Predator Podcast

S4 E14: Spend MORE TIME Chasing Predators with Dakota Parker

• Drew Schliem • Season 4 • Episode 14

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This week Dakota Parker is on from down in Arizona. We are talking about how Dakota attacks the desert to consistently put predators in the truck and on film. He has a YouTube channel called Obsessed Predator Calling that he shares his hunts on. Check out all of Dakota's pages and enjoy this episode! 

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SPEAKER_03

What's up guys? Predator podcast season four. We have another great episode today. And before I jump in with my guests this week, I just want to remind everybody uh the Wisconsin Open Season Sportsman's Expo is coming up in Wisconsin Dells March 27th to the 29th this month. We will be there. We'll have a booth, we'll have some hats, we'll have some thermals, we'll have some cool guns. Uh you guys better stop in and see us. So uh we will see you guys there in a few weeks. Um, in this week's episode, I have a great hunter from the southwest, Dakota Parker. He's a fellow Fox Pro field staff member. Uh he's uh has a YouTube channel called Obsessed Predator Calling, has some great videos. If you guys are in my Facebook group, he posts active stuff in there that's super cool. And I finally got him on for a podcast, and uh Dakota here here he is, and thanks for joining me today.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah, thank you for having me on. I greatly appreciate it.

SPEAKER_03

So Dakota is down in Arizona, and uh we were just talking about the weather. I have a balmy 65 here in Wisconsin today, and it was t-shirt weather. Uh, he's down there where it's a little bit warmer and a little bit drier, but uh lots of predators down there, I believe. Um, but we will see what Dakota says about it, and how has the hunting been for you uh as of late?

SPEAKER_02

Uh it's been going pretty good. I haven't been going out as much as I normally do, um with deer season, elk season, and then kids stuff, but uh going back in it full bore now, and it's killed one yesterday and then a lot of dry stands lately, but it's that time of year.

SPEAKER_03

Yeah, for sure it is. It's getting to be that late uh you know, post-breeding time where uh it can certainly result in some dry stands, but um also you know, I think a time of year where you get some hard callings when you do get callings, it's just seems like there's fewer of them. So uh what would you say the overall like I know I know obviously that there's no night hunting uh or no thermal hunting in in Arizona, so you're strictly day hunting pretty much, right?

SPEAKER_02

Yeah, I all I do is is day calling. I can drive about an hour and a half and do night calling with lights. Uh it's just something I haven't really done yet. You know, I'm in I'm in bed by nine and up at three in the morning during the work week, so right. Kind of fits my schedule.

SPEAKER_03

Yeah, no, I don't blame you. Uh you can't beat uh some good day calling action. And um, if you get you guys will have to check out Dakota's YouTube channel. Uh it's called, like I said, obsessed predator calling. Uh, and he's in that like um it's almost like brush country kind of a lot of like unique looking. Um it looks like you can't see very far normally. Like, what's your average shot down there?

SPEAKER_02

So I'd say my average shot is probably anywhere from 20 to 40 yards. Holy smokes. Um we I can travel an hour and a half, two hours and be in the rolling hill country. It's just I like hunting the thick brush. It's it's a lot of fun get in there tight with them with a rifle, and I'm getting them hard charging my call. That's just something I like to do. But for filming purposes, I need to start going to the more rolling hills and watch them come from a ways. But I just I just like getting in tight with a rifle instead of a shotgun and and getting them on the move. That's why most of my videos they're running over my call. I like getting in tight with them.

SPEAKER_03

Yeah, for sure. And uh you posted a video the other day kind of of your recap of your stand. Um, and you had I now I don't know if you did it for the picture or for the video. I'm just asking, did did you you use two calls? Or did you just have the two sitting there?

SPEAKER_02

I just I just had two sitting there for the picture. Uh I kind of alternate back and forth sometimes depending on what I'm feeling. Um, I always take a backup call with me, and I like this I like to alternate them, play around with different stuff. And I have tried multiple calls at the same time, but it's just too much of a pain trying to keep up with two remote, two remotes.

SPEAKER_03

So, yeah, I could see that. Yeah, I I would agree with that. That would be difficult to do. Um, I have a hard enough time with one remote and not you know dropping it and uh you know clanking it off my binoculars or whatever it is, but uh yeah, I I agree. Um, do you have okay? So I know in the picture, I believe it was a shockwave and an X24. Do you have like is one of them better for one thing than the other thing? Or what's your view on that?

SPEAKER_02

So the X24 is by far my my favorite caller. Uh the X wave, I just got it because I've always wanted it for a long time. And uh I just I was able to pick it up and I've just been playing with it. But uh the X24 is by far my favorite call. I mean, it's super small, compact, you got the loud volume, pretty much got everything you need.

SPEAKER_03

Yeah, for sure.

SPEAKER_02

The X Wave, you can play, you know, you can play multiple sounds on it, and then you also got the Fox motion, and it's still kind of a smaller unit, but it's just something I'm playing around with. I like to I like to dabble in a little bit of everything, I guess.

SPEAKER_03

Yeah, yeah, me too. I totally hear hear you there. Uh and I know uh you typically do you typically shoot 223 uh or do you bounce around calibers too?

SPEAKER_02

So I mainly shoot 223, I also do 243 and then uh a 224 Valkyrie. I just got into gas guns like two years ago, so I'm still kind of having fun with the AR thing because it's always been a bolt gun until two years ago, and uh I'm probably going back to the bolt gun, but I'm still having fun with you know with the ARs.

SPEAKER_03

Yeah, I noticed that in your picture the other day um that you're shooting a gas gun, and uh I wondered too too if you like were set on the gas gun or if you like like if I'd obviously in that that tight country, I could see where having an AR would be nice when they come bombing in on you, you know, with that looks like uh L VPO on there, and um you're able to probably get on target quick and get them killed and uh have a quick follow-up shot if you need, because you probably I can't imagine you get too many shots off before they're gone, you know.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah, you you don't, and it is nice having AR. I mean, I have multiple videos out there of calling in two or several of them and get them all rolled up on the run out. It's just it is quick, it is nice, it's got a 16-inch barrel, one by six, so I can get on them fast. Uh I think it's a super useful tool for Thai country and calling coyotes, right? Uh, but when when I go to northern Arizona or Southern Arizona, I I I like a little bit bigger caliber, so like my 243, uh, just a little bit more knockdown. Further shots, their furs a little thicker. Yeah, and I have I start getting spinners when I get into more colder country. Uh, so it's I'm just going on a limb and saying it's their fur has something to do with it too. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03

So I've heard that before. I've heard that uh the big furry ones will have thicker uh hides and like in the west, and you know, where where that wherever they get, you know, more furred up. Maybe I'm just used to the really furred up ones. I don't know, because I'm in the north. So they don't have much fur down here where I'm at.

SPEAKER_02

I mean, it's it's pretty much hot. You get some nice weather in the morning, then it's warming up pretty quick. So they they don't have much for fur here.

SPEAKER_03

Yeah, I've seen uh that on your some of your videos before, and then it seems like like almost randomly, like you'll just shoot a night a good like a one that looks pretty good or more furred up, but uh, and then the next one might be like ratty isn't the word for it, but you know, a lot less hair.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah, well, like I said, you can drive pretty much from where I'm at, you can drive an hour, hour and a half, and get into a totally different country, totally different temperature. I mean, two and a half hours from me, there's a bunch of snow right now.

SPEAKER_03

Huh?

SPEAKER_02

It just kind of depends where you're at in the state to get the different fur, the different temperature and stuff on the coyotes.

SPEAKER_03

Yeah, that makes sense. Do you have out of all your guns and calibers and things, do you have a favorite?

SPEAKER_02

Um, it's gonna be my 223, my my little cheap AR platform right now. Like I said, I just got into gas guns and I've I've had a blast with that thing.

SPEAKER_03

Yeah, for a lot of cheap. For sure. Uh, and what do you what can is it on there?

SPEAKER_02

So I got the Diligent Defense Enticer TIS. Okay. See, I just got it probably about a month ago. And so far I'm really liking that thing.

SPEAKER_03

Yeah. Just have an adjustable gas block and you're able to tune it up, or do you not have no?

SPEAKER_02

I I don't have that. I just have a standard little AR set up and I'm just running it, it shoots lights out, so I just do you get much for gas in your face? Uh a little bit at first. Now I I just I don't notice it.

SPEAKER_03

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02

I mean, I I'm sure I get some, but I just I don't really notice it.

SPEAKER_03

Yep, no, I get you. It's not yeah, and it's yeah, I've only seen it a few times where it's not great, but usually it's not that bad. You know, uh it's yeah, it's just uh some it's weird, like sometimes you'll throw a can on a gas gun and all of a sudden it's super super gassy and you have malfunctions and troubles, and then sometimes you screw it on and it's works just perfect. It just depends how the you know the back pressure is and all the different things, but you have uh what is that have a is that a 30 cal suppressor or do you have a different end cap on it?

SPEAKER_02

So it's a 30 cal can, but I have the six millimeter n cap on it.

SPEAKER_03

That's what I thought. Do you like it?

SPEAKER_02

And uh yeah, yeah, I I I really enjoy it so far. Um I don't know. I've took it out probably four or five times so far, it's been really good to me.

SPEAKER_03

Yeah. Did you have other cans before you?

SPEAKER_02

I dropped my 243 off. Uh yeah. So I had a silent AF can. Um I mean it was a good can also. All the cans I've ran have been they're all good cans. I mean, they do they do their job, you know what I mean?

SPEAKER_05

Yep.

SPEAKER_02

Um I'm I'm kind of newer into the cans and experimenting with other cans, so I can't really say much on the suppressor stuff.

SPEAKER_03

Yeah, no.

SPEAKER_02

Some people are super high-tech and going for that.

SPEAKER_03

I'm not either. I just like the the sound is what I care about, and like when I've bought cans, all I care about is like, hey, what does it sound like? How you know, and I just ask people those questions. Like, I don't like the length, the weight, the all that stuff is not real uh relevant to me. It's just more so I care about the the sound, and I don't know the tech, you know, tech behind all of it. And you know, I know the difference between a flow and uh you know standard, you know, baffle can or a 3D printed, you know, things like that. But I mean other than that, you know, I couldn't tell you the the like I've had people tell me like, oh, it has this baffle construction, so it'll be quieter, and I'm like, well, I don't even know what that means, but perfect. That's all I needed. All I heard was it's quieter.

SPEAKER_02

Well, that's why I want to go back to my 243 bowl gun, is just to have that little bit, you know, it can be quieter, so I'm just waiting for it to get finished, threaded up, and then I'll probably go back to using that.

SPEAKER_03

Yeah, I yeah, I really like this the 243 and the bowl gun. Um, yeah, just like you said, you know, you I shot I actually shot a ton, a ton of coyotes with the two with a 223, and I would just know you know, I would just have a spinner, a spinner occasionally, and usually like pushing that 300, you know, to 350 range. Um, but I just don't have that. It was my 243, and I got so used to now, like just everything is just pretty much dead right on the spot that I don't you know I have a hard time not using it. Uh I'm gonna I'm gonna try a six creed at some point here, but uh and then I'm gonna see if I like that the same or better or if it's any different even.

SPEAKER_02

But yeah, I ran the six creed a little bit. That's what uh Stacy Morris runs, and that gun, that gun's a hammer. Yeah, it's it's a hammer.

SPEAKER_03

Yeah, I'm excited. Uh just you know, I just for some reason I don't know, I don't know what it is, but there's just something fun about trying new stuff, you know. And oh yeah, you know, it's as a predator hunter, we have so many things we can try. There's new sounds, there's new calls, there's new, you know, hand calls, e-calls, mouth calls, uh, you name it. But uh, I feel like uh especially nowadays with the sounds, um, it seems like there's always something new coming out, and every time, every time you think you need to try it.

SPEAKER_02

I I'm a sound person, I love the new sounds. I run a lot of sounds on one stand, and I just I I think it helps a lot, especially with the ones that are just released, but that's my opinion. But I run I run a lot of sounds on one stand, it's just something I like to do.

SPEAKER_03

Yeah, because I mean down in Arizona, you're primarily hunting public ground, I presume. Uh there's probably you know, it's a it's a very public land heavy state where uh there is a lot of public land to hunt. So I'm sure at any given time, you know, you're probably you're hunting dogs that have potentially you know heard call at some point.

SPEAKER_02

But yeah, uh well, even even the private land here, if it's not posted, you can go on it and hunt it. Um, unless the owner comes up to you, then you have to leave. But I mean, in reality, you can pretty much hunt anywhere you want in the state. We have gone in and you know, we could see drag drag marks for someone just shot a coyote and stuff, so that's really have to start changing up your strategy and how you call, where you call to stay consistent. I mean, we have a bunch of coyotes, yeah, but we also have a ton of callers, and to kill consistently, you kind of have to think outside the box a little bit, I guess would be the best way to put it.

SPEAKER_03

Yeah, yeah, I agree. Uh what so on that note, what are some outside the box things that uh you're doing to stay ahead of it? And um, how do you um well let's start with that question? Um, how do how do you kind of think out the box and try to you know stay on top of it?

SPEAKER_02

So I look, I I got I'm e-scouting all the time and I look for super super thick stuff that most people don't want to walk through. And I get on there and e-scout and look for like a little opening in the back of it or in the in the middle of it, and most people don't want to walk through that. Second thing is for years it's been said walk walk further to your stands. So a lot of people are going further back, and I started not going as far. Yep, and I start I started killing them again. Now I can't say for sure that's the reasoning, but seems like when I started not going as far, I started killing again, and you always hear go further, go further, go further. And I've had really good luck on not on not doing that and staying to the thicker stuff. Most people want the beautiful wide open stand where you can see a ways, and I you know, 50 yard openings and stuff, or 30 yard openings is been really good for me.

SPEAKER_03

Right. Yeah, that makes sense. Um, I think uh I've seen that here, um, but I'm we're still on the opposite one. Uh because with night hunting, everybody just sets up, you know, right in the easy spot, right in the right off the road, right out, you know, everyone just sits sticks right in the easy spot, you know. So I'm still I'm like I'm in the same boat of like I'm going a little farther, or just or just maybe just a little different access point, or you know, something just a little different than the standard, you know, oh this this this is the spot that looks good, you know, and because that's the spot everybody's calling.

SPEAKER_02

Drive three four hundred yards down the road where it's not as good access, and then walk in right there into the into the thicket instead of calling on the other side of the thicket.

SPEAKER_03

Yeah, that makes sense. Yeah, and uh you are a sound guy, and you you said you play a lot of sounds. What what does that look like on a stand?

SPEAKER_02

So I guess it depends on the year and kind of where where I'm at. Different areas here have more pressure than than other areas, which I can go over that in a minute. But so we'll say this time of year I start off with like a small rodent sound, kind of lower volume if one's close, just like what happened to me yesterday. I mean, yeah, he was sleeping 50 yards away from me. But uh I usually play a sound for about a minute and a half, and then I'm rolling into the next one, rolling into the next one, minute and a half, two minutes, and I'm just consistently changing that for 10 to 15 minutes.

SPEAKER_05

Yep.

SPEAKER_02

Uh I don't really do any pauses unless I'm kind of in a heavy pressured area, then I'll throw in some pauses, but I'm just consistently changing the sounds up every minute, minute and a half, two minutes.

SPEAKER_03

Huh. Yeah. And uh you're you are kind of like I said in most of your videos, they kind of dive bomb in on you a little bit. And uh do you think that that helps like keep them coming by keeping sound going? Um and you know, kind of eliminates that, not eliminates it, but you know, kind of gets them the like you what I what I see happen is like even when like uh like for example, um MFK's cocktail sauce, if you if you've ever played it, it will like play through and then it like has like a pause in it, like and I've seen coyotes coming into it, and like it'll hit that pause for you know 10 seconds or whatever it is, and they'll they'll stop if yeah and sit and stand there until it comes back on again, and then they'll just keep coming again. And like seeing coyotes come from distance to sounds like that has made me certainly pause less because I see that what they do when the sound pauses, if they're coming.

SPEAKER_02

Most of them come in probably a few seconds right after the sound change. So, I mean, I I'd want to say it does help and it kind of makes a different type of trigger. Uh, there has been just a few times where I've seen it kick me in the butt. So, say, yeah, if if I'm in kind of a pressured area and I'm playing vocals and I decide to play like a rodent at the end, I've seen them coming in and then my fingers going down to switch the sound when I see them, and as soon as they hear it is stressed, they they turn tail and run. Right. But for the most part, they they bomb in right after the sound change. I mean, within I'd say 20-30 seconds, most of them. I mean, not all not all the time, but I would say 80% of the time it's right after my sound change. Yeah, I would agree. It's hard to say if they're on the way or not, but I'd like to think it it helps, you know.

SPEAKER_03

Yeah, I always think that too. Like, I'm always like, Well, you I I think that a lot of times I noticed that they, you know, showed themselves after I switched sounds too. Um, but I always am like, wait, so was he coming to that last sound and then like he just made it out here on this one? Or you know, I don't know, because like a lot of the times I'm not seeing them uh you know to that point. But you know, I'm I'm most of the country I hunt, I'm able to see enough to where like I've had them come, you know, to 500 yards and sit down, and then I've rifled through you know six or eight sounds before finally I found something that they come keep coming to. And yeah, it's interesting. Obviously, um most of your stands are a little more fast to action, but like being able to see them come like that um has definitely changed a lot of my perspective on you know changing sounds and you know like it's kind of like uh I I know I've heard like Tori Cook talk about like finding the trigger, you know, finding what their trigger is, um, what's gonna trigger them. And it's weird when you actually see one and you play, you know, a cotton tail, you play a pup fight, you play whatever, and then all of a sudden they're what. Sound gets them to break. And I've seen it, I've seen it the opposite direction too, where I played fights and pup sounds and everything, and then all of a sudden I turn on cotton tail and hear that here they come.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah, I I've seen it a couple times too. It's it's super nice to watch and be able to see that to kind of see how they interact with the call and stuff on what sounds they they do trigger on. Um I have noticed if you if you can find one that day that they are coming to, they usually all come to that one sound. Not down here, not necessarily the sequence, but that one sound for some reason that day is the one they want to come in on.

SPEAKER_03

Interesting. Yeah, I uh ironically noticed when I was in Wyoming here a week or two ago. Now um every single hard charger that came in was two pound town. And I was like, man, I should just sit down, play pound town, and see if they come in. Not actually, but um I've done it, it worked. Yeah, I'm sure it would. And I just like it was just ironic. Um, you know, you do it once, you do it twice, you do it three times, you think, okay, this is this is getting weird, and then it happens again, and then you start thinking, okay, maybe I should just come out here and play pound town and go to the next stand. But uh, it's just funny um that you say that because I just saw I had this happen to me uh a week or two ago, and I've never I've never had that happen, I don't think. Like, I don't know what it is about Wisconsin up here and where I'm at. I don't know if it's just because of the pressure or what, but like I'll have guys ask me all the time, you know, of course, the age old question of what sound is working or what they're coming into. And uh most of the time I'm like, man, came into distress on this stand, they came into a pup fight on that stand, they came into you know lone howl on that stand. It's usually a very mixed bag up here. Um, and I just don't know if it's just a pressure deal, and you know, there's just so much more pressure that they it creates this randomness, but I don't know, it's interesting though.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah, it it the sound changes pretty much every day, from what I've noticed. I mean, for instance, a few weeks ago, me and my buddy Travis, he's the one that runs the Instagram for me because I'm not a big Instagram person, the obsessed one. We were out, and like the day before they were calling on distress. The next day, we we seen a coyote hit distress, nothing to do with it. So I was like, I'm gonna cut out distress and just go to breeding sounds and fights. Soon as I took distress out of it, they started bombing the call again, and we got some killed, and it just it changes every day. And yeah, when someone asked me about sounds, it just you know, hey, this is what I'm doing this time of year, but don't be scared to switch it up because it it changes so much, you know what I mean? Like, yeah, new stands, nothing, try something else, take this out, put this in, type of deal. Just I mean, that's that's here in Arizona. I think every state may be a little different, not too sure, but that's just from my experience on it.

SPEAKER_03

Yeah, I agree. I think uh you definitely have to change it up, and I think uh I think a lot of times that can be you know, I'm not, I guess I don't know for sure, but I think a lot of times it can be pressure related, like if if they've heard you know rabbit distress from you know four other guys in the last two weeks, like yeah, I don't think rabbit distress is maybe as effective, but you know, if they didn't hear uh, you know, pup distress three or whatever, you know, is is it is that gonna be something that might work, you know, in that area, you know, if it's something a little bit different. I know you said you're you you're you're always using different sounds and stuff, and I think that's where you know using different different sounds can be a tool. I mean, you know, to be able to kind of mitigate pressure, I guess, or at least or at least make me feel like I am. Exactly.

SPEAKER_02

It gives you the the confidence, and that's basically what you need. Right.

SPEAKER_03

Yeah, that way when one shows up, you expected it to show up, and it's not like, oh crap, I wasn't I didn't think that was gonna happen, you know.

SPEAKER_02

So on the you know, I everybody knows what areas have more pressure in their area than other areas. So like like here there's certain areas that everybody calls, right? So once summertime hits, say June, July, is when I start going to those super pressured areas, and I can start killing those coyotes, and I'll hunt that until around Halloween, and then I'll go to the areas that I know don't don't get that much pressure to kind of switch up the areas, you know what I mean?

SPEAKER_05

Yep.

SPEAKER_02

But I do know in the summertime I can locate before the sun comes up, move in tight to those pressured coyotes and start killing the educated ones out. I mean, that's that's what I tell myself to give me confidence to go into the pressured areas. Yeah, but I have noticed once I do that, I can go in the pressured areas in the summertime and start killing some of those older coyotes, and then I can do the early season and do really good until it starts getting, you know, someone's calling it every every day, you know, a different person. And that's something I kind of do to switch up ground and pressured and non-pressured areas is wait for that summertime to go in there and try to thin those ones out a little bit.

SPEAKER_03

Yeah, I completely agree with you there. Um, I do think that's a great tactic. I do something similar, uh just you know, identifying those, you know, pressured areas and get and just getting in there at a different time. You're also talking about a different, you know, whole different life, you know, the coyotes are at a completely different life, you know, stage of life cycle to where they are a little bit more protective um and aggressive. So uh at least my opinion, my experience with that time of year, it can be you know a little bit, you know, they they are in a different mind space than they are, you know. It's a blast. Yeah, it is.

SPEAKER_02

I uh summer calling.

SPEAKER_03

I mean, it gets hot as I'll get out here, but he's gonna say it's a hundred degrees by 8 a.m. probably.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah, I mean it it will get to 118 and still calm. I I love it.

SPEAKER_03

That's so hot. That is that's crazy. I don't if it was 118, I think they would cancel school here.

SPEAKER_02

I mean, the sun's up at five, do two stands, and you know, home by eight, nine depends how far I drive. I mean, yeah, like I said, I drive sometimes up two hours for three stands. Um you know, when I go out, I do one to three, four, or five stands and come home. Uh, I do a couple full day hunts throughout the year, but mainly I just go kill one to four and then come on home. You know what I mean? Yep.

SPEAKER_03

Yep. Yep, I agree. Uh I I'm in the same boat too. Uh obviously, with we both have young kids, and you know, it's nice to be uh not gone all day every day. Um you know, you're gone all week pretty much at work, and then you turn around and you're gone all weekend, it's not as easy uh as it once was, you know. So uh yeah, I agree. And when you are going on a stand, what what's all coming with you? Because I know you film and you do, you know, different or you try to film everything, I'm sure, but what what's all coming with you?

SPEAKER_01

So I take I take my tripod, uh, switch over to a tripod. I take my X24 or Foxbro and my rifle and a bino harness with some binos, and that's it.

SPEAKER_02

I I stand everywhere here. Oh unl unless I go up to northern Arizona or southern, I stand. So basically just my tripod rifle call bino harness, and that's about it. I always take some mouth calls and diaphragms with me, also, and mix in with the stand sometimes, but that's that's basically it. I take uh I have a small camcorder. Uh it's thick here, so my camera setup is on the same tripod. I I don't do a separate tripod, and my buddy comes with me and helps film, so it that's all connected together on the same tripod.

SPEAKER_03

Nice. That's pretty sweet. Uh yeah, I didn't think about you standing, but honestly, from watching some of your videos, as soon as you said it, it makes complete sense uh that you would stand. I mean, because it's so thick and you sitting on the ground, I'm guessing you get less visual than when you stand.

SPEAKER_02

Well, not only that, but I can I can see him coming sooner and I can spin better than sitting on the ground and trying to pivot. I can just rotate my feet and and get on them quick.

SPEAKER_03

Yeah, for sure. Do you have to worry about the sun? Like, do you do you have to try to call with the sun at your back? Do you have to uh does it when it's in your face, does it give you trouble with you know coyote seeing you, or you think means you're in a lot of times in that thicker cover that it doesn't affect you as much?

SPEAKER_02

So I I try to play the sun and the wind, but sometimes you can't do it all the time. Uh my theory is I mean, I don't really wear camo or base colors, it's it's more a movement and just getting a good backdrop behind you, or even in front of you, even and just your top half sticking over. Yeah, uh, I mean, I I have them running right by me at 15, 20 yards and they don't see me. I I think it's more movement more than anything.

SPEAKER_03

Yeah, I agree. Uh, I think too, that's one of the biggest mistakes a guy can make is like that that kind of old crap moment that people have when they see uh one piling in or you know, catch a glimpse of one coming in is they immediately want to move and you know, kind of do that panic move or like uh kind of almost startles them and it can cause uh I think them to see you a little bit or oh yeah.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah, that fast movement, they they catch quick. I try to I try to position my call from where I think they're coming from, like hard left or hard right away from me, to so I can try to get the camcorder on them and they don't pick up that movement.

SPEAKER_03

But uh, I mean sometimes they surprise you and come from a complete different direction, but I was gonna say they probably do out there in that thick stuff, they probably pop up from anywhere at times.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah, I mean we we have good openings too. I mean, we can see them coming from a ways, you know, 100 yards or so, but most of the time I'm I'm trying to call the more thicker stuff to get the numbers.

SPEAKER_03

Yeah, makes sense. Do you have trouble uh getting them like stopped in an opening and killed? Or do you shoot them on the move a lot? Or how does that go? Because it seems there's all these like it seems like there's just like stuff everywhere to where like like not like to where you can't see but where shooting would become you know so my it's just something I like to do.

SPEAKER_02

Most of my videos you see I should I they're on the they're on the move. Um I mute the call and sometimes they'll stop, but I've noticed here if you try to whoop them or howl at them, they they turn and burn or they pick up the pace. Uh the early season they'll stop, but you know, after I feel like Halloween, they if you try to get them to stop besides pausing the call, they they turn and burn. You don't really get an opportunity. So I just shoot them on the run in or on the trot end. That's it's just yeah, it's something I like to do, and it makes kind of my videos I I don't know, to me, a little bit more entertaining.

SPEAKER_03

Yeah, yeah. Different too.

unknown

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03

Yeah, well, it makes sense if you're shooting them close. I mean, it it kind of makes sense to me. I mean, I don't shoot them moving very often, but I'm also you know, shooting them at 180 to 300 yards, you know. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02

Uh when when Travis comes with me and we film together, or I take new people out, then I I do everything I can to get them to stop. But when it's just me solo hunting, I just shoot him on the move.

SPEAKER_03

Yeah, that makes sense. Yeah, that one you put the other day, the one that kind of comes from the right, and it didn't look like it was well, what how far was it again? Was it 15 yards? Yeah, it was it was about 20 yards, yeah. And the thing just locked up and went feet straight up in the air.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah, he uh I I like to run the decoy just you know, if there's a cat around and that thing, if it's going, they're not they're not stopping.

SPEAKER_03

They're they're locked in. Yep, that's my experience too with the decoy. Do you have many cats there? We have quite a few cats, yeah.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah, uh, I've I've killed quite a few. I I need to target them a little more, but usually I just I I like to run and gun for coyotes, you know, in and out, in and out. I'm not a very patient person. Uh, but most of the cats I kill are within seven minutes.

SPEAKER_03

Yeah, I agree. Uh I'm not very patient either. It's one of the hardest things for me to do is to call cats. Like uh, I killed uh my cat um this year and it didn't come in until like 30 some minutes, and I was ready to leave so much sooner than that. Or I'd be on a stand thinking I'm cat hunting, and then I would coyotes would howl and I'd immediately just throw everything out the window and just I would just want to kill the coyotes and I would for completely forget about the cats. So uh yeah, my patience level is not there either for cats. I always tell people that I really love killing cats or calling them in, but I hate hunting them. Exactly.

SPEAKER_02

Well, I keep I keep trying to go for uh mountain lions, and I'll make the trip. I'm like, all right, I'm serious, I'm gonna do it this time. And I always end up seeing a coyote or hearing one howl, and then I just go into coyote mode and the lion thing goes out the window. I just need to focus on it and actually get it done because I mean, within 10 minutes, I'm like, all right, I'm antsy, I'm ready to go.

SPEAKER_03

Yeah, no, exactly. Me too. I uh I feel the same exact way. It is, I mean, yeah, it's just there's something about the fast pace of coyote hunting that just is fun and like it's almost like that, you know, kind of mindset of if it doesn't work or you don't call one in, we can just get to the next stand. And the faster I can get to the next stand, the better chance I have to call one in. Yep.

SPEAKER_02

Well, uh, like I said, that's when they're calling the me trying to get the extra stuff in the filming goes out the window, and I'm just in I get into kill mode and go, go, go, and I just start busting out stands. It's just something I I like to do. To me, that's that's my pleasure hunting is the run and gun type style. We can't do contest here, so that's just kind of my my way to hunt them, I guess. Right.

SPEAKER_03

Yeah, that makes sense. And uh, since you don't use a shotgun and you shoot these a lot of these coyotes really close, do you shoot any certain bullet or what kind of bullets do you shoot typically?

SPEAKER_02

Uh I do use a shotgun every every now and then, but I I shoot the 55 grain V Max uh out of my 223, and it just I've had good luck with it. I mean, it just it stones them right there. I mean a good shot placement, and they're they're going stiff.

SPEAKER_03

Yeah, that makes sense. Um, and you're shooting factory ammo, I presume. Yeah, nice. Yep, factory. Nice. Yeah, I had a lot of good luck too. Uh when I shot 223, that's what I shot too, was the 55 grain V Max, and I had good luck with it. I locked up a lot of coyotes with that gun, and uh, I actually really liked shooting them with it. I just I you know, just over time, just like I said, I just am always trying something different and just yeah, but great, great gun.

SPEAKER_02

I think if I was shooting past a hundred yards consistently, I would not really use it. Yeah, but for a hundred yards and in, it's just it's it's cheap to shoot. Um yeah, that's true.

SPEAKER_03

That's true.

SPEAKER_02

I mean, yeah.

SPEAKER_03

It works. Uh yeah, that makes sense. Okay, and you can't okay, so let's kind of talk a little bit more about Arizona because you there's a lot of different rules there, like with night hunting, with no contests, with um, you know, uh some of that stuff obviously is gonna help the day hunter, um, limit pressure, um, sort of, but it's still but the thing that's the weird about it to me is like or from the outside looking in, of course, is just everyone has to do the same stuff almost. Like, there's no like way to be real different, you know what I mean? Other than with your sounds and your you know, approach. Like, you can't just oh, this area gets pressured, I'm gonna night hunt it, you know. Yep.

SPEAKER_02

They so you you can night hunt certain areas certain times of year, art artificial light only. Uh so yeah, every everybody's out day calling, but most of them get in it and then they get right back out of it, and they really don't try to play the wind, they don't really try to put in the effort, they just go out and have a good time, hit some dirt roads type of deal. But I mean, we have I feel like we have a really good population of coyotes, and there's so much public ground, you can get into places where people don't really call. Yeah, um, I mean, it probably gets called, but if you east out enough and try hard enough, you can get into you can get into areas that don't get really pressured that that much to can to stay consistent on killing.

SPEAKER_03

Yeah. Do you have um in the fall and such when like your elk seasons and your big game seasons are in, do you have uh more trouble kind of finding places to call like that, or is there just enough area that you can and you know kind of areas where people will be and won't be?

SPEAKER_02

So that depends on the on the on the place in Arizona, right? So you go to northern Arizona, that's where all your elk hunting's at. Southern Arizona is mule deer, coos deer around here is is mule deer, yep, in the Sonoran desert, but there is areas that the deer are, and then there's areas the deer aren't. Uh once the once the deer hunting starts, it does get a little harder because of all the pressure. You just have to kind of move your stands, move your areas to stay out of people's way. Uh, it's hard to get a big game tag here, so I don't want to mess anyone's once in a lifetime hunt up. But kind of where I'm at, I really don't have to worry about that stuff.

SPEAKER_04

Yeah, you know, it doesn't make sense.

SPEAKER_02

When you get up in northern Arizona and Southern Arizona is when you kind of have to really take that in consideration. Yeah, for sure.

SPEAKER_03

Yeah, it takes uh takes guys 20 to 20 plus years to get an elk tag there. They probably don't want to roll up on a guy trying to do some coyote stands.

SPEAKER_02

Exactly. That's why I put in for the the hard units. I do some OTC OTC OTC stuff, and I don't get nothing big, but I get the meat, and that's that's all that matters for me.

SPEAKER_03

Totally. Did you have a video the other day uh that was a uh coyote in town?

SPEAKER_02

Yeah, that was uh I was on my I was on my break eating, I looked out the window and there was a coyote coming through the parking lot. There is there's a lot of city coyotes in in Phoenix and Tucson and all that stuff. There is a healthy population of them.

SPEAKER_03

Huh. That's crazy. I've never seen one uh in town or anything like that before.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah, they're all over the place. They just roam the sidewalks and everything. I mean, they just look at you and you know, they just keep going. They really don't care.

SPEAKER_03

Wow. That would be that would be weird. We have we have uh red fox a little bit. Like I had one on my door camera the other night at my house, but like it's there there's some red fox that will like kind of linger around town a little bit, but like for the most part, we don't really have coyotes uh that clump that close. Uh I did hear one last night. I I got woken up from one that was howling, and it had to be, you know, probably seven, eight hundred yards from my house. I live right on the edge of town though, so it's not like it was, you know, it certainly wasn't in town, but uh that would be weird. I think people up here would panic if they saw a coyote in town. Oh, really?

SPEAKER_04

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_02

It's kind of I mean, I've seen them in front of my kids' school and stuff. They mainly come in at at night time, you know, especially when it's dry. You know, we've been in a drought pretty bad. They come in for food and all that stuff, try to grab people's pets. It it actually happens a lot here.

SPEAKER_03

Yeah, I could see that. See, because like it's stuff like that down there that people up here see videos of, and then they everybody thinks that you know, if there's a cow around, it's gonna eat all their pets, and uh which it which obviously it does happen. Uh uh, we just thankfully don't have um them coming really into town uh like like down there. But I've I've heard that before, but like that video you had with

SPEAKER_02

like it looked like a decent sized coyote like broad daylight in town I was like wow he was eating the geese across the street on the pond I mean that's where he was coming from he was he was healthy you know last year I think it was last year there was a coyote in a certain area that I think it snatched two different kids and it tried I mean it went after him and that that was just last year so the city coyotes I mean they need to do something about them they're yeah for sure there's a good population of them yeah have you ever traveled anywhere and hunted coyotes in other states uh yeah I went to New Mexico Texas I'm from Arkansas Oklahoma area so I used to hunt down there a lot and that's Colorado and that's that's about it.

SPEAKER_03

Did is Arizona your favorite place to call it yeah okay if you if you couldn't call Arizona where would be your next place to go uh probably New Mexico yeah very similar right or is or is New Mexico is probably probably a little more it's similar yeah it's it's a little more open it's just the public land thing is a huge it's a huge benefit I mean I don't have to worry about trying to get land running out of stands uh I do miss calling back in Arkansas Oklahoma area you know that's super fun to call but I like it here in Arizona I do want to try the thermal thing though I've never even seen a thermal I've never looked through a thermal so I I'm always watching all these thermal videos you know like oh man this looks like a blast yeah it's fun uh it's it's fun but it's nothing like uh day hunting I mean you you would probably get a kick out of it for a little bot a little while I'm sure like just it being new and different and then I'm guessing like you'd probably be really good at it because you if you can master the nerves of like the day hunting and Kyle's charging in like the thermal hunting doesn't compare in my in my opinion like the day hunting and like the intensity of a day stand and the excitement is so much higher it just makes uh your next thermal stand feel like it's you know just not quite as exciting I guess.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah you just got to be able to pattern them like I guess for night like daytime my first stand or second stand I want to find their travel route from their food source to their bedding and then once the sun's up I need to find what what they like to bed in and what they like bed around and I guess I would probably struggle at night trying to figure out where they are at nighttime instead of verse daytime the morning versus midday versus right evening time.

SPEAKER_03

Yeah that makes sense and like that that's a good point though like with the public land because where I'm at it's all permission like we have very little public land like you know I have to I have to you know text five landowners you know before if I've even thinking about hitting you know their place and always you know trying to keep talking to landowners get new spots you know figure out where people are hunting if other people are hunting these properties um you know it's just kind of a like you know a lot of guys have to really like manage their spots and manage their landowners is a whole another portion of you know the hunting up here uh like when I was in Wyoming last week you know we just rolled and hunted public land like I never had to worry about you know running out of spots or it was just keep driving to the next you know yep so that part's nice e even with the public land it's still you know I can drive four hours pretty much any direction and call along the way but it still takes a good amount of work to to kill a lot per year you know putting in the miles the the time and all that stuff so I mean it's still it it's easier to find land but it still takes a lot of work to to to stay in them consistently for sure for sure yeah and and like you said just kind of knowing where there's pressure uh being able to just work around it figure out be different and that's a huge part of it I think just being different is always helpful like up here out there I feel like that's you know can be something that everybody uses everywhere is when you are up against pressure you're up against conditions just try different things uh don't be afraid to play a sound that you might think hmm I wonder what this sounds like yep and scouting I feel like scouting and knowing where they're at for that time of day is is is crucial. Yeah I I agree actually when I was in Wyoming I really was that was one thing that I struggled with was that big huge country I did I thought there was gonna be coyotes everywhere kind of I guess I've I'm like used to you know everywhere I've been there's pretty much been coyotes you know pretty pretty available everywhere you know but like that that huge huge country I don't know if it was just the time of year if it was weather if it what it possibly was but it seemed like they were really pocketed like there was one there there was two over here there was you know and I wish you know obviously learning experiences my first time going out there but like things like that that I'm like man what what is it or what am I I don't know what I'm looking for you know I don't know what exactly I should be keying in on to hunt you know this midday or this night nights were actually harder for me out there than than day I never killed the coyote at night out there and that's kind of to think about but it was harder for me because I it was such big huge country and the moon was bright and I would they I would see them I would hear them but they would all be out at 1400 yards 1500 yards and just they have no reason to come any closer because they can see they got vantage they got you know and I think you know part of it would be me not knowing the country good enough you know making going into most of these stands for the first time in the dark uh it's it it was harder I thought at night it was gonna be you know they're gonna be running the call over like they were in the daytime but I feel like at the in the daytime I was able to just get a better feel for where I needed to be and being in the right spot versus at night I just you know didn't I felt like I just didn't get in the right spots all the time.

SPEAKER_02

I still struggle with that sometimes. Yeah yeah but I think you know here they they can't they can't check up at 1500 yards and check it out so I they they have to come in and poke their head up at least to see you know the curiosity get the best of them. Yeah I mean but it does suck when they check up 30 yards from you and they're on the other side of this little baby thicket and you can't can't get a shot. I mean that that gets irritating but yeah it's still still fun.

SPEAKER_03

Yeah no I agree uh I know we've kind of talked a lot about this um but one the one question I like to ask people a lot is what is something that you do that is different uh than most of the people out there than most of the people in your area I think I put in more time than most people um I mean at one point in time I was going if I had a spare hour I was going out.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah now I try to go out at least at least once a week twice a week but put in the time seeing where the coyotes are at driving the dirt roads looking for the tracks seeing bless you thank you driving the dirt roads and seeing um where where they're crossing at where they're going just spending the time out there and getting to know the areas they like and spending the time and calling and locating and to me I just I put in a lot of time.

SPEAKER_03

Yeah a lot of time and in learning where you where are good stands like exploring new country I assume I'm guessing you're always probably trying to explore new country make new stands um you know find fresh stands whatever it might be I spend hours on onyx I mean yeah I'm not in the desert I'm looking at the desert on on onyx I mean like I said I even if I'm tired from work and I want to get up I I push myself to get up and I I go out I just to me I feel like time is is probably something a little bit different than than other people here. Yeah I agree and just putting in the effort in 100% yeah no that and and also that's that's how you get experience that's how you get better that's how you learn that's how you know all the things that you uh are doing that you you know I feel like I feel like people that you know not that it's not fine like obviously if someone only likes to hunt every once in a while that's totally fine but you know someone that only goes out every you know couple of weeks or once a month for a few stands they you know if they hunted with a guy like you you'd you would be able to again handle those situations where the coyotes piling in or you know keep your cool keep your composure you know know how to respond and react in those situations because you've done it so much and well I feel like if say say you can't go out and actually physically spend the time out there get learn how to read on X the the Google maps learn what to look for on the maps and you can start picking out your stands online uh I I do that a lot once I figured out all right I need to find a water source nearby I need to find good cover and you can start picking stands out online and really benefit you if you don't if you don't have the time to physically go look at it.

SPEAKER_02

Right. Yeah I think that is it's worked in my favor a lot and once you learn how to read the maps I feel like it's a huge tool to to be able to use to to pick stands out.

SPEAKER_03

Yeah I agree. One thing that I did when I went to Wyoming was the first thing I did when I got out there was I just drove around and looked at some of these spots that I was you know eyeballing and stuff because I didn't really know what I was looking at on a map. You know I I could tell well of course you can tell some things but like some of the stuff looks like there's nothing there. Then you get out there and there's all kinds of cover and all kinds of places they can be like just being able to identify what I'm looking at uh on the on Onyx you know being in completely 360 degree different country than I'm used to hunting. So yeah uh that's you know obviously but I think it goes back to two like even even if I get a new property up here I can probably I can probably look at onyx and probably get myself in the right spot but it still always helps to see it and yeah I usually you know can get myself in about the right spot but um seeing it in the daylight always helps um but I can at night you're obviously you're you can't see so sometimes you do set up a little bit wrong or in the you know with a didn't see that one low spot where that cowout came in or whatever but um just seeing them in the daylight and you know that's the that's the one advantage of day hunting too that I like is you can see you know what you're hunting and see what you're walking into you can see tracks you can see sign you can see different things like that that you just don't see at night and um there's just a lot obviously it's dark out so there's a lot of unknown but and you can see the back of your eyelids at 9 p.m yeah no kidding yeah yeah uh yeah that's interesting I think it's super cool uh that you are able to you know get out and hunt as much as you are because I mean getting out and and calling is one of the you know my one of my favorite things to do and when you're able to get out and call that much and get coyotes killed I mean it uh it certainly do you do you hunt really anything else you I think you mentioned you hunted some OTC deer and different things and send in for some tags but obviously you can't even get that many tags as a resident right like you can't get an elk tag every year.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah I can for oh for over the counter it's a super hard hunt uh I killed a mule deer last year uh killed an elk um got my father in law and my brother-in-law their first elk over the past few years uh I'm really getting into the snoring mule deer stuff it's super hard it's a whole nother learning curve but yeah I like to I like to hunt other stuff uh just the main thing is coyotes yeah and for sure I'm super fortunate that my wife understands how much I love hunting for sure and lets me go that's why I do one three you know four stands to come home she's you know like I said once a week sometimes twice a week I'm leaving in the mornings going calling trying to come back early so that's definitely a huge benefit is her being understanding that I love to hunt and lets me spend that much time out there in the desert.

SPEAKER_03

Yeah that's huge uh I know I get that all the time too how does your wife let you do that and how do you get to hunt so much how do you get to go on those trips and do that stuff but obviously um they know how much it means to you and of course we're appreciative of being able to do it uh and um I always tell people I've always been this way I'm always like she she doesn't know anything different because I always uh you know when she met me I was still I was hunting I actually probably hunted more back then so yeah you know before kids and everything like that it was uh a little easier to go hunt all day and night and go and do whatever but um now it's I'm I'm a lot more like you I like to go make a few stands you know two three stands four stands maybe uh and you know hit some good spots get home and I'm good with that you can still get a pile on three to four stands yep absolutely I agree especially if you uh uh hit it right and uh the hard part for me is when you hit like two or three stands and you kill on all of them and you're like dang it now I now I don't want to stop yep so in in November I I just want to talk about the stand because it was the coolest stand I've ever had in November I went out and like 30 seconds into the stand I had a coyote come in and dropped it.

SPEAKER_02

I kept gone another one came in I killed five coyotes and a bobcat within eight minutes on the same stand.

SPEAKER_03

Oh my gosh.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah it was leading where did the bobcat come like what what uh so the bobcat was not second to last and it came out to a coyote fight food fight wow but I kept shooting they kept coming and it was it was one of the coolest stands I've ever had and it was the one stand I did not bring my camcorder on. Of course the story of everybody who films the stand where they didn't bring the camera yeah that is the worst I've been there way too many times but I mean it just you never know that that's what I love about clone is you never know what can happen at on any stand you know what I mean that's that's what's awesome about it.

SPEAKER_03

Yeah that's that that is what what is the most fun on it is uh that unexpected surprise and then you know when a plan comes together it it just makes it that much better. Yes sir all right Dakota I have really enjoyed this conversation and appreciate you coming on with me uh I know you are real close to a thousand subs on your YouTube channel so tell everybody what your YouTube channel is so they can go and subscribe and get you to a thousand subs. So my YouTube channel is obsessed predator calling uh same thing with Instagram obsessed predator calling I try to put out weekly content um we're trying to kick it up and do more than just kill stuff but uh yeah obsessed predator calling YouTube and Instagram and I appreciate you uh having me on here and talk about coyotes yeah man it was awesome I'll put all the your info in the description below and whatnot so guys can click on it and find it and check out your stuff um if you guys are not in my Facebook group you should be because uh Dakota posts some of his videos and kill shots and stuff in there too so another place that you can see them and keep up with it but uh yeah well I will let you go and thanks again for coming on with me.

SPEAKER_00

Yep thank you for having me have a good evening yeah you too see ya thank you for listening to this episode if you want to support the Predator Podcast check out our great partners in the description below follow Drew on Instagram at predator podcast underscore Drew join the predator podcast Facebook community and keep up with real time tips and tricks to keep putting fur in the drug until next time