Christmas Special 2024: Wallace and Gromit Supervising Animator: Will Becher

Welcome to a very special Christmas edition of TV Makers!

We’re adding a sprinkle of festive magic as we go behind the scenes of Wallace and Gromit: Vengeance Most Fowl, premiering on BBC One and iPlayer at 6:10 pm on Christmas Day. Supervising Animator Will Becher joins us to reveal the artistry, challenges, and meticulous craftsmanship that go into bringing these beloved characters to life.

But that’s not all! We’re embracing the Christmas spirit with a festive chat featuring TV friends and professionals discussing what makes holiday TV specials truly special and the creative pressures behind crafting Christmas magic for millions of viewers.

And it wouldn’t be Christmas without a game! In a Taskmaster-inspired challenge, we pitch the next big Christmas TV format for 2025—complete with laughs and a surprise prize giveaway. Commissioners, take notes!

So whether you’re wrapping gifts, cooking up a feast, or doing some last-minute shopping, grab a mince pie and join us for TV Makers: The Christmas Special !

The Film and TV Charity information and Links:

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More information is available here: Mental health and wellbeing | The Film and TV Charity

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For all enquiries you can email support@filmtcharity.org.uk



As always don't forget to rate, comment and subscribe to the podcast and follow on instagram @tvmakerspod for special behind the microphone content. 

Recorded and Edited by Ashley Golder - https://ashleygolder.tv/
Instagram @tvmakerspod
Email: Podcast@tvmakers.co.uk

Artwork by Benjamin Leon -
Instagram: @benleondraws
Website: www.benleondraws.com

Transcript

00:00:01:20 - 00:00:21:12
Ashley Golder
Well, that sounds a bit different, doesn't it? Welcome to a very special Christmas edition of TV makers, where we go behind the scenes with the people who make our favorite shows so that we may learn how to do it ourselves. And today we're adding a sprinkle of festive magic. I am thrilled to announce that we have a very special guest.

00:00:21:15 - 00:00:50:06
Ashley Golder
The whole world is eagerly awaiting the new Wallace and Gromit film Vengeance Most Fowl, which is premiering on BBC one and iPlayer at 6:10 p.m. on Christmas Day. And I was fortunate to catch up with the film's very own VIP supervising animator Will Becher. Will took some time out ahead of the premiere to share his behind the scenes stories and the incredible craft that goes into making a film of this scale.

00:00:50:08 - 00:01:17:23
Ashley Golder
Even I didn't fully appreciate the level of detail and how one mistake can truly mean a week's worth of reshoots for what amounts to seconds on screen. It's utterly insane. However, the cause for celebration doesn't stop there. To help me get into the Christmas spirit, I've laid out the cheese, the wine, and invited some TV friends for a festive chat about what makes Christmas TV specials truly special.

00:01:18:00 - 00:01:39:04
Ashley Golder
While, of course, getting into the highlights and pressures teams face to ensure their hard work makes it onto our screens in time for that big day. And lastly, before we dive in, don't forget to follow right and subscribe wherever you're listening to this podcast and follow at TV Makers Pod on Instagram. For some behind the microphone exclusive content.

00:01:39:06 - 00:01:55:03
Ashley Golder
And now, whether you're doing last minute shopping, cooking up a turkey, or wrapping your gifts, grab yourself a mince pie and join us. For TV makers, the Christmas special.

00:01:55:05 - 00:01:56:05
Ashley Golder
Cheers, everyone.

00:01:56:07 - 00:01:59:21
Will James
Cheers! Oh, oh, that great.

00:01:59:22 - 00:02:09:05
Ashley Golder
Sounds really nice. Okay, there's a lot of you here this evening, so please go round, introduce yourselves so that everyone listening knows who they're listening to.

00:02:09:07 - 00:02:12:11
Jake Goldman
I'm Jake. I'm an AP in broadcast TV.

00:02:12:17 - 00:02:19:17
Holly Frazer-Mills
Hello. I'm Holly. I'm a former TV worker. So no longer in the industry. I'm now a freelance scream working with.

00:02:19:19 - 00:02:20:07
Ashley Golder
Lovely.

00:02:20:10 - 00:02:23:21
Rachel Forrester
I'm Rachel, and I'm a producer in factual television.

00:02:23:23 - 00:02:29:08
Will James
I'm. Will, I'm, TV director. Self shooting producer. Camera operator.

00:02:29:10 - 00:02:31:18
Verity Tonge
Hi. I'm Verity, and I'm a shooting researcher.

00:02:31:20 - 00:02:37:04
Ashley Golder
And we have a TV makers veteran from episode one.

00:02:37:05 - 00:02:39:07
Ben Seale
I'm Ben. You will remember me.

00:02:39:09 - 00:02:41:04
Ben Seale
I'm a TV producer.

00:02:41:04 - 00:02:42:09
Ben Seale
Director who.

00:02:42:11 - 00:02:45:16
Ben Seale
Jumped ship last year to start in YouTube.

00:02:45:16 - 00:02:47:03
Ben Seale
And digital content.

00:02:47:04 - 00:03:01:19
Ashley Golder
And you know me. I'm Ash. I'm your host of TV makers, director of factual TV. Welcome to TV makers first Christmas special, everyone. Thank you for joining us. So we have these lovely Taskmaster crackers.

00:03:01:24 - 00:03:02:20
Will James
Got cross your arms.

00:03:02:20 - 00:03:04:18
Will James
Got it.

00:03:04:20 - 00:03:07:24
Ashley Golder
So from the hit show Taskmaster one, two three.

00:03:08:01 - 00:03:10:04
Ashley Golder
Oh,

00:03:10:06 - 00:03:13:13
Ashley Golder
Lovely. Everyone grab yourself a hat.

00:03:13:15 - 00:03:14:20
Verity Tonge
oh wow there’s a lot of things

00:03:14:22 - 00:03:15:16
Ben Seale
Did you get anything?

00:03:15:21 - 00:03:18:15
Will James
Think there's something thought might. It's not Christmas without the hat.

00:03:18:17 - 00:03:44:10
Ashley Golder
So in the Taskmaster crackers, obviously there are tasks. However, as a producer, I obviously actually cracked into these crackers earlier and then reset them. These tasks, they're great, but probably not brilliant for an audible podcast. So I thought, well, why don't I actually reach out to Taskmasters Alex Horne to see if he'll do us a voice memo? Tasks for the podcast.

00:03:44:12 - 00:03:48:15
Ashley Golder
And I can tell you his agent did not get back to me.

00:03:48:16 - 00:03:53:00
Will James
Oh, don't do that to us.

00:03:53:02 - 00:04:00:20
Ashley Golder
So instead, I've made our own tasks that we're going to do later. But I can tell you there is a prize.

00:04:00:22 - 00:04:02:15
Will James
Hell yeah.

00:04:02:17 - 00:04:12:05
Ashley Golder
So we'll do that task later. First of all, we're going to go in a circle. We're going to learn just a little bit about each other just to figure out what everyone's about. Verity. First of all, what you got?

00:04:12:07 - 00:04:15:06
Verity Tonge
I have a gold medal in synchronized ice skating.

00:04:15:11 - 00:04:20:16
Will James
What? Actually. Yeah. Gold? Yeah. Wow.

00:04:20:18 - 00:04:23:14
Verity Tonge
It was like a Scottish synchronized.

00:04:23:16 - 00:04:29:05
Will James
So why did she go first? She cast end? Yeah.

00:04:29:06 - 00:04:39:06
Verity Tonge
It was the Scottish Synchronized Championships of, like, 2012, maybe. And in the certain category that my team was in. And that was several categories, so. Well there were teams all over Europe.

00:04:39:08 - 00:04:40:19
Ashley Golder
Congratulations on your gold

00:04:40:21 - 00:04:41:11
Verity Tonge
Thank you.

00:04:41:12 - 00:04:43:15
Ashley Golder
Will,  

00:04:43:17 - 00:04:44:23
Will James
well, how can I follow that?

00:04:45:00 - 00:04:53:07
Will James
Well, soon as it's Christmas. I was in a Christmas special of Doctor Who. Yeah.

00:04:53:07 - 00:04:55:02
Ashley Golder
What were you playing?

00:04:55:04 - 00:05:06:24
Will James
I was playing multiple roles, actually. I was a dock worker. I was a market stall seller person. Like, get your not salty nuts. It's like.

00:05:06:24 - 00:05:11:08
Will James
Victorian specialty. Yeah.

00:05:11:10 - 00:05:17:09
Will James
And I was like, kind of like a middle class, sort of Victorian person.

00:05:17:12 - 00:05:19:12
Ashley Golder
Which Christmas special of Doctor Who was this?

00:05:19:12 - 00:05:37:05
Will James
I think it was called, like the next doctor or the other doctor. It was like set in Victorian London. And there was like another doctor and at the end, this, like, giant Cyberman rises up out of London. I was like 17, 16, ten. So it's a while ago.

00:05:37:08 - 00:05:42:19
Ashley Golder
Wow. Okay, I will try and find the link and put that in the show notes for everyone.

00:05:42:21 - 00:05:44:18
Verity Tonge
I really want to see that,

00:05:44:20 - 00:05:47:15
Ashley Golder
Or if you've got a photo.

00:05:47:17 - 00:05:50:15
Will James
Not on me now, but I can dig one out.

00:05:50:16 - 00:05:57:13
Ashley Golder
Yeah? Yeah. Okay. Will's going to send me a photo, and I'll add that to the show notes. And put that on social. - Ben...

00:05:57:15 - 00:06:06:13
Ben Seale
what do I talk about? None of you guys would ever know is I'm half Swiss, and it's not like that. Very much present on the first episode of the podcast. So?

00:06:06:18 - 00:06:16:15
Ashley Golder
So, yeah. Yeah. The inside joke on this one listeners is so we obviously know each other very well. However, there isn't a day that goes by that, Ben, maybe.

00:06:16:15 - 00:06:17:09
Ben Seale
A day.

00:06:17:11 - 00:06:21:12
Ashley Golder
That Ben doesn't remind us that he's Swiss Rachel Forest.

00:06:21:14 - 00:06:29:08
Rachel Forrester
Well, mine is going to be similar to Will's, but I didn't actually get the part I was. I was very close in the auditions. The second generation of skins.

00:06:29:10 - 00:06:33:11
Will James
Oh, I've never anything like the Jack O'Connell.

00:06:33:13 - 00:06:38:12
Rachel Forrester
I would have been the one so that for generation. Yeah, yeah. Yeah.

00:06:38:13 - 00:06:39:01
Will James
That one.

00:06:39:02 - 00:06:40:15
Ashley Golder
What a throwback.

00:06:40:17 - 00:06:41:12
Will James
Isn't it.

00:06:41:14 - 00:06:42:14
Ashley Golder
Who are you going to play.

00:06:42:15 - 00:06:51:21
Rachel Forrester
I don't it wasn't decided like I hadn't quite got that far. So I've done the open ones, I've gone back for another one and I've gone back for like a third round. And it was after that that. Yeah they dropped me.

00:06:51:23 - 00:06:54:05
Ashley Golder
What did you have to do in the audition? Do you remember?

00:06:54:07 - 00:06:58:18
Rachel Forrester
It was improvised. You were getting exam results that you knew you cheated on your exam.

00:06:58:23 - 00:07:02:23
Ashley Golder
Rachel, just grab that piece of paper on the table or pretend that is your exam results.

00:07:03:01 - 00:07:05:14
Rachel Forrester
Absolutely not. Then I might have to.

00:07:05:16 - 00:07:07:05
Will James
PTSD is coming up, though.

00:07:07:08 - 00:07:11:05
Rachel Forrester
That was the moment I decided to go behind the camera, not in front of it. And it was good for everybody.

00:07:11:07 - 00:07:17:01
Ashley Golder
Okay, so so far we've had two people in or possibly in TV a go.

00:07:17:03 - 00:07:19:08
Will James
I was just an extra. I wasn't like a main role.

00:07:19:08 - 00:07:21:22
Ashley Golder
You're my main role. A gold medalist.

00:07:21:22 - 00:07:23:11
Will James
Or. Wow.

00:07:23:13 - 00:07:27:21
Ashley Golder
A gold medalist ice skater. Someone who's Swiss. Holly.

00:07:27:23 - 00:07:30:19
Holly Frazer-Mills
So mine's like a weird, like, bodily fat.

00:07:30:22 - 00:07:32:11
Ashley Golder
Oh,

00:07:32:13 - 00:07:33:03
Will James
Excellent.

00:07:33:03 - 00:07:36:03
Ashley Golder
Different podcast. We'll have it for the Christmas special.

00:07:36:06 - 00:07:51:10
Holly Frazer-Mills
But none of you know, I don't think. But basically, when I was younger, I had quite a serious operation, on my ears. So when I was younger, they used to call me Dumbo and I had my ears pinned back. Oh, major surgery. And I was seven.

00:07:51:12 - 00:07:55:11
Ashley Golder
Yeah. I did not know that about. Yeah. Your ears, in fact. Great earrings today.

00:07:55:11 - 00:07:56:18
Holly Frazer-Mills
Thanks.

00:07:56:20 - 00:07:58:15
Ashley Golder
Thank you for bringing them.

00:07:59:05 - 00:08:00:15
Ben Seale
the ears or the earrings?

00:08:00:17 - 00:08:04:00
Ashley Golder
Yeah, both. Both ears and earrings. Jake.

00:08:04:02 - 00:08:18:23
Jake Goldman
My fact is that when I was a child, I. And this sounds weird in hindsight, but I, performed on a stage in front of Michael Jackson. Yeah. Yeah. So that was sort of the how old my career would.

00:08:19:00 - 00:08:20:22
Jake Goldman
This this was the thing.

00:08:20:24 - 00:08:42:13
Jake Goldman
I mean, I don't remember anything untoward. I was 12, and I was in, the West End production of Oliver as a little urchin. And, we had a few, like, high profile people come, but Michael Jackson was like, the. And that very much was the peak of my career. It really has been downhill ever since and is continuing on that trajectory.

00:08:42:15 - 00:08:43:23
Ashley Golder
Apart from this Christmas special.

00:08:44:02 - 00:08:45:08
Jake Goldman
From the TV like this.

00:08:45:09 - 00:08:45:19
Ashley Golder
Yeah, yeah.

00:08:45:20 - 00:08:47:08
Jake Goldman
When I got the call from you, I was like.

00:08:47:09 - 00:08:54:22
Ashley Golder
We're now on the lead it. Yeah. Okay, so I want to talk about how to make a Christmas special because we've all made Christmas specials in our time, right?

00:08:54:24 - 00:08:57:15
Will James
Yeah, yeah, yeah. I was filming one yesterday.

00:08:57:15 - 00:09:04:12
Ashley Golder
There you go. So what I want to first talk about is, what are the pressures that come with making a Christmas special?

00:09:04:13 - 00:09:28:22
Jake Goldman
Well, I mean, there's usually quite a finite amount of time. And resources that are going into it. So you might be doing kind of longer days. I found often than usual. And you have more people around as well. You know, often more of the, senior team a down there who might not be there normally. So that really, ramps up the sort of feeling that this is something that that really is quite high stakes.

00:09:28:23 - 00:09:46:10
Ashley Golder
You're right. Actually, there's nothing like making a Christmas special feel. Not special for you. Then all of your s. Yeah. Then all of your bosses coming down to see you, make sure you're doing it right. And that is. And that's a lot of pressure. I've definitely been in those and oh, not even you.

00:09:46:12 - 00:10:07:02
Ben Seale
Like if you make the 52 episodes of the year usually. And then the Christmas they bring in the opening special staff, because they're regular staff who filmed every episode of the year, qualified to do a Christmas special. Yeah, that just becomes a lot of stress and pressure from, like, higher ups who just don't want to let the crew sort of get on with.

00:10:07:07 - 00:10:08:01
Jake Goldman
What they go on with.

00:10:08:01 - 00:10:33:01
Ashley Golder
Sometimes. You know, that's a really interesting thought. Yeah. So if you are doing a regular show and they were to bring in other crew, that's a bit of a kick in the teeth, isn't it? Like you know how to make the show so I think, yeah, if you're listening to this and you're a commissioner and exec and maybe just have a chat with your crew first, see if they want to do the special and the answer will be yes.

00:10:33:03 - 00:10:45:09
Ashley Golder
And if maybe the things that you've got planned they can achieve. There's nothing wrong with bringing in extra people. You know, as we're hearing, there's a lot of pressure on these Christmas specials. Extra hands are useful.

00:10:45:13 - 00:10:46:17
Holly Frazer-Mills
Not extra voices.

00:10:46:18 - 00:10:48:14
Will James
They,

00:10:48:16 - 00:10:53:14
Will James
Cut with crew members, though, like with the DOP adds, like more of a production value.

00:10:53:16 - 00:10:58:13
Ashley Golder
Yeah, for sure, but don't bring in for the ops to replace the current crew.

00:10:58:15 - 00:10:59:16
Will James
No. Yeah.

00:10:59:16 - 00:11:00:00
Rachel Forrester
And I think.

00:11:00:00 - 00:11:01:06
Will James
From experience, I.

00:11:01:08 - 00:11:20:13
Rachel Forrester
I you're forward planning as well being done by other people. So I've done a bake off Christmas special and that was slap bang in the middle and filming the regular series. Those producers, researchers, casting people that are looking after everyone else just did not have the brain space to put together a Christmas special, bringing out past celebs and things like that.

00:11:20:19 - 00:11:30:24
Rachel Forrester
So having people in the office, forward planning and putting that together, still using the on the ground crew on the day to film it, but having other brains on it, I think is really helpful and valuable for sure.

00:11:30:24 - 00:11:52:11
Ashley Golder
That's really necessary. You just touched upon something that I think is important to say with the pressure, is that you are typically for a show filming a Christmas special whilst doing the run of the series of your usual series at the same time, because the sets there, the cast are there, the contributors are there, the camera crew are there.

00:11:52:11 - 00:12:13:02
Ashley Golder
If you're not replacing them, so everything is there. It's cheaper to do it whilst you're there, but I think I'm probably right in saying we've all been in that situation where they don't give you extra time to then film your usual series. You just got to somehow do everything all at once. That's about right.

00:12:13:03 - 00:12:13:12
Holly Frazer-Mills
Yeah.

00:12:13:12 - 00:12:27:23
Rachel Forrester
Which is why quite often you find yourselves ringing for Christmas over a weekend because you can't break from that weekly schedule that you've worked out. Yeah, it's got to be done. You've got to put additional hours in. And that's not uncommon, as in a lot of shows that I've done, I've done three specials and it's been the same on all of.

00:12:27:23 - 00:12:50:13
Will James
The time, is always a big thing as well on on specials, because you have to finish it at a certain time. It has to be ready for Christmas, but with that comes the weather. And that's always going to be an issue when you want to film something before Christmas, is you going to be filming it in the middle of summer and or autumn?

00:12:50:15 - 00:13:13:00
Will James
I just finished filming a special a few weeks ago, and we had to go to the Arctic Circle. We had to go to northern Sweden just to find something that was frozen, any kind of snow, to have it cut and ready to before Christmas. You can't do that in the UK. If the channel wants to know, then that's that's the only thing you can do.

00:13:13:01 - 00:13:14:10
Ashley Golder
You've got to hire in the snow. Yeah.

00:13:14:13 - 00:13:30:00
Will James
But because of that, like I said, about time, it's the turnaround time for the editors. It's always crazy. There's so much stress with post as well as what we do because of that, that time to finish or, you know, it has to be done.

00:13:30:06 - 00:13:52:17
Ashley Golder
Yeah, it's an interesting time of year to do Christmas in July. Do you think that Christmas specials are harder to create now that our viewing habits are changing? You know, we do sort of usually sit on our, you know, watching a linear show and that's for channels. That's what we have watched Once Upon a time. And now you can just pick whatever you want to watch.

00:13:52:19 - 00:13:55:15
Ashley Golder
Is that magic being taken away?

00:13:55:17 - 00:14:14:10
Verity Tonge
But I think so. I think it gives you more option to watch all of them. Like I think, yeah, back in the day, you'd have to pick which one you wanted to watch, argue over it in the family, you get that one. But I think now you can watch the one you want to watch on Christmas Day, Boxing Day, whichever, and then watch the other ones that clash with that.

00:14:14:12 - 00:14:17:23
Ashley Golder
So you're saying you can watch more Christmas specials because of it?

00:14:18:00 - 00:14:18:20
Verity Tonge
Yeah, I think so.

00:14:18:21 - 00:14:20:23
Ashley Golder
You'll probably going down for Christmas there soon.

00:14:21:02 - 00:14:21:23
Verity Tonge
I think.

00:14:22:00 - 00:14:22:12
Will James
Watching them in.

00:14:22:12 - 00:14:24:15
Will James
June I think.

00:14:24:15 - 00:14:30:03
Verity Tonge
They I don't know if this is everyone's family, but when I was a child was always by the Radio Times and we never.

00:14:30:06 - 00:14:32:22
Will James
Oh yeah, we used to circle all the things you want to.

00:14:32:22 - 00:14:38:19
Verity Tonge
Watch. Yeah, but we never we only ever buy it now at Christmas. And I still go through it each Christmas.

00:14:38:19 - 00:14:39:18
Ben Seale
On that I think.

00:14:39:20 - 00:15:03:03
Ben Seale
Like we've got to be aware as well. Not everyone celebrates Christmas or watches it. So I think, you know, the modern times sort of reflect that. And, you know, if there's nothing but Christmas stuff on and terrestrial TV, maybe that was not necessarily a good thing for people that don't celebrate Christmas. And now people having the choice of whether they want to watch it or don't want to watch it, and when they want to, you know, that's not being taken away.

00:15:03:03 - 00:15:09:21
Ben Seale
As Verity says, if you want to sit there with your family and watch endless TV specials, you can, So yeah, I don't think we've lost anything in that sense.

00:15:10:01 - 00:15:17:01
Ashley Golder
Yeah, absolutely. That's a great point. The fact that technology has given us a choice as to what to watch, and if we even want to watch it.

00:15:17:03 - 00:15:31:00
Rachel Forrester
And to play devil's advocate to what's just been said, I do think the family aspect disappearing, though, because those because I can watch those whenever I want rather than fighting over what I want to watch my parents, I'll sit and eat cheese for the fifth day in a row and watch it. Drinking wine in my flat.

00:15:31:00 - 00:15:32:00
Rachel Forrester
Like.

00:15:32:02 - 00:15:43:01
Rachel Forrester
Without doing over what we're going to watch or pick. That one thing like I will watch what I want, when I want, rather than sitting down with my family and watching what was on, because that's what we did when I was a kid. And I don't do that now.

00:15:43:03 - 00:16:02:15
Jake Goldman
There's something like a step back in time I find on Christmas. And what you just said about the Radio Times is absolutely true. That is the only time that you actually have to tune in at a certain time, or it maybe don't have to, but you choose to. At least in my family, we choose to tune in at a certain time and actually do something in real time together.

00:16:02:17 - 00:16:20:22
Jake Goldman
Which I think, you know, we've lost in our viewing culture now because of how things have changed. And that's really nice, actually. And even if you don't really, you lost out and you didn't really want to watch what has been decided on. I still enjoy that experience of being all together. And there's something there's something that's very retro.

00:16:20:23 - 00:16:23:22
Will James
There's something wrong with putting on Netflix on Christmas Day.

00:16:23:22 - 00:16:25:03
Verity Tonge
Exactly I agree.

00:16:25:05 - 00:16:33:15
Ashley Golder
Lovely. Okay, so we've got a bit of Rachel wanting to stuff cheese and eat cheese alone and watch shows., Verity, that one's 24/7

00:16:33:15 - 00:16:35:02
Will James


00:16:35:04 - 00:16:45:07
Ashley Golder
Shows Jake going back in time. What is it about Christmas that brings us back to the television and watch these shows, be it newly created or indeed repeats.

00:16:45:09 - 00:16:56:01
Verity Tonge
There's a element of Christmas that's just it's that cheesy predictability that's a little bit cringe. And I think there's, there's a guilty pleasure for that. And to want that.

00:16:56:03 - 00:16:57:02
Ashley Golder
The nostalgia.

00:16:57:08 - 00:17:04:12
Verity Tonge
Yeah. And it's a bit of just the oh, of course, the bakers cooked someone in the oven and they stop.

00:17:04:12 - 00:17:09:22
Ben Seale
Sorry. What what specials do you watch?

00:17:09:24 - 00:17:11:14
Will James
Bake Off special.

00:17:11:16 - 00:17:13:03
Jake Goldman
meets EastEnders. Yeah.

00:17:13:05 - 00:17:16:06
Verity Tonge
cross with the Sweeney Todd

00:17:16:08 - 00:17:18:10
Rachel Forrester
But I've written it down.

00:17:18:12 - 00:17:24:14
Verity Tonge
I think you expect an element of cheesiness and a bit of predictability. And that is also Christmas in itself.

00:17:24:14 - 00:17:43:06
Will James
Is that why every single Christmas day for the last like ten years, the schedule has been exactly the same. Like strictly, Mrs. Brown's Boys, Call the Midwife, Gavin and Stacey special seems to always be there. Yeah, it's it's always the it's always the same.

00:17:43:07 - 00:17:45:13
Ashley Golder
Are you saying that's good or bad?

00:17:45:14 - 00:17:46:20
Will James
No i’m saying it’s bad

00:17:46:20 - 00:17:48:17
Ben Seale
But what do you want to watch Will?

00:17:49:06 - 00:17:50:11
Jake Goldman
die hard.

00:17:50:13 - 00:17:52:15
Rachel Forrester
That’s on as well for sure!

00:17:52:17 - 00:17:57:24
Will James
I know I realize I'm kind of going against my point that you watch the same thing, but.

00:17:58:01 - 00:18:13:11
Ashley Golder
I mean, come on, a good Christmas film is beautiful. But I might now argue a Christmas film is Christmas TV because you're not going to cinema. You're watching it on your TV screen, and that becomes part of your TV viewing.

00:18:13:16 - 00:18:23:03
Jake Goldman
I quite enjoy watching EastEnders on Christmas and then trying to figure out what's happened the preceding year. That's quite a fun, little game.

00:18:23:05 - 00:18:23:24
Ashley Golder
Like a Cluedo episode

00:18:24:01 - 00:18:28:09
Jake Goldman
Exactly. Episode who's Killed Who? Yeah. Done other things with who?

00:18:28:11 - 00:18:33:03
Ashley Golder
It's great. I feel like that would make, like, a drinking game. Drinking game? I was going to say, I.

00:18:33:03 - 00:18:33:24
Verity Tonge
Love that I want to do this.

00:18:34:00 - 00:18:43:17
Rachel Forrester
Yeah, I will probably watch Gavin and Stacey, but almost because I feel like I have to at this point, like have watched all the others I've watched it until this point. I've got, each time they release an episode, I have to watch it.

00:18:43:19 - 00:18:49:03
Holly Frazer-Mills
I was going to say the Tim Allen ones in, in Santa Claus. Oh, you seen.

00:18:49:05 - 00:18:50:12
Will James
Santa's Santa Claus?

00:18:50:12 - 00:18:54:08
Holly Frazer-Mills
Yeah, they're my favorite. They're great. I could sit and watch all 3 in 1 sitting.

00:18:54:08 - 00:18:55:06
Ashley Golder
Yeah.

00:18:55:08 - 00:19:19:18
Ashley Golder
Okay, so those are all great Christmas specials. We're going to take a break now because we actually have an interview with the supervising animator of the new Wallace and Gromit film, vengeance. Most fowl will be here. But before we go into that, a reminder that we opened up our Christmas Taskmaster crackers with some great tasks, but perhaps not great for audio.

00:19:19:20 - 00:19:45:03
Ashley Golder
So I've made up my own that you'll complete during this next interview. So in front of you are some paper and pens, and I want you to come up with your own Christmas show format. Give it a title, a summary, fold it up and add it into this bowl in front of me. I'll read them out and we'll vote on who wins the yet to be revealed Christmas prize.

00:19:45:05 - 00:20:04:24
Ashley Golder
And who knows if there's any commissioners listening. Maybe your idea will get commissioned for 2025 and we all get to work on it. But whilst you're thinking of those, grab some more drinks, a bit more food and let's have a listen to the interview with Mr. Will Beecher, supervising animator of Wallace and Gromit Vengeance Most Foul.

00:20:05:01 - 00:20:14:17
Wallace and Gromit Trailer
Wallace and Gromit Trailer

00:20:14:19 - 00:20:27:13
Wallace and Gromit Trailer
Wallace and Gromit Trailer

00:20:27:15 - 00:20:34:11
Ashley Golder
Well, thank you for joining me for TV makers. A very special Christmas edition for this year. How are you today?

00:20:34:13 - 00:20:36:20
Will Becher
I'm very well, thank you. And thank you for having me.

00:20:37:00 - 00:20:37:21
Ashley Golder
My first question.

00:20:37:21 - 00:20:39:01
Will Becher
Well, yeah.

00:20:39:03 - 00:20:54:04
Ashley Golder
Aardman has an impressive roster of films, but what do you think it is about Wallace and Gromit that continues to resonate with us, especially at Christmas? Apart from like, a copious amounts of cheese?

00:20:54:06 - 00:21:23:13
Will Becher
Yes. I mean, Wallace and Gromit, the kind of duo that you see in other things in history. And I like Laurel and Hardy, you know, they're a great double act together, and I think that's part of it. They've got a very clear relationship between sort of Master Wallace and his pet dog. But we all know that Gromit is the intelligent one, and it's a loving relationship, but it's also a very funny one because you really enjoy those sort of the.

00:21:23:13 - 00:21:47:09
Will Becher
Yeah, the, the tricky sides to to that relationship is part of what makes Wallace and Gromit funny, I guess. And they're very funny. They're just the world that Nick Park is created. It's full of these charming, funny visual gags, and little, little bits of graphic humor that I think make everyone just enjoy being in that world.

00:21:47:11 - 00:22:13:01
Ashley Golder
It's definitely family friendly and slaps stick. And I think as audience members, we always come back because we, we get to just enjoy this universe of just silliness and those I know what those Easter eggs, those small jokes that maybe only work for when you get to a certain level of age and you're like, oh yeah, now I understand that one a bit more.

00:22:13:05 - 00:22:31:24
Will Becher
Yeah, I think so. And there's that. There's so many of those. I mean, that's something I picked. A lot of people talk about, a lot of the fans talk about just the many, many layers of, of detail that you can. I think that's why they bear repeat viewings, you know, because there's just so much visually, there's so much to watch each time.

00:22:32:01 - 00:22:45:02
Ashley Golder
Tell me about the scale of creating Wallace and Gromit Vengence most. For how long did it take? How much footage do you get in a week? How many animators are there? Or does it take to create something like that?

00:22:45:04 - 00:23:11:17
Will Becher
Stop motion is is quite unique, isn't it, as a sort of process because we, we have to physically have everyone in the same space. So, you know, we have a big studio, it's all shot in, in interiors. So everything's blacked out because we have to control all the lighting. So yeah, we, we basically we have about 200 people on the crew all together, while about 30 of those are animators.

00:23:11:19 - 00:23:34:09
Will Becher
And the animators are the ones who are physically moving the characters in front of the camera and taking the frames. So it's their work that eventually gets seen. Their performances, I suppose they get seen on screen and their aim is to do five seconds a week. That's the plan. Each animator tries to do five seconds a week, which sounds like hardly anything, but believe me, that is quite ambitious.

00:23:34:09 - 00:23:36:19
Ashley Golder
Five seconds a week.

00:23:36:21 - 00:23:57:10
Will Becher
Yeah. I mean, on the on the other side of the scale, obviously that's the animators, but there's this huge crew. There's the sort of people that that light it and film it and make it very feel very filmic. That's a camera team as the art department. They make everything those miniature worlds, they've built them all in the studio.

00:23:57:12 - 00:24:15:16
Will Becher
And then there's the puppet makers who actually create the Wallace Gromit puppets that we use to animate. And those take weeks, months to develop and build. So, but right at the top of it all, you've got the writers and directors. So on this film, it's Nick Park and Merlin crossing him, directing, and Mark Burton writing it with.

00:24:15:16 - 00:24:38:06
Will Becher
Nick and Nick have probably had the initial idea around sort of 15 years ago, maybe even longer. So he always keeps these sketchbooks. And one of these ideas, I think it was around to where up it kind of time you was thinking about this robotic node and he kept coming back to it. And then probably about six years ago, he started working on it's pretty much full time.

00:24:38:08 - 00:25:02:11
Will Becher
So that's when this particular film, I guess, started in earnest about six years ago. And then over those first few years, it's very much just working out the ideas and the story. And the other thing in animation, particularly as we tend to build the whole film a storyboards before we shoot it. So the the whole film exists as a sort of very basic comic strip.

00:25:02:13 - 00:25:14:09
Will Becher
That means we can time everything out so that when the animators start shooting, we're not wasting any footage. We literally just shoot the shot. We don't do loads extra, and edit it down afterwards. That's generally how it works.

00:25:14:11 - 00:25:24:03
Ashley Golder
I mean, I did want to ask you, as an animator yourself, do you get to improvise ad lib that? I think that probably answers. My question is you you don't get the time too.

00:25:24:04 - 00:25:41:17
Will Becher
Well, yes, I know, I mean, that's the great thing about stop motion. The fact is a bit slower. It means that there's so many opportunities for people to add ideas. On the negative side, you might have a brilliant joke. Two years later, you start filming that joke, by which point you know you're thinking, is this even? Was this ever funny?

00:25:41:21 - 00:25:59:20
Will Becher
Because you've gone over and over and watched it so many times. But on the plus side, it means lots of people along the way can add things, including the art department, you know, including the puppet makers. Anyone can have a good idea and just say, oh, what? What if we made this book in the background called Such and such?

00:25:59:22 - 00:26:21:03
Will Becher
And the animators, they are working to a to a sort of blueprint, but at the same time it's an organic process. So we are physically animating these puppets frame by frame, and you can have an idea and you can get one of the directors to come in and discuss it with you. And then literally in the middle of a shot, you might create something that wasn't in the original plan.

00:26:21:03 - 00:26:24:23
Will Becher
So it does happen. And that's what's quite nice about it's got motion.

00:26:25:00 - 00:26:32:01
Ashley Golder
Did that happen in Wallace and Gromit in new film? Is there something that we should look out for that wasn't planned, but has made it in.

00:26:32:03 - 00:26:59:16
Will Becher
There's, I mean, every day there's, like, a challenge you didn't expect. I was having a think this sort of practical thing. Sometimes things. Stuart objects and wait. And puppets. The thing is, you can have a really good idea for a scene. And then when you actually physically try and get, the puppets together in that location and then the camera, bearing in mind the puppets are about, 6 to 8in tall, the camera itself is pretty big.

00:26:59:16 - 00:27:26:07
Will Becher
So you've got to get the camera really quite close to them. So we have this whole sequence at the end of the film, and I'm not going to say any spoilers, but various things take place on on a canal barge. You will have seen that in the teaser trailer. Canal barge is tiny. So various shots that involve the characters standing at one end or being inside it, you know, we physically, you know, we just get into this situation where we can't possibly get them all.

00:27:26:09 - 00:27:36:01
Will Becher
So quite often we're cheating things. So there's a few shots where we had to sort of change slightly the action or the location because of physically the and not being able to get their hands in.

00:27:36:01 - 00:27:51:12
Ashley Golder
Is there another scene in Wallace and Gromit that really sticks in your mind that you either loved doing, hated doing? Maybe if it was such, such a pain, or something that you just really enjoyed the process of.

00:27:51:14 - 00:28:14:24
Will Becher
So on this film, I was a supervising animator. Generally that's a role that doesn't involve animating. It's working with the whole team, sort of finding the people, training them to animate in the way that Nick would have originally, and then making sure that everyone has everything they need, you know, that they understand the motivation and the characters and stuff and that they can physically sculpt.

00:28:15:01 - 00:28:39:15
Will Becher
So in this film, I was mostly with Nick and for the majority of it I'd be there with him breathing. So I do remember, you know, the scene that sticks out is this scene that involves a hack, as in a computer is being hacked. I can imagine who might be behind it. If you've seen, again, the trailers, it was just exquisitely animated, and every single shot builds really nicely.

00:28:39:15 - 00:29:00:09
Will Becher
So when you watch the film, for me, it's one of those moments that you just think this is, this could only ever exist in a Wallace and Gromit film. It's just so ludicrous. The whole thing, the way it sort of plays out with this, hack taking place. But I remember it just because every single shot came in and they all the animators on this sequence.

00:29:00:09 - 00:29:22:15
Will Becher
So pretty much two of them, most of it were just working, you know, they'd see each other's shots and you could see they were sort of being inspired by what the other one was doing. And, I think it can make had a very clear idea of it in its head. And so what you see on the film, it just feels it feels sort of very uniquely an Aardman moment on sculpting.

00:29:22:15 - 00:29:37:13
Ashley Golder
Then you're working with these materials, clay. I've learned silicon. How do you create something that is innately lifeless life. Like what the secrets of that.

00:29:37:15 - 00:30:00:06
Will Becher
Yeah. I mean, that's actually a big part of the job as a supervisor is to make sure that these things that they get built and they're exquisitely designed and made these pockets, they're incredibly sort of well engineered, but they are essentially puppets and they look like puppets, and you put them on camera and they they don't have any character at that point.

00:30:00:06 - 00:30:20:12
Will Becher
And so the animators really, it's a case of we do a lot of work with the clay before we start shooting to sort of, I guess, give it, texture and, and make it make the shapes work for us when we're animating, because a lot of it comes from Wallace and Gromit. It's brow as you would imagine, that that sort of area above their eyes.

00:30:20:14 - 00:30:42:06
Will Becher
So we spend a long time just just making sure that the puppets start to look like the characters. So I've got this whole character Bible of the things that we add and take away to make these, these clay objects feel more in character. And then and then really is a case of the animators understanding the motivation, what's about to happen in the scene.

00:30:42:06 - 00:31:04:18
Will Becher
And when they're animating, they they have to feel it. They're physically moving the puppets frame by frame, but they have to actually perform themselves. So they have to keep rehearsing and and then performing. And the really good ones, some of them are quite shy people. But we do live action video reference as well, sometimes just so that we can have a shorthand between the director and the animator.

00:31:04:20 - 00:31:27:00
Will Becher
You know, it might take an animator two weeks to do one single shot. So we really want to make sure before they start they understand what they're going for, what they're trying to get, so that the live action is a really good way of just having that conversation and trying to figure out the timings. But but really, ultimately it comes down to the curtain closes.

00:31:27:00 - 00:31:50:23
Will Becher
The rest of the crew who've set up shot disappear and the animators then just with the or maybe multiple puppets and they just have to start. It's quite a scary moment to start the shot, but they just have to start it. And essentially acting and sculpting in slow motion over several days. But but it works best when they really know what they're trying to achieve something.

00:31:50:23 - 00:32:06:03
Ashley Golder
I mean, that's so much pressure, isn't it, when when you're trying to create five seconds a week and I guess if you mess up, that's that's not just to redo a shot. That could be one week, two weeks, three weeks worth of work I imagine.

00:32:06:05 - 00:32:27:13
Will Becher
It is. Yeah. It is actually. And that's we've, we've tried to make the studio environment is sort of stress free as possible because it is as you know, working in film or TV, anything like that. There was a lot of people working together on the high pressure. Yeah. There's always things that go wrong and, and there's been a lovely shoot for that.

00:32:27:13 - 00:32:47:17
Will Becher
It's been really warm and everyone's been very supportive. But you know, we have had shots that that don't quite work out and that go wrong. And the take two and a take three is actually a massive deal because it's not like we can change something in the middle. So you're constantly thinking as an animator, you are constantly thinking, don't mess this up.

00:32:47:17 - 00:33:11:11
Will Becher
Don't mess this up. It's hardest when it's a really long shot and you get halfway through and you're really pleased with it because then you're just like every, you know, every time you go away and come back, you're just thinking what's what's like going with that and what it's like doing. So a lot of it's about just the animators getting into the right mindset and being able to enjoy the performance on that.

00:33:11:13 - 00:33:16:18
Ashley Golder
What is the hardest thing then about animating?

00:33:16:20 - 00:33:37:23
Will Becher
The, the hardest thing quite often on a Wallace and Gromit project and I, you know, I started out as a as it and as an assistant, like a junior assistant animator and the animators at the the sort of less experienced end, they always get their close up shots of buttons being pressed or someone holding newspaper, that kind of stuff.

00:33:37:23 - 00:33:55:19
Will Becher
And actually, quite often they're the hardest things to do. The close up. Yeah, but the close up shots, because there's so little to go on, you know? Yeah, every frame counts. It really counts. And you have to be really good at sculpting to get it right, to make it look good. And the timing is really important on a really close up short shot.

00:33:55:19 - 00:34:18:24
Will Becher
So funnily enough, and then also, I mean, every Wallace and Gromit film has those shots. It feels like part of the language that Nick uses that the sort of buttons being pressed and things. But but the other thing on this film, I think the massive challenge was Feather's trying to maintain that really amazing character from, The Wrong Trousers.

00:34:19:01 - 00:34:37:09
Will Becher
He's he's not in the wrong trousers very much in this film. He's in it quite a lot. And we knew that he had to be quite developed as a character. You know, he had to show a bit more emotion than he did before. But part of that emotion comes from not really giving too much away, so not moving him too much.

00:34:37:11 - 00:35:01:00
Will Becher
So I think I worked a lot with Nick and Merlin, the on which animators could, could do that sort of performance. And then and then really it was a case of pairing everything back to the point where we would literally say he mustn't blink unless there's a purpose to it in this shot, you know? So every shot we did with feathers, it was a case of like, can he blink in this?

00:35:01:00 - 00:35:10:24
Will Becher
I don't think he can't. Can he move his head? I know he's not going to say no. So it's just getting it looking really good and then being confident enough not to move it all the time.

00:35:11:01 - 00:35:30:10
Ashley Golder
So how are you pairing those animators up with those characters? Because yeah, feathers McGraw doesn't emote. And so if you're if you're really having to look at it that much and that much detail, what are you looking for in your animator to make sure that that pairing works?

00:35:30:12 - 00:35:51:02
Will Becher
Ten would tend to sort of, towards the side of. So with all the animators right there, they're all they can all do everything. And that's the point. You have to be able to animate Wallace Gromit, feathers, all the other characters. You potentially as an animator, you have to do all of them sometimes at the same time in the same shot.

00:35:51:04 - 00:36:12:20
Will Becher
But but feathers require some really specific sculpting, like really fine sculpting, but also very subtle movements. So we would be looking for the animators who would tend to be more conservative and like in terms of their movements, and, and the ones that just historically, you know, most of them have worked on other projects. Some of them hadn't.

00:36:12:24 - 00:36:39:16
Will Becher
But, I'd be looking for the people who had the real, really attention to detail, sort of very fine tuned ability for sculpting and movement. So some animators just are really big and bold. Naturally. I'm one of those animators for me, Wallace and Gromit, the just the most fun to work with feathers requires utter, sort of almost meditative concentration.

00:36:39:17 - 00:37:06:22
Will Becher
So you don't, you know, break out of that mood, but is it? It's really interesting because we're constantly all the time during the film casting the animators very much like actors. We cast them on sequences and scenes, some animators a better comic timing. Some are really good, nuanced emotion, some are good at action, some are good. Everything. So it's like having a team of 30 actors and just figuring out who's going to go where.

00:37:06:22 - 00:37:14:15
Will Becher
And we always start with a key scene, so we'll pick the most important shots in the film and put our key animators onto those.

00:37:14:17 - 00:37:28:09
Ashley Golder
I mean, it's crazy to hear you say something like, comic timing when you're literally doing it frame by frame. That comic timing is hard to get in real life, let alone stop motion animation. How is that possible?

00:37:28:11 - 00:37:47:10
Will Becher
Well, I do, you know, I think we probably have it easier in some ways because we have got so much control over the timing. What we tend to do, we do our live action sometimes is a sort of discussion about the performance, but we also tend to do like a block, like a key frame block through of a shot.

00:37:47:10 - 00:38:05:20
Will Becher
So that means not animating it, but putting it in those key positions. And it's a really good opportunity to break the shot into chunks of time. And so we have a bit of a chance to sort of play with it before we shoot it. But, you know, we are in control of everything as the animators. We're in control of every movement.

00:38:05:20 - 00:38:27:13
Will Becher
So if you have an idea in your head of how long you need a moment to last before the, you know, the, the reaction or before the comedy drop in the shot, we can do that and we can play with it. You know, we can extend those moments more easily because we're doing it in 1/12 of a second at a time.

00:38:27:13 - 00:38:28:10
Will Becher
Yeah.

00:38:28:12 - 00:38:40:12
Ashley Golder
Is there something within this film that maybe didn't go to plan that you then, as the supervisor or as part of a team, had to think of a way forward?

00:38:40:14 - 00:39:02:02
Will Becher
Yeah. I mean, there were lots and lots of minute examples all the time, every day. Quite often, actually. It's physical things. So I mentioned about the boat earlier, but for example, you know, one of the characters, like Gromit holding some binoculars to his face, we built, we test the size before we build things and we make sure everything's going to work.

00:39:02:07 - 00:39:24:24
Will Becher
Okay. But of course, as soon as we tried to animate him lifting them up, we realized his massive nose is right in the way, and then he can't. So we can't. We can't just do that like we were told, like Nick did in the live action. Oh. That's easy. Suddenly you've got to cheat and, you know, literally the binoculars sort of, here for a frame.

00:39:24:24 - 00:39:41:08
Will Becher
And then the next frame, they've gone through his face physically and they're up here, and then we have to cut away the animator. Roger. It was, what do we love? It had to cut away a whole section of Gromit's face just from a frame that he puts in there, so we could actually get them close enough to work.

00:39:41:10 - 00:39:44:03
Will Becher
So it's things like that happened quite a lot.

00:39:44:05 - 00:39:46:09
Ashley Golder
The small details that catch you out.

00:39:46:11 - 00:40:14:02
Will Becher
Yeah. In this film we've got the notes by Kansai coach. Really, really exciting to have them, back in a Wallace and Gromit film. But but I mean, the lights that are in those in, in the bike, they're physical. They're real light. So we have, wires and things. So you have to trail around. And then in this film, there's a sort of radar dish on the back of it which had to turn round so that quite a lot of fun figuring out how to sort of animate things like that.

00:40:14:07 - 00:40:24:14
Will Becher
Whilst whilst a bike is moving along a road with a camera moving as well, you know, lots of problem solving, which is what I think the crew loves to do as well.

00:40:24:16 - 00:40:43:21
Ashley Golder
So you've been recently appointed as the stop motion lead at Aardman, so you've got lots of experience and lots of students eager to learn from that experience. What's the typical stumbling point or question, or your top tip that you'd usually give to and to animators wanting to step up their game?

00:40:43:23 - 00:40:44:20
Will James


00:40:44:22 - 00:41:17:01
Will Becher
Yeah. I mean, there are it's a very it's very exciting thing. The Academy is it's been going for quite a long time, actually, unofficially, it was created for Chicken Run, the first film, because there just weren't enough animators. So I sort of realized Aardman realized that to train people and we sort of done it ever since. So I've so I've been involved now actually only for about four months, full time, but my, my sort of there's so much that goes into being an animator working in the studio.

00:41:17:01 - 00:41:39:06
Will Becher
So a lot of it is showing people how the studio works as well. How you know how to communicate with other departments, how to work with a puppet. But but when they come in and do animation, I'm spending a lot of time telling them about just the pose before you even start animating. It's like finding the pose that suggests to the audience what the character's thinking.

00:41:39:09 - 00:41:47:14
Will Becher
So you do a lot of work with that animating in that thing. It's it's all about visual communication and, you know, gestures really.

00:41:47:16 - 00:41:52:02
Ashley Golder
So almost the secret to animation is to not animate.

00:41:52:04 - 00:41:52:10
Will Becher
Yeah.

00:41:52:14 - 00:42:13:11
Will Becher
Well, yeah, I think sometimes it is. And again, I mean, I'll talk about Nick a lot, but he is if you look at all his work, he, he has this contrast because he'll have moments of movement and, but moments of stillness that before that was quite rare because normally animation is, you know, by its nature it's like things moving around a lot.

00:42:13:17 - 00:42:38:04
Will Becher
So he made it a bit more naturalistic, but, but still retain the sort of comical cartoony elements here. And that like creature comforts and things. So those little moments in the background that make it so funny, I mean, the, the students I've had, a lot of them have asked if they can watch me animate, and I think that's what people at, and I don't know why.

00:42:38:04 - 00:42:59:11
Will Becher
I think that'd be really boring personally, but, but I think what it is, is the best way to learn animation is to do it genuinely. Because every time you do it, you make mistakes and then you learn and you do it again and it's it's so slow compared to filming real, real people in live action that it takes a while for all of those lessons to go into it.

00:42:59:11 - 00:43:17:12
Will Becher
Like takes years to develop from a junior to a senior to a to a lead. It can be a long process on many projects. You're still learning and I'm still learning, you know, now. But I think that's the number one thing, is just to get on with it and do it. And don't worry about having everything right first.

00:43:17:12 - 00:43:19:21
Will Becher
Just just start. That's what I would say.

00:43:19:23 - 00:43:46:21
Ashley Golder
Great advice. Well then my final question is, as you been supervising this film across years, you were saying how Nick had this idea 15 years ago. It's been in sort of pre-production six years ago, five seconds a week for each animator. We've you are you going to sit down at Christmas and watch it, or are you have you seen enough?

00:43:46:23 - 00:44:06:24
Will Becher
It's that's, that's a really good question. I generally I think everyone, you know, we're very proud of the films and they're, they're a massive team effort. But of course, when you're on the crew of something, you do tend to watch the bit that you, you know, I'll be looking at in animation. But I love the fact it's on Christmas Day on BBC.

00:44:06:24 - 00:44:24:21
Will Becher
It's so important. It's such a it's like, just the best. It's just the best thing it could be, frankly. And I am quite excited about seeing it on Christmas Day. I was seeing it once before, so I've worked on it and I've seen lots of sort of work in progress, but I've only actually watched the whole from once.

00:44:24:23 - 00:44:34:08
Will Becher
I really enjoyed it and I, I will be making a family sit down on the sofa on Christmas Day and we'll watch it together. And I can't wait.

00:44:34:10 - 00:44:56:21
Ashley Golder
I can't wait either. I'm. I'm with my niece, nephew, my nieces and nephews and the rest of the family that day as well. So we're very much looking forward to sitting down together, you know, is such a family, you know, gathering around the TV, watching this beautiful, crafted film with its legacy that it's got. So I think we're all excited.

00:44:56:21 - 00:45:10:13
Ashley Golder
So congratulations for such a feat across those years. And for whatever is to come both with Aardman and yourself. Thank you for joining me for a very Christmas edition of TV makers. Well.

00:45:10:15 - 00:45:15:09
Will Becher
Thank you so much, ash. It was lovely talking to you and, Yeah. Hope you enjoy it.

00:45:15:11 - 00:45:20:07
Wallace and Gromit Trailer
Hi. I'm your nifty. Oh, jumping robot. Call me Norbot

00:45:20:10 - 00:45:22:11
Wallace and Gromit Trailer
This is my latest invention.

00:45:22:17 - 00:45:25:09
Wallace and Gromit Trailer
Pleased to meet you, Master Gromit.

00:45:25:11 - 00:45:31:24
Wallace and Gromit Trailer
A smashed gnome.

00:45:32:01 - 00:45:40:11
Wallace and Gromit Trailer
Well, go on, Chuck put him through his little paces. He's voice activated.

00:45:40:13 - 00:45:41:02
Will James


00:45:41:04 - 00:45:58:02
Ashley Golder
Well, that was Will Becher, supervising animator of Wallace and Gromit's new film, Vengeance Most Fowl. And you can catch that on BBC and BBC iPlayer, premiering on BBC one at 610 on Christmas Day. Whilst that's been playing, we filled up our drinks. We've got some cake.

00:45:58:06 - 00:46:00:04
Jake Goldman
It's delicious.

00:46:00:06 - 00:46:10:12
Ashley Golder
And everyone is still furiously writing their next year's Christmas commissions. Rachel Forest you done?

00:46:10:14 - 00:46:13:22
Rachel Forrester
No, no. Absolutely not. But me and Holly have some gems here.

00:46:13:22 - 00:46:14:22
Holly Frazer-Mills
Yeah, we've tag team.

00:46:14:22 - 00:46:15:16
Rachel Forrester
We’ve worked as a team

00:46:15:18 - 00:46:16:05
Holly Frazer-Mills
But we’re not finished.

00:46:16:06 - 00:46:21:08
Ashley Golder
Okay, so before we get onto your commissions, first of all, who's tuning in for the Wallace and Gromit film this year?

00:46:21:12 - 00:46:22:09
Ben Seale
Absolutely.

00:46:22:09 - 00:46:23:23
Holly Frazer-Mills
Yeah. All of us.

00:46:24:00 - 00:46:24:06
Rachel Forrester


00:46:24:06 - 00:46:24:19
Ben Seale
Love Wallace and Gromit.

00:46:24:20 - 00:46:25:10
Ashley Golder
Yeah.

00:46:25:12 - 00:46:38:02
Rachel Forrester
It's that music. And it's that music that Holly tortured me with in the office every day for that. So whistling it daily, I had it in my head for a full year. So I have fond memories of that June

00:46:38:04 - 00:46:39:20
Ashley Golder
favorite Wallace and Gromit moment. Will?

00:46:40:15 - 00:46:59:00
Will James
favorite moment has to be when, when Gromit moves out, you know, in the wrong trousers, when the penguin takes. Oh, and I know it's a really sad moment, but I just find it so sweet because he wraps up all of his, items, and it's just like a clock and a bone, and that's hopefully I'll.

00:46:59:02 - 00:47:01:14
Ben Seale
The model train as well. Has to be, the iconic.

00:47:01:14 - 00:47:06:06
Ashley Golder
So I mean, with the never ending track out that barks you to for the kids. No, I think it's great.

00:47:06:06 - 00:47:08:12
Will James
Yeah. The wrong Trousers is definitely the best.

00:47:08:13 - 00:47:14:23
Rachel Forrester
Yes I good I love a villain, so I really want one of those jumpers you can get with Feathers McGraw on it is classic I love it.

00:47:15:00 - 00:47:16:09
Ashley Golder
Well.

00:47:16:11 - 00:47:28:01
Ashley Golder
Well, like I said, the prize, the commission shot the fact that we're going to do for the Christmas special. Oh, no you didn't. It's not exactly a jumper in my hand.

00:47:28:03 - 00:47:30:24
Will James
But I have,

00:47:31:01 - 00:47:32:08
Will James
That's sick.

00:47:32:10 - 00:47:33:05
Rachel Forrester
That's the one.

00:47:33:10 - 00:47:34:22
Ashley Golder
A vinyl pin.

00:47:34:23 - 00:47:37:19
Jake Goldman
Oh, yeah. I want it of Feathers McGraw.

00:47:37:21 - 00:47:38:03
Will James


00:47:38:03 - 00:47:42:19
Rachel Forrester
Well, if You told us this before, I should have tried a little harder.

00:47:42:21 - 00:48:03:24
Ashley Golder
I told you that was a prize. Your effort should be 100%, no matter what. So to remind the audience I tasked you. We tried to get Alex Horne for a task, but he's yet to get back. I assume he'll get back to me soon and we can have him for 2025. Alex. Feel free. podcast@tvmakers.co.uk

00:48:03:24 - 00:48:19:17
Ashley Golder
You can email me there. So I have a huge bowl of ideas and we'll see who's got the best idea. Okay, so there's four on one. I cannot read this writing.

00:48:19:17 - 00:48:20:12
Verity Tonge
So I read it for you.

00:48:20:14 - 00:48:22:17
Ashley Golder
Christmas chores.

00:48:22:19 - 00:48:23:17
Verity Tonge
Crafts.

00:48:23:19 - 00:48:24:03
Ashley Golder


00:48:24:08 - 00:48:26:06
Ashley Golder
Wow.

00:48:26:08 - 00:48:27:17
Ashley Golder
So this is your title?

00:48:27:18 - 00:48:37:13
Verity Tonge
No this is I would like to have more time to with lots of ideas. And these are not the best. So I've done this in like two minutes. But it's the idea, not the title, but although there's one title I didn't.

00:48:37:14 - 00:48:41:14
Ashley Golder
Yeah Deck the Holly.

00:48:41:16 - 00:48:48:03
Will James
You just punch Holly. I nice Christmas.

00:48:48:05 - 00:48:49:02
Ashley Golder
Go on Verity read it out.

00:48:49:08 - 00:48:50:20
Verity Tonge
So there's four ideas.

00:48:50:22 - 00:48:52:12
Ashley Golder
Pick your favorite one.

00:48:52:14 - 00:48:54:16
Will James
Oh oh.

00:48:54:18 - 00:48:56:08
Ben Seale
Oh.

00:48:56:10 - 00:49:12:10
Verity Tonge
I don't think it would be commissioned nowadays maybe back in the 90s, but, it's Mr. Mistletoe and, a bit like blind dates, but they have two and a bit like, naked attraction. But they have to date someone based on how good a kisser they are, and that's all they have and all the information I have.

00:49:12:10 - 00:49:14:01
Verity Tonge
So they would be blind, blindfolded.

00:49:14:03 - 00:49:22:21
Ashley Golder
Lovely. Okay, Christmas Eve, 30 minutes of people smooching. Next. Married at first. Christ.

00:49:22:23 - 00:49:24:16
Will James
Oh.

00:49:24:18 - 00:49:26:09
Will James
That’s mine...

00:49:26:10 - 00:49:28:22
Will James


00:49:29:01 - 00:49:29:19
Jake Goldman


00:49:29:21 - 00:49:33:01
Ashley Golder
Will do you want to explain.

00:49:33:03 - 00:49:55:04
Will James
Can I not? I just, thought of the funny title. Really? I haven't really thought about that. You also maybe. Maybe, you have two single people, and they first meet on Christmas Day on their family Christmas dinner, and then after that, they decide whether they want to be together forever. No.

00:49:55:04 - 00:50:04:07
Ashley Golder
You know what? This could work because all your family are around for Christmas, right? Yeah. Family, friends, whoever you might. So it's quite an intense day.

00:50:04:09 - 00:50:07:21
Will James
You meet them, obviously very much linked to Married at First Sight.

00:50:07:23 - 00:50:09:18
Ashley Golder
I mean, this could be their Christmas special.

00:50:09:22 - 00:50:12:14
Will James
Yeah, but not Jesus related. It's just a funny title.

00:50:12:14 - 00:50:16:21
Ashley Golder
Yeah. Okay. So married at first. Christ. Next.

00:50:16:23 - 00:50:17:16
Will James
Yeah.

00:50:17:18 - 00:50:28:18
Ashley Golder
Home alone in a bed. Working title for an A bed. But the rooms are rigged with home alone style booby traps from the iconic scenes.

00:50:28:20 - 00:50:31:09
Will James
That's that's a good idea, as.

00:50:31:11 - 00:50:34:22
Ashley Golder
The contestants have to get out of the bed and breakfast.

00:50:34:23 - 00:50:38:17
Will James
Unharmed.

00:50:38:19 - 00:50:40:22
Will James
This is day. So.

00:50:40:24 - 00:50:47:16
Jake Goldman
Yeah, that is me. Yeah, I think the title needs work, but I think there could be something there, to be honest.

00:50:47:16 - 00:50:50:06
Ben Seale
Is this like documentary or like Scandi horror? No.

00:50:50:06 - 00:50:58:22
Jake Goldman
Oh, like kind of weird or like maybe bringing some like Total Wipeout element in as well. So, you know, there's some like intense physical challenge as well.

00:50:59:00 - 00:51:01:17
Ben Seale
And obviously duty of care top priority.

00:51:01:18 - 00:51:08:13
Jake Goldman
Well yeah. Not fucking. Yeah. Like let's let's forget this Christmas. I mean, come on, we want real violence. Yeah.

00:51:08:15 - 00:51:15:07
Ashley Golder
Okay. Last but not least, festive Christmas specials. The. Oh, dear.

00:51:15:09 - 00:51:15:24
Will James
Oh.

00:51:16:01 - 00:51:17:09
Rachel Forrester
We don't think you can read that one out.

00:51:17:10 - 00:51:18:01
Will James


00:51:18:03 - 00:51:22:00
Ashley Golder
The centipede is instead the Santa-pede

00:51:22:02 - 00:51:24:08
Will James
Oh.

00:51:24:10 - 00:51:26:13
Ashley Golder
I mean, the centipede. A Santa-pede

00:51:26:15 - 00:51:29:09
Will James
Yeah. Santa-pede!

00:51:29:11 - 00:51:36:24
Rachel Forrester
We haven't got around to thinking of titles to the other ones. We were just saying something. Duh. Yeah. Speaking of funny rule, the dark Christmas specials.

00:51:37:02 - 00:51:39:10
Jake Goldman
Is it off the Christmas dinner? They do the Santa-pede

00:51:39:12 - 00:52:07:09
Ashley Golder
Yeah, yeah, yeah, we have to be off to, like. Yeah. After 9:00. Yeah, yeah. Oh, no, I just got what? Well, was talking awful. Awful. Okay, so it's a high bar, so we'll we'll run down the floor. So we've got Mr. and mistletoe from Verity. We've got married at first Christ. Home alone in a bed and the un festive Christmas special, the Santa-Pede.

00:52:07:11 - 00:52:11:13
Will James
Oh, sorry. Oh, God.

00:52:11:15 - 00:52:15:20
Ashley Golder
Let's have a vote. Mr.. And mistletoe. Hands up!

00:52:15:22 - 00:52:17:05
Verity Tonge
I don't think I'm voting for mine.

00:52:17:05 - 00:52:18:19
Ashley Golder
So married at first.

00:52:18:19 - 00:52:22:07
Will James
Christ. But you found yourself so.

00:52:22:12 - 00:52:26:13
Ashley Golder
One hand for Will. And that goes hand. I mean, home alone in a.

00:52:26:13 - 00:52:28:01
Will James
Bed, I mean, I well, yeah.

00:52:28:03 - 00:52:29:03
Ashley Golder
I mean, it's.

00:52:29:05 - 00:52:30:12
Jake Goldman
Oh is that the right one. Yeah.

00:52:30:15 - 00:52:31:23
Ashley Golder
Yeah okay.

00:52:32:02 - 00:52:32:16
Will James
Unanimous.

00:52:32:16 - 00:52:48:19
Ashley Golder
There we go. Unanimous decision home alone in a bed. The next Christmas special for 2025. We'll get it commissioned. If any commissioners want to get in touch with you, Jake. They can they can email podcast at TV makers, Skoda UK, and I'll get them in time.

00:52:48:19 - 00:52:54:06
Jake Goldman
Amazing. I think off the back of this I'm going to move into development. So thank you for the career guidance.

00:52:54:08 - 00:53:01:05
Ashley Golder
You are welcome. If anything, we are here to improve people's careers. Here is your feathers McGraw, Wallace and Gromit vinyl.

00:53:01:09 - 00:53:11:11
Jake Goldman
I am so honored. Thank you. Japan. Thank you so much. Stay in Australia. I'm genuinely chuffed with this. This is great. Thank you. Sorry.

00:53:11:13 - 00:53:19:11
Ashley Golder
You're welcome. So I'm intrigued. Do you guys like coming together as a group and watching something on TV together from a Christmas vibe?

00:53:19:11 - 00:53:23:04
Holly Frazer-Mills
Yeah, yeah. Only once a year. Yeah, I've never heard.

00:53:23:04 - 00:53:25:00
Will James
Yeah. Know why?

00:53:25:02 - 00:53:33:14
Holly Frazer-Mills
Because there's too many. Oh, I need another turkey sandwich. Oh, I need to go and get this. So there's never any, like, peaceful silence. Yeah. You don't have to pause it. Don't go.

00:53:33:14 - 00:53:35:05
Holly Frazer-Mills
Yeah, just fuck off!

00:53:35:07 - 00:53:42:15
Holly Frazer-Mills
Whereas when you're on your own, in your own space, like for me, definitely. I can sit and just be completely calm.

00:53:42:17 - 00:53:49:00
Ashley Golder
Just coming together to watch something together. Have to have rules. If you're coming together, it's on and you're watching it.

00:53:49:02 - 00:53:49:17
Will James


00:53:49:17 - 00:53:52:04
Holly Frazer-Mills
On and shut the fuck up.

00:53:52:06 - 00:54:20:22
Ashley Golder
I want to try something with you guys. Christmas past, present and future. And because it's TV makers, this is all about things that you have learned or can talk about that have affected your careers. So let's go for Ghost of Christmas Past, something that you're grateful has been left behind in the past, whether that's in your own career, your own experience, or indeed just the wider TV community.

00:54:20:22 - 00:54:26:07
Ashley Golder
Something that we can just leave behind and never have to deal with ever again. I can give you an it's not completely.

00:54:26:07 - 00:54:37:06
Ben Seale
Christmas themed, but, as like a positive that the industry has moved on from when I was a runner, I used to get employed a lot as a underpaid chauffeur for talent.

00:54:37:08 - 00:54:37:24
Ashley Golder
And I don't.

00:54:37:24 - 00:54:54:18
Ben Seale
Feel like that happens as much anymore. I could stand corrected. But yeah, a lot of jobs that I did as a runner were employed to pick up talent 3 or 4 hours away, and I hired Mercedes or BMW to do a 12, 13 hour day and then do another three, four hour drive off the back or whatever.

00:54:54:18 - 00:54:55:15
Ashley Golder
So some of the.

00:54:55:15 - 00:54:58:05
Ben Seale
Hours were ridiculous for very low pay.

00:54:58:05 - 00:54:59:20
Ashley Golder
So you would still do your running job?

00:54:59:21 - 00:55:14:16
Ben Seale
Yeah, I do a running job, but then drive talent to and from the shoot. And it was a way that productions used to get around paying 400 and 450 pounds for a chauffeur or whatever for the day. And I feel like that doesn't happen as much anymore.

00:55:14:18 - 00:55:29:11
Rachel Forrester
It's not that some of the jobs I've not got have actually turned out to be the best thing for me at the time, because other things have come through otherwise, so it's felt like devastating at the time when it's your present. But then in the past when you look back on it like, actually, if I take that job, I wouldn't have got off with this and done this thing.

00:55:29:14 - 00:55:32:08
Rachel Forrester
So I'm actually grateful for some of the things that I didn't get.

00:55:32:10 - 00:55:53:00
Ashley Golder
Well, that actually then moves me to ghost to Christmas present. Is that something that you have learned in your past that you always come back to in your present? Something that you can also tell other people who might be listening to this, something that you know has been that lesson learned that you always yeah, revert to today.

00:55:53:02 - 00:56:25:09
Will James
Yeah. I've got one I, I worked as a researcher on the Grand Tour. It was the first series on Amazon. I, I only did one series of that, and I kind of look back on it thinking it was kind of like a failure. But as I've progressed in the industry, I've come into more of a technical role, I think to look back on those things like they're not failures, that you're just sort of testing what you're good at, you know, like when you're starting out in the industry, you're sort of you're trying little things, aren't you?

00:56:25:09 - 00:56:36:23
Will James
Trying a bit of post or you're trying a bit of editorial or production or, you know, cameras that if you're not really good at something, it's not a bad thing. You just, you know, try something else.

00:56:37:04 - 00:56:38:20
Ashley Golder
That's great. Verity.

00:56:38:22 - 00:56:44:06
Verity Tonge
I think I was going to joke and say like, my advice is everything that you've taught me to be a shooter but.

00:56:44:08 - 00:56:44:19
Ashley Golder
me?

00:56:44:23 - 00:56:45:16
Verity Tonge
Yes.

00:56:45:17 - 00:56:46:03
Ashley Golder
Nice.

00:56:46:07 - 00:57:06:05
Verity Tonge
But my actual answer. Is that it's really easy to overthink, when you're starting out as, like, a runner or researcher, and especially when you're working for big shows that you've watched on TV and suddenly you're working on it and it's very overwhelming. And I think you can only do the best you can with the information you have at the time, and that's all you've got.

00:57:06:05 - 00:57:07:07
Verity Tonge
And no one can have a go at you.

00:57:07:08 - 00:57:09:00
Ashley Golder
When does that thought into your head?

00:57:09:00 - 00:57:14:22
Verity Tonge
If I'm starting to panic that I need to come up with a decision and I haven't got one yet, that's when I'm like, come on, let's just stop.

00:57:14:22 - 00:57:26:20
Ashley Golder
Absolutely. Take a deep breath and go, okay, I think it's totally okay to tell people, I just need a moment. And I do that all the time. Like, leave me alone for two minutes. I will come up with a solution, but I just need two minutes to think.

00:57:26:22 - 00:57:42:18
Rachel Forrester
On one of my very first jobs, a producer came to me and he was like, you don't have to say no. Like, don't ever say no. But say, I'm not sure on that, but let me go and investigate or research that, and I will come back to you with a solution. Yeah.

00:57:42:18 - 00:58:03:13
Ashley Golder
Which is, which is perfect. Don't let somebody think you know it or panic and then just come up with a bullshit answer again, take a breath, have a think, come back. And lastly, but perhaps most important, the Ghost of Christmas Future. Do you have any goals, projects or areas you're planning to explore in the coming year?

00:58:03:15 - 00:58:04:15
Rachel Forrester
I wish for a job.

00:58:04:15 - 00:58:06:23
Will James
Please. Yes.

00:58:07:00 - 00:58:13:23
Ashley Golder
Most people in TV, I think, would echo that one job side. What is everyone prepping for for 2025?

00:58:14:02 - 00:58:23:12
Ben Seale
So I've been quite open about my journey over the past 12 months of like leaving TV and going into YouTube and creating content. So digitally.

00:58:23:14 - 00:58:31:17
Ashley Golder
And you, you don't create you, you're not like a vlogger. You are working with a company creating content for them on you. Yeah, with a company.

00:58:31:17 - 00:58:54:06
Ben Seale
And an individual. So an influencer basically. Yeah. Creating YouTube content for him on a weekly basis. Yeah. But yeah, I just felt like many in the industry so trapped after six months of unemployment, I couldn't do it anymore. Couldn't afford rent. You know, so many people are going through the same thing. I think I left a lot earlier than a lot of people and just felt so helpless.

00:58:54:06 - 00:59:22:13
Ben Seale
Is like a really specialized TV person. You know, a self shooting producer director. It seemed like I had all these skills that were really high end and really specific, but not the broader. I don't know, the broader strokes to make that a full package. And I'd just say that, you know, having worked outside of the industry for six months, you know, I've been editing for six months, like nonstop now, essentially, really developed that.

00:59:22:15 - 00:59:43:18
Ben Seale
And it's just, you know, it's helped fill a lot of gaps. And I feel way more capable now as a videographer, to provide a wider package. So it's picking up extra skills the whole time. And that applies to TV or outside TV. But just know your worth. New value. And something that seemed like the worst thing in the world has actually flipped around and been fairly beneficial in a lot of ways.

00:59:43:20 - 00:59:48:16
Ashley Golder
Absolutely. Yeah. And all the credit to you. Who else is looking to the future?

00:59:48:18 - 01:00:07:08
Verity Tonge
I want to learn new skills, but be in different environments and different situations and problem solve, because I really enjoy problem solving and I like using that part of my brain. And I think I want a new challenge. And yes, working in some different formats would be really enjoyable.

01:00:07:08 - 01:00:24:18
Jake Goldman
I think this is, maybe a bit of a weird way of looking at it, but I find in this industry, obviously there is a lot of uncertainty sometimes, and you're often thinking about the future or worrying about the future. But what I've kind of this is maybe a better one for my present, but, it's good to kind of take stock of what you're doing.

01:00:24:23 - 01:00:52:12
Jake Goldman
There might be things you love. There might be things you don't love. But I find there's often there's something different or interesting, that, that you haven't done before that often comes up. And I'm just learning to just enjoy those moments and to not actually stress too much about going in a certain direction, because that will will happen, but actually getting to work on some, some great stuff or some interesting, stories is of is worth a lot in itself.

01:00:52:12 - 01:01:00:23
Jake Goldman
So that's kind of, I think, a really valuable lesson that I've learned whilst sort of on this, on this track really lovely.

01:01:01:00 - 01:01:14:17
Ashley Golder
What about you, Holly? Are you. So you're currently a groom for horses? You've just come back from Spain, right? From what? Some shows. Yeah. Are we ever going to see you come back to TV?

01:01:14:19 - 01:01:15:18
Holly Frazer-Mills
No.

01:01:15:20 - 01:01:16:08
Ashley Golder
No.

01:01:16:09 - 01:01:17:14
Holly Frazer-Mills
Is the short answer.

01:01:17:16 - 01:01:22:17
Ashley Golder
No. You're enjoying the horse world like the equine? Well, yeah.

01:01:22:17 - 01:01:50:12
Holly Frazer-Mills
And I think people will always need help with horses. So there will always be work. That's how I look at it. And I've had work for years, solidly, and I've never had to worry about pay my rent. I've never had to worry about my bills or anything because I have consistent work. Whereas when we were in TV, I mean, we did a repair shop for about I think I was on it for a year and a half.

01:01:50:14 - 01:02:00:24
Holly Frazer-Mills
And then when it changed and I did some other shows, it was so inconsistent and I panicked because I live on my own. I don't panic anymore, which is nice.

01:02:00:24 - 01:02:01:05
Ashley Golder
Yeah.

01:02:01:05 - 01:02:02:18
Holly Frazer-Mills
It's really sorry to gloat.

01:02:05:16 - 01:02:09:13
Ashley Golder
So how can we get. Yeah.

01:02:09:15 - 01:02:14:15
Holly Frazer-Mills
And I think I enjoy it more. That's lovely. Yeah. I'm doing something that I actually love.

01:02:14:17 - 01:02:38:20
Ashley Golder
I think for me, for my Christmas future as a work life balance. I think for me, and I know that feels very generic, but I think we all work basically 24 seven in TV, and being able to work out a work life balance within it would be lovely when there is work. Okay, to wrap it up everyone, what are you watching then on Christmas Day?

01:02:38:22 - 01:02:47:07
Jake Goldman
I'm Outnumbered is a very nostalgic show, so that would be really interesting to see. Like what? They, what they do with that now, so many years later. I'm excited.

01:02:47:13 - 01:02:57:00
Holly Frazer-Mills
Probably Wallace and Gromit, but I think who isn't? Don't they do a big fat quiz of the year? Is that normally on Boxing Day or around it's.

01:02:57:00 - 01:02:57:10
Ashley Golder
Around the.

01:02:57:10 - 01:03:03:11
Holly Frazer-Mills
Christmas. I love watching that, and I'm probably the only one in my family that would stay off from watch. Nice. Yeah, that would be one of mine.

01:03:03:16 - 01:03:19:11
Rachel Forrester
I think that's a great shout because I'll probably watch that one as well. But the like typical Christmas family is it down? It will be Wallace and Gromit because that'll be the I think the one thing that my family can unanimously agree on that we all do want to watch. And I think, yeah, that's probably the only thing out at Christmas that we will all sit down and quite happily watch.

01:03:19:16 - 01:03:30:00
Ben Seale
Yeah, I came here today without an answer to that question. But yeah, some great suggestions. Big Fat Show, as always, a classic. And then Wallace and Gromit.

01:03:30:02 - 01:03:32:02
Ben Seale
She hasn't paid us to say it, but yeah.

01:03:32:04 - 01:03:33:07
Ben Seale
It's, that.

01:03:33:12 - 01:03:35:04
Ashley Golder
They've not paid me to say.

01:03:35:06 - 01:03:35:18
Ben Seale
Yeah, yeah.

01:03:35:19 - 01:03:37:07
Ben Seale
Who doesn't love it?

01:03:37:09 - 01:03:56:09
Will James
It's not a, it's not a TV show, but I'm really looking forward to watching Nosferatu. I think it comes out on Boxing Day. Maybe it could be wrong, but, Yeah. Robert Eggers new, new film. I love The Northman, love the witch, The Lighthouse, yeah, remake of the the horror classic Can't Wait.

01:03:56:11 - 01:04:15:04
Verity Tonge
I think I'm going to be the same that also, I probably watch Wallace and Gromit, and mainly because my dad's sense of humor is very it does make him a lot to make him laugh. And so when he laughs, that becomes a thing that's funny. And I can't wait to watch to watch the thing that's funny and then watch my dad lose it over something so simple it makes me happy.

01:04:15:06 - 01:04:35:16
Ashley Golder
Yeah. I mean, all of those really great suggestions for me. I'm really I don't know what about it, but I really do love gladiators. So the fact that they've got a Christmas special, whatever that might be, I'm definitely going to be watching that at some point. Anyway, that is our first Christmas special of TV makers. Thank you all for joining.

01:04:35:16 - 01:04:37:18
Ashley Golder
Thank you for being part of this podcast.

01:04:37:20 - 01:04:38:13
Ben Seale
Woo.

01:04:38:15 - 01:04:44:03
Will James
You're very welcome. Ooh merry Christmas merry merry Christmas.

01:04:44:05 - 01:05:09:08
Ashley Golder
And that brings us to the end of this special Christmas edition of TV makers. I want to say a huge thank you to will be chair it was truly inspiring to hear about the creativity, craftsmanship, and dedication that Will and his team put into their work. Wallace and Gromit Vengeance Most Fowl will premiere in the UK on Christmas Day at 6:10 p.m. on BBC one and BBC iPlayer.

01:05:09:12 - 01:05:37:00
Ashley Golder
Don't miss it. I'm also incredibly grateful to Jake, Verity, Ben, Rachel, Holly and Will who joined me for some festive fun sharing their stories, laughs and even creating future TV gold. And of course, thank you to you for listening. Your support means the world, especially after what's been a tough year for so many of us. The TV makers community has been amazing and your lovely comments and feedback have been wonderful to read.

01:05:37:02 - 01:05:59:02
Ashley Golder
And on that note, I want to take a moment to highlight the film and TV charity. They do incredible work supporting those in our industry. So if you're struggling like so many of the community, their services are available 24 seven every single day of the year through their support line, staffed by qualified counselors, ready to provide in the moment help.

01:05:59:04 - 01:06:20:16
Ashley Golder
They also offer free 1 to 1 counseling sessions, financial and legal advice, and more. So please reach out if you need to and all the links are in the show notes of this episode, or go to film, TV charity.org UK. Also, if you're in the position to support the work that the film TV charity are doing, consider donating to their winter appeal.

01:06:20:20 - 01:06:46:03
Ashley Golder
Lastly, my one Christmas wish. Please do take a moment to rate and comment the show wherever you're currently listening. It's the gift that doesn't cost you a penny, but your feedback is so important to better inform where we go next. What do you want to learn? Who do you want to hear from? What have you enjoyed? Comment on the app and don't forget to follow us on Instagram at TV Makers Pod for some exclusive behind the mic content.

01:06:46:05 - 01:07:03:03
Ashley Golder
And now, until next time, I wish you all a joyful holiday season and a fantastic new year. My name is Ashley Golder. I'm off to finish the cheese and you've been listening to TV makers the first and maybe not the last Christmas special. I'll take care.