Have you ever wondered how it feels to care for a child with complex medical needs? We've got the insider scoop for you, direct from the heart of a parent in the thick of it, battling insurance bureaucracy, juggling career advancements, and dealing with unexpected family health scares that life seems to throw as curveballs. Personal, relatable, and raw - our talk is an open book that peels back layers of fear, guilt, and the innate human capacity to endure and adapt.
In this episode, we tackle the all-too-familiar financial fears that go hand-in-hand with managing medical complexities. We share first-hand experiences about balancing medical costs, insurance, and maintaining a semblance of normalcy in family life. It's not all doom and gloom, though. We discuss resources and strategies that have been our lifeline, including the importance of accepting help and nurturing open communication within our relationships.
Finally, we delve into the emotional labyrinth of parenting a child with medical complexities. Expect conversations about fostering empathy in our children, discussing feelings of isolation and loneliness, and reminding ourselves that it's okay not to have all the answers. After all, we are all capable of more than we often give ourselves credit for. Join us for an episode that is as empowering as it is empathetic, brimming with hope for every parent navigating medical complexities. Tune in for a dose of courage, resilience, and unwavering love.
Get your copy of She is Charlotte: A Mother’s Physical, Emotional, and Spiritual Journey with Her Child with Medical Complexities by Emily K Whiting on Amazon
To get more personal support, connect with us directly at: CharlottesHopeFoundation.org
Email: Contact@CharlottesHopeFoundation.org
Facebook: Charlotte's Hope Foundation
Instagram: CharlottesHopeFoundationInc
Have you ever wondered how it feels to care for a child with complex medical needs? We've got the insider scoop for you, direct from the heart of a parent in the thick of it, battling insurance bureaucracy, juggling career advancements, and dealing with unexpected family health scares that life seems to throw as curveballs. Personal, relatable, and raw - our talk is an open book that peels back layers of fear, guilt, and the innate human capacity to endure and adapt.
In this episode, we tackle the all-too-familiar financial fears that go hand-in-hand with managing medical complexities. We share first-hand experiences about balancing medical costs, insurance, and maintaining a semblance of normalcy in family life. It's not all doom and gloom, though. We discuss resources and strategies that have been our lifeline, including the importance of accepting help and nurturing open communication within our relationships.
Finally, we delve into the emotional labyrinth of parenting a child with medical complexities. Expect conversations about fostering empathy in our children, discussing feelings of isolation and loneliness, and reminding ourselves that it's okay not to have all the answers. After all, we are all capable of more than we often give ourselves credit for. Join us for an episode that is as empowering as it is empathetic, brimming with hope for every parent navigating medical complexities. Tune in for a dose of courage, resilience, and unwavering love.
Get your copy of She is Charlotte: A Mother’s Physical, Emotional, and Spiritual Journey with Her Child with Medical Complexities by Emily K Whiting on Amazon
To get more personal support, connect with us directly at: CharlottesHopeFoundation.org
Email: Contact@CharlottesHopeFoundation.org
Facebook: Charlotte's Hope Foundation
Instagram: CharlottesHopeFoundationInc
Whether you've just been blindsided by your child's diagnosis or you've been in the trenches of their complex medical needs for a while empowered by hope, is here for you, though we wish you didn't know this heartache.
Speaker 2:We're so glad you found us so together we can walk this journey in hope. Hello and welcome to Empowered by Hope. This is Emily Whiting, here with Ashlyn Thompson. We are so excited about today's episode. I think it's relevant to everyone who has a child with medical complexities. And today's episode is all about how you are capable.
Speaker 2:And our last episode was focused on guilt and we called it the Green-eyed Monster of guilt, and we talked a lot about the different forms of guilt and how it can affect our care for our child, and we thought the natural progression was oftentimes, when we first learn of a diagnosis for our child or when we're in the midst of navigating that diagnosis, we battle these feelings of guilt and also fear, and they almost kind of seem to do this tango with each other, and fear can make us feel like we are very incapable. And so we thought, okay, we're going to tackle this right up front about just how capable those of you who are listening are to navigate this world of medical complexities. So, before we dive into too much content and get too excited, figured we can start out with just catching up with what's going on in our lives a little bit. So, ashlyn, you have had a lot going on. Fill us in of the latest.
Speaker 1:I would Well thank you everybody for joining us today and listening to Emily get us started. I have to laugh. We're almost becoming a little bit of like mythbusters for things that try to confuse you and make you think that you cannot do this. But if you're here you can do it. That's right, all right. So I'm going to jump in to share a little bit about what's going on.
Speaker 1:The last episode I mentioned to you all that we are pursuing a surgery for Emory, that is, in London. We are now in what I'm sure is a very familiar weight game to many of you the insurance weight. So it is a little bit different trying to get coverage for healthcare outside of the country, let alone in operation. But we are in that weight period which drives me a little bit crazy. So I am trying to focus on the things I can do instead of obsessing over my email on the things I can't control Right.
Speaker 1:Aside from that, I also, kind of last minute last week, decided to apply for the manager role in my department and my marketing job. I'm not really sure. I just kind of felt like you know what. I already know how to do this job. I'm not really sure I want to deal with training somebody who doesn't know how to do this job right now. I mean more positively than it sounds, but I decided to go for it and I was offered the job a couple of days later, which is really exciting and is helpful. Right now, I'm a little intimidated by possibly more responsibility, but the cool thing about when you have a kid who faces mountains like ours do, it helps keep a really good perspective and I'm now able to look at this job as you know what. I've done things a lot harder. I've faced things a lot scarier. So, yeah, pretty sure I can do this, and the world's not going to stop if I don't do it perfectly.
Speaker 2:Yes, oh, that's such good perspective, isn't that so true? After going through what we've been through at, you know, everything just gets a whole different perspective, and what used to feel so impossible is now you know. Yeah, yeah, we'll figure it out.
Speaker 1:No big thing, right? Yes, exactly. So I am grateful for that, because I wasn't somebody who was like that previously to this journey. I was very, very, very shy and hesitant in work. I knew I had the talent, but I was always so soft spoken and always felt like I just needed to be in support roles. I'm not really sure why, but once I got my black belt and advocacy, apparently that changed how I approach work. So I decided to use those skills on this new adventure.
Speaker 1:One other thing I want to share with you and then I'll toss it over to you, emily is I just want to bring up how it is interesting and frustrating, but also comforting all at the same time, how life just keeps going on and piling on, no matter what's going on in our lives with our kids. Right, I felt like, okay, I am tackling trying to secure the opportunity for a life changing surgery for my daughter and another country, which would require us to relocate for six to seven weeks. Surely that is enough. Then decided to throw on well, let's get a new position in my company with more responsibility. Okay, that should be enough.
Speaker 1:But then my grandmother, who I call Nani and is one of the rocks in my life, love her got referred to an oncologist this week because a weird spot on her arm had turned into a knot, which apparently is a tumor, and they are not sure if it is malignant or not. But the plan is to take that out December 5th. So appreciate any prayers and positive vibes. Just think Nani in your head. Yes, but I had a moment where I just didn't handle it all very well yesterday. I got really, really mad because I felt like life was being very pushy, very unfair and just not very conscientious of the fact I have more than enough going on Right right, I didn't really need it anymore.
Speaker 1:Does anybody else ever have?
Speaker 2:those thoughts, oh man, Girlfriend, so many times yes.
Speaker 1:So that's just a wrap up. We will talk more about that as we continue in this conversation. But what I want to say in some of that is it has definitely had me questioning am I capable of handling all this? Do I really have what it takes inside of me to keep all these plates in the air, keep juggling all these balls? And thankfully I'm in a place that I believe that I am that person and I do have that ability, and Emily and I are looking forward to talking to you about how you can see your own capabilities. But before we get there, emily, we know that you have more than enough on your plate, so please do share.
Speaker 2:Well, it's funny, as I'm listening to you speak about your overwhelm, I'm relating very much this week. So I didn't realize until last Friday, when I looked at the calendar for the week ahead, that my husband was going to be gone for seven days for work and various travel. That was pre-scheduled, and I just didn't look ahead far enough. Because for those of you who you know I mean all of you can relate to this. When I've come to learn, I used to be a very big planner. Look ahead, have my calendar organized. I'm still super organized, but with the amount of just honestly, chaos and constant change that happens in our lives, especially with medical complexities, it's so hard to look past one week at a time and even then it's like one day at a time. So anyway, I'm looking at the calendar on Friday and I freaked out because I'm thinking seven days parenting by myself, three children, one who's in pain every single day needs a lot of medical attention, blah, blah, blah, all these things. And then I find out that our kitchen is getting painted this week too, and I knew the painter was coming sometime soon. I just didn't know it was going to be this week. So then we live in this old farmhouse. So there's lead paint probably somewhere in the layers of paint that are on those cupboards. So I pack up everybody, pack up the kitchen, move it down to the basement, pack up my kids, move to my parents' house for the week.
Speaker 2:Meanwhile, next week we have a procedure for Charlotte and it's really not a big procedure. It's really to just buy us time till we do the big one in December, but it's still a procedure nonetheless. It's anesthesia, it's a four-hour drive to get to the right hospital, to the right surgeon, and then a four-hour drive back and an overnight stay and babysitters for the other kids and yada, yada, yada. So, yeah, I had a few moments this week where I kept thinking I don't know if I can survive this week, like I know I'm strong but I am not superwoman. But I had to keep coming back to okay, one day at a time. I have no idea where we're going to live tomorrow. I still have my parents, but we'll figure it out. And the kitchen is looking lovely.
Speaker 1:And what color is the kitchen being painted? Oh, I'm so excited.
Speaker 2:So the top is white, the top cabinets are white, the bottom is a gray, and then the walls are going to be kind of a gray white, a lighter color.
Speaker 2:So pretty modern, I like that it is, yes, a big upgrade. Yeah, our kitchen is straight from the 60s, so it's going to be very exciting, you know, and we had every intention of doing a whole lot more remodeling before we had children. We also intended on moving before we had children and then, you know, life happened and we received this massive diagnosis. Life just got, you know, pressed pause and, honestly, it all worked out to be for the better. But it's just amazing how goals change and timelines shift and what was going to be a three year home turned into a 10 year home. Now we're remodeling the kitchen finally.
Speaker 1:Well, yay for that. We are for any wins. But speaking of wins, I know you also have something else that's pretty exciting that is coming up. That, I believe, is a very big win.
Speaker 2:Yes, I'm waiting for the proof of the book she is Charlotte, that's the title to show up on my front door in the mail. I'm very excited. We are getting ready for it to be available on Amazon in just a few short weeks, and so the latest proof is on its way via UPS right now to my house, and when it shows up, I cannot wait. When my husband gets home, I'm going to hand him. The kids go hide somewhere and read an edit. So, yes, that should be available. Well, it will be available December 3rd on Amazon. And it's very exciting. And the story of from when we received the diagnosis at the 20 week ultrasound to when we left the NICU, which, of course, barely even scratches the surface of the story of Charlotte, but nevertheless it's 300 pages long. So I think I was like, ok, well, we'll stop there and maybe we'll write a sequel later, I think there will be an entire collection of stories about Charlotte and look forward to seeing those.
Speaker 1:In the meantime, definitely invite you all to follow us on Facebook. Look for us on Instagram, because we will be sharing updates about the book when you can get it, where you can get it, and then I believe Emily is planning on having a little bit of a fun online launch party for the book, so look for more details on that. We'd love to have you join us. Lots to celebrate.
Speaker 2:Yes, yes, so exciting. So, as life keeps coming right, ashlyn, let's just dive right into this topic because it's so relevant to what we're navigating now and what we talked about last episode too. I think we mentioned these emotions that you get right up front at the time of diagnosis and these challenges. It's not like you overcome them and then you never face them again. You know this guilt, this fear, this feeling like you're not capable, but you get more and more seasoned and recognizing that. You know what. I've been here before, I've navigated this before and I've overcome it and we've pushed through, you know. And so it just helps.
Speaker 2:And, looking back on this week, it's been very helpful to reflect on that of. There's been many times this week where, even with Charlotte's care, where I'm thinking I cannot, how am I supposed to prep for the surgery and this and that and all that? And then it's just like, okay, stop, love on the kid in front of you and deal with the next two lists, and you can do this. You've done it before, you're going to do it again. So it's just such a perfect timing. And, ashlyn, I think it's so cool what you learned as a mantra this week, so I'm going to toss it over to you, because I want to learn more.
Speaker 1:Yes.
Speaker 1:So I shared before that I have been in counseling for the better part of this year because I was just really struggling, honestly, with all the trauma, from what the first year entailed, all the way back to the diagnosis, to getting through the surgery, to starting life over again, basically after we came home.
Speaker 1:So I have been working with a really great therapist, love her, and I was actually talking to her yesterday about just the overwhelm in feeling like there's too much. I don't feel like I can do it all, but I know that I have to do what's on my plate. It's not like there's a lot of options. And so we talked about what are some actionable things that we can do, or that I can do, to help myself push through those moments where it just frankly feels like too much. And one of the things that we settled on was a mantra and, funny enough, the mantra we came up with is this it says I am brave, I am strong, I am capable". And we came up with this without me remembering that today we were talking about being capable for the episode.
Speaker 2:That's amazing.
Speaker 1:So that just goes to show it is something that we always need to be thinking about. It is important in any situation we're facing in life to be reminding ourselves that even when you don't feel it outwardly or it's not obvious to yourself that you are brave, strong and capable, it doesn't change the fact that you have that inside of you. So I think we'll dig into that deeper. Today We'll talk about what are some of those really common fears that try to fool us into thinking we can't do this life right, that we're not made for it to handle it, and how we can combat them, because they don't deserve to keep space in our heads any longer. They're not helping us and, more importantly to us parents and as caregivers, it's not helping our child staying stuck in fear. So let's dive in. And what do you say, emily? Let's call out some of those fears, put them in the hot seat for a change.
Speaker 2:Let's do it, okay. So where to begin? There's so many, okay, I think I'm going to just start with the overarching. I can't do this. Okay, it's very broad, but I think it's just a good one. So a couple of ones that, and I'll share just a little, some ones that came to mind when we were thinking about what are the sticking points that have caused the most fear for us, that we imagine cause a lot of fear for others too. So one is how in the world are we going to afford this? We can't afford this. You know, I won't know what my child needs. Maybe I'm not experienced with a child with medical complexities. I'm not experienced medically or maybe I am experienced medically I've heard of many nurses, doctors, who have a child with medical complexities. But it's a whole different deal when it's your child right, oh, yes.
Speaker 2:So there's that fear. There's the fear of what if I hurt my child? What if, in the intention of caring for them, I cause an issue or make it worse? What if our family life will never be good again? What if we're never stable again? I'll never be happy again. I can't handle this and take care of my other children too. What's going to happen to my other children? What if my marriage falls apart or my relationship with my significant other? And those are just the ones that we thought of, because they're the ones that rocked our boats the most. There are many others, but those are the ones we figured we'd tackle today and just hit head on. But I want to start by just hitting this overarching concept of I'm not capable, and you know I okay, so I'm just going to go where my head's leading me here.
Speaker 2:Naturally, I remember the first few weeks after we got our diagnosis. You know I'm 20 weeks pregnant at this point of probably 22 or 23 weeks, and I was driving home from work and go in between appointments and just my world is totally rocked. I'm still thinking that my baby's going to die any day now and I find myself pulling into a graveyard where my grandma's buried and I I'm not even sure how I ended up there, but I got there and I walk over to my mom's grave site or my grandma's grave site and I sit down and I just start sobbing, saying how am I going to do this? How am I going to do this? Over and over and over again. And when I finally came to a place of peace still heartbroken, but peace just out poured all my emotion and you can read all the details about this in the book. But I got this overwhelming feeling and this kind of just like hearing my grandma say you're going to do it one day at a time.
Speaker 1:That's how you're going to do it.
Speaker 2:Oh, that's so good.
Speaker 1:That's gold.
Speaker 2:Yes, and I just remember thinking okay, I don't have to overcome the next 10 years, I don't have to overcome the next two weeks or even the next day, or you know like two days, whatever. I just need to get through what's right in front of me right now and what is my job in front of me right now. And at the time I think it was just that I had to schedule to get in with cardio for a fetal echo, you know whatever it was at the time, but it was like, okay, that's what I'm going to do One day at a time. And then, once we got into the NICU, I quickly learned one day is too much.
Speaker 2:One day in the NICU is insanity. One day post-op is insanity. So then my mantra became okay, you don't even have to do one day at a time, you have to do one minute at a time, Just oh, yes, what's in front of you right now. So when we start feeling, this feeling and that's what helped me get through this week, quite frankly was coming back to okay, you don't have to have it figured out how it's all going to work in the next week, you just need to know how you're going to be the best mom and wife and fill in the blank for the next. You know 10 minutes.
Speaker 1:Right, absolutely. And I just want to add on to that too that you know I felt all those same things that you're talking about, emily. I'm sure a lot of our listeners are very familiar with that conversation in your head. But I want to add one of the things that I honestly can't even remember who it was that told me, but I'm pretty sure it was one of our nurses in the NICU when I was having a little bit of a breakdown about how am I going to diaper my child? I'm scared to death of putting a diaper on her because I'm staring at her bladder outside of her body. Yeah, and I think I even said I can't do this. It was just I was too raw, too emotional, and she looked at me and she said just tell yourself, you can't do this.
Speaker 1:Yet and that word yet at the end of that sentence, tells your brain but maybe later.
Speaker 2:Yes.
Speaker 1:And sometimes that's all we need to just hit that pause button and it's okay to admit. Nope, I don't have what it takes to do this right now, in this moment. I have no clue what I'm doing. I remember being terrified of helping with Emily or Emory in the hospital after her surgery and you know, those first few days I didn't touch her hardly. I was scared to death. But as time went by, I saw more nurses, I got some practice in, got a little braver and by the end of it I was doing so many things by myself that nurses probably wish I wasn't doing, but I felt right about as her mom Right. It's amazing how, if you just give yourself that permission to learn to be okay with not knowing it all up front, it really can change the dialogue in your head and when that dialogue becomes more positive, your reactions are more positive and then you can become so much more proactive in a healthy way. And so I just want to remind you, just remember that word yet, not yet. Yes.
Speaker 2:Okay. So I love what you just said about, you know, saying I may not feel capable, yet I think that's so powerful and the way we talk to each other, to ourselves, is so powerful, right? And so another thing that I have learned, another word to tack on, when I find myself telling myself I'm not capable, is to say, you know, I'm not capable of this alone. And the cool thing about that is we're never alone. And so then it rewires my head to be like, okay, yeah, you're not capable of this alone. That's all right, you were never meant to be capable of this alone.
Speaker 2:You know, leaning on my faith has been so powerful because, I know, am I capable of raising my child all by myself? And you know, managing this? No, not at all. But if I can take it to, you know, the Lord and put it at his feet and be like, okay, what do I do next? You know it's almost like a merging of these, these concepts we're saying of like, all right, I'm not capable of this yet. So, god, what do I do next? You know what do I need to do to become capable, or to just sit in the fact that you know what? I don't have to be superwoman, as much as I like to try to be, and it just be like okay, god, I'm not capable of this by myself. So what do you? What's your plan?
Speaker 2:You get around this show and it's amazing how he shows up when we stop trying to control. I mean, we've already mentioned several times that I like to control things and in previous episodes and this has been the biggest lesson to let go of this thought that I can control things or be in control or do it by myself. Gosh, if anything can bring me to my knees and make me realize that I'm not capable of doing it on my own, and that is a very good thing, it's this situation.
Speaker 1:Oh, yes, for sure. It's amazing how quickly we learn that one. And just keep in mind, as you're listening for Emily and I, we both talk about how, you know we go to God with this and helps lighten our load, helps us, you know, put down some of our burdens. It doesn't take away the difficulty necessarily, but sometimes just that reminder of I'm not alone can be a huge relief. And then also to just and a practical standpoint. You know within your own circle, when you get the diagnosis, you know how they say it takes a village to raise a child, it takes a village to care for a child. And just remind yourself you may feel alone up front and short is primary. Is the primary responsibility on your shoulders? Not going to deny that, of course it is, but that's why you have a medical team, that's why, hopefully, you have friends, you have coworkers, possibly you have a partner, you have someone, and if you don't have someone, you have Charlotte's hope. So we're glad we can be here for you and we're not going anywhere.
Speaker 2:Exactly, exactly. Oh, I love this. Okay, so we already tackled three great things that you can think about when you're feeling like you're not capable. We said you can take it one minute at a time. We said you can say I'm not capable.
Speaker 2:Yet and you can also say I'm not capable alone, and then find who it is that you're going to lean on so you don't feel alone. So those are. Oh man, I wish I listened to this podcast five years ago when I received that diagnosis. That would have been so helpful. So, okay, another thing that we had thought about.
Speaker 2:Well, I'm going to go on this to this one, because it really was a struggle for me. I was so afraid of finances. How are we going to afford this when my daughter lives or doesn't? Either way, it's going to be very expensive and I knew that the minute Charlotte was born it was going. We were going to hit her out of pocket max, like within a couple of days. And after that, you know, I had never lived in this world of insurance before, like we had never.
Speaker 2:And gosh, I'm realizing now what a blessing and, quite frankly, how naive I was. We had never hit her out of pocket max. I didn't even know what that was. And the helmet hole Right, exactly, yeah. And here we find ourselves, you know, not even having a baby in our arms yet and realizing the expense that this child is going to cost to help keep her alive is going to be immense. And I just remember I would joke that you know we're going to be living in a cardboard box and eating ramen noodles to. You know, when I was talking to coworkers and people. But really deep down I believed it, like I really was concerned that that was going to be true.
Speaker 1:But it's such a real fear and it's honestly, very, very understandable and it's so relevant. That's why we're talking about it, because when you get hit with a diagnosis or you know ongoing health care issues, you know a lot of the times, the conversations with your support system will focus on the emotional aspect, the mental toll, even logistics, the time commitment, all of that. But one of the things that people are usually really uncomfortable talking about is the money, and it's a huge part of it. It's something that we do have to deal with and, Emily, I know that you all found that you did not have to live in a box. As you heard, Emily is actually having her kitchen cabinets repainted, so that is a hopeful story there in itself. But, Emily, what did you guys you know what ended up happening for you that you all were able to put that fear to rest.
Speaker 2:You know what? I think it was our first example of how to look a fear head on. And you know, oftentimes we fear something because it's our natural response to try to address it. But we tend to and I'll speak for myself here it's more comfortable to just live in that space of fear than to look at it head on. But when you can stop and think okay, I'm living in fear that we're not gonna be able to afford a home, or you know, our mortgage or whatever, and so instead of going and buying that latte to nurse my fear and wound of, oh man, I'm not gonna be able to afford this in a year, so I should probably just, you know, go nurse it now and I'm just kidding but to sit down.
Speaker 2:My husband and I actually literally scheduled a night after work where we were gonna sit down and we were going to learn how does insurance work, and we researched and we called up family who we knew had experience with insurance, and we printed out our insurance plan and we poured over it to learn more. It was not fun, but it was very eye-opening and we were able to sleep that night because it was. You know, we still were worried, but at least we were able to say, okay, we know what our out-of-pocket max is. We can spend the next 20 weeks to save for that. We know that once we hit that, you know this is what finances will look like and we can start getting very intentional and prepared for it.
Speaker 2:We also figured out that now we didn't realize this till we got in the hospital, but hopefully those of you tuning in can learn from us so you don't have to wait till you're in the hospital. But there are financial advisors in the hospital and if you tell your doctor or a nurse, hey, I need to speak to somebody about insurance or about you know the financial aspect of this they can get you in touch with either social work or with a financial advisor who can sit down with you and help you figure out what does this really look like. You know when does Medicaid step in and how does insurance work and how much money do we need to save to be able to navigate this or that, and that's been really helpful. So the best way we learned to deal with it was to just look at it head on and you know, crunch the numbers and figure it out.
Speaker 1:I think that's great Couple other things to think about. Even with the access that we all have to YouTube, there are so many videos out there that can honestly walk you through a really simple way of how do I figure out how much I need to live to function, and it can be an exercise as simple as literally write down all of your expenses. I don't know about you all, but for a long time, and still from time to time, I'm not always aware of how much money is going out out the window each month, or sometimes even each week. And just putting it in black and white, seeing what your expenses are and analyzing those to see, okay, what is critical, what expenses do you have to have, and then maybe looking for some opportunities of okay, I see that I normally spend about $200 on clothes a month. If you're gonna be in the hospital for a while, you may not need more clothes, and while Because you're gonna be in yeah, the same clothes were yes, yeah, yeah, there is no judgment on hospital attire.
Speaker 1:None Become fear the better. But just something like that just looking at what are your expenses, what do you have to be able to cover, and then maybe looking for some opportunities of some you know, some expenses you can shave. Even just an exercise like that can help you feel a little bit more in control, yeah, A little bit more aware of what you're actually facing, and I think that's awesome. I honestly didn't know till right now that I could ask for a financial advisor or support through the hospital. That's a great idea and it makes a ton of sense. So anybody out there if you have any experience doing that yourself would love to hear if you've got any advice on how to work with somebody like that in a hospital or any lessons that you learned from going through that process. It'd be great to share that with our listeners.
Speaker 2:Yes, yes, I love it. Yes, and I've discovered there are a lot of different programs out there specifically for children, pediatrics, you know, like our hearing aid I don't even know what the organization was called, but it ended up being 100% covered and you know just different things like that. I didn't realize when we got to the NICU that that falls under Medicaid instead of in insurance, and I'm not. I mean, please don't take any of go to someone in your area who knows more.
Speaker 2:But I'm just speaking from our specific example. I had no idea how these different things were built and there are a lot of programs out there, a lot of help offered. You can even call your county health department and they can point you to different programs or somebody who can advise you. So the biggest thing, I think, was just learning to not just live in that fear that we're gonna live in a box, but actually look at it head on and try to think through the reality of what it's gonna take to not be in a box and still be okay. And I will say I mean we've hit our out-of-pocket max by January 2nd ever since Charlotte was born and that is impressive, I know honestly. Yeah, it does make bill paying easy in the fact that, like, once it's done, it's done, you're just hitting it and you're done.
Speaker 1:There you go. There is a positive right there. That is a positive way to look at a. Wow. I'm kind of blown away by that. By January 2nd, I thought we were doing pretty good by, like you know, march 1st. All right, well, I think we've hit the financial fear really well, but I'm right. But one of the ways that I'm going to move on with this is actually it kind of blends in a little bit with those finances.
Speaker 1:Another way to help you with anything in these situations that you're scared you are not capable of. It kind of goes back to when Emily said remember you're not alone. This is not the time to hold onto your pride, folks, and I'm not saying, put yourself out there and beg, but if you need financial support and you are struggling to get it, this is about your child and people look at you as a collective whole. They want to support your child. This is not the time to feel embarrassed, as hard as that is, trust me. You were talking to somebody right now who was struggling with the fact that I'm a little you know, not 100% confident about how we're going to handle living abroad for six to seven weeks while still maintaining all of our expenses back home. Right, we'll figure it out.
Speaker 1:But if somebody wants to help you, if somebody wants to do a fundraiser, if somebody wants to donate money from a business, you do not need to say no out of pride or out of fear of looking like you aren't able to handle something. People want to help, let them do this. And because it's them helping your child, I think if you stay focused on the fact that it is for your child, it can help remove a lot of that discomfort that comes along with feeling incapable of covering the expense right. I mean, that's a terrible feeling. So use those resources, lean on those friends, those local community businesses, et cetera, and just welcome the help. It's a beautiful gift. There's going to be plenty of times that you'll have to do things on your own. It's okay to not do this one on your own.
Speaker 2:I have the biggest grin spread across my face. I'm sorry, I know you're leading into the next topic and I'm so excited to go there, but first I just have to say you just gave the most perfect teaser for the future episode that's going to have to be recorded very soon. Because I think it's very relevant is accepting help, because I think it is such a important thing for us to learn to humble ourselves. And it's usually and I'm gonna try to not get too excited right here because we're gonna get off topic but it's very hard to accept help for a lot of reasons.
Speaker 2:But this is not the time to try to be superwoman. Like we said, we're superman. This is not the time to be prideful, and it's just when you start saying yes, when people offer help, I think you will be overwhelmed, not only by how much it helps you, but maybe more so, how much it lights up other people's worlds because they want to help you so much. And when we turn that down, because we don't want to appear like we need it or whatever, we turn down their interest in helping. So it almost it's an interest. I can't wait to have that episode. It's gonna be so great. Okay on to you, ashlyn.
Speaker 1:Great, great point. It's very true, and that worked really well with our next topic, or our next fear that we're going to address, which is is our family ever going to be the same? Are we ever going to be happy again? And I would even group in with that if you have other children, am I going to be able to be a good parent to all of my children? Am I going? Is this going to ruin their lives? Not that we're ever blaming the child who has a diagnosis or who is having the health concerns.
Speaker 1:Please know that when you're having those feelings, anybody from this walk of life in majority of people I would say understand that you're never pointing a finger at your child, you're never placing blame on them. It's okay to acknowledge that there are fears generated from their circumstance, though that is not anything to feel shame about or to feel guilty about, okay. But with those fears that are very real, it goes straight back to you. Guys don't have to figure this out on your own. Your family is going to look different and in fact I would venture to say that majority of you, your family, is about to expand in a lot of ways because family is going to start to look different for some of you. You are going to have people step up that sometimes are the last person you would think would show up in your life to help. You're going to have, most likely, nurses that become friends. You are going to have, possibly, an occupational therapist who is coming to a family dinner at some point. It's amazing how those relationships evolve and your family expands.
Speaker 1:So I think, stepping back from that, one of the best things that you can do for yourself is, once again, always acknowledge that fear. Just say it out loud, whether you're saying it to your partner, you're saying it to a friend, say, I'm really scared that life is never going to look the same for my family, but also being able to acknowledge that it's going to look different and different can be okay. It could actually be. It could be good and there will be a lot of good. There's always going to be hard.
Speaker 1:We will talk about that often. There's no fast forward, there's no shortcuts about getting around the hard times. But what this journey will teach everybody who walks on it is that there are so many amazing experiences and life lessons that come from this that you just can't even begin to understand until you meet them. And they will come. And we will continue to highlight those here for you, because that's another thing that can just inject that hope into this really hopeless feeling experience up front. Just remember brighter days are ahead, they will come. And just don't do this alone. I feel like I'm going to just keep pounding on that. Do not isolate yourself. Do not feel like you and your family have to do this alone.
Speaker 2:And I'm going to interject that, if you are feeling alone and you don't know who to turn to, please email us, Message us on social media. Obviously, we're never going to be able to replace family and friends, but we realize that this can be such a lonely journey and we so want this mission to help parents not feel alone, and whether we're the organization that helps make you feel plugged in or we point you to one that is directed specifically for your diagnosis or whatever I mean, part of our mission here is not to it's never to replace anything else that's out there. There's a lot of great organizations out there. Our goal is to help bring you in, create this community where we can really learn how to be advocates and then also help share with you.
Speaker 2:Hey, have you heard of this organization? It might be great for what you need. Have you heard of this one? Have you heard of this one? So, if you're feeling lonely, please reach out to us on social media Charlotte's Hope Foundation on Instagram or Facebook, or you can email us at contact at charlottehopefoundationorg. We would love to hear from you. And then I want to go to the kind of simultaneous topic we're talking about of what about our other children, Because yesterday I think this is so relevant I was actually at the doctor's office with all three of my children to get vaccinations for all three a well check for one and a pre-op check for the other.
Speaker 1:So it was that's all, emily. Yeah, that was all. Oh, I'm gonna do a blood draw you know, yeah, that's all.
Speaker 2:So we were there from. We were there for three hours. I packed so many snacks it was insane, but anyway. So I was just so touched because this fear of how it's gonna impact our other children I will be honest, I battle with it every single day. I worry about how much attention my child with medical complexities gets and therefore how much not attention the other two get I worry about. You know, the other two witness a lot of trauma that I just really wish they didn't.
Speaker 2:Obviously, the one with medical complexities experiences a lot of trauma that I so wish I could take away from her, but I can't. But so yesterday I'm sitting in this doctor's office and my baby is getting immunizations and so of course she's screaming and my son, who's three and a half, comes over and well, okay, first he said I want to leave, I don't want to watch. So I was like sure, you can go see it in the hallway, you don't have to watch. Well, then he hears my baby cry and he comes right straight in and he stands at her head and starts rubbing her head and he kisses her and he doesn't leave.
Speaker 2:And then we had to go do a blood draw and both the kids were standing there holding her other hand while the lab tech was drawing the blood and comforting her. And so it just. You know what? It's amazing what our other children get to learn when they're witnessing all of this medical I'm gonna call it trauma, because that's what it is in our world but they learn such empathy. And you know, here I have this three and a half year old who recognizes when someone needs empathy and he comes barreling in, even though he did not want to witness it. He comes in anyway and starts loving on his sister.
Speaker 1:So I have to keep reminding myself.
Speaker 2:I know I have to step back and be like okay, yes, it's hard, yes, they're witnessing more than I wish they ever did and, yes, I don't get to rock them as much as I'd love to. But you know what? They still are very much loved. They know it and they're learning empathy more than I think most of us know by the time we're adults, you know.
Speaker 1:Oh, I could not agree more. Cole, my five-year-old son has had to grow up faster in some ways of life than I wanted. He was so excited to be a big brother and then to have his sister come home for just a short amount of time and then be taken out of the home for over a month. That was really hard for him to understand. But I saw him grow so much just in his maturity and his awareness for others that it really was a beautiful thing to see. And sure this is a good example of what we've mentioned last week or the last episode about how positive emotions can happen simultaneously with sad emotions.
Speaker 1:So, I'm sad.
Speaker 1:I was sad about the reason that this was happening to Cole right, that I was seeing him grow up and be more conscientious and more aware of others' needs, but at the exact same time I had this overwhelming pride developing and just appreciation for this child and seeing who he's becoming and all this potential that's in him.
Speaker 1:And I have no doubt that this is going to put him years ahead of a lot of his peers, truthfully, because they just have a view of the world that so many don't get, if ever in life, and that gives you an appreciation for things that so many people miss. And I really think that is a big part of experiencing life to the fullest is being able to appreciate the small things, and I already see Cole able to do that more than I think he would have been without this experience. So just keep in mind once again so often this entire journey is going to show you that while life may not look the way that you would have written it in a book as the ideal life, it's also going to gift you things that you never could have dreamed of, hoping for or expecting, because they were outside your reach of anticipation, they're outside norm, but you will just learn that okay, looks different, good, looks different, but it's still just as powerful and positive.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, there's so many different things. My head is thinking and I'm trying not to overwhelm our listeners so many ways I could go with this conversation. We have so many episodes to record, so much to talk about. But yeah, I think that's so good.
Speaker 2:And if you are listening and you have older children, or let's say, I love that Ashlyn and I have different experiences in terms of Charlotte was our first and Ashlyn Emery was your second, and so you had to navigate an element we didn't, where you had to figure out how to care for a child in the hospital and provide all this extra care while you're also raising your other child, and I know many listeners have had to navigate that.
Speaker 2:We've had to learn that now, now that we have more children, but we didn't have that upfront. So I think the whole accepting help topic is very relevant for here too, because while, of course, we would love to be the ones who provide the primary care for our children and we still are accepting help and allowing our circle to expand of who all is involved in our child's care is gonna be critical. I've had to learn to just be so grateful for help instead of letting the guilt and the fear of like, well, it's not me and it really should be me. And well, yeah, but it's not me. It can't be me right now. It will be me, it's not me yet.
Speaker 2:Right now I'm in the hospital but it will be me again and right now they're in very capable hands. So, and the other thing, I had somebody advise me because I was expressing this concern. I was on my way to the hospital for appointments, probably like two years ago, and a family friend had offered to go with me to help with the other kids. So she and I were in the car, we had an hour to kill and I was just expressing this concern of you know how it's gonna affect our other children and she said well, you know what? I think that's an easy one to navigate in terms of. She wasn't trying to be flippant, but she was just like when they get old enough to have the conversation, you just tell them.
Speaker 2:You know I'm concerned about how this is affecting you. So I want you to tell me when you're feeling a little left out, a little lonely or a little like. You know it's kind of hard to navigate this with all the medical complexities, cause she was like if you can just talk about it and create an environment where it's okay to say I'm feeling left behind, then that's gonna overcome half the issues, you know. And I was just like, oh, oh, that's so good, I know. I found so much peace in that, and already I'm having that conversation with Liam, who's three and a half, where you know we'll get to the end of the day where I barely held him all day because I've been dealing with this or that, and I'll be like you know what, buddy? I know mama wasn't very available, did you feel a little left out? And I don't think he quite knows how to have that conversation yet, but we're starting it now and that was the best advice. Gave me so much peace. That is so good.
Speaker 1:That is a really good idea and I think I'm actually gonna try that with Cole. One thing I just wanna call out for our listeners I'm sure there are some of you who are whether you're in that NICU or you're on a recovery floor in the hospital and you have children at home. Let's face it, covid has really changed. Still to this day, you know visitor policies and now going into, you know right now for us we're recording this it's November, so flu season is kind of rampant again, so that can really make it difficult to keep seeing your other children.
Speaker 1:So to any of you parents, caregivers, who are sitting with your child that's in hospital and you're apart from your other children, just know that we're thinking about you, our hearts are with you because we understand we can give you all the tips and tricks and tell you why it's okay, but we've lived it and we understand just how heavy that is.
Speaker 1:But just note that this is not defined you as a parent being away from your other kids. You are still completely capable of being an amazing parent and we're willing to bet that you are, even when it doesn't feel like it. Okay, and just know that when you do get out of there having a magic date with your kids. You know some one-on-one time with them, even if it's a 20 minutes of coloring a picture or going for a car ride and playing some music that you know they love. It is amazing how resilient kids are and how much they appreciate being in the moment when they get those times. So look at that as something to look forward to, I guess. But just wanted to give a shout out to any of you who are being kept from your other kids because, man, we know that hurt and it is tough very tough.
Speaker 2:It is so, so tough. Yes, I think I'm gonna get a bigger taste of that soon, because we're gonna be doing our surgery four hours away from here and it's gonna be, you know, a week long of in the hospital, while we've had plenty of times of separation from our kids while we're in the hospital, this will be a uniquely extreme one for us All, right so we have covered several of those fears that make us feel inadequate and capable, paralyzed in reality.
Speaker 1:So just one more that I think we'll wrap up with today is addressing one that's very personal, that goes very well with everything we've been talking about. But is that fear and doubt that can come into our minds of? Is my relationship with my partner, my spouse, what have you? Are we capable of handling this life together? And it's a very, very common question and it's an understandable fear, because nobody is ever prepared for this. Nobody signs up for this life or is looking for it or expecting it.
Speaker 1:Right, when it gets thrown on you, it can make you question a lot of things, but the first thing to remind yourself is that questioning voice that's fear, that is fear whispering or yelling in your ear just trying to trip you up, trying to freeze you, scare you and, frankly, a lot of times it's lying to you. But we wanna talk about that. And Emily, I know she talks about this in her book. She is Charlotte. But, emily, I would love to hear how you and Dan, your husband, what you did to combat this, because you all were very intentional and I think our listeners can learn from that.
Speaker 2:Oh, thank you. Well, yeah, I mean, this was a fear we definitely had, and still have sometimes, of just the impact that it can have on relationships, and especially that partnership relationship, because you're the ones day in and day out, caring for that child. And how are you each gonna react? And the thing that I had to learn and it took me quite a while to learn it, I'm still learning it we grieve differently, we have different fears. We, you know, I mean a micro example is we'll be in the hospital for a hospitalization and we have the same situation is confronting both of us with our daughter, and he reacts very differently than I do, and we've had to learn how to recognize that that's a good thing and to not let it become a division, but to say, okay, when you're confronted with fear and anxiety and this, and that this is how you react, this is how I react, and so we're going to learn how to harness that and make sure it doesn't divide us but create, you know, more of a team. So, yeah, I think this fear is such a real one and one that again, much like the finances, has to be looked at head on with your significant other to say you know what this is hard. This is going to be hard, but you and I matter. We matter a lot, in fact, and we need to find a way to stay strong. And so what are we going to do to do that? You know, ultimately we need to be a team through this for ourselves and for our children. And so, you know, I think that just starts a really good conversation and it's not like it's not a one conversation and done, it's an ongoing conversation of okay, you know, now we have this hurdle and this hurdle and this hurdle, and we know that it can cause a divide.
Speaker 2:And I heard a stat and forgive me, I don't know where it came from, but I totally believe that it's true that one of a great pressure on relationships is raising a child with medical complexities. I mean, it makes perfect sense. So for us, we sought out counseling and it was kind of a proactive thing of like okay, we're about to face something that is crazy and we're gonna need a lot of help. And we've actually stayed with that therapist. We first did individual therapy and then we did couples therapy and now we stay with that therapist.
Speaker 2:And you know, he made a good point when we kind of hit this place of where we were doing really well and we thought we kind of have this life with complexities sort of figured out as that's funny to me, you know, anybody ever haven't figured out. But we were like, you know, we're in a really good place, the two of us, and so we were talking about this with our therapist of like, well, maybe we don't need to meet anymore. And he made such a good point, he goes look, patients, see their doctors for followup once a year, once every six months or whatever, as a well check, what makes mental health any different or relationship health any different?
Speaker 1:Oh nice.
Speaker 2:Checkups.
Speaker 2:And so ever since we've been having checkups and it's so good, because even on the times we meet where we're like we really don't know what we're gonna talk about, we end up filling the hour and wishing we had five more hours it's really good and just I think, just that intentionality of looking at the relate, that fear about how this is gonna affect your relationship, and then hitting it head on and knowing like, yeah, this is gonna be really hard on our relationship.
Speaker 2:And you know what is really cool? I love the analogy of diamonds are created in fire. Right, the hardest material is created through fire, and so a relationship can be strengthened through the fire of what we're confronting, you know, with our medical complexities, it can also be burnt up, and so, looking that in the eye, and now Daniel and I will sit back and look at each other and be like you know what we're. So not that we would probably willingly take this on on our own, but we're grateful we've been through it, because we are now stronger than we've ever been, and that's through a heck of a lot of intentionality.
Speaker 1:So I love that. That is beautiful and I think your relationship has experienced a lot of growth. I think it's really cool how you talked about the fact that you all did counseling and you show that you can go to counseling and it doesn't mean that there's something wrong with your relationship. You can go to counseling to take care of your relationship and to help strengthen it and support it, because it's very, very necessary. Now we also understand maybe counseling services just aren't an option for you right now, for whatever. It could be many. But I got some good advice from the counselor I'm working with, so happy to share this with you all, one of the best things that she has shared with me lately or encouraged me to do, and I am guessing that it's very common.
Speaker 1:In a lot of relationships there is a more dominant personality and there is one that is usually somebody who's a little better at, or more comfortable, following the other's lead and bring into the equation a child with medical needs that person who's a little bit more comfortable being proactive or I shouldn't use the word aggressive, but sometimes that's how it feels for me I feel like I'm a little bit more aggressive about attacking the issues at hand. That really shines a light on that personality. So what can then happen is the person who is a little bit more go with the flow or a little quieter can start to look like somebody who doesn't care, and that's most of the time. Not the case Not saying every time, but we really believe that majority of the time. Both parents, you know, both people involved care very, very much. Just, some people aren't as vocal and some people aren't as confident, you know, helping make those decisions, but that can then alternately leave the other person feeling like they're handling it all. You could be the mom, you could be the dad, you could be a grandparent who is maybe providing most of the care, but that can also put you in a bad state of mind, right? It can make you start to look at your partner as more of a well, we'll just say, less of a partner, and it can make you feel alone and really frustrated, possibly even resentful.
Speaker 1:So one of the things that she encouraged me to do in my life with my partner is to ask open ended questions. So often I would go to my husband and say you know, do you think this is okay or how do you feel about doing this? And he would basically just repeat what I said or just say like, yep, that sounds good. I started feeling like, but you're not really having a conversation with me about this, or you're just repeating what I'm saying. So are you really even invested? And that's not the case at all. But if I change the questions to hey, I'm thinking about this idea. What are your thoughts on doing this? Or how would you do this differently? Or do you have any other questions that you want to throw into the mix with the doctor? Just make sure your questions are open ended and let them know. I want to hear what your thoughts are, because I'm feeling a little alone or a little overwhelmed.
Speaker 1:And I don't feel like it's just me bringing everything to the table. I need my partner. So I welcome your thoughts on this. I want to hear what you have to say on it and that can just really change the tone of how you guys are handling this. It is so easy and I say this speaking from experience because I very much did this to myself I totally siloed this role of being the primary you know, guardian of all things, medical for Emery.
Speaker 1:I was the one who, from day one, was like okay, I'm going to do all the research, I'm going to call all the people, I'm going to set all the appointments, I'm going to make all the arrangements, I'm going to have the conversations with the nurse, etc. Blah, blah, blah. And I left no room for him and he, because he believed in my ability to do it, allowed me to do it. But then it kind of created some space for resentment and looking back. You know now that there's been some time, I'm able to look at that and go, okay, I didn't really give him room to participate and I didn't really invite him. Granted, I don't know about any of you, I was anybody else.
Speaker 1:I was also thinking why shouldn't have to invite him, he should just automatically do this, right? Yeah, that's not really being, you know, very realistic, right, because we all have different personalities, we all have different approaches and I think just leaving room like Emily like you said, people handle things differently throw trauma onto the stage. People are going to react very differently and you cannot consider one way more right than another as long as that person's not just running away, right, yeah, then you. Then you've still got a partner. So I think that's probably the best advice I could give is to just make sure that you continue to invite them into the conversation, even if it feels like you shouldn't have to. You're more than likely going to feel a lot better having done that and they're going to, over time, hopefully start to create more space for themselves in those situations and be more comfortable having a louder voice in and being more supportive.
Speaker 2:Naturally, yes, I love it and I think, out of fear, I often you know, especially early on would ask for Dan's opinion, but then if it didn't match mine or if it was different angle of questions or perspective, I would almost shut it down of like, okay, well, we obviously feel very differently about this, you know, and then it would be this resentment and anger and whatever, whereas I'm coming to learn and this is from a place of constant learning and growing and screwing it up and trying again. But but his perspective is so different than mine, so different, and sometimes it can feel almost abrasive, but it's not at all, it's. He just sees it very different and it's. It's a really good thing when I can put my pride aside and just sit and listen to him long enough to be like, oh yeah, good perspective, you know, you have a good point. So that's been very helpful, like especially with hospitalizations when we're super under stress and we both handle it so different and his mind is thinking something completely different than mine. To stop and just hear him out and not let my brain overrun it and be like, yeah, but what about this and this and this? And blah, blah, blah, blah. And I can't believe you're thinking about that when we should be thinking about this, and, yeah, I totally can, can railroad the situation.
Speaker 2:And so we've covered a lot of different things that might be fears and thoughts that cross your mind, making you feel like you're less than capable of being the parent or caregiver for your medically complex child, and we hope that by now you have seen that you are in fact capable and that you are not alone in feeling like you're not capable and that we still navigate that emotion. You know often, and you know, with some experience, continue to get faster and faster at, I guess, knocking that fear out of our heads and replacing it with the fact that we are capable. I love your mantra I'm going to come back to that, ashlyn about how you say you know, I am brave, I am strong, I am capable. I think that's. I'm going to put that on my forehead. But so, just to wrap this up and bring it home, you know a few ways that we have explored to help confirm that you are in fact capable are just to remind yourself to take this one day at a time, and if you're in the heat of this, then maybe one day is still too much and it's one minute at a time. You know, when you start feeling totally overwhelmed, just remind yourself one day, one minute at a time.
Speaker 2:The other idea that we had tossed out was to to remember, if you're not feeling capable, add that word. Yet to realize that when you can open yourself up to the fact that you're going to learn and you'll get there, that you're going to, you're going to be able to give yourself the grace to know that it's okay that you don't know now and that you don't feel capable now, but you'll get there. And then the other word we tossed in was you know, maybe you're feeling like you're not capable because you're feeling alone, and to remember that you are not alone, not alone at all, and to call in your family, your friends, your Lord, us reach out to us, you know. And to realize that you know. If you're feeling like you're not capable alone, well, that's because you weren't meant to do it alone.
Speaker 1:Exactly None of us were meant to do this alone, and that is probably one of the best things that you can work on accepting right now. That's where you were putting your energy will do not only yourself a lot of good, but your child a ton of good. Your child needs you to lean on others so that way you can be as whole as possible and as strong as possible for them.
Speaker 2:Yes, yes, I love it. So with that, I think, ashlyn, you, you put this grounding thought together and I think it was so perfect, so I think would you mind sharing it with us.
Speaker 1:No, I would love to. We've talked about so many different things and we really wanted to focus on reminding you that you truly are capable, even if you feel the furthest thing from it. But if you're struggling with that doubt still after listening to this conversation, I want you to listen to this and really think about yourself as the person I'm describing. No human on earth loves your child more than you. That alone, that love is enough to make you capable of caring for your child. There is no one who is more equipped to walk this road with them, because you two were literally made for one another and there is so much power in that that no other human being on earth possesses. That is what you hold on to. That is what we hope you take from today. Your love alone will carry you through this. Your love alone will help you learn all the hard things, face all the hard things and push those fears down, so that way you can give your child the very best chance for the greatest quality of life possible, no matter what is ahead.
Speaker 2:Yes, such a good reminder. And you know the other thought that comes through my mind that I think is just very important to share, and something you'll probably hear me say a lot when I realized that God loves my child even more than I do, that's when I realized that with him we're capable. You know, it was like, okay, I'm not the only one who loves this child with this overwhelming amount of love. He loves her even more than I do and therefore together we're capable. And so just remembering that fear can be overcome with love.
Speaker 2:And when we look at it face on and we address those fears face on much like we talked about in our last episode of, you know, getting that guilt written on paper, spoken to someone, get it out of your head. Same with fear If you can get it out of your head on the paper, spoken to someone, addressed head on, it doesn't take it away, but it helps to dull the edge of fear and turn it into something that propels you to address an issue, rather than swimming in that fear and letting it swallow you. So, with that, we are just so grateful for you listening and tuning in and if this episode connected with you and you want to hear more, please be sure to hit subscribe. We would love to hear more from you about your personal journey and we would love to learn, you know, what has helped you when you have felt these overwhelming emotions of fear. What has what has propelled you and helped you gain more confidence? So please reach out to us at contact at charlottehopefoundationorg. Let us know and, last but not least, if you know of someone who could benefit from this podcast, please share.
Speaker 1:If this episode connected with you and you want to hear more, be sure to hit the subscribe button.
Speaker 2:We would also love to learn about your personal journey and how we can support you.
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