This week I interview Elizabeth who is an amazing ally to the lgbtq+ community and we go over questions that she has and also that you all have regarding working with the lgbtq+ community. Things like:
- is it ok to ask for pronouns more than once?
- how to pronounce a queer couple as married or what to call them?
- ways to pose queer couples a
I hope you'll share this with someone who could learn a little more this week.
The intro and all instrumentals were written, sung and recorded by @JaynaDavisMusic
clearly, beloved, uh, my name is Anna and I have Elizabeth with me here today. we're so glad to have you here and thank you so much for being with us, Elizabeth. I, I'm super excited to have you. we met through, through photography, so, I would love if Few first would just, yeah. Share who you are, your pronoun. any identities that are important to you to share. and then we'll talk a little bit about what you do next. Well, hello. Thanks for having me today. I'm excited to be here talking with you. Uh, my name's Elizabeth. She, her or my pronouns identify as a woman. what else did you wanna know? No, that's great. I don't know. Sometimes people have other identities that are important to them. I thought about that cause I'm a mob, but I was like, do I wanna. Identify as mom. I dunno, that's a deep question. I don't know. Yeah, you'll have to think about that one. personal journey. Yeah. I mean it's, so, it's an important piece. So that's still good to share. yeah. And then I would love to know a little bit about like what you do, like your involvement with the photo world. Yeah. so we've met through photography and I am pretty new to the photography world. my focus is more on like family photography, I guess as being a mother, I realize like proof of mom photos are so important to me, and time with your little ones is so fleeting. So, just really love to be there to capture those moments for families. my ambitions, which kind of. intersects with this conversation is to do like, sport climbing photography, cuz I do that as a hobby. Mm-hmm. And I know that there's a big, like, trans community in climbing, which is like so gray. They have so like, so many meetups. there's this like H B O show that just aired called The Climb, and the winner of that show was a trans person named Kat. And they're just like, the journey was like so beautiful. So, Again, this conversation is important to me because I want to be an ally in that community and learn how to do it respectfully. So there you go, Wow, that is, that is so beautiful. Thank you so much. And yeah, I know we already chatted about it, but like, like you said, this is so important and I really appreciate like you volunteering your time and like your emotions to this conversation because like, I know that it can feel scary and like basically, you know, being like, let's talk about something that is not 100%. My expertise is like sometimes. Like vulnerable. So I really appreciate you being on here. Yeah, and I, you know, I'm both excited and like a little nervous of the conversation. I grew up like in a really traditional Catholic family, so it definitely experiences as I grew up into adulthood. But, you know, this conversation is important, so I'm happy to be here. Yeah. Yeah. And yeah, even just you saying that, like, would you mind me asking just a little bit about that journey as far as like, because I grew up super religious as well. my dad is a pastor, so Oh yeah. a lot there. but like, kind of what that maybe, I don't know if it was a transition or not, but like that process into being like, oh, I'm actually open to this and like, wanna know more. Yeah. I think that's an interesting way to put it, like a transition. Uh, I mean, I'm a, a straight woman, but like transitioning like my mindset, because I remember, you know, the TV show friends and Ross's wife is a lesbian, and I remember my parents having a conversation with me literally being like, you know, Ross's wife has a wife, but like, we don't support that. Like that's a sin kinda. And. I mean, I was young, but I even remember being like, that seems weird. Like, they're like happy. Like, I don't understand why we don't, and isn't God all about love, you know? Mm-hmm. and then I lived with a gay man in college and the same kind of thing. They were like, oh, well I know you live with a gay man, but you know, we don't support that lifestyle. And I'm just like, that just like makes me so sad because this is. My best friend and I live with him. And for you guys to like sit down and say that you don't support that is just so mind blowing to me. Mm-hmm. So, as we were talking before I majored in theater and that, I. What am I looking for? That environment has a lot of, LGBTQ funds. Yeah. So yeah, so that was, I mean, anything that I thought I had known or like learned through those fear-based conversations with parents and family, I'm like, was just so, so misguided and, you know, I'm just, just was so happy that I was able to just like shed anything that my parents had thought that they taught me and just really be able to be open-minded and not scared. Cause there's no reason to. So, yeah. Yeah. That's amazing. And like, I'm so happy to hear and like glad that you were able to separate that. Like I know that's what you believe, but like, I don't think that's true. and I think that's really like an important point too of just like there's people from the community everywhere and like even if you don't know it, like you're probably interacting with someone who is so like, it's cool to be like, no, I. I wanna have good around interactions, even if that person hasn't told me they are or something like that. I think that's exactly right. I think a lot of it, like speaking with like those older relatives think that, people who are queer are like dressed differently and are just like, there's a spectr for anybody, even like straight and cis people, you know? Right. I don't know what I'm trying to say here, but like when you, anybody you meet is on any kind of journey that they're on. So it is just like, I don't know, the prejudice out the window because it's just be respectful for everybody. Your opinion shouldn't change based on learning a fact of their sexual orientation. That doesn't matter as far as like how you treat a person, in my opinion, so, yeah. Yeah, very true. I love that. would you mind me asking like how that looks like with your parents now? Are they still kind of on that same train of thought or have they pivoted at all? It's not something we usually talk about. I know that our politics are very different. they know that I have very different politics. I've come spoken publicly. you know, I'm here, I am on your podcast, for instance, and yeah, but it's something that I'm sure they won't talk to me about. It's just kind of like outta sight, not outside for them. So, yeah, exactly. Yeah. Yeah. Well that's, you know, a perfect transition into like the, that's why we're doing this episode, you know, even if, obviously like your parents, so listen, like there are other people out here who, you know, might be similar and like could really benefit from listening. So. Yeah, I, I wanted to do this episode because looking back at my own life, similar to things we already touched on, like I grew up very sheltered, with the same ideology of like, queer people are wrong. Like, that's not what got intended. and even though I knew pretty early on that I was queer, like. That was still my mindset. So it was like a weird you know, a weird time. But I think like, I just wanna share that like it's okay to learn because like even as someone in the community. I'm still learning and I'm still on learning things too. and so that's why I really wanted to do this episode. and just kind of hear what questions are floating around that people still have, that we can take time to address. So, yeah, let's just dive in and. Kind of start to hear what some of your questions are. Okay. My first question is, I recently had, I also randomly teach figure skating and, one of our students came up and she, well, excuse me, they said, you know, my name is Cody, my pronouns are they them. What's your name? And, you know, great interaction around, but I. Forgot what they said their pronouns were. Mm-hmm. and, and I felt bad. I was like, I don't know if I'm allowed to ask again or, so that was like my first question. I'm like, can you ask again Yeah. Yeah. Cause I don't wanna call anyone out, I guess, because it still feels a little foreign to me. just that incorporation of like asking and respecting people's pronouns upon first introduction. So. Yeah. Well, yeah, that's a great question. and thank you for sharing that. I think even the way you just handled that of like acknowledging the wrong pronouns and like moving on, just perfect. I don't think that it's bad to ask. I think you asking shows like you care, right? And you want to make someone feel seen. I think the other thing too is that like a lot of it depends on your relationship with the person too, right? Like I think it's different if you were, like for example, in an office setting and you have a coworker and like four months later you're like, oh God, what's What's your name again? Like, I don't know, But if it's someone that you're seeing for like an hour long session. Yeah. Or you're seeing them once a month. that's totally different. It's not like you're seeing them every day and you're like, oh my God. Like I just saw them and I can't remember. It's like, you know, it's totally normal. okay, it feels like it, but you know, just ask a question. And I think later on down there it was like, if you misgender somebody during a shoot, do you kind of, I was, excuse me, you know, or part of me. Mm-hmm. Wrong thing. you know? Mm-hmm. she, they, you just, how's best to handle that? And it might be case by case, but generally speaking, if I was talking to somebody, I'm like, oh, can you move, move her over there? Oh, I mean, move them over there. You know, like, what do you too? Yeah. Yep. Totally. That's exactly right. Like just moving on like. I think a common misconception is, People need to be all apologetic and make it this big thing because they want the other person to know that they're sorry and they didn't mean it, and like they're trying to do better and you know, yeah. It becomes way too big of a thing where then sometimes the other person feels as though they need to like counteract and be like, it's okay, like you're doing great. Like it totally reverses this situation. Whereas if you're just. Correct yourself or say I'm sorry and move on. Like the other person's like, got it. They caught themselves. They're doing better. There's no, we don't need to make a big fuss about it. That is good. Cause I think people get like caught up in their head about it. I've had conversations with like, my mother-in-law or whatever, and she. she has expressed like sometimes she doesn't exactly, she doesn't know. She's like, oh, I called them the wrong pronoun, and then I kind panicked and I wasn't sure, like, what do I, you know? Mm-hmm. yeah, because it's just like an unfamiliar mm-hmm. and it's like, but it's good to be in that space and learn from it, right? Yep. Yeah. Totally. And I think, I think having conversations with you, you know, even people in my life, It does feel unfamiliar and scary, which I totally understand cuz I was once there too. But I think like the more you use it, and especially like the more you meet people and have those people in your life, it becomes like totally second nature. Like you're just like, I. And then eventually it becomes like second nature to do it for people you don't even know because you're just like, I don't know. So I'm gonna just say they them for right now. Like, oh yeah, that's a good question. If you don't know, is it more appropriate just to use like they them and then perhaps be corrected versus to asse she, he? Yeah, I would say so. And I. I think that also kind of ties into, even the situation that you mentioned where if you're like feeling anxious or you don't quite remember, a really good thing to just like start practicing and to make it feel more normal is like when you introduce yourself, introduce yourself and your pronouns. Because then it opens up the other door for the, for other people to feel comfortable to share theirs. so, you know, even, even during that lesson, if you were to be like, okay, you know, I'm just gonna make it normal, I'm gonna like remind myself and everyone else, hi, I'm Elizabeth. I, you see her pronouns, and then everyone else will be like, oh, okay, cool. Like, let me, let me share mine. So yeah, I think even just doing that in like day-to-day interactions, you know, makes it more normal too. That's like a point that I know that I know, but I think like hearing it that say that it's okay that for like me, a straight woman to introduce myself like that is okay because I, I guess that would like bring a more welcoming environment all around. It doesn't need to be reserved for people only identifying as maybe so. different. Oh my gosh. Now I'm thinking a lot about like, how like culture putting the pressure in the wrong places. Like it just needs to be across the board, like a, a practice. Yeah. Yeah. Brings me to another question that I had, and I don't know if you saw that. the New York Times did an article about like, oh shit, what was it like? Societal like, okay things or whatever. And one of the things I brought up that it was not okay for people in straight relationships to use the term partner for their relationships. They're like, that should only be for, you know, like homosexual, relationships. And I, I was curious about that cuz my husband and I have thought about like, should we identify ourselves like this is my partner or should that only be reserved for other relationships? I guess there's probably no like definitive answer on that, but I was, I was thinking about that as I was thinking about what to ask for this podcast. yeah. Oh, that's really interesting. I mean, I think, just like you said, I don't know that I can answer that, but in my mind I think that using the term partner or spouse just feels. more inclusive. I think, I think that there could be a, an opportunity for, in a relationship like yours to maybe use both. like when speaking about your spouse, you could say spouse and husband. And like, it lets people know like, okay, that's, you know, how he identifies. I don't, I don't think it's wrong. At least I don't think so. I think that, you know, maybe like an old, like bias because I, this is like my own unlearning process is like if someone were to come to me and say like, oh, my partner X, Y, Z, I would probably asse same sex partner. Mm-hmm. anything else it could be so, mm-hmm. Then what's an appropriate way, I mean, there's not an appropriate way to ask. Like, it's not really like my business to know either, oh man, this is like my thought of this coming I love it. Oh, so you're saying like if, if you were to meet someone and they said, you know, blah, blah, blah. My partner and I like you're trying to figure out if the partner. Right, but then you just heard a thought that I'm like, what's not my business anyway? Like they can disclose whatever they want about their relationship. Like my shouldn't change anything to know if you're in a straight or non-straight relationship. Yeah. Yeah. That's a great point. And I hope that everybody catches on to your mentality, cuz I think, I think actually in some ways using the word partner. brought me a lot of safety. Mm-hmm. in terms of like when I'm in spaces that I can't exactly quite read if the people are cool or not. At least if I say that it's a little bit more, you know, used by people now, so I can say it and like let them know I'm, I'm seeing someone, but they don't necessarily know who That's cool. Yeah. So. I like that. I think we will continue to incorporate partner into our relationship. Yeah. Yeah. That leads me to another question. Yeah. Thank you. In wedding specifically, bride and groom, is there always a bride and a groom or what? How are people approaching that now within like their. Yeah. Yeah. I think, I think it still honestly is kind of a new territory, like one that there's not, again, like no definitive answer for, So I think part of, like, specifically for wedding vendors, part of your practice should just be asking the couple, because there's a good chance that like, even if someone is non-binary, they may still, you know, feel like they relate to the term brighter groom. Like you just don't know until you ask. beyond that, I have heard, nearly weds can be used as. An example instead of fiance. otherwise, the other one that I've heard thrown around to is merrier. Merrier. Mm-hmm. like, they're like merrier Yeah. Yeah. Like they're the person getting married. So they're, oh, okay. That's cool. And then that goes in with, I guess this would be cuz people can rewrite the script of their ceremony however they want to. But traditionally at the end of the ceremony he goes, I now pronounce you husband and wife. You may now kiss the bride. How does that script, and I'm sure that that's a conversation they have with their officiant. But I guess maybe as you're saying like the, the field of what words to use is kind of unknown still. So, Yeah. My, my question is like, how do you approach that? Or maybe that's just left out or I don't know, expand Yeah, yeah. No, I love this question. I think it's so great. and I'm actually super glad that you asked this question because, I, I can share some examples, but I think the crazy thing is, is that like these examples are things that people already say and like are already in people's vocabulary that. you could say it and it would be no big deal, but like to some people, if you were to all of a sudden say like, oh, like let's use gender neutral language, they'd be like, no, I'm, I'm not gonna do that. And it's like, okay, but these are things you literally already say. So like Okay. Yeah. Yeah. So yeah, I'm glad you asked cuz. yeah, it could be, you may now kiss your spouse. you know, I now pronounce you newlyweds. Like, it's such an easy and like obvious and oh my gosh. Yeah, it's not hard to do, but you're right, some people might be so like stubborn about it, but I never, you may not kiss your spouse. How easy is that? Yeah. Like, or Yeah, just saying like, you are now newlyweds. Like in any other context people will be like, oh yeah, for sure. Like they're newlyweds. Yeah. But as soon as you ask someone to like, say it like gender neutral, they're like, mom, I'm not gonna do that. Then you're like, okay bud. So, Yeah. Great question. I guess I wonder if like, if straight couples incorporated, like, would that be appropriate for straight couples? Like, just like make that a norm, like you may not kiss your spouse. Like that's just the, the wedding language, like societies and traditions change and evolve with people. How easy would that be for if I were to do it again? I'm already married, but maybe that's something that a conversation my husband and I would have. Like maybe we say like, you may not kissed your spouse. Is that appropriate? Yeah. Well, and I think too, just even like when, when you like wrote down the words like, okay. you may now kiss your bride. Like even that, I was kind of like, okay, but why is it like, why does it have to be the guy that like gets to kiss? The girl, you know what I mean? Like why could, why is it not like, okay, bride kiss your groom. Like wow, that even let's into the problematic weddings in the first place. Yeah. Like I think even just that, you know, there's just so a lot of that like very power dynamic, old language. Yeah. so I think it could definitely be appropriate for straight couples to. Say that and show to other people that it's okay to change it up. I think so too. I think especially after like post pandemic wedding life, I've been to so many different types of weddings now and it's really fun to see like we're like in such like a midst of like the change of the traditional wedding and what that looks like for all types of people. It's really. what you're doing is so important. Oh, I love it, Thanks. Okay. That kinda reminds me too then. what's, like, what's an appropriate way to signify that you are an l lgbtq plus vendor without seeming, like, performative, like, when, uh, queer Couple is looking for vendors to use, how do you signify that you know, you, you're happy to work with them? being like flashy or like, you know, selling pride flowers. Like I don't have friends. Yeah. Yeah. No, I, I also super appreciate this question because it's an important one to think about. and I think a lot of it has to start with each personal vendor. Like thinking about what are your intentions, first of all. are you like, I genuinely like love and support this community and want them to feel happy and safe, and so therefore I'm gonna do X, Y, and Z? Or are you kind of still like, oh, this, this still feels kind of like trendy, so like I'm gonna hop on the trend, or I'm just gonna kind of like maybe say it so that I can get another paycheck, but I don't necessarily like love and support the community, so like, I think the first part of it, definitely, you just have to like check your intentions, like where are they at? Because I think that's gonna show in how you are, like displaying things to the world, right? and I think once you kind of get that piece figured out, the next piece is like, say something about it, right? Like, yeah, I, I've said it before, but like for me personally, I'm just not gonna work with a vendor if they don't explicitly say it, because like, I'm not about to go into a relationship completely blind, like Sure are they, aren't they, are they, aren't they like, I'm looking for a pride flag. I'm looking for a, like, all love is welcome here. I'm looking for a, anything that just like quick lets me know where they're at. as far as like, sorry. Yeah, no, no, go ahead. Go ahead. If someone has like a website or maybe they don't have a storefront or like on their Instagram page, that's something that you're looking for. Then necessarily like photos of representation, et cetera. Yeah. I think. I think like having it somewhere on your website or in your bio is, is important because you want people to be able to easily find it. But then exactly that too. Like you wanna show, like if you had had the opportunity to work with a queer couple in the past, like are you showing that to people, and are you showing it to people beyond just pride month, right? Like Right. Yeah. Once a year. in June. It doesn't really count as like you trying to show that you are always inclusive. so yeah, that's. Yeah, that's an important one because I used to have like outdoors for everyone in my bio. Mm-hmm. and I was like, I dunno, am I allowed to put that I dunno. Yeah. Yeah. I love that you are like, I, I do really appreciate the mentality of you like wanting to be respectful, but I think like, So many of your intentions and being like, I wanna be inclusive. Like, it's okay. A lot of people know you're inclusive and you're like using inclusive language, like that's all great That's good. I overthink a lot of things, so this is a nice conversation. Thank you. You're welcome. Oh yeah, that's the goal. That's the goal. We want people to feel better about inclusivity. Good deal. Let's see. Okay. Yeah, did you have any other questions? That was kind of, I mean, those were great. but I wanna make sure that you don't have any other questions before. Well, is this a db question? I have here, like if both people identify as female, but some addresses more masculine, how. Pose them. And that on surface like feels like a db question, but I know that if I was at a shoot, I would have a moment of. who's hugging? Who does someone wanna be like featured, like taller than the other? Like, what angles am I using? I don't know. Yeah, yeah, yeah. No db questions. yeah, I mean, and to anyone who's listening, I did share two episodes a while back on, on posing queer couples specifically to go check out episodes two and three. but yeah, no, I think. I think basically like the gist of those episodes is that like when you think about it so much opposing does come down to gender roles and power dynamics. Like that's why, you know, the guy is always picking up and the guy is always doing this and like, So I think, it's not to say that like those can't sometimes still have a place in a relationship like that, but I think it's more about like the energy and the personality of that couple versus like, okay, if the couple looks like this, then, then I should probably do this. Like, yeah, I would just suggest, you know, Starting out with a lot more neutral poses. You know, having them walk together, having them hug each other, having them, you know, and then if you start to kind of vibe out, like this is how they interact, you can always ask like, Hey, would it feel natural if you did this to this person? Like, how does that feel for you? Like, I think the, the big idea is to just like challenge yourself to kind of step outside of like, The usual norms and just be like more inquisitive. That's a good way to approach it, you raising it like that is, and I think keeping in a conversation is a really good key too. yeah, continuing to unlearn and step out of that comfort zone. Yeah, exactly. And I think it's kind of, I think it's kinda honestly better, right? Because it like it sort of forces you to get to know the couple in ways that maybe you wouldn't if you just went into a session assing like, oh yeah, this is the kind of couple there are. Like this is how it is. Versus you get to like ask them questions and like see what's normal for them and how like, I don't know. I think that's a really beautiful. and that's such a fun, skill as a photographer too, to be able to read the couple and what jives with them naturally and organically versus like, stand together, sit down, let's get each other kiss, you know, Yeah. Yeah. And even that too, it sounds like, it sounds like you probably already have that skillset of like, thinking of poses that don't require. Figuring out who's the quote unquote man in the relationship. Like it sounds like you already have that tool. You just need to like figure out how to like bend that tool a little bit. Exactly. In a way, I think just more practice as someone with me who's not, specifically working with, you know, queer couples all the time, having more queer couple experience will help me feel more comfortable with that over time too. So it won't be so. A foreign territory every time I go to shoot with somebody. Yeah, exactly. Yeah, exactly. which, yeah, also I did, I hopped on Instagram and kind of asked, asked around and saw if there was any other questions that folks might have. So, I was just gonna take you this time and address some of those questions. see if you relate to any of them. Because, yeah, that was one of the questions that I received was how do you ask for lgbtq plus models for like style shoots or for practice without it being like quote unquote tokenizing, Have you like, is that something you can relate with? Well, yeah. Cause as like somebody, you know, on social media wanting to show my portfolio, but not necessarily having the opportunity to organically interact with queer couples, I do want to be able to showcase that I want to shoot, I want those to be my clients, but I haven't had the opportunity yet. So I think that is a great question. I. Excited to hear your answer on. Yeah. Yeah, and it's a, it's a good question and goes back to intention. Like, I can tell that this person clearly like, has great intentions. So like you're already off to a great start there. and I think like part of that, Is Juan saying your intention, saying like, I really wanna like prioritize like L B T Q or bipo couples, like those love stories are important to me and important to share. So like letting them know that. you value them and that you're a safe person. And then also just being real. Like if it's an experience, you're searching out, being like, Hey, you know, like this is maybe one of my first times working with a couple like you. and just like being straight up. And then from there, like that couple has the power to be like, yeah, totally. Thank you for letting us know. Like we're really excited to. Help you learn. Or they can be like, actually, like, maybe that doesn't feel safe right now, but like, thanks so much. So you're kind of like setting expectations and, and letting people sort of decide like where their comfort level's at too. That's great. Yeah. Just the open line of communication and being clear on intentions versus like throwing up, like looking for queer couples. Not explaining Yeah. photographers throwing up like in search of models or X, Y, Z and sometimes, you know, it's kind of a hard line to judge, but sometimes it does feel like, why are you looking for them? Or whatever, but mm-hmm. Very true. Yeah. And I know like that's a, that's a practice that like won't ever change for me from here on out. Like if I'm ever looking for models, like the first thing I say is like lgbtq plus and bipo couples will be like considered first just because it's like I want people to first of all know that they're safe. Yeah. And welcome. And also to be like, I know that your love stories haven't always been prioritized, so. I wanna do that. And if that's okay for me as a, a straight woman to say too. Yeah. Okay. Yeah. Yeah. You're like saying, you know, and as long as you still have a conversation with them of like, whether or not it's new to you or not, not, I don't know, but you know. Just letting people know and that that can be important with people of color as well too, right? Just being like, yeah, absolutely. Maybe I don't have as much experience like editing your kind of skin tones. Like I just want you to like be aware of that, that like I'm learning. Yeah. I love that. I. I just like want everyone to, to be on that Sorry. I'm like kidding. Like chills. Oh, I dunno. I might cry. Oh. Oh. I feel the same way about like making the wedding space better. So, I'm glad you feel the same way, I just feel, I think everyone has just such beautiful lives and stories and coming from such a close-minded upbringing, it just really, like, I just get, I get like, oh, passionate, where I'm like, oh, just everyone deserves a safe space and I just cannot understand. It breaks my heart. Yeah. Mm-hmm. Sorry, back to the questions, No, no, that's great. Yeah. yeah, I think a lot of the other questions that were asked, we kind of already touched on, which is great. I think the only other one was like, someone asked, like, if two people were both wearing dresses, how would you pose them? and I think that is really interesting too, right? Because like usually the assption is, the bride's wearing the dress and like the wedding day is about the bride, right? So like, if you have two of them, my brain's broken. Like who do you focus on? so yeah, I think that's just like a really interesting concept of like, I think like the broader idea is that like we should also be moving away from that concept, right? That like, A wedding isn't just about a bride, it's about like both people getting married. Yeah. so that's something I think about. And then also like, they're both wearing dresses just like extra fun, you know? Like they both get to like have their moment. They both get to like play with their dresses. Like I think it's just extra fun. I suppose. normally like people. Yeah, exactly. But I guess it's as we've kind of broached the idea that like when it's new it just kind of feels foreign cuz we're so used to seeing it set one way, right? Mm-hmm. Yeah. Yeah. Well that's why your work in the space and. You know, lgbtq plus photographers are so important. I like you recently did I think a reel where you went through your Pinterest looking for like, like LGBTQ plus couple poses and stuff. And I, I was like, that was mind blowing to me cuz I never, of course, I, I never thought about that, like how much that representation matters and it's important to get it out there. Cuz if I was searching and he had to keep scrolling and scrolling and scrolling. It was a really a mind opening for me. I, I loved that reel. Thank you. Yeah. And just for anyone who's listening for context, I, had decided to do like a little experiment and basically hop on Pinterest and search something generic like couples posing or like engagement ideas. and I screen recorded and I was like, I'm not gonna stop until I see a queer couple. And like, of course, I can't know, I can't asse, like, just based on what I see, but. A lot of them looked very straight. That's true. And I, yeah, I, I scrolled for like six minutes and like didn't see a single one, which is very sad. But yeah. Sucks. Yeah. Representation matters, Exactly. Yeah. Yeah. Well thank you so much for all the questions. Those were fantastic. and I think people hopefully are really gonna take some stuff away. but since you've been asking me all the questions, I'm gonna ask you a co couple quick questions, So we're gonna do a fun little lightning round. just to keep things fun, so. Okay. Are you ready? I'm ready. Okay. What's your favorite dessert? Ice cream. ice cream. Do you have like a specific flavor? Oh, I, I mean, I love vanilla ice cream with caramel drizzled over it. And then Rainbow sprinkles That is specific. Yep. That's amazing. Okay. what's your favorite. I think purple. But I really like anything that sparkles. So there's that I'm sensing a theme here. Sparkles, sprinkles, Oh, amazing. And then what would be like the best Saturday? Like tell us your best Saturday plans. Oh man. Well, I, my best Saturday would be. Going to the beach, grabbing some sushi, and then just like chilling out there all day, listening to the waves, reading a book, eating my little snack. That sounds like the best to me. Sounds good. Probably somewhere other than Minnesota. Yeah. Yeah. That's not gonna be here. Yeah. Oh man. Awesome. Elizabeth, thank you so much seriously for being with us and for helping us all learn more together. Like I learned things, I felt very inspired, like knowing that there's people out there like you who are like sincerely trying and want the world to be a better place. So thank you. Well, thanks for having me. And I, you know, I hope this was handled respectfully on my part and, Informative and educationally, so thank you. well, clearly, beloved, thank you so much for joining us on this week's episode. I hope you'll learn something. I hope you have a good day, and we'll see you next week.