Black Boomer Besties from Brooklyn
Black Boomer Besties from Brooklyn
Ep150 Navigating midlife love: Get smaller or get clearer
The moment someone says you’re “too much,” you face a fork in the road: get smaller or get clearer. We chose clarity. To mark three years of Black Boomer Besties from Brooklyn, the Besties rebroadcast a past episode where a relationship that ended: not because love was absent, but because the container couldn’t hold who Angie was becoming. What followed was a surprising kind of closure, the kind your body recognizes before your brain does.
If you’re navigating midlife love, boundaries, and reinvention, this conversation offers a grounded roadmap for choosing commitments that don’t ask you to choose yourself last.
Listen, share with a friend who needs this reframe, and if the show resonates, follow, rate, and leave a review so more listeners can find us.
Book a free coaching consultation with Angie here: https://calendly.com/rhythmwigs/more-joy-complimentary-consultation
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Get Angie’s eBook:
We’re Too Old for This! The Inquisitive Older Woman’s Guide to Joy http://joystrategy.co/ebook
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Visit Black Boomer Besties from Brooklyn website for behind-the-scenes extras.
So old.
SPEAKER_01:I can't even believe it.
SPEAKER_04:I can't even. We're three years old. I know what I'm telling you. But Black Boomer Besties from Brooklyn Podcast. We're celebrating our third year anniversary. We started in October of 2022. Incredible. I couldn't even believe at that time what you got me into. And here we are over a hundred. Well over a hundred episodes. Um revealing about love, friendships, thoughts, yes, politics a little, a little bit, yes, but personal stuff. And during looking back over some of the things, I realize how much we've grown over these three years. Oh my gosh.
SPEAKER_01:In front, in front of everyone. In front in front of everyone.
SPEAKER_04:So what we've decided to do for the next few episodes is look back at some of our oldies but goodies. See if you still like them, if they still look enjoyable, if of course have changed how I've um fixed my teeth with my invisible line. I just kept looking at my teeth and I'm like, what the hell?
SPEAKER_01:We were all the things, all the things we were just coming at you raw and natural. Um, this particular episode um was uh over a year ago, maybe a year and a half ago. And it was um, among other things, me kind of talking about sharing when I was too much for someone, a relationship that I was in. And um, it was so interesting looking at myself, listening to how I was feeling at that time. And um yeah, but you're you're gonna see. Now remember, this was first aired in uh almost two years ago. January. Yeah, it was probably recorded um at the end of 2022, but it didn't get published until January of um 2023, I think, something like that. But anyway, it's been a while, and um yeah, so uh whatever whatever I have to say about that, know that it's been a long time.
SPEAKER_04:Um have a couple of things behind you, and the other thing she does well, I'll say you do talk about a relationship that has ended in some of your insights about it afterwards, but you're in a relationship in a loving relationship right now.
SPEAKER_01:I'm in a beautiful relationship right now.
SPEAKER_04:So I have to ask you, since you've reviewed the video, yeah, have your feelings about that changed? You know, looking back at it and saying, you know, would you have done anything different? Have you done have you have have you gained any more insight?
SPEAKER_01:I this is what I recognize. What I recognize is that man, you are really solid, meaning I really did my work. I I processed things in a way that I am proud because it was not easy. It was a very difficult time. And um I I I did the work. There was nothing that I would um kind of look back and say, ooh, I I was feeling the only thing, the only thing I have to admit that I felt a little funny about is when you asked me if I still loved him, and I said no. And the way that things are now, because you know, I do consider him a friend now. We're we're not in touch very often at all, but I do consider him a friend, but absolutely it wasn't the same way that we were in a relationship before. Um, I am in love, I am in a relationship, and um, but I do see him as a friend. Um we have um kind of moved over to that stage, but it was, man, that was hard to revisit. So I hope you guys enjoy it. This was again, I don't know, the phase in our lives. We were we were young, we were we were we were young podcasters, but we're still here and we hope to be here for years to come. We hope you enjoy the episode. Hey Les, what's cooking?
SPEAKER_04:Before I get into this, I want to say because our viewers and listeners may not know when they see us, you sitting in a bed, me laying on the couch. So I gotta let you all know. Welcome to another episode of Black Boomer Besties from Brooklyn.
unknown:Brooklyn!
SPEAKER_04:Casual edition.
SPEAKER_01:The casual edition.
SPEAKER_04:You know, this is the first time that I've recorded our podcast sitting on the couch, laying on the couch. I'm like reclined with a cover over me.
SPEAKER_01:I think the the first time I did it reclining in bed is when we did a live, an IG live, talking about um talking about um when we had a live when we did the the clitoris 101. But um casual. What's that? I've never before uh recorded um so casual. Yeah, I know, but it was like we needed to have this conversation, and um I kind of don't want to, but um but I um I don't I don't but I'm okay with being pushed to, so it's like, well, if I'm gonna do it, I'm gonna be real, I'm gonna be real relaxed. I wish I had an um an adult beverage. Like I do. Oh, you got one? You got the best drinks, I have to tell you, make the best, the best. What's the one you make with the ting? This is what I'm drinking.
SPEAKER_04:I'm drinking some ting with some gin in it. Wow. It was a hit at Monique's holiday party, too.
SPEAKER_01:I remember having it, and you know I'm not a fan of gin, but with the ting, the gin and ting, it's it's very good.
SPEAKER_04:Another level. Yes. So remember we had this conversation, and I remember exactly where I was. I was driving north in the Garden State Parkway, and you got me, and you were telling me about a new project that you were starting. I don't remember what the project was, but it was it was awesome, it was brilliant. Yes, and as I'm so often in awe of you, I said, I said, who wouldn't want to be partnered with you? Like who wouldn't want who wouldn't want to be around you just all the time?
SPEAKER_01:And so I answered. I do remember, and I was like And then there was a pregnant pause. Should I start the list? And then I'm like, oh yeah, we're like listen, listen, we're not for everybody, we are not. I know I certainly am not. I certainly am not, but then yeah, we started talking, and we're gonna um use the name Topher because that is um we both know who we're talking about while keeping the um um keeping appropriate and that launched into a conversation about tofer that I thought that was pretty interesting.
SPEAKER_04:First of all, and I might need to change my glasses because I feel like I look like Mr. Magoo. Look how let me tell you I think it's the way that the light maybe he didn't need glasses.
SPEAKER_01:Mr. Magoo never looks so good, he never looks so good. So you're okay. You're the cool, you're the coolest Mr. Magoo I've ever done.
SPEAKER_04:Okay, so I'll leave the glasses on. Okay, but the light is hitting it in a weird way. Yeah. Um you know you and I vibe. I mean, you and I click. It's like I get you. I get you.
SPEAKER_00:You do.
SPEAKER_04:But sometimes, sometimes I almost get not overwhelmed, but you're a lot. I'm a lot. You're a lot. I am a lot, and as much as I feel you like this, sometimes I I get a little anxious or nervous around you. Yeah, and and thinking about it, what happens is some of your energy, and you have energy sometimes like this, right?
SPEAKER_00:I do.
SPEAKER_04:And sometimes when that energy hits me and I embrace it, then I become like this in a time when maybe I'm not ready for it. So I get a little nervous for you. Like, is she gonna hold this off? Is she doing too much? And and when we talk about it, it comes out that um I'm with you and I'm your number one cheerleader. Right, but then on your own, you may pivot from that idea, even though I was all in, it made sense to me. I signed off on it, I endorsed it. It's like, okay, good, this is what you're gonna do, or this is what we're gonna do, perhaps with the podcast or with some other things that we collaborate on. Right, but then when you come up with another idea, then it's like, oh, okay, wait a minute. Yeah, wait a minute. Yeah, and maybe some of this what I'll call tension, which can be good or bad or neither, but this tension, maybe it comes from our left brain, right brain differences.
SPEAKER_01:I think that's a part of it. I would go I would go a little deeper into it, you know, because I have studied and used um an apparatus called instinctive drives, which looks at your natural motivations and drives and ways of you know being. And the way that I would frame it in those terms is that I I use improvise, I use the improvise um drive very much. Um so improvise is one of my key drives, and it's actually avoiding improvise is one of yours.
SPEAKER_04:What do you explain that for the people in the back?
SPEAKER_01:So, what that means is that I am always thinking about what's possible, not can we do it, but how can we do it? Like, what is the way to get it done versus not sure if we can do it? And you are more on the I'm not sure if we can do it. Should we really do it? I don't know, Ange. And I'm with the yeah, we can. What do you mean? Of course we can. And um there's no um, you know, one better than the other in in any of this, but I think what I've learned to do when I interact with people who are more um driven like you to avoid improvise, because you think about you think about the how and it's important for someone who's who's driven to improvise like I am, um to actually get things done, I want to work with someone who is more on the how. But if the person who is more wired on the how and looking at risks and things like that, they tend to not try really big audacious things.
SPEAKER_04:So And that's where it comes in because when you present these big audacious ideas, yeah, and because we communicate so well, you communicate with me and convince me of how it's gonna happen. Calm down, Les. This is what we're gonna do, and this is how we're gonna do it. Right. Okay.
SPEAKER_01:I'm all in. Hey, I just wanted to take a quick minute to have you recognize something that's happening in this episode. You'll hear me talking about um instinctive drives, and I use it to explain how I'm wired, how Leslie's wired, how we kind of um can understand each other more clearly. Instinctive drives is something that I started using in my corporate career over 15 years ago. It is something that makes you really clear about your gifts and your talents and to understand your needs. Not your wants, but your needs. And you'll notice in this episode that I also use it in my personal life. It is something that is so powerful that it is the reason why I started coaching. Because it is it has been this incredible tool that I have used to create a life filled with joy and fulfillment because I am super clear about my gifts and my needs. I can do that for you. I don't equivocate about that um that statement. I can do that in my coaching for you. I've done it over and over and over again, and I started by doing it for myself. I work with women who are older who are ready to get more fulfillment in their lives. And you can um set up a free consultation with me, just 30 minutes, and you can see whether I would be a good coach for you. So if you feel like you're ready, you're ready, it's time you spent so much time feeling um undervalued, feeling like you're doing for others and not for yourself, feeling like you have more time spent than time left to spend, and you're ready to make the most of it and to have more fulfillment. I can be your coach. I can help you to do that, to absolutely do that. So you will see a link below to schedule a consult with me. Go ahead and do that and we'll see. Thanks.
SPEAKER_04:But then if you say, wait a minute, I got another idea, or I got a different idea, or I decided I'm putting this on the back burner, instead, I'm gonna do it this way, then we start that cycle all over again for me. And I'm like, you know me, I'm change averse.
SPEAKER_01:I'm like, uh sure. Well, I think so. So what happens is that um, and we've talked about this in earlier, probably in season one, that I ideate. I I am an idea generator, and I ideate, and when and I'm really flexible, which is another one of my my drives, um, is the um in um instinctive drive speak and ID speak. I am um I am an I avoid the complete drive, and you um you you use the complete drive. So there again, we're opposite. We're opposite on those last two. Um and so what that one means is you like harmony, you like things to be in a routine, very kind of um sequential, and I like to have flexibility. I like to see, okay, I made these assumptions here, or these were these were the givens at at time A, but at time B, those things have changed. And so I want to adapt to the to the new situation. I don't want to just do the old thing because that's the way that we have planned, but things have changed. So you're like so um, so the thing is that one of the ways that I've learned to work with people who are wired differently from me is to let them know I'm ideating right now. This is not the time to think about how we're gonna get 50 million things done. That's not my intention. And me, I'm the doer. You're the you're ready to talk about it.
SPEAKER_04:Let's you're ready to get in gear. Stop talking about it. It's like, you know, it's like everybody who knows me is like if I say as soon as we start saying that's when the plan starts.
SPEAKER_01:Exactly. This is what we're gonna do. And you're like, and that's why it's so that's why it's so disruptive for you, is because you're already because I've already started it. Yeah, you've already started it, and I'm still trying to decide which one we're gonna do.
SPEAKER_04:You know what? That is such a perfect succinct way of characterizing it.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, yeah, yeah. So that's so that's what happens, and because you layer on top of it this long-term friendship and us knowing each other so well, but not only us knowing each other, but we want to make each other happy, and we're very kind of considerate of the other person. And so you wanting to be my champion, show me that you're on board, and not just show me actually be on board, you may start absorbing while I'm coming up with ideas versus waiting until I decide on which one or two ideas versus 50 that I really want to go after. It's almost like I'm jumping on it too quickly. You jump on it. Well, I won't even say two because that's kind of judgmental. You jump on it faster than I intend for the for the um actual execution to begin, right? So while I'm still thinking about which one, you've already started taking action on as many of them as possible. And I also need flexibility. That's true. I know it's true. What do you think? I'm trapped liver. This is true.
SPEAKER_04:That's my um I know what I'm talking about. Yeah.
SPEAKER_01:Right. Wow. So but we stretch each other, right? Because um I stretch you to be more flexible because if you hadn't really been stretched, we would no longer be friends. You would think that I'm crazy and would have been done with me. I would have quit you. You would have quit me. You would have quit me. And like the woman is us.
SPEAKER_04:We would have only like we met in the 10th grade, we would have just quit each other in the 11th grade.
SPEAKER_01:Uh and I have a great example of of something that I want to share too. And then the the other side is that once once we get started, I need flexibility because if I see a better way of doing it, I would I'm like, I am not bound by an old way that we thought would work when there's a more efficient way to do it. But also in your case, it could be a different idea completely. It could, but I think what happens there a lot of times, Les, is that you and other and people who are wired like you, who have the similar drives that you have, is you do not see the linkages that I see. So it seems to you like I'm doing these discrete things that are disconnected. And in fact, everything that I do, I think is connected. Everything.
SPEAKER_04:So in other words, you can look a little higher up on the umbrella.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah. Or trust me, which is usually what you end up doing, is um is is is trusting me because you know, I do stretch you, but I don't stare you wrong.
SPEAKER_04:But but for me, because I don't innately have as big a picture as you have, it does require me to put together what I see as disparate um pieces. Yeah, you know, and then later on you show me that, hey, you see the connection, you see the thread. This was there all along.
SPEAKER_01:Right, right. Because there's no way that I'm gonna start working on different things that I don't see a connection. Now I may try something and it doesn't work, and you know, those types of things, but my planning is always aligned. It's it's always aligned in in my way of thinking because I so I I'm usually trying to get um I hate this this term, but I I haven't thought of a new one. I'm always trying to kill two birds with one stone, and so I'm always um linking things that I think we we make one attempt and we'll check three boxes versus you do that, yeah.
SPEAKER_04:You do.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah.
SPEAKER_04:So here's here's here's the thing, like getting back to Topher that was so because I said who who wouldn't want to be with you romantically or connected or in your orbit. Right. And I said I've got one.
SPEAKER_01:Wait a minute. Is there one? Is there one? Yes. Well, here's what was really interesting. Man, this is so I'm thinking of so many things right now. So you you know that sorry, this thing just started to go dark.
SPEAKER_04:Let me okay, that's yeah. You look the same on my end.
SPEAKER_01:Okay.
SPEAKER_04:So um in your caftan.
SPEAKER_01:I love a caftan. Listen, we're gonna have Black Boomer Bestie caftans before this is that this is through. Just know that. That's gonna happen.
SPEAKER_04:We're gonna have a caftan club. You heard when you just asked me to put on my caftan, I resisted, right? I'm like, I'm not ready for the caftan yet.
SPEAKER_01:Caftan, listen, I am not there yet. It feels so good, it's so silky, and yeah, all the things. So, okay, there's so many things, so I'm gonna try to really focus in so that you understand. So, um, you know that um when things kind of came to a head, what was the reason for the breakup was that um I was I was more than he could handle. I'll say it a different way.
SPEAKER_04:Okay. So I'll just succinctly say that Ange was in a long-distance relationship with Topher, and they connected on a very deep level from my perspective and certainly from her from yours. And it turns out that Tofer decided or decided that he didn't think that the relationship would have longevity because it would require that I would have to change too much for him.
SPEAKER_01:So let's say, just to make it simple, let's say that And he did acknowledge that you would likely change or want to change or whatever, right? Yeah, right, that I couldn't fit into his box, yeah. Right, and you insisted that you could, right? But hold on. So I couldn't fit into his box, and so I would really want to and I would try, but in a few years I would realize that I couldn't, and that's when dissonance was gonna start to happen, and he wasn't willing to take that chance, right? And I was devastated. Like, what are you talking about? Of course I can fit in your box, and I realized after you know, it took a lot. This this this was this was one of the most difficult things that I've had to process and get to the other side of that he was right.
SPEAKER_04:That was right. The problem with that discovery or revelation was that it didn't come immediately.
SPEAKER_01:No, not at all.
SPEAKER_04:We both thought that he was a little nuts with that decision because you guys were getting along so well. But here's some of his history. He had been in a longer marriage that um that changed and they ultimately divorced. And perhaps we just thought you and I thought that he just was afraid or not ready or it was too soon. Right, right. And that he wasn't assessing.
SPEAKER_01:It had been five, it had been five years, so it wasn't like a soon thing, but um I initially felt that it was as they say, some baggage from the past that came up. And I And like what are you talking about? It's like yeah, yeah, I thought this was my person. I really, really did. And what made this um a I'm not just saying it, I really feel it thing for me is when I saw the picture of um I saw some wedding pictures. I saw that he had gotten married, and I saw I saw his beautiful wife, and my reaction was so right because that's so not me.
SPEAKER_04:You could kind of see from the pictures. I could see just you know that.
SPEAKER_01:Maybe I'm making some of this up because I don't know the person, but from what I could see, it was there. You go. I it was it just became like, and so when you when I told you and you were like, What do you mean? You're not mad, you're not, I'm like, no, because I get it, I saw it.
SPEAKER_04:Like you know how I characterized the the picture.
SPEAKER_01:You remember I said, please don't say it, Les, don't say it. But I so um you can say it if you want.
SPEAKER_04:No, I'm just saying in gym and then I'll say it.
SPEAKER_01:No, but the thing is, you know, when you see something and um the way it hits you is the real truth. Clarity. It's not like and the way it hit me, it was like, oh my God, he was so right. Because I may have been that for a little bit, and I might have wanted to, and it might have been just something that um I in a way kind of sacrificed a part of myself. I may have been totally willing to do it because you know the love was so the love was so strong. That's what we do, we change. Yeah, yeah. But I think that he, first of all, he knew himself. So regardless of whether he knew me or not, or whether I was willing to do it or not, he knew who he was. And he knew that he, whether it was fact or fiction, he knew that he would have felt that I was shutting parts of myself down. You know what I mean? But what you say he knew you more than you knew you? No, rem this is a subtlety, so stay here with me. Yeah, go ahead. This is a he knew himself. And he knew how he would have felt he he knew himself and he knew how he would have felt um if he had any inkling or if I said anything that that felt like it was in that ballpark, he would have started believing that because he knew himself. Does that does that hit? And that I really okay. So let's say someone says, um I don't know if I can think of anything. Okay, let's say um he knew what he could he knew what he could tolerate and he knew what he had sensitivities around. Yeah. And so he knew if he if he had a feeling that I was um diminishing um who I was fully to fit into his box. If he sensed that, he knew that it would have been something that really troubled him. Ah. So that's regardless of whether I was gonna be able to do it or not. Because I used to think that, well, he didn't know me. He, you know, he really didn't understand. Oh my god, I'm like thinking that that is so deep. Yeah, it it is really deep. The the the thing that lingers that I'm almost done with this, also. The thing that lingered the longest is he should have told me and we could have arrived at the same place together. Instead of him getting there secretly, you know, without communicating, and then it was this abrupt, it was this abrupt thing for me. You know what I mean?
SPEAKER_04:But a couple of revelations around that. I've I concluded that he was a less than virtuous person, you know, by not being a little more forthright earlier, you know. However, in thinking about this, from what I remember of the few details about the relationship as it was still going on, was that he was letting you know that he was concerned that your personhood or your lifestyle may not be compatible with him. And you in fact tried to um let him know that that there were two, because there were two sides of you, that this is your entrepreneurial self or your um online presence or your public view, whereas the private core of you was some some someone different.
SPEAKER_00:Right.
SPEAKER_04:So whereas he was telling you of the concerns that he had, you were trying to explain to him that that outward appearance was not who you were at your core.
SPEAKER_01:Right, right. Um true. Here's the thing that um he didn't believe me. He he would always say that you do XYZ with such ease. There's no way that you don't you don't like you know taking selfies or doing lives or whatever. There's no way, or when I was doing the Hair Stories project, you know, did you did you memorize that? It's like, yeah, I I know it really well, and so I can say it without reading or or whatever, but it took effort to do that. I make it look easy, but it takes effort for me to do it. So um I so he did not believe me, which you know really bothers me when someone thinks I'm being disingenuous. That's yeah, that doesn't fly for too long with me because I um I hold my honesty in you know on such a pedestal, just the way that I was raised.
SPEAKER_04:I I think that it's so nuanced that it in this case it wasn't necessarily that he was saying that you were being dishonest. Yeah, it was in saying that what you don't think that he was just saying like maybe you just are not aware.
SPEAKER_01:No, because it wasn't an awareness thing. It's just like if somebody's telling you who you are and he's like, eh, I don't know. No, no, no, then that that's that's not a what's that? It's like don't tell me who I am. Exactly. Don't tell me who the fuck I am. Yeah, it was annoying. It was annoying because um because and then and then to know that he was making all these decisions based on it. And trust me, he didn't whatever what you just said about he was kind of giving hints, not really, because what you know me. If I smell something, I'm gonna ask. I'm not gonna just I'm gonna ask, I'm gonna check in, and I'm gonna assume that someone's gonna tell me the truth. Right. It's like what's gonna if they say, Oh, such and this, it's work or whatever, I'm gonna believe you.
SPEAKER_04:I'm like that too.
SPEAKER_01:Just tell the truth.
SPEAKER_04:Tell me, yeah.
SPEAKER_01:So me extending grace became I was not being realistic. Well, I would be realistic if you would just tell me. You don't you don't have to. If I'm asking you a question, give me the right answer, give me the true answer. But at the end of the day, I um I think that he was right that I would have, he would have expected, I think, I'm gonna say it that way. He would have expected me to keep a part of myself turned down because kind of that would have been what I signed up for. And and when I say a part of myself, for example, I don't think he would have been comfortable with me talking about the clitoris 101 or talking about um boudoir um photography or wanting to learn how to do pole dancing, those things wouldn't fit into his box. Now, it doesn't mean that I could have would have any issue in giving any of those up because I do think in relationships you you know you you make decisions.
SPEAKER_04:And I think that this was a a show of his love for you is that he didn't he wouldn't want you to give those things up.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, that's very true. Yeah, right. But my thing is though, that would have been my choice. Yeah. And and I think that having been um uh married and divorced twice, there's certain things that um I would be so willing to turn off or turn down or to forego to have a genuine friendship and um deep intimate connection with someone. There are things that I would have been, I would not have felt it a hardship to turn down. So I do think it was a mix of how he knew himself and what he felt um would be kind of triggers for him. And one of them is that he he would have um it would have been a forced thing versus a choice that I would make.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah.
SPEAKER_01:Right? Like like coloring my hair, for example, right? You know, I color my hair all the time. Yeah. Um he actually thought that I would have an issue with not coloring my hair blue. I'm like, if the person that I love didn't want me to have blue hair, that wouldn't be something that I would feel, oh, I can do whatever the hell I want. It's just not how I'm wired. Yeah. But it would be hard for someone like him to understand that that would not at in any in any light be a hardship for me. It would be like, you know, because Yeah, yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_04:But but but I get I get that position though. I wouldn't want you get what position? I wouldn't want to be the guy who says to your loved one, I know you love blue hair, but because I don't like it, you can't have blue hair.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, but listen, I know that that's a position. So let so okay, you stayed at that position. Here's a different position. A different position is I can blue hair means nothing to me. It it has if in the in the priorities of life right, right, right. Blue hair is in the top 100. The blue hair is there, but it's 105. Do you know what I mean? And for me, that's what compromise in a relationship is, and it wouldn't be something like that was in you know, the the the top 100 things that I would want to do that I felt like it was such a compromise. But he made that choice for me. Do you know what I mean? He he felt just like you did. I wouldn't want to, but for me, that would be for me to say and but here's where I said that he really knows himself because if he thought that I was giving up something that I really cared about, it would be triggering for him. And maybe he would have a fear that I would grow tired of him or whatever.
SPEAKER_04:And who knows, right, when how and when these issues presented themselves in his prior relationships of self-drown.
SPEAKER_01:Exactly.
SPEAKER_04:But you know, now we come back to where we started thinking here. I am thinking when you came when you gave me this, I remember just driving in the car, and you're like, and I'm like, wow, this is I don't even remember what the idea was, but I remember my reaction to it saying that that's a great idea, Ange. Okay, let's do it or you do it or whatever. And I'm like, man, who wouldn't want to be with someone who thinks in this way, you know, because it was that innovation or that out there idea that was just so appealing that I'm like, wait a minute. Right, right. We are not for everybody, not for everybody, and guess what?
SPEAKER_01:I'm okay with that. I'm okay with that. I'm not for everybody, but I am for somebody. That's good, that's good. I am for somebody, and that I know, and it's just you know, it'll it'll happen. It'll happen.
SPEAKER_04:So um because you you would think, and and and I'll I'll say it this way who I guess you gotta live a little bit to be able to um to to see this and realize it. Like, why wouldn't you want someone who is um kind, godly, nurturing, idly educated, entrepreneur, entrepreneurial you know what I mean? It's like we we we you mentioned ticking off boxes. You would think, like, oh, you know, if you were to put this on uh Tinder, people would swipe right.
SPEAKER_02:Whatever. I don't want to talk about that.
SPEAKER_04:But I'm just you know what I mean? But and then you when you dig a little bit deeper, you realize that we're gonna it's not just about ticking the boxes and this and that. It's that you start really addressing some core issues or core fears, core concerns, anxieties, your history and who you are, you know.
SPEAKER_00:Right.
SPEAKER_04:Then it gets a little more complicated.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah.
SPEAKER_04:Well, as you always say, you gotta dig a little bit deeper that you can't stay superficial.
SPEAKER_00:Right, right.
SPEAKER_04:Yeah, um when you mentioned to me about the um photograph of the wedding, it became a little bit clearer to me as you described how um you know he wasn't you know your person. Or you was you weren't his person.
SPEAKER_01:And and therefore we weren't meant for each other. Um yeah, I was um I have to say that it was such confirmation for me, the way that my body reacted to seeing the the the picture because it was involuntary, right? You see a picture and it's someone that you used to love and you know, and well, you know, it was like oh there it is. There it is. He he was he was right. Um because um you still love you still love, right?
SPEAKER_04:Oh no.
SPEAKER_01:No, really, definitely not um in the way that I used to. No, I don't no, no, no, I don't I I wouldn't use the word love. I don't love him anymore. I just wish the best for him. I don't wish him any harm. Right, right. Occasionally I I I pray for his um his joy. But no, I wouldn't I wouldn't say that. Wow.
SPEAKER_04:It's almost like it just um podcast talking about the the love.
SPEAKER_01:You know, well, I think he caused more pain than it really than was necessary.
SPEAKER_04:But look how many lessons came from it.
SPEAKER_01:Still so you could learn less.
SPEAKER_04:I believe that the Lord works in a way that um we get the lessons that are supposed to have.
SPEAKER_01:He does, but it doesn't mean that that you keep loving someone who's hurt you.
SPEAKER_04:You could you could learn a lesson in Eros love.
SPEAKER_01:I mean No, any kind of love. Agapo let's let's move into that. Well, the thing is, right? I do agree. I believe that God allows things in your life for the lesson to be learned. I don't think that God expects you to love the people who teach you these lessons necessarily. Because some of these lessons you could have one without the other. It doesn't have to yeah, yeah, yeah. I that's true. Yeah, so um lesson learned. No, I no longer love him because I um I was too open a communicator for him to not still for him to kind of go off on this tangent by himself without letting me know that this was percolating. And the coward cowardice. Yeah, it was cowardly. Yeah, it was cowardly, I thought. Um, and also because um when I was surprised by you know, when he actually told me, he said, Well, if you were paying attention, you should you should know. And I thought that was really hurtful because I was I was like, I was so paying attention. I'm like, that's what grace is, because I believed you. Yeah, you know what I mean? When you said it was because of this, that, the other, I believed you. I didn't hang on and say, nah, he's bullshitting me, he's blowing smoke. You know what I mean? And so for that, I had to kind of put that in the in in in in its box and yeah, yeah, wish him the best. But I I wouldn't say that.
SPEAKER_00:Okay. Well, yeah.
SPEAKER_04:We got each other. I get you.
SPEAKER_01:I feel sure. You do. And even, you know, even when you don't get me, you don't mistreat me.
SPEAKER_05:That's true.
SPEAKER_01:That's it. You just have to be honest, yeah. Right?
SPEAKER_04:Wow, and whatever the end too.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, whatever you're able to say when you can't say it anymore, you can say it months before. You could get up the you could get up the courage sooner rather than later. Don't go to punk. Um, avoid a lot of pain. What's that? Don't be don't go to punk root. Don't be a punk.
SPEAKER_00:Don't be a punk. Exactly.
SPEAKER_04:You know what? That's a great way to end this. Don't be a punk.
SPEAKER_03:Brooklyn.
