S3, E7: Building Resilience and Leadership Strategies with Eleanor Chappell (Former British Kickboxing Champion, Police Officer and now Executive Director, Buddy Up Australia).

Eleanor Chappell is the Executive Director of Buddy Up Australia which is a registered Charity with a nationwide presence delivering physical, social and volunteering events/opportunities across Australia.  Buddy Up Australia supports ex-serving veterans and first responders in the community operating in the preventative and early intervention space of mental health and wellness.  

Eleanor was a former Police Officer in both England and Western Australia. Eleanor also served in the Reserve Army in England and became a British kick boxing champion!  After leaving her role in the Police Force she changed paths and built two companies from scratch. 

After a successful 2021 (despite Covid), Eleanor started to miss her life in the forces and decided to join Buddy Up Australia which became the missing jigsaw piece when she transitioned from Police Officer to civilian. 

Get ready to be inspired…..5-4-3-2-1. 

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Connect with Eleanor Chappell:

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W: buddyupaustralia.org.au

E: eleanor@buddyupaustralia.org.au

E: info@buddyupaustralia.org.au

Connect with Vicki Main - Podcast Host & Co-Author of The Momentum Mindset Book:

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Click here to purchase a copy of The Momentum Mindset Book by Vicki Main and Jonathan S.Bean.

Transcript

I'll put my hands up now and be honest, I'm not 100% okay with being vulnerable. I still sometimes find it uncomfortable to be very vulnerable. But the one thing was holding you back in terms of your creativity. You need to be vulnerable to actually fail and move forward and try new things. Fail at new things. 

Welcome to the Get unstuck Fast Viscosity podcast, brought to you by VLM training and coaching specialists across the UK and Australia, hosted by me, Vicki Main. Are you a business owner, leader or executive? Have you ever felt stuck or disappointed where your life or business is heading? Do you ever feel overwhelmed, compare yourself to others or feel like you're swimming in treacle at times? 

This podcast is here to help you get unstuck fast from viscosity to achieving escape velocity and expanding your knowledge. 

Our guests on the show will share practical tips and real life experience about how they got out of negative situations or circumstances to live their best life on their terms. We will be sharing real life stories from real people doing some incredible things. Stay tuned for our next guest. 

Welcome to season three, episode seven of The Get. Unstuck fast, viscosity. Podcast. I'm your host, Vicki Main, and today we have Eleanor Chappell on the call. Welcome, Eleanor.  Eleanor is the executive director of Buddy Up, Australia. Welcome to the show. Thanks, Vicki. Thanks for having me. I've been really excited. Yeah, me too. And what's the weather like in Perth today? Rubbish. Is it? Yep. No, it can't decide whether it wants to be sunny or rainy, so I tried to duck out earlier and take the dog out for a walk and it threw it down with rain. Oh, really? Hopefully this week it will brighten up. Oh, lovely. Well, I've got a lovely sunny day today where I am, so yeah. In the Isle of White today, so, yes, but I'm sure the tables will turn. It'll be lovely and sunny for you very soon in Perth. Of course. Let's get started. 

So, Eleanor, can you tell our listeners about your career journey and what you're doing now? Yes, well, the majority of my career has been in emergency services in the police force, so I was a police officer in Nottingham in the UK for seven years, and then I transferred to Western Australia Police in 2014 and I spent around three years in Western Australia Police. And then I left to run my own business. So I took all of my transferable skills and I thought, no, I'm going to go out in the big, bad world of entrepreneurship and see what that had in store for me. So I had to learn what life was like out of uniform. I had to learn to network and be around business owners. And I started my own company in the travel industry. It gained traction. Things were going great. COVID hit, my industry was knocked to the floor and I had to decide what I was going to do. Fortunately, I ran a consultancy, so not an agency, so my model worked where I was building big overseas holidays for higher earning professionals and they paid me a service fee, so I didn't take commission, so I didn't have to pay any commission back. So I was very fortunate that I could focus on the solutions and not the problem when COVID hit. And I changed my business model and I started to run experiences in Western Australia for small business owners. And that's when I built my relationships with local tourism operators in Western Australia. And the most popular event I had was the sailing event. So I did a day's sailing over to Garden Island or Carnac Island, and it was a fantastic opportunity for female business owners or male business owners. We did it for both, to have a complete day of self care, disconnect from the craziness of everyday life and put themselves first, enjoy the war. There was no pressure and it was amazing and I had great fun there. So we did lots of events like that. I built a membership from it, so my business survived, and that was a few years. And then in 2022, I had this moment where there was something missing in my life, so I couldn't put a finger on it. I spent days where I felt that there was something else out there for me. I started to miss my life as a police officer. There was no way I was going back. Operational policing, that life was over for me, but I really missed that team bonding. It was a crazy lifestyle, but it was so much fun and I missed being around that. Those connections and bonds you have in the service life, they're totally different to what I've experienced in civilian life. And I was looking for that again, or I was looking to find a way of reconnecting to that side of it. And I had the opportunity of coming onto the board of Buddy Up Australia. There was an opening for a board director and I was very fortunate to get onto the board. And after a few months of being a board director, there was an opportunity to take on, at the time, the managing director's role, which I did in a voluntary capacity for a few weeks, just to help out. And then I was asked to stay on. And that was June last year. We're now in September 2023, and I've been the executive director ever since. Fantastic. What a journey. 

What a career journey. Oh, it is. It's been fantastic. I've definitely got stories to tell and if I sit there and reflect on all the adventures I've had through the police and I actually was in the reserve forces, British Army reserve forces, before I joined police for a short period in the UK. The adventures are amazing, not things I can write in a book, but the memories are hilarious. I know you've also competed professionally. Tell us about your sporting career as well. So I know you're very humble, but tell us about what you actually managed to achieve in your time when you were training and doing lots of sport and activities. Yes, sports always been a really important part of my life to stay mentally and physically strong. It is my go to, to decompress, to debrief, and it became more important the more my policing career advanced as well. In my 20s started martial arts, and when I started martial arts, I was single and I didn't have any kids, so I would do my shift and then I will spend anywhere up to a few hours a night training. And I very quickly got into the competing side of martial arts in England and I loved it. It's not that I like beating people up, don't get me wrong, but it was that intense cardio workout. It was exactly what I needed to get rid of all the rubbish that had happened in the day and I could go home feeling fresh and reset. But I very quickly got into the competing side. I loved it and I did a few competitions in England and before I left to move to Western Australia, I actually won the Southern British Championship kickboxing. So I gained a title, but I was never able to defend my title. But it was the most amazing feeling. I remember being so ridiculously nervous, like, how am I going to do this? Who do I think I am? I'd worked hard to compete in a higher belt level than I was. I remember I was competing against black belts and I wasn't a black belt at the time. I was frightened, but nerves. I remember my coach saying to me, your nerves are going to get you through this. You're going to win this. She was so confident and that pushed me through and it was an incredible feeling. I still look at the picture of me holding my trophy now and think, I did that, I did that. You can do anything you put your mind to. It was amazing. 

Do you find that when you have moments of doubt or if you're going through, like, having some stuff that is difficult to deal with, for example, and you don't need to go into any details, but do you find that, having that anchor of knowing that you did that and how resilient you were to go through that process and competing, do you find that really helps you generally in life with mindset as well and resilience? Yeah, there's two key things that are really put down to, I guess, me building resilience and me pushing through challenging times. And that is, what if I've had a very challenging day? Or even if I'm going through a period where it's pretty difficult applying myself to physical activity and to sport? I love it's a transformational experience for me. It really helps me move through that and it's key to my resilience. And the other thing is having a strong social network. So that is really important for me. And sport on the social network has gone hand in hand for me because when I moved from England to Australia, I knew no one other than my now husband and a couple of people that were going to join the police force at the same time as me. No one. So the way I built my social networks initially was through community sport. 

So the first thing I did when I moved to Australia was find a martial arts school that I could join. And that was the most important thing for me because community sport and the strength of them bonds around it was how I built lifelong friendships as well. Yeah, that's brilliant. I love the story, what you said there. I think it's fantastic. Do you miss the police force? Although I guess your role now is very much involved in the community and ex service people, really, isn't it? Yep. Buddy Up Australia is for current and former serving military and emergency service personnel as well as their immediate families. So, yes, I miss the police force. I wouldn't go back to it operationally, but with Buddy Up, I still feel connected to that community. So I'm very much involved in having that positive impact and being around like minded people. I guess one of the things I found hard when I left the police force was conversations were very different. When I was in a network environment and in a business environment, I found that I had to really try. Hard to have a different style of conversation because it was very different to the humor that we had and the camaraderie and how we would exchange in conversation to get through certain bad days or difficult incidents. Whereas in the small business environment, I'm sure if I had those level of conversations, people would look at me as if to say, who are you with, Buddy Up? I do feel like I'm around a community that I've spent so much of my life professionally and that feels like a safe space. Not that I feel unsafe, but it's a different type of feeling. And yeah, I feel connected. I still feel connected to the job or the best parts of the job. There were some really challenging parts of the job, but Buddy Up has given me a way to still reflect on all of that amazing stuff that I did as a cop and be in that positive environment. I think you've had a fantastic career and there's a lot more that we're going to see if you well know in terms of what you're doing now and growing Buddy Up Australia and what's the plans for the future for Buddy Up or for me. Okay, so, so exciting. So the past year there's been a lot of change in the organization. So it's been supporting that change management, building some effective communications, revising our volunteer program to make sure it works and that people are happy. We've grown our team from I think when I took over Body Up Australia, it was myself and the finance officer that were employed. And now we have a team of twelve employees. So in twelve months we've grown to a team of twelve employees. We're nationwide, we have under 1600 members. So the next year it's really continuing to grow and building our membership base in different areas, raising our brand awareness, collaborating with other organizations in the community. And I'm a big fan of collaboration to enhance what we're doing in the community and not duplicate. Also we're growing our volunteer portfolio in the event leader capacity so we can deliver more events, a more diverse schedule of events as well. So there's some really exciting stuff, lots of tech stuff as well. We've launched a new app, we've got our new website that will be launched very soon, hopefully this month. So a lot of infrastructure to support the scale of the organization in the background and exponential growth. That's the phrase I'm looking for. Yeah. Fantastic. I wish you all the best with that. And I know when you had your business, I actually came on some of your sailing trips and it was such good fun. If Carlsburg could do sailing trips, you did some amazing trips. And also building that entrepreneurial community. I think that's so important, especially we talked about this before, about being in isolation as a sole director or working for yourself. It's very much those trips are really important because it's fostering not only community, but I think that collaborative. You never know who you're going to meet on these trips. Absolutely. And yeah, some of my best memories and my fondest memories from running the business was on the catamaran. There was belly laughs and new friendships. And every time I see some of the ladies that were on there, they still first thing they talk about. I actually saw a few photos pop up the other day. I think it was you with the sea lions on the beach. Yeah, which was sea lion. They made me smile. It was laugh and smiles from start to finish and that's what I wanted from you need that. You'll need that break and they would be great. Some on the island here on the Isle of White. Maybe I fly you over and do some over here as well. That would be fun. And this is recorded and I will always remember you obviously love your role and the strategic element of your role as well in the community. What would you say is the toughest part about what you do now? I find it tough working from home 100% of the time. We have 100% remote working model. I have a national team. The majority of our executive team is in Western Australia, but we have employees and volunteers in every location of Australia other than the Northern Territory. So what I've I've had had to learn to manage a team remotely and to delegate and to let go of control, to trust, because there's a huge amount of trust that goes into remote working and to not panic or worried. So when I first started building a team and I knew I had team members in Tasmania and Queensland, I was worrying that they were okay. Was I giving them enough information? Was I communicating with them enough? Were they communicating with me enough? Did they feel confident enough that they were asking for help? Was something going wrong? You start to realize that the benefits of being in that office environment and you take advantage of the fact that you can walk over to somebody in the next office or sitting on the table next to you and say, hey, how's things? Did you get that? Did you get that email? Have you sorted that? Whereas that doesn't happen when I'm on the other side of Australia and I have team members in Queensland, they're on a different time zone as well. And it's been a real adjustment because if I've ran teams in the past, they've been in Western Australia, I've been in the same location, I've been in the same building as them, and all of a sudden I'm on different time zones and I'm a five hour flight away from some of them. I can imagine that must be hard. And I suppose everyone's been through, dare I say, the PED pandemic, where we've all had to train ourselves to work from home in isolation and any distractions and noise. But now that you're running a charity organization that is essentially building community, if you're feeling like that, your other execs might be feeling like that as well. How do you build that and foster that environment where people feel that in isolation? That's interesting. I can tell you one thing that's really made a huge difference in that, and it is after I read a book called Traction by Gino Wickman. So Traction is a system, an entrepreneur operating system. And I took from that is a meeting structure. So a weekly meeting structure. It's very regimented in how you deliver that, which follows with a quarterly meeting structure and an annual meeting structure. And what I really love about that is the ability to help your team feel confident, to bring issues to the table. So a large proportion of that meeting is allowing the team, giving them that space, that safe space, and giving them permission to say, this isn't working. I think this is an issue, I need help to solve this problem. And that is the purpose of that. And it's made a huge difference. Huge. Yeah, I know. I used to adopt those strategies in my teaching practice, working in teams, and we use Lean methodologies and we'd have stand up huddles and things at the beginning of the week and have these short meetings, but they would really add value and look at where identify where the challenges were. So that was great. So let's talk about mindset. And I know that you've recently read my book with Jonathan, the Momentum Mindset. And just curious. I know the book shares practical tips about overcoming inertia and leading an incredible life. But I'm curious, in your life, have you ever had to overcome your own inertia and be able to move forward? And how did you deal with those setbacks and not giving up and having that resilience? Tell us a bit about your story. Yeah, I think the big transition point for me was leaving the police force. It took me a year to leave the police force. I didn't decide I was leaving and walk out the door. I had a massive issue with vulnerability. I'll put my hands up now and be honest, I'm not 100% okay with being vulnerable. I still sometimes find it uncomfortable to be very vulnerable. But I understood and especially after reading Brene Brown, and I started to understand that I needed to address that because it was holding me back and it was also holding me back in different ways. So I knew that when I was a sergeant in the police force put a lot of pressure on myself to be this superwoman. I could do anything. I could do everything. I was trying to do everything and anything, and I was on the road to burnout, basically. And I didn't want to put my hand up and say, hey, I can't be that person anymore, or in reality, I'm not that person. I'm trying to be the person you keep telling me I am, that you think I'm a superwoman, that I can do anything. I'm trying to live up to that. And it was really hard for me to say, hey, that's not me, there's boundaries, or I've got limitations. And I knew that. I started to look into why I was so adverse to this vulnerability, why I needed to have this superwoman persona. And then I was recommended Brene Brown and then there was loads in that book that stood out for me. But the one thing was holding you back in terms of your creativity, you need to be vulnerable to actually fail and move forward and try new things, fail at new things. And I'm like, okay, I can do that. And through that whole year of deciding that I was going to leave the police force, that was a real huge falling over my own feet, failing and being vulnerable, having those conversations with family, saying, I can't do this anymore, and it being okay. And I wasn't letting people down, I wasn't letting myself down. I was actually saying, thanks very much for the life experience, for everything you've taught me, for the skills that I've gained. And now I'm going to go out and find my own feet and if I fail, I'll get back up and do it again. Yeah, that's fantastic. Thanks for sharing that. Yeah, it takes a lot of courage to be vulnerable and there is strength in vulnerability as well, for sure. Absolutely. Let's talk about leadership and teams. What would you say has been the biggest challenge of leading a team and what do you think are the common mistakes leaders make while leading teams in the workplace? So I know looking at my own experience with leading teams and when I look at what I was like when I was running my own business and I didn't have a team and you just did everything, you did every role in the organization, I didn't run my own business and delegate straight away and outsource things. I did everything. I went on marketing courses, I learned digital marketing, I did PR, I learnt cybersecurity. I thought, I don't need anyone, I can have every skill and do it myself. Well, I quickly figured out that I was not going to get very far doing that. And even though I understood that when I started to lead teams, and even when I was leading building the team, with Budy up, I had to delegate. I had to let go of control. Because if I didn't, the organization would never run without me. And I had to set myself a goal. And it is one of my goals now at board director level, is to look at succession planning. And because I don't want to work 365 days of the year, I want time off. I've got two little boys that are nearly four and five years old. I still want to be mom, but I want to walk away and have time away from the organization and still know that it's not going to fall over without me, that everybody else in the organization can still carry out their roles and nothing's going to fall over. So delegation and working as a team, effective communication, letting go of control were really strong key themes and I encourage if I talk to anybody that is leading teams or they've asked me what my experience is, look at your succession planning, if you needed to take time off from work, will your organization fall over? And if the answer is yes, then address that so that you can scale with confidence, but take some time off and still feel like you can do that without panicking. Yeah, I love that. Thank you for sharing that. I'm doing some research into conflict in the workplace, and I know well all of your roles, particularly in the police force, you would have dealt with a lot of conflict situations. But I'm curious how you handle conflict situations workplace. And I'm not suggesting you have them right now, but you have Australia. But how would you deal with those and what would you say tend to trigger because everybody has these hot buttons which can either lead them to have constructive behaviors or deconstructive behaviors that won't help the situation. And I'm curious, so how do you handle conflict and what would your triggers be, your hot buttons and any advice for listeners how to deal with conflict? Well, I can tell you my way of dealing with conflict as a police officer was very different dealing with conflict in managing teams. I had a set of handcuffs, I had a Taser, I had lots of varying levels of use of force, but they were no longer available to me and I had to be very good at communicating. I left the police force, but there's one great thing about having that emergency service career, is that conflict resolution was a big part of your training. And I would say in England, especially when I was trained as a police officer, I never had a Taser or I never had a gun. And I know that six out of seven days of the week we would be potentially fighting physical. I worked in one of the biggest council housing estates in the area and there was tension every day. And what we learned was to talk our way out of those scenarios because sometimes I will go to jobs. And I knew it didn't matter what use of force I had. The person I was faced with could have been twice the size of me and physically stronger than me. And you just had to get really good at bringing people down with conversation and your tone and how you initially opened up conversation with them, your body language, and we got really good at that in terms of translating that into teams, communication is still number one. And throughout when I've left the police force since 2017 till now, I have had to deal with different scenarios throughout these six years where there's been conflict situations. And it is about that communication. I've had it where it's been face to face and we've had to deal with remote situations as well. And I've always been a strong believer in bringing the people together, whether it is face to face or online, and helping each of them understand what is the situation, how did it make you feel and why did it make you feel like that? Because people have different personalities, different behaviors, different triggers. Like you say, their personal experiences and background may lead them to being triggered by certain words or events. And we may not necessarily know that. We may not be exposed to that. We may not have an in depth understanding of that. So when there is a conflict, we need to make sure that everybody in that situation understands how they've made somebody feel, what those triggers were to make somebody feel and have a mutual respect with that. It doesn't mean that people are going to come out being best of friends, but they respect and they truly understand why the situation got to that level. Yeah. And I guess in terms of me being in my triggers, because I'm really passionate about communication. I have had in the past six years where there has been conflict situations, but people didn't want to have those conversations. It was it I've said what I've said, I'm walking away. I want nothing else to do with the situation. And you used to get really frustrated by that. I couldn't understand why people didn't want to have the conversation. But now I've go, okay, you're not ready to have that conversation. Whatever's going on in your life or whatever's triggering you to react in that way, okay. Understand that you need to deal with that and that's okay. Yeah. That awareness piece and being able to give people space and know that your journey is very different is so important because not everyone, when you were describing there someone who would avoid conflict at all costs, that was my former self. I would do that because I was the peacekeeper. I wanted to keep the peace, and everything was nice. And being the oldest child of four children, I was always trying to keep the peace and everything and then had this epiphany where I went, no, you got to address conflict. And regardless of the situation, you can't hide under a rock and go, this isn't happening. You have to address it. And communication, you hit the nail on the head there. But I'm still learning, hence the research. Yeah, absolutely. And it's still a learning journey for me. All the yeah, yeah. Fantastic. So what's the bravest or scariest thing you've ever done? I would definitely say moving to Western Australia. And I say this because I got to a point in England when I was a police officer and I had enough of the job. It was a tough job and I had enough. And it was either I would have either left the job and found something else, but I'd worked really hard and I like, change. I'm not adverse to change. I'm curious. I'm a very curious person. So I remember coming home and saying, hey, I said to Gav, we weren't married at the time. Should we move to Australia? Because I know that police officers in England can transfer to Australia. So I'd never stepped foot in Australia in my life before. So all I did was Google every single police force in every single state and territory and have a look which one was recruiting and who would sponsor me to get there. And it was Western Australia. So I applied. Within nine months, I'd got offered a job. And I remember my mum said she didn't think I'd get the job, not that I couldn't get it, but she didn't think I would leave my entire life and move to Australia. I was like, Mom, I've got the job. I'll be gone in three months. And I literally sold everything. We rented the house. Out, got on a plane and flew to Australia. And I'd never stepped foot in the country before. And I tell you this now, I was convinced that I would never need a jacket or a jumper in my life again because people told me that it's sunny the whole time. So I didn't pack one jumper or jacket. And I landed in Perth in the middle of July 2014, and it rained for two weeks solid. And the first thing I bought was a dressing gown and a pair of slippers. And I spent about an hour in my new rental looking for radiators. I couldn't understand how to warm, but yet, leaving my entire family, all of my friends, to move to a country that I'd never stepped foot in before, to start a new life, a new job, not knowing if I'd like it and what the future holds for me was exciting, but terrifying in the same breath. Yeah, that's fantastic. I've got a similar story myself. I'd never been to West Australia prior to moving there. I can totally resonate with what you're saying there, although I moved in October when there was actually a heat wave at the time and, yeah, a bit opposite to you. But then, having said that, by the time July came, I was like, Why is it so cold? I know, because you acclimatize, don't you? That's the thing. But wonderful. Well, final remarks. Have you got any final tips for anybody who's feeling a bit stuck and who is maybe looking for some inspiration to get out of a negative situation that they're in? Is there anything you would give your final remarks and say any advice you would give? Yes. On page 28 of your book, I must have read this paragraph, like, 20 times because it resonated with me so much. So I'm going to read it out because every time I feel a little low or having a difficult time, I'd always come back to this page. And it is. It takes real courage and bravery to live your best life. You have to be motivated enough and want it enough to make the necessary changes to achieve it. There will be a grieving process as you leave behind what you once had, even if you never wanted it. You may find yourself wanting your old life back because it's all you've known. Changing your life is tough, so you've got to ask yourself, why would you bother in the first place? If you're struggling to answer that question yourself, use our suggestion, because an incredible life is the greatest gift you can give yourself. I love that. It's my favorite part of your book. Yeah. Courage to hear that this morning. Thank you. There's some real gold nuggets in there and it's absolutely true. And I'll tell you what's been interesting for me, given that I wrote this book. If I'm having bad days, we all have them. I have to give myself my own advice. So I go back to the book and go, Hang on, I'll bookmark this page in the future because I love it and it's true. And I think you're absolutely right. The book was written because an incredible life is the greatest gift you can give yourself. And there are so many people out there for me who just it's not even about fulfilling their own potential, about genuinely being happy. And if you're unhappy because it's about being happy and being and we control that. At the end of the day, we definitely can drive that. We're in the driver's seat and, yeah, it's okay to have a bad day. I've got two crazy toddlers that drive me wild sometimes and work is piling up okay to feel overwhelmed and have that bad day. But you choose what steps you take to change that course. You choose that. And that's what I have to remind myself. My kids used to do this thing where they'd play camps and they'd jump from one sofa to the other. Do yours do that? Oh, yeah. We had that at the weekend. And I play Spiderman. So, gosh, those memories and mine have grown up now. It's scary how quick they grow and yeah, I know, it's about embracing that time when they're young as well, because you never get it back. And it's crazy. Isn't is playing camps and Spider Man and whatever else you get up to. It's so funny. If it's Spider Man one day, Power Rangers the next. I think we're to ninja turtles. Yeah. We've gone through all the Marvel characters, so it's an interesting time with the two boys. Good. It's been lovely, eLNO, speaking to you again, and you're an incredibly inspiring lady, and I wish you all the best with everything that you're doing with Buddy Up Australia and exponential growth. And if there's anything I can do to help outside of this call, let me know. And also, where can people find you on LinkedIn? You're on LinkedIn. Yes, I'm on LinkedIn. Under Eleanor Chapel. You can find me on LinkedIn. And when the new website is live for Budy Up Australia, you can find me on the new website there. So in a few weeks, check out the brand new website. Really exciting, but, yeah, professional wise, you can find me on LinkedIn. And I'm across all the social media platforms cheering on Buddy Up Australia as well. Amazing. Thank you. Thank you so much for your time today. Thanks for having me, Vicki. It's been really nice chatting to you. Thank you.