Black Boomer Besties from Brooklyn
This is what the world needs now: two free-thinking “seasoned” Black women speaking their truth and inspiring others to do the same. Shaped by 45 years of friendship that began at the prestigious Brooklyn Technical High School through the Ivy League, medical school, marriages, divorces, triumphs, parenting queer children, life-threatening illness and many many amazing adventures. Each week, besties Leslie Osei-Tutu and Angella Fraser will push against boundaries in love, culture, careers, faith, politics and out-dated assumptions about women of a certain age. Remember, you’re never too old to change your mind…or your hair! (but more on that later :-)All views are our own and do not reflect the views of our institution/company. Information provided is not intended to serve as medical advice.
Black Boomer Besties from Brooklyn
Rethinking Love & Marriage
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Season 3 starts with a revelatory conversation that challenges the "acceptable" ways that people form partnerships. Over the years, The Besties have often joked about the prospect of getting married, as platonic friends of course. But would we all benefit from more expansive ways of finding compatible life partners? Yes, indeed.
Visit Black Boomer Besties from Brooklyn website for behind-the-scenes extras.
Hey Ann.
SPEAKER_01She Les. How are you?
SPEAKER_03All I could say is wow. All right. Do you know why I'm saying wow?
SPEAKER_01Because of how we set up. Listen, we have been recording so much in different states that when we come together and start recording in the same place, it is a comedy of errors.
SPEAKER_03Oh my gosh. It's like Lucy and Ethel set up a recording studio. And every time we set up together, it takes us two and a half hours.
SPEAKER_01It takes us two and a half hours, but it gets better every time because right now it's pretty amazing.
SPEAKER_00It's pretty amazing. But it's so frustrating, and I'm so tired. Don't get frustrated. You're fine. So, okay, introduce us, Leslie.
SPEAKER_03I'm Leslie. That's Angie. And this is another episode of Black Boomer Besties from Brooklyn. Brooklyn. And Angie, you know what else it is? What? It's the start of our third season.
SPEAKER_01It's the start of our third season. So I think we're extra giddy. We're giddy. Um, we don't get to hang out together too much, and we're here for our reboot um week, almost week. Reboot week, wellness week. And oh, I like that. And so um I am gonna tell on Leslie a little bit.
SPEAKER_03Oh, am goodness.
SPEAKER_01Just a little bit, right? So y'all know that she made a commitment to me to not make this a um big box store time, right? I mentioned to her, and she knows me, that it doesn't take much for me to go with it because I enjoy it too. But Leslie is not the best accountability partner. I tried so hard. Wait, if you guys even heard about what she said was a necessity, we gotta have it. We got we gotta have a table, a side table to go between. I get it that the the pool is in place.
SPEAKER_03Let me go, let me just go back. My new pool build that was supposed to take 90 days, took a year and a half to happen.
SPEAKER_00It was tragic.
SPEAKER_03And we're at the point where the water is in the pool. We're in Florida. So what do people do poolside? They lie out, right?
SPEAKER_01Yeah, absolutely.
SPEAKER_03I didn't have reclining chairs.
SPEAKER_01She had chairs, so we had reclining chairs.
SPEAKER_03I'm just we lay out. You can't lay out in a sitting upright chair.
SPEAKER_01Agreed.
SPEAKER_03So we had to get reclining lounges, chase.
SPEAKER_01Okay.
SPEAKER_03And let me just ask one question and shame the devil. Just one question, Ange.
SPEAKER_01Yes.
SPEAKER_03When you're lying, picture this.
SPEAKER_01Sicily, Aruba, the Bahamas.
SPEAKER_03Just picture the Mai Thai in your hand. When you're lying poolside and the person brings you your drinks, where do they put the drinks? In the at the table, in between the chairs.
SPEAKER_01Not all.
SPEAKER_03They never put it on the concrete.
SPEAKER_01Okay.
SPEAKER_03As a result, the necessity she speaks of was the table. So it was okay diverting to buy the lounge chairs, but she really got upset with me when I insisted that we get a table. That was the sore point for today.
SPEAKER_01No, kind of, but the sore point was she we ended up getting three chairs lounges, fine, but there was other shopping going on in between. She looked at other chairs, she looked at different, and and yes, the table. I'm like, Leslie, do we need a table? Absolutely.
SPEAKER_03Absolutely.
SPEAKER_01It's a must-have. Wait a minute. Whenever I share whenever I go to the beach, it's it's not uncommon that my drink ends up, you know, in the sand. It's not a big deal. This is not sand. This is a stable, beautiful, brand new um, what is it called?
SPEAKER_03Pavers.
SPEAKER_01Pavers. Flat, nice, we clean.
SPEAKER_03Let's agree to disagree. We I needed a table. And as soon as the table was placed between the chairs, whose drinks and food went on it?
SPEAKER_01Yours.
SPEAKER_03Yours.
SPEAKER_01Yours.
SPEAKER_03Anyway.
SPEAKER_01Here's another thing. Here's another thing. How did the stuff get home in your convertible?
SPEAKER_03Is this how we're gonna listen?
SPEAKER_01Is this how we're gonna start our season three with an with a bicker bickery? I just wanted people to understand. Um, since we mentioned that we were gonna be doing this and we talked about accountability and being partners in um upholding our commitment to rebooting and not um getting caught up in fixing up the house and so on and beautifying the house. And I just wanted, you know, to um to let people know that uh we didn't start off that way. But anyway, we're gonna turn it around, right, Les? Absolutely. Shenanigans are over. Oh, let me also mention she tried to sneak out of the house before I woke up.
SPEAKER_03That's true.
SPEAKER_01This is what I'm dealing with. She's not used to me waking up because I'm a night owl, and so I like to get my six, seven hours sleep. So I don't wake up as early as Leslie, but I decided to wake up early, and she was ready to go so she could go.
SPEAKER_03My plan was to leave and return before you woke up.
SPEAKER_00I was up at six o'clock every day.
SPEAKER_03And one one day she texted me, where are you?
SPEAKER_01I was trying to get home before you woke up. No, I said I had to get something for mom. Right, right, yes. Anyway, so that's how it's been, but it's still amazing to be together and um it's still fun and all of that stuff. So, anyway, one of the things that we have been um wanting to talk about, Leslie recently sent me an article about um uh a form of partnering called Sologamy. Sologamy. S-O-L-O Solo G-A-M-Y sologamy. And it's it's it is what it sounds like. It is making a decision that you're going to be with yourself, marry, actually marry yourself, actually marry yourself, and so it um it brought to our um memory that we've wanted to talk about we've been talking about partnering and different ways of of being in partnership with other people, um, what that could look like, how there could be so much variety um different from the the what we what is very well known, which is marriage, monogamous marriage, and um heterosexual marriage, but there's so many other ways to be in partnership with um I I move my hands a lot, she's trying to my kids, yeah, hand vibration. Oh, I see. Okay, I gotta do this. Oh, anyway, and so we we wanted to kind of talk about this out loud with you guys to see how um, yeah, what you thought about some of the opinions that we have about this, yeah. Um so do you want to jump in?
SPEAKER_03Well, yeah, I want to jump in, and I'm gonna say for people who know me personally, they know that my husband and I have been together for 32 years. So we've been together a long time. So I've been in a monogamous committed marriage for quite a while. But it hasn't my marriage vows has not constrained my thinking about other ways of partnering. For example, what was really um attractive to me was when I've heard about um best friends actually marrying. And this idea, and literally marrying. Right. Um, because in many states now, most states I think, um, if the best friends are same-sex um friends, then um same-sex marriage is legal in probably all of the states by now.
SPEAKER_02Yeah.
SPEAKER_03But I don't know about Texas, but anyway. Um, but these relationships, when I say best friends marrying, I am saying they are platonic friends, they are not um in romantic partnerships um at all. But the point about marriage that I think is very vital is that marriage has become both a legal and a religious construct. And because of that, it has been so limited and has excluded so many viable, different, useful forms of partnering. So, for example, let's just say if I were otherwise married, but you know how close the two of us are.
SPEAKER_01I and not only close, how well we we mesh when it comes to the things, the things that are um important in life, right? Right. Leslie's really good at finances, for example. I'm really good at I don't know what, but not finances.
SPEAKER_03So things like that is what the point is, I certainly would want you to have access to my medical records and my medical care. Right, right. I certainly would want you to have access to my um financial accounts to handle things if you needed to.
SPEAKER_02Right.
SPEAKER_03Um in the absence of marriage, a marriage certificate that comes with it all of its legalities and abilities, there is no way for me to for you to make decisions for me if I were incapacitated and otherwise had no one else to do that. You absolutely know what my wishes would be.
SPEAKER_01And I would want to honor them.
SPEAKER_03And you would be able to and want to honor them, but unless I specifically name you, you would not be able to have any part of it. I think that's wrong.
SPEAKER_01Yeah.
SPEAKER_03I think that's wrong.
SPEAKER_01Yeah.
SPEAKER_03The other thing that I'll say um before I forget is that as I understand it, same-sex relationships or same-sex marriages, the main reason that I think the main reason for the need for such a um a marriage recognition and s and certificate was in order to confer to these couples the same types of things, laws, um, legalities, abilities, access that married couples get automatically.
SPEAKER_01Right, right.
SPEAKER_03You know, so remember it's almost like an upload of all of the things that come with the union of with the ceremony of marriage.
SPEAKER_01Right. So it merges the religious and the legal.
SPEAKER_03Well, I don't I'm not that interested in merging the religious marriage per se.
SPEAKER_01But that's what marriage, the way that we know it, it merges the religious and the and the legal, right? Right, yeah. Okay.
SPEAKER_03But I've never, as a Christian, I've never thought that Christians own the concept of marriage.
SPEAKER_01Understood. Yeah, agreed, actually.
SPEAKER_03And so often we say that's unbiblical, if same-sex people or marriage should only be a cisgender male and a cisgender female. Says who? Yeah, yeah, you know, and when I think about says the Bible, whether or not that's my personal belief, what about atheists? You know, what about those people who don't believe in Christianity in in the way that I do? Aren't they allowed to love and form a union? And have all of those rights, responsibilities conferred to their union, right as I do, right? Or do they need to be in a hospital dying without their loved one having access to those things just because they didn't subscribe to I get it.
SPEAKER_01I get it. One of the things that came to mind as you talked about this too is that the idea that we have now that marriage is um a love marriage, right? That all marriages, and we we know that in some societies there there are um still arranged marriages, right? Yeah, yeah. Um or um, yeah, arranged marriages. And so the idea it used to not be the case, even in what we call Western society, where marriage was for love. Marriage was for um the union of of um families.
SPEAKER_03Families, it was to keep money in certain families, it was very often it used to be intermarriages, interfamilies, familial marriages.
SPEAKER_01The idea of marrying for love and intimacy is fairly new. It's fairly new, and so when Leslie talked about um, you know, um partnerships, and we'll I'm trying to make a distinction where where it's it's required between partnership and marriage, right? And I think Les, you are bringing in marriage because marriage is the way in our society through which you have the rights to act on behalf of another. Right. It has to be through marriage here.
SPEAKER_03Um and only in the last couple of years have states um made legal that um civil unions would also be have access to health care benefits or things like that. But it's not very common. Some states do that. Oh, absolutely. You're um again, a legal civil union partner can be on your um health insurance, can share your health insurance if you're deemed a legal union. Right, but again, I don't know, it can it it gets so hairy.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, so Leslie and I've joked more often than her husband name like the thing, right?
SPEAKER_03Go ahead, finish the sentence.
SPEAKER_01We've joked that that for uh quite a few things, but one thing we've joked that we should we should be married. But here's why. Before you guys start, you know, I'm not into polygamy, not into the polygamy.
SPEAKER_03And while I find it very attractive, I'm not I'm not attractive. I'm attracted to you. You're all right, but not my time exactly.
SPEAKER_01But here's the thing. But what's funny is this is how Leslie and I um how we're in relationship with each other.
SPEAKER_03Wait, before we even say about how we're in relationship with each other, can we talk about what our hands look like when we met at the airport?
SPEAKER_01Okay, so this is how we're in relationship with this. This is this is listen, guys, if you've ever been to get a manicure, whether you've you've had one yourself or you've um accompanied someone who had a manicure, you know that there are a gazillion different color nail polish.
SPEAKER_03They point you to the wall and say pick one.
SPEAKER_01Or they hand you a you know a color wheel, whatever, or a stack of fake nails with all these colors. A million six. Leslie and I come out of the airport.
SPEAKER_03I flew in, um, we we arrived together, right? But we and I think it was Monique that said look at their hands.
SPEAKER_01Look, look at how look at our nail polish, how similar. It's ridiculous that this happens all the time. It's ridiculous. No, our toes are not the same color, but crazy. Okay, so we should be married. So here's what I want to say, not because of that. I don't understand um why one would not want to be in a partnership with someone who is different from them, who has different strengths, who um has um uh even different different likes and and dislikes to a certain degree, right? The example is so as as I said, Leslie is very organized. You guys know this about her by now, right? And there's certain things that she does well and she enjoys doing it. She loves doing laundry. Oh my god, she loves doing laundry and grocery shopping, grocery shopping, cooking. These are not things that I enjoy. These are not things that I enjoy. If I were to be able to be in partnership with someone who enjoys the things that I would rather not do, and that I enjoy the things that they would rather not do, perfection. Like, but it's it's oftentimes when the um um sexual intimacy and those things start to come into it where I think these pretty clear ideas of what works start to get really muddied, and you know, but that's why it's like we should get married because we just have um uh the synergy between us, and it's not just about you and I, the synergies between people um and what um what is required to have a beautiful life could be achieved by being in partnership or because of how our society is constructed, in marriage with people who just work, just work with you.
SPEAKER_03Without the judgment of what gender they are.
SPEAKER_01Exactly.
SPEAKER_03Why they are together. Why they're together. What race they are. What's weird about what they look like.
SPEAKER_01Exactly.
SPEAKER_03Exactly. You know, obviously, we're we're speaking a little tongue-in-cheek about us getting married, although we have talked about that. Um but what what the reason that this topic is interesting to me is because so many people have opinions about unions and who should be together and look at those people, and we don't like same-sex marriage, and we don't think that um transsexual unions and what have you, transgender unions are appropriate or valid or whatever. But traditional marriage is not does not work very well.
SPEAKER_01You know, when you're talking to someone who has been married twice, divorced twice.
SPEAKER_03So and you in each case was married to a male, yes, who you partnered with with great intentions and what have you. And so many marriages come together for that reason and for whatever it is that it doesn't work. Right. But we've never, as a society, in my opinion, been brave enough to think about other types of unions.
SPEAKER_01Right. I'll give you just an example with with with an um to think about it, but to embrace, to embrace other types of unions.
SPEAKER_03Right. Well, even consider first and then think about the merit of then and then embrace. Right. So for example, we've also spoken about um, and this is also in the news these days, of older people, um, married or single, coming together in households of several people, let's say in a compound, let's say, but co-living together.
SPEAKER_00Talking about communists.
unknownIt's kind of weird. No. You come.
SPEAKER_00Okay, sorry. I was being serious and hearing you. I'm sorry, go, go, go, go, go, go. I've been watching too much of a place to call home. Okay, go.
SPEAKER_03So what I'm saying is another way of partnering or living together, and these union and these households work well. They form these um, I'll use the word pods, right? Because, you know, from COVID uh remnants, yeah, but multiple groups of people sharing resources. Because in our older years, very many of us have limited resources, very um many of us have health concerns, and believe it or not, a lot of people are lonely. Yeah, you know, so these are another types of unions or partners um that work together and work well, you know. Um, and notice we haven't even started mentioning about mentioning um polygamous relationships and those types of things. Um, and and you know, we don't necessarily have to.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, because I don't know a whole lot about that topic. To me, it's just um if something makes sense, right, if it works, then why are we so against it? Because it's so evident that the ways that we think things ought to be, it doesn't work a whole lot of the time. For whatever reasons, whether it ought to work or not, it doesn't work. And so what you're saying is that people should um should be resigned to being miserable if it doesn't work the way that it ought to work, that it's that way or nothing, and that's the kind of thing from someone who um, as Leslie mentioned, um went into two um marriage unions with the best intention that they would last a lifetime, and they did not. And so, and and there was a lot of mental work that I had to do to because I was my faith tradition is that marriage is supposed to be um a lifelong um union, and so there was a lot of kind of unpacking that I had to do because I know what my heart was, I know the intentions of my heart, and I know that I did not take um divorce lightly. Um and so well, if it happened to me and I I did everything that I knew how to do to for it to not um end in the the ways that they did, does that mean that that's it? I don't, I don't, I don't get to um be in partnership any other way? You know, should I just keep trying that? Or do I try something else that may actually work better than what has failed? Would would people encourage in any other situation? Okay, try it again. Or you're just not you're just not um you're just not um um made, or you don't deserve to be in partnership because you keep getting it wrong. You know what I mean? And that's something that I um had to um work on kind of figuring that out and um uh you know what what happens next, and is it me and all of those things. And at the end of the day, I I know that um I am to have joy in my life. Um, and so I'm looking at other ways to be in partnership. Great segue. I was just gonna ask you to be in partnership. So what are you up to, Ant? Oh my gosh.
SPEAKER_03Um I know you've done online dating.
SPEAKER_01I have and I am doing online dating. I don't love it, to be honest. I don't love it. I don't know.
SPEAKER_03If I had to start dating, right now, you wouldn't have a data.
SPEAKER_01I would have known not know what to do. I don't love it. Here's why. Um I don't know that I really and truly have time. Um, you know, I do my morning writing, and in a recent morning writing, um I really asked myself, do you really have time? What would it look like if you met someone and you started dating? What would that look like? Okay, you'd get dressed and go to dinner. And I kind of wrote out some of these scenarios, and to be perfectly honest, I'm like, hmm. Not so much. I'm not sure.
SPEAKER_03Maybe I'm not sure that was busy like you are.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, but then but then what then you don't go out. So anyway, it was like um it was it was yeah, and so I I am on um uh marriage app. I can say which one, right?
SPEAKER_03When they start sponsoring us.
SPEAKER_01Um, and I have been on and off it for for a while. Um it runs with Glee Marmole. Um, and you know, here's another thing. Here's another thing. I'm very disappointed in the ways that it happens to be I my choices so far have been black men, and I have been pretty disappointed in um what that has looked like for me in the ways that um black men have approached me, in the ways that they have um made commitments and then pulled back, in the ways that they, oh my gosh, in the ways that they um are are willing to um allow an amazing person like me to just kind of it's like what else, what else would you what what are how good is your decision making? And this is I'm not saying this from a place of being very kind of you know self-absorbed or anything like that, right? But at the end of the day, I'm someone who does a lot of internal work. Um, and I am at a place right now where I'm I'm I'm pretty awesome. Pretty awesome. And so um I have a lot of grace, and no one can tell me different. I have a lot of grace. I I understand, I don't expect people to you know be anywhere close to perfect. I think people ebb and flow.
SPEAKER_03But but again, you know, you've met nice men and men who have enriched and added to your life and to your perspective.
SPEAKER_00Yeah.
SPEAKER_03And what and while they did not necessarily last very long or forever or as long as you may have wanted, um from your faith journey and beliefs, and you and I agree in this regard that these relationships came to you and went appropriately. Right. Yeah. So I don't I don't believe that I'm hearing you saying that you're asking for something different from those relationships because you left there.
SPEAKER_01I I don't know. So what I um I start out from a place of trust. Um people you've gotta work really hard for them to trust you, and then you're in. Me, I start out, I trust you until you prove me wrong. And so I think because I'm wired that way, if if you say that things are this way, I'm gonna believe you until you show me that that they're not.
SPEAKER_02Yeah.
SPEAKER_01Do you know what I mean? Of course. And so, and and you know what the the last serious relationship that I was in, it was just um but the most disappointing relationship of my life, to be honest. You know, I'm still kind of processing through um how things why things went the way that they went, why they went south. It I just don't understand. I just don't understand. It's like you you expect people are going to um uh follow through, and then when they don't, it's just really jarring. So that's why I'm saying that I have been really disappointed in the ways that the people that I have um not only data, I don't even know what dating means.
SPEAKER_03I don't either.
SPEAKER_01I have no idea, but I don't know what dating means. But what I'm talking about are people who um have uh gotten together with me and for the intention of seeing whether a relationship can can flourish. Um it's just been, I don't know, it's just but I I also recall that in your work through that relationship, you concluded that you you kind of understood what might have gone wrong, or well, certainly that, but also the utility of the relationship in so what I'll just be clear, I don't understand what went wrong. What I what I came to to rest on is what happened wasn't there was a lesson other than what there was a lesson that the other person was to learn.
SPEAKER_02Right. You know what I mean?
SPEAKER_01God uses you, yeah. And in that situation, there was a lesson that that person had to learn. I wasn't the focus of the the big lesson. I understand. You know what I mean? Yeah, that makes sense to me. And and I and I'm okay with it because God, you know, you demand. You demand. Yeah. Um, but yeah, so it's um, I am, I am, you know, it's kind of like when, especially when you get on these dating apps, you have to be very, I want this and not that. You know, it's it's kind of this, you know, it not necessarily binary, but this, not this, that, a little bit of this and this type of thing. So you have to kind of say what you want. And it got me thinking, well, are there other configurations that that may work? Do you know what I mean? And is there are there other configurations? Configurations like configurations like same-sex unions? Possibly, possibly, but it's not coming from any particular attraction. I'm attracted to love. I'm attracted to love, I'm attracted to compassion and partnership and intimacy and caring and and trust and forgiveness and grace and mercy. That is what I'm attracted to. And so my wondering is, and that is where I am right now, my wondering is does it have to come in a package that looks like that? Or can it come in a package that looks like this also? And so um the reason why this kind of became like, oh my God, it is because when you're interfacing with these, with these apps, these this technology, you have to kind of do that picking. And so I'm like, why do I keep picking this? This one, this doesn't work. This hasn't been working for me. Should I click on something else? So that's kind of where I am right now. Um, it's it's it's it's a as I was telling you earlier today, it's not a it's not coming from this. I'm attracted to this and not attracted to that. It's it's coming from where do I find a deep sense of partnership and love and care and those things? And um, I'm wondering whether that package has to look a certain way.
SPEAKER_03You know, that reminds me of the reality show with um Nick and Vanessa Lachey, Love is Blind. Oh you familiar with that? I am, I am, I used to watch that. So what they attempt to do is take the visual out of it. And I've never seen same-sex partnerships, but they take the visual out of it and try to get the couples to connect just through what they know of each other without looking at race or size or hair color or you know, physical appearance. Um really interesting show, you know? I've seen it a few times, and it's so funny how when the couples finally commit and then meet, how some of the old isms fall back in. You know, like these. This was I remember the first season, it was a really great. Remember the Indian couple? Yes, uh, he was a doc uh dentist, I believe. And she whatever, and they seemed to be so compatible, and he was there because he wanted to fall out of his type. Yes, right, and she actually did, and she was a lovely lady, the mother, but he could not let that go.
SPEAKER_01He kept seeing his auntie or something like that.
SPEAKER_03You know, but it all it also um takes me back to what you were saying about trying to get out of outside of type. Yeah, and it's so difficult to do that, yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_01Well, I think one way that it may be easier for me to do it is because I've been so willing to try the prescribed way, you know, um, and because I've not I've not been willing to give up on being in love. Yeah, I haven't been willing to do that, and so um so yeah, we'll we'll see how it goes. Um I am um I don't even know if I have time.
SPEAKER_03Well, you gotta you know you gotta make your priorities, you know.
SPEAKER_01I know. That's true. You're right. You're right. Interesting. All right, well anything else you want to say about I wanna say that I'm happy to be in season three, and um we're gonna keep talking about things that um uh are a little more um I guess on our minds. On our minds, but a little more um maybe um undercover. Is that what I want to say? Um a little more that um we we wouldn't maybe typically talk about, but more revelatory? More revelatory. That's it right there. More revelatory. And um but continuing in the idea that the more that we are willing to talk about things, the more that we can be of service to other people who may be thinking about this, who may be afraid to just allow themselves to question standards or expectations or speak out loud either, or script and stuff, and it really takes a bold step to say, you know, I don't want the traditional marriage, it's not for me, right?
SPEAKER_03Right, and instead I'm going to do this, yeah, you know, and then to ignore the naysayers, right, you know, or the haters. Yeah.
SPEAKER_01And the thing is too that sometimes, as is as is the case with me right now, it's not even about um a decision. I'm gonna not do this, I'm gonna do this. It's about allowing yourself to wonder, allowing yourself to consider the possibilities. It's you know, that is the decision. Oh, what would be the restraint? Exactly. Yeah, exactly. What else could be there? Because this is what I know to be true. I am going to have love.
SPEAKER_03You mean more love other than what I give you? Different love.
SPEAKER_01I'm going to have different love. I love you. I love you too. Um, and so um I'm interested, I'm very interested in knowing how it's gonna show up for me. Okay. So and I'm interested in podcasting about it.
SPEAKER_03We'll keep you posted. All right, guys. This is another episode of Black Boomer Besties from Brooklyn.
SPEAKER_02Brooklyn!
