SPEAKER_01: All right.
SPEAKER_01: Well, welcome back to the follow-up.
SPEAKER_01: I'm your happening host, Pastor Ryan, and I'm joined by Pastors Jeff and Arlen.
SPEAKER_01: What's up, you guys?
SPEAKER_01: How are you doing today?
SPEAKER_00: I'm doing good.
SPEAKER_00: Fantastic.
SPEAKER_01: Wonderful.
SPEAKER_01: We had the privilege of closing out the series on Jonah, getting to preach on Jonah chapter four.
SPEAKER_01: And you guys preached on this chapter before?
SPEAKER_02: Uh with student ministry like three years ago.
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
SPEAKER_02: But it's been a minute.
SPEAKER_00: I did a sermon on the whole book, like a few years ago.
SPEAKER_00: And so we just like we just basically did like a flyover like the entire book.
SPEAKER_00: And so yeah, we didn't we didn't like hunker down into the passage to the specific verses like we got to in this one.
SPEAKER_00: So yeah, this was this was fun.
SPEAKER_01: That was fun.
SPEAKER_01: I have been through Jonah a handful of times in youth ministry and in big church stuff and never gotten in there to preach on this passage.
SPEAKER_01: So and the other thing is that like I was looking at my kids' storybook Bibles, like a lot of them don't have this chapter, uh, don't have this part of the story where Jonah's like all mad, you know?
SPEAKER_02: Um, it cuts it off after three.
SPEAKER_01: Right, right.
SPEAKER_01: So um, you know, we we all kind of talked about it, but there's an abrupt ending here for the book, ends with a rhetorical question from God.
SPEAKER_01: Um, should I not also care about the Ninevice and also many animals?
SPEAKER_01: That's how that's how it ends.
SPEAKER_01: Um so as you studied, as you learned, why do you think the book ends this way?
SPEAKER_01: What what do you think is going on there?
SPEAKER_02: Uh one thing that I said when I was preaching through, I I kind of posed the question for all the questions that God's asking, right?
SPEAKER_02: Because he asked twice, is it right for you to be angry?
SPEAKER_02: And then he asks this question at the end.
SPEAKER_02: And I lovingly just challenged us.
SPEAKER_02: I think God's also asking us these questions, right?
SPEAKER_02: I said it doesn't end with Jonah's answer.
SPEAKER_02: Uh, but Jonah, I'm sure, did answer, but we don't need to see his answer because I think that this is the ending of Jonah 4's asking directly asking you that question.
SPEAKER_02: I think that that's what scripture is trying to get you to think um and and get you to process.
SPEAKER_02: So I think it ends more on the ambiguous side because it's asking us to actually consider our own hearts in that same way.
SPEAKER_00: It's a good call.
SPEAKER_00: And I yeah, I think there's a there's a confrontive nature there where um I think you see throughout the story of scripture, God's people are, I guess, confronted with how much they tend to prioritize themselves, like the just the in terms of being like the privileges of being within the covenant versus seeing their role as like actually it's cosmic, it's bigger, it's much bigger than than just, hey, let me just sit here and and um enjoy the privileges of being in the Lord and in right covenant with God, but it's also an opportunity, I think, that um uh to recognize, even as the Israelites would have been reading this, you know, a generation later, um, like their own hearts, their own posture towards the nations.
SPEAKER_00: Um so yeah, I I mean I think that in, you know, Arlen, you said the same thing I did in terms of like the the mirror.
SPEAKER_00: I think this is the mirror aspect, like where it's like it's it wants you to to answer the question.
SPEAKER_00: Like, and then so we don't get to see Jonah's answer.
SPEAKER_00: Um, because it probably it wouldn't have been good.
SPEAKER_00: I mean, I think it I don't know.
SPEAKER_00: I mean, maybe I have a bad like opinion of Jonah, but it I don't picture him going, you know what, you're right, Lord.
SPEAKER_00: Like, I'm I'm wicked, you know, you were merciful to me.
SPEAKER_00: I should have compassion on them.
SPEAKER_00: Thank you for saving the Ninevehites.
SPEAKER_00: Like, I'm so grateful that you did that for them and for me.
SPEAKER_00: Like, I just I don't know that there was uh any of us are set up for that response from him.
SPEAKER_01: Um yeah, but yeah, yeah, absolutely.
SPEAKER_01: I think it is meant to cause us to reflect, the original readers, the Israelites to reflect as well.
SPEAKER_01: So just interesting.
SPEAKER_01: I I love noticing those unique kind of literary things in the Bible that um, you know, when you're younger and you're first exploring the Bible, you don't always pick up on that.
SPEAKER_01: But uh God, God in his wisdom has given us um a diversity of kinds of literature and and it does different things, it impacts us and it acts on us in different ways.
SPEAKER_01: So it's very cool.
SPEAKER_01: Um, I wanted to ask, you know, sometimes we prep for messages, we spend time reading and discussing, you know, we we read this much or we study this much, and we gotta condense it down, you know, we gotta like narrow it into that that window.
SPEAKER_01: So was there anything that you guys felt like you left uh, you know, left on the cutting room floor, any little tidbits?
SPEAKER_01: I I had one that I wanted to share, but I don't know if you guys had anything that you're like, ooh, this is an insight that really struck me, or something that um I learned, you know, afresh studying the passage this week.
SPEAKER_02: Um I I kind of mentioned it, but I didn't zoom in on it.
SPEAKER_02: The fact that God asked twice, is it right to be angry?
SPEAKER_02: Um I think that there's uh I I heard a long time ago, uh repetition is important.
SPEAKER_02: So if you see something in scripture more than once, it's actually a really important thing.
SPEAKER_02: And so for um for God to be asking Jonah twice, is it right for you to be angry?
SPEAKER_02: And he's asking about two different things in that way.
SPEAKER_02: And so he's asking, is it right for you to be angry about the the Ninevehes?
SPEAKER_02: Isn't it right for you to be angry about the about the plant?
SPEAKER_02: Um, and so it's a whole it's a whole in like intensely deep dive into the heart of Jonah in that.
SPEAKER_02: And I didn't want to you could you could rabbit trail in a million different ways in that, but I think the fact that God his response twice is is it right for you to be angry?
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, that's so good.
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I you know, there were two things I think.
SPEAKER_00: One occurred to me later, actually, I was listening, Arlen, I was listening to your sermon, and the fact that he's he doesn't ask, is it right to be angry?
SPEAKER_00: He is it right for you to be angry?
SPEAKER_00: Like, like, I mean, there's a like a there's a personal nature of like, Jonah, really?
SPEAKER_00: Like you for you to be angry, you who have been extended mercy and grace and are in a situation that you're only here because I showed that to you.
SPEAKER_00: Um, I think that that piece of like it's not just abstract, is it right to be angry in this situation?
SPEAKER_00: But then I didn't get to to focus a whole lot, and I'm sure there's a lot of like hyperlinks, you know, right as you like to say with uh with Exodus 34, like in like the the times where we see that show up throughout the old testament because it's it's such a repeated phrase.
SPEAKER_00: I know Bible projects done, you know, um entire series, you know, dissecting that.
SPEAKER_00: And so I'm sure there's some real applicability of like him mentioning that and and when did we see that earlier, and and some of those uh aspects that I I felt like I just didn't have the time to really hunker down.
SPEAKER_00: I'm sure there's there's a lot of like tussle.
SPEAKER_00: Uh yeah, what's up?
SPEAKER_02: I touched on it briefly.
SPEAKER_02: I was like, hey, in this moment, he's quoting it back to him, and then basically I'd I pointed out like uh imagine saying these things to God.
SPEAKER_02: Like imagine being in that position and like I knew you were too good, God.
SPEAKER_02: I knew this because you you told me this.
SPEAKER_02: And so again, there's a million sermon illustrations, and and there's a million ways to dive into that.
SPEAKER_02: But yeah, that actually is 34 piece.
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, very much couldn't dive.
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
SPEAKER_01: So one thing, one thing that uh jumped out at me, I just felt like it was gonna take us too far afield, and I'd lose most of the people.
SPEAKER_01: But Jonah builds a shelter for himself.
SPEAKER_01: Maybe you guys studied this or you saw this too.
SPEAKER_01: He builds a shelter, and it's the word sukkah.
SPEAKER_01: Uh, the festival of booths that Israel celebrates is sukkot, which is the plural form of sukkah.
SPEAKER_01: So he builds himself a booth there up on the hill.
SPEAKER_01: And at least one commentary I read said there's probably an illusion here that you're supposed to see Jonah is sitting up there and he's kind of celebrating the festival of booths himself.
SPEAKER_01: And the festival of booths was meant to like look back to Israel's deliverance from slavery, so their own salvation.
SPEAKER_01: And in Zechariah 14, Zechariah gets a vision of the eschatological like age, the new creation.
SPEAKER_01: And part of what God projects into the future is there's gonna come a day when all the nations of the earth are gonna come and celebrate the festival of booths with God's people.
SPEAKER_01: So there's this like ingathering of the nations, people from every tribe telling nations doing the festival of booths and celebrating God's deliverance.
SPEAKER_01: So that festival is meant to be a backwards looking to their previous salvation and a forwards looking to what God's gonna do.
SPEAKER_01: And here Jonah is up on a hill, mad that God's delivered the Ninevehes, and he's up there celebrating by himself.
SPEAKER_01: And you're you're supposed to be like, oh man, it's so so.
SPEAKER_01: I'm like, so I saw that, but I was like, man, just take too much, take too much time, you know, and um really uh an interesting connection.
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, those rabbit trails.
SPEAKER_02: I mean, even the fact that he built the shelter and his shelter wasn't good enough to cover him, and then God had to give him a plant anyway, you know, like like the fact that there's there's a million things to even look into that.
SPEAKER_02: Just the fact that Jonah was so inadequate in so many ways, his shelter even fell out.
SPEAKER_01: I know, I know, I know.
SPEAKER_01: Well, so one thing that we all, you know, kind of drove home a little bit is you have this theme in Jonah that he loves mercy for himself, loves God's grace for himself, but he wants justice for the Ninevehes.
SPEAKER_01: It's like uh, you know, you guys said, you know, basically like grace for me or mercy for me, justice for thee.
SPEAKER_01: Um, so I mean, let's do a little bit of self-reflection here.
SPEAKER_01: What are the ways that that shows up in in our lives?
SPEAKER_01: How do you how have you seen that, whether that's just personally or people you've interacted with, um, where we can fall into that rut of, man, I I love God's mercy for me, but you know, wanting to see others held to account.
SPEAKER_01: What does that look like?
SPEAKER_00: So that's a good question.
SPEAKER_00: I I, you know, uh there's a little bit of an example.
SPEAKER_00: It was, it's not necessarily a straight one.
SPEAKER_00: We had this uh project in seminary where we had, it was called a grace paper.
SPEAKER_00: And essentially people got to uh it was an extra credit assignment.
SPEAKER_00: And so you could opt in and get extra credit and it would increase and give you, you know, kind of a little bit higher standing in the class.
SPEAKER_00: And so you didn't have to do it, but you could do it.
SPEAKER_00: And so what ended up happening, you know, probably half the class did the paper and a number of me included, I didn't do the paper.
SPEAKER_00: And then when it came time to turn the paper in, everybody got credit for for having done the paper.
SPEAKER_00: And you should have seen just the the look of on the faces of the people who did the paper, you know, and they worked hard.
SPEAKER_00: It was, I mean, it wasn't a huge paper, it was four or five, you know, like term paper on the subject of grace.
SPEAKER_00: And they were really like just, you know, there's those fleshy moments of like being frustrated, like, no, I earned this and you're getting it.
SPEAKER_00: Like, you know, just the frustration of it.
SPEAKER_00: Um, I was super happy because I'm like, man, I did nothing.
SPEAKER_00: And I got credit for having written that paper.
SPEAKER_00: My roommate was not happy, like having stayed up late and you know, and and toiled through just really wrestling through that.
SPEAKER_00: But still, there's we both like got to enjoy the the fruits of that.
SPEAKER_00: And I think that there is that it's the horizontal aspect that's so difficult at times.
SPEAKER_00: And and maybe it is just that we think we've earned it.
SPEAKER_00: Like we think, oh, you know, like I I know me, I know my story, I know all the the reasons why I do the things I do.
SPEAKER_00: Um, and and God understands that, and that's why he gave me grace.
SPEAKER_00: But you, even though you may have done the same things, I don't, I don't even stop to consider what what may be going on with you.
SPEAKER_00: Um, and so it's just, I don't know, I I deserve it because I have all these extenuating circumstances and things going on in my life, but but you, even though you did the same thing, you you should get, you know, the consequences of your actions.
SPEAKER_01: Um you're saying like deep down, deep down, there's a part of us that believes that we deserve salvation or we deliver we deserve God's mercy.
SPEAKER_01: Like there's a there's if we really were to be gut level honest, there's a part of us that's like, yeah, I mean, God had to be gracious with me, but like I'm also kind of, you know, I kind of deserve what I'm getting.
SPEAKER_02: I think that's I think that's pretty natural though.
SPEAKER_02: Like if you ask most people, are you a good person?
SPEAKER_02: What's our answer gonna be?
SPEAKER_02: I think most people are gonna say, Yeah, I, you know, I I I uh don't commit that many crimes or I don't do that many bad things, you know.
SPEAKER_02: I think I think the vast majority of people probably see themselves as good.
SPEAKER_02: Um and and that's that's a hard reality when when confronted with the gospel that like, hey, uh whether or not you did something that was good or kind, like you're still separated from the Lord and you're still you're still need to be to be saved.
SPEAKER_02: I think where I notice it the most is sometimes I think um from from like Christian to non-Christian, right?
SPEAKER_02: This like, hey, you are doing wicked stuff.
SPEAKER_02: The Bible says that that's not good, so therefore justice and all this stuff.
SPEAKER_02: And so I think that that's where I see it a lot, um, or even from brother to brother within the church, right?
SPEAKER_02: Like uh just almost like an abusive level of accountability, like, hey, I'm gonna come after you in justice.
SPEAKER_02: And I'm not saying that that it happens all the time, but those are areas where it's where it can pop up, um, where we want grace for ourselves, um, and then we look at somebody else and we're not super willing to extend it.
SPEAKER_02: I use the example of imagine you're getting you get pulled over, the cop lets you go, and then somebody speeds past you the next day, and you're like, I hope there's a cop to go get them.
SPEAKER_02: And we just that's just kind of an innate human reality.
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
SPEAKER_00: Can you imagine?
SPEAKER_00: Oh, sorry, go ahead.
SPEAKER_00: No, go ahead.
SPEAKER_00: No, you're good.
SPEAKER_00: You're good.
SPEAKER_00: Can you imagine?
SPEAKER_00: I was just saying, can you imagine God coming back and going, Oh, oh, Jonah, you want justice.
SPEAKER_00: You know what?
SPEAKER_00: Let me let me just throw you back into the sea and let you drown.
SPEAKER_00: Like, like you really want justice?
SPEAKER_00: Okay, we can be all about justice.
SPEAKER_00: Let's let's just rewind the tape.
SPEAKER_00: You know, let's go back and think at that point be like, okay, yeah, no, I'll I'll take I'll take the grace, I'll take the mercy that I don't.
SPEAKER_01: Absolutely.
SPEAKER_01: I was really impacted um by a a teaching and book a number of years ago that really focused on um kind of fruit to root, or sorry, root to fruit, you know, like, okay, there's a root in my heart, and then how is the fruit coming out of my life?
SPEAKER_01: And nailing it back down to these like four, you know, statements about God that I do or don't believe in.
SPEAKER_01: Um, the one that's like, God is gracious, so I don't have to prove myself.
SPEAKER_01: The fruit that I don't believe that is like I'm angry and I'm not patient with others.
SPEAKER_01: Um, I am judgmental, I'm quick to like be harsh towards other people or to make snap judgments.
SPEAKER_01: And what that reveals about my heart is that like somewhere deep down inside, I believe that like I am good enough or I have, you know, um I would pass the test, you know, if if if judgment came, and that like I'm not living in grace.
SPEAKER_01: Um, so that other people should have to live up to my expectations.
SPEAKER_01: Um and I I don't need to be patient and gracious with others because I'm I'm good enough, you know.
SPEAKER_01: Um, and so I I look for that in my own heart.
SPEAKER_01: Like there are times where I'm again harsh towards people, overly critical, and it's like, oh boy, that just reveals like I don't uh I haven't I believe, but I don't yet fully believe, you know, in in God's grace.
SPEAKER_01: Um certainly not living into it for sure.
SPEAKER_01: Um I want to talk a little bit about uh justice because you know some people might hear this and be like, okay, I I see God's grace, I get that, but also like the Ninevites, and and each of you pointed this out, you know, the Ninevites were bad people.
SPEAKER_01: Like they they mutilated people, they tortured people.
SPEAKER_01: Not saying that every person in the city was doing that, but they were completely a wicked society.
SPEAKER_01: And um, many of the people who were spared from God's judgment probably had done, you know, heinous things.
SPEAKER_01: So how do we like how do you guys hold this intention?
SPEAKER_01: Do you do you pray for God's judgment ever on other people?
SPEAKER_01: Is it okay to pray for God's judgment against other people?
SPEAKER_01: Is it never okay?
SPEAKER_01: I don't know.
SPEAKER_01: What what do you what do you say?
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, that's a I think that's a hard question to to start to wrestle with.
SPEAKER_02: Um for me, here's where here's where I land.
SPEAKER_02: Um I really just pray for God's will in a lot of areas, and and I trust that He is gonna He's gonna move through that.
SPEAKER_02: Um I do think that we should, as Christians, call out wrongdoing.
SPEAKER_02: I do.
SPEAKER_02: I just think I think when we see something that is not right, or especially within within a body of believers or within something, I do think we have an obligation to speak up against and and say, hey, this isn't good, this is not of the Lord.
SPEAKER_02: I think that we have that responsibility.
SPEAKER_02: Um, but I think on the same level of responsibility that we have for accountability, we should also really desire restoration and reconciliation just as equal, right?
SPEAKER_02: And so, so should I call out when something is not right?
SPEAKER_02: Absolutely, but then should I be willing to really want to walk with somebody and restore them in the Lord?
SPEAKER_02: Absolutely.
SPEAKER_02: And so that's a that's a hard tension to hold because sometimes we just want to call out the bad and not help them move into what the Lord wants.
SPEAKER_02: And so uh, yes, we should want the we should want what is righteous because that's what the Lord wants.
SPEAKER_02: And we should want what is good and what is what is holy, but also at the same time understand that we are not the definitive decider of what that is.
SPEAKER_02: Uh, that's the Lord.
SPEAKER_02: And so operating within the will of the Lord.
SPEAKER_01: It's like because I'm I'm not holy, like I'm not sinless, I might fool myself into thinking that I can righteously call for judgment for other people when actually like it too quickly gets twisted into me thinking I'm righteous.
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
SPEAKER_01: And um kind of like kind of like everybody thinks that uh, you know, like it's it's possible to have righteous anger.
SPEAKER_01: That's true, that is true, but everybody thinks that their anger is righteous, you know?
SPEAKER_01: And it's like probably most of the time, my my anger, my anger at least, is not righteous.
SPEAKER_01: Um, but I could trick myself into thinking it is, you know.
SPEAKER_01: Um yeah.
SPEAKER_01: Uh Jeff, what were you gonna say?
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I mean, I think uh I guess uh there's a tension there when we have like the imprecatory psalms, you know, that are like out of the teeth of the wicked, and I mean, like it is praying, judgment come down.
SPEAKER_00: Um I think I I tend to see those as definitely most applicable to who screw, you know, the I think the New Testament highlights are real spiritual enemies.
SPEAKER_00: I mean, I think that there's absolutely like a sense of God's will being done to push back evil, to press light into the darkness.
SPEAKER_00: I think when we get into the New Testament, um, I'm just trying to think of like there's a number of times where I will absolutely play, Lord, ruin them for everything but you.
SPEAKER_00: Like ruin someone that they might see you.
SPEAKER_00: And and if that, like there are times where I know y'all probably had loved ones where you're like, man, they're going through a hard season, suffering, you know, health scare, those kind of things.
SPEAKER_00: It will this be the thing that maybe will snap them out and go, oh man, I need you.
SPEAKER_00: Like I can't rely on the things, all the things that I was relying on previously, and I pray, Lord, that they would be ruined for everything but you and see you.
SPEAKER_00: And you kind of even see this with dis of the discipline process, where if you're walking someone through and they're not repenting from their sin, like it's a fellow believer, um, then the while the the process ends with, okay, actually you do say, okay, because brother or sister, you're not repenting, you're not walking with the Lord, what we're gonna do is we're gonna we're gonna disfellowship with you and the hopes, and scripture even says that like Satan would like basically like attack your flesh and again make like like reveal those things that you might behold God all the more.
SPEAKER_00: And so there is a way in which you're, I mean, even in that process going in even in your mercy, would would this exile create a tension in you that would then pursue the Lord all the more?
SPEAKER_00: And so you almost see that even within like the church as well as I think people that that don't know him, that they might see him even if calamity were to come, that there would be a response there.
SPEAKER_00: Because I think at the end of the day, if you look at the law, like the law has provision for people to repent.
SPEAKER_00: And so, I mean, it's it's not always a one and done death sentence for transgressors of of even the Levitical law.
SPEAKER_00: And so, I mean, their repentance in that process, like they could do all the things, you know, in terms of, you know, obviously there's probably individual repentance that will be required for Ninevites.
SPEAKER_00: Um, but Jonah seems to want destruction.
SPEAKER_00: Like, I mean, I don't think there's any desire to, oh, maybe they'll like step into the sacrificial system and do all the right things and walk in faithfulness.
SPEAKER_00: He didn't he don't want any of that, he didn't want any part of that.
SPEAKER_02: And so um, so it's vengeance that he that he desires more than just yeah, I think I think where Jonah was not wrong for saying that the Ninevehites did bad stuff.
SPEAKER_02: They did, right?
SPEAKER_02: And so it's not wrong for a Christian to say what's going on is bad, right?
SPEAKER_02: Like if you see something that is just not right and abysmal things like this are happening, it's not wrong to say, this is not of the Lord, this is not okay, this is not righteous.
SPEAKER_02: I I think where Jonah's heart fell short and where he got off track was then he started wanting, he did not want restoration or reconciliation for those people, but he wanted those people to suffer and eventually die, right?
SPEAKER_02: Like that's what he wanted for them.
SPEAKER_02: And so I think again, accountability is not a not a bad thing, but accountability needs to be partnered with a desire for reconciliation with the Lord.
SPEAKER_02: And and so I think I think kind of what Jeff is saying, like, hey, if something is going on, our heart is to walk with them through that and to like to love them through that, and to, and then eventually if they decide not to, I mean, that's a whole different conversation.
SPEAKER_02: But I think restoration and and reconciliation with the Lord should be our heart for anybody and everybody.
SPEAKER_02: And and that's a hard place when you are seeing something that can be so egregious.
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, and Arlen, you had a really good line about I think you're you're referencing something a pastor had said to you once about, you know, if you're wishing for the death of your enemy, basically you've like forgotten the grace that rescued you or something like that.
SPEAKER_01: Yep.
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I I think that's really true.
SPEAKER_01: And Jeff, I think you're right that when we trace um basically that theme of retribution and justice into the New Testament, what we find is like, yeah, there are enemies, God's people have enemies, but as we get a fuller and fuller Revelation in Jesus and in the New Testament kind of expands on what we have in the Old Testament.
SPEAKER_01: We see that our real enemies are not the human beings who are made in the image of God, but the dark powers who have, you know, are working their will through sinful humans and deceiving sinful humans.
SPEAKER_01: And so we never look at, we never look at individual humans, no matter like what their agenda is, what they're, you know, they're captured by.
SPEAKER_01: We never totally say they are irredeemable.
SPEAKER_01: That person is the enemy.
SPEAKER_01: It's like, man, they're in bondage to sin, they're in bondage to Satan.
SPEAKER_01: We pray for them.
SPEAKER_01: We pray that we pray for justice, that God would make things right.
SPEAKER_01: Um, but the best thing would be if they're redeemed and they're rescued.
SPEAKER_01: And so always keep that in mind, even as we long for justice.
SPEAKER_01: Um, well, hey, we got to wrap up here pretty quick, but I want to just quick want to ask, you know, we really tried to highlight how Jonah's heart is not aligned with God's heart, not matching God's heart.
SPEAKER_01: And we see that in the way he responds.
SPEAKER_01: Um, and I heard from a couple people as they were leaving, and maybe y'all did as well, this sort of like, oh man, feels like you were meddling a little bit, God's meddling a little bit, and maybe he's revealing some stuff about my heart.
SPEAKER_01: So, you know, to somebody who's who's still, you know, walking around with this passage rolling around their brain, um, what would you say if they recognize, like, man, my heart's my heart is not mashed up with God's?
SPEAKER_01: What might be some next steps or response to this?
SPEAKER_02: Pray.
SPEAKER_02: Pray, pray, pray, pray, pray.
SPEAKER_02: I think that like sometimes it's the answer that we like to just throw out there.
SPEAKER_02: Um, but my goodness, praying is such a healthy, healthy thing for Christians to do because it doesn't move God, it moves us, right?
SPEAKER_02: Like to pray constantly to say, and I even shared this.
SPEAKER_02: I prayed over and over, God, give me eyes so that I can see people the way you see them.
SPEAKER_02: And that changed my heart.
SPEAKER_02: That changed who I was.
SPEAKER_02: That was not, that didn't move God closer to Arlen's view.
SPEAKER_02: I didn't pray that God uh have my eyes so that I'm justified, right?
SPEAKER_02: Like that's not what I prayed.
SPEAKER_02: I prayed, God, give me your eyes so that way I can see people like you do.
SPEAKER_02: And and I think that man, it all starts with prayer, it all starts with prayer, and then I think you really do have to do your best to understand what God's calling us to do through the teaching of his word, through this uh study of his word, but it's it's praying.
SPEAKER_02: God humble me, break my heart for people, give me eyes, give me ears, give me uh give me an opportunity to practice these things.
SPEAKER_02: I think like when you pray for patience, that's when you find yourself behind the slowest drivers on planet earth.
SPEAKER_02: I think that's the Lord's answering your prayers.
SPEAKER_02: And and so I think man, it never underestimate prayer in the Lord and asking him for some stuff.
SPEAKER_02: And I think if you can really center your life around asking the Lord to align you with him, it's gonna it it just does.
SPEAKER_02: And and I know that from experience.
SPEAKER_00: That's so good.
SPEAKER_00: I it's funny.
SPEAKER_00: You uh I had someone come up and said, Hey, I I think you kind of prepped us for the uncomfortable series today.
SPEAKER_00: Um like there were a number of moments where I was I felt very uncomfortable, like just you know, like as far as just the you know, the the questions that were being the self-examination that was happening in the midst of it.
SPEAKER_00: I'm like, that's funny.
SPEAKER_00: I wouldn't I that it wasn't I wasn't even a forethought in my mind of like, yeah, this actually is kind of a good, like, oh, you got to kind of sit in the heaviness of it because it it's meant to per to to push you in there.
SPEAKER_00: And I and I think that that's where you know the the the last things I highlighted were man staying close to to the Lord, you know, in his word and prayer and worship, like that's how you become like your heart begins to start to look more like his.
SPEAKER_00: Um there's there's these passages that I wish I could have gotten time just talking about how our relationships to idols, you know, that that those who worship idols become like them.
SPEAKER_00: And so I think that in the same way as we behold the Lord, we become like what we worship.
SPEAKER_00: And so um, so I think that, yeah, the intimacy with God, those, those ordinary, like the spiritual disciplines um that are not just for like, you know, good good health, therefore, hey, I want to hope my heart to be stirred, to be aligned, to to match with the Lord all the more.
SPEAKER_00: Like those are those are huge.
SPEAKER_00: Um and I think we we undervalue that.
SPEAKER_00: Um, we think that there's maybe some big, you know, grand gestures that that need to take place in order to change that.
SPEAKER_00: But but in reality, I think communion with the father begins to align our hearts with him.
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, we never we never graduate from those things, you know.
SPEAKER_01: We just go further, further up, further in, deeper.
SPEAKER_01: So, well, gentlemen, it has been an honor.
SPEAKER_01: I'm so grateful for Faithful Brothers.
SPEAKER_01: Uh, we get to teach the Bible alongside.
SPEAKER_01: It's just wonderful.
SPEAKER_01: Um, thank you guys so much for watching.
SPEAKER_01: We are um just honored that we get to do this.
SPEAKER_01: If you haven't yet uh subscribed or followed us, we'd love for you to do that.
SPEAKER_01: Just it lets um more people it alerts more people to the channel and get to see what we're doing.
SPEAKER_01: And um, we will hopefully see you guys next time on the follow up.
SPEAKER_01: Thanks so much for watching.