Empowered by Hope
You want the best possible quality of life for your child regardless of diagnosis or prognosis. Raising a child with medical complexities is often lonely, scary and overwhelming. Join two parents of amazing children with rare medical complexities, Emily K. Whiting and Ashlyn Thompson, to get help and grow with them into empowered advocates for our kids. Here you’ll find a community of support, encouragement, education and resources, equipping you to navigate your child’s medical complexities with hope. To get more personal support, connect with us directly at www.ParentEmpowermentNetwork.org.
Empowered by Hope
The Silver Lining for Siblings: How Siblings of Medically Complex Kids Grow in Strength & Compassion
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As parents of children with complex medical needs, our hearts often ache with worry about our other children. Are they getting enough attention? Will they feel less important? Do they resent their sibling's conditions? These questions haunt us during late-night hospital stays and therapy appointments.
What we rarely discuss, though, is the remarkable beauty that emerges in these siblings' lives. Through heartwarming stories like seven-year-old Nora proudly telling her class about her sister's rare condition on Rare Disease Day, or Cole developing an extraordinary voice at a young age, we discover the gifts hidden within our challenging journeys.
Ashlyn & Ashley share their personal experiences raising both medically complex and typically developing children, revealing how these siblings develop profound empathy, advocacy skills, problem-solving abilities, and perspective far beyond their years. They discuss the importance of taking off what they call the "Sherlock Holmes hat" – that constant problem-solving mode parents develop – so that we parents can simply enjoy our children and create meaningful connections through small moments like car rides or special traditions.
Perhaps most striking is the resilience these children show. Despite hospital stays that separate families and the inevitable imbalance of attention, these siblings often demonstrate remarkable forgiveness, adaptability, and joy. They remind us that children have an extraordinary capacity to live in the moment and find happiness within challenging circumstances.
This conversation offers hope that while your family's path may look different than imagined, your children are developing unique strengths through challenges most families never face. Your "typical" children aren't just surviving this experience - with your love and attention to their needs, they're thriving in ways that will serve them throughout their lives.
Recommended Resources:
Supporting the Siblings with Wendy Plant, PhD - Excellent webinar for parents presented by Courageous Parents Network
Courageous Parents Network: Sibling Support
Child Life on Call: Supporting Siblings: How Child Life Specialists Can Help
We kindly ask that you share this podcast with other families who might benefit from our insights and support. Additionally, please take a brief moment to leave a review on your preferred podcast platform, which helps us to reach as many families as possible who are navigating this challenging journey, so they can find our support circle and access the assistance they rightfully deserve. No one should walk this journey alone.
To get more personal support, connect with us directly at:
https://parentempowermentnetwork.org
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Join the Parent Empowerment Network Community of Hope
Get your copy of She is Charlotte: A Mother’s Physical, Emotional, and Spiritual Journey with Her Child with Medical Complexities by Emily K Whiting on Amazon
Whether you've just been blindsided by your child's diagnosis or you've been in the trenches of their complex medical needs for a while, Empowered by Hope, is here for you, Though we wish you didn't know this heartache. We're so glad you found us so together we can walk this journey in hope.
Speaker 1:Hello, welcome to Empowered by Hope. It's your co-host, ashlyn and Ashley, which is still fun slash. Funny to say. We're the, we're the A team. Yes, and Ashley. This is a really sweet conversation that we get to have and we actually tried to record this a couple weeks ago and sound was just it was not on our side that day and so we were like we don't want to put anything out there. That's blah. So we decided to record again and it worked out perfectly because since then two really special things have happened. So one, we've had a conversation with an adult who grew up as a medically complex child and got to hear her perspective and it was oh, so healing and enlightening and just all the amazing things. And then it was also rare disease day and, ashley, this is you were telling me the sweetest story about Nora, who is in your family, the, the typical sibling. I feel like they need a cooler name, like we need like a cool code name for the kids who don't have all the medical things. Right.
Speaker 2:We should know what your ideas are. What do you call your?
Speaker 1:kid like to parent our other children and to help them through life as they are experiencing. A sibling who is not only like, receives more medical attention, but just requires more parental attention, more dedicated hours. Energy depletes emotion, you know emotional stability at time and sometimes takes us away from our other kids. I feel like it's so easy to get lost in all the negatives or all of our fears of you know how much additional therapy our children are going to need as they grow up, thinking they weren't as important or as cared about as our medical kiddos. And we are here to talk about the fact that there is a whole other side to this and it's a really bright side, and there's actually a lot more beautiful things that can come from this. So, Ashley, can you tell us a sweet story about adorable, amazing Nora, as M Marin's big sister.
Speaker 3:Yes, absolutely so. Nora is seven and in first grade and I don't know if her school did anything for rare disease day last year, but this year they sent out an email that everyone should wear zebra print as just a you know, a reminder about rare disease day and awareness thing. And so I found a cute zebra dress on Amazon because obviously Nora needs to participate or if she wanted to. And of course she was obsessed with the dress and she said, Mom, I already told my class that this day was going to be all about my little sister and I was like, oh, you did that is so cool. And she was like, yeah, she was like, and they asked why?
Speaker 3:And she, she went in to talk about how her sister was born with bladder extra V and she goes to the bathroom different than us and it's really cool and like all of the neat things that I guess come along with that. And I was just like stopped in my tracks and it was the sweetest, most genuine sentiment from her, like she was so proud to talk about Maren and how she's different. And you know, we celebrate different in our house, obviously because it's great, but we want Maren to know that it's cool to be different for her sake later, right, but it's just funny. You, as we've like stressed that with her, Nora's picked up too and she thinks it's really cool. So it was just very heartwarming that she was so proud to like tell her whole class about Marin and and celebrate her sister. You know it wasn't a bad thing or a negative on her side. She thinks it's awesome too.
Speaker 1:So I don know it was just really sweet oh my gosh, remind me, or let's how. How old is Nora? What grade is she in? So?
Speaker 3:Nora's seven. She's in first grade and she's three years older than Maren. Yeah, so two and a half, but three by school.
Speaker 1:So yeah so yeah, it was just really she did that on her own because she didn't so remind me.
Speaker 1:To my knowledge she didn't like say hey, mom, I want to tell people at school about Marin. Right, like she just did this on her own, used her own voice and also focused on sharing the story as like it sounds like she made it. You know it's part of her story too. Yeah, that she was part of it. Not that does that make sense? What I'm trying to say? Like it shows me that Nora is experiencing this life, realizing she is a part of this and her sister is a part of her life. That it's not everything's about, which is you know. I would say you know. My fear with Emery and Cole had been originally was like, oh my gosh, is Cole just gonna feel like, you know, the throwaway or like a less important child?
Speaker 3:and Nora's just making my heart feel a whole lot better yeah, exactly, I mean you kind of said it when you kicked us off like that's our biggest fear, right, or one of our biggest fears on top of all the other medical fears is that, like you know, maren does require a lot more attention, and has since she was born, and so I've always been very caught, you know, try to be very conscious of, like, what, what time Nora is getting, and like, are we talking to Nora about how she might be feeling, because I've been gone for months at a time, or whatever the case may be, and so you know, something you and I've talked about too, that's something I've been very concerned about since Maren was born and you know, it's cool to see how, yes, like, I think those fears are valid and I think those concerns are valid and we should be very, you know, pay attention to that Right, and make sure that we're discussing those things with our kids.
Speaker 3:But, like she did, she turned it into her story Maren's her big, her little sister, you know, and she, like, was celebrating that and it was just really cool and all on her own, like, by the time I brought up rare disease day to her, she had already said she had told her class that that's what the day was about. So so, yeah, she did it all by herself.
Speaker 1:I know For Nora and for you, and for you and Brian, right For your family. Like that to me is a beautiful sign Like you guys are doing a good job. What that also makes me think about is so if you have already heard our conversation with Annalise, we will put we should put a link to that podcast in these show notes, because if you haven't, you definitely want to hear the adult perspective. So I think she said what she's the youngest of five. Is that right? Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2:Youngest of five.
Speaker 1:And some of the pros that she talked about.
Speaker 1:As you know, being a child who grew up with medical complexities, I realized that those same benefits, or a lot of them, are actually being applied to Cole, my oldest, that he is on the receiving end of those as well, and I kind of unintentionally blinded myself to that.
Speaker 1:So she talked about body awareness and you know, obviously she is probably, you know, unquestionably more comfortable and confident advocating for herself. And the reality is I actually do see those things in Cole and Cole's about to turn eight this month and you know, sometimes his advocating for himself comes a whole lot like bossing and being very clear about what he wants to do in the moment and what he does not want to do, and it can make me want to pull my hair out, but the reality is he knows how to speak up for himself right, he doesn't get shut down easily and he does express his emotions very verbally. He's very, very direct and sometimes it can just feel like typical, like just frustrations with, you know, following directions. But as I'm stepping back, I'm kind of realizing that in this life, because he has some friends who will come over for play dates and they're just like okay, sure, whatever, and I think that that's what I want, but reality is long term?
Speaker 3:Please tell me.
Speaker 1:Ashley, I'm on the right track here.
Speaker 3:You're totally on the right track. I heard a quote one time and I'll never forget it. They said sometimes the things that make kids difficult when they're younger are what make them really awesome adults. And it's the same thing, like you want him to speak up maybe not to you all the time, right, but but you do. You want them to have a voice, right. That's what we, that's what this podcast is about. A lot of the times is that you have to advocate for yourself and for your child. And right, Cole's learning to do that already, and that's really that's your right, right, yeah, absolutely.
Speaker 1:That's not something you have to earn and I know that I mean. That's not something I naturally grew up with and I grew up around advocates, but I don't think I understood to the degree that that we do now. Right, because I didn't have a sibling most of the time who needed advocacy. So, being that much closer to it, I can see the benefits of it. And when I look at you know parenting through that filter, instead of all the evening arguments, I can look at this as check. We're learning how to express ourselves and maybe we need to work on tone a little bit, but there's more benefits.
Speaker 1:Another one that I think is is very, very obvious in our experience and I think I actually I know I've witnessed it with Nora when we shared our spring break together is the empathy that our children have both of them right. It's the empathy for others and just their hearts are so big and in a world that wants to tell us what's right, who's out. I am so proud of Cole that to him, everybody is in and he doesn't understand when they're not, and he's been on the receiving end of being not on the in crowd and sometimes it has been due to him being so empathetic and caring that other kids you know, boys, who are his peers don't always understand. Why are you so worried that I missed school yesterday? I was sick no big deal. I'm back, nicole. Are you feeling okay? Do you need help with anything? You know and and I know that that's just going to be a huge benefit in the future and I'm really hopeful that someday, if he gets married, that his future spouse is saying thank you, thank you.
Speaker 3:Yeah, it was funny. One of um, I love Nora's first grade teacher so very much and, um, she was telling me in our first, uh, parent teacher conference that something about Nora was that she was always trying to help her classmates, like even when it was like to her own detriment, like she should be in her chair doing her work, but she was like she saw someone that needed help and like she's always like quick to jump up and do that and I think that's like I admire that in her, you know, I hope she keeps that, you know. And then you know we had a really hard year with Marin last year and a bunch of surgeries, some of which were unexpected, and the aftercare that we had to do with. You know the aftercare that we had to do with. You know you're getting your bladder and all the things that hurt her. Nora was always quick, even if they were fighting.
Speaker 3:Right before we started doing Marin stuff like fighting over a toy or something like that, nora was the first one to run over and be like man, I'll put your hand and you know, like mom, like can you know what can I do? And she would try to make Marin laugh. And you know, for her to be able to jump out of that. Like you snatched this toy from me mode right or whatever it was to. You know, you know a caregiver, it was really cool to see and she's, you know, seven she was six at the time Like that's not typical, you know, for a kid. I don't think you know.
Speaker 1:I think that, too, invites the opportunity, or that's a really good example of one of the things that we can do if we're struggling with you know, is our other child getting enough attention If there are ways that they can help even the smallest thing like? I remember Cole used to be like Johnny on the spot when Emery needed 15 things to do a diaper change, our girls required so much stuff for a diaper change.
Speaker 1:Cole was four when she was born and at home and I was trying not to hyperventilate every time there was a diaper change and I didn't even realize in the moment, but I was kind of naturally including him and that was making him feel special. It was helping him connect with his sister just by asking him can you go get the supplies basket? Or, oh, I dropped that diaper, can you pick that up please? Or oh, can you go grab the diaper bag that has the diaper kit inside of it. And I think those little things are part of what helped our relationship. But I think it helped him start to see himself as a helper and also it helped him start to see that the world existed outside of his needs. Yeah, and other people have needs. So I think that's another really awesome benefit. We probably don't always think about right, Because as much as our children are the world, one of my favorite Bluey episodes it's when I think it's Chili's brother is bringing over his kids and I think I don't remember if it's Muffin or one of the other crazy ones, but he says something to her about you know, you're the most special kid in the world.
Speaker 1:And so she goes and plays the games at Bluey's house with Bluey and Bingo, but she won't play by the rules and she's just wreaking havoc. And they ask her why aren't you playing by the rules? And she said because I'm the most special kid in the whole world. So they go and is it maybe Spike is his name their uncle? And he's like oh, just one moment. And he goes back and he tells him you know how? I told you you're the most special kid in the whole world. Yes, you're not. Now to mom and you know, and dad, you're the most special kid in our world, but not to anybody else really, or you know, it just doesn't work like that. And she just literally says OK, and then runs and tells Bluey and Bingo, I can play by the rules. Now, I'm not the most special kid in the world. And all three of them cheer and then start playing happily. And I mean, if you want parenting advice, in my opinion, just start watching, Just watch.
Speaker 3:Louis.
Speaker 1:Totally, but I love that Right. And I think that that's something that we can actually forget, is an important lesson for our kids. It's okay and it's actually valuable people, you are not everything Right, as as odd as that even sounds. To say what are your, what's your experience with that.
Speaker 3:No, I, honestly it's so funny. I love that. Blue episodes but I love, but I love how they said it you are the most special kid in the world to us, but outside of here you are not. You know and that's so reaffirming to them that, like you're, you know your parents still love you more than everything, right, but. But you got to play by the rules and you got to realize that, like, you're just part of this community or whatever it is Right, like, and you got to play your part and I, um, I love. I love that too. I think it's so good and, you know, because we want our kids to feel special, right, but we also want to know that there's.
Speaker 3:like you know, you got to live in the world too, right, Right, you know one of the things.
Speaker 1:I'm curious if you've experienced this with Nora, you have. You have a great story that I want you to share in the just a bit about your big girls trips that you take. But one of the pros that I can add to the list is that I feel, like you know, I don't know any different. I only have my first child who was healthy, and then my youngest child, who wasn't, so this is the only you know sample I have to pick from. So maybe it would be the same regardless. But I personally feel like one of the added benefits is that it doesn't take something big to be special for us. We're able to really appreciate the small moments, like when I invite Cole to go run an errand with me and not Emery, and then he we call it car DJ. I let him pick the songs that we listened to, whatever they are, even if it's over and over and over the same one.
Speaker 3:Yes.
Speaker 1:We have so much fun and it is so true. The same one, yes, appreciate the small little things together and I'm really grateful that he's getting that experience. Getting to see it doesn't have to be a big production, don't get me wrong. We are still struggling with weekends where he thinks that we are supposed to provide full-time entertainment. So if you have any recommendations, if somebody else was here to help do it I know right, or pay for it, right I?
Speaker 3:know right, or pay for it. Right, I know right. No, you know Lisa, I think, mentioned that too. If you guys go back and listen to that podcast that you know she appreciates the small things and I totally see that in our family and I see that in your family too. And you know I had to go get. I didn't have to. I wanted to treat myself and get my nails done.
Speaker 3:One day when we were experiencing your Indiana weather down here and it was freezing and gross, and I took Nora because she loves anything girly. But you know, I decided, I made the decision to leave Marin here with Brian and me and Nora went and got her nails done and every time I looked at her she had the biggest smile on her face and it was just a couple hours, but it was just me and her and it was. It was small in you know the scheme of things, but it was really special. You know, and I don't know. I just think, I agree, like I think it's. It's those baby moments like that, and those are the times too, like when we are in the car and it's just me and Nora. It doesn't happen a ton, but when it does like, I like to ask your questions.
Speaker 3:You know, like. You know, hey, has it been hard, like with your sister this week? Or you know, um, what's going on at school. You know, whatever, whatever it may be, it may have nothing to do with Marin, but I do. Those are the good chances to talk to them about um stuff, because, you're right, they'll just start blabbing Right Until, just start blabbing right until they want to hear their song again. Nora's current favorite is Cotton Eye, joe and I.
Speaker 1:It is a great song, but on repeat it is very long and it is losing its impact a little bit, a little bit, a little bit. Don't need to hit the road, yeah exactly let's see what right now Cole is into like theme songs from his favorite shows. And they're all like they're all. Do you? We can trade for a little bit.
Speaker 1:They are all like. Ben 10 is one, so you know it's like kid superhero characters, but usually there's aliens or monsters or something like that involved. Super cool. Yes, the the songs tend to be very what I would call like manly workout music songs, but he gets so into them that it's really enjoyable and and I love giving him an opportunity to just get in his groove and, you know, shine without having to fight with his sister about it.
Speaker 3:Yeah, totally, I love that. I love that.
Speaker 1:So I mean, it's just you know we're not going into anything super in depth here I think that that's important for us to realize, as parents, that a lot of times there's a lot more good going on. And I think that we, as advocates, once you know, when you make that shift from parent to parent advocate, it can cause us to unintentionally leave our Sherlock Holmes hat on all the time, unintentionally leave our Sherlock Holmes hat on full time, and by that I mean we are consistently actively searching for problems that need our attention and need to be solved. Right, yeah, that is a great skill and a very important one, but, just like anything, too much of anything is not generally a good thing, and so I feel like one of the best things that we can all remind ourselves is to remember to take that hat off sometimes, is to remember to take that hat off sometimes. I don't know if you're struggling with this. Go out and buy a or Amazon. Don't even put the pressure on yourself to leave. Yeah, exactly.
Speaker 3:Amazon.
Speaker 1:We're heading into summer right now, so if you're, you know, for this time, find a fun hat, some bright hat, I don't know something that when you see it it's kind of like something you would have rocked as a teenager, as a kid, and loved. Make that literally your fun hat and maybe you put that on when you go to run errands with your kids, or maybe I don't know if you need help literally getting yourself into a different mindset. That's one of the other huge, huge gifts we can give our kids. Let them just be kids and enjoy them. That is the oh. There's nothing really better than just allowing your kids to see you love them and enjoy them.
Speaker 3:Yeah, totally I, um I you know we talked about this. I think that was like it's so hard to take off that medical mom hat, or you called it the Sherlock Holmes hat or whatever where it's like, what can I fix, what can I do. And when I got back from the hospital, totally we.
Speaker 3:And when, cause it's gonna um you know, when I got, I guess when Nora, you know, maybe like a year after I got home from the hospital with Mary, cause I was gone for about six months the first time and I was like, oh my gosh, I need to get Nora in therapy, like she's going to hate Marin because it took me away. And you know we've talked about this and it was this huge fear. And so I got her, and you know, play therapy and it was. She thought it was fun because they played games, because she thought it was fun because they played games, and so she loved going. But I was like, is she going to be okay? You know, I'm like every week I would ask her like, is she, she going to be all right? Like is this traumatizing her? And she's like, actually, she's great, she loves her sister, you know. And I'm like, okay, and it was helpful to hear that.
Speaker 3:And you know I'm a huge proponent for therapy. I think it it doesn't hurt by any means for any of us kids, adults, whatever, obviously, but it is. It was so hard to take that hat off and just remember that our job we've said this a million times, you said this on this podcast Our job is to love our kids right and to make them feel special and loved and cared for and safe, and one of the things I think you alluded to this earlier, but one of the things I started with Nora was um an annual big girls trip.
Speaker 2:So because I was gone for so long.
Speaker 3:I know, I know y'all need to um, so, uh, we, after you know, things settled enough for Marin, me and um, one of my best friends we started an annual big girls trip and mom and aunt Ashley because my best friend is aunt Ashley that comes with us. She we take Nora somewhere special and the first couple of years was Florida and she, nora, talks about it all the time still and, you know, some years it's not big, some years we just go somewhere driving distance and for one night or whatever it is.
Speaker 3:But I just wanted her to have something that was hers and to feel special and um, and she loves it, and this year we're actually considering letting her come, because she's almost five, so she's technically getting to be a big girl, um, but Nora's even excited about that, you know, and so it was something that was hers. And now she's getting the choice whether, you know, her little sister gets to come or not, and I just it's been really special to give that gift to Nora, you know, and it's just about loving her. It's nothing.
Speaker 1:It has nothing to do with anything other than helping her have a really great time, but it's been really special, you know, and I also feel like it's a it's okay to acknowledge, and a positive thing to acknowledge, that it's also a gift to yourself getting to carve out those times, because what you discovered by giving Nora the opportunity to go to therapy to learn how to work through emotions that she no doubt wasn't understanding, you got the affirmation she loves her sister, right, which was the thing you were so concerned about. And what that reminds me of is it's okay to allow your kids to take the lead on their feelings, and what I mean by that is I think kids have a far greater capacity for forgiveness, for living in the moment, for moving forward. Yeah, only saying that if you've got little ones in your car, I think that is what starts to put a damper on our own ability to do those things that we were naturally born with, right, and I think it's just, it's one of those ways that we can actually be learning from our kids. You know, and that's a really special thing to do we're gonna learn from our older kids, gonna learn from our younger kids.
Speaker 1:I mean, I remember the first time Cole said you don't love me as much as you love Emery because she's little and she has a weird bladder or something, something along those lines and it was flaming dagger to the heart, cut me to my knees and I called my mom and she said I understand that would. That was probably really hard to hear. I'm going to tell you two things. One, we know that Cole doesn't really believe that he's having a knee-jerk reaction to being upset, and he knew that that was a way to hurt you. Now, what he's likely feeling is jealous, which is completely normal, right. The other thing she said is Ashlyn, you are you, you know you as the middle child, your sister, my sister is four years older and then my brother is four years younger, and she assured me that, even though we didn't have these type of things, words like that were thrown around a plenty and it is very typical, even, dare I say, very healthy developmental behavior experience of you were literally, because of COVID, completely isolated states away from Norway.
Speaker 1:It was so young, I mean, what two.
Speaker 3:Two and a half.
Speaker 1:Two and a half, and you were gone for literally months, six months. Oh gosh, I mean. Yeah, months, six months, oh gosh, I mean. So you. You carried so much pain and hurt from that experience. But when you returned home, did Nora give you the cold shoulder? Nope, not at all.
Speaker 3:Did she get in the cold shoulder and want nothing to do with her? No, she was obsessed and so happy at her baby sister was like dogs, right Like puppy dogs.
Speaker 1:Yeah, they're. No, she was obsessed. I'm so happy that her baby sister was home. They're so much more like dogs, right Like puppy dogs when they're kids.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I mean you're right, Like we need to learn from that. And if we could get rid of our job and like, think more like them, the world would be such a better place.
Speaker 1:I love that.
Speaker 3:No, it's all right, you're right.
Speaker 1:We, it's all right, you're right, we're gonna start a line of hats.
Speaker 3:Every I see so many people now having those businesses with like the iron-on, like customized hat. We need to get one that says this is my happy parent hats yeah, exactly you know. Or like my kid hat.
Speaker 1:Yeah, exactly, and use that as just our okay time to, you know, wear a different hat, look through a different lens and allow myself to enjoy the benefit of being a parent and allow myself to experience the things we hoped parenting would be like.
Speaker 1:Right, right, absolutely, because just because we're on this medical journey, it might look extremely different, you know, and there's no might about it actually. Yeah, definitely, it looks different and it's okay to have those fears, have those guilts. Those experiences are just as natural as breathing air. But taking a moment as breathing air, but taking a moment, even if you need to walk around the corner of your house and or do what I do, go hide in a closet for a moment, it works and just take a couple of deep breaths and remind yourself look, you are doing the best you can and you know you love all of your children Yep, immensely, immeasurably. And even on the days you fear they don't feel it or you don't show it does not change that truth, right? And we want them. Should they grow up and have the chance to become parents? Don't we want them to have that same grace and love for themselves? Absolutely.
Speaker 3:Absolutely. It's and to look at it. You know, in addition to that, you know it is hard and there are, like you said, it might be different than what we thought it was going to be, but look at all of the beautiful things that come from it, you know. Look at the empathy and the learning to speak problem solving the voice and the problem solving? Yes, absolutely, and you know, I think our kids do learn that a little sooner than maybe perspective, I mean my God.
Speaker 1:Yes, another one their ability to start to grasp you know what perspective actually is, what is a huge problem or a travesty versus what's not, and you know that's another great gift.
Speaker 3:Totally, absolutely, it's special and you know, I love that we're talking about this today because it's easy to lose sight of those things. I think sometimes, like when you're in the trenches, right, but when you take a second, any parent I mean this doesn't just apply to parents with medical complex kids you know it's any parent just taking a second to look at the beauty of your family and your, what you're building, and you know it's, it's really special and I love that we're doing that today.
Speaker 1:Absolutely yes, 100%. Well, Ashley, I've had so much fun with this conversation. Yeah, I'm so thankful that we get to have each other's kids in our lives too, because I'm secretly not not so secretly starting to manifest that Nora and Cole someday will align on a path to connecting us as an official family. Just gonna say that to you and not Brian, so he doesn't start, like you know, cornering Cole at future shared vacations Not yet, anyway.
Speaker 3:Well then that would be the ultimate dream. They're both adorable.
Speaker 1:With that. The last thing I want to say on here is, if you enjoyed this episode or gained something positive from it, please do us a favor and one leave a review on. You know, whether it's Apple podcasts or wherever you listen to it, just let us you know, send us a quick thought, leave a quick comment so that way other parents, other families, can find our podcast and receive that type of support they need more easily. And also share, share, share sharing is caring, especially with conversations like this. So we thank you for sharing your time with us and we really hope that this inspires you to go, look for the good and look for the fun with all of your children.
Speaker 3:And find a fun hat.
Speaker 2:You are capable, you are equipped and you are not alone. Together, we can do hard things for our children. If this episode connected with you and you want to hear more, be sure to hit the subscribe button. We would also love to learn about your personal journey and how we can support you and, last but not least, if you know of someone who could benefit from this podcast, please share when hope is buried.
