, the support that I knew I would have by staying. Those were two of the obvious reasons. And of course me being able to play football was just the cherry on top.

HOST LETICIA MALDONADO (29:35):

Now, Dr. Ward, I'm going to go back to you for a second. So looking back at everything that you have accomplished as an institution ELIMINATE LONG PAUSE in the last 10 years, what do you think has really gotten you to where you are today?

DR. FARAH WARD, PROVOST (30:10):

As I think about it, it really is about the people. And the one thing about higher ed institutions, no matter where you are, 90% of the time, they'll tell you people work in silos. And trust me when I say we do not have everything figured out here at ECSU, but the one thing I will say that we are committed to and it's what saved the institution when the community rallied together, and it's what has helped us progress. And that is we work together. Just a few months ago when we were working on fall enrollment, and again, we saw a 4.4% increase in enrollment, just have to throw that part out there, but we had an enrollment strategy meeting.

(31:09):

And so in this meeting when you look around, there are people from athletics, from housing admissions, financial aid, bursar's office, office of Student Success and Retention Distance Education, the graduate program, it really is everyone across the university as well as vice chancellors. I'm in there, vice chancellor of student affairs, business finance, the athletic director. We understand that to move things sometimes it really takes everyone in the room. I often say the student doesn't know whether or not this person they're talking to is in the division of student affairs or academic affairs. They have no knowledge who financial aid reports too. They don't know if it's academics or business. They're not thinking about that.

(32:12):

And so since we're all here to support the success of the student, what has helped us is that we all get in a room together. We work together. And then I would say that the second thing as far as the secret sauce is really our dedication to continuous improvement. We are happy of what we have accomplished, but what we know is that we still have issues to address. And so we always on. Okay, well that's good. I know the team probably looks at me crazy because I'm not a big celebrator. I know that's important. And so we hit it rolling and I'm very happy. The team has worked hard. I congratulate everyone and I'm so thankful. But at the end of the day, it's like, okay, well what could we have done better? What do we need to focus? How can we improve? How can we retain more students? How can we make sure that our students are being successful? What loop holds do we need to address or feel? And so I think those two things are really what is the secret sauce working together and then this dedication to understanding that it's never finished. There's always places that we as a university can improve.

HOST LETICIA MALDONADO (33:25):

Thank you. Now you mentioned something earlier that I want to ask you to elaborate on and is, you mentioned that you had a difficult rollout when you were initially redesigning, but despite having a difficult rollout in 2014, that in 2015 you tried it again. So how did that happen? What led you to want to try it again? Because I think a lot of an audience will relate to that.

(36:52):

And so DegreeWorks, which I didn't talk about, we launched during that time. I led that initiative and we launched during that time degree audit systems. We know the benefits that degree audit systems can have. We launched it, we used it and then we stopped. We still had it, but it just was not being utilized. We are just relaunching that system again. Last spring we launched it. So that's just an example that everything will not work out the first time. But if you understand how a system will help your students, you do have to stick with it. And you may have to again, go circle back. It's not going to always be seamless the first time something comes out. And so those two things are examples of how you can get something and it may not work and you may have to revisit again. And as an administrator, I understand how things get cut and it's so hard because again, I have to approve the actual requisitions on how much we're spending on these pieces of software.

(37:57):

So I get when you're in tough times, why things get cut. But I think that one thing I would say is that sometimes things don't work. And what you have to do is go back and figure out what went wrong and how can we kind of relaunch it the second time. But we're all in on degree works this time, so we are we rolling it out to the students during the fall semester. So the faculty are trained, they're utilizing it, we're putting it in our advising as requirements. And that's the thing that I think we learned about E for U now is we have figured out how to institutionalize stuff. It's harder to get rid of something when it's now part of our culture, early alerts that faculty just do that. They know that we're having them, so they use E for U. You don't have to think about it. So to cut a program like that at this time would devastate our canvas.

HOST LETICIA MALDONADO (38:47):

Wow, thank you so much. And again, I think a lot of our listeners are going to relate to what you're sharing. II'm hearing the creativity and commitment to pivot and to listen to your faculty, to listen to your staff and say, okay, where did we go wrong? What do you need to make your job easier? What kind of institutional barriers do we need to remove? And let's give it another shot. So Omar, I wanted to ask you a question because, we have leaders who listen to our podcast, but our hope is also to reach prospective students. Maybe students who are not sure if they want to go to college are not sure if it's for them or if they feel like maybe their parents didn't go to college, they might not feel prepared for it. So I would love to ask you, what would you say to those students

STUDENT OMAR RICHARDSON (39:54):

As far as picking colleges, find a college that suits you? So I would say from the aspect of Elizabeth City State, this town and community reminds me a lot of home. I stay about two hours away from here in Nashville, North Carolina. But it's a lot like here, a rural town, very close knit community. So when I left for college, it was pretty much a transition. I was just meeting different people, but same environment, close to the same environment for the people or the person who feel like they're not thinking about college because their parents didn't do it. If you feel like this is something that could change your life because at the end of the day you're in control of your life, your parents can only guide you with so much, but this is something that you want to do. Don't be afraid to step out of your comfort zone. You may not get it right the first time, but it's okay. Continue to grow and continue to learn and continue to try things, do things outside of the box.

HOST LETICIA MALDONADO (40:51):

Thank you very much. Anything else that any of you would like to add that I did not ask you?

DR. FARAH WARD, PROVOST (41:03): 

One thing I didn't talk about that was definitely a contributor to our decrease in enrollment was the instability of our chancellor. We had five chancellors in five years, and so our previous chancellor who had been here six years actually just departed the university. But she really did play a pivotal role in helping us as well, the consistency of leadership. And so even though of course we're talking about higher ed, as I think about individuals and how they stabilize the campus, that actually helped as well for stabilizing,

HOST DANA POOLE, EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR (41:41):

Right? And what I was going to say is I jokingly said Dr. Ward likes her meetings in person instead on Zoom. But I appreciate being at the table. I feel like we get more done at the table in person so I can see you, I can see your body language. One of the things that ECSU has afforded students as well as staff, like myself, I'm now a Gallup certified coach. We had a partnership with Thurgood Marshall. And so they paid for a couple of students to go and get this expensive training students and staff. And we are able to now have those students coach their peers on their strengths. And so the students are given the strength assessment and so the students are able to do the coaching. And so I say all that to say we had a meeting and also faculty have done this coaching.

(42:33):

And I know Dr. Ward, one of her strengths is restorative. And I would say that she's absolutely restorative, right? She will, when we think all is awry, she will find a way to see everybody's point of view and put it all together. And so I appreciate that strength that she has. And like she said, leadership was an issue. And so it does play a role. And so I fall under, I'm in academic affairs, so I do fall under provost ward and I've told her often I will follow you. And there's a video that I often use about leadership.

(43:10):

It's not like the leader, it's about the follower, right? The follower starts to spark the leader sets the tone, and as long as somebody sees that the leader is doing right, people will begin to follow. And so I've told Dr. I will follow her. So she's a mathematician. I'm also a mathematician. I think she got one up on me, so I'm about the number. And again, I appreciate that she's about the number because I know sometimes it is a number thing. But again, just about the people and listening. And so I think that as long as the institution and those in leadership continue to listen to those, and I felt it was important, I always feel it's important to bring the student's voice into the situation, right? Because we're on the ground working with those students. But again, I can't do anything if that leadership is not there for me to share what those students need.

HOST LETICIA MALDONADO (44:53):

I have a follow-up question for you, Omar. What would you say to leaders of higher education in terms of the impact that they can have on students based on your experience with Dr. Ward and your experience at ECSU?

STUDENT OMAR RICHARDSON (45:16):

I think that's just her being who she was.  And just her being who she is, her being her authentic self was the reason why our relationship grew. I would definitely say getting outside the office and actually talking to your students, and whether that's the calf or them heading the class or even at a football game, that's where you'll see majority of your students anyways, just talk to them. You will find out a lot about students just listening to them talk and just taking a genuine interest in them. We understand that you guys have a lot to worry about, but the students at the end of the day are the most important aspect of a college. So just taking the genuine interest in them and they'll open up like a flower

DR. FARAH WARD, PROVOST (46:04):

That done got me emotional. Can I get my words? Lemme get some water. Oh my goodness. It really is. I think I would say that it really is about how can we make a difference. I think that as a leader, one of the things I think about when I went from chair and then administration associate vice chancellor is the higher you get, the further you get away from the students. And if you allow yourself to get far away from the students, you will forget what it's like and who you're really doing the work for. And so one of the things I am definitely conscious about, because it's my fuel, I tell chair, the department chair is a good position. You still kind of teach. But where I am, I can go days without seeing students. And so because of that, I understand the importance of figuring out ways to connect with them. I'm at the volleyball games, losing my voice, yelling. I saw Omar at the football game literally, this was just two weeks ago.

STUDENT OMAR RICHARDSON (47:19):

You took a picture of,

DR. FARAH WARD, PROVOST (47:19):

I took a picture of him. We were singing the star spanked banner, right? I saw him. We locked eyes before he went out on the field because I know him. And so I find ways, and I think that this is what I would say is very important for administrators, provosts, and chancellors to find ways to connect with students, one of course to hear their voice. And two, so you can constantly be reminded why you do the work, why you work the long hours, why you are pouring the resources in every student matters. And so that's what I definitely take a conscious effort to do, and it's what fuels me and reminds me. And if you allow yourself, you can sit on the third floor in a building and never see students, but you'll forget why you're doing the work. And so I make a conscious effort to stay connected so I don't forget.

HOST LETICIA MALDONADO (48:14):

Okay, so we are approaching the end of our segment, and I would love to hear any final thoughts that you would like to share. And Omar, I would love to start with you, then I'll turn to you, Dana, and we will end with you. Dr. Ward,

STUDENT OMAR RICHARDSON (48:31):

I just wanted to let ECSU how thankful I am for the school and the opportunities that I was afforded because of it, even just from a football standpoint. Wasn't really highly recruited when I came out of high school, but I ended up walking onto the football team here. And for that opportunity, if nothing else, I'm always grateful. But not only that, I've been given a church community. I've been given friends and faculty that I will cherish forever, and I'm a part of the community. And for that, I'm forever grateful.

HOST DANA POOLE, EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR (49:04): 

As for me, I will say I'm an alumna of the institution. I came on campus as a freshman in fall of 2000 and now been an employee for 19 years, actually a little longer if you count my part-time, jobs I had as a student. But even then, I will say when I was on campus, I had a child during my junior year and a program that I was working in, I was working fast food, and that coordinator asked me to be her admin. She would even allow me to bring the baby in. And so the support that I've received from the institution, the opportunities I got to travel with the institution. I don't think Omar shared when he did, he talked about his journey to Costa Rica. I think that was his first time out of the country. Those opportunities, like little old Elizabeth City State, ECSU, it supported a lot of students, those opportunities.

(50:00):

And so a lot of the things and experiences that I've got, I had as a student at ECSU. And so I've been here through those challenges, like just hearing Dr. Ward saying that she had to make those decisions. And I'm so grateful that I got to stay. And I think that it speaks to the institution. The people at the institution, they care. It could have been a number and we could have all been gone during that time. But people, they listen to you. The senior administration in particular, they listen to you. Sometimes that listening ends up you ending up on the committee, but they really listen to what you're saying because they know where you are. They trust you to be the experts in the areas that you're in and expect you to give them that information that they need so they can make those hard decisions. My parents both went to college and graduated, but by the time I got into college, they were not in the best situation. And so a lot of the things that for college came to me, even though I had these people who you would assume would know what to do, I had to navigate that on my own as well. And so for those listeners who I know, sometimes we assume that if you're not first gen, you understand and know ECSU is a school from day one. That's why the enrollment team is so special. We communicate and talk to each other, so anybody at any level can come in and be successful. And so that's another thing that I pride my institu on because it is my institution. I bleed blue all day.

DR. FARAH WARD, PROVOST (51:22):

And I think as I close, I think I probably have five key takeaways after I think about it. I don't have time often to think about how far we as an institution have come. But the first thing I would say is it is really important to take time to understand the problems at your particular institution and to address those. There are a lot of solutions out there, and of course there's a benefit from learning from others, but you really do have to think about yourself. And there's very few things in this higher ed realm that are cookie cutter that you can take directly from another institution. You really have to tailor any specific thing. The second thing I would say is doing something is always better than doing nothing at all. And you really can't let perfect be the enemy of good. And so I'm always very transparent about things, not always going well, because I think it's important that people don't think that, oh, we launched that and everything worked well.

(52:27):

I often like to talk about things that didn't go wrong because you tend to learn so much during those times. The third thing I would say is that data and technology are only half the battle. If you're going to have real true reform, you have to get the people buy in and on board the technology of E four U, it didn't change that much. It was really about how can we inspire, motivate, persuade the actual faculty and staff about the importance and what effect this is going to have. Number four, if I would say, don't obsess about the goal. Again, I know, and Dana will tell you, I'm a mathematician, so I know every number. I know what retention rate. I know what our goals are at all times. We're trying to get a 78% freshman retention rate by next year. We're at 76.9. So I always know the goal, but that can't be just the sole motivator.

(53:25):

If the motivation is really about how can we improve, how can we make sure students are getting away their need? I thoroughly believe that if that is what you're focused on, the outcomes will come. And it's not linear. It is not going. And they don't tell you, last year we had a dipping retention rate, but they came back, we figured out what it was, and I'm really confident that we'll meet our strategic plan goal to get to 78%. But you can't just obsess about that because that's not how student success works. These are people, students are people. And so don't always, every cohort doesn't act exactly like the previous cohort. And so there will be things that'll change. And then lastly, and this is something I say often, and it's something that I live by and that is student success is a marathon. It is not a sprint. And so you cannot be in it for just thinking that everything is going to turn around. Looking back at our success, yes, but this is six years, eight years in the making of where we are right now. This was not an overnight. We were down last year and we're up this year. That's not how this story goes. And so student success is a marathon, not a sprint. And my final thought is that the marathon will always continue.

HOST LETICIA MALDONADO (54:44):

Well, thank you so much to the three of you. It has been an honor and such a pleasure to chat with you, and I'm just so excited that we finally got a chance to have you join our podcast. I'm really excited for our audience to listen to your remarkable story, your takeaways, and the lessons that you have learned throughout your journey. So thank you for being with us today.

HOST DANA POOLE, EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR (55:10):

Thank

STUDENT OMAR RICHARDSON (55:10):

You. Thank you. Thank you for having us.

HOST LETICIA MALDONADO (55:17):

This has been the Ask You Telling Our Story podcast. As we continue this series, we will share more stories from Ask You and ITS members who have taken bold steps to successfully support underserved students and their communities. Please get the word out about this important work by sharing this podcast with colleagues, teachers, students, family and friends. It's available on Spotify, apple, and many other podcast platforms. If you are an ASQ member with a promising practice you wish to share, please visit asq telling a story.org. Thank you for listening. Until next time.