How to Get What You Want
Your career isn’t built by waiting for someone to notice your value. It’s built by learning how to advocate for yourself with confidence.
You’ve been told your work will speak for itself. Yet despite doing everything asked of you—and more—you’re still feeling overlooked and uncertain about your next step. Leadership isn’t just about managing a team; it’s navigating the complexities of internal relationships and consistently advocating for your growth.
On Get What You Want, Susie Tomenchok is your silent partner, empowering you with the mindset and tools to negotiate your career—and life—with intention.
Unlike podcasts that focus on climbing the ladder or hustle culture, this show is for women who want to own their careers authentically. You’ll learn practical strategies for everyday negotiations, from asking for what you deserve to confidently handling tough conversations. Because negotiation isn’t just for raises or promotions—it’s how you navigate every opportunity in your career and beyond.
Susie is a negotiation expert who understands the challenges of being in a male-dominated industry and the struggles women face when advocating for themselves. She’s helped countless professionals unlock their potential and will show you how to do the same.
If you’re ready to stop waiting for your career to happen to you and start creating the opportunities you want, hit follow and join Susie each week to build your confidence, advocate for yourself, and finally Get What You Want.
How to Get What You Want
Negotiation skills from parenting and the military with Jim Collison
Ever thought about how lessons from parenting and military experience can shape your leadership skills? Or how asking the right questions and giving the right advice can have a lasting impact on someone's life? That's what we're uncovering in this enlightening episode with my dear friend, Jim Collison. We journey through Jim's personal experiences, unraveling the complexities of leadership and its remarkable parallels to parenting and the military.
We push the boundaries of conventional leadership norms, exploring the power of vulnerability, and the importance of understanding our strengths and weaknesses. We also touch on the immense value of staying connected with the younger generation, giving us fresh perspectives and innovative ideas.
This chat with Jim is the leadership masterclass you didn't know you needed, one filled with invaluable insights and anecdotes. Whether you're a seasoned leader or a budding professional, you'll find a valuable nugget to take away. So, buckle up and join us on this leadership voyage of discovery.
Connect with Jim Collison:
https://theaverageguy.tv/
_____________________
🚀 Ready to Get What You Want?
Listening is great, but real change happens when you take action. Join my newsletter for exclusive negotiation strategies, scripts, and real-world case studies you won’t hear on the podcast. Sign up now at www.negotiationlove.com—it takes 10 seconds and will change how you view and negotiate forever.
📖 Continue Your Professional Growth with These Resources:
Get my Book: The Art of Everyday Negotiation without Manipulation:
www.susietomenchok.com/the-art-of-everyday-negotiation
Work With Me: Speaking, corporate training, and executive coaching:
www.susietomenchok.com/services
_____________________
Remember, negotiation is more than a skill—it’s a mindset.
💕Susie
www.linkedin.com/in/susietomenchok
Welcome to the Leaders with Leverage Podcast. I'm your host and negotiation expert, Suzy Tomonczuk. It's time to be your own advocate and negotiate for what you really want out of your career, Not simply the next role or additional compensation. I want to show you that negotiation happens each and every day so that you opt in and say yes with confidence. Together with other business leaders, you'll learn the essential skills you, as a leader, needs to become that advocate in growing your professional skills, to increase confidence, gain respect and become the future leader you're poised to be, and when you face a high-stakes situation, you're ready, no matter how high those stakes are. So let's do this. Let's lead with leverage. Welcome to Leaders with Leverage. I'm so excited to be here because I'm here with gosh, a mentor and somebody that I really admire, but a good friend too, Jim Collison. Welcome, Jim.
Speaker 2:Hey, it's good to be here. Thanks for asking me to be on. Don't set me up too high. We've all got things that we need to work on.
Speaker 1:But you and I did a podcast like a year and a half ago, and I remember you told me something about myself I didn't know, and so it stuck with me for a long time this idea of learning about who we are strengths, and we'll talk about that a little bit. But I just think that's why I really feel like we're connected, because of that feedback that you gave me.
Speaker 2:Oh, that's good, Good It's— yeah, well, we're all connected in a lot of ways, right? And I think oftentimes we miss those opportunities because we're just not waiting or listening for them. Yeah, there's been so many people around me, I mean, there's had so many great moments like that where people have spoken truth to me. Yeah, and not every time I listened, but the times I did, you're like, oh, that's actually really profound, you know.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I think we got to listen.
Speaker 2:There's been a lot of work on listening lately, like everybody's talking about listening in the context of leadership, and I think we all have something to learn there.
Speaker 1:Oh my gosh, there's room to grow in listening, that's for sure. So but just start out by you know, I introduced you and kind of gave like an informal introduction of you, but when you look at your kind of journey as a leader, as a professional, can you really kind of recount it for me or just tell me some of the highlights, if you had to express kind of what it felt in your shoes?
Speaker 2:Yeah, I mean leadership really started young, at 19, in the military, and was thrown into some leadership roles which I didn't do a really good job on. I mean I was 19. The military does some things to kind of help. You know. They send you just some training and they have this month long live in school NCO Academy that you go to, and actually it taught me a lot.
Speaker 2:I think I spent the next 25 years figuring out how to be a good leader or just to be a leader, not a bad leader, let's just put it that way how to be not a bad leader in that. And I still, I still I mean leadership is hard and it's not for everybody and you know there's those who can do it really really, really well and there's others that can't, and so you know I'm still learning in that process. So some time in the military I got out of that, did some retail banking for a while and I was kind of a subject matter expert during those times. But 15 or so years into that led me into some project technology, project management, which led me to some project management and leadership here at Gallup, where I'm at, and then opened up this role in community management, which was totally new to me. Never thought in a million years I'd be doing this.
Speaker 2:It was a surprise job which I really love doing, and I invented the job here at Gallup, like it was one of those where you're like, hey, somebody needs to do this, and they're like, okay, you go do it. Type deal, right, okay. And you know, I've been in that role eight years now and even for the first maybe three years didn't even have a title for it. It didn't, it wasn't something official, it was just like, well, you're doing it, okay, let's, we'll figure it out. It gets done.
Speaker 2:But I always go back to parenting. I have five children, 34 to 24 now in age, and if I ever did write a book and I never will I would write a book that said everything I learned about leadership. I learned from my children and they really taught me how to. They taught me a lot about leadership and and leading them and working with them. And this just this week.
Speaker 2:We've we've had some things going on at the house, and so the kids have been over for some of those and we spent a lot of time on the deck talking and I and I just realized like even this week, all that time I poured into them and as, as a dad, I wasn't perfect, right, but they're willing to come back and talk to me now, you know, in their twenties and thirties, they're willing to come back and we've had some tender. We've had some really tender moments over the week and that was a validation of some of those leadership in the in the moment. Leadership is not exciting in the moment, it's not fulfilling in the moment, it's just hard work, helping people do things they don't want to do. The payoff, I think, is much farther down the road and I think this is where a lot of leaders really get it wrong. They think it's going to be rewarding in the moment. It's horrible in the moment. In most cases the payoff is further down the line and I see that in my kids, in my parenting.
Speaker 1:Wow, that is so true and so well spoken Cause I was going to say, you know, for people that are getting into leadership, how do you define it and what does it look like? But I love that you've already set us up for TARD, so tell us, like, what would you tell somebody that's just starting out?
Speaker 2:Yeah, I tell this to future leaders here at Gallup all the time when they come in and I say you're about to embark on something you're not ready for, you have no idea what you're up against and it's with people so it's infinitely hard, because we all I mean humans are just really difficult to move, to get to do things right. The essence of leadership is changing people's minds, is getting them to move in a direction they may not want to go and they may want to. I'm painting it like it's difficult in all circumstances, and it's not in all, but it isn't most.
Speaker 2:Like you have to. Sometimes you have to convince people. I know you don't want to do this, naturally, but as a group, this is where we're going and I need you to get on board, you know, with this so we can move forward and in a way and I think in a way that's not authoritarian or is not demanding. Now listen, in the military, there are times you need to be an authoritarian because people's lives are on the line. It's completely different, right, the military thinks, yeah, you need to tell somebody what to do, because other people will die if they don't do those kinds of things. Right, that's not the typical case in the rest of the corporate world, right, but people still coming in with their own selfish desires, with their own needs, with their own wants, with their own expectations, and moving them in a direction, especially on a team which gets infinitely harder, because now you're adding those that difficulty on top of it. It's just a lot of hard work and you have to really like people to want to do it.
Speaker 2:I think this is another area of leadership. Maybe I'm being too honest on this, but this is another area of leadership where I think people think leadership is about telling other people what to do, and that couldn't be farther from the truth, right? I mean, you're really there to serve them, not lead. I think serving and leading are the same thing in a lot of ways, but not telling what to do, but to bring them along, to serve them in that, and they'll follow you when you do that, right, when you're leading in that way.
Speaker 1:Yeah, so what are some of the things, what are some of your best practices that you do Maybe like to prepare? Like, do you have a thing that you prepare before you talk to some of your people? Or how do you structure, how you move through your leadership weeks?
Speaker 2:Yeah, so I'm in a little bit of a unique situation now because I feel like I manage. You know, we have about 14,000 certified coaches around the world who it's really my job to manage them, to lead them. They may not think that's true, but that's the truth of it.
Speaker 1:right, it's true it is.
Speaker 2:That's what my job is to do, is to lead them, and so it's a day. For me, that's a daily, that's a daily exercise and I almost said a daily battle in some. In some ways, it is right, because I'm getting you know. I'm getting emails and instant messages and stuff on LinkedIn right from people hey, how do I do this, how do I do that? So there's some elements to it that are just informational. They're just they need to know how to do something. I know how to do it the way I want them to do it, so I influence them away.
Speaker 2:By the way, in the CliftonStrengths lexicon, right, these four domains of leadership, influencing is one of those. I have four of my top five in influencing, so I guess built for this role. I want to tell people what to do, in the sense, when they've asked me a question and I think that's important. Like you, don't tell people what to do until they've asked you in a lot of ways hey, I want to be, I'm interested in your opinion, what, what should we do here? And then you tell them right. So for me. So part of my role is is informational, then part of it's just solving problems. They're messed up in our system. Somehow it's not working the way it's supposed to. There's a misunderstanding in some way, and so it's straightening out some of those things that that have to be, you know, done in that way. And then there's visionary leadership, right, which is where do we want to go for the future? What is this? What will this thing look like? What's, what are positive directions? How can I drag this group of rag tag individuals along with me, all just trying to scrap out this thing we call coaching, and and how can we all be successful together and right. And so there's some, some futuristic. I don't have futuristic high as from a theme perspective, but it's part of my job. I've got to do it. I've got to lead them in direction. So how do I get ready for that? Well, I'm kind of design, I'm kind of built that way to firefight.
Speaker 2:Every day, I wake up kind of forgetting the day before and like, okay, brand new day, let's crush this thing, let's do this thing. Who can we help today? How can we get this done? I think it's getting myself in the right mindset every single day when I wake up to say, okay, my job today is to serve people, and so how can I do that in a way that helps them to be the most successful.
Speaker 2:Same thing when I do my podcasting, my job is not to to tell people how smart I am. My job is to make other people seem and be really smart and make them the big deal right, make them serve them in that, in that role, and when that, when that happens, when that works, all that stuff does come back to you as a leader. Right, I mean, it's not like it's all given away. I think it oftentimes comes back to you, and fulfillment and satisfaction as well. So I get ready every day, you know, I put on, I wake up and like, All right, let's do this thing, you know, and get the eye of the tiger and then come in every day to just really help people make today better than it was yesterday.
Speaker 1:Wow, that's so powerful. I think you know as a coach, I know the power of asking questions and I tell people all the time like we say it. But it's like when you see people, you ask a question and you stop the seven words or less and you allow to see that transformation, when they kind of have this aha moment, you you're reminded of the power. So I love that. You said what can I do today to support the people around me? Like just even to ask, turn a question on yourself. That makes it a new day.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, yeah, it's yeah. No, it's just, it's for me it's a daily fight. There are others, there are others who do aren't built the way I am. That would date. They just wouldn't like that. They would get through it and be like I don't know if I wanted, how long I want to do this for Think the key is is realizing yes, I am built that way and I kind of thrive in it.
Speaker 2:That's another moments, and today may even be one of those moments where you get to the end of the day, you know like, whoo right, I don't know if I want to do that again. Yeah, but but guess what? I'll be here Monday and you know what we like. All right, let's, let's make this week better than it was, than it was last week. So I think for leaders getting that are listening to your program here, think the key is getting yourself in the right mindset for what you are going to be doing, what you know you need to do, based on who you are and what you're good at, what your strengths are and some of those kinds of things. And and get, get yourself mentally geared up for this thing on a daily or weekly or monthly, keeping in mind it's not all about getting after it right. You need to spend some time on yourself and some hoping. I think we all know that now. Well being is what we heard over the last three years. We've heard a lot of, but you got to take care of yourself as well.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I think that's so true. I you're making me think. One of a really early moment for me in my leadership. I had probably 30 people, 40 people working in my group and I they were their entry level people and I said to one of my peers who was a good friend of mine I hate managing people because it's just so like, oh, they're late and I have to tell them they're late and he goes, it shows. And I was like I've hold, I've held on to that for so long because it was kind of the slap in the face that I needed for somebody just to go. It's a two way street.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:It's not just telling them what to do, it's about really understanding them. And one of those people came back to me years later and said she sat with me, by me on a plane and told me about a piece of advice I had given her at that time that I have no memory of that stuck with her for her whole career, that she leant, and so that makes me feel like we don't know when we have made an impression. It's never what we think it's going to be, those things that we tell people to coach them.
Speaker 1:Yeah it might just go over their head, or they might not hear it for five years.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I like this idea to. I'm in a role where it's large group influence, right, I mean, I don't have these aren't my direct reports. I don't have any way to motivate them. I can't give them more money. I can't take things away. Yeah, I can't do that. And yet I still have to. I still want to move them in directions. Right, I still need to convince them. There are things I need them to do for, for the, for the greater whole, or just for themselves and some of the work they're doing.
Speaker 2:And in some ways, that's a harder form of leadership because you don't have any. You don't really have any levers to turn. You have to be genuine. You have to bring value. You got to convince them it's the right thing to do. You don't. You don't have any way of doing that except doing it Like. It has to be genuine. You know you can't use Jedi mind tricks on them to to be like I know you're thinking this, but you need to think something else. Right, we've, we've all done those management things. I know you don't like this raise, but this is the raise we're going to get.
Speaker 2:You know, type deal and in in in this space that I have, I don't have any of those levers to pull, I actually like it. I like it better. It feels more genuine to me in some ways. But I'm built that way. I just think I'm built to manage large groups of people doing things in that way, can handle that, all those things. So I embrace it and embrace it. And I've gotten a listen. I've had the privilege to land in this role over the last 10 years. That will be really be the last 20 years of my career, maybe 30 if I'm lucky and so it's. It's. It's for me. Recognizing that and seeing it has been has been kind of half the battle, and to be fortunate to find a role that would fit that here towards in my career.
Speaker 1:Hey there, love this podcast. I'm taking 10 seconds out of this episode to ask you to leave an honest review. More reviews on the show help us to reach more professionals who are ready to lead with leverage. Now let's continue the conversation. So let's talk about that a little. I mean your eggs. You know strengths so well because you live and breathe it with people around you and you talk about it. How do you apply it for yourself? How do you like? You said what clicked for me when you said I have four influencing themes and you said you like it. When people ask you to be like on the podcast, you said to me I like people. Well, you know, I'm not gonna, I'll just stop there, but you like influence. You like when people are like that and advocate for themselves, because you honor that, because it comes naturally to you. So how do people know their direction? What? How can they? How can they leverage their strengths? Yeah, what? What keys or clues would you give?
Speaker 2:It's a lot of trial and error. I mean, well, first of all, you need to framework a structure. I mean, I'm here at Gallup, we have Clifton's strengths. There's other assessments that do it. We like ours.
Speaker 1:It's self serving. I have to say it, I have to say it, I have to say it.
Speaker 2:So understanding that framework, right, understanding the framework of strengths, to be like, okay, here are some things about me that I know. One of the benefits of knowing that or have somebody else telling me, is it doesn't remove a little bit of my own bias, of my own desires. Like I thought I was a way better project manager than I was. Just experience rooted that out, like oh yeah, I started doing that. I mean, I took, you know, 20 years ago, I took a project management job and technology and thought, let's be great, I'm really good at this. I really wasn't, and you know I fortunately I got about 18 months in and this job popped up and and so I could exit that one cleanly. But but I think, having that so one, having a framework about yourself, and and then not just a framework, but having folks around you, people around you who know you, who who are not afraid to say yeah, no, that's not really you know, type deal, right, having those conversations we kind of call that a board of directors, having your own personal board of directors kind of around you. So so one that you gotta, you gotta kind of peel the, the layers of the onion back so you can kind of see what's in there, right. Then being real, honest and open with yourself and thinking like, yeah, I'm not good at everything. In fact, I'm only good at a few things. If we're really honest with ourselves, there's just a few things, some of us more than others, but most of us just a few things Then saying, okay, what are those things? And then how can I put myself in a role where those are honored and I can exploit them? I can, I can use them every day Doesn't happen overnight.
Speaker 2:I mean, it took me a long time to find that career along the way, though that's not wasted time. You're learning. You continue to learn more and more things about yourself. You know. So. You know, if I was, if I was back 25, 30, 35, somewhere in that age range now and I would, you know I'd encourage you open up a little bit. Like the, the, the corporate world put so much pressure on us to have it all together today and nobody has that. Nobody. Open up, be vulnerable. Get yourself a board of directors, figure out around you, start, start opening up and say you know what are my, what really am I good at? And then how do I find ways in the current role that I'm in, or something different. How could, how could I position myself in a way so that in the next whatever X number of years I can take advantage of those things in my career takes a while. That's the thing I think some people are expecting. This like well, I'll start Tuesday, yeah, okay, it's gonna take a little bit longer than that.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it is so true, and you do pull things along the way. I remember somebody might think it was my brother-in-law who said to me early it's so interesting looking back, like everything I've learned I actually apply now, like somehow it was all worthwhile. Yeah, because there was a place for it later on, and so I've always kind of embraced that idea. That might not make sense when I'm doing this right now, but there might be a place for it in the future. It's an investment in yourself.
Speaker 2:Yeah, you just, you just never know. You just never know how are those kinds of situations are going to pay, going to pay off in either wisdom or or understanding in the future. I mean, I don't know if I've ever been the tenderest guy in the world. I don't know if I feel all the emotions I probably should be feeling at times. Over the last couple years I've been kind of really thinking through this idea of emotional intelligence and understanding the power of that. Not because it does affect the way I lead. You know, it does.
Speaker 2:How I'm feeling emotionally in the moment does have. You can't separate those from your leadership. They do have an impact on what you're doing, what you're saying and how you're feeling, just as much as the training and education and all those things that you've done, plus your own physical well being. You have to kind of think about your emotions, you know, stability or your emotional well-being in the moment, because that plays a big part in what you're doing. So understanding where I'm at today and then like, oh, like today, today may not, maybe it's not a great emotional day, so I'm not going to do things that require those kinds of conversations. Maybe that's a smart, maybe it'd be a smart move you know for, for for me, so I think pulling that in that helps as well.
Speaker 1:Yeah, for sure, you know what you're in an interesting circumstance too is how do you get better, how, where do you get your feedback and how do you process it?
Speaker 2:Yeah, so I have a. I have a kind of a I wouldn't say formal, but fairly formal board of directors around me. If folks that I've worked with for a lot of years that I've learned to trust they're not all my friends, by the way Some of them give me some really hard advice. They don't they don't actually know they're on that, but I looked to them for feedback on hey, what, how did this work? Because I know I'll get honest feedback from them that way. So I have a group of folks around me, a pretty tight group. We don't get together on any formal basis and meet like you would.
Speaker 2:You know you think about board of directors, but over the last five years is I've made that post 50 conversion right In my life. I've begun to surround myself with with folks that are not my age anymore and I, like I have lunch with all of our sales folks here and they're all you know, they're all Gen Z, young millennial or young millennials now, and have found spending time with them has been so good for me in hearing what they're thinking Like hey, you're the future, right, you're the future of the workforce, what are you thinking about? I just I just came before I came up here for the interview. I was just, it's a little thin today, it's a Friday, little thin here on the campus, but but there were a couple of folks we've hired in the last year and and I've gotten to know them, and I and I waved them over to the team and and I've gotten to know them and I waved them over to the tail hey, come have lunch with me.
Speaker 2:Those lunch conversations are not just entertainment. I am learning from them, I am sharpening myself with them, I'm being open to them, and they asked me great questions, and so I think, sometimes too, we forget in our leadership roles, the, the, the future. Can you know if, if they're the future, they can sharpen us as well? And it's not going to happen by accident, you have to make it happen. And so I sit with them every lunch and, and you know, every time I have a chance, every time I'm here and I have lunch, which is a lot of days, an advantage to coming in. I learn a ton from those, from those guys.
Speaker 1:I, I like that idea of making space in places that you don't normally or naturally go to the person that you would ask. And I think, lee, you and I were talking about just right before we started press record about this idea of busyness and how people it's such an excuse and but if you're intentional and you make the space just by saying I'm going to go down to the lunch room and I'm going to look for somebody, yeah. To sit with.
Speaker 2:And they all sit together, like this isn't a matter of me inviting them. They were sitting together and I invaded. I was like hey, can I sit with you guys? And at first I like okay, like who is this guy you know? And. And so I just began to invite myself into their world. Listen, it'd be super easy for me to go down to the cafeteria grab lunch, go to my desk, eat while I'm doing things that could. That's super easy.
Speaker 2:Yeah takes way more courage to go down and start making, because our organization, like other, every other organizations, turned over. You know, in the last three years we've had huge amounts of turnover. There's a whole bunch of new people here. It would be easy to be the old guy and say, oh, my friends are gone, I'm a relic here, nobody, you know, whatever. No, it's time to re on board, and so I've been re onboarding myself into the next generation.
Speaker 2:I want, I want to be as as a significant part of their existence here and as their manager is or is there. I want to. You know, I don't want age to get in the way of, I want to be their friends. We've had some great conversations down there and I get a chance to influence them and they ask me questions all the time what do you think about this? You know? And that's a great opportunity to informally lead them, sharpen those leadership skills a little bit and say, you know, hey, do I still have it? You know, for the kids, can I still do it with the kids, right? So, yeah, I think it's important, very intentional, by the way, very intentional.
Speaker 2:This wasn't a mistake, this was me saying All right, I got to get was a whole bunch of new people. I got to figure out who these people are and get to know them, because pre pandemic I knew everybody. Yeah, I knew the whole company. Two years later I didn't know anybody. Well, I knew half right, I knew half the company. So you got to be intentional about it.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I love that. Nothing Intention is so key, it's so key. So you, what you haven't mentioned, and maybe this is just a selfish question but you host, you have hosted podcasts that have had millions and millions of downloads, like millions, like 5 million, and around the world, and you go to Gallup Summit and people like stand in line to take a look at the world and you have a lot of pictures with you Like I'm not kidding, Like it is like you're a known entity in the community. How does that feel? You hold influence and you have influence in themes which allows you to hold that. But like what does that feel? Like that you've so many people know you and listen to you.
Speaker 2:It's a ton of responsibility, like I don't want to. Yeah, I've made, I've joked about that at times. You know it's silly. You know all these selfies that we take and post and such and we have a good time and my personality while it's big, the individual attention like that is a little uncomfortable for me. The one on one attention is pretty uncomfortable for me at times and I push through it and you smile for the pictures and some of those kinds of things. On the surface it's very, very uncomfortable, but let's be really, really clear.
Speaker 2:It's very satisfying to see the end results of people actually moving right, when it actually moves them, when they, when I get emails that say hey, I heard you say this, we did that, this is the result. That is satisfying Right, it's very, very, very, very fulfilling when you get those those kinds of things. They don't happen all the time and they're they're. You know it's not like it's happening every day, but it's. It's very the part's very, very fulfilling. And I think, going back to realizing I really like and am good at that job, the podcasting job, that's the one that got me into this role. It's, it's, it was. I was meant to be a media guy. Never get sick of it. I love doing it, love being on the microphone, love talking about it, love having conversations like this with you. Yeah, I'm kind of built for this kind of thing.
Speaker 2:So, it's very, very, it's very, very satisfying, very satisfying.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and I, as somebody that sees you in that community, I think your key is, like you said it's you show up really consistently. You're very you're always the same trusted source and you've really built your that's. That's who you are. Yeah, everybody knows.
Speaker 2:I have a. I mean I hold some standards to myself that I answer emails quickly, like, and I may not have all the answers, but I consistently get. I mean I've half a dozen of these today already where people are like whoa well, I thank you for getting back to me so fast. Yeah, that's usually the first line in the email is thanks for getting back so fast. Wow, I didn't like cause, cause, that's not normal.
Speaker 2:Just to be honest, like we're all inundated, we're all and we all have systems that take forever. Every company has giant customer support systems that just don't move as fast as people would really want them to. It's hard to get it. I don't want anybody to wait any length of time when I oh, in fact I'm guilty of answering those emails and meetings when I should be listening. You know they're like hey, what do you think, jim? I'm like I don't have a clue what you just said. Can you just repeat it again? I was thinking about something else, so, but that's that's important to me. That's one of those values that I hold. I hold very dear in my leadership as people get a quick response.
Speaker 1:So yeah, that's great. Well, you know, I have a love for negotiation and I am leadership, and when I think about leverage, that I think to me that's a key component of being thoughtful about your approach and things. When, when I talk about leverage to you, how do you define it?
Speaker 2:Yeah, it's a great question and I think I'm going to define it through. We wrote a book 15 years ago called Strengths Based Leadership and there's four pillars of the four needs of followers hope, stability, compassion and trust. And I think you, when we think of leverage, I think about that as the ability to move someone in a direction right, whether it's in a sales standpoint or getting to commit to something, or whether it's changing their mind on something right or a vote right, all those things as we think about in negotiations, and that's all. That's all negotiated stuff. I mean, we spend most of our life negotiating. We just don't realize it's all negotiating. Yeah, we don't call it that until I need to sign the document. All of a sudden, then it becomes no, no, no, we're actually doing it our whole lives, right? I think it's a big part of everything that we do, but I think my values would land in that. I think we need to think through those four needs hope, stability, compassion and trust. That builds. What that builds on is the ability to me to speak into someone and negotiate from a perspective of overwhelming evidence or overwhelming love or overwhelming confidence that they don't.
Speaker 2:I don't say you should do this. They say how do I do it? Right, I want them to be asking me hey, I see something, how do I get on board, like, how do I do that? That, to me, that is the best form of negotiating is when they've changed their mind based on my behavior or my influence or my whatever. Fill in the blank. There they're making that decision without me having had to have to do anything. I've pulled them, I've created a vortex of whatever and I'm pulling them along with it. Yeah, that's my preferred, that's. I'm a terrible closer. I admitted that to you when we were talking. I'm terrible at closing. I don't want to do it that way. I want to be so persuasive. They make the decision without me ever having to ask for it. Yeah Right, that's what I want. Doesn't always happen that way, you know. Sometimes you got to. Sometimes you got to just close the deal. Okay, are we doing this thing or not?
Speaker 1:That was so good too, because it you can inspire your, your leadership can be inspired by just kind of sitting back and watching the impact that you you likely had on somebody, or just reflecting back. That's pretty powerful.
Speaker 2:We're going through this phase here Gallup, we have an internal stock program and and we talk about it from time to time about taking ownership and Gallup and and the value of that stuff. And in you know, I often have conversations with with younger employees who are just getting here and I say, let me tell you about the opportunities you have in this and let me paint a picture for you of what it could be. And this doesn't guarantee anything, but but I want you to know I mean, I've been doing this for 15 years. Here's some of the things I've seen in it. How can?
Speaker 2:And at the end of the I don't, you know, I don't have anything for them to sign, I don't. It's not my job to get them to do it. I just want to overwhelm them so that they just go and do what they need to get done. And then we'll come back to me because I had somebody do that for me 15 years ago Say hey, jim, let me show you a few things here and the benefit of this and and I believed him and I did it and I saw, you know, I saw some pretty incredible things happen. So I want to provide that for others too.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, oh, that's so good. This has been such a great good conversation. Thank you for taking the time, yeah.
Speaker 2:Yeah, no, I enjoy. You know I enjoy this. You want to do it for another three hours. I'm not sure anybody listened for another three hours.
Speaker 1:I know we do yeah.
Speaker 2:You probably wouldn't even listen to another three hours.
Speaker 1:No, I totally, would, I, totally would. I have like work. We may have to do a part two.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:Because there's just so many things to cover. What? What would you want to tell people about connecting with you? Or what could they do if they enjoyed the conversation? What could they do?
Speaker 2:No well, first of all, thanks for enjoying it. Not everybody does, but but but I appreciate you if you did. A couple ways to connect for the work that I do with Gallup and CliftonStrengths Just search CliftonStrengths on any social platform and be able to find it. We have a YouTube channel, youtubecom slash CliftonStrengths. That will get you there and boy, you see a lot of me, and I apologize in advance. It's just a. It's just a hazard of the job is that somebody's got to do the interviews and so I get those. I get that done as cleanly as I can with it.
Speaker 2:We have a brand new podcast called the CliftonStrengths podcast, which is kind of theme based around those where we spent some time talking about Dr Jacqueline Robinson is on that some of our best. We spend some time talking about well being. This year we've been talking about our role based reports, so leadership, our leaders report, our managers report in our sales report, and so that's been a fun, a ton of fun too. You can't miss me, jim underscore Collison, at gallupcom if you want to send me an email.
Speaker 1:Awesome, and you know that Jim will respond quickly, and if he doesn't, usually pretty fast yeah it's like liar, I'm not going to point it out.
Speaker 2:Hey, sketchy was just saying that for the podcast.
Speaker 1:But gallup has so much great content on the website and through the podcast it's it's just opening up your eyes and pressing click and you can learn so much about yourself, and we all need to make space for that so that we can have that self discovery.
Speaker 2:So, yeah, Susie, I think before, before he closed, I think the one thing I'd say on that is I think sometimes we think you know we're in such a like popular book culture like I want to know something about leadership. I'm going to buy the best leadership book, I'm going to read it in a weekend and then that's all I need, and maybe for some people that works, but I think for a lot of people, little bits over time. This is what podcasting has been great Little consistency over time. You know, maybe an hour week on the topic, but over the course of a year that's 52 hours that you've invested in that right and and I just think it has I think it pays better, better dividends.
Speaker 2:So leaders, be long, be in the long game. I think on this in little bits over time, and make sure you take some time for the future, like and not just your future, but for the future of those around you. Take some time to sit down and have lunch or whatever with the future. They need it. They need it desperately. They need strong leaders desperately. So we need to be there for them.
Speaker 1:Wow, that was so well. I can't even close after that. So, one hour a week, like that's, all it takes is investment and in you and the people around you. Thank you, jim, that was really good.
Speaker 2:Yeah, no, you're welcome. Thanks for having me.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah. So this has been Leaders with Leverage. Make sure that if you thought this was a great episode, share it with somebody. Let them know that you're thinking about them and you're investing in them and helping them take that time. So thanks for joining us, share this and thank you for for being here. Thanks for listening to this week's episode of Leaders with Leverage. If you're ready to continue your professional growth, commit to accelerating your career development and say goodbye to that anxious feeling in your stomach Anytime you need to advocate for yourself, then get my book the Art of Everyday Negotiation Without Manipulation. In this book, you'll learn the essential steps to take before entering into any negotiation or conversation, any interaction in your day to day. You'll discover what the other party really needs and be clear about what you're going after. You'll bust through your fears and boost your confidence and embrace that negotiation truly happens all around us. Head to the link in the show notes for more, and you can even get a bonus if you buy it today.
