Knightfalls Vale
Nerds and pop culture references galore. Three friends discuss whatever topic we or, hopefully at one point, the fans deem worthy of us 😆
Knightfalls Vale
Villainous Ventures: Anime Tier Lists, Chaotic Debates, and Nostalgic Narratives ðŸŽ
email us at knighfallsvale@gmail.com
This episode takes listeners on an extensive journey through the fascinating world of fictional villains, dissecting their motives, complexities, and iconic status in various media. From anime to films, we explore what makes these antagonists resonate with audiences while discussing the criteria for ranking these beloved baddies.
• Villains in anime: Analysis of characters like Dio and Itachi and their impacts
• Video game villains: Nostalgic reflections on Bowser and Dr. Wily
• Comic book adversaries: Exploration of the Joker, Lex Luthor, and Doctor Doom’s legacies
• Iconic movie villains: The psychology of chaos with figures like Hannibal Lecter and Norman Bates
• Discussion on common threads of villainy across multiple story formats
Join us for a riveting episode that unpacks the layers of character motivations and the essential role that villains play in storytelling!
Hello one and all, welcome to the Nightballsville podcast, kind of experimental tier list edition, something we've done before, something we have done before but not in a while, something different, not this broad yeah not this broad, it's just strictly anime. Villains fiction, villains in fiction Set in his house. And there was me, you. You shall not be named in Hobbit. Villains of fiction. There's five of us, yeah villains.
Speaker 2:He shall not be named in Hobbit.
Speaker 1:Villains of fiction. There's five of us. There's five of us. We haven't recorded it before?
Speaker 2:Yeah, it's okay, Bill had me going there.
Speaker 1:I was like wait, we've done this before on the podcast. No, I don't. Yeah, Villains in fiction tier list. So what we're going to do is I was going to say the closest thing we came was drafting our fucking. We haven't drafted anime characters. By the way, We'd have to set up a team ranking for that.
Speaker 1:Aimee would probably love the shit out of that one and he'd kill us if we picked any of his characters. Mine, mine, so uh, but no, matt did. Matt did the fuck you to me in the DC one. He took some time. I'm like, hey, yeah, and you got fucking Spectre. Deal with your shit. You had the fucking god team, me drafting gods. You had the humans. Wow, what the Look at my team. Jay looked at his thing and was like I got a bunch of ass humans. What the fuck. I took Zatanna to hurt you. All. Right enough about the draft. Lay out the criteria and what they're expecting.
Speaker 1:Well first I'm going to say we're going to do it in sections, kind of, because we we organized Matt here organized them by some category Anime, comic book, video game and miscellaneous, no film 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6 categories 5 it's mainly.
Speaker 1:it's like 4.2. Miscellaneous isn't very big. No, film Film 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, categories 5. It's like 4.2. Miscellaneous isn't very big. You don't have a 5. Dice with 5 in it, no, so we're going to tier them out. I think we have S through bottom tier. What do we have for our bottom tier? We have S. I'm only keeping track of the S and A, fundamentally. And we're doing it the same way as the dungeon tiers S tier, you're a top raker. Well, what Well we gotta put?
Speaker 1:the ones that aren't S or A somewhere. We're just gonna have a. Well, I'm gonna cross them off. A, b, C, bc. I mean, you guys want to write them out too, because I'm not going to keep track of them all. F is bottom tier. What do you got S. I got S and A. Don't ask me why. Every so you would have BC and he would have DF. Jay gets the trash.
Speaker 1:I have to write shit. Well, if we're not going to, we'll have to read that one. Yeah, yeah, this is kind of just for our own sanity, in a way, I guess, Just so I can see where we put everything. So why don't I have C? No, b and C. You're passing, I'm passing F, d and S.
Speaker 1:Yes you're trash. I get the humans again. To be fair, there's probably not going to be many of them. Yeah, considering we're taping the top mostly Ranker, there might be some. We don't think that good. I see why you're trying to limit the S's, because a lot of them are good. That's the problem when we're re-ranking.
Speaker 2:S tier.
Speaker 1:So when we're done with all of our mini tiers, we're going to try to rank them at the end, all together, just the big ones. We won't go through them all again. So, okay, maybe we can do a short run-through of those things and say who's the best in this tier? Yeah, and if we enjoy doing this which we might, depending discussion we'll fucking do more of these Different topics. We at least gotta do a second one with the heroes. Yeah, we gotta do a hero cheer list.
Speaker 1:Yeah, on the mouth. Villains go first. I love. Well, that was my choice. I said villains. I'm always very even keeled. If we're gonna do villains, we gotta do heroes at some point we should. Fucking Hobbit would actually be good for this too. We'd have to let him know about the hero one. He'd be good. Unless we talk about X-Men, then they're all fucking ass. And I'm also going to apologize in advance for how many Japanese names I'm going to butcher out of them. Cco, it's still the only one you have memorized. He's not even on here. What he's at the top 50 of these lists, ranker Well he should be. I remember his name. Well, that's for a different reason. That's why I, when I pulled them by their things, I randomized them afterwards, so I didn't control what. So they're not on the ranker list. This way they're randomized afterwards. Oh, and I should mention too criteria I figured will go off of accomplishments, impact on pop culture and the universe. They're in design and aura, slash, charisma, kind of the same thing character, depth and complexity, general likability and threatening.
Speaker 2:Threatability.
Speaker 1:Threatability to the hero and of the hero and story. I don't know how to make sure that's an actual word, I just spelt it that way.
Speaker 2:I think I said no, you know what I didn't say, I did not say threatability.
Speaker 1:I said something more simple. There's no way I said that it's a big word for me. I can use big word. I didn't use that word. I didn't use that word. You should have had him read that I didn't use that word.
Speaker 2:I didn't use that word, you would have said throatability. Ah, it starts R. I was like I didn't read.
Speaker 1:Yeah, throatability, how well you can talk, hey, dean, now you gotta raise the villain's throatability. That would probably be the only thing. Darth Vader's an effin' oh God, ready for number one? Sure, agnolia Fairytale oh, I'm like. That's Agnolia Agnologe. Yeah, I told you I was just butchering these. Who the fuck's Agnolia? Agnolia, okay, agnolia, that's the dragon. I told you I was just butchering these. Who the fuck's Anolia? I can't remember Anolia. That's the dragon, matt said, and I'm like. I was like, was it the end's actual name? No, that's the blue dragon that killed Igneel. Oh, I'm like I was going through Anolia. I love it. Good stuff Right off the bat. I think I'm going to get the next one, though it's the fourth one down I'm going to have an issue with. I think I'm going to be horrible for saying D F range for me. Oh, sad thing is I'm agreeing, because I can't really Accomplishments.
Speaker 2:He killed.
Speaker 1:Igneel, you killed Igneel. So that'll, get him about an A.
Speaker 2:Had the whole.
Speaker 1:Igneel was pretty fucking powerful in here, Let me see. But again, Fairytale is one of them. That's like I would never say. Fairytale has top tier villains. Let's see His impact on pop culture and universe. There ain't really nothing there. I mean, if you like anime, you know I like Fairytale 1 on this list. What?
Speaker 2:He is the only one, okay.
Speaker 1:I don't remember shit about him. So Character depth and complexity, there was none. I'm a dragon that's, and Fairytale's, not over complex. I'm a dragon that's really strong and I'm just killing fucking shit. So like he's a dragon.
Speaker 2:Yeah, igneel is not gonna be that high, so low on accomplishments.
Speaker 1:He gets the A for killing Igneel, for threatability to hero and story. This is why I like having Matt. Matt can do a lot of stuff like yeah. I can give him that one. That's the whole reason for Natsu being who he is.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:No, no, no, Not the whole backstory.
Speaker 2:You're thinking of Zerath.
Speaker 1:You're thinking of Agnolokia's, not You're thinking of Zerath. You're thinking of Zerath, I think, because I'm like Agnologia didn't really have much to do with Natsu, so general likability is also going to be low. Igneel, yes, igneel, yeah, I thought you were talking about Agnologia.
Speaker 2:He had nothing to do with Natsu, really Killed Igneel, Killed Igneel sure.
Speaker 1:I thought you were talking about. Agnologiagia was important to, not to his backstories. I'm talking about killing him.
Speaker 2:I see what you were comparing.
Speaker 1:I was trying to like no, I don't think. Okay, I misunderstood what you were saying. I get no. Well God, you were taking that quite literally. I wasn't taking it bad, I didn't know what you meant. So I'm like wait, oh, I got it. A, d, f, f, f, he's got aura, a little bit of aura.
Speaker 2:But it's not max.
Speaker 1:But since he's got an A thing, I think we have to put him in D. I'm leaning C. You were leaning C, I'm leaning C. I was trying to go B, but I'm like nah, I gotta go C. Fairytale's not known for villains, that much he's not bad but. I think I'll vote you then that's fine, that's fine.
Speaker 1:D go, d, d go. Zerlan A C N O L. You're telling me Agnol, that's fine, that's fine. Digo D Digo, Zerlan A-C-N-O-L. You're telling me Agnolokia was on there over Zerath D-I-A. I'm surprised he was in the, according to Ranker. I know, I'm just surprised it went, agnolokia, over Zerath. Okay, from Fanex.
Speaker 1:I could see how you Sounds that fucking weird Just reading it off Act no, leah. Uh shit, I would have said act no. This will be more fun when we get to ones like Jay didn't remember much and Matt like the next one, I don't know. I barely remembered that. I don't know how much Matt even did anything with fairy tale. I know I knew who it was. Okay, I don't remember them by their better funner when we all. I never watched it, I only watched it. We'll just get the solo leveling characters and then we're like there ain't none on there?
Speaker 2:I don't think Nope.
Speaker 1:The biggest one doesn't exist, there doesn't exist yet, and we? Won't even get that until next season. I'm really curious where this shit ends. There are people it's the demon, he's gonna fight the. It's the top of the tower and the demon, the fucking demon king, they're gonna tease the Juju Island. I'm just saying people keep saying it's this season and I'm just saying everyone keeps yeah, I'm like Guys, whoever thinks it is needs to worry.
Speaker 2:I'm not crazy, I'm telling you these people are really.
Speaker 1:They don't show any ants in the intro. People are saying no, no, episode 12 and 13 is Jujuy. What I'm just saying they may lead into it like a cliffhanger type thing but they will not bring you to the island. I don't know how they're getting to it. There's no way. They're cutting it short. People have said, and I've noticed they've cut a lot of manga out already.
Speaker 1:They have actually dimmed it down, but they haven't cut it. People are actually complaining about that on the internet. They're cutting out characters that ended up not meaning anything. What's-his-name's sister has a decent role in the manga, but she's only in like three chapters. His adopted brother that he's working with now oh yeah, isn't he the one that shows up in Ragnarok? I haven't watched it. I've got to keep reading. I was rereading it. Alright, did you know? There's fucking like 130 chapters of that in Korean. What? And it's only the introduction. Yoshikage Kira Jojo's Bizarre Adventure. Oh, mr, I Like Hands. Oh no, oh fuck, god damn it. Oh, you're relying on me, I'm relying on you. Oh yeah, you're the. I'm relying on you. You're the stand here, the stand that works. Stand, he said stand.
Speaker 1:Don't get too happy, otherwise we know where to be standing.
Speaker 2:Ah shit.
Speaker 1:I knew it was coming. I knew it was coming. Okay, okay, okay Accomplishments the funny thing is not really much, because Kira's whole thing is living his peaceful life. He just wants to kill people in peace. That was in a. That's Diamond is Unbreakable. Yes, yep, he's a fucking serial killer. Impact on culture? Not really Well. Kira's a very popular character, but again, what I mean by that is someone who you got this motherfucker on t-shirts and all that shit like Joker's an S, joker's a, b, so he didn't reach. This is technically two parts. It's our pop culture, but also how much.
Speaker 1:He's popular in anime. He's a popular anime. He didn't reach Dio status. Dio would be a little higher. Dio would be higher than that. Dio will probably be on there. Design and aura. He gets pretty good there because he has one of my favorite stands. His stand is probably my favorite stand Killer Queen. I love Killer Queen, depth and complexity. That is there, depth and complexity, just because of his uh, he has that hand fetish. It's not that fucking he kills someone. He keeps her hand. Yep, uh, general likability he is likable. By the way, there is probably one part of this that's going to piss you off. There's an honorable mention that I put on here because of something that I noticed.
Speaker 1:Okay, credibility to the hero in the story. He's up there, I literally put him in. He didn't really kill nobody that memorable, except for the little fat dude I'm sorry for his name, but ability I mean he literally came up with. He literally pretty much Killer Queen has an ability that if you he unlocked later, if you even talk about Killer Queen, it resets you and kind of kills you. So it's kind of a broken ability. So Was there any more of one of those characters that manipulated shit in the background? Yeah, he didn't really, he didn't fight that much until he fought Josuke. He's the whole reason for the bow showing up again. Right, kinda, yeah, wait, no, the bow. Yeah, the bow showed up a little bit. Nope, Nope, that was golden wind. That was five, that was five. Wait, no, yeah, five. Because Stardust Crusaders is three, four is diamond, five is golden wind. Yep, that was five. That's because that's what Polnareff gets stabbed with and his fucking Star Chariot fucking devolves and shit. So, yeah, that would.
Speaker 1:I wanted to see. I wanted to look at something here quick, but I'm leaning towards. I'm leaning towards B, I'm leaning towards a B. I was there Because he's a lot more known than Agnologia is. Like I said, I can't even picture him. I'd have to fucking. I can handle. I don't have a vote because I didn't watch JoJo. That was it. I was right. Killer Queen's ability.
Speaker 1:I don't want to say you're missing out, but then it's like I can't say shit because it took me forever. It's the gayest straight man show ever. It took me forever. Thank you for describing yourself, Pete man show ever. It took me forever. Thank you for describing yourself, dean, damn it. To actually get into it and watch it. Here's where I'm with you. I had the fucking I just put Kira, I don't know who it is. Jojo, I actually prefer the first.
Speaker 1:Joe. What'd you say? What'd you say? I said I prefer the first Joe. Oh yeah. Yeah, he was the one who had to really push a little bit to finally watch it. Jj will never watch it. He'll never watch it, even though he's a fucking hobbit bastard. They don't like the animation. It gets too colorful. What?
Speaker 2:Well, no, the color swaps the color swaps.
Speaker 1:Damn the color Color swaps, damn the color swaps. Okay, all right. So, speaking of fat people, oh great Majin Buu. I'm going to let Jay rag a little bit, because fat Buu, oh boy.
Speaker 2:Is it specifically?
Speaker 1:fat Buu or is it just Majin Buu? It just said Majin Buu, so it's taking in all forms, all of them. Oh, okay, I can get involved a little bit. Okay, it's easily an A, you think. Blue A, you can only put him S tier. Lowest I'd put him is B. So I think it's between.
Speaker 1:B and A. I'm gonna agree with J a little bit. I don't know if I'm ready for A, but he's Accomplishments. He did the damn same damn fucking thing that Cell did. He took on the entire world and pretty much killed everyone. I'm leaning towards A because he's tech. I'm leaning the intelligence factor is what knocks it out of an S. Basically, he's a force of evil, but it's not directed at it. He's not really complex.
Speaker 1:His design and aura gets better as he evolves, Like when you get the kid boo. It's holy shit. Even though the most aura is the one, I always forget which one it is. The tall skinny one is just aura.
Speaker 1:Bro just stands there and stares at you His head cocked. It's fat boo. Evil boo. Super boo. I think it's baby boo. Super boo. Gohan boo that's still super boo. Super Boo, I think it's Baby Boo. Super Boo. Gohan Boo that's still Super Boo. Super Boo is confused. Boo, like chocolate, he got Vegeta to turn evil again. Yeah, that's something. That's something. I think he's actually unhinged and excluding Fat Boo for this. Sorry everyone for calling him Fat Boo, but it's what he is. He also gave us a character that hasn't been realized yet at the end of the saga Oop, majin Oop. Like we're never gonna actually see his ass unless Super capitalizes on its next arc, threatening to the hero in story. He's very high there because she built the arc around him.
Speaker 1:You had to verse jump this man again. You had to bring back the fucking Super Spirit Bomb. Everybody, give me your power. That's what all the fucking NFL teams are doing for the Eagles and it worked. General likability is probably in the mid-range.
Speaker 2:I'd say mid, because Boots doesn't have much likability.
Speaker 1:There's a lot of people that do like him. I happen to be one of the people that I like, his race as a whole Example. I'm curious if Jay would agree and I'm going to exclude, I'm going to put my bias there's bias, but I'm asking it generally. I think Cell is more likable than Boo is because of the personality Cell has Perfect Cell. I can't argue with you there. Okay, I wasn't even meaning it, I was trying to compare. I'm talking what I think of Cell's a cocky prick, but you can't help but kind of like him.
Speaker 1:You didn't get that until he turned to Super Boo, and when he turned into Kid Boo it was too chaotic. All Cells though I mean first form Cell was kind of I'm skinny and bleh, middle Cell was he was starting to get pretty macho. First Cell was the most intimidating because he was alien. He didn't know what he was.
Speaker 1:Middle Cell was starting to be chad-ish kind of. Then you got fucking Perfect Cell. I'm fighting Because he's perfect. I'm right here. He's Max Orr, just because he built an arena and invited everyone to come run his face. He was built out of Frieza cells. He was built out of all the Z-Fighter cells and uh, I forget, he actually had somebody. Oh, Piccolo's, I think he's part of the Z-Fighters.
Speaker 2:He's part of the.
Speaker 1:Z-Fighters. There was some other set of fucking races. I'm comfortable for Boo and A, I think. I think Boo can go to A. I sent you the name of the next one, so I don't know what the fuck. Oh, ryogu, killakill, killakill. Okay, I gotta actually, is it Chelsea?
Speaker 2:Reggio.
Speaker 1:Reggio. I can probably do the rest of these String guy? That one's tough because I didn't watch Kill la Kill much man. This one's not really fair. It's a problem. Kill la Kill's animation was a little wonky, so I had to really get used to it. It's the top person for Regio. Oh, and some people, oh God, and some people fucking. Yeah, I know who it is, I know who it? Is, and so that's the main she looks like a fucking Pokemon.
Speaker 2:And some people.
Speaker 1:I don't agree. See, I'm kidding. Okay, so design it or Don't go back. It looks like a Pokemon. I'm kidding. Okay, so design it or Don't go back. It looks like a Pokemon Bounty. That's a doubt. I don't know, I'm just talking shit. I love Pokemon, okay, okay. Okay, so she gets upgraded because of fuckability. Oh, fucking hell. Oh, no, no, that will no. No, we're not talking about sexy Pokemon, fucking hell. There are some. I mean Mewtwo got them thunder thighs. We all know that. Oh God, did you look at her? We need to hurry up with this one, because this is getting funnier by the minute. We're going to have to cop out at some point. Where's a fair spot to put her?
Speaker 2:Because I guess I don't know that much, I don't know her.
Speaker 1:Or we could just say skip, then it's not fair. If that's fair for not being fair, it's just going to be funnier.
Speaker 2:Everybody apart of the Kill.
Speaker 1:La Kill is going to hate us. We're leaning towards B. We'll think about it. Yeah, we'll come back. We'll probably be just to be fair, because I know her, but I ain't watched Kill la Kill in a long-ass time.
Speaker 2:Time to binge it.
Speaker 1:And why it's funny is because number five is Team Rocket. Oh fuck, is that generalized? Is that generalized or is it just it's an organization? Team Rocket, it's not just Jesse James and Matt. Well if it's Jesse and James. A lot of these are bad Accomplishments.
Speaker 2:Nothing.
Speaker 1:Almost nothing. It's being funny. You've stolen Pokemon. You're an evil organization that exists. General likability is max. You chop up slowpokes. They're either an A or S in likability. James wanted to send the women back to the Stone Ages, where they belonged. Why does that live in my head, red? I still want to say it to you. Before or after he had tits. Probability to the hero none. They blasted off again. Even the organization isn't a real threat. Even Giovanni, he don't do shit. I'm chilling. So that's almost an F in threatability. Um, depth and complexity, oh god, we're not trying to bash Team Rocket, but I think we have character depth, especially the like Giovanni and Jesse James.
Speaker 1:Yeah, every single Team Rocket character does have character depth, that's at least a B or an A, with as much thing that we have of them. Well, general likability wobble. I can give them a, b thanks to their design aura. I'm starting to lean D too. I don't feel right putting them in the back General likability I was leaning C, maybe General likability there's not a Wobbuffet carries. Wobbuffet carries that. So Wait, Wobbuffet. Why do you love that? We've got A's and D's, we have three out of six where they hit with.
Speaker 2:I feel bad for their Pokemon man, because they don't Does.
Speaker 1:Wobbuffet, just get. I think they should be. You put them at a C. Yeah, I put them at a C. I had D. He was on D too, so technically, dean's always on a D. No, dean is always the D, he's on a D. What was James in Pokemon? Oh, hoppy, hoppy, topping and Wobbuffet.
Speaker 2:Wobbuffet, are you forgetting?
Speaker 1:Victory Bell. Yeah, victory Bell. What was the one that kept eating him? It went Bellsprout. Jesse gets points because I've seen some fifth-down art, so Jesse gets points. I was right next to it. I wouldn't go low because I think your list is going to be too long. Just keep going. As a list. Did we say C? You both put it in.
Speaker 1:D I guess we got two. I can't, I can't. That's not slammed into T-Rocket, it's going off our important criteria. Alright, now probably the most evil man on this list no, palpatine. No, it's smooth anime, palpatine.
Speaker 2:I know Disney tried to make this anime, because somehow he came back hey, he was in there.
Speaker 1:He was in their anime. You fucker. Full metal oculus. Oh, is there something lower than F? I'm kidding, I hate this man, but that doesn't make him. That makes him a good villain, though he was never intended to be. A villain accomplished. I turned my daughter and dog into a chimera. Fuck, I love the impact on what's your heart. Was he a good? He had no, oh God F. He's a threat For threatability to the character. He's an F. He wasn't.
Speaker 1:Yeah, you're impacting on pop culture and, okay, pop culture as a whole, fucking S A. So we got a B and S Universe. They're in Not so much Pop culture as a whole, s Universe, they're in not so much Pop culture and the whole S. I give that to C because you weren't expecting it. You weren't expecting him to do that. You weren't expecting it out of him Character complexity. That's at least a C or a B. He did it to keep his fucking alchemy license.
Speaker 1:Okay, I give you that General likability. None, see this. Give you that which is general likability. None, none. See, this is where questionability is Objectively. Say anything about that Likability. Oh, I want to see the savage that likes him. That is like king of the edgelords. See, this is where I want to twist the science head. So we're grading a general likability on how we like them versus how much we like them as a villain. Grading a general likability on how we like them versus how much we like them as a villain. What he did makes him a great villain. I'm not saying it's S. Is he the only? No, there's probably a couple from Full Metal on there. This is so fucking off for us I'll bring up the honor roll mention after this Doing this brings him from my F to everyone's C.
Speaker 1:I think it's C, I think it's C, I think it's C too. Even though he should be F, he should be below F. He should be Z he's unright. Shu is S-H-O-U, s-h-o-u, so me willingly writing is just ridiculous. I have no idea. So this is where Fullmetal was, where we may have an issue with Dean on this. There's two other Fullmetal characters on here. Oh great, none of the Hoomunkalai made it. No, how did his father make the list? Father made the list. Father is on here. At some point. I would have been sore.
Speaker 2:Not even King.
Speaker 1:Bradley King. Bradley is the other one, that's right, that's kind of okay. I see the other homunculi were like all tied, which is where I was like, okay, dean's going to hate this, but it's like they were all like 45, 46, 47, then there was a break and they got next one.
Speaker 1:I believe them too because they were all just eee. King Bradley was the top of the humongous line, so I wanted that to get out there before he got completely mad at it. But the next one is Madara Uchiha. That's ass, Hold on. What do you think we have to go through? There's 42 anime. We killing this shit. What do you mean? It's a good time. It's got three hours to kill man. It's fun. This is fun. I love this. All right, who we got? Madara Uchiha? Oh yes, Come on, Come on. Come on, go through the criteria. Give people why you're throwing it. Accomplishments wanted to smoke with everyone. They had to send the entire verse after this man. They still. It's not pop culture. There's not a fucking person in. Everyone knows who Madara is, even people who don't know what anime is.
Speaker 1:I wouldn't go that far, but he's in the S-tier class of it For the universe they're in as well. Design and aura, that's, that's max. Because this man stood up on his little hill waiting for the whole, the all, the all, the villages sent their whole army. He's up there, realized every single villain that you absolutely love in anime just has their own hill that they stand on. Well, this, just you know, I come up and the biggest balls there was the first one this how about this character, depth and complexity?
Speaker 1:water is not really a moderate someone who he sought peace, but in a fucked up way his character is a complex, his, his strategy is infinite. Soko Yumi, I'm gonna fucking put everybody under a trance and make them like it's water what are you?
Speaker 1:doing like he wasn't a bad guy, but his rivalry, hashirama, is great, though. They wanted all the smoke. All the smoke. That's them Uchihas. The Uchihas always a problem. Who's the most racist? Poby Rama, second one. All the Uchihas got to go. He was right. He was right. He wasn't wrong. He was right. Look at all the problems the Uchihas caused fucking Sasuke being a little fucking bitch, danzo fucking stealing eyes and shit up until the very end of Obito started a war over a bitch.
Speaker 1:JJ that was for you. Boruto is the only story that made Sasuke likable. It made me. It made me annoyed with him too, cause, like Boruto, why didn't you spend time with your dad? Oh yeah, your dad ain't got time for you. That whole Boruto made everyone look like shit.
Speaker 2:Made everyone look like ass I also turned into the new Sasuke. I don't like you, dad you don't have time for me.
Speaker 1:I don't like you Actually. No, I can't say that Naruto's daughter Fuck, I'm forgetting her name Turned into the new Naruto Likeability. That's pretty max and high. Everyone likes Mon.
Speaker 2:Mon.
Speaker 1:Are going to get much debate out of us for us Towards the anime Threatability to the hero that they had. They sent the verse after him and they still had the trouble doing it, he was either A or S.
Speaker 1:It's going down on this paper. My guy opened up the eight gates and Mon was like alright, you're just like yep. I knew I wouldn't get much debate on Madara, just like the. I'm interested in the next one anyway because it's going to be carried by Keen. Oh, great Carries the show. He's going to carry at least the anime segment of this. Oh no, uh, makima Chainsaw man, makima Chain Summit. Oh no, makima is not S, she is not, but she's. Actually I could easily put her at a, b Makima's. I agree. I'm gonna agree with Jay here. Makima accomplishment. Oh no, brain, shut up. Why'd you make that joke? And it's horrible. What dude's come up making a reason no, no, b for bitch. I don't agree, I don't agree with you.
Speaker 1:I'd lose that debate because Maksima's evil she is evil Bitch Dog oh yeah, jesus Christ, you were going. I mean she was a bitch to people. But Accomplishments, I mean she. It took everything Denji had to fucking finally beatments. I mean she, it took everything Denji had to fucking finally beat her.
Speaker 2:I mean she killed a lot of.
Speaker 1:Basically reincarnated, killed a lot of people using the gun. Devil. Because she controls devils, she can control devils. Killed Power, even though that was one of the most savage things I've ever seen in a manga. Power just wants to spend time with Denji. She brings a cake because the makima invite her over denji's maki opens the door, bang, just blows her to pieces god damn it can't be any worse than her reincarnated death impact on that.
Speaker 1:That's middle but decent, because people like makima, people, people do like Makima. She has you woof. I'm going to meet her in September. I'm going to love it. I'm going to get her pop sign Design and aura. She's got solid aura. It's solid. It's solid. She's got presence Design's not anything. She wears tight office pants, which is a plus Okay, and she's got the fucking white button up and it's white. Did anime really make office clothes? No, I've always liked those, because I'm not getting on my love for no, I'm not talking about the pants I like on this fucking podcast I love this I'm having too much fun.
Speaker 1:Fuck you. Character depth and complexity Really complex. She's a control devil and controls things. There's not much complexity there, not much Likeability. That's a little skewed because she's evil, people don't like her, but she's hot, so there's. I'm not sure where the he-he-he came from. Was that a horny he-he-he? A little bit A little bit A A little bit, a little bit, a little bit.
Speaker 2:Threatability to the hero.
Speaker 1:Giggity. Threatability to the hero. Decent, good threat. She died in the first part but then kind of got reincarnated. But even the reincarnated one got her head chopped off. But she might come back still. That's still bullshit. She might come back still. I'm going B. You're going B. God, I have to read. I'm going B. You're going B. I'm going B. That's a good spot. B's start getting to be some good villains. I'm going B, not B for dog. God damn you B for bitch. Jay's doing pretty good with some of these calls. I'm going to give Jay a lot of credit here. He's kind of reading my mind. I'm not reading your mind, I'm going by your criteria Lelouch, lelouch, lelouch. Oh Kogias, god damn, that's tough because Lelouch Again, this is another one that.
Speaker 1:I never thought of him as a fucking villain.
Speaker 2:No, this is another one that skewed me.
Speaker 1:He is technically an antagonist. I know he did it for good reasons, yeah, but that's basically Okay. Him and Light are in the same fucking.
Speaker 2:Oh.
Speaker 1:Light's on there, light'll be a discussion boy. Yep, light's on here at some point. Him and Light are in the same boat. For me, like, I can't really think of him as a villain, so I will be almost. It's just the enemies from a villain's point of view. Alright, so accomplishments. He did what he set out to do. Yeah, he did.
Speaker 2:He basically backed on pop culture in the first area, which which was completely rewrite the government.
Speaker 1:Yeah, so that's an ass. Literally, his niece is doing the same thing. Impact on it, which is weird. I really need to watch that I haven't watched.
Speaker 2:Code.
Speaker 1:Geasson forever. No, I'm talking the sequel. Oh yeah, Impact. Decent impact on Technical sequel.
Speaker 2:Decent impact because he is popular it is connected or impact.
Speaker 1:Technical sequel Decent impact because he is popular, connected or not. Character depth and complexity is very high because he had a lot of motives for what he was doing. Design and aura was always there. It was alright. It was solid. Likeability, a little bit of unique design you're not used to Likeability. Is there Unique trench coat thing? His likeability goes up and down because what the fuck are you doing now?
Speaker 1:Oh wait, okay, then you understand what he's doing later he had his moments where he was nice to his comrades and then he had his moments where he just fucked them over completely. Threat to the hero in the story. I mean, probably Was he a hero in that story he's the protagonist slash villain Technically his friend is more of the technical hero. So how would you put that one Threat to the hero and the story? That's weird. He's the only reason for the story moving along.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that's weird, for fucking that's weird for.
Speaker 1:So then it's threat to hero and or story, I guess.
Speaker 2:So it's like that's why I was going there.
Speaker 1:That's just weird for how Kogias is set up. So that's a tough one.
Speaker 1:That one you put in the middle of the line, then yeah, the only reason he even counts in that criteria is because he's the reason the story even moved along at all. And again, not one of my personal favorites. But I'm still thinking A. I'm thinking A, a yeah, I was leaning towards A, b, b, b myself or B. B could work too, b could work too well. Let's see accomplishments. You rate it as well. Part of me is we don't have to A for accomplishments. We're doing good. We know our ABCs impact on pop culture and universe probably C yeah C because the universe they're at. Probably C yeah C Because the universe they're in is high. But he's gotten old In terms of an older anime the younger generation might not know who fucking Lelouch even is.
Speaker 1:Okay, I can agree with you on that one. C, serenity Designed Different design. I'd say it's a B or a B, I think say it's an A or a, b, I think B it's not over the top or over. So far we're at B Character depth and complexity.
Speaker 2:I think that's A or S.
Speaker 1:That's pretty high it still averages out to a B. Okay, we're still in between an A and a B, but leaning B.
Speaker 2:Likeability goes up and down.
Speaker 1:I think that'll drop it back to a B I'm thinking B, lower B, so that I think we're at B.
Speaker 2:How do we?
Speaker 1:spell that I go B. I'm like you want me to spell that shit. I won't give you his last name because it's funny, oh, so L-E-L-O-U-C-H, o-u-l-o-u-c-h, o-u-c-h, Yep, lamp-roog, lamp-roog, oh.
Speaker 2:God Lamp.
Speaker 1:Just write down lamp Lamp. He's a lamp he's that lamp he was the light of his country. All right, we'll dial it back a little bit for the next one Cell.
Speaker 2:Are we dialing it?
Speaker 1:Dial. This is carrying over to a previous conversation and he was already rating Cell higher. I don't know if I can get Cell. Where'd Boo go? I don't know if I can get Cell. I don't know if I can get Cell to S. Though he is A, he is for sure A. I can't get him to S. I can't get him to mother. You want to know his impact on pop culture and universe. Everybody wants him to come back and still haven't gotten him back. You want to know what we got.
Speaker 2:We got a fucking.
Speaker 1:That fucking does nothing. But that's what Cell Max does. It's because they refuse to give him lines. They refuse to give Plankton lines. To be fair, where do you rank his accomplishments? His accomplishments, is there not really? He didn't really have a goal.
Speaker 2:He just wanted to beat.
Speaker 1:He made some use of the Dragon Balls more than once.
Speaker 2:But he didn't really kill anyone outside of the androids.
Speaker 1:But here's the thing, though. Cell didn't really Goku Goku sacrifice himself to do that. But here's the thing, though Cell, this whole thing, this man literally just wanted to beat the shit out of people and show you he's superior. That's what he wanted to do. It's not nothing to him. If it wasn't for him, frillin wouldn't have 18. Exactly no. That's not necessarily fair. I pulled that one out of my ass and it makes the most sense. To be fair, it was the wish of getting rid of the bombs inside them that got it, which happened after Cell. That was the.
Speaker 2:That was the You're saying there's a chance, you're saying there's a chance, Design and aura.
Speaker 1:Dean always puts that in there. I'm putting that's high just because a meme carries that to. S Cell really built that arena and begged everyone to come run his fade. So general likability is still up there. Throw the ability to the hero.
Speaker 1:That's up there because again they had the fucking damn near Cell was created to make Gohan the next hero. It never passed. It never passed because Goku came back to be the next hero and it didn't ever pass. It never passed because Goku came back to be the main hero anyway, because the fans are dickheads and the Dragon Ball fans are assholes. The father, son, kamehameha, hell, gohan still doesn't get the likability he's supposed to the movie tried three different times.
Speaker 1:We've given Gohan a chance. And the fans were like the movie tried Three different times. We've given Gohan Chance. And the fans were like, no, fuck you Dragon Ball Superheroes. They tried to put Gohan as the forefront and Piccolo stole the show. His dad Stole the show. I said it Fuck your dad a show. His dad stole a show. I said it Fuck your dad. How does that? Never mind, I'm not going, don't do that. That's a big debate. He literally walks over him and goes.
Speaker 2:Who's a giddy dad or?
Speaker 1:not, don't get into that. No, not that, it's kind of, it's reversed from the real world. White daddy Left, oh my, some good black person in fucking. I work with hey and I work with Piccolo. Goddammit Popo, I count Popo.
Speaker 2:I was. Oh, never mind that's my guy at work.
Speaker 1:I was only counting Popo. Mr Popo, I work with Mr Popo. He hates me every day. Piccolo and Popo, you work with Mr Popo. Why is Piccolo black? Piccolo, black as hell, just cut Okay. Look up black anime characters online.
Speaker 2:Piccolo there and he's green Every single time and he's there.
Speaker 1:He's fucking there. I don't know how it happened, but Piccolo is black.
Speaker 2:That throws great. Why is he?
Speaker 1:black, I don't know he got that.
Speaker 2:It's his aura.
Speaker 1:It's the black Air Force energy. Every time he's on screen, everybody says that's my dude, that's my dude. I'm not getting Piccolo when I'm looking it up on my phone. Black anime characters yeah, are you the fuck? Your phone's too white? Let Dean do it. It'll pop up Arguably acting most racist. Oh my God, oh my God. I swear to God, me and Dean did this the other day. It gave me oob before it gave me fucking piccolo, that's fair.
Speaker 1:That is fair. Oob is very. Yeah, it's not. The statue is the first one that comes up is your.
Speaker 2:That's fair, my dark-skinned queen.
Speaker 1:Okay, number three is Killer B, so I'll take that.
Speaker 2:Don't get JJ started.
Speaker 1:Don't get JJ started on Killer B. He hates Killer B, he hates Killer B, he hates his fucking raps. So is Cell stuck in A or are we devoting?
Speaker 2:him. I'm getting him A.
Speaker 1:I'm getting him A. He going A. I'm sorry, killer B sidetracked. Jj was hearing me going. Oh Red, I fucking hate Killer B Fucking raps and shit. Like you rap though, jj. No, he raps terrible. King Bradley, king Bradley, Full metal again. Yep, I'm doing my best to. I don't think I'm helping in this one, you can list off stuff.
Speaker 2:Again, I'm not going to be the.
Speaker 1:You can list off stuff and I can object to it. I'm not going to be the greatest amount because, again, full metal I have not watched in a long time. I've not watched it in a long time. I know he's fairly likable, it's because he's a big, a chad, but he just wants all the smoke. He's definitely threatening, I remember that, and Bradley just wants all the smoke, so he has threatening. At least A Right General likability. There's aura when he pulls his swords out. Oh sure, so aura Impact. Pop culture Actually impact. But in anime, because it's full metal, he's got decent impact. Full metal is the greatest anime of all time.
Speaker 1:There's another A in the list, or are you putting it higher? I think he's A. I think King Bradley would be A too. His lowest is probably in accomplishments, because I don't remember what all he did.
Speaker 2:Yeah, remember he didn't do that much besides being father's fucking strongest, fucking dude, go deal with shit.
Speaker 1:I mean, it's probably accomplishments in general, like ability, honestly. Because, he didn't have much like. He had aura, but he didn't have much personality. He was very stoic, yeah, very stoic. So do two D's or two C's, put him below.
Speaker 2:Double D's.
Speaker 1:Double D's, that's a B, does it? If you average out a grade, he's got three A's, two C's and a B. Yeah, those C's really fuck with your grades. If you're in school and you have those A pluses two A's, you know. Do we think father's bigger, father Dean, is father bigger. There's an innuendo there.
Speaker 2:I know there is, I'm trying to avoid it.
Speaker 1:I'm like what the fuck I'll bring father in now. I see him on the list. Really Well, father is basically just a god. He's just a god Again. He lost in the end. He did create a simuncula. He wanted to pretty much take over the world and shit, but that's pretty traditional of anime, so is father an A or S? Is that kind of dick pics? Is he going to be our first S?
Speaker 2:No, madara, is S Madara, madara.
Speaker 1:Madara. You gotta say his name with the aura, madara, madara, oh God, I'm comfortable, just out of respect. The Full Metal. I think they both are A. Might be lower tier A, but I think they, I think, fine, I think they both A. So the Alchemists get A. Yeah, I'm fine with that I feel like we're doing the alphabet. Yep, we ain't got no trash yet. We may not get much trash. Yeah, we put Team Rocket as D. Yeah, they might have to go down.
Speaker 1:You guys may put my honorable mention in trash that I was told to put on here. No, oh boy, I was given a name who was definitely not in the top 50 and I was told to put on here. No, you were told, oh boy, I was given a name who was definitely not in the top 50, and I was told to put him on here. Not by me, no.
Speaker 2:Okay, you didn't tell me anybody to put on here.
Speaker 1:I just wanted to make sure Vader, sauron and fucking yeah, they're all in the list. That's Death, that's Death. Likeability S. That's more neat talking. Uh, oh see, uh uh, accomplishments. She didn't even get with the guy she loved. She uh kind of just just Tatsumi wanted to go with flat chest and mine instead. Makes no fucking sense. How do you spend an entire On an island?
Speaker 2:they were on an island Because Tatsumi wanted to go with Flat Chest and Mine instead.
Speaker 1:Makes no fucking sense. How do you spend an entire On an island? They were on an island together. How long did they spend together they were on they were like a couple months, I think, on an island. I didn't fucking like it. Impact on pop cult not really, because Akame Got Killed is not really that well-known. The sign and or they've got the design excluding Some of these women. You gotta exclude design. It's a little bit. I love it. Outside of that, the design is a little bit more unique too. Her design is a little unique. Yeah, she's very.
Speaker 1:She's kind of SS Nazi type, just a gray outfit, low-key, yes. Boots With boots, step on me, one of those first characters that everyone was like you gotta step it's hair.
Speaker 2:Boots With boots, step on me, step on me now.
Speaker 1:One of the first characters that everyone was like you gotta step on me, she's got a cool. She's got cool, very overplayed in anime, but she can stop time. That's a cool ability, even though it's overplayed. Everybody and their mother can stop time. It had a literal reasoning, scientific reasoning behind it, though. She can stop time. She drank, though, fucking that water elixir and got the ability to fucking stop time. That's where she got the ability from. It's just so Not really deaf, though. She's kind of a dog for the emperor, just going and conquering shit. Maybe there's some complexity.
Speaker 1:Her background was there to set it up, but it didn't really execute on it. Yeah, her people were slaughtered, so she went and slaughtered them. Eventually, her story became all about Tatsumi. Complexity, if you want Tatsumi, but then again Tatsumi. How old was Tatsumi? We got some stranger danger going on again. We got these goddamn stranger dangers. Watch these. I'm not gonna downgrade, but I I love it. What Anime loves that? I mean, I think beats Master Roshi and Bulma. So, and that's the most sketchy of them.
Speaker 1:Master Roshi is older than everyone except for his sister. Yeah, but the problem is that Bulma is 16 in the fucking Dragon Ball, and that's where it starts. He hits on every woman, every attractive woman. Tatsumi is a teenager. Oh, just that. Yes, early 20s. Unfortunately, I found out that.
Speaker 1:Jifu could send in Japan up until 2023 was 13. Their culture is very different. That's why I don't throw shade that much, but to us it's weird. To us it's weird, oh, because we were raised by England for quite some time.
Speaker 1:Threat, she had some decent threat you beat, I was putting it at C. I love her more than you do and I was going to put her at a C. You like her more than I do. We gonna start. We're going to start. That's one I won't give you. Well, what if you like them big, though? If she like them big, yeah, she'll step on you. I'd like that. I'm going to go B. I'm going to go B. You got two Bs. Matt had to move.
Speaker 1:It was all great. They're gonna start Arguing over women and we all know that's not something to do with. That's all you. I had to contend it Just because. Is that the last one of these? Nope, I just pulled my. How vested I am In. Akame got killed. I got cards, man, I got cards. I got cards everywhere. I don't care. Alright, dean, here's a passion subject for you. Uh-oh. Askeladd Vinland Saga. Askeladd Vinland Saga. That's the truth. That's the truth. He's not a good guy, he's evil. But how he shapes Thorfinn God. Vinland Saga is so good. I love Vinland Saga. It's one of them ones that takes a bit to get into, but it tackles that Viking culture and stuff pretty good. I sadly have not watched season two yet. Accomplishments.
Speaker 2:He killed.
Speaker 1:Thorfinn's dad I forgot Thorfinn's dad's name, but he was a great fucking hero Killed Thorfinn's dad, even though Thorfinn's dad kind of just let himself get killed. Likeability is not really likable because he's a fucking scumbag, but it still has. But it's still a little bit likable in its own way because he's a smug bastard. Depth and complexity not really, he's kind of a, he had a little bit of a sad backstory, if I remember right.
Speaker 1:So you're throwing him in that CD range. No, no, no, I think I'm going B, I'm thinking in the Bs, I'm thinking B. He's getting some peoples in there. So accomplishments you'd throw at Probably a fierce B because he killed that. His group killed Thorfinn's dad. That's part of the big reason Thorfinn became who he is.
Speaker 1:Impact on pop culture and the universe that's low because it's Vinland Saga. Vinland Saga's not fucking. It's popular if you watch it, but it's not Design and aura. I wouldn't think it's anything special. It's probably around C. Yeah, yeah, it's Viking. So far we got a couple of. I'm leaning B, I'm leaning B, a, d and a C, anda A. So we're at about a B. Depth and complexity Lesser's a little bit there, but for the most part, like I said, you're in a C-B range. Yeah, there's a little bit I'm seeing a C so far, especially with general likability and threat to the hero. Yeah, he may just get downgraded to a C just because of the anime, isn't it? I'll go C. I think C's fair. C's not like it's bad or nothing. That's the middle of the road.
Speaker 2:But I'm just saying the.
Speaker 1:Vinland Saga fans will be fucking. He's a middle-of-the-road villain, though. How do you spell that? A-s, a-s-k-e-l-a-d-d, d-d, dd, dd, double D, yep, what the fuck? It's not triple D Vegeta. Oh, boy Villain. I might let Jay take a little lead on this one, because I can yap about Vegeta, but I trust Jay's thing a little more. Damn Well, he's not a villain anymore. Almost got him on lock, dude Okay, in a very recent episode of Daima. I won't take a bath with you anymore. Bulma's got him on lock, dude Okay, in a very recent episode of Daima, I won't take a bath with you anymore.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I've seen that clip. Literally in the middle of a fight I'm going to kill this bastard. And she says I won't take a bath with you anymore. He comes, flies back and says okay, you can go fight him now. So D Sadly. Unfortunately, Bulma's the only one. So D Sadly, Unfortunately, Bulma's the only one that could put a chain on him. He's also Beerus' bitch, yeah, but who is it? Beerus' bitch Whis, the one that teleports? Whis Hoist by the great Ian Senkai Goku Whis. That's cause Vegeta knows how powerful he is.
Speaker 2:Goku is also working learn-ish stuff.
Speaker 1:But that's because Vegeta knows how powerful he is. But I'm still going with a D His accomplishments I want to defeat.
Speaker 2:Kakarot, I ain't never been close to that shit.
Speaker 1:No, he came by, he wanted to.
Speaker 2:Even remaking the villain died for heroic consequences.
Speaker 1:I'm going to be a good guy. Yeah, you're fair. When he came back as a villain in the Boo saga, he still went out a hero. Yeah. I'm not going to argue with it Impact on pop culture in New York.
Speaker 2:City. It's pretty high because it's DBC, it's higher.
Speaker 1:It's DBC, so let's go with that. Design and aura, I mean there's not a single person in the world who can pull off that fucking V on his forehead, that receded hairline? Yeah, there's not a single fucking person that can pull that off, except for him. The only thing about um Depth and complexity.
Speaker 2:He has some depth.
Speaker 1:He's not really complex. He wasn't a complex villain. He's a complex person. Complexity that you get are in the movies, because it actually goes into the backstory on. I would consider him probably, and people would wonder, jay would know a lot of people. He's a contender for most prideful character in anime. To me he's two. One will never be touched If you're going for general likability. As a whole, he is very likable.
Speaker 2:But if you're going as, a villain?
Speaker 1:nobody liked him as a villain yeah, they liked him as a villain when he did. They liked him as a character yeah, which made him a hero Going off of this criteria which. I think is very fair. Jay might be right he might be.
Speaker 1:Threatability to the hero and the story. Okay, so he started off as the biggest threat, goku. He started off as the biggest threat. Goku, piccolo and all them barely fucking beat him. Yajirobe had to step in and cut off his tail just for them to even do anything. Yajirobe, the most forgettable fat character in anime. Yeah, man, he killed Koron up there, yeah he is he's still a little fucking cat. They up there chilling Smoking pot because them two are the most chill characters in Dragon Ball. What?
Speaker 1:the fuck that Mio. The threat ability at the time was S. Yes, wait a minute. Who's Yajirobe Mio? He is not that villain. Which is why I put him at a D. He is not an F. Go ahead, wait a minute. If Mio were Yajirobe and Korra, am I Yajirobe? Son of a bitch, you're the cat. Oh fuck yeah, you get your stick and your beans and my beans. Oh yeah, that's where they go to get sensu beans they grow them bitches.
Speaker 1:You're the whole reason that the cell fight was prolonged? Sensu beans. Oh wait, one fucking aura moment. I have not seen it in a long time. I gotta make the comment. But if I'm not mistaken, didn't um, didn't goku be like here. Cell, I want you at full strength when you fight my son yes, sensu b. Yes, it's one of the main reasons that people call goku a bad father, but no ain't nothing wrong with that meat son.
Speaker 1:If you go in depth, he's trying to move his son. I'm a bad dad, I'm a bad meat. No, no, you beat him at his best. You know that weak shit. He served him. You beat him at. He served him. It's like if you don't beat him at his best, you ain't coming back home.
Speaker 1:You're not a Serb. I'm going to send you Croatian. Okay, that was Nugita at a D as a villain. I don't as a villain, you're like villain. So if he's not on the hero list, then Obi-No, obi-tobin-no, jj, jj. I'm going to call you. I'm sure Dean's sitting at this much, so you might as well. I got a good amount left, I'm okay, I'm too busy laughing.
Speaker 1:I can't give him an episode until he finishes one. I got to you never finish. I just hear JJ Somewhere. Jj right now is saying that son of a bitch started a war over a ninja war. He started a war over a ninja war. He started a war over a bitch. I can hear him right now. You see, if I'm right, that's almost. It's so fitting for an anime character. Starting a ninja war is a good accomplishment impact on pop culture. He did have one of the best fights in Naruto, though with Kakashi in the Kamui world. He did have one of the best fights in Naruto, though with Kakashi. He did have one of the in the Kamui world. He did have one of the best fights in Naruto.
Speaker 2:And his relationship with.
Speaker 1:Kakashi is pretty high up there. That's a pretty good relationship. Design slash aura Junwu versus Igaris was rated number two fight of 2024 in anime. Oh yeah, I was gonna say of year. Okay, of the 2020s in anime. Oh yeah, I was gonna say a year or two of the 2020 season.
Speaker 1:What the fuck was? Number one, I don't remember Depth and complexity. Obito's got a lot of that because he was pretty much rocked back to life and nursed back to health and trained by old Madara, old-ass Madara, who was still alive, living in a cave. That face, yeah, I was wondering about Madara coming back to life, and that's one of the coolest. Obito's a part of a lot of shit. He's pretty high because Kakashi's shotting gun is Obito's eye, so that's a cool thing. Take my eye, kakashi. I think we're starting at B and figuring it out. Yeah, he won't go lower than B, there's no way, as much as JJ is somewhere punching A or 1 and put him at F. So let's see Threat.
Speaker 2:He gets A Threat, he's there when he gets A General likability.
Speaker 1:A yeah, it's maybe B-ish, but he's not even being a threat. He used so many other people to be the big threat.
Speaker 1:Yeah, he's a good fighter, though, as much as Dean doesn't like those characters, the characters that are able to manipulate everybody in the background to get what they want. Obito threw hands like a motherfucker though he's a good fighter, but in terms of the Naruto power class he's probably closer to B. He didn't do it but he almost outsped Minato and that's a feat, almost almost. When you be kind of comparable to the fucking Minato speed A at points, but he's mainly probably in the B. So the fucking Minato speed, he has A at points, but he's mainly probably in the B. So far we've got three out of six for A Threat General and Character. Well, big threat. When he became fucking the intelligent Shuriki, then that motherfucker was throwing everybody off. Design Dean Design's pretty cool. I like Obito's design, especially when he's got his mask on and he's Toby. I like his. It's not over-complex but it's cool, especially when he's Obito as they call him.
Speaker 1:Would you put Impact as a? I'd put? It pretty high because he was a big part of.
Speaker 2:He was recent for Shippuden so I think he'd be high there I'm leaning A.
Speaker 1:I think I'm going A for Obito. I think I'm going A. Jj would demote him to a fucking D. No, JJ would demote him three points, because he just started a war over Rin. Like what you mean? Love Most wars, a lot of wars are started over love. Love hurts. Yes, I'm done. No, I'm not. I'm having too much fun.
Speaker 2:Okay.
Speaker 1:Do I want to keep his high going or do I want to give some time to you Keep? Do I want to keep his high going or do I want to give some time to you? Keep his high going Pain. Oh shit, you're going to be a dick to me on that one. Why? Why would I Accomplishments? He killed Jiraiya. Yep, he hits me with that one the same way he hits me with Gwen, because he knows I'm like. He should have fucking won. They should have at least tied or some shit. No, just hit him with these sticks, with these pipes. Oh God, I like the alternate timeline Accomplishments. So, killing Jiraiya, he destroyed the leaf. Almighty bush, that's an accomplishment. We had the fucking, you know? Impact Naruto how many people like to cosplay in his head?
Speaker 2:Nagato Pain, so AS Design.
Speaker 1:Multiple versions of him. The six paths of pain Animates bodies pretty much, so don't really fight, he just throws motherfuckers out there, not being character-dead.
Speaker 2:There's a lot.
Speaker 1:There's a lot because he's not. He had three S's. Did we put it at? I think we're leaning it's AS, so right now it's AS I'm gonna say SAS, payne is arguably.
Speaker 1:Payne is arguably the second best villain in fucking Naruto. He would be above Obito. I think he'd be above Obito just because of the. I had a feeling he was gonna end up being S the complexity Nagato, you know, similar. He wanted peace. He loved Jiraiya's books and shit. He wanted peace too. But the Akatsuki were not evil ninjas. They were evil at what they were doing. They thought what they were doing was the best way to have peace in the ninja world. Even Itachi, who I don't know, people try to naming Itachi after he killed us all. But the fucking Itachi were a problem. He did the world a favor. He did. He did Fuck it. Look at you, bonzo. I gotta stop talking about anime. You wanna break? No, I'm good.
Speaker 2:Wait hold on.
Speaker 1:Where'd you write Pain down? That's because he said he was higher than Obito. I think he would be. He's not. Pain is not above Madara's number one. Well, we'll get to that when we get to it. But he is in the S tier General. He's likable, I'm just making sure he had him in three or four S's already.
Speaker 1:He had the reverse time in a way to rebuild the leaf, because Naruto seeked him out. With Seeked him out, I said seek wrong, you fucker, even though that could be taken so wrong. I mean, what do you Talk? No jutsu, what do you take? Talk no jutsu, as what do I mean? Shit. But he had to. He had to talk no jutsu, pain Nagato to basically become Shenron and bring back the leaf. Yeah, pain became Shenron. Alright, back the leaf. Yeah, pain became Shenron. All right, dean, keep your energy, we're going to give a break to you.
Speaker 1:You're going to bounce off of me.
Speaker 2:No, he's not going to go to sleep.
Speaker 1:Is this one? No, is this one? I'm not. I'm sure you'll have comments, but we'll give Jay his chance. Oh, okay, shredder, he got an anime. Okay, I mixed in some. There was some cartoon that decided to fall in here. The cartoon went into anime A little bit. I'd let Jay do a lot of yap, and that's my favorite. Second favorite turtle character I almost forgot Mikey. It doesn't matter what, because accomplishments are all over the fucking place. I mean Raw general. He doesn't fit in the SRA tier for that. His daughter and grandson are higher than him as far as accomplishments. Them bitches killed the turtles. They killed three of them, bitches.
Speaker 2:They killed all of them.
Speaker 1:They didn't kill me. He's probably an S in impact. He's definitely an S as far as pop culture and universe. They're in shredder. People don't feel there's turtles.
Speaker 2:Lesson to almost that was a high take, and I liked it.
Speaker 1:Design and aura is design Definitely Probably science up there. That man just only design on shredder that didn't hit was super shredder in teenage. Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles 2 in the 90s Character depth and complexity Not that high, but there's some which show you're in and which era. So Split probably puts him at a C because he can be low and high. Dean absolutely hates when he turns into a boob. No Crank.
Speaker 2:Crank. He turns into a crank.
Speaker 1:General likability, that's easily an A. I think so because he's evil, he's bad, but he's got the. If you're bad but you have aura, you become likable. It's how you carry yourself Threat to the hero and story. Well, let's put it this way Without Splinter, the turtles don't always beat Shredder.
Speaker 2:They gotta jump his ass.
Speaker 1:But if they talk shit about his mama they get loaded. Sorry, I had to bring up the damn take shot. I'm sorry, you know it was gonna come out. So are we A or B? He was kinda Would 1C give all those A's a B? No, probably not, because he's got an S in there, a borderline S at least Between impact, yeah, and impact and design. He's probably. Design is only brought down to an A because of Teenage Mutant Turtles 2. Yeah, the ooze. So I guess he's an A. I'm fine with an A, then you can go back, then we can go into a Dean segment on Mahito. What? Alright, buddy, mahito's cool. That's not the one I'd glaze. There's one for Jujutsu Kaisen. I'll glaze. You want the main guy? You want the main guy.
Speaker 2:He was like 9 on Rank. Jujutsu Kaisen, I'll glaze. You want the main guy?
Speaker 1:You didn't make a list, did you he?
Speaker 2:was like nine on.
Speaker 1:Ranker. There's one other Jujutsu on here. He was like nine on Ranker, so he's in there. Let him finish. Mahito, mahito, mahito. Wait, that's the one that calls everyone monkeys, isn't it? No, that's Gato. Mahito is the one that fucking off Nanami in front of Yuji, the one that touches you and reconfigures your soul.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:He's the personification of human's fear. He's a curse born from human's fear of other humans. Accomplishments Kill. Nanami is pretty big because Nanami was a very beloved character. Impact on pop culture and universe Universe is in. Yeah, pop culture is People hate Mahito. The other one will talk about people like People hate Mahito, but again, when you're a part of Jujutsu Kaisen, which is ending now sadly, please come back. We all need another fucking you know board where we can erase shit for Alright accomplishments. We have him as an A.
Speaker 2:Design, or His designs.
Speaker 1:We can't remember six categories. We're already dumb enough as it is. Design slash aura is decent. He's got some charisma. He talks a lot of shit. Aura, I mean, his design is pretty standard, but he's got his patchwork face. It's decent. Character, depth and complexity you can take a bunch of ways, though. He's a curse born from people's hate for each other and people's fear of other humans, so you can. That's very interesting of a fucking character, and a lot of his thing is just trying to understand people and he thinks humans are stupid. Like, why do you love people? They're shitty to it and all that shit. Maito's got a lot of deep things to him, but he's just a savage that wants to kill people. Likeability is low, but again, his likeability is so low because he's a pretty good villain. Because he's a good villain, though. So it's like we're coming back to the fucking who was the other one? That was. You don't like him, but is that discrediting him being a good villain?
Speaker 1:That's the problem, so does that throw him in the same category as Shu in a.
Speaker 2:C no.
Speaker 1:I wouldn't dare put him in C. I think Mahito's B. I think Mahito would be general like him.
Speaker 2:I don't have a vote. I can't disagree with you I don't have a vote.
Speaker 1:Oh yeah, because I'm going to go with Mahito would be Sorry. I know it's good marks, fuck y'all, alright, and then I guess we'll throw out. I guess we'll go back and say We'll go to the other two guys that are most known for being bad guys in a show, but they're the main characters of the show. So we have Light Boy and then the next one, I'll do Light. When you said there were two, there's actually three. I missed one. Yes, so it's Lelouch Light, and then the next guy, technically another one. We'll find out. All right, dean, where should we do this? How should we do this?
Speaker 1:Light, yeah, accomplishments he didn't accomplish what he was set out to do. He didn't, but he killed a lot of people. He started killing a lot of people. He started, but he did start killing people for jaywalking basically. But you jaywalk, didn't he do that? Just to set an example, kind of. But he started off with good intentions but just became what the fuck? What are you doing? Impact on culture that's high because it's light People. Death Note, death Note carried anime.
Speaker 1:Everybody knew who he was in the universe. Yep Death Note. Kira Death Note. Carried Design Nothing special, nothing. There's nothing special he had aura. He had aura, even though, see, this would be a hot take but it's kind of biased. But he had probably the second best aura in the show because I'm a Ryuk stan. Ryuk was just the guy. I loved Ryuk. You had him voiced. I will have him.
Speaker 1:He's the perfect fucking person. His death is more middle of the road, but he's very complex. Oh yeah, he did have one of the most poetic deaths, and I did love his death, though, because it's very first.
Speaker 2:I still want the sequel.
Speaker 1:Very first episode, Ryuk says we'll do this, but one day I'm going to write your name in my death note. And that's how he ends. General likability E-ish. Yeah, he's likable, but when he starts going off the rails, and then credibility to the story. He's got the death note you're dead.
Speaker 1:That's throwing us into a B range, isn't it Out of respect? I think Light's got to go of respect. I think Light's gotta go A. I think he's A accomplishments. The only thing with Death Note, though, that hurts, it is once after L dies. Death Note, just that's degrading the anime.
Speaker 1:I think that pushes it to a, b it degrades Light too, because as soon as he's dead there's almost, but I gotta remember it comes too quickly for his death, yeah, and he kinda gets like they. They left almost no. If what that should've done, they should've never killed L or let L die like in some different way in like the end of the series like they killed each other out or something.
Speaker 1:They killed L too quick because Nero and the other little fucking weaves that fucking took L's place just were oh my god, made the show. Oh my god, no, what the fuck were their names? One was M, I think, and the other was like Nero or some shit. It's like bro, you guys are not it. Where's L?
Speaker 1:And L ain't doing my L Just sat there like this. Just sat there eating his cakes, eating his cakes. I don't think Light is in the same group as this group of A's. No, I'll go to B. I think B that's fine, not a disagreement. I'm in the same group as one of your favorite women. What Wait? No, not a disagreement.
Speaker 2:Well, that puts them in the same group as one of your favorite women. What Esda Wait? No, who Wait? Makima, makima, makima.
Speaker 1:Do you know, did you put it? In that group there's only Makima and Esda. Oh, do you know how many fucking anime women I like Jesus Christ, I can make a fucking portfolio. So portfolio, so it's like which one? It's a folio, like the other one technically is aaron jaeger. Oh shit, no no, no, technically there we go. It wasn't for that fourth fucking season I never would have I used to. I hated aaron when he was a hero I hated Eren.
Speaker 1:Then when he fucking got that man bun boy, it was over. He did, he had a man bun and then he had no reason. He had no reason doing Armand. He was such a whiner. He had no reason. He was no better than his buddy Armand. Armand, yeah, and he had no reason doing Armand what he did. You know why I never did nothing to you army? I knew it wouldn't be a fair fight. And, mikasa, you're just my slave. You do what I tell you. That's the acrimony.
Speaker 2:I'm like jeez Accomplishments.
Speaker 1:He's the whole reason. Bro started the rumbling and almost ended the world just because he wanted to protect his people like a good Serb. You said it exactly how you wanted to say it. You just made him a Serb hero. So impact on pop culture, that's.
Speaker 2:That's high because it's fucking attack on sight.
Speaker 1:You go to any anime movie ever and if the Crunchyroll thing comes across, evan Jaeger is fucking yelled out. Design and aura that's easy to aim. Design is solid, especially while I'm calling it, his character design isn't special.
Speaker 2:It's better when he gets his mad butt as weird as that is it updates throughout, though?
Speaker 1:Yeah, because he gets older. As weird as me saying the man butt helps, and I hate man butts. Goddamn. There goes the damn thing. His favorite pop should have been right there. Oh fuck, oh God, his favorite pop should have been right there. Ah fuck, pocoon, oh god. Uh, general like character I was gonna say I'm putting at least the first.
Speaker 1:Charisma is literally had his own sect of fucking people doing anything he says, like he was fucking Jesus, the fucking Yeagerists. I have at least the first four criteria there, at least at an A. Yeah, aaron's, at least I'm willing to put him an A. I think Aaron would go to A.
Speaker 1:He's his own fucking threat. Yeah, he's his own threat. They gotta pull out the whole verse to stop him and shit and this man. This is gonna take a lot to explain, but I gotta say it. Attack on Titan. All the Titans are kind of connected. The nine Titans are connected and you can fucking fuck with time and shit. Eren from like the fucking future, went back in time and orchestrated everything. His dad doing this, he manipulated his dad and shit.
Speaker 2:It's a lot to explain Attack on.
Speaker 1:Titan goes off, the fucking wonky whale, fucking rails. Holy shit, that last season.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it's like whoa, where are we?
Speaker 1:going. Now we got time travel and fucking Aaron going back, fucking with Gresham, his dad and shit and manipulating them. It's like, fuck, attack on Titan got weird. We go from Titans and big monsters oh shit, simple to to fucking marley committing genocide and killing all and putting all the eldians on their own on parody and shit and I'm like, which funny thing, you know, that's actually inspired by a true thing. Um, it's no secret that that attack on titan is heavily inspired by Nazi Germany and shit. Because, well, jaeger and putting the Eldians on Paradis, history fact Hitler wanted to put the Jews on Madagascar Legit. That's where he got that from. That's where Attack on Titan got that from, legit. That's a thing. That's still. He ended up fucking putting them in God. You should have just put them on Madagascar, shit, fuck. Then we would have had a real life attack on Titan. But yeah, aaron's A, he made him instead of Jerusalem. Do either of you watch Monster? Oh, johan, johan Lieber.
Speaker 2:Johan Lieber, I don't know Johan Lieber.
Speaker 1:Johan Lieber, I don't know, it's been a long time, but I know Johan's widely considered a goat. Do you want to minus him off? I think we for fairness, even though Johan's probably A or S. But again, I have not watched Monster, Sorry internet.
Speaker 1:But Johan, he's a master manipulator, serial killer. It's a great show that I fucking have not watched in a long time. He's recommended it to me. Johan Lieber is up there. I'm well aware he's very high tier. He's very loved. Garou, one Punch man. Garou, oh shit, oh boy, we're talking about some Chad. No, oh boy, oh God, enz is a hero. Garou's not dead. Garou's not. Garou said ends. Garou don't really. Yeah, he teams up with Saitama. Eventually. Garou's Saitama literally manipulates time to where he becomes a good guy again. Yeah, garou punches, saitama punches before time even can fucking recognize it. I don't fuck my Saitama's broke, it's not even right. Impact on.
Speaker 1:No amount of fucking push-ups and exercises should be able to give you the time, the ability to manipulate time. Garou's got very good aura. Garou's story's cool because he wants people to understand the villain. That's Garou's thing. He's like people don't understand the villain. The hero's not perfect. Garou always wants. I thought that was cool. That's why Garou was my favorite character for One Punch.
Speaker 2:I was like let's see Accomplishments.
Speaker 1:He took out every freaking S-tier hero. Yeah, they had trouble. They had trouble dealing with him, they had a lot of trouble dealing with him and it took One Punch to do anything, definitely. Well, I was going to say design Original Gar. That shit goes up. That shit's good.
Speaker 2:That builds to it.
Speaker 1:Eh, uh-huh, at least General likability. Garo's likable. He's one of the most popular characters in the show and, again, he's not really Garo's kind of an anti-hero Garo's really kind of an anti-hero.
Speaker 1:Ian try that last criteria right there Threat to the hero and there's no threat. He's no threat. Threat to the hero and there's no threat. Nothing threatens Saitama, nothing In the current shit. They're going to fight God. You think God's going to be a threat? I'm B or A for Garo. What's Saitama going to do to God? Bitch, slap him. I would lean towards B. Yeah, I think B, but Saitama in the most recent chapters I've read because Phone Punch man does not come out all the time. Ninja chapters I've read because Phone Punch man does not come out all the time.
Speaker 1:The ninja that fucking Blast is fighting. Now I forgot his name. It's Void, has these swords that slash dimensions. These swords slash dimensions, man, and he just slashes and he got this wave of dimension energy kind of that slashes dimensions. So that's how I'ma caught these bitches and just huh, bro, you a gag at this point. A dimension energy kind of that slashes dimensions. So that's how I'm gonna caught these bitches and just huh, bro, you a gag at this point. I haven't read since he beat Garou. Damn, you are way behind. I'm gonna tell you that that's a little behind. Has it done like a whole arc? Sense? They're still kind of dealing with monsters. But God's a new threat now because Blast is involved. And shit, how do you spell Garou G-A-R-O-U? That's what fucks me up Garou.
Speaker 1:I'm going to try to pick this up a little bit. We're only doing anime, so far yeah we're still only on anime.
Speaker 1:Oh no, I'm fine. I know I knew this would take a bit because I said there's me yapping, we're going to dedicate a tier show to just anime. This is it. I say that and then I'm going to let you take off with Mr Flamboyant himself, Doflamingo. Well, let's see, I already got design and aura down. That man has so many videos on TikTok of people trying to imitate his walk Accomplished. To be fair, that is one of the most copy-paste trends, for One Piece is copying somebody's walk in One Piece.
Speaker 2:Or laugh.
Speaker 1:They even did it in Dandedon. Accomplishments.
Speaker 1:He took over Jesterosa whole government under his foot. He took over Jesterosa and he knows things about the Celestial Dragons and nobody else knows design character depth. They had to throw him in Impel Down just because of that, didn't they? He's kind of just a savage in a way, but he does care for his crew a lot. He don't care about anything else. Man, he killed his own brother. Man killed his own blood brother oh fuck, because he was threatening his operation. Man, I'm just gonna fucking fuck. I think that's only one piece person on here. Actually. Really, that's interesting. No, akainu, no, blackbeard. Me and Jay will start throwing hands over Akainu. Nope, no, we won't. I mean, he's on the villain list. No, we won't. To be fair, like I said, it's anime top 50. Nothing really. The Flamingo's the only one on here, solid, I think. A B Can't put him in A with those guys, I'm just going to put Dolphy.
Speaker 2:Put.
Speaker 1:Dolphy, I know what. Do you want me to say it in a Pika voice? I really want to follow those two up together. Mariam, oh boy, dollar Store sell I'm kidding In looks. Yes, that's Teemu. Sell in looks he's got the Buddha ears. And Dollar Store fucking sell looks. Accomplishments Kind of held the whole Hunter x Hunter world at a standstill. So that's pretty high Impact, not max, but high, because Hunter x Hunter is pretty popular, probably around B. Yeah, in terms of design, now, aura he's got. Aura, aura he's got, because this motherfucker walks in the room and scares people. Design I gotta knock a bitch's cell. I'm a horrible fucking person because I put him out of seat. I can't do that. Why I can't do that? His chess master's with his blind girl Because he can't win. He's a professional goongi player even though she's blind. He just accepts it too. That's the reason he just accepts it too, that's the reason he folds to one person.
Speaker 1:That's the reason Miriam see. This is why Miriam is actually great Gungi made him. He thought humans were just cattle. But he's playing this game, gungi, with a blind human who he thinks ain't shit and he's like how are you beating me? Maybe there's more to these humans. And then obviously Nenero comes in there trying to kill him and fucking Meriam's like bro, I just want to talk, man, did we just talk? Did we just talk?
Speaker 2:Did we just talk?
Speaker 1:He became the king of ants, and then it led to nothing. For the longest time, oh God Directed a hero to story, even though Gohan never even threw a hand.
Speaker 2:Remember the story.
Speaker 1:Well, hunter x Hunter is weird. Gohan ain't even been. Not because of the main character of Hunter x Hunter, certainly Because Gohan is gone for a bit, like his dad. You want a tier deadbeat anime dad. Him and Brock are in S tier.
Speaker 2:Him and.
Speaker 1:Brock's dad S tier Goku at least comes around when he's not dead. That's his getaway. Brock's dad's on both sixes. When he wants to disappear, he dies. What about Brock's dad? He knows, getaway man. Brock's dad's on both six. When he wants to disappear, he he dies. What about Brock's dad? He knows it's his only time away, because they can just wish him back. What about Brock's dad living behind the fucking? That's even worse. The SDR dead Pete dad. So we've got SDR dead. Pete dad would be gone instead. Yeah, gene's like get away from me Over a shoe tucker. Well, that's.
Speaker 1:I mean he wanted to keep his alchemist license to provide for his family. So, I'm going to merge you. I'm providing. I'm providing one less mouth to feed. What? The? Oh God, oh God, so B? I think I had him. I think Miriam is A. I can't put Miriam in B. Where's your honest vote? My honest vote yeah, he deserves a, B. It's C for me because it was. Miriam is a Hunter. Hunter is so drawn out Like I have to wait forever just for anything. That's why I don't read it anymore.
Speaker 2:Well, it's always on break because the guy's sick, that's all.
Speaker 1:I see for me. But honestly, as far as character and everything that we have for criteria, he meets the B. Yeah, I was leaning B too. I guess I think we're going to have a lot of fucking Bs. I will go B he.
Speaker 2:I think we're going to have a lot of fucking bees, I would go bee, bee, bee.
Speaker 1:He did have the whole world at a standstill. He lost a poison Because they can't. It's like Jesus, yeah, but then we're also comparing him to guys that basically took over the world. A tier is basically people that did so and he didn't do that. He took over if he was, if he was, if he was.
Speaker 2:I'm just saying, that seems that basically people that did.
Speaker 1:He took over if he was. I'm just saying that's the difference with most of these and I'm going to compare him to another ant that you haven't seen yet. What Beru? Yep, fuck, they're very different. Beru is literally born and bred to kill. Merium has so much character and, to be fair, beru is the stronger than S-Class Hunters.
Speaker 1:He's not stronger than he didn't have much to him until after he became a Shadow. Yeah, I think we're closer to B with him. That's fine. Just to be fair, we're closer to Cell than anybody else. My ally who would try to put a game with me is In terms of accomplishment. To what he did, cell was basically just a roadblock. My um, you know, the comparisons are there. But when we call him Teemu Cell, I know, but that's basically out of everybody in the A tier, he's closest to Cell. I'll go to B, that's fine. I'm personally an A, but I will go B. You gotta write another. No, I just wanted to comment. That's fine, I'm personally an A, but I will go B. No, I just wanted to comment. My ally who would make this a tie is not here.
Speaker 1:JJ might have him in S JJ would have him up here I don't know. The funny truth about JJ is he's actually more strict on his criteria. Miriam is not my favorite villain in Hunter x Hunter. Chrollo is. Miriam is not my favorite villain in Hunter x Hunter. Crollo is Miriam's second. Okay, we put him as a, b, that's fine.
Speaker 1:There's a lot of people going to be pissed at that and I'm sorry, I know it's funny. It's hard for me, based on what he's done, to put him in the same group as this. That's fair. Michael Jackson, muzan, you want me to put him in the F? People hate me. I can't stand, muzan. I want to conquer the sun. So I'm going to try to get Nezuko and fucking absorb her so I can be in the sun, bro. So I'm gonna fucking try to get Nezuko and kill Nezuko and fucking absorb her so I can be in the sun. Bro's, so basic. His best thing is being Michael Jackson. His meme lives in yeah, so he's makes him live. Wasn't he the whole reason for Conjuro being who he is? Yeah, he is. That was a random house he stumbled upon and was hungry, so it's like I'm going to kill these people. He didn't know that was it.
Speaker 2:To be fair.
Speaker 1:There are a lot of stories.
Speaker 2:I thought you manipulated that?
Speaker 1:No, we did not. That was just random. He found their house and killed them and left. Oh well, I guess I do have to watch the movie that's coming out then to understand that shit. I, I didn't read the way you did. Muzan, yeah, muzan, I agree, but Muzan is. People hate Muzan. That is people's biggest gripe with Demon Slayer is Muzan. Muzan's outshined by his upper moons, who are great, akasa's, great, fukoshibo's, great, gyataro's, great. He's outshined by his upper moons, character, depth and complexity. There's not much there. Well, I, I might, just, I might just say do you? He's not? Oh boy, how the hell is he more powerful than his upper moons? Who was it? Yeah, husan is strong, he's strong. He gives them their power. He makes some demons. Husan's the first demon and it's weird. He became a demon by basically getting the wrong medicines. He was sickly and turned into a demon. It's kind of what? Yes, what origin is that?
Speaker 1:Yes that's basically his origin. So character depth, he gets what. D, f might be a little harsh, so D he has an S. What? Which one? The pop culture, yeah, because he's fucking Muzan. And design, yeah, so he gets S and basically that criteria. It's kind fucking Muzan. Design, yeah, because he's Michael Jackson, so he gets S and basically that criteria range. It's kind of weird how that actually gives him an S. That's Michael Jackson. You instantly fucking recognize him.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I mean he's in threat.
Speaker 1:I don't think he's an F. No, I don't think he's an F. I just wanted to make the joke because oh, was M-U-Z-A-N Correct? Alright, you have one. Are you smarter than a fifth grader as I write like a fucking third grader? Alright, I still want to take these two, but I'm going to give it a little break. The Demon King Seven Deadly Sins. The Demon King Seven Deadly Sins. I didn't really like the Demon King. The Ten Commandments outshined him. Damn. Oh, fuck. I mean, the only reason he was there was to further the plot. I feel like, yeah, demon King was not that, but again, he's outshined by Zeldris was better, that's kind of why I went with this one.
Speaker 1:After Fallout, mr Rosa was better. I mean he's got some aura. He's got a big-ass giant, fucking Viking Odin-like design. I mean that's cool. So you're putting him in D? How is it we have no trash? Because the rank he took the top ones from Anchor to do a discussion.
Speaker 2:So we ain't gonna have much for that.
Speaker 1:We can move Team Rocket down there for shits If we really wanted to. I think. Were you saying demon Depth and complexity? He's really just trying to kill off the goddess clan. It's a war with the demon race and goddess race war.
Speaker 2:There's not much to it.
Speaker 1:Like I said, he's fucking out. I'm gonna go D. He's outshined by fucking accomplishments. I'm gonna go D. He's outshined by fucking accomplishments. He got bitch made by the fucking. I hope you can spell Demon King. Okay, Ah, D-A-E-M-O-N? D. That's why he needs to Demon Demon. No, if it was four nights, If it was four nights, the apocalypse Arthur is way above Demon King. Final DBZ Frieza.
Speaker 2:Oh God.
Speaker 1:I might let Jay take this, because I'm biased. I hate Frieza. I hate Frieza. He's my least favorite out of the three main villains so. I'm letting Jay handle that one.
Speaker 2:As a villain, because I'm biased as a villain.
Speaker 1:I hate Frieza.
Speaker 2:By myself.
Speaker 1:Put him at the B? A range. The world puts him at the B-A range. The world puts him at an? S. They will not let this fucker die.
Speaker 2:I mean, that's the thing he's had.
Speaker 1:so many power-ups to combat Goku's. So every fucking time Goku gets one, frieza gets one. Even in hell, frieza Black gets one. For fuck's sake, they made him the most racist character made of black. So we're giving him low character complexity, low character complexity, depth and complexity. Yes, I'm gonna give Frieza one. He has shit. He's basically a woman. I will give Frieza one thing. He has an iconic line Hello monkeys, hello monkeys. No, I ain't gonna go. I'm not gonna do it. I was gonna do C at least. But Damn Jay, frieza's killed people. I'd probably say he blew up Krillin. Like, if you, um, like I said, said I let Jay take the thing on that one. Jay, you want to put some around?
Speaker 2:no, here's the question. He is my out of.
Speaker 1:B range for me out of boo when he comes back as cyber Frieza, oh yeah. Trunks just comes back and in three seconds. Fuck you guys when they put that in actual time in a Dragon Ball Super, super.
Speaker 2:Hero movie.
Speaker 1:It was fucking hilarious out of the main ones. You got Cell, you got Frieza, then Cell, then Boo. People argue all the time Frieza's my least favorite out of them three. Yeah, one of the best parts about Frieza? What his voice actor? Are you talking about the old one or are you talking about Damon Mills? Both, damon Mills is going to be at Anki. The new one, damon Damon Damon, yep, he brings so much honor to the old one, same way that the new fuck, uncle Iroh, yeah, brings honor to the old one.
Speaker 1:They're in the same boat for me. I cannot hear that voice without hearing the same. I did that to let it be fair to Frieza. Jake, I did the same shit I was probably going to do. Don't like Frieza, I'm not fair.
Speaker 2:It's not that I don't like Frieza.
Speaker 1:I just think he is in the same boat as Goku.
Speaker 2:Frieza, I just think he is.
Speaker 1:He's in the same boat as Goku. For me, I like Goku, but there's no reason for you to be the center of fucking attention all the damn time. So you don't like Frieza? Huh, I tell you who you do like. It was me, dio. Oh God, they literally created a god-killing character in Dragon Ball Super. Yeah, oh, here comes fucking Frieza as the next fucking arc, frieza Black, and that's it. So you have a god-killing character and you're gonna follow it up with Frieza Black, I agree. Now, dio, named after the great Ronnie James Dio. Rest in Peace. Rock Legend, literally, is Everyone in JoJo is named after a musical person, every power and person. This man has arguably the greatest line in, arguably a top tier, top ten line in anime history. You thought your first kiss was going to be with Jonathan Joestar. Was it Jonathan or Joseph? Which one's your favorite, joseph, right, jonathan? I think it's Jonathan's first. You thought your I believe, your first kiss. You thought your first kiss was going to be with Jonathan Joestar, but it was with me.
Speaker 2:Deal.
Speaker 1:That's fucking, that's goaded, that's goaded, that's goaded, that's a meme. Even Matt should know that meme. Matt should know that it was with me. Dio Impact on it's Dio is just Dio's a meme. So design there's aura in design there. Pretty good Design, yeah, but charisma and aura, dio's got that in spades.
Speaker 1:Character, depth and complexity there's not that much because Jonathan is the one. Joseph, okay. Not much depth for Dio. His whole goal is just wipe out the Joestars. I'm going to kill the Joestars. That's his goal. His dad was a piece of shit and he pretty much got adopted by the Joestars. He wants to kill the Joestars. That's literally Dio's thing. We got Joseph before his head got lopped off. Thank God Likeability Dio is very likable.
Speaker 1:People like Dio. Even though he's a fucking douche, people love Dio. But then we also got Giorno Giovanna. Yeah, dio's head, but Jonathan's body. What the fuck. So Jojo, go there Threaten, a hero in story.
Speaker 1:He's always there, the man is. Even the man's presence is felt in part six and he's not even in it because part six's villain is his lover, gucci. Dio is an aggressive bisexual male. Holy, holy shit. Am I behind on the fucking JoJo story, jay? The world needs to accept that Dio is an aggressive bisexual male. The world needs to accept this Bisexual. He's bi as hell. There ain't no way. There ain't no way. There's a whole fucking arc about his lover trying to bring him back. People debate no, poochie's not his lover. Who lover who? What? Two men lay on a bed and read books together? You get the fuck out of here. That's no. No, who does that? Okay, the closest we come to that is me on the other couch. Too much info. It's not really. My mom is my witness. What the fuck are you two doing? You're on the other couch and you're sending each other messages. Alright, speed it up.
Speaker 1:D-O-Z. I think D-O-Z. The world might put him in S, but I can't put him in S with them fucking heavy hitters up there. A is good he's very high tier.
Speaker 1:You don't put the Bulldogs here with those other S tiers. Useless, useless, useless, useless. Dio's great Dio, he would be S. I wouldn't be mad at anyone putting him in S and I'm a big Jojo stan. I actually do in my mind. Put him around the S with moderate hold up. Put Dio in S, put him in S. I agree everything as far as our criteria goes. He damn near got an S for it, itachi, oh boy, so overrated. But I gotta be fair, itachi, Itachi, turn through it if you need to B. I can't get him much lower than B, I don't even have to go through.
Speaker 1:I think that's fair. Like I said, I gotta be fair.
Speaker 2:His main accomplishment is killing his family.
Speaker 1:The world loves Itachi. He did save Sasuke. His goal was to save Sasuke. That's his main accomplishment. Though what has he done? I mean he helped a lot in his impact on pop culture and the universe.
Speaker 2:That's pretty high because Itachi's so popular.
Speaker 1:His design? Kind of basic. He looks just like his brother. He's just not a big threat to the story. Long hair, the long hair. Terrible likability is what are we calling?
Speaker 2:it.
Speaker 1:People hate Tachi at first. Then they like him a little more when they understand why he did what he did. And, to be fair, we gotta downgrade him a little bit because he's not fully a villain. He did things that he was asked to do. Yes, but, yes, but the fuck. Anti-hero, then what the hell?
Speaker 2:Kind of I was yeah.
Speaker 1:A or S for Aizen I'm actually quite sure. Aizen, that's the other one at that. You want to know how modern.
Speaker 2:I am.
Speaker 1:I can't quite put him in S just yet. What His brain's turning? I want to, but I can't quite put him an S just yet. His brain's turning I want to, but I can't instantly give him the S. Let's see Accomplishments. That's definitely an S. He's the reason for damn near everything. Yeah, he orchestrated the whole story and he fused with the Hojoku and became a fucking god, damn near. Until you watch became a thing. Aizen was the reason for everything. Impact on pop culture that's an S. He's very popular, aizen's popular. So far. I have two S's Design and Design not necessarily or a yes Design yes.
Speaker 1:Let me show you what Aizen Design develops. I guess I'm not saying his.
Speaker 2:Let me show you.
Speaker 1:His fucking butterfly form is amazing. Oh, I'm saying, that's Hojoku form. Let me show you His fucking butterfly form is amazing.
Speaker 2:Oh, I'm saying, that's good form.
Speaker 1:I was basing it off the human form. Oh, still, here I will.
Speaker 2:Here's what Aizen did when he became a villain.
Speaker 1:He gives me a very Clark Kent vibe. That's aura. Yeah, I'm dead. He's got the fucking squirrel. He's got the Clark Kent, alright, so he's just gonna put him up there. I can't. That's very high, because 4 out of 6 already. Yeah, he's S threat to the hero and star motherfucker is the only reason they beat you, me and Jay.
Speaker 2:Jay calls him you watch me.
Speaker 1:I can only follow by you watch. I can't even pronounce it the same way you do. Ali Baba Gabi from my I can't even pronounce it the same way you do Alibaba, alibaba, gabi, gabi from my year, or Shigaraki, he'll probably be later there's only eight-ish left. Oh shit, gabi, about Shit. We really are only doing anime today. That's why I'm trying to speed it out. We're going to go through comics probably pretty quick. We're not going to talk much about comic. Yeah, you got Dean on anime first. That was your issue.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:Dobby Dean will talk anime first Dobby. I might get Dobby to Dobby's story with. Endeavor is fucking pretty cheap. That's part of the issue. Nope, hey, hey, hey. Character depth and complexity, very, very his character from the beginning, very high. Everyone knew who he was oh yeah, todoroki, but he was the he was. I don't know if the author meant to go that direction or if he was just meeting the fans. Demands like co-host is finished that's the site.
Speaker 2:That's our last episode general likability.
Speaker 1:Davi is pretty likable, especially threat to the hero. He didn't really, he didn't really interact that much with Deku it was always downgraded. It was always it's Endeavor. He had daddy issues, but for a reason. For a reason, Endeavor fucking left them. Yeah, I thought you liked character with daddy issues, though If they're women, that just If they're women.
Speaker 2:I mean Did.
Speaker 1:Midnight have daddy issues, what no, I?
Speaker 2:don't think so.
Speaker 1:Not before she died. Even I heard about that one. I'm leaning B For Dobby. Yeah, I was saying C, but I'm not B For Dabi. Yeah, I was saying C, but I'm not mad at B. You're giving him the rank that's in his name, simply because. He's also an A. I can't say it's.
Speaker 1:Dabi, dabi, d-a-b-i Dabi. He is totally just as evil as he is. He's totally justified. He was. His dad wanted perfection, perfection, and he couldn't really live up to it. So he just got beat all the time he got. He tried to train by himself. His whole thing was making his dad proud and he endeavor never accepted him. Then he got all the end. Then he got yeah, until the end. He finally said wait wait, wait, oh no, he died in the hospital.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it was an epilogue. He didn't die in the manga, but it said he wasn't going to live much longer. Yeah, that actually.
Speaker 2:That's when they finally that hurt me, that hurt me.
Speaker 1:I was like oh, Well, no, the hurt me the most is when Todoroki's like he never got a chance to bond with his brother at all. He said he's trying.
Speaker 2:That was Endeavor.
Speaker 1:The whole Todoroki story is arguably the best thing in my Hero for me. I love that whole saga. That was fucking Love it. So I'm going to put Davi in B. I agree, skeletor, I'll get you.
Speaker 2:E-man, I can't give him an F, I'm gonna let Jade yap about that a little bit. I'm biased.
Speaker 1:I like Skeletons.
Speaker 2:I like Skeletons.
Speaker 1:You know what? See, it's just straight C. He's kind of a joke. He gave us memes, he gave us memes. When you give us memes, you're something Threatability to the heroine's story. Come on, gave us memes, he gave us memes. When you give us memes, you're something Threatability to the heroine's story. Come on, kevin Smith would kick our ass for that one. I don't think we're going to have to delve into much. He's bold and nostalgic. How?
Speaker 2:do you spell it?
Speaker 1:It's skeleton start and then tor.
Speaker 2:You really just instead of O-N you'd start Okay Well, even.
Speaker 1:And then tor, no, ed you really? Just, instead of O-N, you'd start Okay, well, even if I spell it wrong, I don't give a fuck, I'm not really, do you read your own handwriting Sometimes no.
Speaker 1:Well, I'm not doing that bad this time. I can't write for shit. I'm not doing that bad this time. Alright, Dean, you get 30 seconds for Hisoka. Hisoka, it's open. Hisoka, Hunter Hunter. He's so not stranger danger. Oh God, Accomplishments. He's a very successful groomer. Very successful groomer that makes him a villain. Very successful groomer Impact on Popcorn. Very successful groomer. Design and aura. I mean, he's a very successful groomer. Design and aura. He's a very successful groomer. He's trying to tell me that that's all he's got.
Speaker 2:I think he'd go an.
Speaker 1:S. If it was on groomer, he'd be S like a. Oh fuck, he soaks his own ear. Fuck, I gotta stay away from the only joke that I have. Fuck you, I know I to say it too. Um, threat to the threat to go and kill. A big threat, a threat. I can't go with the details. He's a threat. Where's he going? Do you want me to ask the back door? Anyone lets him what? Oh yeah, we see. So he's a B B for back door. I'm sorry. Here's the thing, though, about Hisoka. Let's talk, though, for a couple seconds. He's not a villain, he's not really. He just likes strength. He knows Gon and Killo are strong, but, bro, when you sense their strength, you don't have to fucking give thrust. Bro, come on, man, they're fucking 10 years old. They're going to be strong. It's like, oh my god.
Speaker 2:He's not a villain.
Speaker 1:I can't even add him to the villain list. You don't want to, that's fine. I can't, that's fine, other than him being a fucking groomer. I almost didn't. People don't like groomers. Orochimaru, another fucking groomer. We have so many Naruto characters Because they got good villains, I cut off too. Why don't you cut off? Zabuza was on here. I hope Paglia wasn't on here. Actually, kaguya may have been, oh fuck, not Moon Bitch.
Speaker 2:That's what I call her Moon.
Speaker 1:Bitch. No, I don't like Kaguya, because that is the one they modeled her into a fucking hole. Garo was up there. What he did to Rock Lee wasn't right. Garra was up there. That was the other one. He wasn't a villain. He started as one. He almost killed Lee until that motherfucking mighty guy was like no, it's because of how he was treated as a fucking person In his village if he didn't do what he did.
Speaker 1:Orochimaru's probably been beat at sea. Orochimaru probably probably been beat at sea. Orochimaru probably go beat Again. He's not as strong.
Speaker 2:He's one of the part of Legendary Sani. He's not that high.
Speaker 1:After who he is now, he's still a low-key groomer. You put groomer after groomer. I don't know. I'm pulling these last ten off in order as I like them. What's off with these fucking groomers? Just because, and how much they fit the narrative we're currently in there drew a scene of Well, he wanted to jump in I don't know who half these people are. He wanted to jump in the Sasuke and beat what is his name? Sai, yeah and Sai his fucking Mr Crop Top, what? Okay, I'll go B. I have no idea how to spell Orochi Maru.
Speaker 2:O-R-O.
Speaker 1:O-R-O C-H. I Maru Okay.
Speaker 2:Just how it's spelled.
Speaker 1:It's literally spelled like the snake god. Orochi Maru. I gotta say the scene, though, where he's creeping on Sasuke and he's like just looking with that creepy ass, look behind a tree and I'm like, bro, I'll get Chrollo out of here. Hi, chrollo, what are you putting him on here? I'm pulling Chrollo. I'm pulling Chrollo out of the names we have left. Chrollo, oh, you're using him.
Speaker 2:I thought you were kicking him out of the team.
Speaker 1:This is a problem because there's a lot of bias here, so I got to no, no, no, let us be the objective ones you give us.
Speaker 1:Accomplishments Leads. The Phantom Troop started the Phantom Troop, one of the most popular groups in anime. I gotta say that the whole reason for Kurapika's whole quest for revenge is he fucking killed his clan and took their eyes Shit. Wait, that's not the guy that he buried, is it? Oh, that's Uvo. That's Uvo Geed. Kurapika's badass moment. He'd bring a shovel to a fight because he was so he was ready to bury a bitch. He'd bring a shovel. The impact is not. It's Hunter x.
Speaker 1:Hunter is popular, but Frollo is one of the most popular characters in the show, so it's decent Design. Oh, that's fucking Design and aura. Is this man fucking? When the Phantom Troops doing their shit in Yorknew, like doing their operation to steal shit, frollo is just running an opera on top of the building and it's cutting the scenes of everything working. Right, the man is a genius. Then he fights fucking Silva and Zeno of the Zoldycks and shit and he's just kind of Character, depth and complexity. There's a lot there because his backstory is sad.
Speaker 1:The full Phantom Troop is a bunch of gutter rat kids that one of their friends got murdered, got her head chopped off. Hunter Hunter's dark and he started his group. So he's got depth. He has some complexity. I'm curious what's going to happen with him now, though, because he's on the verge of having another fight with Hisoka, so likability is high. Because these fucking people love Chrollo, threat to the hero. Instead, I'm going to go A. I'm going to go A for Chrollo. He interacts with Gon quite a bit in York, but he never fights Gon. He never fights Gon. So I think A is fair. After all we've said about fucking the Hunter, it doesn't even feel like Gon's the main character or hero. Gachi did really good at giving everyone their little times to shine, so he was really good with that, like as soon as Gon went uh, what the fuck is that mode he goes into where he goes kind of adult he turns into a fucking macho man.
Speaker 1:He pretty much sacrifices his life for fucking for strength no, no, no the Slim Jim guy. He turns into the Slim Jim guy oh, with his hair.
Speaker 1:Yeah, he does that just to literally kill Pito. It's like, bro, I give going man points, he sacrificed everything just to kill one friend, one fade, just one. I just want one. I want to kill dude, alright. Next, weird name guy from Bleach. Weird name Yohabah Okura, okura, yeah, spoon man, u-l-k-k-l-a, u-l-q-u-i, o-r-r-a, okura. Oh god, mason's right hand man in that arc. Basically, the funny thing was, though, okura got the most. Okura was like a spot of six, stark was one is the funniest thing, but Okura got all the fucking. Everybody started glazing Okura.
Speaker 1:That's the funny thing, I swear the only reason that he wasn't number one is because he didn't try, kind of. I just always find that funny. I always tell it's like Okira was a spot of six and the only reason he lost is because he brought out Ichigo's full hollow. Yeah, okira had a lot of death, though he didn't even die yet because Orihime saved him. Okira died, he faded.
Speaker 2:she tried to, but he faded off.
Speaker 1:Grimmjaw was the one that didn't technically die yeah.
Speaker 1:Grimmjaw came back. He came back just to be fucking hit. Um Sternritter's messed with him. Complexity and depth he's got a lot because a lot of his thing is understanding humans and Orihime talks about the heart a lot. All humans go by the heart. That's the line I have written on my pop. What is a heart? He's very big on trying to understand humans. He don't understand them at all. Orahime's affection for Ichigo in that final fight when Ichigo's going all nuts and shit and he's beating the kind of and it's equal, but he's beating Okura and Orahime's going all nuts because he knows Ichigo shouldn't be like that. Okura's like well, like that, Okura's like well. Maybe there is something to this love and compassion these people have and he's learning. So Okura's pretty high, I'm thinking. Alright, let's use your criteria and not go off of bias, I'm not being biased Okura is not a favorite, favorite, but I appreciate him a lot.
Speaker 1:Accomplishments is A.
Speaker 2:He didn't really accomplish much.
Speaker 1:That's probably where his lowest criteria is so C-ish. Forcing enough effort out of Ichigo is probably his biggest effort. Impact on pop culture and universe.
Speaker 2:Popular universe Design.
Speaker 1:Design is normal. Design is meh when he's in his spotter ship, when he gets his wings and shit it goes up. Because I like that design Captain. Complexity is pretty high, likeability is high because of his.
Speaker 2:Because of.
Speaker 1:Meaning A For Okira. I'm not against it. I'm not against it at all. We'll go. A Threat to the hero is a big threat. All right, then you guys can debate. Shigaraki, oh, not Shiggy. Oh, my god, accomplishments S Kinda Voiced by the great Eric Bale. Why'd I gotta shout out to everybody, because you know that Impact on pop culture and universe they're in S Yep Design and charisma, that's a little lower Design's a little lower.
Speaker 1:His design kind of goes up as the series goes, but it stays pretty. It goes up a little bit Even when Awper One takes over his body. Yeah, he's still just kind of all beat up and fucking crusty face and shit. So it's kind of it's fine. It's not like it's a bad design. But Charisma's up there. I mean he leads the league, he leads the whole league of villains, so he's gotta have Charisma. He definitely has character depth and complexity. Yes, because he's not. He's again a young person. That was just the powers came out and I killed my family and that was all orchestrated by All for One, pretty much, yeah, he's a great villain in his own right.
Speaker 1:You know, it's that we tend to like the characters that orchestrate the entirety. I mean, he didn't. He lost the final fight, but he stayed true to himself in the end.
Speaker 2:The whole story. You'd think.
Speaker 1:Deku's gonna change him. Deku's gonna make him good again.
Speaker 1:He's like but in the end though, because he said you tell Spinner I fought to destroy to the end, because he knew that would destroy Spinner if Shigaraki became good and shit, and you guys are like, nah, fuck that shit, I'm a bad guy, what's our time at? We're at two hours already. Yeah, well, another, oh God, okay, two minute warning. Two-minute warning Start to the heroes is high, because he was the main villain pretty much throughout. Besides the times, all for One came in and stole the spotlight a little bit. Depth of Complexity, likeability I think Shigaraki could easily be in the A or S. He could beS or A. I will say A because I can't quite put him with.
Speaker 2:I was leaving A because one for all is a lot of the manipulator here.
Speaker 1:Yeah, all for one does a lot of it hurts him a little bit, that's fine, I can go with that. He, um, yeah, that's Because all for one is kind of the main villain. Everything behind his accomplishments is due to all for one. I don't think we're going to be able to get through comic book.
Speaker 2:Oh boy.
Speaker 1:Because I think you're going to talk too much for comic book, honestly. Oh boy, we got two hours out of anime Ryomen, sukuna, sukuna, sukuna. Oh shit, the other jujitsu You're like this is going to be the top. Alright, do we not need to say anything? No Accomplishments he's very recent and nobody would disagree with us putting him up. Accomplishments defeated arguably the most popular anime character in a generation, gojo that's. That's up there. I have a feeling.
Speaker 2:I'm gonna be held. He didn't switch bodies.
Speaker 1:I have a feeling I'm going to be holding. You didn't switch bodies. I have a feeling.
Speaker 2:I'm going to be holding you didn't switch bodies.
Speaker 1:You just jumped in the Gojo's body Because he stole Kenjaku's technique. I think I'm going to be holding this for the next two people, huh.
Speaker 2:There's more after him.
Speaker 1:I got three people. After this Impact on pop culture, I'm still kind of sad. We have no apps. Yeah, sukuna is everywhere. Save that for the honorable mention. Sukuna is everywhere. So pop culture is JJ Cage Design and aura is just max. Jj Cage is aura farming, that's all Jujutsu Kaisen is. Is aura farming? Not gonna lie, because everyone in there has fucking aura.
Speaker 1:Character depth and complexity is not that high, because I never got his Heian era flashback. We got pieces of it, but that'd probably be feed A. It's fine, it's probably a, b most likely. His complexity, because he becomes a spirit. He's Sukuna's. He literally says I'm strong, I kill people, I eat people. That's what I do, that's how the world treated me, that's how I'm going to treat the world, that's how Sukuna is. But again, sometimes simple is good, simple is never. Simple is not bad, it's how you do it. Likeability is Aura makes him fucking likable. He was 9 on Ranker, for God's sakes, of all time. That's voted a lot by people. Threat to the hero. So he was just, he was a thorn and he was the main bad guy. The whole fucking story, the whole fucking story. And there they had to jump him in a like 50 to 60 fucking page fight where everyone in the verse jumped this man, people jumped out jumping and his man just cauterizing this whole fucking verse stay down stay down, stay down, no, no no.
Speaker 1:For 60 chapters. The tide turned. It took a black guy to come in and fight to turn Miguel, to come in and turn the tide a little bit. The fucker from JJK0. Akutami says I'm going to bring Miguel back and I'm like, oh my God, sukuna's S to me. I don't think many people would disagree.
Speaker 1:That's what I said Just write it down, I've got soup. Vicious, cowboy Bebop. You didn't see much of Vicious, that's the sad shit, but again it's Cowboy Bebop, so it's got that iconicness to it. And the ending of Cowboy Bebop is iconic. That fight between Spike and Vicious is iconic, where Spike just goes bang. I think C could be okay. I think C would be okay. Just goes bang. I think C could be okay. I think C would be okay. Vicious is high school I don't know if it's because it's too old and the fact that he didn't really have an impact on the story as a whole until the very end. Yeah, I think this guy's going to end up in C2. Nobuyuki Sugo Sword Art Online.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I think this guy's going to end up in C2. Nobuyuki Sugo Sword Art Online F Shit, I'll let Jay take. He did a lot.
Speaker 1:I'll let Jay and Matt take that one, because I'm not a big Sword Art guy. I know you're not.
Speaker 2:But in terms of what?
Speaker 1:he did and almost got away with. He's probably in the C. I almost got away with, he's probably in the C. I said F as a joke, but I don't think he's higher than B. I didn't want to put him higher than C at all, I know, but I'm saying I don't think he's higher than that. So just put Nobuyuki in there. Oh the fuck, n-o-b, no-ba, no-boo, no-boo, yeah. So N-O, n-o-b-u-j-u-k-i, j-u-k-i.
Speaker 2:No butchery, no butchery.
Speaker 1:The final named one before the honorable mention is Griffith from Berserk. And no, no, no, no, no, no you made him put that oh boy, oh God. Do you want to? Okay, fine, we'll start from the bottom Threat to the Okay, no, alright, fine, we'll start from the bottom Threat to the hero. It killed the whole fucking main cast. So that puts you at what S General likability is one of the most hated characters in all of anime, but that's good, though in a way he has an F for character, depth and complexity.
Speaker 1:There's actually a lot, because when Griffith gets, his goal is to have. He's poor. As a kid His goal is to be a king and have status and have his own kingdom. That's his dream when he was a kid. Because he's poor, he started the band of the hawk and acquired Guts and Kafka and his whole group and his goal was to go and do stuff and do jobs and become strong and eventually have his own kingdom.
Speaker 1:One day, after a war, he eventually gets captured and as a prisoner he gets his R. He's starved to death. He gets his art, all his tendons cut, so he can't fucking move anymore. He's a fucking stick. He can't do nothing. His dream's dead. The man's dream is dead and he has a decision. He can. He can keep living through his friends or he can say fuck this shit, I'm gonna still get my dream and sacrifice his whole band of the hawk for power and to become a king.
Speaker 1:He becomes a demon lord, pretty much a demon king femto, but he does. It says so it's fuck this, so it's. Basically he sacrifices everything for his dream. He's selfish in a way, but killing the band of the hawks in his mind, I think, feels that he's a band of the hawks with him. That's why he killed them. They died for his dream, for his dream to be fulfilled in a fucked up way. He hates Guts because Guts got out thanks to Skull Knight. But Guts is like Guts. You're saying fuck you to my dream. You should have died for my dream. But while he's in the fucking eclipse it's called, he's killing all the band of the hawk. After death and complexity, easily A, I didn't get to the part where we fucking I don't know, I'm leaving that for the top one.
Speaker 1:Oh, that's an accomplice. Okay, the design and aura. He's basically a pretty boy, femboy, low-key he's that long white.
Speaker 2:You're all about them, femboys.
Speaker 1:Long blonde hair and shit. So design is fine. Now when he becomes Fento, that shit go up a little bit. That shit go up pretty good actually. Impact on pop culture and Universe they're in Universe, they're in. He changed the whole fucking world of Berserk. Impact on pop culture Everyone knows who Griffith is because of the Eclipse and everyone has seen the Golden Age arc. Everyone's like, oh this motherfucker.
Speaker 1:Accomplishments here's where I will let you say his accomplishments. Okay, accomplishments, here's where I will let you say his accomplishments. Killed the entire band of the Hawk and almost killed Guts, except for Guts and Kafka Almost died, but they got saved by Skull Knight. This man was so furious at Guts for fighting so hard and trying to survive. Kafka and Guts had a thing. This man picked up Kafka and fucked her right in front of Guts and did not look at Kafka one time. He just stared at Guts every second. I'm like bro, what are you doing? It's his favorite thing. If we didn't let him say it, he would have His favorite thing. He brought it up twice. He's A or S. He could be S, but A might be more fair. A is fair. A is fair. I couldn't put him in B just to.
Speaker 2:He's too iconic.
Speaker 1:The A and up B is great to good villains. I think A and up is like you're starting to get to the iconic ones, and Griffith is iconic. The only reason we have ones in S is because you can't change who they are. There's no.
Speaker 2:When you think of them.
Speaker 1:You think there's you, automatically. You think of Madara, it's Naruto. You think of Sukuna, that's Jujutsu Kaisen. They're just, they're them. They're tied to anime as a whole. Aizen is damn near so. It's like Go and buy. The honorable mention that I was forced to put on here by my co-worker was Gargamel From Smurfs. What the hell Gargamel? Technically, he's one of the most evil people to ever grace a cartoon. To be fair, I'm gonna say it just because somebody's gonna laugh. But yeah, his whole thing was trying to eat little people. Yeah, eat the commies. Well, fuck you and thank you at the same time. I always make the joke. No, you need to. Smurfs is a little commie town. That's what it's basically based off.
Speaker 2:Little communist town. What was the running?
Speaker 1:joke the red caps. Yeah, little Smurfs do whatever Papa Smurf says. Papa Smurf wears red. That's a commie. That's fucking great. I'm fucking happy Matt knows that.
Speaker 2:They don't have to put them on here.
Speaker 1:Think about their outfits. They're blue people in red caps Don't have to put them on here. I was bringing that one up as a joke because I was forced to put him on here, you know what the really sad part is? Even as a fucking joke, we can put him as an F. He has so much meaning to the characters if we want to use our criteria. Accomplishments well, he gave the internet Smurfette, sadly, that's a fucking accomplishment.
Speaker 1:Accomplishments Well, he gave the internet Smurfette, sadly that's a fucking accomplishment he was able to be translated into a live-action character for not one but two movies. Impact on pop culture and universe. They're in. You cannot think Smurfs without thinking guardimel design and aura and charisma. Vicky fucking fails. He's an old creepy dude. He basically looks like a fucking what you think of a nasty witch, but as a dude that looks good as a dude. Character, depth and complexity there's almost none.
Speaker 2:I want to eat s'mores.
Speaker 1:His motive is he wants their magic. He wants to be the big wizard honcho in the land. Likeability oh good lord. General likeability, okay, as a kid, for some reason you would like his ass, just because of his relationship with his cat. Threat to the hero he is the main reason the Smurfs stay hidden. Nope, he's basically what the Burgesses, or whatever the fuck they are in Trolls. Oh, one person? Alright, ready for the next category. I can't even put them in a fucking F.
Speaker 2:I don't Yep.
Speaker 1:I mean, they look like Stalin. They look like Stalin. Kinda, that's Stalin. No, that shit got ruined for me in high school because someone said you know what? There's nothing but a communist regime. What the fuck? Get the fuck out of here. No way Do you know the real. Do you know what Smurfs are? They're evil little creatures that steal children, bury them in snow. No, seriously, look up Smurfs in. Was it German or Swedish culture? You fucking Smurf? I'm serious, they're evil, so technically Gargoyles is the hero.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I'm gonna eat these fucking. Alright, what do we got? We're gonna go to video games because we can probably churn through that. At least we might be able to churn out through film. But I don't think Dean's gonna be able to resist not talking for a comic book. Let's go. Yeah, I agree Number one. I didn't expect this to be what we wanted, but I didn't expect it to be this much. I half expected it. I kinda did the anime I knew was just going to be its own thing. Mr Peach is himself Bowser's number. That's the first name on the list.
Speaker 2:Are we writing?
Speaker 1:these down.
Speaker 2:I guess Okay.
Speaker 1:We're into anime, we're into video games. People Video games. Category switch. We should be able to churn through this quickly. It's just like. What category switch? We should be able to churn through this quickly. It's just like.
Speaker 2:D Damn, damn.
Speaker 1:No, I mean iconic Bowser's iconic. Yeah, did you put him a, c? As much as he's silly. I mean we're not putting him an S, but I was leaning towards C, b, c. I was putting him in a, d, but C hasn't been a fucking threat since the D. He hasn't been a fucking threat since Mario.
Speaker 1:He hasn't been a threat Mario 1 and Mario Bros 1 and 2. Fine, put him in C. Bro kept trying to steal Peach, though Mario never got shit for it. Peach, peach, peach, wrong, for that I don't know. Dean can talk about the next one, he definitely can't talk about 3. The boss, yeah, what, what the fuck? What are we doing? Where's the boss? What Diablo.
Speaker 2:From.
Speaker 1:Diablo. I did not play them games, I know. That's why I said I don't think you can put anything on that one. I didn't play Diablo. I need Ryan kind of for this one. Even Diablo is not helpful. Ironically, the threat of Diablo is the biggest thing of the problem, but every time in a video game where you're dealing with him, he's less, he's more of a no diff point. I've never made it through a single one of them games the games are hard, man, it's not that they're not hard, it's the top down for me.
Speaker 1:I for some reason am not as into the top down RPGs. Put him in B. That's where I would lean.
Speaker 2:I can get to that.
Speaker 1:Well, we get to talk me and you get to talk a little bit about Xehanort. That's a fucked up story. Kingdom Hearts. Okay, you guys, I didn't play that, you guys gotta hear it. I don't know how many of these, how many of the early ones you've played? I don't want to put them in B because of how large our fucking B list is. Yeah, b, like I said, b is getting up there. I'm going to have to switch over there. I mean, b is still B. Well, I've been writing left-right versus up-down.
Speaker 2:I know I'll just have to go over here.
Speaker 1:I don't have shit on my page. Well't think there was going to be many. And my writing is trash, but it's not as bad, as I thought he's a good spot Because until we get four, we have nobody who lives above him. He's not S though.
Speaker 2:He'll be in your tree.
Speaker 1:He's not more memorable than any of our S's.
Speaker 2:There was an overall villain the Kingdom Hearts.
Speaker 1:That's it. Oh, okay, he's the whole reason for the.
Speaker 2:There was an overall villain in the Kingdom Hearts that's Xanar.
Speaker 1:Oh okay, I thought it was just a fucking. He's the whole reason for the keywords Delatos of Portal. Oh my god. C. I didn't play Portal much. Yeah, I said that was going to be the. You'll have comments on the next one. Guaranteed Dean. What. When you think of sarcastic bitch and likability, that's your woman Straight C. In terms of overall threat. It's low, so it's gotta be C. She's not even a threat to you. She just laughs at you for your own stupidity. She's a threat to you by continuously throwing you in puzzles.
Speaker 2:Oh, that could kill you. It's not even her.
Speaker 1:That's the entirety of the fucking factory you're put in. This one you will definitely chime in on and it's probably going to be on my page. Dracula, castlevania Aye, well, uh, d for Dracula, not right? No see, uh, it doesn't want to suck, though there's Dracula, there's, there's automatic aura. I don't know if you can see Castlevania, though. I don't know if you can see Castlevania, dracula, I don't know if you can. And we're talking video games, not Netflix.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I don't know. I'm going to make a comment you can't.
Speaker 1:You've got to exclude Netflix because it gives him a sad backstory.
Speaker 2:People treated him like he killed his own.
Speaker 1:He had the same backstory in the games. Who made him? They story in the games. They just made it more in your face in the Netflix, took him until PS3 in order to explain that, like, he got his own Castlevania game. A or S In terms of depth, well, we got just a If it's overall. It's not Dracula, but you're going just video game. Maybe say A because Castlevania is so iconic. I'd say A A If it was just overall fiction Dracula. He gave us Alucard. No, it's just straight. Castlevania Police Girl. Not that Alucard, damn you. I'm thinking of Alvin Alduin Elder Scrolls B. I just Alduin from fucking the dragon, from yeah, they didn't play Elder Scrolls like that, but it's B, it's B.
Speaker 1:You'd think I'm gonna trust him by the time you I watched a whole my guy who does tier list Ethan on Ethan on everything. Subscribe to his channel.
Speaker 2:He does great tier lists.
Speaker 1:I love the guy. He's literally the whole reason we're doing this. But, um, I watched him just put Alduin down and fucking like see your D. What were you gonna say about? By the time you get, I can understand C, because he was not a big fan of Alduin. That's not the, not the big is that a Skyrim thing? Yeah, just by the time you fight him, it doesn't matter, I know. That's why he's like it's a no-div fight, he's like he's a shitty.
Speaker 2:Go ahead, put him in.
Speaker 1:C okay, skyrim, how do you spell?
Speaker 2:it.
Speaker 1:A-L-D-U-I-N. I never actually played the entire game. Skyrim was hard. I had trouble with Skyrim. It was a hard game to me whenever I was young. I was too fucking busy doing the side quests. That's what it's designed to be, that's what all of Bethesda does the worst thing about fucking here's the thing about Skyrim that bugged me.
Speaker 1:I had bad luck, and this is a funny story. I'd be trying to level up and grind to get some levels. I'd be going across some open field to get a chest that fucking saw, but da-da-da, da-da-da, da-da-da, the sky rim. Here comes a fucking dragon again. Leave me alone. I'm like level five. I can't do shit. I'm throwing sticks at it, which, by the third or fourth time you play it, you quest where the dragons start becoming active, but you do all the other side quests.
Speaker 2:I gotta fucking.
Speaker 1:See, that's where I got lucky, because I never went to the Rocky Mountain. You got a basic-ass broadsword trying to. I run up. I'm like, well, I gotta try. I got a basic-ass. The dragons activate before you go to the mountain. It's going to, it's going to the center city, activates them. I gotta say this story quick. I got a basic ass, fucking broadsword on the first dragon graveyard you go to activates the spawn. You're telling me I glitched out Skyrim 2? The moment you go fight the first dragon in the graveyard is when they start spawning, because when you go back to town to report your attack, that's when.
Speaker 1:I play a single fucking game without it glitching out. I'm trying to do shit. I can't attack. I can't play a single fucking game without it glitching out. I'm trying to do shit I can't do. I got a basic fucking broadsword and I'm just fucking.
Speaker 1:It's epic in a way, because that song's playing, but me at its ankle would have leveled. Just see him in game, especially if he was playing the VR version. Just Uh, what did that sound? Oh no, playing the VR version. Just Uh, let. What did that sound like? Oh no, dr Robotnik, sonic, and then Dean's gonna talk for the next hour. Dean, he hasn't done shit aside from give us characters that actually are a threat. Oh my god D. He hasn't done shit aside from give us characters that actually are a threat.
Speaker 2:Oh God.
Speaker 1:No, I talked about this with Dean before. Oh my God, he gave us Metal Sonic.
Speaker 2:They asked him about this at work.
Speaker 1:He's the reason for Chaos. Well, he's not the main reason for Chaos, it was already there. So D for Doctor yeah, okay, is she Doctor. Yeah, okay, is she. Now we go into Dean. He's a likable character, but he doesn't really as far as our criteria goes. No, ares God of War.
Speaker 2:Ooh.
Speaker 1:I feel like I'm missing another D on here. Okay, I gotta give credit because at least God of War represented him good In most animes. Ares is a dumb fuck. He's just not Jesus Christ, and Darmachi's man marched the wrong way Like what the fuck? Why is Ares the God of War? And he's an idiot? Um, complacent. He's a god, I'm a god. He's a decent amount. Very popular game. Are you specifically talking God of War? Yes, game God of War Not overall, because if it was overall, he'd be like in C. He's still got to give accomplishment to some of the Greek myths that appear in there.
Speaker 1:So, sadly, he's not even the reason for the Ghost of Sparta being who he is. Yeah, he's just, wasn't it Zeus? Yeah?
Speaker 2:Well, of course.
Speaker 1:Zeus was probably down there. Fucking shit, you know he was. He probably becomes a god because Zeus ends up being the father of Kratos.
Speaker 1:I knew it. You learned that out of War 3. So, since he's more impactful in the first game and then you learn he's not much of anything for the thing, so he's just After God of War 1, ares means nothing Because he's dead. Well, aside from that, yeah, I'm leaning C what I could easily. But no, at least God of War made him cool and threatening but I was just joking with that and most Wreck-It-A-Wreck-It-A-Rock.
Speaker 1:I can say this he's comic relief. Ron Machi's an idiot. It's like, bro, why is Ares so if you? Oh, okay, come on. But now think about Percy Jackson. He played by Edge.
Speaker 2:That's Aura.
Speaker 1:Automatic Adam Copeland. You know, the sad part about that is too, though he himself actually still plays a joke of a character. Oh God, fucking Skull Kid Zelda. I didn't dabble in. Zelda much Skull Kid. Zelda, I didn't dabble in Zelda much Skull Kid. I need the picture.
Speaker 2:Hold on I think I know who that is. Is he from?
Speaker 1:Majora's Mask. Yeah, that's Majora's Mask. I don't know about villain wise. I looked his design as a kid, I looked his design as a guy. This is where we would need JJ. None of us are Zelda guys. Majora's Mask is one of those games.
Speaker 2:I'm just as designed as a guy.
Speaker 1:I did this is where we would need JJ. None of us are Zelda guys. Majora's Mask is one of those games that I didn't actually beat.
Speaker 2:I had trouble with that one too.
Speaker 1:I lived vicariously through JJ on that one Quaker I played and beat. Do you want your easy one or your hard one?
Speaker 1:I'll go to easy one Pyramid Head. See, pyramid Head is probably oh God, he's weird because he is a mascot for an entire series, so he's got aura point Whatever he shows up. Whatever he shows up Misrepresented in the movies. Yeah, because he's connected to James Sunderland, who's not even. He's a personification of James Sunderland's guilt and grief for killing his wife. That is who Pyramid Head is. James manifested him, and so Pyramid Head should not be in nothing that does not involve James, which is the movie. Return of Silent Hill is on Silent Hill 2. Side note. So that should be hopefully better, but I doubt it. I'm off, sorry.
Speaker 2:I had to bring it up.
Speaker 1:No, it's okay, I'm trying to do this quick. I'm trying to just bring out the important stuff. Impact on pop culture I mean, everyone knows a pyramid. If you play games, you know what a pyramid is. Accomplishments I tormented James for a whole game, even though James is fucking. That's about it, though. Again, he's in one game, technically other games, but I only count really two, because anything else is not Pyramid X. It's not James that made him manifest.
Speaker 1:You throw him in a B or C range. I'm probably going. I'm B Low-key just because it's threat to the hero. He's always His character. Depth and complexity comes from the main character Likeability. As ugly and monstrous as he is, people love him. He gets plushies. They have plushies. You know you're likable when you get plushies, even if you're a fucking monster that carries around a big butcher. Axe Hellraiser got plushies. Oh God, oh God. Design. Or I didn't play Silent Hill, I got nothing. I'll go Like I said my heart wants to put him in A because I think he's iconic, but I think B is fair. B is fair If you're going by your criteria, which I am. It's hard because he's a different kind of. He's a very different kind of villain. Has anybody here played Bioshock?
Speaker 2:I have not.
Speaker 1:Which Bioshock? Andrew Ryan Bioshock. Those are the first two. Those are the first one. I think Andrew Ryan Bioshock is the one. Those are the first two. Those are the first one. I think I can't say anything. I may be being too harsh, but see, he's the one that controls the character. Would you kindly, would you kindly, would you kindly.
Speaker 1:If you want to put him on there. I don't know enough to. You got two. Really nothing out of us See after Bioshock 1 and 2, it means nothing because they end up doing a bunch of different shit. They end up going more backstory.
Speaker 2:I'll just do C, but I'll let Jay talk.
Speaker 1:Okay, keep going, jay. And I don't even get the entirety of the story because after Bioshock, Infinite I think it is they end up doing different timelines. Infinite is not yet. That's yeah, that's like, that's like fucking in the sky and shit totaled out. It's a really hard story to follow. One thing I will give Bioshock, though I love its setting Rapture as far as 1 and 2 go, I can put them in at C.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I think I'm going to stick with a C, alright, so how quickly can Dean go through Psycho Mantis? Uh, they can give you a half hour, no, I can't.
Speaker 1:Are you actually timing it? Are you going to press start when he starts? No, I just again. I'm going. He's giving you a challenge, I'm not. It's hard. I love Psycho Mantis. I'm trying to Accomplishments. I mean, child Soldier went in Fox Island tormented Snake for a good portion of the first game With Psycho. With Psycho, kinetic is Mind fucks and shit. He's got a plush and he's got a plush.
Speaker 1:Impact on pop culture and that is decently high. He's in Metal Gear. That's a very popular series and his boss fight's one of the greatest boss fights of all time. Because of the mind fuck of having to switch your fucking port Fucking hit him. That's the mind fuck Controller port and he reads your memory card. He'll wipe your memory card too, I don't know who decided to fucking program that yeah that was straight devil shit right there.
Speaker 1:Because if you that was so ahead of its time. You had to make sure when you were playing that game that you only had Metal Gear on there. You would lose everything. He would corrupt your files. That was not a lie. Aura and Charisma there's a good amount Charisma. He's. You don't talk that much, he talks the whole fight. But Aura, he's got a good design. His gas mask is a pretty iconic design. So there's good. Aura he's the first likable emo kid in GameCube Character depth and complexity I mean he's a child soldier.
Speaker 1:He has done a lot of bad things in his life and when he dies he opens a door for Snake with his powers and he talks about how he could do one good thing before he died. So I think that gives him some points for a little complexity. He has a little turn at the end. Likability again he's likable just because of his fucking just because of that boss fight. It's like Psycho Mantis, psycho Mantis, threat to the hero. I mean he's got Psychic Power so Low-key just because of that boss fight. I almost want to put Psycho Mantis in A. Just because of that boss fight. I think we'll put him in A Shao Kahn. Shao Kahn is not that high as much as I love Shao Kahn. He don't do shit, especially after Mortal Kombat 1, I'd put him in a, B. I think that's fair because he is iconic in his own. Yeah, he's kind of still the big bad of the universe, yeah but no Mortal.
Speaker 1:Kombat 1, he's not. Yeah, well, not Mortal Kombat 1.
Speaker 2:That's a different. But he's teased in one. He's.
Speaker 1:General Shao. He's kind of teased. He's, general Shao, teased in one to be a bad guy. In terms of the lore that came out with it, he was kind of. Yeah, he's about to turn bad.
Speaker 2:He's kind of about to turn bad. He's a prick in one Okay.
Speaker 1:I did beat the story for one. He's a prick. He was kind of always a prick Under Queen Sindel, melina and Katana. He works for them. He's their general. So I'll go B, but again, jj might give a shit for that one. I don't know In terms of, it's hard to say. With that one I was Xiao, the internet itself, xiao, s-h-a-o, okay.
Speaker 2:I did that right.
Speaker 1:K-A-H-A-N. I have then K-A-H-A-N, k-a-h-n. What is it I? Have a K-A-H-N Really Well whatever. I thought Kahn was spelled that way. Dumbass space in there. We probably should use JJ for this one for Handsome Jack Borderlands. Jay might be able to give a little bit. I didn't play Borderlands like that either. Well, he's the reason we have four games.
Speaker 2:No.
Speaker 1:And side games, literally Like we have choice games because of him. Impact on Pop Culture and universe thread, that's easily an A right there. Design and aura I don't know if JJ would agree with me, but he's easily in that. B to A range Character, depth and complexity I can't give you shit on that because I didn't play enough of the game. I only have tidbits from videos. From what I understand, the character isn't complex. The character isn't complex, but the depth is the depth. Is there General likability? It's odd how shitty of a person he is, but he is likable. Yeah, that's true Again, from A or B.
Speaker 1:Third ability to hear a story. A, that's fine. Borderlands is popular. I'll accept it. I mean, I don't know, I don't know Borderlands, that'd be a JJ one or. Ryan. Ryan isn't as foreign to Borderlands, oh I guess. Or Ryan I don't know the ending Ryan isn't as far into Borderlands oh, I guess he is.
Speaker 2:I don't know the ending of 3.
Speaker 1:I don't know where he lands. Dean, oh, no, dutch. Vanderland Dutch, oh, not Dutch, god damn it Fuck. Red Dead, yeah, ah, fuck, he's at least a B Dutch might be. A Dutch is very you need. Has any of you played that game like full and beat this game? I've, yes, you have. I didn't play, I didn't do one, I did Dutch Dutch becomes. So If you have to, matt, well, it might have hit me more, but once you, if you play Red Dead through the whole story, that whole story gets you, like when, if we do Heroes, arthur Morgan's very high If you talk about bronchitis.
Speaker 2:Herculosis is what he has, herculosis.
Speaker 1:But talk it up to him. You don't often. I guess back then you may have you don't often die from bronchitis, you may. Back then maybe All of them affected her. Oh God, I mean impact, I mean accomplishments. Eh, you see, stole a bunch of money, stole a bunch of fucking money. But a compliment not much, because he always has a plan. Dutch always has a plan.
Speaker 2:I mean the plan always goes well. I got a plan.
Speaker 1:Fucking Dutch Is always has a plan. I mean, this plan always goes well. I got a plan. Fucking Dutch B. Is he probably a B? I'm trying, I'm going to. I want to get Dutch to A. I really do. I fucking like Dutch. Dutch is fucking great Dutch is.
Speaker 1:If you look at Dutch's. There's a guy at my work who I love, named Dave. He's going to be Dutch's brother. He looks just like that's not far fetched. Far fetched design and aura. His aura is crazy, like when they're walking up to the fucking the Braithwaite's house. You get out of here. You come out here. You inbred trash. Yeah, good stuff.
Speaker 1:Likability. Dutch has so much charm and charisma. It's very high gap in complexity. He has a lot because I would like a game. I'd like Rockstar to do one more game like another prequel I don't know yet. Gta 6 is the next thing. Whenever that decides to come up, screw GTA. I want one where you play as Dutch, because I want to understand Dutch more.
Speaker 1:Dutch is not inherently bad, but he might be bad though, because you don't know Dutch's true feelings on a lot of shit, because the game it can be tanky, that Dutch cares about his gang and shit, but a lot of the shit he does. Dutch is like taking in easily manipulated people and just kind of manipulating them to do what he wants the whole. Fuck his whole life. Like arthur and hosea his first two people were just street kids treats everyone as harley quinn and not not like, not that bad. Like I said, you could say dutch cares too because.
Speaker 1:But as he, as the gang, starts to unravel, so does dutch. He becomes more and more unhinged and nuts with his shit. Um, threat to the hero or story mean he becomes a threat because he's the leader of the gang and Arthur is just a number two. So what the hell is Arthur going to do, especially if you go on the high honor route for the game, because you can play it two different ways. I think Dutch should go A. I want Dutch in A. No, I kept dying from bears. Oh my god, I would go hunt in a bear wood shop.
Speaker 2:Hey, I did that pretty quick.
Speaker 1:I still think he's a B. I want Dutch in A, b, b, b, what the heck? I don't think he fits with these guys. Fine, I'll put Dutch in B. There's some bias there, because I love Dutch. There is some bias. To be fair, he can be a high B If we broke down the B list, but I don't. That's fine. There is some bias. I mean, to be fair, he can be a high B if he broke down the B list. Yeah, if we broke it. But I don't think he's in the same realm as these guys because I don't think he killed enough people. Dutch, no, we have no reason to break down our Ds.
Speaker 2:Dutch's memes are the only ones we have to break down.
Speaker 1:We apparently want to break down Dutch does have.
Speaker 1:Like Dutch's memes are legendary. Like like one quick Dutch thing. It was funny. I only take a couple seconds, but fucking, um, there was like. I seen a video at a con. Someone asked his voice actor a question or like um, what was Dutch's plans? He goes into Dutch's voice. How many times do I got to tell you I have a plan. We just need money and and to cause shit. We just need money and to cause havoc, and I'm like he said that about 30 times in a fucking game. We just need money. We need money so they can go to fucking Haiti. How quickly can we get through Ridley for Metroid? See? Tired of me. What? Yeah, ridley, yeah, or see.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:Where's Bowser? Where's Bowser? You said ties with Bowser, so I thought you put him with Bowser. No, you were supposed to write him in C. I did. Oh wait, never mind, he's right there, I've seen him. Who am I? Right near Ridley? How was that Ridley? Scott R-I-D-D, no 1-D, l-e-y Does Scott have 2-Ds in it? No, that's from what? Metroid? That's the big bad from Metroid. King Dedede, he's sitting right next to me. Fuck you, I knew it would come. You know what we can do that.
Speaker 1:All right, let's put Dean's accomplishments up on the board and we can add an uproar. It's the impact on pop culture and universe. They're in and we can throw a Kingroar.
Speaker 2:It's the impact on pop culture and universe they're in and we can throw a pink K-Rule along with him.
Speaker 1:His design in horror is pretty up there Once the cop. His character, depth and complexity. He's got a lot of depth and complexity. Oh boy, you don't want to talk about that. I can give you the fucking death eyes General likability. He's always likable, that's true. A threat to the hero and the story. I don't have a pen. That depends who's the hero of the story. If Lowe's the hero, I'm a big threat. You've got to always kill him just for your fucking character growth Accomplishments. Just put Big Dick yeah you have one accomplishment in life.
Speaker 1:It's Big Dick.
Speaker 2:Yeah right, I'll take that.
Speaker 1:That's a win I'm talking shit, but that's right. No, no, let's add this Three kids who aren't his. He went to get the Jordans. Never came back. They're probably Nazis. Where does the fucking?
Speaker 2:penguin go. King Dedede Jordans never came back. They're probably both Cs.
Speaker 1:Where does the fucking penguin go King Dedede. I actually like him more than Bowser. It's kind of weird. You want to put King Dedede in B? No, they're probably both Cs. Okay, I'm just going to literally put King D.
Speaker 2:They're around the same thing.
Speaker 1:The weird part is Bowser's done more than King Gator. You can write King K Rool there too. King K Rool, he's Donkey Kong, but he's basically the same thing. Fat Gator With a rocket pack on his back. King, what King? K Rool, how the hell King.
Speaker 2:K Rool.
Speaker 1:K Rool. Wow, I guess we'll Divide out the Street Fighter guys Krule Krule. Wow, I guess we'll divide out the Street Fighter guys Akuma and M Bison, I think. Akuma's higher because all Akuma wants is to smoke Akuma's A and Bison's B. All Akuma wants is to smoke.
Speaker 2:That's all Akuma wants.
Speaker 1:That's stupid, how I did that. Yeah, it is. And Bison and B. That's fine. He's cool, he's very cool, he's a good villain. But no, he's mad at himself because he put Bison and B and Akuma in A.
Speaker 2:I alphabetized it Damn.
Speaker 1:But Akuma is he just wants to smoke. And Roge is Roge just wants to smoke and Ro just wants Ryu to be so fucking strong, like, come on, get stronger so you can fight me. Come on, dr Wily. Oh fuck, what's that?
Speaker 2:I know that name.
Speaker 1:Mega man Okay, jay, you gotta take this one. I can't put him on the same level as.
Speaker 1:Balter and him, but he's better than it's like a low C, low C as, but he's better than it's like a low C ID. I think he's better than, or does more than, eggman. He does do more than Eggman. So, dr Wiley, onc. For fuck's sakes. He created Eggman's brother and Wiley is C. For fuck's sakes. He created Megaman's brother and Wiley is W-I-L-E, w-i-l-e, w-i-l-e. Okay, dean, you can take off with your two oh boy, albert Wesker and Nemesis Nemesis. Yeah, yeah, well I. Nemesis son. Yeah, yeah, well, I. Nemesis is very hard, because the man walks around and just says Stars, stars, oh, fucking day, he's a scary motherfucker, though he shits your pants when you see him.
Speaker 1:Was Nemesis in the movie, though they made him sympathetic. That's almost unforgivable and that's my favorite Resident Evil movie probably, but I have issues with that. It is kind of sad that it was a good movie. Like you made Nemesis the walking bioweapon killing machine A fucking sad backstory. Oh boy, my God, accomplishments doing Nemesis, where he pretty much killed all the stars except for Jill. That's because Jill's that bitch. Imagine we get the heroes and Jill's on them. Impact on pop culture it's decently high. Nemesis is a pop, he's a pop. He got statues. You get a plush or a pop, he got plushies, he does have plushies. The sign and aura that's pretty cool when you have the sign is cool when you have aura and all you say is stars, that's because he's just oh shit, it's Nemesis, you've got aura and you have one word Isn't?
Speaker 1:he another one of those villains where, when he popped up in the game.
Speaker 2:You couldn't really fight him.
Speaker 1:He had to run Because he has that fucking theme song that makes you run. Yeah, he just jumps. There's one where he jumps, which is why they like to. Uh, they did that meme thing on uh, the mods where they turned him into fucking Promise the Train. Yep. Depth and complexity. Nah, he has no depth or complexity, but a general likability. Yeah, that's high because people like Nemesis I think he's the best bioweapon in the Resident Evil series. I kind of want Nemesis in A. I'm not going to lie, I think Wesker is almost A. He's got the same aura and shit as Nemesis, but Wesker's got more depth and complexity. Wesker goes hand-to-hand with fucking a lot of Capcom characters. That's hard, yeah you think they're both A's.
Speaker 1:I would, just because of how much Resident Evil is so popular and they're both loved characters. They're classic characters. Likeability Wesker's a prick and he's likable. They're classic characters. Likeability Wesker is a prick and he's likable. He's a fucking prick. He's got a booshy-ass boss where he can't hit him and he has something. In the Marvel vs Capcom.
Speaker 2:Bam Bam.
Speaker 1:He just slashed Threat to the hero. Wesker is the main villain up until 5, where you finally kill him and Chris punches the boulder. What, yeah, he punches the boulder, punches the boulder. That's a Chris Redfield feat. That's a meme. You got to press A repeatedly to punch the boulder out of the way. It's a feat. It happened, it happened. I think they're both A. They could be maybe. Yeah, I think so. I think they're both A. They could be maybe. Yeah, I think so, just because of their. Alright, what do we got next? Voss, like Far Cry, far Cry, okay, voss, voss. I have not played Far Cry 3 in forever, but 3 is one of the most iconic Far Cry there is.
Speaker 1:They have never been able to match that. Nope, they tried with 5. Boss has that charisma and aura, whatever he's preaching his shit to you. Or with a 4. What, oh, it's 3. He's in 3. No, no, no, I'm talking about where they tried to meet Boss's energy With Jean Carlo the pastor. That's 5, yeah.
Speaker 2:What was his name? What?
Speaker 1:was the main villain. They couldn't make that game now. They could not make Far Cry 5 now.
Speaker 2:Holy shit, holy shit.
Speaker 1:Holy shit. You read the story of what Far Cry 5. Oh, make the Holy fuck, you can't make that shit now. What was his Far Cry? Keep you happy about Far Cry? Make that shit now, hulk. What was his Far Cry? Keep you happy about Far Cry? For a little bit, jake, but His main thing was just fucking with your survivability, joseph. Seed Wasn't it, joseph Seed. Yeah, that was a dick of a fucking.
Speaker 2:There's a secret ending where you can just leave If you don't do anything in the opening sequence yeah, it's a secret ending where you can just leave if you don't do anything in the opening sequence?
Speaker 1:yeah, it's a secret ending. I'm surprised you don't have fucking much to say about accomplishments. I think boss is also an A he's iconic he's got impact on culture. He gets A there. Yeah, design and aura is fucking there, character depth and complexity also there.
Speaker 2:You kind of get where he's coming from.
Speaker 1:Yes, you kind of get where he's coming from Kazuya Mishima, second Kazuya Kazuya. I gotta look up a picture because I gotta make sure. Jin's father After eight? What?
Speaker 2:Kazuya.
Speaker 1:Accomplishments. He's the main villain of fucking.
Speaker 2:They had to put Hayachi in there.
Speaker 1:No, kazuya's higher Because Hayachi's had quite a few redemption arcs. Man Hayachi and has gotten his ass kicked by Kazuya, yeah, and so much so that he got a DLC redemption arc where he just becomes evil again. I like Hayachi. He's just that old man. That's a badass. He trained a fucking bear In a Hayachi style. I'm biased, though, because we all know who, in my opinion, was the most badass in fucking Tekken Luchador Luchador. I think he's pretty high. I think so because Tekken is.
Speaker 1:Tekken has a claim for the best fighting game ever. If it's Mortal Kombat, tekken or Street Fighter and them fans, you put them in a room. The best fighting game ever. If it's Mortal Kombat, tekken or Street Fighter and them fans, you put them in a room, they'll kill each other. Which one of you wants to talk? Let go, jay. Jay's been having some good rants today. Elusive man, jay, what it's effective. Let's say that. Let's say rants.
Speaker 1:I hated him. I hated him. That was your number one Mass Effect one. I fucking hated him. There was no liking his ass, even when I tried to help him. I swear to god, he's the reason I blew up. I was putting where did we put? Did we put Kazooie in A. Okay, I was writing him in B for no reason, I swear to god. There was like a small backstory or like you know how in games they leave you like little written journals or something. I swear to god. In Mass Effect there was a little written journal that said he is the actual reason that your ship is blown up in the beginning of Mass Effect 2. The actual reason that your ship is blown up in the beginning of Mass Effect 2. The whole reason for you having to be brought back by Cerberus.
Speaker 1:We hated the guy from day one. Accomplishments he damn near is able to make the Reapers his bitch. The human Reaper he almost tried to control. There is a literal story choice where you let him do so and it's a shit. I don't think anyone's ever actually done it or followed through. That's how much everyone hates him. He's got impact on pop culture and the universe they're in. When the universe they're in he's got. Two would be nothing without him. Three would almost be nothing without him. Pop culture I can't say he's shit. So that's C range, because more people remember Miranda out of that game than they do.
Speaker 1:Elusive man, design and aura the man just fucking. He's this Bond villain kind of. He sits in a chair and stares at the space and smokes with these glowing red eyes or yellow, I can't really remember. I think they were red. So that's easily a B. Design-wise Character, depth and complexity, I can put that at a B.
Speaker 1:His reasoning behind everything is, you know, human survival and evolving Shit like that General likability. I am not the guy for that. I did not like him from the get go. Threat to the hero and story complete jackass. That's straight villain, no matter what you try to do with him. So that actually ranks higher. That's a, but you seem to be leaning more towards B. Yes, there you go, dean. Elusive man. You know how to spell elusive. Fuck, no, i-l-l-u-s, i-l-l-u-s, i-v-e. I probably could, I just don't want to butcher spelling. Yeah, well, so I'm always going to ask Well, dean, take it away.
Speaker 1:Revolver Ocelot, slug, Slug Out of a bit. Slug God, a giga-tad villain. Hate that. The only other Metal Gear on here. Bro ain't a villain, bro ain't a villain. Anyway, it was revealed in 4 that the man sacrificed his whole life to try and end the government control of the Patriots. He sacrificed everything and to try to save his friend Big Boss. You're talking about a fucking cat that I don't even know should be on here. He was just listed on here. He'll play a big role in 5-2. Phantom Pain yes, he trained Venom Snake. He was his advisor. Fun fact the first person in the big One of the other people to say One of the other people to say when Big Boss defeated him in their first fight, he said you're pretty good, yes. Then, first fight, he said you're pretty good, yes. Then Ocelot said started saying you're pretty good. Jay's like oh god. Dean had to say you're pretty good, you have it on a book.
Speaker 2:Where are you?
Speaker 1:putting him Low key. He is at least A. My heart literally wants to put him an S, because if I explain the whole Metal Gear fucking saga, that would take hours. You might understand as convoluted as Metal Gear is. So it's like oh fuck, I can agree with everything he says. He might get cut at the end, but I think Ocelot should go to S with how much he means to that story.
Speaker 1:There's been only two Metal Gear games I cannot beat because of glitches. I just don't think he's going to be bigger than the big two that we have remaining. Ocelot I'm fine if he goes to A, only fine if he goes to A. There's three names left. Two of them are probably the biggest names on here, okay, and I think those are going to be your biggest, just for games. Yeah, jesus. The weakest name remaining is Vladimir Makarov. Call of Duty Makarov. Oh, he's a menace. Makarov was a menace, but he's probably in the B. Yeah, makarov was a menace, but he's a big pain in your ass for three of the B, for two of the first three games, and he was kind of behind the scenes and won. I hope you can spell Vladimir. He should be able to. I'll try. Oh, I forgot one. All your favorite Russians have Vladimir in their name. I know where Dean wants to put that one. That's Makarov. M-a-k-a-r-o-v. M-a-k-a-r-o-v. I forgot one. Fuck, what'd you forget?
Speaker 2:Revan.
Speaker 1:Oh shit, darth Darth, darth Knights of the Old Republic. How did you forget a Star Wars character? I'm crossing them off as I go I'm not going in the order that I have them anymore did you forget a Star Wars character.
Speaker 2:I'm crossing them off as I go. I'm not going in the order that I have them anymore.
Speaker 1:It still floors me that you, the biggest Star Wars fan among us, forgot a Star Wars character. Eh, for a game I didn't play. You didn't replay those. No, where'd that remake at? That might be dead. Maybe that remake might be fucking dead. Fuck you, disney.
Speaker 1:I blame you why'd you say that on there? I blame Disney. I'm blaming Disney for everything. It's all Disney's fault. On my deathbed I'm going to say it's Disney's fault. On your tombstone it's literally going to say it's Disney's fault. On your tombstone it's literally going to say blame Disney, blame Disney. They killed me. They made a terrible Spider-Man movie and I had a heart attack. I mean God, what does that actually fit him? It was like Disney got the whole rights to Spider-Man and he turned gay. That'd be some shit. I'd be writing letters. This is not. He hooked up with Harry Osborn and got AIDS. This is not a slander.
Speaker 1:Go into Revan, just stop Revan. He's like. He's like. I'll help you out, I'll just label things off and you can just go. He beat some Sith. He beat a couple Sith lores. He beat a lot of Jedi. Names would escape me if I could find them, but whatever, I'm trying to speed run this Impact on Pop Culture. He's a very popular Star Wars character who will probably never get the love he deserves. Same thing with design, design and that's Character, depth and complexity.
Speaker 1:Very high because of fucking, are you? So that's? Very high because of he's the only he walks the path of light and dark, for God's sakes. So far we have three S's Like ability, People love Revan. Threat to the hero or story hey, he's got so many like I think Revan's S. He's got so many top tier fucking things I think Revan is S. It's been a while what.
Speaker 2:Matt's happy.
Speaker 1:S has become actually pretty sparing, low key. Well, the problem is that I think one of these is guaranteed to be an S and the other one we're going to be debating about between A and S. Well, I know one is there, because one ain't been said yet and it's a crime if he's not said. Well, I'll say him next. Then Sephiroth he's the one that I don't. How does Sephiroth not get an S? I'm not a big Final Fantasy guy and I can't much argue against it. Okay, threat ability to hear your own story. Matt is going to try to keep him out of S. Matt is going to be the one to try to keep him out of S general likability.
Speaker 1:I'm going to let him cook S design and aura S character. Depth and complexity the depth isn't there, the complexity is.
Speaker 2:Yes.
Speaker 1:Because if you try to understand his origin and stuff like that, the whole mother and Jenova, what Hold on. But then you understand that everybody that received Jenova cells is considered her child. Yes, that is the thing that goes on. And a compliment she's literally the strongest soldier known to God and is basically trying to end the world. He basically said I fucking hate people and started everything. That's kind of relatable I hate people, I'm going to end the world. See, this is why me and him have said if you actually wanted to, you should play the Final Seven remake.
Speaker 2:It's on my list. I want to give that a shot.
Speaker 1:The remakes, all three that go with it. Yeah, he'll enjoy it more than I will because it's not turn-based. I thought they added a setting where you could make it. Nope, it's been a while since I played. I beat him and then I just let him sit for a while. This one, I think, is a guaranteed S, and it's Ganon Ganon. Oh shit, again we need the hobbit for this. I don't think there's much to debate.
Speaker 2:Ganon is Ganon.
Speaker 1:Ganon, how do we roll through it? The same way we did with Sephiroth. Take the iconic Nintendo kind of villains we got here like and fucking um some other Nintendo ones. We've talked about Eggman and shit. My joke one was Master Hand, by the way. That was my honorable mention. That was my honorable mention. Fucking what his attacks, my honorable mention, that was my honorable mention. Fucking what His attacks. Just walk on you, flick you With his middle finger at that, not even his like, but um, why they had to fucking do it this way, not this way.
Speaker 1:Out of all them old classic Nintendo games like from fucking Donkey Kong and fucking Mario and Zelda, Ganon's the most aura badass. Out of all of them Leaps and bounds. Ganon from the original Legend of Zelda was still kind of a bitch. I am aura farming, Aura farming. I think Ganon is an S. I think Ganon's S what's?
Speaker 1:our time at. I think we're done. No, five, four, how much time do we have? Just go, let's finish it out. Fuck it. We're not going to finish it out. There's no way. We're not going limp Gene, God damn it, never. Alright, we'll see how the comic book is going to depict on how quickly that's a special pill. We'll see how quickly we go through. Wait, this is villains, right, okay, it is villains. I'm gonna say you're gonna say Spider-Man's ass, we're doing film villains first. Okay, because how quickly we get through this still will depict how quickly we can get through comic books. Patrick Bateman, american Psycho Jay's ready just to fucking do this big, massive episode. Just pay extra money for fuck. I know what it's my thinking. Fuck off.
Speaker 1:I know what you're thinking you need money, I got you. But you're like no, no, I got it. But um, let's see who did we say? Patrick Bateman, patrick Bateman, jesus Christ, batman himself. Accomplishments he killed a homeless man and stomped on his dog to death. The dog thing, yeah, it was in a movie. I mean, it was in the movie. He killed a dog and a homeless man. I'm like why are you?
Speaker 2:doing that? What the fuck?
Speaker 1:It's a fucked up movie. The book's worse. So his accomplishments are up there. He's a serial killer. I don't know why Rating accomplishments of a serial killer, yeah, rating accomplishments of a I've killed a lot of people. We can't effectively rate the accomplishments I've killed a lot of people. Impact on pop culture is. It's not ridiculous, but it's a cult classic. American Psycho is a cult classic.
Speaker 2:Aura.
Speaker 1:Yeah, decent, he's just a businessman. He's the whole reason people love clear, fucking plastic and murderous shit. Now Like any cereal filler. Yeah, that's true. He's the whole reason people love clear, fucking plastic and murderous shit. Now like any serial filler. Yeah, that's true. Like look at fucking Dexter. Yeah, character, depth and complexity. He's a psycho, american psycho. That whole scene where he's explaining the music to the person he's killing, that's Jared Leto. Yeah, that's.
Speaker 2:Jared.
Speaker 1:Leto yeah, that's Jared Leto Explaining music to Jared Leto yeah, yeah, ain't that. Oh, wow, that's funny now. That's real funny now. I didn't even know about it at the time 30 seconds to Mars.
Speaker 1:You had to explain to me who he was. Likeability, I don't know. I don't know. I like him. He's not likable. He kills a thog. That kills your likability points. So you throw him in a C, I might, because I figured he was going to end up on Dean's page some way or another. Shape or charm. Yeah, I think I'll go C. I'll go C, we'll go C. Hobbit's number one Chucky. A lot of the horror guys are on here, by the way. A lot of the horror guys are on here, by the way.
Speaker 2:Oh God.
Speaker 1:If he was the leprechaun I'd put him at a, d, but he's Chucky. But he's Chucky Kind of forces him into B Because he's better. He got his own fucking show which lasted four seasons. Five Tried to reboot his franchise. Yeah, didn't mind A lot of people. You know the sad thing about that show. That show was a little woke for people so some people didn't like it. No, and it's not even that big of a deal. The main character's gay, so of course people are like what the fuck? Oh, that's all it is.
Speaker 2:I thought you were talking about.
Speaker 1:Chucky's son. I mean, it's kind of the hate that Buzz Lightyear's movie got. That's pretty much the only reason. That's what the bullshit is. Oh, because his commander was gay. Oh well, his best friend, sorry, he likes dudes Shit. They adopted children. Oh, okay, that's not a bad thing. The movie still wasn't great. The movie still wasn't good for that one thing.
Speaker 1:It turned fucking Buzz Lightyear into the villain. It turned him into Zurg, alright. So where are we putting Chucky? I think he's gotta go B simply because he's got some of the best one-liners in fucking movies. It's funny, chucky's funny. He's on pop culture, yep, probably the second best one-liners in horror. I got a feeling we'll talk about one, even Thal who knocked up a human woman. I figure we'll talk about Mr Kruger at some point. Design and aura. Chucky don't got on the horse. I'd punt him. She's getting punted, he has been punted. He's getting punted, he has been. Chucky is not intimidated. He's got to do stealth kills. He don't kill nobody upright, he runs at you man, he's very good at it.
Speaker 1:Me. Yeah, I'll put Chucky in B. Hans Gruber, oh, chucky Envy. Hans Gruber. Oh shit, I'm going to let Matt take this. Let him cook. What am I going to do with Hans Gruber? It's Hans, it's your favorite movie. I don't think you're going to let him fall out of a building. He's perfectly capable of doing that himself. Accomplishments he defailed the Rob the Plague. He failed the Rob the Plague. He failed In sitcom pop culture. Barry, that's an.
Speaker 1:A. So we have one A, we have an F and an A Design and org. He did kill people, so we'll put him as at least a D or C for accomplishments. He's killed people.
Speaker 2:I killed people.
Speaker 1:It was half his goal. So P A Design. I mean it's he, they design. I mean it's run of the mill, bad guy. Run of the mill, basically German ace bad guy. How far we got dad Character depth and complexity, maybe CB.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:What's his reasoning behind what he's doing? He's a thief, I'm a thief. General likability. He's one of people's favorite human bad guys. Probably D yeah. So we have A D, d Threatability to the hero D. It's CB, b yeah. Yippee-ki-yay man, we all love him, but the only thing that gives him that A is impact on pop culture. I don't know.
Speaker 2:So it's.
Speaker 1:C Threat to the hero. I mean, he felt the fucking building himself. What did we say? C or B, b, b, d, d. He said D. Okay, look how many Ds we got, accomplishments D, I guess.
Speaker 2:And we let Matt talk.
Speaker 1:He's not really disputing. That was one of Matt's. Now we're going. Now here's an oldie, norman Bates Psycho. Oh boy, that is very hard because he might not seem so good if dealing with a lot of this shit with a lot of the criteria. But God, norman Bates is one of the greatest, one of the greatest villains in cinema and if you pay attention to the sequels it gives him a face turn Like what the fuck? People don't realize it had sequels. Oh, impact on pop culture is it's psycho? It's Alfred Hitchcock, for god's sakes. We should want to check.
Speaker 1:Uh, design and aura, is that sequels? Yes, psycho sequels, cycle two, cycle three. It kind of made I ain't seen him in a while, but it kind of made norman more understandable and you turn him into a good guy. Um, aura design, I mean it's pretty run-of-the-mill but it's not bad. Yep, the complexity is very high, just because he's fucking traumatized by an overbearing mother that I think everyone can relate to at some point. Yep, polka dot man, certainly can. You like that, mama. You like that, you got it. Rickability, mama. You like that Rickability? He's likable because he seems like just a nice squeamish guy at first, until he's like fucking and you don't even know it's him. You think it's his mother or some shit. You don't even think it's him until it's revealed he's cosplaying as his mother because he's so fucking traumatized he is.
Speaker 1:Let's see Breath to the Hero of Stamina. He kills the main character in the first like 20 minutes of the first Psycho. So he won technically, but then he just made another character came in. How do we do this? I mean, he's not perfect on all of those. I put Hans Gruber at a, d, so what? He's not, but I think there's. I don't know, but it's Norman Bates, one of the most iconic characters in horror. I don't think he's S anymore. I'd be leaning towards A. That's fine, I'll accept A. See, at least Matt understood my dilemma. You can't put Norman Bates lower than A. You can't put him lower than A. It's Norman Bates. So I never saw this one. Annie Wilkes, misery. Holy shit, we got Stephen King, little Stephen King, oh boy, one I probably should have in the miscellaneous. But I'm gonna lean probably a lower A to a high b because a lot of is.
Speaker 1:She is great in the books. She's the same and great in the books, but kathy bates played her and kathy bates bring so much ridiculous credibility to that character. It's not even funny. So a lot of it. I got a credit to kathy, credit to Kathy. I'm getting the name right, kathy Bates. Right, I think it's Kathy Bates. I wanna make sure that's right. Yes, it's Kathy Bates. Even looked to confirm but accomplished held fucking Mr Sheldon captive for fucking like months and months. Uh, impact on pop culture and universe they're in. Impact is pretty high because she's one of the most recognizable characters Stephen King's ever written. Because she's one of the most recognizable characters Stephen King's ever written. She's right up there with fucking Pennywise, who might even show up on that fucking list. When I think about it, design and aura Design she's just a little. She's a middle-aged lady, middle-aged woman, really surprised.
Speaker 1:B or C Next list. Okay, that makes sense. Design aura I mean really surprised. B or C next list next.
Speaker 2:Oh, Missy, okay okay, that makes sense design, aura.
Speaker 1:I mean again, she's a just a middle-aged woman, but aura, she's got aura because when she gets mad boy it turns up a little bit. Because she's got she's depth and complexity. She's, she has a lot. Because she's obsessed with his book. She's obsessed with Paul Sheldon's book, misery, and she is pissed that he killed off Misery, the main character, and she's keeping him captive because she wants him to rewrite this book. That's literally what it is. It's so. It's likability. She's not really likable, but she's. Kathy Bates played her so well.
Speaker 1:Threat to the hero, restore. I mean, she has one of the most, most scenes in fucking movies. She puts a fucking wood block in between Paul Sheldon's fucking feet and takes a sledgehammer and cracks his feet and just dangles his, breaks his fucking ankles. It's one of the most scenes in fucking shit. It's just so well done. Jay might know what I'm talking about. It's like fuck Broke, his shit. Annie Wilkes probably A For movies A Movies, his shit, I think. Annie Wilkes probably A For movies, a Movies, a. Okay, then you get to lead into Michael Myers. Oh, my god, fucking god, I don't like Michael Myers that much, so I'm trying to be Michael Myers. Bores the shit out of me, we'll walk around slow and just kill people in a lot of basic ways. Yeah, because you can't kill Physically, kill him. He's the shade, he's the shape. That's what he originally was called the shape. Until he just like admired oh god, he's probably B Gotta give him a little bit of credit.
Speaker 1:I think he's B. He's intimidating shit. He's just fucking nuts. He wants to kill his whole family. We don't have to talk about that one much likeability threat. He's a threat to Laurie Strode Godzilla you want you want me to do this one accomplishments he has more accomplishments. Old Godzilla was stomping around. You want me to do this one Accomplishments he has more accomplishments as a fucking hero Old Godzilla was stomping around Tokyo City like a big playground. Stop, stop, stop.
Speaker 2:Great fucking parody something I love.
Speaker 1:You made a beat Accomplishments as a villain. I mean you're basically taking the Toho's yeah, Toho's, and Zero, Because after that he's kind of just like a middle ground guy. Impact on pop culture. That's a fucking S right there.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:Design and. Aura, Dean, the next three hurt. I'm giving you that. Yeah, All three of them. This one and the next two hurt. What do you mean hurt, as in pretty obvious. I need your help on this one. Dean, You're the aura guy. Which one design or Well, design has always been great. I even enjoyed the Zilla design. Some designs are a little wonky, but that's like the 50s. Gotta give him a break. Sometimes he can appear too chonky. Nothing wrong with thickums.
Speaker 2:Nothing wrong with thick boy.
Speaker 1:Like are you talking about Monster vs what? The one I call thick boy? Damn, what the fuck's up with thick boy. He's skinny again and then big again. He can't choose. Aura is pretty max, because Ro uses the Colosseum as a map as a bit. That's pretty max. That's pretty up there. So we have C, s, s, a, s C.
Speaker 2:Design and Aura Did we literally do S.
Speaker 1:I didn't say A S, s. Yep, there's really nothing there. Yep, the complexity, there's not much there, it's more. No, sadly, as far as Godzilla goes, we don't add shit to his background. He changes background a little bit every time, a little bit depending on. Even in MonsterVerse. We can't even give him any more of that, Like I'm hoping they do, if they fucking do.
Speaker 1:Destroyer yes uh, general, like that's probably s I'd say that's pretty high. That's a or s. Everyone loves godzilla. People may not be as into kaijus, but most people, I'd say, like godzilla. Threat to the hero and story. So threat to tokyo? Uh, that depends on that motherfucker. Motherfucker from Jurassic Park 2. I think that's BA. Who the fuck do you think is the hero? Threat to the story.
Speaker 2:Threat to the story.
Speaker 1:Yeah, a BA. I mean it's trying to destroy Japan. Mother, it's my bias giving him an A. I think A is perfectly fine.
Speaker 2:I think A is fine.
Speaker 1:I was wondering if we were going to push him to S. I would love to, but his character death and his no, because the next one's S Because the complex man's character death, and A man in Jurassic Park 2 left Tokyo to get away from him. I left Tokyo to get away from him. I left Tokyo to get away from this shit. Any reason, we're not putting Darth Vader at S. I think he's F. No, we don't have. You have my permission to hit him in the balls.
Speaker 2:Well, I can't do it.
Speaker 1:No, but Steve has too much fun with that. He'd be like you touched my dick, I win, that's like trying to see it to lose. No, I just have to. That's S. I don't even know if you gotta talk about me or no. Next is Terminator. I will be back. And this is Arnold Terminator. I will be. Eh, this is.
Speaker 2:Arnold Terminator. I will be back.
Speaker 1:That's where I was leaning Accomplishments. Because he eventually, is treated as a hero. It is very fair. He's iconic, definite impact on pop culture and the universe he's in. Oh yeah, design and aura. I mean, for fuck's sakes, people always wear sunglasses and leather jackets because of him. Now it's Schwarzenegger. Arnold Schwarzenegger, that thing's plexiglass. You can find some.
Speaker 2:He's a.
Speaker 1:Terminator from Skynet and he has a face turn.
Speaker 2:General likability yeah you don't like him in the first one because he's got every single one of those is an A.
Speaker 1:Sure, yeah, he's got an A All right now, probably the most divisive aim, because we're going through several different iterations of this that are all varying difficulty, divisive. Oh boy, sheriff of Nottingham, the Sheriff of Nottingham, sorry. The first one that pops into my head is the Robin Hood in his Mary V. Like I said, we're degrading him on several variations when he's got the bull that cuts technically for the most recent one with what's his name? Fuck Eggsy. And the most recent.
Speaker 1:Edgerton. Yeah, warren Edgerton, you're getting two variations of the Sheriff of Nottingham, you do, don't you? Yeah, I'm fucking right. Oh, save it, dean. No, it's going to come back to haunt you. No, it's Disney, bro. Yeah, disney counts, disney counts. It is going to come back on your grave. I mean, even that one was. I barely remember that one. I love that one. That was the problem. It was fucks that one. Okay, that's probably a Disney movie that made a lot of kids into furries, yep, yep, I can attest Because I didn't like her like that, but I can attest, I can see why the princess, yep.
Speaker 2:I can see why.
Speaker 1:That definitely made me like foxes. I'm like hey, what the fuck y'all doing here? You trying to make me into like animals?
Speaker 1:No it was Renamon that did it to me for some fucking reason. Renamon, renamon. I think I can understand why. But the voice and then the way she moved, I don't know what the fuck was about it. I should have said I mean, it's not any more furry than him. I don't even want to know what you're talking about. My weird, my weirdest furry thing is fucking Bunny's. No, sonic, oh, amy, forgot about that one. Tony's gonna go by. Weirdest furries, even though this is almost not even furry. It's kind of kind of machine. But I have a really weird thing for Five Nights at Freddy's, chica and Foxy. I have a very weird thing there. It's very weird.
Speaker 1:I think me and you have been spending a little too much time on the internet. I could have told you that I'm out, knowing that you especially. That's why you're staring at your ceiling when you're awake, isn't it? Don't open the phone. Don't open the phone. I think we could. It's just so. It's C because it's straightforward. Between any iteration, it can be bad or good, maybe B. That's what I was going to say. It's like Sheriff of Nottingham.
Speaker 2:Do you need?
Speaker 1:help with any of those words. Probably the Sheriff of Nottingham isn't even a real villain in any of the stories.
Speaker 2:It's the king's brother.
Speaker 1:Yeah, uh, commodus, gladiator Joaquin Joaquin Phoenix Commodus. Hey, dean, that's he kind of lost shit. Did he lose it at the end? I think you lose aura points if you're fucking killed in the arena and you're. God, I didn't mean to bring that up, but you're just fucking. He's a groomer, when in Rome I shouldn't have used it like that?
Speaker 2:No, he shouldn't have.
Speaker 1:Oh my god, a or B, he's not ass Guaranteed. No, because Rose just fucking left out there. His body's just left to rot in the arena. Oh yeah, and then we get Gladiator too. Oh my god, as much as I like the main character in that, but what's such a down grade? We'll go B, even though B is becoming a fucking.
Speaker 2:I'm not surprised.
Speaker 1:Should we be putting more people that are in the Ds and the Fs and then the fucking Cs? We don't have an F. Maybe we'll get to one. Davy Jones, pirates of the Caribbean. Davy Jones luck. I couldn't even joke about fucking F for his character. They even they had the CGI right at that point.
Speaker 1:Cgi looked better then than it does now. Yes, his whole character falling in love with, uh, uh, fuck, what's her name? A, not seriously, no. B and help me out, wikiman, what pirates, I don't care. B and oh, david Jones, fucking lover. The, the Witch of the Sea. A, c, b Accomplishments.
Speaker 2:A.
Speaker 1:Pop culture. A, I think pop culture's lower because he's not often referenced for Pirates of the Caribbean compared to other characters. No, the fucking, what's his name? Barbossa, barbossa.
Speaker 2:Barbossa is.
Speaker 1:Monkey Barbossa.
Speaker 2:Barbossa is.
Speaker 1:Thank you. Design AS. His design's pretty iconic. Do you fear death? S. Do you fear death, character, death and complexity? As yeah, because he's. He's probably the most complex character in the franchise, unless we're talking about Spongebob. Oh my god, I knew it. General likability A. I like David. He's great. I think he's going an A. Yeah, I think he's going an A. I can't because I'm not gonna dispute it. There's bias for me there because he's a big part of pirate legend. His design in Ori and the Jones look is the only thing I would throw into S. Thanks to them actually knowing how to do CG. Back then, freddy, freddy Krueger, fred D Krueger, I thought you were going Fazbear Just to mess with him.
Speaker 1:I don't think any of them made it. No, because the real villain of that fucking game is the golden fucking rabbit. It's gotta be said. Even though does Freddy lose points for being a pretty much confirmed pedophile?
Speaker 2:Even though it's been retconned, and whatever. The pedophile.
Speaker 1:It's been talked about. I think that was true in one it's heavily the first one. It's heavily implied in the original movies, but then Nightmare on Elm Street he's a pedophile. Oh that one, the remake he's just a pedophile. Why was my brain still on 519 Freddy's? Because Freddy, the name Freddy, was said there used to be on there Freddie Fazbear.
Speaker 2:He's not a villain, though.
Speaker 1:That's the problem. How many names do you have in B? A shit ton Too many. 23?, 26 and 8. So, okay, I mean we're getting you know. All in all, I've only written down seven fucking games we're getting. We're a little divided, but there aren't many Ds. There weren't going to ever be no.
Speaker 2:I'm not surprised there's no half Guys.
Speaker 1:I'm glad we don't have that many Ds here. Just three and a half, wow, at least he only gave him a half. He could have said two or three and a half.
Speaker 2:I was modest, Careful.
Speaker 1:It's going to end up in your mouth one day oh no, he probably already has. He's got ribs still. The fact that you know that shit gives you I was in elementary school. Fact that you know that shit gives you I was in elementary school, of course I know that shit. The story of Marilyn Manson fucking taking out his ribs so he can fucking suck his own.
Speaker 2:There wasn't.
Speaker 1:I don't think that's what he was referencing.
Speaker 2:I know, but I'm just that was what I was referencing. Oh boy.
Speaker 1:That was an elementary school comment and joke. Okay, when are we putting Freddie? God Freddie is, Are you putting him under Chucky Freddie's over Chucky Freddie's legendary Well?
Speaker 2:we have Chucky, and what right Chucky he was so iconic that we got a Versus movie. Yeah.
Speaker 1:And Grey Fog is also in this list. Obviously Jason's on there. Yeah, I think Freddy is. Wherever Freddy lands, Jason lands. That's fair.
Speaker 2:That's fair I mean, if you want to call it right now.
Speaker 1:That's fine, I'll rate them both. I think Freddy's A. We're going to put Jason Voorhees in A also, because I can't you can maybe take things against him here like well, actually Jason Voorhees has more death than people think. He kills teenagers because because they were fucking while he was drowning. There's only one Jason movie that people don't even really like as much as the others, and it's Jason X. People the true no, no, the real ones love Jason X because it's fucking happy and funny as a bitch. That's a great, fucking reboot. A soft reboot Because they were trying to make it more silent. The 2009 remake of Friday was Friday the 13th, so it's actually really good too. There's some bias because the great Jared Padalecki was in it, ready for the next one? Sure, our favorite Nazi, oh no, hitler. Hitler, our favorite Nazi. We're not doing actual, real people. Most notorious Nazi, our favorite.
Speaker 1:Nazi we did real people. We did a lot of shit. Hans Landa, inglourious Bastards, oh, played by a great Christoph Waltz, oh shit, he's at least a B Accomplishments Killed a lot of Jews Bastard, I love it. Killed a lot of Jews, sorry, jewish listeners, impact on pop culture, what, what, what'd I say? Maybe we got some Jewish listeners. I swear to God, jewish people made that movie. Is Tarantino Jewish? I don't think he is. I think he's a Nazi. I don't believe in anything. I don't think the sign and aura. He's a Nazi as tough as that sounds the aura is sure Design isn't, he's just a Nazi.
Speaker 1:He's just a Nazi Character death and complexity. We don't really get much of that in this movie. He's just a Nazi. Likeability Is he's got Like a Nazi is likeable. Like Threat to the hero I guess it's threat to the story really.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I mean he turned out to be a decent threat, but it's probably not high tier. Yeah, I think B is. I think B or C. You're not gonna argue it, I'll go B. So who was it again? Hans Landa, hans, okay, I need fucking uh, landa. L-a-n-d-a, l-a-n-d-a, yeah, okay. Hans Landa, famed non-Jewish American director.
Speaker 2:So no, the famed non-Jewish I don't know why they had to put it that way non-Jewish, non-jewish.
Speaker 1:I don't know why they had to put it that way Non-Jewish. Non-jewish Because he's married to an Israeli singer. Ah, beetlejuice, what. Beckingly. The villain of one, oh my, oh God, he's a pedophile. One and two. He just no, he generally loves her. And two, still trying to use her, though he loses points for the pedo part. That's it, accomplishments. He didn't say it a third time. You lose his points for the pedal part.
Speaker 1:That's it. Beetlejuice, beetlejuice, accomplishments. He didn't say it a third time. Beetlejuice, beetlejuice, beetlejuice. Let me do it for him. Jenna Ortega, jenna Ortega, jenna Ortega. I don't think it works for me. You gotta try it. Jenna Ortega, jenna Ortega, jenna Ortega. I heard clicking at the door. We'll check. I'll get a door. She's asleep. Yeah, b, that's my wife. B for beetle, b for beetle. Your God, b is just. I'm going to put him at a C. You think C? Yeah, he's not. You're taking it away from the pedo part. Look at accomplishments. What did he accomplish? Getting several people to say his name old, but carry.
Speaker 2:I know not carry out.
Speaker 1:What the fuck is that bloody Mary? Yeah, that's one thinking of. Yeah, that is who you think? They took that trope and made it into a comedy. That's definitely an S design. Any. And made it into a comedy AS. That's definitely an S Design. Any iteration kind of is AS.
Speaker 2:What For Beetlejuice? All right, put him in C, because you're talking about C.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I think he's a C. Okay, that's fine, fine. I thought it was decided Character depth and complexity. Until 2, he had no real depth or complexity. Yeah, I'm going to say it, our other favorite Nazi Scar, here's fucking.
Speaker 2:Disney. Only a few of them.
Speaker 1:How many Nazis you got on that list? I'm hoping it's the last one. Are we crop dusting our listeners? I don't think there's another Nazi. Are we crop dusting our listeners? I don't think there's another Nazi. Depends on how you feel about a couple people.
Speaker 1:No, not on here. What you need to be in your comic book, I know, okay. No, I was like I was thinking about wait, nowhere. No Red Skull. Okay In the film, I know that, but I was like, wait, they don't know if Red Skull's on the comic, that's what I was like. Red Skull's in the comic book, that the Red Skull, the Red Skull's someone, not even the Joker, could fuck. I Don't fuck with Nazis. Why is that fucking panel so iconic?
Speaker 1:That shows, how evil Nazis are Scar accomplishments. He accomplished it. He killed his brother, Killed his brother, took over the Pride Lands. He accomplished his goal. He did everything he set out to do Except kill. Simba oh no, don't do that, Brain Wait a minute.
Speaker 1:Does that mean that Mufasa? Does that mean Mufasa is within Simba? Oh, where's Simba? Impact on pop culture and universe they're in. Eh yes, where is father Design? Nothing special Aura. There's some aura there. You see, bro sings, bro makes the fucking hyenas nazi deuce walk. That's some aura. Uh, character, depth and complexity it's not high it's not high. It's not bad, but it's not high. That's at least a C, yeah C. Jay, where's father? Why did that break you? You just gotta say something simple. See ya, jay, where's Spotless. Why did that break you?
Speaker 2:You just gotta say something simple you know what, you know what.
Speaker 1:Bye-bye, I broke my own brain. General likability E. Yeah, because you kind of like Scar. I'll tell you after the show how I broke my own brain, because if I said it on the podcast I'd be canceled as a person. Threatability A.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:So we kind of put him in A, b. I think Scar's got to go, a, I think Scar's A. I still don't like we have no trash. Well, this is probably the closest one that's going to get there. But it depends on how you feel about him, dr Evil, what that man is, a, c or B, I'm saying it depends on how you feel about him. He doesn't know the concept, he doesn't understand the concept of money Fuck, he doesn't. He doesn't even understand the concept of creating a son.
Speaker 1:My God, I had to look at it like oh, austin Powers, you forgot. I was like Mr. Oh God, austin, he literally created a rocket that looks like a dick. You know, austin Powers fucking, because I've always acted the same way, even in high school. You know what threw me off? Goldmember, or them two end up being brothers and he has a turn. Them two end up being brothers and he hasn't turned. He ends up being a good guy. No, I have a weird thing with Austin Powers because I've never really changed Like boy. Even in high school I was pretty much this way, and in high school they're like Dean, you kind of like Austin Powers. What, what, like, why? Because, what, like? Why? Because I said no, I'm serious. No, no, no, no, seriousness, that's true as a motherfucker. Damn it. Now I'm Austin. No, you want to know why? It says when you get pissed, it's like somebody stole your mojo. He stole them Because otherwise you're a happy, giddy, fucking dude. You're, you know, bouncing off walls, no matter what I think. C for Dr Evil, I agree.
Speaker 1:I think, C Jigsaw Talking about one of my heavy hitters, goddammit Villain. He's only a villain because he kills people. Well, no, that's not Jigsaw, though. That's later on. But later on his ideals are kind of. His disciples are starting to kill people for jaywalking and shit, so it's starting to get off the wall. Does that sound familiar? Has he already talked about killing people for jaywalking, for Light Yagami? Yep, yep, yep, you jaywalked. You did Later, about an hour and a half ago.
Speaker 2:Nice.
Speaker 1:Way an hour and a half ago. Nice Way to go along this episode ever Wait, okay, okay, oh God. Accomplishments Again. It's a serial killer, so he's killed a lot of people. Impact on Popcorn he's a very popular slasher. Now. Design and or I mean it's not really John Kramer, it's fucking Billy the Poopit that's got the aura. Fuck your talks, drew. Tell me the voice doesn't give you aura. Yeah, it does. Tobin Bell's got a great voice for that shit. Charisma oh God, character. There's a lot there. Surprisingly, as much as people call Saw torture porn, there's a good story to it. Come on, saw, what is it 10? Turn it around. For us it wasn't torture porn. Saw went off the rails after about after like two, after three.
Speaker 2:Then it started becoming torture porn.
Speaker 1:I'm pretty sure that's the reason why 10 gave us a soft reboot, almost when we had to go prequels in order to fucking do anything. Yep, and just because Saw became Threat to the Hero and so if you're in one of Jim Saw's traps you're kind of fucked and it's bullshit. You got to do all sorts of bullshit to survive. Fuck that.
Speaker 2:Break all your fingers. There could be out of the 10.
Speaker 1:My brain instantly went to Scary Movie 4.
Speaker 2:With Shaq.
Speaker 1:And Dr Phil. Out of the 10 names in the miscellaneous category, there could be 3 or 4 S's.
Speaker 2:Uh oh.
Speaker 1:That's where the S's are. We still don't have an F. What you think? I actually think Jigsaw. I think Jigsaw's up. He's not quite there to be low. I think he's a low A Because he's not quite to the level of Freddy or Jason, but he's carved out his own legacy B. That's also fair.
Speaker 2:I think he's a downgrade to the big two.
Speaker 1:I couldn't put him in an A, it's simply because I think we give him B because he's probably in the realm of Chucky, where his movies are very hit or miss. Yeah, the whole Saw franchise. That's not his fault. Well, remember, jigsaw is not the main, it's not him. Yeah, it's his disciples. Actually, in 3, it's his disciples controlling shit, isn't it? Yeah, pretty much he's still there, but it's not him doing it. Yeah, 3 is the one where he dies. John Kramer finally dies. T-1000, terminator 2. What? Why do we have two Terminators on the list?
Speaker 1:Because, it's different Terminators. I said T2. Okay, we're gonna put fucking, uh, molten man. Hmm, he's arguably everybody's second favorite Terminator. Where do we put Terminator? He's the villain. Yeah, I think so I can agree. T-1000? T-1000? Okay, because he was more menacing and after he was created they started using him more, but they still used the regular skeleton as well. Yep, leatherface, oh God, leatherface is probably Leatherface. To me is probably in the C range because accomplishment. I ain't giving him D. No, he's not D, because he's got a good amount of cred, but he's a fucking. He's pretty much abused by his family, turned into a monster, but he's a and I'm not using this word to offend no one, but he is literally a big retard. I really can't think for himself. He does whatever dad says. Is dad the one telling him to kill people? I know, yeah, he's a family of cannibals.
Speaker 2:Oh yeah, I forgot.
Speaker 1:I forgot they based the Hills. Have Eyes off of that Origins? Did you know Texas Chainsaw Massacre is based on Ed Gein? Yeah, who, actually small thing. I did not know this. I learned about it a few months ago. I didn't know. Netflix does this series called Monster. It's about serial killers and Charlie Hunnam is going to play Ed Gein. I was like, oh yeah, I think Leatherface would be C, definitely C. Alright, there you go, sir, another one for your paper You're going to need to use the back side of your fucking paper.
Speaker 1:Why did I get this one? I got the shit handwriting. It's bullshit. I think Matt did this on purpose. He's holding up a xenomorph. Oh boy, that's not even. That's just a monster. Do we have a Z? Put him in Z. Why would we put it in Z? X, X. You can't rate me. The queen is X-rated, so the queen would be like stop it. In your brain. Some of the Xenomorphs are triple X-rated.
Speaker 2:I die, though, because it's acid.
Speaker 1:Fine, fine, let's throw it. When I can't fucking debate you on shit, I go through it with you. Accomplishments Killed a lot of people. They get C Damn Impact on pop culture A lot, a lot. I sign you downgrade accomplishments because it's a horde of them usually killing you, except for the first movie. It was one, it was just one.
Speaker 2:Okay, impact, it's one of those popular monsters, it's just like one or two.
Speaker 1:And then we got other movies where it's like, well, we're just gonna throw our shit. Design is design and horror is that they. They haven't really changed the design.
Speaker 2:They clear a room, but their design is iconic.
Speaker 1:They haven't changed the design since 2.
Speaker 2:One design was definitely different.
Speaker 1:There's different versions. I mean, uh, character, death and complexity.
Speaker 2:That might be our F.
Speaker 1:Aside from Alien vs Predator and fucking Prometheus, and some people think they tried to do too much Likeability. I love Xenomorphs, but that's again, that's just me. Killing machines. They're a big threat, unless you got a bunch of space marines, unless you're the main character and have flawed armor. You need flawed armor just to fucking get away from them. Yeah, that's why I think it's a C. Okay, if we were, I just get accepted.
Speaker 1:They're literally treated as the fodder for whatever you want. That's fair, because literally in the entire Romulus movie they're just sitting there killing them and running away. They're not even and I'm not talking about the aliens killing, I'm talking about people killing the aliens. That's the sad part. Maleficent, it's Angelina Jolie. No, no, no, technically it counts. It's a different iteration Technically. You gotta add what's the Fucking Kids Show 2. Where it's all the bad guys' children I can't remember the name. Descendants, yeah.
Speaker 2:Technically, you gotta put that one in there too.
Speaker 1:I thought you were gonna add the fucking.
Speaker 2:Oh, what the hell was it called?
Speaker 1:God damn it.
Speaker 2:I can't help you. You didn't give me anything.
Speaker 1:No, I gotta help myself out. Go ahead and discuss while I think when do we put Scar? We put Scar in A. That's the starting point. Do we downgrade her or upgrade her? I don't know if I'd personally Scar was in B.
Speaker 2:Scar was in A I wouldn't put Maleficent above Scar.
Speaker 1:Well, I'm saying same tier, it's definitely not higher. She did better than him when it came to Kingdom Hearts. She didn't really fight Scar that much in Kingdom Hearts. Is she a B, b In terms of content and story? Once upon a time? Yes, that's fair. That's where you were trying to go.
Speaker 2:That's where I was trying to go.
Speaker 1:You could have said live action, and I may have been able to lead you there.
Speaker 2:The other live action.
Speaker 1:I was going to say you said Descendants, we had Angelina. Jolie we already said Descendants and we said Angelina Jolie. You said the other live action and it's like, oh, what's about to?
Speaker 2:happen.
Speaker 1:Uh, it's stupid, as that's how fucked up my brain is. I know it, think of it, and it's one of my favorite shows. Alright, me and you for this one Tan Tan.
Speaker 2:Star Trek Fuck it.
Speaker 1:Which option do I want to go with? You got to merge them both because they're all film. We have to merge them both, which makes it that makes it A tier Cucumberbatch.
Speaker 2:Oh yeah.
Speaker 1:And technically Khan. No, it wasn't Khan that killed his son, that was the Klingons. Khan's. The reason that Spock disappeared. Yeah, the search for Spock, the search for Spock. Jack Torrance, oh boy Shining. Oh God, there's Jackie, there's Johnny.
Speaker 2:Johnny not.
Speaker 1:Jackie, if my brain was Jackie, there's Jackie. Did he transition? I'm sorry, I'm with the times. No murderer, sure, attempted murder Jackie now, oh, he did murder that one dude, so technically a murderer. Whoa, that's a whole new spin on the fucking movie. That's the reason he went crazy. Oh, no, a murder, whoa, that's a whole new spin on the fucking movie. That's the reason he went crazy, oh no.
Speaker 1:He's transitioning. Oh no, this is hard. That's one of my favorite horror icons ever and I haven't defied it. It doesn't mean he's an ass. The last Stephen King movie we went to I can't let him buy a fucking toy for it. That monkey's an ass. The last Stephen King movie we went to I can't let him buy a fucking toy for it. That monkey's an ass. That monkey had aura. He didn't say shit.
Speaker 1:Oh, Jack Torrance Accomplishments kill Impact on pop culture. He's one of the most iconic characters. Design he's just a normal average Joe guy. Or when he goes nuts he's pretty creepy, Even though them twins in there are pretty creepy too. Come play with us, Danny, Forever and ever in hell.
Speaker 1:General likability I mean that floor gets me more than anything else in that movie. You know what gets me the worst in the Shining? The old lady in a bathtub. I've walked out of hotels because they had the same fucking floor style as that. Oh, Jack Torrance Directed a hero.
Speaker 1:I mean he's a big director, a little boy, Even though the boy outsmarts him and lets him get frozen to death. Oh God, that's hard because a lot of Jack Torrance's is fucking depth and complexity he's got, because a lot of it is him being an alcoholic dealing with fucking, not being a very flawed guy and being, uh, you know, Shawnee deals a lot with isolation. Some people deal with isolation and shit and he goes nuts and he's already not a perfect person. So there's a whole theory about being reincarnated and all that shit that I don't want to get into. To fucking theorists, Stephen King theorists, Jesus Christ, I want to go just because of how iconic he is. I want to go low A. I don't know what you think, Jack, it's Jack Torrance. I don't know what you think, Jay, it's Jack Torrance. I know I'm thinking it's tough.
Speaker 1:I already transitioned him, so leave me alone. I leaned B. Yeah, he gets a B, he transitioned, he cups, he trans. I'm going to need a cake up here in a couple minutes here.
Speaker 2:Okay, okay, suck it. I'm gonna need a cake up here in a couple minutes here.
Speaker 1:Okay, fuck it. Hey, I mean, you're just giving Dean reasons to write. I know, and I'm just like fuck, jack Torrance. I know, fuck, fuck. I just don't want to fuck it up, but I get made fun of even more because my spelling is a trope. What?
Speaker 2:what? Let's give him a new shit for not being able to spell it.
Speaker 1:I just don't want to fuck it up, but I get made fun of even more because my spelling is a trope I can't make fun of you.
Speaker 1:We already have a dyslexic friend. That's true. That's true. Your chicken scratch is no worse than his, because I write like crap, but I guess you're left-handed. That makes it sound like crap. It's a good, it's a better reason to write. The sad shit is as sloppy as my handwriting is. I have physically seen worse, so I can't even be too mad.
Speaker 1:Scientifically, it gives you a better reason for your handwriting being crap than it does somebody writing with their right, because we write left to right, so we're instinctually writing from the left to the right. Our hand already is positioned to use our right hand. You're doing the opposite fucking way. You're instantly going to have smudges and all that other shit, unless you start learning to write backwards. Oh, good lord. You know, as a kid I thought people who had left-handed writing used to write backwards. It's just technically an excuse for him to go to Japan. I wonder if a lot of them are left-handed. That's one, eric Jafar. Oh, good lord, one more Disney one to go through after this C. You think he's a C? Yes, what the fuck? He's not the leader of Hamas. How the fuck is he becoming?
Speaker 1:the leader of Hamas. Wow, now that was a pull. I'm giving it a 1. Wouldn't being the leader of Hamas put him higher. Oh, that puts you low. That's it. That's an official terrorist group. He technically accomplished a lot. He never successfully won everything, but he accomplished a lot. He was the fucking advisor. He got outsmarted Very easily For being somebody who's an advisor. He got outsmarted into being a genie.
Speaker 2:Yeah, he wasn't thinking about the rules and regulations.
Speaker 1:In Return of Jafar yeah, well, yeah. So he definitely did no better Than the rest of the Disney villains we put on this list, other than Scar.
Speaker 2:Scar's an.
Speaker 1:A Scar is an A Scar is an A. That's why I put him at a C. I don't think he did any worse than Maleficent. He did worse. He has Raja. I love this tiger. Think about the Kingdom Hearts games. Raja belonged to Jasmine. Damn it. I fucked him up. He had Iago. Oh yeah, raja's the whole reason that we have the bounce scene. Oh god, I disagree, but go ahead.
Speaker 2:I guess you know what.
Speaker 1:No, here I'll give Jafar that accomplishment, because after Jafar said Aladdin wasn't shit or something about her father, that's when we get the bounce scene. Jafar gets that accomplishment. The bounce scene, because it's the only Disney movie you get that where a Disney princess you get physics.
Speaker 2:Dean.
Speaker 1:So what were we saying? Let's see for me. Really, I had him at B.
Speaker 2:And You're the tiebreaker.
Speaker 1:Hopefully You're the breaker. I'm trying to. I don't even want to. He's the breaker.
Speaker 2:I think, Jafar's got enough.
Speaker 1:I'm gonna go B. I've been agreeing with J a lot. I'm gonna go B. That was the worst. Well, it happened. We'll go different ones more. William and J got some sort of discontent and we've been pop culture, design and aura, character, depth and complexity.
Speaker 2:He's very similar to Maleficent to me.
Speaker 1:That's where I was going. He's very similar. He's very similar to Maleficent Threatened, a hero in story as soon as he turned into a fucking genie now, ah, Pinhead. Oh no, oh god, why, especially now that I actually Pinhead. Oh no, oh God, why, especially now that I actually bought him the puzzle.
Speaker 2:Oh my God, how the fuck did he Was he?
Speaker 1:on the ranker. Yeah, I can't believe. Oh wow. Well, hellraiser is a lovable series. The sick fucks Like me. Oh my god, he did drop one of the greatest lines in cinematic history to me, please, no tears. That's just a waste of good stuff. You solved the box and we came Now taste our pleasures. Bro just dropped nothing but banger lines. Doug Bradley or the goat, I'd love to meet you at a con. You do cons. Oh God A con. Oh my, this is just a lot to unbox. Oh my, this is just a lot to unbox. What I'm staying away from you in that puzzle. I'm going to put you in a box at some point here.
Speaker 2:You always put them in a box.
Speaker 1:Yeah, figurative one this time it's going to be literally. It has a whole song for it. That's accomplished. There's tortured a lot of people to death. Figurative one this time it's going to be literally. It has a whole song for it. That's the accomplished. There's tortured a lot of people to death. That is a hell priest.
Speaker 1:Impact on pop culture. Pretty popular slasher Design and aura is pretty high because that design is pretty oh shit. Character depth and complexity is not amazing, but there's some stuff there. As sick as he is, people really like him. Threat to the hero or story you can't really beat him. You can't really beat him. Uh B, even though I'm just casually writing more names on my fucking list. Yeah, enjoy your suffering.
Speaker 2:I will.
Speaker 1:Bill kill Bill. Oh, jesus Christ, we're just fucking getting. I can't really fucking. I have not watched Kill Bill in fucking eons, holy fuck. And it was great enough to get two parts. It was so fucking long that it split that bitch into two. Oh fuck, god damn, I don't think he's, I think he was alright. I don't think he's quite B. I think I'll go C. I think C is fair. I think C is fair. I think C is fair for Bill.
Speaker 1:You don't see him much. You see him a little bit. Then you see him a little bit more in the second one. Then it's giving him an A in accomplishments. I'm giving him an A in pop culture and universe they're in. I'm giving him a C in design and aura. Yeah, I'm giving him a Depth and complexity. C in depth and complexity. Likeability is kind of B in likeability. I could easily give him a B. You think a B? Yeah, threat to the hero and story yeah, because he kind of just Threat to the hero and story evens him out, kind of because he's got a bunch of goons. These goons do a lot of work. So okay, I'll put Bill Palpatine. Oh boy, oh no, I guess it came back Somehow. Can I please write it. Somehow he came back.
Speaker 1:Oh come on, oh, he's not lower. The sequel trilogy is still a thing. It's canon. I gotta write him down it's as canon, as I wanna believe it is. I wanna write one name there. Palpatine was the golden opportunity.
Speaker 2:I'll write something there for you, if you want actually, yeah, write it there for you if you want. Actually, yeah, write it there.
Speaker 1:Let's see what you got to say. No, I don't write it.
Speaker 2:Come on, I'm going to show it to you after I write it. Oh.
Speaker 1:I'm not going to hide it from you the entire game. The sad thing is, Palpatine can't go lower than A. I don't think he can as much as you want to bitch about the sequels, because if you read the comics and the books, he's actually the reason for almost everything Anakin.
Speaker 1:Yeah, he's a master. The birth of Anakin. Is that how it's the funniest thing? If fucking I dare you, how are you gonna to work that? Well, call him Hobbit, what do you want? Okay, I'll wait for it. We're still in movies, right? Yeah? Okay, you just told me to write something there. You didn't say it had to be content-related, but it's a villain.
Speaker 2:For him it is.
Speaker 1:It's as great as insults. Funny God, the funniest thing about Palpatine if you go to Klonicle over there and I'm going to grab that chair so he can be here spiritually He'd have a lot of good thoughts. Loki, god see, grab that chair so he can be here spiritually, just to tell him to start. Then He'd have a lot of good thoughts. Loki, god see, is Palpatine good enough to get up to? Not, I put him in it Because he's not with Vader, vader just was.
Speaker 2:Vader killed him.
Speaker 1:And most of the time Palpatine just sat in his chair and did good, until the sequel. I say this he's right up there with Mr Burns' excellent. I say this jokingly, because it's not necessarily true. Our last Disney one is Captain Hook. Oh my god, you think so. I mean. I'm not gonna. Every iteration of him has just been gold. He's a pirate, though I'm like I'm trying to. He's a pirate, so I'm trying to fucking be like, oh shit his only weakness is a silly one, but sure, oh shit, a crocodile.
Speaker 1:No, tick the clock, the ticket that's the crocodile coming. It lets him know. The crocodile's there, come on, come in these waters, come in these waters. Oh God, damn it. I totally spaced on the fact that we'd have fucking Disney villains in here, like, oh fuck, here comes Disney. I mean, like I said, it's technically correct, but also not technically correct that this is the last Disney character? Oh boy, we'll find out. I said A, b.
Speaker 2:I can't put him above Scar.
Speaker 1:You can't put him above Scar. No, I don't think I could either, to be honest, even with all the iterations you get of his ass, like for I have the Robin Williams hook movie to go off of.
Speaker 2:That's the only one I have.
Speaker 1:I have three different live-action fucking Peter Pan movies. Outside of that which I can't really fucking, I stole him as a bee. That's tough for me.
Speaker 1:You have the fucking cartoon version of him. You have the Neverland Pirates TV fucking show for kids. Accomplishments though I'm kind of like he's the tiebreaker. You have A B, he's the tiebreaker, picks to him. You know, the sad part is I can't list any of his accomplishments. I's the tiebreaker. You have A, b, he's the tiebreaker, pitch to him. You know, the sad part is I can't list any of his accomplishments. I'm leaning B only because I'm doing a little bit of what Matt does. I'm trying to see who we got in these tiers. The Disney villain in A is Scar. I think Scar is arguably the best Disney villain. You can make a case for other people, arguably. But it'd have to be someone that's really really close with Scar to go into A and it's like, oh fuck. So it's like, eee, I'm a lean B, I'm a lean B.
Speaker 2:Oh, I'm a lean bee.
Speaker 1:Ivan Drago Snarky. Oh God, ivan Drago. If he dies, he dies. He dies those longer. My brain wanted to say a, c, but then I'm like it's too iconic to do that. That was gonna be B Dean's running out of fucking space. I'm gonna have to flip the fuck technically he's got a row right here. You're right, I do actually, I just gotta write even smaller. I mean, ivan Draco is literally four and five letters.
Speaker 2:Oh god, find me Predator.
Speaker 1:Dean, what Predator? Xenomorph down in C, dean, what Predator? Oh fuck, xenomorph down in C, but Predator. I think I like Predator better. B oh goddammit, I'm sick of B. I hate B. I don't like B. I don't like B. No more B's, just like the fact that I got this B. That's shit. B, b. I'm so sick of B. I'm trying to put this. Do you want to just write it? I'm like that's an F man, I guess the first villain of all. It's literally because it's caused his life hell, because he gets nothing but shit. So yeah, that is a very iconic villain in realism.
Speaker 1:Oh no, oh no, Are we writing something else?
Speaker 2:on there, this hero.
Speaker 1:It's the worst villain we have Jesse trying to be a villain.
Speaker 2:He's Jay's arch nemesis in the campaign.
Speaker 1:Yes, in every campaign. So where are we putting Predator? I don't want it. Fuck Bob Fitzmincy's killed a lot of motherfuckers. We've said that a lot. I don't want fucking fuck Bopless Mintz. He's killed a lot of motherfuckers. We've said that a lot impact on Bop. He's trying to make him. I'm trying to make him A or C. You have Ruben C. How? Come, I gotta write it again that's not a problem you should be worrying about. Alright, matt, let's go through you wanted to write these fuckers down.
Speaker 1:Bopless Mintz. I. Alright, matt, let's go through it. You wanted to write these fuckers down. I was giving you an out not to write any of this shit down. I was only going to write down S's and A's and I had to make more fucking words. I could have wrote down where they were on the side of each thing on the paper.
Speaker 2:He wanted me to feel pain and he's winning. Winning with the movies you like.
Speaker 1:That's why pain's a nest here.
Speaker 2:Oh God, damn it Well it's fighting with the movies you like. Oh, fuck.
Speaker 1:That's why pain's a nest here. Oh God, predators like police is always a major threat, because you can't kill this motherfucker unless. And even when you kill him, he blows up likeability yes, always a threat to the hero in the story. Always a threat Deathly Com. They're not complex. A they hunt. They're not complex. I give them A. I do too. You give them A for a different. No, I honestly think Predator's A, even though I feel bad because Xenomorph's down here.
Speaker 1:The only one. You can't justify everything for giving him an. A is Accomplishments, but a Predator can kill a Xenomorph Routinely, that is true. That's a good point, agent Smith.
Speaker 2:Matrix.
Speaker 1:Oh boy, does his heel turn count.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:I mean, he was always a villain. He just became THE villain and then it became Red Skull.
Speaker 2:Oh god, what, what.
Speaker 1:Honestly, he's more V for V for Vendetta the voice or the actor, Because I know they switched that up too, but still it seemed I believed more of the trend of him not becoming a Nazi and more him becoming V for Vendetta and just anti-everything. Anti-everything Fits the actor himself anyway, Sorry, Elrond.
Speaker 2:Anti-Ring.
Speaker 1:Save those for later. Oh god, accomplishments. It takes until movie three for him to not be a fucking threat. I'm leaning towards A he's still a threat in three. Impact on pop culture A. Design and aura Design's not necessarily much, but aura A Right, yeah, I think so. Character depth and complexity Not really much, but aura A Right, yeah, I think so. Character depth and complexity that evolves over time, yeah. General likability Sure Threatability to hero and story.
Speaker 2:A.
Speaker 1:Hey, look at that. Now we're getting mad to write more than you. I don't know. I know Dean likes the next one, but he could end up on my list. I'm still waiting for an F. This one was so bad, neither of these two are going in the F. Can we get more Ds? I don't want to ever say that again.
Speaker 2:I don't want to ever say that again.
Speaker 1:Anton Sugar. No Country for Old Men. Oh, that's Javier Bardoom. Yeah, he's great, but where is he going? You cheaters what you put him in B Get in the ass.
Speaker 1:You're just trying to put everything in B. It seems light. Go through your criteria. Oh my god. I sound like a broken record. Killed a lot of people Impact on the pop culture and the universe they're in it's a good. It's a pretty popular movie and the universe they're in it's a good. It's a pretty popular movie and the universe they're in I mean he's basically just a hitman that goes and gets shit done for the cartel.
Speaker 1:Design or charisma. He's got aura. Motherfucker just walks in. He's Two-Face, he flips a coin to see if you live or die Awesome. Where would you rate that as A through F? I think design. Design is very pedestrian, but I think that's A range. You're giving accomplishments D because you're a broken record when it comes to that one. Impact on pop culture. You gave a, b, yeah.
Speaker 1:I'd give that A A Character, death and complexity. I'd give that A A Character, death and complexity. There's not much there. I mean C because he's just doing hitman stuff. Likeability is like B or A because, like I said, he's different.
Speaker 2:Guess what you're averaging out the way A, b, I don't know, threat to the hero is a story.
Speaker 1:Threat to the hero is a story. Threat to the story is a pretty big threat. So B's going to fucking B. Next one's not going anywhere, you're fine. Oh my god, anton, I'm over here A-N-T-O-N. Okay, I was right, you can just do Antron. I think we'll figure that out.
Speaker 2:Anton okay.
Speaker 1:I'm sorry, man, that's okay, I was right. You can just do Anton. I think we'll figure that out, anton.
Speaker 2:Okay, I'm sorry man, that's okay.
Speaker 1:That's okay, and our final one for film Darth Maul.
Speaker 2:Hey.
Speaker 1:Hey, I give Matt this one. I think Maul low-key. I think Maul could be A.
Speaker 2:He's one of the best.
Speaker 1:Star Wars villains. Besides, it took the end of the Clone Wars for him to finally admit defeat to Obi-Wan. The sad thing is, in Clone Wars, when he called Anakin the Duel and Ahsoka showed up, he was pissed because he wanted Anakin to show up, because he knew Palpatine's plan. He wasn't even fucking in Clone Wars, was he? That was in Rebels.
Speaker 2:Was that?
Speaker 1:Rebels.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:I got them mixed up, but that's why he wanted Anakin. Even further down the timeline. That's why he kind of had a little bit of a face turn, even though he was still a bad guy. He went about it wrong, but he wanted to stop them. I still want them to do a Han Solo sequel, to play with his character some more. Oh yeah, because he appeared at the end. Alright, ready for books. Books, oh boy, books. They have films for most of these, but they were basing it but they originated in books.
Speaker 1:Here comes Sauron, sauron's number one. There we go, the first one we're doing yeah, oh shit, we're going to have to let Matt do some of this because, all right, buddy, run us through the accomplishments. A lot of people bash accomplishments a little bit because people again, I didn't read books. People say Sauron didn't do that much, so I don't know, I, I don't know I'd have to love them Then continuously gather groups of people to try and take over the world.
Speaker 1:So Charisma is an S Hold on. Does that mean that Rings of Power actually got something? No, because he doesn't look like that, I don't buy the elf version, even though he still kind of to me looks stupid, even though apparently some people can figure out that him and the guy he played in the preseason one were the same person. That's how much I hate the show. All he did was name 20 for him and change hair color. Yeah, okay, so we did accomplishments.
Speaker 2:A or S.
Speaker 1:He definitely getsS for the pop culture.
Speaker 2:Yes, if.
Speaker 1:Kevin Smith has to reference you in his movies you're an S.
Speaker 2:That's our.
Speaker 1:That's one of my favorite designs ever for a villain. Movie design is S, Even the floating oh. You see it for five minutes and even the floating eye is still fucking intimidating. Um, okay.
Speaker 2:Until we lose contact lens.
Speaker 1:I was going to say until the contact lens, nobody move, nobody move. Yeah, nobody move, nobody move. A character death so accomplishments was A Impact S Impact S Design S Character, depth and complexity. Again, somebody's got to go with Matt, because Sauron don't do much in the movie, so a lot of it is books. You got to go. I don't think his character is overly complex.
Speaker 1:So really they just make him an evil entity. Yeah, but that's all he needed to be for the franchise. But there is some depth, so he's probably A in depth and C in complexity. So now we're averaged out to A. I think he's very high in likability. Three S's and one B. I think he's very high in likability too, because A S S A.
Speaker 1:So it comes on general likability, people like him as a villain S or an A. I'd put it at an A, so he's straight between an S and an A. That's definitely an S. You read it, sauron's S he is S now his color part. Saruman is probably an A when you do that reverse order. Yeah, now his counterpart.
Speaker 2:Saruman is probably an A when you do that reverse order.
Speaker 1:Yeah, go get him. Nazgul Gollum. Oh my god, omegle. How does he count as a villain? Because he's trying to manipulate Sam and Frodo the entire time. That was the ring doing that. I think it was still all Gollum and a split personality.
Speaker 2:My precious. I'm not saying he's high, that's too funny.
Speaker 1:Shut up. You think I just sit there in front of the case. My precious he's probably a seerity. Why do you think I had to give you that cup? In France, accomplishments is low, vultures relatively higher up.
Speaker 1:Universe of Rin low, but everybody knows his name. Designing Charisma. Low. Character C to B. C to B Because this is Sparta. What the fuck was that parody movie? Meet the Spartans, meet the Spartans. He had such an iconic look that they had to parody him. Character depth is relatively high, complexity's not so, even out there. General likability C yeah, I didn't really like him. Likability of the hero in the story Zilch no, it's. There is some, because if he leads them in the wrong direction, they don't go the right way. Yet they could have just flew them. Fucking things, the fucking Lord, or in the first. So, dean, you have to write it down, but it goes in C versus B.
Speaker 2:Okay.
Speaker 1:That's one of people's biggest. I said under your breath Fuck you, just tell me how to spell gollum. I'm not looking up, I'm not spelling it. G-o-l-l-u-m, g-o-l-l-u-m, l-l-u-m. Yep, you um, yep. Half of these I'd get right if I just tried. Okay, let's see how. I have a feeling you'd probably smelt this one wrong, unless you know how to spell it Smog, dr Reagan. Yeah, ready to come a-batch. Son of a bitch. Again, a lot of these. Lord of the Rings, I gotta let Matt carry a little bit, because hey, movies.
Speaker 1:Most of what you see out of that is in the Hobbits. If you saw the Hobbits, Is that? Another sea? No, because he's an actual force. He sleeps on a mountain of gold and basically does destroy the town that's next to it. He's a giant-ass, fucking dragon.
Speaker 2:I'm just saying he's still Wait a minute.
Speaker 1:If I was a dragon, would I have a mountain of bunnies?
Speaker 2:Son of a bitch, somebody would have to make those.
Speaker 1:Would I have bunnies, though In cases, go ahead, small smog S-M-A-U-G Yay. Did he say B? Yeah, s-m-a-u-g. Okay, voldemort, tom Riddle, tom Riddle. Well, we shouldn't say his name.
Speaker 1:Harry Potter episode coming soon. Quit teasing him. We're in fucking season two and we've been saying that since what Episode one I had to. It's the perfect go in, it's the perfect go-in, it's the perfect Voldemort, voldemort's no lower than A. So we can just.
Speaker 1:I don't have to write this, at least. Thank God there ain't no way someone's getting Watch, watch, watch Me and Matt start going through criteria. Fuck you and get him the B. I like how he considers this his punishment. Wow, I like how he considers this his punishment. Wow, writing things is punishment for D. I just don't like it. I'm so conscious about my chicken scratch I'm not even looking at it. I mean, it's not even that horrible, it's just all over the place because my fucking hand-eye coordination's fucking on on vacation. Oh, voldemort, it's the weekend. They didn't expect you to write shit.
Speaker 1:He did take over Hogwarts at the end. He got lost eventually, but he did take over Hogwarts. Avada Kedavra, avada Kedavra. He did kill Harry Potter. Technically Tried to twice. He's tried a lot Three separate times throughout the Damn it. He didn't directly, he did not kill him, he didn't cast a spell, but he had a. He was there when they killed Cedric Diggity. So he gets S tier for impact. He gets A tier for accomplishments, design and aura. I mean design and aura is actually decent, even though I've seen him to look like a snake.
Speaker 2:No.
Speaker 1:I've seen a scrap design where he looked more like a snake. They scrapped the design. Though they scrapped it. I see that they should have used that. He looked more like a snake when he was with Professor Quirrell too, in the original designs. Yeah, so I'd. It's a, b. Sure, depth and complexity A S, b, I think so. I think that's S or A, because I mean going back to Tom Riddle and all that shit.
Speaker 2:I think he's an A.
Speaker 1:Just so you know, you're justifying us writing him as an A. I'm trying. I'm surprised. I thought Voldemort was a shoe-in for S, but I don't think he's quite on the level of them guys up there. Okay, now put the Space Wizard against that wizard, the Space Wizard against Vader versus Voldemort. Uh, vader, I think Vader's just force-throwing him fucking halfway across the fucking. Will you ask? Dean Six, penny-wise, hey, georgie.
Speaker 2:Why are?
Speaker 1:you looking at your dick when you say that You'll float too. Hey, georgie, god, the sad thing is, I'm gonna tell ya, I'm gonna tell ya right now. You have no clue why. That is hilarious to me.
Speaker 2:What.
Speaker 1:What the fuck joke you make. I still can't. You said something about being in the pool with me. You talking about swings.
Speaker 2:You'll float too.
Speaker 1:Oh fuck, okay, Okay, I get it now. The thing about Pennywise, though, is he can't get ridiculously high, because, when you think about it, if you don't fear him, he's a bitch. He turns into a little baby. Oh fuck, what do you think it? If you don't fear him, he's a bitch. He turns into a little baby. Oh fuck, what do you think? He tortures you until that point. It's no worse than what they did in the books so that they didn't fear him anymore. Oh, the ritual With all the young kids. Oh my god, stephen King, holy fuck, that's so bad. People buy the books to look for that section, like where's that section? And they don't believe. It's a whole fucking chapter. Where's that section? Oh my god, I have the book at home. I'm like Jesus Christ, okay, okay, we're still. We're still going off the criteria for, uh, pennywise again an accomplishment.
Speaker 2:I told you it was a town. For how many years hold up? I got an accomplishment.
Speaker 1:JJ's still scared of him. That is an accomplishment. That is up there. He keeps thinking he's not. I'm packed on pop culture.
Speaker 2:Pretty high JJ's still scared of him Design. Jj's still scared.
Speaker 1:Aura charisma. Jj's still scared of him. Eric's death and complexity. Aura Charisma JJ's still scared. Air. Death and Complexity yes. General Likeability JJ's still scared of it. Threatability to JJ. I think even he turns into a tuck when you fucking fear him. I think A is fine. I think Pennywise is actually If we're going to actually go in depth on his character and what he actually is a part of In Stephen King's universe A so S to Jesse.
Speaker 2:B to the rest of us.
Speaker 1:I'm curious about. You'll see Pennywise again because they're doing the Welcome to Derry show.
Speaker 2:The, what it's a doing, the.
Speaker 1:Welcome to Derry show, yeah, the what. It's a prequel. Welcome to Derry, bill Skosky. It's on, max, I believe. Here's the criteria for your first half. Oh no, bring it.
Speaker 2:Jaws what.
Speaker 1:Fuck, fuck. I love Jaws. A cop. He's not a threat if you're not swimming, unless it's, I said, sharp bone. What do you mean? I'll point at that table and you know exactly what I mean. What about sharks that ate the boat? You were in water. I somehow survived. Accomplishments. He killed a fucking swimmer lady. And a quint and a quint In all three movies. It's a different jerk every time. And Jaws for the revenge.
Speaker 1:it's personal, he's looking out for that bloodline I didn't even want to bring up that fucking movie, that movie. That plot is so kid's stupor. I can't even want to bring up that fucking movie, that movie that plot is so I can't believe it was greenlit.
Speaker 1:Who the fuck came into that room? Let's make the jaw sentient the shark sentient. He's hunting down that bloodline. Who the fuck okayed that impact on pop? That's high. That fucking song is everywhere. It made people scared to go in the water for years, so you got to give them that.
Speaker 2:Design and order.
Speaker 1:The annual movie watch where?
Speaker 1:they're in the pool on like boobs watching Jaws, I'd literally sneak in the water and put a little fin on and start swimming around. People have done that. There was one dickhead who blew, uh blew up like a small stick of dynamite in the water. Oh God he was. I might shit myself. Um design and aura and charisma. I don't know how the fuck to grade a shark's aura and charisma. Uh, you grade the shark's aura and charisma by singing the theme song again. So that's decently high, sadly. Character, depth and complexity it should be his only S. The shark gets an S In Aura. Okay, jaws is character, depth and complexity. F Until you get to four Ready.
Speaker 2:He grows as a shark.
Speaker 1:The shark has an F General likability. I see, see, straightforward. Yeah, it's a shark. If you're in the water it's high If you're on land, it's zero.
Speaker 1:It can't be our only justice. It's C or D In terms of straight. Even though I love Jaws, you just want me to write something. No, that's J-A-W-S. That's fine. He's like I'll be able to spell Jaws. I can't spell that. You want to know how long it's been since I wrote something? Hans Gruber, I didn't write these Jaws is so fucking funny. No, we need Dean to put the next two on his list, just because it'd be fun to spell Frankenstein's monster.
Speaker 1:I'm gonna put Frank on there, frank's monster. No, you can't put Frank, because you're actually Frank as villains. Frank, remember Frank, the plant from Little Pet Shop of Horrors? I think it's called? Oh my god, oh god. The last one on this list is going on my chart.
Speaker 2:That is the plant's name?
Speaker 1:right, Frank? I think so. So, okay, who do we got Frankenstein's monster? Frankenstein Mary Shelley's Frankenstein Accomplishments Threw a little girl in the water and made her drown. You know who? The real villain of that was Frankenstein. Well, he was just playing with the little girl and he accidentally threw her in the water. Impact on pop that's high. It's fucking Frankenstein who has been spoofed and mean to him. Let's see, we have a D, a, A, a C Design and aura is almost non-existent.
Speaker 1:Really Design is okay, they reuse his design and a lot of shit. Aura and charisma is fucking. But okay, yeah, because they're really scared of shit. More on charisma is fucking, but okay.
Speaker 1:Yeah, because everyone's scared of, except for Frankenstein in fucking the Creature Commandos. Then that guy just talks too much Character depth and complexity. He's a complex design. Yeah, he's made up of body parts. General I'm forgetting about one, young Frankenstein. No, hotel Transylvania, frankenstein, general likability. I mean, fine, he's very likable. He's very likable. Threat to the hero of their story. Aside from the people in the story, nobody wants Frankenstein to die. It's like See.
Speaker 2:Let's see.
Speaker 1:Let me get my phone on. I'm not fucking done.
Speaker 2:Frank, and then S-T-E-I-N?
Speaker 1:What Frank S-T-E-I-N? What Frank S-T-E-I-N-J? I believe so it shouldn't be I-E-N, is it? It's E-I. Cool, I can still spell German shit. Now, where are you going to put Professor James Moriarty? Moriarty, I definitely want to put him A tier.
Speaker 2:I was leaning that way, but that's bias.
Speaker 1:I was leaning that way, professor Moriarty, every fucking version of him, except for Elementary. On the contrary, my dad's. There was a TV show on ABC called Elementary, where it had Lucy Liu in it. Yeah as Watson. As Watson, I actually I love her. On the contrary, my dear Watson, it's the ironically. The one that I'm less interested in is the most recent one that's coming out with Maurice Chestnut playing Watson. Yeah, as the doctor.
Speaker 1:Yeah, but it's a straight doctor thing versus when he solves fucking Medical mysteries via house I'm doctor thing versus where he solves fucking medical mysteries via house.
Speaker 1:I'm sorry. I would tell you Robert Downey Jr's Sherlock Holmes is one of the most underappreciated things ever. We're never getting the three. We got him as Doom before. We're getting fucking three. What A or S for Hannibal Lecter? Oh, we got a heavy hitter boy. It's the last one. We got a heavy hitter boy. That's the last one. We got a heavy hitter boy. What do you think? What do you think Me?
Speaker 1:Yeah, oh, that's tough man I can put my opinion out there, but it barely means shit. He almost could be. That's just because of how he's inspired so much. He's so fucking popular. He got his own series.
Speaker 2:Yep.
Speaker 1:And it's fucking. Sir Anthony Hopkins, two iconic people playing him. Sir Anthony Hopkins, bye-bye. And Sir Anthony Hopkins and Mads Mikkelsen. I still have yet to watch that show. It kind of pisses me off the fact that he's so classy and shit and just kills people and eats them. It's like what the fuck. And he's not a savage.
Speaker 1:The lowest I'll give him is an A. Well, you might have already said A or S. It's Hannibal Lecter. Design, aura and charisma is high Accomplishments. I mean he's A-S-S-S Design and Aura, yep. Well, aura, yeah, yeah. Depths and Complexity, I think's A or S too. Likeability it's Hannibal Lecter. I mean, never had a love for Hannibal Lecter. And threadability of the story. Why the fuck did the name Charisse just pop into my head? Claries, do you still hear the lambs? Claries, I wish I could. My head actually went Sherry's, not Claries. I wish I could talk longer, but I'm having an old friend for dinner. That's it. Eat that fucking Animal Lecter's ass man. Alright, we may have burned Dean out enough that we may be able to get through the comic books relatively quickly. That's our longest fucking episode ever. It's legendary. I guess I have actually calmed a bit. I have calmed a bit. I'm putting my two cents in, but I have calmed a bit.
Speaker 2:I'm not tired.
Speaker 1:You called yourself a broken record. Well, because, talking about a lot of them people, they killed people. They're villains. They killed a lot of them people. Like they killed people. I mean how the fuck they're villains. They killed a lot of people. Generally, none of them have done general homicide yet. Like no, I mean like world-scale. Like no Vader did oh what, alderaan, I blew up a planet. Technically. It wasn't him that gave the order, that was Tarkin. Yeah, you can totally tell in his suit. He didn't necessarily want it, but he's like okay, do it. Alright. So there was a pretty even split between your Marvel and DC. Yeah, oh, I like that Up until I did. When I did 30, it was 15-15 for Marvel-DC. Then I went through the next couple to figure out were there any big omissions that weren't just like small?
Speaker 1:We definitely could have split this episode up Like villains.
Speaker 2:Imagine heroes.
Speaker 1:Heroes might not be as bad. I don't know. That'd be tough, you know. What you could do is just take the heroes of every villain we put on the list. No, because several of them are franchised, oh my god, because what are we going to put as the hero? For One Piece? It's Luffy, but we've had four, one, one Piece, and then we Luffy, but we've had Thor one, or we had one One Piece, and then, oh, we can put Zoro on there, zoro can appear in anything if he gets lost.
Speaker 1:Alright, let's see if we can speedrun this. That's probably gonna be easy. Doc Ock, what's that? You putting him at a B tier, low key? Yeah, something in B, because the man took over Peter's body and still couldn't hack it. I mean, design and aura are not as big. Character, depth and complex are pretty good there. Likeability. He's a very popular Spider-Man villain. He's always Whatever happened to Hydra, the Hydra version of him, I don't remember Superior Octopus. I have the pop of that shit. I'm like, oh yeah, that's a pop I got. He has the silver suit, but he's basically Spider-Man with the Doc Ock arms. Well, I think. Do you think any higher for B? No, I said it initially B's fair, I, b is fair. I think B is fair. He's like one of my favorite Spider-Man villains. Yeah, green Goblin, oh boy, just because of Dean's house.
Speaker 2:Hey.
Speaker 1:Ah, that fucking haunted-ass pop that's in storage. Now I can't do shit. Hey, he's the one opening your storage. You better go check on your pop suit. They're all out of there. That scared the shit out of me. They're all out of their box staring at me like we need to steal his key and do that one day. We don't know what storage unit he has. No, if I just open up my thing, what the fuck is this Toy Story? Oh, they dropped it. They all fall flat, so they all platoon. No, I hate us anyway. Because we took him out the box, I might become John Wick. I'm going to smoke chump. We didn't kill any dogs. What if Sadie got killed when I become John Wick? Yes, depends on how Sadie died, but sure.
Speaker 1:Let's see how reckless and ragey he gets when I kill him. We did Green Goblin. Next you were hinted at killing my puppy.
Speaker 2:I know he and him easily put Green Goblin A, I think Goblin yeah. Next what you were hinted at killing my puppy.
Speaker 1:I know he and him easily put Green Goblin A I think Goblin's A Can't quite get him to the, but not when he rapes people. I'm talking about killing Sadie and D&D. Oh oh no. Oh no, you bring him into combat For a game. I can't knock him for that logic. You gotta give her an invincible shield. Fuck, am I gonna do that when JJ doesn't let me make anything? Brainiac, brainiac, oh God, brainiac's kind of a weird one because I hate my brain, because I used to think it would be. I kind of did too. One because I hate my brain because I instantly would be, I kind of did too. Honestly, I'm not fighting it, yeah, but Brainiac B for Brainiac. You just hate when you alliterate yeah, I do yeah, I do, but I'm not mad at it.
Speaker 1:Accomplishments he has a lot of them. He gave me one of my favorite MMO games. To be fair his greatest credibility is what we got out of the shitty game that they just made.
Speaker 2:Kills the Suicide.
Speaker 1:Squad or kills the Justice League. That's technically his biggest threat.
Speaker 2:I thought it was confirmed somewhere that those were all clones of the Justice League.
Speaker 1:He's been used for every fucking video game they've made. I mean, Bro does got little cities. Think about it. Injustice 2, he was in there. He was like the main threat, wasn't he? And then we have the MMO, the fucking DC Universe Online. He's the reason for everybody having fucking superpowers. And now we have the Suicide Squad still the Justice League. He's the reason for that.
Speaker 2:Oh for fuck's sake.
Speaker 1:He's got little cities in jars, where Tandor was in Supergirl's fucking city Because of his pet's potential. I think he's an A Low-key I'm not disagreeing, low-key, I think it's. I'm not a big Brainiac fan, but I'm not Instant B, but the accomplishments he's high up there.
Speaker 1:He's one of Superman's biggest His design and aura and charisma kind of drops him a bit. He's a decent Character. Depth and complexity. If you go more in depth in the stories and actually read on him, he has a lot to him. General likability is iffy, that's maybe D. Yeah, threatability, that's borderline S. He is a Justice League level threat. So yeah, I think A is fair Because Superman himself never beats him really alone. He always has some type of help. Carnage Dean.
Speaker 2:What did you say?
Speaker 1:I said Dean. I said Dean, let's roll through it. Here's my fucking broken record again Kill people. Here's my fucking broken record again Killed people.
Speaker 2:No, he's, he's caused carnage.
Speaker 1:He's borderline, caused mass genocide. So that's a little bit above. Do you want to mention Null Null? Oh yeah, he has more accomplishments. He's fought Null Maximum carnage.
Speaker 1:He was a borderline, had to call in, call in the Avengers to fucking handle him. At times he's completely unhinged. His design slightly edges Venom to me because he's red. He's the fucking bloodsplat. Aura and charisma's there because he's just fucking insane. There's not much there because Cleus Cassidy's again a serial killer. He don't really. There's not much there because Cleus Cassidy is again a serial killer. He don't really. He's not that complex. He gets a little more complex in, like some stories, but the symbiote itself took on his personality and no matter what host. It goes on to the baitability. If Carnage is a female symbiote, I think Carnage is a female symbiote. I will say that to the day I die. I don't care likeability, he's fucking nuts. Carnage is a female symbiote. I think Carnage is a female symbiote. I will say that to the day I die. I don't care Likeability, he's fucking nuts and he's fucking loved. He's a top five Spider-Man villain for sure.
Speaker 1:He comes back damn near more than Venom does. Yeah, Threat to the hero or story. Nine times out of ten it takes a Venom-Spider-Man. Actually you know for general likability throw this in.
Speaker 1:When you get a tie-in story with a DC character named Joker, you know you've made it. Yeah, because Joker says I think he's more insane than me Because that's because Joker is super insane. Yeah, threat to the hero again. Threat to the hero or story. It's Venom. Usually, venom and Spider-Man got to team up to beat him. I think Carnage is a solid. He's A or B. I'd put him in at A Think an A.
Speaker 1:I think he's an A. I do too. I think he's a low A, but he's in there Because of his. He's got a lot of high points there. Definitely, I think A I'll put Carnage in A. Well, that means most likely Venom will go there too, if he made the list. But yeah, venom's, not Venom's on here. Okay, want me to put him on here. Might as well Skip that and put Venom there. I think Venom's also A.
Speaker 1:Might as well say Venom too, Because the only thing I will say is Eddie Brock's got more character, depth and complexity than Carnage does. So, eddie Brock, I wouldn't put Venom in A. No, what'd you say? Where would you put A? I'd put him in B. You wouldn't put Carnage. Would you honestly put Carnage over Venom? I think Carnage is more of a villain than Venom.
Speaker 1:That's very true. Yeah, that logic fits. There's things on here. Venom's better like character depth and complexity. Eddie Brock is better because he's been through so much, he's probably got the better story. Yes, I agree with that. But I can understand Venom. I'm going to break our brains. The Venom movies never depict him as a villain. Yeah, he's kind of just eating bad guys. Fittingly enough, even though we went on that Venom tangent Joker was next A solid B S. That's one of the most obvious. That's Darth Vader level S Like shit. Okay, moving on. Fuck that's next. Oh, no, Like shit, Okay, moving on. Uh, fuck that's next. Oh no, Poison Ivy.
Speaker 1:Oh um, fyi, what so Carly's not on here, by the way. That's fine. She's not a villain, no more. That's not a villain. Ivy's a goddess. She's attached to the green. She's fine. She's not a villain, no more. That's not a villain. Ivy's a goddess. She's attached to the green. She's a female swap thing. That's a love story. We haven't seen, really, have we?
Speaker 2:Oh, Lord, oh God.
Speaker 1:Can you imagine that shit?
Speaker 2:Holy fuck, I'm kind of curious on how.
Speaker 1:She has turned her character around so fucking much. The green has actually accepted her Before. She used to control it by force. So see, I think so. We're not judging his character, we're judging her as a villain. I think so, honestly. She's less of a villain unless you're invested Aside from the way she goes about things. Yeah, see, see, bruce Wayne. Let me tell you something about Bruce. I got to get one comment in. Let me tell you something about Bruce Wayne. That man has the willpower of a god. Yes, because Ivy trapped him so many times trying to seduce this man, and he's like nah, I'm not with it, I'm not with it. No, I had it caved in under a millisecond. Let's put it this way Superman caved, superman, fucking caved. Superman. Bruce is just fucking resisting. That pheromone hung upside down on me. I'll give it to him. Give it to him. Why is that, fuck you?
Speaker 2:I'll give you this Penguin Damn it.
Speaker 1:I fucking, I hate Penguin. Until Colin Theroux God damn it. I hate it. I thought Penguin was so fucking lame. Until Colin Theroux I'm like, hey, you have not watched Penguin yet. Hold on, you hated Penguin even after the Arkham games. He was still just a little fat guy, and I'm like eh it was alright, but I kind of liked what they did with him in Gotham. He didn't put boys in IVNC, by the way. I know I got distracted because he said fucking.
Speaker 2:In.
Speaker 1:Gotham, they turned him gay. All them undertones with Nygma. Yeah, oh, my Nygma didn't want anything to do with it. He was like oh, you're my friend, awesome Cool. Penguin I want to be more than friends. Yeah, oh God. That's the only thing I didn't like about his character, but everything else was cool. I think. What do you think? F. Just so, I write something. You really want to put Penguin in? F. No D, I give him a C.
Speaker 2:I was leading.
Speaker 1:He may not be writing anything for the rest of this game. That's not fair. Then give him that paper. You can trade papers. Yes, please, please, there you go. Please, find places with my chicken scratch, please. I need a fucking break. I'm so fucking done with that writing shit. I'm not tired, but I'm done. I don't want writing. The rest, the rest, the rest, the rest, the rest, the rest, the rest, the rest, the rest, the rest, the rest, the rest, the rest, the rest, the rest. Oh shit, we're going to put penguin. Fuck, I gotta write again.
Speaker 1:No, we're still debating we're putting penguin in C. Okay, good, that's love. When I say hate, I mean love. All you need is love. Fuck why did.
Speaker 1:I take the fucking paper when I have to write penguin. This is becoming one of the most epic podcasts we've ever done. This is our endgame. We're on borderline delirium. Why did you take the fucking paper? When I have to write Penguin? This is becoming one of the most epic podcasts we've ever done. This is our endgame. We're on borderline delirium. This is our endgame. On your left Fuck off, he is in the cafeteria.
Speaker 2:He's on your left.
Speaker 1:You're the cameraman, I'm just running, he's kicking On your left. You're the cameraman, I'm just running, he's on your left. The fact that we're all probably over tired is making this so much better. Apocalypse Fuck. I should have laughed as hard as I did at you taking the paper. It's like, oh fuck, I got a penguin now.
Speaker 2:I should have done that.
Speaker 1:Apocalypse. Wow, that's ARS. Let's just write it right here. No, he gets D tier because everything he does is through his.
Speaker 2:He's a three-person Batman v Superman.
Speaker 1:Oh, wrong, wrong. Apocalypse, that's Zodpocalypse. Did you say apocalypse, or did you say? The planet apocalypse, oh, apocalypse is Marvel. That's where my brain is going. Is it apocalypse, marvel? I'm thinking Doomsday, doomsday's on here too, he's not a D.
Speaker 1:Apocalypse is pretty iconic to me. I'm thinking Doomsday, doomsday's on here too. He's not a D. Apocalypse is pretty iconic to me. I love Apocalypse. I almost said iPocalypse. What the fuck is an Apocalypse? Sauron Apocalyptical who the fuck? That's only if you won. I can't get him to S. I think he's an A. I read that as Korra. Which one, jojo? Hey, you want me to write down Korra for a villain? Fuck, not F. Oh no, did we put Apocalypse in A? Yes, I think he fits there. Hey, don't do what I do. I mean Accomplice fits. He's like A for Apocalypse in A. Yes, I think he fits there. Hey, don't do what I do I mean.
Speaker 1:Accomplice fits. He's like Apocalypse fits, a for Apocalypse. Well, he put it there. My disability character definitely unsub a new one. Guess where the next one's going On your page? Bane, oh fuck. Bane and B, I don't know.
Speaker 2:No, just to piss him off. So he has to write something.
Speaker 1:I have no problem writing.
Speaker 2:I haven't wrote shit that will shut a lot of shits.
Speaker 1:I love how Dr Eggman's in Jaws. Hey, our first Logan was a D, our first one was a D. Oh man, we put Bane in A. I think bane is a. He broke batman's back. Yeah, that's a big accomplishment. Impact on pop. I mean tom hardy, mr freeze, not a single one of us can not think of pringles, can. Oh, you think you're a friend of the darkness. That's right. Darkness is your ally. I was born in it, molded by it.
Speaker 1:I didn't see the light until I had become a man, mr Freeze. He said Mr Freeze, accomplishments, I mean, I can't no he's never really saved his wife.
Speaker 1:I loved it, but no he might get negative points because he's never saved his wife. That's his own thing. You know what the Batman cartoon you know? Yeah, he's more of a villain in that one because he's a thief who turns into ice powers. Oh my god, impact on pop culture. I mean. A lot of that's just because of Batman design, lots of that. A lot of that's because of Schwarzenegger. As much as we love the fucking Batman villains, the only ones that get higher than a C rank are Joker and Bane. Ah, you could maybe Rache Rache, maybe the great Leon Neeson. I'm going with C Freeze. I think that's fair. I do like Freeze. I'd like to see him in a movie, but I think that's fair. Threat to the hero. I mean, you take away his ice gun. It's like he's fucking, just like. No, you just take away his suit. I can't breathe. Yeah, I'm good Scarecrow. Oh, jesus Christ, fucking Batman out the ass here. See, I had way. No Scarecrow Mysterio for life. Oh my God, how did that come back? That?
Speaker 1:was one of our Um, I'm sadly, I'm thinking C too, cause there's, you know, he's got some aura. The Arkham game, arkham Knight, gave him some aura Cause he had a nice design in there and he was pretty creepy. Uh, there's a fucking mini games. You had to play every goddamn game because it's a girl. But I think the games the other ones were worse yeah design.
Speaker 1:Impact. Here's how much of a C character he is. He was a throwaway villain in the first Batman, uh begins, yeah. Then he was just a cameo, glorified cameo in the rest. Okay, I think C, I think C, I think C is fair. You wanted a break from DC. Ultron, that's ARS to me. Oh boy, I love class you, ultron, I bring the world to ruin. In you, ultron, I rang the world to ruin in Age of Ultron. That's a big accomplishment. Impact on pop culture I mean he's got a lot more hype because of James Spader. James Spader has helped us a lot. He's got three S's so far Character, depth and complexity. See, I don't want to do too much MCU, but I loved his design in MCU.
Speaker 1:Oh, his design was fucking spot on from the comics, because it's not like they were going to do that cosmic. They killed him too, but there's a theory that they could bring him back at any time. They really wanted, not that he's living in the internet. Character, depth and complexity the fact. Character, depth and complexity the fact that a meme is like bro was on the internet for like 10 minutes and decided humanity's gotta go, they gotta go A. So far I have 3 S's general likability and he's likable yeah we're filling up A pretty quick too, but that's okay.
Speaker 1:We got four really full characters. No, no, I'm talking about what we have criteria-wise. We have three S's, two A's, one of a threat to the hero.
Speaker 2:So S, so we have four S's and two A's.
Speaker 1:I don't know if there's a Marvel one that categorizes in that. I was going to say I think we do got as much as I, as much, as he's very top tier for.
Speaker 2:Marvel.
Speaker 1:I don't know if I can get it, because the only time I thought he was so s they gave him the infinity gauntlet oh my god, embedded in his body. The problem is the only s comic character we have is Joker so far, and I can't put Ultron next to Joker. That's part of the issue, not even in 1F series.
Speaker 1:That's one instance versus we have several instances Tactically now, thanks to the Disney Plus series. The only one that I could, the only fucked up, one of the. There are two Marvel that might be MCU, though, but the only two Marvels I'm might be MCU, though, but the only two Marvels I'm thinking about. One should be on there. Doom's got to be on there. So is Thanos. Those are the only ones that might. I think we've got to keep I know he's actually leaning somebody else over Thanos. We'll see when we get there, but I think we've got to keep Ultron just at A for now. He could get Very high A. I think he'd be a high A. He's creeping on S though. Loki Beef, we gotta fuck, see. The problem is I'm trying to do you don't disagree with me. No, I don't necessarily disagree. I'm trying to differentiate from MCU and comics. So I'm trying to.
Speaker 2:That's why I said B.
Speaker 1:But it is the comic category, so I gotta kinda Dean. If you go MCU, he was only a villain in two movies. He's also not a villain in a lot of the comic books. He switches in between. So I think B is fair, because he can be a villain and when he can be a hero he was basically only a villain in the 60s and 70s.
Speaker 1:As soon as the 80s hit, he was a switch. Oh my god, why my ass beat. Un-fucking-believable Shut up. Red Skull S for SS, nazi Waffen-S. Oh my god, did you use triple S, triple S? Oh my god, I think I can't see he's Captain America's number one villain. I don't think I can get him to C. I think it's B or A. B because he's a one trope guy. I'll put Bane. Did Bane make it to a? Yes, okay, uh, I'm on b. Accomplishments outside of founding hydra. He usually just gets mollywop by cap a lot. Yeah, there's other. I mean, impact on pop culture is the only thing that helps him. Design and aura Charisma. If you take into account old man Logan, he took over the world.
Speaker 2:Let's not go there.
Speaker 1:You're like that's not gold, he knows it. I know exactly what you want to do, but that'd be switching fucking characters, different fucking villain, and if that villain is not on that list, oh you don't want to talk about. Yeah, they did Hulk Dirty and he's inbred. Are you talking about the inbred Hulk?
Speaker 2:Maestro.
Speaker 1:I think it'd be for Red Skull. I think B is fair. I think B is fair, Definitely fair. Doomsday oh okay, Doomsday is weird because he arguably has the greatest accomplishment in all of comics. He killed Superman Jay's like fuck. I can't dispute that. Fuck, Definitely wasn't the Ninja Turtle Doomsday Impact on. He killed Super. Oh my god, he could almost say he killed Superman for every fucking thing. Oh fuck, Do you try to sound like a broken record again? No, I'm not.
Speaker 2:I'm being honest, he killed Superman.
Speaker 1:Design and aura. He killed Superman. Oh, that's a fitting, since we already talked about Venom. The next name on the list is Galactus. Oh my god, Remember Doomsday? No Galactus. Oh, I was like Doomsday, no Galactus. Oh, I was like Doomsday. I could easily A. I don't know if I could throw him into S. I don't think I can throw him into S.
Speaker 1:Considering his new story arc is where he's the ruler of time In DC. That would make no sense. Why are you Doomsday could? Because he can't die. He literally comes to Superman for help to die, but he can't die. He literally comes to Superman for help to die. Superman, help me, kill me. I think A is fair. A is fair.
Speaker 1:The man got the A on basically one accomplishment Killing Superman. One accomplishment it was Galactus. I already said B. Yeah, I think B is fair. Galactus doesn't really do shit much because he eats planets, but Reed just reeds them every time he fucking calls.
Speaker 1:I'll iterate off of what you said. Galactus don't do shit much. Oh yeah, so much that he turned into a cloud. Oh my God, that was so bad. But again, like I was saying, the best thing he did was spawn a daughter that the internet loves. A normal human, smart, very smart man keeps him at bay, just like come on, get out of here. I've got to deal with you. Get out of my. Okay, I leave Franklin. Come on, tylee, go away. Go away. Big planet-eating man who's actually not that big. He's a little dude in a suit, big ass, fucking suit. But B is fair Two-Face. You know Batman's got a very consistent rogues gallery. But besides Joker and Bane, it's hard to get him above B. I would actually you know this is sad of me to say it but Two-Face B Really yes. I mean why? Because he doesn't get out of that thug range. He doesn't do anything in the story, not really. He's never really a big player, he's always a street level kind of guy.
Speaker 1:Scarecrow always impacts Gotham as a whole, Mr Freeze as a whole. Penguin has like that whole underground. Yeah, I give Penguin that. Yeah, Ivy same thing Depth and complexity. My face is scarred so I'm emotional and pissed off about it. He's got multiple personality disorder and only one personality really takes over.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I think, D is actually fair. I think he's classic. You can't say he's not classic, but he's kind of a weak villain. They threw him away in the second movie, yeah, because you didn't see him in the third. Yeah, riddler, see, we're putting all of Batman's in C. I can't put him higher than that. If you talk about his accomplishments, what has he done? Get out smarter by Batman on every fucking episode. No, think about the. What was it? The Joker Wars? Yeah, didn't he start that?
Speaker 2:Yeah, I got it.
Speaker 1:That's about his only accomplishment, really. Yeah, impact on pop culture. Yeah, his only impact on pop culture is related to Adam West, his fucking suit and his riddles. Yeah, his design, aura, his riddles. Yeah, his design, aura and charisma. His design has damn near been the same in everything except for the Arkham games. He's decent charisma, though, even though his charisma always gets crushed when Batman outsmarts him. Yes, character depth and complexity.
Speaker 1:There's a lot of depth there because he hasn't been very aura-y. I forgot about the design and aura. There's a lot of depth there because he has an inferiority complex. I forgot about the design and aura. Jim Carrey played him. He has an inferiority complex to Batman.
Speaker 2:I think C.
Speaker 1:Because he can't. Yeah, he's got to always prove himself to Batman, Because Batman keeps on proving he's smarter. Blame the smarter man. How could you have possibly solved that riddle? So this here's my other, when all you had to do was press a button in the game, right. So here is my candidate for S outside of Doom Magneto.
Speaker 1:No, no, can I be the dick of group and say A I mean you can. I mean he's that high. He is high. Yeah, he was my outside camp Accomplishments. The only reason that puts him outside of that S-Villain tier is because he's now the leader of the X-Men. He is literally the good guy. I mean he was, wasn't he a leader and very instrumental in establishing Krakoa to their country. He is literally the good guy. I mean he was, wasn't he a leader and very instrumental in establishing Krakoa too?
Speaker 2:Yes, their country.
Speaker 1:Their island. If I remember correctly, he used his own powers to raise the fucking island. Of course, fucking Magneto Raise that shit. Impact on pop culture.
Speaker 2:That's very high.
Speaker 1:That's his S? Tier. His design is also S tier. Oh, I've seen some Character depth and complexity S tier. He has three S's right there that help you. I think Magneto is S the other ones are what hurt him His threat to hero and story.
Speaker 2:I mean he's a very high threat to hero.
Speaker 1:It takes a whole team Half the time it takes. His general likability A lot of Is usually around the AB range. His likability is he's a sympathetic villain. You can understand. He survived the Holocaust. So you have three S's and three A's. Yeah, rhett to the hero. I think he takes a. It takes a whole team to beat him and half the time they beat him their plan is to get his helmet off so Charles can shut him down. Like what the fuck? The fact that this man beat and it's obvious, but the aura of just defeating Wolverine by just drowning him.
Speaker 1:Fucking skeleton, I'm throwing you in the fucking water. If you have any kind of metal, you're fucked, and a lot of the heroes do. The sad part about it is the human body already has metal. Someone tried I gotta bring this up for comedic purposes someone tried to debate me in like high school, I think, or maybe I was at, I don't know. Maybe I was at work, maybe I think it was high school. Someone tried to debate me literally. It's like I don't know. I think Iron man could take Magneto. Bro. My ears started ringing after that. Bro, where's your? I think Magneto was asked when the? Are you serious? He's turning Iron man into a tin. Can you know how little cubes that cars turn into when you smush them? That's what he's turning Tony into. Yup Kingpin. Oh, that hurts, I can't put him that high, but I like Kingpin. He's A or E. Thanks, I can see it. He became the mayor of New York. Oh, we're getting it in the show too.
Speaker 1:He's running for mayor Impact on pop culture. It's gotten better since D'Anfario's been playing him. This guy's an amazing fucking actor. There's nothing he's in that doesn't do successful Design and aura's up there. Except for Echo. Oh god, he's got a presence, he's got some depth and complexity, because he, uh, because Vanessa, vanessa, what?
Speaker 2:do you yell it out like that it?
Speaker 1:kind of sounded like the way Vincent says it. I mean, you got Vanessa, then you got DC, you got Martha. It had to come up once. Likeability. I think he's pretty likable. Ah, Kingpin is too.
Speaker 2:Where do we?
Speaker 1:have Doomsday. I'm moving him down because of that. Oh fuck, oh my god. That wasn't his fault. He's still in the movie. Didn't give his character creation any justice either.
Speaker 2:No, it didn't.
Speaker 1:Oh boy, that's the threat to the hero or story. I mean, he's a big threat to it. Do we have to give him credit for killing Peter Parker in Spider-Verse?
Speaker 2:Fuck, that's bullshit.
Speaker 1:He? I mean, that was Goblin. Don't care, that was Goblin. He finished him off the story. Um, it's a threat. He's a big threat to Daredevil. He gets some good licks. Spider-man has some trouble with him. That's only because Peter holds back. We've seen what happens at Kingpin when Peter stops holding back. Yeah, that's where you're putting him. That's tough. What do you think? Do you think B or A, I think he's B.
Speaker 1:I think B. I think B. I think B Because he's I. I think B. I can't quite get him to A because but if he gets a couple more like little good stories he could move up the thing is I think he's B because I think the next guy is A that's how I'll put it.
Speaker 1:As far as villains, when it comes to comics, if they're a very likable villain, they get their own story. Yep, which leads me into why I think this guy's A, the next guy's A, lex Lex, has a case for F. That's up me into why I think this guy's A, the next guy's A, lex Lex, has a case for S. That's up for a lot of people too. What about that? You want to say that one again?
Speaker 2:Lex has a case for.
Speaker 1:S oh, wow, superman. Where is he? Where's Superman doing? He's a villain. We gotta take him out. Take him out, take him out Accomplishments. He's never theoretically been Superman. Yeah, he's become president.
Speaker 2:God, god I like how that broke?
Speaker 1:No, my brain instantly went Trump. I know, I know why it broke your brain. No, my brain instantly went.
Speaker 2:Trump.
Speaker 1:I know, I know why it broke your brain. I know why it did it earlier. Was Trump in the battle suit? Elon might Come on. Barron says Polite. Barron says we get he likes before. Trump is Fuck, no, barron, if Trump ever got shot. Barron's is political. Barron's is we get Lex before Trump is fuck, no, barron, if Trump ever got shot. Barron's Batman Legit. Barron's just Batman. Oh, he's got the fucking skull for it. Barron's like six foot eight. It's fucking like bro Lex, I, I, I have minimum an A oh, minimum A, yes. Character depth and complexity. The S's, s yeah, yeah. How do you want to say that? I said it how I said it? Fucking shit. That's really what's the S stand for hope fuck.
Speaker 1:Lex has no hope. Nicholas Holt maybe will give him hope. I fucking hope so. At least it's not Eisenberg again. Oh god. The problem is threat to the hero or story In physical like, even in his battle suit, unless he has kryptonite he don't really pose much of a threat to Superman, unless he has his kryptonite. He don't really pose much of a threat to Superman Unless he has his Kryptonite, because usually it's Superman. His battle suit lets him stay in the fight if he's fighting Superman.
Speaker 2:Here's the thing.
Speaker 1:Lex is more of the strategic type of villain than he is. He'll go out there and throw hands if he has to, but he will manipulate things in the background and say I didn't do it, yeah, before he ever tries to actually throw hands with Superman, because he knows that will accomplish nothing. And Lex is built like a brick shithouse If you look at it, he's built like a. Let's not forget that he built a fucking android to protect himself. Was that a mazo Stacy, stacy, okay, his fucking bodyguard, oh yeah.
Speaker 1:That always follows him around. Yeah, used to be a real woman until something or other happened. I forget what it is in the comics, but then he turned her into an android. I'm gonna go A. I think A. I think very high A Because he's being attached to Superman. Multiple movies with him Gets his own comic. Irona what Irona. That's where we were leaning. I drop him a little for design. Lexus never had an amazing. Even his battle suit to me is meh.
Speaker 1:I don't know what you're talking about that white suit, bald head type thing, bald head, juggernaut, boy Juggernaut might be like what Bitch B I?
Speaker 2:was almost leaning Juggernaut bitch. I was also Juggernaut bitch, I was also leading.
Speaker 1:I'm a juggernaut bitch. I'm a juggernaut bitch. I was also leading C or B. That's C or B Because there's not. There's not much. He just runs and won't stop. I mean, I like his origin, that he's magic-based and not a mutant. That's cool. He's powered by a fucking demon. We're gonna to give him he's a big threat Villain-wise C. Okay, I think so. Okay, I'll go C. I was in that range. I'll go C. Well, accomplishments, Think about it.
Speaker 2:I mean, he's always.
Speaker 1:What has he accomplished? Not much. He created a son who turned into a hero. That's about as much accomplishment as I can think of.
Speaker 2:He always gets stopped.
Speaker 1:Spider-man stopped him by drowning him in concrete Impact on pop culture. That's his big one. Design and aura that's another big one. It's decent, but it's Character, depth and complexity. I'm up there. Well, there's a bit there, but you can't really go into it on a podcast unless we had another three hours. Yeah, general likability that's kind of mad to me because people like Juggernaut. That's the reason I'm going for C. Threat he's a threat, but he's been stopped. It's real retarded.
Speaker 1:It's a little too easy to write him plot-wise. He's been stopped a little too easily.
Speaker 2:Spider-Man stopped him by drowning him in concrete.
Speaker 1:Getting rid of his power gem, drowning him in concrete C. That was almost the wrong one. Ra's al Ghul, I'm going to let. I could do some yap, but I'm gonna let. Jay Jay gotta take the lead on this one, oh man.
Speaker 2:Oh man.
Speaker 1:He gave me Talia. He gave me Talia. That's an accomplishment. He gave Damian Wayne, he gave me Talia. Hey, hey, other than fucking the last Batman movie, probably it was the shit Impact on pop culture he is so fucking liked he got a major actor to play him, greatly at that. That was great portrayal Design and aura, dean Design and aura is Dean Design and aura is pretty high. He might be the actual reason. I like goatees, like facial hair-wise, character, depth and complexity.
Speaker 2:Lazarus.
Speaker 1:Pit. The man stays alive damn near for fucking ever, until he goes crazy and his daughter has to kill him for the last time. I still like the fact that he's got a fucking, except for that one Batman story where he takes over his daughter's.
Speaker 1:I like when he feels bad for Jason Todd. He's got to put Jason Todd in there. He's the reason we have fucking Jason Todd alive and Jason Todd is. Every time he fucking sees a crowbar he's like, oh no. There's only one story I don't like with Rache and that's the Batman Beyond story where he is his daughter Talia oh God Remember where he actually convinces Bruce Wayne to go into the Lazarus pit. Yeah, I think so. Oh, that was a really fucked up fucking story because him and Bruce actually kissed. Oh yeah, dude, batman Beyond went through it. That's called going through it, jesus. Bruce was worse because he realized he kissed Ra's al Ghul. Are you between B and C or A and B? I will go with. I would personally go with A but B because he hasn't had an impact on DC as a whole. It's just Batman.
Speaker 2:I'll agree.
Speaker 1:I'll agree. I'll agree. At least we got a Batman villain besides Bane and Joker out of frickin' one goal, god damn it. I don't even do it on Barbie TV. I actually don't know how to. R-a-s, r-a-apostrophe-s yeah, that's what I thought. A-l-g-h-u-l Gorilla Grodd oh god, I don't.
Speaker 2:I wish he deserved.
Speaker 1:I wish he deserved higher than a C. Captain Cold's on there, it's probably Captain Cold, no, it's Reverse Flash. I wish Grodd deserved higher than a C. I am mad. I think Grodd deserved higher than a C I am mad.
Speaker 1:I think Grodd will be C, because I think there's potential, but they don't ever use him. I think Jay's right. The best they did was in the fucking CW show and they can't use him all the time Because he's too expensive. Next is actually Reverse Flash. Ooh, that's, I'm gonna tell you. I think, jay, might. You might contend, I think reverse clash would get reverse flash could get the a.
Speaker 1:I think he's an a I think, man, man, man, I'm gonna bring up flash boy, but man, this constantly going back in time to say fuck you to Barry, he's a fucking menace. Oh no, hey, you know what he was. He's the original. It was me. Yeah, it was me. You saw, you did that, but it was me, reverse Flash. He was the original deal, bro. Reverse Flash did give me Thomas Wayne Batman in a way, because it was. He gave you Martha Wayne as fucking Joker. I can't. You know one thing, I gotta say I still. The fucking Reverse Flash got a good meme to me where he's talking to Barry and he voiced him over like Barry, remember that time, time you were with Iris, you didn't, she didn't make you Plum Berry, I ripped you off at super speed. That just lives in my head. Of course it does. I wrote Dr Doom in S Wait, wait, did we put Reverse Flash in A? Yeah, I think he is in A. I like Reverse Flash.
Speaker 1:And he got that drip when he got the white coat. He stopped the incursion. Accomplishments Pick one Impact he was able to control the fucking zombies of Marvel Design and aura. That's top tier.
Speaker 1:Except for your birthday, doom. That was Crash Test. Dummy Doom, that's got one of those. Except for your birthday, doom. That was Crash Test. Nummy Doom, that's what it looked like.
Speaker 1:Character depth Doom's got great character. He's not necessarily evil. What year was that? 2010? 2012? 2015-ish, 2015? He's not necessarily bad. He's just always looking out for that bear, even though sometimes he's like I'm going to be god of the world, I'm gonna be sorcerer supreme. Now again, ah, likability. Doom's love threat. He's always a threat, for god's sakes.
Speaker 1:One of my favorite little lives, a small story, but spider-man with the balls of steel thought doom kidnapped mary jane and spider-man goes up in the lat vera. He's fighting all the doom bots and shit. Though doom comes out like and it was funny, bro, what are you doing here? You kidnapped Mary Jane. Give her back, bro. I did not kidnap Mary Jane. She's not here. Look around. She's not my bad, peter Luke, she's not here. Look at, it's an actual story.
Speaker 1:Mystique, jj, call me. No, no, no, no. If you say Jennifer Lawrence, mystique, you'll go. F, f, do it. I can't put her at F. Mystique's pretty cool. B. Can we, though C or D? I think B is a little too high for Mystique. I don't think she deserves a C. I think she might, just because of how much she can fuck with you, in what way, both Mentally and physically. The fact that she is her own man, she's the father, oh my god. Hey, it is your type, you can be anything I want. I mean, it's got me in the mood for it Just for the fuckability with Dean.
Speaker 1:Oh fuck, why are these two side by side? Now that I see that I don't know 29 is Thanos and 30 is Darkseid. Darkseid, yeah, darkseid and Thanos, yeah. Oh my god, I need a different type of seed. Holy shit, we might have fucking. That's a tie. We might have two S's. I can't get Darkseid out of S Hell. No, I don't think I can put the Thanos completely in S I don't think I can put the C'thanos completely in S I don't know.
Speaker 1:I was putting him in A. Who has more of a say to S, darkseid or Thanos? Darkseid has a raise to me.
Speaker 1:Really, Are we doing this again? Yes, Okay, Okay. I think Darkseid accomplishments shit the whole Justice League. They don't ever beat him, they just push him back for a little bit until he comes back. When you said this was a special fucking episode, you weren't fucking kidding. This is an extravaganza. I'm all here for it. I had a great time. Goddammit Impact on pop culture. It's fucking Dark Side Design and Dark Side's had some killer-ass designs. Omegabeam man, OmegaBeam's character. I don't think you're getting either of us to decline Darkseid as an S. It's Thanos. I'm going through it to yap a little bit. I mean, like, about Darkseid threat to the hero. I think we've yapped enough. I don't think we need to hit the big guns with much. Thanos is probably where we need a debate.
Speaker 2:A little bit.
Speaker 1:Thanos is tough. He's claimed to feign his MCU-wise. Yeah, thanos copter, I love you Death. Sorry, I like Deadpool better.
Speaker 2:No. And that decreases his accomplishments he is kind of he is kind of a little bitch boy for Lady.
Speaker 1:I love you, love me to never die, love me. I still don't get that. Arguably that's his biggest impact on pop culture is still the snap. That's his greatest thing, yeah funny thing and that didn't even happen to fucking comics funny thing?
Speaker 2:no, this is just.
Speaker 1:Well, he's had the Infinity Gauntlet.
Speaker 2:I mean the funny thing is he's only snapped it in the original comic. We've had a theoretical fucking yeah, but he didn't get rid of half the universe.
Speaker 1:We've had a theoretical fucking. Theoretically. A quick thing is Thanos and Darkseid actually fought their battle, didn't I, so agreed with their outcome. They gave Thanos the gauntlet They'd bring up something that'd be cool in that fight, darkseid could boom tube him out of the Marvel, out of a universe where the fucking Infinity Gauntlet don't work and Thanos is just fucking boned. I'm not a big fan of his design. He's got an aura. Thanos is jacked up grimace. Are you talking about his worm chin? I mean that's a variation.
Speaker 1:Thanos is grimace if you fucking hit the shit he's not drinking the shakes.
Speaker 1:I'm not a big fan of his comic book edition. What? Okay, I will give you one, jay, I'm sorry in advance. I will give you one, jay, I'm sorry in advance. I will give you one Thanos that had fucking Just the max aura, mcu King Thanos and had a white beard. He conquered the world. He killed every single Avenger, except for Hulk. Hulk was his pet. That's the reason why the MCU Hulk was straight. I'm not kidding you, jay, hulk was his pet, he was the only.
Speaker 1:Avenger alive, but he was his pet. You realize that story was its thing. And then they did a fucking side story where Maestro fucking came in and broke that and Thanos is an A-level threat. I don't think he's an S-level threat Without the Infinity Gauntlet, without the Infinity Gauntlet, without the Infinity Gauntlet.
Speaker 1:Sadly. There are stories where the Guardians of the Galaxy take him out, yeah, yeah. And there's a story where he captured the Avengers and one of the most random duos ever goes up to free him, and I love that story. It's Spider-Man and Thing Nope, nope, nope, biggest one, yet, not Squirrel Girl. No, he lost to one person. Squirrel Girl, I'd lose to that thickness too. That's not how he lost.
Speaker 2:Nuts Okay.
Speaker 1:I guess he did lose that way. I think Thanos is an A, I'm fine with A. I'm fine with A, I'm fine with A. All right, we got three left. Oh, here we go, we're at the heavy. The heavy ears are gone. We got some Fs, we got some crap. Which Stro do you want? Sinestro or Mysterio Mysterio? Fuck. Mysterio goes right next to Scarecrow and see Kinda, that was a joke. Oh, fuck you, you're making a Mysterio joke again. Sadly, I think Mysterio C is still a solid villain. I think he does gotta go with C and Sinestro. Hmm, I mean, sinestro might be a B. I'm thinking Sinestro, power is fear yeah, right there with Scarecrow, uh huh, might be a B. I'm thinking Sinestro Power is fear. Yeah, right there with Scarecrow, uh-huh.
Speaker 2:Thank you. You know what's sad Even Sinestro's had parallax for a bit Internet's going to hate me for saying this.
Speaker 1:You know what's sad about Sinestro? What he's a B tier villain. Yeah yeah, I mean, he's a Green Lantern's Fucking best villain. You can make Parallax maybe we're doing a tier list, so am I putting him at B? I think he's fine in B. He's probably he's got Sinister's name, but he barely does anything. Him in B. I think he's fine in B. He's probably Lance. He's got Sin in his name, but he barely does anything. He's probably fucking Hal's best villain. He only turned villain because he was trying to do good.
Speaker 2:Yeah God that's fucked up.
Speaker 1:Think about Manny Bellens. I'm trying to do good but I'm doing it wrong. And the final name is that's true, oh, for, I knew it, I knew it. He's referencing the movie Judas Contra. Oh, fuck, yes, f Just because of that movie, just because of that storyline, F he has a heavily implied relationship with Tara, who's obviously underage. He was the worst groomer of them all.
Speaker 2:He worked at.
Speaker 1:Hisoka.
Speaker 2:Oh God Hisoka came back.
Speaker 1:Yes, he's worse than Hisoka Because he's hands-on, oh my yeah, Hisoka just kind of hip thrusts and gets all happy.
Speaker 1:Oh God, and you can't forget. Oh why does this story live in my identity crisis where he's defending Dr Light who killed him and assaulted children? He's defending him too. Before you completely like that, I should have asked for a picture of that. It's too late. I mean, he's had some good classic fights and some good moments. I think Deathstroke would be me. You do not want to put him high because of that fucking movie. It's not even just the movie, it's a story, it's an actual story Judas Contract, an actual story.
Speaker 1:Judas Contract is a fucking Teen Titans story.
Speaker 1:Where he's basically a pedo and the movie wasn't far off of what happened in the comics. The problem is they left it up to interpretation. The movie, actually, hey, I was liking the movie. I was liking the movie. I was liking the movie. Slade's in his chair, chilling, driving the fucking thing, and Tara walks in in her bra and pant. I'm like whoa, what the fuck going on here. That didn't. Oh man, alright, just for that. Now we gotta go to fucking Lost World. Shout out to Lost World of Wonders, the best comic. Go to fucking Lost World, hey, shout out to Lost World of Wonders, the best comic book. Shout out to Lost World of Wonders and HiHiAnimeShop. Sponsor us, please, like we did. Sponsor we could. We're pretty S-tier. He pays enough. I didn't buy a bunny. Okay, seriously, Deathstroke is the last one. Design it. Design Aura's up there, cause you got one of the most badass. He inspired Deadpool did. Can you can? Did Deathstroke come first? Yes, he did. I think he's a Wade Wilson.
Speaker 2:I know it's like what the fuck? I think he's upbeat Iade.
Speaker 1:Wilson, wade Wilson, I know it's like what the fuck? I think he's a, b. I don't know what Matt thinks. Yeah, he is a bitch. Oh my god, he fucked a bitch, god damn it yeah an under under under age. Shut up D. You know what pisses me off about that was cause I absolutely love the Teen Titans. You know Cartoon Network show. And then that shit came out. I see Lopi, our last character is a fucking bee. Hey bee, just chilling with all these motherfuckers.
Speaker 2:Okay.
Speaker 1:I would personally like to thank everyone For listening to our. I hope you listen to our, to our rambling, to our legendary Fucking Fictional villain tier list. Coming up next will probably Be a heroes tier list at some point. It's not gonna be our next video. It's not gonna be the our next video. It's not going to be the next video. Oh yeah, the movies. Here come the movies again. Here come the movies. That should be the name of the next episode. Here come the movies. Not July, oh, that's July. Here come the movies when I'm going to end up paying rent to my parents. You live here. Pay rent, fuck, next month, alright well thank you.
Speaker 1:Can you hear that? Did my dad or my mom actually listen to me in this episode? What did he just say Rent Dad, rent, Rent. What do you mean? Rent? I get money. Alright, goodnight, everyone. See you soon.
