In the last episode of Season 7, the Besties and guest Carla Forte, Licensed Clinical Social Worker & IT Manager, are getting real about the intersections of identity, career, and the audacity to be our authentic selves.
Carla's choice to rock her natural gray hair at the office after over 2 yrs of wigs & weaves, wasn't just about style—it was a bold declaration of self. Her story is emblematic of a journey many of us understand deeply.
From her pivot from IT to social work and back again, Carla Forte's experiences unfold like a masterclass in adaptability, reminding us all that the paths we walk are rarely straight but often lead to profound destinations.
Carla's self-acceptance and the wider implications on body awareness offer a refreshing perspective on the beauty of growing older and the importance of self-care. We're not just talking about surface-level changes; we're delving into the heart of what it means to align your work with your passion, to seek fulfillment beyond the paycheck, and to leverage support systems within our communities
This episode and all previous episodes are available on YouTube. Please join our Besties Quad Squad as a Patreon subscriber at the $5 or $10 monthly level. You'll receive exclusive behind-the-scenes content.
Visit Black Boomer Besties from Brooklyn website for behind-the-scenes extras.
In the last episode of Season 7, the Besties and guest Carla Forte, Licensed Clinical Social Worker & IT Manager, are getting real about the intersections of identity, career, and the audacity to be our authentic selves.
Carla's choice to rock her natural gray hair at the office after over 2 yrs of wigs & weaves, wasn't just about style—it was a bold declaration of self. Her story is emblematic of a journey many of us understand deeply.
From her pivot from IT to social work and back again, Carla Forte's experiences unfold like a masterclass in adaptability, reminding us all that the paths we walk are rarely straight but often lead to profound destinations.
Carla's self-acceptance and the wider implications on body awareness offer a refreshing perspective on the beauty of growing older and the importance of self-care. We're not just talking about surface-level changes; we're delving into the heart of what it means to align your work with your passion, to seek fulfillment beyond the paycheck, and to leverage support systems within our communities
This episode and all previous episodes are available on YouTube. Please join our Besties Quad Squad as a Patreon subscriber at the $5 or $10 monthly level. You'll receive exclusive behind-the-scenes content.
Visit Black Boomer Besties from Brooklyn website for behind-the-scenes extras.
Hey Ant.
Speaker 2:Hey Les, how are you?
Speaker 1:I'm doing great. I'm doing great. This is the great Les on Very Little Sleep. I was on call last night and into today and recently got back from the hospital. Got in about nine o'clock last night and then at two in the morning they called me to go back to the hospital, so I just got back. So you know, but here I am and I get energized by being here. So, yes, yes if you hadn't told us that we wouldn't have known there you go, I'm ready.
Speaker 1:So welcome to another episode of Black Boomer Besties from Brooklyn.
Speaker 2:Brooklyn. I'm so happy today, brooklyn, brooklyn.
Speaker 1:So nice you had to say it thrice, three times. You're so corny, oh my gosh, you laughed almost like you fell out your chin I'm a sucker for your corny jokes.
Speaker 1:I guess so, I guess so. So we're delighted to welcome a special guest today. And you know how we do when we have our guests, we like get all in there and we love up on them and we draw all the info we can out of them and then we make them honorary besties, all those things. So that's what's going to happen today. Absolutely, I'll let you introduce this guest today.
Speaker 2:So, just right up front, we don't have a formal bio for Carla, because it was just yesterday that I'm like, oh my gosh, you've got to get on our podcast and I'll tell you in a moment what happened and why I did that. A little background about Carla and Carla you can fill in after I finish and why I did that. A little background about Carla Carla you can fill in after I finish. Because I'm definitely going to get emotional. I'm not even going to apologize for it. I'm not going to try to hold it back. I'm just not going to do it. I'm going to just be completely in my feelings because Carla is someone that I have known for. I don't know how long it's been Carla, it feels like a few lifetimes 15 years.
Speaker 2:Yeah, because we've been. We've been through a lot together personally and professionally. Carla is someone that I used to work with and we have done a lot of heavy lifting in the workplace and helping people to behave properly and to make forward movement when it was really difficult to do that. We're two Black women, two of the few in our IT organization, and so we've done some incredible and difficult work there and you know, in our personal relationship also and I mean, carla has traveled the world just Japan, dubai, india, worked in several of these places Japan, dubai, india, worked in several of these places. I hold her in such a high regard myself and my children and is a licensed social worker. Just has a lot of commas and-.
Speaker 3:Letters.
Speaker 2:Letters after her name and PMP, you know, project management professional, just all the things. And why I asked her to come on at this point is because we met for lunch yesterday and Carla knows how to handle me, because she had a surprise. She had a surprise for me, right. I get excited to see her anyway because she's one of those people who you you never, ever leave Carla's presence without feeling seen and being taught something, just being poured into. It's just kind of how she shows up for everyone, even if people don't acknowledge it, or kind of feel it in the moment. It's because they have a barrier up, it's not because she doesn't offer it Period, 100%. So Carla has this fly new car, right, we both have these red vehicles, that-.
Speaker 3:You inspired me to get a red car, unless it doesn't like that car. It was an imprint. Okay. Why am I only looking at red cars? Why am I only looking at red cars? I wonder why.
Speaker 2:I'm only looking at red cars. Leslie's still mad that I got a charger because she didn't know that that was that battery I just don't get it. She just didn't know, I just never thought that.
Speaker 2:Yeah. So anyway, carla pulls up for us to go to lunch together and I approach the door of the car and I open it and I see Carla in this new way that I've never seen her before. In all of these years I've never seen her this way and I could not get in. I was so overcome by her radiance always that, but not like this. I was overcome by the courage that just kind of exuded, because I know what her journey has been around it and I'll just say this is around her new, her new hairstyle.
Speaker 2:I know that she's been on this journey because I've seen it and you guys know that hair is my thing. Like I know, I know what's behind hairstyles. I know that you know, especially as black women, kind of some of what, um, the, the emotional and the, the kind of the ways that we see ourselves and the ways that we code, switch and the ways that we mask and the ways that we unmask, how all of that shows up through our hair. And so when I saw Carla show up this way, I knew, I knew that. I mean, honestly, when I opened the door, it just kind of like whoosh.
Speaker 1:And it was, it was, it was a beautiful whoosh.
Speaker 2:It wasn't like a. It was like it was a beautiful whoosh. It wasn't like it was like it was a lot. It was a lot like the tears just came.
Speaker 1:It was the other thing that I'm hearing from what you're saying is that you are no longer in that corporate environment and right color is and that also has a whole other nuance right day-to-day living yes and in feelings, and in expressions and in responses. Yes all of that so ann said she was going to be crying I can't even see you guys right now.
Speaker 3:I'm going to take my glasses off and just sort of face my face, as my mom would say, because this is, you know, angela is such a beautiful person. Everything that she's saying about me, I feel the same way about her, so she's just mirroring, we're just mirroring back to each other, right?
Speaker 3:You know this radiance and this all-encompassing, like you know like hug that she gives everyone and the love that you feel, and I feel like I'm family, like you know, just haven't met her when we met 15 years ago and that that feeling has just continued, you know, through all the years. And so I knew she was going to be shocked because, full disclosure, last time she saw me I had a curly weave down to my shoulder.
Speaker 3:I mean, it was flat but it was one of those things where, a couple of years ago, I was going on vacation and I just want to ease which there's nothing wrong with that and then two years went by and I, either between the curly weave or the crocheted locks or braids, my hair was covered for two years and there wasn't a plan.
Speaker 3:I wasn't even conscious of it. I just know I had a lot of things to do and I just needed to be able to just go and be ready wherever I was, and I remember the last time that we had coffee we met for coffee about a month ago. I was talking about all the work things and I said and then this you remember me doing this and saying this, you know.
Speaker 2:I went into back so.
Speaker 3:I, so my journey with this particular company has been over a course of 17 years, and when I initially came, I had long straight part banker sort of hairstyle is what I call it. And then I want to say so 2007 say two years later. I went natural and you know, when we first go natural, we think it's going to be curly, wavy, loose curls, and then you know all of our texture and all of this beauty and kinky cool shows up.
Speaker 3:I wasn't thinking it was going to look like this, and so I straighten it and then very quickly realize that, ok, this is not about straight or curly, this is just about me being comfortable with my own texture and how it shows up and what it looks like. And so I quickly cut it again and let it grow. And so between 2009 and what 2022,?
Speaker 3:my hair was natural it was, it was blonde it was, it was red it was. It was blonde it was, it was red it was brown it was. It was a big Afro, it was a um, a short Afro and all the things in between.
Speaker 2:And.
Speaker 3:I just loved it and it really embraced it, and so when I went back to this company in 2021 with my full Afro I mean, I'm talking about my hair was out to here and I just loved it.
Speaker 2:And I just like that was my way of like sort of pushing the buttons and the envelopes and all the things that you think that you're going to get this, but you're going to get that.
Speaker 3:And very, being very conscious of that. So then to, for a variety sake, you know, change my hair and then look up in two years of gone by, I was like, who is this person Right? What does this mean? And what is this? What is this sort of translation that's happening, you know, in my physical exterior, and then all of the things that are happening, you know, you know internally, and so one of the things that I did with my hairdresser, who she's a beautiful person she kept asking me like I had a full weave with no leave out, but I was still having her dye my hair for a year and she was like why are you doing?
Speaker 2:that Doesn't show up.
Speaker 3:What is this? I said I don't want a great show. I don't, I'm not ready for that. You know, I'm still trying to pull the young guys and all this stuff, you know, and we laugh about it. But she was like oh my gosh. And I was like you know, yes, I'm vain. That's what it is.
Speaker 2:And that's what it's been.
Speaker 3:And so finally one time I said, ok, tara, don't color it. You're right, it doesn't make sense. I'm losing my edges, and this doesn't make sense. And so for probably eight months I didn't have her color it, but I still don't. Don't you let not one peep show.
Speaker 1:If, if the little curls started to come out, I would have the black mascara. You were not there yet.
Speaker 2:I was not there.
Speaker 3:And so I have been talking about it and thinking about it and, um, this time I was getting ready for a week of PTO and I said, well, if I'm going to do this transition, this is probably a good time, because I need to sort of put it on like a code and feel it, see how it feels, see what I think and if and if I don't like it. I still have time to change it before I go back to work.
Speaker 1:You left yourself an out.
Speaker 3:That's my girl, exactly, and so I, and so I have to tell you this part of the story, which is really beautiful. So I'm still all the way up to the door, like him and han going back and forth, and I say I still have time to go get hair I do you know all the things?
Speaker 3:and so I go into the shop and there's this beautiful, regal black woman and I want to say she's in her 70s or 80s and she has this silver beautiful, like silver hair, and she's in the chair and she's like take it off.
Speaker 2:I don't want, I don't want, I don't want.
Speaker 3:I just just take it all off and just cut it down as low as you possibly can, because you know I just don't want to do hair because of the weather. Right at her and how regal she was with the silver hair and how beautiful she was and how just clear she was, that okay, this is the season for taking it all off and not having any encumbrance. And I told my hairstylist.
Speaker 1:I said I'm ready, I'm ready and she's like you're sure what she's having right, right.
Speaker 3:and so then I could feel the, the liberation in Right Like this doesn't define who I am. The color doesn't define who I am. The texture? None of that. I've already sort of gone through all the layers of texture length, you know professional not professional, and I thought I was done with all of this. But this next level has to do with aging. If I'm really honest, you know really having an acceptance for where I am in my in my lifespan journey Right.
Speaker 1:Wow, we've been talking about that a lot. It's interesting that it comes up. It shows up in so many ways, so many ways, yeah.
Speaker 3:Yeah, and what I realized just in the what what?
Speaker 2:four or five days because it just happened Friday, but it feels like a lot of time is that you know, I what it forced me to look at is like what else is going on that?
Speaker 3:you're not comfortable with. So yesterday we went to get oysters and we're sitting inside and one guy comes in, you know, he gets out of his car, he has a cane.
Speaker 3:Another guy comes, he has a cane and I promise you it took him like 15 minutes to walk to like a few hundred yards in front of us, and so I'm sitting here with with my partner and I'm like what the heck is going on, you know here, and it was like you know I'll be dogging on if that's gonna be me, and so really looking at, it's not just the hair, it's like how am I feeling in my body, like what are some of the limitations that are happening around movement and how I sort of perceive myself and my ability and the things that I can do in this phase of my life?
Speaker 3:So all of that stuff is coming up and I believe that you know these things come up for us to put some sun on them, literally and, you know, shine a light and sort of. You know, do this sort of cleanse around, of cleanse around, not letting it be a thing, not letting it be any way, defining who you are as a human being and what you're capable of.
Speaker 1:Wow.
Speaker 3:All of it.
Speaker 1:Wow.
Speaker 3:So I did get on my yoga mat after the first one I was like, but we laughed. Yoga mat after the I was like, but you know, but we laugh it's all of those things.
Speaker 1:Yes, it's all of those things. Before I get into asking or digging deeper into this, carla, could you introduce yourself and tell us a little bit about who you are from where? You've come and we don't even know your name.
Speaker 2:You mean, everybody doesn't know Carla?
Speaker 1:Okay, we just started chatting, like the three besties that we are, but you know, yes, I feel like an honorary bestie, because. I've heard you know, angela talk about you in such a loving way.
Speaker 3:Yes, exactly. So my name is Carla Forte and so I have a very interesting set of skills. I say like Liam Neeson yeah, I have a particular set of skills. So I actually have been in IT for over 20 years, but somewhere in the middle, like in the beginning, I had gone to school and got my master's in social work. I always wanted to be a therapist, but I was like I had a business background and so I didn't really fit in a box. Neatly right.
Speaker 3:I had some development experience and I just like, okay, well, I'm not sure what this is going to look like. So, in figuring all of that out, I got asked to do a corporate role at this particular company and it was a friend of a friend who said, hey, they're going to fire this girl. Can you do this project real quick? And I was like you know, sure. And the day after I got there, the person who hired me said okay, and this was like in 2007. So before cell phones she said I'm going to China.
Speaker 3:You got everything. Okay, you won't be able to contact me, but good luck. And I was like, oh my gosh, right. So you know, I had come from an environment where you know, as a project manager, you sort of you do the requirements for the customer and you go all the way to the end of delivery. So I was doing everything in this big company because I just that's how I was trained to manage projects.
Speaker 3:And they were like that's not your job, somebody over there does that, and somebody over here does this, and so by the time she came back, I was in everybody's business and everybody was saying, oh, she's a rock star.
Speaker 3:But you thought you were doing your job, thought that's how everybody does it it was out of ignorance, sheer ignorance and so that sort of brought me on to become a permanent employee. And then I look up and four years have have gone by and I was like that was not my plan. This was supposed to be a stop, not a destination, and so I left that company to to get licensed and to start a private practice as a mental health therapist. And so I did that and I was very happy. You know about that. But life is how they say life be lifen. And so I ended up going through a divorce and I had two children and we had a lifestyle. So I literally, you know and I'll tell this story because this is an Angelus story I was doing some IT work while I was building a private practice and I did that for 10 years and people you know I didn't sleep much and I was teaching yoga.
Speaker 3:But the story of that brings Angela into this is that she had been my manager in like 2009. And said coworkers, she was my manager and and 2000,. This was 2012. So I had left the company in 2011. And so we hadn't talked in a while but, out of the blue, she calls me and she says I have some money, do you have some time? You know, sounds like a Donald summer song, but that's literally what she said. And so, um, but nobody knew that. I just, you know, separated two months earlier.
Speaker 2:And I'm looking at the phone like how does this woman know I need money.
Speaker 3:I needed money at that time and that was the first time that I came back to the company to do some contract work. And then that was short, and then somebody else said hey, I heard you're doing and they brought, brought me back again and this is literally the sixth time that I've come back to this company and do this work, and so I had um, a really um. I'm claiming her as a friend say to me girl, if you don't know you're on assignment here.
Speaker 2:I don't know what to tell you you know, six times coming back to the same place.
Speaker 3:And really feeling like this this time. It's like there's this opportunity that wasn't there before, or at least I couldn't see it for myself, and the opportunity is that I'm literally talking about mental health for blacks at this company like openly, openly, like they're calling me doctor? I'm not. I don't have a doctorate, but they're like.
Speaker 3:Hey, can we hear from Dr Carla on this? You know, yeah, and you know, I have this thing where I say when you find yourself saying you can't make this shit up, god is all in that, and I did say shit at god's same time yeah, but but I certainly get it, I yeah and you know.
Speaker 1:Ange sometimes calls them God moments, but the revelation is real and profound. Yes, when you're in a space, whatever that space may be and your space is certainly nothing that I would be comfortable with but when you sit in it and look around and it's like, yeah, yeah, you know it's life sustaining and not draining. Yes, when it's hard work but you look forward to it yes, you know it's. It's almost like um, it's your heart space, it absolutely is, it absolutely and that's what. That's what we look for, and and some people are blessed enough to find it in their 30s or 40s I think that's rare, but or or they may find it then, but not appreciate it until they become a little bit more sophisticated.
Speaker 2:Absolutely Wise is the word.
Speaker 1:Yes, yeah, in the wisdom of it.
Speaker 3:Yes, I totally agree with you.
Speaker 1:In my case, I was fortunate to have dabbled in other things before I found my niche. So I was the high school science teacher. I worked in physical therapy practice and different things. But when I went to medical school and became an anesthesiologist, that's when I found home, when I could, you know, work for hours or days straight, you know, and still feel filled when I and I still say I would do my work without getting paid for it. You know, I've been a medical missionary, for free, a volunteer, you know. So it's those kinds of things that people look for.
Speaker 3:Absolutely and and invite you to the table right, because one of the things that happened is that we have a group for Black women at the company and the person who was running that group she was, she was just. She got promoted like two or three times. She was overwhelmed and she said hey, can you just take this? You know we were going to sort of co-chair and then she just handed it over.
Speaker 3:And so that opened up a space for me to talk about some of these things just with black women. And then a dear for another dear friend who left the company, who was leading the well-being pillar for the blacks at the company, she said can you take this on, because I know you get it right?
Speaker 2:You know what I was trying to build.
Speaker 3:And now I have her legacy, you know, to build on. And when I tell you, like you again, you just can't make this up, like how wonderful is it I get to do like the work that I love, and talk about the things that I'm passionate about, you know, in space, where I thought there was never going to be space for that. Like you know, that's not a job, that's a side project, that's a volunteer thing, that's not a job you know, and then.
Speaker 3:So let's go back to tying this to the hair thing, right? So here I am, finding my authentic voice in this space where lots of times, you believe that that voice isn't appreciated. I'll talk a little bit about the project and bring it through to this, which was when I came back and I worked on this project, I was a contractor and there's some freedom in that right Like I don't have to you know, play by all the rules that everybody else does.
Speaker 3:If I'm a contractor, at least that's what I'm thinking in my mind, and so I was the one in the in the meetings, oftentimes saying that's not going to work, we can't do that, and I'm thinking you know they're going to fire me at any point because they're going to be like she's Debbie. Downer, she's not. You know, nodding her head, she's not saying. But then that became a part of my brand. Not not negativity, but she's going to tell you the truth she's going to tell you what's possible?
Speaker 3:And if she says that this is what it is, this is what it is.
Speaker 1:Right, and we have a history, you know exactly history, you, you know exactly and then.
Speaker 3:so then we go into this space, this I'm saying season, where now I'm being asked well, what do you think about this and what do you have to say about?
Speaker 3:yeah, what carla thinks yes, yes, and, and it's not, and it's not even about telling people what to do. It's not. It's like, you know, let me share this story and that's what I feel like I'm doing all the time. I'm just sharing stories of lived experiences, things that people have shared with me that you know, everyone can relate to, and in each story you find a little bit of yourself Right. Each story, you find a little bit of yourself right, because, at the end of the day, I was very clear about this, even when I was practicing as a therapist that you already know what it is. I'm just, you know, connecting the dots and reminding you of what you already know.
Speaker 3:Yeah, right, um and sort of like a guide, if that makes sense. Nothing, nothing more, nothing less. You know yeah.
Speaker 2:Yeah, okay. So when you, when you talked about this extra thing, that that that you're doing around the black employees and the the kind of subgroup around Black women, no matter what is going on in the other part of your work, that becomes like a place of rejuvenation, absolutely, absolutely. And one can find that in a workplace, maybe in very different ways, but it's such an example of listen. This is where you spend a lot of your time. This is where you're around seeking places of where you can get energy, where you can find a place to be completely yourself. That's work that you have to do. That's stuff you have to look for. Yes, you know what I mean, that stuff you have to look for. Yes, you know what I mean. You don't have to be in these situations where things are just sucking the life out of you.
Speaker 1:But, ange, that's almost like career 2.0 or 3.0. We're baby boomers and we're of the generation where tradition was that you work for a period in a discrete period of your life it could be until age 65, let's just say. And you were not supposed to get all of this emotional fulfillment from work per se, you were supposed to get that from the things outside of your work. So, after 5 pm and after age 65. Yeah, in a place that sucks your energy and that drains your emotions and that you bristle and your shoulders go up when you walk in the building and they only come down when you leave. The weathering, yes, of decades of those behaviors will inform how you live in retirement and how you live after 5 pm.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 3:Yes.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I think you know nuance.
Speaker 1:It is looking for fulfillment, emotional fulfillment. We're looking for paycheck, yeah.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I can remember even before, like Angela was my manager and thinking I don't want to do this work. This, this work is just I don't, I'm not connected to it, I don't, I don't get it.
Speaker 3:You know most of the time, and realizing that you know, it wasn't going to be contained in that 40 hours, and so what I did at the time still having a passion for mental health is that I served on a board and I leveraged the company to sort of do matching things, and that was the way that I sort of connected the dots outside of my day to day. But I think it is not impossible in this day and time, with the new thought process, to figure out ways to bring that passion and that energy to your day, to day and I feel fortunate because I wasn't actually seeking it necessarily, I didn't even know I needed it.
Speaker 3:But you know, now having stepped into this space, where now I'm considered a leader around well-being in this space, it's like now my mind is just going on steroids, trying to figure out all the ways that I can connect the dots and all the people that I can connect and how I can use sort of this other set of skills around.
Speaker 3:you know, relationship building and connecting dots and being strategic to also amplify well-being in this space and in this company, first for us and I say first for us because I am a Black woman. You know, I had a friend years ago. She talked about there's a book that that's called a God that looks like me and she's. She was a white woman and she talked about you know, what does God look like when you pray to him or her? And she said I can't pray to a male God. That's just like that doesn't work for me.
Speaker 2:And so what it?
Speaker 1:forced me to think.
Speaker 3:I said, I said I get what you're saying. I understand what you're saying, I said, but before I can say that I'm a woman, I'm black, like.
Speaker 2:I, that's something I can't hide.
Speaker 3:When I come in the room, you know that. You know I sort of lead with black and then women and all the other isms and things that go with that you know. And so now you know part of this hair story because again I've had my hair natural, I've had my hair short is the gray and embracing that also. What's coming with me is age. You know, sometimes wisdom, most of the time wisdom. But but what does that look like also in the workplace, and how do you welcome that and nourish that and make sure that you're modeling? You know what aging gracefully looks like.
Speaker 1:Right, right.
Speaker 2:Let me tell you like when, when we were we arrived at the lunch, I was thinking, as Carla was kind of stepping out of her badass car, I was like do you know how we're reflecting what older can be to younger people?
Speaker 1:That's where the podcast originated. Ann, in our early meetings even before we ever purchased the microphone off of Amazon we had these thought meetings about what we wanted to do and what we wanted to portray to others.
Speaker 2:We did the whole. Thing.
Speaker 1:We really, really did. We sat down because we looked at the trajectories of our lives and our interpersonal relationship and said what is it that is special about us?
Speaker 2:Yeah, who are we trying to reach and what is the? Message we're trying to give them, and I mean all of that is we were really clear.
Speaker 1:We were very clear and intentional and not just you remind me that I have an obligation.
Speaker 3:Yes.
Speaker 1:You know, I've been blessed and hence we've been blessed with certain gifts. Everybody has gifts, but some people haven't identified their gifts. We're all here for a reason. I believe that. But when you can tap into your purpose and when you understand the why of your gifts, then I believe it's your obligation to share it with the world. Yeah, and this was the way that we came up with and we're having a good old time doing it. This is the way. You know. Nobody said that sharing your gifts is supposed to be miserable. You know, right, you know it's even better when it's fun and and it's enriching, absolutely. But yeah, so when you just said, and that you got out while you were still working in corporate at this IT company, that a co-worker or someone said to you yeah, there's something about you, there's something different about you, isn't that something?
Speaker 3:But let me tell you this, leslie, that's how she ended up becoming my manager, because I remember a couple of years before it happened, I saw this woman and I think you had your hair like it was a short fro at the time. At the time and I said, and you, you, you sent a message talking about your parents and how you were going to take a sabbatical to go care for your parents, and it was a very heartfelt message. It was beautifully written and, and when I saw it I said I want to work for someone like that. And then we ended up. It was a chance meeting in the elevator.
Speaker 1:So you're that lady.
Speaker 3:You're that, oh my God. And then, not even a year later, there was a reorg and she, she became my manager. And I was just over the moon because I felt like here's someone who gets it, here's someone who knows that you can always find a job but you can't get time with your parents, back your loved ones and you know doing the things that again, that we're responsible for, not just out of obligation but just out of reverence and respect Right.
Speaker 1:Wow, well, you had that experience at the company. I almost said the name at the company. I almost said the name at the company, but in 1978,.
Speaker 2:I had that experience in the hallways of Brooklyn Tech High School.
Speaker 1:We you were in architecture, you were in architecture, I was in chemistry, so we didn't have classes together, but somehow our circles overlapped and we became inseparable in 1978. Wow, and that's 46 years ago.
Speaker 2:And the thing is that. So, Leslie, I hate chemistry.
Speaker 1:Come on, come on, I still hate chemistry.
Speaker 2:I still hate chemistry. I was the physics person and Leslie was the chemistry. We were, we were. We really were geeks. We really were. We just didn't look like it Right, but with stage light, makeup on For the disco that we hardly went to. So there are these two people and it's just kind of energetically, we came together and we saw each other. You know, beyond the things that we were, not the ways that we were not alike, we found each other. We loved to sew, so we got together around sewing and at the time Brooklyn Tech had over 7,000 students.
Speaker 1:Wow, wow, we found each other. It was like Kismet it was the room.
Speaker 2:And here we are with Trey, and we found one picture of us in. I think it was in my architecture class. You came to visit.
Speaker 1:Cutting my classes probably Hanging Just hanging out in another class. Cutting my class.
Speaker 2:I know you came to visit me because you always were like the social butterfly I was.
Speaker 3:Ange was just a shire at the time.
Speaker 2:Right what's?
Speaker 1:that you were always shy at the time and I was the outgoing, like you know, the drama queen.
Speaker 2:It came me like um, when they wanted to do something wrong. It was like let me just check with ang. Okay, I'm about to, I'm about to do something.
Speaker 1:I know I'm good. Let me see how this, how this goes over, how does it sound? And and we even talk about how appreciative we are that your mother allowed you to hang out with me and be friend and be my best friend, you know yeah, yeah, yeah, because we were we were kind of different, but we were.
Speaker 2:We were very different, but, mommy, mommy saw who you were yeah too, um so so I'm running short on time we can reminisce for a long time okay, okay, okay, okay, and we're going to reminisce for our Patreon subscribers too, but I just wanted to kind of say that, that the thread that I want to kind of pull out in what all that Carla shared is that there's this journey that we're all on.
Speaker 2:There's this journey that we're all on. It's not an arrival, it's not this place that it's allowing ourselves to kind of to become, you know, whatever is needed at that time. It's allowing ourselves to become, and when we do that work, the way that we show up for other people is so incredible. It's so incredible and so it's kind of why we're here is to always be in this state of I don't even want to call it improving, because it's not. That has some connotations that I'm not comfortable with. It's all in the state of evolving to this next level of who we are, and people are always watching and I'm thinking of self-actualization.
Speaker 2:Well, it's the self. That's exactly. That's exactly what it is.
Speaker 1:So when.
Speaker 2:I saw Miss Carla. When I saw Carla, that is, that is everything that I felt, because I'm so in tune with these things for myself and I knew that that is what Carla was going through, and it was so, so, so, so, very powerful, so powerful. So that's why the tears came down for both of us and that's why we had to call you know.
Speaker 2:That's why this had to happen and and they continued to call. That's why this, this, this had to happen and I'm so grateful that we had this platform to kind of amplify it and share it with all of you guys.
Speaker 1:Ok, here's my question you, ladies, you've got it all together. When is my turn? What I got to do? Who I got to do?
Speaker 2:Listen, we all do it in different ways. Right, you got your, you call them dentures. You got your, I got my dentures.
Speaker 1:You weren't able to hear by now, but what Carla was able to hear me. You hadn't put your ears on us yet and I said hey, carla. I said I'm looking for my teeth. She said your teeth or is it your tea? I said no, it's my teeth. She probably said what the hell happened. She got to look for her teeth before she did it. But that's what I call my Invisalign braces. My teeth Can I can.
Speaker 3:I say one last thing before we wrap up. So when I think about the thread right, that's common with all of what we've been talking about you know, I want to bring up this term, grief. And I want I'm bringing it up intentionally because I want us to get comfortable with that.
Speaker 2:Because for me grief is not about death.
Speaker 3:It is about the reconciliation that you know, I think I'm here, but I'm really here, and what does that look like? You know to sort of do the reconciliation, and so when we talk about this hair and the significance, of it.
Speaker 2:This is the reconciliation of.
Speaker 3:Not only has my journey look like all the things we shared and talked about, it also looks like this, and when you said that word responsibility or obligation, you know I have an obligation to show that all the the goodness that we, that we have and that we experience it can also look like this yeah and that's where I think this is sort of leading me into the next phase of my life, and you know, as an elder right.
Speaker 3:Because I'm no longer like hot, you know, like sex kitten, even though you know, I can sort of lay that down.
Speaker 1:Yeah, you still get out of a car. That's what that looks like.
Speaker 3:But, I can lay that down, but anyway, yeah, intention, intentionally lay that down and pick up. You know, this new right Got you.
Speaker 1:I'm inviting us to do a part two of this Because, carla, what you said about what this looks like and the next phase, I would love to talk a little bit more about what this looks like and the next phase. I would love to talk a little bit more about, really especially with your work in mental health and social work what the journey looks and feels like, because I have personally, I um reticence into, I'm change averse, I resist um what some people might even say progress. You know, very often I'm afraid to go very deep. I don't care for writing things down and looking at it again, but that clearly indicates the whole constellation of these feelings. Just talking about writing, I often start sweating and getting warm. Yes, it becomes a physical thing. So what that tells me is that there is some blockage that um, maybe I need to identify face. I don't, I don't mind talking about it, you know, um, but I I'd love not to let it lie right here yes, absolutely yeah.
Speaker 3:And I'll just say just quickly that life transitions like if we were in other cultures we would have a ritual for every sort of trans life transition and phase of life and all those things, and we have some, but we actually don't celebrate going into menopause, or you know there's a term called chrome, like that we think of that as an old lady bent over with the with the cane and, you know, white hair down to her back, and there are other ways that you can look at that and embrace that and understand that with the things that we have to let go.
Speaker 3:And don't get me wrong, you know I'm very, you know, comfortable in my sexuality, but in letting go of having to be, you know, the hot chick in the room, I can also embrace some other things. It's almost like you know the question is what do you want to contain for yourself in this phase of life, and it's going to be different for everybody. You know what I mean, and so that's one of the things that I can. I can let that go so that I can bring in some other things right.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, yeah, I can make room for something else.
Speaker 3:Exactly, exactly.
Speaker 2:Yes, I can make room for something else, exactly, exactly, yes, yes, yes, yes.
Speaker 1:What are?
Speaker 2:you all making room for, making room for? What are you all making room for? Listen, listen, look, we got to have to have like a VIP day. We're going to have to have like a retreat or something.
Speaker 1:I love it.
Speaker 2:We've been talking about it out loud in, in, uh, but it's just kind of we have to and invite people like Carla and just kind of get get at some of this stuff. That's in the way. Yeah, not that many shopping days till Christmas people. Yeah, we got to like you know what I'm saying To be continued and, and and.
Speaker 1:Well, you and I will make it a An agenda item that we need to develop more.
Speaker 2:Yeah, for sure.
Speaker 1:Well, wow.
Speaker 3:Thank you guys, it's so fun this is wonderful.
Speaker 1:So Black Boomer Besties from brooklyn is produced by angela fraser, our editing team is by matt dershowitz and our media, social media and marketing team is from cultural copywriting. So this has been another great, great, great episode of Black Boomer Besties from Brooklyn, brooklyn.