What is Reality Horror? | Beyond Found Footage.

Hello, horrorphiles. In this episode, we dissect the subgenre of Found Footage, along with its broader subgenre of "Reality Horror." This dissection will be spoiler-free.

“Found footage is a cinematic technique in which all or a substantial part of the work is presented as if it were film or video recordings recorded by characters in the story, and later "found" and presented to the audience,” according to Wikipedia.

Popular examples include, The Blair Witch Project, Paranormal Activity, Cloverfield, and more recently, Late Night with the Devil.

This is Dissecting Horror: Examining the anatomy of fear in film, television and literature with Kelsey Zukowski and Steven Aguilera.

We hope you find it in your cold, black, withered hearts to join our Society of Grotesquery and Loathing and keep our podcast suffering onward:

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Photo credit: Slevin Mors

Transcript

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Hello, horrorphiles. You're listening to Dissecting Horror. Examining the anatomy of fear in film, television and literature. In this episode, we're dissecting the genre of found footage. I'm filmmaker Steven Aguilera I'm writer and performer Kelsey Zukowski. In our Society of Grotesquerie and Loathing, if you will. I will. And we hope you will subscribe for more. Won't you? Found footage is a cinematic technique in which all or a substantial part of the work is presented as if it were film or video Recordings recorded by characters in the story and later found and presented to the audience, according to Wikipedia. Popular examples include The Blair Witch Project, Paranormal Activity, Cloverfield, and more recently, Late Night with the devil. found footage is one of the most hit or miss subgenres of horror. There are far more found footage films that come off as one note, lazy and style over substance than those that utilize the gritty, erratic style to successfully complement a gripping, suspense fueled story that offers a lingering eeriness in the viewer. Iconic trailblazers like Cannibal Holocaust and The Blair Witch Project perhaps honor the definition of found footage best, presenting it as if it were a captured account of true terror that its subject managed to get on film. Now being presented to us While there are very different films, they both leaned into public sphere and fascination of horrors that they believed could have really happened that tangible, close to home sort of evil, and even the personal challenge to uncover it as myth or fact caused to many in a unique way that made these films hard to resist. Playing with that eerie compulsion and then maintaining compelling, effective suspense and story within that is the essential foundation for found footage that manages to be memorable and effective in a sea of mediocre entries. As a loose analogy, found footage is to cinema what reality shows are to conventional TV narratives. This perceived sense of reality makes it more impactful, and as the name implies, more real. Regardless of how fantastical its premise might be. This idea expands the found footage subgenre into a broader category one might call reality horror. With this broader inclusion, one can integrate things not so previously classified. Take the 1938 Orson Welles radio broadcast War of the worlds, famous for convincing listeners that Martians were actually invading Earth, inciting widespread panic. though presented as a live report and not as found recordings, it still fits my reality model. Note here that a defining characteristic of found footage is that it tends to depict scary events, which even the 1938 War of the worlds broadcast contained. The ordeal recorded also includes an effort to film what was happening, despite the perils involved in doing so that the footage survived as often, the only witness to what happened makes the loss of its creators somehow more chilling or poignant. it acts as a testament of their will to survive by preserving this record so others might be spared. The Blair Witch Project, and more recently Paranormal Activity are two of the most profitable horror films, sending the sign to studios, aspiring filmmakers, and anyone with a camera that they could strike gold through a similar formula while making the film and getting it out there in the world is never easy. The subgenre is one of the most conducive to the idea of making a film that is easy, quick, and profitable. Which of course triggered an oversaturation of found footage films of varying quality and originality. From an independent perspective, it's wonderful that the popularity of this subgenre paved the way and encouraged filmmakers and novices with lower budgets to create visually and technically, it is one of the most forgiving styles of filmmaking. Looking more unpolished and amateur can even make it seem all the more raw, gritty and intimate. It has the artifice of something easy to do, but in many ways, found footage can be even more challenging for filmmakers to create a film that grabs its viewers. Mini focus on a small group of characters in a fairly understated setting, with things slowly escalating. While this can be easier to work with and accomplish with a low budget, having a story or a set of characters that don't grip the audience in this form is far less forgiving than a film more drenched in gore, action, and makeup flare each moment you have to continue to grip in a number the audience, whether due to the character's story, deeper layers, striking realism or mystery, and often through a very minimalistic, less is more approach. Even for fans of the style, the shaky cam and grid of the images scene can get old quick, if that's all there is. As with any other form of story, if all you have is the style and not the substance, it will fall flat or at the least be forgettable. Circling back to my reality TV analogy, it and found footage have the benefit of being much cheaper to create. It can be just as engaging, if not more so. Being an expensive to produce has long been a plus point of horror film production anyway. The found footage format is also the most accessible for anyone to make, Sense it can be achieved with a smartphone you have on you right now, while potentially being just as impactful as a $50 million production. I might even argue that the crappier the footage, the more effective it comes across. 1st May not even have much filmmaking understanding. While that in itself could lend to a more authentic feel, since characters in the story usually have no such experience either. In fact, Something to polished could detract and feel fake. Case in point when Dreamworks purchased the rights to Paranormal Activity, they had the intention of remaking it with a bigger budget. But after responses to test screenings where some audience members were too scared to remain, they changed their mind. It's worth mentioning that Oren Peli, the director, was a software designer with absolutely no film production experience. Yet Paranormal Activity is considered one of the most successful films of all time. It was shot for seven days at the director's house for $15,000, earning 194 million at the box office worldwide. An unpolished documentary style can also make for a more unpredictable, frantic feel, which aligns nicely with anxiety. Security footage, with its degraded quality and detached viewpoint, offers a cold eye to what we are witnessing. Perhaps the most iconic shot of M Night Shyamalan's signs glimpses an alien captured on home video during a child's birthday party, passing their house. Well, I, for one, am definitely thrilled that they didn't decide to reshoot Paranormal Activity with a bigger budget. Really? When I'm looking at not just what is a good film that's found footage, but what is an example of found footage that really utilizes that subgenre and that grittiness and the building tension and the minimalism, and doing a lot with that. I think paranormal Activity is one of the strongest examples that I can think of, and I actually not that I never would, but I have purposely not watched any of the sequels, because one thing I think was so great about it was it was just so resourceful and doing so much was so little, and it was that minimalist style. I think that, like, made it so great, in my opinion. The film features realistic, largely likable characters to follow, played by no name talent and presented by a first time director, the film nailed absolutely biting tension through the ticking time stamp, and small but incredibly effective creepy reveals. It oozes resourcefulness, creativity, and the art of the scare that was far more impactful than many big budget horror films full of CGI ghosts in your face or overly exaggerated, forceful jump scares. Even though post Blair Witch audiences weren't going to necessarily believe a found footage film was real, it still managed to bring on a fan phenomenon, partially because it still was feeling very grounded, fresh, and triggering once fear response, even in a safe, fictional setting. In many ways, that tantalizing feeling of tension and awe and a safe setting digs deep into the appeal of horror for many. I saw it in its limited release when they were trying to create word of mouth through the demand in a theater near you campaign. This was really before there was much hype around it, and I was able to go in without many expectations. It's still one of the best theater experiences I have had, where the whole crowd was on the edge of their seat, unified, and being fueled with anticipation, expecting something to happen at any second, bracing for impacts and still a piercing through us as one when something as small as the covers moving on their own occurred. As an indie filmmaker who has made your own found footage film, The Frankenstein Monster Project, what inspired you and made you want to use this genre vehicle to tell your story? There is the obvious advantage of, budgetary constraints and the documentary style that it takes advantage of makes for not just a cheaper production, but one that can be filmed at a greater pace. I think we shot that in eight days or something like that one day longer than, Paranormal Activity. From there, the equipment needed, for set up and just the the general quality of footage didn't require a $70,000 RV Alexa or something. Or red camera. You can just do it with something more prosumer. But ours was a take on, silent films. It was It was a parody of The Blair Witch Project, but 100 years earlier with Frankenstein. So it was the Frankenstein Monster Project, so we could even degrade the film more than normal. And I did so in post quite significantly, to make it look as rough and as raw as it could be. And so that's an advantage there. You don't have to worry about the quality so much. And normally, I'll get to a point about the audio later, but ours was a silent film, so we didn't have to record any audio, which made it even more, easy to do. yeah, I think that's the main thing is the budget and the logistic simplicity of it all. it's that weird inverse where the worse you make it look, the more authentic it feels. And so it was definitely a new style and a new area of filmmaking that I'd never tackled before. I'm usually more spielbergian in my approach, so this is so opposite and I enjoyed that challenge plus as a way of as sort of honoring and poking fun at Blair, which I kind of ties into that. And it also just focusing on this very early cinema period, you know, and even like the footage in, you know, is even mentioned in the film a lot. So it's, it's, it's kind of in grounded in the, the story and what's happening itself. And you play The Bride of Frankenstein, and that's how we actually originally met. And one day, I swear to God, we're going to get this film out. It's done. It just needs, distribution. So if any distributors are out there, by all means reach out to us. An original hook of found footage was implying the events as having actually happened. This included extending the reality nature of the film into its promotion, with showings of The Blair Witch Project. At film festivals such as Sundance. Missing persons fliers of the cast were posted as part of the marketing campaign. The film's website also described the conditions of their disappearance, including fake police reports, sparking a highly successful viral marketing campaign. Even the film's IMDb page listed the actors as, quote, missing or presumed dead, unquote. In the first year of the film's availability, the naive among us will always exist, but I think we're past the days of anyone wondering if such content is literally real footage that was found. Yet even with that pretense laid aside, I think it's interesting that the format is still so effective. Yeah, it seems like there is a certain fascination really, even in horror films, just based on a true story. Even half the time when it's very, very loosely, you know, a base that's still people get more excited for that. They're something that could really happen. I get just more grounded. And even if we're not believing this is actual fact found uncovered by, you know, police investigation that that it's, maybe presented more in a format that feels like it's very personal and intimate and could be almost as if we are there with people documenting it. There is something about reality itself that could be included, whether it's based on true events it could be horror, it could be some other genre. It doesn't really matter that as a hook I think is very enticing to people. And I think this whole reality nature of found footage and that broader genre I'm calling reality horror tends to be so effective, especially with horror, because, the events are so supernatural or far fetched or generally dramatic that, wow, if that really happened on any level, then it's even more compelling. But when we have, let's say, The Amityville Horror, which I think the Warrens were, present for and sparked the whole initial, craze about, back in the whatever it was 70s, it was, a far stretch, a far cry from the actual events, if you if you know what really happened. And so once that spell is broken and you get how far things are taken from the events that were really there, you get more jaded about things and it doesn't quite mean the same thing. But as as a kid I was like, wow, this, this is amazing. This actually happened. You believe, like everything, all the dialog, every word was spoken by the actors, was spoken by the original people. And now it's it's mostly bullshit, but it is a compelling hook. Yeah. It's interesting. Especially when, to your point, when it takes these supernatural or. Otherworldly sort of threats. And it's a way of kind of like grounding it or making it more close to home. It seems like I think some of, that there's like a few films that focus on more of, I guess like monster and natural disasters sort of a thing that, I think do kind of connect your head a little bit more something that could very much happen. Like, I don't know, one that comes to mind is the Bay that I thought was really well done, which is sort of eco horror, but sort of natural disaster horror. Just disease and destruction. But just seeing that sort of taking from normalcy and then it kind of being ripped farther and farther away from that. sort of documentary horror. Film that it kind of takes place sort of, like a reporter. So there's reason for them to be documenting and, pretty much there's an infection that spreads that just brings more and more chaos and turns extremely gruesome in terror inducing. And something about, I think the footage style, I don't know, kind of puts us there in the middle of all the chaos. Well, circling back to the based on true events concept, when when you're saying that, I'm thinking, well, another compelling point about knowing that something loosely happened, based around this, story is that it feels like someone felt compelled to make this movie because it was so important of a thing. And it's the medium or format to get it out to the public. And perhaps that's a last ditch effort to, say what actually happened where no other avenue may have existed. So it makes it feel even more compelling in that regard. I never saw the Bay, but I've looked for it here and there, and whenever I have, it wasn't available for streaming. Is that that's not a foreign film, is it? No. It's, sudden, like New England area. Yeah, I think I think it's, like, available to rent right now. I had seen it a few years ago. I think it used to be, you know, available on streaming that one. And, I would say like Rec two that's those two rec in the Bay. I always confuse those and I've never seen either of them. Okay. Rec well, quarantine was the American version that was inspired by Rec. But, yeah, Rec was more it was in that same line of like, natural disaster and kind of similar that it starts with, a reporter kind of uncovering something. And then as things escalates, them kind of uncovering and trying to fight through and survive sort of a situation. But yeah, but I think both are, are very well done. And I'm a little bit of that realism. And just like kind of put you if you were in this situation kind of how would you manage and fight through it. And like Paranormal Activity, those have spawned a great many sequels as well. I understand, I don't know about the Bay, but I know Rec has had several, versions. Was that the one that's like French or something? rec think it's as, Spanish, I believe Spanish. Okay, well, I'm not good with subtitles. You know how much I loathe reading, but I'll give it a go. Kelsey, What are things that make a found footage film bad? Oh, yes. I think the biggest thing is just not having a fully fleshed out story. And I think characters, like, they don't have to be the most layered, you know, well, well-connected characters in the world. But I think if they're not at least interesting and you can't really empathize or feel like you're invested in what they're going through, then it really kind of falls apart. Recently, I watched a film that I thought was like middle, middle ground. It was hell House LLC, the initial premise was very interesting. It, focuses on some haunt creators like, manufactured haunted houses to, you know, for, for guests to experience as, immersive celebration of Halloween. And, they had built on a sort of cursed or haunted ground. And one of my first acting jobs in LA was, a character on the Queen Mary for their Dark Harbor event, which is, you know, the Queen Mary is known to be a very haunted location. So there was that connection there, but also, I think haunted house, kind of depictions are a little underutilized subject matter within horror. Like there's been a few films that have taken on that subject matter, but like, hardly any ever seemed to really dig enough into the potential in those themes. And to show, I guess I kind of like a compelling perspective and even like the psychology that I think is very inherent and very interesting, actually, another found footage that fell a little short of that, but had that potential was, the houses that October built, that one similar focuses on haunt enthusiasts looking for like the the most, like, edgy, extreme haunted house that end up getting sort of haunted by these malicious, mysterious kind of characters. For both of them, the initial intrigue was strong, but they just didn't offer realistic and interesting enough characters or dig deep enough into anything that really clung on to those layers and the compelling elements. With just a little bit more development, it would have been far more interesting and strong entries in the found footage subgenre. And going back to Hill House, I'll see. I think the most interesting aspect was kind of like the origins of this, of this haunting and what what was responsible. Essentially, it opens, you know, when they have their opening nights, there are already some creepy or mysterious unexplained things have been happening with like, sort of like the props kind of coming alive, or is there something kind of animating them or something sinister happening? And they have this opening night that goes horribly wrong and people are injured. And, it starts off kind of like a documentary like mystery series of like what really happened that night because they have footage that's been uploaded on YouTube. And, just a lot of people have like looked into this case and no one can really, like, see what happened. So, yeah, like the premise was really interesting and even the characters weren't bad. They weren't like, they weren't like horrible, but they weren't like, interesting. Really. So it was kind of like you just needed to flush them out a little bit more or dig into, I guess, like the origins and kind of like deeper story that was happening. And even even the found footage aspect there was with the documentary aspect, there was a little bit of an interesting of like, okay, something, something crazy happened. Like what? You know, so there is a little bit of mystery in it and, enticing nature to that. But other than that, the I don't I didn't really feel like the found footage style, like, added anything for me. There wasn't really any, like, creepy moments, like Paranormal Activity, for example. I think key differences there was, I mostly found the characters likable enough where I cared about them and what they were going through, and I wanted to see, you know, them at least document this horror that they were, you know, certain was terrorizing them. it brought alive those like, little moments better of well created tension. Really. Well, where you were just every second you were expecting something to happen, you're like, okay, what's it going to be? I'm ready, I'm ready. And so this didn't really have that strong biting tension and even even moments where you're like, oh, that prop moved or something creepy happened there, I don't know, for me, it just didn't really have any impact. So I got it's not like a horrible film. And there are many sequels and a prequel, which I have heard. The prequel is a bit better, but also when you get where the first film, you're like, there's a lot of, issues or things that could have been better with this. It doesn't necessarily inspire you to watch like four more movies to get to that good meat that you wanted in the first one you bring up a point that, I think it's important to bear in mind. spoke of anybody being able to shoot, found footage, film with their cell phone or whatever, but those technical aspects of filmmaking, you can get away with something very, low tech, but you still need well-written characters that are believable, but you need to, have performers to relay those performances in a way that are actually believable. And that takes actually, something of a talented actor whose job it is to portray fictionalized characters in the most believable way possible, or else your found footage film isn't going to seem very real at all. And there are some people, like in real life, we all know people who are kind of bland, and we know people that are more charismatic and interesting, and you want to just sort of be in their space or just watch them, do whatever they do. And those people are not necessarily abundant in society. So my caveat is that if you're going to make a found footage film, you need to cast it with people who are really talented or who at least are interesting people to look at or watch, do whatever it is they're doing. So that's that's probably going to be your biggest challenge. Yeah. And I think, another one that comes to mind where I think the characters were really, pretty much ruins the film for me, to be honest, was the did you ever see that? That's a third one that I confused with Rec and the Bay. Yeah. VHS overall not horrible, but especially in the first segment. Oh my God. The characters were like some of the worst I think I've ever experienced in horror cinema. They were just that, like, really, really annoying, tedious. Like, obviously you're like, okay, we're probably just like building up to like some satisfying deaths or something, but it's like, I couldn't even enjoy that. Like every minute of that film was just like pain inducing just to, like, endure these characters. And it's also an anthology. So it's like you have, I feel like within mythology is it can be hard to really get the right, the right, mix where it compliments and kind of interweaves and doesn't feel just like here are three separate shorts that are, you know, all horror, you know, or in, in, found footage style. And, yeah, I didn't think it quite nailed that, but, yeah. And it, I think if you're not going to have likable characters because I mean, not that's fine. Not every set of protagonists like you have to be super invested in, but at least either like the story or like the villain, you have to create like a very interesting, enticing villain. So then you're rooting for that. But if you just are just annoyed or just don't care or are so detached from every single person you see on screen like it's hard, it's hard to care about anything, or for that as a story to have any impact at all. Which I think is definitely strong actors and being believable, especially in the style that's very like grounded and were being presented as if these are real people. And this is just, you know, an adventure, you know, that they went on of trying to document and then in many cases, horrible demise kind of befalling them. So, yeah, if there isn't some investment or realism there, I think everything just falls apart. And on that realism wall kind of improv can be conducive. I think also some filmmakers almost see it as sort of like an easy way out or like, yes, with the style. It's forgiving and can be kind of very rough and gritty. But like I've also like years ago, I've also, you know, auditioned for things where essentially there was no script, your foundation or like, you know, like there should at least be. Okay, this is kind of what's happening in this scene. And you start here, there's this challenge, there's this beat, and then this is kind of like how you come out of it. Like if you're going for a very heavy improv style because it can add to some realism. But I don't know. I feel like I've seen it just as a case, a lot of times where it's like, okay, well, we'll just let them do whatever. And it without again, it's like not creating that story or substance and just kind of, I don't know, just viewing it as like, oh, this will be an easy, quick film, sort of a thing Found footage presents its own unique sets of problems which require creative solutions so that the completeness of the story can be satisfied in a way that showcases the characters sufficiently, both visually and audibly. It's trickier than you might think, since one must plausibly capture everything necessary for the story in a way that doesn't feel contrived or distracting. I have found that you can be as sloppy as you want with the visuals, But the audio still needs to at least be decent. Nothing will torture an audience more in a bad way than audio, which is challenging to make out or grates the nerves. Now, I was watching, Paranormal Activity, fresh a few days ago. I didn't get through it all, but I did notice that the sound wasn't great. it sounded more like the, just whatever built in crappy mic that was on the camera. That wasn't necessarily, a system where everybody was miked up But I would say that was barely minimum, working. But any worse than that, I think it would have been more painful, especially if you had to least strain to make out what people were saying. Yeah. And I think like, again, some that are just forgettable. But, you know, over the years I've definitely watched a lot of lower budget and, you know, indie. And it's not that indie is always the problem because like VHS, I think was a bigger budgeted film and it still had those story issues. And really I think it also like really overdid like the shaky cam thing. Like I you of, a definitely a downside to found footage is like also I think like Blair, which was so iconic and did so well, I think for, for so long, there was just so many people just essentially copying that. So there it wasn't the originality and they're like, oh, there was this kind of memorable moment in Blair Witch. So we'll just kind of do that same thing. But yeah, even, even there's like even some good films I like, I don't have the best experiences with because it's just like sort of headache inducing and like, you know, there's a little bit of, like putting you into this hysteria and this, you know, just total fear. As if you were you were with these characters running for your life from something you just saw. But I think when it's overdone, it, it kind of just ruins it and kind of takes you out and just makes you almost like more detached from the film. Motion sickness can be an issue. Even when we're shooting Frankenstein, I had this balance. I was trying to strike where the, camera's built in. Stabilization was activated, but I was still doing it handheld. So those. It wasn't like all the micro jitters were taken away. But there's still some degree of Movement. And when I was editing that thing, oh, my God, I was so sick to my stomach because of all the switch pans and all the rest of it. But yeah, that's a problem. And, there's a handful of scenes in Blair Witch where things are really hysterical and the camera's flying all over the place, but there are few and far between. And, even with, like, Jason Bourne films where you have this sort of these action sequences where things are just moving around so much you don't even know which guy's has the knife or whatever. And you have to really, deal with that, not just while you're filming it, but in the edit. And be very cautious, because there are a lot of people who just have very weak stomachs and they just can't deal with that sort of. Even Edgar Wright was talking about that when it comes to his, Cornetto trilogy with Shaun of the dead think in this case, he was talking about Hot Fuzz and all of his, transition shots and whatnot. They're just too much for some people and some audiences. People are getting up and leaving because they were just too sick and that was pretty minimal. That was just the transitions. I never noticed anything, Me neither. But I never saw in a theater on a big screen. And I think that makes a big difference to if it's more immersive that way, it might have a bigger effect. Yeah. I think, when I saw Cloverfield, one that I think it was a good, like event movie, like it was exciting at the time, but I felt like going back to it. It's not bad, but I feel like it. It doesn't have that same, I don't know, kind of like excitement or thrill to it as when it was like released in the theater. But that was one. It's not the movie's fault, but I didn't have the best theater experience with because I was like, front row. Just like that was one with a lot of kind of shaky cam and just distortion. And I definitely had like a crick neck and felt kind of sick after I watched that movie. I hated the characters in that film. I hated those people. So fucking much. There were just too, I don't know, they looked like actors. There's too hip and good looking, and they're just annoying people that I couldn't relate to in any way whatsoever. So yeah, I can see that it seemed a little, little Hollywood, you know, depiction of something that's supposed to be grounded and more personal that I like. I don't know if that was something that stood out to me at the time, but. Yeah, that that's, reasonable. One film that made its own mark and added something new to the found footage subgenre was 2014 creep. It was heavily improvised and brought something fresh to the found footage subgenre with ample realism and unease. The film was inspired by conversations between co-writers Patrick Brice and Mark Duplass, who also star in the film alongside each other, especially considering Duplass mumblecore roots and the inherent understanding the two had on what they wanted to create, it is understandable that they would be able to create such a cohesive, naturalistic, tantalizing character study of a man who feels equally unhinged and sympathetic that escalates into something more invasive and predatory. For me personally, the first film really hit on the risks we sometimes take as freelancers in the entertainment world. Many of us have accepted a job or connected with someone who is an essential stranger online, who could have ended up being a deranged psychopath, or someone who was using a project as a lure to bring in their prey and nothing more. And that premise alone, and the idea that something is amiss, the tension and dread is palpable. Interestingly enough, Bryce noted it wasn't intended to be a horror film at first, but simply a focus of psychological tension and the humor between the characters. But the material and early audience opinions made him realize it was destined to go in a darker direction. Its sequel focusing on a struggling YouTuber who willingly aligns herself with the serial killer to bridge the gap and capture something that people can't scroll past. Tapped even more into the modern age, occupation and obsession with serial killers, documenting everything in our lives and finding a sense of a voice and importance through an audience's accepted. This aspect is connected at its core to found footage style, and in fact, going beyond that style to offer subtle commentary and exploration around the motivation. That in itself makes it a worthy contribution. Not just choosing this as the vehicle and style to tell the story, but to peel back its layers and look at the motivations and psychology of this subject and documentarian impulse. One of the most recent angles on found footage is utilizing the video chat and online presence era, with films like Unfriended and Hosts, which also add subtext of the climate they reside in, such as touching on things like cyber bullying and the divide, isolation and fear in the early pandemic. And this, the footage and social media style is an integral part of it, and a piece of the story it's telling. While of the two, I felt host was a stronger film, both build great suspense, creativity and strongly execute. The less is more craft Currently found footage can be expressed in a great many ways in addition to smartphones, home video, documentaries, security cameras and news broadcasts we now have webcams, dash cams, traffic cams, infrared cameras, body cams, helmet cams, hidden cameras, 360 cameras and drones, among many others. and these days the numbers of people continually filming themselves in public justifies further that found footage content should exist much more so than over a generation ago, when the genre first gained popularity. Yeah, I definitely agree. And I think while there's nothing wrong with just choosing the found footage style and making a good film with that style, I think to kind of have your own voice and identity as a found footage film. a good instinct is to add something to it, whether it's a commentary on something you see in humanity or going on in the world or, you know, any, any number of things. But I think that some of them that stand out now, more that we have so many of a very specific formula that didn't really work and didn't stand out, I think the ones that kind of go that extra step to kind of uncover something different, like, you know, to your point of, yeah, we definitely are growing as society, more just obsessed with sharing everything and documenting and the, the, the likes and appreciation and followers and all and all of that, that if anything, it would, it almost makes it more realistic and likely that if something horrific was happening that you would want, want to share it and put it out there in the world even more so than when it was just having a video tape that someone might uncover one day. things are evolving to a point where yeah, we're we're in a much different time now, and social media has done a great deal to affect things, in a way that's, intrinsically darker in so many ways. And that, like you say, lure for likes and attention and validation, which our podcast has none of, know, but, we'll get there one day. An early form of reality horror can be found in creepypasta, which emerged around the same time. Found footage gained notoriety in the late 1990s and 2000, though the term itself came about around 2007. I believe. A creepypasta is a horror related legend which has been shared around the internet. Originally it had as a common theme The notion of being left behind by some anonymous author passed along through internet forums as a warning to others, like found footage, Many would question if they were real. According to an article on Medium.com, quote, because of the anonymity, the users would often copy and paste text to these forums, either to share something they found with a larger community as inside jokes, or convince others that these things actually happen. To the original poster and quote from this copy paste practice on forums was born the term copypasta, which further morphed into creepypasta when shared among horror communities. These days, creepypasta, as with found footage, is understood to be fiction. At this stage, creepypasta has become a catch all term for For any horror content posted to the internet. For someone who, reads so much and ingests so much content horror related, we haven't talked much about creepypasta. That's something that sort of went under your radar. I can't say I've read many. That's weird. And for me to be the guy who's sort of the antithesis to you like all the different mediums that you take in, whether it be reading books, whatever, for me to be the one who's in creepypasta and you to not feels like somehow you missed the boat or this something like what happened there. Never really. I mean, I, like, know of its existence, but I was never like, oh, let me check out all the top creepy pastas. It's interesting. I would say I would more like. I mean, if I'm going to read something, it's usually going to be a novel or series. So maybe there's an element of being more invested in, overarching, longer developed narratives, I guess if there was a creepypasta like, related to, I don't know, something, I was like writing or something like that, I would definitely look into it and, and, read it. But yeah, I can't say I've just like scrolled, forums and read all the creepypasta, but it's cool and interesting and I think it taps into fears and any number of things from cultures to kind of local legends. So yeah, interesting and props for it. Existing. Kelsey, what makes a good found footage film for you? I think there's a few elements which we've tapped into a bit. I think creating this kind of like very compelling on the edge of your seat tension and and weaving mystery and kind of playing off people's fear and fascination I think is is a really key part of it. And I think as, as time has gone on, I think it's also, again, as we, you know, mentioned strong characters or at least likable and realistic characters and performances, but also something that kind of just grabs you. And I think at this point you have to be adding something different or you utilizing this grittiness and realism and suspense kind of intrinsic formula to kind of have your own voice or create something new, like there's, yeah, I think if you're just kind of doing the same thing that's been done or like even even a film, that's good, but it doesn't really need to be found. Footage like that can be okay, but that's not going to be like the best example of found footage. I think it it should be something that really digs into that potential and has a different perspective or psychology or commentary or uses almost. Why? Why are we attracted to found footage? Because you're assuming, you know, some people might just be watching because they watch everything. But most people watching these films, they have a a sort of pull to it. And there's something, there's something in that, that that's a type of horror that connects or brings, or thrill or terror for them. So I think building off of that and adding something either just very, very compelling and entrancing and ideally adding a different sort of substance or commentary, I think is is pretty essential. The original Blair Witch had elements which really worked for me, and one of which was they really set things up in the beginning with the the lure of the Blair Witch and interviewed these interesting, people. And you go into it before they even take the actual trip. It's set up. So well that your imagination is looking for these clues, or different people or different, phenomenon to kick in and my favorite part of the film was the look and feel of that forest. The fact that it felt so cold and it felt like you're really camping with them, and to find just piles of rocks, like, what the fuck does that mean? Why are these rocks here? And it's obviously something that somebody put there, these stick figures hanging. What's the significance? It feels like there's a reason for this. And this is a mystery layer to it. And the part that I like the least about that film was the building hysteria and paranoia and bickering and the, the screaming. get that there needs to be conflict in stories and in every scene. There should be some conflict. But it got a bit nerve grating, to me. And it's the only reason I don't watch it more often. But then we get into the sequels. The Book of Shadows wasn't really a found footage film at all, so I'm not really counting that. But Blair Witch, which came out just a few years ago, I think they're trying to go back to the roots and employ newer technologies and so forth, but it didn't really have that vibe. It didn't really feel, like there was anything creepy there. It felt like more like a production was was happening. And they did too much with visual effects and monsters and things like that to where you couldn't really fill in the blanks with what was creepy for you. That set up that was so rich in Blair Witch with all the, the, the lore and the witches and whoever. that was something that was just so primal. And in this one it was more like, oh, we're going to make a monster movie and show you things, actually show you the witch or whatever the entities are. And it just there's no way that could work. Especially it may have fulfilled whatever was creepy in the minds of the writers, but it was too specific and it just totally fell flat for me. Yeah, I think one of the strongest things about the original Blair Witch is, yeah, working off imagination and suggestion and definitely creating just this eerie chilling. It's almost I feel like a lot of good found footage just creates all these possibilities and fears and kind of this makes this kind of, like, wickedness come alive around you, where you do feel you are transported. And I'm usually all for like, yeah, give me that monster. Let's get some exploration. I want to get in there in their minds, I want to I like, want a good kind of sense of who they are, what, how, how they're preying off people, how they operate. But I think with a film like that, almost what was so powerful is it could have it could have been all real or could have not been. It could have been just the the myth and the idea of this kind of came alive in their minds. And I think that is almost one of the most interesting aspects of it, that then trying to make it a sort of more monster in your face or bigger kind of jump scare production, I think, is where a lot of films miss the mark. That especially for films that like start off indie and understated and do that so powerfully where they do, so many audiences do flock and respond to them, and they feel this authentic tension and dread through them. And then the studio is like, okay, we'll do it again. We'll just throw more budgets and more in your face and more scares. And they're just they're not understanding what made it enticing in the first place. Yeah, they do try to make it bigger. And I think what worked so well about the previous one was it was just based on local legends and like you say, imagination and so forth. But, it started off as something relatable that campers could relate to. Anybody who's gone camping or been out in the woods could just sort of, feel that sort of tension. And they expanded it and tried to make it bigger to the point where it was bordering cosmic horror, like, oh my God, how how big are they going to try to make the scope of this thing, which was never really meant to be and work better on a more, subtle, intimate scale if you had to. What's your go to in your mind of, I don't know, maybe like three found footage horror films that you're like, wow, this is really like the peak of what the genre is capable of. I'm going to say the The Blair Witch Project, minus those elements that were annoying to me, which could have easily been edited out or scaled down. But the performances were quite good in that film. And, with that, I tried thinking about this in terms of like, how many have I even seen? Yeah, and I don't ingest as many films as, you do. I really like Late Night With the Devil, but is that so? Found footage. It doesn't really. It's it's it's own sort of fresh thing Yeah. It almost seems more like there's a documentarian aspect to it, but more just because they're recording the show. It's almost like more behind the scenes stuff, because we're seeing if it was found footage, we wouldn't be seeing half of that thing. That is like during their commercial breaks when half of everything's going down and he's kind of descending more into madness. Right? Right. I did like paranormal Activity, but I too have not seen any of the sequels. And I'm morbidly curious too, because I want to see I'm assuming they devolve into something much more generic and less fresh. But I did like that and that was the other one I was thinking of. I don't know if I can come up with three, to be honest. One of my questions for you is what is your favorite found footage film? Probably the most generically phrased obvious question I could ask you during such a podcast. Yeah. I think the, the one that stands out as this is really what is kind of utilizing this, the style and genre and tension and just kind of like really impress me and hit with me the most is, is I went into a bit paranormal activity, I think especially I just was like, I'm not really on the edge of my seat with most horror films. Like, I might be very engrossed in the story, but I feel I think it was maybe a little bit of the the theater, just for it was like a really good theater crowd. Like everyone was just like just feeding off that, that tension and just so invested. And I think I wasn't really expecting much at the time. There wasn't really much hype about it yet. When I had seen it, it was just like, oh, there's like a free. It was like a free screening. And it was just like, yeah, there's this like this found footage horror film. And it was, this really cool theater in Chicago. And, I'm like, okay, yeah, I'll check it out. And it was just this very gripping, just very rich, suspense fueled film. And I think I just so appreciated how much they did with so little and I did feel kind of invested and connected with the characters. And it also had like a very, really real quality to it. Like, I could believe that these were real people and this was really happening, like, not in actuality, but there's enough. It was it was an easy suspension of disbelief. it just builds upon how powerful those little things can be. And the power of just very well, crafting suspense and just how, you know, I've never really been a big fan of the jump scares that are, you know, the high pitched noise or something you know, it's very quiet and then super loud. All of a sudden it's it doesn't always take me out of it. It's okay. I understand some of that's going to happen in horror films, but I feel like the, the horror films that sometimes are the most frustrating can be ones that just completely rely on that, that that's all that it is, that there's no creativity or subtlety or craft in it. And I feel like Paranormal Activity just really created that, that craft so well and just did it was just extremely effective with those little things and making them count so much more of that. Yeah, it was just very well done. I did like creep a lot and I will add that, comedies can work well, as we know, with The Office and Parks and Rec, we have that sort of reality feel, which works well with comedies, but they also work well with comedy horrors like What We Do in the shadows and, troll, I think was another really good one. I think that was like Scandinavian or one of those whatever countries like, Finland or or somewhere where it's really cold. Yeah. So, I'll add those to my list as well. Okay. Yeah. I think I mean, creep was really, I think it was just so captivating. It was partially Mark Duplass, his character. And yes, played it. You're like, even when you're like, okay, this is obviously going to go horrible direction. This guy, like, something's going to turn out bad here. And having a strong feeling that this guy is unhinged. And he also had these like just this great duality and range where in these little moments where you almost empathize or almost kind of like want to connect with him. But so and it puts you in the perspective of these characters interacting with them too. And again, I think for that, that was very realistic to me because I'm like, how many times essentially that could have happened? I've done so many shoots with people I had. I don't know who these people really are. You know, where it could have it could have easily gone that route. And I think maybe that makes it hit a little bit more. But I think regardless, even if you haven't, that it's it's just a fascinating and just very compelling character intention that they, that they created. Yeah. I can't imagine anybody else playing that character. Just the tension and awkwardness that we're building in every scene. Just, it definitely captured one's attention. as much as it may elicit groans and eye rolls from more so-called enlightened critics and filmmakers, I like the unconventional thinking and structure that goes into presenting found footage. Despite its overall proliferation, I still consider it a fresh way of telling a story. In many cases, though, not every story lends itself to that format. For the past quarter century, this subgenre has been considered a passing fad. Perhaps it has run its course for many, but I do think to a greater or lesser degree, it is here to stay as filmmakers find new ways to keep it fresh. While new technologies and creative thinking are applied. found footage is one of the most divisive and sink or swim brands of horror. Many horror fans avoid it completely, while others gravitate towards it with endless fascination. While many films let their potential for something more interesting, layered and evocative be swallowed up by the found footage, tropes and stylistic elements, there are the films that are well-done, captivating, and rich with substance and stirring themes of horror that almost don't lean into their found footage style enough, and could be essentially the same film without this documentarian setup and esthetic. There are few indie successes within found footage, like As Above, So Below and Afflicted that are fantastic films with ample layers, substance constantly weaving an evolving mystery and a connection with fear and coming to terms with it that make them incredible well done films. While the reason for the footage existing works and is realistic, they are films that would be equally as strong if the filmmakers chose not to go the found footage route with them, there is still films worthy of celebrating, but I wouldn't say there are standouts that truly utilize the subgenres, full capabilities and appeal, or push the subgenre to any kind of new potential. Now, not every film of a given subgenre needs to be an outlier, but it does put into perspective how rare the well-crafted and memorable gems are that have a voice and identity of their own. if you would like to join our Society of Grotesquerie and Loathing, subscribe now and give this podcast a like. And be sure to comment your wretched thoughts below. Keep our podcast suffering on by finding it in your cold, black, withered hearts. To support us on Patreon. A link to our PayPal is also below. For one time donations of any amount. It was nice knowing you.