Individuality - The Secret to Impactful Leadership with Guest Expert Isabelle Fortin

In this powerful episode of The Visibility Impact Show, Crissy Conner sits down with Isabelle Fortin, former Royal Canadian Air Force officer, speaker, leadership consultant, and founder of Against the Ordinary. Isabelle unpacks what it really means to lead with humanity, the difference between management and leadership, and why individuality is the gateway to greater visibility, team connection, and impact. 

Whether you're a seasoned entrepreneur or emerging leader, this episode will challenge you to stop being the carbon copy and become the most genuine version of you.

Connect with Isabelle:

https://www.linkedin.com/in/isabellemfortin/

Book a NOVA profile session here https://www.againsttheordinary.org/ 

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OMNI is your group coaching experience where you learn how to create visibility that works harder than you do. A strategic blueprint to become discoverable on the feed, search and AI. https://thevisibleceo.com/omni 

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Transcript

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Welcome back to the visibility impact show we have an amazing guest episode today. And so I am excited to introduce you to Isabelle Fortin who is a former Royal Canadian Air Force officer turned speaker and leadership consultant. She's the founder of against the ordinary and a passionate advocate for individual individuality, human centered leadership. That's a mouthful, but that's okay, because we're learn so much about her today. Isabel, welcome to the show. Chrissy, thank you so much for having me. I'm delighted to be here with you. I would love you to give us a brief overview of how you went from the Royal Canadian Air Force turned speaker and leadership consultant. I don't know if that's a long story or a short story, but give it to us however you love to tell it. uh it's kind of a long story, but I'll make it short for you. being in the Air Force was the family business. Both my parents had served in the Air Force. And when I joined in 1989, my brother was an Air Force pilot. So fresh out of high school, there was just no real questions. It's just, okay, so you joined the military and that's what you do, right? So a decade in, although I absolutely loved wearing the I loved serving my country, the sense of camaraderie, the sense of belonging, the purpose, the sense of service was very, very important to me. However, the actual daily grind, my job... getting a little bit boring and I have to tell you Chrissy I really really look inside the organization to see is there another trade that I could do that would satisfy like that je ne sais quoi I was looking for I really didn't find it and my perception of the world shifted drastically when I joined the corporate world because first job I had an extremely terrible boss and I thought, holy moly, this person really sucks at leadership. And then I only lasted five months and because of her, to be honest with you. And then I get to the second job and it's just kind of more of the same. And I lasted three years and I get to the third job and it's exactly the same. And I go, okay, there's something wrong here. But it took me a while to understand what it was. And honestly, it's the lack of leadership training. Because in the military, if you're in a leadership position, you have had leadership training. In the corporate world, they will take the best salesperson. And I always take sales because sales department in most companies, is the department that has the biggest budget for training because that's where the money is right so they take the best salesperson and they say you're great at sales we're gonna put you in charge of that team but leadership is a skill selling is in different kind of skills and i am dumbfounded prissy that this is still happening. This is 25. I've been out of the military longer than I want to count and we're counting in decades here. So it was that shift that made me go, huh, there's something missing. And I think I can help. Yeah. And that's how my business was created. So you talk a lot about human centered leadership. What does that mean when we're talking about like today's business environment? Like, and even on if we can touch on what does that mean for entrepreneurs as well? Well, human centered leadership is the people, the leaders that understand that the biggest asset is the people. It's the humans working for them or with them, regardless of, you know, depending on how you want to see it. So it's about the leader being at the service of the people actually doing the job. The job of the leaders to take care of the people, it's not to make sure that the train's on time. That's management. that's a whole new ballgame, a whole different ballgame. But I find that a lot of corporations mistake the two, because I'm the team leader, sounds... way sexier than I'm the management of this department. A manager's job is to make sure that the train's on time. I listen, I'm not saying management is a bad thing. I'm really not. And middle management, they have the worst jobs, regardless of the industry and regardless of the company they work for. But leadership is something else. And the job of the leaders to take care of the people They don't work for you, you work for them. Your job is to support them, to train them, to mentor them, to make sure that they're satisfied, they're engaged, they're happy, they're recognized, they're seen, heard, and valued. That's your job. Yeah. You know, this, it really reminds me of, I know you were talking about cells, but it really reminds me of, don't know if you listen to Gary V, but Gary V always talks about the most, the best marketing strategy ever is to care. And it's really caring about the end user, the end human that is going to be eventually your customer. And so it's, you know, and I talk about this a lot too, my clients. Like if you're willing to show up and you're willing to get visible, you're willing to influence people, impact people's lives, AKA you are a leader, right? You are a leader. Or at least I hope that you are because I, and I don't know how much you believe in this too, but you know, I feel like a true leader leads themselves first and then they can lead others. And also sometimes I feel like true leaders don't actually know that they're a leader. That is very, very common. And in most organizations that I work with, the leader that has, the person, I should say, that has leader in their job title isn't actually the leader of the group. The leader of the group is the natural mother of the group, right? That takes care of everybody and that nobody takes care of her. Yeah. I say her, could be him. I'm just, you know, most of the time it's the women. But yeah, and I love Gary Vee and you're right. actually to double down on what you're saying, Percy, I heard Richard Branson say, and I mean, as far as businesses are concerned, I mean, I think he's done well for himself. uh Saying in an interview with a French reporter, The reporter asked, okay, so, you know, how do you take care of your clients? And he giggled because he's, you know, he's a little bit of a sarcastic human. Like he's very nonchalant, right? So he kind of giggled and he said, oh, that's easy. don't. And the reporter kind of went, you know, being French and all and being a little bit offended and said, well, what do you mean? He says, no, I don't take care of my customers. I take care of my people and they take care of And that's the difference. And I heard recently, Gary Vee in an interview saying, I will fire anybody that doesn't treat the employees correctly, regardless of how much money they make me. And that's company culture first. And that's why he's successful. Yeah. I mean, it's about the inhuman, right? It really is, you know, and yeah. And, you know what, Chrissy, with AI and everything that can be automized will be, if it's not already, but it's, it's certainly getting there. But the one thing that AI will never take is how to be human. So there are more things that unite us that are things that divide us. And yes, and yet, we live and work in polarized environment. Like what? I can't talk to you or I can't be friends with you if you're a Democrat or Republican? Come on, you're human. That's what you are first. Let's find the common ground. Absolutely. Absolutely. So true. So you talk about individuality and you talk about that being the entry point to like better leadership and communication. Can you go a little bit deeper into that? honey, I can talk about this for hours individuality and if if I want the audience listening to this podcast to take away one thing that's what I'm about to say individuality really is all it's graphed up to be. You are not here by mistake. You are not a mistake. You were put here with an infinite amount of skills and talent and unique abilities, you're already different, your job is to figure out how and be more of that. So when it comes to leadership, that's how you get your employees to feel like they're seen heard and valued is by tapping into what you're naturally good at. Everybody should take what they do easily. without even having to mentally wake up and tap into that and do that for a living. Because productivity goes up and when productivity goes up, so does your bottom line. Yes. So true. Like I love this whole conversation. Like it's hard to sit in my seat and not jump up and down and agree with you like yes, yes, that's so good. Like I agree with that. Like yes, that's how I feel. So I absolutely love that. So when we spoke obviously pre interview, we talked about something called a Nova profile. Can you explain more about that? Because I think we talked about that unlocks more individuality, correct? Yes, so an over profile is a psychometric assessment and I want to make something very clear. Please, in the audience, do not take a personality test. Your personality is not to be tested. You are perfect the way you are. eh Your personality is not to be tested. I mean, testing means that there's a possibility of you failing. You're not failing at being who you are. So, It's called a psychometric assessment. So I use Nova, it's from Switzerland. It's been around for about three decades. And the reason that I've used other tools before, the reason that I decided to work with that particular assessment is because not only will it give you your behavioral preferences, your cognitive preferences, your communicative preferences, So basically, how is your brain wired? That's what it means. But also, it will give you how you are naturally and how you have adapted yourself to any given situation. So if your need for, I'll give you an example, if you need to be in action, if you need to rise to the challenge is not being met and you're not conscious of that, you will unconsciously put yourself in trouble. Because you have a need to rise to the occasion. You have a need to be challenged, to face things, to be in action. Right? So when you know how you're adapting and what area of your life you are adapting, well, you can be a little bit more careful and choose things that are good for you so that you can come back to who you are. And the second reason I really, really love Nova is because It will also go into your motivations. And Chrissy, unless you use violence, and you know, we are seeing what violence is about right now in the world, unless you use violence, you can't motivate anybody to do anything at any time, ever. So what you need to do is find out what motivates the other person and tap into that. And look at what are you trying to accomplish? And how is this good for the other person? And what's good for the other person? But here's the trick. You can't fake that shit. That's the best. what's good for them, for real. And you know what? A lot of entrepreneur that I work with and team leaders that I work with, yes, but you know, isn't that manipulative? And I always answer, you know what? Not everybody wants to be an entrepreneur. Some people are actually very happy working for other people, punching the clock and going home. And that's... Beautiful, thank goodness we have people like that. So find out what's good about your project for them and they will crawl through broken glass for you. Have you ever seen somebody take the test that, cause I always say, obviously I don't, I'm not giving people this test, but I do say blanket statement. Not everybody is meant to be an entrepreneur. Not everybody can handle being an entrepreneur because we're, we are so conditioned in our society to work an hour, get paid for an hour, get work for an hour and get paid for an hour. And as an entrepreneur, is not the way it works, right? Until you start bringing those, that regular revenue in. But if you ever had a situation where somebody took this test and they either maybe realized they weren't ready to be an entrepreneur, weren't fit to be an entrepreneur, or maybe weren't in the right industry or in the right niche that they thought they had to be in. I have two examples, I'll give you one. CEO of a big local corporation here where I live, about 400 employees then, a little bit more now, actually a lot more now. And they're... Leadership, I'll say leadership, not skills, because it doesn't measure skills, but preferences was extremely low. And ironically, that's the first thing that we talk about in the debrief. Because this assessment, it's not only you go on the internet and you fill out a questionnaire and it gives you the report. Actually, it gives me the report and I spend an hour. analyzing the data and making sure that you know what is connected with what and how things are influencing one another because you are not one thing at the time you are all these things at once and then it comes with a 90 minute debrief and Percy I've tried to do it in less than 90 minutes I've never succeeded to this day because it's it's a lot of information it's you know between 25 to 40 pages report so back to my story this gentleman is the first thing that I have to talk about is the fact that he's not a natural leader and he his preference is actually not to be and he kind of looked at me and folded his arm you know like the white man does you know with almost his feet on the desk and said well Isabel come on You know, like I'm the CEO of this big corporation, I have over 450 employees. I mean, you have to admit, you know, like this test is a little bit, you know, goofy, right? And because I had spent so much time reading the profile, I understood where that was coming from. And I said, well, actually, doesn't measure what you're capable of. It measures what you prefer. And I said, I'm willing to bet a fair bit amount of money that if you can, if you could make the same amount of money, have the same lifestyle, offer the same lifestyle to the people that you love and work alone in your basement at equal salary, equal benefits, equal everything, I bet you would choose. working alone in your basement. And then he went, yeah, I would. I said, you're going after the lifestyle and that's okay because you have a need for that as well, right? So I think that that's the biggest challenge that I got inside a debrief where he literally folded his arm going, this is bullshit. You was kind of happy because not only was I able to actually get that point across, because it was about him, it's not about me. It's not me being right. I don't care if I'm right or wrong. And if it doesn't apply to you, then fine. It doesn't apply to you. You don't have to take it at face value if you don't want to. But I was quite pleased with myself. And he sent me many people since. Yeah, absolutely. He was happy with the end result, right? Exactly. So yeah, I love that. Such a good story. And such a good transition, transformation that he had too. And you know what? I I took the test myself and I remember the first time I've taken it twice so far. And I remember the first time there was something in my motivations and I went, what the heck are you trying to tell me here? I didn't say that out loud, but my like physical energy and thank God it was the last thing on that page. And I went. And it was about my values. And I kind of looked at her and I remember saying, so basically you're telling me I have no values. And she said, no, Isabel, that's not what I'm saying. I'm saying that your values are yours and that you will get along with anybody who doesn't share this value because you understand that, you know, their values is theirs. And as long as they're not trying to convince you of anything, you're like, okay, you. you do you and I'll do me. That's it's okay. But like the my initial reaction was like, what? No, no, no, I have a lot of values. No, no, it's not saying that at all. Like, okay. So that's why it's, it's an added bonus to have a debrief. It's not only had I read the report, I would have done this is crap. Yeah, so good. So one of the things you said when we talked originally, you said that people who are very self-aware benefit from the Nova profile. Why do you feel self-awareness is so critical for entrepreneurs and leaders? Thank you for that question. Chrissy, before I answer that question, I'm going to tell you something. So, Dr. Tasha Yurick, and she has a great TEDx on self-awareness. She wrote several books on that. held her and her team did the biggest study on self-awareness in the world. They literally interviewed close to 5,000 people. They read every piece of literature ever written on the subject from the 1600s to now, even anything and everything related to that. And there's one thing that she says in her TEDx that absolutely is crucial to my answer. So she says two things. The first one is after interviewing close to 5,000 people, between 90 and 95 % of people said that they were extremely self-aware. When in reality what they found is the number is closer to between 10 and 15%. And when she adds in her TEDx is that what that means is 80 % of us are lying to ourselves about the fact that we're lying to ourselves. That's insane. Yes. So, and she defined, I seriously, if you're curious about self-awareness, go write TEDx self-awareness and she'll be the first one that pops up. She wrote several books on the subject and they're all extremely interesting. So back to Nova and self-awareness. Mm-hmm. What if you weren't in that 5 to 10 percent? What if? I'm like the rest of you, I was 100 % convinced that I was extremely self-aware until I did my first NOVA. And NOVA comes with a bunch of questions, even in the debrief. I mean, in order to get to that stage, you have about 40 some odd questions, I think it's 43 or 45 questions and then pops up a report. even in the debrief, there's a lot of questions. Which, well, you know, what do you think your cognitive preference is? What do you think your, you know, behavioral preferences is? What do you, and I got every answer wrong. I think, I really think I'm a, you know, like a big, big dark red. Mm-hmm. turns out I'm a 45 out of a hundred. Oh yeah, must be a 60 yellow. know, the yellow is the need for influence or communication and it's also the seeking fun. Like fun is extremely serious for me. I know it sounds, you know, stupid but it is. If it isn't fun, I'm not there. I'm just not there. Yeah. I'm not, I'm not, there's not just two short, man, I'm gonna die. No, no, no, I got no time if it isn't fun. But I thought I was like, you know, the average 60, I'm at 93, I think. So that's the greatest thing about having an assessment like that, is that you get to meet yourself with no judgment. There is no wrong profiles, there is no wrong... answer. It is what's there. When you know what's there, you can tap into it more. And I have to tell you, Chrissy, I've adapted the way I do business since I saw my own profile. Okay, so what I'm naturally good at is X, Y, and Z. Let's tap into X, and Z. How I get clients is by doing what I'm doing with you now, doing podcasts and going to in person events and shaking hands and making friends and that's how I get business. Because cold messaging just doesn't work for me. doesn't mean it doesn't work for anybody. I have I know plenty of people that it works for them. It's just not my vibe. So when you know yourself better than you it's easier to go and lean into who you are. Yeah. So good. So good. Like I geek out about this. I know we could we could. So let's move on to talk a little bit about visibility. Because obviously this show is about visibility. My first question is how has being visible sharing your story? And again, I count being a podcast guest is being visible, right? You're putting yourself out there. Your work, how has it supported both your business growth or even your leadership impact? it's a game changer. It really is. Yeah, it's a game changer. It's, it's, and actually I'll, again, we'll go one step further. There's a big part of my story that came to light by talking about it publicly. Things I had never realized that came to me in the middle of a podcast because... When you share your story, you get the feedback from somebody and then by a question you go, hang on. And it was like kind of a, you know, rapid or fire questions at the end of a podcast and, and somebody's, you know, just threw a question at me and I, and I answered and while listening back at the answer, I went, my goodness. I had never realized that about myself. So visibility is everything. It's everything. We are not meant to be cavemen. We are not meant to be alone. We're creatures of groups, of tribes, of... We're made. And some people's tribes need to be smaller. I respect that, but they still need a tribe. Yes. So good. So good. It's funny you said that because I will never forget doing a speech and I kind of plan it out. And I remember this story coming in my head in the middle of telling this speech that so went with the story. But I mean, so went with the speech, but I was like, where did this come from? Like this has been buried in my head for like 10 years and like it just came out and I was like, that was the weirdest thing ever. It was like this epiphany like happened in the middle of a speech. And I always joke that I prepare for a but I black out because I'm an introvert and hate being the center of attention. I'm good at it, but I black out and I don't really remember what I say, but I remembered that story. And so it was the funniest thing, which leads me into, you said that you delivered your first keynote in English and something, it was a breakthrough moment, correct? Yeah, I've given many, many, many, many, many, many speeches in my life. And last year, last August, I was invited to be the keynote speaker in an event in Detroit. And it was, I realized right there and then that it wasn't my first podcast appearances. I had done like over 150 between. Podcasts and live events and on LinkedIn YouTube, whatever I had done a lot but in person It was the first time doing in the English and I actually said that Like at the beginning beginning of my speech I said I you know I was introduced and I walked on stage and I said I just realized that this is the first keynote I will ever do in English and The audience just cheered and I went that's so cool. That's very cool So it was, yeah, it was a big pivotal moment for me because even though I speak English in my daily life, it's something else. Giving a keynote, standing up in spotlight, you can see, you know, the first three, four rows, it was just, it was kind of a, well, see, Chica, you've made it. You can, you're capable of doing that. And I was... I don't know what's the word. I was kind of surprised that it hadn't dawn on me yet. I just kind of wrote the speech and it was custom made for that particular event. And I kind of wrote it and I practiced it and made the slide and, know, send the slide ahead. Like all you do in order to get, and I, I'm obviously not an introvert. And so I leave a lot of room for things that are going to pop up because I know they're going to pop up. So even though I'm extremely well structured, it's not verbatim. So, and it even started with something I wasn't expecting. uh So, I mean, was it uncomfortable or you just, you didn't even realize that till you were on stage, there was no like fear, extra fear there. I don't get fear. get excitement, but I, you know, no, I'm not, no, I'm not paralyzed by the fear of public speaking, which is really funny because very often when I write on my LinkedIn tagline that I'm a public speaker, I get a lot of public speaking coach that approach me, you know, I will help you, you know. Blah blah blah. Deal with your fear. Public speaking. Yeah, sorry, wrong crowd. You're barking at the tree. You know, what's interesting is obviously I'm an introvert. But I went to I got invited to like this local speakers Association of Ohio, which is where I live. And I remember walking in and people coming up to me and saying, how do you do live video? And I'm like, how do you speak in front of 1000s of people? Like it was interesting. Like how I'm like, what? Like how? How can you not just go push go live? And they're like, how do you do that? And I'm and you know, it got me to thinking like, there, when we're doing when I'm doing live video, obviously, I don't see faces. And I feel like as a speaker who speaks in front of that many people, you're probably getting immediate feedback from those faces and expressions. Are they getting this? Do I need to go a little bit deeper to explain myself? Are they getting my jokes? Right? Because I'm funny. I'm hilarious when I'm on a Facebook live, right? Like I'm hilarious. I laugh at myself have no clue if anybody else is but I think I'm funny. Yeah, well, and at the end of the day, that's all that matters. Right? For me, the the in person events is if it feeds me more because of the human contact before and after and because of the feeling the vibration in my body and the laughter and the claps and the And it's not an ego thing, it really isn't. It's about a shared experience. And I even say, especially in that talk in Detroit last year, I said, I wasn't the center of attraction tonight, you were mine. I did this for you, not the other way around. You're not here for me. I was here for you. And so that's, I think that when you show up with that, it's just better. Yes, so good. remember, I think it was my third time getting on a stage and I had this like full length like sequin outfit on and I get up on stage and I'm like, I'm gonna sit down because I don't wanna look down at you. I actually want to look you right in the eye, because the stage was up and like I was eye level when I sat down and that was the most like exhilarating experience because I could look and instead of going like this, I was looking straight into every single person's eyes. And it felt so magical to connect with them in that way. Yeah, I should try that. I'm gonna try that next time. uh then I always love I'm about to do something crazy is normally what I say. And then it's like, boom, it's gonna blow up after that. It's gonna be amazing. So so I'm always down with I have a crazy idea. I think this is what I'm gonna do. But I just felt it. And I just sat down. It was like there was like actually even a couch but I there was a carpet on the floor. And I sat on the floor. Cross my legs and gave my speech. Yeah. a good idea, I'm gonna try that. Yeah, yeah, it was very, it was very emotional, but it was, but it just, I feel into it and I thought it was perfect. so yeah. All right. So we see a lot of entrepreneurs struggling with showing up authentically because they're so busy. watching what everybody else is doing. So many carbon copies of everybody else out there, right? We have people who trying to be Gary V. People are trying to be Tony Robbins. People are trying to be whoever right? Why do you think that is? And what advice would you give those trying to find their voice? Oh, goodness gracious. You are bringing me in this very slippery subject, which okay, I love. I actually don't go for authentic. I go for genuine. Because to me, and that doesn't mean that's what it means, I'm saying to me, there's two things. Authenticity has been so overused that it has been depleted of its meaning, again, for me. And the other thing is that for me it means that I have to show you all of who I am I don't necessarily want to show you all of who I am But I want to make sure is that what I choose to show you what feels safe for me to show you is actually Correct, which is the reason I go for genuine So the meaning that person that you are meeting with that you are having conversation with right now is the real me is just not all of me You don't see the fight I had with boyfriend last week. You don't see the fact that my dad is losing his memory. You don't see that I lost my dog and I'm still sad. You don't see that. You don't see all of it because this is not the time and this is not the place for it. and the other thing is when I use the word genuine for me it is safer. because I still can control what I choose to share. So I go for genuine. So make sure that you feel secure in what you're about to share. And you have to look after you first. That's your job. When you were born, you were giving a human... and your job is to take care of that human its entire life. And that's you. Yeah. I love that. That's such a good call out. I love that. So good. I'm totally using that. Moving forward. uh it somewhere. Yeah, no, no, it's so good. It's so good. All right, so we are gonna do a quick rapid fire round. And so I have some fun questions to ask you. And some of them may not be one answer. And that's okay. Because again, you have no idea what I'm about to ask you. So so we'll go with it here. So what's one thing that people would be surprised to learn about you? that I'm a salsa dancer. I didn't know that. That's so cool. Okay, do you have a favorite leadership quote or motto? Yes, actually it is from Simon Sinek and it's leaders eat last. So good. What do you think one thing that you do daily that sets you up for the most success is? I show up. These answers are fire, by the way. Is there a book or resource that deeply influenced your leadership? Yes, but it has nothing to do with leadership. It is a book that's been written, I don't even know how long ago, but I'm guessing it's about a hundred years. It's called The Prophet. It is by Keblib Gibran and it's truly a philosophy book. I have never heard of that. Now I want to go find it. like two or three pages per chapter. It's not even 100 page. It is so, so, so profound. I've dropped that book in the sand, in the pool, in my bathtub. I've given it seriously. I've given this book at least 20 times in my life. my gosh. That's so good. That's so good. Okay. Add to your to be read list friends listening. All right. What is, yeah, I'm totally would totally totally I'm onto that. So, okay. What is something on your bucket list that you cannot wait to do? huh. There's two. One, I will not do, you'll understand why. And the second was supposed to be for my 50th birthday, but it was COVID. So the first one is to go to St. Petersburg, Russia, because my, that's the last trip my mother took before she passed. But with everything that's going on with Russia politically, I'm going to abstain, at least for now. Right. more than likely have at least 25 to another 30 years to live. So hopefully I'll get my turn. The second thing is to go to Cape Town, South Africa. And that was actually in the works, airline book and everything for my 50th birthday. But I turned 50 during COVID and instead I rented a cottage an hour away from my house. Yeah. and the same sex appeal, if you ask me. yeah, but the trip is in the works is what you're saying. It's happening. Okay, I love it. I love it. Such great answers. Such great answer. All right, so where can people connect with you and learn more about your work? It's very very easy to connect with me either LinkedIn or Facebook, Isabelle Fortin. There are many many many of us. I am the only one with purple hair. And my website is being redone but by the time this aired it should be redone already and it is againsttheordinary.org and if you want to there's a calendar linked in there if you want your profile profile, your NOVA profile, can go there and you can just, you know, go with the contact me button and land into my email inbox. Awesome. And I was gonna ask if there's anything you want to share promote today. Is that the assessment? Okay. everybody should do it. I truly truly do. And plus, you know, they get to spend 90 minutes with me. Yeah, and we'll add it in the show notes too, so you can have the link. All right. Any final words or advice that you would love to share with my audience? Individuality really is all it's cracked up to be. There, there to be, you're already different. There to be more of it. Figure out how you are different and be more of that. There is enough cheap versions of Louis Vuitton and Yves Saint Laurent and all these, you know, big high value items. Don't be the cheapest version of Mel Robbins be who you are. You're not worth less than she is. You're just invisible for now. So be visible. oh So good. Thank you so much for being one of our amazing guests. If you are listening to this episode, make sure you share it with someone you know that could get value from this. Make sure you connect with Isabelle and make sure you stay tuned for the next episode. Thank you so much for listening.