Why We Should Eat More Plants with Lauren Plunkett

In this episode we talk to  registered dietitian and certified diabetes care and education specialist, Lauren Plunkett about the benefits of plant based nutrition for people with diabetes. Lauren  has been called a plant-based powerhouse, fiercely honest and a Renegade girl with an authentic voice. Her friends call her a bad-ass.

Lauren works as a registered dietitian and certified diabetes care and education specialist. Her professional experience includes pediatric endocrinology, performance nutrition, virtual primary care, and plant-based nutrition for chronic disease and preventive health. She is a public speaker, indoor cycling instructor, and author of the award-winning book, Type One Determination. Lauren has lived with type 1 diabetes for nearly three decades. She credits physical activity and her vegan lifestyle of over 13 years for thriving health.
www.laurenplunkett.com 

Check out the digital resources that can be downloaded and paired with Type One Determination 

email: lauren@lpnutritionconsulting.com
Instagram and Facebook @laurenplunketthealth
Linkedin: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lpnc-rdn-cdces/

Transcript

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0:47

welcome to embracing diabetes, a podcast that explores the many different ways. People are thriving with diabetes in the world from making music and art. To helping us better understand and manage our emotions. I'm Amy Stockwell and I'm here with Dr. Liz Stevens. And today we're speaking with award-winning author and registered dietician, Lauren Plunkett. Lauren been called a plant-based powerhouse, fiercely honest and a Renegade girl with an authentic voice. Her friends, call her a bad-ass. We're so glad to have Lauren on to talk to us today.

Amy 1:25

Lauren, welcome. We're so excited to have you. And um, the first thing that we like to start off with is ask everybody to tell your diagnosis story because we all have a diagnosis story and they're all stuck in our memories. For ever and ever. So tell us about yours.

Lauren 1:44

Okay, well, I don't think mine is too outrageous in comparison to, to so many of us. I was 11. Um, I often describe that as just before the hormonal apocalypse begins is that's the prime time that so many of us get diagnosed. And although like the average age is, is going up quite a bit, um, still so many of us get diagnosed in that time period. And yeah, I was, um, I heard your story, Amy, that really like, resonated with me because I think I was like sucking water out of the bathroom faucet too. And I remember sixth grade and we were approaching Halloween and um, Yeah, I just, cotton mouth.

Amy 2:19

It's funny too that it's always October cause

Liz 2:22

Yeah, I think mine was too, really,

Lauren 2:23

I dunno the diagnosis date, I don't know it. And I have like the paperwork to fill out to really find out, but whatever, October, the well it's, you know, it's a shift in seasons, you know, it's a, whether it's environmental, but because it's autoimmune but, um, yeah, 11, um, cotton mouth. What I remember was getting up during the night so many times to go to the bathroom and then drink outta the sink. And that was really the, this curse that was kind of developing, in my sickness and my. Had said to me later, once I wrote my book, um, I didn't, I didn't realize exactly what my parents' perception was other than it being like positive. I mean, they just were, we're gonna get home, we're gonna do this, we're gonna dive right in. We're gonna learn what we have to, and we're gonna keep you going just as we had planned, as as parents, we're gonna raise you all the same. But my dad pointed out this sunken eyes, um, he was watching the life leave me. Yeah. So I could kind of switch the language around to make this even more positive. To say I was diagnosed at 11, but really I was given a new life at 11 That's when the new life began. Uh, you're diagnosed and you learn how to give yourself an injection. With a needle. It was 1993 for me. Yeah. And, um, and so it begins Wow. The adventure of life.

Amy 3:39

Did anyone else in your family have a history?

Lauren 3:42

No. History, nothing. Not even tight. You have siblings? I do. I have two older brothers. Uh, yeah, it's, um, there's, there's very, there's some health history to be, you know, of concern in my family, but diabetes is not one of them.

Liz 3:55

I just did a grand rounds on type one diabetes, this, so I had to do all this research. So it's like 93% of people don't have a family history of type one diabetes.

Amy 4:03

Why did they even tell us that? Because that's like the one thing that people always know. They'll say, oh, you just, you must have someone in the family, I rarely hear of somebody who has a parent, also a parent and a child with type one. You know, I think I, that was my perception until I started

Lauren 4:21

working in an endocrinology clinic at Children's Hospital. And then it just seemed like it was so frequent that we would have siblings come in, or, uh, there was one instance where I believe mom was diagnosed in her forties and the child was diagnosed six months later. Yeah. So the genetic component of course, is more obvious when you're in an endocrinology clinic and it's just like, wow, these, you know, all these families are, are getting type one. I have a friend who has twins that both have type one, they were diagnosed at very different times. So it's, um, it speaks to what, what our bodies are constantly adapting to what our environment is. Very imperfect, Um, and it's out of our hands. What happens to us? With an autoimmune condition, and it's hor, you know, hormonal, the endocrinology system. It's, it's something where we now have the opportunity and the requirement to learn as much about our bodies as possible. Yeah. And that's what I find is the beauty of type one is we have the opportunity to learn an incredible amount with our body, but we first have to accept it, have to embrace diabetes. Yeah. And how to roll with it. Time for some people. It took me, it took me a long time. Yeah. And it wasn't like I was, you know, from my diagnosis story, um, being sick, getting diagnosed, being admitted in the hospital. I had a little bit of a traumatic experience in the hospital also. And then, um, I was already feeling like a number. I was already feeling like ju being judged. Mm-hmm. Um, I already knew that my blood was somehow being judged, my existence was going to be determined by these numbers. And, um, I don't know if I already knew how rebellious I am at that age, but, uh, the rebellion wasn't in, I'm not gonna take my insulin. I never did that. I don't, I the feeling of being high, I, I had identified that real quick. Right. It's awful. And it's hard to describe something, you know. Oh, by the way, I feel like such girl power in here with you too. Het like women over 30, like Yeah. Like, we exist. We grow up and we're healthy. Yeah. You know? For sure. Yeah. There's such a gap in community with women that have diabetes that, you know, as we age it. Yeah. There's like this, this your pediatric, and then this doom and gloom starts to come in. I've really been feeling that, I know I'm switching the subject here, but I've really been feeling that with, um, national Diabetes Awareness Month. There's all sorts of stories that come out, but I feel like there's been a huge push for medication and this huge, um, push for like, remember the complications rem like. Okay. That is the last thing. Any of us.

Amy 6:53

I don't, I don't feel like it's, you didn't get about that. I feel like it's always been about the complications. Oh, always. Yeah. It's certain. Had a nice grace period somewhere. Know. Yeah. It never went away. Yeah, it certainly

Lauren 7:06

has been there. I um, that stuff is such a, it, it, to me, it just feels like that healthcare practitioners and those that are like the, these big dogs and diabetes are so out of touch with who we are. Come on, we've been hearing this all the time. Don't lead with fear. Right. Lead, lead with encouragement, lead with positivity. Get, get on the ground with this, you know, and, and know who we are and see what inspires us. Cuz it's certainly not, not that, you know, talking more about lifestyle. How do we live our lives to the fullest cuz it is there and we're like so close to, to leading these conversations more often. That's what helped me change. So, growing up from, you know, my diagnosis story, and I talk about this in the book where there were so many things that. I didn't understand what was happening to my body. I had so much anger. Um, my mental health was totally not okay. But there wasn't, therapy wasn't exactly a big conversation at that time in the nineties, really not until recently, I think, putting so much emphasis and importance on, on helping people through these depressions and burnouts and all of that going on, that that's never gonna really stop because taking care of yourself is a marathon. You're not going to get to stop doing that. Right. And I had to change my mindset. There's a point at which I was like, Lauren, you're either gonna get healthier or you're not. Make a decision and learn. You need to learn some things. And, you know, frustrating it is when you're being told to do something, the same thing over and over and over again. You get that same conversation about carb counting, yada yada. You know, you go in, you get an insulin adjusted and then see ya in three months or six months, or whatever they say. and you go back home and you feel like I'm doing everything I'm supposed to do. Why is my A1C still high? Yeah. And you just, you get so down on yourself, so bummed. And that's what I was sick and tired of. Mm-hmm. I'm not living my life like this. This is not gonna happen. I can't go on this way. I don't want the brain fog. Um, this, this can't be it, you know, I have to have more than this for myself. And that was really the, the turning point. Um, and it was years ago now cuz so, so much has happened since then,

Amy 9:14

How old were you then? And what do you think, was there like a moment, an epiphany or was that something that you kind of came to gradually epiphany is a good word for it. I, I

Lauren 9:23

call it awakening, you know, rude awakening. Several of them. I, I was kind of trying to run away from myself, but, you know, run away from the diabetes and create this new life. But really, diabetes is a partnership with the person that we are. Mm-hmm. it is a partnership. It's not a, it's not, you know, and it was language I needed to change. I don't view diabetes as I'm fighting it, or it's a struggle, or I really try to avoid, the word sucks. I don't like that. Right. Like, it's not, that doesn't help me. And what would help me is trying to understand when my blood sugar goes high, what's going on? Is there something internal here? Cause I'm going through the motions. And when I started diving more into nutrition, it was like awakening after awakening after awakening. And then I, I come across research that I didn't even know existed. And I was kind of right when I was starting. My life over and decided to go back to school to become a dietician. I thought I need to get on the other side of the exam table. I need to learn as much as I possibly can and get into the, the dietician saddle in a sense to, to really do this. You know, my, the line I've used, I know this isn't terribly fair, but I became a dietician because I never met one I liked. Yeah, yeah. And that is, that, that in itself is, you know, I thought, I'm a study of one. My own horrible experience was my own fault. But in the last five years or so when things kind of took off for me and I started, um, traveling and speaking at JDRF events on exercise in particular, that then led into nutrition conversations, um, what really was touching were the stories I was collecting from other people, type one or parents. And then I'd go home and it would take me weeks to kind of like shed the emotion. Yeah. From what I had absorbed. And I'm realizing I am not a study of one. My horrible experience is it's not. It wasn't. Okay. And all these other things that are happening to people all over the country are not Okay, what is happening Right. How did we get here? Right. And there's all sorts of reasons as to how we probably got here with a shortage of time or, or people that are, you know, jaded and it's like the empathy energy just doesn't stay there when practitioners are so busy. But there's a huge issue with training. Mm-hmm. and understanding what people's diabetes need.

Amy 11:28

And you and Liz are both straddling those worlds because Liz is an endocrinologist so too sees both sides and don't you think, Liz, that it goes all the way back to the like training, like when you're in med school and you're being taught.

Liz 11:43

Um, well, I think that, um, I mean, I definitely think that there are opportunities for us to do better, a better job with that. Um, I do think the education part, I think there's just the, the experience of being living with chronic disease is so unique, especially with diabetes. I mean, there's really nothing like it. Um, that I can think of in terms of chronic illness. Um, you know, like rheumatoid arthritis. I mean, there's, there's so many chronic diseases that are out there that just don't affect you in so many ways. So I do think that, I think it's a hard thing to always, um, be able to expect someone to be able to understand or know. And I also would say that, In our healthcare environment right now, it is just such a mess in terms of, you know, just time constraints and reimbursements and the amount of just like slog that we have to get through. It's just really hard, I think, sometimes to be able to generate as much, you know, just as much empathy as you'd like to have. Cuz no one goes into medicine cuz they don't like people, you know, I mean, everyone goes into medicine, they wanna help, but it's just, you know, it's, it's, it's really, it's a very difficult, I think, especially post covid, it's just been really, really hard.

Lauren 12:45

Yeah, I'm glad you mentioned that because I felt that myself with having. Um, absorbed too many stories in the same day from, from people, particularly with type two. Cause that's who I've been working with primarily the last several years, but I was also working in digital healthcare in the primary healthcare system. So it was quite unique to be learning about primary care and what that is like for like, for people with diabetes. And then to be hearing these stories of people with type two who have had diabetes for maybe 15, 20 years and they've never met with a dietician or a diabetes educator. Right. And they've never been given the opportunity to enact practices in lifestyle medicine, right? They've never been introduced to it. And you know how this, with medications, it's, um, add more or take a different one. Right. So we, the fun part was, I'm going to talk to you about how to reverse the resistance. Do you know what insulin resistance is? And it was always, So we're gonna go there and I'm gonna try to get you really excited about living your life again. They had lost hope for themselves and that's where I started feeling closer to type two as a person with type one, being able to get in their shoes. And then if we could enhance the conversation into sensors, then I could kind of begin to talk about this selfsufficiency and empowerment that can happen from this. And then I would see amazing things happen from their original outlook. To just a couple of conversations of them realizing that they could take more of this into their hands. I can't believe how many missed opportunities we might have, but I was getting really exhausted from that. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And I, I didn't want to, cause it was heavy, right? It's heavy stuff and I knew I had to really slow down. And how many people I talk protect my. Yeah. Yeah. Cause often you really have to get into like, you know, money and, what can you afford to, like, it's just heartbreaking oftentimes.

Amy 14:34

So I, I wanna hear more about becoming, when training to become, um, a dietician and you are a language person, and you and I have talked about language before, but mm-hmm. I hate the word dietician, like Shouldn't it be nutritionist? You know, Oh, yeah.

Lauren 14:53

Real quick. The, the interesting thing is registered dietician. So RD is, is a, is a protected title, registered, it's a licensed title, but a few years ago they, they added nutritionist to the end of that. So technically rdn, registered dietitian, nutritionist to try to own that word as well, because we are at the highest level of training and rigorous, all of that with schooling in the internship and the clinical and all those things, and licensed. But anyone can call themselves a nutritionist, technically. Nutritionist is a more positive tone to it than dietician. But my whole thing is dieticians should be teaching people how to eat, not how to diet. And diet doesn't have to be a bad word, but it should. Label people with fads or, um, yeah. So come see a registered dietician and we'll probably, you know, help you work through the fact that. Weight is so much deeper than just numbers. Totally. Oh my gosh. There's so much trauma underneath.

Liz 15:52

Yeah. And that's a really hard thing to sell for people. You know, often that dietician thing, people don't wanna talk about food. I think your initial comment about shame and type one or type two food is just such a trigger for so many people. Yeah. That it's, yeah. I spend a lot of time talking about food is medicine, like food is medicine. Like you gotta, it's, you gotta respect it. I don't wanna give you more medicine.

Lauren 16:13

Uh, well, plant-based nutrition saved my. That is the honest answer is that, uh, I needed to learn how to eat. So I was in my early twenties when some of the awakening started to happen, but over time is when this started to, started to develop. And it took another 10 years really to, uh, renew my spirits, become a dietician, become a diabetes educator, and be able to move on from there. And, and, and there was so much research that I got into in that process that I came across some studies about, fiber, and this, this is, I'm giving you the abbreviated version of this, but, uh, I, you, you heard some things about fiber and at the time it was like subtracted. Do you think any of us are gonna bother with that? Like, seriously, what a hassle. Looking for every gram here and there to subtract something. And, and also that also inspired a disordered relationship with food. Because we're looking for everywhere that we can find fiber to subtract it to take less insulin. So now insulin looks like the bad guy when it is so important to have insulin on board and carbohydrates, then become the bad guy, which is another horrible influence because carbohydrates are not equal. Cakes and cookies and candies are not the same as beans and broccoli and wild rice and apples. Um, and oatmeal. And blueberries. I mean, there's nutrient richness here. And I realized that's what I was. was nutrients, period. So I had to get over this carbohydrate hatred language. And so in, so in these days, what I call it is, is reframe self blame, reframe language around carbohydrates. Mm-hmm. just like reframing clinical language, words like, uh, non-compliance, awful, awful labeling terms like this. Um, you know, I'll say in front of, in front of audiences, uh, please don't call me diabetic. You can call me Lauren and you can say that I have diabetes. But I can assure you, um, a lot of things besides diabetic Yeah, I like that. Choose your verb After you hear me speak, you might call me all sorts of things, but, um, don't call me diabetic. Yeah. So plant-based nutrition really did save my life because I didn't know the difference between what would happen to my body if I ate, uh, bean chili and a. Then I ate, uh, sugary cereal in the morning. I didn't really know how there was a difference there. And the difference was in, well, this is fiber rich. There are more nutrients here going on. Versus it being, well, this is 30 grams of cereal, sugary cereal in carbohydrate. This is 30 grams of bean chili. And it was a, it was a shock as to how this was helping me. And this is, this research is really big in, in type two diabetes looking at how can we lower A1C through nutrition. And I thought, well, if insulin, insulin resistance is the topic of type two, but I've only ever been encouraged to take more insulin. If my blood sugar is high, why haven't I been told to look at the quality of my carbohydrates? So that's what I started to analyze. I, it was like I got just a taste of feeling like I was a study of one and then I had figured out diabetes. Oh. And I didn't know the research existed. And then I met my mentor and she's like, I know what's happening to you. And she gave me like a stack of research and, and then it went from there. But you know, what that inspired is as I'm, as I'm discovering this method of eating that is just, it, it's common sense. But I needed to understand the science of this. Why is this helping me and where can I go from here? Because I was also having more energy, more mental clarity. I was no longer at risk for Hashimotos, which was, I was getting pretty close on that. And my LDL was going up. Everything changed. I talked a couple dieticians. They didn't know what was going on. My endocrinologist was like, just keep doing what you're doing. I'm not getting my way, but we're going to bring your insulin down cuz this is serious. I was having so many lows. And then I had the urge to exercise. I had energy. So it was this perfect storm of, of positive. Awakening that I had to this. And then because of all of this good stuff that was happening, what it really inspired was soul crushing anger. Yeah. As to why, yeah. This is not being talked about, or at least in an introduction. Um, why aren't dieticians just all over this? But I had just gotten done at the University of Minnesota and I know what I was being taught in those classes. And I know that I was also told that I would barely graduate. I was told I would never get an internship. Wait, why? Cause I'm rebellious. Cause I was, I mean, you know, I was, I was like, doesn't work that way. I went to to, there's a very competitive program here that had a stipend and I was like, oh, I'm just gonna go. I'm never gonna get in, but I'm gonna go and I'm gonna see what the competition was like. And I described this in my book as it was like the Hunger Games of Diet dietetic internships because of who I was around. And everybody's looking and sizing, sizing each other up. And I'm just laughing to myself like, I can say anything I want in here because I'm not getting in and I thought maybe I can talk my way in. I'll write a really awesome letter and, and see about it. And I'm sure that just went to the paper shredder, like whatever. Look at her gpa cuz that's all they were looking at was, was gpa. Like isn't that an interesting thing That has followed me through life. It's like being judged by my blood sugars and now I'm being judged by my GPA And you know, what this is gonna do is it's only gonna it fire me up even more to fight as hard as I can to get to whatever stage I have to, to start talking about language. Plant-based nutrition. Um, and, and whatever else comes across the table that we've, we've gotta start bringing to the forefront, asking educators to change, asking doctors to please start hearing this. And I knew I was starting to tap into some pretty scary territory. Cause I'm, I'm asking for change. However, I'm an evidence-based practitioner, right. I have got research to show you I am my own example. And I've, I've worked with other people to see what they do with this. But there are other educators doing this too, in, in the world of, um, in diabetes with plant-based nutrition. But, but what's so amazing is that there's research on digestive health and brain health, which is an incredibly important topic in diabetes as preserving our cognition. Um, anything endocrinology related, you know, if we're talking about P C O S and with immunity and protecting our body, making it strong and becoming a more efficient machine. And in sports nutrition, which is where I really got turned on to, um, plant-based nutrition was through sports. Is that if they look at at fiber in any of those chronic conditions, we have positive outcomes. It helps. So that's why I started to realize that whatever affects diabetes, diabetes is part of the whole system and the whole system affects diabetes. So we have to treat and eat to protect everything. This is not just about blood sugar anymore. This is not just a OneNote. So I'm going through, you know, you can imagine like your medical nutrition therapy classes at the university and they start talking about diabetes and you're just like, oh my God, you're just sticking down in your chair and you're like telling myself, just shut your mouth. Don't say anything. And I also was older, so I had a chip on my shoulder about all kinds of things. you know, going back to school, my later. And, um, not really knowing, like, what am I gonna do with myself here? I need to just try to get an internship. I gotta follow the rules, at least to the point where I get in Um, so anyway, plant-based nutrition has been amazing and it's been super, um, touching to watch what people do with it. My mentor is super inspiring and through the Association of Diabetes Educators, there are so many of them that wanna know more, right. And they've given me a stage to, to speak on, and it's been, really such an honor. You know, I start a lot of my presentations by like, I'm, I'm still a kid with type one who's scared of all of you, So thanks for having me.

Amy 24:04

But you know, what I think is really interesting, um, about what, what you're telling us is, is the anger piece. Because I, I think that like, I don't know if I ever. Let myself experience anger. Well, when I was hearing you say that, yeah. Wow. And anger can, anger is, is can be such a motivating force. I mean, I can see that with you that it, it makes you, instead of just being sad and feeling depressed, being angry feels more empowering. And I'm wondering, I mean, I feel there must be a lot of people out. Who had this, this anger, but, but direct it inward, you know, because

Lauren 24:46

And hold it. Yeah. Which is even harder to suppress emotions like this. But I wrote a paper about why am I so angry was the question mark and some research that I came across that was super interesting. Not specific to diabetes, but it was looking at emotion and what, um, showing frightening images does to people. What does this inspire and fear was so closely associated with anger. Sadness was not associated with anger, but fear is, and what I find to be very interesting in diabetes, and particularly in type one, is that if we kind of flip the script here and look at what are we really afraid of, and it's being out of control. Mm-hmm. feeling out of control or being told we're out of control. And that can inspire anger. But if you, if you look at it, From this perspective, like, why am I angry? What is this thing that's making me angry? What is in my power to change? And we have, we have so much power over our, our thoughts and our, but they can absolutely run away from us, particularly if we have high blood sugars, we have brain fog and we're just, you know, upset. Now looking back, I understand my anger, but I had to become an indoor cycling instructor to deal with a lot of my anger, which I have been for 10 years. And that is how I deal now with seeing, um, certain studies come out that I know are not going to help people. They're going to be studies that make things very, very difficult. And they're funded by somebody who, or a company or an industry that's trying to influence something. Um, I, I see this all over the place with this, um, push of medications on people with diabetes instead of, let's talk about the lifestyle factors because no matter how much medication you take, lifestyle issues, Choices are always going to be there. And that's the golden ticket.

26:31

Uh, conversation with Lauren ended up. Running way over time. So we are stopping here and calling this part one and we will run. Part two, the rest of our conversation. Next week. So thank you for listening to this episode of embracing diabetes. With your podcast hosts, Liz Stephens and Amy Stockwell. We hope you enjoyed our conversation and maybe felt inspired or informed. Or less alone or all of the above. Please subscribe to embracing diabetes on all major podcast platforms. And leave a comment question or review. Thanks again we hope you'll come back for more