Episode 112: Liz Allan and Amy Carter - Electric Trucks and Cutting-Edge Charging Solutions

Episode 112: Liz Allan and Amy Carter - Electric Trucks and Cutting-Edge Charging Solutions

Liz Allan speaks to Amy Carter, the EV Operations Manager at DAF Trucks. Amy's vast experience in the automotive industry began when she officially entered the field in 1988. Growing up around mechanics and rebuilding carburettors as a child, she quickly developed a passion for vehicles. Over the years, Amy has worked with brands like MG Rover, Mercedes-Benz, and Audi, eventually focusing on electric vehicle technology. At DAF Trucks, Amy has helped lead the charge in electric truck innovation, contributing to developing new models like the CF and LF electric trucks and working closely on launching new technologies to improve efficiency and sustainability. 

Amy Carter Bio:
Amy Carter is the EV Operations Manager at DAF Trucks, where she has played a pivotal role in the development and rollout of electric trucks. With a career that began in 1988, Amy has worked across the automotive industry for over three decades. Her experience spans from being a mechanic to technical training roles with major brands like Audi and Mercedes-Benz. Amy is also a passionate advocate for electric vehicles and sustainable transport solutions, and she brings extensive knowledge of electric vehicle technology to her current role. In addition to her professional work, Amy is a proud transgender woman, sharing her inspiring journey to living as her true self. She is also the author of a memoir, self-published on Amazon, chronicling her personal and professional journey.

Amy Carter Links:
DAF Trucks: https://www.daf.co.uk/en-gb/trucks/alternative-fuels-and-drivelines/battery-electric-vehicles
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/amy-carter-bb0215143

Episode Keywords:
DAF trucks, new generation trucks, battery electric trucks, hydrogen trucks, diesel trucks, lithium ferrophosphate batteries, LFP batteries, operational efficiency, microgrids, electric truck range, 350-kilowatt motor, zero-emission trucks, EV

Transcript

Liz Allan [00:00:01]:
Welcome to Amy Carter, who is the EV operations manager at DAF Trucks. Amy, thank you ever so much for joining me. It's lovely to see you.

Amy Carter [00:00:12]:
Hi, Liz. Absolute pleasure.

Liz Allan [00:00:15]:
We met over a 5-day period back in July, didn't we?

Amy Carter [00:00:22]:
We did. We did.

Liz Allan [00:00:23]:
Amy was on the Greenfleet EV rally that I was one of the drivers for on the women drive electric team. It was an amazing experience, very tiring, but I want to talk about that during our conversation today. It's brilliant to have you on here.

Amy Carter [00:00:43]:
Thank you.

Liz Allan [00:00:45]:
So you've been working at DAF Trucks for over 6 years. You're operations manager now, EV operations manager. You were a technical trainer and an EV specialist at DAF before that. But you've worked in automotive for what looked like a long time. Tell me about that, will you?

Amy Carter [00:01:09]:
I officially started my automotive career in 1988 when I went to college in Leicester, and I've been in the industry ever since. My dad was a mechanic, and I grew up around cars, so I could strip and rebuild a carburetor by the age of 7.

Liz Allan [00:01:28]:
Oh my god.

Amy Carter [00:01:28]:
I remember my first memory of pain was my brother turning around with a welding torch while he'd been putting some sills on his Triumph Triangle, and it burnt across my calf. It didn't do any damage; it was just quick, but that smell of burning flesh still sticks in my memory. I was like 3 at the time. That's my earliest memory of being in the motor trade. Since then - 14 years as a mechanic with various companies, cars and trucks.

Liz Allan [00:02:04]:
Mhmm.

Amy Carter [00:02:05]:
Then, at the age of 29, I went into technical training. I worked with MG Rover until they closed the business. Then, I went on to Mercedes Benz, Vauxhall, Mazda, and a few other manufacturers, but I ended up with Audi. That's where I started my electric journey. We were developing the A6 and A8 hybrid, and then we moved into e-tron. I did the technical launch for the A3 e-tron and Q7 e-tron back in those days.

Amy Carter [00:02:34]:
I project-managed all of that. Then, I left Audi not long after, just after transition, actually. I transitioned to Volkswagen Group in 2016.

Liz Allan [00:02:45]:
Mhmm.

Amy Carter [00:02:46]:
Then, in 2018, I left for DAF Trucks. And here I still am.

Liz Allan [00:12:27]: You provide a complete solution at DAF, don't you? How does that look for the companies you're selling to? Do you put charging solutions into their depots? If they're going depot to depot, they can have it in the depot, but what if they're on the road a long time and not going back to their depot?

Amy Carter [00:12:40]: It's complicated within our industry. For example, if we have a distribution specialist delivering to multiple clients, having a charger at the client's premises causes additional red tape and issues. But it can be done - if it's a long-term contract, they can factor the charging solution into the contract. The cost of the energy is offset by the cost of the distribution network and their business operations.

Back-to-base charging, along with microgrids, is becoming very popular. Where a warehouse or truck distribution centre has a large flat roof, it's ideal for solar energy. With storage batteries and chargers, you create a microgrid. You'll still use energy from the grid, but significantly less because you're storing energy you've generated throughout the day. While trucks are out working, the storage batteries build up energy. Overnight, the trucks are charged ready for morning. Or if they're double-shifted, you can have other solutions. It's never going to be completely standalone from the grid, but it means your grid energy consumption is significantly lower.

Liz Allan [00:14:04]: With the chargers that go with the microgrids, what power are we actually looking at going into those trucks? You mentioned a 500 kilowatt-hour battery - what's the top power you can get from a charger?

Amy Carter [00:14:30]: There are many variables. PACCAR, the American company that owns DAF, has a new branch called PACCAR Power Solutions involved with charger sales. Chargers are packaged alongside DAF Trucks if customers choose. Customers can have their own charging solutions if that's more appropriate, but we offer them as a service.

We qualify the customer rather than sell them a truck. We discuss their operation, how they plan to use the truck, how to get the best efficiency, and look at postcodes on typical routes to work out how the truck will integrate without operational changes. If changes are needed, like destination charging or on-route charging, we look at the most attractive and simple solution for the customer.

Then, we'll discuss charger size. We go from 7.5 kilowatts for car parks all the way up to 360 kilowatts for rapid truck charging. What you can get from a microgrid depends on factors like solar energy harvested and storage battery size. We have a dealer in Rotterdam being used as a trial for our PACCAR power solution systems, with two 180-kilowatt chargers. They're operating a fleet throughout the day but also monetizing by offering those chargers to other businesses in the area.

We're seeing this as a practical solution. In the UK, for example, First Bus depots have multiple chargers sitting empty while buses are out working. First Bus and Arriva are now monetizing this - companies like Post Office are dropping into First Bus locations to charge their vans en route.

From 2025 onwards, we will have 34 sales dealers within the 300-odd DAF truck dealer network. Each will have at least one 180-kilowatt charger, some more depending on the site. DAF customers will be able to use these chargers as part of their daily routes, with a back-office payment scheme for simple invoicing later.

Liz Allan [00:17:47]: That sounds like a really good idea because you see it in other businesses where chargers are just sitting unused. The chargers themselves cost quite a bit, so why not utilize them in other ways? When other companies use those slots, is there a booking system?

Amy Carter [00:18:24]: Not currently, but that's what we're working towards. It's in the planning stage, not live yet, but DAF and PACCAR Power Solutions hope to have a network where truck operators can drop in and arrange a charge. They'll be able to book at their local dealer and get a quick top-up charge if needed, with a simple payment solution in the background.

Liz Allan [00:18:55]: That sounds like a really good idea. How do you feel currently about the eHGV network as a whole? I suppose it's very embryonic currently?

Amy Carter [00:19:08]:
Yes, it is. The charging network in the UK, I think, is fantastic as an EV driver myself - a fairly new EV driver, I should add. I've not had any issues whatsoever. I believe there is more than enough chargers if you plan carefully. But for trucks, particularly trucks with trailers, it isn't easy. We saw this on the EV rally with the Mercedes - it's an incredible truck, but to charge in most locations, they had to decouple the trailer and move the tractor unit onto a truck charger. We would have exactly the same issues with the DAF or any other brand.

One thing I liked about the rally was when we stopped at Turbine in Leighton Buzzard. That facility had been set up specifically to allow trucks and caravans and anything with a trailer to charge easily. It was a very innovative solution, and we need to see more of that across the country. Hats off to Turbine for the brilliant work they've done there.

Liz Allan [00:20:16]:
I think that's a megawatt in that turbine because I heard the MD—I think it's AW-Energy. I was at CarFest very recently.

Amy Carter [00:20:31]:
Oh, wow.

Liz Allan [00:20:32]:
When he was talking about it, and I got to speak to him afterwards with one of his directors, they were just so brilliant talking about how the aim is to power local houses as well. Like you said, just to get everybody that ability to drive in there. The area was beautiful there in Bedfordshire.

Amy Carter [00:21:07]:
Yes, lovely. It's just off the A5, which is a major trunk road for trucks. It splits down from Northampton all the way through Bedfordshire. It's a great location, but we could do with more of them. 

DAF was involved in ZEHID - Zero Emission HDV and Infrastructure Demonstration. The government has put £200 million into a fund to allow operators to drive electric trucks, larger electric trucks over a 5-year period so we can gather data through telematics. This will prove to investors that heavy trucks work in electric applications. We need investors to invest in more charging opportunities, more destination chargers, and more motorway service chargers. Hopefully, ZEHID will pave the way through the three successful consortia - one's hydrogen specific, and the other three are battery electric and a mix of both.

Liz Allan [00:22:17]:
That brings me to another question about the trucks themselves and the number of organizations recognizing that electric trucks work. How is that looking? Is it still tricky? I'm assuming that what you're saying about the charging network might put some people off, especially with HGVs. How are you feeling about people's acceptance of electric vehicles? They're massive vehicles, aren't they?

Amy Carter [00:22:57]:
The way I look at it - and I'm going to quote the immortal words of Paul Kirby of the EV Cafe here, EV van man and commercial expert - we could keep doing what we do. We could just replace diesel trucks with electric trucks and expect them to do exactly the same thing. But that means developing huge batteries to match the diesel tank range.

That's not what we're trying to do. We're in a position now where we can reinvent the transport industry. We don't need to keep doing things the same way. Why do we have drivers sleeping in a cab for 5 days running? It's not safe - cabs get broken into, trucks get broken into in roadside laybys. We can work differently.

We could utilise more electric rail to move goods closer to their destination, then use last-mile delivery in smaller vehicles or electric trucks that can do that journey easily without needing to think about charging. It's really about taking this opportunity to redesign the automotive and logistics industry completely.

My anxieties aren't really anything - it doesn't keep me awake at night. Electric trucks work very well. Net zero is a massive consideration, of course. As your lovely husband will attest to, we need to keep below 1.5 degrees, otherwise we're all in serious trouble.

Amy Carter [00:24:53]:
I think about the more practical applications on a day-to-day basis as well. Take noise pollution, for example. I live in an inner city - London- on weekends with my partner. During the week, I live in a very quiet area of South Oxfordshire. In London, the traffic noise is ridiculous. The more electric vehicles on the road, the quieter it is. People who live in built-up urban areas can only benefit from that quieter environment, from a stress perspective and everything else.

I also think about air quality. Ella's Law has now come into play. You should have the right to live in an inner city and expect good clean air quality. It's not right that people have a lower life expectancy because they live in the city. That shouldn't be happening, and we need to stop that. Whether we think diesel works or petrol works is irrelevant - the range is one thing, and how we use these trucks in the application is another thing. But ultimately, we all deserve the right to live healthily. It shouldn't matter whether you live in a cottage in the Cotswolds or in the middle of Brixton. We should expect the same.

Liz Allan [00:26:04]:
Totally agree. I think I've said this before on the podcast - I'm originally from Yorkshire, and we had a lot of chimneys up north and lots of factories. In fact, my mom, bless her, she's no longer with us, but I remember her coming down here for the first time when I moved down in 1995, and she said, "Oh, there's not very many chimneys down here." And what they kicked out, you could see.

Amy Carter [00:26:48]:
Yeah.

Liz Allan [00:26:48]:
But what cars kick out, unless there's a problem with the car, you can't really see. I can smell it because I've got a really strong sense of smell, to my detriment sometimes. But if I can smell it, other people must be able to smell it. You've got kids walking past schools with cars left with their engines on. If it was visible, it would be different. What we need to do is like the warnings on cigarette packets. Someone said recently that when people go to petrol stations, there should be warning labels saying how many thousands die prematurely from air pollution. I don't think people know as much about this. I had somebody - we've gotten on well for years - and when I talked about air pollution and mentioned Ella, she said, "Well, that's only one little girl."

Amy Carter [00:28:05]:
Wow.

Liz Allan [00:28:06]:
Yeah. I know.

Amy Carter [00:28:07]:
That's a headline. There are many, many little girls and boys.

Liz Allan [00:28:12]:
But that's how people thinkshe's not an unintelligent person. If that's what people think, we need to up our game on this one. As you say, we are all entitled to breathe clean air.

Amy Carter [00:28:29]:
I read a headline the other day that said in India, in certain parts of built-up areas like Delhi, some children are being born with lungs that are 20% smaller purely because of the environment they're being born into.

Liz Allan [00:28:43]:
That's the scary part, isn't it?

Amy Carter [00:28:48]:
Net zero and the environment is a huge topic, of course, and it's got to be our driving force. But there are secondary factors to driving electric vehicles and other types of zero-emission transportation that will benefit us day-to-day as well as in the future. This has to be taken into consideration.

Liz Allan [00:29:11]:
Let's talk about the EV rally. We talked about this before we started recording - we call them trucks now, don't we? When did it stop being a lorry?

Amy Carter [00:29:43]:
We started last year with the 5 capital challenge, and we only entered one truck - the 19-ton LF electric. That was a challenge, I'm not going to lie, because we were using predominantly public charging opportunities with a 19-ton truck with a 5-meter wheelbase. Using car chargers was particularly challenging last year because there was no Turbine on the list for the charging points.

We had to park in some interesting ways to access the charge point, which is just behind the driver's door on the offside of the truck. We had to park at certain angles to get the relatively short charging cable to reach the truck's charger. It's a CCS2 charger, the same as any typical car these days - some are CHAdeMO, of course. It can operate from 50 kilowatts up to 150 kilowatts maximum charge rate on the LF.

In certain cases, we had to park on the opposite side of the chargers and put cones around the truck so we could position the charger the other way. We were almost on the access road to the chargers, charging from the back end. In Washington, near Tyne and Wear, we had to park on the Fastned charger basically blocking the road.

Liz Allan [00:31:12]:
Wow.

Amy Carter [00:31:13]:
There was one where we used Instavolt, I think, where we basically blocked four chargers because we had to park the truck horizontally across all the charges to charge it. We weren't popular, but we got the job done.

Liz Allan [00:31:30]:
You had no choice. So where normally is the charge port on the truck?

Amy Carter [00:31:39]:
It's always just behind the cab - if you imagine when you get out of the truck and close the door, by the door handle on your left, it's just down below that and a bit further to the left. We call it the mud wing or the front mud flap, just behind the front wheel effectively.

Liz Allan [00:31:58]:
Right. Just behind the cab.

Amy Carter [00:31:59]:
Yes. It's always on the driver's side on DAF trucks. If the truck's left-hand drive, the charge points are on the left side, and if it's right-hand drive, it's on the right side.

Liz Allan [00:32:07]:
Makes sense. It doesn't always make sense sometimes on some of the cars in my mind. I know there are reasons why charge ports are in different places, but I just wish everybody who's driven a petrol or diesel car are used to putting fuel in at the back on the left or right side. I just wish there was a way to have more consistency, but I do understand what happens. So what you're saying about your trucks makes sense to me.

Amy Carter [00:32:54]:
Yes, places like Turbine were super easy because we could just park in a long lane and the charger was in the perfect position to connect to the truck. But with car charging, it's a challenge, especially at motorway service areas because almost all the chargers are in the car area. We're having to drive into the car area in a 19-ton truck, breaking the rules of the motorway service area to reach the chargers.

In some cases, we had to go through the no-entry area because we couldn't go around the normal way due to height restriction barriers. We had to use the exit to go in where there was no height restriction. We had to break a few rules to do it. The good thing is it proves first that electric trucks work, but it also proves we need to change the way we operate.

Amy Carter [00:33:49]:
We need motorway service areas to raise their game and recognize there are vehicles other than cars that need charging. We shouldn't have trucks going the wrong way into a car park, which could potentially be dangerous. We were very careful, of course, but we shouldn't need to charge a vehicle of that size on a charger that's designed for it but not placed in an area conducive to charging that truck. Really, we need car chargers for cars and truck chargers for trucks in the same motorway service area. That's the only way it's going to work efficiently.

Liz Allan [00:34:32]:
It's not a one-size-fits-all solution, is it? I know companies like GridServe are starting their eHGV charging network.

Amy Carter [00:34:44]:
Yeah.

Liz Allan [00:34:45]:
But I know it's not something that can happen overnight.

Amy Carter [00:34:51]:
Of course.

Liz Allan [00:34:52]:
So let's go back to the rally - you were driving, weren't you?

Amy Carter [00:35:04]:
Sharing the drive with two or three other people. Ed Miles and Richard Warner - we were the three drivers of the truck and myself. It's 1500 miles, so it's a long way to drive for one person. We split the driving between us throughout the days.

Liz Allan [00:35:21]:
How easy was it this year with splitting the driving? How long did you have to stay and charge in between? Obviously, like I said to you before we started recording, it felt like we were cheating in a Tesla.

Amy Carter [00:35:47]:
We were doing okay, actually. There was a marked improvement between this year and last year. It just felt easier this year. All the checkpoints were straightforward. If we couldn't charge at all of them, sometimes we had to go off-piste and find charging elsewhere. But that was really not to do with the truck's powertrain - it was due to the size of the truck. It just didn't fit in some of the checkpoint locations.

We found it easier than last year - fewer problems. Last year, one of the biggest problems was moving from the UK mainland to Ireland. With the ferries, there was very limited charging opportunity in Scotland before we got onto the Stranraer ferry over to Ireland. That caused problems - some trucks needed to charge as soon as they got into Ireland. We had a bit of a problem in Belfast, but we figured it out. We went to a local dealership, and they allowed us to charge there instead. There were ways around it, but as we've discussed, there's a lot to do to make the network more truck-friendly.

Liz Allan [00:37:00]:
How long did it take you to charge up once you got to, say, Turbine in Leyton Buzzard? And by the way, for those interested, it's not called Turbine - we called it that because it was T for Turbine in our A to Z. If you look for AW Energy near Leyton Buzzard, you'll see there's a Costa and various facilities there. But how long did it take you to charge?

Amy Carter [00:37:39]:
We only picked up about 40 minutes charging there. It's a 282 kilowatt-hour battery, 264 usable, taking into account the battery's intricacies. We hadn't long charged anyway - I think we'd charged in Cambridge. Our truck with that battery system can charge to 100% as much as we want without worrying about the 80% rule. LFP batteries can take it - they don't tend to need preconditioning and are quite robust. 

From flat to full is around an hour and a half on that particular vehicle. From 5% to about 95% takes about an hour and twenty minutes at 150 kilowatts maximum charge rate. We can charge on 22kW AC as well, so we can use overnight AC charging. But of course, on a 282 kilowatt-hour battery pack, that's going to take 10 to 12 hours.

But that's where the trucks go into operation - 50% of LF vehicles we sell up to 19 tons do less than 100 miles a day in application, even with diesel engines. So traditionally, those trucks of the LF or now the XB model, 50% do less than 100 miles a day statistically. They're perfect for electrification because they'll never really need a charge during the day, even if they're being used for secondary applications like tail lifts or bin lifts with electric motors.

We have EPTOs (Electric Power Take-Off) on the truck anyway, so they can either use the 24-volt battery system, which is traditionally what a tail lift would operate on a diesel truck, or if they need more power, there's an EPTO solution - power take-off of 25 kilowatts or 90 kilowatts depending on application, to facilitate things like refrigerated systems for chilled deliveries. We can even run rear-mounted cranes for building merchants delivering sand or concrete blocks. They're very versatile.

Liz Allan [00:39:59]:
So what currently is the take-up? Have you got any idea about what size organizations are taking these trucks on currently?

Amy Carter [00:40:18]:
It's very varied. We've got about 40 vehicles on the road at the moment. Twenty of them are from what we call the BET trial. The EV rally truck is a veteran of the BET trial. It came back to us because the end user couldn't facilitate that truck - they needed one with a shorter wheelbase. We helped them find a solution, got that truck back, and we've used it for the rally two years running. It's never missed a beat.

To put that into context of the wider fleet, those 20 trucks were part of the original pre-ZEHID trial where we put trucks in local authority care with NHS and councils. They ran them over an 18-month period, and we gathered data. You can see that data at www.senex.bets.co.uk - there's a full report showing how many tons of CO2 we saved, NOx, and so forth. It's fascinating to see that data over an 18-month period with just 20 trucks on the road.

If you multiply that by the number of trucks - there's 500,000 trucks on the road at any given time - we saved hundreds of tons of CO2 just with 20 trucks doing local deliveries. Imagine if the entire network was electric - it's incredible what we could do. We just need to facilitate it.

In terms of our fleet, we've got a mixed customer base. We've got smaller companies that want to be early adopters, proving to people in their space that they went first. We've got one we can talk about - Cisco Brakes' LF, which your husband had some involvement with. It runs the climate stripes as part of its graphic package.

Amy Carter [00:42:20]:
That runs out of Cisco Brakes in Reading, going into London and back every day. Reading University partnered with Cisco Brakes in the evolution of that truck. I believe Reading University is taking telematic data from it daily to form research material. The climate stripes are fascinating, really.

Liz Allan [00:42:49]:
And you can actually see the emissions per town. I'll put that in the show notes because that's really interesting. I think it shows the local authority involvement, whether they've declared a climate emergency or not, and what that council area is doing about the climate emergency. For those listening and watching who don't know about this, there are some councils who still haven't declared a climate emergency. Those will be the ones that'll take a long time, depending on who's in power and other factors. Going back to Reading University - Professor Ed Hawkins is the one who created the climate stripes.

Amy Carter [00:44:02]:
Absolutely. And then if we look at the other end of the spectrum, we've got big players - speaking generally, companies like Stobart and Maritime and Wing Canton. They're all involved in the ZEHID projects. They'll take a mixture of trucks from DAF, Scania, Mercedes Benz, Renault, and any other players in those particular consortia.

We are taking big orders from some of those larger customers who have bought diesels from us for decades. They're now starting to build their own infrastructure, looking at their depots, destinations, customer base, and how charging can operate efficiently for them. While that's happening, they're looking at truck specifications and what works best. Do they stick with what they know, or do they change specifications based on their traditional diesel trucks? We're finding that many are actually downsizing the cabs - going from a traditional larger cab with a big sleeping area, which wasn't really being used anyway, down to more of a day cab, which is lighter, cheaper, and more efficient. It's interesting to see the evolution of fleet as well as the smaller customers who want to be early adopters.

Liz Allan [00:45:25]:
What would you like to see happen in the next few years?

Amy Carter [00:45:33]:
I would really like to see trucks become more of a focal point for legislation and funding. We currently have something called a plug-in truck grant, which requires tremendous effort to access - you need to sacrifice a kidney and deal with loads of red tape. I've spent the last two years working with different authorities to get our trucks approved, and I've finally succeeded. But it shouldn't be that difficult. If we want customers to adopt electric vehicles, we need to make it easier for them. I think we're there now with cars and vans, but in the truck space, we need to do more.

Currently, customers can claim £25,000 against every eligible chassis on the government portal. To get onto that portal, the manufacturer has to cover the cost - we've spent thousands trying to get our trucks listed, which we've done. We won't recover any of that as a manufacturer, but the end user can claim that £25,000 per truck. We do this to help our customers adopt, but it's not a workable solution.

Personally, I'd rather see the government offer £30,000 towards depot charger installation, with the agreement that, where practical, you would allow others to use it when you're not. That's how we'll build an infrastructure and network as good as the car network.

I'd also like to see a change in driver regulations. Currently, there are challenges around tachograph regulations that make EV adoption difficult, especially on longer routes. For example, after 4.5 hours of driving, you must take a legal 45-minute break. With tachographs, you have three settings: work (driving), sleep/rest, and other work (like daily checks). You're not allowed to put the vehicle on charge and then take your rest - you have to list charging as other work. So legally, if I'm sleeping in the truck while it's charging, I'm technically breaking the tachograph rules.

Liz Allan [00:48:18]:
What?

Amy Carter [00:48:18]:
I have to charge it, then move it to a rest area, park it up, and then take my rest.

Liz Allan [00:48:22]:
That adds time on to the end of your day!

Amy Carter [00:48:23]:
It's ridiculous. We just need a small change in legislation to allow charging to be classed as rest. It stems from traditionally not being able to count resting while filling a diesel tank, which makes sense - you're actively standing there filling the fuel tank. But once I've plugged in the charger, which takes 3-4 minutes at most, I'm going to sit in the back and sleep or rest while the vehicle charges itself.

Amy Carter [00:48:56]:
That doesn't need to be 'other work' - it needs to be classed as rest. We need some tweaks to the driver regulations to make it more feasible for drivers and operators to use these trucks legally. Otherwise, there will be challenges down the road.

Liz Allan [00:49:14]:
I didn't realize that hadn't been changed. I suppose these regulations have been around for many years, haven't they? It's about looking at a rule and saying, "Okay, we're doing this now, so that rule shouldn't apply" - because why would you stand next to a charger when you wouldn't stand next to where you're filling up with diesel?

Amy Carter [00:49:45]:
Exactly. There's one other change we'd like to see. Currently, we're running a 42-ton truck. In the 40-ton category, that's based on a 5-axle combination - 3 axles on the trailer and 2 axles on the tractor unit, allowing up to 40 tons. Adding another axle to the tractor unit means we can go up to 44 tons maximum gross vehicle weight.

Currently, we get a 2-ton uplift to 42 tons because of government legislation to mitigate battery weight. But realistically, the trucks are easily capable of 44 tons on a 4x2 axle configuration. We're being disadvantaged because with 4x2 electric trucks, the batteries sit between the wheels. A 6x2 configuration means a very long tractor unit, similar to what you see in the States, but that's not feasible on UK and European roads - we need a good turning circle.

Our front axles are capable of 9-10 tons, even 11 tons now with NATO beam axles. There's no reason why the government couldn't change legislation to allow 44 tons on a 4x2, which would let us take the same business as companies running diesel 6x2 tractor units. It's a disadvantage at the moment.

Liz Allan [00:51:19]:
I suppose it's about evening up the playing field, isn't it?

Amy Carter [00:51:22]:
Absolutely.

Liz Allan [00:51:23]:
Making sure everything's evened up.

Amy Carter [00:51:26]:
If the government is serious about EV adoption, they need to help us out a little bit. That's my bottom line.

Liz Allan [00:51:32]:
I totally get you. We brushed over this very quickly at the beginning - I want to talk about you now.

Amy Carter [00:51:46]:
Okay.

Liz Allan [00:51:47]:
This is, as long as you're alright - we have discussed this before, I haven't just put Amy on the spot. You talked about your transition as a trans woman. I just wanted you to share - you don't have to go into all the details, but how has it been since the transition working in automotive? Have they been accepting? Obviously, I don't want you to damn anybody, but it's not an easy thing, is it?

Amy Carter [00:52:37]:
It's really not. My first experience - I came out in 2015 and didn't transition until 2016. I gave Volkswagen a 6-month lead time to get used to what was going to happen. I worked with the HR directors to figure out what it would look like because no one had transitioned at Volkswagen before. They were fantastic - absolutely hats off to them. They had no background information, so they went to Stonewall, the LGBT charity, and talked to them about policy. I wasn't very demanding - I said I'd do whatever was the easiest way to get this done. But it had to be done.

I remember the first week I came into Volkswagen Group as an Audi trainer as Amy, as my true self - the happy version of me. The week before, we had our regular Friday planning meeting discussing car movements, workshop setup, and project management. As my old self, I had proposed a project launch idea, and they said "great idea," with clapping hands and note-taking. A week later, as me, as Amy, presenting as female, I suggested something similar for a different launch. The response was just "yeah, okay, that's great." Then two minutes later, one of my male colleagues said literally the exact same thing I'd just said, and everyone was clapping and writing things down. In that moment, I knew that as a woman, I was going to have to work twice as hard for the same recognition in the motor trade.

Liz Allan [00:54:57]:
I think a lot of women find that anyway.

Amy Carter [00:54:57]:
Exactly. It's not a trans thing, that's a woman thing. Hopefully, it will change at some point.

Liz Allan [00:55:06]:
And you have written a book, haven't you?

Amy Carter [00:55:13]:
Yes, it's the result of living on a farm in a shared house in Cosgrove, just outside Milton Keynes during lockdown. Having access to a laptop, ADHD, and a lot of time on my hands, I decided to write my memoirs just for something to do because I was so bored. I sat underneath this lovely willow tree with a babbling brook in front of me and my laptop. Before I knew it, I'd written five chapters of a book, so I thought I better carry on.

Fast forward 18 months, a very good friend of mine and my last boss at Volkswagen, a wonderful woman named Kate Hudson - not the famous actress - who now works at Ford Academy, edited the book for me. She's an absolute tour de force and one of my closest friends. We went through several proofreads with some test readers, and some people from DAF read it for fact-checking.

When we thought it was publishable, I looked for publishers. Unfortunately, being a niche book in the trans space and talking about a subject that not everyone's comfortable with, I couldn't get a publishing deal, so I self-published on Amazon. I'm basically a product of Jeff Bezos now, unfortunately. But it's an easy way to get your product out there, and despite the challenges of working with Amazon, they're very good at helping people like me put something out there for the masses. I think I've sold about 800 copies so far, not too bad for the scribblings of an idiot.

Liz Allan [00:57:08]:
No, you're not at all. Amy, I have to say - people listening and watching should check around because I love how honest you are. You're so technically minded, it's fantastic. And actually, you are now comfortable in your own skin, aren't you? How many people can say that?

Amy Carter [00:57:40]:
The former version of me had reached a glass ceiling where I just didn't have the drive and ambition to do anything else. I was a technical trainer and thought, "Well, that'll do." Since I've transitioned, I've got my truck license, I'm doing a business degree at university, I've got a much better job. My circumstances are just better all around, and I'm happy at the end of the day. 

I get some criticism on social media for the way my voice sounds or the fact that I wasn't born female, but none of that really matters because at the end of the day, I'm just a person. Whether you assign a gender to that person or not, it doesn't really matter. You have to be comfortable in your own skin. And when you're comfortable with who you are, that's when you achieve your best results. I've done more in the last 8 years as me than I did in the 42 years prior to that. That should really be all that matters. But for some people, it's not. I always say, if only closed minds came with closed mouths, we'd all be happy.

Liz Allan [00:58:40]:
Absolutely. Totally get you. I'm so pleased that the last 8 years has been what you've wanted, because everybody wants to be happy and that's the main thing. I'll make sure I put a link to your book on Amazon in the show notes.

Amy Carter [00:59:06]:
I appreciate that. Thank you.

Liz Allan [00:59:07]:
I'm going to end there because I think that's a very poignant point to finish on. I want to thank you for being honest, for being brilliant - you are just brilliant. Keep doing what you're doing.

Amy Carter [00:59:29]:
Oh, stop it.

Liz Allan [00:59:31]:
I look forward to hugging you hopefully next week when we're both going to an event, assuming I'm not crying because my son's going to university or hiding in a cupboard! But listen, Amy, thank you. I really appreciate your time. You've been a brilliant guest.

Amy Carter [01:00:00]:
Thank you too. And thank you for the opportunity to come on this amazing podcast, which I'm now catching up with all the back episodes. I'm absolutely loving it. So get out and get it shared. Get listening.

Liz Allan [01:00:10]:
And thank you for that prompt. If you have enjoyed this, and I hope you have, whether you've watched or listened, please share it because all of this needs to be shared with more people. More people need to find out about electrification, about air pollution, about the electrification of trucks and all of this kind of stuff. This is only a small independent podcast - the only way we can reach that audience is by the people who are watching and listening actually sharing. So please do that if you can, and share Amy's story as well and all the wonderful stuff that she's told us. On that note, I'm going to say thanks again, Amy. It's been brilliant.

Amy Carter [01:00:58]:
Thank you.

Liz Allan [01:00:58]:
To everybody else, thank you for listening and watching. I'll see you next time. Bye-bye.

Amy Carter [01:01:03]:
Bye bye.