Translation: NRSVue
3 Questions:
What word, phrase or image strikes you in this text?
Toward what is God calling you in this text?
What is your new song in this season?
Additional texts:
Acts 10:44-48
1 John 5:1-6
John 15:9-17
Translation: NRSVue
3 Questions:
What word, phrase or image strikes you in this text?
Toward what is God calling you in this text?
What is your new song in this season?
Additional texts:
Acts 10:44-48
1 John 5:1-6
John 15:9-17
00:01.78
nathanpile
Hello and welcome back to tend a bible podcast. It's good to be with you as we engage scripture together, especially as we enjoy the season of spring here and things are starting to ah. Leaf up and dandelions are showing up in the yard so that idea of new life springing up in us this week we're going to look at psalm 98 um, and we're gonna Kevin and I are gonna read from the new revised. Standard version updated edition. Um n r s v u e for those in the into you know, letter, whatever that is abbreviations are 3 questions.
00:50.17
Kevin Shock
Abbreviations. Ah.
00:54.57
Kevin Shock
So yeah.
00:55.32
nathanpile
Ah, what word phrase or image strikes you in this text toward what is God calling you in this text and what is your new song in this season.
01:10.44
Kevin Shock
Nathan and Kevin are people and this is a disclaimer about them. We are men married to women in financially stable households white in our late 40 s college and seminary educated we work in Lutheran Church and we're born and raised in Western Pennsylvania all this affects how we read scripture and discuss it. But none of this makes us better able to read and discuss scripture than anyone else. We believe that the wisdom of scripture is the whole community's compiled interpretation for life with god and one another. So we want to know what you hear and think from your perspective and life experience again. This is psalm 98 from new revised standard version updated edition. Oh sing to the lord a new song for he has done marvelous things his right hand and his holy arm have gotten him victory. The lord has made known his victory. He has revealed his vindication in the sight of the nations he has remembered his steadfast love and faithfulness to the house of Israel all the ends of the earth have seen the victory of our god make a joyful noise to the lord all the earth break forth into joyous song and sing praises sing praises to the lord with a lyre with a lyre and the sound of melody with trumpets and the sound of the horn make a joyful noise before the king the lord let the sea roar and all that fills it the world and those who live in it. Let the floods clap their hands. Let the hills sing together for joy at the presence of the lord.
02:40.82
Kevin Shock
For he is coming to judge the earth he will judge the world with righteousness and the peoples with equity if you are meeting with a group. We encourage you to pause the podcast now and engage the questions on your own Nathan since you and I are together. What word phrase or image strikes you in this text.
03:04.20
nathanpile
It would have to be make Joyful noise. Um, yeah, um, like it it is It is a phrase that we use at camp. Um, and obviously this passage.
03:21.20
nathanpile
Repeats it. But that idea of of making a ah Joyful noise doesn't mean that it has to be a um, ah pleasant to the ear noise I Guess um.
03:37.61
nathanpile
You know we we say make a joyful noise and it just has to be that you're you know that you're up that you're exuding the joy that we feel as we're gathered together when we so you know we sing at camp a lot 3 times after so we swing after every meal and we sing at worship and camp fire every night so we sing 5 times a day which. Is not normal in our world. Um, people don't go around singing group songs together 5 times a day but that is it is a part of our nature at camp one of the things I love about camp is is to that we sing and that we do do that. Ah, joyfully. So so much so that oftentimes there are motions and dances that go along with certain camp songs that we sing. Um, whether they're faith-based or or some of the even some of the silly ones that we do at camp and so that idea of. Um, of making a joyful noise and and and keeping keeping it as simple as that like I think sometimes in our world. Um, we hear beautiful professional musicians who make recordings and cut those recordings until they have the perfect. Ah, sounding piece of music. God isn't asking for our that for our music or for our noise to be perfect. God is simply asking for it to be joyful and so being able to take the opportunity to um to sing and and and again a part of it is is um.
05:14.43
nathanpile
Not being self-conscious when we do that or or even if we are that we turn that negative voice down and say this is just simply about giving thanks and praise to God Um, and and how can we do that? Joyfully. So um. So that was the thing that kind of stuck out to me both.. It's a philosophy that we live at Camp on a very regular basis in the summer and ah so that was part of why it stuck out to me. Obviously it's a part of our our daily life here at camp.
05:50.16
Kevin Shock
That's yeah, thanks for sharing that there was something that um I had to think about a little bit as you said it. But I think um, something else that you said the end clarified it for me, you said something about a joyful noise doesn't have to be pleasing to the ear. Ah, and. And that that caught me off guard because I feel like a joyful noise is pleasing to the ear or maybe maybe not the ear but the soul. Ah maybe that's maybe that's what Ah what I'm looking for because I was thinking.
06:15.12
nathanpile
Yes, Yes, yeah, yeah.
06:23.71
Kevin Shock
As you as you kind of wrapped up your reflection I was thinking oh like it doesn't have to be technically good or like musically sound Um, but ah, but I feel like I feel like someone singing a Joyful Joyful song making a joyful noise. Um, even if it doesn't even if it's not musically proficient. Ah I feel like the joy is contagious and and so maybe that's a good way to to make the distinguish the distinguish it is that it might not sound good to the ear but it sounds good to the soul. Yeah.
06:56.92
nathanpile
Yeah, that would be a great way of distinguishing it because there can be sometimes that that when we are singing at camp that it's just better for the guitars to stop playing because we're not on pitch anymore.
07:02.67
Kevin Shock
Yeah.
07:14.79
nathanpile
But there's too much enthusiasm that we can't lead them anymore. So we just have to kind of bow out um, kind of a thing but really overall the kids are really good. You know they're They're very good at singing and so it's It's always fun to kind of do that. But absolutely, it's more about it's not about being pitch. Perfect.
07:16.43
Kevin Shock
Ah, yeah.
07:32.96
nathanpile
And more about being about singing together and um and letting that joy happen in our voices. So how about you what word phrase or image strikes you in this passage.
07:42.00
Kevin Shock
Yeah, yeah, how about.
07:49.60
Kevin Shock
Ah, victory and um, not in a it doesn't catch me in a good way necessarily or at least that it's It's a challenging thing for me to think because this is a song This is a psalm about joy. Um, it's a psalm about.
08:06.42
Kevin Shock
God making mercy faithfulness righteousness known. Um both as we hear in verse three to the house of Israel ah, and also to all the ends of the earth um, and victory is a.
08:25.96
Kevin Shock
Victory is a in in human terms is a 0 sum term there are winners and losers and when I think of victory as it's presented here in the psalm. Um everyone everyone enjoys it.
08:45.45
Kevin Shock
Um, there. There are no, there are no losers unless you want to get like ah you know philosophical about it or theological about it that the evil has lost. Ah you know the devil has lost um sin death has lost ah but but you know. Those are ah yeah I don't think maybe even that's not even the case. maybe maybe god turns all of those things around too. Ah so that they become a part of the victory. But I just I was thinking again. As Nathan I have said before we always we record this a couple of weeks ahead so um you know I don't know what the situation is as you're listening to this but I was listening to the radio this morning and more news reports out of um, Israel and war stuff and and. More nations getting involved and um that you know I I don't think there's a lot of holy victory when it comes to war there are there are winners and losers and um and it's a very.
09:58.40
Kevin Shock
Though people will say and I'm not just saying in this particular situation in the in the war in between Israel and Hamas um, but in lots of wars throughout history. Ah, when when people go to war for. Religious reasons they are looking to make winners and losers in that situation and so it just doesn't for me, it doesn't line up with this I'll say this psalm in particular victory in my mind victory takes on a different connotation. In this psalm and so that's part of yeah I mean I think that's why it captures my attention when we're reading it. Yeah with each other right now.
10:45.60
nathanpile
Now now. Yeah, when you first said, the word victory because of of everything that's going on in our world. Um, that connotation of winners and losers automatically jumped into my head. Um today today's version of victory. Um.
11:07.84
Kevin Shock
Yeah, yeah, yeah, it and I I think that the the very last sentence of the psalm the last half verse speaks to that he will judge the world with righteousness and the peoples with equity.
11:26.29
Kevin Shock
And there's a sense of even more than fairness that this is ah this is a holy judgment. This is not a This is not a judgment as human beings make Judgments but this is something that um that is seeking to give the people.
11:45.48
Kevin Shock
Life and and seeking to ah make make Headway in the world. Ah in the form of Steadfast Love and Faithfulness. So good. Holy healing things not not not destruction. Not war, not violence. But um, but healing and unity. So yeah.
12:15.31
nathanpile
Um, all right? Why don't we do this? Ah second time.
12:17.67
Kevin Shock
Sounds good.
12:22.36
nathanpile
Who sing to the lord a new song for he has done marvelous things his right hand and his holy arm have gotten him victory. The lord has made known his victory. He has revealed his vindication in the sight of the nations. He has remembered his steadfast love and faithfulness to the house of Israel all the ends of the earth have seen the victory of our god make joyful noise to the lord all the earth make a joy break forth into joyous song and sing praises. Sing praises to the lord with the lyre with the lyre and the sound of of melody with trumpets and the sound of the horn make joyful noise before the king the lord let the sea roar and all that fills it.
13:00.86
Kevin Shock
Yeah.
13:16.48
nathanpile
The world and those who live in it. Let the floods clap their hands. Let the hills sing together for joy at the presence of the lord for he is coming to judge the earth he will judge the world with righteousness and the peoples with equity. Well Kevin what is god calling you in this text.
13:44.81
Kevin Shock
I Don't know what it means practically speaking but the word that or the or the phrase that came to mind um for me was comes comes from our. Worship songs in our lutheran tradition and one of the one of the songs we sing um is this is the feast and there's a line in this is the feast that says join join in the hymn of all creation. Ah, and. I Don't know how I do that exactly but that seems like something that I'm feeling calmed toward in this text. Ah and and I don't know if it's um I think I think it's twofold I think it's to listen to the.
14:22.14
nathanpile
Mm.
14:35.23
Kevin Shock
The Joyful noise that creation is making I you know I noticed when you read at that time that that that line that you were talking about in the last question Joyful noise. That's a it's a command to all the earth.
14:48.40
nathanpile
Yes.
14:52.18
Kevin Shock
And um, so what is what does that sound like you know I think I think like I said 2 twofold First it's calling me to listen to what the hymn of all creation is what the joyful noise. That all the earth and the hills and the the floods. Um what they are what they're singing about but then secondly it's to reflect that hymn. In my own speech song life actions. All of that kind of stuff. Um, yeah so again, practically practically I don't know what it means exactly? ah.
15:48.16
Kevin Shock
But that's what I'm feeling called toward.
15:51.33
nathanpile
Your your reflection makes me think about when I've sung in choirs in college and and even in high school like the as I sang in choirs then I would compete at some choir festivals and so you're dealing with even a. Better talented group of people and of singers. Not ah just of people but of of that they're they're like they specifically have practiced singing and and the reality that we have to sing together. Um Like. It doesn't help if if the 20 tenors are louder than everybody else in the choir then all you hear is the tenor line instead of lending of all all of the voices and so your reflection there makes me kind of think about how do we I think as human beings we have a tendency to.
16:36.15
Kevin Shock
Yeah.
16:45.63
nathanpile
Think our section needs to be the loudest Maybe that we need to be the melody. You know? that's the part that that you're constantly everybody else is working around to kind of support and lift up so that that that Melody line is heard um, more fully and so that idea of.
17:04.76
nathanpile
Um, what happens if we as human beings aren't what if we're not the Melody line What if it's the Hills and the and the floods and the you know the the seas that are this next section of music is to be their time to sing the Melody and so how do we. Listen Well enough to know that our part is now Harmony Um, was kind of the piece you as you were reflecting that I thought oh that makes um that you know that that kind of touches off of you know, personal experience of singing in those choirs of boy that's a powerful statement of.
17:42.67
nathanpile
Um, that all the earth is doing this joyful praising and singing. But how do we as as some of the voices. Not all of the voices. How are we as some of the voices as human beings. How are we listening.
18:00.41
nathanpile
To the others sing so that we might join the joyful noise and not make it dissonant. Um, yeah, it was always one of the things you know in college you get exposed to different types of music and music that's real dissonant. No one is enjoying like you're waiting for it to. Balance out and and to give a pleasing chod to resolve right? and so that idea of um, how do we? How do we do that as we're listening and and bring about that praise.
18:20.24
Kevin Shock
Yeah to resolve.
18:33.97
Kevin Shock
Yeah, yeah, that's that's something your reflection speaks to me. Um I I sang in like I've sung in congregational choirs and I sang in the seminary choir that was the most technically proficient choir that I've. Ever sung In. Um and we had. We had a great leader and some singers I would I would put myself toward the bottom end of the proficiency of the singers at Choir just because I didn't have a lot of ah I didn't have a lot of experience going into that.
19:09.62
Kevin Shock
But I can remember at 1 point we were. We were practicing for um, a ah, a small tour that we did to congregations throughout New England and Pennsylvania and um and part of our practice for that was to stand in a big circle in the. In the chapel at the seminary and we were not standing in our part groups. Yeah in our sections right? So I sang bass. But you know there might be ah, a soprano and an alto or a soprano and a tenor next to me.
19:37.68
nathanpile
Sections. Yeah.
19:48.73
Kevin Shock
And so I had to listen to them and not the other people who were singing my same same part but but our our director ah Mark Mummert also told us to keep our eyes on someone. Across the room who was singing our same part. You couldn't hear them necessarily but you could see them and you could kind of mimic them and and the thing that I found that was surprising to me was that the more that I listened to people who were not singing the part my part the more confident I got in my own part and.
20:09.30
nathanpile
Yeah.
20:25.41
Kevin Shock
But the but the thing was like you said it. It was a way of training us that our own part would not stand out because we also had to be listening to the parts that were on either side of us and it was such an interesting exercise for me. Um.
20:41.73
Kevin Shock
And really helped me but but I think that that's a great image for what what? I'm feeling here so you know as ah as a part of this all creation Choir. What am I listening to to help my part in proclaiming this new Song. Um, to help my part come out but not stand out. Ah so that I'm I'm singing in support of all of this all of this wonderful work and all of the all of the song that God is bringing forth in the world. Um, that my part is important.
21:02.81
nathanpile
Yeah.
21:19.50
Kevin Shock
But I'm not singing a solo here I'm I'm a part of this great choir. Yeah yeah.
21:25.39
nathanpile
Yeah, well in this um, being ah the month of April um, you know so the earth day is in this month and so there's this idea you know that that even too is probably part of what is is causing me to think this way.
21:35.93
Kevin Shock
Sure.
21:42.81
nathanpile
Um, but how do we you know and it and we at Sequanota have ah a love your mother retreat weekend and so this is a big thing. You know that this whole theme kind of gets lived out. Um during that weekend. Um, so yeah. No, that's a it's ah it's a a part of of the this culture that we live in this me first culture. It is something that we have to fight against to be able to have listening ears for.
22:14.85
Kevin Shock
Yeah.
22:19.97
nathanpile
What the rest of creation This idea of all an all creation choir um is really interesting to me and how how we do that. So.
22:30.94
Kevin Shock
Yeah, what about you Nathan toward what has got calling you in this text.
22:37.49
nathanpile
Um, you know I had it on. Let me think of for a second to recall because I got in this other um other direction. Oh well, it was very similar to it was it was where you were at so um.
22:52.85
nathanpile
But I didn't I used it. It was later on it was that idea that the that these natural things have voices that we can hear and so towards what is God calling It wasn't so much in my singing but in my listening um.
23:09.59
nathanpile
And and we've had a couple of really gorgeous days and yesterday I took the the advantage of the really nice day and yes I did some yard work but I also sat on the front porch for hours. Um, which I don't do very often. Um, not that I don't. Have a great front porch the the house here at camp is completely surrounded by the woods. Um, but I I don't a lot of times take time to listen and yesterday I spent um like I said several hours um in between breaks working in the yard. But also then I grilled. And so it gave me a reason to sit on the porch and and um and I I didn't bring anything with me I didn't bring a book out I I just kind of sat and listened felt the sun on my face listened to the the birds chirping and it was still really windy here. Um, so there were sticks.
24:04.63
nathanpile
Continuing to fall out of the tree after I picked them all up out of the Yard. Um, Ah, but the the just the sounds of that natural world and it was a very for me. It was ah a good day. Um, just to to enjoy the surroundings. Um. Of Camp and and um of this natural world and so um, so I think because of that day and then this piece of of do we really? you know God is saying let these things happen but but are we listening for them. Um, as God's people. Um.
24:44.20
nathanpile
Are we listening for the the sea to roar and for the um, the Hills to kind of sing and and what does and what does the natural world singing sound like um, ah.
24:59.14
nathanpile
Um, and so I think there's there's there's a couple of things because I've talked about this theme I think this this late winter early spring a couple of times of of having read and and this idea that some of the things I've been reading about technology and how do we put down our technology. Um I think all of that kind of spirals into some of what i'm.
25:17.43
nathanpile
I'm feeling here right now with this passage so that idea of of really being able to listen to these other voices and and and and apply mine My voice to that that making a joyful noise but but recognizing that all of creation is making a noise. And and what does that sound like so yeah, so like I said not very far off of what you were saying but that I that same idea that same piece.
25:41.40
Kevin Shock
Yeah.
25:51.68
Kevin Shock
Ah, um, should we look at a third time. Let's do oh sing to the lord a new song for he has done marvelous things his right hand and his holy arm have gotten him victory. The lord has made known his victory.
25:53.60
nathanpile
Yeah, why don't we.
26:09.42
Kevin Shock
He has revealed his vindication in the sight of the nations he has remembered his steadfast love and faithfulness to the house of Israel all the ends of the earth have seen the victory of our god make a joyful noise to the lord all the earth break forth into joyous song and sing praises sing praises to the lord with a lyre. With a lyre and the sound of melody with trumpets and the sound of the horn make a joyful noise before the king the lord let the sea roar and all that fills it the world and those who live in it. Let the floods clap their hands. Let the hills sing together for joy at the presence of the lord. For he is coming to judge the earth he will judge the world with righteousness and the peoples with equity. Nathan ah, what is your new song in this season.
27:02.92
nathanpile
Um I think I as I was listening to you read this time through um and I was thinking about that question I think it would be fair to say um I'm not yet certain what that new song is. However, I have I have an inkling of the chorus. Yeah, so um, so like you and I have talked multiple times on this podcast that the the god is.
27:30.38
Kevin Shock
O.
27:40.50
nathanpile
God is um god is being faithful to who god is um and god is doing something different in the church and that's going to cause paradigm shift and and for the church to look different in 25 years um but I big I believe. Um, as I was thinking about this. Ah this idea of sing a new song like I'm not positive yet I know what? the new song is but I absolutely every every um, every conversation I have um and and every.
28:07.78
Kevin Shock
Yeah.
28:17.76
nathanpile
Book that I kind of read helps me to kind of begin to to see more fully the direction that god is moving us in um, and and remembering us so yesterday as I preached at a congregation and um. And I used that image of um of the eucharistic liturgy where we say do this in remembrance of me. Um, and one of the things I've been wrestling with is is that god is remembering us so not not. God is recalling us or and and that we're not trying to recall god but god is actually reforming us reputting us back together as the body of Christ right now and and maybe I'm ahead of the cart there maybe god's still pruning the body of Christ.
29:01.59
Kevin Shock
Yeah.
29:10.49
nathanpile
Ah, to be fair. But I also think god is also reforming in the midst of that pruning and so that idea of ah that god is absolutely doing something that is causing there to be new music and and so like in my mind the the tune. Like as ah as you think about really songs that you love that you listen to maybe it's on the radio. Maybe it's on the cd maybe it's on your um, um, you know your iPhone um but songs that you really love the like that the tune has those. Um, that that the way that the music begins it kind of you know it's your song within 5 or 6 notes because of of how unique the entrance of the song is or um or you love the chorus and so when it comes you turn it up louder and you sing it out. Um, you know those parts of like.
30:08.46
nathanpile
Those are all parts of this new song for me God is doing that God is God is um, like it's the the new song when you learn a new Song. You're like I don't know if I like this and not you know? Yeah, it's New. Um, but the more times you listen to it. You're like ah yeah, this is. Coming along and and and I'm to the place in this new song that that oh I almost have the chorus down that I can sing it out kind of a thing and so that part of this question of what's your new song in this season like I can describe it like it's hopeful.
30:45.33
nathanpile
It's like a babbling brook like it moves. It's got some speed to it and it rushes through things. Um, but not in a hurry but in ah in a natural flow kind of a piece. Um and it inspires and so those pieces of this song I think are in place. Um. And I think that at this point I'm starting to see them the big rocks in that stream which are going to be the things that move us forward forward god's great. Love for us god reforming or or remembering us as the body of Christ. Um, those are all big pieces of this new song. Um.
31:23.10
nathanpile
For me so like ah it's not a to me. It's not a um I don't want to say Ah, it's not a dirge I got rid of the the the descriptor on the front of that. It's not ah, it's not slow. It's not. It's not dragging us on it's it's light. It's it's got.
31:43.11
nathanpile
Um, pace and flow to it. Um, and it's catchy. Um, but it is it is new. Um, and so recognizing that we're going to hear those new themes and those new pieces. Um, so. I'm not really I'm not solid of what that whole what the whole song is yet I don't know it well enough to have it down in memory. but but I again I think hopeful. It's a hopeful song for me that that um that I haven't I would say the last four or five years I don't know if I've heard it. Um, as clearly as I'm beginning to hear what I hear now if that makes sense how about you.
32:23.12
Kevin Shock
Um, now yeah that well you yeah that makes a lot of sense. But that's the yeah, it's deep.
32:31.86
nathanpile
It's it was an artistic way of answering your question. It didn't really answer your question I'm I'm usually more practical. Um, but usually the more practical of the 2 of us. So I went with a little artistic artistic rendering of the question today.
32:36.29
Kevin Shock
No, ah no it. No, it definitely answered the question.
32:45.66
Kevin Shock
Well no, it was ah it was a great answer to the question I'm just there's a you know there's a lot to think about and um I I think you know again. Ah I don't I've said before I don't think of these questions with an answer in Mind. Um. It's not um I don't have a new song. Um, the the news. The new song is beyond me and um and you know harkening back to my answer for the last question I'm a part of this great big choir I'm not the I'm not the director I'm not the ah.
33:21.23
Kevin Shock
Composer? Um, but I do have a part and um and so I think that again I like you I don't know exactly exactly what the words to the song are the melody. Um, it is Joyful. Ah, and it is um I think it's I think the theme of the song for me is a song about oddly enough I don't I don't know how to say it? Um, and so I might have to unpack it a little bit. Um the sovereignty of God um.
33:59.36
Kevin Shock
I think that I think that the church at least the traditions that I know have have gotten in the we're good at giving lip service to say that we're worshiping God ah and and saying that we're following God Um,, there's a lot of what we do that is. Like what what can I do to fix the church. What can we do to fix the church and um and I'm just having I'm having this sense lately that the the church is not ours to fix.
34:33.20
nathanpile
Amen.
34:38.71
Kevin Shock
Christ um, established the church. Ah god created the people in the church. Ah the the church is god's to fix and um and I would do well. To be listening for what my part is in that song and and join in as as I'm able. But um, well not even as I'm able to join in in the way that god the the part that god has written for me. Ah.
35:15.92
Kevin Shock
Yeah there's a lot I don't know I've I've been maybe I'm getting ah more I don't know the word I'm I'm coming back to the basics in my old age I don't know if that's right or not. but um but I really do I think a lot about It's hard advice to say you know well just follow Jesus and you know and you'll figure everything out. Um, because following you know we talked about this at last episode or a couple episodes ago following Jesus is a lifelong struggle to figure out how that how you know fit.
35:54.37
Kevin Shock
Carry out your own salvation with fear and trembling that that whole notion from Paul um, but I really am thinking about how god is present very present in our lives. Um, if only we have the will not if.
36:14.33
Kevin Shock
No God is very present in our lives period when we have the wisdom to listen Beyond ourselves then we can hear. Perceive How God is very present in our lives and what God What part God is calling us to sing or to play and how how God might lead us into a new reality. Um.
36:50.30
Kevin Shock
I Just ah when I the church I was at yesterday. Um, thinking about when I was preaching there and I I don't think that my sermon was that great. Um, but I mean not that I not that I usually sometimes I think my sermons are pretty good. But anyway. Um, something that I was meditating meditating on um, both before and during and after my sermon is the phrase I kept coming back to and I'm not in the sermon necessarily but my reflections is.
37:27.40
Kevin Shock
Um, normalizing miraculous things. Um that that we we as followers of Jesus are resurrection people and so miraculous things new life. Um, resurrection that is a normal part of our being that's a normal part of our everyday life and there's so much written in scripture in the new testament about how. There are people in the world who can't perceive it because they don't know god I think I think for those of us who confess to knowing god to having an idea of god to trusting in Jesus Christ um
38:18.50
Kevin Shock
We should be able to perceive all of the miraculous things that are constantly happening in us around us for us in the church. Um, there's there's a lot. Ah, but 1 thing I said in my sermon yesterday was we.
38:35.60
Kevin Shock
Because it was talking about the disciples being witnesses to these things and and what are the things they begin with suffering and death every human being is a witness to those things. Ah, but then the the people of the people of god in Christ are witnesses to resurrection. They're witnesses to.
38:55.38
Kevin Shock
Repentance and forgiveness their witnesses to new life in all, its various forms. Um, and and the the parallel I Drew was that when Jesus appeared to as disciples in the gospel according to Luke while they were still. Ah.
39:14.72
Kevin Shock
In their joy were still wondering and confused. Um he asked them if they had anything to eat and so the the parallel I made was a a person being resurrected from the dead and appearing before you.
39:29.91
Kevin Shock
For ah for those of us who follow Jesus is as normal as someone having a meal needing to eat. It doesn't feel that way but that is our reality and so for me, that's a part of this new song is that god is.
39:48.82
Kevin Shock
This is all going back to what I said originally the sovereignty of God means that God is very present in everything that is happening in us for us around us and that um God has given us the spirit has given us the gift of being able to perceive. All of that miraculous stuff happening um and and to normalize that miraculous stuff and so I feel like part of the song that I'm being called to sing is witnessing to that miraculous stuff witnessing to New Life. Um. Because everyone is aware of suffering and death but not everyone is aware of new life and and so I feel like there's ah, there's a song ah in all of creation that is saying that is proclaiming. Um, here's new life.
40:46.33
Kevin Shock
Here's resurrection. It's all around us. It's all throughout creation. Ah, that was a long answer to a short question. But yeah, that's where I am.
40:56.23
nathanpile
Well, but but ah, but I think what I hear also in your in your pieces ah of this is is that there's There's not anxiousness about knowing the words there's not anxiousness of trying to learn the new song. The new song will come.
41:15.51
nathanpile
Because it's it's composed and written by God and so and so there's this idea of of um of the last several years of of seeing this downward trajectory.
41:19.63
Kevin Shock
Yes, Amen amen.
41:35.50
nathanpile
Um, of the church and saying oh no, you know everything's on fire. How do we put it out. Um and and and it's it doesn't feel good. It doesn't you know to have that that loss or to.
41:51.27
nathanpile
But there's not anxiety like this I that there's this new thing that god's doing um you know I guess I would say that there's probably maybe even seasons of the year where I I don't feel that way. But right now I'm in the season that I feel. That I that are like this this is god's to do. This isn't Nathan's to do. This is a god size problem. Not a not a lutheran church size problem. Not a not a um yeah you know Kevin size problem and like this is ah this is a god size problem. So god's going to be the one that's going to work through this.
42:28.49
nathanpile
Um, and I need to trust that this new song that's coming like I need to listen I need to I need to you know start you know and as I as I hear a tune and it starts to develop in my head that I need to kind of sing it sing it along hum along um you know break into song as as. As I learn that chorus. Um, if I'm not ready with the verses. That's okay, um, because God's doing it. So God's God's right in the words God's taking care of that that Melody um piece and so that anxiety that I do experience in seasons.
43:05.74
nathanpile
And again I say that because I don't know if in another season I feel anxious again or not. But right now I I feel as if I'm coming out of of years of anxiety around what are we going to do about the church. Um, or you know, kind of thing. How do how do.
43:19.80
Kevin Shock
Yeah, that's an interesting way to put it. Yeah yeah.
43:22.73
nathanpile
But like how do I How do I help fix it. How do I This thing that I've loved and been a part of how do I help fix it. Um and and in all reality I can't fix it the best I can do is listen to the voices around me. Um.
43:41.60
nathanpile
And and try to sing along as ah as I see as I hear and see the song going forward.
43:52.27
Kevin Shock
Yeah, yeah, yeah, I'm I'm going to try not to mix too many metaphors here. So I'm going to try to say what I'm thinking about in the metaphor of this new Song. Um, the church has been talking for decades now. About the new thing that God is doing or going to be doing and I think for so long we have talked about it in the sense of ah like we already know our part. We already know the song So we're going to just keep singing the way we have been singing.
44:27.26
Kevin Shock
and and and god will god will you know take out the parts that aren't helpful anymore and god will add new parts as they need to be added but but for me I'm using big air quotes here for me a faithful person in the church of Christ nothing will really change for me.
44:44.62
nathanpile
Oh.
44:44.92
Kevin Shock
Ah, boy have we gotten that wrong, but and and the new song means that we might have to learn an entirely new part. Even if we have been singing the ancient songs from the time of our birth. Ah, there's There's a new song being added to the repertoire.
45:00.88
nathanpile
No oh yeah, oh I Love that imagery That's beautiful. Yeah.
45:03.53
Kevin Shock
That that has echoes of all of the songs that came before it and and in fact, in, in fact, the theme you know both both contextually ah semantically and musically the theme is really the same. But there are all kinds of new variations on that theme and so my part might feel familiar. But it's different and and I think we have fooled ourselves in the church into thinking I'm just going to keep singing the same thing.
45:39.50
Kevin Shock
And and God is going to do all of this other work around me. Ah, but I don't I don't think that's the case anymore I think that I think I'm I'm having to learn a new part I'm watching other people around me have to learn new parts as well and there are there are other people. Who Um, who are not singing their old parts anymore and there are people entirely new people who are bringing new parts to the song and ah and it doesn't always feel comfortable yet. There's something about singing the new song that.
46:18.54
Kevin Shock
Ah I wouldn't say is comfortable but it gives me a lot more. It feels a lot more certain than just trying to sing the old song louder. There's there's ah, there's There's a wonderful freedom.
46:35.14
Kevin Shock
In having controls stripped away from you I don't know how to explain it necessarily but but there's something about um, finally being able to say to oneself. Ah I can't fix the church God has to do it. Um.
46:54.37
Kevin Shock
That that seems it's a little counterintuitive. It seems like it would add to your anxiety I Think in fact, it it takes away from your anxiety um because the problem is not yours but it it doesn't mean that you're not needed. It doesn't mean that you don't have a part. Um. But you're not in charge God is in charge and and we're we're and that's the other thing is that we're learning this new song together.
47:20.52
nathanpile
Yeah, well and I think that's why you and I have set a set aside time every week to um to engage in scripture a because it helps us to maybe hear the old words but the new words that god is pulling out of those old words. And maybe that's part of what's helping my me feel like I can put away some of this anxiety um is this this pattern of us now for a year and a half of sitting and kind of having conversation together and recognizing um because I do think we have to we have to listen.
47:39.58
Kevin Shock
Um, yeah.
47:48.65
Kevin Shock
Um.
47:58.45
nathanpile
And we have to listen to the the God we have to listen to the creator who is who is creating in our time. Um and that happens again part of what you shared in our disclaimer. Um, as we're listening to all of the voices. Um.
48:16.70
Kevin Shock
Yeah.
48:17.58
nathanpile
Of interpretation and so it's it's not it's the community it's not Kevin's and Nathan's theology alone but it's listening to all of these other voices. Um, and recognizing that. Um this just has to be a part of of the song.
48:26.76
Kevin Shock
Yeah.
48:36.78
nathanpile
You know of being able to to hear those new voices that are being brought in and again there's going to be those great old themes as you said it that that are they're going to be echoes of our past and we're going to hear them in this new Song. Um, and those would be time for us to kind of smile and say ah yeah, but. It's just going to be part part of it. It's not the whole song. It's the the old songs aren't going to be the new song. Um, we'll have the echoes of of the of the tunes and of the words those will be a part of this new song but the new song will be new.
49:04.24
Kevin Shock
Oh.
49:11.60
Kevin Shock
Yeah, yeah, and and the new song learning the new song might mean that we rediscovered the ancient songs that that have been buried under the the parts that we have written on top of the old song.
49:30.45
Kevin Shock
Yeah, no yeah I yeah no I I appreciate that I appreciate your reflection the discussion. Um, and I real and I do think I mean this is you know Nathan and I dear listener. Ah. Every week. We say you know if you're meeting with a group you can pause the podcast now and and engage the questions on your own. Um, ah Nathan and I can both testify to how ah taking an hour each week to sit down and talk through these things has um.
50:05.46
Kevin Shock
Strengthened our personal relationship has strengthened our relationship with scripture and has helped us to see things in new ways and and and we're both people who have you know masters of divinity degrees like we've we've gone through the schooling. We've gone through the education. Um, this this I now see this work that Nathan and I are doing as essential not not for all the people who are listening but for us I mean I really do think that I I was just reflecting to myself this past week thinking you know.
50:33.28
nathanpile
Yeah.
50:43.97
Kevin Shock
Wherever I land in the future in my in my next call or whatever it is um, this like this has to be a part of it. What whether it's I mean I hope it continues with you Nathan but but um, but also but also with the people wherever I am um. Either people in a congregation or colleagues in the ministry. Um, this has to be a part of it for me it. It. It brings us together and and helps us to discern what god is actually.
51:13.22
nathanpile
Ah, yep, that absolutely.
51:20.88
nathanpile
Yeah, yeah.
51:22.42
Kevin Shock
Saying and doing So yeah, so anyway I say all that to say ah find yourself a partner and talk through some of this stuff keep tending. Yeah yeah, don't don't just listen to us but have have somebody that you can share things with.
51:30.60
nathanpile
Keep tending find find Partners and tend.
51:41.78
Kevin Shock
And um and you don't have to you don't have to sit and talk about it for a whole hour. You can talk about it for 10 minutes it's it's something though. Yeah.
51:49.28
nathanpile
Yeah, and keep sharing with us as as many of you continue to do via email or or social media and those pieces are here at the end of the podcast will be re reminded of all of those to pieces.
52:02.32
Kevin Shock
Yes, yes, please.
52:05.29
nathanpile
A couple of additional texts if you were looking to dig a little deeper around similar themes acts chapter 10 verses 44 through 48 the spirit poured out on the gentiles first John. Chapter 5 verses 1 through 6 the victory of faith and John 15 verses 9 through 17 ah Christ the friend and the one who loves us Kevin as always thank you for. Um, sharing your reflections with me today and and and beginning to sing a new song. Ah who we hoped I am a tenor him there we go.
52:50.57
Kevin Shock
Um, you're a You're a tenor aren't you good? Well I'm a bass so we can we can listen to each other and figure out our part.
52:59.60
nathanpile
And we go keep that's right we hope to tend our faith with you again soon. Grace to you.
53:04.68
Kevin Shock
And peace.