Hey, Psych Bytes with CCS is a weekly podcast hosted by Student Life Counseling and Consultation Service. This show is dedicated to discussing a wide range of topics pertaining to mental health commonly experienced in the college setting. It is important to note that this podcast is not a substitute for therapy. All of the topics on this show, while discussed by professionals are strictly psycho educational, and meant to inform listeners on available resources, skills and support. Topics on this show can be sensitive in nature. And should you find yourself needing additional support or resources, please visit ccs.osu.edu or call us at 614-292-5766. With that in mind, enjoy the show. What is up everybody and welcome to psych bytes with CCS. My name is Josh and today we are joined by Jake Friedman, a licensed independent social worker here with Counseling and Consultation Service. Jake, thank you very much for joining us today.
Jake Friedman:Appreciate you having me very excited. Absolutely.
Josh Bailey:So today you and I are going to be talking about men's mental health. Where I want to start is why is it important to emphasize "men's" mental health? Why don't we just talk about mental health in general? Why do we gotta talk about men exclusively here?
Jake Friedman:Yeah, so talking about mental health in general is always great. And historically, talking about men's mental health, in particular, has been something that has been brushed to the side. And we have some statistics that that show that men experience mental health, sometimes more significantly than other gender expressions. Certain statistics, including 75% of suicide victims are men, and the men are three times more likely than women to die by suicide. Life expectancy for men is four years shorter than women. Nearly 25% of U.S. men experienced some form of contact sexual violence in their lifetime. Cis men have higher rates of loneliness. 80% of college men report feeling dissatisfied with their body, and 40% and 36% respectively, of college men experience anxiety and depression, to the extent of functional impairment. So these are all things that affect men, but are often brushed aside by men themselves or other members of society.
Josh Bailey:Why is this such a thing that we don't talk about it, or we don't focus on it? How you said it was either were we brushed it aside ourselves as men, both you and I being male identified, but you also said maybe society in general can also brush these things over to the side or ignore it or push it away? How do we get here?
Jake Friedman:Society has set norms and values. These are things that have been passed down from generation to generation that help us explain the world around us. When it comes to men, when you look at traditional values for men, you look at stoicism, you look at strength. And those things have been determined to be not talking about our emotions, to act like we don't have emotions, including self control or reluctance to be vulnerable. Men are less likely to seek mental health services and even peer support.
Josh Bailey:So when you say peer support, like I'll be talking to my friends, you know, if I'm on a team or something like that, not bringing that type of stuff up. It's just, eye on the prize, get the job done. Point A to Point B.
Jake Friedman:That's it.
Josh Bailey:What do we do to work against this? How do we strategize around this to bring it into the limelight, to bring it into focus, so that we can start maybe changing that narrative? Because those numbers that you kind of pointed out before, like, one of the things I'm looking at, you know that the 75% of suicide victims are men and men are 3.5 times more likely than women to die by suicide? I mean, I feel like that would be right, like, we need to focus on this, this is a problem. This is a huge deal. What do we do?
Jake Friedman:I think the first step is to acknowledge it within ourselves as men. Unless we seek services, unless we seek help, nobody knows that those things are going on within us. So it's about that personal journey of being able to push through some of those societal norms and recognize when you are in need of help. When you are in need of help, finding trusted family members, trusted friends, trusted people in your circle that you can go to to express that need for help. And then once you do that, you can then look to further services, whether that see CCS or elsewhere. They are available to us
Josh Bailey:Looking at, you know, how maybe we are kind of progressing collectively towards more awareness. You know, I know November is known as "Movember," or men's mental health awareness month. I know that's something that you kind of spearhead here with one, another one of our staff members, Kristin Swope, and I'm curious. What is that all about? Impact? How does it work? What do we do with Movember?
Jake Friedman:Movember is really all about what we're talking about today, which is really bringing these things out of the shadows. It's about making people know that they're not alone. It's about making people know that there are people who support them in their community. We do that through all kinds of different ways, whether that's public events out at the Union, whether that's doing virtual workshops, there are all kinds of ways that we CCS tried to show that we care about our male students, male identified students, and here to support them. And it takes really a group effort. It's not just CCS that can be doing these things. It's in your personal life, your individual life, you and the people around you. It's not just men, it's those who are supporting men also being a part of that.
Josh Bailey:Okay. All right. So a topic that I want to touch on a little bit, and I think we've already talked about it, without explicitly stating it, but like the idea of toxic masculinity, what is it? How does it present? What do we do about it?
Jake Friedman:Toxic masculinity is really the expression of those societal expectations of men taken to 100. So when you think about toxic masculinity, you know, if you close your eyes and really view it, a lot of people see the angry, juiced up, pissed off person. And what we can do about some of these
things is A:call it when we see it. Being able to have the personal strength to call out somebody who may be taking something over the line. And being kind enough to that person to try to dig deeper, what's really going on there. How can I support you in a way that would help you work through some of these things? And if you notice it within yourself, it's really taking that personal inventory and saying, "How did I get here? What is this doing for me? Is this helping or hurting?" You look at the relationships around you and generally, if you're somebody who experiences those toxic traits, then the relationships that you have in your life may be deteriorating anyways. And so taking a step back, using something like a feelings wheel, maybe it sounds silly, but being able to identify what emotions that you are feeling. I'm somebody who used to say, I don't get angry, because to me angry was that toxic version of it that, that screaming that yelling, but I looked at a feelings wheel and frustration is one line below anger. And I'll tell people, I'm frustrated all the time. So that was something that I needed to see to say, "Oh, I do have emotions, I am angry. And how do I take this out in a way that works for me and the people around me." So whether that's physical activity, whether that's punching a pillow, something that is going to take that step back away from some of those more intense feelings, and release those.
Jake Friedman:Yes.
Josh Bailey:So finding an opportunity for release, finding So when we think about that, too, we talk about a way to kind of get that out to express it in a way that is non this repression of emotion, or I'm only expressing the tip of the iceberg, which oftentimes is anger or frustration, or something that is not pleasant in the moment. What are some other ways that we maybe see men kind of mask that, because something that's coming to my mind is the use of substances, damaging, right? Whether it be to my relationships, whether it right? Like, I may lean on alcohol, or I may lean on some other substance to try to curb my emotions, or, more specifically, try to mute my emotions. Like if all I'm feeling is angry, day in and day out, and I don't know how to get rid of it, it's very easy to lean on a mind altering be to myself. substance to change my mood.
Jake Friedman:Substance is a big one. I also think that people get into, as a whole, some toxic relationships in order to feel almost supported in those behaviors.
Josh Bailey:What's a toxic relationship? What would you what would be a good example of that?
Jake Friedman:A good example of that would be getting with the people in your circle or dating relationship, who express similarities to you and make you feel like those actions that you partake in, or the way that you express your emotions, is not as destructive as it may actually be. Sometimes those things are really hard to see because you're surrounding yourself with those types of people. But sometimes looking at your familial relationships, or how people outside of your circle react to you, or the ways that you're able to recognize, "Oh, I may not be surrounding myself with the best people." Jim Tressel, who is an old coach of Ohio State football, used to say, "You are who you surround yourself with." And so this is a way that people mask who they are, or trying to be, by surrounding themselves with things that may not be the best for them.
Josh Bailey:I see. All right, so it just promotes and enables it, right? Minimizes the consequence, promotes my continued acting in a certain way.
Jake Friedman:Yes.
Josh Bailey:As we look to move forward, as individuals, as a community, as a collective, as a society, are there any major points or major takeaways that maybe we haven't focused on enough yet? Or resources that maybe we can highlight? I know we talked about Movember, but is there anything else that if I'm kind of kicking it around here at OSU? Where else might I go? What else might I look into?
Jake Friedman:I think one other thing to touch on would be the idea of intellectualizing. I think men often move from the emotional space and move things into the intellectual world where I think about it, but I don't necessarily feel it. And that can often guise, "Well, I'm dealing with it, because I'm thinking about it." And oftentimes, it takes that extra step of that acceptance of the feeling and truly sitting with that feeling in order to move on from it, as opposed to simply thinking about it. Now, when it comes to resources, the one I would suggest the most on this topic is Let's Talk. So Let's Talk is something that we do here at CCS. They're offered daily. They are 20 minute sessions where you are able to talk to a clinician, and either find resources that will be helpful for you, or simply talk about whatever you need to talk about. This is something that doesn't necessarily create a record. It's something that you can drop into. And it's something where if you don't feel super comfortable jumping right into therapy and talking to a therapist, it can be that kind of first entry way. Another option is our group therapy. Here at CCS, we have a group called Buckeye brothers, which I actually help run. It is a group for male identified students, both undergrad and graduate. You can get involved with that by either doing one of those Let's Talk sessions and expressing interest or doing one of our triage sessions and expressing interest there.
Josh Bailey:All right, Jake, thank you so much for taking the time to join us today. I really appreciate you sharing your insights, your wisdom and resources on a very important topic, and something that we'd like to focus on and prioritize here at The Ohio State University. If you are interested in more services or resources here at OSU, please check out our website at www.ccs.osu.edu and you can check out our On Demand services, like Let's Talk, our group counseling services, which we have a variety of different affinity groups and skill building groups. And then any of our other resources and services that we have can all be found on the website under our variety of drop down tabs. To our
listeners:Thank you again for dropping in hanging out with us and listening today. Until next time, keep your eyes peeled for our next episode. Take care of yourselves and until then, my name is Josh and this has been Psych Bytes with CCS.