{"version":"1.0.0","segments":[{"speaker":"David 00","startTime":0.0,"endTime":0.8,"body":"00"},{"speaker":"David 00","startTime":0.8,"endTime":5.2,"body":"[Cities 1.5 Main Theme plays] I'm"},{"speaker":"David 00","startTime":0.8,"endTime":5.2,"body":"David Miller and you're listening"},{"speaker":"David 00","startTime":5.2,"endTime":9.6,"body":"to Cities 1.5, a podcast about"},{"speaker":"David 00","startTime":5.2,"endTime":9.6,"body":"how climate leaders are driving"},{"speaker":"David 00","startTime":9.6,"endTime":11.6,"body":"global change through local action."},{"speaker":"David 00","startTime":11.6,"endTime":16.4,"body":"[urgent music] Heading into the COP28"},{"speaker":"David 00","startTime":11.6,"endTime":16.4,"body":"UN Climate Change Conference last fall,"},{"speaker":"David 00","startTime":16.4,"endTime":19.2,"body":"the world teetered on a knife edge."},{"speaker":"David 00","startTime":19.2,"endTime":25.6,"body":"Hopes for a positive outcome were low when"},{"speaker":"David 00","startTime":19.2,"endTime":25.6,"body":"it was announced that it would be held"},{"speaker":"David 00","startTime":25.6,"endTime":30.8,"body":"in the United Arab Emirates, a petrostate"},{"speaker":"David 00","startTime":25.6,"endTime":30.8,"body":"whose economy is heavily dependent on"},{"speaker":"David 00","startTime":30.8,"endTime":34.0,"body":"the extraction and export of oil and gas."},{"speaker":"David 00","startTime":34.0,"endTime":38.8,"body":"As the conference unfolded, the record"},{"speaker":"David 00","startTime":34.0,"endTime":38.8,"body":"numbers of fossil fuel lobbyists in"},{"speaker":"David 00","startTime":38.8,"endTime":43.2,"body":"attendance drew the ire of climate"},{"speaker":"David 00","startTime":38.8,"endTime":43.2,"body":"activists from across the globe."},{"speaker":"David 00","startTime":43.2,"endTime":47.2,"body":"Many prominent climate figures and"},{"speaker":"David 00","startTime":43.2,"endTime":47.2,"body":"key players were conspicuously absent,"},{"speaker":"David 00","startTime":47.2,"endTime":52.4,"body":"thinking that it wouldn't be worth"},{"speaker":"David 00","startTime":47.2,"endTime":52.4,"body":"the effort or the emissions to attend."},{"speaker":"David 00","startTime":52.4,"endTime":56.8,"body":"Despite these obstacles and misgivings,"},{"speaker":"David 00","startTime":52.4,"endTime":56.8,"body":"COP28 ended with an historic first."},{"speaker":"David 00","startTime":56.8,"endTime":60.8,"body":"After dramatic, intense negotiations"},{"speaker":"David 00","startTime":56.8,"endTime":60.8,"body":"lasting deep into the night, a"},{"speaker":"David 00","startTime":60.8,"endTime":65.2,"body":"road map to transition away from"},{"speaker":"David 00","startTime":60.8,"endTime":65.2,"body":"dirty energy was agreed upon."},{"speaker":"David 00","startTime":65.2,"endTime":70.0,"body":"Could the end of the fossil fuel"},{"speaker":"David 00","startTime":65.2,"endTime":70.0,"body":"era finally be within reach?"},{"speaker":"David 00","startTime":70.0,"endTime":71.2,"body":"[music fades out]"},{"speaker":"David 00","startTime":71.2,"endTime":76.4,"body":"[gentle, delicate music] COP28 also saw"},{"speaker":"David 00","startTime":71.2,"endTime":76.4,"body":"the first global stocktake of the 194"},{"speaker":"David 00","startTime":76.4,"endTime":81.2,"body":"national governing bodies and the European"},{"speaker":"David 00","startTime":76.4,"endTime":81.2,"body":"Union, who adopted the Paris Agreement."},{"speaker":"David 00","startTime":81.2,"endTime":86.0,"body":"In 2016, the parties all vowed to"},{"speaker":"David 00","startTime":81.2,"endTime":86.0,"body":"meet targets which mitigated emissions"},{"speaker":"David 00","startTime":86.0,"endTime":88.0,"body":"and adapted to climate impacts."},{"speaker":"David 00","startTime":88.0,"endTime":93.6,"body":"Achieving these goals is vital if the"},{"speaker":"David 00","startTime":88.0,"endTime":93.6,"body":"world is to keep global heating under"},{"speaker":"David 00","startTime":93.6,"endTime":95.6,"body":"1.5˚C degrees above pre-industrial levels."},{"speaker":"David 00","startTime":95.6,"endTime":96.4,"body":"The result?"},{"speaker":"David 00","startTime":96.4,"endTime":99.2,"body":"The parties nationally-determined"},{"speaker":"David 00","startTime":96.4,"endTime":99.2,"body":"contributions are woefully lacking."},{"speaker":"David 00","startTime":99.2,"endTime":102.4,"body":"The world is officially"},{"speaker":"David 00","startTime":99.2,"endTime":102.4,"body":"and dangerously off track."},{"speaker":"David 00","startTime":102.4,"endTime":108.0,"body":"[upbeat, energetic music] For the first"},{"speaker":"David 00","startTime":102.4,"endTime":108.0,"body":"time ever, cities and their mayors had a"},{"speaker":"David 00","startTime":108.0,"endTime":112.8,"body":"seat at the table at COP28, solidifying"},{"speaker":"David 00","startTime":108.0,"endTime":112.8,"body":"their status as climate leaders."},{"speaker":"David 00","startTime":112.8,"endTime":117.2,"body":"Over 70 countries committed to"},{"speaker":"David 00","startTime":112.8,"endTime":117.2,"body":"working with local leaders on the"},{"speaker":"David 00","startTime":117.2,"endTime":120.0,"body":"next round of nationally-determined"},{"speaker":"David 00","startTime":117.2,"endTime":120.0,"body":"contributions for 2025."},{"speaker":"David 00","startTime":120.0,"endTime":125.2,"body":"75% of C40 cities, many of whom"},{"speaker":"David 00","startTime":120.0,"endTime":125.2,"body":"were present at COP, are reducing"},{"speaker":"David 00","startTime":125.2,"endTime":128.0,"body":"emissions faster than their"},{"speaker":"David 00","startTime":125.2,"endTime":128.0,"body":"respective national governments."},{"speaker":"David 00","startTime":128.0,"endTime":134.0,"body":"While the actions of cities and mayors"},{"speaker":"David 00","startTime":128.0,"endTime":134.0,"body":"from across the world give all of us"},{"speaker":"David 00","startTime":134.0,"endTime":139.6,"body":"hope for the future of our planet, more"},{"speaker":"David 00","startTime":134.0,"endTime":139.6,"body":"is needed from national governments and"},{"speaker":"David 00","startTime":139.6,"endTime":145.6,"body":"industry if we are to avert catastrophic"},{"speaker":"David 00","startTime":139.6,"endTime":145.6,"body":"outcomes such as the collapse of polar ice"},{"speaker":"David 00","startTime":145.6,"endTime":151.2,"body":"sheets, fatal health impacts of dirty air,"},{"speaker":"David 00","startTime":145.6,"endTime":151.2,"body":"and the ravages of storms and wildfires."},{"speaker":"David 00","startTime":151.2,"endTime":154.0,"body":"The window for action"},{"speaker":"David 00","startTime":151.2,"endTime":154.0,"body":"is rapidly shrinking."},{"speaker":"David 00","startTime":154.0,"endTime":160.4,"body":"Now that the dust has settled from COP28,"},{"speaker":"David 00","startTime":154.0,"endTime":160.4,"body":"we're just over five years away from the"},{"speaker":"David 00","startTime":160.4,"endTime":162.4,"body":"next crucial climate deadline – 2030."},{"speaker":"David 00","startTime":162.4,"endTime":165.6,"body":"So, where exactly does"},{"speaker":"David 00","startTime":162.4,"endTime":165.6,"body":"the world currently stand?"},{"speaker":"David 00","startTime":165.6,"endTime":166.8,"body":"[music fades out]"},{"speaker":"David 00","startTime":166.8,"endTime":171.6,"body":"[upbeat electronic music] In today's"},{"speaker":"David 00","startTime":166.8,"endTime":171.6,"body":"episode, we'll hear how one of the"},{"speaker":"David 00","startTime":171.6,"endTime":175.2,"body":"world's leading human ecologists is"},{"speaker":"David 00","startTime":171.6,"endTime":175.2,"body":"rethinking humanity's densest habitats,"},{"speaker":"David 00","startTime":175.2,"endTime":179.6,"body":"how net-zero innovations are transforming"},{"speaker":"David 00","startTime":175.2,"endTime":179.6,"body":"the places we live into sustainable"},{"speaker":"David 00","startTime":179.6,"endTime":184.4,"body":"eco-cities, and how the world can avoid"},{"speaker":"David 00","startTime":179.6,"endTime":184.4,"body":"triggering deadly climate tipping points."},{"speaker":"David 00","startTime":184.4,"endTime":189.6,"body":"But first, let's get the inside story"},{"speaker":"David 00","startTime":184.4,"endTime":189.6,"body":"on the progress and influence cities"},{"speaker":"David 00","startTime":189.6,"endTime":195.6,"body":"and mayors had at COP 28, and what"},{"speaker":"David 00","startTime":189.6,"endTime":195.6,"body":"the coming years might hold for the"},{"speaker":"David 00","startTime":195.6,"endTime":198.0,"body":"world's urban centres and their leaders."},{"speaker":"David 00","startTime":198.0,"endTime":199.2,"body":"[music fades out]"},{"speaker":"David 00","startTime":199.2,"endTime":203.2,"body":"[rotary dial telephone rings]"},{"speaker":"David 00","startTime":199.2,"endTime":203.2,"body":"[clicks] Hello I am Mark Watts."},{"speaker":"David 00","startTime":203.2,"endTime":208.8,"body":"I am the Executive Director of C40"},{"speaker":"David 00","startTime":203.2,"endTime":208.8,"body":"Cities and I am dialling in today"},{"speaker":"David 00","startTime":208.8,"endTime":211.2,"body":"from the wonderful city of London."},{"speaker":"David 00","startTime":211.2,"endTime":213.2,"body":"[receiver chimes, replaced in cradle]"},{"speaker":"David 04","startTime":213.2,"endTime":214.0,"body":"07"},{"speaker":"David 04","startTime":214.0,"endTime":219.6,"body":"Mark Watts has served as the Executive"},{"speaker":"David 04","startTime":214.0,"endTime":219.6,"body":"Director at C40 for over a decade."},{"speaker":"David 04","startTime":219.6,"endTime":224.4,"body":"Under his tenure, C40 has led"},{"speaker":"David 04","startTime":219.6,"endTime":224.4,"body":"the way through being the first"},{"speaker":"David 04","startTime":224.4,"endTime":228.4,"body":"organization of governments to"},{"speaker":"David 04","startTime":224.4,"endTime":228.4,"body":"adopt the 1.5°C target, which aims"},{"speaker":"David 04","startTime":228.4,"endTime":230.8,"body":"to halve global emissions by 2030."},{"speaker":"David 04","startTime":230.8,"endTime":234.0,"body":"By increasing coalition building"},{"speaker":"David 04","startTime":230.8,"endTime":234.0,"body":"with civil movements, unions,"},{"speaker":"David 04","startTime":234.0,"endTime":238.0,"body":"businesses, and youth climate"},{"speaker":"David 04","startTime":234.0,"endTime":238.0,"body":"leaders, Mark and C40 have delivered"},{"speaker":"David 04","startTime":238.0,"endTime":240.4,"body":"both bold ambition and bold action."},{"speaker":"David 04","startTime":240.4,"endTime":241.2,"body":"[music ends]"},{"speaker":"David 04","startTime":241.2,"endTime":243.2,"body":"Mark, welcome to Cities 1.5."},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 04","startTime":243.2,"endTime":244.4,"body":"41"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 04","startTime":244.4,"endTime":244.8,"body":"Hello."},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 04","startTime":244.8,"endTime":246.4,"body":"Delighted to be joining."},{"speaker":"David 04","startTime":246.4,"endTime":247.2,"body":"44"},{"speaker":"David 04","startTime":247.2,"endTime":252.0,"body":"Can you just tell our listeners"},{"speaker":"David 04","startTime":247.2,"endTime":252.0,"body":"a little bit about yourself, your"},{"speaker":"David 04","startTime":252.0,"endTime":256.4,"body":"background, and what inspired you"},{"speaker":"David 04","startTime":252.0,"endTime":256.4,"body":"to work in the climate sector?"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 04","startTime":256.4,"endTime":257.6,"body":"52"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 04","startTime":257.6,"endTime":262.8,"body":"The true answer for how I got"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 04","startTime":257.6,"endTime":262.8,"body":"involved in working on the climate"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 04","startTime":262.8,"endTime":265.6,"body":"crisis is because I was told to."},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 04","startTime":265.6,"endTime":271.6,"body":"My then-boss, the then-mayor of London,"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 04","startTime":265.6,"endTime":271.6,"body":"Ken Livingstone, I used to do a thing for"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 04","startTime":271.6,"endTime":278.0,"body":"him when I was one of his researchers;"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 04","startTime":271.6,"endTime":278.0,"body":"I would take books away at the weekend"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 04","startTime":278.0,"endTime":284.4,"body":"that he didn't have time to read and"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 04","startTime":278.0,"endTime":284.4,"body":"then give him a précis on them and,"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 04","startTime":284.4,"endTime":290.0,"body":"one weekend, he gave me Jared Diamond's"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 04","startTime":284.4,"endTime":290.0,"body":"book, Collapse, to read, which is an"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 04","startTime":290.0,"endTime":294.0,"body":"anthropological study of how civilizations"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 04","startTime":290.0,"endTime":294.0,"body":"throughout history have either survived"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 04","startTime":294.0,"endTime":299.2,"body":"or failed, depending on whether they could"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 04","startTime":294.0,"endTime":299.2,"body":"live in harmony with their environment."},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 04","startTime":299.2,"endTime":304.4,"body":"I read that, summarized it, and I"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 04","startTime":299.2,"endTime":304.4,"body":"remember the mayor asking me, \"Are"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 04","startTime":304.4,"endTime":306.4,"body":"you terrified after reading that?\""},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 04","startTime":306.4,"endTime":308.0,"body":"and I said, \"Yes."},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 04","startTime":308.0,"endTime":308.4,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 04","startTime":308.4,"endTime":310.0,"body":"[chuckling] I really am."},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 04","startTime":310.0,"endTime":310.4,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 04","startTime":310.4,"endTime":315.6,"body":"This climate crisis thing seems a real"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 04","startTime":310.4,"endTime":315.6,"body":"problem,\" and then he said, \"Good."},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 04","startTime":315.6,"endTime":317.6,"body":"You're now my climate advisor.\""},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 04","startTime":317.6,"endTime":320.4,"body":"So, that's how I got into it."},{"speaker":"David 05","startTime":320.4,"endTime":321.2,"body":"36"},{"speaker":"David 05","startTime":321.2,"endTime":327.2,"body":"So, it does raise an issue that I"},{"speaker":"David 05","startTime":321.2,"endTime":327.2,"body":"hear often when I speak, Mark, or"},{"speaker":"David 05","startTime":327.2,"endTime":332.0,"body":"do a promotion session for my book,"},{"speaker":"David 05","startTime":327.2,"endTime":332.0,"body":"Solved; people say, \"Why cities?\""},{"speaker":"David 05","startTime":332.0,"endTime":337.6,"body":"You've been involved in this space"},{"speaker":"David 05","startTime":332.0,"endTime":337.6,"body":"as an advisor to one of the great"},{"speaker":"David 05","startTime":337.6,"endTime":343.2,"body":"mayors of one of the world's great"},{"speaker":"David 05","startTime":337.6,"endTime":343.2,"body":"cities, and now leading C40 as an"},{"speaker":"David 05","startTime":343.2,"endTime":348.0,"body":"organization of mayors of the world's"},{"speaker":"David 05","startTime":343.2,"endTime":348.0,"body":"greatest cities – nearly 100 of them."},{"speaker":"David 05","startTime":348.0,"endTime":350.4,"body":"Can you just speak to that?"},{"speaker":"David 05","startTime":350.4,"endTime":353.6,"body":"Why do cities matter to"},{"speaker":"David 05","startTime":350.4,"endTime":353.6,"body":"addressing climate change?"},{"speaker":"David 05","startTime":353.6,"endTime":356.4,"body":"And, in particular, why does C40 matter?"},{"speaker":"David 05","startTime":356.4,"endTime":357.6,"body":"Who is it?"},{"speaker":"David 05","startTime":357.6,"endTime":360.4,"body":"And why does it make a difference?"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 06","startTime":360.4,"endTime":361.6,"body":"11"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 06","startTime":361.6,"endTime":367.2,"body":"Well, you know, the obvious answer"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 06","startTime":361.6,"endTime":367.2,"body":"to that is just cities are where most"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 06","startTime":367.2,"endTime":372.0,"body":"people live and its most energy is"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 06","startTime":367.2,"endTime":372.0,"body":"consumed there, and they're where"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 06","startTime":372.0,"endTime":374.0,"body":"most carbon emissions are produced."},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 06","startTime":374.0,"endTime":378.8,"body":"But, actually, I think the more important"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 06","startTime":374.0,"endTime":378.8,"body":"thing—that more interesting thing, and"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 06","startTime":378.8,"endTime":384.8,"body":"certainly it is why C40 has an important"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 06","startTime":378.8,"endTime":384.8,"body":"role—is because the only way of tackling"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 06","startTime":384.8,"endTime":388.4,"body":"climate breakdown is through incredibly"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 06","startTime":384.8,"endTime":388.4,"body":"extensive global collaboration and"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 06","startTime":388.4,"endTime":391.2,"body":"cooperation that transcends political"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 06","startTime":388.4,"endTime":391.2,"body":"differences, geographic, cultural"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 06","startTime":391.2,"endTime":396.0,"body":"boundaries, and what the leaders of"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 06","startTime":391.2,"endTime":396.0,"body":"cities—the mayors of cities, the governors"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 06","startTime":396.0,"endTime":401.2,"body":"of cities—have really demonstrated a"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 06","startTime":396.0,"endTime":401.2,"body":"propensity to do over the last couple of"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 06","startTime":401.2,"endTime":406.8,"body":"decades is to build that type of global"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 06","startTime":401.2,"endTime":406.8,"body":"collaboration, to come together on a"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 06","startTime":406.8,"endTime":412.8,"body":"common problem of the climate crisis and"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 06","startTime":406.8,"endTime":412.8,"body":"not to compete with each other or wait"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 06","startTime":412.8,"endTime":419.2,"body":"for each other to go first and only be"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 06","startTime":412.8,"endTime":419.2,"body":"willing to do the difficult things if"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 06","startTime":419.2,"endTime":425.6,"body":"someone else has done it, but instead to"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 06","startTime":419.2,"endTime":425.6,"body":"help each other to all move much faster."},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 06","startTime":425.6,"endTime":431.2,"body":"And really, for me, the inspiring thing"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 06","startTime":425.6,"endTime":431.2,"body":"about working with mayors and the reason"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 06","startTime":431.2,"endTime":438.8,"body":"why I think C40 has got a big role to play"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 06","startTime":431.2,"endTime":438.8,"body":"is it shows what is possible, that could"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 06","startTime":438.8,"endTime":444.0,"body":"happen at other levels of government and"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 06","startTime":438.8,"endTime":444.0,"body":"across the private sector, across civil"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 06","startTime":444.0,"endTime":449.2,"body":"society, the way that we could collaborate"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 06","startTime":444.0,"endTime":449.2,"body":"globally to overcome the climate crisis."},{"speaker":"David 07","startTime":449.2,"endTime":450.0,"body":"23"},{"speaker":"David 07","startTime":450.0,"endTime":453.2,"body":"You've just come back from COP28 in Dubai."},{"speaker":"David 07","startTime":453.2,"endTime":458.8,"body":"Can you speak about that in the"},{"speaker":"David 07","startTime":453.2,"endTime":458.8,"body":"context of what you just said – that"},{"speaker":"David 07","startTime":458.8,"endTime":462.4,"body":"cities systematically have been"},{"speaker":"David 07","startTime":458.8,"endTime":462.4,"body":"collaborating, not saying, \"I'm not"},{"speaker":"David 07","startTime":462.4,"endTime":468.0,"body":"going to do anything until you do,\""},{"speaker":"David 07","startTime":462.4,"endTime":468.0,"body":"about saying, \"How do we do it?"},{"speaker":"David 07","startTime":468.0,"endTime":470.4,"body":"How do I learn from you?"},{"speaker":"David 07","startTime":470.4,"endTime":472.8,"body":"How do we address this challenge?”"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 07","startTime":472.8,"endTime":474.0,"body":"45"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 07","startTime":474.0,"endTime":481.2,"body":"It was a historic COP from the point of"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 07","startTime":474.0,"endTime":481.2,"body":"view of, I think, marking the start of a"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 07","startTime":481.2,"endTime":487.2,"body":"significant shift in who's at the table to"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 07","startTime":481.2,"endTime":487.2,"body":"make these annual climate talks a success."},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 07","startTime":487.2,"endTime":492.0,"body":"They've been set up to essentially"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 07","startTime":487.2,"endTime":492.0,"body":"be a negotiation between the national"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 07","startTime":492.0,"endTime":496.4,"body":"governments of the world and,"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 07","startTime":492.0,"endTime":496.4,"body":"frankly, without a lot of success."},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 07","startTime":496.4,"endTime":501.6,"body":"We've had a couple of moments – the"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 07","startTime":496.4,"endTime":501.6,"body":"original founding of the Paris Agreement."},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 07","startTime":501.6,"endTime":504.4,"body":"Hard to point to much else, really."},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 07","startTime":504.4,"endTime":508.0,"body":"Kind of slow, incremental negotiated"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 07","startTime":504.4,"endTime":508.0,"body":"progress for global solutions."},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 07","startTime":508.0,"endTime":514.4,"body":"What you saw at this COP was, for the"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 07","startTime":508.0,"endTime":514.4,"body":"first time, a major space being created"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 07","startTime":514.4,"endTime":520.4,"body":"inside the so-called \"blue zone\" – the"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 07","startTime":514.4,"endTime":520.4,"body":"place where you've got to have a pass to"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 07","startTime":520.4,"endTime":526.0,"body":"get in, to be alongside the presidents"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 07","startTime":520.4,"endTime":526.0,"body":"and the prime ministers and the ministers,"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 07","startTime":526.0,"endTime":532.0,"body":"a stage for mayors and for governors"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 07","startTime":526.0,"endTime":532.0,"body":"of regions, so states in the US, etc."},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 07","startTime":532.0,"endTime":537.2,"body":"I thought that really galvanized the"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 07","startTime":532.0,"endTime":537.2,"body":"whole process because you had a very"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 07","startTime":537.2,"endTime":541.2,"body":"big group—hundreds of powerful political"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 07","startTime":537.2,"endTime":541.2,"body":"leaders—who are really working together"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 07","startTime":541.2,"endTime":546.0,"body":"and very dynamically trying to bring down"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 07","startTime":541.2,"endTime":546.0,"body":"their emissions and achieve resilience"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 07","startTime":546.0,"endTime":550.4,"body":"against the ever-growing impacts of"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 07","startTime":546.0,"endTime":550.4,"body":"climate change without any mention of"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 07","startTime":550.4,"endTime":555.2,"body":"agreements, dots and commas, clauses"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 07","startTime":550.4,"endTime":555.2,"body":"in the right place – just talking about"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 07","startTime":555.2,"endTime":561.2,"body":"the action that they were taking and"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 07","startTime":555.2,"endTime":561.2,"body":"how they could move faster if they got"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 07","startTime":561.2,"endTime":566.4,"body":"greater support from each other, or"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 07","startTime":561.2,"endTime":566.4,"body":"if their finance was flowing in bigger"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 07","startTime":566.4,"endTime":569.6,"body":"and faster to the to the right places."},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 07","startTime":569.6,"endTime":574.4,"body":"And I think this is the start,"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 07","startTime":569.6,"endTime":574.4,"body":"hopefully, of a changing of"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 07","startTime":574.4,"endTime":576.0,"body":"the nature, coupled together..."},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 07","startTime":576.0,"endTime":581.2,"body":"We've seen, in the past, that first"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 07","startTime":576.0,"endTime":581.2,"body":"step of bringing in civil society,"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 07","startTime":581.2,"endTime":586.8,"body":"business, NGOs like C40, to get a"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 07","startTime":581.2,"endTime":586.8,"body":"positive pressure onto the COP, but this"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 07","startTime":586.8,"endTime":589.6,"body":"is the first stage in formalizing that."},{"speaker":"David 09","startTime":589.6,"endTime":590.4,"body":"33"},{"speaker":"David 09","startTime":590.4,"endTime":596.4,"body":"[driving music] Well, it's a big victory"},{"speaker":"David 09","startTime":590.4,"endTime":596.4,"body":"for C40 to be part of the movement."},{"speaker":"David 09","startTime":596.4,"endTime":598.0,"body":"Much congratulations on that."},{"speaker":"David 09","startTime":598.0,"endTime":601.6,"body":"That's a positive outcome"},{"speaker":"David 09","startTime":598.0,"endTime":601.6,"body":"and achievement of this COP."},{"speaker":"David 09","startTime":601.6,"endTime":607.2,"body":"There was quite a bit of criticism,"},{"speaker":"David 09","startTime":601.6,"endTime":607.2,"body":"for example, of some of the comments"},{"speaker":"David 09","startTime":607.2,"endTime":612.4,"body":"that the COP president made at one"},{"speaker":"David 09","startTime":607.2,"endTime":612.4,"body":"point in time during the conference."},{"speaker":"David 09","startTime":612.4,"endTime":616.4,"body":"Yet, the final statement perhaps"},{"speaker":"David 09","startTime":612.4,"endTime":616.4,"body":"was a cause for optimism."},{"speaker":"David 09","startTime":616.4,"endTime":621.6,"body":"There did seem to be a hint of"},{"speaker":"David 09","startTime":616.4,"endTime":621.6,"body":"progress in the final communique."},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 10","startTime":621.6,"endTime":622.8,"body":"00"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 10","startTime":622.8,"endTime":627.2,"body":"There was definitely progress in"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 10","startTime":622.8,"endTime":627.2,"body":"the painfully slow world of climate"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 10","startTime":627.2,"endTime":631.2,"body":"negotiation – quite important progress"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 10","startTime":627.2,"endTime":631.2,"body":"because, for the very first time,"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 10","startTime":631.2,"endTime":635.6,"body":"there was recognition—the agreement"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 10","startTime":631.2,"endTime":635.6,"body":"at the end of this COP—that we"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 10","startTime":635.6,"endTime":638.0,"body":"need to stop using fossil fuels."},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 10","startTime":638.0,"endTime":642.4,"body":"And, it's extraordinary that"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 10","startTime":638.0,"endTime":642.4,"body":"it's taken to COP28 to get there."},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 10","startTime":642.4,"endTime":646.4,"body":"So, all the agreements should be"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 10","startTime":642.4,"endTime":646.4,"body":"about abating carbon emissions."},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 10","startTime":646.4,"endTime":652.0,"body":"[music fades out] They hoped and expected"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 10","startTime":646.4,"endTime":652.0,"body":"and invested a lot of lobbying effort"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 10","startTime":652.0,"endTime":658.0,"body":"in trying to achieve that so, in that"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 10","startTime":652.0,"endTime":658.0,"body":"context, to have instead, for the first"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 10","startTime":658.0,"endTime":663.2,"body":"time, got a recognition and agreement"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 10","startTime":658.0,"endTime":663.2,"body":"across all the nations that we need"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 10","startTime":663.2,"endTime":668.4,"body":"to stop using fossil fuels was indeed"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 10","startTime":663.2,"endTime":668.4,"body":"progress, and the UAE deserves some"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 10","startTime":668.4,"endTime":673.6,"body":"credit that that, as also for creating"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 10","startTime":668.4,"endTime":673.6,"body":"the space for the non-state actors"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 10","startTime":673.6,"endTime":676.4,"body":"to be very centrally in the process."},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 10","startTime":676.4,"endTime":682.0,"body":"And then, you know, the good stuff"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 10","startTime":676.4,"endTime":682.0,"body":"that was at COP about the investment"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 10","startTime":682.0,"endTime":687.2,"body":"to treble in this decade, that's"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 10","startTime":682.0,"endTime":687.2,"body":"really where we need to go now."},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 10","startTime":687.2,"endTime":692.8,"body":"And, in that context, you know,"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 10","startTime":687.2,"endTime":692.8,"body":"clearly it was a huge error by the"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 10","startTime":692.8,"endTime":697.2,"body":"COP president to make those false"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 10","startTime":692.8,"endTime":697.2,"body":"comments that science doesn't require"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 10","startTime":697.2,"endTime":699.6,"body":"a phasing out of fossil fuels."},{"speaker":"David 11","startTime":699.6,"endTime":700.4,"body":"05"},{"speaker":"David 11","startTime":700.4,"endTime":706.0,"body":"So, the door has been opened for the"},{"speaker":"David 11","startTime":700.4,"endTime":706.0,"body":"first time for this conversation about"},{"speaker":"David 11","startTime":706.0,"endTime":711.2,"body":"the phasing out of fossil fuels and,"},{"speaker":"David 11","startTime":706.0,"endTime":711.2,"body":"as you noted, it's really urgent."},{"speaker":"David 11","startTime":711.2,"endTime":716.0,"body":"Certainly, the global stocktake showed"},{"speaker":"David 11","startTime":711.2,"endTime":716.0,"body":"us that we're not nearly making remotely"},{"speaker":"David 11","startTime":716.0,"endTime":720.8,"body":"enough progress so, from your perspective"},{"speaker":"David 11","startTime":716.0,"endTime":720.8,"body":"as leader of this city-based organization"},{"speaker":"David 11","startTime":720.8,"endTime":726.4,"body":"whose mayors represent urban regions of at"},{"speaker":"David 11","startTime":720.8,"endTime":726.4,"body":"least 700 million people—it's like a giant"},{"speaker":"David 11","startTime":726.4,"endTime":731.2,"body":"country—from that perspective, now that"},{"speaker":"David 11","startTime":726.4,"endTime":731.2,"body":"there's a recognition of what the problem"},{"speaker":"David 11","startTime":731.2,"endTime":734.4,"body":"actually is, where does the world go now?"},{"speaker":"David 11","startTime":734.4,"endTime":736.4,"body":"What's the role of cities?"},{"speaker":"David 11","startTime":736.4,"endTime":740.8,"body":"And, what's the role of C40,"},{"speaker":"David 11","startTime":736.4,"endTime":740.8,"body":"both from an action perspective"},{"speaker":"David 11","startTime":740.8,"endTime":744.8,"body":"and an advocacy perspective to"},{"speaker":"David 11","startTime":740.8,"endTime":744.8,"body":"drive the change that's needed?"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 11","startTime":744.8,"endTime":746.0,"body":"54"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 11","startTime":746.0,"endTime":751.6,"body":"Well, I think where it has to go, for"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 11","startTime":746.0,"endTime":751.6,"body":"national governments, but actually for"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 11","startTime":751.6,"endTime":756.8,"body":"all actors—for big businesses, for cities,"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 11","startTime":751.6,"endTime":756.8,"body":"for regions now—is to do exactly what"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 11","startTime":756.8,"endTime":761.6,"body":"C40 Cities started doing immediately"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 11","startTime":756.8,"endTime":761.6,"body":"after the Paris Agreement, which is put"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 11","startTime":761.6,"endTime":767.6,"body":"together a very clear action plan for"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 11","startTime":761.6,"endTime":767.6,"body":"what it's going to take and how you're"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 11","startTime":767.6,"endTime":772.8,"body":"going to achieve making your contribution"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 11","startTime":767.6,"endTime":772.8,"body":"so the world stays under 1.5˚C, because"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 11","startTime":772.8,"endTime":778.4,"body":"there is absolutely no way we can make"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 11","startTime":772.8,"endTime":778.4,"body":"the extraordinary scale of change that"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 11","startTime":778.4,"endTime":784.0,"body":"is necessary to achieve that goal and,"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 11","startTime":778.4,"endTime":784.0,"body":"at the same time, improve our resilience"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 11","startTime":784.0,"endTime":788.8,"body":"to the impacts that are already happening"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 11","startTime":784.0,"endTime":788.8,"body":"without some really serious planning,"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 11","startTime":788.8,"endTime":794.4,"body":"because you've got to map out,—and at"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 11","startTime":788.8,"endTime":794.4,"body":"a very sort of systems level, across"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 11","startTime":794.4,"endTime":798.8,"body":"cities, regions, countries—how you're"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 11","startTime":794.4,"endTime":798.8,"body":"going to deploy resources to make a"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 11","startTime":798.8,"endTime":804.4,"body":"change to our energy system and, in"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 11","startTime":798.8,"endTime":804.4,"body":"fact, a change to our entire economies,"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 11","startTime":804.4,"endTime":809.6,"body":"at a pace and scale that's never been"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 11","startTime":804.4,"endTime":809.6,"body":"achieved before in human history."},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 11","startTime":809.6,"endTime":814.8,"body":"What C40 mayors did, coming out of"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 11","startTime":809.6,"endTime":814.8,"body":"the Paris Agreement was exactly that."},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 11","startTime":814.8,"endTime":820.0,"body":"We sat down as the professional team"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 11","startTime":814.8,"endTime":820.0,"body":"with the leading mayors and said,"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 11","startTime":820.0,"endTime":824.8,"body":"\"Okay, the world has now agreed"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 11","startTime":820.0,"endTime":824.8,"body":"we're going to stay under 1.5˚C."},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 11","startTime":824.8,"endTime":827.2,"body":"This is a massive step forward."},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 11","startTime":827.2,"endTime":832.8,"body":"If we're serious, we've got to show"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 11","startTime":827.2,"endTime":832.8,"body":"how we're going to do it,\" which"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 11","startTime":832.8,"endTime":837.6,"body":"means a thorough, robust plan for"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 11","startTime":832.8,"endTime":837.6,"body":"each city, based on some international"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 11","startTime":837.6,"endTime":839.2,"body":"standards which we created."},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 11","startTime":839.2,"endTime":846.0,"body":"A condition of being a member of C40 is"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 11","startTime":839.2,"endTime":846.0,"body":"to have that plan and be implementing it"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 11","startTime":846.0,"endTime":849.6,"body":"and be measured on it on an annual basis."},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 11","startTime":849.6,"endTime":851.6,"body":"That's what we've been doing."},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 11","startTime":851.6,"endTime":857.2,"body":"Now, the focus – the national governments"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 11","startTime":851.6,"endTime":857.2,"body":"need to shift to that the revision of"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 11","startTime":857.2,"endTime":860.8,"body":"their NDC—their Nationally Determined"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 11","startTime":857.2,"endTime":860.8,"body":"Commitment on climate—that, under the"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 11","startTime":860.8,"endTime":867.2,"body":"Paris Agreement, has to be delivered by"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 11","startTime":860.8,"endTime":867.2,"body":"2025, and we need all of those to now"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 11","startTime":867.2,"endTime":872.4,"body":"be consistent with the world halving"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 11","startTime":867.2,"endTime":872.4,"body":"the use of fossil fuels this decade"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 11","startTime":872.4,"endTime":877.2,"body":"and cutting emissions fast enough"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 11","startTime":872.4,"endTime":877.2,"body":"for the world to stay under 1.5˚C."},{"speaker":"David 13","startTime":877.2,"endTime":878.0,"body":"40"},{"speaker":"David 13","startTime":878.0,"endTime":880.0,"body":"2025 is a key date."},{"speaker":"David 13","startTime":880.0,"endTime":881.6,"body":"2030 is another one."},{"speaker":"David 13","startTime":881.6,"endTime":887.2,"body":"The C40 plans you referred to, Mark,"},{"speaker":"David 13","startTime":881.6,"endTime":887.2,"body":"as we both know, require our cities"},{"speaker":"David 13","startTime":887.2,"endTime":892.4,"body":"to do their fair share of the overall"},{"speaker":"David 13","startTime":887.2,"endTime":892.4,"body":"halving of global emissions—more or"},{"speaker":"David 13","startTime":892.4,"endTime":894.4,"body":"less halving—that's required by 2030."},{"speaker":"David 13","startTime":894.4,"endTime":899.6,"body":"What do you see as the key climate"},{"speaker":"David 13","startTime":894.4,"endTime":899.6,"body":"battlegrounds ahead of 2030, and"},{"speaker":"David 13","startTime":899.6,"endTime":904.4,"body":"what can C40, the world's great"},{"speaker":"David 13","startTime":899.6,"endTime":904.4,"body":"cities, other cities and mayors do"},{"speaker":"David 13","startTime":904.4,"endTime":907.2,"body":"to ensure that those battles are won?"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 14","startTime":907.2,"endTime":908.4,"body":"13"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 14","startTime":908.4,"endTime":912.8,"body":"[light, percussive music] Deadlines"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 14","startTime":908.4,"endTime":912.8,"body":"– to have that focus on the next"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 14","startTime":912.8,"endTime":917.6,"body":"five years, the next decade rather"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 14","startTime":912.8,"endTime":917.6,"body":"than the mid-century 20, 40 years."},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 14","startTime":917.6,"endTime":922.8,"body":"Unfortunately, it's taken that we're now"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 14","startTime":917.6,"endTime":922.8,"body":"really, really in the crisis of climate"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 14","startTime":922.8,"endTime":925.6,"body":"breakdown to bring that focus much nearer."},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 14","startTime":925.6,"endTime":928.8,"body":"There are some really"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 14","startTime":925.6,"endTime":928.8,"body":"simple answers to this."},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 14","startTime":928.8,"endTime":933.2,"body":"Number one – as the International"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 14","startTime":928.8,"endTime":933.2,"body":"Energy Agency has been saying for"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 14","startTime":933.2,"endTime":938.8,"body":"a few years now, we've got to stop"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 14","startTime":933.2,"endTime":938.8,"body":"all new investment in fossil fuels."},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 14","startTime":938.8,"endTime":944.4,"body":"There is no place for investing in"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 14","startTime":938.8,"endTime":944.4,"body":"trying to pull more oil and gas."},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 14","startTime":944.4,"endTime":948.8,"body":"[music fades out] And then, you know,"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 14","startTime":944.4,"endTime":948.8,"body":"equally importantly, really putting"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 14","startTime":948.8,"endTime":954.8,"body":"the focus and an investment on how we"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 14","startTime":948.8,"endTime":954.8,"body":"can rapidly change our economies to be"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 14","startTime":954.8,"endTime":959.6,"body":"fundamentally clean, in terms of energy"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 14","startTime":954.8,"endTime":959.6,"body":"resource efficient, but also much more"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 14","startTime":959.6,"endTime":965.6,"body":"equitable to do that in a way where"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 14","startTime":959.6,"endTime":965.6,"body":"there's a transition in which those who"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 14","startTime":965.6,"endTime":971.2,"body":"are currently most vulnerable and get"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 14","startTime":965.6,"endTime":971.2,"body":"the least out of the global economy see"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 14","startTime":971.2,"endTime":973.6,"body":"their standard of living rapidly rising."},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 14","startTime":973.6,"endTime":979.2,"body":"And clearly, someone's going to have"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 14","startTime":973.6,"endTime":979.2,"body":"to pay for that – that those who are"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 14","startTime":979.2,"endTime":984.4,"body":"currently most privileged are producing"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 14","startTime":979.2,"endTime":984.4,"body":"the most emissions and cause most of the"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 14","startTime":984.4,"endTime":990.0,"body":"problems are going to have to contribute"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 14","startTime":984.4,"endTime":990.0,"body":"a bit more to make that possible."},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 14","startTime":990.0,"endTime":996.8,"body":"But, in the end, we all win because"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 14","startTime":990.0,"endTime":996.8,"body":"we get a future where all of us can"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 14","startTime":996.8,"endTime":999.2,"body":"thrive and can live better lives."},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 14","startTime":999.2,"endTime":1005.2,"body":"The role for cities in this, I see, in"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 14","startTime":999.2,"endTime":1005.2,"body":"the immediate period, is really about"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 14","startTime":1005.2,"endTime":1010.4,"body":"reducing the demand, because I've seen"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 14","startTime":1005.2,"endTime":1010.4,"body":"nothing in my career that suggests that"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 14","startTime":1010.4,"endTime":1016.8,"body":"the finance sector is going to lead and,"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 14","startTime":1010.4,"endTime":1016.8,"body":"out of altruism, is going to say, \"We're"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 14","startTime":1016.8,"endTime":1019.2,"body":"gonna stop investing in fossil fuel.\""},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 14","startTime":1019.2,"endTime":1025.2,"body":"What's going to turn off that tap is"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 14","startTime":1019.2,"endTime":1025.2,"body":"that the demand starts to come away."},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 14","startTime":1025.2,"endTime":1030.8,"body":"So, when mayors take really tough"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 14","startTime":1025.2,"endTime":1030.8,"body":"decisions to bring in clean air zones that"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 14","startTime":1030.8,"endTime":1036.0,"body":"restrict polluting vehicles from traveling"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 14","startTime":1030.8,"endTime":1036.0,"body":"within the city, that starts to cut off"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 14","startTime":1036.0,"endTime":1038.4,"body":"the demand – the petrol for gasoline."},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 14","startTime":1038.4,"endTime":1044.0,"body":"When they regulate to change what kind"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 14","startTime":1038.4,"endTime":1044.0,"body":"of buildings are permitted and the energy"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 14","startTime":1044.0,"endTime":1048.4,"body":"systems that serve them, so investing in"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 14","startTime":1044.0,"endTime":1048.4,"body":"regulating out highly-polluting cooking"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 14","startTime":1048.4,"endTime":1052.4,"body":"stoves, charcoal, etc., and replace"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 14","startTime":1048.4,"endTime":1052.4,"body":"it with clean renewable electricity,"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 14","startTime":1052.4,"endTime":1057.6,"body":"in African cities, for example, those"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 14","startTime":1052.4,"endTime":1057.6,"body":"things again, they cut off the demand"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 14","startTime":1057.6,"endTime":1062.8,"body":"for those fossil fuels and they start"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 14","startTime":1057.6,"endTime":1062.8,"body":"to make that investment prospect for"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 14","startTime":1062.8,"endTime":1066.0,"body":"oil and gas and coal far less sound."},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 14","startTime":1066.0,"endTime":1070.0,"body":"On the positive side, we've"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 14","startTime":1066.0,"endTime":1070.0,"body":"really seen a massive, massive"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 14","startTime":1070.0,"endTime":1074.0,"body":"increase in investment in renewable"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 14","startTime":1070.0,"endTime":1074.0,"body":"energy, primarily driven by China."},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 14","startTime":1074.0,"endTime":1078.8,"body":"Half of all the world's investment"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 14","startTime":1074.0,"endTime":1078.8,"body":"in renewables is in China and,"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 14","startTime":1078.8,"endTime":1083.2,"body":"similarly, a huge, huge, huge shift"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 14","startTime":1078.8,"endTime":1083.2,"body":"to electric vehicles, which is"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 14","startTime":1083.2,"endTime":1088.0,"body":"a significant part of the global"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 14","startTime":1083.2,"endTime":1088.0,"body":"emissions is in transport which, I"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 14","startTime":1088.0,"endTime":1092.8,"body":"think, gives us the tipping points"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 14","startTime":1088.0,"endTime":1092.8,"body":"for the global economy are achievable."},{"speaker":"David 17","startTime":1092.8,"endTime":1093.6,"body":"03"},{"speaker":"David 17","startTime":1093.6,"endTime":1097.6,"body":"It seems that, even when national"},{"speaker":"David 17","startTime":1093.6,"endTime":1097.6,"body":"governments have tensions, cities"},{"speaker":"David 17","startTime":1097.6,"endTime":1102.0,"body":"are able to have conversations about"},{"speaker":"David 17","startTime":1097.6,"endTime":1102.0,"body":"real and substantive issues between"},{"speaker":"David 17","startTime":1102.0,"endTime":1106.8,"body":"themselves, regardless of the geopolitical"},{"speaker":"David 17","startTime":1102.0,"endTime":1106.8,"body":"situation, which really seems to add to"},{"speaker":"David 17","startTime":1106.8,"endTime":1109.2,"body":"the ability to spread these solutions."},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 17","startTime":1109.2,"endTime":1110.4,"body":"19"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 17","startTime":1110.4,"endTime":1115.6,"body":"I was very pleased to see that very"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 17","startTime":1110.4,"endTime":1115.6,"body":"evidently, that 15-minute city concept,"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 17","startTime":1115.6,"endTime":1120.0,"body":"the urban development, is China learning"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 17","startTime":1115.6,"endTime":1120.0,"body":"primarily from European cities, but"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 17","startTime":1120.0,"endTime":1125.2,"body":"there are examples all over the world now"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 17","startTime":1120.0,"endTime":1125.2,"body":"– clean construction standards that they're"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 17","startTime":1125.2,"endTime":1130.8,"body":"adopting, coming very much from Vancouver,"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 17","startTime":1125.2,"endTime":1130.8,"body":"from Oslo, and a lot of interest around"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 17","startTime":1130.8,"endTime":1137.2,"body":"budgeting at a city level, which, David,"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 17","startTime":1130.8,"endTime":1137.2,"body":"you and I have both been big advocates of,"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 17","startTime":1137.2,"endTime":1140.0,"body":"coming from other cities across the world."},{"speaker":"David 17","startTime":1140.0,"endTime":1140.8,"body":"43"},{"speaker":"David 17","startTime":1140.8,"endTime":1146.4,"body":"One of the examples I'd be interested"},{"speaker":"David 17","startTime":1140.8,"endTime":1146.4,"body":"to hear your thoughts about is shipping."},{"speaker":"David 17","startTime":1146.4,"endTime":1151.6,"body":"There's work going on, led by Shanghai,"},{"speaker":"David 17","startTime":1146.4,"endTime":1151.6,"body":"Los Angeles, and I think Copenhagen."},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 17","startTime":1151.6,"endTime":1152.8,"body":"53"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 17","startTime":1152.8,"endTime":1157.6,"body":"The stuff around the green ports and"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 17","startTime":1152.8,"endTime":1157.6,"body":"green shipping was really fantastic"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 17","startTime":1157.6,"endTime":1162.8,"body":"because this is an initiative that"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 17","startTime":1157.6,"endTime":1162.8,"body":"was seeded by our former chair, the"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 17","startTime":1162.8,"endTime":1166.4,"body":"incredible Eric Garcetti—formerly"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 17","startTime":1162.8,"endTime":1166.4,"body":"Mayor of Los Angeles, now U.S."},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 17","startTime":1166.4,"endTime":1171.6,"body":"ambassador to India—and he had this"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 17","startTime":1166.4,"endTime":1171.6,"body":"concept of, if we're going to change"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 17","startTime":1171.6,"endTime":1176.0,"body":"one of the hardest-to-move sectors,"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 17","startTime":1171.6,"endTime":1176.0,"body":"the shipping sector, off fossil fuels"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 17","startTime":1176.0,"endTime":1182.0,"body":"onto renewables, then the best way for"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 17","startTime":1176.0,"endTime":1182.0,"body":"that to happen is if ports, and the"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 17","startTime":1182.0,"endTime":1187.6,"body":"big cities that regulate or own them,"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 17","startTime":1182.0,"endTime":1187.6,"body":"get together and let's create a green"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 17","startTime":1187.6,"endTime":1192.4,"body":"shipping corridor between two of the"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 17","startTime":1187.6,"endTime":1192.4,"body":"biggest ports in the world—Shanghai and"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 17","startTime":1192.4,"endTime":1195.2,"body":"LA Long Beach—and, that is now happening."},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 17","startTime":1195.2,"endTime":1199.6,"body":"In addition to that collaboration, there's"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 17","startTime":1195.2,"endTime":1199.6,"body":"now a collaboration between Singapore"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 17","startTime":1199.6,"endTime":1205.6,"body":"and Long Beach, starting, to kick off,"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 17","startTime":1199.6,"endTime":1205.6,"body":"and I saw in Shanghai—I mean, it's all"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 17","startTime":1205.6,"endTime":1211.6,"body":"a bit kind of sci-fi—but the largest"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 17","startTime":1205.6,"endTime":1211.6,"body":"port in the world, the newest bit of"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 17","startTime":1211.6,"endTime":1217.2,"body":"a quarter of which has now been fully"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 17","startTime":1211.6,"endTime":1217.2,"body":"electrified, so meaning that these huge"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 17","startTime":1217.2,"endTime":1222.0,"body":"great container ships aren't running their"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 17","startTime":1217.2,"endTime":1222.0,"body":"great big diesel engines, polluting the"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 17","startTime":1222.0,"endTime":1226.4,"body":"city when they're in port, but instead,"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 17","startTime":1222.0,"endTime":1226.4,"body":"are plugging in—clean electricity"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 17","startTime":1226.4,"endTime":1231.6,"body":"takes huge amounts of infrastructure"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 17","startTime":1226.4,"endTime":1231.6,"body":"to provide the kind of power that they"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 17","startTime":1231.6,"endTime":1234.0,"body":"need—but also, a fully automated port."},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 17","startTime":1234.0,"endTime":1238.4,"body":"The whole automated process has"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 17","startTime":1234.0,"endTime":1238.4,"body":"allowed it to maximize the efficiency"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 17","startTime":1238.4,"endTime":1244.0,"body":"and therefore make it cost effective"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 17","startTime":1238.4,"endTime":1244.0,"body":"to run it in a much cleaner fashion."},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 17","startTime":1244.0,"endTime":1250.4,"body":"And, if that's happening end to end in"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 17","startTime":1244.0,"endTime":1250.4,"body":"LA to Shanghai, two of the biggest ports,"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 17","startTime":1250.4,"endTime":1256.8,"body":"we're going to see a lot more following"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 17","startTime":1250.4,"endTime":1256.8,"body":"suit, and already, I know there are many"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 17","startTime":1256.8,"endTime":1260.0,"body":"other ports looking to do the same thing."},{"speaker":"David 19","startTime":1260.0,"endTime":1260.8,"body":"29"},{"speaker":"David 19","startTime":1260.8,"endTime":1265.2,"body":"[pensive music] Well, there's some"},{"speaker":"David 19","startTime":1260.8,"endTime":1265.2,"body":"cause for optimism from China, there's"},{"speaker":"David 19","startTime":1265.2,"endTime":1270.0,"body":"cause for optimism from COP28, and"},{"speaker":"David 19","startTime":1265.2,"endTime":1270.0,"body":"even more so, there's cause for"},{"speaker":"David 19","startTime":1270.0,"endTime":1274.8,"body":"optimism from the great work of"},{"speaker":"David 19","startTime":1270.0,"endTime":1274.8,"body":"mayors and cities around the world."},{"speaker":"David 19","startTime":1274.8,"endTime":1277.2,"body":"And, we've got pretty tough deadlines."},{"speaker":"David 19","startTime":1277.2,"endTime":1283.2,"body":"2025 is next year, 2030's six years, and,"},{"speaker":"David 19","startTime":1277.2,"endTime":1283.2,"body":"you know, you're leading a critical part"},{"speaker":"David 19","startTime":1283.2,"endTime":1289.6,"body":"of this climate movement, and I think all"},{"speaker":"David 19","startTime":1283.2,"endTime":1289.6,"body":"of our listeners wish you luck and success"},{"speaker":"David 19","startTime":1289.6,"endTime":1295.6,"body":"to move from optimism to building on the"},{"speaker":"David 19","startTime":1289.6,"endTime":1295.6,"body":"real action that cities are taking today."},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 20","startTime":1295.6,"endTime":1296.8,"body":"03"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 20","startTime":1296.8,"endTime":1298.8,"body":"Well, thanks so much, David."},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 20","startTime":1298.8,"endTime":1300.8,"body":"I've really enjoyed this conversation."},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 20","startTime":1300.8,"endTime":1305.6,"body":"It's a real honour to work in"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 20","startTime":1300.8,"endTime":1305.6,"body":"this sector because it provides"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 20","startTime":1305.6,"endTime":1307.6,"body":"the opportunity to be optimistic."},{"speaker":"David 20","startTime":1307.6,"endTime":1308.4,"body":"10"},{"speaker":"David 20","startTime":1308.4,"endTime":1310.8,"body":"Thanks again for your time today."},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 20","startTime":1310.8,"endTime":1312.0,"body":"12"},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 20","startTime":1312.0,"endTime":1312.8,"body":"Thank you."},{"speaker":"Mark Watts 20","startTime":1312.8,"endTime":1314.4,"body":"[music continues then ends]"},{"speaker":"David 20","startTime":1314.4,"endTime":1315.2,"body":"21"},{"speaker":"David 20","startTime":1315.2,"endTime":1319.6,"body":"[light, driving music] This episode"},{"speaker":"David 20","startTime":1315.2,"endTime":1319.6,"body":"of Cities 1.5 is produced by"},{"speaker":"David 20","startTime":1319.6,"endTime":1324.0,"body":"University of Toronto Press with"},{"speaker":"David 20","startTime":1319.6,"endTime":1324.0,"body":"generous support from the C40 Centre"},{"speaker":"David 20","startTime":1324.0,"endTime":1326.4,"body":"for City Climate Policy and Economy."},{"speaker":"David 20","startTime":1326.4,"endTime":1330.4,"body":"Want more access to current"},{"speaker":"David 20","startTime":1326.4,"endTime":1330.4,"body":"research on how city leaders"},{"speaker":"David 20","startTime":1330.4,"endTime":1332.0,"body":"are taking climate action?"},{"speaker":"David 20","startTime":1332.0,"endTime":1336.4,"body":"We also publish the Journal of"},{"speaker":"David 20","startTime":1332.0,"endTime":1336.4,"body":"City Climate Policy and Economy."},{"speaker":"David 20","startTime":1336.4,"endTime":1340.4,"body":"Our mission is to publish timely,"},{"speaker":"David 20","startTime":1336.4,"endTime":1340.4,"body":"evidence-based research that contributes"},{"speaker":"David 20","startTime":1340.4,"endTime":1344.4,"body":"to the urban climate agenda and"},{"speaker":"David 20","startTime":1340.4,"endTime":1344.4,"body":"supports governmental policy toward"},{"speaker":"David 20","startTime":1344.4,"endTime":1346.4,"body":"an equitable and resilient world."},{"speaker":"David 20","startTime":1346.4,"endTime":1350.8,"body":"The Journal serves as a platform"},{"speaker":"David 20","startTime":1346.4,"endTime":1350.8,"body":"for dynamic content that highlights"},{"speaker":"David 20","startTime":1350.8,"endTime":1354.4,"body":"ambitious, near-term climate action,"},{"speaker":"David 20","startTime":1350.8,"endTime":1354.4,"body":"focusing on human-centred solutions to"},{"speaker":"David 20","startTime":1354.4,"endTime":1356.4,"body":"today's most pressing climate challenges."},{"speaker":"David 20","startTime":1356.4,"endTime":1360.0,"body":"To read the latest issue, visit"},{"speaker":"David 20","startTime":1356.4,"endTime":1360.0,"body":"JCCPE.utpjournals.press or find"},{"speaker":"David 20","startTime":1360.0,"endTime":1362.4,"body":"the link in the show notes."},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 21","startTime":1362.4,"endTime":1363.6,"body":"01"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 21","startTime":1363.6,"endTime":1368.0,"body":"[rotary dial telephone rings] [clicks]"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 21","startTime":1363.6,"endTime":1368.0,"body":"My name is Xuemei Bai, distinguished"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 21","startTime":1368.0,"endTime":1372.0,"body":"Professor in Urban Environment and Human"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 21","startTime":1368.0,"endTime":1372.0,"body":"Ecology, Australian National University."},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 21","startTime":1372.0,"endTime":1374.0,"body":"I'm sitting here in Canberra."},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 21","startTime":1374.0,"endTime":1376.0,"body":"[receiver chimes, replaced in cradle]"},{"speaker":"David 21","startTime":1376.0,"endTime":1376.8,"body":"34"},{"speaker":"David 21","startTime":1376.8,"endTime":1381.6,"body":"[upbeat electronic music] Xuemei Bai"},{"speaker":"David 21","startTime":1376.8,"endTime":1381.6,"body":"is a scientist and academic who has"},{"speaker":"David 21","startTime":1381.6,"endTime":1386.8,"body":"authored over 100 publications, and her"},{"speaker":"David 21","startTime":1381.6,"endTime":1386.8,"body":"accolades are nearly too many to count."},{"speaker":"David 21","startTime":1386.8,"endTime":1390.8,"body":"She was a lead author for the"},{"speaker":"David 21","startTime":1386.8,"endTime":1390.8,"body":"Millennium Ecosystem Assessment,"},{"speaker":"David 21","startTime":1390.8,"endTime":1394.8,"body":"the Global Energy Assessment, and"},{"speaker":"David 21","startTime":1390.8,"endTime":1394.8,"body":"the IPCC's Sixth Assessment Report."},{"speaker":"David 21","startTime":1394.8,"endTime":1398.8,"body":"She also co-leads the Earth Commission's"},{"speaker":"David 21","startTime":1394.8,"endTime":1398.8,"body":"Working Group, targeting planetary"},{"speaker":"David 21","startTime":1398.8,"endTime":1400.8,"body":"levels in cities and businesses."},{"speaker":"David 21","startTime":1400.8,"endTime":1401.6,"body":"[music ends]"},{"speaker":"David 21","startTime":1401.6,"endTime":1406.0,"body":"Professor Xuemei, thanks so much"},{"speaker":"David 21","startTime":1401.6,"endTime":1406.0,"body":"for joining us on Cities 1.5."},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 22","startTime":1406.0,"endTime":1407.2,"body":"10"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 22","startTime":1407.2,"endTime":1410.0,"body":"Thank you, David, for having me here."},{"speaker":"David 22","startTime":1410.0,"endTime":1410.8,"body":"11"},{"speaker":"David 22","startTime":1410.8,"endTime":1412.4,"body":"Your resume is incredible."},{"speaker":"David 22","startTime":1412.4,"endTime":1418.0,"body":"Can you just speak a little bit so"},{"speaker":"David 22","startTime":1412.4,"endTime":1418.0,"body":"that our listeners can understand the"},{"speaker":"David 22","startTime":1418.0,"endTime":1422.8,"body":"work that you do and your involvement"},{"speaker":"David 22","startTime":1418.0,"endTime":1422.8,"body":"with all these various commissions"},{"speaker":"David 22","startTime":1422.8,"endTime":1426.8,"body":"from the perspective of ecology,"},{"speaker":"David 22","startTime":1422.8,"endTime":1426.8,"body":"human health, and climate change?"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 22","startTime":1426.8,"endTime":1428.0,"body":"27"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 22","startTime":1428.0,"endTime":1432.8,"body":"So, the primary focus of my work"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 22","startTime":1428.0,"endTime":1432.8,"body":"has always been urbanization and"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 22","startTime":1432.8,"endTime":1438.0,"body":"cities, so I have at least three"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 22","startTime":1432.8,"endTime":1438.0,"body":"distinct sort of streams of work."},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 22","startTime":1438.0,"endTime":1444.0,"body":"The first one is really looking at the"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 22","startTime":1438.0,"endTime":1444.0,"body":"process of drivers and impacts of rapid"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 22","startTime":1444.0,"endTime":1448.0,"body":"urbanization, and that includes what"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 22","startTime":1444.0,"endTime":1448.0,"body":"that means for global sustainability."},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 22","startTime":1448.0,"endTime":1452.4,"body":"And, the second part is trying to"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 22","startTime":1448.0,"endTime":1452.4,"body":"really understand various aspects"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 22","startTime":1452.4,"endTime":1454.4,"body":"of cities and climate change."},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 22","startTime":1454.4,"endTime":1459.2,"body":"And then, third bit is looking at"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 22","startTime":1454.4,"endTime":1459.2,"body":"cities as active and transformative"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 22","startTime":1459.2,"endTime":1462.4,"body":"agents for a climate-safe future"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 22","startTime":1459.2,"endTime":1462.4,"body":"and global sustainability."},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 22","startTime":1462.4,"endTime":1468.0,"body":"So, those are the things that I do here"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 22","startTime":1462.4,"endTime":1468.0,"body":"at the Australian National University."},{"speaker":"David 23","startTime":1468.0,"endTime":1468.8,"body":"04"},{"speaker":"David 23","startTime":1468.8,"endTime":1474.4,"body":"Well, I think all three of them have"},{"speaker":"David 23","startTime":1468.8,"endTime":1474.4,"body":"a place in our conversation because"},{"speaker":"David 23","startTime":1474.4,"endTime":1479.6,"body":"rapid urbanization can be done in a"},{"speaker":"David 23","startTime":1474.4,"endTime":1479.6,"body":"way that is supportive of environmental"},{"speaker":"David 23","startTime":1479.6,"endTime":1484.4,"body":"goals or really hurts environmental"},{"speaker":"David 23","startTime":1479.6,"endTime":1484.4,"body":"goals, as we've seen, you know, in"},{"speaker":"David 23","startTime":1484.4,"endTime":1489.2,"body":"the United States, for example, with"},{"speaker":"David 23","startTime":1484.4,"endTime":1489.2,"body":"urbanization that we would loosely call"},{"speaker":"David 23","startTime":1489.2,"endTime":1492.4,"body":"sprawl as a type in many, many cities."},{"speaker":"David 23","startTime":1492.4,"endTime":1497.2,"body":"A lot of the science about climate"},{"speaker":"David 23","startTime":1492.4,"endTime":1497.2,"body":"change is thinking about worldwide"},{"speaker":"David 23","startTime":1497.2,"endTime":1501.6,"body":"impacts or looking at statistics,"},{"speaker":"David 23","startTime":1497.2,"endTime":1501.6,"body":"for example, on a national level."},{"speaker":"David 23","startTime":1501.6,"endTime":1506.0,"body":"What's the place, from a scientist's"},{"speaker":"David 23","startTime":1501.6,"endTime":1506.0,"body":"perspective, of urban areas and"},{"speaker":"David 23","startTime":1506.0,"endTime":1507.6,"body":"cities in that conversation?"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 23","startTime":1507.6,"endTime":1508.8,"body":"46"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 23","startTime":1508.8,"endTime":1512.8,"body":"Well, urban areas and cities"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 23","startTime":1508.8,"endTime":1512.8,"body":"are absolutely playing a crucial"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 23","startTime":1512.8,"endTime":1514.8,"body":"role in this whole thing."},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 23","startTime":1514.8,"endTime":1519.6,"body":"For example, just look at the current"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 23","startTime":1514.8,"endTime":1519.6,"body":"impact that cities are having."},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 23","startTime":1519.6,"endTime":1524.8,"body":"The most recent IPCC report shows"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 23","startTime":1519.6,"endTime":1524.8,"body":"that almost up to 80% of all"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 23","startTime":1524.8,"endTime":1528.4,"body":"consumption-related GHG emissions"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 23","startTime":1524.8,"endTime":1528.4,"body":"actually can be traced back to"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 23","startTime":1528.4,"endTime":1534.0,"body":"cities, so we know cities are already"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 23","startTime":1528.4,"endTime":1534.0,"body":"making a huge impact in terms of"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 23","startTime":1534.0,"endTime":1536.0,"body":"causing this current climate change."},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 23","startTime":1536.0,"endTime":1542.0,"body":"And, the second one is we really need"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 23","startTime":1536.0,"endTime":1542.0,"body":"to look at the future impact, right?"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 23","startTime":1542.0,"endTime":1546.8,"body":"The UN population projection actually"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 23","startTime":1542.0,"endTime":1546.8,"body":"shows that about two billion more people"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 23","startTime":1546.8,"endTime":1553.2,"body":"will be added to the world's cities,"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 23","startTime":1546.8,"endTime":1553.2,"body":"and then about 90% of them will be added"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 23","startTime":1553.2,"endTime":1555.6,"body":"to the cities in developing countries."},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 23","startTime":1555.6,"endTime":1560.0,"body":"So, these new urban residents, they"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 23","startTime":1555.6,"endTime":1560.0,"body":"will require housing and infrastructure"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 23","startTime":1560.0,"endTime":1565.6,"body":"if they are to have a decent urban"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 23","startTime":1560.0,"endTime":1565.6,"body":"life, and that's what we want."},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 23","startTime":1565.6,"endTime":1571.2,"body":"If we are to provide the same level of"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 23","startTime":1565.6,"endTime":1571.2,"body":"infrastructure services to those people"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 23","startTime":1571.2,"endTime":1576.0,"body":"in developed country's cities, and"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 23","startTime":1571.2,"endTime":1576.0,"body":"do it in a business-as-usual way, our"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 23","startTime":1576.0,"endTime":1580.8,"body":"analysis actually shows that may entail"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 23","startTime":1576.0,"endTime":1580.8,"body":"226 gigatons of carbon emissions, and"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 23","startTime":1580.8,"endTime":1586.8,"body":"we all know that, from the most recent"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 23","startTime":1580.8,"endTime":1586.8,"body":"IPCC report, it says the remaining carbon"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 23","startTime":1586.8,"endTime":1592.8,"body":"budget, if we are to achieve the 1.5"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 23","startTime":1586.8,"endTime":1592.8,"body":"degrees, is about 420 gigatons of CO2."},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 23","startTime":1592.8,"endTime":1597.6,"body":"So, we can see, building these new"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 23","startTime":1592.8,"endTime":1597.6,"body":"cities and then providing services"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 23","startTime":1597.6,"endTime":1602.8,"body":"alone, will, you know, just blow more"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 23","startTime":1597.6,"endTime":1602.8,"body":"than half of the remaining carbon"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 23","startTime":1602.8,"endTime":1608.0,"body":"budget, and this really means that"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 23","startTime":1602.8,"endTime":1608.0,"body":"we really certainly need to find some"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 23","startTime":1608.0,"endTime":1610.4,"body":"innovative ways to build our cities."},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 23","startTime":1610.4,"endTime":1615.2,"body":"And also, thirdly, I think cities"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 23","startTime":1610.4,"endTime":1615.2,"body":"are really important because of their"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 23","startTime":1615.2,"endTime":1619.6,"body":"agency – the potential for them to"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 23","startTime":1615.2,"endTime":1619.6,"body":"be active and transformative actors."},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 23","startTime":1619.6,"endTime":1622.8,"body":"And, we have really seen this at work."},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 23","startTime":1622.8,"endTime":1627.6,"body":"We already know that cities are often"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 23","startTime":1622.8,"endTime":1627.6,"body":"prompting national governments to follow,"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 23","startTime":1627.6,"endTime":1633.6,"body":"and we have seen that, for example,"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 23","startTime":1627.6,"endTime":1633.6,"body":"like in Korea or in Japan, where the"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 23","startTime":1633.6,"endTime":1638.4,"body":"national government committed to net"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 23","startTime":1633.6,"endTime":1638.4,"body":"zero only after most of their major"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 23","startTime":1638.4,"endTime":1640.8,"body":"cities have already committed to it."},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 23","startTime":1640.8,"endTime":1644.0,"body":"Cities can play a"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 23","startTime":1640.8,"endTime":1644.0,"body":"significant role in there."},{"speaker":"David 25","startTime":1644.0,"endTime":1644.8,"body":"51"},{"speaker":"David 25","startTime":1644.8,"endTime":1650.0,"body":"As you just said, a huge proportion"},{"speaker":"David 25","startTime":1644.8,"endTime":1650.0,"body":"of the greenhouse gases can be"},{"speaker":"David 25","startTime":1650.0,"endTime":1652.0,"body":"attributed to the world's cities."},{"speaker":"David 25","startTime":1652.0,"endTime":1657.2,"body":"The world's cities have agency and there"},{"speaker":"David 25","startTime":1652.0,"endTime":1657.2,"body":"are excellent examples of them leading"},{"speaker":"David 25","startTime":1657.2,"endTime":1662.4,"body":"their national government but, at the"},{"speaker":"David 25","startTime":1657.2,"endTime":1662.4,"body":"same time, there is this mass push"},{"speaker":"David 25","startTime":1662.4,"endTime":1668.4,"body":"to build new cities to meet a growing"},{"speaker":"David 25","startTime":1662.4,"endTime":1668.4,"body":"population in many countries of the world."},{"speaker":"David 25","startTime":1668.4,"endTime":1673.6,"body":"It's a huge challenge to build"},{"speaker":"David 25","startTime":1668.4,"endTime":1673.6,"body":"those cities in a way that is"},{"speaker":"David 25","startTime":1673.6,"endTime":1674.8,"body":"truly environmentally sustainable."},{"speaker":"David 25","startTime":1674.8,"endTime":1679.6,"body":"Do you have any thoughts or, as"},{"speaker":"David 25","startTime":1674.8,"endTime":1679.6,"body":"your research indicated, any paths,"},{"speaker":"David 25","startTime":1679.6,"endTime":1684.4,"body":"whether it's cities using their own"},{"speaker":"David 25","startTime":1679.6,"endTime":1684.4,"body":"agency or learning from others, that"},{"speaker":"David 25","startTime":1684.4,"endTime":1689.6,"body":"would help square that circle so"},{"speaker":"David 25","startTime":1684.4,"endTime":1689.6,"body":"that we can anticipate a future that"},{"speaker":"David 25","startTime":1689.6,"endTime":1691.2,"body":"lives within planetary boundaries?"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 26","startTime":1691.2,"endTime":1692.4,"body":"39"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 26","startTime":1692.4,"endTime":1696.0,"body":"[driving music] I would never say"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 26","startTime":1692.4,"endTime":1696.0,"body":"\"impossible\" [chuckles lightly]"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 26","startTime":1696.0,"endTime":1700.8,"body":"because that's not only unacceptable"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 26","startTime":1696.0,"endTime":1700.8,"body":"but also it's not good for my"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 26","startTime":1700.8,"endTime":1702.8,"body":"own, you know, mental health."},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 26","startTime":1702.8,"endTime":1708.4,"body":"So, I always like to maintain a positive"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 26","startTime":1702.8,"endTime":1708.4,"body":"outlook and really strive towards it."},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 26","startTime":1708.4,"endTime":1714.0,"body":"And, we do see a lot of positive"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 26","startTime":1708.4,"endTime":1714.0,"body":"signs if we work on cities."},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 26","startTime":1714.0,"endTime":1718.4,"body":"For example, many cities have already"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 26","startTime":1714.0,"endTime":1718.4,"body":"achieved 100% renewable energy supply."},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 26","startTime":1718.4,"endTime":1723.2,"body":"And then, now we are really looking"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 26","startTime":1718.4,"endTime":1723.2,"body":"at how to reduce transportation"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 26","startTime":1723.2,"endTime":1726.8,"body":"emissions and also reduce the solid"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 26","startTime":1723.2,"endTime":1726.8,"body":"waste management-related emission."},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 26","startTime":1726.8,"endTime":1732.0,"body":"So many, many cities in the world"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 26","startTime":1726.8,"endTime":1732.0,"body":"are really doing lots of things,"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 26","startTime":1732.0,"endTime":1736.8,"body":"starting from what they can, in"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 26","startTime":1732.0,"endTime":1736.8,"body":"order to bring about positive change."},{"speaker":"David 27","startTime":1736.8,"endTime":1737.6,"body":"19"},{"speaker":"David 27","startTime":1737.6,"endTime":1739.6,"body":"You followed COP28 very closely."},{"speaker":"David 27","startTime":1739.6,"endTime":1746.0,"body":"How did you feel when you read or heard"},{"speaker":"David 27","startTime":1739.6,"endTime":1746.0,"body":"that the president of COP28 said that"},{"speaker":"David 27","startTime":1746.0,"endTime":1751.2,"body":"there was no science that said the"},{"speaker":"David 27","startTime":1746.0,"endTime":1751.2,"body":"phase-out of fossil fuels could achieve"},{"speaker":"David 27","startTime":1751.2,"endTime":1756.8,"body":"1.5˚C, and specifically said there's no"},{"speaker":"David 27","startTime":1751.2,"endTime":1756.8,"body":"road map for a phase-out of fossil fuel"},{"speaker":"David 27","startTime":1756.8,"endTime":1761.2,"body":"that will allow for sustainable socio"},{"speaker":"David 27","startTime":1756.8,"endTime":1761.2,"body":"and economic development, unless you"},{"speaker":"David 27","startTime":1761.2,"endTime":1764.4,"body":"want to take the world back into caves."},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 27","startTime":1764.4,"endTime":1765.6,"body":"49"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 27","startTime":1765.6,"endTime":1770.4,"body":"Well, let me take a deep breath"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 27","startTime":1765.6,"endTime":1770.4,"body":"and start from the beginning."},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 27","startTime":1770.4,"endTime":1776.0,"body":"[both chuckle] If you look at the IPCC"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 27","startTime":1770.4,"endTime":1776.0,"body":"report, it says that limiting warming"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 27","startTime":1776.0,"endTime":1780.8,"body":"to 1.5˚C  implies reaching net zero CO2"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 27","startTime":1776.0,"endTime":1780.8,"body":"emission, globally, around 2050, right?"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 27","startTime":1780.8,"endTime":1786.0,"body":"And, the report also says that this"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 27","startTime":1780.8,"endTime":1786.0,"body":"requires a drastic reduction in fossil"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 27","startTime":1786.0,"endTime":1790.0,"body":"fuel consumption, and while there"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 27","startTime":1786.0,"endTime":1790.0,"body":"are technically feasible sort of"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 27","startTime":1790.0,"endTime":1794.8,"body":"pathways to achieve the 1.5˚C target"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 27","startTime":1790.0,"endTime":1794.8,"body":"that includes some ongoing use of"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 27","startTime":1794.8,"endTime":1799.2,"body":"fossil fuels, these pathways usually"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 27","startTime":1794.8,"endTime":1799.2,"body":"require the use of negative emissions"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 27","startTime":1799.2,"endTime":1803.6,"body":"technology to offset those remaining"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 27","startTime":1799.2,"endTime":1803.6,"body":"emissions and the feasibility, or the"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 27","startTime":1803.6,"endTime":1807.6,"body":"scalability or sustainability of these"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 27","startTime":1803.6,"endTime":1807.6,"body":"technologies is unclear and still"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 27","startTime":1807.6,"endTime":1810.0,"body":"subject to ongoing research and debate."},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 27","startTime":1810.0,"endTime":1815.6,"body":"[music fades out] So, I think what is"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 27","startTime":1810.0,"endTime":1815.6,"body":"clear here is that maintaining fossil"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 27","startTime":1815.6,"endTime":1821.6,"body":"fuel use would make it much, much more"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 27","startTime":1815.6,"endTime":1821.6,"body":"difficult to get to the 1.5˚C goal"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 27","startTime":1821.6,"endTime":1825.6,"body":"and there are certainly, of course,"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 27","startTime":1821.6,"endTime":1825.6,"body":"considerable challenges to energy"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 27","startTime":1825.6,"endTime":1831.2,"body":"transition to phase out fossil fuel,"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 27","startTime":1825.6,"endTime":1831.2,"body":"and actually doing so in a just way."},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 27","startTime":1831.2,"endTime":1836.8,"body":"But what is important is that drastically"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 27","startTime":1831.2,"endTime":1836.8,"body":"reducing or phasing out fossil fuel use"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 27","startTime":1836.8,"endTime":1842.8,"body":"doesn't really mean that the world has"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 27","startTime":1836.8,"endTime":1842.8,"body":"to be set back into caves, and there"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 27","startTime":1842.8,"endTime":1846.8,"body":"is increasing evidence that renewable"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 27","startTime":1842.8,"endTime":1846.8,"body":"energy is even, economically, more"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 27","startTime":1846.8,"endTime":1851.2,"body":"viable than fossil fuel, and many"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 27","startTime":1846.8,"endTime":1851.2,"body":"cities have achieved 100% renewable"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 27","startTime":1851.2,"endTime":1856.4,"body":"electricity supply, including Canberra,"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 27","startTime":1851.2,"endTime":1856.4,"body":"the city where I live now, and we are"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 27","startTime":1856.4,"endTime":1858.8,"body":"certainly not back into the caves."},{"speaker":"David 29","startTime":1858.8,"endTime":1859.6,"body":"18"},{"speaker":"David 29","startTime":1859.6,"endTime":1865.2,"body":"You know, the COP president took back"},{"speaker":"David 29","startTime":1859.6,"endTime":1865.2,"body":"his comments a few days later but,"},{"speaker":"David 29","startTime":1865.2,"endTime":1871.2,"body":"to me, they were indicative of a part"},{"speaker":"David 29","startTime":1865.2,"endTime":1871.2,"body":"of the world that looks at things"},{"speaker":"David 29","startTime":1871.2,"endTime":1876.4,"body":"this way and is, you know, usually"},{"speaker":"David 29","startTime":1871.2,"endTime":1876.4,"body":"connected with the fossil fuel industry."},{"speaker":"David 29","startTime":1876.4,"endTime":1882.4,"body":"Did you have any takeaways from what you"},{"speaker":"David 29","startTime":1876.4,"endTime":1882.4,"body":"saw happen at COP, especially in relation"},{"speaker":"David 29","startTime":1882.4,"endTime":1884.8,"body":"to cities and urban climate action?"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 29","startTime":1884.8,"endTime":1886.0,"body":"43"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 29","startTime":1886.0,"endTime":1889.2,"body":"Well, we can certainly see"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 29","startTime":1886.0,"endTime":1889.2,"body":"some achievement, right?"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 29","startTime":1889.2,"endTime":1894.4,"body":"For example, like the COP president"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 29","startTime":1889.2,"endTime":1894.4,"body":"said, we have the language on fossil"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 29","startTime":1894.4,"endTime":1900.8,"body":"fuel for the first time in the Agreement,"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 29","startTime":1894.4,"endTime":1900.8,"body":"you know, and that the scale and pace"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 29","startTime":1900.8,"endTime":1903.6,"body":"of change can be stopped or reversed."},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 29","startTime":1903.6,"endTime":1909.2,"body":"And then, if I borrow the word of UN"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 29","startTime":1903.6,"endTime":1909.2,"body":"Climate Change Executive Secretary, Simon"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 29","startTime":1909.2,"endTime":1914.8,"body":"Stiell, he says, \"It certainly signals the"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 29","startTime":1909.2,"endTime":1914.8,"body":"beginning of the end,\" but this probably"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 29","startTime":1914.8,"endTime":1920.4,"body":"is really far from what the world has"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 29","startTime":1914.8,"endTime":1920.4,"body":"been anticipating, and I totally agree"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 29","startTime":1920.4,"endTime":1926.0,"body":"with you, David; this really highlights"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 29","startTime":1920.4,"endTime":1926.0,"body":"that there is a long way to really,"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 29","startTime":1926.0,"endTime":1930.8,"body":"truly mobilize the political will at"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 29","startTime":1926.0,"endTime":1930.8,"body":"international and national level, that is"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 29","startTime":1930.8,"endTime":1933.2,"body":"required to address this climate crisis."},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 29","startTime":1933.2,"endTime":1938.4,"body":"And, I think, all the more, this means"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 29","startTime":1933.2,"endTime":1938.4,"body":"the importance of mobilizing cities"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 29","startTime":1938.4,"endTime":1943.6,"body":"to take action ahead of, and really"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 29","startTime":1938.4,"endTime":1943.6,"body":"above and beyond, what their national"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 29","startTime":1943.6,"endTime":1946.0,"body":"counterparts are really willing to commit."},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 29","startTime":1946.0,"endTime":1951.6,"body":"On the other hand, I think it's"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 29","startTime":1946.0,"endTime":1951.6,"body":"also very important to not be so"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 29","startTime":1951.6,"endTime":1956.8,"body":"naive as to think that actions by"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 29","startTime":1951.6,"endTime":1956.8,"body":"cities alone will solve the problem."},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 29","startTime":1956.8,"endTime":1960.8,"body":"Cities really need support from"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 29","startTime":1956.8,"endTime":1960.8,"body":"the national and their rational"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 29","startTime":1960.8,"endTime":1964.0,"body":"government, within, you know, the"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 29","startTime":1960.8,"endTime":1964.0,"body":"government institutional structure"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 29","startTime":1964.0,"endTime":1966.0,"body":"to fully realize their potential."},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 29","startTime":1966.0,"endTime":1972.4,"body":"But, I mean, cities can really be a very"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 29","startTime":1966.0,"endTime":1972.4,"body":"powerful force, both in terms of reducing"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 29","startTime":1972.4,"endTime":1977.2,"body":"emissions, as well as taking action, for"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 29","startTime":1972.4,"endTime":1977.2,"body":"example, through better spatial planning"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 29","startTime":1977.2,"endTime":1982.0,"body":"of cities that require less traffic and"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 29","startTime":1977.2,"endTime":1982.0,"body":"enable a public transportation system."},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 29","startTime":1982.0,"endTime":1988.4,"body":"And also, to leverage the unique power of"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 29","startTime":1982.0,"endTime":1988.4,"body":"cities in shaping a new culture, I think"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 29","startTime":1988.4,"endTime":1994.8,"body":"because cities can be really the starter"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 29","startTime":1988.4,"endTime":1994.8,"body":"of a new culture and new norms that really"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 29","startTime":1994.8,"endTime":1999.6,"body":"says, \"Climate-conscious choices are not"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 29","startTime":1994.8,"endTime":1999.6,"body":"only necessary but also, you know, cool.\""},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 29","startTime":1999.6,"endTime":2005.6,"body":"And, I do see cities can play a unique"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 29","startTime":1999.6,"endTime":2005.6,"body":"role in this because, traditionally, our"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 29","startTime":2005.6,"endTime":2011.2,"body":"cities have really been the birthplace of"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 29","startTime":2005.6,"endTime":2011.2,"body":"many such new cultures and new movements."},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 29","startTime":2011.2,"endTime":2014.4,"body":"A climate-conscious culture,"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 29","startTime":2011.2,"endTime":2014.4,"body":"started in cities can bring"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 29","startTime":2014.4,"endTime":2016.0,"body":"about a large-scale change."},{"speaker":"David 31","startTime":2016.0,"endTime":2016.8,"body":"43"},{"speaker":"David 31","startTime":2016.8,"endTime":2022.0,"body":"My instincts are similar to yours,"},{"speaker":"David 31","startTime":2016.8,"endTime":2022.0,"body":"that that cultural change is a very"},{"speaker":"David 31","startTime":2022.0,"endTime":2026.8,"body":"powerful thing, saying, \"This is what"},{"speaker":"David 31","startTime":2022.0,"endTime":2026.8,"body":"dealing with climate change looks like.\""},{"speaker":"David 31","startTime":2026.8,"endTime":2031.2,"body":"Do you see some big lessons that"},{"speaker":"David 31","startTime":2026.8,"endTime":2031.2,"body":"mayors and their administrations"},{"speaker":"David 31","startTime":2031.2,"endTime":2035.6,"body":"and the cities they govern can"},{"speaker":"David 31","startTime":2031.2,"endTime":2035.6,"body":"take from the leading examples?"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 32","startTime":2035.6,"endTime":2036.8,"body":"00"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 32","startTime":2036.8,"endTime":2040.8,"body":"What I'm really interested in is"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 32","startTime":2036.8,"endTime":2040.8,"body":"the potential for collaboration."},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 32","startTime":2040.8,"endTime":2043.2,"body":"The first one is"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 32","startTime":2040.8,"endTime":2043.2,"body":"city-to-business collaboration."},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 32","startTime":2043.2,"endTime":2048.0,"body":"Within our Earth Commission, I've been"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 32","startTime":2043.2,"endTime":2048.0,"body":"leading the Working Group that's called"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 32","startTime":2048.0,"endTime":2053.2,"body":"Translation, in which we are trying to"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 32","startTime":2048.0,"endTime":2053.2,"body":"really connect the planetary or earth"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 32","startTime":2053.2,"endTime":2058.0,"body":"system-level target and boundaries down"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 32","startTime":2053.2,"endTime":2058.0,"body":"to the actors like cities and businesses."},{"speaker":"David 32","startTime":2058.0,"endTime":2058.8,"body":"24"},{"speaker":"David 32","startTime":2058.8,"endTime":2062.4,"body":"The work of the Earth"},{"speaker":"David 32","startTime":2058.8,"endTime":2062.4,"body":"Commission is really important."},{"speaker":"David 32","startTime":2062.4,"endTime":2066.4,"body":"Can you just explain, for"},{"speaker":"David 32","startTime":2062.4,"endTime":2066.4,"body":"the benefit of our listeners,"},{"speaker":"David 32","startTime":2066.4,"endTime":2069.2,"body":"what it is and what it does?"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 32","startTime":2069.2,"endTime":2070.4,"body":"29"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 32","startTime":2070.4,"endTime":2074.8,"body":"So, the Earth Commission is a"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 32","startTime":2070.4,"endTime":2074.8,"body":"global team of scientists – both"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 32","startTime":2074.8,"endTime":2076.4,"body":"social and natural scientists."},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 32","startTime":2076.4,"endTime":2081.6,"body":"The focus of Earth Commission is really"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 32","startTime":2076.4,"endTime":2081.6,"body":"to answer what are the environmental"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 32","startTime":2081.6,"endTime":2086.4,"body":"thresholds that we should not cross"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 32","startTime":2081.6,"endTime":2086.4,"body":"in order to safeguard the planet,"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 32","startTime":2086.4,"endTime":2092.4,"body":"that can support human well-being,"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 32","startTime":2086.4,"endTime":2092.4,"body":"and how can we do it in a just way?"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 32","startTime":2092.4,"endTime":2098.8,"body":"So, while trying to do this work, there"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 32","startTime":2092.4,"endTime":2098.8,"body":"was a spin-off study that we worked on."},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 32","startTime":2098.8,"endTime":2103.6,"body":"We discovered that many cities that"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 32","startTime":2098.8,"endTime":2103.6,"body":"actually have this net-zero target also"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 32","startTime":2103.6,"endTime":2108.8,"body":"are those that harm us – really big"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 32","startTime":2103.6,"endTime":2108.8,"body":"emitter cities, Global 500 emitter cities."},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 32","startTime":2108.8,"endTime":2114.4,"body":"So, what is interesting is that, many"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 32","startTime":2108.8,"endTime":2114.4,"body":"of these cities, they have the target,"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 32","startTime":2114.4,"endTime":2118.8,"body":"but the companies that are having"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 32","startTime":2114.4,"endTime":2118.8,"body":"headquarters in those cities, they"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 32","startTime":2118.8,"endTime":2124.8,"body":"don't have net-zero kind of targets,"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 32","startTime":2118.8,"endTime":2124.8,"body":"so we really try to look at, what if"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 32","startTime":2124.8,"endTime":2127.2,"body":"we can bring those ambitions together?"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 32","startTime":2127.2,"endTime":2132.4,"body":"So, if we do bring those city and"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 32","startTime":2127.2,"endTime":2132.4,"body":"business targets to this higher"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 32","startTime":2132.4,"endTime":2137.6,"body":"level of ambition, then actually our"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 32","startTime":2132.4,"endTime":2137.6,"body":"study shows there is a big additional"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 32","startTime":2137.6,"endTime":2140.0,"body":"potential to mitigate the GHG emissions."},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 32","startTime":2140.0,"endTime":2144.8,"body":"[gentle music] So, this is something"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 32","startTime":2140.0,"endTime":2144.8,"body":"I'm, right now, very much interested"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 32","startTime":2144.8,"endTime":2150.0,"body":"in, and we do have a paper"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 32","startTime":2144.8,"endTime":2150.0,"body":"that is under review right now."},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 32","startTime":2150.0,"endTime":2155.6,"body":"So, I think it is really important for"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 32","startTime":2150.0,"endTime":2155.6,"body":"cities, for example, to really reach"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 32","startTime":2155.6,"endTime":2160.8,"body":"out to those major companies that have"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 32","startTime":2155.6,"endTime":2160.8,"body":"headquarters in their location, try to"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 32","startTime":2160.8,"endTime":2165.2,"body":"have this cross-sector interaction, and"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 32","startTime":2160.8,"endTime":2165.2,"body":"then bring everybody onto the journey."},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 32","startTime":2165.2,"endTime":2169.6,"body":"Unless everyone, every city, every"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 32","startTime":2165.2,"endTime":2169.6,"body":"business is really committed to this"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 32","startTime":2169.6,"endTime":2175.6,"body":"kind of goal, then it is not possible for"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 32","startTime":2169.6,"endTime":2175.6,"body":"us to collectively achieve this target."},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 32","startTime":2175.6,"endTime":2179.2,"body":"And then, the second element of"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 32","startTime":2175.6,"endTime":2179.2,"body":"this cross-sector collaboration"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 32","startTime":2179.2,"endTime":2180.4,"body":"is city-to-city networks."},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 32","startTime":2180.4,"endTime":2186.4,"body":"If we look at the heightening sort"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 32","startTime":2180.4,"endTime":2186.4,"body":"of need for the world to be really"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 32","startTime":2186.4,"endTime":2191.2,"body":"prepared for the different kinds of"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 32","startTime":2186.4,"endTime":2191.2,"body":"shocks and hazards, almost all the"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 32","startTime":2191.2,"endTime":2196.8,"body":"predictions are saying we will be having"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 32","startTime":2191.2,"endTime":2196.8,"body":"more and more severe and more frequent"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 32","startTime":2196.8,"endTime":2201.2,"body":"extreme weather events, for example,"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 32","startTime":2196.8,"endTime":2201.2,"body":"heat waves flood and wildfire, etc."},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 32","startTime":2201.2,"endTime":2206.0,"body":"And, we know cities are particularly"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 32","startTime":2201.2,"endTime":2206.0,"body":"vulnerable to these kinds of hazards,"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 32","startTime":2206.0,"endTime":2211.2,"body":"but the thing is, with the increasing"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 32","startTime":2206.0,"endTime":2211.2,"body":"number and frequency of these hazards,"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 32","startTime":2211.2,"endTime":2217.2,"body":"it is very, very hard for each and"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 32","startTime":2211.2,"endTime":2217.2,"body":"every city to prepare for each and"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 32","startTime":2217.2,"endTime":2219.6,"body":"every hazard that will be coming."},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 32","startTime":2219.6,"endTime":2220.8,"body":"[music fades out]"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 32","startTime":2220.8,"endTime":2225.2,"body":"So, this really brings me to"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 32","startTime":2220.8,"endTime":2225.2,"body":"think about the necessity of"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 32","startTime":2225.2,"endTime":2228.8,"body":"trying to build a networked"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 32","startTime":2225.2,"endTime":2228.8,"body":"resilience across different cities."},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 32","startTime":2228.8,"endTime":2234.8,"body":"So, imagine if we have a group of"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 32","startTime":2228.8,"endTime":2234.8,"body":"cities that have formed this kind of"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 32","startTime":2234.8,"endTime":2239.6,"body":"network and they can go beyond just"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 32","startTime":2234.8,"endTime":2239.6,"body":"sharing information or learning from"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 32","startTime":2239.6,"endTime":2244.0,"body":"each other, but really actively plan"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 32","startTime":2239.6,"endTime":2244.0,"body":"something and then implement something"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 32","startTime":2244.0,"endTime":2246.8,"body":"together in the event of external shocks."},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 32","startTime":2246.8,"endTime":2253.2,"body":"So, if within the network, one city is"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 32","startTime":2246.8,"endTime":2253.2,"body":"hit or two cities are hit, there are"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 32","startTime":2253.2,"endTime":2259.2,"body":"still many others can actually come to"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 32","startTime":2253.2,"endTime":2259.2,"body":"help, and I think this kind of building"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 32","startTime":2259.2,"endTime":2263.6,"body":"networked resilience is something that"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 32","startTime":2259.2,"endTime":2263.6,"body":"we need to explore, going forward."},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 32","startTime":2263.6,"endTime":2269.2,"body":"But, I think most of the focus, for"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 32","startTime":2263.6,"endTime":2269.2,"body":"now, is really on sharing information"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 32","startTime":2269.2,"endTime":2272.8,"body":"and adopting similar protocol"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 32","startTime":2269.2,"endTime":2272.8,"body":"planning – those sorts of things."},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 32","startTime":2272.8,"endTime":2278.8,"body":"So, I would really think the next step"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 32","startTime":2272.8,"endTime":2278.8,"body":"for these kinds of networks should really"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 32","startTime":2278.8,"endTime":2283.6,"body":"be trying to explore the possibility"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 32","startTime":2278.8,"endTime":2283.6,"body":"of truly planning and acting together."},{"speaker":"David 35","startTime":2283.6,"endTime":2284.4,"body":"39"},{"speaker":"David 35","startTime":2284.4,"endTime":2289.2,"body":"It's a really interesting point, and"},{"speaker":"David 35","startTime":2284.4,"endTime":2289.2,"body":"that article is well worth reading."},{"speaker":"David 35","startTime":2289.2,"endTime":2295.2,"body":"You know, one precedent for this might"},{"speaker":"David 35","startTime":2289.2,"endTime":2295.2,"body":"be how C40 Cities reacted early in 2020"},{"speaker":"David 35","startTime":2295.2,"endTime":2300.0,"body":"to COVID because, under the leadership"},{"speaker":"David 35","startTime":2295.2,"endTime":2300.0,"body":"of Mayor Garcetti, the then-chair, and"},{"speaker":"David 35","startTime":2300.0,"endTime":2305.2,"body":"Mayor Sala from Milan, C40 Cities actually"},{"speaker":"David 35","startTime":2300.0,"endTime":2305.2,"body":"worked together in quite detailed ways."},{"speaker":"David 35","startTime":2305.2,"endTime":2310.0,"body":"One way I remember very clearly"},{"speaker":"David 35","startTime":2305.2,"endTime":2310.0,"body":"is Seoul helped Seattle learn how"},{"speaker":"David 35","startTime":2310.0,"endTime":2314.8,"body":"to do drive-in testing for COVID"},{"speaker":"David 35","startTime":2310.0,"endTime":2314.8,"body":"because Seoul was ahead of Seattle."},{"speaker":"David 35","startTime":2314.8,"endTime":2320.0,"body":"And, although that's a different crisis,"},{"speaker":"David 35","startTime":2314.8,"endTime":2320.0,"body":"it does speak to the possibility of"},{"speaker":"David 35","startTime":2320.0,"endTime":2322.0,"body":"the collaboration you're speaking to."},{"speaker":"David 35","startTime":2322.0,"endTime":2325.2,"body":"But, just on that point,"},{"speaker":"David 35","startTime":2322.0,"endTime":2325.2,"body":"you mentioned wildfires."},{"speaker":"David 35","startTime":2325.2,"endTime":2327.2,"body":"You know, I'm in Canada."},{"speaker":"David 35","startTime":2327.2,"endTime":2330.0,"body":"It was horrific what was happening here."},{"speaker":"David 35","startTime":2330.0,"endTime":2334.0,"body":"We saw New York, Philadelphia, Boston,"},{"speaker":"David 35","startTime":2330.0,"endTime":2334.0,"body":"Toronto, Montreal working together"},{"speaker":"David 35","startTime":2334.0,"endTime":2338.4,"body":"last year during the wildfires"},{"speaker":"David 35","startTime":2334.0,"endTime":2338.4,"body":"because they were all receiving smoke"},{"speaker":"David 35","startTime":2338.4,"endTime":2340.4,"body":"from thousands of kilometres away."},{"speaker":"David 35","startTime":2340.4,"endTime":2345.2,"body":"There are floods, there's heat, there's"},{"speaker":"David 35","startTime":2340.4,"endTime":2345.2,"body":"increasing evidence of the spread of"},{"speaker":"David 35","startTime":2345.2,"endTime":2347.2,"body":"disease, potentially because of climate."},{"speaker":"David 35","startTime":2347.2,"endTime":2352.0,"body":"One question people have is,"},{"speaker":"David 35","startTime":2347.2,"endTime":2352.0,"body":"\"How bad is it going to get?\""},{"speaker":"David 35","startTime":2352.0,"endTime":2355.6,"body":"and, as a scientist, perhaps"},{"speaker":"David 35","startTime":2352.0,"endTime":2355.6,"body":"you have some insight."},{"speaker":"David 35","startTime":2355.6,"endTime":2358.0,"body":"Are we close to tipping points?"},{"speaker":"David 35","startTime":2358.0,"endTime":2362.4,"body":"What is a tipping point in"},{"speaker":"David 35","startTime":2358.0,"endTime":2362.4,"body":"the context of climate change?"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 37","startTime":2362.4,"endTime":2363.6,"body":"06"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 37","startTime":2363.6,"endTime":2370.0,"body":"I think the tipping point is the moment or"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 37","startTime":2363.6,"endTime":2370.0,"body":"a critical threshold when a small change"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 37","startTime":2370.0,"endTime":2375.2,"body":"or series of small changes become really"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 37","startTime":2370.0,"endTime":2375.2,"body":"significant enough to actually cause a"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 37","startTime":2375.2,"endTime":2380.8,"body":"larger and often dramatic change, and"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 37","startTime":2375.2,"endTime":2380.8,"body":"it's likely it's a point of no return."},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 37","startTime":2380.8,"endTime":2385.6,"body":"And, once you have crossed a tipping"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 37","startTime":2380.8,"endTime":2385.6,"body":"point, things can't really easily"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 37","startTime":2385.6,"endTime":2391.6,"body":"go back to how they were functioning"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 37","startTime":2385.6,"endTime":2391.6,"body":"before and there is a new set of"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 37","startTime":2391.6,"endTime":2394.0,"body":"conditions or realities to really handle."},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 37","startTime":2394.0,"endTime":2399.2,"body":"So, once you have crossed these tipping"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 37","startTime":2394.0,"endTime":2399.2,"body":"points, they are very often irreversible."},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 37","startTime":2399.2,"endTime":2404.0,"body":"If you look at climate-related tipping"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 37","startTime":2399.2,"endTime":2404.0,"body":"points, according to the analysis of"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 37","startTime":2404.0,"endTime":2410.0,"body":"David McKay, who is also a research fellow"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 37","startTime":2404.0,"endTime":2410.0,"body":"at Earth Commission, four to five major"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 37","startTime":2410.0,"endTime":2416.0,"body":"tipping points are already at risk of"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 37","startTime":2410.0,"endTime":2416.0,"body":"crossing due to the warming right now, and"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 37","startTime":2416.0,"endTime":2418.8,"body":"before, even we crossed the 1.5 degrees."},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 37","startTime":2418.8,"endTime":2423.6,"body":"So, what does crossing this tipping"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 37","startTime":2418.8,"endTime":2423.6,"body":"point mean for the Earth system?"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 37","startTime":2423.6,"endTime":2428.4,"body":"For example, the collapse of the"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 37","startTime":2423.6,"endTime":2428.4,"body":"Greenland ice sheet, it is melting"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 37","startTime":2428.4,"endTime":2432.8,"body":"at an accelerated pace, and Greenland"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 37","startTime":2428.4,"endTime":2432.8,"body":"melting is changing the Atlantic"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 37","startTime":2432.8,"endTime":2436.8,"body":"Ocean current, which really actually"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 37","startTime":2432.8,"endTime":2436.8,"body":"controls the thermostat of Europe."},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 37","startTime":2436.8,"endTime":2438.8,"body":"And, this can be irreversible."},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 37","startTime":2438.8,"endTime":2443.6,"body":"And, the changing Atlantic Ocean current"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 37","startTime":2438.8,"endTime":2443.6,"body":"reduces the rainfall over the Amazon"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 37","startTime":2443.6,"endTime":2448.8,"body":"rainforest, which is now dying out and"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 37","startTime":2443.6,"endTime":2448.8,"body":"losing its ability to store carbon."},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 37","startTime":2448.8,"endTime":2453.2,"body":"And, the Atlantic circulation is"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 37","startTime":2448.8,"endTime":2453.2,"body":"also linked to the collapse of"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 37","startTime":2453.2,"endTime":2457.6,"body":"part of the Western Antarctic ice"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 37","startTime":2453.2,"endTime":2457.6,"body":"sheet and Antarctica, which would"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 37","startTime":2457.6,"endTime":2459.6,"body":"dramatically raise the sea-level rise."},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 37","startTime":2459.6,"endTime":2464.4,"body":"And, we know that scientists think"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 37","startTime":2459.6,"endTime":2464.4,"body":"that, if the Greenland ice sheet"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 37","startTime":2464.4,"endTime":2469.2,"body":"is melted completely, that would"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 37","startTime":2464.4,"endTime":2469.2,"body":"contribute to more than 7 metres of"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 37","startTime":2469.2,"endTime":2471.6,"body":"sea-level rise to the world's oceans."},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 37","startTime":2471.6,"endTime":2476.8,"body":"And, just think about many of our"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 37","startTime":2471.6,"endTime":2476.8,"body":"cities, you know, located along the"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 37","startTime":2476.8,"endTime":2482.8,"body":"coast and river mouth, and many of them"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 37","startTime":2476.8,"endTime":2482.8,"body":"are often just above the sea level."},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 37","startTime":2482.8,"endTime":2488.4,"body":"So, in short, I think the Greenland ice"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 37","startTime":2482.8,"endTime":2488.4,"body":"sheet tipping point being crossed means"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 37","startTime":2488.4,"endTime":2494.0,"body":"it might be set into a process of an"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 37","startTime":2488.4,"endTime":2494.0,"body":"irreversible domino effect across several"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 37","startTime":2494.0,"endTime":2498.0,"body":"other systems as well, with really,"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 37","startTime":2494.0,"endTime":2498.0,"body":"really devastating socioeconomic impacts."},{"speaker":"David 39","startTime":2498.0,"endTime":2498.8,"body":"13"},{"speaker":"David 39","startTime":2498.8,"endTime":2504.4,"body":"[somber music] At C40, we've experienced,"},{"speaker":"David 39","startTime":2498.8,"endTime":2504.4,"body":"over the past few years, a huge increase"},{"speaker":"David 39","startTime":2504.4,"endTime":2507.2,"body":"in abuse online and very strange theories."},{"speaker":"David 39","startTime":2507.2,"endTime":2512.0,"body":"You know, we work a lot around urban"},{"speaker":"David 39","startTime":2507.2,"endTime":2512.0,"body":"spatial planning, particularly the"},{"speaker":"David 39","startTime":2512.0,"endTime":2517.2,"body":"idea of the 15-minute city, so cities"},{"speaker":"David 39","startTime":2512.0,"endTime":2517.2,"body":"that are relatively compact and people"},{"speaker":"David 39","startTime":2517.2,"endTime":2523.2,"body":"can go about and get their daily"},{"speaker":"David 39","startTime":2517.2,"endTime":2523.2,"body":"needs met without having to own a car."},{"speaker":"David 39","startTime":2523.2,"endTime":2527.2,"body":"And, it's become a huge, in"},{"speaker":"David 39","startTime":2523.2,"endTime":2527.2,"body":"some circles, conspiracy theory."},{"speaker":"David 39","startTime":2527.2,"endTime":2530.8,"body":"It's bizarre, but some of"},{"speaker":"David 39","startTime":2527.2,"endTime":2530.8,"body":"this verges onto abuse."},{"speaker":"David 39","startTime":2530.8,"endTime":2531.6,"body":"Two questions."},{"speaker":"David 39","startTime":2531.6,"endTime":2535.2,"body":"One – as a prominent climate"},{"speaker":"David 39","startTime":2531.6,"endTime":2535.2,"body":"scientist, is this something"},{"speaker":"David 39","startTime":2535.2,"endTime":2536.8,"body":"you're concerned about, personally?"},{"speaker":"David 39","startTime":2536.8,"endTime":2542.4,"body":"And secondly – how do we ensure that"},{"speaker":"David 39","startTime":2536.8,"endTime":2542.4,"body":"scientists feel safe to speak up and"},{"speaker":"David 39","startTime":2542.4,"endTime":2547.2,"body":"share their knowledge publicly and"},{"speaker":"David 39","startTime":2542.4,"endTime":2547.2,"body":"ensure that we can, you know, benefit"},{"speaker":"David 39","startTime":2547.2,"endTime":2552.4,"body":"from the knowledge and make the change"},{"speaker":"David 39","startTime":2547.2,"endTime":2552.4,"body":"that's needed before it's too late?"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 40","startTime":2552.4,"endTime":2553.6,"body":"05"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 40","startTime":2553.6,"endTime":2554.0,"body":"Indeed."},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 40","startTime":2554.0,"endTime":2558.8,"body":"I think more vocal climate scientists,"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 40","startTime":2554.0,"endTime":2558.8,"body":"including many women and many of"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 40","startTime":2558.8,"endTime":2563.6,"body":"them are my colleagues and friends,"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 40","startTime":2558.8,"endTime":2563.6,"body":"they became the subject of vicious"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 40","startTime":2563.6,"endTime":2567.6,"body":"attacks on the internet, and"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 40","startTime":2563.6,"endTime":2567.6,"body":"some even received death threats."},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 40","startTime":2567.6,"endTime":2573.2,"body":"One example of that is Will Steffen,"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 40","startTime":2567.6,"endTime":2573.2,"body":"who passed away last year and who"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 40","startTime":2573.2,"endTime":2578.4,"body":"was a world-renowned Earth system"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 40","startTime":2573.2,"endTime":2578.4,"body":"scientist here at ANU, and who was a"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 40","startTime":2578.4,"endTime":2580.4,"body":"prominent advocate for climate actions."},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 40","startTime":2580.4,"endTime":2586.0,"body":"He really suffered from such threats"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 40","startTime":2580.4,"endTime":2586.0,"body":"to the extent that, when he was the"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 40","startTime":2586.0,"endTime":2589.6,"body":"director of the Australian National"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 40","startTime":2586.0,"endTime":2589.6,"body":"University Climate Institute, the"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 40","startTime":2589.6,"endTime":2595.2,"body":"corridor that led to his office had"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 40","startTime":2589.6,"endTime":2595.2,"body":"to be installed with a security door,"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 40","startTime":2595.2,"endTime":2600.4,"body":"and we know that many female climate"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 40","startTime":2595.2,"endTime":2600.4,"body":"scientists said they have received threats"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 40","startTime":2600.4,"endTime":2602.4,"body":"relating specifically to their gender."},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 40","startTime":2602.4,"endTime":2608.0,"body":"And, I think this is, in a way, a"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 40","startTime":2602.4,"endTime":2608.0,"body":"phenomenon of our deeply polarized"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 40","startTime":2608.0,"endTime":2612.4,"body":"society and associated to the"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 40","startTime":2608.0,"endTime":2612.4,"body":"radicalization of some people, and I"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 40","startTime":2612.4,"endTime":2617.2,"body":"think more support and positive voices"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 40","startTime":2612.4,"endTime":2617.2,"body":"from society is really, really crucial."},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 40","startTime":2617.2,"endTime":2621.2,"body":"I can see several things"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 40","startTime":2617.2,"endTime":2621.2,"body":"that probably can be done."},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 40","startTime":2621.2,"endTime":2626.8,"body":"For example, we really need to realize"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 40","startTime":2621.2,"endTime":2626.8,"body":"that scientists are people who are trying"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 40","startTime":2626.8,"endTime":2632.4,"body":"to find out how things would work and"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 40","startTime":2626.8,"endTime":2632.4,"body":"communicate their findings and sound the"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 40","startTime":2632.4,"endTime":2635.2,"body":"alarm, based on what they have found."},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 40","startTime":2635.2,"endTime":2640.8,"body":"And, what to do about this information"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 40","startTime":2635.2,"endTime":2640.8,"body":"is very often the choice of society,"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 40","startTime":2640.8,"endTime":2645.2,"body":"and attacking the canary in the"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 40","startTime":2640.8,"endTime":2645.2,"body":"mine doesn't really solve the"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 40","startTime":2645.2,"endTime":2647.2,"body":"gas-leaking problem of your mind."},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 40","startTime":2647.2,"endTime":2652.4,"body":"So, that's a very important thing,"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 40","startTime":2647.2,"endTime":2652.4,"body":"I think, for us all to remember."},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 40","startTime":2652.4,"endTime":2658.0,"body":"And, I think we need a very clear and"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 40","startTime":2652.4,"endTime":2658.0,"body":"unequivocal stance from our leaders"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 40","startTime":2658.0,"endTime":2663.2,"body":"across all the spectrum that, even if"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 40","startTime":2658.0,"endTime":2663.2,"body":"one disagrees with one another, such"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 40","startTime":2663.2,"endTime":2666.8,"body":"behaviour of abusing and threatening"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 40","startTime":2663.2,"endTime":2666.8,"body":"is really, really unacceptable."},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 40","startTime":2666.8,"endTime":2672.8,"body":"People should know this by now, but I"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 40","startTime":2666.8,"endTime":2672.8,"body":"think it is important that our political"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 40","startTime":2672.8,"endTime":2679.2,"body":"leaders actually voice a clear voice in"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 40","startTime":2672.8,"endTime":2679.2,"body":"that, and I think they also need to be"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 40","startTime":2679.2,"endTime":2684.4,"body":"very, very careful not to really propel"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 40","startTime":2679.2,"endTime":2684.4,"body":"the misinformation and hatred in society."},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 40","startTime":2684.4,"endTime":2689.6,"body":"The general public also has a role"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 40","startTime":2684.4,"endTime":2689.6,"body":"to play here, for example, shaping"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 40","startTime":2689.6,"endTime":2694.8,"body":"a very strong consensus as a society"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 40","startTime":2689.6,"endTime":2694.8,"body":"for which the silent majority probably"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 40","startTime":2694.8,"endTime":2700.0,"body":"needs to step up a bit and voice"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 40","startTime":2694.8,"endTime":2700.0,"body":"their support for scientists who"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 40","startTime":2700.0,"endTime":2702.4,"body":"are trying to uncover the truth."},{"speaker":"David 42","startTime":2702.4,"endTime":2703.2,"body":"23"},{"speaker":"David 42","startTime":2703.2,"endTime":2708.4,"body":"[driving music] Well, one of the"},{"speaker":"David 42","startTime":2703.2,"endTime":2708.4,"body":"things that gives me hope about the"},{"speaker":"David 42","startTime":2708.4,"endTime":2712.8,"body":"city-based climate movement is not just"},{"speaker":"David 42","startTime":2708.4,"endTime":2712.8,"body":"the technical aspects we've discussed."},{"speaker":"David 42","startTime":2712.8,"endTime":2719.2,"body":"It's more along the lines of the culture,"},{"speaker":"David 42","startTime":2712.8,"endTime":2719.2,"body":"and I think it speaks to the point"},{"speaker":"David 42","startTime":2719.2,"endTime":2724.4,"body":"you just made about we have to create"},{"speaker":"David 42","startTime":2719.2,"endTime":2724.4,"body":"an environment where scientists and"},{"speaker":"David 42","startTime":2724.4,"endTime":2730.0,"body":"knowledge are respected and speak up"},{"speaker":"David 42","startTime":2724.4,"endTime":2730.0,"body":"when we see hatred or abuse being spread."},{"speaker":"David 42","startTime":2730.0,"endTime":2733.6,"body":"And, mayors reach across national"},{"speaker":"David 42","startTime":2730.0,"endTime":2733.6,"body":"boundaries sometimes when the"},{"speaker":"David 42","startTime":2733.6,"endTime":2738.0,"body":"national governments aren't speaking,"},{"speaker":"David 42","startTime":2733.6,"endTime":2738.0,"body":"and it gives me hope because it"},{"speaker":"David 42","startTime":2738.0,"endTime":2740.0,"body":"sets a standard for civility."},{"speaker":"David 42","startTime":2740.0,"endTime":2744.4,"body":"You model them in your own"},{"speaker":"David 42","startTime":2740.0,"endTime":2744.4,"body":"behaviour, Professor, and it's been"},{"speaker":"David 42","startTime":2744.4,"endTime":2747.6,"body":"a delight to have you on Cities 1.5."},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 43","startTime":2747.6,"endTime":2748.8,"body":"07"},{"speaker":"Xuemei Bai 43","startTime":2748.8,"endTime":2751.6,"body":"Thank you very much, David [music ends]"},{"speaker":"David 43","startTime":2751.6,"endTime":2752.4,"body":"12"},{"speaker":"David 43","startTime":2752.4,"endTime":2756.8,"body":"[upbeat, energetic music] As climate"},{"speaker":"David 43","startTime":2752.4,"endTime":2756.8,"body":"impacts rise beyond the models projected"},{"speaker":"David 43","startTime":2756.8,"endTime":2760.8,"body":"by scientists, our planet is forced"},{"speaker":"David 43","startTime":2756.8,"endTime":2760.8,"body":"into completely unknown territory."},{"speaker":"David 43","startTime":2760.8,"endTime":2766.4,"body":"What we do know is that the need to"},{"speaker":"David 43","startTime":2760.8,"endTime":2766.4,"body":"urgently shift from dirty, polluting"},{"speaker":"David 43","startTime":2766.4,"endTime":2770.4,"body":"fossil fuels to clean, renewable"},{"speaker":"David 43","startTime":2766.4,"endTime":2770.4,"body":"sources has never been greater."},{"speaker":"David 43","startTime":2770.4,"endTime":2774.0,"body":"Despite significant pushback from"},{"speaker":"David 43","startTime":2770.4,"endTime":2774.0,"body":"petrostates and the fossil fuel"},{"speaker":"David 43","startTime":2774.0,"endTime":2778.0,"body":"industry, COP28 closed with a"},{"speaker":"David 43","startTime":2774.0,"endTime":2778.0,"body":"final agreement that signalled a"},{"speaker":"David 43","startTime":2778.0,"endTime":2780.0,"body":"transition away from fossil fuels."},{"speaker":"David 43","startTime":2780.0,"endTime":2785.6,"body":"This is thanks, at least in part, to"},{"speaker":"David 43","startTime":2780.0,"endTime":2785.6,"body":"the voices ringing out from cities."},{"speaker":"David 43","startTime":2785.6,"endTime":2790.8,"body":"By forming coalitions and demanding"},{"speaker":"David 43","startTime":2785.6,"endTime":2790.8,"body":"to be heard at the highest of levels,"},{"speaker":"David 43","startTime":2790.8,"endTime":2795.2,"body":"they are showing that they can"},{"speaker":"David 43","startTime":2790.8,"endTime":2795.2,"body":"influence their nation-states to act."},{"speaker":"David 43","startTime":2795.2,"endTime":2800.0,"body":"Cities are at the forefront of"},{"speaker":"David 43","startTime":2795.2,"endTime":2800.0,"body":"climate action, but they are also"},{"speaker":"David 43","startTime":2800.0,"endTime":2802.0,"body":"the frontline of climate breakdown."},{"speaker":"David 43","startTime":2802.0,"endTime":2805.6,"body":"The work of mayors has"},{"speaker":"David 43","startTime":2802.0,"endTime":2805.6,"body":"never been more vital."},{"speaker":"David 43","startTime":2805.6,"endTime":2806.4,"body":"[music ends]"},{"speaker":"David 43","startTime":2806.4,"endTime":2811.6,"body":"[Cities 1.5 main theme plays] On"},{"speaker":"David 43","startTime":2806.4,"endTime":2811.6,"body":"the next episode, we revisit a topic"},{"speaker":"David 43","startTime":2811.6,"endTime":2817.2,"body":"that's at the heart of Cities 1.5 and"},{"speaker":"David 43","startTime":2811.6,"endTime":2817.2,"body":"the Journal of City Climate Policy"},{"speaker":"David 43","startTime":2817.2,"endTime":2821.2,"body":"and Economy – ecological economics,"},{"speaker":"David 43","startTime":2817.2,"endTime":2821.2,"body":"which is a theory that privileges"},{"speaker":"David 43","startTime":2821.2,"endTime":2826.4,"body":"people and the planet over growth, a"},{"speaker":"David 43","startTime":2821.2,"endTime":2826.4,"body":"very different framework than the one"},{"speaker":"David 43","startTime":2826.4,"endTime":2829.2,"body":"most of our planet currently runs on."},{"speaker":"David 43","startTime":2829.2,"endTime":2834.0,"body":"Professor Peter Victor is a world-leading"},{"speaker":"David 43","startTime":2829.2,"endTime":2834.0,"body":"expert who recently published an article"},{"speaker":"David 43","startTime":2834.0,"endTime":2838.8,"body":"in the Journal on one of the founding"},{"speaker":"David 43","startTime":2834.0,"endTime":2838.8,"body":"thinkers of ecological economics,"},{"speaker":"David 43","startTime":2838.8,"endTime":2840.8,"body":"titled Herman Daly's Great Debates."},{"speaker":"David 43","startTime":2840.8,"endTime":2842.4,"body":"Tune in next week."},{"speaker":"David 43","startTime":2842.4,"endTime":2844.8,"body":"You won't want to miss it."},{"speaker":"David 43","startTime":2844.8,"endTime":2845.6,"body":"[music continues]"},{"speaker":"David 43","startTime":2845.6,"endTime":2850.4,"body":"This has been Cities 1.5, leading global"},{"speaker":"David 43","startTime":2845.6,"endTime":2850.4,"body":"change through local climate action."},{"speaker":"David 43","startTime":2850.4,"endTime":2851.6,"body":"I'm David Miller."},{"speaker":"David 43","startTime":2851.6,"endTime":2857.2,"body":"I was the Mayor of Toronto, Canada,"},{"speaker":"David 43","startTime":2851.6,"endTime":2857.2,"body":"and I know, firsthand, the role cities"},{"speaker":"David 43","startTime":2857.2,"endTime":2860.0,"body":"can play in solving the climate crisis."},{"speaker":"David 43","startTime":2860.0,"endTime":2865.6,"body":"I'm the Editor in Chief of the Journal"},{"speaker":"David 43","startTime":2860.0,"endTime":2865.6,"body":"of City Climate Policy and Economy,"},{"speaker":"David 43","startTime":2865.6,"endTime":2870.8,"body":"published by the University of Toronto"},{"speaker":"David 43","startTime":2865.6,"endTime":2870.8,"body":"Press in collaboration with the C40 Centre"},{"speaker":"David 43","startTime":2870.8,"endTime":2875.6,"body":"for City Climate Policy and Economy,"},{"speaker":"David 43","startTime":2870.8,"endTime":2875.6,"body":"where I'm also the Managing Director."},{"speaker":"David 43","startTime":2875.6,"endTime":2880.8,"body":"C40's mission is to help our member"},{"speaker":"David 43","startTime":2875.6,"endTime":2880.8,"body":"cities halve their emissions within a"},{"speaker":"David 43","startTime":2880.8,"endTime":2884.8,"body":"decade, while improving equity, building"},{"speaker":"David 43","startTime":2880.8,"endTime":2884.8,"body":"resilience, and creating the conditions"},{"speaker":"David 43","startTime":2884.8,"endTime":2886.8,"body":"for everyone, everywhere to thrive."},{"speaker":"David 43","startTime":2886.8,"endTime":2891.6,"body":"[music continues] Cities 1.5 is produced"},{"speaker":"David 43","startTime":2886.8,"endTime":2891.6,"body":"by University of Toronto Press in"},{"speaker":"David 43","startTime":2891.6,"endTime":2896.8,"body":"association with the Journal of City"},{"speaker":"David 43","startTime":2891.6,"endTime":2896.8,"body":"Climate Policy and Economy and C40 Cities."},{"speaker":"David 43","startTime":2896.8,"endTime":2901.2,"body":"This podcast is produced by Jessica"},{"speaker":"David 43","startTime":2896.8,"endTime":2901.2,"body":"Schmidt, and our executive producers"},{"speaker":"David 43","startTime":2901.2,"endTime":2903.6,"body":"are Peggy Whitfield and Dali Carmichael."},{"speaker":"David 43","startTime":2903.6,"endTime":2906.0,"body":"Our music is by Lorna Gilfedder."},{"speaker":"David 43","startTime":2906.0,"endTime":2911.2,"body":"The fight for an equitable and resilient"},{"speaker":"David 43","startTime":2906.0,"endTime":2911.2,"body":"world is closer than you think."},{"speaker":"David 43","startTime":2911.2,"endTime":2916.0,"body":"To learn more, visit the show's"},{"speaker":"David 43","startTime":2911.2,"endTime":2916.0,"body":"website, linked in the episode notes."},{"speaker":"David 43","startTime":2916.0,"endTime":2917.6,"body":"See you next time."},{"speaker":"David 43","startTime":2917.6,"endTime":2920.0,"body":"[main theme music continues then ends]"}]}