{"version":"1.0.0","segments":[{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":0.84,"endTime":2.76,"body":"Yes, indeed, dear"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":0.84,"endTime":2.76,"body":"TRAPPIST, welcome back to what"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":2.76,"endTime":6.18,"body":"many people are calling episode"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":2.76,"endTime":6.18,"body":"96 of the real advisor podcast,"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":6.18,"endTime":10.86,"body":"T, R, A, P, trap. My name is"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":6.18,"endTime":10.86,"body":"indeed lick Lincoln. And joining"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":10.86,"endTime":15.0,"body":"me in a catastrophic Digital"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":10.86,"endTime":15.0,"body":"Studio of doom are the three"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":15.0,"endTime":19.62,"body":"other horsemen, Alan, the"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":15.0,"endTime":19.62,"body":"storyteller, Smith, Carl della"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":19.62,"endTime":24.02,"body":"voce, the voice would you and"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":19.62,"endTime":24.02,"body":"and the ultra heart. Now,"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":24.02,"endTime":28.88,"body":"gentlemen, we have a show packed"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":24.02,"endTime":28.88,"body":"full of app absolutely nothing."},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":28.88,"endTime":32.3,"body":"So let's get it underway with"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":28.88,"endTime":32.3,"body":"another high energy review. Read"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":32.36,"endTime":36.14,"body":"out my very good friend the"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":32.36,"endTime":36.14,"body":"right honorable Mr. Andrew Usain"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":36.14,"endTime":36.62,"body":"Hart,"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":37.58,"endTime":40.36,"body":"thank you very much."},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":37.58,"endTime":40.36,"body":"Nicholas, today we have one"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":40.36,"endTime":45.82,"body":"review from Ice and Fire. 78 six"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":40.36,"endTime":45.82,"body":"out of five stars. These four"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":45.82,"endTime":48.82,"body":"are introducing the world to a"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":45.82,"endTime":48.82,"body":"revolution in the industry by"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":48.82,"endTime":51.52,"body":"promoting proper financial"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":48.82,"endTime":51.52,"body":"planning focusing on goals,"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":51.52,"endTime":54.88,"body":"dreams and aspirations, not"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":51.52,"endTime":54.88,"body":"product and sales. It's a great"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":54.88,"endTime":58.3,"body":"podcast with a very witty and"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":54.88,"endTime":58.3,"body":"well scripted format and"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":58.3,"endTime":62.34,"body":"excellent banter and guests."},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":58.3,"endTime":62.34,"body":"What more? Back to you."},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":62.34,"endTime":66.0,"body":"Nicholas, well scripted, if any,"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":62.34,"endTime":66.0,"body":"if any, thank you. That's a"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":66.0,"endTime":68.64,"body":"lovely, lovely, lovely review"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":66.0,"endTime":68.64,"body":"from Ice and Fire seven chair"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":68.64,"endTime":70.8,"body":"please. To keep the reviews"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":68.64,"endTime":70.8,"body":"coming in, we love to read them"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":70.8,"endTime":74.22,"body":"out, good or bad. We last"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":70.8,"endTime":74.22,"body":"episode, Episode 95 we had a"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":74.22,"endTime":76.86,"body":"slightly negative review. We"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":74.22,"endTime":76.86,"body":"were we don't care. We really"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":76.86,"endTime":79.8,"body":"don't care. Okay, let's get the"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":76.86,"endTime":79.8,"body":"show on the road and put some a"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":79.8,"endTime":83.48,"body":"timestamp on the last show"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":79.8,"endTime":83.48,"body":"before trap live happens. I"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":83.48,"endTime":88.28,"body":"believe on that note, Mr. Smith,"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":83.48,"endTime":88.28,"body":"you have a ticket going well, a"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":88.28,"endTime":90.02,"body":"couple of tickets, actually. But"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":90.2,"endTime":92.66,"body":"has the gentleman"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":90.2,"endTime":92.66,"body":"let us know where we are in the"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":92.66,"endTime":93.5,"body":"ticket sales?"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":93.86,"endTime":95.3,"body":"Brian in the box,"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":95.48,"endTime":95.96,"body":"yeah,"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":96.02,"endTime":102.98,"body":"Brian. Brian, now,"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":96.02,"endTime":102.98,"body":"don't do that. Put it away. Come"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":106.9,"endTime":114.64,"body":"it back in good plan. Yes, it's"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":106.9,"endTime":114.64,"body":"good. Brian in the ticket office"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":114.64,"endTime":118.18,"body":"has confirmed we have officially"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":114.64,"endTime":118.18,"body":"sold out for trap Live, which is"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":118.36,"endTime":120.64,"body":"not a not a billy bullshit, it"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":118.36,"endTime":120.64,"body":"has happened. Thank you."},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":120.64,"endTime":123.54,"body":"TRAPPIST can't wait to see you"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":120.64,"endTime":123.54,"body":"soon, so good news. So no,"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":123.72,"endTime":124.26,"body":"fantastic"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":124.26,"endTime":126.24,"body":"if you can't make"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":124.26,"endTime":126.24,"body":"it and you've got a ticket,"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":126.66,"endTime":129.96,"body":"yeah. So completely"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":126.66,"endTime":129.96,"body":"sold out. Thanks Brian for"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":129.96,"endTime":132.66,"body":"letting us know he's been"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":129.96,"endTime":132.66,"body":"monitoring the ticket sales for"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":132.66,"endTime":136.86,"body":"weeks and weeks. So complete"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":132.66,"endTime":136.86,"body":"sell out in a great location."},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":137.1,"endTime":140.6,"body":"But of course, as inevitable"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":137.1,"endTime":140.6,"body":"happens as we get closer to the"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":140.66,"endTime":143.36,"body":"date, but the time this goes"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":140.66,"endTime":143.36,"body":"out, it's less than a week away."},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":144.92,"endTime":148.34,"body":"Life changes. 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They"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":150.86,"endTime":154.76,"body":"can't make it anymore, and"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":150.86,"endTime":154.76,"body":"they'd be happy to donate their"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":154.82,"endTime":159.5,"body":"tickets on a first come first"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":154.82,"endTime":159.5,"body":"served basis to those, ideally,"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":159.5,"endTime":161.92,"body":"those who are perhaps a bit kind"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":159.5,"endTime":161.92,"body":"of younger earlier in their"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":161.92,"endTime":165.1,"body":"career, who the price of the"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":161.92,"endTime":165.1,"body":"travel and the ticket might have"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":165.1,"endTime":169.42,"body":"been a bit too much. So,"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":165.1,"endTime":169.42,"body":"gentleman called Derek fish,"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":169.48,"endTime":173.8,"body":"who's an advisor in Scotland,"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":169.48,"endTime":173.8,"body":"he's got a ticket. Gary abeler,"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":174.34,"endTime":178.6,"body":"who is the AI, one of the AI"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":174.34,"endTime":178.6,"body":"gurus around town. He can no"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":178.6,"endTime":182.58,"body":"longer make it. And young"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":178.6,"endTime":182.58,"body":"advisor, Sam Luke, he actually"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":182.58,"endTime":186.42,"body":"bought three tickets, and all of"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":182.58,"endTime":186.42,"body":"his the three of them can't make"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":186.42,"endTime":190.26,"body":"it, so that means a three, four."},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":186.42,"endTime":190.26,"body":"There are five available free"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":190.26,"endTime":193.74,"body":"tickets, and the only way you"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":190.26,"endTime":193.74,"body":"can get hold of those is to"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":193.86,"endTime":198.06,"body":"check out the notes, the show"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":193.86,"endTime":198.06,"body":"notes for this episode, where"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":198.12,"endTime":203.0,"body":"the LinkedIn connection details"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":198.12,"endTime":203.0,"body":"are listed and contact these,"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":203.06,"endTime":206.6,"body":"any of these gentlemen, and"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":203.06,"endTime":206.6,"body":"request that you are the"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":206.6,"endTime":209.6,"body":"recipient of a free ticket. So"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":206.6,"endTime":209.6,"body":"there's a few free freebies"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":209.6,"endTime":212.18,"body":"going for those who are quick"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":209.6,"endTime":212.18,"body":"off the mark as soon as this"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":212.18,"endTime":213.08,"body":"episode comes out."},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":214.22,"endTime":216.68,"body":"Okay, good stuff."},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":214.22,"endTime":216.68,"body":"Alan, you put the links in"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":216.68,"endTime":216.98,"body":"there. Yeah,"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":217.219,"endTime":219.259,"body":"yeah. I am the time"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":217.219,"endTime":219.259,"body":"you finish this all right? Or"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":219.259,"endTime":219.499,"body":"it's"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":219.5,"endTime":219.74,"body":"a bit"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":219.74,"endTime":221.8,"body":"or it's a bit or it's"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":219.74,"endTime":221.8,"body":"a bit of a challenge. I just"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":221.8,"endTime":223.06,"body":"need to find them on LinkedIn"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":223.06,"endTime":223.36,"body":"and do"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":223.359,"endTime":224.259,"body":"so maybe do that"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":223.359,"endTime":224.259,"body":"then."},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":224.32,"endTime":226.36,"body":"And first come, first"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":224.32,"endTime":226.36,"body":"served. Get in there."},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":226.42,"endTime":230.02,"body":"Derek fish, Gary"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":226.42,"endTime":230.02,"body":"Baylor, Samuel, Luke, good luck."},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":230.74,"endTime":232.42,"body":"These are the"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":230.74,"endTime":232.42,"body":"hottest tickets in town. These"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":232.42,"endTime":235.3,"body":"are that so maybe it's good to"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":232.42,"endTime":235.3,"body":"do some hard work and track them"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":235.3,"endTime":239.68,"body":"down. Okie dokie, good stuff."},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":235.3,"endTime":239.68,"body":"And and still, storyteller with"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":239.68,"endTime":240.18,"body":"you. And, well,"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":240.18,"endTime":240.6,"body":"you're on a"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":240.6,"endTime":241.44,"body":"solid wave, dream"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":241.68,"endTime":244.8,"body":"on a on a similar"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":241.68,"endTime":244.8,"body":"theme. We've been talking about"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":244.8,"endTime":248.4,"body":"this for a while. We did"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":244.8,"endTime":248.4,"body":"actually issue the questionnaire"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":248.4,"endTime":253.68,"body":"for the inaugural trap track 26"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":248.4,"endTime":253.68,"body":"which is a kind of, you know,"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":253.68,"endTime":257.1,"body":"we're trying to find out what's"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":253.68,"endTime":257.1,"body":"going on in the within the trap"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":257.1,"endTime":260.54,"body":"community, within the full fat"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":257.1,"endTime":260.54,"body":"financial planning community"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":260.78,"endTime":263.48,"body":"advisors, para planners,"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":260.78,"endTime":263.48,"body":"everyone who's involved,"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":263.48,"endTime":266.0,"body":"everyone who's the audience, who"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":263.48,"endTime":266.0,"body":"are the listeners and the"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":266.0,"endTime":269.96,"body":"viewers of this podcast. So we"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":266.0,"endTime":269.96,"body":"sent it out. Well, few days ago,"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":269.96,"endTime":273.2,"body":"really, we have had an"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":269.96,"endTime":273.2,"body":"incredible response so far. Last"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":273.2,"endTime":278.0,"body":"time I looked and we checked 364"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":273.2,"endTime":278.0,"body":"was the number that I saw of"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":278.0,"endTime":281.2,"body":"people who have taken and it is"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":278.0,"endTime":281.2,"body":"just a few moments of your life"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":281.2,"endTime":284.32,"body":"to sort of tick the appropriate"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":281.2,"endTime":284.32,"body":"boxes give us a sense check on"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":284.32,"endTime":288.58,"body":"what how things are in your"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":284.32,"endTime":288.58,"body":"operation and your business,"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":288.58,"endTime":292.9,"body":"what the sentiment is, what the"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":288.58,"endTime":292.9,"body":"biggest challenges are. Our idea"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":293.02,"endTime":296.5,"body":"is that we'll kind of, we'll"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":293.02,"endTime":296.5,"body":"look at the the reviews and what"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":296.5,"endTime":300.24,"body":"people are saying, and we'll and"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":296.5,"endTime":300.24,"body":"we'll talk about it at. Trap"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":300.24,"endTime":303.24,"body":"live. Because if there are"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":300.24,"endTime":303.24,"body":"things on the minds of the"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":303.3,"endTime":306.96,"body":"audience, then we probably need"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":303.3,"endTime":306.96,"body":"to give it a good going over."},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":307.2,"endTime":309.42,"body":"There are, I don't know if you"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":307.2,"endTime":309.42,"body":"guys have looked at all yet."},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":309.42,"endTime":313.38,"body":"There are some quite interesting"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":309.42,"endTime":313.38,"body":"developments, and quite where we"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":313.38,"endTime":316.62,"body":"asked about, you know, what"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":313.38,"endTime":316.62,"body":"people's setup is? Are they"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":316.62,"endTime":320.72,"body":"working in restricted firms,"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":316.62,"endTime":320.72,"body":"independent firms, consolidated"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":320.72,"endTime":324.08,"body":"firms, there's quite a"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":320.72,"endTime":324.08,"body":"divergence of experience and"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":324.08,"endTime":327.38,"body":"opinions across the marketplace,"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":324.08,"endTime":327.38,"body":"where people are but more will"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":327.38,"endTime":331.88,"body":"be revealed on the evening. And"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":327.38,"endTime":331.88,"body":"so for those who haven't, we are"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":331.88,"endTime":336.86,"body":"going to put a hard stop on this"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":331.88,"endTime":336.86,"body":"survey. The date is Sunday."},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":336.98,"endTime":339.44,"body":"What's the date of the month?"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":336.98,"endTime":339.44,"body":"Sunday? The something of May."},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":339.5,"endTime":340.66,"body":"10. 10th"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":340.66,"endTime":343.3,"body":"of May with the last"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":340.66,"endTime":343.3,"body":"chance to participate. Everyone"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":343.3,"endTime":346.66,"body":"who participates in this will"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":343.3,"endTime":346.66,"body":"get full details and a copy of"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":346.66,"endTime":349.36,"body":"the survey and see how, how"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":346.66,"endTime":349.36,"body":"their colleagues are getting on,"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":349.36,"endTime":352.36,"body":"see what, how the market is"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":349.36,"endTime":352.36,"body":"getting on. So we would really"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":352.36,"endTime":355.06,"body":"appreciate you taking literally"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":352.36,"endTime":355.06,"body":"three minutes of your life to"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":355.06,"endTime":357.82,"body":"click the link in the show"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":355.06,"endTime":357.82,"body":"notes. We post it on LinkedIn as"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":357.82,"endTime":361.08,"body":"well. And just give us your"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":357.82,"endTime":361.08,"body":"thoughts, give us your opinions,"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":361.08,"endTime":361.92,"body":"give us your views."},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":361.92,"endTime":364.56,"body":"Okay, yeah, good,"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":361.92,"endTime":364.56,"body":"good. Stuff done. Thank you."},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":364.56,"endTime":365.76,"body":"Next, watch the"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":368.58,"endTime":373.38,"body":"Central Bank of"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":368.58,"endTime":373.38,"body":"Ireland joined up with 17 other"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":373.38,"endTime":380.96,"body":"central banks, and it was led by"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":373.38,"endTime":380.96,"body":"the FCA. And this is an endeavor"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":380.96,"endTime":386.96,"body":"to try and, I suppose, manage"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":380.96,"endTime":386.96,"body":"and regulate, to some extent,"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":387.14,"endTime":390.92,"body":"the influencers that are out"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":387.14,"endTime":390.92,"body":"there that are extolling the"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":390.92,"endTime":394.22,"body":"virtues of various financial"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":390.92,"endTime":394.22,"body":"products that they're selling."},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":394.22,"endTime":398.78,"body":"So look, it's quite good to see"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":394.22,"endTime":398.78,"body":"that there's kind of a cohesive"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":398.78,"endTime":403.6,"body":"effort against these types of"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":398.78,"endTime":403.6,"body":"people. My social media"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":403.6,"endTime":408.28,"body":"consumption is limited to"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":403.6,"endTime":408.28,"body":"LinkedIn, YouTube and podcasts."},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":408.46,"endTime":411.04,"body":"So I know it's very prevalent on"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":408.46,"endTime":411.04,"body":"the likes of Tiktok and"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":411.04,"endTime":414.22,"body":"Instagram, and I'm not being"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":411.04,"endTime":414.22,"body":"exposed to that at all. But it"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":414.22,"endTime":418.0,"body":"is infiltrating, you know, the"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":414.22,"endTime":418.0,"body":"podcast world. There's"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":418.0,"endTime":421.38,"body":"definitely lots of stuff on"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":418.0,"endTime":421.38,"body":"YouTube that you're I'm just"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":421.38,"endTime":423.96,"body":"coming across because obviously"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":421.38,"endTime":423.96,"body":"it's coming in via the"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":423.96,"endTime":427.86,"body":"algorithm, and it's like crazy"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":423.96,"endTime":427.86,"body":"stuff, and it's okay for people"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":427.86,"endTime":432.12,"body":"to have opinions and to, you"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":427.86,"endTime":432.12,"body":"know, give their opinions and"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":432.12,"endTime":436.8,"body":"stuff, but to be just basically"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":432.12,"endTime":436.8,"body":"given false facts and making"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":436.92,"endTime":440.72,"body":"sweeping generalizations is not"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":436.92,"endTime":440.72,"body":"okay. So it seems the central"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":440.72,"endTime":443.66,"body":"banks of the world are uniting"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":440.72,"endTime":443.66,"body":"and they're going to try and get"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":443.66,"endTime":448.04,"body":"a handle on this, a big job,"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":443.66,"endTime":448.04,"body":"obviously, but good at the same"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":448.04,"endTime":452.42,"body":"time, because it might put"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":448.04,"endTime":452.42,"body":"manners on a few people and make"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":452.42,"endTime":455.78,"body":"sure that there's much better"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":452.42,"endTime":455.78,"body":"content out there than some of"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":455.78,"endTime":458.72,"body":"the stuff that has been put out"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":455.78,"endTime":458.72,"body":"there. So I thought kind of cool"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":458.78,"endTime":463.3,"body":"that there's a global effort"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":458.78,"endTime":463.3,"body":"against this, as opposed to, you"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":463.3,"endTime":467.08,"body":"know, one small country trying"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":463.3,"endTime":467.08,"body":"to tackle this on their own. I"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":467.079,"endTime":467.679,"body":"think that"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":467.68,"endTime":468.28,"body":"social media,"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":468.28,"endTime":470.5,"body":"those structures,"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":468.28,"endTime":470.5,"body":"global struggle, how they're"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":470.5,"endTime":473.14,"body":"going to do these people are"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":470.5,"endTime":473.14,"body":"entirely unregulated. What's the"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":473.14,"endTime":477.7,"body":"FC, FCA going to do to them?"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":473.14,"endTime":477.7,"body":"It's more the platforms"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":477.7,"endTime":480.96,"body":"themselves. And, my God, there's"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":477.7,"endTime":480.96,"body":"just a they're just full of"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":480.96,"endTime":484.62,"body":"nonsense. Whether it's financial"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":480.96,"endTime":484.62,"body":"services or political or you"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":484.62,"endTime":486.36,"body":"name it, it's just full of"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":484.62,"endTime":486.36,"body":"opinions. It's,"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":486.48,"endTime":488.4,"body":"I think, I think,"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":486.48,"endTime":488.4,"body":"really, what you're trying to do"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":488.4,"endTime":491.28,"body":"is get more more the more famous"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":488.4,"endTime":491.28,"body":"people,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":491.28,"endTime":491.64,"body":"right?"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":491.639,"endTime":493.799,"body":"And kind of, you"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":491.639,"endTime":493.799,"body":"know, clip their wings a small"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":493.799,"endTime":497.639,"body":"bit when there's stuff Andy"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":498.3,"endTime":499.08,"body":"Mr. Tick tock,"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":499.08,"endTime":501.08,"body":"yeah, and he's, and"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":499.08,"endTime":501.08,"body":"he's putting out great content."},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":501.8,"endTime":502.34,"body":"Believe"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":502.76,"endTime":505.52,"body":"is it, what do you"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":502.76,"endTime":505.52,"body":"consume? Nick, is it still gets"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":505.52,"endTime":509.48,"body":"to talk. You're on Nick,"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":510.2,"endTime":514.4,"body":"yeah, I'm on I'm"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":510.2,"endTime":514.4,"body":"on face. Gram, I love it, yeah,"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":515.36,"endTime":517.58,"body":"tweet, Snapchat back, isn't"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":518.3,"endTime":521.08,"body":"it? I think it's I"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":518.3,"endTime":521.08,"body":"mean, as you say, it's good that"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":521.08,"endTime":523.78,"body":"they're having a cohesive effort"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":521.08,"endTime":523.78,"body":"to try and tackle this, but"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":523.78,"endTime":525.64,"body":"they're almost fighting a losing"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":523.78,"endTime":525.64,"body":"battle. You're right."},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":525.64,"endTime":528.76,"body":"Misinformation and fraud, you"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":525.64,"endTime":528.76,"body":"know, is part of the human"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":528.76,"endTime":532.48,"body":"condition, but hopefully they"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":528.76,"endTime":532.48,"body":"can have a bit of a chance."},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":532.48,"endTime":534.7,"body":"There was a there"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":532.48,"endTime":534.7,"body":"was a podcast, there was a"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":534.7,"endTime":537.58,"body":"podcast episode Andy brought to"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":534.7,"endTime":537.58,"body":"my attention by one of the trap"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":537.58,"endTime":541.38,"body":"listeners, a young fella in the"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":537.58,"endTime":541.38,"body":"north. And I listened to it, and"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":541.38,"endTime":545.1,"body":"it was like, Jesus Christ, no,"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":541.38,"endTime":545.1,"body":"this particular one was"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":545.1,"endTime":548.7,"body":"basically saying, Don't ever go"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":545.1,"endTime":548.7,"body":"to a financial advisor, because,"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":549.0,"endTime":551.88,"body":"and I don't mind anybody saying"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":549.0,"endTime":551.88,"body":"don't go to a financial advisor,"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":551.88,"endTime":553.56,"body":"because, really, it's up to us"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":551.88,"endTime":553.56,"body":"to be able"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":553.56,"endTime":554.58,"body":"to install, yep,"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":554.64,"endTime":557.1,"body":"extol our own"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":554.64,"endTime":557.1,"body":"virtues. But some of the claims"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":557.1,"endTime":559.8,"body":"that he was making, I'm like,"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":557.1,"endTime":559.8,"body":"that's just not the case, you"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":559.8,"endTime":565.7,"body":"know? So, yeah. So, look, I"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":559.8,"endTime":565.7,"body":"think people make an outrageous"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":565.7,"endTime":568.94,"body":"claims. Wasn't the famous one?"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":565.7,"endTime":568.94,"body":"Tom Brady was selling crypto or"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":568.94,"endTime":569.54,"body":"something, and"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":570.14,"endTime":572.66,"body":"a lot of people got"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":570.14,"endTime":572.66,"body":"caught up in that. Yeah, a lot"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":572.66,"endTime":573.8,"body":"of famous names. But"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":574.76,"endTime":576.2,"body":"Trouble is, car TX,"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":576.2,"endTime":577.04,"body":"wasn't it? Ft,"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":577.039,"endTime":578.359,"body":"yeah. What it was he"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":577.039,"endTime":578.359,"body":"was behind"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":578.36,"endTime":579.32,"body":"all that, yeah, yeah."},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":578.36,"endTime":579.32,"body":"The trouble"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":579.32,"endTime":581.68,"body":"is, with a lot of"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":579.32,"endTime":581.68,"body":"these things, that's the more"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":581.68,"endTime":585.1,"body":"extreme your opinions are, the"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":581.68,"endTime":585.1,"body":"more of an audience you'll get,"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":585.1,"endTime":588.7,"body":"the more clicks you'll get, the"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":585.1,"endTime":588.7,"body":"more ad revenue you'll get. So"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":588.7,"endTime":593.38,"body":"to say something just day to day"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":588.7,"endTime":593.38,"body":"and regular is not a sort of a"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":593.38,"endTime":596.68,"body":"money spinner for a lot of these"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":593.38,"endTime":596.68,"body":"people, unfortunately, and maybe"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":596.68,"endTime":598.96,"body":"they can. I mean, nowadays"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":596.68,"endTime":598.96,"body":"you've got anonymous accounts."},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":598.96,"endTime":602.28,"body":"You've got literally eight. AI"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":598.96,"endTime":602.28,"body":"enabled YouTube accounts, which"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":602.28,"endTime":605.22,"body":"aren't a real person, and they"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":602.28,"endTime":605.22,"body":"go out and they also, it's"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":605.22,"endTime":605.58,"body":"crazy."},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":605.64,"endTime":608.34,"body":"I think something, I"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":605.64,"endTime":608.34,"body":"think something that's more"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":608.34,"endTime":613.5,"body":"dangerous and impactful is major"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":608.34,"endTime":613.5,"body":"national brands and newspapers"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":613.68,"endTime":617.1,"body":"allowing people to advertise and"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":613.68,"endTime":617.1,"body":"sell complete junk that then"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":617.1,"endTime":621.2,"body":"blows up. And I've seen that"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":617.1,"endTime":621.2,"body":"with, you know, the number one"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":621.2,"endTime":623.96,"body":"newspaper in the UK. So there's"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":621.2,"endTime":623.96,"body":"obviously a lot going on the"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":623.96,"endTime":627.14,"body":"fringes and people that have got"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":623.96,"endTime":627.14,"body":"big followings, but national"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":627.14,"endTime":631.94,"body":"newspapers, major brands"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":627.14,"endTime":631.94,"body":"allowing clear stuff that blow"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":631.94,"endTime":635.54,"body":"up in the future on their"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":631.94,"endTime":635.54,"body":"platform. And these, these"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":635.54,"endTime":641.38,"body":"publications like, let's say, in"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":635.54,"endTime":641.38,"body":"January 2026, they'll allow mass"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":641.38,"endTime":644.26,"body":"advertising of total junk that I"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":641.38,"endTime":644.26,"body":"know is going to blow up at some"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":644.26,"endTime":646.6,"body":"point in the future, three years"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":644.26,"endTime":646.6,"body":"later, when it's blown up, they"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":646.6,"endTime":650.68,"body":"cover the story, yeah, and I"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":646.6,"endTime":650.68,"body":"think, Jesus Christ, you guys"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":650.68,"endTime":653.92,"body":"will allow it to win, win"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":650.68,"endTime":653.92,"body":"advertising your platform, and"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":653.92,"endTime":657.16,"body":"then you cover the story three"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":653.92,"endTime":657.16,"body":"years later. So I take snippets"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":657.16,"endTime":659.56,"body":"whenever I see them doing things"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":657.16,"endTime":659.56,"body":"that I know are going to blow"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":659.56,"endTime":662.04,"body":"up, like whiskey investments."},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":659.56,"endTime":662.04,"body":"That was this thing like two"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":662.04,"endTime":664.32,"body":"years ago. Whiskey investments"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":662.04,"endTime":664.32,"body":"all over mainstream"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":664.32,"endTime":667.08,"body":"publications. They are going to"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":664.32,"endTime":667.08,"body":"blow up at some point in the"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":667.08,"endTime":670.02,"body":"future. It's not like, oh, did"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":667.08,"endTime":670.02,"body":"the whiskey go well? It's a pure"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":670.02,"endTime":673.8,"body":"frickin fraud. It's a pure"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":670.02,"endTime":673.8,"body":"share. Whiskey investments have"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":673.8,"endTime":677.04,"body":"not done well, therefore that"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":673.8,"endTime":677.04,"body":"product's not done well. No,"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":677.04,"endTime":680.78,"body":"it's a pure scam. I was"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":677.04,"endTime":680.78,"body":"expecting returns on whiskey."},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":681.02,"endTime":681.56,"body":"Sorry. I was"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":681.56,"endTime":684.2,"body":"expecting a call"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":681.56,"endTime":684.2,"body":"half an hour before recorded"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":684.2,"endTime":687.86,"body":"this, and so I took the call on"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":684.2,"endTime":687.86,"body":"my mobile, and it wasn't who I"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":687.86,"endTime":692.06,"body":"was expecting. It was somebody"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":687.86,"endTime":692.06,"body":"selling fine wine, fine wine"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":692.06,"endTime":695.24,"body":"futures, and he just said"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":692.06,"endTime":695.24,"body":"something they said, and it's"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":695.24,"endTime":698.6,"body":"done 17% compound a year for the"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":695.24,"endTime":698.6,"body":"last 10 years, blah, blah, blah,"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":698.84,"endTime":702.1,"body":"and it's all tax free, which it"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":698.84,"endTime":702.1,"body":"probably is if you invest in in"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":702.1,"endTime":705.34,"body":"wine, and, you know, can we"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":702.1,"endTime":705.34,"body":"speak to you about it? And I"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":705.34,"endTime":708.22,"body":"just thought, No one does these"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":705.34,"endTime":708.22,"body":"cold calls are very, very, very"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":708.22,"endTime":710.74,"body":"rarely take these calls. You"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":708.22,"endTime":710.74,"body":"don't do them unless, some"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":710.74,"endTime":711.7,"body":"people bite, unless"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":711.7,"endTime":712.12,"body":"they were"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":712.12,"endTime":714.16,"body":"some Yeah, unless"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":712.12,"endTime":714.16,"body":"they work. So some people they"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":714.16,"endTime":716.08,"body":"make, you know, that guy's"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":714.16,"endTime":716.08,"body":"sitting there making very nice"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":716.08,"endTime":718.6,"body":"guy on the phone, very sort of"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":716.08,"endTime":718.6,"body":"polished. He's probably making"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":718.6,"endTime":722.22,"body":"100 calls a morning and and some"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":718.6,"endTime":722.22,"body":"of them are saying yes to it. So"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":722.22,"endTime":725.88,"body":"it is, it's buyer beware, it's,"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":722.22,"endTime":725.88,"body":"it's, but it's an issue, but"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":725.88,"endTime":728.16,"body":"it's never it's not, not going"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":725.88,"endTime":728.16,"body":"away, despite all the best"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":728.16,"endTime":730.44,"body":"efforts of the trying,"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":731.34,"endTime":734.94,"body":"yeah, and the FCA"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":731.34,"endTime":734.94,"body":"and 17 other countries, I like,"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":734.94,"endTime":738.54,"body":"look, it's better they try and"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":734.94,"endTime":738.54,"body":"do something, even if the impact"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":738.54,"endTime":742.28,"body":"is going to be minimal, because"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":738.54,"endTime":742.28,"body":"if they save one or two people"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":742.28,"endTime":744.8,"body":"from it, then happy days they"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":742.28,"endTime":744.8,"body":"should. That's what they should"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":744.8,"endTime":747.38,"body":"be doing. Don't just not try,"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":744.8,"endTime":747.38,"body":"because it's, oh, that's an"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":747.38,"endTime":747.92,"body":"impossible"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":747.919,"endTime":749.599,"body":"Well, that's,"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":747.919,"endTime":749.599,"body":"that's true. We often, we often"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":749.599,"endTime":752.599,"body":"criticize the regulators for"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":749.599,"endTime":752.599,"body":"being so reactive. And at least"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":752.599,"endTime":754.879,"body":"here they're trying to get on"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":752.599,"endTime":754.879,"body":"the front foot. But I do think"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":754.879,"endTime":757.339,"body":"it's a really, as Andy said,"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":754.879,"endTime":757.339,"body":"it's, they're chameleons."},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":757.339,"endTime":759.619,"body":"There's, they're shape shifters,"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":757.339,"endTime":759.619,"body":"these people, you know. And as"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":759.619,"endTime":761.899,"body":"soon as you what's the whack a"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":759.619,"endTime":761.899,"body":"mole. As soon as you whack one"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":761.899,"endTime":765.039,"body":"down, another one pops up, and"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":761.899,"endTime":765.039,"body":"then it's but they're trying."},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":765.039,"endTime":765.939,"body":"The intent is good."},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":766.179,"endTime":769.419,"body":"Okay, there's this."},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":766.179,"endTime":769.419,"body":"There's a starfish story hung up"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":769.419,"endTime":772.599,"body":"in your office. I believe Alan,"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":769.419,"endTime":772.599,"body":"but the little boy and he saved"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":772.599,"endTime":774.399,"body":"one starfish. So there you go."},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":774.4,"endTime":775.42,"body":"Lisa saved that one."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":776.62,"endTime":777.16,"body":"Exactly,"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":777.7,"endTime":778.54,"body":"exactly,"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":778.96,"endTime":781.74,"body":"right. Coming back"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":778.96,"endTime":781.74,"body":"to planet Earth, as this"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":781.74,"endTime":789.3,"body":"podcast, as this podcast, is"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":781.74,"endTime":789.3,"body":"bleeding into your ears, feeding"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":789.3,"endTime":792.3,"body":"into your ears, it will be. It's"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":789.3,"endTime":792.3,"body":"coming out on Tuesday, sorry,"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":792.3,"endTime":795.84,"body":"Thursday, May the seventh. And"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":792.3,"endTime":795.84,"body":"we have local elections in the"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":795.84,"endTime":798.12,"body":"UK, and they're looking to be,"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":795.84,"endTime":798.12,"body":"well, they could be very, very"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":798.12,"endTime":800.7,"body":"interesting. We have an"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":798.12,"endTime":800.7,"body":"incumbent government with a"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":800.7,"endTime":803.84,"body":"massive majority, but it's not"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":800.7,"endTime":803.84,"body":"particularly going that well for"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":803.84,"endTime":806.42,"body":"the government, and the local"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":803.84,"endTime":806.42,"body":"elections could well be a sort"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":806.42,"endTime":809.48,"body":"of semi referendum on their"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":806.42,"endTime":809.48,"body":"performance to date. And one of"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":809.48,"endTime":812.78,"body":"the parties that may do quite"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":809.48,"endTime":812.78,"body":"well in today's local elections"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":813.14,"endTime":816.32,"body":"is the Reform Party, and to its"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":813.14,"endTime":816.32,"body":"immense credit, whether you"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":816.32,"endTime":819.32,"body":"agree with this or not, they"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":816.32,"endTime":819.32,"body":"have officially said they are"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":819.32,"endTime":823.6,"body":"going to scrap DB pensions for"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":819.32,"endTime":823.6,"body":"new public sector workers. Now"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":823.6,"endTime":827.44,"body":"this is an immense pivot. No"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":823.6,"endTime":827.44,"body":"political party has ever had the"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":827.44,"endTime":830.62,"body":"balls to do this. This is"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":827.44,"endTime":830.62,"body":"completely the right thing to"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":830.62,"endTime":834.88,"body":"do, and it should have been done"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":830.62,"endTime":834.88,"body":"many, many moons ago, and it's a"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":834.88,"endTime":838.06,"body":"brave thing to do, because the"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":834.88,"endTime":838.06,"body":"public sector in the UK is a lot"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":838.06,"endTime":840.7,"body":"of people, of voters, and they"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":838.06,"endTime":840.7,"body":"will be pissed off by this."},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":840.7,"endTime":843.48,"body":"There won't be natural reform"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":840.7,"endTime":843.48,"body":"voters in the first place, and I"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":843.48,"endTime":846.0,"body":"doubt this is not going to get"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":843.48,"endTime":846.0,"body":"them any votes, but I think for"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":846.0,"endTime":848.52,"body":"reform to go out and limb, at"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":846.0,"endTime":848.52,"body":"least bring this conversation"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":848.58,"endTime":851.16,"body":"out. So the political parties"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":848.58,"endTime":851.16,"body":"now there's some clear water on"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":851.16,"endTime":853.62,"body":"this, because this, for me, has"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":851.16,"endTime":853.62,"body":"been a BMI bonnet for years,"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":853.62,"endTime":857.04,"body":"that the public sector gets,"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":853.62,"endTime":857.04,"body":"gets pensions that we plebs us"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":857.04,"endTime":861.02,"body":"money purchase plebs don't get"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":857.04,"endTime":861.02,"body":"what these final salary swanks"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":861.02,"endTime":863.84,"body":"have and a credit to credit to"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":861.02,"endTime":863.84,"body":"reform. So it's interesting how"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":863.84,"endTime":866.0,"body":"that plays. I guess reform are"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":863.84,"endTime":866.0,"body":"taking the view Well, at this,"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":866.0,"endTime":868.76,"body":"people in this public sector, by"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":866.0,"endTime":868.76,"body":"and large, aren't going to vote"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":868.76,"endTime":871.52,"body":"for reform anyway, so screw it."},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":868.76,"endTime":871.52,"body":"But I think it's just brilliant."},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":871.52,"endTime":873.86,"body":"They've got it out there as a"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":871.52,"endTime":873.86,"body":"conversation point. Because if"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":873.86,"endTime":876.14,"body":"they've got it out there now,"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":873.86,"endTime":876.14,"body":"other parties may start talking"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":876.14,"endTime":879.32,"body":"about it and just avoid kicking"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":876.14,"endTime":879.32,"body":"this can down the road, because"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":879.32,"endTime":881.74,"body":"it we can't go on as we are with"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":879.32,"endTime":881.74,"body":"the debt we're in. So I don't"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":881.74,"endTime":883.78,"body":"know if you boys picked up on"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":881.74,"endTime":883.78,"body":"that."},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":885.279,"endTime":888.339,"body":"It's a huge subject,"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":885.279,"endTime":888.339,"body":"Nick, and there's various points"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":888.339,"endTime":892.719,"body":"to it. It is a huge future"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":888.339,"endTime":892.719,"body":"ticking time bomb. Did they say"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":892.719,"endTime":895.239,"body":"that they're going to do career"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":892.719,"endTime":895.239,"body":"average earnings nick or just"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":895.239,"endTime":896.379,"body":"completely remove it?"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":896.38,"endTime":896.68,"body":"I don't"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":896.68,"endTime":898.18,"body":"think they went"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":896.68,"endTime":898.18,"body":"that much detailed on the"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":898.18,"endTime":900.6,"body":"article. I think they're going"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":898.18,"endTime":900.6,"body":"to remove it. Think it's been"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":900.6,"endTime":901.14,"body":"money purchase,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":901.14,"endTime":901.44,"body":"well"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":902.22,"endTime":902.88,"body":"and it will be"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":902.88,"endTime":903.54,"body":"money purchase."},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":903.9,"endTime":908.7,"body":"I thought that most"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":903.9,"endTime":908.7,"body":"civil service pension schemes"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":908.7,"endTime":912.66,"body":"had already moved to career"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":908.7,"endTime":912.66,"body":"average, which is still defined"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":912.66,"endTime":917.82,"body":"benefit, but it's not the actual"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":912.66,"endTime":917.82,"body":"final salaries. It's based on a"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":917.82,"endTime":918.54,"body":"career career."},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":918.54,"endTime":921.32,"body":"This is still"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":918.54,"endTime":921.32,"body":"defined benefit, DB, pension,"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":921.32,"endTime":923.0,"body":"they're getting rid of dB. So"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":921.32,"endTime":923.0,"body":"they would get"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":923.0,"endTime":924.92,"body":"that means that, by"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":923.0,"endTime":924.92,"body":"definition, they're getting rid"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":924.92,"endTime":927.86,"body":"of career average. So move into"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":924.92,"endTime":927.86,"body":"a money purchase. The"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":927.86,"endTime":931.88,"body":"interesting thing is, what the"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":927.86,"endTime":931.88,"body":"level of contribution they would"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":931.88,"endTime":935.9,"body":"suggest money purchase, because"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":931.88,"endTime":935.9,"body":"it ends up being a 25% off"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":935.9,"endTime":939.8,"body":"salary purchase, DC contribution"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":935.9,"endTime":939.8,"body":"then, but"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":939.8,"endTime":940.82,"body":"that's a finite cost."},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":940.82,"endTime":943.12,"body":"Yeah, at least you"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":940.82,"endTime":943.12,"body":"exactly, at least you've capped"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":943.18,"endTime":946.9,"body":"the future. Okay, well, that's,"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":943.18,"endTime":946.9,"body":"that's interesting. It's"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":946.9,"endTime":949.24,"body":"interesting to see how that"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":946.9,"endTime":949.24,"body":"plays out, because obviously"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":949.24,"endTime":949.72,"body":"there's a lot"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":949.72,"endTime":952.0,"body":"of people. Nick,"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":949.72,"endTime":952.0,"body":"what's your thoughts? Nick, on"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":952.0,"endTime":956.02,"body":"the public sector earn more,"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":952.0,"endTime":956.02,"body":"earn less, sorry, generally,"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":956.02,"endTime":958.0,"body":"than the private sector. Hence,"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":956.02,"endTime":958.0,"body":"they have,"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":958.0,"endTime":959.86,"body":"yeah, that's no"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":958.0,"endTime":959.86,"body":"longer the case. That's no"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":959.86,"endTime":962.52,"body":"longer the case, and they've had"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":959.86,"endTime":962.52,"body":"inflation busting pay rises for"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":962.52,"endTime":965.82,"body":"the last X number of years, that"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":962.52,"endTime":965.82,"body":"way ahead of the private sector."},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":965.82,"endTime":968.04,"body":"So there's two things there."},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":965.82,"endTime":968.04,"body":"Still you asked this question,"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":968.04,"endTime":970.56,"body":"Andy, so perhaps I'll finish it."},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":968.04,"endTime":970.56,"body":"That's the way it works, and"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":970.56,"endTime":972.96,"body":"then you go again. So"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":972.96,"endTime":973.14,"body":"they've"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":973.14,"endTime":974.04,"body":"had jet lagged,"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":973.14,"endTime":974.04,"body":"they've"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":974.1,"endTime":978.18,"body":"had inflation"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":974.1,"endTime":978.18,"body":"busted, inflation busting pay"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":978.18,"endTime":981.14,"body":"rises. They're basically"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":978.18,"endTime":981.14,"body":"unstackable. They have no"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":981.14,"endTime":983.72,"body":"competition. It's really, really"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":981.14,"endTime":983.72,"body":"hard to lose your job in the"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":983.72,"endTime":986.12,"body":"public sector. And I'm not"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":983.72,"endTime":986.12,"body":"denigrating what they would do"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":986.12,"endTime":988.52,"body":"in the public sector if you're"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":986.12,"endTime":988.52,"body":"doing it, but it's you have no"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":988.52,"endTime":990.92,"body":"competition. All right, there's"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":988.52,"endTime":990.92,"body":"only one civil service, there's"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":990.92,"endTime":993.5,"body":"only one health system, there's"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":990.92,"endTime":993.5,"body":"only one estate education"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":993.5,"endTime":996.44,"body":"system. You've got no"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":993.5,"endTime":996.44,"body":"competition. And their pay has"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":996.44,"endTime":998.66,"body":"gone up marked in recent years."},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":996.44,"endTime":998.66,"body":"And there used to be the"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":998.66,"endTime":1001.32,"body":"argument the pension was that"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":998.66,"endTime":1001.32,"body":"was compensating for lower pay."},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":1001.5,"endTime":1004.14,"body":"Yeah, it doesn't anymore. It"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":1001.5,"endTime":1004.14,"body":"doesn't anymore. And these"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":1004.14,"endTime":1007.02,"body":"people have made through their"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":1004.14,"endTime":1007.02,"body":"legislation, DB schemes in the"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":1007.02,"endTime":1011.22,"body":"private sector unaffordable."},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":1007.02,"endTime":1011.22,"body":"They don't exist for us. Why the"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":1011.22,"endTime":1013.56,"body":"hell should they have them get"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":1011.22,"endTime":1013.56,"body":"rid"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1014.1,"endTime":1015.96,"body":"that's the key word,"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1014.1,"endTime":1015.96,"body":"Nick unaffordable, and it's"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1015.96,"endTime":1017.58,"body":"unaffordable now and in the"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1015.96,"endTime":1017.58,"body":"future it's"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1017.58,"endTime":1020.1,"body":"going to be it's"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1017.58,"endTime":1020.1,"body":"about the accumulated future"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1020.1,"endTime":1023.48,"body":"liability is the key thing, and"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1020.1,"endTime":1023.48,"body":"because pensions are paid, are"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1023.48,"endTime":1027.92,"body":"index linked as well, those"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1023.48,"endTime":1027.92,"body":"compounding effects of that are"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1027.92,"endTime":1031.52,"body":"just, well, bottom line, country"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1027.92,"endTime":1031.52,"body":"can't afford it. Can't afford"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1031.52,"endTime":1032.0,"body":"any of this,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1032.0,"endTime":1032.36,"body":"right?"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1032.66,"endTime":1035.06,"body":"So that's the harsh"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1032.66,"endTime":1035.06,"body":"reality. Will be interesting to"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1035.06,"endTime":1039.02,"body":"see how that plays with the"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1035.06,"endTime":1039.02,"body":"results which are out today."},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1039.38,"endTime":1043.84,"body":"Yeah, just to if I"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1039.38,"endTime":1043.84,"body":"can make one point, we have"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1043.84,"endTime":1045.04,"body":"similar system here"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":1045.16,"endTime":1047.02,"body":"I was going to ask"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":1045.16,"endTime":1047.02,"body":"you, yeah, that's"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1047.26,"endTime":1052.18,"body":"why I don't think"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1047.26,"endTime":1052.18,"body":"nurses, doctors, teachers, are"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1052.18,"endTime":1056.38,"body":"paid half enough, and I think"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1052.18,"endTime":1056.38,"body":"they deserve the defined benefit"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1056.44,"endTime":1059.5,"body":"pension scheme that they get at"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1056.44,"endTime":1059.5,"body":"the end of their careers."},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":1060.82,"endTime":1063.96,"body":"Okay, well,"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":1060.82,"endTime":1063.96,"body":"they're paid well here, okay,"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":1065.52,"endTime":1065.94,"body":"ultra"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1066.0,"endTime":1070.14,"body":"moving on. Okay. This"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1066.0,"endTime":1070.14,"body":"is a company you may or may not"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1070.14,"endTime":1076.5,"body":"be aware of mellow. I think Alan"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1070.14,"endTime":1076.5,"body":"knows a lady who works here, as"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1076.56,"endTime":1082.46,"body":"I do. They mainly Vicky Hicks."},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1076.56,"endTime":1082.46,"body":"Runs that business. They mainly"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1082.46,"endTime":1087.92,"body":"help businesses sell, grow, sell"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1082.46,"endTime":1087.92,"body":"a new are a new thing that"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1087.92,"endTime":1091.4,"body":"they're working on is they're"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1087.92,"endTime":1091.4,"body":"setting up a new marketplace,"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1091.4,"endTime":1094.22,"body":"online marketplace, I'm"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1091.4,"endTime":1094.22,"body":"assuming, to connect buyers and"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1094.22,"endTime":1097.16,"body":"sellers of financial advice"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1094.22,"endTime":1097.16,"body":"firms called Project exit. It's"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1097.34,"endTime":1102.04,"body":"going to be part of the mellow"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1097.34,"endTime":1102.04,"body":"stable of products. So a couple"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1102.04,"endTime":1105.76,"body":"of points here, mellow help"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1102.04,"endTime":1105.76,"body":"advisors build their business"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1105.76,"endTime":1108.94,"body":"and then sell and exit. And"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1105.76,"endTime":1108.94,"body":"they're also trying to add some"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1108.94,"endTime":1111.88,"body":"more innovation in this space"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1108.94,"endTime":1111.88,"body":"with their new marketplace"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1111.88,"endTime":1116.44,"body":"called Project exit. Any points"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1111.88,"endTime":1116.44,"body":"on that?"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1117.16,"endTime":1120.9,"body":"Well, I do, I do"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1117.16,"endTime":1120.9,"body":"know Vicky. In fact, obviously"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1120.9,"endTime":1125.16,"body":"you'll not have forgotten, on"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1120.9,"endTime":1125.16,"body":"behalf of trap, I was invited to"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1125.16,"endTime":1129.06,"body":"their Christmas quiz, and I won"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1125.16,"endTime":1129.06,"body":"it."},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1129.24,"endTime":1130.14,"body":"You ended up winning."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1130.14,"endTime":1130.44,"body":"I won"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1130.44,"endTime":1132.3,"body":"the whole thing, and"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1130.44,"endTime":1132.3,"body":"I got a trophy for it and"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1132.3,"endTime":1133.92,"body":"everything. And I give trap a"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1132.3,"endTime":1133.92,"body":"few"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1133.92,"endTime":1135.48,"body":"individual event."},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1133.92,"endTime":1135.48,"body":"Was it?"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1136.14,"endTime":1139.74,"body":"Yeah, no. What do"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1136.14,"endTime":1139.74,"body":"you mean? I was individuals. It"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1139.74,"endTime":1144.26,"body":"was all the leading celebrities"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1139.74,"endTime":1144.26,"body":"from the industry, was"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1144.26,"endTime":1146.54,"body":"the quiz an"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1144.26,"endTime":1146.54,"body":"individual event, you won. You"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1146.54,"endTime":1148.04,"body":"won an individually on your own."},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1148.04,"endTime":1151.58,"body":"Yeah, that I was"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1148.04,"endTime":1151.58,"body":"representing this podcast. You"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1151.58,"endTime":1151.82,"body":"weren't"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":1151.88,"endTime":1153.62,"body":"part of a team at"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":1151.88,"endTime":1153.62,"body":"the event, I think is what"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":1153.62,"endTime":1154.4,"body":"Carl's alluding to."},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1154.4,"endTime":1156.2,"body":"No, I wasn't part of"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1154.4,"endTime":1156.2,"body":"a team. I was just me. You"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1156.2,"endTime":1158.3,"body":"had nobody to speak"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1156.2,"endTime":1158.3,"body":"to and confirm"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1159.26,"endTime":1160.1,"body":"for a friend."},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1161.3,"endTime":1161.9,"body":"That's"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1161.9,"endTime":1166.48,"body":"sweet. Be true"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1161.9,"endTime":1166.48,"body":"anyway. So yeah, I do know Vicky"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1166.48,"endTime":1171.4,"body":"and some of her team. And, well,"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1166.48,"endTime":1171.4,"body":"it sounds we like innovation."},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1171.52,"endTime":1172.06,"body":"Sounds good."},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1203.06,"endTime":1206.42,"body":"Yeah, exactly. Gain"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1203.06,"endTime":1206.42,"body":"has also joined there, who's"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1206.42,"endTime":1211.18,"body":"also financial services"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1206.42,"endTime":1211.18,"body":"powerhouse, gain of rugby. She's"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1211.18,"endTime":1213.46,"body":"the Chief Operating Officer. So,"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1211.18,"endTime":1213.46,"body":"yeah, they're building out. So"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1213.46,"endTime":1217.0,"body":"if you're in that space, looking"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1213.46,"endTime":1217.0,"body":"to build your business and sell"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1217.0,"endTime":1219.7,"body":"it, I think there'll be a good"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1217.0,"endTime":1219.7,"body":"company to connect with and"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1219.7,"endTime":1220.12,"body":"speak to."},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":1220.8999999999999,"endTime":1223.96,"body":"Okey dokey. Watch"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":1220.8999999999999,"endTime":1223.96,"body":"Central Bank of Ireland under"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":1223.96,"endTime":1224.26,"body":"pressure."},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1224.92,"endTime":1227.2,"body":"Yeah. So on the one"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1224.92,"endTime":1227.2,"body":"hand, we had a good story with"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1227.2,"endTime":1232.32,"body":"central bank. So this is a"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1227.2,"endTime":1232.32,"body":"story, and. It's actually, it's,"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1232.32,"endTime":1235.1399999999999,"body":"I don't know, slightly"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1232.32,"endTime":1235.1399999999999,"body":"disturbing. So the central bank"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1235.1399999999999,"endTime":1241.74,"body":"in 2020 had an application for a"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1235.1399999999999,"endTime":1241.74,"body":"controlled function CEO of some"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1241.74,"endTime":1244.92,"body":"fund management. The details are"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1241.74,"endTime":1244.92,"body":"light because they haven't"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1244.92,"endTime":1248.6399999999999,"body":"released the names, and that's"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1244.92,"endTime":1248.6399999999999,"body":"correct. But anyway, they"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1248.6399999999999,"endTime":1251.8999999999999,"body":"refused this guy, he was an"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1248.6399999999999,"endTime":1251.8999999999999,"body":"Irish guy, but he had worked in"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1251.96,"endTime":1256.76,"body":"the UK, and there had been"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1251.96,"endTime":1256.76,"body":"allegations where he had worked"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1256.76,"endTime":1259.52,"body":"in the UK and the central bank"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1256.76,"endTime":1259.52,"body":"basically didn't give him due"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1259.52,"endTime":1264.02,"body":"process and refused his control"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1259.52,"endTime":1264.02,"body":"function, and because he then"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1264.02,"endTime":1266.8999999999999,"body":"had this black mark against his"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1264.02,"endTime":1266.8999999999999,"body":"name, he couldn't get a job,"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1266.8999999999999,"endTime":1271.72,"body":"basically, in financial services"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1266.8999999999999,"endTime":1271.72,"body":"at all. And it seems his life"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1271.72,"endTime":1274.3,"body":"kind of unraveled a small bit"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1271.72,"endTime":1274.3,"body":"afterwards, as you can imagine,"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1274.3,"endTime":1280.78,"body":"might so it was brought to the"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1274.3,"endTime":1280.78,"body":"High Court, and the High Court"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1280.78,"endTime":1284.56,"body":"were scathing in their criticism"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1280.78,"endTime":1284.56,"body":"of the central bank that they"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1284.56,"endTime":1287.02,"body":"wouldn't give this guy a kind of"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1284.56,"endTime":1287.02,"body":"an interview and whatever. So"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1287.02,"endTime":1292.08,"body":"look, I just thought worth"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1287.02,"endTime":1292.08,"body":"pointing out, possibly a little"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1292.08,"endTime":1295.92,"body":"bit brave to point it out, but"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1292.08,"endTime":1295.92,"body":"you know that they regulators"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1295.92,"endTime":1301.3799999999999,"body":"don't always get it right. And"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1295.92,"endTime":1301.3799999999999,"body":"you know everyone is entitled to"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1301.3799999999999,"endTime":1304.62,"body":"due process, and they should"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1301.3799999999999,"endTime":1304.62,"body":"have given this guy, you know,"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1305.04,"endTime":1308.46,"body":"the opportunity to explain the"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1305.04,"endTime":1308.46,"body":"situation, because I don't think"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1308.46,"endTime":1312.98,"body":"he was actually as involved in"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1308.46,"endTime":1312.98,"body":"the situation as maybe it had,"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1313.46,"endTime":1317.54,"body":"it had been claimed. So there's"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1313.46,"endTime":1317.54,"body":"not a whole lot of media"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1317.54,"endTime":1320.72,"body":"coverage about this. But I think"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1317.54,"endTime":1320.72,"body":"it should be, because, hey, we"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1320.72,"endTime":1326.42,"body":"all make mistakes, and I think"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1320.72,"endTime":1326.42,"body":"the central bank, it might"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1327.02,"endTime":1331.48,"body":"mellow them a small bit too."},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1327.02,"endTime":1331.48,"body":"There's a segue from the last"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1331.48,"endTime":1335.08,"body":"one, but, yeah, it might, it"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1331.48,"endTime":1335.08,"body":"might help everybody, because"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1335.3799999999999,"endTime":1340.24,"body":"sometimes regulation, because"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1335.3799999999999,"endTime":1340.24,"body":"can become overly stringent, and"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1340.24,"endTime":1344.62,"body":"that's actually not good for"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1340.24,"endTime":1344.62,"body":"commerce to be done, and that's"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1344.68,"endTime":1347.5,"body":"effectively, or ultimately, what"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1344.68,"endTime":1347.5,"body":"we all need, isn't"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1347.5,"endTime":1347.68,"body":"it?"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1348.6399999999999,"endTime":1350.82,"body":"Did the article say"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1348.6399999999999,"endTime":1350.82,"body":"that there was compensation pay"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1350.82,"endTime":1353.8799999999999,"body":"Carl, because you alluded to"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1350.82,"endTime":1353.8799999999999,"body":"this guy's life just basically"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1353.8799999999999,"endTime":1355.68,"body":"fell apart. He couldn't get a"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1353.8799999999999,"endTime":1355.68,"body":"job, and he's"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1355.68,"endTime":1358.32,"body":"chosen that the"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1355.68,"endTime":1358.32,"body":"article I read didn't I read two"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1358.32,"endTime":1361.62,"body":"articles on it, and neither of"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1358.32,"endTime":1361.62,"body":"them said about compensation."},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1363.42,"endTime":1366.72,"body":"But funny, one of the people who"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1363.42,"endTime":1366.72,"body":"are working in the central bank"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1366.72,"endTime":1370.02,"body":"has now gone in as the CFO of"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1366.72,"endTime":1370.02,"body":"our national broadcaster, and"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1370.02,"endTime":1374.24,"body":"that has been riddled with bad"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1370.02,"endTime":1374.24,"body":"news stories. So here's just"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1374.24,"endTime":1378.68,"body":"another one for RTE, which is"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1374.24,"endTime":1378.68,"body":"just an interesting link, but"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1378.68,"endTime":1382.46,"body":"yeah, no. Andy, I didn't see"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1378.68,"endTime":1382.46,"body":"that anywhere, but I hope that"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1382.46,"endTime":1385.7,"body":"guy gets sorted out, because"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1382.46,"endTime":1385.7,"body":"that's just, you know, you you"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1385.7,"endTime":1388.58,"body":"know, we're all good trying to"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1385.7,"endTime":1388.58,"body":"do our best and get on with our"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1388.58,"endTime":1391.42,"body":"lives and do the best for our"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1388.58,"endTime":1391.42,"body":"families, ultimately. And here's"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1391.42,"endTime":1395.3799999999999,"body":"a man who got his his livelihood"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1391.42,"endTime":1395.3799999999999,"body":"taken away. He went in to work"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1395.3799999999999,"endTime":1398.98,"body":"for an unregulated business,"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1395.3799999999999,"endTime":1398.98,"body":"which was fine, so he didn't"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1398.98,"endTime":1402.1,"body":"have to go through the central"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1398.98,"endTime":1402.1,"body":"bank approval process, and they"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1402.1,"endTime":1404.98,"body":"found out about it, and then"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1402.1,"endTime":1404.98,"body":"they fired him. So this thing"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1404.98,"endTime":1409.06,"body":"has just followed him around,"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1404.98,"endTime":1409.06,"body":"and that's not okay. That is not"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1409.06,"endTime":1409.36,"body":"okay."},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":1410.32,"endTime":1415.92,"body":"Okay. So moving"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":1410.32,"endTime":1415.92,"body":"on, Andrew, you have, I mean,"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":1415.92,"endTime":1419.04,"body":"we've got trapped live, haven't"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":1415.92,"endTime":1419.04,"body":"we, which is the biggest event,"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":1419.04,"endTime":1422.28,"body":"but you do? You do something,"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":1419.04,"endTime":1422.28,"body":"humans under what?"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1422.279,"endTime":1425.879,"body":"Yes, so I'm deep in"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1422.279,"endTime":1425.879,"body":"the conference organizing, event"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1425.879,"endTime":1428.819,"body":"organizing space at the moment,"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1425.879,"endTime":1428.819,"body":"yeah, putting everything"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1428.819,"endTime":1431.359,"body":"together. So I've got my two"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1428.819,"endTime":1431.359,"body":"conferences later in the year."},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1431.359,"endTime":1433.9389999999999,"body":"Humans are under management"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1431.359,"endTime":1433.9389999999999,"body":"London and humans under"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1433.9389999999999,"endTime":1436.219,"body":"management South Africa. The"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1433.9389999999999,"endTime":1436.219,"body":"tickets have hopefully been"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1436.219,"endTime":1438.379,"body":"launched at the time you are"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1436.219,"endTime":1438.379,"body":"hearing this, so you should have"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1438.379,"endTime":1441.859,"body":"been hopefully bombarded by"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1438.379,"endTime":1441.859,"body":"emails from various different"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1441.859,"endTime":1445.399,"body":"sources connected to me. So"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1441.859,"endTime":1445.399,"body":"that's all good. So yeah, London"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1445.399,"endTime":1449.539,"body":"and South Africa. And as always,"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1445.399,"endTime":1449.539,"body":"if anyone makes the pilgrimage"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1449.539,"endTime":1453.819,"body":"from the UK or Ireland to South"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1449.539,"endTime":1453.819,"body":"Africa, Cape Town, you have a"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1453.819,"endTime":1458.199,"body":"free ticket. Obviously, you need"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1453.819,"endTime":1458.199,"body":"to schlep yourself to the"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1458.499,"endTime":1462.819,"body":"southern hemisphere. That's it."},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1458.499,"endTime":1462.819,"body":"So my yeah two conferences later"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1462.819,"endTime":1465.519,"body":"in the year, and Carl was"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1462.819,"endTime":1465.519,"body":"invited to South Africa, but"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1465.9389999999999,"endTime":1469.4189999999999,"body":"he's got quite a lot on his"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1465.9389999999999,"endTime":1469.4189999999999,"body":"plate, so he politely declined"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1469.779,"endTime":1473.579,"body":"to come with me, even though he"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1469.779,"endTime":1473.579,"body":"carefully considered it. But"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1473.579,"endTime":1477.059,"body":"maybe more about that trap live."},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1473.579,"endTime":1477.059,"body":"So that's it."},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1477.06,"endTime":1478.5,"body":"Tell me something."},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1477.06,"endTime":1478.5,"body":"Andrew,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1480.0,"endTime":1480.36,"body":"yes, why"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1480.359,"endTime":1483.1789999999999,"body":"have you never gone"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1480.359,"endTime":1483.1789999999999,"body":"back? Why have you never had"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1483.239,"endTime":1486.059,"body":"hum, Dublin, you had one."},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1486.059,"endTime":1486.599,"body":"Oh yeah,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1486.599,"endTime":1486.719,"body":"you"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1486.72,"endTime":1489.18,"body":"had had it once. I"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1486.72,"endTime":1489.18,"body":"think"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1489.18,"endTime":1489.8999999999999,"body":"we were all there"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1491.7,"endTime":1494.78,"body":"again. Why did you"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1491.7,"endTime":1494.78,"body":"stick to UK and South Africa, of"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1494.78,"endTime":1498.3799999999999,"body":"all the places, just a hop skip"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1494.78,"endTime":1498.3799999999999,"body":"and a jump across the Irish Sea,"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1498.86,"endTime":1502.22,"body":"you could be in the heart of he"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1498.86,"endTime":1502.22,"body":"he ruined enough lives."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1505.94,"endTime":1506.18,"body":"No"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1506.54,"endTime":1510.56,"body":"joke, yeah. Aside, I"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1506.54,"endTime":1510.56,"body":"am up for doing Dublin again."},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1510.56,"endTime":1513.34,"body":"And me and Carl spoke quite"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1510.56,"endTime":1513.34,"body":"seriously about it. And I spoke"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1513.34,"endTime":1516.22,"body":"to various different companies."},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1513.34,"endTime":1516.22,"body":"Each country's got their own"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1516.8799999999999,"endTime":1520.48,"body":"various things to consider, but"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1516.8799999999999,"endTime":1520.48,"body":"it's just a time constraint. You"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1520.48,"endTime":1524.56,"body":"know, humans under management is"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1520.48,"endTime":1524.56,"body":"technically it? You know, not my"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1524.56,"endTime":1528.04,"body":"main business like as in,"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1524.56,"endTime":1528.04,"body":"they're all sort of in the mix"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1528.94,"endTime":1532.26,"body":"and doing three. Global"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1528.94,"endTime":1532.26,"body":"conferences per year, it would"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1532.26,"endTime":1535.3799999999999,"body":"have just been way too much. But"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1532.26,"endTime":1535.3799999999999,"body":"no, I'm very keen to go back."},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1535.44,"endTime":1536.3999999999999,"body":"Ireland"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1536.52,"endTime":1540.0,"body":"is ready, Andy, and"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1536.52,"endTime":1540.0,"body":"you should definitely do it."},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1540.0,"endTime":1540.3,"body":"Yeah,"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1540.3,"endTime":1541.44,"body":"I know we've spoken"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1540.3,"endTime":1541.44,"body":"about it."},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1541.44,"endTime":1543.42,"body":"There's a ground"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1541.44,"endTime":1543.42,"body":"there's a ground swell"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1543.42,"endTime":1543.78,"body":"here."},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1544.68,"endTime":1545.22,"body":"I"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1545.22,"endTime":1547.8,"body":"And there's a few key"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1545.22,"endTime":1547.8,"body":"companies that I can speak to,"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1548.76,"endTime":1552.68,"body":"yeah, in terms of exhibitors and"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1548.76,"endTime":1552.68,"body":"sponsors. But we could another"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1552.68,"endTime":1553.04,"body":"thing."},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":1553.1599999999999,"endTime":1553.52,"body":"Yeah, we"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1553.52,"endTime":1554.8999999999999,"body":"take your anniversary"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1553.52,"endTime":1554.8999999999999,"body":"Nick"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":1555.02,"endTime":1558.32,"body":"wellness that also"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":1555.02,"endTime":1558.32,"body":"do a Trappy kind of thing. It's"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":1558.32,"endTime":1561.1399999999999,"body":"not that difficult for all four"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":1558.32,"endTime":1561.1399999999999,"body":"of us to get out there. Anyway."},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1561.1399999999999,"endTime":1564.32,"body":"This guy always gigs."},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1561.1399999999999,"endTime":1564.32,"body":"Let's move No, I'm"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":1566.36,"endTime":1568.58,"body":"trying to improve"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":1566.36,"endTime":1568.58,"body":"yours further from a very low"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":1568.58,"endTime":1572.2,"body":"base storyteller message from"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":1568.58,"endTime":1572.2,"body":"Jack party in Northern Ireland."},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1572.26,"endTime":1575.68,"body":"Okay, bear with not"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1572.26,"endTime":1575.68,"body":"quite as prepared for this,"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1577.54,"endTime":1579.1599999999999,"body":"right? Jack,"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":1579.1599999999999,"endTime":1580.54,"body":"absolute shambles,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1580.54,"endTime":1580.72,"body":"talk"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1581.92,"endTime":1582.94,"body":"amongst yourselves."},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1581.92,"endTime":1582.94,"body":"We've"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1583.06,"endTime":1584.74,"body":"got no drops today."},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1583.06,"endTime":1584.74,"body":"Nick, have we got no"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1584.74,"endTime":1586.24,"body":"drops? Absolute"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1584.74,"endTime":1586.24,"body":"shambles, I"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1586.24,"endTime":1586.48,"body":"don't"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1586.48,"endTime":1586.78,"body":"think the"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":1586.96,"endTime":1589.06,"body":"media was working"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":1586.96,"endTime":1589.06,"body":"that well, mate. So I'm very low"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":1589.06,"endTime":1589.6,"body":"to touch it."},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1590.98,"endTime":1594.0,"body":"Talk about yourself"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1590.98,"endTime":1594.0,"body":"so Jack is"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1607.62,"endTime":1610.76,"body":"I love that one. Oh,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1607.62,"endTime":1610.76,"body":"you got all these ready for"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1610.76,"endTime":1611.3,"body":"trend line?"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":1624.98,"endTime":1627.56,"body":"Right for the love"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":1624.98,"endTime":1627.56,"body":"of God, Alan, please go on. Oh,"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":1627.56,"endTime":1628.52,"body":"come on. You."},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1633.1599999999999,"endTime":1636.28,"body":"All right, so Jack,"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1633.1599999999999,"endTime":1636.28,"body":"I'm just gonna read out. I have"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1636.28,"endTime":1639.8799999999999,"body":"his permission to read out. Send"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1636.28,"endTime":1639.8799999999999,"body":"a message to me via LinkedIn. Hi"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1639.8799999999999,"endTime":1643.72,"body":"Alan, I owe you and the guys at"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1639.8799999999999,"endTime":1643.72,"body":"trap a long overdue Thank you. I"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1643.72,"endTime":1646.36,"body":"was an advisor at True"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1643.72,"endTime":1646.36,"body":"Potential, working for a firm"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1646.36,"endTime":1650.6399999999999,"body":"that didn't even do cash flow"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1646.36,"endTime":1650.6399999999999,"body":"modeling, and I hated it when"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1650.6399999999999,"endTime":1654.18,"body":"you had Cathy on the podcast, I"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1650.6399999999999,"endTime":1654.18,"body":"enrolled in verve, and it really"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1654.18,"endTime":1656.94,"body":"opened my eyes as to what was"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1654.18,"endTime":1656.94,"body":"out there. With a one and two"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1656.94,"endTime":1659.58,"body":"year old and relatively new in"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1656.94,"endTime":1659.58,"body":"the profession, it wasn't a good"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1659.58,"endTime":1661.8,"body":"time to go out by myself. But"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1659.58,"endTime":1661.8,"body":"then you mentioned Paul"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1661.8,"endTime":1666.0,"body":"mccooberry's mastermind group. I"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1661.8,"endTime":1666.0,"body":"got in touch with Paul, and he"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1666.0,"endTime":1669.24,"body":"ended up opening a position for"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1666.0,"endTime":1669.24,"body":"me at his firm. I'm now doing"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1669.24,"endTime":1672.08,"body":"full fat financial planning and"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1669.24,"endTime":1672.08,"body":"making a difference in a real"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1672.08,"endTime":1676.34,"body":"way. Goes on to say Paul's"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1672.08,"endTime":1676.34,"body":"mastermind group, which again,"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1676.34,"endTime":1680.36,"body":"we talked about in the past, is"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1676.34,"endTime":1680.36,"body":"all business owners, but with"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1680.36,"endTime":1684.1399999999999,"body":"his help, I've got my own"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1680.36,"endTime":1684.1399999999999,"body":"mastermind group, which is a mix"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1684.1399999999999,"endTime":1688.22,"body":"of directly authorized and"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1684.1399999999999,"endTime":1688.22,"body":"network and employed advisors."},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1688.22,"endTime":1691.96,"body":"Here in Northern Ireland, we're"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1688.22,"endTime":1691.96,"body":"looking to add maybe two to four"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1691.96,"endTime":1694.78,"body":"more to our group, and we'd"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1691.96,"endTime":1694.78,"body":"appreciate a shout out, if"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1694.78,"endTime":1698.2,"body":"possible. And he put his email"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1694.78,"endTime":1698.2,"body":"address, which we'll put in the"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1698.5,"endTime":1701.92,"body":"in the show notes. So that was a"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1698.5,"endTime":1701.92,"body":"kind of convoluted thing, but,"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1701.92,"endTime":1705.04,"body":"you know, I think the underlying"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1701.92,"endTime":1705.04,"body":"message here is, and we've often"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1705.04,"endTime":1708.1599999999999,"body":"talked about in the past,"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1705.04,"endTime":1708.1599999999999,"body":"mastermind groups. Carl's got"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1708.1599999999999,"endTime":1711.3,"body":"his, or he's had his. He's been"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1708.1599999999999,"endTime":1711.3,"body":"involved in in Dublin, in"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1711.3,"endTime":1714.48,"body":"Ireland. Of course, we've all"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1711.3,"endTime":1714.48,"body":"been active historically in"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1714.6,"endTime":1717.6599999999999,"body":"London. Mastermind groups."},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1714.6,"endTime":1717.6599999999999,"body":"Getting together with fellow"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1717.6599999999999,"endTime":1720.12,"body":"professionals is a really"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1717.6599999999999,"endTime":1720.12,"body":"important thing to do,"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1720.12,"endTime":1724.08,"body":"particularly as you develop your"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1720.12,"endTime":1724.08,"body":"career. So Jack, yeah, and with"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1724.08,"endTime":1729.48,"body":"Paul's group, it is mostly"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1724.08,"endTime":1729.48,"body":"business owners. So there's so"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1729.48,"endTime":1731.6399999999999,"body":"good for Jack, he started a"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1729.48,"endTime":1731.6399999999999,"body":"different one who aren't"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1731.6399999999999,"endTime":1735.02,"body":"necessarily there. Could be"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1731.6399999999999,"endTime":1735.02,"body":"employed advisors. Could be, you"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1735.02,"endTime":1738.02,"body":"know, directly authorized"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1735.02,"endTime":1738.02,"body":"people. But if you are in that"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1738.02,"endTime":1740.48,"body":"part of the world, in Northern"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1738.02,"endTime":1740.48,"body":"Ireland, and you want to be part"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1740.48,"endTime":1742.6399999999999,"body":"of a group that meets up"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1740.48,"endTime":1742.6399999999999,"body":"regularly, shares their best"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1742.6399999999999,"endTime":1746.12,"body":"practice and best ideas, do get"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1742.6399999999999,"endTime":1746.12,"body":"in touch with Jack. I think the"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1746.12,"endTime":1748.58,"body":"whole thing is a great story."},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1746.12,"endTime":1748.58,"body":"Anyway, him going from True"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1748.58,"endTime":1751.48,"body":"Potential to working at a proper"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1748.58,"endTime":1751.48,"body":"financial planning company."},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":1751.78,"endTime":1754.3,"body":"Yeah. Brilliant,"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":1751.78,"endTime":1754.3,"body":"absolutely brilliant. Well done"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":1754.3,"endTime":1756.3999999999999,"body":"Jack. Well done Jack and well"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":1754.3,"endTime":1756.3999999999999,"body":"done Paul. That's, that's a"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":1756.3999999999999,"endTime":1759.46,"body":"brilliant, brilliant story."},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":1756.3999999999999,"endTime":1759.46,"body":"Okay, just conscious of time."},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":1759.76,"endTime":1762.34,"body":"Okay, so I've only just come"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":1759.76,"endTime":1762.34,"body":"across this article because it"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":1762.34,"endTime":1765.3999999999999,"body":"hit my inbox this afternoon, but"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":1762.34,"endTime":1765.3999999999999,"body":"we've been, we've been going on"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":1765.3999999999999,"endTime":1769.48,"body":"about cash skims on platforms"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":1765.3999999999999,"endTime":1769.48,"body":"for for over the last year. I"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":1769.48,"endTime":1772.1399999999999,"body":"guess because it is an issue, we"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":1769.48,"endTime":1772.1399999999999,"body":"all think it's an issue, and we"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":1772.32,"endTime":1774.6,"body":"know that one one platform"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":1772.32,"endTime":1774.6,"body":"doesn't do it, and it's a"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":1774.6,"endTime":1777.84,"body":"prominent platform, and another"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":1774.6,"endTime":1777.84,"body":"platform didn't do it and is now"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":1777.84,"endTime":1782.04,"body":"going to actually introduce a"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":1777.84,"endTime":1782.04,"body":"skim on its cash holdings on its"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":1782.04,"endTime":1784.92,"body":"platform. Aviva, going against"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":1782.04,"endTime":1784.92,"body":"the we'd have thought the"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":1784.92,"endTime":1788.1,"body":"prevailing winds were, is now"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":1784.92,"endTime":1788.1,"body":"going to introduce a skim on its"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":1788.1,"endTime":1791.96,"body":"cash on its on its platform. And"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":1788.1,"endTime":1791.96,"body":"I read the article on city"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":1791.96,"endTime":1794.3,"body":"worlds linked to it in the so"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":1791.96,"endTime":1794.3,"body":"called show notes. Didn't have"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":1794.3,"endTime":1797.54,"body":"time to really read it in depth,"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":1794.3,"endTime":1797.54,"body":"but I went to the comments and"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":1797.72,"endTime":1800.8999999999999,"body":"yeah, basically Aviva doing it,"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":1797.72,"endTime":1800.8999999999999,"body":"and their commercial view is"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":1800.8999999999999,"endTime":1803.8999999999999,"body":"because everyone else does it,"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":1800.8999999999999,"endTime":1803.8999999999999,"body":"so we're going to do it, which"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":1803.96,"endTime":1807.92,"body":"strikes me as being a little bit"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":1803.96,"endTime":1807.92,"body":"shitty, to be honest. And the"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":1807.92,"endTime":1811.8999999999999,"body":"comments on the article back"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":1807.92,"endTime":1811.8999999999999,"body":"that up as well, but, yeah, I"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":1811.8999999999999,"endTime":1815.92,"body":"don't know. It's just, to me, a"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":1811.8999999999999,"endTime":1815.92,"body":"bizarre it just seems that"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":1815.92,"endTime":1816.76,"body":"that's a clanger."},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1819.46,"endTime":1822.58,"body":"Yeah, I wasn't aware"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1819.46,"endTime":1822.58,"body":"that Aviva didn't charge a skim,"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1822.58,"endTime":1824.02,"body":"so That's news to me. Well,"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":1824.019,"endTime":1826.059,"body":"well, they do."},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":1824.019,"endTime":1826.059,"body":"They check. They charge 35 bits"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":1826.059,"endTime":1828.699,"body":"on cash, which is they, that's"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":1826.059,"endTime":1828.699,"body":"how they do."},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1829.24,"endTime":1831.72,"body":"They charge a fee."},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1829.24,"endTime":1831.72,"body":"Fixed skim, quite"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":1831.72,"endTime":1834.72,"body":"a fit, high fixed"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":1831.72,"endTime":1834.72,"body":"skim. And now that now, and if"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":1834.72,"endTime":1837.0,"body":"you look at the article that"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":1834.72,"endTime":1837.0,"body":"they're getting rid of the 35"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":1837.18,"endTime":1840.0,"body":"bit charge on cash, but they're"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":1837.18,"endTime":1840.0,"body":"going to retain"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1840.0,"endTime":1843.96,"body":"interest, yeah, all"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1840.0,"endTime":1843.96,"body":"right,"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1844.1399999999999,"endTime":1847.02,"body":"that's, you know,"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1844.1399999999999,"endTime":1847.02,"body":"the most egregious ones are the"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1847.02,"endTime":1852.32,"body":"ones who take a skim on cash and"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1847.02,"endTime":1852.32,"body":"charge platform, platform fee,"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1852.32,"endTime":1854.78,"body":"and there's a there's a few of"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1852.32,"endTime":1854.78,"body":"them as well who do both those"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1854.78,"endTime":1858.44,"body":"things. We know. The only"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1854.78,"endTime":1858.44,"body":"company that we're aware of that"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1858.44,"endTime":1861.56,"body":"does none of those is transact,"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1861.56,"endTime":1863.78,"body":"transact. Charge"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1861.56,"endTime":1863.78,"body":"their platform fee, Alan, but"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1863.78,"endTime":1866.18,"body":"don't skim on the cash, so they"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1863.78,"endTime":1866.18,"body":"get the best rate they can get"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1866.18,"endTime":1868.94,"body":"for you. But they do charge"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1866.18,"endTime":1868.94,"body":"their platform fee on it, just"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1869.48,"endTime":1872.2,"body":"okay, but because"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1869.48,"endTime":1872.2,"body":"they get their institutional"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1872.2,"endTime":1875.62,"body":"terms on the cash, as I"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1872.2,"endTime":1875.62,"body":"understand, that can often"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1875.68,"endTime":1878.74,"body":"completely cover the cost any"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1875.68,"endTime":1878.74,"body":"much cash you've got without,"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":1878.74,"endTime":1880.6,"body":"without drowning"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":1878.74,"endTime":1880.6,"body":"in this, maybe read the article,"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":1880.6,"endTime":1883.18,"body":"you got chance options. I think"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":1880.6,"endTime":1883.18,"body":"the current rate of EVA paying"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":1883.18,"endTime":1887.32,"body":"is 1.8 on cash, whereas transact"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":1883.18,"endTime":1887.32,"body":"paying 3.69 I mean, it's just a"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":1887.32,"endTime":1889.6599999999999,"body":"different bloody world"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1889.6599999999999,"endTime":1891.72,"body":"once you've got a"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1889.6599999999999,"endTime":1891.72,"body":"few 10s of billions on your"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1891.72,"endTime":1895.5,"body":"platform. This is a money spent."},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1891.72,"endTime":1895.5,"body":"It's a money spinner. Jeez,"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1895.5,"endTime":1895.62,"body":"yeah,"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1895.62,"endTime":1897.54,"body":"when those"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1895.62,"endTime":1897.54,"body":"consultants come in and go what"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1897.54,"endTime":1900.24,"body":"you're not, they don't call it"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1897.54,"endTime":1900.24,"body":"skimming on off cash. I'm sure"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1900.24,"endTime":1901.92,"body":"they've got a great internal"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1900.24,"endTime":1901.92,"body":"name for"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1902.52,"endTime":1903.96,"body":"it, margin"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1902.52,"endTime":1903.96,"body":"expansion."},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1904.92,"endTime":1906.24,"body":"We skim off cash."},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":1907.68,"endTime":1909.84,"body":"We use the casino"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":1907.68,"endTime":1909.84,"body":"model, yeah."},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1910.68,"endTime":1914.54,"body":"But the juice. Take a"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1910.68,"endTime":1914.54,"body":"look at that. Look at this. I"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1914.54,"endTime":1917.48,"body":"think I can't remember. I think"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1914.54,"endTime":1917.48,"body":"it's about eight to 10% of all"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1917.54,"endTime":1922.82,"body":"assets on platform are in cash."},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1917.54,"endTime":1922.82,"body":"Anyway, yeah, it's a recurring"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1922.82,"endTime":1927.26,"body":"theme on trap transact are"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1922.82,"endTime":1927.26,"body":"insanely transparent about it,"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1927.32,"endTime":1931.06,"body":"and they're becoming more vocal"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1927.32,"endTime":1931.06,"body":"about it as well, rightly so."},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1931.78,"endTime":1934.54,"body":"Anyway, that's the Yeah, if,"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1935.8,"endTime":1941.8,"body":"if a platform is"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1935.8,"endTime":1941.8,"body":"has a platform charge, I think"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1941.8,"endTime":1944.56,"body":"it's okay to charge if there's"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1941.8,"endTime":1944.56,"body":"money on the platform because"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1944.56,"endTime":1949.12,"body":"that you've just have a platform"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1944.56,"endTime":1949.12,"body":"charge, you can decide, I know."},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1949.12,"endTime":1952.5,"body":"I know. So, so so fair play, and"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1949.12,"endTime":1952.5,"body":"then transact, give all the"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1952.5,"endTime":1957.06,"body":"return back to the client,"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1952.5,"endTime":1957.06,"body":"right? So what? Nick just said"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1957.06,"endTime":1960.84,"body":"that, that, if I'm correct,"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1957.06,"endTime":1960.84,"body":"Nick, that that Aviva, are now"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1960.84,"endTime":1963.72,"body":"not going to charge on the cash"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1960.84,"endTime":1963.72,"body":"amount, but they're going to"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1963.84,"endTime":1965.28,"body":"take some of the return."},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":1965.58,"endTime":1966.0,"body":"Yeah,"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1966.0,"endTime":1968.1,"body":"half the return."},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1966.0,"endTime":1968.1,"body":"Carl, sorry, half the return,"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1968.1,"endTime":1968.82,"body":"approximately,"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1968.82,"endTime":1972.3799999999999,"body":"okay, yeah. But you"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1968.82,"endTime":1972.3799999999999,"body":"know what? I'm kind of okay with"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1972.3799999999999,"endTime":1975.08,"body":"that. It's the people who are"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1972.3799999999999,"endTime":1975.08,"body":"charging and then they're also"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1975.08,"endTime":1978.1399999999999,"body":"taking the interest in the cash"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1975.08,"endTime":1978.1399999999999,"body":"those people that that's what"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":1978.1399999999999,"endTime":1979.34,"body":"the regulator should look at."},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":1979.6399999999999,"endTime":1980.18,"body":"But the Viva"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":1980.8999999999999,"endTime":1985.82,"body":"will now appear."},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":1980.8999999999999,"endTime":1985.82,"body":"Aviva will now appear. 35 bips"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":1985.82,"endTime":1988.22,"body":"cheaper, you know, and all the"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":1985.82,"endTime":1988.22,"body":"platform comparison things,"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":1988.22,"endTime":1990.68,"body":"because that's, that's that cost"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":1988.22,"endTime":1990.68,"body":"has gone. The skim isn't"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":1990.68,"endTime":1993.04,"body":"factored into costings when"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":1990.68,"endTime":1993.04,"body":"you're looking at platform. At"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":1993.04,"endTime":1995.74,"body":"platform analysis and that kind"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":1993.04,"endTime":1995.74,"body":"of stuff. So it's not just the"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":1995.74,"endTime":1998.02,"body":"whole book. We're trying to get"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":1995.74,"endTime":1998.02,"body":"this. It's almost like"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":1998.02,"endTime":2001.62,"body":"commissions, isn't it? Ways we"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":1998.02,"endTime":2001.62,"body":"want this transparent world, if"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":2001.62,"endTime":2005.6399999999999,"body":"we, if I put my clients money on"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":2001.62,"endTime":2005.6399999999999,"body":"cash, and you're taking 20 bits"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":2005.6399999999999,"endTime":2005.94,"body":"on it,"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":2005.94,"endTime":2006.18,"body":"yeah,"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":2006.24,"endTime":2007.8,"body":"do you pass"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":2006.24,"endTime":2007.8,"body":"through the whole amount? And"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":2007.8,"endTime":2009.8999999999999,"body":"that's all I want to, you know,"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":2007.8,"endTime":2009.8999999999999,"body":"just, just give us those"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":2009.8999999999999,"endTime":2012.02,"body":"figures. Don't charge on cash,"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":2009.8999999999999,"endTime":2012.02,"body":"but we retain some of the"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":2012.44,"endTime":2013.28,"body":"because it's like"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":2013.28,"endTime":2015.3799999999999,"body":"accepting what"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":2013.28,"endTime":2015.3799999999999,"body":"you're saying. But if you want"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":2015.3799999999999,"endTime":2019.28,"body":"to go after the worst, the worst"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":2015.3799999999999,"endTime":2019.28,"body":"offenders, it's the people who"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":2019.28,"endTime":2021.86,"body":"are charging for that yeah, and"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":2019.28,"endTime":2021.86,"body":"taking on, sure,"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":2021.86,"endTime":2022.1599999999999,"body":"yeah."},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":2022.34,"endTime":2024.5,"body":"But the whole, the"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":2022.34,"endTime":2024.5,"body":"whole thing, you're right, it's"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":2024.5,"endTime":2028.1599999999999,"body":"a bit icky. It's about, how can"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":2024.5,"endTime":2028.1599999999999,"body":"we kind of fudge the story a bit"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":2028.1599999999999,"endTime":2029.3,"body":"just to squeeze?"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":2029.6,"endTime":2031.3,"body":"Well, really"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":2029.6,"endTime":2031.3,"body":"honestly, read the article."},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":2031.3,"endTime":2033.3999999999999,"body":"They're not that subtle. They're"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":2031.3,"endTime":2033.3999999999999,"body":"saying that we're doing it"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":2033.3999999999999,"endTime":2035.92,"body":"because everyone else is good"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":2033.3999999999999,"endTime":2035.92,"body":"doing it and getting away with"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":2035.92,"endTime":2036.46,"body":"it. Between"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2036.46,"endTime":2036.76,"body":"the Lines,"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":2036.759,"endTime":2038.079,"body":"did you read the"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":2036.759,"endTime":2038.079,"body":"article? Andy,"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2038.92,"endTime":2040.18,"body":"I did call Yes,"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":2040.36,"endTime":2041.74,"body":"just just then."},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":2040.36,"endTime":2041.74,"body":"Everybody should"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2041.74,"endTime":2043.06,"body":"read all links. Put"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2041.74,"endTime":2043.06,"body":"in"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2043.96,"endTime":2044.68,"body":"two minutes in"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2045.46,"endTime":2049.1800000000003,"body":"your experience for"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2045.46,"endTime":2049.1800000000003,"body":"our listeners."},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":2050.5,"endTime":2053.82,"body":"Okay, right? Guys,"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":2050.5,"endTime":2053.82,"body":"time is temperature. Tempest is"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":2053.82,"endTime":2058.26,"body":"fugitive, past us as we speak,"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":2053.82,"endTime":2058.26,"body":"right? Very, very briefly, self"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":2058.26,"endTime":2058.92,"body":"promotion, very"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":2058.92,"endTime":2063.42,"body":"briefly, ironically,"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":2058.92,"endTime":2063.42,"body":"in the age of AI and technology"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":2063.42,"endTime":2069.1800000000003,"body":"innovation, we are AI at my"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":2063.42,"endTime":2069.1800000000003,"body":"independent advice firm in"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":2069.1800000000003,"endTime":2073.7000000000003,"body":"London, we are hiring not one,"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":2069.1800000000003,"endTime":2073.7000000000003,"body":"but two people. We're hiring a"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":2074.2400000000002,"endTime":2078.68,"body":"Head of Financial sorry, head of"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":2074.2400000000002,"endTime":2078.68,"body":"para planning, so a senior, a"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":2078.68,"endTime":2082.64,"body":"senior para planner and a"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":2078.68,"endTime":2082.64,"body":"regular paraplanner. We're"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":2082.64,"endTime":2087.32,"body":"beefing up our support team"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":2082.64,"endTime":2087.32,"body":"quite significantly. Things are"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":2087.32,"endTime":2090.7599999999998,"body":"going in the right direction"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":2087.32,"endTime":2090.7599999999998,"body":"despite us using all the tools"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":2090.7599999999998,"endTime":2093.46,"body":"of the trade. We need more"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":2090.7599999999998,"endTime":2093.46,"body":"bodies on the ground. I think"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":2093.46,"endTime":2095.98,"body":"we've got a very, very"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":2093.46,"endTime":2095.98,"body":"compelling offer, and I'll post"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":2095.98,"endTime":2099.2799999999997,"body":"links to it in the show notes."},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":2095.98,"endTime":2099.2799999999997,"body":"So if you are looking for a"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":2099.2799999999997,"endTime":2103.0,"body":"change of scenery and you want"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":2099.2799999999997,"endTime":2103.0,"body":"to come and work at Capital, do"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":2103.0,"endTime":2105.4,"body":"get in touch if you're a"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":2103.0,"endTime":2105.4,"body":"paraplanner or a senior"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":2105.46,"endTime":2106.7799999999997,"body":"paraplanner, thank you."},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":2106.84,"endTime":2109.18,"body":"Okay, and I think"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":2106.84,"endTime":2109.18,"body":"Carl has a similar kind of"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":2109.24,"endTime":2110.22,"body":"message, sir, yes."},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":2110.22,"endTime":2113.4,"body":"We have exciting"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":2110.22,"endTime":2113.4,"body":"plans, which I'm looking forward"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":2113.4,"endTime":2118.68,"body":"to sharing at shop life or"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":2113.4,"endTime":2118.68,"body":"recruiting for three or maybe"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":2118.68,"endTime":2123.06,"body":"more private client managers in"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":2118.68,"endTime":2123.06,"body":"Dublin at the moment. And the"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":2123.06,"endTime":2127.38,"body":"link to the careers page on our"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":2123.06,"endTime":2127.38,"body":"website is in the show notes"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":2127.38,"endTime":2128.88,"body":"somewhere, wherever they are."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2130.94,"endTime":2131.48,"body":"Okay, very,"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":2131.96,"endTime":2133.88,"body":"very good. Okay,"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":2131.96,"endTime":2133.88,"body":"just"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2133.88,"endTime":2135.8,"body":"a quick thing on"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2133.88,"endTime":2135.8,"body":"recruitment Maven advisor,"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2135.8,"endTime":2138.44,"body":"actually recruiting four people"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2135.8,"endTime":2138.44,"body":"at the moment. Alan's only"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2138.44,"endTime":2142.52,"body":"recruiting two. Carl just three."},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2138.44,"endTime":2142.52,"body":"We're recruiting four. So we're"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2142.52,"endTime":2150.22,"body":"looking for a head of internal"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2142.52,"endTime":2150.22,"body":"audit. We're looking for a lead"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2150.34,"endTime":2152.44,"body":"financial planner on our sports"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2150.34,"endTime":2152.44,"body":"division."},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":2155.92,"endTime":2156.7599999999998,"body":"Back to"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2156.7599999999998,"endTime":2157.12,"body":"you,"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":2157.719,"endTime":2159.939,"body":"Assistant compliance"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":2157.719,"endTime":2159.939,"body":"director,"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":2160.6,"endTime":2160.9,"body":"you"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2162.879,"endTime":2164.259,"body":"Regional Director,"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":2164.5,"endTime":2166.84,"body":"you 1212, or even"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":2164.5,"endTime":2166.84,"body":"to be there."},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":2167.08,"endTime":2167.5,"body":"Yeah,"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2168.7599999999998,"endTime":2170.2799999999997,"body":"right for the name"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2168.7599999999998,"endTime":2170.2799999999997,"body":"Christ. Let's"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":2170.2799999999997,"endTime":2171.72,"body":"end recruitment."},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":2170.2799999999997,"endTime":2171.72,"body":"Recruitment"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":2171.7799999999997,"endTime":2174.18,"body":"plans. Let's,"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":2171.7799999999997,"endTime":2174.18,"body":"yeah, I did it in 2008 great"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":2174.18,"endTime":2177.0,"body":"guy, one of the greatest, one of"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":2174.18,"endTime":2177.0,"body":"the greatest guys, one of the"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":2177.0,"endTime":2182.2799999999997,"body":"greatest. Okay, let's move on."},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":2177.0,"endTime":2182.2799999999997,"body":"We'll end with you chose this"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":2182.2799999999997,"endTime":2184.5,"body":"platform. Smithy, you tell us"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":2184.5,"endTime":2187.08,"body":"why I'm not. I'm not"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":2184.5,"endTime":2187.08,"body":"gonna name and shame. I was"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":2187.08,"endTime":2191.06,"body":"just, I was just kind of raising"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":2187.08,"endTime":2191.06,"body":"this with those around the table"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":2191.06,"endTime":2195.38,"body":"right now, we really are"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":2191.06,"endTime":2195.38,"body":"struggling with our kind of"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":2195.38,"endTime":2200.54,"body":"default platform provider, just"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":2195.38,"endTime":2200.54,"body":"basic, basic stuff, turnaround"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":2200.54,"endTime":2205.4,"body":"times, delays. You know, it"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":2200.54,"endTime":2205.4,"body":"seems a lot of the work we do,"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":2205.4,"endTime":2207.86,"body":"there is a lot of admin"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":2205.4,"endTime":2207.86,"body":"involved, despite all the and"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":2207.86,"endTime":2210.2799999999997,"body":"you can bring all the technology"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":2207.86,"endTime":2210.2799999999997,"body":"in, but at the end of the day,"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":2210.2799999999997,"endTime":2212.62,"body":"the people that are the"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":2210.2799999999997,"endTime":2212.62,"body":"custodians the client assets,"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":2212.62,"endTime":2215.14,"body":"when client wants some money"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":2212.62,"endTime":2215.14,"body":"out, or they want to do certain"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":2215.14,"endTime":2219.82,"body":"things or put money in, God"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":2215.14,"endTime":2219.82,"body":"forbid, what's, what's, I mean,"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":2219.82,"endTime":2224.2599999999998,"body":"I know you boys are just firmly"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":2219.82,"endTime":2224.2599999999998,"body":"in the transact camp. 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And you would"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":2236.16,"endTime":2239.82,"body":"think in 2026 a lot of these"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":2236.16,"endTime":2239.82,"body":"issues would be kind of resolved"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":2239.82,"endTime":2242.34,"body":"with all this sort of tech"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":2239.82,"endTime":2242.34,"body":"opportunities, but it's"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":2242.34,"endTime":2246.06,"body":"currently really, really"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":2242.34,"endTime":2246.06,"body":"difficult, really challenging on"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":2246.06,"endTime":2248.7599999999998,"body":"a pure admin front. Any"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":2246.06,"endTime":2248.7599999999998,"body":"thoughts?"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2250.86,"endTime":2252.14,"body":"Nick, do you want to"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2250.86,"endTime":2252.14,"body":"go"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":2252.859,"endTime":2256.399,"body":"nothing really to"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":2252.859,"endTime":2256.399,"body":"add? I mean, we've all built"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":2256.399,"endTime":2258.739,"body":"businesses now around the"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":2256.399,"endTime":2258.739,"body":"platform, and if one or two"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":2258.739,"endTime":2261.619,"body":"platforms, normally just one"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":2258.739,"endTime":2261.619,"body":"within a subsidiary platform,"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":2261.799,"endTime":2264.199,"body":"for certain cases, certain"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":2261.799,"endTime":2264.199,"body":"client profiles, and if your"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":2264.199,"endTime":2266.839,"body":"main platform isn't working,"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":2264.199,"endTime":2266.839,"body":"it's like a key member of your"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":2266.839,"endTime":2272.379,"body":"team is just not on. Boys coming"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":2266.839,"endTime":2272.379,"body":"in late is, whatever. It's just"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":2272.379,"endTime":2274.719,"body":"not, it's just not pulling his"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":2272.379,"endTime":2274.719,"body":"or her way. It's, it must be a"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":2274.719,"endTime":2277.419,"body":"matt. I mean, I haven't had that"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":2274.719,"endTime":2277.419,"body":"experience. I can't imagine what"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":2277.419,"endTime":2280.899,"body":"it is like. And I know that, you"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":2277.419,"endTime":2280.899,"body":"know, when you try and mass"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":2280.899,"endTime":2283.599,"body":"migrate clients from one"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":2280.899,"endTime":2283.599,"body":"platform, that's a big exercise"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":2283.599,"endTime":2286.899,"body":"in itself, disruptive, and"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":2283.599,"endTime":2286.899,"body":"clients get a bit nervous about"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":2286.899,"endTime":2290.139,"body":"it. But it shouldn't be"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":2286.899,"endTime":2290.139,"body":"happening in 2026 we've got all"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":2290.139,"endTime":2292.199,"body":"this bloody tech, you know,"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":2290.139,"endTime":2292.199,"body":"everything, everything should be"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":2292.199,"endTime":2295.019,"body":"slick. It should be a tech"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":2292.199,"endTime":2295.019,"body":"enabled process. Andy,"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2296.7599999999998,"endTime":2300.0,"body":"yeah, the platform is"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2296.7599999999998,"endTime":2300.0,"body":"insanely important. And also,"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2300.0,"endTime":2305.16,"body":"client demands in 2026 are"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2300.0,"endTime":2305.16,"body":"pretty high. As I get clients"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2305.16,"endTime":2309.12,"body":"send 50 grand into a pension."},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2305.16,"endTime":2309.12,"body":"They WhatsApp me as the money"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2309.12,"endTime":2309.72,"body":"landed, like"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2309.72,"endTime":2309.9,"body":"10"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2310.02,"endTime":2312.38,"body":"minutes later,"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2310.02,"endTime":2312.38,"body":"because that's how the other"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2312.38,"endTime":2314.9,"body":"platforms are operating"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2312.38,"endTime":2314.9,"body":"potentially. And then I've got"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2314.9,"endTime":2317.54,"body":"to manage their expectations. It"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2314.9,"endTime":2317.54,"body":"will take me a day or so to"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2317.54,"endTime":2319.94,"body":"confirm, then I'll send you an"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2317.54,"endTime":2319.94,"body":"email to confirm it's been"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2319.94,"endTime":2322.7599999999998,"body":"invested. I thought if I dealt"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2319.94,"endTime":2322.7599999999998,"body":"with one of those horrendous"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2322.7599999999998,"endTime":2325.34,"body":"platforms that you may be"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2322.7599999999998,"endTime":2325.34,"body":"referring to, Alan, it might"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2325.34,"endTime":2327.8,"body":"take two or three weeks to show"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2325.34,"endTime":2327.8,"body":"on the client's pension, and"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2327.8,"endTime":2330.08,"body":"they're thinking, I need to tell"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2327.8,"endTime":2330.08,"body":"my accountant now, we need to"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2330.08,"endTime":2331.6,"body":"invest it. The markets are"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2330.08,"endTime":2331.6,"body":"moved."},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":2331.779,"endTime":2332.319,"body":"Yeah, so"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2332.32,"endTime":2334.7799999999997,"body":"you've got your own"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2332.32,"endTime":2334.7799999999997,"body":"team members tripping you up."},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2334.7799999999997,"endTime":2340.48,"body":"You want those platforms to just"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2334.7799999999997,"endTime":2340.48,"body":"work? So again, I'm fortunate"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2340.48,"endTime":2342.88,"body":"that, yeah, that my main"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2340.48,"endTime":2342.88,"body":"platform does just work. And I"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2342.88,"endTime":2345.64,"body":"spend a lot of time every day on"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2342.88,"endTime":2345.64,"body":"there making sure the money's in"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2345.64,"endTime":2347.86,"body":"the right place, the cash has"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2345.64,"endTime":2347.86,"body":"been invested. Because again,"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2347.86,"endTime":2350.08,"body":"you hear lots of things. I had"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2347.86,"endTime":2350.08,"body":"an advise the other day. Talk to"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2350.08,"endTime":2353.04,"body":"me about a platform. We went to"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2350.08,"endTime":2353.04,"body":"the rebalance. It didn't work."},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2353.04,"endTime":2356.16,"body":"Now he owes the client five"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2353.04,"endTime":2356.16,"body":"grand or something. So, yeah,"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2356.16,"endTime":2360.72,"body":"there's real life implications,"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2356.16,"endTime":2360.72,"body":"yep, real life financial"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2360.72,"endTime":2363.96,"body":"implications of these things not"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2360.72,"endTime":2363.96,"body":"working. There are other times,"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2364.02,"endTime":2366.7799999999997,"body":"yeah, there are other times when"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2364.02,"endTime":2366.7799999999997,"body":"a client needs X 1000s of"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2366.7799999999997,"endTime":2370.08,"body":"pounds, they've given you enough"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2366.7799999999997,"endTime":2370.08,"body":"preparation time, two weeks,"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2370.08,"endTime":2373.22,"body":"three weeks, four weeks,"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2370.08,"endTime":2373.22,"body":"transact. Which is platform,"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2373.22,"endTime":2375.5,"body":"mainly, you can get the money"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2373.22,"endTime":2375.5,"body":"within a week. I always tell"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2375.56,"endTime":2378.02,"body":"clients from you, telling me you"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2375.56,"endTime":2378.02,"body":"need the money to being in your"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2378.02,"endTime":2381.32,"body":"bank. Assume a week. Some"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2378.02,"endTime":2381.32,"body":"platforms take absolutely ages."},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2381.32,"endTime":2384.62,"body":"They get down a hole, and"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2381.32,"endTime":2384.62,"body":"they'll say, you can't call us"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2384.62,"endTime":2389.0,"body":"back for a chase for 14 days."},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2384.62,"endTime":2389.0,"body":"You're just sitting in no man's"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2389.0,"endTime":2392.38,"body":"land, no person's land, for 14"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2389.0,"endTime":2392.38,"body":"days, and you chase it, and they"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2392.56,"endTime":2394.84,"body":"say, oh, you know the signature,"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2392.56,"endTime":2394.84,"body":"it doesn't quite match the one"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2394.84,"endTime":2399.22,"body":"we had from 19 years ago. And"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2394.84,"endTime":2399.22,"body":"you go for, yeah, okay, we've"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2399.22,"endTime":2399.7599999999998,"body":"just gotten"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":2399.759,"endTime":2402.159,"body":"it. That's exactly"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":2399.759,"endTime":2402.159,"body":"like when you've got clients,"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":2402.159,"endTime":2406.239,"body":"and clients do need money out to"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":2402.159,"endTime":2406.239,"body":"meet certain liabilities that"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":2406.239,"endTime":2408.219,"body":"they've agreed and they're"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":2406.239,"endTime":2408.219,"body":"giving you three or four weeks"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":2408.219,"endTime":2413.819,"body":"notice for it, and then we're"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":2408.219,"endTime":2413.819,"body":"failing to deliver because,"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":2413.819,"endTime":2417.359,"body":"yeah, that's unaccept you won't"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":2413.819,"endTime":2417.359,"body":"do it. It's it's a real issue."},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":2417.359,"endTime":2419.759,"body":"Just last thing, Carl, I mean"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":2417.359,"endTime":2419.759,"body":"that you've often talked about"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":2419.759,"endTime":2422.279,"body":"platforms. In Ireland, there's"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":2419.759,"endTime":2422.279,"body":"very little competition. I know"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":2422.279,"endTime":2424.979,"body":"that secular going in there to"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":2422.279,"endTime":2424.979,"body":"give a bit of competition. But"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":2424.979,"endTime":2427.439,"body":"do you ever, ever have issues"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":2424.979,"endTime":2427.439,"body":"like this and have sort of"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":2427.439,"endTime":2429.959,"body":"admin, money in, money out,"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":2427.439,"endTime":2429.959,"body":"administration?"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":2430.04,"endTime":2431.66,"body":"Honestly, no,"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":2430.04,"endTime":2431.66,"body":"honestly, no."},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":2431.659,"endTime":2432.019,"body":"Well,"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2432.2,"endTime":2432.62,"body":"consider"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":2432.62,"endTime":2433.58,"body":"yourself lucky."},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":2432.62,"endTime":2433.58,"body":"It's,"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":2434.299,"endTime":2436.459,"body":"yeah, it's really,"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":2434.299,"endTime":2436.459,"body":"it's really good. There's"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":2436.459,"endTime":2441.139,"body":"probably half of my team going,"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":2436.459,"endTime":2441.139,"body":"he doesn't know what the hell's"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":2441.139,"endTime":2445.099,"body":"going on in the background. And"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":2441.139,"endTime":2445.099,"body":"he was like, I'm on transact all"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":2445.099,"endTime":2447.919,"body":"day, and I'm moving them. I'm"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":2445.099,"endTime":2447.919,"body":"like, I wouldn't even know how"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":2447.919,"endTime":2450.279,"body":"to log in. But anyway, that's"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":2447.919,"endTime":2450.279,"body":"probably a good thing for"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":2450.279,"endTime":2453.699,"body":"everybody. But no, I if we had"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":2450.279,"endTime":2453.699,"body":"problems, I'd know about it,"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":2453.699,"endTime":2455.439,"body":"because I'd hear be here, not"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":2453.699,"endTime":2455.439,"body":"about it. So"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":2455.44,"endTime":2455.98,"body":"yeah,"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":2456.34,"endTime":2458.2,"body":"right. Andy, things"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":2456.34,"endTime":2458.2,"body":"really, sorry."},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2458.199,"endTime":2460.179,"body":"A logistical"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2458.199,"endTime":2460.179,"body":"question. Carl, if a client"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2460.179,"endTime":2464.019,"body":"emailed Metis Norway tomorrow"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2460.179,"endTime":2464.019,"body":"and said I need 50 grand out my"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2464.319,"endTime":2467.139,"body":"X, Y, Z account, how quickly"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2464.319,"endTime":2467.139,"body":"would that money land in their"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2467.139,"endTime":2468.999,"body":"bank? Five"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":2469.0,"endTime":2469.7799999999997,"body":"working days."},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2470.379,"endTime":2472.619,"body":"Okay, so similar to"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2470.379,"endTime":2472.619,"body":"us, yes, that's weak, because"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2472.619,"endTime":2474.119,"body":"it's the five working day"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2474.36,"endTime":2474.54,"body":"thing,"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":2474.6,"endTime":2478.2,"body":"because never get"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":2474.6,"endTime":2478.2,"body":"it, because that doesn't exist."},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":2478.2599999999998,"endTime":2478.74,"body":"But anyway,"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":2480.48,"endTime":2485.22,"body":"okay, 41 minutes."},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":2480.48,"endTime":2485.22,"body":"41 minutes in, boys, so that's a"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":2485.4,"endTime":2488.7599999999998,"body":"very good topical time, time"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":2485.4,"endTime":2488.7599999999998,"body":"tidbits and putting a timestamp"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":2488.7599999999998,"endTime":2493.04,"body":"on episode 96 so I think it's"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":2488.7599999999998,"endTime":2493.04,"body":"time that we moved over to the"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":2493.04,"endTime":2495.74,"body":"meat and potatoes of the real"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":2493.04,"endTime":2495.74,"body":"advisor podcast. This is where"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":2495.74,"endTime":2499.52,"body":"we take a subject and give it a"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":2495.74,"endTime":2499.52,"body":"damn good thrashing and or we"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":2545.6,"endTime":2548.7799999999997,"body":"have an interview with some of"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":2545.6,"endTime":2548.7799999999997,"body":"the more interesting figures in"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":2548.7799999999997,"endTime":2552.14,"body":"and around this thing of ours."},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":2548.7799999999997,"endTime":2552.14,"body":"And for this one, we've got a"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":2552.3199999999997,"endTime":2555.14,"body":"humdinger. I don't think he"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":2552.3199999999997,"endTime":2555.14,"body":"needs much of an introduction."},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":2555.56,"endTime":2560.2,"body":"Rory Sutherland, a very, very"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":2555.56,"endTime":2560.2,"body":"good speaker a wide range of"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":2560.2,"endTime":2563.08,"body":"subjects he can opine on. And he"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":2560.2,"endTime":2563.08,"body":"had the task of corralling Mr."},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":2563.08,"endTime":2565.66,"body":"Sutherland for this one, trying"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":2563.08,"endTime":2565.66,"body":"to get a financial services"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":2565.66,"endTime":2569.2599999999998,"body":"slant on it. So we hope you do"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":2565.66,"endTime":2569.2599999999998,"body":"enjoy it. I give you without any"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":2569.2599999999998,"endTime":2571.48,"body":"further ado, Mr. Rory"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":2569.2599999999998,"endTime":2571.48,"body":"Sutherland,"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2574.359,"endTime":2577.019,"body":"so Rory Sutherland,"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2574.359,"endTime":2577.019,"body":"the man, the myth, the legend,"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2577.019,"endTime":2580.0789999999997,"body":"the ruckus maker, the"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2577.019,"endTime":2580.0789999999997,"body":"storyteller. Welcome to The Real"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2580.0789999999997,"endTime":2584.0989999999997,"body":"advisor podcast trap. You have"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2580.0789999999997,"endTime":2584.0989999999997,"body":"spoken a couple of times at my"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2584.0989999999997,"endTime":2586.6189999999997,"body":"conference, humans under"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2584.0989999999997,"endTime":2586.6189999999997,"body":"management in London. It was"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2586.6189999999997,"endTime":2587.759,"body":"greatly received, very,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2587.7599999999998,"endTime":2588.54,"body":"very big fan."},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2589.2,"endTime":2591.9,"body":"Good. Thank you very"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2589.2,"endTime":2591.9,"body":"much. Welcome to today's show."},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2592.14,"endTime":2596.96,"body":"The theme we're going to focus"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2592.14,"endTime":2596.96,"body":"on today is AI and its impact on"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2597.08,"endTime":2600.62,"body":"professional services. We're"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2597.08,"endTime":2600.62,"body":"going to try and stick to that"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2600.62,"endTime":2603.92,"body":"brief. You are also a client of"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2600.62,"endTime":2603.92,"body":"a financial advisor, so"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2603.92,"endTime":2608.8399999999997,"body":"experience the financial advisor"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2603.92,"endTime":2608.8399999999997,"body":"process. So where do we start?"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2608.9,"endTime":2610.2799999999997,"body":"AI professional services"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2610.64,"endTime":2614.0,"body":"also absolutely"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2610.64,"endTime":2614.0,"body":"convinced that, and actually,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2614.0,"endTime":2616.7,"body":"the evidence of the auto"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2614.0,"endTime":2616.7,"body":"enrolment pension"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2617.7799999999997,"endTime":2618.02,"body":"is"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2618.02,"endTime":2621.22,"body":"clear to see"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2618.02,"endTime":2621.22,"body":"that there are major, I think,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2621.7,"endTime":2625.6,"body":"or in some cases, fairly minor,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2621.7,"endTime":2625.6,"body":"legislative changes to the"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2625.66,"endTime":2629.44,"body":"design of pensions which would"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2625.66,"endTime":2629.44,"body":"make an extraordinary"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2629.44,"endTime":2633.22,"body":"difference, both to people's"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2629.44,"endTime":2633.22,"body":"participation in these things,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2633.3399999999997,"endTime":2637.08,"body":"but also to actually overall"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2633.3399999999997,"endTime":2637.08,"body":"wealth throughout people's"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2637.08,"endTime":2640.68,"body":"lives. And one, one problem I"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2637.08,"endTime":2640.68,"body":"always have talking about"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2640.68,"endTime":2644.16,"body":"pensions is I'm an absolute"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2640.68,"endTime":2644.16,"body":"advocate of pensions. I'm"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2644.16,"endTime":2647.3399999999997,"body":"absolutely delighted that my"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2644.16,"endTime":2647.3399999999997,"body":"children now have some form of"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2647.3399999999997,"endTime":2652.68,"body":"pension, even though they're"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2647.3399999999997,"endTime":2652.68,"body":"only 25 at the same time"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2652.68,"endTime":2656.2999999999997,"body":"unconscious of the fact that to"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2652.68,"endTime":2656.2999999999997,"body":"some extent, life is back end"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2656.2999999999997,"endTime":2661.46,"body":"weighted that to some extent,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2656.2999999999997,"endTime":2661.46,"body":"too much wealth and disposable"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2661.46,"endTime":2665.6,"body":"income is probably concentrated"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2661.46,"endTime":2665.6,"body":"in certain parts of society at"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2665.6,"endTime":2668.6,"body":"the tail end of life. And one of"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2665.6,"endTime":2668.6,"body":"my one of my proposals would be,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2668.96,"endTime":2672.38,"body":"I think people should be allowed"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2668.96,"endTime":2672.38,"body":"to take their student loan, as"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2672.38,"endTime":2676.66,"body":"it were, and do what they want"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2672.38,"endTime":2676.66,"body":"with it, not absolutely spend it"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2676.66,"endTime":2679.9,"body":"on higher education. And one of"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2676.66,"endTime":2679.9,"body":"the things I think is important"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2679.96,"endTime":2687.04,"body":"is what you what we actually"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2679.96,"endTime":2687.04,"body":"need to do is redefine wealth in"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2687.04,"endTime":2691.8399999999997,"body":"less narrowly economic terms,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2687.04,"endTime":2691.8399999999997,"body":"and effectively find a"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2691.8399999999997,"endTime":2695.62,"body":"relationship between wealth and"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2691.8399999999997,"endTime":2695.62,"body":"opportunity. Now a large part of"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2695.62,"endTime":2700.3199999999997,"body":"opportunity doesn't require that"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2695.62,"endTime":2700.3199999999997,"body":"you spend money. It requires"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2700.3199999999997,"endTime":2705.06,"body":"that you know that you have"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2700.3199999999997,"endTime":2705.06,"body":"funds to draw on. And therefore"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2705.06,"endTime":2708.06,"body":"giving young people it's a sort"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2705.06,"endTime":2708.06,"body":"of lump sum equivalent of the"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2708.06,"endTime":2712.8599999999997,"body":"guaranteed basic income. Giving"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2708.06,"endTime":2712.8599999999997,"body":"them some upfront cushion in"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2712.8599999999997,"endTime":2715.92,"body":"their lives would make a"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2712.8599999999997,"endTime":2715.92,"body":"spectacular difference. I'll"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2715.92,"endTime":2718.52,"body":"give you a very simple example"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2715.92,"endTime":2718.52,"body":"of this, which is, I think,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2718.52,"endTime":2721.64,"body":"quite telling. The first time I"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2718.52,"endTime":2721.64,"body":"went to the United States was"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2721.64,"endTime":2726.8599999999997,"body":"1993 and by that stage, I was"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2721.64,"endTime":2726.8599999999997,"body":"kind of like a higher rate"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2726.8599999999997,"endTime":2731.6,"body":"taxpayer. Just about I was, what"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2726.8599999999997,"endTime":2731.6,"body":"was I? 2829 something like that."},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2731.66,"endTime":2734.54,"body":"And all I can remember thinking"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2731.66,"endTime":2734.54,"body":"when I first went to the United"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2734.54,"endTime":2737.5,"body":"States is, I'm really glad I"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2734.54,"endTime":2737.5,"body":"never came here when I was"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2737.5,"endTime":2740.68,"body":"skinned and that wasn't because"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2737.5,"endTime":2740.68,"body":"it's expensive. The United"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2740.68,"endTime":2743.98,"body":"States isn't expensive. It's"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2740.68,"endTime":2743.98,"body":"just the United States is"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2743.98,"endTime":2749.2,"body":"absolutely terrifying as a place"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2743.98,"endTime":2749.2,"body":"if you can't draw on $3,000 when"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2749.2,"endTime":2753.16,"body":"you need it. And so there's a"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2749.2,"endTime":2753.16,"body":"wonderful idea by the Canadian"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2753.16,"endTime":2756.96,"body":"business writer Roger l Martin,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2753.16,"endTime":2756.96,"body":"who proposes that instead of"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2756.96,"endTime":2761.7599999999998,"body":"giving everybody 12,000 tax free"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2756.96,"endTime":2761.7599999999998,"body":"every year out of their income,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2762.18,"endTime":2765.0,"body":"you should, instead front end"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2762.18,"endTime":2765.0,"body":"weight it so that, in his"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2765.0,"endTime":2768.24,"body":"proposal, he's Canadian, the"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2765.0,"endTime":2768.24,"body":"first 200 and something $1,000"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2768.6,"endTime":2772.02,"body":"everybody earns in their"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2768.6,"endTime":2772.02,"body":"lifetime is tax free, after"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2772.02,"endTime":2774.12,"body":"which you pay tax on nearly all"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2772.02,"endTime":2774.12,"body":"of it."},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2774.72,"endTime":2775.2,"body":"Sure."},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2775.68,"endTime":2777.92,"body":"And so. So"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2775.68,"endTime":2777.92,"body":"there is, there is a, you know,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2778.1,"endTime":2781.1,"body":"inordinate fan of pensions. I"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2778.1,"endTime":2781.1,"body":"also think they need to be"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2781.1,"endTime":2784.2799999999997,"body":"rebranded and reframed. You"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2781.1,"endTime":2784.2799999999997,"body":"know, there are a whole load of"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2784.2799999999997,"endTime":2788.0,"body":"psychological factors here. You"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2784.2799999999997,"endTime":2788.0,"body":"know, are pensions all about"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2788.0,"endTime":2791.9,"body":"retirement anymore? Or do you"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2788.0,"endTime":2791.9,"body":"sell them as the ability to work"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2791.9,"endTime":2796.1,"body":"part time later in life? Which"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2791.9,"endTime":2796.1,"body":"might chime much, much better"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2796.1,"endTime":2799.48,"body":"with, a younger audience. For"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2796.1,"endTime":2799.48,"body":"example, it's very difficult to"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2799.48,"endTime":2804.64,"body":"envisage when you're 23 the idea"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2799.48,"endTime":2804.64,"body":"of retiring, it is quite easy, I"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2804.64,"endTime":2807.88,"body":"think, to envisage the idea of"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2804.64,"endTime":2807.88,"body":"actually, I think most 24 year"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2807.88,"endTime":2810.4,"body":"olds probably like to work a"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2807.88,"endTime":2810.4,"body":"four day in fact, most people"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2810.4,"endTime":2811.7799999999997,"body":"would like to work a four day"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2810.4,"endTime":2811.7799999999997,"body":"week."},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2812.2,"endTime":2816.8399999999997,"body":"Yeah. Back to"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2812.2,"endTime":2816.8399999999997,"body":"specifically on AI. Rory, how do"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2816.8399999999997,"endTime":2819.72,"body":"you think AI is going to impact"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2816.8399999999997,"endTime":2819.72,"body":"professional services like it"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2819.72,"endTime":2823.8599999999997,"body":"already is. What's coming down"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2819.72,"endTime":2823.8599999999997,"body":"the line? How should we adjust?"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2823.8599999999997,"endTime":2826.98,"body":"How should the humans adjust?"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2823.8599999999997,"endTime":2826.98,"body":"What are you seeing on that?"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2827.819,"endTime":2832.6189999999997,"body":"I think that it"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2827.819,"endTime":2832.6189999999997,"body":"will patently affect decision"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2832.6189999999997,"endTime":2837.859,"body":"making. You can expect the fact"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2832.6189999999997,"endTime":2837.859,"body":"that AI is used very heavily as"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2837.859,"endTime":2840.439,"body":"a second opinion. This is"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2837.859,"endTime":2840.439,"body":"something doctors will have to"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2840.439,"endTime":2842.479,"body":"face to an inordinate degree"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2842.6,"endTime":2845.2999999999997,"body":"for both ends of it,"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2842.6,"endTime":2845.2999999999997,"body":"clients and the professionals,"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2845.42,"endTime":2846.92,"body":"not what's happening at the"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2845.42,"endTime":2846.92,"body":"moment?"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2846.98,"endTime":2849.56,"body":"Yeah, yeah,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2846.98,"endTime":2849.56,"body":"absolutely, not everybody. I"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2849.56,"endTime":2854.12,"body":"think some people are fatalists."},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2849.56,"endTime":2854.12,"body":"Some people will go look the"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2854.12,"endTime":2858.16,"body":"best policy is not to get down"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2854.12,"endTime":2858.16,"body":"in the weeds of complex decision"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2858.16,"endTime":2860.98,"body":"making. It's to go with a"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2858.16,"endTime":2860.98,"body":"professional opinion and leave"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2860.98,"endTime":2867.1,"body":"it and by the way, in some ways,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2860.98,"endTime":2867.1,"body":"the obstacle that the investor"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2867.1,"endTime":2870.16,"body":"community always faces is"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2867.1,"endTime":2870.16,"body":"actually choice blindness,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2870.16,"endTime":2874.42,"body":"people being blinded by the"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2870.16,"endTime":2874.42,"body":"headlights. In other words, I'm"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2874.42,"endTime":2878.2799999999997,"body":"the last person to propose. I'm"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2874.42,"endTime":2878.2799999999997,"body":"generally fairly libertarian,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2878.52,"endTime":2881.3399999999997,"body":"but there's an element of me"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2878.52,"endTime":2881.3399999999997,"body":"which says that if there were"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2881.3399999999997,"endTime":2885.42,"body":"only one pension, we'd all"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2881.3399999999997,"endTime":2885.42,"body":"compete to contribute it more"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2885.42,"endTime":2889.44,"body":"and more. What happens is the"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2885.42,"endTime":2889.44,"body":"choice architecture of pension"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2889.44,"endTime":2892.68,"body":"provision, saving and investment"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2889.44,"endTime":2892.68,"body":"in general is a goddamn"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2892.68,"endTime":2896.72,"body":"disaster. If you look at retail"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2892.68,"endTime":2896.72,"body":"sites, you know, if you look at"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2896.72,"endTime":2899.8399999999997,"body":"Amazon, if you look at eBay, any"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2896.72,"endTime":2899.8399999999997,"body":"of those entities, what you'll"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2899.8399999999997,"endTime":2902.18,"body":"see from the design of those"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2899.8399999999997,"endTime":2902.18,"body":"sites is they make it quite"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2902.18,"endTime":2905.48,"body":"difficult for you to find page"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2902.18,"endTime":2905.48,"body":"two of your search results. And"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2905.48,"endTime":2908.8399999999997,"body":"what Amazon knows is that if you"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2905.48,"endTime":2908.8399999999997,"body":"search for a toaster, and you've"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2908.8399999999997,"endTime":2912.08,"body":"got to choose between 15"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2908.8399999999997,"endTime":2912.08,"body":"toasters, you might well buy a"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2912.08,"endTime":2916.2799999999997,"body":"toaster. Once you get to page"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2912.08,"endTime":2916.2799999999997,"body":"two and you've seen 30 toasters,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2916.88,"endTime":2919.2999999999997,"body":"you're out of it, you're not"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2916.88,"endTime":2919.2999999999997,"body":"going to buy anything. And"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2920.2599999999998,"endTime":2923.68,"body":"consequently, I think there are"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2920.2599999999998,"endTime":2923.68,"body":"two corresponding"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2923.74,"endTime":2928.3599999999997,"body":"interpretations here. One it"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2923.74,"endTime":2928.3599999999997,"body":"makes choice easier. The other"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2928.3599999999997,"endTime":2931.8399999999997,"body":"one is it makes choice yet more"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2928.3599999999997,"endTime":2931.8399999999997,"body":"difficult. Because one of my"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2931.8399999999997,"endTime":2934.96,"body":"arguments with financial"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2931.8399999999997,"endTime":2934.96,"body":"advisors is actually get"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2934.96,"endTime":2937.92,"body":"yourself a financial advisor,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2934.96,"endTime":2937.92,"body":"even if they aren't that good,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2937.98,"endTime":2941.22,"body":"because their value is a bit"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2937.98,"endTime":2941.22,"body":"like the value of a coach in"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2941.22,"endTime":2944.22,"body":"personal fitness. It's not that"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2941.22,"endTime":2944.22,"body":"they get you to do something"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2944.22,"endTime":2946.5,"body":"perfect, it's that they get you"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2944.22,"endTime":2946.5,"body":"to do something at all."},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":2946.56,"endTime":2946.92,"body":"Yeah,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2947.64,"endTime":2951.9,"body":"by the way, the"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2947.64,"endTime":2951.9,"body":"other question with AI is, one"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2951.9,"endTime":2956.66,"body":"does the whole polarity of the"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2951.9,"endTime":2956.66,"body":"business reverse, so that you"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2956.66,"endTime":2959.96,"body":"effectively ask your AI to"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2956.66,"endTime":2959.96,"body":"assemble a package, in other"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2959.96,"endTime":2963.62,"body":"words. In other words, do you"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2959.96,"endTime":2963.62,"body":"literally have effectively"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2963.62,"endTime":2967.52,"body":"financial products created by"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2963.62,"endTime":2967.52,"body":"the end user, rather than"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2967.58,"endTime":2971.3599999999997,"body":"existing financial product"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2967.58,"endTime":2971.3599999999997,"body":"effectively being sold to a"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2971.3599999999997,"endTime":2974.72,"body":"user? Do you actually find that"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2971.3599999999997,"endTime":2974.72,"body":"the whole polarity reverses?"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2974.72,"endTime":2977.56,"body":"That's always possible. Does it"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2974.72,"endTime":2977.56,"body":"make the discussion of this"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2977.56,"endTime":2981.1,"body":"territory more intelligent or"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2977.56,"endTime":2981.1,"body":"more stupid? Absolutely no idea."},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2981.1,"endTime":2986.7999999999997,"body":"Probably both. I'm old enough at"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2981.1,"endTime":2986.7999999999997,"body":"the age of 60 to try and view"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2986.7999999999997,"endTime":2990.64,"body":"technology, not in the way we"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2986.7999999999997,"endTime":2990.64,"body":"view football teams. And this"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2990.64,"endTime":2994.06,"body":"was one of the best advice I've"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2990.64,"endTime":2994.06,"body":"received from a talk given by"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2994.06,"endTime":2997.2599999999998,"body":"the guy who's actually the AI"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2994.06,"endTime":2997.2599999999998,"body":"advisor to the Commonwealth, who"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2997.2599999999998,"endTime":3000.62,"body":"said, most people tend to"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":2997.2599999999998,"endTime":3000.62,"body":"actually approach AI as"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3000.62,"endTime":3003.92,"body":"something like a football team."},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3000.62,"endTime":3003.92,"body":"You have to love it or hate it,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3004.7599999999998,"endTime":3008.8399999999997,"body":"and approaching it with what you"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3004.7599999999998,"endTime":3008.8399999999997,"body":"might call a balanced mindset is"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3008.8399999999997,"endTime":3014.8399999999997,"body":"really, really important,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3008.8399999999997,"endTime":3014.8399999999997,"body":"because it's one of those"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3014.8399999999997,"endTime":3018.4,"body":"things, which is, you have to"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3014.8399999999997,"endTime":3018.4,"body":"learn to be with technology. You"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3018.4,"endTime":3021.22,"body":"have to learn to be a bit"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3018.4,"endTime":3021.22,"body":"equivocal. And you know, an"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3021.22,"endTime":3024.46,"body":"example would be, you know, a"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3021.22,"endTime":3024.46,"body":"technology like Airbnb. I have"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3024.46,"endTime":3026.5,"body":"to acknowledge that at one"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3024.46,"endTime":3026.5,"body":"level, it's absolutely"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3026.5,"endTime":3030.22,"body":"magnificent. It frees people to"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3026.5,"endTime":3030.22,"body":"spend time in homes and places"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3030.22,"endTime":3032.5,"body":"and discover communities they"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3030.22,"endTime":3032.5,"body":"never would have otherwise"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3032.5,"endTime":3036.22,"body":"discovered. And I also have to"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3032.5,"endTime":3036.22,"body":"recognize that if you're a 35"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3036.46,"endTime":3040.02,"body":"year old in Barcelona who wants"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3036.46,"endTime":3040.02,"body":"to buy or rent a flat. It's a"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3040.02,"endTime":3042.66,"body":"living nightmare. What it does"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3040.02,"endTime":3042.66,"body":"to the whole business of"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3042.66,"endTime":3046.14,"body":"intermediation is interesting. I"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3042.66,"endTime":3046.14,"body":"would argue, from an"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3046.14,"endTime":3049.98,"body":"anthropological perspective,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3046.14,"endTime":3049.98,"body":"that estate agents and personal"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3049.98,"endTime":3054.2999999999997,"body":"financial advisors are not going"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3049.98,"endTime":3054.2999999999997,"body":"to go away to the extent"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3054.2999999999997,"endTime":3059.8399999999997,"body":"predicted by techno optimists,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3054.2999999999997,"endTime":3059.8399999999997,"body":"and that's simply because any"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3059.8399999999997,"endTime":3065.0,"body":"decision of significance and a"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3059.8399999999997,"endTime":3065.0,"body":"house or a major investment or"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3065.0,"endTime":3070.04,"body":"savings plan basically both fall"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3065.0,"endTime":3070.04,"body":"into that category, requires"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3070.1,"endTime":3073.7,"body":"some degree of human"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3070.1,"endTime":3073.7,"body":"encouragement to get you over"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3073.7,"endTime":3076.48,"body":"the line loads and loads of"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3073.7,"endTime":3076.48,"body":"people for age. Have been"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3076.48,"endTime":3079.96,"body":"proposing that we buy cars the"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3076.48,"endTime":3079.96,"body":"way we buy books on Amazon. And"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3079.96,"endTime":3084.16,"body":"the question is, they're not"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3079.96,"endTime":3084.16,"body":"really commensurate decisions,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3084.3399999999997,"endTime":3086.74,"body":"because if I buy a book on"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3084.3399999999997,"endTime":3086.74,"body":"Amazon, it doesn't turn up, or"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3086.74,"endTime":3092.02,"body":"it's a shit book. It's annoying,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3086.74,"endTime":3092.02,"body":"but it's not a catastrophe. On"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3092.02,"endTime":3095.62,"body":"the other hand, if I'm buying a"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3092.02,"endTime":3095.62,"body":"house or if I'm buying, you"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3095.62,"endTime":3098.94,"body":"know, a major savings product,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3095.62,"endTime":3098.94,"body":"or indeed, a reasonably"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3098.94,"endTime":3105.06,"body":"expensive car. I need some"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3098.94,"endTime":3105.06,"body":"degree of human reassurance, and"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3105.06,"endTime":3108.3599999999997,"body":"you might even argue"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3105.06,"endTime":3108.3599999999997,"body":"performative salesmanship. I"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3108.3599999999997,"endTime":3111.72,"body":"want someone to make an effort"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3108.3599999999997,"endTime":3111.72,"body":"that's commensurate with the"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3111.72,"endTime":3113.1,"body":"importance of this decision."},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":3113.64,"endTime":3116.2799999999997,"body":"Would Tesla go away?"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":3113.64,"endTime":3116.2799999999997,"body":"Would Tesla push back on that?"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":3116.2799999999997,"endTime":3118.88,"body":"Because you can buy Teslas on"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":3116.2799999999997,"endTime":3118.88,"body":"apps, and they arrive, you know,"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":3118.94,"endTime":3119.96,"body":"automatedly, and"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3120.5,"endTime":3120.68,"body":"it's"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":3121.279,"endTime":3122.5989999999997,"body":"an unusual car"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":3121.279,"endTime":3122.5989999999997,"body":"company,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3122.839,"endTime":3125.719,"body":"I would argue"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3122.839,"endTime":3125.719,"body":"that this is absolutely what"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3125.719,"endTime":3129.019,"body":"you'd expect technologists to do"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3125.719,"endTime":3129.019,"body":"when they design a car company,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3129.019,"endTime":3131.719,"body":"and they sold a huge number of"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3129.019,"endTime":3131.719,"body":"cars because it was very good"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3131.719,"endTime":3134.239,"body":"car. They do have showrooms, by"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3131.719,"endTime":3134.239,"body":"the way. You can get blue water"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3134.239,"endTime":3137.439,"body":"just down the road, and you can"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3134.239,"endTime":3137.439,"body":"go and test drive one and have a"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3137.439,"endTime":3141.219,"body":"look. They haven't attempted to"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3137.439,"endTime":3141.219,"body":"make it purely a kind of remote"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3141.219,"endTime":3144.219,"body":"decision. I think they would"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3141.219,"endTime":3144.219,"body":"have sold a lot more cars if"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3144.219,"endTime":3147.399,"body":"they'd actually had some sort of"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3144.219,"endTime":3147.399,"body":"dealer mechanism. It's"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3147.399,"endTime":3150.219,"body":"complicated, because the car"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3147.399,"endTime":3150.219,"body":"dealer used to make a lot of"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3150.219,"endTime":3152.919,"body":"money doing servicing and"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3150.219,"endTime":3152.919,"body":"repairs. And electric cars are"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3152.919,"endTime":3158.759,"body":"rather kibosh, yep. And by the"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3152.919,"endTime":3158.759,"body":"way, human psychology varies"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3158.759,"endTime":3161.6389999999997,"body":"enormously. I think I'm one of"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3158.759,"endTime":3161.6389999999997,"body":"those people who tends to be a"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3161.6389999999997,"endTime":3164.879,"body":"bit of a investment fatalist."},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3161.6389999999997,"endTime":3164.879,"body":"There are other people who are"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3164.879,"endTime":3169.439,"body":"investment micro managers. My"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3164.879,"endTime":3169.439,"body":"contention is, is that most"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3169.439,"endTime":3172.319,"body":"investment works through a"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3169.439,"endTime":3172.319,"body":"compounding effect over the"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3172.319,"endTime":3176.719,"body":"longer term, so endless"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3172.319,"endTime":3176.719,"body":"tinkering costs more than it"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3176.719,"endTime":3180.739,"body":"gains. And my argument is the"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3176.719,"endTime":3180.739,"body":"signal to noise ratio is quite"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3180.739,"endTime":3183.679,"body":"good over the long term and"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3180.739,"endTime":3183.679,"body":"appalling over the short term."},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3184.0389999999998,"endTime":3187.279,"body":"And therefore, if you get down"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3184.0389999999998,"endTime":3187.279,"body":"in the weeds financially and are"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3187.279,"endTime":3190.459,"body":"one of those people who's"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3187.279,"endTime":3190.459,"body":"endlessly anxious that X may be"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3190.5789999999997,"endTime":3194.5989999999997,"body":"underperforming y by one or 2%"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3190.5789999999997,"endTime":3194.5989999999997,"body":"over the last three weeks, it's"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3194.5989999999997,"endTime":3197.5589999999997,"body":"actually a bad mindset to have"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3194.5989999999997,"endTime":3197.5589999999997,"body":"in order to invest"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":3198.04,"endTime":3201.58,"body":"Sure. How do you"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":3198.04,"endTime":3201.58,"body":"think new companies coming up"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":3201.58,"endTime":3208.48,"body":"with financial AI chat bots"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":3201.58,"endTime":3208.48,"body":"trying to service large numbers"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":3208.48,"endTime":3212.14,"body":"of younger individuals? Do you"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":3208.48,"endTime":3212.14,"body":"think people will be attracted"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":3212.14,"endTime":3214.6,"body":"to these types of solutions?"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":3212.14,"endTime":3214.6,"body":"What's your thoughts on them?"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3214.96,"endTime":3218.58,"body":"This will be"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3214.96,"endTime":3218.58,"body":"much slower, because in order to"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3218.58,"endTime":3222.12,"body":"make those things really"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3218.58,"endTime":3222.12,"body":"meaningful, I think you will"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3222.12,"endTime":3225.24,"body":"probably have to give them"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3222.12,"endTime":3225.24,"body":"access to your own finances."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3225.54,"endTime":3226.02,"body":"Yep,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3226.92,"endTime":3231.48,"body":"and over time,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3226.92,"endTime":3231.48,"body":"mechanisms will arise. Just as"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3231.54,"endTime":3235.08,"body":"if you have a Monzo account, you"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3231.54,"endTime":3235.08,"body":"can now actually connect it to"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3235.08,"endTime":3238.04,"body":"your credit card accounts to get"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3235.08,"endTime":3238.04,"body":"a single view of your own"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3238.04,"endTime":3242.9,"body":"finances. My observation is that"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3238.04,"endTime":3242.9,"body":"people, not unreasonably, are,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3242.96,"endTime":3246.7999999999997,"body":"at the moment, fairly paranoid"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3242.96,"endTime":3246.7999999999997,"body":"about doing so. And one of the"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3246.7999999999997,"endTime":3250.94,"body":"things I think you'll find is"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3246.7999999999997,"endTime":3250.94,"body":"that the investment in AI has"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3250.94,"endTime":3258.7599999999998,"body":"probably leapt ahead in some way"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3250.94,"endTime":3258.7599999999998,"body":"of people's propensity to and"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3258.8199999999997,"endTime":3262.0,"body":"even ability to change their"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3258.8199999999997,"endTime":3262.0,"body":"behavior, I would argue that"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3262.0,"endTime":3267.04,"body":"maybe Apple is playing a blinder"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3262.0,"endTime":3267.04,"body":"in being one of the few big tech"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3267.04,"endTime":3271.48,"body":"companies to adopt a kind of"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3267.04,"endTime":3271.48,"body":"wait and see strategy. I'll give"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3271.96,"endTime":3272.08,"body":"you"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":3272.08,"endTime":3273.8199999999997,"body":"often Apple's stance,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3273.94,"endTime":3277.2599999999998,"body":"yeah, yeah."},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3273.94,"endTime":3277.2599999999998,"body":"They're actually, in many ways,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3277.3199999999997,"endTime":3280.08,"body":"not an innovative company. They"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3277.3199999999997,"endTime":3280.08,"body":"still haven't got a folding"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3280.08,"endTime":3286.56,"body":"phone, for example, and they"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3280.08,"endTime":3286.56,"body":"were once, of course. Now I"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3286.56,"endTime":3290.1,"body":"would, I would argue that there"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3286.56,"endTime":3290.1,"body":"are certain aspects of AI which,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3290.1,"endTime":3293.7599999999998,"body":"to me as a marketing person,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3290.1,"endTime":3293.7599999999998,"body":"seem critically important, which"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3293.7599999999998,"endTime":3297.2,"body":"haven't yet been finalized or"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3293.7599999999998,"endTime":3297.2,"body":"haven't yet bedded down, one of"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3297.2,"endTime":3302.6,"body":"which is, what's the interface?"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3297.2,"endTime":3302.6,"body":"Do we talk to it? Do we wear"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3302.6,"endTime":3306.3199999999997,"body":"spectacles? I mean, you know, in"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3302.6,"endTime":3306.3199999999997,"body":"another five or six years, the"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3306.3199999999997,"endTime":3309.44,"body":"whole thing could go up in the"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3306.3199999999997,"endTime":3309.44,"body":"air because, for example,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3309.44,"endTime":3314.6,"body":"connected specs or something"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3309.44,"endTime":3314.6,"body":"similar become the default mode"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3314.6,"endTime":3319.8399999999997,"body":"of interaction. We also don't"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3314.6,"endTime":3319.8399999999997,"body":"know to what extent people have"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3319.8399999999997,"endTime":3327.64,"body":"an appetite for engagement in"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3319.8399999999997,"endTime":3327.64,"body":"this in all parts of their life."},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3327.64,"endTime":3330.94,"body":"Now, some part of AI people will"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3327.64,"endTime":3330.94,"body":"end up using because to the"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3330.94,"endTime":3334.48,"body":"extent it's been imposed on"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3330.94,"endTime":3334.48,"body":"them. I mean, a lot of the tech"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3334.48,"endTime":3338.16,"body":"firms are partly justifying"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3334.48,"endTime":3338.16,"body":"their own investment in AI by"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3338.16,"endTime":3342.72,"body":"effectively almost mandating AI"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3338.16,"endTime":3342.72,"body":"use for their users, or making"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3342.72,"endTime":3346.2,"body":"it an obligation, not an option,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3342.72,"endTime":3346.2,"body":"so that they can then produce"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3346.2,"endTime":3349.68,"body":"impressive statistics which show"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3346.2,"endTime":3349.68,"body":"to what extent AI is"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3349.68,"endTime":3352.8599999999997,"body":"transforming their business. And"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3349.68,"endTime":3352.8599999999997,"body":"there's an element to the whole"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3352.92,"endTime":3355.8599999999997,"body":"AI thing, which is a bubble and"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3352.92,"endTime":3355.8599999999997,"body":"a self fulfilling prophecy."},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3357.8399999999997,"endTime":3361.52,"body":"There's also, I think, an"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3357.8399999999997,"endTime":3361.52,"body":"element to corporate behavior"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3361.7,"endTime":3365.0,"body":"where AI has become a self"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3361.7,"endTime":3365.0,"body":"fulfilling prophecy. Companies"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3365.0,"endTime":3367.8199999999997,"body":"are desperate to cut costs"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3365.0,"endTime":3367.8199999999997,"body":"because they've lost the ability"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3367.8199999999997,"endTime":3371.48,"body":"to innovate. Therefore they need"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3367.8199999999997,"endTime":3371.48,"body":"a plausible story to explain how"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3371.48,"endTime":3375.38,"body":"they can cut staff costs without"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3371.48,"endTime":3375.38,"body":"actually affecting the value of"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3375.38,"endTime":3379.24,"body":"what they offer. Yeah, and AI is"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3375.38,"endTime":3379.24,"body":"a very, very convenient smoke"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3379.24,"endTime":3382.48,"body":"screen to inject. Well, what if"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3379.24,"endTime":3382.48,"body":"you, if you reduce the size of"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3382.48,"endTime":3387.88,"body":"your call center by 50% won't"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3382.48,"endTime":3387.88,"body":"that mean that? And you go, no,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3387.94,"endTime":3391.7799999999997,"body":"because technology and companies"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3387.94,"endTime":3391.7799999999997,"body":"have been playing that game for"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3391.7799999999997,"endTime":3395.08,"body":"25 years, and it's time that"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3391.7799999999997,"endTime":3395.08,"body":"investors got a bit more"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3395.08,"endTime":3398.8199999999997,"body":"skeptical. But unfortunately,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3395.08,"endTime":3398.8199999999997,"body":"once they've told that story, it"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3398.8199999999997,"endTime":3402.42,"body":"becomes self fulfilling, even if"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3398.8199999999997,"endTime":3402.42,"body":"they discover they can't"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3402.42,"endTime":3405.72,"body":"actually remove their call"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3402.42,"endTime":3405.72,"body":"center or that actually, AI,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3405.72,"endTime":3408.54,"body":"makes the complexity of"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3405.72,"endTime":3408.54,"body":"interaction so much higher that"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3408.54,"endTime":3412.44,"body":"you need more call center staff,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3408.54,"endTime":3412.44,"body":"not fewer. Once they've told"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3412.44,"endTime":3415.14,"body":"that story to the investor"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3412.44,"endTime":3415.14,"body":"community, they're almost"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3415.14,"endTime":3416.66,"body":"obligated to go through with it."},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":3417.56,"endTime":3420.2599999999998,"body":"I mean, the upfront"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":3417.56,"endTime":3420.2599999999998,"body":"investment is enormous. They're"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":3420.2599999999998,"endTime":3422.6,"body":"going to have to recoup this"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":3420.2599999999998,"endTime":3422.6,"body":"somewhere down the line. So in"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":3422.6,"endTime":3425.66,"body":"terms of how they're going to"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":3422.6,"endTime":3425.66,"body":"price it, what the tier is going"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":3425.66,"endTime":3428.7799999999997,"body":"to be, the thing that is quite"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":3425.66,"endTime":3428.7799999999997,"body":"interesting consumers who have"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":3428.7799999999997,"endTime":3431.6,"body":"never subscribed to any tech"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":3428.7799999999997,"endTime":3431.6,"body":"product and have always used the"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":3431.6,"endTime":3435.44,"body":"free option, a lot of them have"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":3431.6,"endTime":3435.44,"body":"subscribed to the chat GPT, $20"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":3435.68,"endTime":3438.3399999999997,"body":"a month. Once they realize the"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":3435.68,"endTime":3438.3399999999997,"body":"limitations of the free version."},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":3438.7,"endTime":3441.3399999999997,"body":"That's a shift in consumer"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":3438.7,"endTime":3441.3399999999997,"body":"behavior. I know businesses are"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":3441.3399999999997,"endTime":3443.7999999999997,"body":"usually ahead of the pack, and"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":3441.3399999999997,"endTime":3443.7999999999997,"body":"we, we subscribe to everything."},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":3443.7999999999997,"endTime":3446.2,"body":"You know, straight off the bat,"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":3443.7999999999997,"endTime":3446.2,"body":"consumers take a little bit"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":3446.2,"endTime":3448.9,"body":"longer to do it. So how do you"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":3446.2,"endTime":3448.9,"body":"think the AI companies are going"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":3448.9,"endTime":3452.08,"body":"to price this and sell this to"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":3448.9,"endTime":3452.08,"body":"professional services firms,"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":3452.08,"endTime":3454.66,"body":"which most of us are, you know,"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":3452.08,"endTime":3454.66,"body":"the information economy."},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3454.7799999999997,"endTime":3457.02,"body":"This is, this"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3454.7799999999997,"endTime":3457.02,"body":"is where I get very depressed,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3457.2,"endTime":3461.16,"body":"okay, because the correct and"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3457.2,"endTime":3461.16,"body":"better way to sell it, if you're"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3461.16,"endTime":3465.3599999999997,"body":"a techno optimist, is this will"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3461.16,"endTime":3465.3599999999997,"body":"make what you do so much better."},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3466.62,"endTime":3470.16,"body":"However, that's a slow and"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3466.62,"endTime":3470.16,"body":"indefinite sell to the"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3470.16,"endTime":3474.06,"body":"procurement function or the"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3470.16,"endTime":3474.06,"body":"finance department. So they"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3474.06,"endTime":3477.14,"body":"will, almost certainly, for"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3474.06,"endTime":3477.14,"body":"reasons of expediency, sell it"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3477.14,"endTime":3480.2599999999998,"body":"on the basis of cost cutting,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3477.14,"endTime":3480.2599999999998,"body":"they will pay a bit of lip"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3480.2599999999998,"endTime":3484.4,"body":"service to of course, it's human"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3480.2599999999998,"endTime":3484.4,"body":"plus AI, which is the perfect"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3484.4,"endTime":3487.94,"body":"combination. But when it comes"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3484.4,"endTime":3487.94,"body":"down to the hard and fast"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3487.94,"endTime":3490.22,"body":"financials, they're going to"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3487.94,"endTime":3490.22,"body":"sell it on the basis of cost"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3490.22,"endTime":3493.7,"body":"cutting, because that's"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3490.22,"endTime":3493.7,"body":"immediate. Goes straight to the"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3493.7,"endTime":3496.7799999999997,"body":"bottom line, and it's generally"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3493.7,"endTime":3496.7799999999997,"body":"fairly what you might call"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3496.7799999999997,"endTime":3501.7599999999998,"body":"definable, whereas being better"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3496.7799999999997,"endTime":3501.7599999999998,"body":"at what you do is generally a"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3501.7599999999998,"endTime":3506.08,"body":"deferred gain. Now, I would"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3501.7599999999998,"endTime":3506.08,"body":"argue that some family owned and"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3506.08,"endTime":3509.08,"body":"founder led companies with a"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3506.08,"endTime":3509.08,"body":"very strong culture will"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3509.08,"endTime":3513.3399999999997,"body":"actually adopt AI for the"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3509.08,"endTime":3513.3399999999997,"body":"purposes of enhancement simply"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3513.3399999999997,"endTime":3516.72,"body":"being better at business, but"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3513.3399999999997,"endTime":3516.72,"body":"the majority, I think, of large"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3516.72,"endTime":3519.96,"body":"corporates will be pressured"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3516.72,"endTime":3519.96,"body":"into buying it on the promise of"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3519.96,"endTime":3522.24,"body":"its cost cutting potential."},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":3522.239,"endTime":3522.5389999999998,"body":"Yeah,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3522.6,"endTime":3525.18,"body":"it's very, very"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3522.6,"endTime":3525.18,"body":"interesting this, because what"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3525.18,"endTime":3530.7,"body":"AI can do and what it ends up"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3525.18,"endTime":3530.7,"body":"being used for are not the same"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3530.7,"endTime":3533.94,"body":"thing necessarily. Now, one"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3530.7,"endTime":3533.94,"body":"thing I've seen that's very,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3533.94,"endTime":3539.12,"body":"very exciting, which I think is"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3533.94,"endTime":3539.12,"body":"potentially fantastic is AI"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3539.12,"endTime":3542.48,"body":"informed telephone call center"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3539.12,"endTime":3542.48,"body":"work. And there's a company"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3542.48,"endTime":3545.54,"body":"called Voice stack, which is"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3542.48,"endTime":3545.54,"body":"part of care stack, which"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3545.54,"endTime":3548.24,"body":"effectively works with dental"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3545.54,"endTime":3548.24,"body":"receptionists, which is an"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3548.24,"endTime":3550.7599999999998,"body":"interesting one thing I'd"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3548.24,"endTime":3550.7599999999998,"body":"recommend everybody in your"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3550.7599999999998,"endTime":3554.42,"body":"business is go and look at"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3550.7599999999998,"endTime":3554.42,"body":"parallel businesses which aren't"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3554.42,"endTime":3557.7999999999997,"body":"financial services, don't"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3554.42,"endTime":3557.7999999999997,"body":"benchmark against other"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3557.7999999999997,"endTime":3560.8599999999997,"body":"financial services companies,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3557.7999999999997,"endTime":3560.8599999999997,"body":"because you'll end up trapped in"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3560.8599999999997,"endTime":3564.94,"body":"a kind of convergence quagmire."},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3560.8599999999997,"endTime":3564.94,"body":"Go and look for inspiration from"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3564.94,"endTime":3567.64,"body":"places like dentists, which are"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3564.94,"endTime":3567.64,"body":"highly commercial by the way,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3567.7,"endTime":3571.3599999999997,"body":"you know, go and look at"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3567.7,"endTime":3571.3599999999997,"body":"dentistry and see what they're"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3571.3599999999997,"endTime":3574.18,"body":"doing really well to"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3571.3599999999997,"endTime":3574.18,"body":"differentiate themselves. And"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3574.18,"endTime":3576.6,"body":"this company voice that"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3574.18,"endTime":3576.6,"body":"fascinates me, because"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3576.66,"endTime":3580.98,"body":"effectively, what it does is it"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3576.66,"endTime":3580.98,"body":"scores and trains call center"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3580.98,"endTime":3585.7799999999997,"body":"staff or receptionist, in some"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3580.98,"endTime":3585.7799999999997,"body":"cases, sometimes on the fly, to"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3585.7799999999997,"endTime":3589.3199999999997,"body":"make them much better faster."},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3585.7799999999997,"endTime":3589.3199999999997,"body":"But it's also intelligent enough"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3589.3199999999997,"endTime":3592.8599999999997,"body":"to say, I see your thing"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3589.3199999999997,"endTime":3592.8599999999997,"body":"interested in 15,000 pounds"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3592.8599999999997,"endTime":3596.1,"body":"worth of cosmetic dental work."},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3592.8599999999997,"endTime":3596.1,"body":"The next call should probably"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3596.1,"endTime":3598.58,"body":"not come from the receptionist."},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3596.1,"endTime":3598.58,"body":"It should come from the dentist"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3598.58,"endTime":3603.3199999999997,"body":"herself, for example. In terms"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3598.58,"endTime":3603.3199999999997,"body":"of problem solving, I mean, this"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3603.3199999999997,"endTime":3606.14,"body":"is why I asked that question"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3603.3199999999997,"endTime":3606.14,"body":"about the interface, because how"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3606.14,"endTime":3611.12,"body":"many times would we phone a"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3606.14,"endTime":3611.12,"body":"company not go to the website if"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3611.12,"endTime":3614.72,"body":"we believed the call would be"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3611.12,"endTime":3614.72,"body":"answered in one second, we"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3614.72,"endTime":3618.04,"body":"wouldn't have to go through a"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3614.72,"endTime":3618.04,"body":"whole rigmarole of security"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3618.04,"endTime":3622.54,"body":"checks, it would simply"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3618.04,"endTime":3622.54,"body":"recognize our voice. Okay, when"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3623.5,"endTime":3626.38,"body":"I want to talk to my wife, I"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3623.5,"endTime":3626.38,"body":"ring her up and I don't go to"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3626.38,"endTime":3629.14,"body":"her website, but that's because"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3626.38,"endTime":3629.14,"body":"she answers the phone"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3629.14,"endTime":3631.9,"body":"immediately, and she doesn't ask"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3629.14,"endTime":3631.9,"body":"my address, postcode, email"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3631.9,"endTime":3634.6,"body":"address, and tell me that calls"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3631.9,"endTime":3634.6,"body":"are going to be recorded for"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3634.6,"endTime":3638.52,"body":"quality control purposes. So one"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3634.6,"endTime":3638.52,"body":"of the things that may happen is"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3638.52,"endTime":3642.6,"body":"it actually brings the telephone"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3638.52,"endTime":3642.6,"body":"back into the forefront, oddly,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3642.66,"endTime":3644.2799999999997,"body":"as a medium for communication."},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":3644.279,"endTime":3645.299,"body":"Yep, yep."},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3645.779,"endTime":3648.5989999999997,"body":"I agree by"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3645.779,"endTime":3648.5989999999997,"body":"basic here, but I'm going to"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3648.5989999999997,"endTime":3651.959,"body":"make it. I'm going to defend"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3648.5989999999997,"endTime":3651.959,"body":"myself here by saying that there"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3651.959,"endTime":3654.5989999999997,"body":"are so many knock on"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3651.959,"endTime":3654.5989999999997,"body":"interconnected effects of all"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3654.5989999999997,"endTime":3660.019,"body":"this that the only correct"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3654.5989999999997,"endTime":3660.019,"body":"response is speculation, rather"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3660.019,"endTime":3663.679,"body":"than what you might call"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3660.019,"endTime":3663.679,"body":"definitive prediction"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3663.919,"endTime":3667.279,"body":"predictions. And also, there are"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3663.919,"endTime":3667.279,"body":"always second order consequences"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3667.279,"endTime":3670.6389999999997,"body":"for these things that nobody"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3667.279,"endTime":3670.6389999999997,"body":"anticipated. You know, I didn't"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3670.6389999999997,"endTime":3673.6389999999997,"body":"you know when email first"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3670.6389999999997,"endTime":3673.6389999999997,"body":"arrived. I thought it was"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3673.6389999999997,"endTime":3676.0389999999998,"body":"brilliant. And one of the"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3673.6389999999997,"endTime":3676.0389999999998,"body":"interesting things is that."},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3676.1189999999997,"endTime":3678.879,"body":"People react very differently to"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3676.1189999999997,"endTime":3678.879,"body":"things when they're an option"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3678.879,"endTime":3681.6389999999997,"body":"versus whether they're an"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3678.879,"endTime":3681.6389999999997,"body":"obligation. I think that the"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3681.6389999999997,"endTime":3686.0789999999997,"body":"people have been predicting the"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3681.6389999999997,"endTime":3686.0789999999997,"body":"disintermediation of real estate"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3686.0789999999997,"endTime":3690.759,"body":"agents and financial services"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3686.0789999999997,"endTime":3690.759,"body":"people for ages. My argument, in"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3690.759,"endTime":3693.699,"body":"their defense, is"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3690.759,"endTime":3693.699,"body":"anthropological. If you went to"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3693.699,"endTime":3697.379,"body":"buy a house for I don't know"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3693.699,"endTime":3697.379,"body":"where you live, what constitutes"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3697.379,"endTime":3700.019,"body":"an expensive house where you"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3697.379,"endTime":3700.019,"body":"happen to live. But let's say"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3700.019,"endTime":3702.239,"body":"you were looking over three"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3700.019,"endTime":3702.239,"body":"quarters of a million pound"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3702.239,"endTime":3703.679,"body":"house and the estate agent,"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":3703.68,"endTime":3705.06,"body":"so be a one bed flat."},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":3703.68,"endTime":3705.06,"body":"Rory,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3705.12,"endTime":3706.8599999999997,"body":"it'll be one"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3705.12,"endTime":3706.8599999999997,"body":"bit of a flat. Yeah, of course."},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3706.8599999999997,"endTime":3710.2799999999997,"body":"You don't want your clients to"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3706.8599999999997,"endTime":3710.2799999999997,"body":"know where you live, but if they"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3710.2799999999997,"endTime":3712.74,"body":"said, Yeah, the key's in a lock"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3710.2799999999997,"endTime":3712.74,"body":"box, go and have a look around"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3712.74,"endTime":3715.92,"body":"yourself, right? You'd kind of"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3712.74,"endTime":3715.92,"body":"go, come on, dance for me."},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3715.92,"endTime":3719.54,"body":"Monkey Boy, I'm thinking of"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3715.92,"endTime":3719.54,"body":"spending serious money here. I"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3719.54,"endTime":3724.64,"body":"want a tap dance. Now, my only"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3719.54,"endTime":3724.64,"body":"explanation for that, I agree"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3724.64,"endTime":3728.66,"body":"it's in some sense economically"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3724.64,"endTime":3728.66,"body":"irrational. Why do estate agents"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3728.72,"endTime":3732.5,"body":"often have to be a bit posh?"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3728.72,"endTime":3732.5,"body":"It's because, even if you're not"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3732.5,"endTime":3736.7799999999997,"body":"posh yourself, there's a kind of"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3732.5,"endTime":3736.7799999999997,"body":"anthropological value for having"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3736.7799999999997,"endTime":3739.42,"body":"some sort of posh show over the"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3736.7799999999997,"endTime":3739.42,"body":"age of 45"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":3740.799,"endTime":3741.939,"body":"or Fox. Is that"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":3740.799,"endTime":3741.939,"body":"right?"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3742.48,"endTime":3744.52,"body":"Yeah, yeah,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3742.48,"endTime":3744.52,"body":"take, take you around and make a"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3744.52,"endTime":3745.48,"body":"bit of a fuss of you."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3746.02,"endTime":3746.38,"body":"Yeah?"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3746.859,"endTime":3749.739,"body":"Because if you"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3746.859,"endTime":3749.739,"body":"don't do that, and I only"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3749.739,"endTime":3753.459,"body":"explain it in these terms, it"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3749.739,"endTime":3753.459,"body":"feels wrong, and I've"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3753.459,"endTime":3757.319,"body":"occasionally this started as a"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3753.459,"endTime":3757.319,"body":"bit of a get out of jail card"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3757.5589999999997,"endTime":3760.919,"body":"for the ethics of marketing when"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3757.5589999999997,"endTime":3760.919,"body":"people were saying, But"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3760.919,"endTime":3764.339,"body":"marketing is unethical because"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3760.919,"endTime":3764.339,"body":"it changes what people would"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3764.339,"endTime":3768.779,"body":"normally do and makes them make"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3764.339,"endTime":3768.779,"body":"worse decisions. And my argument"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3768.779,"endTime":3773.759,"body":"was, in certain settings, it's"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3768.779,"endTime":3773.759,"body":"impossible for the human to"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3773.759,"endTime":3778.699,"body":"perform to make a decision,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3773.759,"endTime":3778.699,"body":"unless you perform some sort of"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3778.699,"endTime":3784.0389999999998,"body":"marketing rituals in advance of"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3778.699,"endTime":3784.0389999999998,"body":"it. So I'll give you a perfect"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3784.0389999999998,"endTime":3787.279,"body":"example of this. Okay, if I turn"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3784.0389999999998,"endTime":3787.279,"body":"up to buy a second hand car at"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3787.279,"endTime":3790.0989999999997,"body":"your house, and you haven't even"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3787.279,"endTime":3790.0989999999997,"body":"bothered to clean the car, and"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3790.0989999999997,"endTime":3793.0389999999998,"body":"it's full of shit, I don't know"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3790.0989999999997,"endTime":3793.0389999999998,"body":"what your car's like. It might"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3793.0389999999998,"endTime":3795.979,"body":"be immaculate, but I turn up to"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3793.0389999999998,"endTime":3795.979,"body":"buy your second hand car, and"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3795.979,"endTime":3799.299,"body":"when I turn up there loads of"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3795.979,"endTime":3799.299,"body":"empty coke cans in the back. Now"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3799.299,"endTime":3803.6189999999997,"body":"I know I'm going to clean the"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3799.299,"endTime":3803.6189999999997,"body":"car. I know at one level, this"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3803.6189999999997,"endTime":3806.199,"body":"is irrelevant to the value of"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3803.6189999999997,"endTime":3806.199,"body":"the car, but I'm not going to"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3806.199,"endTime":3809.6189999999997,"body":"buy that car. And if you can't"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3806.199,"endTime":3809.6189999999997,"body":"be bothered to get out of bed to"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3809.6189999999997,"endTime":3813.279,"body":"show me around it, but you just"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3809.6189999999997,"endTime":3813.279,"body":"chuck me the keys, I'm not going"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3813.279,"endTime":3816.339,"body":"to buy the car. So there's a bit"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3813.279,"endTime":3816.339,"body":"of me here. I'm not being a"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3816.339,"endTime":3820.0789999999997,"body":"behavioral scientist here, I'm"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3816.339,"endTime":3820.0789999999997,"body":"being an anthropologist, which"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3820.0789999999997,"endTime":3823.739,"body":"is that fundamentally, there"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3820.0789999999997,"endTime":3823.739,"body":"seem to be necessarily"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3823.739,"endTime":3827.939,"body":"preliminary rituals, what you"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3823.739,"endTime":3827.939,"body":"might call economists okay in a"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3827.939,"endTime":3831.959,"body":"sentence, economists don't"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3827.939,"endTime":3831.959,"body":"understand foreplay. If, if you"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3831.959,"endTime":3836.0389999999998,"body":"asked an economist okay to"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3831.959,"endTime":3836.0389999999998,"body":"describe the purpose of sex, it"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3836.0389999999998,"endTime":3840.5589999999997,"body":"would entirely be around either"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3836.0389999999998,"endTime":3840.5589999999997,"body":"orgasm or jacket and"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":3840.56,"endTime":3841.2799999999997,"body":"reproduction"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3841.2799999999997,"endTime":3843.2599999999998,"body":"because,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3841.2799999999997,"endTime":3843.2599999999998,"body":"because that's the transactional"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3843.2599999999998,"endTime":3848.24,"body":"component of the sexual act. But"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3843.2599999999998,"endTime":3848.24,"body":"fundamentally, as human beings,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3848.3599999999997,"endTime":3853.52,"body":"we require that act to have some"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3848.3599999999997,"endTime":3853.52,"body":"sort of meaning that goes beyond"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3853.58,"endTime":3859.48,"body":"mere fluidics and hydraulics. I"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3853.58,"endTime":3859.48,"body":"hope. Okay. And consequently, we"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3859.54,"endTime":3862.42,"body":"are probably varies by gender"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3859.54,"endTime":3862.42,"body":"here, but I won't get any more"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3862.42,"endTime":3866.8599999999997,"body":"specific. I'm not Andrew Tate,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3862.42,"endTime":3866.8599999999997,"body":"okay, you know, but there are"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3866.8599999999997,"endTime":3870.52,"body":"some form of preliminary"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3866.8599999999997,"endTime":3870.52,"body":"activities which are necessary"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3870.7,"endTime":3875.62,"body":"before the exchange of fluids"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3870.7,"endTime":3875.62,"body":"can take place. And in the same"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3875.62,"endTime":3879.18,"body":"way, I think, I think that's"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3875.62,"endTime":3879.18,"body":"true of certain intermediated"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3879.18,"endTime":3882.18,"body":"professions. There's also the"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3879.18,"endTime":3882.18,"body":"fact that, of course, the"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3882.18,"endTime":3887.04,"body":"intermediary has, in a world of"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3882.18,"endTime":3887.04,"body":"imperfect information, the"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3887.04,"endTime":3891.3599999999997,"body":"intermediary has a value. Let me"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3887.04,"endTime":3891.3599999999997,"body":"explain Okay, and this is a"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3891.3599999999997,"endTime":3896.18,"body":"perfect way to explain it,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3891.3599999999997,"endTime":3896.18,"body":"wedding planners, right? A"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3896.18,"endTime":3900.08,"body":"wedding planner is undoubtedly"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3896.18,"endTime":3900.08,"body":"an expense. You could plan your"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3900.08,"endTime":3904.52,"body":"own wedding. The only problem"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3900.08,"endTime":3904.52,"body":"is, you know, deep down that the"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3904.52,"endTime":3908.0,"body":"florist is really terrified of"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3904.52,"endTime":3908.0,"body":"disappointing that wedding"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3908.0,"endTime":3911.3599999999997,"body":"planner, because the wedding"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3908.0,"endTime":3911.3599999999997,"body":"planner buys a fuck load of"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3911.3599999999997,"endTime":3914.66,"body":"flowers. Top client, right? This"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3911.3599999999997,"endTime":3914.66,"body":"is exactly the same when I'm in"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3914.66,"endTime":3918.04,"body":"Paris and I need to get a taxi"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3914.66,"endTime":3918.04,"body":"to the station, to the Eurostar."},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3918.04,"endTime":3922.9,"body":"I do. I actually don't even get"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3918.04,"endTime":3922.9,"body":"new but I get Ogilvy to book the"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3922.9,"endTime":3926.14,"body":"taxi because they're a big"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3922.9,"endTime":3926.14,"body":"enough client of the two"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3926.14,"endTime":3930.7,"body":"monopoly taxi for their duopoly"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3926.14,"endTime":3930.7,"body":"taxi, the taxi is going to turn"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3930.7,"endTime":3934.42,"body":"up if I book it myself as a"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3930.7,"endTime":3934.42,"body":"fucking, fucking worst beef one"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3934.42,"endTime":3938.8199999999997,"body":"of taxi, it's not going to test"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3934.42,"endTime":3938.8199999999997,"body":"guy. Mr. English money, no, not"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3938.8199999999997,"endTime":3941.7,"body":"gonna happen, right? And in the"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3938.8199999999997,"endTime":3941.7,"body":"same way, you have a wedding"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3941.7,"endTime":3944.88,"body":"planner, partly because they can"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3941.7,"endTime":3944.88,"body":"put the fear of God into their"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3944.88,"endTime":3947.2799999999997,"body":"suppliers in a way that you"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3944.88,"endTime":3947.2799999999997,"body":"can't. You're probably only"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3947.2799999999997,"endTime":3950.04,"body":"getting married once, and"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3947.2799999999997,"endTime":3950.04,"body":"consequently, a florist will"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3950.04,"endTime":3954.24,"body":"even make a loss on your wedding"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3950.04,"endTime":3954.24,"body":"in order to keep the wedding"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3954.24,"endTime":3956.94,"body":"planner happy, whereas with you,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3954.24,"endTime":3956.94,"body":"it's a different matter. Oh,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3956.94,"endTime":3959.7799999999997,"body":"they have reputational skin in"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3956.94,"endTime":3959.7799999999997,"body":"the game. I'm not suggesting"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3959.7799999999997,"endTime":3962.9,"body":"they don't care, but there are a"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3959.7799999999997,"endTime":3962.9,"body":"whole load of reasons for"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3962.9,"endTime":3967.04,"body":"intermediaries. It's the"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3962.9,"endTime":3967.04,"body":"consolidation of information."},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3967.16,"endTime":3970.46,"body":"You probably have some clients"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3967.16,"endTime":3970.46,"body":"who are quite like me. You"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3970.46,"endTime":3975.2599999999998,"body":"probably have a load of clients"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3970.46,"endTime":3975.2599999999998,"body":"who are totally unlike me, but"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3975.2599999999998,"endTime":3977.98,"body":"just by the law of our."},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3975.2599999999998,"endTime":3977.98,"body":"Averages, you'll go rory's A bit"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3977.98,"endTime":3981.52,"body":"like so and so, so and so. And"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3977.98,"endTime":3981.52,"body":"you can draw on that kind of"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3981.52,"endTime":3982.18,"body":"information."},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":3982.359,"endTime":3984.399,"body":"Yes, that's one of"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":3982.359,"endTime":3984.399,"body":"the huge values."},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3984.88,"endTime":3987.52,"body":"So one thing we"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3984.88,"endTime":3987.52,"body":"got to watch is we got to watch"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3987.52,"endTime":3991.24,"body":"this business where everybody in"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3987.52,"endTime":3991.24,"body":"nerdville, everybody in"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3991.24,"endTime":3995.74,"body":"management consultant Ville, and"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3991.24,"endTime":3995.74,"body":"everybody in kind of econ Ville,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3996.58,"endTime":4001.94,"body":"is obsessed with stripping"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":3996.58,"endTime":4001.94,"body":"transactions down to the minimum"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4002.24,"endTime":4004.22,"body":"and optimizing for efficiency."},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":4005.48,"endTime":4006.5,"body":"Least friction. Yeah,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4006.56,"endTime":4009.2,"body":"least friction."},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4006.56,"endTime":4009.2,"body":"You know, least, least transact,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4009.2,"endTime":4012.62,"body":"lowest transaction costs,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4009.2,"endTime":4012.62,"body":"because there's an opportunity."},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4012.62,"endTime":4015.2599999999998,"body":"What those people do is they get"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4012.62,"endTime":4015.2599999999998,"body":"the credit for the cost saving,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4015.2599999999998,"endTime":4017.3199999999997,"body":"but they never get held"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4015.2599999999998,"endTime":4017.3199999999997,"body":"responsible for the lost"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4017.3199999999997,"endTime":4020.2599999999998,"body":"opportunity. And the example I"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4017.3199999999997,"endTime":4020.2599999999998,"body":"always give is self checkout in"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4020.2599999999998,"endTime":4023.08,"body":"supermarkets, right? It's"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4020.2599999999998,"endTime":4023.08,"body":"brilliant. Look, we've reduced"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4023.08,"endTime":4025.54,"body":"the number of conveyor belts we"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4023.08,"endTime":4025.54,"body":"have. And look, you know, we all"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4025.54,"endTime":4027.8199999999997,"body":"these machines. They don't need"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4025.54,"endTime":4027.8199999999997,"body":"to be paid. They don't join a"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4027.8199999999997,"endTime":4030.52,"body":"union. They don't need to be"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4027.8199999999997,"endTime":4030.52,"body":"paid. People are swiping their"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4030.52,"endTime":4031.48,"body":"own shopping."},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":4031.6,"endTime":4033.88,"body":"Yeah? It starts off"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":4031.6,"endTime":4033.88,"body":"with 10% then it goes to"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4034.6,"endTime":4036.7599999999998,"body":"20% closed."},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":4037.359,"endTime":4037.739,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4037.74,"endTime":4040.2,"body":"Two things one,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4037.74,"endTime":4040.2,"body":"my next door neighbor won't go"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4040.2,"endTime":4044.2799999999997,"body":"to Waitrose and Seven Oaks"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4040.2,"endTime":4044.2799999999997,"body":"because she's pissed off by it."},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4044.46,"endTime":4048.06,"body":"Now, no one who installed all"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4044.46,"endTime":4048.06,"body":"those machines is taking the hit"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4048.06,"endTime":4048.54,"body":"for that."},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":4048.6,"endTime":4049.56,"body":"No. Second"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4049.56,"endTime":4051.7799999999997,"body":"thing is, you"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4049.56,"endTime":4051.7799999999997,"body":"can't do a big trolley shop. If"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4051.7799999999997,"endTime":4055.3199999999997,"body":"you're made to made a self"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4051.7799999999997,"endTime":4055.3199999999997,"body":"checkout, you can self scan, but"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4055.3199999999997,"endTime":4058.2799999999997,"body":"a lot of people don't do that."},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4055.3199999999997,"endTime":4058.2799999999997,"body":"And it also requires you want to"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4058.2799999999997,"endTime":4061.64,"body":"do a big trolley shop and not"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4058.2799999999997,"endTime":4061.64,"body":"use a conveyor belt. You've got"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4061.64,"endTime":4064.58,"body":"to do quite a lot of forward"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4061.64,"endTime":4064.58,"body":"planning. You got to take a load"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4064.58,"endTime":4066.92,"body":"of bags along. You got to put"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4064.58,"endTime":4066.92,"body":"them in a trolley. You got to"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4066.92,"endTime":4070.16,"body":"get the scanner. You got to log"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4066.92,"endTime":4070.16,"body":"into the dump, especially when"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":4070.16,"endTime":4070.2799999999997,"body":"you"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":4070.279,"endTime":4071.359,"body":"got screaming kids"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":4070.279,"endTime":4071.359,"body":"with"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4071.3599999999997,"endTime":4073.04,"body":"you got a"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4071.3599999999997,"endTime":4073.04,"body":"screaming kid. Now, theory, a"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4073.04,"endTime":4076.22,"body":"load of people are going to do"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4073.04,"endTime":4076.22,"body":"that. In practice, they don't."},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4076.4,"endTime":4081.1,"body":"Okay. Final thing, it's a lovely"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4076.4,"endTime":4081.1,"body":"little mantra this. It doesn't"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4081.1,"endTime":4084.04,"body":"count as cost cutting if you're"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4081.1,"endTime":4084.04,"body":"making your customer pay the"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4084.04,"endTime":4087.46,"body":"price. And a lot of companies"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4084.04,"endTime":4087.46,"body":"have taken the credit for cost"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4087.46,"endTime":4090.64,"body":"cutting when what they're really"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4087.46,"endTime":4090.64,"body":"doing is outsourcing work to the"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4090.64,"endTime":4093.7599999999998,"body":"customer. And one of the things"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4090.64,"endTime":4093.7599999999998,"body":"that you can do as a financial"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4093.7599999999998,"endTime":4098.04,"body":"adviser, and I really mean this,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4093.7599999999998,"endTime":4098.04,"body":"right? Okay, don't you don't"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4098.04,"endTime":4102.42,"body":"tell Justin this, because it'll"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4098.04,"endTime":4102.42,"body":"offend him. But 30% of his value"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4102.42,"endTime":4104.58,"body":"is filling in forms of shit,"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":4104.759,"endTime":4106.379,"body":"yeah, with"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":4104.759,"endTime":4106.379,"body":"professional form?"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4106.56,"endTime":4108.36,"body":"No, no, I hate"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4106.56,"endTime":4108.36,"body":"to say it, right?"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":4108.36,"endTime":4109.4400000000005,"body":"Yeah, great at it."},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4109.62,"endTime":4113.58,"body":"But the extent"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4109.62,"endTime":4113.58,"body":"to which, A, you do it a lot, B,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4113.58,"endTime":4117.92,"body":"you pre check it. Okay, now and"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4113.58,"endTime":4117.92,"body":"see, you know, Adam Smith"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4117.92,"endTime":4121.88,"body":"division of labor, right? Fairly"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4117.92,"endTime":4121.88,"body":"simple, the form filling bit, I"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4121.88,"endTime":4124.46,"body":"mean, literally, it doesn't"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4121.88,"endTime":4124.46,"body":"sound like a brilliant"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4124.46,"endTime":4128.54,"body":"advertisement to for financial"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4124.46,"endTime":4128.54,"body":"advisors to say, we fill in your"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4128.54,"endTime":4129.4400000000005,"body":"forms for you."},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":4129.7390000000005,"endTime":4131.539,"body":"But people hate"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":4129.7390000000005,"endTime":4131.539,"body":"filling forms, so it is"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":4131.54,"endTime":4131.78,"body":"a good"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4131.78,"endTime":4133.58,"body":"advertisement."},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4131.78,"endTime":4133.58,"body":"Certainly hate it. They're not"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4133.58,"endTime":4135.14,"body":"confident at it. They"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":4135.62,"endTime":4137.02,"body":"throw away huge"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":4135.62,"endTime":4137.02,"body":"benefit."},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4137.08,"endTime":4139.84,"body":"It's a huge"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4137.08,"endTime":4139.84,"body":"benefit right now,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4139.84,"endTime":4142.72,"body":"interestingly, I won't ask"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4139.84,"endTime":4142.72,"body":"Justin this, because it would"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4142.72,"endTime":4146.14,"body":"offend him the next time I buy a"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4142.72,"endTime":4146.14,"body":"car, by the way, this is a whole"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4146.14,"endTime":4149.56,"body":"industry in India. Did you know"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4146.14,"endTime":4149.56,"body":"this? And it started because a"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4149.56,"endTime":4151.96,"body":"lot of people didn't speak"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4149.56,"endTime":4151.96,"body":"English, and the forms were in"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4151.96,"endTime":4152.56,"body":"English,"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":4152.68,"endTime":4153.28,"body":"yes,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4153.639,"endTime":4156.099,"body":"absolutely"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4153.639,"endTime":4156.099,"body":"massive. Now, an Indian friend"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4156.099,"endTime":4159.719,"body":"of mine. His parents were coming"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4156.099,"endTime":4159.719,"body":"to an Indian wedding in the UK,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4159.719,"endTime":4163.139,"body":"and they had to fill in a load"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4159.719,"endTime":4163.139,"body":"of visa forms. And they said to"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4163.139,"endTime":4167.339,"body":"their son, look, can you use"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4163.139,"endTime":4167.339,"body":"your credit card to pay? I can't"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4167.339,"endTime":4170.159000000001,"body":"remember what it was like this,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4167.339,"endTime":4170.159000000001,"body":"you know, a few 1000 rupees to"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4170.219,"endTime":4173.699,"body":"the form filler. And he said,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4170.219,"endTime":4173.699,"body":"I'll do that for you. Don't"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4173.699,"endTime":4176.899,"body":"worry, because I can do that"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4173.699,"endTime":4176.899,"body":"here. I'll do it online. Bit of"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4176.899,"endTime":4179.899,"body":"a problem, because now eight of"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4176.899,"endTime":4179.899,"body":"the other relatives got in touch"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4179.899,"endTime":4182.239,"body":"with him and said, Can you do"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4179.899,"endTime":4182.239,"body":"our forms too?"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":4182.599,"endTime":4184.759,"body":"No good deed goes"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":4182.599,"endTime":4184.759,"body":"unpunished."},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4185.0599999999995,"endTime":4186.68,"body":"It goes"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4185.0599999999995,"endTime":4186.68,"body":"unpunished. Now, the interesting"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4186.68,"endTime":4191.0599999999995,"body":"thing, I think, is that the next"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4186.68,"endTime":4191.0599999999995,"body":"time I buy a car, I want to"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4191.0599999999995,"endTime":4193.58,"body":"outsource that to somebody else."},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4191.0599999999995,"endTime":4193.58,"body":"I do not want to go through"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4193.58,"endTime":4197.68,"body":"that. But I bought the car on"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4193.58,"endTime":4197.68,"body":"the company, Daddy, Daddy da, I"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4197.68,"endTime":4200.5,"body":"don't want to go through that"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4197.68,"endTime":4200.5,"body":"shit ever again, because it was"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4200.5,"endTime":4203.86,"body":"two days out of my life, by the"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4200.5,"endTime":4203.86,"body":"way. Now I've got to prove I'm"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4203.86,"endTime":4205.54,"body":"not Pablo Escobar and that"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":4205.78,"endTime":4206.68,"body":"every time to"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":4206.8,"endTime":4207.04,"body":"every"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":4207.04,"endTime":4207.34,"body":"bank,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4207.4,"endTime":4210.16,"body":"every fucking"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4207.4,"endTime":4210.16,"body":"time. You know? Yeah. I mean, we"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4210.16,"endTime":4213.4,"body":"need some sort of identity thing"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4210.16,"endTime":4213.4,"body":"that says this person isn't a"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4213.4,"endTime":4217.26,"body":"money launderer and they're not"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4213.4,"endTime":4217.26,"body":"wanted by the Fair the banks are"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4217.26,"endTime":4218.64,"body":"the worst for it, business"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4217.26,"endTime":4218.64,"body":"banks."},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":4218.76,"endTime":4219.36,"body":"Oh, my God."},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4219.66,"endTime":4221.64,"body":"Oh, by the way,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4219.66,"endTime":4221.64,"body":"I tried to apply for an American"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4221.64,"endTime":4227.64,"body":"Express business credit card."},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4221.64,"endTime":4227.64,"body":"Okay, I'm there. Here's my 200"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4228.12,"endTime":4233.16,"body":"fucking quid a year. The forms"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4228.12,"endTime":4233.16,"body":"arrive. I'm not finding this and"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4233.16,"endTime":4236.84,"body":"this, by the way, it's not just"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4233.16,"endTime":4236.84,"body":"the effort. There are a couple"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4236.84,"endTime":4240.32,"body":"of other things, but he makes"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4236.84,"endTime":4240.32,"body":"this is important to do with"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4240.32,"endTime":4243.38,"body":"pensions, by the way. This is"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4240.32,"endTime":4243.38,"body":"the weirdest thing of all. Okay,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4243.92,"endTime":4245.24,"body":"it's really, really"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":4245.479,"endTime":4246.799,"body":"got a delivery. Rory,"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":4245.479,"endTime":4246.799,"body":"sorry, mate."},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4246.8,"endTime":4248.5999999999995,"body":"Oh sorry. No"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4246.8,"endTime":4248.5999999999995,"body":"no, no. Don't worry. Don't"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4248.5999999999995,"endTime":4248.78,"body":"worry."},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":4248.839,"endTime":4251.539,"body":"Sorry, my friend, the"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":4248.839,"endTime":4251.539,"body":"usual Amazon daily delivery."},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4251.72,"endTime":4254.66,"body":"No, don't I got"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4251.72,"endTime":4254.66,"body":"one to collect. Actually, one of"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4254.66,"endTime":4257.44,"body":"the best things the government's"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4254.66,"endTime":4257.44,"body":"ever done is that passport pre"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4257.44,"endTime":4260.0199999999995,"body":"check. So that's actually royal"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4257.44,"endTime":4260.0199999999995,"body":"mails, but sorry, it's the post"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4260.0199999999995,"endTime":4262.12,"body":"office. That passport pre check"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4260.0199999999995,"endTime":4262.12,"body":"thing,"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":4263.2,"endTime":4263.8,"body":"life saver,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4264.16,"endTime":4266.0199999999995,"body":"absolute life"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4264.16,"endTime":4266.0199999999995,"body":"saver, right? And you're a"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4266.0199999999995,"endTime":4269.32,"body":"professional form filler, and"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4266.0199999999995,"endTime":4269.32,"body":"you think it's pretty good. Now,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4269.32,"endTime":4271.9,"body":"I know it's beneath all our"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4269.32,"endTime":4271.9,"body":"dignity to talk about all these"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4271.9,"endTime":4273.88,"body":"things, because we should be"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4271.9,"endTime":4273.88,"body":"talking about, you know, what"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4273.88,"endTime":4277.92,"body":"the Fed's doing. You know, long."},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4273.88,"endTime":4277.92,"body":"Term projected interest rates."},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4278.16,"endTime":4280.86,"body":"But one of the lessons I've"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4278.16,"endTime":4280.86,"body":"learned through being a marketer"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4280.92,"endTime":4283.86,"body":"is that really trivial things"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4280.92,"endTime":4283.86,"body":"have huge effects on human"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4283.86,"endTime":4286.5599999999995,"body":"behavior, not because they"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4283.86,"endTime":4286.5599999999995,"body":"actually necessarily convey"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4286.5599999999995,"endTime":4290.88,"body":"costs, but because they convey"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4286.5599999999995,"endTime":4290.88,"body":"meaning. And one of the things"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4290.88,"endTime":4293.4,"body":"I've always argued to the"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4290.88,"endTime":4293.4,"body":"anybody who'll listen about"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4293.4,"endTime":4297.14,"body":"pensions is I always ask the"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4293.4,"endTime":4297.14,"body":"question, if you ask anybody, if"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4297.14,"endTime":4300.5599999999995,"body":"you suddenly had 100 grand"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4297.14,"endTime":4300.5599999999995,"body":"windfall, what would you do?"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4301.22,"endTime":4304.88,"body":"Very few people say, I put some"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4301.22,"endTime":4304.88,"body":"of it in my pension. Now that is"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4304.88,"endTime":4308.84,"body":"a massively tax efficient thing"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4304.88,"endTime":4308.84,"body":"to do. What they'll almost"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4308.84,"endTime":4311.36,"body":"certainly say is our property,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4308.84,"endTime":4311.36,"body":"that, by the way, is your"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4311.36,"endTime":4313.88,"body":"biggest competitor. Your biggest"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4311.36,"endTime":4313.88,"body":"competitor is not other"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4313.88,"endTime":4316.96,"body":"financial advisors. It's the"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4313.88,"endTime":4316.96,"body":"fact that property has served as"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4316.96,"endTime":4320.8,"body":"a proxy for long term saving and"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4316.96,"endTime":4320.8,"body":"retirement planning for too many"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4320.8,"endTime":4324.22,"body":"people, for far too long, and"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4320.8,"endTime":4324.22,"body":"it's falling off a cliff. Mate,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4324.28,"endTime":4324.94,"body":"absolutely,"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":4324.94,"endTime":4325.48,"body":"it's"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4326.44,"endTime":4327.16,"body":"tanking."},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":4327.22,"endTime":4330.5199999999995,"body":"The Golden Age ended,"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":4327.22,"endTime":4330.5199999999995,"body":"you know, 15 years ago, and it's"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":4330.5199999999995,"endTime":4331.66,"body":"been a slow death since then."},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4332.26,"endTime":4334.84,"body":"Well, actually,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4332.26,"endTime":4334.84,"body":"also worse than that, it's not"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4334.84,"endTime":4338.88,"body":"being reported. You know the"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4334.84,"endTime":4338.88,"body":"news media were massive. Well,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4338.94,"endTime":4339.78,"body":"yeah, in"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":4340.32,"endTime":4340.86,"body":"circles,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4341.099,"endTime":4343.559,"body":"yeah, yeah, in"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4341.099,"endTime":4343.559,"body":"your circles. It's totally"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4343.559,"endTime":4346.139,"body":"universally known. My daughter"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4343.559,"endTime":4346.139,"body":"works in property. It's"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4346.139,"endTime":4349.8589999999995,"body":"universally known that new build"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4346.139,"endTime":4349.8589999999995,"body":"is a total drug on the market,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4351.179,"endTime":4355.679,"body":"but the mainstream news media"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4351.179,"endTime":4355.679,"body":"should be talking about it. But"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4355.679,"endTime":4359.659,"body":"weirdly, whereas they bigged up"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4355.679,"endTime":4359.659,"body":"property prices for 30 years and"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4359.659,"endTime":4362.719,"body":"treated it as an unmitigated"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4359.659,"endTime":4362.719,"body":"good news story, they're"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4362.719,"endTime":4366.259,"body":"comparatively quiet about the"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4362.719,"endTime":4366.259,"body":"fact that thought you buy to let"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4366.259,"endTime":4369.259,"body":"portfolios just tell us see you"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4366.259,"endTime":4369.259,"body":"through. Think again."},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":4369.32,"endTime":4371.54,"body":"Every year rolls on,"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":4369.32,"endTime":4371.54,"body":"there's more regulation. Back to"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":4371.54,"endTime":4374.78,"body":"your Airbnb thing, Airbnb in the"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":4371.54,"endTime":4374.78,"body":"in the UK, now in the UK now has"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":4374.78,"endTime":4377.62,"body":"been limited to 90 days a year,"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":4374.78,"endTime":4377.62,"body":"even if you bought a very"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":4377.62,"endTime":4380.74,"body":"expensive Airbnb, because it"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":4377.62,"endTime":4380.74,"body":"could do 27 days a year. Now"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":4380.74,"endTime":4383.26,"body":"you're limited to nine. It's"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":4380.74,"endTime":4383.26,"body":"just there's no good news when"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":4383.26,"endTime":4385.72,"body":"it comes to property. Literally"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":4383.26,"endTime":4385.72,"body":"no good news. But"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":4385.72,"endTime":4385.84,"body":"yeah,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4386.0199999999995,"endTime":4387.7,"body":"well, there is"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4386.0199999999995,"endTime":4387.7,"body":"good news, because if you're"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4387.7,"endTime":4390.22,"body":"young and you're wanting to buy"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4387.7,"endTime":4390.22,"body":"property, you might now have a"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4390.22,"endTime":4393.0999999999995,"body":"chance. We've all got to"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4390.22,"endTime":4393.0999999999995,"body":"remember swings and roundabouts."},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4393.0999999999995,"endTime":4395.98,"body":"You know absolutely If, on the"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4393.0999999999995,"endTime":4395.98,"body":"other hand, you thought that"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4395.98,"endTime":4399.54,"body":"your inheritance or your own"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4395.98,"endTime":4399.54,"body":"house was going to cater for"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4399.54,"endTime":4402.9,"body":"your retirement, you better be a"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4399.54,"endTime":4402.9,"body":"bit wary about it. And one of"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4402.9,"endTime":4405.5999999999995,"body":"the probably one of the best"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4402.9,"endTime":4405.5999999999995,"body":"financial products you could buy"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4405.66,"endTime":4409.32,"body":"is probably Lifetime Care"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4405.66,"endTime":4409.32,"body":"insurance to protect your"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4409.32,"endTime":4413.34,"body":"inheritance. And I think you"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4409.32,"endTime":4413.34,"body":"guys should sell that quite"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4413.34,"endTime":4415.74,"body":"assiduously. You could actually"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4413.34,"endTime":4415.74,"body":"sell it as inheritance"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4415.74,"endTime":4420.26,"body":"insurance, because, you know, my"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4415.74,"endTime":4420.26,"body":"parents were extraordinarily"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4420.26,"endTime":4424.0999999999995,"body":"kind to me. Both of them died"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4420.26,"endTime":4424.0999999999995,"body":"very quickly, extraordinary act"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4424.0999999999995,"endTime":4427.22,"body":"of generosity. I mean, obviously"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4424.0999999999995,"endTime":4427.22,"body":"not a bad way to go either. My"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4427.22,"endTime":4431.54,"body":"father was 93 you know, he went"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4427.22,"endTime":4431.54,"body":"from fine to dead in four days,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4431.78,"endTime":4435.44,"body":"you know. But it's also"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4431.78,"endTime":4435.44,"body":"financially extremely generous."},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":4435.68,"endTime":4439.0,"body":"I mean, we obviously"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":4435.68,"endTime":4439.0,"body":"know the long term trends,"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":4439.0,"endTime":4442.66,"body":"people living longer, people"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":4439.0,"endTime":4442.66,"body":"somewhat living unhealthy lives"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":4442.66,"endTime":4445.9,"body":"in the last 510, years of their"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":4442.66,"endTime":4445.9,"body":"life. Do you think the advances"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":4445.9,"endTime":4450.28,"body":"in AI and medicine are going to"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":4445.9,"endTime":4450.28,"body":"make this problem gigantically"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":4450.28,"endTime":4452.8,"body":"worse? Planning a 30 year"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":4450.28,"endTime":4452.8,"body":"retirement might turn into a 40"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":4452.8,"endTime":4455.5,"body":"year retirement, a 50 year"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":4452.8,"endTime":4455.5,"body":"retirement, which plays into the"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":4455.5599999999995,"endTime":4458.38,"body":"hands of long term Financial"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":4455.5599999999995,"endTime":4458.38,"body":"Planning and Investment"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":4458.38,"endTime":4460.68,"body":"Management. Investment"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":4458.38,"endTime":4460.68,"body":"Management. But my God, is this"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":4460.68,"endTime":4463.2,"body":"going to be a societal issue"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":4460.68,"endTime":4463.2,"body":"that we need to address?"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4463.92,"endTime":4467.16,"body":"It'll be very"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4463.92,"endTime":4467.16,"body":"interesting. I mean, I think the"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4467.16,"endTime":4471.18,"body":"biggest thing, I suspect,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4467.16,"endTime":4471.18,"body":"actually, no, no, sorry, I'm"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4471.18,"endTime":4474.24,"body":"sure that AI will lead to a few"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4471.18,"endTime":4474.24,"body":"medical breakthroughs. I mean,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4474.24,"endTime":4475.26,"body":"Google are trying to,"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":4475.499,"endTime":4478.339,"body":"trying to trying to"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":4475.499,"endTime":4478.339,"body":"fix every disease"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4478.4,"endTime":4483.62,"body":"you know, and"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4478.4,"endTime":4483.62,"body":"also it will be, you know, it"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4483.62,"endTime":4487.04,"body":"will be decisive in a few areas"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4483.62,"endTime":4487.04,"body":"which we yet cannot predict,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4487.16,"endTime":4491.72,"body":"obviously genomics and genetic"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4487.16,"endTime":4491.72,"body":"medicine and so forth. What I"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4491.72,"endTime":4498.0999999999995,"body":"also hope is, I think we haven't"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4491.72,"endTime":4498.0999999999995,"body":"had an industrial revolution in"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4498.0999999999995,"endTime":4503.44,"body":"knowledge work. And genuinely, I"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4498.0999999999995,"endTime":4503.44,"body":"think that so this is, I'm not"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4503.44,"endTime":4506.98,"body":"entirely this sounds ridiculous,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4503.44,"endTime":4506.98,"body":"but when the doctors went on"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4506.98,"endTime":4512.62,"body":"strike, productivity in the NHS"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4506.98,"endTime":4512.62,"body":"went up. That is not suggesting"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4512.62,"endTime":4516.04,"body":"for a second that junior doctors"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4512.62,"endTime":4516.04,"body":"have bullshit jobs or they're"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4516.04,"endTime":4519.54,"body":"wasting their time. I think that"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4516.04,"endTime":4519.54,"body":"bullshit jobs thing was actually"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4519.54,"endTime":4523.68,"body":"a misdiagnosis, in a way. I"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4519.54,"endTime":4523.68,"body":"think what it means is that"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4523.68,"endTime":4530.16,"body":"actually we're deploying people"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4523.68,"endTime":4530.16,"body":"very, very badly in terms of, in"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4530.16,"endTime":4534.12,"body":"other words, our our individual."},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4530.16,"endTime":4534.12,"body":"We're looking to solve problems"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4534.12,"endTime":4537.14,"body":"at the level of the individual,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4534.12,"endTime":4537.14,"body":"but most problems are actually"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4537.14,"endTime":4539.84,"body":"institutionalized at the level"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4537.14,"endTime":4539.84,"body":"of the organization. I mean,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4539.96,"endTime":4542.96,"body":"your business, in some ways, is"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4539.96,"endTime":4542.96,"body":"a very good business, because"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4542.96,"endTime":4545.48,"body":"it's a lot of very small"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4542.96,"endTime":4545.48,"body":"businesses, for the most part,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4545.48,"endTime":4548.72,"body":"which I think operate quite"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4545.48,"endTime":4548.72,"body":"intelligently. I think once you"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4548.72,"endTime":4553.76,"body":"reach scale, all sorts of weird"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4548.72,"endTime":4553.76,"body":"bureaucratic frictions emerge,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4553.76,"endTime":4556.9,"body":"not least defensive decision"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4553.76,"endTime":4556.9,"body":"making, which every single"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4556.9,"endTime":4560.32,"body":"person's behavior is completely"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4556.9,"endTime":4560.32,"body":"rational and in line with what"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4560.32,"endTime":4564.58,"body":"they're incentivized to do, but"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4560.32,"endTime":4564.58,"body":"level of the system, it's very"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4564.58,"endTime":4568.3,"body":"often counterproductive. I mean,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4564.58,"endTime":4568.3,"body":"everything from high speed two"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4568.3,"endTime":4573.4,"body":"to Lucy, let be is basically an"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4568.3,"endTime":4573.4,"body":"example not well with the Lucy."},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4573.4,"endTime":4575.68,"body":"Let me case I think two of the"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4573.4,"endTime":4575.68,"body":"people involved, or maybe three"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4575.68,"endTime":4579.36,"body":"of them. Are actually stupid. I"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4575.68,"endTime":4579.36,"body":"won't name them, okay, but"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4579.36,"endTime":4582.66,"body":"actually the bigger problem is"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4579.36,"endTime":4582.66,"body":"the institutional problem of"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4582.96,"endTime":4587.46,"body":"we're not actually, we haven't"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4582.96,"endTime":4587.46,"body":"evolved for large scale"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4587.46,"endTime":4590.28,"body":"decision, organizational"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4587.46,"endTime":4590.28,"body":"structure. I just don't think"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4590.28,"endTime":4593.4,"body":"the capacity to understand it is"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4590.28,"endTime":4593.4,"body":"there in our brains. I think in"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4593.4,"endTime":4597.32,"body":"teams of 150 teams of 10, I"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4593.4,"endTime":4597.32,"body":"think we can kind of work out"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4597.32,"endTime":4600.2,"body":"what makes sense once you reach"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4597.32,"endTime":4600.2,"body":"a certain scale, we what we'll"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4600.2,"endTime":4603.0199999999995,"body":"often try to do is we try and"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4600.2,"endTime":4603.0199999999995,"body":"scale everything. And some"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4603.0199999999995,"endTime":4606.0199999999995,"body":"things don't scale. The"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4603.0199999999995,"endTime":4606.0199999999995,"body":"relationship doesn't scale. I"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4606.0199999999995,"endTime":4610.46,"body":"want the same financial advisor."},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4606.0199999999995,"endTime":4610.46,"body":"I don't want a level three, you"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4610.46,"endTime":4611.54,"body":"know, operative,"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":4611.66,"endTime":4612.0199999999995,"body":"yeah."},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4612.92,"endTime":4615.44,"body":"And so"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4612.92,"endTime":4615.44,"body":"understanding, if AI, can"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4615.44,"endTime":4618.0999999999995,"body":"actually understand what you"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4615.44,"endTime":4618.0999999999995,"body":"might call actually, was"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4618.0999999999995,"endTime":4623.98,"body":"actually called cybernetics"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4618.0999999999995,"endTime":4623.98,"body":"better than we can and actually"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4623.98,"endTime":4626.86,"body":"say, look, the whole way you've"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4623.98,"endTime":4626.86,"body":"structured the high speed two"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4626.86,"endTime":4630.46,"body":"proposal is a recipe for"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4626.86,"endTime":4630.46,"body":"disaster, regardless of the"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4630.46,"endTime":4632.38,"body":"talents of the individuals"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4630.46,"endTime":4632.38,"body":"involved."},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":4632.68,"endTime":4633.16,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4634.42,"endTime":4638.34,"body":"And say, for"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4634.42,"endTime":4638.34,"body":"example, actually a project of"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4638.34,"endTime":4642.66,"body":"that size needs an Elon Musk"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4638.34,"endTime":4642.66,"body":"dictator figure in order to make"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4642.66,"endTime":4645.66,"body":"it happen. Because, if you try"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4642.66,"endTime":4645.66,"body":"and do it with a load of nerds"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4645.66,"endTime":4648.48,"body":"from some management consulting"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4645.66,"endTime":4648.48,"body":"firm, and, you know, it's"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4648.48,"endTime":4651.18,"body":"basically, it's going to be a"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4648.48,"endTime":4651.18,"body":"catastrophe. Think, I think"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4651.24,"endTime":4654.54,"body":"ultimately, we could get"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4651.24,"endTime":4654.54,"body":"somewhere and so that, you know,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4654.54,"endTime":4657.44,"body":"maybe in healthcare, the really"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4654.54,"endTime":4657.44,"body":"big thing is that you could, I"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4657.44,"endTime":4661.76,"body":"genuinely think you could make"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4657.44,"endTime":4661.76,"body":"the NHS inordinately better and"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4661.76,"endTime":4666.5599999999995,"body":"more productive without actually"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4661.76,"endTime":4666.5599999999995,"body":"apportioning blame at any"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4666.5599999999995,"endTime":4668.9,"body":"individual level. Although"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4666.5599999999995,"endTime":4668.9,"body":"they're, you know, I'm sure"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4668.9,"endTime":4670.82,"body":"they're poor, deeply flawed"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4668.9,"endTime":4670.82,"body":"individuals. It's an"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4670.82,"endTime":4673.76,"body":"organization like any other. But"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4670.82,"endTime":4673.76,"body":"the real problem is the design"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4673.76,"endTime":4676.28,"body":"of the system. I'll give you a"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4673.76,"endTime":4676.28,"body":"perfect example of that in"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4676.28,"endTime":4678.88,"body":"microcosm. I think it was"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4676.28,"endTime":4678.88,"body":"Walkers Crisps who, at one"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4678.88,"endTime":4684.16,"body":"stage, paid potato farmers by"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4678.88,"endTime":4684.16,"body":"weight. Their biggest expense"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4684.16,"endTime":4689.5,"body":"was obviously energy in making"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4684.16,"endTime":4689.5,"body":"potatoes into crisps. Because"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4689.5,"endTime":4692.62,"body":"the potato farmers were paid in"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4689.5,"endTime":4692.62,"body":"weight, they would spray their"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4692.62,"endTime":4697.8,"body":"potatoes with a hose before"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4692.62,"endTime":4697.8,"body":"delivering so that a large"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4697.8,"endTime":4701.46,"body":"amount of Walker's energy costs"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4697.8,"endTime":4701.46,"body":"was effectively evaporating"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4701.46,"endTime":4705.0,"body":"liquid which had been added at"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4701.46,"endTime":4705.0,"body":"the point shortly before"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4705.0,"endTime":4705.54,"body":"delivery."},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":4706.019,"endTime":4708.239,"body":"No, the humans didn't"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":4706.019,"endTime":4708.239,"body":"do that. Did they?"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4708.36,"endTime":4710.82,"body":"No, no, because"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4708.36,"endTime":4710.82,"body":"each person"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":4710.88,"endTime":4711.24,"body":"No, of"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4711.24,"endTime":4712.86,"body":"course, doing"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4711.24,"endTime":4712.86,"body":"something individually"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4712.86,"endTime":4713.34,"body":"perfectly,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":4713.519,"endTime":4716.2789999999995,"body":"right? Of course they"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":4713.519,"endTime":4716.2789999999995,"body":"did. Yeah, yeah."},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4716.4,"endTime":4718.28,"body":"That's how it"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4716.4,"endTime":4718.28,"body":"works. And I think what you"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4718.28,"endTime":4721.0999999999995,"body":"might call that syndrome, that's"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4718.28,"endTime":4721.0999999999995,"body":"obviously an easily"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4721.0999999999995,"endTime":4723.74,"body":"comprehensible one, but I think"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":4723.799,"endTime":4726.139,"body":"I thought you say"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":4723.799,"endTime":4726.139,"body":"they were putting sort of heavy"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":4726.139,"endTime":4730.519,"body":"objects in the in the trucks,"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":4726.139,"endTime":4730.519,"body":"and, you know, additional"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":4730.64,"endTime":4730.82,"body":"they"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4730.82,"endTime":4731.42,"body":"tried"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":4733.28,"endTime":4735.38,"body":"spark said, Actually,"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":4733.28,"endTime":4735.38,"body":"we get caught out with that one."},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":4735.38,"endTime":4738.82,"body":"This one is a temporary one, and"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":4735.38,"endTime":4738.82,"body":"it's a it's a blameless crime."},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4739.0599999999995,"endTime":4741.0999999999995,"body":"We see, I"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4739.0599999999995,"endTime":4741.0999999999995,"body":"actually worked at the Ribena"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4741.0999999999995,"endTime":4743.8,"body":"factory where we had deliveries"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4741.0999999999995,"endTime":4743.8,"body":"of black currants. I was a"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4743.8,"endTime":4748.42,"body":"forklift truck driver, and it"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4743.8,"endTime":4748.42,"body":"was patently obvious that people"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4748.42,"endTime":4751.84,"body":"had hosed down the trays."},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4748.42,"endTime":4751.84,"body":"Because you can't blame a lorry,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4751.9,"endTime":4754.48,"body":"because it could have been"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4751.9,"endTime":4754.48,"body":"rained on. You see, you have"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4754.5999999999995,"endTime":4755.92,"body":"plausible deniability."},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":4755.919,"endTime":4756.339,"body":"Yeah,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":4757.0,"endTime":4757.38,"body":"yeah."},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":4757.799,"endTime":4760.799,"body":"To the specific"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":4757.799,"endTime":4760.799,"body":"professions. So just just taking"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":4760.8589999999995,"endTime":4765.239,"body":"lawyers, financial advisors and"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":4760.8589999999995,"endTime":4765.239,"body":"accountants out of those three,"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":4765.239,"endTime":4768.539,"body":"who do you think is potentially"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":4765.239,"endTime":4768.539,"body":"the most disruptor of all? I"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":4768.539,"endTime":4771.059,"body":"don't know about you, but I'm"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":4768.539,"endTime":4771.059,"body":"hearing anecdotal stories from"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":4771.059,"endTime":4773.699,"body":"friends, family, clients,"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":4771.059,"endTime":4773.699,"body":"people, self representing"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":4773.699,"endTime":4777.079,"body":"themselves in courts, using AI"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":4773.699,"endTime":4777.079,"body":"to push back against large"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":4777.079,"endTime":4780.679,"body":"organizations. So this is going"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":4777.079,"endTime":4780.679,"body":"to create a lot of extra work"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":4780.679,"endTime":4783.199,"body":"for the legal profession, people"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":4780.679,"endTime":4783.199,"body":"self representing."},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4784.04,"endTime":4786.38,"body":"It's the"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4784.04,"endTime":4786.38,"body":"fundamental requirement in any"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4786.38,"endTime":4789.92,"body":"large scale transaction that"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4786.38,"endTime":4789.92,"body":"there's someone who is"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4790.04,"endTime":4791.42,"body":"blameworthy."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":4792.32,"endTime":4792.74,"body":"Yes,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4792.98,"endTime":4795.0199999999995,"body":"or you could"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4792.98,"endTime":4795.0199999999995,"body":"phrase it another way, which is"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4795.0199999999995,"endTime":4798.28,"body":"a fascinating phrase, which has"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4795.0199999999995,"endTime":4798.28,"body":"been used in marketing without"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4798.28,"endTime":4801.7,"body":"anybody going, what does this"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4798.28,"endTime":4801.7,"body":"really mean? Reputable or"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4801.7,"endTime":4805.18,"body":"reputable tech, yeah, but the"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4801.7,"endTime":4805.18,"body":"reason I said reputable is"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4805.18,"endTime":4809.2,"body":"because it's capable of being"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4805.18,"endTime":4809.2,"body":"reputationally enhanced or"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4809.2,"endTime":4813.94,"body":"damaged. So I'm relying on, if"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4809.2,"endTime":4813.94,"body":"you are my financial advisor,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4814.0,"endTime":4818.82,"body":"I'm relying on your sense of"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4814.0,"endTime":4818.82,"body":"shame and your reputation and"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4818.82,"endTime":4822.48,"body":"your ability to acquire new to"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4818.82,"endTime":4822.48,"body":"clients, you may be a bit more"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4822.48,"endTime":4826.2,"body":"frightened of me as a client,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4822.48,"endTime":4826.2,"body":"because I'm a bit famous, and"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4826.2,"endTime":4829.5,"body":"therefore, if you stiff to me,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4826.2,"endTime":4829.5,"body":"the potential I would have to"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4829.5,"endTime":4833.58,"body":"damage you would be higher than"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4829.5,"endTime":4833.58,"body":"for a random punter, but that is"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4833.58,"endTime":4838.4,"body":"effectively a reputational"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4833.58,"endTime":4838.4,"body":"calculus. Now, if you have a"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4838.4,"endTime":4842.96,"body":"machine, you can obviously"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4838.4,"endTime":4842.96,"body":"program it to avoid certain"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4842.96,"endTime":4847.22,"body":"things. Nonetheless, it doesn't"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4842.96,"endTime":4847.22,"body":"have a sense of shame. And this"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4847.28,"endTime":4850.64,"body":"is why, a very strange thing,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4847.28,"endTime":4850.64,"body":"okay, I suspect, you know, tend"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4850.64,"endTime":4854.78,"body":"to buy cars locally, and the"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4850.64,"endTime":4854.78,"body":"reason is because I live in"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4854.78,"endTime":4858.64,"body":"Seven Oaks, if I buy from a"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4854.78,"endTime":4858.64,"body":"garage in Kent. I can make their"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4858.64,"endTime":4862.0599999999995,"body":"lives a bit awkward if they"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4858.64,"endTime":4862.0599999999995,"body":"screw me over, right? If I go"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4862.0599999999995,"endTime":4867.34,"body":"and buy a car from a, you know,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4862.0599999999995,"endTime":4867.34,"body":"ex in Glasgow, you know, I'd"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4867.34,"endTime":4869.86,"body":"have to spend half my life on"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4867.34,"endTime":4869.86,"body":"social media, you know,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4869.86,"endTime":4873.22,"body":"demonizing a Glasgow car dealer."},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4869.86,"endTime":4873.22,"body":"It's a bit more difficult, and"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4873.22,"endTime":4876.04,"body":"consequently, they're a bit more"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4873.22,"endTime":4876.04,"body":"scared when you take in a say."},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4876.12,"endTime":4879.54,"body":"Car to a reputable dealer, by"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4876.12,"endTime":4879.54,"body":"the way, the first thing they do"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4879.54,"endTime":4881.76,"body":"is move it somewhere completely"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4879.54,"endTime":4881.76,"body":"different than the"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":4881.94,"endTime":4882.3,"body":"country."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":4882.3,"endTime":4882.42,"body":"Yeah,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4882.54,"endTime":4883.32,"body":"it's really"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4882.54,"endTime":4883.32,"body":"weird."},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":4883.74,"endTime":4886.86,"body":"You have been famous"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":4883.74,"endTime":4886.86,"body":"as saying, create surprise in"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":4886.86,"endTime":4889.14,"body":"business. Any stories for"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":4886.86,"endTime":4889.14,"body":"financial advisors?"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":4889.14,"endTime":4889.38,"body":"Yeah,"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":4889.44,"endTime":4890.46,"body":"create surprise."},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4890.5199999999995,"endTime":4893.0999999999995,"body":"There's a guy"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4890.5199999999995,"endTime":4893.0999999999995,"body":"only just discovered, and his"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4893.0999999999995,"endTime":4896.46,"body":"name is right. Can I do you mind"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4893.0999999999995,"endTime":4896.46,"body":"if I google something? Yeah, it"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4896.46,"endTime":4899.66,"body":"is worth knowing. So here's a"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4896.46,"endTime":4899.66,"body":"bit of a source of inspiration."},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4900.98,"endTime":4903.8,"body":"And he's clearly bonkers, by the"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4900.98,"endTime":4903.8,"body":"way. But I love the guy. I only"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4903.8,"endTime":4906.62,"body":"just discovered him by accident."},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4903.8,"endTime":4906.62,"body":"I mentioned the fact that you"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4906.62,"endTime":4911.96,"body":"could read the wonderful book"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4906.62,"endTime":4911.96,"body":"unreasonable hospitality. Will"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4911.96,"endTime":4912.5,"body":"Gadara,"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":4914.54,"endTime":4916.5999999999995,"body":"reverse benchmarking"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":4914.54,"endTime":4916.5999999999995,"body":"and reverse"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4916.5999999999995,"endTime":4919.18,"body":"benchmarking."},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4916.5999999999995,"endTime":4919.18,"body":"I'll mention that there is a"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4919.18,"endTime":4923.5,"body":"guy, God, Australian dentist"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4919.18,"endTime":4923.5,"body":"called, have you come across"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4923.5,"endTime":4923.68,"body":"him?"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":4923.68,"endTime":4924.58,"body":"I think so. Yeah,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4924.58,"endTime":4925.54,"body":"yeah, okay."},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":4925.659,"endTime":4926.799,"body":"His name, it's an odd"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":4925.659,"endTime":4926.799,"body":"one."},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4927.0999999999995,"endTime":4929.14,"body":"Yeah, he's got"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4927.0999999999995,"endTime":4929.14,"body":"a really odd name. It's"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4929.68,"endTime":4931.84,"body":"something like pad, yeah,"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":4931.84,"endTime":4932.44,"body":"Paddy Lund."},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4932.44,"endTime":4935.74,"body":"Paddy Lund,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4932.44,"endTime":4935.74,"body":"you've got it exactly. And he"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4935.74,"endTime":4939.54,"body":"has a wonderful detail called,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4935.74,"endTime":4939.54,"body":"see knees, which are critical"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4939.54,"endTime":4940.32,"body":"non essentials."},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":4940.32,"endTime":4941.22,"body":"Yeah, he was a"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4941.22,"endTime":4942.66,"body":"very"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4941.22,"endTime":4942.66,"body":"interesting guy paddy land. I"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4942.66,"endTime":4946.38,"body":"think we ought to, if you, if"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4942.66,"endTime":4946.38,"body":"you can get him, actually, for"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4946.92,"endTime":4949.62,"body":"humans under management, he'd"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4946.92,"endTime":4949.62,"body":"be, I think he'd be great fun,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4949.74,"endTime":4952.26,"body":"because he was running this"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4949.74,"endTime":4952.26,"body":"dentist surgery, and he was kind"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4952.26,"endTime":4954.72,"body":"of bored with it. He wasn't"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4952.26,"endTime":4954.72,"body":"making much money, and it was"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4954.72,"endTime":4957.92,"body":"all tedious. And he basically"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4954.72,"endTime":4957.92,"body":"decided to go, you know, shit or"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4957.92,"endTime":4961.5199999999995,"body":"bust. And the first thing I"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4957.92,"endTime":4961.5199999999995,"body":"think he does is replaces his"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4961.5199999999995,"endTime":4966.2,"body":"receptionist desk with, like, a"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4961.5199999999995,"endTime":4966.2,"body":"$7,000 cappuccino machine, top"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4966.2,"endTime":4971.54,"body":"of the range, Italian barista"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4966.2,"endTime":4971.54,"body":"thing. And he now only gets"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4971.54,"endTime":4975.38,"body":"paid. He then only got patients"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4971.54,"endTime":4975.38,"body":"by referral. He basically just"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4975.38,"endTime":4981.0999999999995,"body":"went completely all out. But his"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4975.38,"endTime":4981.0999999999995,"body":"concept of the scene, he is very"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4981.0999999999995,"endTime":4984.7,"body":"similar to will gadara's idea,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4981.0999999999995,"endTime":4984.7,"body":"very similar to what I"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4984.7,"endTime":4989.32,"body":"christened the reverse"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4984.7,"endTime":4989.32,"body":"benchmark. Yeah, find an area"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4989.32,"endTime":4992.92,"body":"which everybody else is"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4989.32,"endTime":4992.92,"body":"neglecting. And I can guarantee,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4992.92,"endTime":4995.8,"body":"by the way, if you offered a"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4992.92,"endTime":4995.8,"body":"form filling service, which is"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4995.8,"endTime":4998.46,"body":"you want to buy a car, just give"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4995.8,"endTime":4998.46,"body":"all the shit to us."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":4998.7,"endTime":4999.0599999999995,"body":"Yeah,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4999.479,"endTime":5000.919,"body":"to be honest,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":4999.479,"endTime":5000.919,"body":"you could underperform the"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5000.919,"endTime":5003.919,"body":"market for 15 years. No one"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5000.919,"endTime":5003.919,"body":"care. I shouldn't be saying"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5003.919,"endTime":5004.8189999999995,"body":"this. Should I on"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5004.82,"endTime":5008.0,"body":"the flip side of"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5004.82,"endTime":5008.0,"body":"critical? On the flip side? No,"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5008.0,"endTime":5010.34,"body":"it's a great idea. It's"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5008.0,"endTime":5010.34,"body":"basically a concierge service"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5010.34,"endTime":5014.24,"body":"for financial and life admin"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5010.34,"endTime":5014.24,"body":"that most people try and steer"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5014.24,"endTime":5016.96,"body":"clear of. So the opposite of"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5014.24,"endTime":5016.96,"body":"critical, non essentials,"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5016.96,"endTime":5019.36,"body":"relatively recent term I've"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5016.96,"endTime":5019.36,"body":"learned, I think it was on a"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5019.36,"endTime":5021.58,"body":"podcast you're on. I think the"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5019.36,"endTime":5021.58,"body":"hungry podcast, silent"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5021.58,"endTime":5024.64,"body":"irritants, things which just"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5021.58,"endTime":5024.64,"body":"slightly NAG and irritate"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5024.64,"endTime":5028.72,"body":"people, but they're not annoying"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5024.64,"endTime":5028.72,"body":"enough to mention it. So any"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5028.72,"endTime":5031.3,"body":"silent and irritants on the"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5028.72,"endTime":5031.3,"body":"professional services?"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5031.3,"endTime":5033.04,"body":"So I have a"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5031.3,"endTime":5033.04,"body":"name for these as well, which"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5033.04,"endTime":5035.74,"body":"is, there's a famous phrase in"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5033.04,"endTime":5035.74,"body":"marketing which is always used,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5035.74,"endTime":5036.9,"body":"which is, unmet needs,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":5037.0199999999995,"endTime":5037.44,"body":"yeah,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5037.799,"endTime":5040.439,"body":"and to some"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5037.799,"endTime":5040.439,"body":"extent, you know, a senior is,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5040.439,"endTime":5043.679,"body":"is a highly exaggerated form of"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5040.439,"endTime":5043.679,"body":"an unmet need. You take"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5043.679,"endTime":5046.619,"body":"something that nobody thought"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5043.679,"endTime":5046.619,"body":"they wanted, and you kind of"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5046.619,"endTime":5051.3589999999995,"body":"double down on it. My opposite"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5046.619,"endTime":5051.3589999999995,"body":"of this is met unneeds, which is"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5051.3589999999995,"endTime":5057.147,"body":"things people do that nobody"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5051.3589999999995,"endTime":5057.147,"body":"actually wants, and you're"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5057.147,"endTime":5061.287,"body":"absolutely right on friction,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5057.147,"endTime":5061.287,"body":"the whole idea of friction, but"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5061.287,"endTime":5064.107,"body":"I think friction now, okay, I'm"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5061.287,"endTime":5064.107,"body":"going to get, there's a"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5064.107,"endTime":5068.607,"body":"fantastic woman you must invite"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5064.107,"endTime":5068.607,"body":"to humans under management. And"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5069.387,"endTime":5071.847,"body":"I'm trying, I'm basically just"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5069.387,"endTime":5071.847,"body":"trying to make her famous,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5071.847,"endTime":5074.547,"body":"because I think she's brilliant."},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5071.847,"endTime":5074.547,"body":"She's called Carla groom. She"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5074.547,"endTime":5077.079,"body":"worked for quite a few years."},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5074.547,"endTime":5077.079,"body":"She's just left the department"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5077.079,"endTime":5081.099,"body":"for working pensions, and she"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5077.079,"endTime":5081.099,"body":"was the person who did all the"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5081.099,"endTime":5084.879,"body":"work on all the work. Is very"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5081.099,"endTime":5084.879,"body":"unfair, but she did a lot of the"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5084.879,"endTime":5088.059,"body":"work and a lot of the decisive"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5084.879,"endTime":5088.059,"body":"stuff on what you might call"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5088.059,"endTime":5088.839,"body":"auto enrollment,"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5088.84,"endTime":5090.88,"body":"auto enrollment,"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5088.84,"endTime":5090.88,"body":"which has been a huge success,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5090.88,"endTime":5096.04,"body":"huge, huge"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5090.88,"endTime":5096.04,"body":"success. Okay? And I said to"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5096.04,"endTime":5101.46,"body":"her, I said, I've got a theory,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5096.04,"endTime":5101.46,"body":"right? And I said the level of"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5101.46,"endTime":5105.36,"body":"opt out was even lower than the"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5101.46,"endTime":5105.36,"body":"most optimistic people, I think,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5105.36,"endTime":5110.5199999999995,"body":"expected. And some of that is"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5105.36,"endTime":5110.5199999999995,"body":"auto. It's a default. I don't"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5110.5199999999995,"endTime":5110.94,"body":"have to do"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5111.42,"endTime":5112.44,"body":"anything great"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5111.42,"endTime":5112.44,"body":"framing."},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5112.979,"endTime":5115.139,"body":"There's also"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5112.979,"endTime":5115.139,"body":"the implicit thing, which is, if"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5115.139,"endTime":5117.139,"body":"someone's making something"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5115.139,"endTime":5117.139,"body":"automatic, it can't be a"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5117.139,"endTime":5121.099,"body":"terrible decision, right? You"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5117.139,"endTime":5121.099,"body":"know, if someone's actually"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5121.099,"endTime":5124.879,"body":"making something in my company"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5121.099,"endTime":5124.879,"body":"and making it automatic thirdly,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5124.879,"endTime":5128.899,"body":"because it's low friction, it"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5124.879,"endTime":5128.899,"body":"creates low anxiety, I'll come"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5129.019,"endTime":5129.3189999999995,"body":"on to"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5129.559,"endTime":5129.739,"body":"this"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5129.74,"endTime":5133.34,"body":"fourthly, and"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5129.74,"endTime":5133.34,"body":"perhaps, and I said, my theory"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5133.34,"endTime":5136.28,"body":"is this was much more decisive"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5133.34,"endTime":5136.28,"body":"than anyone realized. There's"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5136.28,"endTime":5139.78,"body":"social proof, which is I"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5136.28,"endTime":5139.78,"body":"fundamentally feel comfortable"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5139.78,"endTime":5142.48,"body":"having the same pension that all"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5139.78,"endTime":5142.48,"body":"my colleagues do, because if"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5142.48,"endTime":5145.0599999999995,"body":"anything goes wrong with it, I"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5142.48,"endTime":5145.0599999999995,"body":"probably wouldn't notice, but"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5145.0599999999995,"endTime":5150.22,"body":"some tragic nerd in the finance"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5145.0599999999995,"endTime":5150.22,"body":"department will. And so there's"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5150.22,"endTime":5154.12,"body":"a company I work with called"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5150.22,"endTime":5154.12,"body":"herdify, which looks at this"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5154.12,"endTime":5157.68,"body":"precisely, the extent to which"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5154.12,"endTime":5157.68,"body":"behavior is highly contagious,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5158.58,"endTime":5162.48,"body":"and we feel comfortable doing"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5158.58,"endTime":5162.48,"body":"things that other people do just"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5162.48,"endTime":5165.3,"body":"automatically. And it's"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5162.48,"endTime":5165.3,"body":"perfectly sensible, evolved"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5165.3,"endTime":5169.08,"body":"human psychological property."},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5165.3,"endTime":5169.08,"body":"Nothing, nothing ridiculous"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5169.08,"endTime":5171.84,"body":"about it. It makes absolute"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5169.08,"endTime":5171.84,"body":"sense that we copy each other"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5171.84,"endTime":5175.74,"body":"and so, you know, that's how we"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5171.84,"endTime":5175.74,"body":"learned before we could speak."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":5175.92,"endTime":5176.04,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5176.12,"endTime":5177.62,"body":"Know, do what"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5176.12,"endTime":5177.62,"body":"that guy?"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5177.8,"endTime":5178.64,"body":"Mimicry. Yeah,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5178.82,"endTime":5182.36,"body":"mimicry. Okay."},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5178.82,"endTime":5182.36,"body":"And I actually suddenly"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5182.36,"endTime":5185.9,"body":"realized, I'll give you an"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5182.36,"endTime":5185.9,"body":"example. The Now, one thing you"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5185.9,"endTime":5188.78,"body":"could do with financial services"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5185.9,"endTime":5188.78,"body":"is you could, but I"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5188.78,"endTime":5192.26,"body":"automatically feel comfortable"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5188.78,"endTime":5192.26,"body":"if, if 76 people in my company"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5192.26,"endTime":5195.38,"body":"have this pension, and I'm the"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5192.26,"endTime":5195.38,"body":"77th very few people feel"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5195.38,"endTime":5198.64,"body":"anxious. The only reason I"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5195.38,"endTime":5198.64,"body":"bought an electric car is"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5198.64,"endTime":5201.7,"body":"because my brother bought one"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5198.64,"endTime":5201.7,"body":"first. Suddenly, if you'd asked"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5201.7,"endTime":5203.86,"body":"me, why did you buy an electric"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5201.7,"endTime":5203.86,"body":"car? Go blah, blah, blah,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5203.86,"endTime":5208.78,"body":"performance, saving and"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5203.86,"endTime":5208.78,"body":"quietness, comfort, okay, but"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5208.78,"endTime":5212.2,"body":"actually, if my brother hadn't"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5208.78,"endTime":5212.2,"body":"bought one first, none of those"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5212.2,"endTime":5214.24,"body":"things would have mattered,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5212.2,"endTime":5214.24,"body":"because I wouldn't have been"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5214.24,"endTime":5216.72,"body":"courageous enough to buy an"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5214.24,"endTime":5216.72,"body":"electric car. Now, the problem"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5216.72,"endTime":5220.38,"body":"with finance, a bit, is there"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5216.72,"endTime":5220.38,"body":"are products which are very"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5220.38,"endTime":5225.12,"body":"visible and hence very, very"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5220.38,"endTime":5225.12,"body":"social, alcoholic drinks, one of"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5225.12,"endTime":5228.42,"body":"the most extreme, okay, if you"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5225.12,"endTime":5228.42,"body":"don't believe this, next time"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5228.42,"endTime":5231.3,"body":"you go to the pub with your"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5228.42,"endTime":5231.3,"body":"mates, order a pina colada,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5232.14,"endTime":5237.68,"body":"okay, you will experience actual"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5232.14,"endTime":5237.68,"body":"pain, right, in not blending in"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5237.68,"endTime":5241.82,"body":"with everybody else, right? I'm"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5237.68,"endTime":5241.82,"body":"not, you're not allowed to"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5241.82,"endTime":5246.14,"body":"explain. It's part of a"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5241.82,"endTime":5246.14,"body":"psychological experiment."},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5246.26,"endTime":5249.92,"body":"Actually, most people, if it"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5246.26,"endTime":5249.92,"body":"weren't for social No, that's"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5249.92,"endTime":5253.28,"body":"too extreme. 20% of people, if"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5249.92,"endTime":5253.28,"body":"it weren't for social pressure,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5253.28,"endTime":5254.72,"body":"would drink Bailey's all the"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5253.28,"endTime":5254.72,"body":"time."},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5255.08,"endTime":5257.2,"body":"Yeah? Contagion"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5255.08,"endTime":5257.2,"body":"effect."},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5257.44,"endTime":5260.0199999999995,"body":"Now there are"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5257.44,"endTime":5260.0199999999995,"body":"other products, Hemorrhoid Cream"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5260.0199999999995,"endTime":5262.24,"body":"would be at the other end of"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5260.0199999999995,"endTime":5262.24,"body":"that spectrum, which are non"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5262.24,"endTime":5264.94,"body":"visible. They're not consumed"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5262.24,"endTime":5264.94,"body":"visibly, and we don't talk about"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5264.94,"endTime":5269.2,"body":"them, okay, generally. And the"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5264.94,"endTime":5269.2,"body":"problem with finance in the UK"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5269.44,"endTime":5272.26,"body":"less so in places like India,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5269.44,"endTime":5272.26,"body":"where people are very open about"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5272.26,"endTime":5277.0199999999995,"body":"it, finance in the UK is closer"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5272.26,"endTime":5277.0199999999995,"body":"to Hemorrhoid Cream. Now, if I"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5277.0199999999995,"endTime":5281.5199999999995,"body":"had a mechanism where I could"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5277.0199999999995,"endTime":5281.5199999999995,"body":"actually see anonymized data on"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5281.58,"endTime":5287.5199999999995,"body":"my social graphs, own investment"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5281.58,"endTime":5287.5199999999995,"body":"wealth, and I could compare"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5287.5199999999995,"endTime":5290.94,"body":"myself against people in my peer"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5287.5199999999995,"endTime":5290.94,"body":"group without needing to know"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5290.94,"endTime":5294.54,"body":"who they were, that would be a"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5290.94,"endTime":5294.54,"body":"very, very potent thing to"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5294.54,"endTime":5296.72,"body":"create. It'd be really"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5294.54,"endTime":5296.72,"body":"interesting talking to this"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5296.72,"endTime":5299.96,"body":"company, heard of that wonderful"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5296.72,"endTime":5299.96,"body":"guy called Tom ridges. His team"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5299.96,"endTime":5302.54,"body":"basically were a lot of"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5299.96,"endTime":5302.54,"body":"Cambridge epidemiologists who"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5302.54,"endTime":5307.4,"body":"just looked at contagion in a"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5302.54,"endTime":5307.4,"body":"broader marketing sense. And so"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5307.4,"endTime":5310.64,"body":"that that element of the auto"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5307.4,"endTime":5310.64,"body":"enrolment was much more"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5310.64,"endTime":5313.76,"body":"important, I think, than people"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5310.64,"endTime":5313.76,"body":"anticipated, which is, well, you"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5313.76,"endTime":5317.38,"body":"know, most people have one of"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5313.76,"endTime":5317.38,"body":"these pensions. If I don't have"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5317.44,"endTime":5320.2,"body":"it, I'm the weirdo. I'm the"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5317.44,"endTime":5320.2,"body":"person ordering the pina colada,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5320.32,"endTime":5323.68,"body":"whereas when only 6% of people"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5320.32,"endTime":5323.68,"body":"bothered with the company"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5323.68,"endTime":5326.44,"body":"pension, you felt like the"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5323.68,"endTime":5326.44,"body":"person ordering, you know, pint"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5326.44,"endTime":5327.34,"body":"of Bailey's please."},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5327.76,"endTime":5329.92,"body":"I'm sure the opt out"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5327.76,"endTime":5329.92,"body":"now are single digits, not"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5330.4,"endTime":5333.46,"body":"I think it was"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5330.4,"endTime":5333.46,"body":"11 to begin with. They thought"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5333.46,"endTime":5336.5199999999995,"body":"it would be 25 and it turned out"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5333.46,"endTime":5336.5199999999995,"body":"to be 11. And I think you're"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5336.5199999999995,"endTime":5337.98,"body":"right. It's down to single"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5336.5199999999995,"endTime":5337.98,"body":"digit."},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5337.98,"endTime":5340.32,"body":"And a few people did"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5337.98,"endTime":5340.32,"body":"opt out immediately for it, for"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5340.38,"endTime":5343.74,"body":"unknown reasons. You know, Dad,"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5340.38,"endTime":5343.74,"body":"uncle, mother, brother, and then"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5343.74,"endTime":5345.72,"body":"they realized they were the ones"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5343.74,"endTime":5345.72,"body":"left out, and they thought,"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5345.72,"endTime":5347.28,"body":"shit, I'm gonna get back in as"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5345.72,"endTime":5347.28,"body":"soon as I"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5347.34,"endTime":5349.86,"body":"can. By the"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5347.34,"endTime":5349.86,"body":"way, 1112, 13% of people should"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5349.86,"endTime":5352.44,"body":"not so actually, I would argue"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5349.86,"endTime":5352.44,"body":"the enrollment rate is 100%"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5353.22,"endTime":5357.92,"body":"because a significant majority"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5353.22,"endTime":5357.92,"body":"of those 11% their husbands or"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5357.92,"endTime":5362.18,"body":"wife is a financial advisor, for"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5357.92,"endTime":5362.18,"body":"example, yeah, you know or or"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5362.18,"endTime":5365.42,"body":"they're massively in debt. That"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5362.18,"endTime":5365.42,"body":"you know, perfectly legitimate"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5365.42,"endTime":5367.7,"body":"thing to do under certain"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5365.42,"endTime":5367.7,"body":"circumstances. If you've got a"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5367.7,"endTime":5370.58,"body":"stack of credit card debt, maybe"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5367.7,"endTime":5370.58,"body":"you shouldn't enroll just yet."},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5370.58,"endTime":5373.5199999999995,"body":"But the other thing that, the"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5370.58,"endTime":5373.5199999999995,"body":"low friction thing, is doubly"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5373.5199999999995,"endTime":5377.2,"body":"important, because if I want to"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5373.5199999999995,"endTime":5377.2,"body":"top up my pension. I have to"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5377.2,"endTime":5382.36,"body":"write a letter, write a check,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5377.2,"endTime":5382.36,"body":"post it somewhere. Okay, I don't"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5382.36,"endTime":5385.0599999999995,"body":"get any confirmation that it's"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5382.36,"endTime":5385.0599999999995,"body":"been received. I've then got to"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5385.0599999999995,"endTime":5388.18,"body":"wait six months to check my"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5385.0599999999995,"endTime":5388.18,"body":"pension statement. Remember that"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5388.18,"endTime":5391.54,"body":"I paid in 5000 quid, and check"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5388.18,"endTime":5391.54,"body":"that they've credited me and"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5391.54,"endTime":5394.5999999999995,"body":"credited me the necessary tax"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5391.54,"endTime":5394.5999999999995,"body":"adjustment. The point is a"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5394.5999999999995,"endTime":5397.14,"body":"that's difficult to do. I don't"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5394.5999999999995,"endTime":5397.14,"body":"even know where my checkbook is."},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5397.14,"endTime":5400.32,"body":"But that's not the only problem."},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5397.14,"endTime":5400.32,"body":"It's not only difficult to do."},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5400.32,"endTime":5403.92,"body":"It's also because it's difficult"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5400.32,"endTime":5403.92,"body":"to do. I automatically think"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5403.92,"endTime":5407.28,"body":"that I shouldn't be doing it."},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5403.92,"endTime":5407.28,"body":"You shouldn't be this feels"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5407.28,"endTime":5408.54,"body":"unnatural. This is good."},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5408.54,"endTime":5409.44,"body":"Feels good to be"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5408.54,"endTime":5409.44,"body":"easy."},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5409.5599999999995,"endTime":5411.66,"body":"If it was good"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5409.5599999999995,"endTime":5411.66,"body":"thing, someone would have made"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5411.66,"endTime":5416.5999999999995,"body":"it easy for whatever reason. You"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5411.66,"endTime":5416.5999999999995,"body":"probably know this. I told this"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5416.5999999999995,"endTime":5419.5999999999995,"body":"to a bunch of pension people up"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5416.5999999999995,"endTime":5419.5999999999995,"body":"in Edinburgh the pensions"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5419.5999999999995,"endTime":5420.14,"body":"conference,"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5420.62,"endTime":5422.3,"body":"if I gave you 1000"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5420.62,"endTime":5422.3,"body":"pounds today,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5423.14,"endTime":5424.22,"body":"put into your"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5423.14,"endTime":5424.22,"body":"pension up."},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5425.3,"endTime":5426.44,"body":"He's got some weird"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5425.3,"endTime":5426.44,"body":"app,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5426.619,"endTime":5429.079,"body":"Goldman Sachs."},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5426.619,"endTime":5429.079,"body":"It was working for Goldman Sachs"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5429.079,"endTime":5432.559,"body":"was the only guy who knew how to"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5429.079,"endTime":5432.559,"body":"do it. Yeah. Now that was, I"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5432.559,"endTime":5435.3189999999995,"body":"ought to be clear about that was"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5432.559,"endTime":5435.3189999999995,"body":"eight years ago. The figure"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5435.3189999999995,"endTime":5439.659,"body":"would be higher now. But those"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5435.3189999999995,"endTime":5439.659,"body":"the audience consisted entirely"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5439.659,"endTime":5440.379,"body":"of people, working"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5440.5,"endTime":5443.0199999999995,"body":"professionals. That"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5440.5,"endTime":5443.0199999999995,"body":"should be the ideal people to do"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5443.0199999999995,"endTime":5445.48,"body":"that. I mean those decisions you"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5443.0199999999995,"endTime":5445.48,"body":"mentioned previously, just"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5445.48,"endTime":5448.84,"body":"explaining that. I call them six"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5445.48,"endTime":5448.84,"body":"figure tick boxes. So this is an"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5448.9,"endTime":5451.72,"body":"ultra enrolment thing. All you"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5448.9,"endTime":5451.72,"body":"got to do is tick this one box."},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5451.72,"endTime":5454.54,"body":"It'll be a six figure tick box"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5451.72,"endTime":5454.54,"body":"in the future. There's a few of"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5454.54,"endTime":5457.0,"body":"those six figure tick boxes"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5454.54,"endTime":5457.0,"body":"here, there and everywhere. I'll"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5457.0,"endTime":5460.0199999999995,"body":"go back to a previous point. You"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5457.0,"endTime":5460.0199999999995,"body":"mentioned. Money is a thing"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5460.0199999999995,"endTime":5463.8,"body":"British people don't talk about"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5460.0199999999995,"endTime":5463.8,"body":"their great financial advisor is"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5463.98,"endTime":5467.28,"body":"something they don't talk about."},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5463.98,"endTime":5467.28,"body":"So this is, this is a scale"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5467.28,"endTime":5470.64,"body":"issue in our business. Is there"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5467.28,"endTime":5470.64,"body":"anything you could recommend"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5470.64,"endTime":5475.5,"body":"financial advisors to do to get"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5470.64,"endTime":5475.5,"body":"clients to be more proactive"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5475.5,"endTime":5476.54,"body":"with referral? Ring."},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5477.32,"endTime":5480.0199999999995,"body":"Just send me a"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5477.32,"endTime":5480.0199999999995,"body":"form and put two stickies on it"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5480.0199999999995,"endTime":5486.08,"body":"and tell me to sign, genuinely,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5480.0199999999995,"endTime":5486.08,"body":"just just, the fact is, we, I'm"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5486.08,"endTime":5490.46,"body":"so sorry. It's not going to go"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5486.08,"endTime":5490.46,"body":"because, but this is really"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5490.46,"endTime":5495.26,"body":"important. Okay. What is"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5490.46,"endTime":5495.26,"body":"difficult? There was a bank"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5495.26,"endTime":5499.72,"body":"which was asked to effectively"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5495.26,"endTime":5499.72,"body":"benchmark its queues, a length"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5499.72,"endTime":5502.78,"body":"of its queues, against the other"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5499.72,"endTime":5502.78,"body":"banks in the town. And everybody"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5502.78,"endTime":5505.36,"body":"was busily going, Oh, we've got"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5502.78,"endTime":5505.36,"body":"slightly shorter queues than"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5505.36,"endTime":5510.46,"body":"HSBC, right? Versus nine. And"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5505.36,"endTime":5510.46,"body":"one guy said, brilliantly, he"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5510.46,"endTime":5514.3,"body":"said. He said, I'm not going to"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5510.46,"endTime":5514.3,"body":"do that, because my customers"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5514.3,"endTime":5516.9,"body":"don't go to the other banks."},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5514.3,"endTime":5516.9,"body":"They go to Tesco. So I'm going"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5516.9,"endTime":5519.36,"body":"to benchmark my cues against"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5516.9,"endTime":5519.36,"body":"Tesco. Now, what we got to"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5519.36,"endTime":5522.42,"body":"remember is we live in a world"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5519.36,"endTime":5522.42,"body":"where, in some things have"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5522.42,"endTime":5527.0999999999995,"body":"become laughably easy, like"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5522.42,"endTime":5527.0999999999995,"body":"Deliveroo, okay, and other"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5527.0999999999995,"endTime":5530.4,"body":"things have become more"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5527.0999999999995,"endTime":5530.4,"body":"difficult. And so you actually"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5530.4,"endTime":5533.28,"body":"have a double whammy effect,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5530.4,"endTime":5533.28,"body":"which is, not only is this"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5533.34,"endTime":5537.0199999999995,"body":"intrinsically difficult, but"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5533.34,"endTime":5537.0199999999995,"body":"it's almost unimaginably"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5537.0199999999995,"endTime":5541.64,"body":"difficult compared to other"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5537.0199999999995,"endTime":5541.64,"body":"things I do. And so there's"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5541.64,"endTime":5544.16,"body":"another great question, which"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5541.64,"endTime":5544.16,"body":"I'm going to give away, and I"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5544.16,"endTime":5546.62,"body":"wish I could credit the person"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5544.16,"endTime":5546.62,"body":"who told me, and I wish I could"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5546.62,"endTime":5549.26,"body":"credit the company who did it,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5546.62,"endTime":5549.26,"body":"but it was an online retailer"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5549.44,"endTime":5553.34,"body":"who, when people bought, asked"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5549.44,"endTime":5553.34,"body":"them the question, what nearly"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5553.34,"endTime":5555.98,"body":"stopped you from buying this"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5553.34,"endTime":5555.98,"body":"product? And they realized they"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5555.98,"endTime":5558.0999999999995,"body":"don't have data on non"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5555.98,"endTime":5558.0999999999995,"body":"customers, because the non"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5558.0999999999995,"endTime":5560.8,"body":"customers aren't customers, so"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5558.0999999999995,"endTime":5560.8,"body":"you can't ask them why didn't"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5560.8,"endTime":5564.22,"body":"you buy? But their closest"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5560.8,"endTime":5564.22,"body":"approximation to that was asking"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5564.22,"endTime":5567.28,"body":"people who did buy. Was there"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5564.22,"endTime":5567.28,"body":"anything that nearly stopped"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5567.28,"endTime":5567.5199999999995,"body":"you?"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5568.0599999999995,"endTime":5570.28,"body":"Superb? Okay, my"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5568.0599999999995,"endTime":5570.28,"body":"friend,"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5571.3,"endTime":5571.54,"body":"thank"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5572.32,"endTime":5575.68,"body":"you. That's superb."},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5572.32,"endTime":5575.68,"body":"I'll send you an email"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5575.68,"endTime":5578.4,"body":"separately about the lady you"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5575.68,"endTime":5578.4,"body":"recommended as a potential"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5578.4,"endTime":5581.0999999999995,"body":"speaker. Thank you very much."},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5578.4,"endTime":5581.0999999999995,"body":"Over now, color groom, I'll"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5581.0999999999995,"endTime":5582.54,"body":"put you in"},{"speaker":"Rory Sutherland","startTime":5581.0999999999995,"endTime":5582.54,"body":"touch. Absolutely."},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5582.54,"endTime":5584.82,"body":"Thank you very much"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5582.54,"endTime":5584.82,"body":"the real advisor podcast. Thank"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5584.94,"endTime":5586.14,"body":"you very much, Rory, see you"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":5586.14,"endTime":5586.38,"body":"later."},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5589.8,"endTime":5592.32,"body":"Very good. So very"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5589.8,"endTime":5592.32,"body":"good. Well done, Andy, well"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5592.32,"endTime":5592.68,"body":"done. Well"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":5592.68,"endTime":5596.42,"body":"done, Andy, that is"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":5592.68,"endTime":5596.42,"body":"not an easy task to corral Mr."},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":5596.42,"endTime":5600.26,"body":"Sutherland into your"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":5596.42,"endTime":5600.26,"body":"questioning. But you know,"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":5600.26,"endTime":5603.74,"body":"great, great conversation, I"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":5600.26,"endTime":5603.74,"body":"just want to say because it"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":5603.74,"endTime":5608.3,"body":"reminded me when I was watching"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":5603.74,"endTime":5608.3,"body":"it and listening to it honestly,"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":5608.3,"endTime":5611.18,"body":"one of the highlights the last"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":5608.3,"endTime":5611.18,"body":"few years was that lunch we all"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":5611.18,"endTime":5614.24,"body":"had. Remember that when we went"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":5611.18,"endTime":5614.24,"body":"we sat in the sunshine in London"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":5614.24,"endTime":5615.98,"body":"with Rory, sort of spontaneous"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":5615.98,"endTime":5616.58,"body":"Devonshire,"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":5616.76,"endTime":5619.54,"body":"yeah, yeah, probably"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":5616.76,"endTime":5619.54,"body":"the best pub in London. And it"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":5619.54,"endTime":5621.94,"body":"was sort of last minute thing."},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":5619.54,"endTime":5621.94,"body":"We sat on the rooftop in the"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":5621.94,"endTime":5624.4,"body":"sunshine, and to have, I don't"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":5621.94,"endTime":5624.4,"body":"know what it was, two and a half"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":5624.4,"endTime":5628.78,"body":"hours of just Rory being Rory"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":5624.4,"endTime":5628.78,"body":"and just exactly as he is on any"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":5628.78,"endTime":5632.26,"body":"podcast. And anytime you see him"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":5628.78,"endTime":5632.26,"body":"speak, you got him just speaking"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":5632.26,"endTime":5634.66,"body":"at you for two and a half hours."},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":5632.26,"endTime":5634.66,"body":"It was, it was a brilliant"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":5634.66,"endTime":5636.16,"body":"experience. Remember that?"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5637.0599999999995,"endTime":5639.96,"body":"Yeah, when I first"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5637.0599999999995,"endTime":5639.96,"body":"booked the table, we were"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5639.96,"endTime":5642.72,"body":"sitting in like a crappy table"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5639.96,"endTime":5642.72,"body":"on the first floor. We said, We"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5642.72,"endTime":5645.12,"body":"got a few people coming. Can we"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5642.72,"endTime":5645.12,"body":"sit anywhere else? They said,"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5645.12,"endTime":5646.86,"body":"not really. We've just got the"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5645.12,"endTime":5646.86,"body":"rooftop."},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":5648.78,"endTime":5649.62,"body":"It's a nice day."},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":5649.92,"endTime":5651.96,"body":"Sun was shining,"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":5649.92,"endTime":5651.96,"body":"wine was flowing, yeah, Rory."},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":5651.96,"endTime":5653.64,"body":"Rory turned up."},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":5651.96,"endTime":5653.64,"body":"Said we were drinking wine. I"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":5653.64,"endTime":5656.16,"body":"don't really want to drink wine."},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":5653.64,"endTime":5656.16,"body":"I've got to talk later. And had"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":5656.16,"endTime":5659.0,"body":"a glass of Zinfandel. This is"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":5656.16,"endTime":5659.0,"body":"very good Zinfandel. This is"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":5659.0,"endTime":5660.5599999999995,"body":"very good Zinfandel, I might"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5660.559,"endTime":5662.7789999999995,"body":"have another glass of"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5660.559,"endTime":5662.7789999999995,"body":"Zinfandel, yeah, he wasn't"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5662.7789999999995,"endTime":5665.7789999999995,"body":"drinking for three hours before"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5662.7789999999995,"endTime":5665.7789999999995,"body":"his talk. No,"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":5665.78,"endTime":5668.0599999999995,"body":"very good. Yes,"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":5665.78,"endTime":5668.0599999999995,"body":"always interesting, always"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":5668.0599999999995,"endTime":5671.54,"body":"interesting. And any insights"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":5668.0599999999995,"endTime":5671.54,"body":"you gleaned from your time with"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":5671.54,"endTime":5671.72,"body":"him,"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5672.98,"endTime":5677.5,"body":"I mean, I've consumed"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5672.98,"endTime":5677.5,"body":"so much Rory Sutherland content."},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5677.74,"endTime":5681.4,"body":"So, no, it was great to try and"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5677.74,"endTime":5681.4,"body":"focus in on a bit more of the"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5681.4,"endTime":5683.32,"body":"financial services element. And"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5681.4,"endTime":5683.32,"body":"AI"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":5683.619,"endTime":5684.099,"body":"he tried,"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5684.34,"endTime":5689.08,"body":"he's he's also a"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5684.34,"endTime":5689.08,"body":"client of Justin king so often."},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5689.08,"endTime":5692.98,"body":"So it's great that he works with"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5689.08,"endTime":5692.98,"body":"a full fat financial planner. So"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5692.98,"endTime":5697.68,"body":"I hear very brief things from"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5692.98,"endTime":5697.68,"body":"Justin and also, Rory speaks"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5697.68,"endTime":5701.04,"body":"very publicly about it, his"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5697.68,"endTime":5701.04,"body":"relationship. He basically"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5701.0999999999995,"endTime":5703.62,"body":"decided to work with Justin"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5701.0999999999995,"endTime":5703.62,"body":"kings yet, because he had a good"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5703.62,"endTime":5708.18,"body":"zoom setup. You know, we all"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5703.62,"endTime":5708.18,"body":"because covid was, was a bit of"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5708.18,"endTime":5712.98,"body":"a leveler, or not quite covid,"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5708.18,"endTime":5712.98,"body":"basically, you work at a super"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5712.98,"endTime":5716.5199999999995,"body":"fancy private bank in central"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5712.98,"endTime":5716.5199999999995,"body":"London. You know, plush carpets."},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5716.5199999999995,"endTime":5720.5,"body":"Go to the 13th floor. You know,"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5716.5199999999995,"endTime":5720.5,"body":"the perfect coffee during covid."},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5720.98,"endTime":5725.24,"body":"You're in your third bedroom."},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5720.98,"endTime":5725.24,"body":"There's no status purchase here."},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5725.36,"endTime":5729.5599999999995,"body":"So we were all leveled, you"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5725.36,"endTime":5729.5599999999995,"body":"know. So Justin King has got an"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5729.5599999999995,"endTime":5734.36,"body":"amazing zoom setup, and that was"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5729.5599999999995,"endTime":5734.36,"body":"one of the reasons why he chose"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5734.36,"endTime":5736.78,"body":"to work with Justin. It's along"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5734.36,"endTime":5736.78,"body":"with various other things. So"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5736.78,"endTime":5737.98,"body":"over to you. Nick,"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":5738.28,"endTime":5740.92,"body":"yeah, no, we're no"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":5738.28,"endTime":5740.92,"body":"Justin. I think it must have"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":5740.92,"endTime":5743.32,"body":"just been the zoom, because he's"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":5740.92,"endTime":5743.32,"body":"got no other qualities,"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5743.32,"endTime":5745.5999999999995,"body":"really has he love"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":5743.32,"endTime":5745.5999999999995,"body":"you too, Justin, but"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":5746.5599999999995,"endTime":5749.32,"body":"we are. We are one"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":5746.5599999999995,"endTime":5749.32,"body":"hour 45 minutes into this is a"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":5749.32,"endTime":5751.42,"body":"marathon monk that's a long,"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":5749.32,"endTime":5751.42,"body":"long, long session with the"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":5751.42,"endTime":5753.94,"body":"southern so we're going to skip"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":5751.42,"endTime":5753.94,"body":"the TRAPPIST questions for this"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":5753.94,"endTime":5756.76,"body":"episode, for episode 96 and"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":5753.94,"endTime":5756.76,"body":"we're going to go straight on to"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":5756.76,"endTime":5759.0999999999995,"body":"culture corner. When I trigger"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":5756.76,"endTime":5759.0999999999995,"body":"this drop, it might not mean"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":5759.0999999999995,"endTime":5761.34,"body":"drop, it might not make a sound,"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":5759.0999999999995,"endTime":5761.34,"body":"so just bear with me and I shall"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":5761.34,"endTime":5762.78,"body":"wink at you when we can go on."},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":5768.36,"endTime":5773.88,"body":"I've two. First one"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":5768.36,"endTime":5773.88,"body":"very quick shout out to a guy I"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":5773.88,"endTime":5778.7,"body":"shouted out about last episode."},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":5773.88,"endTime":5778.7,"body":"Ben Felix was on Diary of a CEO"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":5778.7,"endTime":5783.0199999999995,"body":"this time. He's just a great"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":5778.7,"endTime":5783.0199999999995,"body":"communicator, and he's really"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":5783.0199999999995,"endTime":5786.38,"body":"understated. He's not, there's"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":5783.0199999999995,"endTime":5786.38,"body":"no pass as about him. He's"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":5786.38,"endTime":5790.04,"body":"probably the opposite to Rory"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":5786.38,"endTime":5790.04,"body":"Sutherland. But, yeah, it's"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":5790.04,"endTime":5793.04,"body":"really good stuff. But the one"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":5790.04,"endTime":5793.04,"body":"that I did, so I didn't want to"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":5793.04,"endTime":5797.5,"body":"leave that one go, but, but,"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":5793.04,"endTime":5797.5,"body":"Nick, you have to cut to help me"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":5797.5599999999995,"endTime":5799.48,"body":"with his, with his name, Shama"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":5799.479,"endTime":5800.8589999999995,"body":"Chamath probably"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":5799.479,"endTime":5800.8589999999995,"body":"put the kettle"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":5801.4,"endTime":5805.36,"body":"on. That's the guy"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":5801.4,"endTime":5805.36,"body":"he's doing. So he's doing these"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":5805.36,"endTime":5809.38,"body":"series. He's trying to sell some"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":5805.36,"endTime":5809.38,"body":"course or something. So he's"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":5809.44,"endTime":5814.0,"body":"loads of YouTube videos out at"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":5809.44,"endTime":5814.0,"body":"the moment. So he's got a like"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":5814.0,"endTime":5818.64,"body":"his a 13 minute long kind of"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":5814.0,"endTime":5818.64,"body":"intro into this stuff that he's"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":5818.64,"endTime":5824.22,"body":"selling. And I don't agree with"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":5818.64,"endTime":5824.22,"body":"all of it and and, but a lot of"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":5824.22,"endTime":5827.76,"body":"it, I'll give you the main"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":5824.22,"endTime":5827.76,"body":"points in a second, but I went"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":5827.76,"endTime":5832.0199999999995,"body":"on to the his investment lessons"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":5827.76,"endTime":5832.0199999999995,"body":"video after this one, and it's"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":5832.0199999999995,"endTime":5835.0199999999995,"body":"just plain wrong. So I'm not"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":5832.0199999999995,"endTime":5835.0199999999995,"body":"telling you to watch all of his"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":5835.0199999999995,"endTime":5837.92,"body":"videos, but I think there are"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":5835.0199999999995,"endTime":5837.92,"body":"some key lessons in this first"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":5837.92,"endTime":5841.94,"body":"one. He says some stuff, like,"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":5837.92,"endTime":5841.94,"body":"don't ever have debt and"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":5841.94,"endTime":5844.82,"body":"whatever. And I'm thinking, but"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":5841.94,"endTime":5844.82,"body":"if I was never, did never have"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":5844.82,"endTime":5847.28,"body":"debt, and I wouldn't have a"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":5844.82,"endTime":5847.28,"body":"house or a car. So, you know,"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":5847.28,"endTime":5850.82,"body":"it's easy for the billionaire to"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":5847.28,"endTime":5850.82,"body":"say it, but for the younger"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":5850.82,"endTime":5853.04,"body":"people, and I know we've lots of"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":5850.82,"endTime":5853.04,"body":"younger people, right? It's"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":5853.04,"endTime":5858.16,"body":"about, you know, he says, For"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":5853.04,"endTime":5858.16,"body":"the you guys have said this to"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":5858.16,"endTime":5860.38,"body":"me before, you know, for the"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":5858.16,"endTime":5860.38,"body":"younger folks, you need to be on"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":5860.38,"endTime":5863.2,"body":"Broadway, right? So he's going,"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":5860.38,"endTime":5863.2,"body":"you need to go to a big city."},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":5863.2,"endTime":5866.32,"body":"You need to go to where it's at"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":5863.2,"endTime":5866.32,"body":"right, and that's where you'll"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":5866.68,"endTime":5870.4,"body":"you'll then be ambitious for"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":5866.68,"endTime":5870.4,"body":"opportunity, not necessarily for"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":5870.4,"endTime":5875.14,"body":"money. So just get yourself into"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":5870.4,"endTime":5875.14,"body":"those opportunities. And he says"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":5875.14,"endTime":5879.18,"body":"work life balance is just a load"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":5875.14,"endTime":5879.18,"body":"of old crap, and that if you're"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":5879.18,"endTime":5884.04,"body":"in a flow in your life, then"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":5879.18,"endTime":5884.04,"body":"you're just in the flow, and"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":5884.04,"endTime":5886.5,"body":"you're just doing stuff, and"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":5884.04,"endTime":5886.5,"body":"that's how opportunities will"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":5886.5,"endTime":5889.68,"body":"abound. I think that's really,"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":5886.5,"endTime":5889.68,"body":"really important. And then last"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":5889.68,"endTime":5894.84,"body":"point, and sorry for going on a"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":5889.68,"endTime":5894.84,"body":"bit, but the number one trait of"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":5894.9,"endTime":5898.16,"body":"being a success, or of"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":5894.9,"endTime":5898.16,"body":"successful people, is"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":5898.16,"endTime":5901.82,"body":"resilience. I could not agree"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":5898.16,"endTime":5901.82,"body":"more."},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":5902.96,"endTime":5906.92,"body":"I watched it and I"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":5902.96,"endTime":5906.92,"body":"thought it was really good, and"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":5906.92,"endTime":5909.8,"body":"the lesson I took away was just"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":5906.92,"endTime":5909.8,"body":"never stop working. He sorry,"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":5909.8,"endTime":5914.24,"body":"probably put the kettle on. Does"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":5909.8,"endTime":5914.24,"body":"not need to work, all right."},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":5914.24,"endTime":5917.5599999999995,"body":"He's a billionaire. He works"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":5914.24,"endTime":5917.5599999999995,"body":"because he gives him purpose, I"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":5917.5599999999995,"endTime":5921.04,"body":"think, and he says he makes fun"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":5917.5599999999995,"endTime":5921.04,"body":"by always pushing forward, keep"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":5921.04,"endTime":5923.5,"body":"the motor going, stay in the"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":5921.04,"endTime":5923.5,"body":"arena and push forward. He"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":5923.5,"endTime":5925.9,"body":"worked with people who were a"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":5923.5,"endTime":5925.9,"body":"little bit older with him when"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":5925.9,"endTime":5928.54,"body":"he was younger, working and they"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":5925.9,"endTime":5928.54,"body":"stopped working at 50. Says, I"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":5928.54,"endTime":5931.0599999999995,"body":"can't believe it. Why do they do"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":5928.54,"endTime":5931.0599999999995,"body":"that? They still have so much to"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":5931.0599999999995,"endTime":5934.96,"body":"offer. I had a Zoom meeting this"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":5931.0599999999995,"endTime":5934.96,"body":"morning with a client, client"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":5934.96,"endTime":5941.364,"body":"and son. The client is 93 the"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":5934.96,"endTime":5941.364,"body":"son is just turned 30. Okay, so"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":5941.364,"endTime":5944.544,"body":"work that out in your head as"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":5941.364,"endTime":5944.544,"body":"well. The dad is still working."},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":5944.784,"endTime":5947.964,"body":"Doesn't need to do it. He's got"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":5944.784,"endTime":5947.964,"body":"all the energy of a 70 year old"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":5947.964,"endTime":5950.664,"body":"or someone 20 years younger than"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":5947.964,"endTime":5950.664,"body":"me, because he's working and he"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":5950.664,"endTime":5954.084,"body":"just keeps he likes, he likes,"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":5950.664,"endTime":5954.084,"body":"he likes the purpose. He likes"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":5954.084,"endTime":5956.544,"body":"to getting out of bed for a"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":5954.084,"endTime":5956.544,"body":"reason. So I kind of, when I"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":5956.604,"endTime":5958.46,"body":"watched the trauma thing. It"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":5956.604,"endTime":5958.46,"body":"kind of tied him with"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":5958.759,"endTime":5960.799,"body":"that. Yeah, he"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":5958.759,"endTime":5960.799,"body":"even, he used a phrase that"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":5960.799,"endTime":5964.219,"body":"we've mentioned a few times that"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":5960.799,"endTime":5964.219,"body":"these guys who he used to look"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":5964.219,"endTime":5967.879,"body":"up to, and now they're not in"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":5964.219,"endTime":5967.879,"body":"the arena anymore. Yeah, the Man"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":5967.879,"endTime":5969.259,"body":"in the Arena talks about"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":5969.259,"endTime":5972.379,"body":"being the arena a"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":5969.259,"endTime":5972.379,"body":"lot. He gets a lot of true he"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":5972.379,"endTime":5975.799,"body":"gets a lot of criticism. Chamath"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":5972.379,"endTime":5975.799,"body":"does because of his his style."},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":5976.099,"endTime":5978.159,"body":"I've watched these. There's a"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":5976.099,"endTime":5978.159,"body":"few of them now, isn't there?"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":5978.159,"endTime":5981.759,"body":"Isn't there's three or four. I"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":5978.159,"endTime":5981.759,"body":"think of these short 413, 50"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":5981.759,"endTime":5984.579,"body":"minute videos, if it's the same"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":5981.759,"endTime":5984.579,"body":"one, the one I saw, he was"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":5984.579,"endTime":5987.699,"body":"talking about just being so"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":5984.579,"endTime":5987.699,"body":"relentlessly focused on your"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":5987.699,"endTime":5991.119,"body":"goal. And he talks about people"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":5987.699,"endTime":5991.119,"body":"like Jensen Wang and Nvidia and"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":5991.119,"endTime":5994.299,"body":"some other just absolutely"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":5991.119,"endTime":5994.299,"body":"focused. And I gotta say, and I"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":5994.299,"endTime":5996.599,"body":"was watching that, and I was"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":5994.299,"endTime":5996.599,"body":"thinking about, and I think all"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":5996.599,"endTime":5999.659,"body":"of us, to one degree or another,"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":5996.599,"endTime":5999.659,"body":"are versions of this. If you"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":5999.659,"endTime":6003.259,"body":"want to be good at your craft"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":5999.659,"endTime":6003.259,"body":"and at your profession, you've"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":6003.259,"endTime":6005.7789999999995,"body":"got to really understand it."},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":6003.259,"endTime":6005.7789999999995,"body":"You've got to read books about"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":6005.7789999999995,"endTime":6009.139,"body":"it and listen to podcasts and go"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":6005.7789999999995,"endTime":6009.139,"body":"to events and really understand"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":6009.139,"endTime":6012.019,"body":"your industry, find out who the"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":6009.139,"endTime":6012.019,"body":"good people are in the industry,"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":6012.019,"endTime":6014.479,"body":"and copy them and meet them and"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":6012.019,"endTime":6014.479,"body":"and you're either going to,"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":6014.479,"endTime":6016.659,"body":"you're going to be really"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":6014.479,"endTime":6016.659,"body":"successful, or you're going to"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":6016.659,"endTime":6018.999,"body":"be, you're going to be a kind of"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":6016.659,"endTime":6018.999,"body":"journeyman. You can always show"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":6018.999,"endTime":6021.399,"body":"up and be a job. Have a job as a"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":6018.999,"endTime":6021.399,"body":"financial planner, and you do"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":6021.399,"endTime":6024.639,"body":"okay. If you really want to be"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":6021.399,"endTime":6024.639,"body":"good, you've got to immerse"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":6024.639,"endTime":6027.8189999999995,"body":"yourself and be relentlessly"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":6024.639,"endTime":6027.8189999999995,"body":"focused on your craft. I saw him"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":6027.8189999999995,"endTime":6030.099,"body":"to talk about that. Yeah, I'm"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":6027.8189999999995,"endTime":6030.099,"body":"just"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":6030.8189999999995,"endTime":6034.059,"body":"conscious of time."},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":6030.8189999999995,"endTime":6034.059,"body":"I'll do my one very quickly. The"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":6034.179,"endTime":6038.219,"body":"in good company with Nikolai"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":6034.179,"endTime":6038.219,"body":"Tangen, Jamie diamond, just"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":6038.219,"endTime":6040.679,"body":"whatever you think of the guy."},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":6038.219,"endTime":6040.679,"body":"And, you know, corporate"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":6040.679,"endTime":6043.919,"body":"banking, he's, he's very good"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":6040.679,"endTime":6043.919,"body":"value. It's a 38 minute listen."},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":6043.919,"endTime":6046.919,"body":"He's, it's a live show that he"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":6043.919,"endTime":6046.919,"body":"recorded with Nikolai. And just"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":6046.919,"endTime":6049.559,"body":"just, just give it a listen."},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":6046.919,"endTime":6049.559,"body":"He's very direct. Don't agree"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":6049.559,"endTime":6052.439,"body":"with as you, as you with"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":6049.559,"endTime":6052.439,"body":"Chamath. Watch. I don't agree"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":6052.439,"endTime":6054.899,"body":"with everything, but not that"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":6052.439,"endTime":6054.899,"body":"Jamie diamond. Lose your sleep"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":6054.899,"endTime":6057.659,"body":"over that. But in the round, as"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":6054.899,"endTime":6057.659,"body":"a man from that they can be very"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":6057.659,"endTime":6060.8589999999995,"body":"bland. People from that sector."},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":6057.659,"endTime":6060.8589999999995,"body":"He is not a bland listen. So"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":6060.8589999999995,"endTime":6061.519,"body":"listen to that"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":6062.36,"endTime":6064.5199999999995,"body":"one. And do you I"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":6062.36,"endTime":6064.5199999999995,"body":"know him? Well, not Jamie, not"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":6064.5199999999995,"endTime":6064.82,"body":"yet."},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":6065.0,"endTime":6065.5999999999995,"body":"Ultra"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":6065.84,"endTime":6068.3,"body":"Nikolai, yes, I know"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":6065.84,"endTime":6068.3,"body":"you're in a rush. Nick, yeah,"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":6068.72,"endTime":6068.9,"body":"no,"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":6068.9,"endTime":6070.7,"body":"no, we are in a"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":6068.9,"endTime":6070.7,"body":"rush for our listeners. Behest,"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":6071.84,"endTime":6074.9,"body":"okay, just be quiet."},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":6071.84,"endTime":6074.9,"body":"The Jamie diamond interview is"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":6074.9,"endTime":6078.76,"body":"superb. I. I agree with pretty"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":6074.9,"endTime":6078.76,"body":"much everything. Jamie diamond"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":6078.76,"endTime":6089.2,"body":"says, agree you cut me off. You"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":6078.76,"endTime":6089.2,"body":"watch. No, no, it's a strong"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":6089.2,"endTime":6092.74,"body":"recommendation for that Jamie"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":6089.2,"endTime":6092.74,"body":"diamond and Nikolai Tangen"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":6092.74,"endTime":6096.46,"body":"interview. It's, it's very well"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":6092.74,"endTime":6096.46,"body":"put together. He's been trying"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":6096.46,"endTime":6099.5999999999995,"body":"to get Jamie on the show or live"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":6096.46,"endTime":6099.5999999999995,"body":"show for a while. Watch it. It's"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":6099.5999999999995,"endTime":6103.5599999999995,"body":"brilliant. Okay, my culture"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":6099.5999999999995,"endTime":6103.5599999999995,"body":"corner is totally unrelated, but"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":6103.5599999999995,"endTime":6105.9,"body":"it's my show, and I'm the"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":6103.5599999999995,"endTime":6105.9,"body":"biggest shareholder, so I can do"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":6105.9,"endTime":6111.24,"body":"I want. Is called the town"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":6105.9,"endTime":6111.24,"body":"podcast from and it's James"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":6111.24,"endTime":6115.62,"body":"Cameron, the director, who is"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":6111.24,"endTime":6115.62,"body":"the film director, who very"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":6115.62,"endTime":6118.4,"body":"rarely does interviews. It's a"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":6115.62,"endTime":6118.4,"body":"two part interview. He goes into"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":6118.4,"endTime":6122.12,"body":"his whole creative process"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":6118.4,"endTime":6122.12,"body":"working with studios. He's, I"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":6122.12,"endTime":6125.36,"body":"think he's done sort of top"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":6122.12,"endTime":6125.36,"body":"three of the top five grossing"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":6125.36,"endTime":6129.0199999999995,"body":"films of all time. So it's a"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":6125.36,"endTime":6129.0199999999995,"body":"good insight into the brain of"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":6129.08,"endTime":6132.26,"body":"James Cameron. Strong"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":6129.08,"endTime":6132.26,"body":"recommendation. Smithy, close us"},{"speaker":"Andy Hart","startTime":6132.26,"endTime":6132.44,"body":"out."},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":6133.16,"endTime":6140.08,"body":"Close you out with"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":6133.16,"endTime":6140.08,"body":"David senra. David senra, it was"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":6140.08,"endTime":6143.5,"body":"the creator of founders podcast,"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":6140.08,"endTime":6143.5,"body":"which we've probably mentioned"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":6143.5,"endTime":6146.08,"body":"this in the past. I really, I"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":6143.5,"endTime":6146.08,"body":"really liked founders, but he"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":6146.08,"endTime":6149.08,"body":"would just read all these books,"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":6146.08,"endTime":6149.08,"body":"loads and loads of books about"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":6149.38,"endTime":6152.26,"body":"successful people, and then he"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":6149.38,"endTime":6152.26,"body":"would sort of give his view just"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":6152.26,"endTime":6157.0199999999995,"body":"a kind of solo monolog to but a"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":6152.26,"endTime":6157.0199999999995,"body":"very, very high quality. But"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":6157.0199999999995,"endTime":6159.72,"body":"he's now pivot. He's still got"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":6157.0199999999995,"endTime":6159.72,"body":"that founders podcast, but he's"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":6159.72,"endTime":6162.36,"body":"got his own podcast, which is"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":6159.72,"endTime":6162.36,"body":"more of a traditional sort of"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":6162.36,"endTime":6165.78,"body":"interview style on video, video,"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":6162.36,"endTime":6165.78,"body":"and it's just called David senra"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":6165.78,"endTime":6168.9,"body":"podcast, and he's interviewed"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":6165.78,"endTime":6168.9,"body":"already a lot of really"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":6168.9,"endTime":6171.72,"body":"interesting people. The one that"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":6168.9,"endTime":6171.72,"body":"that I listened to the other day"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":6171.9,"endTime":6175.14,"body":"is, you come across this guy,"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":6171.9,"endTime":6175.14,"body":"Jason freed, or Jason Fried,"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":6175.14,"endTime":6179.668,"body":"Jason freed, 37 signals, base"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":6175.14,"endTime":6179.668,"body":"camp and all that. I just think"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":6179.668,"endTime":6185.068,"body":"he's a really smart operator,"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":6179.668,"endTime":6185.068,"body":"because he obviously, he founded"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":6185.068,"endTime":6188.488,"body":"a tech business, and the idea,"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":6185.068,"endTime":6188.488,"body":"if you're in that world, it's"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":6188.488,"endTime":6191.128,"body":"all about scaling and getting to"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":6188.488,"endTime":6191.128,"body":"a billion dollar, multi billion"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":6191.128,"endTime":6194.488,"body":"dollar valuations, becoming a"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":6191.128,"endTime":6194.488,"body":"unicorn. And he's just disputed"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":6194.488,"endTime":6197.38,"body":"all that. He's never taken any"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":6194.488,"endTime":6197.38,"body":"funding from any VCs. He built"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":6197.38,"endTime":6201.22,"body":"it, bootstrapped it, gone, and"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":6197.38,"endTime":6201.22,"body":"just kind of operated in a way"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":6201.22,"endTime":6204.4,"body":"that was the antithesis to the"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":6201.22,"endTime":6204.4,"body":"traditional tech companies. He's"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":6204.4,"endTime":6207.4,"body":"just got a nice way, a nice way"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":6204.4,"endTime":6207.4,"body":"of thinking that you don't have"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":6207.4,"endTime":6211.5999999999995,"body":"to be this multi billion global"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":6207.4,"endTime":6211.5999999999995,"body":"business. It's all about the job"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":6211.84,"endTime":6215.2,"body":"you do, the work you do, what it"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":6211.84,"endTime":6215.2,"body":"gives to you, what it gives to"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":6215.2,"endTime":6217.68,"body":"your customers and your team."},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":6215.2,"endTime":6217.68,"body":"And I think there's some good"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":6217.68,"endTime":6220.08,"body":"lessons in there for anyone"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":6217.68,"endTime":6220.08,"body":"growing a financial planning"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":6220.08,"endTime":6221.7,"body":"business. David senra,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":6221.759,"endTime":6222.059,"body":"okay."},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":6222.119,"endTime":6222.719,"body":"Podcast,"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":6223.0199999999995,"endTime":6224.82,"body":"thank you. Thank"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":6223.0199999999995,"endTime":6224.82,"body":"you. And it's ever links to all"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":6224.82,"endTime":6226.98,"body":"those culture corners are in"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":6224.82,"endTime":6226.98,"body":"these so called channels. Okay,"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":6226.98,"endTime":6230.28,"body":"so there we go, best part of two"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":6226.98,"endTime":6230.28,"body":"hours on this one. Hope you"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":6230.28,"endTime":6233.16,"body":"enjoyed it. TRAPPIST, there we"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":6230.28,"endTime":6233.16,"body":"go. Episode 96 has come to a"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":6233.16,"endTime":6236.66,"body":"close and is being flushed down"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":6233.16,"endTime":6236.66,"body":"the U bend of Father Time. Do"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":6236.66,"endTime":6241.46,"body":"leave a review on your pod app"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":6236.66,"endTime":6241.46,"body":"of choice. Please like and"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":6241.46,"endTime":6243.5,"body":"subscribe to our YouTube"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":6241.46,"endTime":6243.5,"body":"channel. That way you get"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":6243.5,"endTime":6246.2,"body":"notified when another pile of"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":6243.5,"endTime":6246.2,"body":"traps slides out. But in the"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":6246.2,"endTime":6249.5,"body":"meantime, dear TRAPPIST, we're"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":6246.2,"endTime":6249.5,"body":"going to see some of you on May"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":6249.5,"endTime":6252.26,"body":"the 30th of trap live. We really"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":6249.5,"endTime":6252.26,"body":"cannot wait for that. It is sold"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":6252.26,"endTime":6254.96,"body":"out. We spoke with Brian. He has"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":6252.26,"endTime":6254.96,"body":"confirmed that cannot wait to"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":6254.96,"endTime":6258.4,"body":"see you. But until then, until"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":6254.96,"endTime":6258.4,"body":"the next episode of trap. Take"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":6258.4,"endTime":6260.62,"body":"care out there, and we'll see on"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":6258.4,"endTime":6260.62,"body":"the other side, guys, I want to"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":6260.62,"endTime":6262.9,"body":"click the outro. You won't hear"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":6260.62,"endTime":6262.9,"body":"it. I'll tell you when it's"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":6262.9,"endTime":6263.26,"body":"finished."},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":6271.66,"endTime":6274.0599999999995,"body":"We heard it."},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":6271.66,"endTime":6274.0599999999995,"body":"Nicholas, see you at trap. Live"},{"speaker":"Carl Widger","startTime":6274.48,"endTime":6275.92,"body":"a marathon session."},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":6276.12,"endTime":6277.32,"body":"There we go. That"},{"speaker":"Nick Lincoln","startTime":6276.12,"endTime":6277.32,"body":"was micken"},{"speaker":"Alan Smith","startTime":6277.32,"endTime":6277.8,"body":"Sutherland."}]}