Episode 24: Acts 1:15-17, 21-26

Translation: Common English Bible

3 Questions:
What word, phrase or image strikes you in this text?
Toward what is God calling you in this text?
How do you make faithful decisions?

Additional texts:
Psalm 1
1 John 5:9-13
John 17:6-19

Transcript

00:01.36
Kevin Shock
Hey tenders time to tend again with the these 2 tenders who who love you so tenderly. Um, oh my gosh. Okay, stop. Ah, it.

00:14.97
nathanpile
Ah, ah, could you could you go up with 1 more chicken tenders chicken tenders.

00:19.44
Kevin Shock
No, no, no, no, that was no that was no that was enough that was enough today Nathan and I are going to be talking about um, thinking about reflecting on acts chapter 1 versus 15 through 17 and verses 21 through 26 ah, sometimes in our appointed readings in our worship tradition. There are parts of texts that are left out and so we um, we stay faithful to that. Ah, although usually we're just not talking about it today but oftentimes it's It can also be helpful to read those in between verses. So either. Ah, you can either engage acts one 15 through 17 and 21 through 26 or just engage acts one 15 through 26 whichever Nathan and I will be doing the former but whichever you want to do? We're going to be looking at the common english bible.

00:56.97
nathanpile
Who.

01:14.96
Kevin Shock
Translation in our 3 questions for this week what word phrase or image strikes you in this text or what is god calling you in this text and how do you make grateful decisions aside from rolling dice.

01:30.80
nathanpile
Um, ah ah man sorry he's already taken. He's already taken my joke from.

01:35.88
Kevin Shock
I mean if that's your answer if well if that's your answer then so be it I was trying to I I really had to think about this question and I was going to put some reference to rolling dice in it. But um, but then decided not to but then I did anyway when I asked it. Um, yeah, so Nathan tell the people who we are ah, ah.

02:00.60
nathanpile
Well, we're Nathan and Kevin um, and ah we are men married to women in financially stable households white in our late 40 s college and seminary educated we work in the lutheran church and were born and raised in Western Pennsylvania

02:01.93
Kevin Shock
We are.

02:15.87
nathanpile
All of this affects how we read scripture and discuss it. But none of this makes us better able to read and discuss scripture than anyone else. We believe that the wisdom of scripture is the whole community's compiled interpretation for life with God and with one another and so we want to know what you hear and think from your life experience.

02:35.22
nathanpile
As you hear the scripture acts the first chapter verses seventeen fifteenth to 17 and 21 through 26 during this time. The family of believers. Was a company of about 120 persons Peter stood among them and said brothers and sisters the scripture that the holy spirit announced beforehand through David had to be fulfilled. This was the scripture concerning Judas. Who became a guide for those who arrested Jesus this happened even though he was one of us and received a share of this ministry therefore we must select one of those who accompanied us during the whole time. The. Lord Jesus lived among us beginning from the baptism of John until the day when Jesus was taken from us this person must become along with us a witness to his resurrection so they nominated to Joseph called. Barsabbas who was also known as Justus and Matthias they prayed Lord you know every one's deepest thoughts and desires show us clearly which one you have chosen from among these 2 to take the place of this ministry.

04:07.96
nathanpile
And apostleship from which Judas turned away to go to his own place when they cast lots the lot fell on Matthias he was added to the 11 apostles.

04:24.90
nathanpile
If you are meeting with group. You can pause the podcast now and engage the questions on your own for those that are listening along. Um Kevin what word phrase or image strikes you in this text.

04:40.59
Kevin Shock
Um, must.

04:46.78
nathanpile
Um, Wow Ah, um, all right must say say ah say must you must say more. You must say more.

04:48.37
Kevin Shock
Um, that's my answer must I say more? Okay, um Nathan Nathan knows as I as I'm sure a lot of you who listen to this know that I'm I'm not a very.

05:04.21
Kevin Shock
I don't like must and I don't like should um I think that it's sometimes sometimes it.

05:08.35
nathanpile
Ah, this is this is so true folks when Kevin and I are in conversations. Yeah I can just see when I use that word should which from time to time I have on the podcast and we've probably talked about it. You could just kind of see his face kind of go. Ah.

05:26.22
Kevin Shock
But ah, ah, um, yeah yeah I I I mean I I appreciate I appreciate how um I get Peter is you know I mean his.

05:27.90
nathanpile
Um, so anyway must is one of those words for you.

05:44.75
Kevin Shock
His first after he after he musts everybody um, his first thing to do is to pray and to acknowledge that. Um you know god knows these people better than we do and so please show us clearly who it is who's going to be added to this company. Um, so I appreciate that you know Peter Peter's not just Peter doesn't um you know make the decision on his own. Ah, but also I just wonder like why? why? Peter why did why does do we have to select 1 more um.

06:19.58
nathanpile
Hey.

06:23.20
Kevin Shock
Like what's the criteria. What's the criterion. What where where is it. Where's it written in the law that the number of the disciples has to be 12 um, maybe maybe there is some kind of answer for that. Ah, and and maybe it's even in those verses that are that are left out here. Um, but we're not looking at those so I don't have them in front of me. Um, yeah I just I just wonder why Peter is "must"-ing here. Ah, and um, that's all that's that's that's pretty much it I I think we can get into trouble when we must too much.

06:55.69
nathanpile
Ah.

06:59.66
Kevin Shock
But yeah, what about you? Nathan what a word phrase or image you in this next.

07:04.81
nathanpile
Ah, ah, well, there's a couple of things here I will come to what my piece is um first every time you say musting or must I'm thinking of Musk with a k and so like I'm thinking it's like some kind of cologne that we're putting on. Um.

07:14.76
Kevin Shock
E Me yeah f me.

07:22.51
nathanpile
Ah, first off which brings me a little bit of amusement every time you say it? Um, ah the musty. Yeah, yeah, that'd be like ah a cabin scent that we bottle here at Sequanota and we could sell musty.

07:24.62
Kevin Shock
Or maybe it's like maybe it's like Musty you know like look like a basement. Yeah this this.

07:40.19
Kevin Shock
Yeah, you would make up make it. Ah ah yes, yes I It's very nice in the camp setting I don't know if it's so nice outside of the camp setting. Um, but anyway.

07:42.96
nathanpile
If people wanted to smell like that and walk around we could make millions. Yeah yeah, um.

07:53.90
nathanpile
Ah, it is not nostalgia when you come in, you're like the musty of camp. Yeah that it is I'm not positive people want to wear that when they you know, go to this the Symphony or something like that So person that's it next over like.

07:57.96
Kevin Shock
Ah, yes, yes, that's.

08:09.61
Kevin Shock
I Yeah yeah, did you pick those clothes up off the floor before you put them up like that kind of ah.

08:10.86
nathanpile
You know you smell like my summer camp cabin. Yeah, all right? um back to the real reason we've gathered not just to talk about. Um, whatever we're talking about. Yeah.

08:25.26
Kevin Shock
Whatever it is. We were talking about. Yeah.

08:29.37
nathanpile
Um, my second point before I get to my thing is I feel like Kevin baited me with this reading because last week he and I were on a we were on a we were on a Zoom together talking about. Ah um, and I wrote a devotion. On this paassage.

08:37.16
Kevin Shock
Oh.

08:49.92
nathanpile
It and what's kind of go off on and so now I feel I feel like maybe I've been baited into um of ah that that this is I didn't know that this was an upcoming assigned text for us I had picked it. Um.

09:04.58
Kevin Shock
Well yeah, okay, okay so I will I will I will say honestly Nathan that I'm not baiting you with this text? Um, ah I might when I read through all of the texts for this that appointed for this week

09:17.11
nathanpile
Yeah.

09:19.22
Kevin Shock
Um, I just didn't like I wasn't feeling the spark in any in any of the other ones and and I knew I I reluctantly chose it thinking. Well.

09:24.40
nathanpile
And anyway and you knew that ah you knew that I would easily fill an hour with me just talking about this passage.

09:35.70
Kevin Shock
At least I know Nathan has opinions about this text. So ah, ah so have at it Nathan ah.

09:36.49
nathanpile
So ah, I'm going to come at this? ah ah from a creative perspective. What is the word phrase or image that strikes me, um, ah Mathias Matthias is the word phrase or image that strikes me.

09:51.93
Kevin Shock
There you go.

09:53.59
nathanpile
Because this is the only time it shows up this is it right here verse 23 and 26 and then he's gone. We never we haven't heard from him before and we will never hear from him again. Um, and.

09:58.74
Kevin Shock
Ah.

10:05.40
Kevin Shock
Ah, ah, which which is another reason to wonder why Peter was "must"-ing so much. But anyway.

10:13.77
nathanpile
Right? Why Peter was much like why did we have to have this guy in. Um if we were going to hear about him. Um, why not why? what? Why didn't he make a little bit bigger of splash. Um, if it must be done. Let's have but let's let's do it. Um.

10:31.54
nathanpile
Ah, even Justus gets more of a like gets more of a description about all of his names than Matthias does like like so um, so there's a lot going on here folks for me in this passage. Um.

10:38.83
Kevin Shock
Um, right, right? right.

10:50.80
nathanpile
And and part of that is because what we we don't read here is that um the author Luke tells us that Jesus tells his disciples to wait before this and then we get into well we have to have 12 apostles because we always have.

11:10.22
nathanpile
Um, and so that's part of my diatribe in other things other places where I write about this? Um, and and so but this piece of Mathias coming in and um and being selected again with dice. Um, like I understand we're at we're at the beginning of the church but is that really the like we prayed. But there's a lot of people that go to Vegas and pray over dice. Um, before they throw them. Um, so or Atlantic city. Maybe you didn't even have to go to Vegas to do it. But.

11:49.66
nathanpile
Um, so there's there's ah this piece like when I was a kid and and they they this idea of they threw lots um got articulated when finally somebody told me it was you know throwing dice and I'm like well that's just lucky Mathias got lucky here. Um, to be called one of the 12 and and we know that if we read the rest of the book of acts god picks the Twelfth Apostle um god god has a conversion experience for Paul. Ah, that's that's who the Twelfth apostle really is going to be um, that's the one that we're going to hear um his story as he shares what goes on and so um, yeah, so the you know the the piece of but round must is ah is um is well stated. Kevin.

12:47.57
nathanpile
Um I think it should call all of us should cause all of us to be a little bit more um, apprehensive when we think we know what we must or should do.

13:03.69
nathanpile
Um, and and and um and I don't want to say that waiting is is the best answer because I'm a terrible waiter anyone that knows me if you're if you know me and you're listening to the podcast you're nodding your head Nathan is a terrible waiter um not like.

13:03.96
Kevin Shock
Ah, you know.

13:21.70
nathanpile
As a server I wasn't bad as a server in a restaurant you know I did that too once in my life I got decent tips but I'm I'm terrible at actually physically not doing something as I Ah you know you know as I've shared before I like give me the next thing and I'm going to jump on it. Um, so waiting.

13:41.26
nathanpile
Listening being patient for god to act in the world. Um I don't believe these early apostles were good at it either and I think that's an and I'm for sure Peter ah because Peter feels like they got to do something while they're waiting for the holy spirit to show up. Um, that can't just be enough that the holy spirit's coming.

14:00.84
nathanpile
He has to do they have to do something um and so you have 120 people and the way we're gonna make this decision is throw dice. Um, and so again I get it that the the culturally in that time that very well may have been. Seen as allowing god the holy spirit to control the dice that a number comes up. Um, but again for me that's not a way that feels like god works in our world. Um, so I'm i'm. Almost confident that I'll probably rant about the second question too in some way shape or form. So I'm just gonna pause my um, my ah um, Matthias is here. We don't really hear of him much. Well, we don't hear of him at all after this this is his moment in the Sun. Um.

14:47.69
Kevin Shock
Okay, okay, ah, um.

14:58.79
nathanpile
And though I I appreciate a faithful witness of again. There's when as you hear the passage read um Matthias was and Justus followed Jesus from the beginning at the baptism of of John's baptism of Jesus.

15:17.69
nathanpile
Through the resurrection. So these guys. These guys were also faithful. They were also committed um to Jesus being the way and so there's there's like I don't mean to to Pooh Pooh any of that commitment I think it the the thing i poohpooh is is. That sometimes we as um christians sometimes as christian leaders. We think we know what needs to happen and I think this is yet another fine example of god saying interesting selection but I'm going to pick Paul in a couple of chapters. Um.

15:55.57
nathanpile
And and and and he's the Twelfth apostle not that god says it that way. But really, you know when you think about who's going to come and and and change the way the early church functions. It's not Matthias. It's it's going to be Paul um, and so god waits.

16:00.30
Kevin Shock
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

16:07.93
Kevin Shock
Great right? yeah.

16:13.75
nathanpile
and and calls um one who has been gifted to do that in the future. Um, and and like it makes me think in my own life. What are the decisions that I feel like have to be hurried up or that I hurry to make because I think it needs to be made. And maybe I should have waited and listened more attentively to what god was doing in the world. Um, you know I don't really fault Peter and these these apostles what this passage strikes for me is how can I grow to.

16:51.53
nathanpile
To wait better. How how do I do that as ah as a follower of Christ and and now we're getting into what I feel called towards I guess probably so we should just pause and read this again.

17:06.11
Kevin Shock
Okay, well I yeah I'd like to just a couple of quick quick reflections. Um one I okay so Matthias Becomes one of the chief 12 in this passage I I have a strong suspicion that.

17:06.63
nathanpile
You can go ahead and respond to me. Yeah.

17:16.61
nathanpile
Oh.

17:21.89
Kevin Shock
Justus Joseph Barsabbas whatever you whatever he wants to go by today. Um does does not yeah I have a I have a strong suspicion that he does not leave the company of the disciples after this.

17:27.91
nathanpile
Um, he had 3 names he was a popular guy. He's 3 name.

17:36.57
nathanpile
Nope no right yeah yeah.

17:38.42
Kevin Shock
But he still is faithfully following I'm assuming um because as you said he's been faithfully following all along from the very beginning So but yeah, so it kind of makes this it kind of makes this decision like oh, what's the point. But.

17:45.33
nathanpile
Right? okay.

17:57.47
Kevin Shock
In any case, fine. It happened Um, the other thing is that I Really think that I suppose this text could be used as a justification toward but I'm a strong advocate against um, having to having to feel. Like you're making the correct decision in every step of your life. Um, so sometimes like I don't I don't First of all I don't think the consultation with God just comes before the decision. The consultation with God continues after the decision is made too.

18:34.21
Kevin Shock
And so I don't think as though it is um you know God is saying if you choose this thing you're right? and if you choose this thing you're wrong I don't I don't think that's the case for for most decisions in our you know so like decisions like well should I take this job or that job.

18:53.93
Kevin Shock
I Think that God God has the ability to help you live faithfully to make you live faithfully. Whatever job you take For example, um I don't think I don't think it's such a binary thing like either either this or that either right or wrong. Um, you make the decision.

19:00.32
nathanpile
There? yeah.

19:13.89
Kevin Shock
Ah, you stay in consultation with god and god is going to continue to give you the gift of faith ah to live as god wants you to live whatever that may be and and that also goes back to in our own faith tradition. Ah that you don't have to be a pastor to be a good. Disciple Apostle preacher teacher of the faith. You just have to you can do that in whatever your vocation is um so anyway, just just some just some thoughts coming out of what you were reflecting on Nathan I think that? yeah well.

19:47.86
nathanpile
My rant my rant. So no, no I called it a rant I have I've no doubt that that it was my my rant. So yep, that bit.

19:52.80
Kevin Shock
And I didn't say that Okay, well.

19:57.75
Kevin Shock
That you were ranting? Yeah, okay, all right second time through from acts chapter 1 during this time. The family of believers was a company of about 120 persons Peter stood among them and said brothers and sisters. Scripture that the holy spirit announced beforehand through David had to be fulfilled. This was the scripture concerning Judas who became a guide for those who arrested Jesus this happened even though he was one of us and received a share of this ministry therefore we must select one of those. Who have accompanied us during the whole time. The lord Jesus lived among us beginning from the baptism of John until the day when Jesus was taken from us this person must become along with us a witness to his resurrection so they nominated 2 Joseph called Barsabbas who was also known as as justice Justus. And Matthias they prayed Lord you know everyone's deepest thoughts and desires show us clearly which one you have chosen from among these 2 to take the place of this ministry and apostleship from which Judas turned away to go to his own place when they cast lots the lot fell on Mathias. He was added to the 11 apostles Nathan toward what is god calling you in this text? Ah okay, you can do whatever you want, you can.

21:14.36
nathanpile
I still want to rant that reading through that a second time want a rant. Ah no no no um ah ah well, it's no you yeah you you helped me to um to quell that. So. I'm going to. Ah I'm going to try to um, stay away from it. But um towards what am I field called here it is going to still come off with a little bit as a rant um that that um.

21:34.40
Kevin Shock
Ah, okay.

21:51.79
nathanpile
As we.

21:57.49
nathanpile
as we live um as christians as we live into god's way. Um, Peter here is very adamant.

22:12.52
nathanpile
Again, ah around the must um that this person will help to proclaim the resurrection because they've witnessed it and.

22:30.68
nathanpile
I think there's a part of me in the from this passage that that um, knowing what else happens in this passage. Um, like I get the importance of being able to to share. Story from a firsthand perspective yet. We also know from Jesus in the gospels that Jesus knows that there are going to be people who are going to be witnesses that have not witnessed anything by their own experience by their of of Jesus's life let me say it that way.

23:06.10
nathanpile
They've experienced other things you and I have experienced other things and we share the gospel. Um, when we preach or at least we we attempt to try to share the gospel of Jesus Christ as we preach um on a weekly basis. Um, or when we preach but it's there.

23:24.83
nathanpile
Like we're witnessing to to that and and we're sharing experiences of where we've seen Jesus alive and working in the world. Um in in in that story in that passage that we're that we're sharing from scripture on a Sunday morning when we're preaching. But at the same time there. There's a piece of this that that um, that smacks for me a little bit of what we hear about over and again about the pharisees and the sadducees like. We as as christians can get caught up and in our own interpretation here and lose the fact that someone else can talk about god's love maybe better than we can um and and so there's just a part of this passage. That that reminds me to be to be open to and to a new witness I guess um is what I would would say that this passage kind of strikes for me of of being able to say yes there is tradition. Yes there's this um you know. Judas does this thing that connects us back to the prophecy from David um, kind of a thing but he still but Judas still has a part of that ministry or shared and as a part of that ministry and now it's time for someone else to do that.

24:56.35
nathanpile
Um, and I think for us a lot of times you know I've said it when I've thought about um leaders for the church or leaders here at camp like who knows our system who knows what we know and that's who maybe we pick.

25:13.87
nathanpile
Um, and so what does it? How do we? How? ah might we be brave enough to seek out a witness that might do it in an unconventional way might do it in a new or deep a different way. Um. All of those things might challenge us as christians um that it that if it is different. Um, it might make us uncomfortable and yet there's a part of this passage that I think um, that strikes me in that way of of How do we? How do we listen to all that that we're encountered you know I think of 120 people that have followed Jesus and there's 2 names that are lifted up because the criteria is.

26:10.48
nathanpile
Who's been there from the beginning to to now. Um and and unfortunately probably because of the society it had to be it was men that were considered you know, um why not Mary Magdalege she was there first she saw Jesus's resurrection and proclaimed it to the rest of us first. Why doesn't.

26:12.25
Kevin Shock
Men.

26:29.57
nathanpile
Mary get a get a nominated as as one of the the 2 Um, so um, so there's there's a you know there's I guess ah again to answer the question they're they' towards what am I do I feel called in this passage.

26:48.48
nathanpile
Ah, feel called to to not be so closed off to be open and and again I would go back to what I think that this passage is really about which is the verses before it which is let's wait. Let's wait and listen and see what God's really really doing in our midst. Um.

27:06.47
nathanpile
And and can we put aside our preconceived expectations or our preconceived idea of what an apostle looks like that we might might be open to others who might be the sent 1 or one of the sent ones. In this in this passage. What? What about you? My friend toward what is god calling you in this text.

27:29.86
Kevin Shock
Um, yeah, um I think I think originally I was going toward the same kind of um, being open.

27:43.38
Kevin Shock
Um, not not thinking that I I know the way to best go about what's happening. It doesn't mean that you know like you talked about in our other conversation ah around this text last week um waiting is not a passive thing waiting is an active thing. Um, you know we're listening. We're paying attention. We're praying. We're engaging in scripture where you know I mean all of those are a part of waiting maybe waiting also involves ah continuing what we. What we know to do until we fight until we hear something else. Um, ah, but for me I think what this is calling me toward the more that you talked I think there's a for me, there's a strong sense of lifting up the.

28:35.68
Kevin Shock
Um, lifting up the the gifts of all of the people. Ah like like you know I'm I'm sure I'm sure there's something about you know there are probably reasons that Matthias and and Barsabbas.

28:55.14
Kevin Shock
Joseph the 3 name guy. um ah use this um ah I'm sure that there are things about them. You know that that that qualified them for this particular kind of service.

29:01.10
nathanpile
Ah, Justus Justus.

29:13.44
Kevin Shock
Um, but also ah for for Joseph. Um there there were probably other gifts that he had and so I hope I hope that Peter and the apostles the other eleven including Mathias did not just say well thanks for playing Joseph um, see you later. You know, but but continued to lift up gifts in him and and I think that there are um, you know one place I don't know if we've talked about it on this podcast. But I know you and I've talked about it 1 place we get into trouble is the church is that we think that the professional. Church people I don't um, you know the pastors the deacons. The people who get a paycheck from the church. Um that they're the ones who really know how things are supposed to go um and and we are we are part of that. But um, but.

30:09.10
Kevin Shock
It's very clear throughout all scripture and in the traditions of our of our church and through what the holy spirit has guided us toward across Millennia that um, all of the people have an important role in the body in the community and um.

30:27.74
Kevin Shock
And so I think that that's ah that is that's something important for me to do is to look for the different gifts that are in people and lift up those gifts so that they can then hopefully live into those gifts. So.

30:45.50
nathanpile
Yeah.

30:47.26
Kevin Shock
Yeah, that's what I'm that's what I'm thinking about around this text I guess I guess I'm really really focusing on Joseph Barsabbas Justus um I want to make sure that he had a he had a good role in the in the body of disciples.

31:02.68
nathanpile
Yeah, well the thing I love about it is that that it's that again I think a part of our world is is we pick and why can't it be what can't it all. Why can't they all be a part of it. Why what is like.

31:04.98
Kevin Shock
I'm sure he did.

31:21.46
nathanpile
Again, you know, maybe the council size needs to be 12 these we need 12 people to you know? um you know, but as I always in a congregation. You know our goal was to have a council of 6 not 12 you know and and so like numbers change. So what is it a.

31:25.21
Kevin Shock
Yeah, yeah.

31:40.35
nathanpile
How do we recognize the giftedness of all and and and it could be if Peter were here and we could ask him that question he would say well we didn't discount anyone else's gifts, but but it does feel that way does feel like Justus is is um.

31:52.40
Kevin Shock
Yeah.

31:59.92
nathanpile
And others Mary you know and other others who were faithful. Followers were were overlooked or their voice wasn't wasn't acknowledged and so I appreciate that of your. Your piece of how how do we do that and I think I think we're trying to um, advocate that way by by putting together this podcast of saying like it's it's richer when we get everybody's input. Um.

32:36.33
nathanpile
I don't know if we know how to do that perfectly yet you know we're using a medium that isn't we we can't get 120 people on on and we create a podcast if so it would be a really long podcast. You'd have to like drive to California to listen to it. Um, but like how how do we? you know again I I I appreciate it I just I think it's an um.

33:11.51
nathanpile
I Would agree with the settlement of how do we? How would the the disciples have done that or the apostles have done that um in a different way.

33:25.48
Kevin Shock
yeah yeah I do think that. Um, there's something about when reading through this the second time you know it does say um, it does it does seem to indicate in verse 25 that there is a there's a certain.

33:40.59
Kevin Shock
You know to take the place of this ministry and apostleship from which Judas turned away to go to his own place. So that says to me that there is a sense of this is a specialized role in the body. Um, and it's not that it's not that Matthias is better than anyone else, but this is something that maybe he has. Gifts that are suited for this? Um, still I agree with you that it kind of feels like work where you know we're rolling dice to pick some but head and well too bad to the person the lots don't fall on yeah, that's all anyway.

34:07.76
nathanpile
Right. Yeah, yeah.

34:18.49
Kevin Shock
Um, why don't we look at it a third time.

34:23.36
nathanpile
Let's do it.

34:27.81
nathanpile
During this time. The family of believers was a company of about 120 persons Peter stood among them and said siblings the scripture that the holy spirit announced beforehand through David. Had to be fulfilled. This was the scripture concerning Judas who became a guide for those who arrested Jesus this happened even though he was one of us and received a share of this ministry therefore we must select 1 of those who had have accompanied us during the whole time. The lord Jesus lived among us beginning from the baptism of John until the day when Jesus was taken from us this person must become. Along with us a witness to his resurrection so they nominated 2 Joseph called Barsabbas who also was known as Justus and Mathias they prayed Lord you know every one's deepest thoughts and desires. Show us clearly which one you have chosen from among these 2 to take the place of this ministry and apostleship from which Judas turned away to get to go to his own place when they cast lots the lot fell on Matthias.

35:58.24
nathanpile
He was added to the 11 apostles.

36:03.58
nathanpile
How do you Kevin make faithful decisions.

36:12.68
Kevin Shock
Listening is at the is at the root of it. Um, and I think some of it means ah quieting myself and listening for the way that God might lead but it also really means ah I'm really fed By. Soliciting feedback from people around me. Um and I and actually I don't do as good a job of that as I probably should a lot of times. Ah, but that's but yeah, that's a part of how I make faithful decisions I think.

36:49.34
Kevin Shock
The the thing that one of the things that really speaks to me from this text is Peter's the beginning of Peter's prayer where he says Lord you know everyone's deepest thoughts and desires. Um.

37:05.49
Kevin Shock
I Think sometimes sometimes there are things um in ourselves both good and bad that we can't see as clearly and so having ah having faithful companions on the journey and and having um. Making that acknowledgement before God is an important part of making faithful decisions I think um.

37:33.42
nathanpile
I Say amen to that I like I think that idea of having outside input on our own lives is helpful.

37:43.92
Kevin Shock
Yeah, for me, there's a there's a it's implied when Peter says Lord you know everyone's deepest thoughts and desires. Um that I hear that at least maybe maybe it's not implied I infer it. Um, that. Even I don't know my deepest thoughts and desires. Even I'm not entirely sure of the things that motivate me what my motive is and in things and so sometimes I think it's a good idea to be able to be aware of our motivation and. And if we need to put that by the wayside so that we might make more faithful decisions. Um, sometimes our motivation might be helpful in the decisions that we make and sometimes our motivation might get in the way of making faithful decisions. So yeah.

38:38.71
nathanpile
Yeah.

38:42.13
Kevin Shock
Yeah, soliciting feedback both from god and from god's people is is important to me and and again I should practice it more than what I have in the past but I'm not always as good at it. So. What about you? Nathan how do you make faithful decisions.

39:02.97
nathanpile
I'm I am the same pieces like how do I listen to god how do I listen to others and and I I think the piece that I would add and I know this is true for you as well is then making sure that when I solicit those. when I'm when I'm making a prayer out to god saying hey god you know, help me with this decision or I've asked a group of friends and and trusted colleagues to kind of say hey help me discern what's going on here. Um, but then also taking time to reflect what I'm hearing from both places. As I'm sitting and listening taking time to reflect and I would say that's probably 1 of the things that um, recently I've been kind of toying with well how do I do that? How do I how do I how do I listen first and then reflect so that maybe um. Again, the first answer in my head might be a little bit like Peter's like well we should have 12 let's get 12 together. Um, you know like I can I can feel that ah being a part of who I am you know I always say that I connect to Peter quite a bit. Um because I think that that's a um, the true statement like.

40:16.18
nathanpile
Like I I see I feel Peter and I get connect like I would do many of the things Peter does um and so but like it maybe the 12 isn't there or maybe it's not about getting the twelfth. Maybe it is about listening and and. And having conversation with 120 um and seeing what's the the next the next steps for our community and so being able to kind of a do that listening but then also then to kind of critically reflect on it. And so one of the things that I that I haven't done or or I shouldn't say that I haven't done I have the the times that I have done it the most which would be some kind of journaling is typically when um I feel the most lost if that makes sense. Um.

41:10.42
nathanpile
But then once I feel like I'm less lost I stop doing it So that idea of okay maybe I need to start? Um, you know, journaling again a little bit. You know what are some ways that I can track and Journal and.

41:14.88
Kevin Shock
Ah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

41:26.68
nathanpile
And and if you look behind me in my office. There's a stack of I don't know 9 or 10 journals that I have that um that are all waiting for me to use them. Um because or or some of them are half-filled.

41:38.13
Kevin Shock
Ah, yeah, some of those too.

41:43.24
nathanpile
But there's still like half of a journal left. So I'm like I'll just save that I'll use it the next time I need to that I'm in the journal time kind of a thing. Um, and so but being able to kind of sit with myself and and the things that I have heard both from god and from others and maybe those are the same. You know, maybe the things I hear from others are from god but but being able to take the things that I've heard recently and for myself to kind of reflect upon them write them down you know and and then write for a couple of more days and then come back and reflect on what I've written what I wrote a week before or a month before um one of the things I'm an I um I like to have ideas about what the next step is or what the next vision is and the staff will tell you around Sequanota I'll be like oh that's a great idea. Let's do that? Um, but rarely do we go off of Nathan's first let's do that.

42:42.52
nathanpile
Um, we wait until it's like Nathan's Twelfth time of saying. Um, oh yeah, that is a good idea. Let's do that and so when I've said it like 10 twelve ten or 12 times now. It's time that we should probably really really be considering this as the next viable option. Um.

43:01.79
nathanpile
You know, kind of a thing and so um, when when I've when I've thought of it a couple of times when I've talked it with with staff members about it a couple of times when I've listened to outside groups a couple of times. Um, then now it's maybe becoming a um. Something that keeps popping up. Um and so it would be in many ways. Maybe it's it's that um we keep rolling double seven s for a year and then I'm like okay number 7 must be the thing. Um not that I would use dice to do that. But like it's an idea that would keep popping up. Um, then it then I then I might say oh maybe I need to take better closer attention look at this better with more attention and so that's that idea of journaling I think that helps me to journal when I journal when it keeps popping up for me. In a journal entry that I'm kind of like or or several journal entries I'm kind of like maybe I need to sit and and reflect on what this what this is and so being able to listen to god listen to others and then myself making time to reflect upon what I'm hearing.

44:12.87
nathanpile
Um, would be the third piece that I would add that I would add to you to your mirror pieces of of listening for me I need to I need to reflect then a little bit of is it just about me is this thing that keeps popping up just about me. Um.

44:30.85
nathanpile
Or something that I Nathan want to happen or is is this really god in this and god moving us in ah in a new direction kind of a thing. So.

44:42.00
Kevin Shock
Um, yeah, the one the 1 thing you said that really resonated with me was the um you journaling in your in your kind of your time of deepest need. Ah but then not doing it whenever.

44:57.25
Kevin Shock
And and I think that that maybe I I don't know Maybe it's maybe it's because some clarity comes. But I I think you know when I consult other people. Um I'm usually consulting them when I Really don't know what to do. I might talk to them otherwise. But then if I'm talking to them. Maybe it's just for confirmation that the decision that in my in my mind in my heart I've already made even though I might be presenting it as I haven't made this decision yet just getting confirmation for that. Um, yeah, So it's.

45:33.52
Kevin Shock
It's hard once we once we cling to something or grab onto it. It's hard to remain open to other options. Um, and I feel like as I get older I get better at that. But um, but not.

45:42.59
nathanpile
Yeah, yeah.

45:51.40
Kevin Shock
Not in all aspects of life I Guess it's is the is the the right thing. The faithful thing thing to say So yeah, yeah, yeah I I think that I think that God has. A lot in store for God's people and um and I just don't want us to limit ourselves and and this this feels like the the action that happens in this text feels like a limiting action.

46:22.75
nathanpile
Yes, yeah, and I think that's that's part of it for me the whole way through that that the wading of this passage seems like the thing that keeps us more open to what to what God might be doing.

46:37.11
Kevin Shock
Yeah.

46:42.51
nathanpile
As opposed to we have to make a decision do we is that is it is that really what God's waiting on is our action here. Um I don't think it's ever that to be honest I don't think ever God is waiting for for.

46:44.70
Kevin Shock
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

46:59.69
nathanpile
Nathan or Kevin or anyone else to to do 1 thing so that then god can reveal what god is doing um right right? Like there's just there's just a part of that. Um that that feels again.

47:04.76
Kevin Shock
That So the rest of the plan can be put into motion. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

47:19.41
nathanpile
As you said limiting it like it. It's making it smaller. Not not not open more open.

47:25.56
Kevin Shock
Um I I will say though as we have this discussion this very this very part of the discussion. Ah that that perhaps god does have a purpose in this and that is. All of these apostles are going to have to get used to discerning through the gift of the holy spirit what it is. They're exactly supposed to do and so maybe maybe this is a practice run. You know I will I'll I'll I'll concede that that this is just. This is the first time they have to desert something so god gives them something maybe somewhat inconsequential and and they employ a seemingly inconsequential or noncommittal way to make that decision. Um, as as the book of acts goes on. Their decision making becomes more nuanced I feel like.

48:18.98
nathanpile
Yeah, maybe the thing is God's trying to get rid of the rolling of dice and and after this one they they realized this was a terrible idea. We shouldn't roll dice.

48:26.72
Kevin Shock
Cost They don't roll the dice anymore. Yeah yeah, ah maybe maybe I don't know I don't know oh gosh.

48:40.95
nathanpile
Ah, ah I don't like dice rolling because I was never very good at Candy land not candy Land Candy Land had the cards life The game of no that had a wheel that a wheel would Monopoly Monopoly I was never good at Monopoly I Never got the dice to fall for me.

48:41.72
Kevin Shock
Okay, well I think I think 1 thing that is a good decision to make. Oh my gosh. Yeah I was gonna sit that had the wheel monopoly there you go? Yeah, oh Yahtzee yeah that's the one that. Yeah yeah, well.

49:00.28
nathanpile
And never fell for me Yahtzee Also yeah, also not not good for me.

49:08.34
Kevin Shock
I'm sorry and unfortunately ah as much as you practice Yahtzee you're not going to get any better at it. Ah so Peter in the disciple in the apostles played a game of Yahtzee to determine who would.

49:10.73
nathanpile
Ah, yeah, that can get you better at it right? like? yeah, ah.

49:19.99
nathanpile
Yeah.

49:26.70
Kevin Shock
Whoever who ever scored the first Yahtzee he became the next thoughts. Ah, ah oh my gosh. Ok the Ex of the apostles. Sure Yeah, um.

49:26.10
nathanpile
Ah, who who got the first Yahtzee became the next apostle that'll be that'll be Nathan and Kevin's paraphrase of the of the book of or the acts of the apostles.

49:45.55
Kevin Shock
Okay, a good faith, a faithful decision to make is to look at some additional texts if if you don't you're no less of an apostle or ah or a child of god but it still could be a faithful decision. Psalm one is the first psalm.

49:54.60
nathanpile
Right.

50:01.63
Kevin Shock
And this a psalm in praise of God's instruction. Oh my God not by the number one? Yes, yeah, interesting biblical fact. Ah the psalms are actually ordered according to the the ah.

50:07.33
nathanpile
Ah, known known by the number one that it's the first song.

50:18.82
Kevin Shock
The cardinal number that they are assigned. But anyway, um, so psalm 1 is the first psalm and ah it is. It's it's a psalm in praise of god's instruction. The lord knows the way of the righteous and then a reading from first John which is the first letter that John wrote. Ah. Chapter 5 verses 9 through 13 life in the son of god and then John seventeen the Gospel according to John Verse chapter 17 verses 6 through 19 is Jesus' ' prayer for his disciples as he's about to depart from the world. So.

50:56.22
nathanpile
If you're not sure which one to read. You can always throw dice and seed that one of those 3, 1 2 or 3

50:58.50
Kevin Shock
Um.

51:03.44
Kevin Shock
Yes, yes, you can Yes, you can. Unfortunately, we do not have a reading from the book of numbers this week but that's that's okay, um oh my gosh.

51:15.91
Kevin Shock
This has been a an interesting exercise in reflecting on scripture and as always Nathan I appreciate it and um and I i.

51:21.61
nathanpile
And I think you've learned your lesson not to give one that Nathan would rant about.

51:27.37
Kevin Shock
Yeah, yeah, perhaps I don't know I we'll see if it happens again. Um so send us your reflections your rants your um your Yahtzee scores whatever you would like to share with us and and.

51:34.48
nathanpile
Ah, yeah, yeah.

51:40.85
nathanpile
Ah, somebody plays Yahtzee and sends us in a Yahtzee score that he's great and peace.

51:45.48
Kevin Shock
And we hope to end our faith with you again soon. Grace to you.