Episode 02: Galatians 4:4-7

Translation: New Revised Standard V’n updated edition (NRSVue)

3 Questions:
What word, phrase or image strikes you in this text?
Toward what is God calling you in this text?
What does your heart cry out?

Additional texts:
Isaiah 61:10—62:3
Psalm 148
Luke 2:22-40

Transcript

00:02.25
Kevin Shock
There's no wetter better way. But actually there's a better way to start a podcast than misspeaking the words like the third word out of your mouth. There's no better way to end the year no it's it's sunny here.

00:12.33
nathanpile
He he just came in from the rain he just came in from the rain it was wet.

00:19.42
Kevin Shock
There's no better way to end the year friends than with some tending. Ah so welcome. She's that that went about as well as I should have expected it to um, welcome as we gather again for some attending on this podcast on the tend tend a bible podcast.

00:29.50
nathanpile
I.

00:38.16
Kevin Shock
Ah, today we are going to be looking at a kind of a short kind of short bible passage for us. But that's good um Galatians chapter 4 verses 4 through 7 the translation we're using is the new revised standard version updated edition the n r s v u e.

00:57.90
Kevin Shock
Ah, that can be found always as always on biblegateway.com or the bible gateway app. Ah that isnt not a not a sponsored um on a sponsored recommendation. Ah, but perhaps Nathan we should talk to them about that. Um, at or just fine. Whatever ah, whatever translation is near to you and that you would like to use um are 3 questions for today. What word phrase or image strikes you in this text and toward what is god calling you in this text and. What does your heart cry out.

01:42.30
nathanpile
Um, is it really sunny there right now. Ah like we have rain and snow and sleet here. So like that you have if it's sunny there like.

01:47.79
Kevin Shock
Well, the sun just went beyond a cloud. But yeah, actually um, yeah, oh well no I.

01:59.50
nathanpile
I Just thought it was because you you slid into your house so you were you know, still thinking about your.

01:59.72
Kevin Shock
Um I um.

02:06.85
Kevin Shock
No I I had just I had just recently driven home ah to Northern Center county from Altoona and I did encounter rain on the way. But um, but not here. Let's dry here.

02:15.41
nathanpile
Ah, that's why I figured it was on your head. That's why I figured it was in your brain that was your wet ride home. So but now wetter.

02:22.74
Kevin Shock
Oh no water way. Yeah no I was just I was just really not speaking good into the microphone. Ah.

02:30.36
nathanpile
Disclaimer If you haven't already figured it out. We have no idea what we're doing um, but but a disclaimer about who we are. We are men married to women in financially stable households white in our late forty s.

02:35.37
Kevin Shock
That's that's a disc that's a good disclaimer.

02:47.17
nathanpile
College and seminary educated we work for the church and are born and raised in Western Pennsylvania all of this affects how we read scripture and discuss it. But none of this makes us better able to read and discuss scripture than anyone else. We believe that the wisdom of scripture is the whole community's compiled interpretation for life with god and one another so we want to know what you hear and think from your life experience as you engage scripture our reading. Comes from Galatians the fourth chapter verses 4 through 7 but when the fulness of time had come god sent his son born of a woman born under the law in order to redeem those who were under the law. So that we might receive adoption as children and because you are children god has sent the spirit of his son into our hearts crying aba father so you are no longer a slave but a child and if a child. Then also an heir through god if you are meeting with a group you can pause the podcast now and engage the questions on your own or you can stick around and see what Kevin has to say here with the first question. What word phrase or image strikes you in this text.

04:20.90
nathanpile
Buddy.

04:21.96
Kevin Shock
Um, born under the law. Um, and my why this catch catches. My attention is not having anything to do with the law per se. Ah, but this phrase for me when I heard you reading it this time was a reminder that when Jesus went yeah when Jesus is born when god is made flesh god is limiting god's self for our sake.

04:56.32
Kevin Shock
Um, it. It doesn't make any rational sense human sense that the one who handed down the law the one who created the law should be subject to the law or. I I mean it seems that the one who created the law would would um would operate within the within the spirit of the law. But there's no that yeah there's no, um, there's no obligation to do that because this person is well this god. When I say this person I mean god is above the law. Ah but born under the law reminds me that when Christ was born when god was made flesh god limited god's self for our sake I think I already said it in that exact way and um.

05:54.79
Kevin Shock
An entirely free being making themself subject to other powers is a real sacrificial kind of move. And I think that that's perfectly in alignment with who we understand God to be God God does things that God doesn't have to do out of the love that God has for us and one of those things is being born under the law. Period. That's the end of my thought.

06:32.27
nathanpile
No yeah, well and well and and and again the the powerful my reflection there of your of your comments of of how powerful that is that again, ah limiting. 1 self for the others for others. Um, and that god does that? um, my because my my first response to this passage is that first verse that first four that you're talking about too and my response was going to be simply. that that god decides to become human um and and you've you've said that plus because because that's exactly what happens god becomes human but god also then puts god's self under the limits of the law and and all of the pieces that we as humanity. Um. The vulnerabilities of of human flesh but also the the god son also lives in the fractured broken sinful human world that we live in and that the law shows us as a part of. Um, shows us those limitations of ourselves and that god chooses to come and live in that system and not has I'm the one in control I'm the 1 in power just follow me. Um.

08:02.69
nathanpile
Rather God comes into that system instead of blowing the system up God says I'm going to work within the way. Humanity works to help them see who I am and what love is um because of that love. So um.

08:03.69
Kevin Shock
Yeah.

08:14.32
Kevin Shock
A e.

08:21.50
nathanpile
Yeah, So um, that was my piece too. But I was I appreciated your taking it to the to that level of that God you know it is all about God and it and it is all about God's love and how God chooses to limit God's self in the midst of that. Like because um, to be honest, like if I had numerable power like it would be too tempting to not have the control in my own life like if I if I had the yeah I would I would love to be able to say that I wouldn't use it for my.

08:48.68
Kevin Shock
Hey.

08:56.66
nathanpile
If I had the power and control to control all things that I wouldn't want to hold onto that power and control make some kind of a loophole isn't that what we would do as human beings like find some kind of a loophole that I can still be the son of God with all of the powers of the of deity and and still come down and try and teach us love. But.

09:08.90
Kevin Shock
Right.

09:15.79
nathanpile
That's not what scripture tells us I Thought that's not who God is so.

09:20.87
Kevin Shock
Yeah, yeah, um, and it what? yeah I don't think that I don't think my response was on a different level I think it comes down to nuance. Ah because what you name is also vitally important. Ah that Jesus. Was a human being and and you said I can't remember exactly how you said it but but that in order for us to know to know god better um god had to come to us on human terms living as a human ah it just made me think that you know god. You know god has tried earthquakes lightning strikes thumbed you know all this all this I mean that's um I can't actually point to places in scripture where that's thus been a flood was tried I do know that it god immediately decided.

10:14.10
nathanpile
Ah.

10:14.78
Kevin Shock
But that wasn't the way to do it and God was never going to do it that way again, but the creator right? Well no, but that but that was a but that was a guiding thing. Not a correcting thing. Um, yeah anyway, ah I'm sure there are things that we can think of if I thought about it. But um.

10:18.91
nathanpile
Pillar of fire pillar of fire.

10:34.23
Kevin Shock
It it for the for the creator of the universe to do something to grab our attention I think we human beings know ourselves well enough that it would grab our attention for like a day and then we would just go back to living the way that we had always lived but but someone coming among us. And fulfilling the law by being in relationship with us has the power to actually change our whole life. Not just how we operate for a day but for how we operate for the entirety of our life and that yeah it's. It's going to be It's god knows that it's going to be more effective for to develop relationships with human beings than it is to just you know clash some planets together to get our attention when we're misbehaving. So. Yeah, yeah, um, anything else you want to comment about that question all right? Well a second time then from Galatians 4 but when the fullness of time had come.

11:38.22
nathanpile
No I don't think so so.

11:50.60
Kevin Shock
God sent his son born of a woman born under the law in order to redeem those who who were under the law so that we might receive adoption as children and because you are children god has sent the spirit of his son into our hearts crying abba father. So you are no longer a slave but a child and if a child then also an heir through god Nathan toward what is god calling you in this text.

12:22.89
nathanpile
Um, so two things first would be ah to be a part of the family that would be the simple answer. However, the more complex answer for me in this. Um.

12:40.83
nathanpile
Is that when you're in the family and as Paul would be writing this for people in galatia there would be there would be just like every time a period of time. There would be x. Expectations of being in the family and here as an heir of the family. There's there's some of that as well. And so um, you know so and for instance would be when I'm a kid. Um my parents. Teach me behavior that is socially appropriate in public. But then they have the expectation that when I am in public I will follow some of the things that they taught me the goal would be that I would follow all of them. But. I was a kid and so of course that didn't always happen but there would be some of that. So. There's a the piece of the air makes me feel like it's more than just being a child There's there is something else that is laid upon the.

13:48.89
Kevin Shock
A k.

13:55.51
nathanpile
The shoulders this time period is a huge honor shame system not that we don't have honor and shame systems now. We just have a kind of different honor shame system. Um, and so there's they're they're honoring the family. Would have been um, a part a significant a part of the culture and so you know if you're the heir of the family There's a part of bringing honor to the family that would have been a part of being the heir or being an heir of the family. So um. So I think there for me there is some it is being welcomed into the family but there's also a bit of a for me or a little bit of a representation of There's also been something placed upon us as being part of the family. The mantle of love and what that looks like um, which I think can get us into a little bit of a slippery slope as lutheran christians sometimes. That idea of the shoulds. Um, what should we do right? I knew you were going to going to so I wanted to get there first? Um, ah.

15:14.57
Kevin Shock
Ah, okay, you said it So I don't have to ah ah but I. Well go ahead finish your finish your thought.

15:30.38
nathanpile
And this is and this is Paul's interpretation this is Paul's interpretation Paul's a pharisee Paul Paul would have some of I think Paul would have shoulds in his language. Um, as a part of the family for sure and um.

15:40.89
Kevin Shock
Oh I think he does. Yeah.

15:49.12
nathanpile
And so like you're a part of the family. But that means you should do something when I say Shoulds That's what I mean that that's the that there as a part of the family that you should do something there. There's certain things that you should be doing and living out as a part of the family of God. So.

16:08.40
Kevin Shock
Yeah, um, well I I think being being a family member brings with a different responsibility. Um I mean I That's yeah I And and though I though I though I hesitate to go to the shoulds. Ah.

16:26.55
Kevin Shock
That's true. That's true, being a yes being if if I'm going to be if I'm going to be a a good if I'm going to live out so I mean the thing that I think of as an example is just like my relationship with my spouse if I'm going to live out. What it means to be a faithful follower of Jesus um, in in my life. The fact that I have a spouse that I share a house with and share other responsibilities and and relationship with. Means that I'm going to interact with her it it it it shapes the relationship that I have with her is what I should is what I should say. Um so you know I am I am free from the law of. Ah, clearing out the dishes in the sink at the end of the day but should I do it probably? Ah I mean that's that but that's a you know I mean that's like a that's like a pretty well I don't want to know I don't want to say it's an inconsequential ah thing to talk about.

17:24.54
nathanpile
To be a good husband. A.

17:40.58
Kevin Shock
Sometimes not doing the dishes does burn consequences. Um, but there but there are yeah there are certain responsibilities in our familial relationships that yeah that just come as a part of the definition of being that part of that family. So whatever that whatever that. However.

17:41.97
nathanpile
Right.

17:59.83
Kevin Shock
That family is defined. Um, and you know it could be the people that you share a household with it could be the people you're related to it could be people that you have ah chosen to you know, share your most ah the most intimate things about your life with. Um, who maybe aren't related to you or you don't share a household with a you know family can be defined in so many different ways here. Um I think you know Paul doesn't use the word family but Paul is talking about us being children. Um, and ah.

18:33.35
nathanpile
Um, sure.

18:36.83
Kevin Shock
So that's I mean that's a familial relationship ah and being part of the family of god is you know has its own responsibilities understandings that come along with it. Yeah, which I'm going to use that as a transition into um. What I was going to answer for that second question and that is ah I I hear your shoulds and I um I even agree with them to a point I was very much removed from no not no not to to for the most part I agree with them. Um. I was very removed from should language in this in this reading because for 2 reasons 1 being an heir does bring a certain responsibility I think but for many of us. Ah, we don't know we're in airir until the part of the family. Um, that puts that on us is already gone I mean an an airir an inheritance is something that you know you're you're.

19:42.98
nathanpile
Me.

19:50.56
Kevin Shock
You're named in a will I mean that's that's what it that's technically speaking. That's what an air is and I think that there are probably people who expect they will be heirs. Um, but I think it's probably a good thing to go through life not expecting that um that they're therefore you're not disappointed If you're not an heir would you think that you should be.

20:07.12
nathanpile
E.

20:09.74
Kevin Shock
Um, but but it is a I mean being an heir is a is a gift It's a gift and yes it does bring I think it's a gift that defines and brings shape to life the life that we live. Um, but. At its core at the core of the definition being an heir being named an heir is a gift and also number 5 number 5 verse number 5 ah Paul in this in this version uses the word receive not earn.

20:31.91
nathanpile
M.

20:46.21
Kevin Shock
But receive with that we might receive adoption as children. Um, so again that that adoption into the family is again gift and in fact I mean we could look at it. You know, widely speaking adoption is gift. That's someone choosing. To bring somebody else into their family. Um, so yeah, so this is all this language here is all very passive language for me and ah, it's um, yeah, passive from what I need to do. So to speak. Ah but active in that god is god is giving god is pouring out these gifts on people. Um through through no merit of our own but through the merit of his son who came. Ah, well as verse 5 says in order to redeem those who were under the law. Um, so ah, my answer to the question toward what has god calling me in this text ah is to not let me say this to follow Christ in the same. Way. Ah that Christ acted in this world as a human being and that is not to take for granted the fact that we hold an honored position in the world because of what god has given us um, but.

22:20.60
Kevin Shock
To remain humble and to recognize that there are all kinds of other people around us and throughout the world who have also received these same gifts and we are not any more important or any better than them. Um, but we are we are fellow children. With them and that changes the way that we define family and also here I'll throw a should in here for you Nathan and also should change the way that we interact with them because our our ah how. Our relationship to them is defined differently because um because our relationship to god through Christ has been defined differently.

23:07.71
nathanpile
Yeah I really appreciate your um, your piece of air. Um, that we're given that gift that that that that's a gift that is given to us in this. Um. Image. It's given to us. It's also a gift given to us by whoever our family is that makes us heirs of of estates today. You know it's that idea that it is gift. Um, oftentimes I think in our society we get this idea of well I'm the.

23:37.83
Kevin Shock
Yeah.

23:46.17
nathanpile
I'm the kid of therefore I've it's owed me it's umve I deserve it? Um, but it's really a gift of the person that is giving the gift of the estate or whatever and so that's a I think that's a touching.

23:49.93
Kevin Shock
Um, right right.

24:04.68
nathanpile
Um, image to have that lift it up in the way that you lifted it up here for us. Um, and but it did get me kind of thinking a little bit about Paul here and and because I've looked this up on bible gateway I only have the 4 verses that we're looking at.

24:09.94
Kevin Shock
A m.

24:22.81
Kevin Shock
E.

24:23.16
nathanpile
Um, in front of me. But do you know? Ah, do you get a sense from Paul here that as Heirs Paul knows that Jesus has died.

24:41.71
nathanpile
Would would there be responsibility in Paul's eyes for us as heirs that that we take this on as the air. Because because Jesus has died. However I don't get the sense from Paul that the father has died so god is still alive would there be do you understand what? I'm asking here. So is there in Paul's and in this text and galatians is there a sense.

25:12.78
Kevin Shock
I Think so yeah.

25:20.47
nathanpile
You know, oftentimes in in the church. We talk about being the body of Christ and that we the many the children make up the body of Christ um, and Jesus was a part. It was the head of that body um is the head. Yes sorry thank you.

25:33.97
Kevin Shock
Is the head of that body. Yeah, yeah, yeah because although I mean I get what you're saying I don't want to and I want to get nitpicky about theology because I know that you know all this. But when we talk about yet Jesus did die but he lives again and Jesus.

25:40.50
nathanpile
Um.

25:48.92
nathanpile
Right.

25:51.87
Kevin Shock
Jesus and the father are one. Yeah I mean I do I'm just saying that for the benefit of our listeners. But.

25:55.60
nathanpile
Listeners. Yeah I appreciate that I appreciate that because I'm I'm I'm I'm kind of going down an a bun bunny hole here I know that because like what does what does? Paul's what does Paul's what well I'm just kind of wondering about Paul's theology a little bit here. A lot of times as lutheran christians we take Martin Luther's

26:02.47
Kevin Shock
Well I mean you're yeah no, you're thinking through.

26:14.13
nathanpile
Um, theological framework the lens the way that we look at the world and and look read scripture and kind of use that to kind of say but I'm I'm wondering about Paul's lens here as he writes this to the people of galatia. Um.

26:16.35
Kevin Shock
Who.

26:30.80
Kevin Shock
Yeah, yeah.

26:32.36
nathanpile
Of how he intends to inspire through his words here of is he is he using that image of air that yes we are gifted but as we come to think about air means we're getting something out of it. Um. You know that the estate would be given to us as an heir.. Ah, do you get? is there a sense of that here in these other verses around this I don't because I don't even have a bible in front of me that I could look at that. But.

27:03.76
Kevin Shock
Yeah, um, well first of all a little ah a little tidbit about bible gateway. Um, at the bottom of your reading. It should have a link that says read full chapter um, and but but anyway so I thought.

27:11.85
nathanpile
Who there it is there. It is it was I had it off my I had it off my screen because I have it all have it squeezed into the corner. So I could read it and see you So yeah.

27:20.87
Kevin Shock
Ah I thought maybe um, yeah, so no I did click on that and and before these verses Paul is talking actually about ah minors um that not not people who mine for things but young people. Um. That airs. He's verse one of this chapter airs. He says my point is this heirs as long as they are minors are no better than those who are enslaved though they are all though they are the owners of all the property but they remain under guardians and trustees until the date set by the father. Um, but I think that. Ah. I think that the context here is that Paul has an issue with some things that the galatians are doing because if we look after the the reading as we have it. Um Paul goes into. Ah. Formerly when you did not know god you were enslaved to beings that by nature are not gods and I think that that's talking about like idols and things like that. Um he talks about elemental principles in here. Um.

28:21.70
nathanpile
Now.

28:31.38
Kevin Shock
Ah, but um, you know how? how can you turn back to those things. How can you want to be enslaved by them again. Um, the the interesting thing here that I think is that Paul Paul in verse 9 paul really lays out his theology. And he almost has to There's almost like a there's a a. There's like an an edit that didn't that remained in the text. Um, he says now. However that you have come to know god and here's the edit or the or at or rather to be known by god. How can you turn back again to the weak and beggarly elemental principles. Um, so I think there is a sense that there is a um, well exactly like what we were talking about earlier Nathan that there's there's a there. There are some responsibilities that ah come that come with being um, family and and and heirs and heirs of the gifts and the promises that god gives um and notice that Paul doesn't say here. Um you know.

29:29.64
nathanpile
Family. Yeah.

29:45.29
Kevin Shock
Ah, if you turn back to these things you're going to lose out on everything that god has given you no Paul says these things are not worthwhile to you anymore. You're going. You're going to be limiting yourselfves you're going to be enslaving yourselves if you turn back to these things.

29:59.77
nathanpile
No.

30:02.49
Kevin Shock
He doesn't say this is going to get you kicked out of heaven or anything like that and and even more so that that language I love that language in verse nine that shows that this is gift. You know that you have come to know god or rather to be known by god like it's Paul saying that's really what has happened here. Is that you have been. You have been brought into the family. You've been made an heir to god's gifts and promises through Jesus Christ and um and so don't squander that I mean I think that's I think that's Paul's admonition here. Ah, don't squander that you know everything else as Paul says ah elsewhere in his writings. Everything else is worthless cling to what that gift and promise is um because all of this other stuff is just what does he call weak weak can beggarly. Yeah.

30:47.11
nathanpile
Yeah, yeah.

30:59.44
Kevin Shock
So I think there's there's a little more context of what's going on. You know how he fleshes out what it means to be an heir. Yeah.

31:00.95
nathanpile
Yeah, yeah, so for him, it's not just pure. It is gift but there is there is pure gift here. But there is there is responsibility as an heir.

31:09.34
Kevin Shock
It is gift is pure gift.

31:20.60
nathanpile
As as a part of the as you say it shapes our relationships.

31:25.86
Kevin Shock
That's and and and that's the way I like to word it better I think because it it doesn't responsibility makes it sound like if we don't live up to the responsibilities. The gift is going to be taken away but the whole point that Paul says is that the gift cannot be taken away because we didn't earn it. It was given to us. However, that gift transforms who we are it shapes our life differently and so yes, their responsibilities but they're not They're not like life or death responsibilities. It's just the the definition. The definition of who you are.

31:42.36
nathanpile
E.

32:01.32
Kevin Shock
And therefore how you live is changed because of this gift that you've received because you have been because you have received adoption and you have been. You have become you have been turned into an heir through Jesus Christ so

32:06.80
nathanpile
E.

32:20.16
Kevin Shock
Yeah, yeah I mean it right? It's the kind of stuff that like if I were talking about my own faith I would talk about like my familial responsibilities but even more so it's It's the the definition of my relationship with other people. Yeah yeah.

32:36.82
nathanpile
Yeah, yeah, and you were talking about that a little bit ago as were our relationships as children child to child children. You know as a part of the being the children that there there's some now all right.

32:46.15
Kevin Shock
Yeah, yeah, yeah, and and I mean gifts do change us, don't they I mean I mean Gifs that you know.

32:55.37
nathanpile
No.

33:00.98
Kevin Shock
And not talking about like you know you get something on your Amazon wish list. Although that's not to say it is a wish list I do wish that I get the things that are on my Amazon wish list. Um, but but not those kind of gifts I mean I can I think you know ah a personal story for me is um, my my grandparents died in. 2020 2021 ah non covid related issues but covid didn't help um and ah my grandfather died in August of 2020 and my grandmother they had been married 70 years um January of 21 you know it was it was her time and I I just think they couldn't live without each other. Um and I knew from talking to my mom who with her sister was kind of in charge of. You know the the executor or whatever it is of the will. Um I knew that the grandchildren had not been named in the will that it was always an intention to put the grandchildren in there. But you know there were there were still grandchildren being added to certain points and ah and um.

34:10.55
nathanpile
Sure sure.

34:15.25
Kevin Shock
And so ah and you know there are some other sticky stuff in the will. But um, there Ah what I lost my train of thought anyway I wasn't long story short I wasn't expecting anything.

34:33.67
Kevin Shock
After my grandparents died and the will got wrapped up my mom and my aunt decided that part of the inheritance they received. They would pass on because they knew that that was my grandparents intention. There was nothing legal about it. You know that obligated them to do it but they knew that that was their intention and the only thing that I knew about it is that my mom told me make sure you go to the post office because there's a registered letter for you. There. Okay.

34:53.90
nathanpile
Sure right.

35:10.37
Kevin Shock
So I went and I opened up this letter and there was a sizable check in it I mean you know nothing that like not like oh I can take a year off of work. Not anything like that. Um, but but sizable and and.

35:20.69
nathanpile
Sure it's niceable. Sure.

35:26.55
Kevin Shock
It came at a point in our life in our household where we could really really use that money and that whole experience was it was transformative because it like it alleviated a lot of stress that was currently in the Household. Um. And ah, but the other thing is that it was It was pure gift I had no idea it was coming and so I think about when when the when I take for granted.

35:52.81
nathanpile
Chair. Sure.

36:01.21
Kevin Shock
The gift that god has given me I think about a moment like that and what my reaction was to opening that envelope and seeing that check in there and and what god has given is a million times greater and yet I can go through my daily life.

36:07.58
nathanpile
Sure.

36:19.61
Kevin Shock
And not even think once about it. Um I think okay here's another answer to the question too I Think what God is calling me to do is to think about it to and and to let it shape my life to let that gift shape my life. Yeah.

36:31.86
nathanpile
Now now.

36:38.90
Kevin Shock
But so that's that.

36:39.96
nathanpile
Yeah, thanks, thanks for sure all right? We'll do a third time that right that were at yeah you shared I sure yep all right? Third time through.

36:44.17
Kevin Shock
Hip and.

36:51.21
Kevin Shock
Um, yeah, yeah, yep.

36:59.10
nathanpile
But when the fulness of time had come god sent his son born of a woman born under the law in order to redeem those who were under the law so that we might receive adoption as children and because you are children god has sent the spirit of his son. Into our hearts crying abba father so you are no longer a slave but a child and if a child then also an heir through god Kevin what does your heart. Cry out.

37:40.66
Kevin Shock
Yeah I Um I don't have my hymnal right in front of me. Ah so I'm trying to use the the interwebs to look it up. Um, yeah soul soul. That's what yeah.

37:57.11
Kevin Shock
I That question I don't know if I must have been influenced by something we were singing in advent. Um, because I'm pretty sure that I sang it in worship yesterday. Ah, but the hymn canticle of the turning.

38:04.91
nathanpile
He he.

38:10.32
Kevin Shock
Begins with the lines. My soul cries out with a joyful shout that the god of my heart is great. Ah, it's a it's a paraphrase of Mary's song the magnificat in in Luke too. Um, so yeah I don't know if I have a better answer than that.

38:20.81
nathanpile
Um, yeah.

38:29.46
Kevin Shock
That ah that my heart my heart cries out. Um I think sometimes we I think sometimes we cry out for justice sometimes we cry out for compassion sometimes we cry out for mercy. This text makes me feel like um this is this this evokes the response in me that i. That my heart cries out with Joy. Um, because because of the greatness of god the abundant mercy of god the love of god that results in pure gift for me and for everyone else born under the law.

38:48.32
nathanpile
Yeah I.

39:06.10
Kevin Shock
And for all who are enslaved to sin. Ah that gift is for everybody and that and what what? a what an unmatched gift. Um there there is an in in the history of the world. Yeah.

39:25.70
Kevin Shock
Yeah, so my heart cries out with a joyful shout that the God of my I guess my soul cries never mind the the God of my heart is great. Ah God does miraculous things and God does compassionate things. Yeah.

39:35.20
nathanpile
Yeah, well and and.

39:42.12
nathanpile
Yeah, and my answer is love my answer to this was love and for all of the reasons that you have articulated here this idea of this abundance of gift from God. And and for me again the the Mo The the um, the feeling of this passage for me. The reason God does all of this that that adopts us into Family. Um. And calls us to be families about love and so the thing that my heart that this passage causes my heart to do is to to cry out in love because of the gift that we've received in that and I agree that our heart can cry out lots of different things and and you've named a bunch of them.

40:41.10
nathanpile
Compassion Empathy cry out in pain and anguish and joy and I also think we can cry out in love. Um, and so um, the beauty of that. Um.

40:45.47
Kevin Shock
A.

40:58.42
nathanpile
Of of the image of a child calling out to a father um or or a parent. Um.

41:14.80
nathanpile
The image that that stirs in us here as children. Um, but as heirs and then what that calls us out into our response to that in our world and and how we live in that Love is.

41:33.21
nathanpile
So rich image for such a short passage because again at the very beginning when I looked at this I Thought boy this is a this is a tiny reading. Um, ah, but but there's but there but there's a lot in here.

41:36.45
Kevin Shock
E.

41:42.88
Kevin Shock
But they're right I thought this they they.

41:50.93
nathanpile
Um, you know we've spent over 40 better part of 40 minutes here talking about um just a few verses but that again as is the way of Paul he he packs he can pack a lot into a little bit of space. But.

41:52.70
Kevin Shock
Um.

42:04.78
Kevin Shock
Sure.

42:10.49
nathanpile
Those ideas of of limiting oneself to live among us to share love to teach us how to be family um with one another child to child. And yet also receiving the eternal gift of um child of God and what that all entails. It's a that's a pretty power that that that we're that we're not stuck in a. World of do this to get to me? Um, but that God still says that that that from our perspective a lot of the dynamics are the same I'm father.

42:51.60
Kevin Shock
Right? right.

43:05.65
nathanpile
Your child. But God has switched the dynamics of that to say you're loved not because you've checked the boxes of the law but because I am who I am and I know you and I just.

43:18.22
Kevin Shock
Right.

43:23.67
nathanpile
That's all I want is that relationship that I know you? um.

43:25.17
Kevin Shock
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, I Well that evokes all kinds of thoughts in me that maybe don't even need to be yeah that just. All I want to say is this is what um my professors in Seminary. What we just did is would would is what they would call a close reading. Um because how easy is it to just look at any. You know a 4 verse passage of scripture read it once and say yeah I can I can abide by all that or I can swallow all that that's fine and then just move On. Um, but when you start to unpack scripture you begin to see all of the worlds that exist.

44:00.80
nathanpile
E.

44:18.13
Kevin Shock
Underneath just the lines that are written down and um and I think I think god who created the universe intends for that to happen. Um, and and you and I both know Nathan and I think probably ah ah.

44:26.57
nathanpile
Oh.

44:34.51
Kevin Shock
Ah, a good number if not all of our listeners know too that you can read the same scripture years apart and it's going to mean different things to you because of how things in your life have changed how yeah it just I mean we evolve as people the words of scripture remain the same.

44:41.20
nathanpile
Me.

44:54.16
Kevin Shock
Ah, and and the word the um, completely ungraspable and ah infinite word remains the same um but we but we continue to see new aspects of who Jesus is ah the word made flesh and and. Are constantly learning more things about ourselves and therefore we learn more things about god yeah so close close reading and discussing scripture as we've always said in this podcast is vital to a life of faith.

45:31.41
nathanpile
Yeah I realized that as you were talking that that you and I our perspective on this passage comes from I don't want to speak for you completely. But I would say comes from backgrounds in loving stable families.

45:48.39
Kevin Shock
I Think yeah I Yeah yeah, right, right? right? right.

45:50.70
nathanpile
And and we and we're able to pull a piece of that from this because we felt that in our own context. Um, but as you were talking about different perspectives I Wonder about this if it if it um is. Again because it's God and God shifting that idea um of the gift of air being an heir.. It's not about you having to do something if that's helpful for others to hear that that might not have that same life experience as you and I.

46:25.70
Kevin Shock
F.

46:26.15
nathanpile
Oftentimes when they think of family. It's a painful. It can be a painful memory. Um I don't know that that's not my experience but I would be curious if if this passage speaks to others who might listen um with a different perspective to to share that with us.

46:33.84
Kevin Shock
Um, yeah.

46:44.11
Kevin Shock
Well even I mean if we're being honest and I'm not I'm not saying ah you're not wrong Nathan um I mean our family situations are different from 1 another um my my family. Um.

46:51.83
nathanpile
Yeah.

46:56.91
Kevin Shock
I would say has always has always been loving for sure. Um, hasn't always been stable. Um, and so that that would have affected at one point I Think how I read this? Um, um, but also I think I could see that I think even.

47:08.60
nathanpile
Um.

47:13.90
Kevin Shock
At the time when my family was not as stable as it could have been I was old enough to know that there's a difference between human beings and God you know, but but that's my experience and I think that it's important what you lift up because.

47:25.85
nathanpile
Sure.

47:31.18
Kevin Shock
There might be people listening who don't know who their fathers are and um, there might be people listening who have ah bad relationships with their fathers or their fathers have you know, um, not been good fathers to them. Um I Also think that someone. Ah.

47:49.29
Kevin Shock
Someone who has been adopted hears this differently than you and I do Nathan who are part of our families of origin. Um, yeah, yeah, which again this is the whole reason for the disclaimer at the beginning and if if you're listening to this and you do hear this differently. Um in as.

47:53.40
nathanpile
Absolutely now.

48:09.17
Kevin Shock
In as comfortable as you are to share. We would love to hear how you read it differently? um either by it's at the end of the episode but I'll say it here too either by emailing 10 dot bible podcast at gmail.com or by contacting us on social media at 10 bible podcast.

48:13.40
nathanpile
Yeah.

48:28.50
Kevin Shock
Yeah, we we would like to we would like to hear different different interpretations and different responses to this text? Sure yeah it it helps us to learn at the very least. But also we want to honor the different experiences that people have.

48:34.48
nathanpile
Absolutely.

48:47.74
Kevin Shock
In their reading of scripture.

48:52.71
nathanpile
Helps us see a bigger worldview that God intends for all of us.

48:54.23
Kevin Shock
Ah, right? Yep Yep yeah so I think that's that um, who's wrapping this who's wrapping this episode up I am okay I had a had a feeling Oh right right? I'm the I'm the.

49:04.86
nathanpile
You are.

49:13.70
Kevin Shock
Um, the dumb dumb who made the 1 sentence introduction into 3 minutes yeah Yeah that was me okay, um, yeah, oh my gosh. Okay, all right? Yes, thank you Nathan we all know what I said. Ah so.

49:15.52
nathanpile
He started you started with a no wetter time. No wetter time to get to 10 than now.

49:29.56
Kevin Shock
Some additional texts related to related to this text from Galatians um isaiah chapter 61 verse 10 through chapter 62 verse three talks about the prophet is talking about being clothed in garments of salvation psalm 49 a joyful shout from the psalmist the splendor of the lord is over earth and heaven and ah, an interesting ah reading from Luke's Gospel Luke chapter 2 verses 22 through 40 this is when Jesus is presented in the um in the temple. On the eighth day. Ah the eighth day of his life that is as as is customary for someone born under the law. Um, but also you get um you get Simons song in this. Ah. In this reading which is um the the liturgical churchy people will know at least the beginning lord now, you let your servant go in peace. Your word has been fulfilled. Um, yeah, so those are all good readings if you want to ah discover more worlds in your reading of scripture. And in discussion with one another as always we look forward to hearing about your reflections as we as we have reflected on this text and we hope to tend our faith with you again soon. Grace to you.

50:58.11
nathanpile
And peace.