#78 Kyle Waldo - A Wrestling Odyssey: From Michigan State Champion to Influential Coach

Today, we bring you an inspiring recount of resilience and passion for wrestling from Kyle Waldo, a four-time Michigan State Champion and the current head coach of Grand Rapids Catholic Central. From his earliest memories of learning to hit a baseball to his journey of becoming one of the most storied wrestlers in Michigan high school history, Kyle's story stands as a testament to his resilience and love for the sport. We dive into the rigorous training, intense rivalries, and incredible success of Michigan Extreme wrestling club, while also touching upon the physical and emotional struggles faced by wrestlers transitioning to high school wrestling.

The conversation doesn't stop there. We also tap into Kyle's life beyond high school wrestling - his transition to a college athlete and then a coach. His insights into the pressures of college recruitment, the impact of coaching changes, and the challenges of transitioning from high school to college wrestling are valuable for any aspiring athlete. Notably, Kyle recounts his decision to return to his hometown to coach and his commitment to nurturing the next generation of wrestlers, emitting a sense of passion that's contagious.

Listen in for a conversation that's not just about wrestling, but also about the resilience, determination, and love for the sport that drive athletes like Kyle to overcome obstacles and reach new heights. Whether you're a die-hard wrestling fan or just interested in the compelling journey of a dedicated athlete, this episode has something for you. Don't miss out on this powerful, inspiring conversation - it's a testament to the human spirit and the power of perseverance. Trust us, you won't want to miss this!

Chapters

• 1:17 Kyle Waldo's Journey in Wrestling
• 15:39 Early Wrestling Training and Tournaments
• 20:25 Training and Rivalries in Wrestling Club
• 29:32 Weight Gain, Confidence, and Wrestling Success
• 33:48 Wrestling Matches and Overcoming Challenges
• 43:00 Team Unity and Overcoming Wrestling Challenges
• 46:57 Wrestling, Leadership, and Overcoming Insecurities
• 56:26 College Wrestling Recruiting and Transition
• 1:05:14 College Wrestling Coach and Program Stability
• 1:10:22 Transfer and Challenges in Collegiate Wrestling
• 1:19:48 From College Wrestling to Coaching
• 1:31:59 Coaching and High School Transfers
• 1:38:00 Interview With GRCC Head Coach

Transcript

Speaker 1: 1:18

JW lions. This was my first slow Geschmack.

Speaker 2: 3:14

And we're live. We are live. We are joined today with the one and only. I met you a while back and, dude, it was awesome to run India at that camp. It was fantastic. We are with four time Michigan State Champ. You're Central Michigan alum, you started at Nebraska but you have probably one of the most storied careers in Michigan high school wrestling history. We are joined by Kyle Waldo. Thank you very much for joining us. Head coach also Grand Rapids Catholic Central. Second year. You said right. Second year. Yeah, year two, all right, all right. Well, and we were just talking before, you've already produced what a state champ, right?

Speaker 3: 3:55

Yeah.

Speaker 2: 3:56

First year we had a state champ right off the gate.

Speaker 3: 3:59

Yeah, yeah, he was a one, all one, all one, 13 pound. Yeah, okay, state champions, so nice. Pretty tough right off the gate.

Speaker 2: 4:07

So I'm pretty proud of him. What was one of the weight classes that you wrestled at that you were state champion? Was it one 13?

Speaker 3: 4:13

One all six, or one all three, one all three, one 12 and then one 19. One 12. Okay.

Speaker 2: 4:18

Okay, yeah, just man you're, because I watched a couple of the videos, some of the interviews and stuff of you just back in the day and then like comparing you now is like man, you were tidy.

Speaker 3: 4:26

No, I was so small, you were a little guy, I could go through it but yeah, yeah. It's been the story of my life. Just, I was always like I'm the guy that's got to get us going, like usually back in the day before they drew weight classes. It was we just starting at one on three, which I know, which sometimes it sucked, but I just walk into it.

Speaker 2: 4:48

But what's so? Like I said, you know, we tell everybody we start from the beginning and we go to now, where you're at now. So let's talk about where you were born. What city were you born in?

Speaker 3: 4:59

Grand Rapids, Michigan.

Speaker 2: 5:01

Writing Okay, right where you're at, you're full circle, all right, okay. So now, now you're back where you came from, let's talk about the journey from, from the beginning, where. What kind of things do you remember? What was your first memory of like sport or any kind of thing that got you into athletics? What was the first thing you remember?

Speaker 3: 5:20

My dad playing softball. So, okay, the earliest memories I have or my dad bringing me to softball tournaments and I would sit with the wives Yep, remember just watching him play, but very intense, okay, very intense, like he was playing at a really high level, playing for state in the worlds and stuff, and those guys were very serious about it. And then you know, at the time growing up, my mom wasn't around, so it was just me and my dad Was your dad, okay.

Speaker 3: 5:51

Yeah, that was it, and I lived in my grandma's trailer for the most part with her, and then my dad was working a few jobs trying to trying to get us out of there, you know like trying to figure something out, right, but the earliest thing I have with sports, like me doing anything, was we were living with two of his buddies kind of on the northeast side of Grand Rapids. Yeah, I remember in the backyard my dad teaching me how to hit a baseball.

Speaker 2: 6:16

Oh, really, because you know he's a softball player and I was good at.

Speaker 3: 6:18

I could throw, I could hit, and I remember playing T-ball at John Ball Park Zoo. Yeah, so, and it just right away. My dad could tell like I'm super competitive.

Speaker 2: 6:28

Yeah, like the blues at all.

Speaker 3: 6:30

Yeah, and sure enough, my dad met my stepmom and I was like four probably, and she was around and I'm still living in the trailer and my dad was like hey, we're getting married. I'm like I don't know what that means, but you know, cool, yeah, you know that's awesome. I like her.

Speaker 2: 6:45

So we're, fine.

Speaker 3: 6:46

That's fine, we're gonna move into Granville and then first year of school, sure enough too small to play football. Yeah, and Granville, you had to be a certain weight and in first grade I was like 40 pounds, 41. Oh, wow, yeah.

Speaker 2: 7:03

I was very very small yeah.

Speaker 3: 7:05

But I did weigh the lowest weight class in wrestling. So when I brought this flyer home it was in my cubby. You know, bring your shoe, put your backpack, but that's all yeah, he's like hey, what about this wrestling thing? My dad knows nothing about wrestling, he's never wrestled, knows nothing about it.

Speaker 1: 7:21

He's like since you're, you can win a medal and I'm like really.

Speaker 3: 7:26

Yeah, you got to go to practice. You know they have a tournament. Granville hosted their own tournament, so it was all freestyle. There was no folk style. There was no such thing as folk style. Folk style was in Flint and we'll get to that.

Speaker 2: 7:40

We'll get to that. Yeah, that's interesting. We didn't know anything about it.

Speaker 3: 7:44

So we just freestyle. I remember just learning grab a wrist, open it up, double leg, drive him down. That's all I knew. We did it for like four practices straight and I remember thinking in my head just run your feet, just run your feet. I took second out of three, I think in the first tournament and I was it was over I got a medal around my neck, went to Chuck and cheese. Not even kidding, we went to Chuck and cheese, I had my medal around my neck, went to sleep with that and did the rest of his history Like. I don't remember a whole lot from that. I remember that Like that was like okay, but that's a good that's a catalyst, you know.

Speaker 2: 8:19

I mean that is right there Like the epitome of. I mean, liam was kind of the same way. I mean, the first tournament he went to he got his butt kicked in the first match. He was kind of close to the second match. The third match he won by a point and he was hooked. You know, he won that one match. It was just that feeling of winning, plus did it on your own, like a more result and he was just like I did that, I did that.

Speaker 2: 8:42

So, yeah, right, so that's that's. That's pretty key moment. So when you start to kind of your journey into wrestling, then what you're talking about only freestyle. How, how was it then around like middle school? Did you start wrestling for school in middle school? When did folk style pop in?

Speaker 3: 9:02

Well, I would say I don't really remember. I know it was like a couple years in.

Speaker 2: 9:08

So I think I was nine.

Speaker 3: 9:10

Well, we'll back it up a little bit. So wrestling was very much my dad and my thing. It wasn't just my thing, and I will always say that because he was so great to me. It just felt like this was our thing, like I went you win, I lose, I could definitely tell you lost to.

Speaker 2: 9:30

Right, yeah, you feel it.

Speaker 3: 9:31

Yeah, my dad was really good at just playing the social game and getting me where I needed to get to. Okay, and Ben Bennett, you know who that is? That sounds really yes. Yes, he's a head assistant at Central Michigan right now. Okay, Time all American three times state champ. Well, his dad and my dad talked and he's like hey, you ought to just come train with us in Rockford. And so that's right In the club practice.

Speaker 3: 9:53

Yeah, go train with Ben and Rockford. Well, we're like man, we got to find some competition on the other side of the state. Well, this is called folk style and MMWA runs it in Flint.

Speaker 3: 10:04

It's a drive, but we wake up early enough the way in are on site morning off. So if we leave at five, four, 35 am, yeah, you can make it their way in, wow. So we were just doing that and doing freestyle in the spring. So I didn't really I didn't really know the difference. All I knew was I could lock my hands in one and the other one. I really couldn't. I wrestled just like folks. I hit switches, standups like no kidding. I just wrestled folks out like holy cow my dad's too stupid to know like he didn't know.

Speaker 3: 10:34

He didn't know. God bless his heart. If you're listening to this dad, you just didn't know it's how do they, like you said, with the stuff that?

Speaker 2: 10:41

he had going on he played softball, he was an athletic dude, but like that sport, it's the same thing with me, like not Liam's to a point now where it doesn't matter if it's freestyle or folks out there beyond me Like right, it's, it's, you know about sports. But to know that much about it after a while you're just like all right, jesus, take the wheel.

Speaker 3: 10:57

I'm sure you're just trying to put him in the best position possible. That's it.

Speaker 2: 11:02

Yeah, and like my dad was a master at that, yeah, you try to surround yourself with the right people and talk to the right people and hopefully you make that right decision. And it sounds like he was a supportive guy, because it wasn't like he was questioning whether or not we should do this. Like it's. It feels like he was all in with you when you decided to be all in on this, you know, and went with you. You know it's it doesn't sound like it was easy, you know, like you guys probably had to figure out ways to make things happen, and we totally get that, but it just seems like he had. He saw your vision and was just trying to, you know, kind of follow up with you, and that's what we kind of focus on. A lot, too, is like the support system that you have not not having mom around, but dad was that guiding force of what you were doing.

Speaker 2: 11:44

So, so where did you? Where did you? It's just a unique situation really only being exposed to freestyle first, which is great, you know, but at the same point, though, too, now did you feel like you guys had to play catch up? You had some really great guys obviously learned from, but having only freestyle, do you feel like you had to play catch up when it came to wrestling school. You know school wrestling, or did you kind of have a handle on that by the time you got into it?

Speaker 3: 12:09

That's the thing, though. We didn't. We were not taught freestyle. We were taught folk style Okay, our coach and just wrestled freestyle tournaments, okay. So, like we do, the rules Hold. We knew a gut wrench, and I knew what leg length was and I knew how to defend it, but in our minds it was not any different.

Speaker 1: 12:27

Like oh, my God Okay.

Speaker 3: 12:28

Like okay, well, we. And then, obviously, when Dave Dean went and brought folks out of Flint, there was great when I entered middle school.

Speaker 1: 12:37

So okay, Okay.

Speaker 3: 12:38

Is when it finally came out. So we were just traveling but my dad met Logan, steve, his dad, and, okay, in Ohio, yeah, and that's how we got hooked up with the Taylor and Steve or Palmer. Yeah, guys, he went down to Jeff Jordan. In reality, man, in Michigan there wasn't anything really like my. Our coach was Ben's uncle, tom Bennett, and his dad, doug Bennett. Tom won a state championship in Indiana and wrestled for John Carroll.

Speaker 3: 13:08

Okay, so, like he was, he was in there, but very quickly we surpassed that and we needed something else. So three times a year we'd go to Jeff Jordan's camp to go wrestle with Taylor and Steve Eber. Yeah, and all the. It was just an insane camp. It was insane every single year. But then I would come back and just test myself and then go back to camp. You know, get a little better, go back, test myself. And then Eric Juergens and Young Guns oh yeah, they started in Michigan, an hour from my house, really. So when they came, everyone went there and that's when I think that's when everyone in our area just took off, just skyrocketed, just took off, and it's unreal. And then we kind of all came back together when they left Michigan and the rest of history, really so yeah, well, and that kind of.

Speaker 2: 13:56

It's kind of goes to say the same thing with, like Ben and Max, when those guys opened a basket in here, like with Scots and a skyrocket and ability, and knowing, like you, so you were already surrounded by some really great dudes your dad was making some, some good moves to get you around, some decent guys. You know what I'm saying. So, yeah, exactly, and whatever he was doing with with like his sports, with you know, softball, I mean the level he was playing at. Obviously he knows that there are angles that you got to do and make to be able to be the best Right. So he found the best, obviously, and you got involved with the best.

Speaker 2: 14:31

So what was what was training like when you were, when you started wrestling in Folk's Town, did you wrestle like freestyle tournaments? Did you? Did you guys go to because we talk a lot about, like in my area, where there wasn't a lot to go to, right, we didn't have, I think my brother he was seven years, seven years older than I was, and I remember those guys go to Iowa once every year and I think that was a freestyle tournament. It wasn't even a Folk style tournament and that was back in like 90, you know, like 90, 91. Where did you guys, did you guys wind up traveling a lot right away for any tournaments because he knew that you needed to get good competition, kind of thing, or what was that like for you?

Speaker 3: 15:09

We didn't really travel until I was in like sixth grade. Okay, okay, makes sense. I think I don't know, and and his, I think I'm sure in his mind too, it was kind of like we were. He was still navigating what we needed to do, I'm sure, but it took that long for me to like get good Okay.

Speaker 2: 15:26

Okay, it was a progression, yeah.

Speaker 3: 15:28

Oh, yeah, I hadn't won a state, like every year I was getting beat in the state. I hadn't won a state title yet, like, okay, you know, I had the same damn kid would beat me every single time, every single time, every, both sides. He'd be in everything Really. But in fifth grade I think that's when I met, really, really got connected with the Steelers, when I was like nine, okay, wow, and then I just took off, yeah, and after that they were like, hey, I think by talking with them, yeah, we blueprint for what we needed to do, okay, so that's when Tulsa came in, that's when kickoff came in, that's when Liberty Nationals came in. Okay, duel meet tournaments. And then I was old enough to be on the Michigan duel meet team, which there was one, there was one in the state of Michigan, john Reader, I mean everyone came, simon's all. Yeah, we had Justin Zerah, we had everyone, wow.

Speaker 3: 16:17

So in sixth grade I was old enough to be on that team. So we did middle school duels, yeah, all that stuff that kids do nowadays. Yeah, we did kickoff, classic Tulsa, russell Freestow, that was it Whole. And like started in sixth grade because my dad learned of these tournaments and all of a sudden it's like oh, so this is what we're supposed to be doing. Yeah, we'll try it. We'll try it. And then I did decent. We're like well, you got to keep coming back here. Yeah, it's like one and two, we're coming back.

Speaker 2: 16:45

Yeah, right, right.

Speaker 2: 16:46

The whole purpose is to see you know the next you gotta. Did you progress getting to the next one? So it's interesting to see. He, he instantly saw it. So your dad instantly saw the progress that you need to make and who you need to keep up with and so, talking about the Tulsa's and things like that, now, obviously you were. It sounded like right from the gecko you were.

Speaker 2: 17:04

Your dad had in mind of more of the quality than the quantity type factor where you're training. Your training seemed to be quality as well, where you had time to train. But then, okay, we're going to train for this. Did you find yourself like, because you were hooked up with stevers and and so many other names, did you find yourself training for a tournament like early kind of doing those types of I guess quadranium is a little, a little much, it's four years but getting ready for, like a Tulsa hey, we're going to prep for this. When did you start? Kind of cause we don't talk about that a lot, cause I don't know a lot about it. How to peak? Did you learn that from those guys when it came to training for, even as a young guy, when it came to training or getting ready for a Tulsa. What was? Did you guys throw any of that into the mix of training?

Speaker 3: 17:50

I'm sure it might have been more in depth than I realized, sure.

Speaker 2: 17:53

Sure Because.

Speaker 3: 17:54

I was young, but it seemed like we had a couple weeks between tournaments, all the time. Okay, Okay. That was. The thing is like I would go to cause my way in middle school, came into West Michigan and I remember going to the state finals. I wrestled like a minute and 20 seconds total the whole day Wow. And like I'd go into the freestyle estate, I would tap for everyone. In the first period it was just like this is pointless.

Speaker 3: 18:18

This is pointless but because nobody really had the opportunity to go do what we were doing. Sure, and like I'll say it, I'll say it right now, we were the front runners that started this whole damn thing. I know Metcalfe was at kickoff and like reader, so like we had seen those guys do it, but there was nobody going to Tulsa at the time when Ben Bennett and I went. I think there was only a couple other guys from Michigan.

Speaker 3: 18:42

No, kidding Totally not, but like we're and that we knew, of course, right, yeah, like that we knew of and it's obviously we didn't have internet on the cell phones and track wrestling back then, so it's like who we saw from Michigan, but it was like, I just feel like we were ahead of the game.

Speaker 3: 18:57

Like everyone was wrestling in state, but for dual meet teams. How the hell are they supposed to even get into this tournament? We're the only Michigan team there wrestling team Jordan and all these guys so like, if you're good, you're on our team and we're just blasting off.

Speaker 3: 19:13

And you guys are just all down there. So that's why I like way I got my freshman in high school. It wasn't a question about whether I was going to win four Like. Of course I'm going to. Like in my mind. I've been watching you guys wrestle. This is nothing Right, at least in my mind. And then you get there and it's a little different. It's a little different, right, it's a little different. The cockiness disappears very quickly, right?

Speaker 2: 19:36

Right, right.

Speaker 2: 19:37

So when you're, when you're, I just can't believe it's amazing that you guys were able to be able to just kind of take it from the beginning, like that, and and kind of run with it. Especially, again, it proves that having those D one level guys around to share those X, the expertise and the experiences that they had I mean because they were, they were dealing with world level guys than at that point though too, because that's where they were at, you know. So now, bringing that, we didn't, we were missing that for a long time in Wisconsin. I mean now we have all these guys coming back. You know, like you got Kaczynski or coach Nazar, he got you have, you know, ask it in these guys.

Speaker 2: 20:14

But there's a lot more. There's a lot more, even like the D three guys that are coming back and sharing that knowledge and making it such a better environment as far as wrestling and technique. When you guys started to explode like that, where were you? How, how you were? You were going to Tulsa you know the tournaments like that but what were you doing for training? So, because the that talent was so far spread, was it just because you guys had that group of guys that that you trained with, that came up with that, or were you finding yourself having to travel the train?

Speaker 3: 20:49

Um, well, this is where, early on, like when Ben and I were training together, yeah, this in size. So I guess, if we back it up a little bit before Tulsa, I would say the year after we went to Tulsa the first time around nine, ish, yeah, that gained a bunch of weight. So I'm going to puberty and I didn't hit puberty until I was 15. So it's like, yeah, what are we going to do? So Ben brought in a couple of guys, a couple guys into our room in rock in his basement, and we started a wrestling club Michigan extreme. Okay, okay, so that's where extreme came from, yeah. And then eventually we're like, well, hell, people are just wondering what we're doing because we're going to tournaments, into thumping dudes, right, and our guys are training with our thumping people. So people want to come and train. And then he started a club and we had by far the best wrestling club in the state of Michigan and one of the best in the country, for sure.

Speaker 2: 21:46

I remember hearing that name you know quite a bit just reiterated at tournaments and things like that. So it's interesting that you guys said that you really had to create your own thing. You guys had to make something to make you know whatever you wanted to keep, continue. So with that what's?

Speaker 3: 22:00

that the training itself was just insane. I guess what we want to talk about the actual training. So in general, we plan on being there. I know in my head it was two to three hours.

Speaker 2: 22:14

Okay, wow Okay.

Speaker 3: 22:17

We don't know where we're going to land in there and right in town times where the power was out, so they'd open all the doors. Guys would pull up their trucks, flash their high beams. Wow, we'd go like we're going to get it in no matter what.

Speaker 3: 22:29

Right, and the parents were just a bunch of psychopaths too. So like they're going to be there, you know, and they're all friends. They're all really good friends. That's awesome, though it was a ton, a ton of exercising, right, just getting our bodies ready to go, which is so smart because they knew that we were going and getting the technique that we needed in the summer. Right, most of us would travel. We'd go learn from the best Perler. The Jordan is like we don't learn. And then when we come back in the fall, it's like does he really want to mess with that, or does he just need to put us through a workout and make sure we get our reps in, get our live in? And then he said the conditioning Wow, and that's that's that. We would condition until everyone broke. And he said a lot of times we would just go and go and go and go until until the majority of the room was done, and sometimes it would take three hours, sometimes it'd take two hours. Wow, whatever we needed, but so different.

Speaker 2: 23:27

I was going to say that is a lot of the stories you hear.

Speaker 2: 23:31

You know it's not. It was that one person or he had a partner that was kind of grand. You had like a whole group and then turned it into a club of guys that were just wanting to grind the piss out of each other. So, knowing what you guys have put yourselves through, what were you guys are dealing with injuries. I mean things like that just grinding that much, you guys weren't really coming up. You're just strengthening yourself so much just by just the back. There was injuries, but sure, sure.

Speaker 3: 23:57

If you don't have to go to the hospital, you better get your shoes on, billy. Wow, yeah, you understand. I remember my head going through drywall one time I wrestled a kid who had a E-wall. Yeah, who was the tallest in the national champ? He was really good yeah. I remember hitting the double I got him and he just took my head right through the drywall and I pulled my head out and I was crying. I mean, when I walked outside and goes you done? Yeah, I'm like no, I just went right back inside.

Speaker 1: 24:26

Like holy shit.

Speaker 3: 24:28

That was the expectation, though Like oh you think you're tougher than me, yeah. You see Okay.

Speaker 2: 24:34

Well, well adjusted room. I mean obviously you guys are willing to take it. I mean you guys are willing to battle with and for each other. It sounds like we love each other too.

Speaker 3: 24:42

That's huge, right, yeah.

Speaker 2: 24:45

So it sounds like you guys had a pretty tight group where in that. It's funny you mentioned that, because it's kind of how my brother's group was. I was again. My wrestling days weren't as long as his and as good as his, so those guys actually were able to form that type of bond. And watching those guys go to one of those tournaments together you know local and things like that in the off season was really cool. And seeing that you guys had that, it was just another level of just pounding the pace each other and it made you better and it made you tighter.

Speaker 3: 25:14

Super fun too, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 2: 25:17

So so, when you guys, when you guys would go to, would you guys then as that, as like a club you would go to these tournaments, dual tournaments or whatnot, what were you guys kind of? You know we're what was your rival? What was your rival going to some of these tournaments that you guys would go to? Because I would imagine there were only so many different types of clubs that were out there, right, that were kind of yeah, harvey twisters. Oh yeah, there you go Out of Illinois, right?

Speaker 3: 25:42

For me, BJ Furtrell, you know who that is?

Speaker 2: 25:43

Yep, sure do, yeah. So me and BJ.

Speaker 3: 25:44

I got a story for you. So it's not a good ending for me. But one year I just put in a ton of time. I think I was like 12. I put in so much time and I just seven, three, yeah, so I was 12. I just really hit a different level. I thought that summer so kickoff. Classic Menedoy said if I one kickoff and you win.

Speaker 1: 26:06

Tulsa.

Speaker 3: 26:07

I'll take it arena. I was like I really want to go to Reno this year. Really bad. Cause they had the giant globe to hold at the time.

Speaker 3: 26:13

I wonder what's so bad, all right. Well, logan, steve was going on the weight class below me. Yeah, taylor is the weight class above me and Palmer is a couple of weight classes above us. Yeah, like this is my year. Like no one's standing in my way, I fit in perfect. Like right at 67 pounds. Like I fit in perfect, so all right. So I'm wrestling BJ Futrell in the semis at kickoff classic. I'm whooping them. I think I was up five to one and with like 30 seconds left and what else? Oh no, I think I just making me.

Speaker 3: 26:49

I'm blushing so in my mind in my mind for some reason. I'm like I'm about to turn it up on this dude. I caught him with 30 seconds left. I caught him and he turned around and he starts hitting the oddly shuffle on me. I'm not, I'm not making this up at all. He went with his feet and I just dove in on a double egg, got in, he falls to his butt and I'm looking over. Yeah, I'm looking at the scoreboard and I see the scoreboard and say nine, eight. And I look down and I see Taylor and Steve are like super pumped for me because I broke through. You know, I've been training for so long. He crotch, lifts me and then the, on the way through, shifts and catches me in a cradle with four seconds left. Oh no, so I'm up my three right.

Speaker 3: 27:35

Yeah, Two takedown and right up the buzzer. He got the seconds wipe for two near fall and beat me. No, Six, five, I was like. And then I look over at the scoreboard again and I see everyone, everyone behind the scoreboard, like this, like that. I was like, oh man, like I look over at my dad, my dad's, like are you? He goes, he mouth, he goes. Are you kidding?

Speaker 2: 27:58

me.

Speaker 3: 27:58

And I'm like I don't know, dude, I don't know.

Speaker 1: 28:01

He's like well, you got to wrestle.

Speaker 3: 28:03

I had to turn around and wrestle. I took third, but yeah man, that was my shot. Then he beat the piss out of me at Tulsa in January. We also like second round, somehow, oh. I don't know how I got, didn't even get seated and I had to wrestle him. And then I turned around and wrestled, I think, lester, who went up going to Oklahoma.

Speaker 2: 28:21

Yeah.

Speaker 3: 28:22

And he just like what are you supposed to do, man? I thought I was going to beat him.

Speaker 2: 28:27

It's so close, so close.

Speaker 3: 28:29

BJ will live rent free in my head for the rest of my life, though.

Speaker 2: 28:33

We go. Bj yeah, thanks, dude, he's a good dude. Yeah, yeah, no, he's a good guy. So we, I mean that dude, that's a, that's a tail and a half of a match right there. So was that? That was you said seventh grade, eighth grade, let's start talking about kind of climbing into high school a little bit. What were you weighing in eighth grade?

Speaker 3: 28:55

Um 80 pounds. It depends on when. So in the seventh grade, my first year in seventh grade, I weighed 68 pounds, seven, 67. Holy. And then in eighth grade I would have been in eighth grade but the MHSA told me, because we ran it through them, that if my dad tries to hold me back in eighth grade they might take a year of my eligibility. But my dad's like how can you do that?

Speaker 3: 29:20

Like I wasn't and I wasn't, but my dad was like he's struggling socially, Like cause he's small, blah blah blah, he's holding him back.

Speaker 3: 29:27

We've been training way too much time. So they held me back and it wasn't until eighth grade. The big start of eighth grade is when I was like 78 pounds, wow. And then I was about 85 by the end of the school year. I was not. And then I hit. And then I hit Fibrity Like more high school Okay. And then I was like I'll say June. And then I was one-on-one-ish Okay, okay, my freshman year. And then after a workout I'd be like 98, but I was right in there.

Speaker 1: 29:56

Wow.

Speaker 3: 29:57

But we knew that going in. And I remember my coaches Craig Shootage was my coach, yeah, and I remember just thinking like nobody can keep up with me, like I go to these camps and Taylor and Steve were already in high school, cause they were a little bit ahead of me and they're having so much success and I was right with them. So I'm like I think if I just wrestle hard, like I have something to prove, yeah, I'm not going to go out there and expect to win, cause I thought I was the man. But then I'm like man, I'm really small, like I think I went 15-1.

Speaker 2: 30:30

Yeah, my freshman year. You did the numbers Right yeah.

Speaker 3: 30:33

Yeah, I know what the deal was Like. I was going to improve. I'm a bad dude Right Like you're not going to do anything about it and it's, which is weird, but in my mind I wasn't very confident.

Speaker 2: 30:43

Did you have? Did you have? Did you have experience Experience against high school guys before you got into high school?

Speaker 3: 30:48

No.

Speaker 2: 30:49

You guys didn't do that, wrestle up a, you know, just a grade or something like that.

Speaker 3: 30:53

So I mean, how am I going to wrestle up Cause?

Speaker 1: 30:57

I'm one of three in the weight class.

Speaker 3: 30:59

right, very true. So it was actually not in my best interest to go and wrestle some of these guys. When I'm so small, it's so small Makes sense, and at the time I was kind of hiding like I didn't wrestle any tournaments in Michigan at all for like a well over a year. Oh, middle school duals, tall says we're just training, just in the dungeon, just getting ready, getting ready for high school. And yeah, they won't be ready when it's time. It's kind of what we thought.

Speaker 2: 31:28

So let's talk about your first match then in high school. What was, what did that feel like I mean going jumping that level. Was that a different feel of just grabbing onto a guy and how he grabbed you, and what was that experience for you that first time?

Speaker 3: 31:42

Yeah, so there's a lot. There was a lot of emotion there. My dad had kidney stones that morning and he had to get an ambulance. He ran, obviously he ran outside to the ambulance, oh wow, cause he was passing a kidney stone. So, like my dad, wasn't there, my first high school match and this kid sucked Like I knew it. I walked out there and I'm thinking this shouldn't be bad.

Speaker 3: 32:06

Yeah, yeah, yeah, but all of a sudden this is what I'm saying. I changed when high school wrestling started and I noticed it immediately because I went out there and I'm like I don't have any confidence.

Speaker 1: 32:19

Yeah, yeah, but I told my dad that I was like I don't, I don't.

Speaker 3: 32:23

I was like I just don't know. I like I'm scared, yeah, so I would go out there and wrestle, and I pinned the kid, I think I walked off and I went. Well, I'm not the man, Like that kid was stronger than me and he was fast, and like I'm way faster than him, obviously, but that worried me that that kid sucks that bad, okay, and I struggled a little bit but that immediately I was like okay, I've got to go a hundred mile an hour, like I have to go really hard. And then after the first tournament I was like man, like I've got to step it up. So your perception?

Speaker 2: 32:54

right away was great. I mean, you knew just as far as that, just that first guy or even, yeah, I pinned them. But that was weird, that didn't feel right. Yeah, so you got, you got a little anxious, I mean. So where, where did you kind of turn? Did you talk to your dad? Was it kind of coaches that you kind of reached out to? What kind of things were you going through Just inside? You dealt with it and you told yourself, I got to go a hundred miles an hour. I mean, you just dealt with it on your own.

Speaker 3: 33:19

Yeah, I'm, I'm an only child too. Okay, so okay. And like, obviously, you heard some of my story growing up. Yeah, I never had help getting through things. Okay, like when I'm sick, do you think someone is there to like Make me feel better growing up? No, dude. Like, right, my dad's got shit to deal with you. Better, deal with your shit too. Like so in high school, when I felt like that, like this is my dad and my thing, but I wanted it so bad, right, right, so, so bad. I was so blessed.

Speaker 3: 33:49

So what I did was go home and watch my video Immediately. What did I do, right? First of all, what did I do right? Yep, like we're, and how did I get to those positions? And what else is possible from that too? Okay, then I would go back and rewatch it and go. I didn't like that, didn't like that, but I'm gonna give myself credit first, because I knew where my head was at. Okay, so I'm like don't beat yourself up when you watch this, let's just see what you did. Good, yeah, I feel good, and then I go back and watch you back, all right, well, I can work on that.

Speaker 2: 34:19

Yeah, you're just doing the math. You weren't putting any motion obsessively though. Yeah, you know like dude, look where it got.

Speaker 3: 34:26

Yeah, I mean yeah that's why I was never the strongest guy ever. But I guarantee you I know myself better than you didn't know yourself. I know myself really well. I know where I'm really good and I know where I'm not.

Speaker 2: 34:40

And I'm going to get there and just kind of listening to how you you know you treated things right away. I mean, if you're able to dig down, yeah for sure You're gonna definitely have some stories to talk to yourself about and be like, hey, you know you and I need to do this, so we need to get it done. You know this is it? So that that's awesome. That's especially from such a young age to be able to have that. And I get, you know, I get the having to deal with, you know, only having one parent and then, plus, you know, it's not that you're, it doesn't sound like you know, your dad is kind of, you know, gruff, but he was telling you is making, making you understand you need to do this, like you know you're gonna have this right.

Speaker 2: 35:16

You're gonna have to someday be able to deal with this to be able to make it out. So I think it's it just shows the resilience you know, number one, that you had to be able to kind of deal with things on your own. But also your dad was was smart enough to know that, hey, this is gonna toughen him up. I, you know I've gotten no other choice but to do it. You know this way with him and it works. It's just like carry Cole out with his dad. May not have worked with another kid, but guess what? I worked with him. I wouldn't want to be right exactly.

Speaker 1: 35:41

I wouldn't want to be the other way.

Speaker 2: 35:42

But I wouldn't anybody else to go through a kind of thing, right?

Speaker 3: 35:45

Yeah, so I can't imagine my dad doing anything different.

Speaker 2: 35:49

Yeah, yeah and and we and we love those guys for it. Right, that's, that's the whole deal is kind of looking back. I mean, what 20 hindsight is 2020,? Right, you can always predict things perfectly once you get past them, but the the, the Things that you went through in life built a character. You know inside you that. That said, you need to keep fighting and keep battling through things. When you got Into some of these tight where I mean where some of these championship matches that you had at state, like you're like holy, holy shit, I almost I could have lost that right there. I didn't go back and watch every single one of them. So where did you have any kind of state matches where you really had to kind of dig in and like hope. I didn't realize this guy was gonna be like this um, I Would say I had two matches that okay okay, two, and I just did a catalog of every match in my head my.

Speaker 3: 36:41

Barely one in the state finals, but I had. I was very, very sick, okay and okay. Rest of that match a hundred times. I'm gonna tech-volume me, right, yeah, so it was crap. But my junior year Sorry, my junior year I bought from 103 to 112 Mm-hmm, spent all summer lifting and trying to get bigger and get ready for it. But the year before the kid that made the state finals he's the one 112 again. Okay, he's a big, strong, hairy dude like yeah, well, it weigh in his puberty. I'm kind of on the front of it, yep, and I didn't really put on the size that I needed to. I was like 118, okay, okay. But again that summer, though, I spent a lot of time in Ohio, just a ton of time down there training.

Speaker 3: 37:27

Yeah ready to go and, sure enough, I went to Denzi duals. We didn't. Like I think and I'll be honest like I think I was scared at some level. Okay, to Test myself, like at Fargo, because I have some freestyle in so long. And I figure it in my own head, like if I just won four state titles, like why would you not recruit me? Like I didn't understand that Michigan, I was just pigeonholing myself into doing this one thing, yeah, and I didn't get out. But anyways, as we're going, I Figured there's one kid I'm at the Russell, his name was Justin Fleson. So in the quarter finals, somehow, somehow he loses at regionals and I know that that regional, the second place guy, is gonna get put on my side. Okay, and I beat my teammate one to zero at districts in triple overtime, holy cow. I beat him one to zero at regionals and I that set out the whole year with a knee injury. So I didn't, I didn't start wrestling until the conference tournament week, oh, okay.

Speaker 3: 38:34

So I had eight matches.

Speaker 2: 38:35

Yeah, I went into districts right way out of shape.

Speaker 3: 38:38

Yeah, but this one kid I just knew and I saw I walked and get online. He took second. Oh my god, like how did you lose? Like of course, man. Like yeah.

Speaker 3: 38:48

I was on my side and we had a war and I beat him seven to five. Wow, wait, in the last 30 seconds I hit him in a sweep single and took him down and wrote him out and beat him and we were tied up. So it was a good match. And then I see, in your year, in the state finals I wrestled the kid named Grant Pisa from Brighton. Okay, that was a war he was in on my legs like four times nice, twice off a scramble, I think oh wow man, it was a war.

Speaker 3: 39:15

I don't know what you know too, though yeah, the rest of them were just.

Speaker 2: 39:19

I Don't know, I don't really remember so, talking about the record, like it was 167 and five right, so the, the five losses that you had, you had. You said you got one year freshman year. Yeah, what? What loss was that? Was that an in-state loss?

Speaker 3: 39:35

so that loss was in the team state quarterfinals to Davidson. Oh Okay, like Roy Halls talked about this on Michigan Grappler podcast, this is a great dual meet win of all time, but yeah they the, because there was two way ins at state.

Speaker 3: 39:51

So we I was in the semis we lost sorry. We won our final match and then you had to weigh in and wrestle again. The next day. They dropped down like eight guys in their team of one weight class. Out of nowhere they went to Ohio and made scratch weight and we didn't know about it, so we didn't know. So all of a sudden I'm looking over at this kid that I used to go to war with in elementary school and he looks sickly and I'm like.

Speaker 1: 40:16

He must be cutting some weight.

Speaker 3: 40:18

I'm like what the hell and we're? I was like, am I in line for 103? I'm like looking up and sure enough, he gets in line right in front of me. And I look at Roy Hall and Roy Hall looks at me and I'm like, holy shit. I was like they're dropping everyone down. And I'm looking at my other teammates and they're all looking at each other and like we lost the duel Right there.

Speaker 3: 40:37

It was a wow right there, no kidding and I went out and we were doing really good and then I got beat 13 to zero, just got. He threw the legs in on me and just beating me over, yeah over and over. Oh, they had to pretty much peel me off the mat after that. One Ouch, and then a bunch of our guys lost that shouldn't have lost all cuz.

Speaker 2: 40:58

That's all because that weight shift.

Speaker 3: 41:01

And one of me at least. It messed with me because I knew him. I grew up wrestling on teams of them, right, right, my boy. Yeah, I knew that in the practice room it was always really close and I didn't know how good he was on top.

Speaker 2: 41:18

So what was your sophomore year? Did you have any losses?

Speaker 3: 41:21

your sophomore year I had one okay, I want to Clark, jamie Clark, and say that's Okay, you just beat David Taylor a week before that. So yeah. I think he beat Steve Taylor and me that season.

Speaker 2: 41:35

I'm pretty sure my god.

Speaker 3: 41:37

I think so. I don't know if you beat Logan or not. I'm not sure, actually I know he beat David right before that, but he checked.

Speaker 2: 41:42

Follow me in the second period, I think so you're putting the string of wins together and so a couple of pretty decent seasons. Now you get into your junior year, are you starting to get news from colleges, things like that starting to kind of float in really?

Speaker 1: 41:57

No radio silence.

Speaker 2: 41:59

No, nothing yours. You're starting your end of your sophomore year.

Speaker 3: 42:03

Okay, okay, because my grades weren't amazing my sophomore year I cut from an obscene amount of weight to get to 103, and I'm not making excuses for myself, but sure, yeah, I Just didn't take care of business, it's part of your story. Right, I went from super high freshman year to low and my GPA set somewhere in the middle. Okay, and at the time too, and I got hurt my junior year I didn't wrestle like at all Okay. Okay, that's like I barely was there, so it's like.

Speaker 2: 42:36

Yeah.

Speaker 3: 42:37

I wasn't the greatest pro and I hadn't wrestled at any national tournaments really, so it's in the state finals and went to camps and train all summer. So, like my stuff, like I didn't see all these things until sure after my junior year. Yeah, yeah, and then I looked back on it and I'm going oh, we figured it out, so I'm at the fargo to the side.

Speaker 3: 42:54

Yep, I don't know where. I think I decided two weeks before the tournament or three weeks before the tournament I was gonna go. I will go. Six, seven Went like I went, 11 and one at busy Dules wrestled really well. Like we went out to junior Dules I did really well. And then I started getting recruited. In my grades I got a 29 on my ACT.

Speaker 2: 43:15

Okay, okay, yeah okay, I didn't do very well in my ACT.

Speaker 3: 43:18

Yeah, so like things started coming together. But it wasn't until right before my senior year that we realized what we needed to be doing to like prove.

Speaker 2: 43:26

So your junior year was that. That year was like you had eight matches before you came in and we're able to do anything.

Speaker 3: 43:32

Yeah, I think I was 16, or I think I was 26, and oh what it was all of a sudden done and okay, lost in the state finals for a team that you're to. So okay, okay.

Speaker 2: 43:43

So not not a lot talk of your, your junior. So I mean, still sounds like it was Successful. I mean, as far as that, you, the ending team team, stayed two years in a row, right?

Speaker 3: 43:53

No, we won at my sophomore year.

Speaker 2: 43:56

Okay, that's right.

Speaker 3: 43:56

Yeah, oh, seven, I think it was my senior year, which was Incredible yeah, yeah 2029 that you're.

Speaker 2: 44:03

So, let's let's talk, let's talk about your, your senior year right now. So your, you guys come off of, you, come off of a State run didn't happen. Your senior year coming in, what were your aspirations of? I mean, obviously you've got four in your sights, right, so you're trying to win four state titles. Oh, what's what's in the the front of your mind when you start the season out? Besides, I mean your team, you guys are. You guys have to, you know, build something together again. See if you can get a state championship as a team. Where are you guys in the room? Do you guys? Are you all healthy, or is just someone else hurt? That's coming up. I don't. How was the team looking right away?

Speaker 3: 44:40

We're good.

Speaker 2: 44:41

I mean.

Speaker 3: 44:42

Unbelievable, yeah, I think One of the best teams going into my senior year. Yeah, it's a really not our best team. Yeah, like we had a lot of problems Internally. Okay, my junior year, sure, I was at the same weight class as one of the fab five freshman that came up like before us and they were sophomores. Now I was a junior and I'm in one of the weight classes and we were just yeah, but yeah, we just weren't, we didn't like each other.

Speaker 3: 45:12

And Ben Bennett was our senior captain and him and the other one of the sophomores would go to war all the time. He was really good and they would fight and stuff. It just was not. We didn't like each other like that. So the only thing I could think of my senior year I don't even care about the fourth state title would mean nothing to me if we don't win one.

Speaker 2: 45:33

Okay, okay, it's embarrassing.

Speaker 3: 45:35

Yeah, we should have won. This should be. I should be going for my eighth, seventh and eighth state titles right now. Yeah, so my only goal is I went out and printed some stickers because they didn't put logos on headgear.

Speaker 3: 45:44

So I got some stickers made and I went and met everyone in the parking lot from the school before school started. It was like, listen, let me lead us this year. Yeah, it's not fight. And we just came together and that was the only thing I could think of was just trying to be friends with these guys. Yeah, be it, I'm not gonna. It's not gonna do me to get a train with the guy that doesn't like me either. Right, we're not buddies and we're not in this together. Right, you know, if you guys got your own, like and I'm on an island right now, like that's not good for me.

Speaker 2: 46:15

Especially for the next four months, you know yeah, we're dealing with a season coming up, for sure, yeah.

Speaker 2: 46:20

So, where did, where did you guys? I mean so what? Let's talk about that a little bit. We, we kind of dive into some with some of these guys like team building, what were you? What did you? What came up in your head to help build, like, where you guys, you know, you see some guys doing like spaghetti dinners, things like that, where you guys sleeping over, like you doing, yeah, go into reaching out, maybe hitting a camp together or something like that, or doing whatever you can during the season. Was it just little things like that, just because I mean, we're all from the Midwest right, who doesn't have a crockpot in their house where you have a bunch of guys? Come over, maybe you know, watch some old wrestling movies or something like that. But what was that the kind of thing you guys were doing?

Speaker 3: 46:54

You just hung out easily at one of the kids houses, yeah, like a lot. The parents were all really tight too, okay, so that's awesome group was now juniors, yeah, and they all lived in some nicer houses. So I would just I could drive and I lived in grandville, which was 40 ish, 35, 40 minutes away, in the wintertime about 40, 45, yeah, so a lot of times like I don't want to go home After practice and I have club that night too, so school Practice and then club, oh, can I just come over and stay the night? Like yeah, right, you know, you have some clothes I can borrow. Like, right, you know, right. So that's like that's how I started. Floyd Mayweather was fighting back then. Yeah, so their parents love hosting the boxing fight, so all the parents would come and then we'd all go downstairs and they'd cook food and awesome every Saturday after a tournament, we'd always meet up at one of the parents houses.

Speaker 3: 47:42

We'd all hang out with each other after the tournament. Yeah, until whenever we wanted to. If we wanted to all stay there, we all would, and that's all that's really cool with it.

Speaker 2: 47:50

Well, it sounds like you went to any length you could, you know, to make sure that you guys made something happen.

Speaker 1: 47:55

did it together, yeah and we loved each other.

Speaker 3: 47:58

Yeah, yeah, putting a weird situation and there was a lot of after JJ Johnson and Jeff shoot it left. There's your year. Yep, there's a big hole in leadership. Oh sure, they kept everyone in line and like we looked up to them so much and we looked up to Ben too, when we loved Ben. Yeah, a different style of leadership. We needed this kind of leader. Ben was lead by example. The other guys were more vocal. Is this little different, so sure?

Speaker 2: 48:27

Yeah, yeah, totally, and in certain guys learn certain ways too. I mean there's guys that'll feed off of, of you know what, one thing that you do, and then another thing they don't. So it's it's interesting, that's that's. It's great to see that you guys were able to, you know, know that let's just, if there's any reason why we don't, it's only because of us, right? So you guys pulled together and did a great job on that. I don't know why my camera is zooming way out like that, but it is so. So, with.

Speaker 2: 48:54

With that being said, the, the senior year you had, was, uh, pretty, pretty well documented. I mean you, I watched I don't know how many of the um, the interviews that you had, and a couple of the, the clips that I got to see that. I mean Michigan was all over you. So let's talk about your individual side of it, since you are, you know, because the team has a lot to do with that. So when you're, when you're deciding to, you know you're making four year run. What were some of the tougher matches on the way there? Did you have any tough matches on the way there? Yeah, I lost. You're so pretty dominant man, you know, I, I was good.

Speaker 2: 49:32

Yeah right, I didn't think so, okay, okay.

Speaker 3: 49:36

Like deep down, deep down. I played a lot of weird mental games with myself where there's a lot of doubt, but that's pretty deeply deep seated thing from like growing up and living, I'm sure, like I'm not afraid to say it like I've been to sports, therapists and stuff before, but like growing up in the environment I grew up in, yeah, and still a lot of insecurity. Okay, so that I bought I think that was a catalyst for how I would perform on the map because that security would fire me up and I'm like I'm not going to let that happen, like I'm going to go out and perform.

Speaker 1: 50:12

So I'd like to walk myself in circles.

Speaker 3: 50:14

It was weird as hell, like I would look at the clock. I'd wrestle the kid. That was five and 25 one time, but he looked strong.

Speaker 2: 50:20

Yeah.

Speaker 3: 50:21

And in my head I thought there was a chance he was going to beat me my senior year. Like I was. Like man, this might be the kid.

Speaker 2: 50:28

Totally put your hand, that you put yourself yeah.

Speaker 3: 50:30

And then all of a sudden I start walking out there and I would just get so fired up that when I would step on the line it was just go, go, go, go, go. Like I would just run this kid over as quick as I can. He was wild man. But I didn't figure that out until college.

Speaker 2: 50:43

But yeah, Well, and so that again it speaks volumes to what the kids have access to now for coaches right at the ages that they have with the guys like you that are coming back to the high schools and coaching. You guys bring that level of things that you know they're going through that a lot. Like you said, your dad didn't wrestle. But there's a lot of kids that are out here their dad doesn't wrestle. They don't know that anxiety that happens when you're just out there by yourself and you're like, oh man, I'm and especially as dominant as you are you already are playing probably through your head like I've got to do this, I have to perform this way, you know, minus the social media stuff and things like that, you're doing it.

Speaker 2: 51:19

You're kind of telling yourself I can, you know I can, I can identify with that. It's just you. You've built this persona for yourself and not even everybody else may around you. Baby, you know telling you this. But in your head you're like I've got to do this. If I don't do this, who knows what's going to happen? I don't know if you know if it's a social fear getting made fun of or whatever it is, but I've got to perform, you know so so you're, you're kind of putting yourself up in a position to where, I mean, the stress factor happens where you almost want to quit. Did you ever have that? Did you ever get to a point where you're like I want to hang it up? I don't think I can do this anymore. It's too much.

Speaker 3: 51:58

Yeah, like all the time not. I would say not once I got in high school. Okay, you know like.

Speaker 3: 52:04

I did this twice my senior year and like I lost in the same kind of lost in my sophomore year and stuff like that. But yeah, growing up there was so many moments where I was like man, this sucks dude. Like yeah, school is tough, school is tough already as it is like socially at school I'm not the guy right, like I'm a really, really tiny, tiny kid and we don't have any money, like we were at the rope.

Speaker 3: 52:31

So I'm at this nice Grandville school and like we're in the same paradigm genes, I wore the last three weeks because, you know and like these kids are as I, there was a lot going on up there, so it's like I don't know. I was like man. I'd rather not wrestle like this sucks.

Speaker 3: 52:46

But I think the wanting to quit would happen when I'd have a bad practice, like I don't want to do this anymore, or all of a sudden we'd be at a practice for three hours. I'd get home it's 9, 15 and then I eat some crappy meal and I'm like man, this sucks. Man, like yeah, I could have got home at 3, 30 and then watching cartoons like I missed all my shows.

Speaker 3: 53:09

I yeah, I missed all my shows today and like, but my dad always told me, like this is it for you, like do you want to play college athletics? And that was it for me. Like I was an athlete, like I thought I was good, I thought I was gonna play college football at one point, like damn, that kind of yeah, you know all right. But when I was like listen, well, he told me you're not gonna be big enough football, yeah, you're not a fast enough runner to be small and play baseball. He was like you're definitely not gonna do some other sport that you don't even play regularly, so you should wrestle. This is it?

Speaker 2: 53:46

this is it for you. He didn't throw it softball. Like I'm surprised he didn't say you should do softball, because I mean I should be playing baseball.

Speaker 3: 53:53

But yeah, yeah, yeah, I got hit with a baseball in seventh grade, like right in my cat, and I did like a flip, like it literally made me do a flip. I could walk and my dad goes well, just can't go to camp this weekend. And I was like, oh yeah, that sucks in my head. I'm like this is great. And then he was like guess, we're not playing baseball anymore and I was like what he's like.

Speaker 3: 54:16

Yeah, he goes. We can't be missing wrestling because you're playing some other sport and getting hurt like oh, yeah, yeah, okay but I think it's different because I probably I get it.

Speaker 3: 54:28

Man, like, yeah, I'm 68 pounds. Yeah, what the fuck are you doing? Playing baseball or football? Like, what are you doing? Like you're really, really, really good at this? Yeah, if you want to be good at athletics, like this is the safe thing. I got hurt doing everything else. Do this. Yeah, I just got hurt, like playing football. I get hurt playing baseball, like you know it's.

Speaker 2: 54:50

It's interesting you mentioned that because it maxed um Sunquests from up in up.

Speaker 2: 54:55

Yeah from up yeah, he, he was playing football forever and he I was just talking to his dad the other day and he brought up the fact that you know, he was getting hurt a lot in football and he missed wrestling and we hadn't seen him in the wrestling room for a while because he messed his ankle up and there's something else. You know, you got hurt in football but then he was back right and that kind of talked to his dad and he just said, yeah, he's like he's just sick of being hurt, sick of being hurt. So he's he. We said you got to pick one thing and do the one thing. I mean, we grew up like I was just we just I just did an interview with um, uh, who was they talking to the other day just said that you know, we played five sports.

Speaker 2: 55:33

You know, when we were kids I did baseball, golf, tennis, wrestling, soccer. Soccer was my gig. But you know, it was just one of those things where you, your dad, was starting to see you and at that point that you, if you want to be good at it and it's something that you like doing, you have to just do this, because otherwise you're going to struggle, you're going to be upset not being able to do well, so that that's pretty cool that again you still had a solid, you know platform of a dude to be able to go off with me. So you know you know to to do something with. So congratulations to him on that, because it's not easy to do it on your own.

Speaker 1: 56:08

Yeah right, I hope that.

Speaker 3: 56:11

Uh, I hope that I can handle my child's life the way he handled mine. Yeah.

Speaker 2: 56:18

I guess that makes sense yeah, makes me a little bit emotional because yeah yeah, it's.

Speaker 2: 56:23

I mean hindsight, so it's like we just said, hindsight, so it's 2020. But when you look at the grand scheme of things, they did what they had to and what they could in time, you know, and it was all for the better, really. So you're in your senior year now. You you're making a little bit of noise coming up to state. Is this when you start hearing from colleges a little bit more now, as is the end of your senior year, starts showing up.

Speaker 3: 56:45

So and I would say right before Fargo I started talking to Nebraska yeah not talking to them, but, like, there was this rule where, like I could call them, yeah, like I was, just I forget what the rule was but they couldn't be doing all the contacting.

Speaker 3: 57:03

Yeah within boundaries. I reached out to them, but they still. I hadn't really seen me wrestle. Yeah, after Fargo, going into my senior year, they came up to me was like we're going to be at your house next week. So Mark Manning flew in a plane to my house in September and showed up just to take me out to dinner, made me an offer and then flew back to Lincoln.

Speaker 3: 57:25

Wow, so it was pretty special and the offer actually wasn't what I needed, because I didn't know, I didn't know, we don't know. Right like right, my dad's never been to college no one in my entire family has been to college.

Speaker 3: 57:40

Like, yeah, so we didn't know that there was only 9.9 scholarships for a division one wrestling, sure, sure, we figured out, we figured. Man, I'm about to get taken care of. Well, he hands me the envelope and I remember looking, opening it up, going 50%, like what I like that my dad and my dad was like what a waste of time, like in my head. And then, like Mark Manning finally explained to us I think he saw our reaction.

Speaker 1: 58:07

He was like uh, oh, yeah, I know other guys just committed.

Speaker 3: 58:11

I know they were going after them so I know their number of prospects that they could get to go to that school. Yeah, dwindling. Steve were committed, taylor committed. Yeah, these guys are all gone. Yeah, I'm like all right, well, let me, I'm gonna sit on it. And he was like not the answer out, think he was looking for, got on the plane, flew back. He calls me at five o'clock in the morning the next day. This is school day. I'm like woke up, I answer the phone. He's like Kyle. I said I'm thinking maybe we could add books and fees to your thing and I was like you know what? That like kind of put it over the point that I needed sure financial stuff and I was like we'll do it. So it's like mid-september and I had been out there three times already. I'd met Jordan Burrows when I was out there. Uh, paul Donahoe was my host when I went there one day.

Speaker 3: 58:59

Oh, okay and the team in Lincoln, nebraska, was so awesome like I just to this day I love that place and it felt like home. Yeah, when I went to Michigan, I didn't really feel like that Michigan State didn't feel like that. Yeah, eastern Michigan was actually incredible. Like I almost went to Bullyard who's at Michigan now is there, yeah, and like I almost went there, I almost went there it was that close, but I committed this. I committed way before the season started, just to get it out of the way sure, and I knew I knew in my heart where I wanted to go.

Speaker 3: 59:29

So what's the point?

Speaker 2: 59:30

like so when you did. When you did that, though, where there's still other schools that were trying to reach out, like in the time, because they didn't know, maybe, or they didn't, they hadn't heard anything um, I think.

Speaker 3: 59:41

I think I had a lot of envelopes in the mail you know, yeah, but I'm gonna be honest with you, I didn't open them you're sold.

Speaker 2: 59:49

I didn't open them.

Speaker 3: 59:50

I knew I wanted to stay. I thought I wanted to stay close yeah, so I was like it's either, if I'm gonna go anywhere, I'll go to. Nebraska, but Paul Donohoe was there and he just won a national title at my weight class. And then this is before that stuff, hell happened yeah, yeah.

Speaker 3: 1:00:05

So I committed and then this stuff happened. So I committed, thinking Paul was gonna be my coach. I'm like, yeah, this is, this is yeah so sick. Like I watched Paul win in Nebraska singlet, like I'm gonna go there and win a national title, right for sure. And then that stuff happened. And then I went there and it was still great, but like there was a little part of me that felt a little bit of a disconnect of like why I was there yeah, you know so we talked a little bit about that in the past, about that experience going into the Nebraska room, kind of like.

Speaker 2: 1:00:38

You know, when you, when you're going from a high school room, it just middle school to high school, then high school to college, I mean it's a transition, it's a you're talking, you're talking men. Now, right, when you're going to college, we're talking men, straight up men. Okay, so you're at, you're at what you said. One was it 118 or something, I think, or 120, I was just over 120 okay, yeah, at the 124 5 every day.

Speaker 3: 1:01:02

Even when I went to Nebraska and showed up, I was under 130 pounds like soaking wet. Yeah, because I mean max flat of 105 115. I'm not joking, I have. I've got a story about that, but we'll go to that in a minute.

Speaker 2: 1:01:16

We, when you got to your, you got to your state finding. I watched an interview of you where you talked about in the state finals where you're like it was a weight up your shoulders, it was, you know as it was done. It's kind of a completion right, like you kind of breathe a little bit and you'd made your commitment, things like that. So as you, as you work over towards getting into college and where you, when your senior you're ended where you already, like, had been to Nebraska after your visits, had you gone there for any type of training in between, does your state have anything with that? Or where you know, but what were you doing during your senior? You're just getting your wrestling high school stuff, or we couldn't, I couldn't go there and train okay, okay, just they wouldn't wouldn't work out either.

Speaker 3: 1:01:59

Yeah, okay, I know I had a. In reality I was just out with down Ohio. Yeah, much as I could, yeah much as I could go down there how long was it?

Speaker 2: 1:02:10

down to those guys, I ours okay, okay, not too bad either for a week yeah but my club coach, craig should.

Speaker 3: 1:02:24

It's wrestled at Central Michigan, yep, and it's just like such a great guy like you know exactly what I need to be learning and stuff like that. But okay, okay, right, when I got out of high school or my in the state finals, I my junior year when I hurt my knee. I never got it fixed. So in the state finalist my senior year, there was a. They put this new sticky mat down on the ground. Yeah, and I didn't know it was sticky. It's the first time they ever used it. Yeah, I thought it was a towel. Oh, I went, I put my leg down and went to like twist my foot around to wipe it off in the towel. Yeah, oh, this is right before the match and my adrenaline just spiked and I was like I just completely destroyed my knee. So when I won the state finals and then we went and got an MRI done and I had torn my meniscus in like three different spots, yeah.

Speaker 3: 1:03:16

I had a partially torn MCL but they didn't think they needed to do surgery on that, but they needed to do a meniscus repair yeah, but I had to go to senior nationals, oh, and I'm like I really want to do this like I've been watching senior national VHS tapes.

Speaker 3: 1:03:32

Since I was seven, right like I've been dreaming of wrestling in this tournament I'm going. So I went and wrestled on one leg and took the third, did amazing. And then the next day I drove to Nebraska, to Lincoln, to their doctors, and they did surgery on me, like the next day and how wow. So I was, didn't do anything until June 6 was I graduated. And then June 6 I drove, my dad drove me to Nebraska, literally pulled up to the Divani where we work out, yeah, through my bags in the ground and said, see ya, got in the car and drove off. I know he's listening right now. That hurt me a little bit. See ya, I was like oh, just walked in with my bags.

Speaker 3: 1:04:15

That was here, guys. Yeah, that is walked in there like who the hell is this? I didn't know where to go oh, nobody's there it's summertime there ain't nobody there. Walked down I was like I think the restrooms over here on my visit sound like walking the restroom. I just walking in my bags. They're like oh, waldo's here. And yeah, yep, it's me, guys, I'm here, yeah oh, I'm staying slept on someone's couch for all summer.

Speaker 2: 1:04:40

It was fun no, can, okay, so you're, you're. Wow, you are thrust into college. You're thrust in college, you're. You're starting out there a little early you're there really yeah, so you're there a little early. Where were you kind of mentally wise once that season started? How did that fire off for you? Your freshman year, you redshirted yeah, they forced me to.

Speaker 3: 1:05:03

Okay, I didn't start off very well. Okay, I didn't have any success in the summertime.

Speaker 3: 1:05:10

I didn't swear a single point all summer, not one. Oh, wow, okay. And because I was really weak, because I my legs from having the surgery to yeah, so I was kind of doing therapy on the knee, okay, and try and lifting weights hard, like hard, I went from being 124. When I showed up June 4th by the first day of school, I weighed 141. Yeah, yeah, you got big, okay, I think. My squat went from 115 to like 205. My bench went from like 135 to like 185, like wow, just well.

Speaker 3: 1:05:49

Then, once I got strong, I started doing a little better in the conditioning workouts too. So like my brain started really firing all sudden. I'm like different than high school now. Now I think I'm the man. And then one practice I got a take down in overtime on one of our starters. Yeah, and I remember it just took my head gear off and I spiked it into the wall as hard as I could and I kicked the doors open and just ran up in the hallway in the middle of practice just screaming up and down. I was like this is it man?

Speaker 3: 1:06:16

I was like I'm the man now and went back inside and I did so good, I think about 24 and 6, my redshirt, freshman year it was a switch, oh it was coming on, I was like I'm the man now, okay, I'm the man, but it wasn't good for me because I never got checked on it and I probably should have got checked on it because I'm going to the coaches, going, I want to start like I'm not. The time to win is now. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And you're they're telling me that I could beat McDonough, like saying things like that to me, erzlund from Purdue yeah, now he does your leg?

Speaker 3: 1:06:51

attacks are better than McDonough's. Right now I'm telling you and I'm like then what are we doing?

Speaker 2: 1:06:55

yeah, what are we doing?

Speaker 3: 1:06:56

let's find out. Right, let's find out. Yeah, and it is kind of the guy that recruited me Mike Greenfield went to be an AD in Illinois. Jason Bester, who is my personal coach, he left him with Missouri. Yeah, and those are the guys that were so close to me so when they left, I felt a little weird, but the season did start off. To get back to your question, the season did start really good, okay.

Speaker 2: 1:07:20

Started off really good now.

Speaker 3: 1:07:21

School was great, everyone was great, it was super fun.

Speaker 2: 1:07:25

So we don't dive into it too much, but obviously you're talking about these coaches, these guys that were there, that really fired you up, that were the guys that could probably take you somewhere if you needed to.

Speaker 2: 1:07:36

Then, all of a sudden, one goes and the next goes. Does that happen? We watch administrations here and there. When it comes to college wrestling, we see them. Well, one coach moves on, but the other three still stay. What are you looking for? And your dad didn't know? Now that you know, what questions would you have asked? Going into a college, are you going to be here? Are you hanging out? How long are you going to be around? Those questions kids should ask these coaches when they're being recruited, because it's hard to guess. Right, you're going to go in, and how do you know who's going to leave and stay?

Speaker 3: 1:08:14

Yeah, yeah, that's a tough question. I'd be honest, I never thought about that.

Speaker 2: 1:08:19

Because what do you do?

Speaker 3: 1:08:20

I mean, they have contracts, the number one thing I've been telling our guys anybody that's ever come from our school is because I got hurt in college, obviously. So, I just go. Well, take wrestling away. If you still stay there, that's good advice. That's going to tell you a lot.

Speaker 3: 1:08:38

Yeah, I mean Russell, are you, do you want to live there? Do you want to go to school there? Can you see yourself sticking around there to maybe do even graduate work? Is that a place you want to be? First, like a person, you want to be there. And then we can go to the wrestling side and say, like you know, in the couple visits and the conversations you have, do you trust this guy? And like that kind of conversation, like then I would be asked I'm like so what's your plan as a coach? Like where do you see yourself here in five years? Right, like you're going to be taking over as head coach at something like in North Carolina a few years ago probably would have been asked and rainbow set question Like where do you see is going on? It's tough, right? I don't know. I don't know if I would have been smart enough to ask that question back in the day, but it sucks that you have to ask. Like I would hope that these guys are for like honest with the guys that they're recruiting.

Speaker 1: 1:09:28

Like hey, listen, I'm not sure my future looks like here, but yeah, yeah, I don't know.

Speaker 3: 1:09:33

That's a good question, man, yeah.

Speaker 2: 1:09:36

I mean, it's just one of those things, because there's the way that things go now With money. You know, like who are you? What are you investing in me? But what are you giving me out of that? You know, like am I know you? Do I know you're going to be here, you know? Do I like you? You know I, that's why I want to come here. Do I know you're going to be here for four years while I'm here? If not, what happens? You know?

Speaker 3: 1:09:57

I think you said I think it'd be dangerous to tie yourself up to a coach, though, Like I can see. I can see going to a college for a specific coach, but I feel like I'd rather choose a program. True, yeah, yeah, failed point Choose the program.

Speaker 3: 1:10:13

It'd be great to have coaches there for you. Like, of course that's important, right, yeah, but I feel like the best programs will have the people that you need there. So, even if one guy leaves, we're going to bring in, which is what Nebraska did when Mester left. They brought in Powell, who was a national champion there. So, like, if I would have just like, if I would have just fought, I wanted to follow up Mester, if I would have followed somebody, I would have followed him. But they brought in Powell and Powell was fantastic, right on Right on.

Speaker 3: 1:10:44

Yeah, oh well, I got burned. I got burned a little bit so I was just like I'm a little hesitant to like put all my trust into this one guy. I'd rather trust the program as a whole, all the coaches, the administration like it's going on and that makes sense.

Speaker 2: 1:10:57

I mean because that that flows then into the RTCs now too. You know, like, because all those other coaches probably have a hand in that and you got to. You have to like. Right now I've been preaching mainly to Leo. You know the school's great, but you also want to train for other things, like world. You know team trials and things like that. What's RTC look like? Is that part of the program going to work for you? So you know it's a big, it's a big scope to look through. But now, with your freshman year coming, you know and all these guys kind of left out what happened at Nebraska. When did, when did the decision to not stay at Burton, nebraska, come?

Speaker 3: 1:11:31

Um, I think it started, yeah, after the first semester. Sorry, the first school year was done, okay, I went home and I didn't do that. Well, the second semester. So they wanted me to come back to take some summer classes just to boost the GPA up as high as I could. Yeah, and when I came back, it was me and Jordan Burroughs taking a nutrition class and I had to drive. He would get me right back to my house or whatever every day. So we're in this classic every day. Yeah, I mean, I hope Jordan doesn't kill me for telling the story. So there was one day where Jordan and I were in class, but we're also doing summer canons, so we're lifting in the morning, doing camps, we have a workout in the afternoon, like it's a lot, sure, and so Jordan and I have class. But we have a nutrition class and they're making us work out and Jordan and I are like, why do we have to do this? I'm working out for five hours today. You want to see if I can, if I'm learning anything? Come watch me wrestle.

Speaker 3: 1:12:32

So, Jordan goes let's go get my car. We're out of here after between because we had a class on one side of the road. You had to walk across the street to the union to go work out, and so instead of going to the union, we just went and went to his car. Teacher calls coach Manning and tells him Jordan and Kyle skipped down on the workout part of class and he's like I understand why. I just wish they wouldn't have done that. Well, manning calls me at my house and, just like this, lays into me and I don't know. It started. This is a lack of trust started to be developed on my side where I was like, okay, my coaches aren't there. I was just like I was beating Dave, our starter during the year.

Speaker 3: 1:13:16

And you guys again, I didn't trust the process, I didn't understand that my journey was good for me.

Speaker 2: 1:13:22

Okay, that actually helped me a lot.

Speaker 1: 1:13:24

It got me stronger.

Speaker 3: 1:13:25

It got me ready to go. Like, when I look at hindsight, man, what a great thing. Like I leaving was a bad decision on my part, but I'll always I'll always tell the truth. There was a terrible, terrible decision that was based on something that wasn't existing. Like I left because I thought I was being screwed. In reality, they were protecting me and they were trying to get me ready to be the man and they could see that I wasn't a man yet.

Speaker 3: 1:13:51

Yeah, like I hadn't figured it out, like just hold on. Yeah, I couldn't. I was like, screw this, I'm out of here and my dad can never come on. Should we wrestle? I mean, I'm going to Iowa and Kansas for open tournaments. He can't make that drive every weekend, right? So it's tough, man, it's tough. My dad and I talked and he's like it's time I think you should come back to central. So I got them to release me from my scholarship and Manon didn't want to let me go. So he told me to get back and I was like oh, really. So I went to the athletic director, tom Osborn, and sat in his office and told him I want to go home. Yeah, I don't want to be here anymore. And he was like okay, if you don't want to be here, I ain't going to keep you here. And he let me go. So he overrode coach Manning, let me go for my scholarship. And then I got a scholarship offer from the central and went straight there. Like weeks later I was there.

Speaker 1: 1:14:48

Wow.

Speaker 3: 1:14:48

Okay, I was like I'm going to miss though, because I was waiting for this whole thing to go to go through over. You know so it was really stressful. And then I got there and it was hard because it was so different, you know, yeah, well, big time country to that, yeah.

Speaker 2: 1:15:07

Yeah, cause you went, like you said you had gone, into an environment that you were looking forward to, right? I mean, it wasn't central Michigan, wasn't even anything you really entertained at all, you know. So, like you said, you're also going from a big tender, you know, into a different type of college room. So not to say that it's worse or better, but it wasn't what you were expecting, right, it wasn't something that that was a part of your story. So when you got in there was that kind of like I mean, your first couple of practices. What were you thinking? Like this is this, isn't I should have done this either? Or were you like I got to give this time, I got to work through this and figure it out, cause we remember you talking about how you had, you know, these stories in your head and the things that you've been doing kind of yourself since high school. Where were you at mentally when you got into central Michigan?

Speaker 3: 1:15:56

Well, I tore my knee up again in the spring before I left, so I was still and obviously I just had to transfer. So guess we couldn't do therapy anymore.

Speaker 2: 1:16:08

Yeah.

Speaker 3: 1:16:10

So what am I going to do? I can't go into the athletic facilities anymore and get therapy on my knee.

Speaker 2: 1:16:16

So it's kind of hot one around.

Speaker 3: 1:16:18

So the first part of this fall was spent just getting back into it and getting my lungs back in underneath me, and the guys were super accepting. Like I did love central Michigan, okay Okay. Like coach Braley is one of the greatest human beings on the planet earth.

Speaker 3: 1:16:36

Like, I love that guy but all the guys in the team nobody like held it against me and that I was probably going to take one of their spots. It felt really good. It felt really good, but the problem is I was getting stronger and I was getting bigger, so they wanted me. I agreed to go 125 for at least two years. There was zero chance. I realized pretty early on that I didn't have the discipline level in order to do that.

Speaker 2: 1:17:00

Okay, Not that I couldn't do it. I was going to say, was it?

Speaker 3: 1:17:03

attainable? Oh yeah, I just didn't have the knowledge and I didn't have the help. Like at Nebraska, if I go to the weight training guy or the nutritionist that I have, they're going to give me a meal card and I go to the athletic meal table and they will make me my food and I eat these calories. At central there's a Walmart down the road, good luck. So I didn't have any cooking skills. I didn't have any knowledge of how to actually get myself down there.

Speaker 3: 1:17:32

And I I'm going to be honest with you was not mature enough to be to go and figure that out and find it.

Speaker 2: 1:17:40

This wasn't, this wasn't man. This is a perfect storm. So that was that the beginning of the end.

Speaker 3: 1:17:47

Once I got hurt. It was it was like yeah, I dropped off a pull up bar and a herniation in my neck popped out, like I lost feeling in my entire left arm, whoa, and like, yeah, so like I thought I couldn't move my head left or right, yeah, yeah, I hit and I was like I can't, I couldn't move, I couldn't feel my arm, wow. So I was like, oh, what the hell? Yeah, and he just laid me down and got an MRI and had a two herniation C four, c five.

Speaker 2: 1:18:15

C five C six.

Speaker 3: 1:18:17

And the doctor was like yeah, we can get you a house 22. They're like we can do a spinal fusion, yeah, or your distance, yeah, and I'm by myself and Saginaw and a doctor and he's ending my career and I'm in that room alone with nobody else, no coaches. They never called to ask no roommate with you.

Speaker 2: 1:18:39

no, nobody with you.

Speaker 3: 1:18:40

No, oh it didn't seem like anybody cared either. Yeah, At the time, as soon as it happened. I don't want to get into it too much, but right, there was a coach at Central that kind of just destroyed me for it, damn Like, just maybe told me I was a failure to my family, the team, wow, and so there's no coming back from that.

Speaker 2: 1:19:03

So that was the beginning of the end. Yeah.

Speaker 3: 1:19:07

Not only do I feel bad, but you're going to hold me up against the wall like in the whole game. How do you have a failure Like, come on, man. Wow, I'm going to take the most circumstance at this point.

Speaker 2: 1:19:19

That's pretty crazy, you know, and we talked about just the validity of what a kid you know, the decision that they're making at 16, 17, going into a college, and you know, knowing that you're having to deal with that, you know, as far as just that, I mean, it's got to make, obviously it made the decision like no, I'm not going through this anymore, I'm done. You know kind of thing. Where you got to, you got to pull the plug, but at the same time, though, too, it's heartbreaking to kind of hear that there's a reaction like that to someone getting hurt.

Speaker 3: 1:19:46

You know, I should say this too. Just a disclaimer. That guy has not been in the program. He was fired the next year. But Central Michigan is not like that now.

Speaker 1: 1:19:56

I love everyone up there now, right, you're good, we got you. Yeah, I love central Go.

Speaker 3: 1:20:00

Chips. Like it's not a bad place for you as an your kid Like I feel bad, it's tough because I have to tell the truth about my story. Yeah, but my story happened to me, yep.

Speaker 3: 1:20:10

And there's there's some I know some other people that had some similar things but like really runs a really tight ship. Yeah, you got the right guys in there and he took, and even when that was going on he took care of me, checked on me, and even when I was out of college years down the road he would just I would just hear from him Like I love that guy and like I probably wouldn't have made it very far if it wasn't for how he reacted to that whole entire thing too.

Speaker 2: 1:20:38

So I mean it sounds like those guys, like they removed the cancer too. Like you said, he was gone. Like they, they found out about stuff. They knew that that bad was going on.

Speaker 2: 1:20:45

Yeah, yeah, so you're, you're coming to an end of your college career, right You're. Unfortunately you weren't able to go all the way through, but there are things that came out of that. You know, like and I always tell Liam about this as far as you know, make it as far and make it as the best that you can, because you're going to make relationships and you're going to, you're going to meet people along the way, you're going to create certain situations for yourself, just through the sport itself. So we ran into you because you were spreading your knowledge through wrestling camps, right, so you're taking it to the kids and taking the knowledge that you've learned through the years and just, I mean, you're learning. You were learning with Logan Steiber, like I mean, I can't imagine that you're taking bad knowledge of these kids in the wrestling room, right?

Speaker 2: 1:21:29

So as you, as you got out of college wrestling, like we're did you take a hiatus. Obviously, there must have been a break. You must have gotten out, gotten healed up, felt better, wanted to kind of release your mind from things, I would imagine, just to kind of let things go and kind of decompress. What were you doing in those times? What did you? Did you? Were you done with school in general?

Speaker 3: 1:21:51

Um, I attended school for what? Three more years after I got hurt, okay, and came back to Grand Rapids. Yep, I was like 2012, 2013. Okay, it was when I came back to GR, started running extreme, um, but before that I didn't really want anything to do with wrestling anymore. Yeah, yeah, I was hurting bad I could imagine.

Speaker 3: 1:22:19

I could tell people, my guys, this all the time too. My high school guys, you have got to learn how to be a person, Right, you have to. I'm like I grew up my entire life not doing anything but wrestling, wrestling, wrestling, sleep video games, wrestling. So when wrestling got taken out of the equation, whereas I have no motivation to do anything, I have no purpose. I mean, I was going to school to win a national title, Sure, yeah.

Speaker 2: 1:22:49

Not going to school? To school, kind of ask the question. I mean I know you finished school, but I mean at some point you got to wonder do you want to be there?

Speaker 3: 1:22:57

What the hell happened. Like yeah, and it took me three years before I was like, oh, like, maybe I'll just go into coaching wrestling. I've got to, I've got to get back into this because I don't feel like myself anymore. And then Roy Hall saw me at the state tournament. Roy Hall, Yep.

Speaker 3: 1:23:13

And I was sitting in a hallway and I said hi to him and he said, hey, you're like. I never really talked to him when I was like what's up, roy? And he's like you're going to be a really good coach. I can see it, you should do this. And I I Roy's like a mythological creature walking through the hallways. So I was like, okay, I'll do that. And I did that's the idea.

Speaker 3: 1:23:35

I rode the wheels off that thing. You know my my high school coach told me to when you have, when you feel like you're in there where you're able to go and travel and do camps, just do what as hard as you can, but also know when to get off.

Speaker 2: 1:23:50

Yeah.

Speaker 3: 1:23:51

Yeah, you know which is a good point? Now, it's a good point.

Speaker 2: 1:23:54

Well, and I think the way to do it you know you, you were doing it you're getting your name out there, you know you're, you're spreading your knowledge and to me that's kind of like a salesman way of doing it. You know you're selling yourself and the knowledge that you have before you get into a position like that, because I mean, you're the head coach of a high school man and as far as I know, down in lower Michigan a lot of the high schools are pretty goddamn competitive. So to be able to, you know, walk into a situation like that and I know I mean I've heard of Grand Rapids wrestling, you know, just with Liam, especially going around with him. Now, when I was wrestling you're lucky if I knew about Minnesota next door when I was wrestling I was worried about soccer.

Speaker 2: 1:24:32

But now, kind of going through the stuff that we've been through in the places that we've been in wrestling and hearing about some of the Michigan stories that the program that you're in, let's talk about that what drove you to want to necessarily go home. I mean, everybody goes home and visits, right, but what drove you to home? What was part of it that made you want to go back to where it all started to coach and not say oh, I want to try to go into Iowa and coach a you know Iowa high schooler. What made you want to go back home and coach?

Speaker 3: 1:25:08

Nate. There was a kid named Nate Limix and Austin Boone. Okay, I kind of got linked up with them. This is truly how it all started. Yeah, I was in individual lessons with them and they were seeing unbelievable amount of success right away and I was like all right, this is kind of cool. But I don't think I really chose Grand Rapids. It was kind of just the only option I really had out of high school or out of college because I was kind of lost. I didn't really know. I didn't really know what I wanted to do. Like I didn't want to be done with this wrestling thing. I thought I was always going to be division one head coach there at some point, like I'm obsessed with this sport. So I was kind of just finding myself, I feel like not in a big woo woo type of way, but on some different jobs, like doing just traveling all over and like I'm obsessed. You'll figure that you know this. I'm obsessed with wrestling technique.

Speaker 2: 1:26:03

Yeah, I'm obsessed.

Speaker 3: 1:26:04

I love teaching it and I could watch anyone do anything. I'm like, oh man, I want to try it. So it was like I could travel and do this thing I'm obsessed with. I'm just going to do it, yeah, like as long as I can.

Speaker 2: 1:26:14

Well, and you run a stern room dude like just watching your camps. It's not. You're a good coach because you have the side that is able to get kids to pay attention to you, right. But you also have the side of you that says, if you're not paying attention, I'm going to stick my foot up your butt and you're going to pay the price for it. So kids were paying, like especially the one we went to. Kids were paying attention after, I would say, maybe a half hour, 45 minutes, because a couple were learning real quick. If you're not, you're going to pay the price, right. So, and those were kids. Now I'm thinking in the long term here, because you're coaching at a high school, but I do see you coaching at a college someday, you know what, maybe at Central Michigan where you're coaching at. You never know, maybe I had, I had my chance, you had your chance, had, had, explain, had. How come you don't have the chance anymore, covid?

Speaker 3: 1:27:05

Okay.

Speaker 2: 1:27:05

Honestly Okay, okay, okay Okay.

Speaker 3: 1:27:06

Okay, okay. I went to the US Open. I went up and did a camp at University of Northern Colorado.

Speaker 2: 1:27:15

Okay, yep.

Speaker 3: 1:27:17

Yeah, they wanted me to go and train there and be a TC coach and basically set me up with this whole thing. Yeah, and I just couldn't do it. I just couldn't do it. I wrestled at the US Open. They kind of put the rest like this journey. My dad and I went on, yeah, and so I was like you know what I want to do? This one more tournament with my dad, just one more. Okay, yeah, and I'm obviously at the Youth Wrestling Club. So I went and did that. Well, I did pretty good. Yeah, I did three months of training and had wrestled in nine years and I was only down by three to Darian Cruz after the first period. Like I'm in there.

Speaker 1: 1:27:58

I'm in there, give me some training.

Speaker 3: 1:28:00

Maybe I'm not so damn stupid Right Like I'm in there, but it was just fun.

Speaker 1: 1:28:04

Yeah.

Speaker 3: 1:28:05

And they wanted me to come out there and all I could think about was leaving my guys, like my boys, the youth kids, and I was like there's no way.

Speaker 1: 1:28:15

Yeah.

Speaker 3: 1:28:16

That's not. This isn't me anymore, like I don't want that that bad. Yeah, I don't Right. Yeah, I really don't Okay what? I believe that what I have going here is going to work out, and I also believe that I told these kids I'm going to see them through. Oh yeah, I'm going to see them through. That's awesome. I'm going to see them through. And then a month later, I met my wife.

Speaker 2: 1:28:38

So no, you're definitely not leaving. Yeah, babe, definitely not going anywhere. Now You're stuck, so that's so. That's a it's and again it's a it's a story, I think, of resilience. You, you were determined to accomplish things and it doesn't happen exactly the way we wanted to. I mean, so many things happen. I mean that last thing, the, the whole spinal fusion, like that's. That's crazy to me. It is. It is so to me, knowing that you can still fulfill some type of energy need to be able to, you know, let it all out and still be able to be in wrestling with those kids and coaching those high school kids and giving them that type of feedback that you have, the knowledge that you have, is is pretty cool. So you got to coach your first, you know, high school state champ last year, right, 113. What was his name? Again DLG, dlg, All right.

Speaker 3: 1:29:36

He was the reason, part of the reason I stayed.

Speaker 2: 1:29:39

So yeah, well, and again, why? When you again I can, I can understand where you're coming from. Why would you want to walk away from something like that that you're already got? You already got that feeling for right, like you're.

Speaker 3: 1:29:50

Yeah, I love them. I love them Like right, there's something special here. I love them.

Speaker 1: 1:29:54

Love is parents.

Speaker 2: 1:29:55

Yeah, well, and now here's the other thing too. It's like you have the ability to build the program right. You have the ability to build something for to prove to people like, look, this is what I was doing and what I was learning, this is exactly what kids need to be learning, right. So what are your goals? You're solid team coming back. How many kids you got from last year? You got coming back Everyone but one, I think. Nice, that's always great. A lot of injuries right now. Yep.

Speaker 3: 1:30:25

We're setting a foundation for something I think right now.

Speaker 2: 1:30:29

So are you trying are you trying to do kind of, are you, do you have your hands? Is there a youth program that that is involved with the high school? Do you guys have something that builds from, from youth Op? Are you trying to build something like that? Um?

Speaker 3: 1:30:43

I feel like I'll try to summon up without butchering it. So, yeah, yeah, um, the Catholic, the Christian, the Catholic parishes and stuff that elementary school kids, when they're coming up they can choose to go to. I think they can choose to go to West Catholic or Catholic central. Okay, we're in the same town, two Catholic schools, so when I try to get some youth things set up they won't allow me to do that. I can't have a Catholic central youth wrestling club when these kids might not even go there. Go there, it could be undue influence it could yeah, yeah, right, makes sense, makes sense.

Speaker 3: 1:31:21

So it's like we can go in there together West and Catholic we can go in there as a group. Both the coaches and I can go together and do together and pitch the sport together. Yeah, but I can't do my own thing. But I started up JRWA because I resigned from the staff in 2016 and got a volunteer packet done and just ran a wrestling club out of the, out of their school. So I was like come on up and I had no intention of taking over as head coach until I would say like a year or two. I like I was kind of in the back of my mind. I was like that would be cool, yeah, it would line up pretty cool, like if I could do that. But I was like, yeah, I'm never going to be ready.

Speaker 2: 1:31:59

And then I had how did how did that job approach you? How did how did that? How did you get into the coaching staff? There was just cause you were moving back home and you're like hey guys, I'm going to be around, can I help out?

Speaker 3: 1:32:10

Nate Lemex is dad. Nate Lemex transferred from Lowell to Catholic Central and I was his main training partner, so we have some really good guys in here. Yeah, you really ought to come check this out. So, I just showed up in 2012, 2013 and it was like just a training partner and I was that guy for a lot of guys in there.

Speaker 2: 1:32:30

But then yeah, in 2016,.

Speaker 3: 1:32:33

I left, built the youth side up a little bit, had fun with it, and then Dale was coming in and then BJ retired and then they interviewed me and he was like it's yours, If you want it. You've been here for nine years. If you want it, it's yours.

Speaker 2: 1:32:45

That's awesome.

Speaker 3: 1:32:46

Yeah that, give it to me. I'll give it a shot.

Speaker 2: 1:32:50

I'm dedicated to a man and that's the best part, and that's again that's why we talk to you guys. Like you, because you guys have a love for the sport. There's a passion for the sport, not only just for the sport, now also for the area that you're in, like I mean, you care about those kids and you can see it just in you telling the stories. So it's interesting to me now that you're the head coach you got the helm for two years. I'm going to watch and see where you guys wind up going a little bit, because I think you guys are going to blow up.

Speaker 1: 1:33:16

It'd be cool, I know.

Speaker 2: 1:33:18

You guys are going to blow up. You're going to notice that if those guys aren't shifting over, when they're kids, from one school to your school now, just let alone to play football and wrestle too, man, come on guys, go to the other side, go where Kyle is.

Speaker 3: 1:33:33

Listen. No, no, no, no. No, mitch SA could be listening now. I've had some odd conversations over the last year and I always tell people like, no matter what, like the grass isn't always greener on the other side. Yeah, yeah, it's not, I agree, and you know you can still, I don't know. Like I just want people to do make the best decision for themselves. But it's weird, dude, like we're in this era where what high school you go to is a decision now that you have to make.

Speaker 3: 1:34:10

Yeah, it's not something that you're just going to go to high school or what the elementary school like you're just going to go in there.

Speaker 2: 1:34:18

And I know, in our room.

Speaker 3: 1:34:19

We're just in a club. We're just like go to your school. Man, like you can be a superstar there, unless it's a really, really bad situation.

Speaker 2: 1:34:26

This far away from having signing days for high schools.

Speaker 3: 1:34:31

I mean, well, nil just got approved for Michigan this week Really, so that you can do NIL for high school athletes and stuff now in Michigan.

Speaker 2: 1:34:39

Well, we got to get some cousins of ours Well, it's my wife's sister, but Liam's cousins. They go to school in California and they basically made an announcement of what high school the Notre Dame high school that their son's going to to be the quarterback there. Like made an announcement for it. I just don't think there's any stopping.

Speaker 1: 1:34:58

You won't, you won't, it's going to destroy wrestling.

Speaker 3: 1:35:02

I think at some point it's going to be really good.

Speaker 2: 1:35:04

It's. You know, we talked about a couple, a couple different episodes. How, like back of the day, how you'd see like maybe three guys in the transfer portal, Now it's like 20, 30 guys in the transfer portal because of dollar signs. Man, Now can I blame them entirely? Hey, someone's waving dollars at me and it's going to pay for my school and I'm that age. It's just like when I, when a little kid doesn't want to, when their parents get divorced and the one kid doesn't want to stay with his parents because one one house is too hard.

Speaker 1: 1:35:31

Of course you're going to pick the easy house.

Speaker 3: 1:35:33

Right, yeah, done. You want to grab my house every time? Yeah, I'm not staying at mom's house, dad's house, you're going to spank me.

Speaker 2: 1:35:42

So you're going to bet at eight. Yeah right, you get money flash in your face. You're going to take the money and so you know parents are involved and it's just. It's craziness. It's the wild West in college sports right now. It's the wild West.

Speaker 3: 1:35:55

Even high school sports is a little ridiculous sometimes.

Speaker 2: 1:35:57

It's getting out of hand. It's getting out of hand.

Speaker 3: 1:36:00

That's my dream at Catholic is to just have to be able to have some kind of youth program going, because my favorite part about coaching wrestling is coaching, because I don't know anything.

Speaker 2: 1:36:11

Yeah, right, right, it's my favorite.

Speaker 3: 1:36:14

It's my favorite. You see, that smart man Like I wake up just a little more or less tired in the mornings. When I have some kids in my team that are like starting to figure it out, I'm like this is fun. That's right, this is fun. Exactly, that's my favorite part.

Speaker 2: 1:36:27

You see the growth, you see the progress, like you said, you see that light switch kind of turn out.

Speaker 3: 1:36:30

You're making a difference and you know you are Totally. You can see it Big time.

Speaker 2: 1:36:35

And that's and to me that's the biggest part of youth sports is the progress, like as a parent you get so buried in the, in the my kids got to be better than this one, I mean, because it's your kid, right but like when you can kind of step back if you can, if you can step back for that nanosecond and realize that you know this is pretty cool. What they're doing is it's pretty and they're learning it. Look how they're taking it in kind of thing. But you know a lot of us get, we do get lost in the, in the, in the winning and losing, but I think what you're doing is great, dude. You know, having you and meeting you at that camp, I think it's it's changed a lot.

Speaker 2: 1:37:07

You're like you helped Liam know that super 32, that one year and You're kind of talking a little at those camps and he's he's been excited about being around you and we got to get over to Michigan because I know that there's a couple of trips we want to make over there and be able to train with you. But I think you're doing great. I think what you're going to do at the high school is going to be awesome, man, and we've had you on for what? Oh, hour and a half now a little little little and hour and a half.

Speaker 2: 1:37:34

So we want to check in with you. Everybody we talked to, we're going to I mean we're going to do multiple episodes. You're on your 78, we're going to do 5,000. So we're going to, we're going to get you back on. We want to find out what's going on. I want to check in. Hopefully I could check in with you by the end of the year and see what you know what kind of progress with the team. But what? What are the guys? What's the lineup of guys? Are they sophomores, juniors, are they? What are they? We have two seniors two this year.

Speaker 3: 1:38:01

Yeah, the whole team.

Speaker 2: 1:38:02

Oh, my God.

Speaker 3: 1:38:03

Yeah, mostly freshmen, sophomores and a handful of juniors.

Speaker 2: 1:38:06

All right, All right. So we this is going to be a speed.

Speaker 3: 1:38:09

And this group of freshmen this year.

Speaker 2: 1:38:11

Yeah, pretty tight, nice Good. Good, we're having fun, man. Yeah, I'll say I'm going to. I'm going to let you go, man. I'm going to talk to you a little bit after we're done here, but I'm going to wind up hitting the button. They'll mute us. We're going to let them watch the cool logo for a second with the, with the, with the ads on there, but we appreciate everybody listening watching this. The audio version will be out this week, but we've been talking to Kyle Waldo man. He's Grand Rapids, a Catholic central head coach. It's been awesome talking to you. The guy is going to make a huge difference over there. So watch out for those guys. But we're going to let you guys go, man, peace, thank you.

Speaker 1: 1:38:59

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