This episode of Queer Love stories features Rebeca and Kail, a couple with whom I had the absolute delight of traveling internationally with and spending time with them back in the Cities and just adore. I hope that some of you can see parts of you in their stories and learn from their experiences as well! :)
THIS is the master doc/ comp het doc that comes up when talking to Kail about her own discoveries.
The intro and all instrumentals were written, sung and recorded by @JaynaDavisMusic
This episode of Queer Love stories features Rebeca and Kail, a couple with whom I had the absolute delight of traveling internationally with and spending time with them back in the Cities and just adore. I hope that some of you can see parts of you in their stories and learn from their experiences as well! :)
THIS is the master doc/ comp het doc that comes up when talking to Kail about her own discoveries.
The intro and all instrumentals were written, sung and recorded by @JaynaDavisMusic
Queerly Beloved, welcome back to this week's episode. This week we have another queer love story with us. And this is actually with one of my 2023 couples, which Wow, they are just so fun. And we definitely made a lot of memories together. We traveled abroad together, which that'll, that'll create some stories for sure. And then we got to celebrate back here in the States, too. So, without further ado, I would love if you would both introduce yourself with your names, pronouns, and any other identities you'd like to share. So my name is Kale, uh, pronouns are she, her, uh, I am a identify as a woman and I have recently kind of come to another coming out milestone as identifying as primarily queer or lesbian. I'm Rebecca. I have she her pronouns and I identify as bisexual. Amazing. Wow. Thanks for sharing that. Yeah, it's crazy that we. Met through Google, like, yeah, really pretty much like 2 years ago now, right? Yeah. Yeah. It's just about yeah. Yeah. A year ago, maybe a year and a half just meet in the middle. Yeah, we'll say a year and a half. Yeah. Yeah. So, yeah, kind of like we talked about the purpose of these stories is both for hopefully other folks in our lovely community to be able to like see and hear parts of maybe their own journey through hearing other people's story, as well as people outside of the community to kind of learn and understand from people inside the community. So with that in mind, like before we talk about Your love story, which I'm very excited to hear about I'd love to know just like a little bit about you two and your own journey with your identities. And as always, it's up to you what you feel comfortable sharing. Okay. So I, I originally came out when I was 14. It was a very weird, I mean, being 14 is. Odd, and I had kind of the good graces of being around other people who already identified as clear. And I, I'll always say that that was such a lucky experience that that I had because. It made me start questioning things about myself so much earlier than I would have. Gotta love that people pleasing nature. But I came out as bisexual when I was 14. And from there, I have, I was in relationships with both girls and guys and was just kind of trying to figure myself out. But I think recently in the last few years, I mean, we've been married for For four months now and two years prior and friends for years prior, and it really kind of started to get me to think about kind of my habits in the past and how I thought about other relationships and how I thought about other people. And I was like, wow, I was really unsatisfied with a lot. Of the scenarios that I was in and that I kind of chose to remain in. And so within the last few months since our marriage, I think I've recently gotten to the point of being able to comfortably say that I do identify as lesbian. I think I prefer the term queer just cause I think. There's a certain, like, of the people I know and grew up around who identified as lesbian, it's like, you knew when you were younger, you knew you understood this about yourself. And I don't think I shared that experience, so I don't want to take that away from anybody else, but that's not to say that I am. So yeah, it's been, it's been a, it's been a journey of self discovery for me, even though I've been out for Pretty much a decade. Yeah, Yeah. That's so cool though. Like what, what a cool way to be able to say like, there's always opportunity to like almost grow more into yourself. Mm-Hmm. And to like, keep exploring what that looks like. Like that's so cool. Yeah. Right. Definitely. Yeah. And I'm, I'm really grateful that I, I didn't have any. We don't really have a lot of people in our lives that would make me feel any kind of shame or invalidated in the growth that I've experienced in the last year from like being in relationships that would be considered straight passing prior, which I think is something that I tried to not kind of get in my own head about. It's been a really good experience for the past few years. Awesome. We love to hear it. Did, did you end up looking at that master doc at all? I did. I did. I have to keep reminding myself to like that, that that is something that I experienced that you're talking about the comp hat doc, right? No. Yeah. Yeah. Yes. I definitely think that that tied in so much to. My experience in coming out as bisexual, because I was like, well, I'm not opposed. I'm not like I'm indifferent to this thing that most people consider normal and As I've figured out that I am a people pleaser and that I did do things because of that kind of compulsory nature, I was like, Oh, wow, I really do. I really do fit into this category. Yeah, that's, yeah, I will. I'll actually link that document in the show notes. Cause I think that was really important on my own journey too. And I think it's definitely like gained more traction in the last couple of years, but like in case there's any listeners out there who want to give it a read, there'll be in the show notes. Yeah, it was, I, that was one of the things that you brought up when we did travel abroad for our, the elopement portion of our wedding. And I, Forever grateful. Yeah, Tiffany. I did. I did. Yeah. I mean, sometimes it's so hard to like get out of your own brain and like out of like the thoughts in your head and just to be able to like, see what other people are experiencing and talking about. Yeah. And it's crazy because I've been, I've been so out for so long. I mean, like it, you know, like I felt like I was the walking LGBTQ plus dictionary for a lot of the people that I was around. For a very good portion of my adolescent life, I was always the person in the group that people were like, so what does this mean? What does this term mean? What does that one mean? And I was always really familiar with it, but I think it's different when you kind of take your take yourself out of that. And take yourself away from being kind of like the, the token 1, because I think that's what I experienced. Right? That's so interesting. You would think that, yeah, like, as you said, being that token person that you, like, there probably was some amount of pressure then of being like, well, I need to, you know, be well versed and be this like representation and whatever and left less space for you to do more exploring. Yeah, I think that definitely was. A big portion of it for me, and it's kind of amazing how you can be so in depth in the world of being understanding and not feeling like immense shame over it at the same time. And yet still have so much growing to do. So, yeah, very true. Yeah, well, thank you for sharing that and Rebecca would love to hear what your journey was like. Uh, mine is much shorter of a story. I, I don't know, I guess I didn't really start questioning anything until I was already 20 and I'm 25 now. So it's really only been a few years, but I grew up. Being in, uh, heterosexual relationships and like, I didn't really think much of it. I was very content at the time and then Kale kind of came along and, uh, everything changed. I kind of just started, uh, it was weird. We, we like became friends and. She was very much like my rock and I don't think I had had that really with anyone else. And then we would talk about a lot of things that I think that I was much more reserved with other people and it just felt really natural. And then it kind of was just like, okay, like. Some of these feelings are, don't seem to be just friends. And so it, it definitely kind of got me to start questioning some things. And then we, we eventually started dating and I kind of like looked back on my life and I was like, okay, I think that there are definitely some signs that I might have missed or just didn't really like. Think much of so, but I mean, we, she's the first woman that I've been in a relationship with and the last. amazing. Yeah. Are there any of those signs that come to mind for you as far as when you were, like, reflecting? We talk about this a lot, I think, with, like, music videos, for sure. I remember, like, Loving the pussycat dolls videos. And I listened, I mean, I listened to a lot of like R& B and hip hop when I was growing up. So it was kind of just like, okay, that's, that's normal. Right. But I. Yeah, I definitely think that there is more to that than just like, okay, I really like this song. Okay. Yeah. And as far as as you were like starting to get closer with Kale and things like that, do you feel, I don't know if I'm going to word this question the best, but like, do you feel like you were pretty like actively like, Realizing your thoughts as they were coming as far as your journey, or was it more like things were happening and then you kind of had a delayed reaction of like, oh, yeah, yeah, I think that was definitely more kale that had the delayed reaction actually. I think I tend to be very much in my own head, so it was kind of normal for me to kind of experience something and immediately be thinking about it and probably overthinking it, too. And so I was usually the 1 that was, like, starting these conversations with her of, like, I don't really understand. And I think in a way, what you were saying about being, like, the person that everyone goes to to ask questions, I feel like. She was kind of like that for me, too, because she was one of my, I think you're like one of the first people I've really grown up around that have been a part of the LGBTQ community. And so I think, like, there are some, like, hypothetically speaking, if I felt this way about some person, would this mean that, and Kayle is very much like, well, in my experience, like this. Like she would kind of just like walk me through it. It was just hypothetically. Yeah, like this is nothing actually I'm just kind of thinking out loud here. But so she kind of like guided me through my own kind of Coming out before really anything even happens between us to wow. Oh, you're like, this is like the slyest like ever right here. Oh my gosh. Wow. That's so beautiful that like you could be different things for each other in your own journeys. Like it's really beautiful. Yeah. Speaking of that journey, I'm sorry, what was that? Just what a time. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Speaking of your journey, would love to dive into when you two met and what that story looks like. Yeah, so we met through a series of mutual friends, actually mutual people. I was in a relationship at the time and the kind of like kismet of us meeting has always baffled me because we knew multiple people in that situation. And I feel like we somehow would have ended up meeting kind of no matter what our other like life. Mutuals situation was going to be but we were friends for, we were really, really good friends for a little over two years before we really broached this topic of even dating and So I think there was, I was dealing with other outside. Factors because I, I was in a relationship and I, and I was kind of in the throes of not recognizing my own kind of people pleasing behaviors. And so that's kind of why my delayed reaction to, to us having feelings for each other started to play its own part. But once we, everything was kind of recognized and out in the open, it was very clear how we felt about one another. Well, okay. So Kale's. Boyfriend at the time was one of my friends that I went to college with and Kale went to school in Ohio and I was here in Minnesota and I befriended her boyfriend at the time and I was also roommates with somebody that played volleyball with. So I had known two different people that knew Kale from two different scenarios. And it was kind of just like, uh, I became a part of this friend group. Kale's name was always thrown into the open. I kind of met her through like FaceTimes that she had with said boyfriend at the time. And it was just kind of like, we met through that. And That guy just happened to be unhealthy for both Kale and me throughout our friendship. And it kind of was something that I think we leaned on each other through just because he was unhealthy for us and kind of different, well, in very different ways. And so we were able to kind of talk to each other through that time. And I think that that's kind of what kickstarted our friendship to become. Like so strong, I guess. And just eventually like it became a thing where I was kind of on the outs with him. You were kind of on the outs with him. It was much healthier for us to kind of move away from those that relationship with him. And then eventually it just became like, okay, we've already established a friendship. And clearly there's something going on here between us. And so we kind of just move forward from there. And I truly don't think that we never crossed the bridge of like, okay, we're friends. I don't want to mess this up. That never, that never occurred between us. We both, I think, like had already had such a strong love for one another. Whether it was platonic or romantic, it kind of, they started to bleed together. So easily and so I feel I feel like when we started the romantic side of our relationship It was kind of like this is what we're doing now. Like once we take this step, that's it That's what we're doing because this is we were already important people to each other. We were already We're already best friends at that point in time. Like there, there wasn't any jeopardizing that by moving forward into a romantic relationship, it kind of just felt like the natural step because we did feel so strongly for one another. Yeah. And so the rest is history. Yeah, we definitely were much, we're very much like, if we take this step, like this is, this is like our end game. And we were both kind of on the same page without really even having to vocalize that very much. It's just like, okay, like. You have things going on in your life, I have things going on in my life, and if we need time to, like, figure those things out first, then we can do that, but, like, once we start this, like, we're both in it, and that's gonna be what happens. Yeah. Wow. You knew, like, you, you knew. Yeah, we knew. I remember us talking, this was before we even started dating. I remember us saying like, okay, we do this, like, like, I'm going to marry you. Like, we're going to get there. Like, that's just going to be the steps that we take. And then. We did. We did get married. Ta da! Oh my gosh, that gave me like chills. Like, whoa, to like know, to have those feelings about someone. Like, wow. Talk about the definition of a silver lining. Like, we're going through something terrible, but like, look how it turned out. Yeah. Yeah. It was definitely, it was definitely interesting because I feel like we have a very unique. Relationship starting point, because we started in the middle of something where we were both kind of learning about ourselves, learning about each other and healing from different things. And we were in kind of a tumultuous. Point like, that could technically be considered a low and that's where we started and it was already so strong. So anything beyond that point, it's like. You didn't have to worry about, okay, what happens when we get into our first fight? What happens when we get into this? Like, we had already gone through all of those steps in our friendship and in our just kind of personal relationship towards one another. So there was no fear of like, what if things get bad and it ruins it. It just. It just was you're just my person. Yeah, there's no like, okay, like what happens if I, I don't want to talk this up, but because we had already had arguments and like, we had gotten upset with each other and kind of called each other out on different things and stuff like that. And so it was never like, yeah, like you said, like, I'm not, I'm not scared to get into like our first argument. We've gone through this already. It was very much just like, We've started at our lowest and we've just been able to kind of support each other to grow and move forward. I think. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, we're kind of just answered what was rolling around in my brain as far as, like, if that. If you feel that friendship period affected how your relationship is now, and I guess maybe I'm just curious, like, do you think things would have maybe had different effects or played out differently? Had you not had that initial, like, friendship time before dating? I don't know. I actually don't know. I think that if you, if you had already been questioning. Your own sexual orientation and where you were at. I feel like we still would have been in the same position. You know, I don't think that you or I are really. The type of like, we wouldn't have dated and like found out we would have, I think we still would have ended up being friends first. I was going to say, I think if anything, it maybe would have just taken us a longer time to get to the dating point and maybe just gone through those things again as friends before. But I don't think that it would have changed like the end result. Very strongly when we, when we first, when we first met. When we came into each other's lives, we talk about this often too, is that we both had the experience of, I want to be her friend. Yeah, I was, I want to be in your life. Yeah, it was immediately like, I want this person in my life. And I don't really know why, like I, I hadn't even really talked to Kayle before, but it was just like, I just somehow know that you're going to be here for everything somehow. Yeah. So I don't think that would have changed no matter how or when we met. Yeah, sounds like like at least some version of like love at first sight. Mother. Yeah. You know, romantic or photo or what have you, but Oh, oh my gosh. cry. Okay. So, I mean, you've already given us a spoil earlier that you are indeed married. So Yes. Way to ruin the plot, but I'm curious how long you two dated and then what, what engagement looked like for you guys. We were dating for three years before we got engaged. We got engaged on Halloween of 2022. And then we got married on Friday, the 13th, October, 2023 yeah, we just had our fourth, like official dating anniversary. So yeah, it was just sort of three years pretty much that we had been dating, but yeah. And then, yeah, so we were just engaged for a year while we were planning kind of like our wedding slash elopement, I guess. And when we were doing the engagement process, I mean, we had talked about like you proposing to me and we had talked about, I remember having conversations of, okay, so here's an event that's happening in our life. Like, what if we, we have this vacation and do we do it before then? Do we do it after then? And just kind of the. The position positioning of everything. And so we were really open about the fact that we were planning on getting engaged. We just, I didn't know when you, Rebecca, we're going to pop the question. Yeah. And even the question looked different. What do you mean? Like, it wasn't just a, will you marry me? We kind of went through, Oh, because I'm so awkward. Say more, say more. Yeah. Well, we, she spent, you plan this. Really awesome. Cute, cute, cute date. Oh, you're very good date planner. And I had been, because I had known that she was planning on proposing soon, I had also ordered a ring that you didn't know about. Oh, yeah. Yeah. And so when we went through the night, I kind of, I was like, okay, it's a Monday night. Cause Halloween was on a Monday and we are, you texted me. I was at work and I was like, okay, we're going out. And I was like, okay, why? And she said, we just are like, okay. I'm very impulsive. Yeah. Oh, so you didn't even ask, did you not know it was happening? Or I didn't plan it planet. I was kind of just like. I want to do it soon. I don't know if I want to like, think too much on the date that I do it is very much like I was at work that day and it was Halloween and I was like, okay, I feel it. So I'm just like. Can I kind of just wing it and do it? Because if I think too much about it, I'm going to check it out. Yeah. So it was very much like I was at work. I remember telling my coworkers too. I was like, for some reason they brought doughnuts, I think for lunch. I think it was just because it was Halloween. And so we're all like surrounding, I was working at a landscaping company, so we're all working outside and we were surrounding. Our work truck and just eating doughnuts. And I was like, I think I'm going to propose today. And everyone was just like freaking out. And that's kind of when I was like, yeah, like I got it. I'm doing it. And I think I texted my mom like right after. And I was like, I think I'm going to do this tonight. And so. Just so you're aware when we call you later tonight, I guess I didn't even know that. Yeah. Oh. So what was the date that you planned? It kind of didn't totally work the way we made it work. Yeah. The way that I had imagined it in my head because, uh, do you know the log shoot ride at the mall? So I loved going on that ride when I was little and I had been wanting to take kale on it for like. A couple of years, every time that we've gone to the mall, we've tried to go on it. It's been closed, always closed, dude. I don't know why it just, it picked me. I swear, but I, I was like, okay, cause she is a huge. Bookworm and I love going to Barnes and Noble too, but she just reads, she just like absorbs books and I can't do that. And so I was like, okay, cool. There's a Barnes and Noble in the mall. So we can like, go on the log shoot, go to the Barnes and Noble and maybe, and I've always really liked, gold medal park in Minneapolis. I like used to always just sit up at the top of the Hill at night and I just loved watching the lights and stuff. And that was one of our first dates, I guess, was I brought her to the Guthrie theater and we sat like on the balcony and everything. Yeah. And so I was just planning on like doing the log shoot, getting some books and then like going to gold medal park. It was pretty simple. But then the log shoot was closed as per usual. And then I was like, dang it. Okay. So I don't really know what I'm supposed to do now, but. We were at Barnes and Noble. We were picking out books and I kind of just turned it into this like game, I guess, where I was like, okay, like you put, you pick a random book. I pick a random book. We show each other the cover and we're supposed to like, try to guess what the book is about. Okay. And so we were like going back and forth doing that and just making up like these crazy stories of what the cover. Is kind of just showing us and so we're doing that for a little bit and then I found another bookstore in Minneapolis that we went to and that place was, it felt really big compared to the Barnes and Noble. So we're kind of just wandering through there and. I think you got a couple of books. I don't know if you did or not, but I can't remember if I, but we were kind of just wandering around. Like it's a new place. We like books. We got caught. I think we got coffee. I did buy a book. Yeah. So, I mean, it was, she's happy prime her for the situation. And we just went to the top of gold medal park and granted it was very cold. And I was not prepared for that because I, I think I just wore like, okay, no, you're missing the best part. We both wore. Yeah. Because before Halloween, we went to, we were at the mall a week and a half prior and we both bought Harry Potter Quidditch hockey style jerseys. So I was wearing my Slytherin one. I wore it to work and you wore your Ravenclaw one. Yeah. And that's how we went out into the world that night. So that's really all we had on was like a long sleeve. And then this, like, Quidditch jersey. Yeah. But then, yeah, we went to the top and I proposed. I honestly can't remember what I said because I think I was freaking out. And I, yeah. Okay. Yeah. You said, so this is, I'm, this is happening or a variation of that. And I said, I kind of figured it was and we kind of went back and forth because. We're not, you specifically are not a, like, if it sounds like it's going to be in a rom com, that's not what's happening. You know, it's the kind of like, written out, played out, this sounds cheesy. And so I think that when we were in, in that moment together, I was really nervous. I was freaking out and you were freaking out. My hands were like shaking. And. I was like, I'm not going to say yes. You have to ask me a question. And I think we ended up landing on just, would you grow old with me and be with me through everything? Yeah. Arguably a 10 times better question. That's out with that, out with that. Yeah. Get rid of that shit. Did you, Kale, did you have Rebecca's ring with you then? I didn't, because of course, I, before we left, because I got home from work that night, I had the ring. She didn't know I had the ring. And I was like, if I bring this with me, I'm gonna jinx it. If I bring this with me, that's not what's going to happen tonight. And I was like, I should, I shouldn't, I should, I shouldn't. And I'm an overthinker through and through. And so I did, I ended up leaving it at home. And so we are at gold metal park. I say yes to the question and then we go home and we got the ring from the same place. Yeah, each of our rings were from the same Etsy seller. Amazing. Yeah, and you had given me the box already. So I had my ring and the box from the ring that she gave me. And we were standing in our kitchen and I toss her a box and she tosses it back to me. She was like, no, keep it. Because I thought it was the same one that I gave her. So I tossed it back to you. like, no, open it. And you were like, no, keep it. Like, what, what are you doing? And so I tossed it back and I said, no, Rebecca. And then you did, and I think that's one of the few times I've left you speechless. Yeah, I didn't know what to say, because I'm just like, I'm bamboozled. What do you mean? Bye! Bye! That was like a true surprise. You were like, Oh yeah, I was not expecting it at all. I 100 percent should have brought the ring with me that night, but I'll take the shock look on, on your face. I'll take that. That's amazing. I mean, it's not really a true proposal story if everything goes according to plan. So we definitely turned it into a really good night. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And well, I am very familiar with your whole wedding story saga. The rest of the world is not. So I would love to hear you share a little bit more about it. Your allotment, your wedding. So we had, we had quite a journey getting to the setup that we had, the schedule that we ended up going with. We had decided early on that we didn't want to do a honeymoon, so we, we weren't planning on traveling afterwards. And I, I'll never stop realizing these moments in my life, but I, I, I am. A people pleaser. And so I struggled a lot with breaking away from the tradition of things and trying to figure out like, okay, what does getting married look like for. Us as people, us as two women, us as queer people. What type of vendors do we want to work with? We actually found you because we were looking for outdoor vendors and I had given up. We were, we had been looking for a few, like since, I mean, this was back in, it was like December or January after. We had gotten engaged and we had been looking for locations. We wanted something small. We knew we were only going to have about 50, 50 people. And we had looked at so many places and gotten like, Hey, no, we're booked. We're booked out until 2024. We're and I think I just Googled outdoor wedding venue, Minnesota. Places to get married outside in Minnesota, and I found your I think it was 25 places to elope in Minnesota blog post on your website and I was at work and I. Was looking through this and I remember getting home and I was like, Rebecca, I need you to pull up this photographer's website because I really, I need you to pull it up because I know I, I know when I like something, but I know if you, Rebecca, don't like something. I'm like, okay. All right, then we're going to move on and we're going to find something different. I'm picky. You have a very particular, like, set of rules of in your brain that needs to kind of come into play. And so I was like, I don't want to jinx it by saying I really, really like this photographer, but I really like this photographer. And then she looked through your website and she was the one who messaged you and immediately the two of you just got along so well. It was like, probably like a solid, like, 10 smiley faces per email. Yes. Yes. And I was so, so happy that, that we, that we found our photographer and, and you just in general. And so you were the first thing that we booked for our, for our wedding process. And I am so grateful that we did because you helped us with it so, so much. But. Through the process of we were going to do a ceremony in one location and then do a reception in a different location. We knew we were going to kind of split between an outdoor and an indoor, but we didn't want it to be at the same place. And so, The way it ended up working out was we actually canceled our initial ceremony venue and about what it was. It was July when we decided to elope first. Well, yeah, because we had, we had originally booked with the Arboretum and I, like, there's just something about it that still didn't really feel. Like us, like that place is beautiful. I've grown up going there. I love the Arboreum, but it just felt like something was off. And I also, like, since I was little, I've kind of always wanted to do an allotment. I'm, I was such a shy kid and thinking about like sharing my most vulnerable moment with a ton of other people. Just. It, it like almost would ruin the day for me because I, I would feel like I'm putting on a show. I don't want to, then I feel like I wouldn't actually say my truth to you just because I would feel like I would need to kind of. Change it because everyone else is listening to it. And I, I felt like that wasn't fair to me or you and it just, and kind of everyone else that was there too, because I just feel like it's kind of fake in a way. Well, it feels more like a presentation than it does. And so that was something that we kind of went back and forth with because for a while you really wanted a wedding. And even though it was going to be small, it was still going to be. Pretty much like a traditional wedding, and it was kind of something that I was trying really hard to, like, accept and kind of be like, okay, yeah, this is still going to be fine. Like, we're still going to really enjoy this and it just was not working. I was not, I never felt like it was really going to be. For me, it felt like it was going to be for everyone else and not for the both of us. And it wasn't going to be authentic, I think to me specifically, cause that's just like how I am. And so, yeah, we eventually canceled with the Arboretum. Yeah, I think it was July and we were like, we're not, we're not moving our date because we were very set on October 13th, 2023. It was kind of the 13th in October. We couldn't pass it up. We couldn't pass it up. It was amazing. And we got engaged on Halloween the year before, like there, it was the 31st. It was the 13th. It was perfect. We knew out of all things that we wanted that date. Yeah. And so when we got moving into planning our elopement, which. We were terrified that we were going to really struggle with not having you there and you agreed to go with us and like immediately you're just like, Oh, I'll go with you. I'll just hang out with you guys. The best thing that could have happened. Oh my gosh. But, and so it ended up working out that we did a private ceremony and in Mexico, in Mexico, we, we kind of bounced around city to city on what we're, where we were going to go and what we wanted to do, but we wanted to be outside. We wanted to be in nature and we wanted to be it to be just us. Yeah. And we ended up, you ended up finding the cenote that we got married in. And oh, it was, it was beautiful. It was there, it was powerful. Yeah. And I could gush about this forever. But, so we did our private ceremony there and then came back to the states after, and there was, there was about three days. It was the 9th and the 13th, those are our, that's our ceremony and signing day. Yes. And so then on the 13th, we basically did family pictures. We went to the eighth frame structure in Lebanon Hills and Egan. And it was beautiful. The photos are amazing. It was perfect fall, but very cold. It was so cold, rainy and windy, but I think the pictures made it. Like they came out very us, I think because of that too. They did. And of course we, I left the marriage license at home and then our, one of our friends ran back to go get it while we were getting our makeup done. And then she left it in her car and had to walk back from the A frame. So it just wouldn't be us if that hadn't happened. But so from there we did the signing and then we did our dinner and reception in a really, really cool space in Uptown. And It couldn't have been better, I feel like. That was the coolest part. We had, there was like a little speakeasy bar in the location. There was a lounge area that was big enough for everybody to eat dinner, and there was a little movie theater, and there was a game room. It was perfect. It was the perfect mix of everybody has something to do. And we were, I honestly, I looked through the pictures last week, and there are so few of us together at the reception. We're hanging out with our people, you're all around everybody else. And it was perfect. I, to be completely honest, I don't know how people manage time when they have more than 50 people at their weddings because we were busy the whole time. Oh yeah. Yeah. And doing it, doing it separately where we had our ceremony, we set our vows. Like I, you didn't even hear them. And we, we did that. We did the ring exchange. And did photos afterwards, basically just had like a really, really cool adventure together. Got stranded after getting married an hour and a half without a taxi. Yeah. Yeah, and and when we came back and being able to have the time and have the opportunity to just focus on us and what we wanted out of that experience and how we got to experience it together and then be able to share with our friends and family was amazing. Yeah. I don't think we could have. Done it any other way. That's really great to hear. Like, I feel like a lot of people have like almost instant regrets about their wedding or who they invited or what happened or whatever. So I'm glad that's not the case for y'all. Yeah. The process was the process of planning. It was stressful with the end result was everything we needed it to be. Yeah. And so I think. Yeah, it ended up being so very much us. Yeah. And I feel like this would not be a podcast with the three of us if I didn't ask, Kale, would you recommend being barefoot on your wedding day? I would 100 percent recommend being barefoot on your wedding day. Be aware of your terrain though, because I did slip Kale a chair. We went swimming in the cenote afterwards and I, so I wasn't in my dress when I fell, grateful for that. But there was also, it was gravel, my feet were not having it the second time that we walked through. But honestly, and I found these, I believe I just looked up barefoot sandals and it was basically just kind of like a toe ring attached to an anklet that draped across my foot. And Weirdly, I was telling you this the other day, I don't know how many people can say of all of the wedding pictures, I love the pictures that you took of my feet. I know normally I'd be like, wow, you know, reach out to me if you want to see these cool sandals. But then I'm like, not my best look to be sending feet pics to people. But yeah, it was a really, really cool experience because I think that was the thing that I knew firsthand. I was like, I want to walk through the forest barefoot. That was what I wanted. And I, my dream came true. Indeed. Hashtag worth it. Yeah. Yeah. And then when we came back for the signing, cause we got to wear our dresses twice I, we, we both had Doc Martens. That's what we wore instead of heels or flats or so it was. Very much in full fashion. Yeah, it was beautiful. They, they both looked absolutely fire for anyone wondering. Well, thank you for sharing that journey, that tumultuous yet very adventurous and perfect journey. Yes. I would love to ask y'all to share your expert opinion now that you've been married for four months, right? Yes. Okay, cool. What advice would you give to the other queer couples out there listening? I feel like don't put too much stress on your relationship to change. You're still going to be the same people. You're the same, you are the same person, you are the same people, and you went through. Went through something that is honestly stressful to plan and whether you plan to elope and have it just be the two of you, or you plan something that's more along the lines of a quote unquote, traditional style wedding, what comes out the other side is still you. And so I feel like one of the most common comments that I got from other people when telling them that like we were getting married was, Oh, the first year is the best or the hardest or however, and I just be you, you're the same people. Yeah, you're still gonna love each other the same way. Yeah, I was gonna say like, it's still very much feels like I'm hanging out with my best friend all the time. So, yeah, but I think I think another thing is like, make sure that you take the time to distinguish what you want compared to, like, the pressure of what everyone else wants, because even though you're not. We were going into it thinking that it was going to be kind of like smooth sailing with everyone. There did turn out to be like some, some stressors from outside members. And like, I think it just, it came to a point where it's like, okay, like, if, is this really what? We want and what I want, or is this kind of being overshadowed by what everyone else is telling me that I should do and what they would want or what is like the norm. And so I think being able to take the time to actually. Talk about what fits for you to is really important to being able to like actually have a like real honest conversation about it because You can kind of you can you can brush over it really easily. Yeah kind of turns into a therapy session Yeah, what do I need? What do I want? Yeah, do you need this? Do you want this? But and yeah in the end just figure out what you guys need for yourselves. Yeah Yeah, wedding therapy sessions here for it, what about, is there anything and whether it's been, you know, your 3 year dating journey or in your wedding journey, like, obviously not to say that, like. Queer couples and straight couples have absolutely nothing in common, and it's two different worlds, but I think we also probably grew up seeing just like those kinds of relationships modeled to us more. So I'm just curious if, like, there's anything that's been helpful in your relationship, like. Communication wise, or like, it could be a small little tidbit of like, make sure you kiss before you leave for work for the day or whatever it might be. I mean, we definitely do have things like, like that where like, we never leave the house without Like saying I love you or drive safe, like, that's just kind of a general, we just started doing that and it just every single morning before one of us leaves for work. That's what happens. Honestly, I think the thing that solidified. Going through the wedding process for me was we talked about it and it was okay, we're going to be married, but I'm like, will I always be your girlfriend? Funny thing too. Cause it's like, like, I know that you're my wife, but like, that's my girlfriend. Yeah. Oh my God. No, like that, that like fun, quirky weirdness that kind of. Keeps us together is 100%. It's like, that's my girlfriend. Yeah, so true. I actually saw something about that on Instagram the other day. That was like, honestly, sometimes you can't really be bae. If you can't also be bro, like yes. Call my fiancee, bro. Yes. Yes, I do. Yeah, we definitely still do that. I was going to say, there's so many times too where we're like, okay. I need to talk to you about this, but I need your perspective of like my friend right now. Yeah. And so then we're like, okay, yeah, no, I got it. So I can, I can do that. And then maybe like throughout the conversations, like, okay, like now this is real talk. Cause we're married and this affects like the both of us, but I mean, yeah, it's definitely like, okay. I, I just like want my, I want my bestie. Yeah. Wow. Being able to draw the lines of that, of being like, yeah, I need best friend mode to be activated. It's been. It's something that we just started doing, and it's really helpful. That is actually so wise. Like, don't, don't lose your friendship in, in all of this. Like, just because you are also romantically involved, like, doesn't mean that friendship is out the window. Right. I think that's huge. Wow. Yeah, I definitely think I think it was when we first started dating. I kind of told you that like you're my best friend first and then like girlfriend second. Yeah. Yeah, we definitely went through went through that because I We were best friends first. Yeah, it's like this is that is us that is at the center of who we are as a couple. On the wedding side of things. I had something separate to say. I think kind of what you were saying about growing up and seeing, you obviously see a lot of. Heteronormative examples of what a wedding looks like in the topic of vendors and the topic of, of who you are, are booking, like if you book a DJ, if you book florists, if you, there's always kind of the, well, are you okay with the fact that I'm marrying a woman? Cause if that's going to alter my service, I don't really want to do it. And there's kind of this like weird line that gets towed. But I think the biggest difference between. Planning a pattern, like a straight relationship wedding or a straight passing relationship wedding is that we really had to figure out who we needed out of, like, what we needed from each other out of that situation. And I think that there's a certain grace that's given to straight passing couples, whether they are straight or not, that it's like, you share this with your friends and family, but we had to share this with us first. We had to figure out what we needed as, as two queer women in this situation and what we needed from, from our wedding because it hasn't something that has always been just a given for two women to get married. And so I think the friends and family is a bonus. Of having a queer wedding. It's a bonus that you get to include your friends and family in that if that's the scenario for you and we are lucky enough to be able to do that. But as a queer couple, we had to figure out us first, rather than this is a given that your family and friends are going to be there and what you get out of it is secondary. And so, yes, I think it is a little different. Yeah, absolutely. Can you yeah, I'd love to hear a little bit more about what you mean as far as like figuring out us first, like what did that look like for you? Yeah. Sorry. That was very rampant. I think that when you're confronted with, there are so many decisions in planning a wedding and there are so many decisions between like, there's clearly things that. You, you just know right away, you're not going to want, like, we didn't need a garter toss or, or a bouquet toss or anything like that. That just wasn't, it's just not who we are. But there are other kind of in between conversations where it's like, I don't know if I need this or if this is just something I've seen before. So I think this is how it's supposed to happen. And I don't know any better because I'm, I don't live in the wedding industry. And I think the wedding industry is built for. Kind of accommodating you and your family and your friends and and the entire scenario But I mean you even when we were looking at venues One of the things that we paid attention to was if there was a bridal suite and and a groom suite They were very clearly one was hyper feminized and one was hyper masculinized and that's not what every couple Needs and it immediately kind of turned us away from those options. And so not only were we like, okay, we want to take a look at these venues. We want to take a look at a few of these different options. But they need to fit us, but also we're not sure if in that situation, are you comfortable as a vendor, as an owner with having a queer wedding at your place, you know, like those questions had to be confronted first. And I remember talking to family galore about that, and that's just not something you think of. When you're not in a queer relationship. So that's sort of what, that's sort of what I mean on the planning side of things for sure. And it is, it is, we're very lucky to have our friends and family involved in the process. And we're grateful for both of it, but that's not something that every queer person has. And so like, we had to figure out what we as, as two queer women. how much we wanted our friends and family to be a part of because it wasn't about cutting people away from it. It was about what kind of place does this, does the ceremony hold in our hearts? What kind of when we say our vows is really is for us. It's not that is for our relationship and how we view each other and not so much about. I need to share my deepest, darkest love and brightest love with my person with everybody else. It wasn't about kind of this show of grandeur. It was about. Us just being there for each other. Yeah, that's so beautiful. And so correct me if I'm wrong. But do you feel then that some of those conversations almost felt as if you were, like, deciding. If or what you were going to compromise on in some sense, like for like using the example you gave of like a bridal suite and like a groom suite, like, where then those conversations like, okay, are we willing to compromise on? Like, 1 of us is just going to have to get ready in a room that does not feel like us. Like, yeah, that's definitely kind of how it felt. I remember, like, we. We found a couple of different venues that we both really, really liked, but I remember seeing like the groom suite and the bridal suite and it's like, like, yeah, that stuff in the groom suite is really cool, but it like. Definitely feels like, okay. Yeah. It's you hanging out with your bros. Right. And it's like, so it kind of felt like, like you're in a frat and then she's like in a sorority. It was like, so polar opposite. And so it definitely was like, okay, so one of us is going to kind of get what we'd like. And the other one's going to maybe kind of get what they like. And it just felt like we were definitely missing a lot of who we were. Yeah. In those scenarios, because it's like, I mean, I'm a bride, but I would like to have a pool table and like my bridal suite too. Like, I want to hang out and play pool with my friends and it doesn't need to be just like, this is just for guys. And it felt very much like. We would have needed to kind of give up like pieces of ourselves to fit into those boxes. And I feel like even if you are a straight couple, like that's not how every guy and how every girl is too. So it almost feels like you're just getting shoved into these. Boxes that not not everyone fits into regardless of your sexuality or gender, right? Yeah, both knew we were like we want to get ready together. How are we gonna split up our friends? We can't we can't we don't want to be split up. We want to get ready and jam together. Yeah, and so we we We for goad, I think that's the right way to say that we didn't do the first look between each other. Like, she picked out my dress with me. She was the person I brought with me to pick out my wedding dress. So, I did, I ended up doing a first look with my mom and that was kind of how I recreated that moment for, for myself. But that wasn't something that was. Necessary. It was like, I want my best friend to help me pick out my wedding dress. And she so happens to be my partner. And so then when it came to like the rooms like that, are you going to have a bridal suite? You're like, okay, we, but we, we want to do this together. We want to be with each other throughout this process. Yeah. And that was, that seemed like it could be a weird thing to bring up to vendors and it wasn't always super welcoming. And so that was another part of it. And then when we were talking to other vendors. Also very grateful that we found you for this reason, because it's right on your website. This is an LGBTQ plus owned business. And I was like, okay, that's amazing to see because I haven't seen it anywhere else. So would love to normalize that. That was amazing. But then when we started to work with. Look for other vendors. I remember finding a bunch of different makeup artists and One of the vendors that I had messaged or reached out to from one of the like larger kind of Wedding planning websites where they pull a bunch of vendors together uh sent over a form and on that form was It asked for a number of like bridal hair and makeup that you were doing whether it was zero or one And it wouldn't increase To two. It wouldn't go above one at all. And so then I reached out and I said, Hey, this form won't allow me to do that. And there's two brides. I don't know if that's an oversight or if it is on purpose, but there are two brides. Can we make that work? And so when we, when we kind of got confronted with those situations, we had to talk to each other about like, okay, does that turn us away from a vendor right away? We could get great service from them and it could be great down the line, but the fact that it wasn't. Like it wasn't pre thought of is that this is a person, this is a type of person that you could be interacting with as a vendor and as a business owner. And that wasn't even a forethought. Do we want to work with somebody like that? Yeah, because it feels much more like, oh, shit. Yeah, I guess we could do that for you guys rather than like, oh, we want to like. Actually reach out to this group of people and make sure that everyone feels comfortable with us. Because that's like our goal. Wow. Yeah, that is you cannot have said that better. That is wow. Yeah. Well, I'm glad that you 2 kind of. More or less that effort to do compromises and instead, like, made your own path, did your own thing and like, did what was authentic to you, like, big props to you too for doing that. That's awesome. Yeah, do you guys have 1 more question in you? Yeah. I think this is just like, such a cool opportunity. Since we've all had, like, different lived experiences and things like that, it's just like, a really cool opportunity to hear, like. It's kind of like an opportunity almost. So, like, if you could have spoken to your younger self or something like that, or speaking to other potentially not out folks here what would you say? Oh, boy okay. So, as somebody who's been out for a long time, in terms of, like, it's been a long portion of my of my life and my, for as long as I've had the agency of self identity, I've considered myself part of this community and the importance of being around other people who maybe like their journey, nobody's journey is going to be the same as yours and you're not going to be like anybody else, clearly. I mean, that's how people work. So your story isn't going to look like anybody else's. And I guess if I was speaking to my younger self, I'd say like, just be patient. You don't need to be. You don't need to fit a role for anybody else. Let yourself feel what you're feeling, figure out what you're feeling and give yourself the space and the boundary to one, protect your inner peace. And ask yourself if and if you have any negative feelings towards your own journey, ask where they're coming from and why they're why they're there. Is it about you? Or is it about somebody else? That's fair. I feel like I don't really know exactly like what I would say to myself because I. grew up in a Latino household. And so I, I felt like very underrepresented in multiple aspects, I think during my childhood, just because I don't think I had a lot of representation of Latino people, like on social media or in movies or shows or anything like that, and definitely not queer Latino people. And so I think that My thing was just kind of thinking like, Oh, I don't see this because we're not, this isn't like how we work like a Hispanic person. This is like, well, clearly there's not people like this. So that's why I'm not seeing them. And I think just, uh, kind of reassuring myself that there definitely are just knowing that, like, I'm not. As like isolated as I think I felt that I was when I was younger. And so I think just being able to kind of reassure yourself that there are people who are experiencing similar things, and there is a community that is like willing to reach out and help and just be kind of like a comfort for you while you do your soul searching and go on, go on your journey. Yeah, absolutely. Thank you for sharing that. And I, I hope it hits the right people because I think those are both very important things. So, yeah, and thank you for sharing your, your story with us and being vulnerable for an hour and putting your love out there. I really, really appreciate you guys sharing your time with us. Well, thanks for having us. Yeah. Thank you for doing this. I think we're getting this for so many couples. Yeah. And thanks for, uh, Googling what you did all that time ago. Get married outside in Minnesota, please. Yeah, we wouldn't have gotten through this process the way that we did if we hadn't. Found you, I was going to say, it would have meant nothing that Google search if you weren't as cool as you are.