It’s your big day, and you deserve nothing more than to celebrate your love in a way that’s most meaningful to you. If you’re feeling a little anxious about finding a wedding officiant who truly supports you, you’re not alone. This week in my podcast, I spoke with Liz from Liz Rae & Co to get her insights as a wedding officiant and her advice on finding someone who is queer-friendly.
The intro and all instrumentals were written, sung and recorded by @JaynaDavisMusic
All right. Clearly beloved. Welcome to this week's episode. my name is Anna and I'm joined here today with, do you prefer Liz or do you go by Elizabeth or both? That's fine, Elizabeth. All the names I get. Yeah. Okay. Perfect. and we met also through kind of the wedding world and have chatted a few times and she's just great. So I'm really grateful to have her here today and I'm gonna go ahead and let her introduce herself. your pronouns, any identities that are important to you. Cool. I'm Liz. I'm a wedding eant. I go by she, her hers. yeah, I don't really have, I guess my biggest identity is a wedding. Eant. We love it. That's a big deal. So and on that note, like I think I'm aware a little bit of, of your beginnings, but you know, for everybody else, could you just share what you do? and then we'll kind of delve a little bit more into how you got into it a little bit later. Yeah. so as a wedding efficient, I write wedding ceremonies and perform them. it started. I think almost like a decade ago now. Cause I had some friends getting married. they, they're gay. They're still gay. or it didn't change. They're still married, which is great. and they were just kind of starting the planning process. Like my friend was about to, to propose to his boyfriend at the time and was starting to look into things and they needed someone to officiate. They had kind of shopped around four officiants. at the time there wasn't really anyone that was very L G B LGBTQ friendly or very open about it. It was kind of like this weird add-on, like, oh, I do weddings also, L G B T one s like as if there were something different. and at that time too, there weren't a lot of people writing, actually writing wedding ceremonies. It was kind of like a fill in the. Fill in the blank ceremony. So they wanted something a little more personal and someone they could feel comfortable with. and that was kind of when I started googling around and being like, well, why don't I do it? I like writing and I don't care who gets married. Like as long as you love each other, that's all it matters. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And that's exactly like why I wanted to have you go. Cuz I just think that that story is like, I don't know, it's so heartwarming for me that like, even though 10 years ago is not that long ago, I feel like the world was still in a very different place 10 years ago. Yeah. in terms of like acceptance and even what laws were a thing back then? So, yeah. What, what was that like kind of entering into the world at that time of, of officiating. It was well weird in a good way. Like I was pretty young. I, I think technically I'm still young, but most people were like retired doing the job or a bit older. And it, it was interesting like when I think back, cause I kind of forget that not everybody had the right to marry. And it wasn't that long ago. But cuz at the time I was in Minnesota, and then Wisconsin didn't have that right. And I would sometimes wonder like, why are you coming to Minnesota to get married? Then I had to think about it and be like, oh yeah, cuz is like, you can't legally get married in your own state. And it's just hard. It's like for me, you know, growing up you just asse you have all these rights and then to have someone that you know, to like see a really good relat. and for them to not be able to take like a legal next step just cuz of who they love. And there's so many stories of people being like, yeah, we were dating for like 30 years, we weren't getting married now Cause we can. And it was, I dunno, it, it's hard cause it makes me a little emotional, I think back that time and like all the weddings that I did where, you know, they traveled in cause they couldn't get married. And that's still an issue in other countries. And it's, it's just wild to me to think like, it's such a natural, right. I don't know why it matters who you love as long you're not hurting anyone. they don't. Right. Yeah. Yeah. That's so true. And I mean, obvious, obviously I feel the same way. but yeah. Have, have you ever encountered like any roadblocks or like, you know, I don't know if you ever like interacting with other, like officiants or things like that of like, oh no, actually, like I don't do that or anything like that? Yeah. it's, it's crazy too, cause I like think back and I kind of, it's like a moment of time where it was like such a cool time to start in the wedding industry cause there's so much change. But then I think a lot of it I blocked out because people were like quite rude about like L G B T weddings. So like I remember getting like hate comments about it and stuff. I think I still do, I think I block off those comments. It's just not necessarily like on reels and stuff. Mm-hmm. Hmm. but, But yeah, or I just remember like other officiates being like one, a little bit rude cause of my age, but then two being like, Hmm, oh, like I don't do L G B T Q wedding. I was like, I don't know why you wouldn't. I don't know. It's just, it's crazy to think back and think about how kind of toxic it was, about who you loved and it's still a little bit like that, but it's gotten better. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Yeah. I agree. Like the world has definitely changed and gotten better, but there's also. very much. Still people out there who are like, no, I would never perform a wedding like that. Yeah. And I don't get why it's like, you know, I think that some of those earlier weddings, not that it's different from any now, but it was like there were times I got so emotional even during the ceremony because when the, like couples would say their vows, it's like crazy to hear like, you know, privately dating for 15 years because we couldn't come out. Or like, just stories like this are like people marrying at such a, and it's totally fine to marry at any age, obviously, but like having to marry legally at a late age because of who they loved and like that. Mm-hmm. that's really hard in a, like hard and a good way to be a part of. Like, it's cool to, to be able to have that moment with someone. But it's hard because, you know, like there's a lot other worse issues in the world you could be dealing with and like, I don't under, I didn't understand. Marriage really mattered. I mean, it does matter, but like why it mattered who you loved to, to be legally married, but mm-hmm. Yeah. Yeah, I know that is, yeah. And like even thinking about my own life, so my dad's a pastor, which means that he can obviously officiate weddings. Yes. and he has done two out of the four of our siblings weddings. Yeah. but obviously like he would never, ever do mine or one cuz he wouldn't want to. And two cuz he would lose his job. so like, thinking about me in my life, I'm like seeing someone like you out there, like it's just, it makes me so happy, annoying that like, you're out there doing something. for, cuz I know there's other people out there like me who are like, we need someone like you You know? so I'm kind of wondering how you continue to sort of carry that same energy of how you got your business started into what you're doing now 10 years later. Yeah. I think the biggest thing, cuz another part like big reason that I started is just like for the actual customization and writing and telling someone's story. Cause I think sometimes we have weddings and we forget. it is a celebration for us and it's okay to share the story and like where it came from and like, you know, finding someone you love can actually be quite difficult and it's like pretty rare. so I try to bring that into every ceremony and approach it from like, we're gonna tell you a story and like, do it in the way that like really means something to you. And I think, you know, that goes back to being inclusive and not being judgmental. And like if people have. 20 kids before they get married. Like not being judgmental. Cause I'm like, I don't care. Like, that's not my life. Go ahead. do what? Do what works for you. Or like, if, you know, they came from like a really weird meeting story, whatever their definition of weird is, it's just not going into it with a judgment and like figuring out a way to tell that story beautifully. And that's kind of always been what I like envisioned for this job, you know? Mm-hmm. regardless of who people loved. I get a lot of people where it's their second, third marriage or if they have a large age gap in getting judged from other officiants and trying to come at it from a place of like, even for me, just learning from them and being like, wow, that's really cool. Like what you've gone through, like how you kind of like battled people's comments cuz people get a lot of comments about their relationship and I don't get it, but. you know, it, it's, it's cool and it's a really cool learning experience and I try to bring everything that I've learned from past weddings into future weddings and have a really open mind going into it regardless of whatever people's situation is. Yeah. Yeah. That's super beautiful and like takes, I feel like, a very kind of special person too, to be able to like, take people who, you know, might have like religious differences or no religion at all, or come from different, like cultural backgrounds and like finding ways to like bring that all together. that's super cool. so, and kind of, yeah, like on that. about what you say, and I know that you really value words in writing. it's a big part of your job. Why do you think that it's, it's important for ceremonies to like have both like really intentional language and also like inclusive language? I think intentional because for a few reasons, like one is probably the only time, one of few times in people's lives where they're gonna like, stop. think about their relationship and like try to figure out a way to convey everything that they've learned and like gone through together. And I think, yeah, you could get like a ceremony off Google, but does that really embody like what you went through and like really share who you are and like give you the space to be like, oh wow, we're like pretty cool, but also inclusive in the sense that like I, it's hard to even figure out how to say it, but a lot of the language that was used in the past was very much like, this is your, this is their role. And it's not like that anymore. Like everybody's kind of changed up what they do in a relationship and life, and I don't think anyone should like enter into their marriage being like, oh, this is like that weird role that I agreed to, but I don't really abide by that. I don't know, like mm-hmm. it, it feels weird to have language in your ceremony that doesn't sound like you or doesn't fit like you, or it doesn't seem. Oh, that is definitely something I'd wanna promise, or it just feels very one-sided and I think it's really easy to add an inclusive language. It's really not that hard, so. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Yeah, that's so true. I was just having a conversation with someone, for an upcoming episode where they were like, like, I don't really know, like, what to say instead of bride or groom and, or like, you, you know, Now announcing Mr. And Mrs. And I was like, like totally fair. That is still really widely used, but it's also crazy to me that there's like alternatives out there that like people already use quite frequently. They just don't realize it until you like ask them to use like, gender neutral language, and then they're like, I don't know what is, why would I, what is that? Why would I do that? You know? So, yeah, it is so easy too. I mean, you can use like couple partner person getting married, you know, like when it's a contact for me, you don't know who's gonna contact you. Like, it's so easy yet. I just have never first name, last name. What are your names? it's super easy to do and it's a, it. I can't even remember the last time I said like bride and groom. It just sounds, I don't know why, I think maybe cuz of my religious upbringing that it's a little bit like, ugh. Like to me, but it feels very. I think it reminds me of when I started weddings like a decade ago, and I try not to go back to that period of time in the wedding industry. So I think I avoid it. it's awkward. Even like aesthetically, I don't know if you've been seeing on Instagram at all. There's been that trend of like pulling up my wedding Pinterest board from 10 years ago and you're like, Oh my gosh. It was such a hugely different vibe back then. Yeah. And it's crazy to think like, it was so common to be like bride groom. And even now, even if it's like, you know, I wouldn't even be like brides, grooms getting, you know, whatever it is. It just feels so dated. It feels like, it feels like I'm looking, it does feel like I'm looking at that like Pinterest board from like 2000. one and having flashbacks of like in sync or something. Mm-hmm. I'm like, oh god, who's that? Era So there, I dunno. That's so true. And I do think that there is like still totally validity. Like I think asking the couple themselves like. what they feel or identify as like is super powerful. Cuz like some of them might still feel that way. You know, like I feel like there are elements that even I can attest to of like thinking about my wedding. I don't think it will be very quote unquote traditional in many senses. But I'm also like, because I know that like my wedding is already going to be. seen as odd just be because of who I'm marrying. There are some things where I'm like, but I also like kind of wanna have that experience, you know, like of traditional cutting the cake or you know, like some of those things that like I grew up never thinking I was gonna have. So like, I think there's validity too, and just being like, you know, If that makes sense. Yeah, and I think there's something about tradition in whatever way you take tradition that feels very much like, this is why my wedding feels like a wedding. Like typically when I'm writing a ceremony at the end, when I'm doing a first draft, I'll be like, I pronounce you married. You may go ahead and kiss. Like I never say like, you make us with the bride, whatever. But every now and then people do wanna say that cuz that's what like feels real to them or like whatever language, I'm like, yeah, that's fine. I don't care. Like that feels good to you. That's fine. even traditional wedding vows. Like people will wanna say them every now and then. Cause like that's what their parents said and their grandparents said, and that like mm-hmm. is what feels carried onto to them. And I think when it's a choice you want to make, it's totally fine. Right? Yeah. Yep. Yes. and so speaking of ceremonies a little bit, like I know that I have like couples and things like that listening. if you were able to like, talk to them and tell them. I mean, obviously we want everyone to hire you, but, what, what do you think that couples should kind of be looking for or like asking potential ef to see if they're inclusive or a good fit? Yeah, I think for share language on the website, I know people will say like, look at photos. Either work, but I. Especially if somebody's just starting out, like maybe they don't have a whole ton of variety in the couples that they've married, but it's something that they're open to and you can get a good sense of that for like how they describe themselves and how they got into it on their website and how they kind of talk to you on the website. Like if they are using language that's a bit of triggering to you, like that's probably not a good fit. You can also tell on the contact form and just in general like having that first meeting cuz you can kind of get a feeling if somebody's going to be. not open or not inclusive by the way that they did describe their process. Like if they're saying, I kind of put everything into a box, and maybe that's what you want and that's totally fine, but if that's not what you want, then you kind of get a good, a good sense of that. I think, I think those are kind of the easiest, easiest ways to distinguish it. Mm-hmm. Yeah. one, once you kind of like start chatting with a couple. how long does it usually take you to feel like, okay, like I'm really starting to catch on who they are and, and now it's gonna take me, you know, this amount of time to sort of write something that feels true to them? It's hard to say. I think this is me personally, I don't know if every other eant feels like this, but I think. for me, I never really fully feel like I know a couple, and I don't mean that in a bad way. Mm-hmm. it's kinda like when you never really fully know a person, like there's always things you're not gonna know. Mm-hmm. usually after the first or second call or meeting, whatever it is, I get a good sense of who they are. I usually try to meet them like in person and a place they like, like whether it's a brewery or restaurant, to kind of see what they're like in the surroundings. Mm-hmm. But I feel like the farther into the process I go with them, the more I get to know them through each meeting. And it's crazy cuz. sometimes a ceremony can take me, you know, 20, 30 hours to work on. Like, it's a pretty long mm-hmm. process. But I could be halfway through the process and we'll just be like talking about random stuff, like on a meeting. Like I had a couple where, I don't even know how this got brought up. I think we were just talking about a trip there on and something that they saw and I was like, well, that's really interesting. And I ended up changing the whole ceremony because that, that one thing that happened and that mm-hmm. kind of embodied everything they had told me. And I think that's like the really cool process. of the wedding ceremony piece. Like even if you use a friend to officiate, it's like you get to kind of like retrace your steps as a couple and think like what meant, what things meant to you, and then have someone be like, oh yeah, I kind of like get a sense of who you are. I think for me it's just kind of an overall learning process throughout the whole time. It's fun. Yeah, it's interesting. Yeah. Oh my gosh. Yeah. That's such a beautiful thing that you kind of just get to. Connect with hans and like learn their stories as like a big part of your job. That's Wow. Yeah. Do you have like any that have, I mean, I don't wanna ask it in a sense of like asking a teacher like, oh ha, you know, did you have like a favorite student? But yeah, just in like any that have like really stuck out to you, or meant a lot. It's so hard cuz I feel like they all do. So you're right. I know I, it's not that the weddings now don't stick out to me. But I think going back to the weddings, many years ago, and I say this because a lot of people have come back to me and like we've done vow renewal, like I'm this old now in the wedding history where I've been able to use voucher renewals with them or like do stuff for their kids. But I think those weddings meant a lot to me because obviously at the time I was. Very inexpensive. And it was the time of people not being able to get married and then people just being so appreciative of somebody being willing to listen to their story. And we formed such cool connections that, like I still talk to all those people from like a decade ago, like I haven't, and that's still the same today, but. It's like we've seen each other kind of go through this decade of change and that's been been really interesting. And I always remember those stories. Like I always remember, like they all took a chance on me and like kind of vice versa. And. Every single one of those stories was so impactful and it was just such a cool experience. It still is now, don't get me wrong. Mm-hmm. But it's really cool when someone's willing to take a chance on you and like open themselves up to somebody that like had no experience and be like, here's our live story good luck, Those are kinda the most impactful. But yeah, it was cool. It was doing about renewal last year with one of'em and we were just talking about some of the stuff they overcame and like kind of vice versa. And it's, yeah, I dunno, it, it's cool to like have that relationship. Mm-hmm. Yeah. No, that is super true. I, I, I love that because those are the ones that probably still like influence the way you do things today. And like the couples you're serving now, probably, you know, A lot of gratitude to, like you said, those first couples too, that kind of helped you get to where you are. So Yeah, I imagine too, like you have the same thing as a photographer. It's like they kind of see you in this journey as you're like developing your art skill and like developing who you wanna work. Four work with, I don't know what the proper terminology is, but it, it's probably like such a, like you go back to your old photos, I'm sure, and you're like, oh my God, but you're so well, like happy those people took a chance on you, Oh my gosh. Yeah. Every once in a while, like. Because, you know, all the old janky things like using to like send people their photos like through Google photos and stuff. And so like, it will pop up on my phone of like this memory from eight years ago and I'm like, I can't believe I like shot that. Like, oh gosh. yeah. Yeah. I could only imagine like, yours is so visual where I'm like, oh my God, I can, I can imagine being like, Ugh, Yeah. Yeah. Oh gosh. Well, I know we've already like, kind of sort of been touching on it. and you've said like you very much so wanna leave the past in the past, which I agree. I think a common theme for me in my business is like people being. Oh my goodness. Like, you know, we've come so far, like you have so much to be like grateful for. You don't have to worry about anything like, as like a queer person or whatever. which I totally agree is true. Like, I feel super grateful that like, I can actually marry who I wanna marry now. Yeah. But at the same time, I am like also painfully aware of like things in the wedding industry that like can still change and we can still like be getting better at. So I wanted to ask you like what your hopes and dreams are for the wedding industry moving forward. That's a tough one. Cause I have lots, share'em all. Yes. My list. I feel like the biggest one. Just looking at weddings, all weddings as equal, and that it's not necessarily like just, you know, like putting everybody on the same pedestal regardless who they love. But even like sometimes there's just this like toxicity of like, oh, if somebody's having a cheap wedding, they're like not cheap in whatever regards. It's like they're not like worthy to work with or whatever it might be. Like everybody values these different things and I think sometimes the industry can be like, Tough on that. especially right now. I don't know why that is. It just seemed like it. I don't know if that's like TikTok or whatever, but that, and then also I think content wise, and I don't know the proper way to put this, but I feel like sometimes if somebody identifies as like L G B LGBTQ people want to work with them for like marketing or like, like they're this like token couple where it's like, oh, so great for my marketing and not coming at it, a approach of. this couple is really cool and I like can't work to like work with them and like make their day great And I think just not having that whole like this is great for marketing. I in the wedding history be would be wonderful if we would just kind of approach it and the more story approach and not just like, this is good for my business. I still feel like that's a lot of it. Yeah. So kind of still making weddings like all feel. they're all equally important. Kind of, yeah. Yeah. It's like whether you have a backyard wedding that costs$2,000 or whether you are, marrying your boyfriend, but the family can't show up because of how you identify. Like it's still an equal wedding. Mm-hmm. like, I don't, you know, I don't want anyone to feel like, just cuz they couldn't afford something or just cuz of who they love. that makes a difference. Like you're making a very active choice when you're getting married and planning a wedding, and I think that's something I wish the industry would just very much recognize. Mm-hmm. like we do, but we don't. Yeah. I, I really appreciate you bringing that up because I think. I think that budget is obviously a very sensitive topic, both on the couple side and also the vendor side too. Right. Because you know, vendors are like, this is my life, I wanna get paid. And couples are like, we can't afford to spend 30 grand for a day, you know? So, I think that's, that's a really important conversation to have that like wherever the couple's at or however they decide to spend their money is like valuable and, and Okay. Yeah, just making everybody feel like they're valuable, cuz sometimes I think this industry can get a bet. like we forget that people are getting legally married. It's a legal docent and it's a very big deal and we focus on like the small things and not like mm-hmm. people who are actively making a very usually legal choice. Not always legal, like sometimes people just do a symbolic wedding and that's totally fine, but like a very active legal choice. And I hope, I hope the industry starts to recognize that more and the importance of that moment and the importance of it being like, this is a very serious thing besides the like financial part of who they love or what the relationship is like, it's a very serious decision in like the coolest way, like mm-hmm. That's why we all got into it. So that's a really cool takeaway too. Like, I mean, I think it's, I think people say it already kind of, but like just goes into the idea of like, it's okay if you're like table to court. is a little off or like missing something, whatever, because you're like, at the end of the day, you're doing like this legal thing because you wanna be with that person. So that's a, that's a great takeaway too. Yeah. Sometimes I have to remind myself of that too. Like when I get frustrated with the wedding industry or like frustrated, you know, whatever it is, and I'm like, oh yeah, this is like a really cool job and like, It's really cool that people like wanna have me part of their day. I don't know why, but, you know, I'm like, wow, thanks. But it sometimes I'll have to like bring myself down a little bit too, and I get annoyed and be like, oh, this is such a cool, like, thing to do. And like, it was cool to have kind of seen change happen over so long. Like, wow, glad I'm really old and can see this now. But it, it's, it's a really cool thing to be a part of. Like, I don't think I'd ever get this with a normal kind of nine to five in whatever industry. Yeah. So true. Yeah. Well my last question for you is kind of sort of related to, it's something that I've been doing to every person that I've talked to, cuz I think it's just so beautiful to get so many different perspectives. so if I were to ask you why you think every wedding should be a little bit queerer, what would you. I was gonna go with a really bad answer of like, because why not Yeah, I think cause, well, okay. This is an overall thing that I've been thinking about a lot recently, but more like everybody has somebody in their life that has gone through the struggle of like loving somebody and gotten judged for it. And I think when you have an inclusive wedding and you don't get super like. Specific with whatever might be, and you're open to, to sharing that with other people. I think it makes all the guests just feel welcome because you know there's somebody, somebody that's attending your wedding that's like gone through something and being able to share that moment with you, but being able to feel like, oh, this is super inclusive and like I don't feel singled out for whatever reason is like, it just makes the whole wedding so much better. Oh my gosh. I actually love that so much. And I love that. That's why I love asking people because it's like, that's so true. Like that I, that idea applies to people, whether they're queer or not, obviously. Like if you're already working to create like a safe and non-judgmental space, like that's so true. Like, judge people for who they're with all the time because they think like they're a bad influence or they're not good enough or whatever. Mm-hmm. And so like already having that kind of energy makes it feel like a safe space for everybody. Ugh. I love that. Yeah, it's cool. I mean, even, I was thinking about this cuz my friend got married last year and they had three weddings, like an American one that my, my coefficient did. so I could. they had one for her side and one for his side, and Hmm. At not a single one of those weddings did it feel very like, like I, I like, you know, I'm not Hindu. Like I don't under, you know, like I don't identify as that. Like I don't, I don't practice, I don't practice the religion, but never once, like during that ceremony that I feel like I didn't belong or like during. the American one that I feel like I didn't belong. Like they did such a good job of including everybody in every ceremony and not having like any specific language or anything that made it feel like, oh, I don't belong, or, because I'm not in a relationship, I can't do this in dance on the dance floor, or whatever it is. And I thought that was so cool. Like it was such a fun wedding. Yeah. Like it was, it was an amazing experience. Like props to them for one, planning three weddings, but making everybody feel included, regardless of which side of the family they're from or like, if people are in a relationship or like what kind of relationship they were in, you know? It was really cool. That's beautiful. Wow. I love that we, yeah, we want all weddings to be like that. Yay. I guess, can I throw the question back at you I'm curious like what your answer would be Why every wedding should be a little queer. Yeah. I mean, I know why you started this, but I think it's fun to hear it like, cause I know you've talked about over these, these episodes. I dunno. It's cool to hear. Yeah. Yeah. well, yes, episode one is my entire response to this answer, but I think, a lot of it has to do with, you know, if, first of all, if you are in the community, like people are already seeing you as quote unquote strange or odd already, you know, so like, run with the energy, like like, if people are already seeing me this way, like, okay, great, like that opens up the door for me to do other things that maybe I was like a little bit nervous about doing differently, but now I'm like, no, I'm gonna run with this and like, do it this way. Yeah. And then two, I think a lot of it is just about creating like a safe and inclusive space cuz you know, even if the couple themselves that's getting married doesn't identify that way, like they might have like a friend or like a wedding party member or something like that, that like would really value. Feeling safe and that kind of inspires everybody in attendance to do the same thing and maybe like do the same thing like in their everyday lives then too, who knows? Yeah, that's so true. I love that. Yeah. Yeah. Okay, cool. Well, I hope you're ready for a few lightning round questions. I think it's so fun to just like keep people on their toes, have some fun, go. so what's your favorite color of the rainbow? Blue, blue favorite like location you've ever done to spend your money? Yellowstone. Oh my gosh. Oh, I'm so jealous. It's, it's fun to hike somewhere and get married. Yes. Oh my gosh. can you think of anything that, like words or like an exchange that's like the most memorable from a ceremony? Yes, I had this October, I will never forget these vows. One because I didn't know what they were going to be. Cause the couple didn't show it to me. And when she first started Ella's like, oh God. But she took it like such a cool way. She basically started, I don't know how many phrases like this, but she was like, our love is messy because, and I like, good for her for doing this. I could not do this. that she would talk about some stuff that they had gone through and talked about how much he loved her and how much that helped her get through what she was going through, and how much that strengthened their relationship, and it was. the coolest. I was like, I can't even write something that good. Like this was so beautiful and good and so true. Mm-hmm. And she said it in front of her whole family. Like, that's so hard to do. Like so hard. It was amazing. It was, it was so good. Like I'll never forget that moment. And it's inspired me a lot with writing, so I was like, wow, I gotta be more vulnerable. Wow. Yeah. Like radical honesty and just like, here we go, Yeah, I still like, I can't wait to see the video from that cuz like I, I was like, man, I need to remember these words. Like, this was so good and it was such a unique approach and a really vulnerable approach. Really vulnerable in front of her. Like she comes from a upbringing of like very traditional. Palestinian upbringing. So like to be able to say that in front of a family that was already kind of like a bit judgmental, like doing a non-traditional wedding was like, oh, it was, it was so crazy. It was so good. It was amazing. It was beautiful. I started crying but I hate it. Sort of Wow. Yeah. We all need to have some more of that, that energy in our lives, I'm sure. Yes. okay. And last but not least, your favorite dessert. Oh, it changes over time. Right now I'm really into cake pops. I don't know why. There you go. Old light sized goodness. Yeah, not too much, not too little. Yeah. I love it. Well, Liz, thank you so much for joining us today and for sharing some, some really insightful things, and I'm sure you've given couples a lot to think about. Hopefully, you know, and people can find you at Liz and Reco on Instagram, correct? Yes, that's correct. Yeah. Anywhere else people can find you or anything else you'd like to share before we say our goodbyes? yeah, I mean, we've got, we've got our website, liz reco.com. but if anyone ever asks questions or I dunno, anything, any, reach out'em all. And. Book. I was saying open ear, read by email. Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. That's better. I hope I'm not like really listening to people's things, but yeah. great. Well, yes, thank you again so much. It's been so fun getting to know you more and yeah, I'm like really crossing my fingers that we have like a wedding together someday. That'd be. Yeah, I'm sure it'll happen. It always does. The world is, the world is cool in that sense. Yeah, All right. Clearly beloved, thank you so much for joining us this week, and I hope you're all having a great day. We'll see you here next week.