It’s Not the Trauma Olympics: PTSD, Misdiagnosis, and the Fight for Veterans’ Care

In this powerful episode of Living Chronic: Military, Medicine, and the Mission Left Behind, Brandy Schantz sits down with advocate and caregiver Helen Perry to tackle one of the most misunderstood and overused labels in military healthcare: PTSD.

Together, they explore:

• How the VA often funnels diverse and serious health issues under a “PTSD” diagnosis—sometimes dismissing critical symptoms like seizures, vomiting, or even tumors
• The harm caused by gaslighting, mislabeling, and invalidation of veterans and their families.
• Why the stereotype of PTSD as the “angry combat veteran” fails to reflect the reality of trauma’s many faces
• The dangerous culture of one-upmanship within the veteran community—what Brandy calls the “trauma Olympics”—and how it undermines solidarity.
• The ripple effects of underfunding, including rising veteran suicides, lack of family support, and the financial strain of paying out of pocket for care
• Concrete steps we can all take—contacting representatives, advocating for funding, and standing together as a military family.

Brandy and Helen remind us: trauma isn’t a competition, and every veteran’s experience is valid. To truly support our service members, we must fund the programs that keep them—and their families—alive.

🔗 Resources and advocacy letters available at brandyschantz.com

Transcript

Brandy Schantz (00:00.994)
Welcome back to Living Chronic, I'm Brandy Shantz. I'm here with Helen Perry again, and we are still talking all things, military, veterans, medicine, and the mission left behind. So get ready, Helen. Today we are talking PTSD and associated illnesses.

So we have a lot to say about this. Let's get started. Let's start with you and I are both very familiar with the VA and how things are run there. And we know that when you go to the VA, almost everything kind of gets thrown under this giant bucket of PTSD. Unless you're a woman over the age of 40 and then you get two buckets, PTSD and perimenopause. So we get two buckets.

Helen P (00:45.954)
It's fantasy and metam. Yeah, always.

Brandy Schantz (00:51.746)
It's probably both of them working together. But of course, it's not always PTSD and we need to have better discussions. So let's start talking, because your husband, they are constantly saying, it must be the PTSD and he does not have PTSD.

Helen P (01:06.83)
He does not. So Matt has complete memory loss. Like he's got memory loss from 2014 all the way through like his childhood. So he can tell you the narrative of what's happened to him, but he doesn't have those like memory bubbles in his head that he can like reflect on. And so he has not, and even prior to his seizures developing, even when he did have memory, he did not have really like symptoms of post-traumatic stress. You know, obviously he was, you know, sad and upset about the things that had happened where his friends died and things like that. But

It's funny because now, frequently when we go into the VA, his new PCM is amazing. I have to give her huge amount of props. She is absolutely incredible. We do not experience this with her, but with other providers, we've had them be like, it's his PTSD. And I'm like...

Really? Like, you know, the vomiting is PTSD? Like that's such a strange, it's PTSD. And I'm like, really? Cause he doesn't have it. Like he's never been diagnosed with it. Anxiety, yes, but that's like a different issue. But like this is completely unrelated. And you know, one of the things that I've noticed within the VA and with patients when I've been working in advocacy and with families is that there's this, it seems like there's this tendency to just kind of gaslight everyone.

I mean, somebody could literally go in, like I said, with like a brain tumor, like sticking out of the side of their head or like vomiting blood. And the VA would be like, it's your PTSD. We'll just we'll up your psych meds, you know. And it's I think that. You know, this is not to be dismissive of anyone who has like truly psychosomatic symptoms, right? So so physical symptoms that accompany their, you know, mental health issues or their their depression or whatever.

Brandy Schantz (02:29.915)
yeah.

Helen P (02:51.834)
But it's, you know, I think that there's this tendency to like mislabel it. And I think it drives patients away from and creates mistrust in the system, right? Cause you're like, you know, let's say you do have like a big mass on the side of your head, you know, you've got something and you go in and be seen and they're like, it's your PTSD or something ridiculous. And you're like, really? Cause like, I feel like, I feel like this is really not that. And you're trying to express these things and these, it gets very dismissive. There's a lot of gaslighting. It's a lot of invalidation.

They're not listening to you. And then I think, you we've talked about this before where people start to, they feel, they feel crazy. They're like, well, maybe it is me. Maybe it is my PTSD. Like maybe, maybe I do need more medication, right? And it starts this escalation of like not actually getting them the help that they need, which then creates other trauma and like other problems and other barriers. I think also, you know, we were just talking about how

Brandy Schantz (03:26.147)
Yeah.

Helen P (03:47.118)
The VA does not have the resources that he needs to provide adequate mental health care to people. So even when it is their PTSD, like what is there to offer them? Right? Like frequently it's a medication adjustment and that's the answer. medication adjustment. No look at life stressors, no look at environmental triggers, no look at, you know, big life changes that have happened that have been, you know, affecting people.

Brandy Schantz (03:51.65)
Right.

Helen P (04:15.074)
It's just medication. you know, we know it is evidence based that like there is not a single treatment for trauma. It is multifaceted. It is multifactorial. And it's also different for everyone. And that I think has been one of the things in my own journey that's been, you know, eye opening for me is that

Brandy Schantz (04:28.344)
Yes.

Helen P (04:39.758)
You know, for many years, this like stigma presentation has been presented to the public, to providers of like what PTSD looks like, what it centers around and how it presents and then like the response to it, you know, and it's been presented as like the super macho guy or, whoever who like, you know, particularly men specifically, it's, you know, predominantly focused on men are sent to combat and they

Brandy Schantz (05:04.194)
Yes.

Helen P (05:09.444)
do these things and then they come home and they're afraid of the public and they're hyper vigilant and they're angry and they're all of these things, right? And like, I'm sure there is probably somebody who like meets that very boxy, rigid dynamic, right? And that description, but like, you know, as like my therapist recently said, she's like, however many people there are in the world with PTSD, that is how many different presentations there are. It is never the same.

Brandy Schantz (05:23.638)
rigid you know stereotype. Yeah.

Brandy Schantz (05:37.495)
Absolutely.

Helen P (05:39.72)
And we have done a disservice to people by painting this picture and typecasting, like what it looks like, because then we're not really doing people a service of like making them aware of like how their post-traumatic stress can present. know, sometimes it presents as increasing anxiety. Sometimes it's depression. Sometimes it's, you know, irritability around their trigger. Sometimes it's just straight up avoidance. And I think the other thing too that was recently said to me is, you know,

Brandy Schantz (06:02.926)
Mm-hmm.

Helen P (06:08.952)
just because you carry it well doesn't mean it's not heavy. And I think that is where we get so many misunderstandings and misconstruing about how people approach their VA disability rating, how the VA approaches it, right? It's like, just because somebody is managing and they're doing the work doesn't mean that they're not still experiencing the trauma and that those things didn't happen to them.

Brandy Schantz (06:12.876)
Yes.

Brandy Schantz (06:20.236)
Yes.

Brandy Schantz (06:30.829)
Right.

Helen P (06:37.54)
There's so many different dynamics to it. And I think I, you know, I really feel like this typecasting has done a disservice to so many people because they'll look at that and they'll say, that's not me. I never shot anybody. I never got blown up. I never, you know, did those things. And they fail to consider, you know, the overall trauma of their other experiences and that those are valid. You know, it's it's, you know, I frequently tell people like it's not it's not the trauma Olympics.

Brandy Schantz (06:51.022)
Right.

Brandy Schantz (06:59.906)
Yes.

Helen P (07:06.308)
Like we are not in a competition to see whose trauma is like, listen, you want a trauma bond. Like I'm here for it. Like I can tell some stories, you know, and like that's so much of like what it is for people, right? It's like this, like, yeah, let me tell you what I saw and let me tell you what I saw, right? And it's this, it's this escalation of, you know, of experiences of like, how terrible can it be? But like, it's, it's not like, that's not the point.

Brandy Schantz (07:07.17)
Yes.

Helen P (07:33.666)
And I feel like so much of the VA very much does make it this like comparative, you know, well, that other guy saw the same thing and he's fine. And you're like, well, that's great for him. I'm glad for him. Is he actually fine? He probably isn't, you know. But it's like, exactly.

Brandy Schantz (07:38.541)
right.

Brandy Schantz (07:44.684)
Yes. Yes.

What is he doing to make it look like he's fine? Because there's a lot of work in the background. There's a lot of work in the background. Yes.

Helen P (07:55.754)
It's a of masking, right? it's, it's, you know, that has been something that I think, you know, I think veterans just in general need to hear, like, whether we are talking about your trauma or your service or what you did in your service or what, it's not a competition.

If you did four years in the Air Force and you never deployed, outstanding. Thank you for your service. Like, that's amazing. If you did 40 years and deployed a bunch of times, like outstanding, amazing. Thank you for your service. But like we've created a lot of atmosphere in the veteran communities of it being this one upmanship, right? And this, you deploy? Did you do this? Well, like, you know, for a lot of people.

Brandy Schantz (08:31.064)
Yes.

Helen P (08:36.176)
You know, I, I try, I tried to deploy, I volunteered for deployment. never happened for me. I ended up going later as a humanitarian and doing a lot of other things in combat stricken areas. Um, I will tell you that like, I, now having been there and done that, like, I don't really understand some of like the, you know, the, emphasis on it. I'm like, you could do a lot of things from the States that are like very much, very hard to do and like still very much serving your country. Didn't need to do that from, you know,

Brandy Schantz (09:01.421)
Yes.

Helen P (09:06.618)
from Kandahar, you know? And so I think it's, you know, I think this like one-upmanship culture that's been created is something that really veterans need to start like stamping out to get the VA to also recognize that like that is not okay and it's not okay culture. Yeah, exactly. Yeah.

Brandy Schantz (09:22.306)
Yes. I nip it in the bud. I mean, nip it in the damn bud. Because we're all veterans. And one thing, and again, I say it all the time. I've been in the military since the day I was born. My father was in the Navy. I graduated from college. I walked across one stage to get my diploma. I left, changed clothes into my Army uniform, walked to the other side of campus, raised my right hand, and swore in as Lieutenant Brandy Baker.

I've been in the military in some way, or form my entire life. I turned around and I married another military person. And one thing that's always been true about our community is we stick together. We are a family. I don't care who you are, where you came from, we are a family. So when I see members of my family trying to classify how much of a family member you are based on what you did or where you served or...

Helen P (09:58.638)
Yeah.

Helen P (10:19.984)
Great.

Brandy Schantz (10:20.034)
how you got your trauma. I'm not here for that. Nip it in the bud, stop it now. We can't do this. We are a family. We stick together. I don't care where you got your trauma. What I care about is you served in the military. You're my family member. That's it.

Helen P (10:34.446)
Yeah. And I think it's, I think a lot of it, you know, kind of percolates from the veteran community into the VA. And then that is where we start to see a lot of the VA doing the comparative analytics of like, well, they were fine, but you're not fine. And are you just out for money? And it's like, so what if they are? So what if they want the increased VA disability so that they get the help that they need so that they can afford, you know, the therapy that they're paying for privately? Because again,

Brandy Schantz (10:41.709)
Yes.

Brandy Schantz (10:49.336)
Yes.

Helen P (11:00.698)
The VA doesn't have the resources, know, and even on active duty, they don't have the resources either. If you walk into mental health today on active duty and you say, need support, you will get a provider to see you for a 30 minute visit once a month. That is the average that they're getting seen. And it doesn't.

Brandy Schantz (11:07.286)
No.

Brandy Schantz (11:17.986)
Yes. And I hope if there's one thing we've made clear throughout this series so far, it's that the problems aren't just at VA, they aren't just at military health. They're at both. They're at both. We need to be talking about both things at the same time.

Helen P (11:28.43)
Yeah, it's everywhere. Yeah.

Yep. And when people start to look at why is it happening, it's because we're not funding it. You cannot have services that are not paid for. And when we're not paying for services, when we're not budgeting either through NDAA or through the VA appropriations, then these services don't happen. And right now we're even seeing other federal programs that were supporting even community efforts to intervene in the suicide epidemic. Those are also being cut.

Brandy Schantz (11:40.194)
Yes.

Brandy Schantz (11:58.584)
Yes.

Helen P (12:03.95)
You know, it's, you for years you could talk about sending people to local vet centers or sending them to programs like Give an Hour or the Winter Warrior Project or any of these programs that existed to help with, with, you know, mental health support. And now those programs, you know, I'm not going to speak for individual programs, but just in general, those programs have wait lists because they're being inundated by people who can't get services through traditional methods.

And so they're looking at other ways to get services. And now those services are being, you know, and as their funding continues to get cut either because of grants or because of decreases in donor, you know, donor giving because cost of living is going up. So now people can't afford to make as many donations. Those resources become more and more scarce. And I think you said it right earlier where unfortunately, I think we're going back to where we were 10 years ago.

Brandy Schantz (12:38.051)
Yes.

Brandy Schantz (13:02.381)
Yes.

Helen P (13:02.64)
with seeing the increasing number of suicide and desperate acts of people who just want help, and there's just no resources for them. And I think that that is, it's so frustrating to me because I I tell people all the time when they're like, oh, thank you for your service. I support veterans. I'm like, unless you're voting to fund the programs that keep us alive, no, you don't.

Brandy Schantz (13:08.494)
Mm-hmm.

Helen P (13:27.472)
Unless you are going out and advocating for these programs that keep us literally alive, no you don't. It's virtue signaling. It's people being like, I support the troops. And I'm like, but you don't because you're not supporting the programs that actually support them.

Brandy Schantz (13:33.74)
Yes.

Brandy Schantz (13:43.458)
which you're not really.

And that's the reality of it. People had so much gusto when it was about support the troops, when it meant going to the airport and clapping when we came home. Clap, clap, clap, clap, clap. It was all great, you know, about support the troops when it's buy them a free drink at the bar or vote to ensure their children can go to college. But now here we are many years later and many states can't afford those benefits and people don't want to fund them because, wait, this is expensive. And I always say,

You gotta vote with the same gusto to fund the programs that you did to just say that you were gonna support them. It's real easy to say, we really should support the troops with these benefits, but it's an entirely different thing to really back that up and fund them. whatever you're doing right now, turn off your political entertainment of choice, and then go to the Appropriations Committee. It's boring. It takes you a long time to read through. There's nothing fun.

Helen P (14:22.618)
Yeah.

Helen P (14:32.505)
Yeah!

Helen P (14:40.645)
Yeah.

Brandy Schantz (14:44.642)
There's no catchy phrases. You're going to have to read through it two or three times. But you know what? That's where the stuff is happening. The Appropriations Committee.

Helen P (14:52.292)
Yep. Yep. Well, and also, you know, even if it's not that, just send a letter to your congressman or your senator and say, hey, support these programs. I've heard that funding has been cut. I've heard that, you know, veterans are now having problems accessing services. Like fund these programs. Fund these programs. Like literally, you can just send a letter that says, please support funding veteran programs. And like, that's all it has to say. You don't have to put together some magic interpretation of like law or whatever.

Brandy Schantz (14:59.17)
Yes.

Helen P (15:21.668)
But like letting and then when people don't vote to support those programs, stop voting for them. Right. Like stop reelecting people.

Brandy Schantz (15:32.462)
Yes.

Helen P (15:36.154)
who are going to use veteran issues as a political tool. And like that frustrates me more than anything, cause like, I don't care what side of the aisle, like don't sit there and come and like, you know, shake hands and kiss babies and like wave the flag and whatever with veterans. If you're the one that actually voted against the services that keep us alive. people like, you know, I hate, people are always like, you're making it political. And I'm like, it kinda is.

Brandy Schantz (16:05.483)
Everything's political.

Helen P (16:06.48)
It is. like the thing is, it doesn't have to be nasty, but like just stop voting for it. Find a different candidate. know, like send your $12 a month to somebody who actually is going to support it. And, you know, I would say that if, you know, on both sides of the aisle, like you can look at politicians who do a really good job. You know, one of my favorite politicians right now, he's actually the attorney general for North Carolina, Jeff Jackson.

is incredible because he's just very, he's very middle of the road. He's very like, Hey, let me just tell you what's happening. He does these like Instagram where he just fills people in and he will talk about the appropriations, the budgets, the, he will talk about the grandstanding and like, this is what you may have seen on TV, but here's what really happened. And I love that because I think for so many people they've, you know, they've, they've seen so many of these like outrageous headlines about things and then they don't know what to believe.

Brandy Schantz (16:34.35)
Mm-hmm.

Brandy Schantz (16:45.539)
Yeah.

Brandy Schantz (16:50.776)
I love that.

Helen P (17:01.678)
And so then nothing gets done about it. And in the meantime, like there are real veteran families that are suffering because these programs are getting cut all of the time, you know, and it's.

Brandy Schantz (17:07.246)
You bet time.

Yes. And what many people don't know, because it didn't really make the news, it didn't make big news, but 2025 started off with a lot of suicides in the VA parking lot. Now, if you don't remember this, there used to be a lot of suicides in the VA parking lot, which does send a message. But that's not what we want to be happening. I don't want to send the message to the VA via suicide by parking lot.

Helen P (17:28.858)
Yeah. Yeah.

Helen P (17:40.176)
Great.

Brandy Schantz (17:40.62)
I want to send a message to the VA by us coming together and working to better our lives. And that's concerning. Why are we seeing that again? We've got to stop it.

Helen P (17:44.208)
Absolutely.

Helen P (17:51.054)
Yeah, I think it's a lack of, I think, you know, and it's, I think that so many people have a tendency to look at it as just a singular issue of like, it was just their post-traumatic stress. And I'm like, listen, it never is a singular issue. It's post-traumatic stress and it's a loss of a job. It's the death of a child. It's the increasing cost of living. It's chronic illness. It's lack of access to care. It's mismanagement of medication. It's all of these things.

And you know, one of the things that I so you know, I am connected in the advocacy side. I am connected with many advocates who also have loved ones who have, you know, gone through with a suicide. And I have asked them, I said, you know, one of the things I'm always. Not curious, but just interested to find out is. Is there ever like a root cause analysis that's done to say, hey, what led to this? Where where was the failure? And what I have heard

Brandy Schantz (18:46.158)
Right.

Helen P (18:50.636)
almost resoundingly is no. They might look at the week before, they might look at the day of, but no one is going back and looking at the entire thing and saying where were the catastrophic failures that led to this being what somebody felt was the only option? And I think that that is where we need to see a lot of change because unless we understand

Brandy Schantz (19:10.786)
Yes.

Helen P (19:20.172)
the why, we can't really get to an intervention and to a solution that really supports them. And the thing that I will say that I see consistently the most as as sort of a unifying sort of uniting factor in all of these events. And I mean, I'm talking about like dozens, if not more of of families that have been impacted by suicide.

is the lack of inclusion of family when we're treating and when we're providing support for veterans affected by post-traumatic stress and suicidality. I mean, to include the fact that, you know, spouses, whether they're men or women, have been written off as just being emotional. she's just being, she's being dramatic, he's being dramatic. It's a marital problem.

Brandy Schantz (19:52.312)
Mm-hmm.

Brandy Schantz (20:10.572)
Yes. Yes.

Helen P (20:15.692)
That's not a factor in their post-traumatic stress, right? They're looking at this and not only that, but like the safety planning, the safety intervention, you know, when the family is the safety plan, what are we doing to address their needs, to address the trauma that they're experiencing? And I think the failure to do that is really a systematic failure that the VA has experienced. And people can talk about like, there's the caregiver program and they can get a stipend. And I'm like, no,

It's more than that. It's education. It's education on medication management. It's education on symptomology. It's education on crisis intervention. What is the crisis intervention plan? Because if that plan is just take them to the ER, that's a horrible plan. so frequently now, you know what the intervention is for most families? Call the police.

Brandy Schantz (20:47.224)
Yes.

Brandy Schantz (21:11.48)
That is the worst possible solution, the worst possible solution.

Helen P (21:13.616)
Absolutely. This is horrible for literally everyone. The veteran, the cops, the family, the kids, the neighborhood, literally everyone. And so it's this problem of like, we need to have veteran interventions, but the flip of that is you gotta fund it. You can't expect these people to work for free. you know, it's funny.

Brandy Schantz (21:25.592)
Yes.

Brandy Schantz (21:36.749)
Yes.

So much of this does come down to the budgeting and the funding. You know, we need more therapy for veterans and for service members. We also need more therapy for families. There's so often I point out, because nobody wants to talk about this part, so people will understand the trauma I'm going through when I explain it. When I explain that I've gone through many years of medical gaslighting, of having to work a full-time job to get my own diagnosis.

of constantly having to fight back to get my own care, of fighting like hell to get a stupid triptan to stop my migraine when the VA is not giving me my prescription and is instead sending suicide hotline people to call me every day. There's all of these things that I can talk about and people are like, I see where that has worn you down to the point that you can't take it anymore. But nobody ever talks about what my husband has gone through.

Helen P (22:19.138)
huh.

Brandy Schantz (22:35.886)
because he has lived through every bit of this with me. He does not have the same trauma I do, but he has trauma and it's related. And that's when things start snowballing because he's my support system. He's all I've got. I've got him and three Pomeranians. That's my support system. So when that support system starts breaking because they're not getting the therapy they need because they're going through their own trauma, although the Pomeranians have their own way of dealing with it they come out, okay, I think the dogs are good, but you know.

Helen P (22:43.034)
Parallel. Yeah. Yeah.

Helen P (22:50.33)
Yeah.

Helen P (22:59.492)
Yeah. Yeah.

Brandy Schantz (23:06.016)
Fund more dogs, fund more therapy for family members because they're going through it too and they're starting to break and when they're breaking then the veteran, the service member breaks more and so on and so forth and it just keeps snowballing. That's our problem.

Helen P (23:08.41)
Yeah.

Helen P (23:15.331)
Exactly.

Helen P (23:19.472)
Yeah, I mean it really is just an absolutely vicious cycle.

But there's, you know, the Elizabeth Dole Foundation does a lot of advocacy on, you know, on the caregiver side. Yeah, they're amazing. So if people aren't familiar with them, please check them out. Their caregiver fellowship program is super educational and also a huge component of getting things like the PACT Act and like the Elizabeth Dole Foundation Act or the Elizabeth Dole Increasing Care Act passed, which went through last year. But there's, you know, there's all of these

Brandy Schantz (23:28.414)
It's great organization.

Brandy Schantz (23:43.502)
Mm-hmm.

Helen P (23:55.268)
There's all of these correlations that we see with the lack of family support. We even had this conversation in our household. We have two small children. Frequently, we pay out of pocket for full-time daycare for both of them to be cared for because during the day we have appointments. But the VA is not kid-friendly. So how can we say that we're supporting veterans when we're also not supporting their families and their kids?

Brandy Schantz (24:21.026)
Mm-hmm.

Helen P (24:22.576)
There are more programs that exist out there to take care of service members pets than there are to support their kids. And that I think is just telling because there's no resources and when people don't have resources they get desperate. They start trying to solve these problems and figure these things out. And by the way, these systems that exist are complicated, they're intentionally complicated.

Brandy Schantz (24:39.0)
Mm-hmm.

Brandy Schantz (24:49.122)
Yes.

Helen P (24:49.648)
And so it ends up with people in these desperate situations and then they make desperate decisions. And again, if we're not funding the programs that keep service members alive, we're not supporting service members. We're not supporting veterans. And that's, you know, it's, it is getting to, I don't think I can truly convey to somebody who's not informed, like how bad the system is getting.

right now, you know, both on active duty and also on in the veteran community. But like we're we're seeing all of we're seeing these crump, we're seeing these things, these signs, these symptoms. And like, I just cannot tell you like, you know, I'm kind of tired of seeing press releases like I like I'm so overseeing, you know, articles that talk about like the plans they have to fix the problems like we've been talking about the problems for 25 years like.

Brandy Schantz (25:20.302)
Mm-hmm.

Brandy Schantz (25:48.398)
Mm-hmm.

Helen P (25:49.454)
Why haven't we fixed it? And so I think a lot of people are just getting to their wits end of like, it's just such a profoundly broken system. And so when people say like, I can't believe this would happen. I'm like, I can.

Brandy Schantz (25:51.288)
Yes.

Brandy Schantz (26:05.39)
Well, yeah. And when you don't go through it, you can't believe it would happen. You know what? There's still days I can't believe that my life is what it is today. And I've been very, you know, we all go through our different emotions. I've been very angry. I've been sad. I've been bewildered. You know, how does this happen? How do we get here? And

Helen P (26:16.709)
Yeah.

Brandy Schantz (26:34.646)
You know, I'm in the DC area. I'm constantly, you know, up trying to advocate for this, that or another something, you know, I'm always there, you know, whether it's for veterans issues or Crohn's colitis or dysautonomia, I'm there. And so often I have politicians from both sides look at me and thank me for my service and then not do the things it takes to make my life better. And it's infuriating. It's infuriating. So when people

Helen P (26:57.496)
Yeah.

Helen P (27:02.148)
Yeah.

Brandy Schantz (27:04.66)
ask, well, why are you no longer giving money to XYZ? Or why are you no longer supporting this or that? That's why. And if you want to know why the people who are nowhere near DC are fed up and just say, well, nobody's helping me, it's because you just didn't help them. That's why. It's not because they're stupid. It's not because, it's because your problem is the one that's in front of you. And when you're trying to live your life and stay alive, whatever it is that you need at that moment.

Helen P (27:19.534)
Yeah. Yeah.

Brandy Schantz (27:31.81)
That's what's most important. And if you're not giving that help to that person, well, they're going to eventually lose hope. And it's very easy to, I, you know, I'm a heck of a strong person, but over these years there have been so many times where I said, know what, I just, I need to give up. There's no point. It's never going to get better. That's how people feel. That's what is leading to these suicides. That's what's leading to people giving up on everyone. That's it. That's the problem.

Helen P (27:38.703)
Yeah.

Helen P (27:48.408)
Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah.

Helen P (27:57.209)
Yeah.

Yeah, I mean, it's it's it's so, you know, I will say that I have had that personal furious moment of having a congressman reach out to me with their veteran case manager to say, hey, we want to help you because they voted to defund the program that like my husband was using that we were like, hey, we can't access this anymore. And they were like, let us help you. And I'm like, you were the one to defund it. Like, you know.

Brandy Schantz (28:19.202)
Mm-hmm.

Brandy Schantz (28:23.822)
Thank you.

Helen P (28:28.568)
I feel like that's a little disingenuous for you to call me and say you want to help me when you literally are responsible for the thing that resulted in me being here. But you know, people, you know, people need to be aware. I think also veterans need to be aware of like why these things are happening and asking, you know, why these programs are going away, why these programs have wait lists, why the VA is no longer paying for, you know, alternative therapies and

Brandy Schantz (28:45.059)
Yes.

Helen P (28:57.552)
why those are being cut. I just saw a bunch of posts about that from people looking for advocates to help them. It's just unfortunate because mental health really is taking a huge hit. again, I think we've covered all these things repeatedly, but it's like,

Brandy Schantz (28:59.587)
Yes.

Helen P (29:23.62)
people, I think people get so overwhelmed that they just want to give up and like, you know, forget it. I don't want to stay engaged and they don't want to keep up with what's going on. It's part of the trauma, 100%. It's also part of the plan because when, you know, if nobody has pointed this out within the VA, it's also true for other systems. But if you wear them down, they stop coming for services and then that's one less person. Right. And so, you know, yeah, it's like I cannot tell people.

Brandy Schantz (29:29.656)
Yeah, and that's part of the trauma. That is part of the trauma. Yes.

Yes.

Brandy Schantz (29:46.956)
Yep. Yep. Right off the books.

Helen P (29:52.996)
But the fight is the point, right? And they know this, and when I say they, it's sort of the proverbial, you know, like government, big systems, corporations, whatever, but they know this. So they may get harder for people to get these accommodations and get these services in the hopes that they will get fatigued and they will go away. So if you're one of those people, please reach out to an advocate who can help you work through those things.

Brandy Schantz (29:55.47)
Mm-hmm.

Brandy Schantz (30:11.598)
Mm-hmm.

Helen P (30:18.404)
Because the more, you know, it's like field of dreams, right? If you build it, they will come. If you use it, then they have to fund it. But when we stop using these programs, then they can say, well, there's been a downtick in utilization of these services. Well, I don't think that's really the case. I think people are just going where they can get the help. And like right now, that's been true for our family where like if our option is to fight and fight and fight and fight and fight for a single appointment every six months,

that is really not even very good and doesn't address our needs, but we can pay out of pocket cash for treatment elsewhere, that's what we're opting to do because it's more important to stay alive than it is to force the system to do the thing that they're not even capable of doing.

Brandy Schantz (31:02.21)
Yes. And that in and of itself is a huge stressor because for so many families, this is becoming very expensive. And I will give the VA this. They do try their best to be as helpful as possible with things that are free. I was just there. I had the best possible appointment, which makes everybody laugh because I was diagnosed with a bunch of stuff that I totally expected.

You know, the normal stuff for getting old. I have osteoarthritis in my neck and my low back. My knees have no cartilage. All the stuff I knew was going to happen. You know, so they gave me the world's largest box of lidocaine patches and a free heating pad, you know, and that felt lovely. was like, look at this, an expected disease, you know, and all the normal stuff. We knew that was happening to this lifelong runner.

Helen P (31:28.815)
Yeah.

Yeah.

Helen P (31:36.089)
Yeah.

Helen P (31:41.494)
Yeah, yeah.

Helen P (31:49.005)
Eheheheh, normal, yeah.

Brandy Schantz (31:55.95)
But there's so much else that I have to come out of pocket for. When you think about, and we're doing quite well in my family. I mean, we don't have nearly as much money as I'd love to have. I'm taking donations every day, but we're still doing OK. And when I think about the number of things that are doctor prescribed that come out of my pocket, my physical therapy, because by the way, they only give you so much. let's be honest, who has the time in their schedule to carve out the 45 minute drive to the one physical therapist that takes the

Helen P (32:07.824)
down.

Helen P (32:22.18)
Yeah.

contracts. Yeah.

Brandy Schantz (32:26.518)
you know, that insurance or whatever, and then back home and, you know, so my physical therapy I have to pay for out of pocket. I pay for at least one massage a month because of the muscle knots that I get due to my dysautonomia. I have to pay for, I take these bath soaks that I do every week trying to just, I mean, there is so much money and work that goes into me being able to stand up and do work for four to five hours a day. It's insane. And people can't afford this.

Helen P (32:53.21)
Yeah.

I mean, we're paying out of pocket $1,200 to $1,500 a month for treatments. that's nothing compared to what other people are paying. listen, compared to civilian people who have...

Brandy Schantz (32:59.555)
Yeah.

Brandy Schantz (33:05.887)
Yes?

Brandy Schantz (33:10.872)
yeah, I get it. Yeah.

Helen P (33:11.682)
Like I'm there, right? But like they also should not have to be having to pay that much. You should not be bankrupted because you got blown up in Afghanistan or because you have Crohn's or because you have cancer. Like you should not be bankrupted. I am very much team like health care is a human right. Everybody should have access to it and there should not be profits in medicine. I think that that is criminal. But like.

Brandy Schantz (33:15.49)
Yes.

Brandy Schantz (33:21.228)
Exactly.

Helen P (33:34.158)
You know, I, you know, people want to talk all the time about like how lucky we are to have TRICARE and VA and all these kinds of things. And I'm like, yeah, but like, dang, man, we're still forking it out. Twelve to fifteen hundred bucks a month could pay for like a whole other insurance plan and then some. And then, you know. Yeah, I mean, it's it's it's insane like how much money we're paying.

Brandy Schantz (33:44.204)
Yeah.

Brandy Schantz (33:49.762)
Yeah, there's some places you could send your kid to private school for that.

Helen P (33:58.274)
And we're not even doing all of the things that we like, like we're picking and choosing what things that we should be doing. If we were doing all of the things, my God, we would be paying $5,000 a month. If we were doing all of the things that we need to be doing and should be doing, but we just have to pick and choose. And it's, you know, I think it's, it's really just sort of an indicator of like how much we really

Brandy Schantz (34:02.476)
Right. Same.

Brandy Schantz (34:10.936)
Yes.

Helen P (34:27.758)
are not taking care of veterans, that this is the reality. And I'll talk to a lot of families on the advocacy side when I'm trying to help them navigate whatever, especially for families who have neuro stuff. And they'll say, my God, how did you do this? And I'm like, we paid out of pocket. We paid out of pocket for all of this testing. We paid out of pocket for all of these diagnostics, for private providers, all of these kinds of things.

And it's the same thing for a lot of people with their post-traumatic stress, with their moral injury, with their mental health, right? Like they're paying out of pocket to get it done because it's just not getting done on the other side. And I think that's criminal, especially for veterans who like the deal was we signed up, we did our bid, they're supposed to provide and they are not providing. like that is where I have an issue. I have an issue with the fact that like

Brandy Schantz (34:58.318)
Mm-hmm.

Brandy Schantz (35:04.899)
Right.

Brandy Schantz (35:16.27)
Exactly.

Helen P (35:23.32)
you know, we're saying that we're like realigning all these like veteran healthcare stuff, but like, I'll be honest, I really have not seen that. You know, and it's, it's just, it's disheartening, you know, and I empathize with families who are just like in it and struggling because

Brandy Schantz (35:30.958)
Right.

Brandy Schantz (35:42.723)
Mm-hmm.

Helen P (35:43.832)
You know, and if, if people, you know, like I said, I've said before, if people need to like reach out to try to find an advocate who can help them navigate the system and find solutions to their problems, like I'm here for it because I get how hard it is, you know, and it's, it's, it's exhausting when the fight has already been kicked out of you. You know, you can always, you can only kick, kick a dog. What's that phrase? You can kick a dog so many times before they don't get back up again, you know, and it's, and it's the same, it's the same for so many veterans who, you know,

Brandy Schantz (35:56.706)
Yes.

Brandy Schantz (36:07.288)
That's true.

Helen P (36:14.224)
are just kind of over the fight, you know, like it is, it is a hundred percent exhausting. say, I was like, we're getting ready to go into another fight with VA, but I, I it's, and you know, I think, I think the other thing is too, that so many veterans feel like, especially now, like I've seen this more and more where veterans are feeling like their VA ratings are being used as,

Brandy Schantz (36:16.898)
Yeah, success soon.

Brandy Schantz (36:24.524)
I know.

Helen P (36:39.152)
ammunition against them as like threats of like well if you don't like what we have to offer then we will you know decrease your ratings and we will you know all of these kinds of things.

Brandy Schantz (36:41.346)
Yes. Yes.

Brandy Schantz (36:48.002)
Yes. Well, that's, they've been playing some nasty games at the VA for a while. My files are messed up like you wouldn't believe. I mean, we'd have to go through another hour long show to go through how badly my file is messed up. But I'm scared to death to go in and correct it because if you ask them to correct your file, it opens you to being decreased.

Helen P (36:53.732)
Yeah.

Helen P (37:15.45)
Yeah, decreased. Yeah, we're in the same boat. For epilepsy specifically, the rating system that they have is based on like, and I'm not making this up. It's based on like a 1960s understanding of epilepsy. It's very archaic. It is not evidence-based. It is very discriminatory against people who have complex epileptic disorders. And like to read, if you're a neuro provider and you look at the ratings, you would be like, this is obscene that this is the way that they consider it.

Brandy Schantz (37:16.726)
And that's ridiculous.

Brandy Schantz (37:29.475)
Yes.

Helen P (37:45.04)
But it's the same thing, right? We're all afraid of doing anything for them to take away the crumbs that they're giving because that's how it's been made out. And the thing that I've always pointed out to people is, if you talk about physical abilities between somebody, what's the difference between somebody who's 90 % disabled and 100 % disabled, right? Physically, probably not much.

Brandy Schantz (37:55.115)
Exactly.

Brandy Schantz (38:08.408)
Right.

Brandy Schantz (38:11.992)
Very little, yeah.

Helen P (38:13.05)
But if financially you're talking about the difference of $2,000 a month. And so when we talk about why do people have this financial motive to go back and keep getting increases and increases and increases, and why are people, you know, you know, kind of up, up charging or whatever on their symptoms, it's because they're trying to like get what they need to be able to like have a life. And it's, you know,

Brandy Schantz (38:15.534)
huge. Yeah.

Brandy Schantz (38:37.07)
Yeah.

Helen P (38:39.632)
like the, and if people don't believe me, like go look up the VA ratings for losing a leg. Cause that's 30%. It's 30 % for losing a fricking, yeah. But like, yeah. So I mean, it's same for an arm, right? Now if you lose two limbs, then you can get a hundred percent. But here's the other thing. Like we know we have a friend who's an amputee.

Brandy Schantz (38:46.038)
It's absurd. It's absurd. 30 % for losing a leg. Thank you for your service. Thank you for your service. my god. Yeah.

Helen P (39:05.296)
And he has scars all over and he has, you know, obviously he's an amputee, he's missing a hand. And so, you know, he obviously has impairment of his hand, right? So that should give him a rating. But because he's an amputee, he doesn't get a rating for the hand that he's missing. as if that is like not, you know what I mean? Like it's this whole convoluted nonsense system of like.

Brandy Schantz (39:24.664)
my

Helen P (39:30.85)
you know, or I have, you know, I know patients who had phantom leg, limb pain for their leg that was amputated and phantom limb pain has its own designation, but they wouldn't do any of the other like associated like joint pain or whatever, because they're like, well, the joint doesn't exist. I'm like, yes, but like also no, like that's.

Brandy Schantz (39:36.492)
Yeah.

Brandy Schantz (39:50.318)
But also, you, I mean, let's go to the definition of phantom leg pain.

Helen P (39:54.48)
Yeah, I have a friend who was shot in the butt. He has shrapnel behind his knee. His knee pain from said shrapnel from the bullet is rated as not service connected.

Brandy Schantz (40:09.532)
my God.

Helen P (40:10.358)
It's a bullet in the leg. And they said, well, that's not a known cause of knee pain. And I was like, really? Yeah, I mean, some of this stuff is just so nonsensical, but yes, I have another friend who was, you know, he's a bilateral above the knee amputee. They did an x-ray at the VA that read that his patella's were still intact. That's your knee caps.

Brandy Schantz (40:17.713)
Brandy Schantz (40:22.062)
I mean, it's a comedy hour. We could do a comedy hour with all of our bad VA ratings, honestly.

Brandy Schantz (40:36.198)
my God.

Helen P (40:36.792)
And he's like, I haven't had patella's in 10 years, you know? You know, it's just, it's this nonsensical stuff. But like the frustration and the anger and the ridiculousness like is the point. Like they want people, you know, to walk away from it and they want people to just stop trying.

Brandy Schantz (40:48.899)
Yes.

Helen P (40:55.208)
But it's also, you there needs to be accountability on the civilian and veteran side of like, we need to stop voting for people who are not going to fund these programs. And we need to advocate for our community to say like, hey, it doesn't matter the cause, it doesn't matter the why, it matters that they're getting access to the resources that they need. And that includes the entire family, not just the veteran. But that's my TED talk.

Brandy Schantz (41:02.914)
Yes.

Brandy Schantz (41:14.296)
Exactly.

Brandy Schantz (41:19.564)
Yep. That's probably the most important. Yeah, that's the most important point, I think, for today's show. Stand up and stand together. Stand together. No, no this or that or what did this person get or that person get or I was in combat more than this person. No, we are family. We stand together. If we stand together, we get what we need. Stand together.

Helen P (41:30.373)
Yeah.

Helen P (41:44.528)
Yeah, it's not the trauma Olympics. Nobody's getting a medal because one person has more traumatic stories than the other.

Brandy Schantz (41:54.86)
Yep. And let's hold their feet to the fire. Hold these politicians feet to the fire. We need to increase our funding. All right. Well, thank you again, Helen. We still have so much to talk about. you know, at this point, I feel like I just need to start a second podcast. That's just all military and veterans, because we could do this all day long, all day long. But if you're looking for more information, go to my website, brandyshontz.com.

Helen P (41:58.522)
Yeah, absolutely.

Helen P (42:10.113)
You

Yeah, absolutely.

Brandy Schantz (42:20.396)
I'll be getting on there soon some letters that you can use to send to your representative. If you've never contacted your representative, give them a call, send them an email, and just say, hey, we need to be funding these veterans programs and let's restore military health funding. So thank you again. Till next time, Helen.

Helen P (42:43.268)
Thanks so much.