Unveiling Personal Transformation: A Journey into Archetypal Consulting with Carolyn Wallace

In this episode of the Transcendent Minds Podcast, we explore the transformative power of archetypal consulting with Archetypal Consultant Carolyn Wallace who shares personal anecdotes and insights from her journey of facing inner challenges and becoming an archetypal consultant. 

We discover how understanding and embracing archetypal patterns can lead to profound self-discovery and empowerment. 

We dive deep into the process of identifying personal archetypes and harnessing their potential for growth and fulfilment. Together, we uncover the nuances of archetypal work and envision its future impact on individual lives and collective consciousness.

Carolyn Wallace's Website: https://yourradiantlife.net

Transcript

PMD: 0:27

I have the privilege of delving into the realm of personal transformation and empowerment with a truly exceptional guest, Carolyn Wallace. Caroline is a certified archetypal consultant with 20 years of experience guiding individuals in their journey towards greater happiness, fulfillment and purpose and drawing from her background as a therapist and her deep understanding of archetypal patterns Caroline empowers her clients to unlock their inner strength, transcend limiting beliefs, and manifest lives filled with confidence and joy. So fasten your mental and emotional seatbelts as we explore and create a rich and engaging dialogue that delves into the depths of personal transformation and the profound influence of archetypes and discover how they can serve as catalysts for profound personal growth and self discovery. Carolyn, welcome to the Transcendent Minds podcast.

CW: 1:26

Thank you. Thank you for having me. Peter.

PMD: 1:28

I want to gain a deeper understanding of the essence of you and the profound evolution that you've undergone on your journey and towards becoming a beacon of light and guidance for others and it seems clear to me that the seeds of transformation was sown during your formative years because you were raised in a nurturing environment filled with love and compassion. You developed a keen sense of empathy and a profound curiosity about the human psyche. And this innate desire to understand and support others laid the foundation for your future endeavors in the realm of therapy and archetypal consulting. So can you share a bit about your upbringing and how it influenced your path towards becoming a therapist, an archetypal consultant, and what pivotal experiences or influences shaped your early understanding of human nature and the complexities of the human psyche?

CW: 2:31

That's a big couple of big questions thrown in there altogether. I was raised in a German Lutheran family, I was taken to Lutheran church, a conservative Lutheran church every week, multiple times a week. And that was actually quite formative in that it was only after I got older that I realized how conservative that the church was and that there were some things I didn't agree with, but when I was in the church services, I was in the choir. I was in the bell choir. It was the ritual of the service, the ritual of the hymns, the ritual of singing the Psalms that I think really sunk so deeply into me that it evoked the sacredness and a sense of connection to the sacred that I have always taken with me. I said, I don't belong to the Lutheran church anymore. But I've taken that sense of sacredness that was instilled in me as a child, just along with me on my journey, which I'm deeply grateful for.

PMD: 3:28

And you have this insatiable thirst for knowledge and your innate desire to make a difference in the lives of others, and you've clearly embarked on this journey of self discovery and exploration, and you pursued a formal education in psychology and counseling, honing your skills and deepening your understanding of the human mind and spirit. But alongside all of your academic pursuits, you have embarked on various humanitarian ventures, including volunteering in underserved communities and participating in international aid projects. Can you walk us through your educational and professional journey from your studies in psychology to your early experiences in the field of therapy?

CW: 4:14

Let's see, I have a bachelor's degree in psychology and then I went on to get a master's degree in social work. So I got my master's degree from Temple University in Northeast Philadelphia and had the opportunity to work in some of those communities in Northeast Philadelphia. Some of those underserved communities you were talking about. And from there, I really came to understand the impact of white privilege and what that looks like, what that means. Institutional racism. My eyes became very open to those concepts and I decided that I needed to go serve more than I already was and that took me a two year stint in the Peace Corps to Ecuador, where truthfully, I got more of an education in Ecuador than I think I provided anyone else, but I worked with a few different organizations while I was in Ecuador serving handicapped children. And their parents and boy, that I just get such an education doing that. And hopefully I brought something of service to the groups that I was supposed to be there to serve. But I think that I wound up becoming away far more richer from those experiences than maybe the people that I touch, but I made some deeply wonderful friends. I'm still in contact with them today. This was a very long time ago now. And then when I came back from the Peace Corps, I don't even remember exactly what happened next, but ultimately I wound up living in Washington DC Oh, that's what happened next. I wound up living in Washington, DC getting a job again in working for a national AmeriCorps program. And then but while I was in DC I became part of another ecumenical church while I was there, but also started studying yoga. And through that yoga studio just became fascinated with yoga, with the health benefits, with how I felt doing yoga, realizing that I could walk out of a yoga studio after class actually not having anxiety, which was eye opening for me and it was without a doubt that I also was becoming, going to become a yoga teacher. So I commuted between Washington DC and Kripalu Center in Western Massachusetts to become a yoga teacher and when that distance became a little bit too much, I said, I think I'm just going to move to the Berkshires in Western Massachusetts, just so I can be near Kripalu and teach there and become part of the community there, which I was very lucky to be able to do. So that was the next part of my journey.

PMD: 6:38

To circle back cause the question that came up for me as you were speaking was that I wanted to understand more about your humanitarian work and your volunteer experience and how did that shape your perspective on human suffering and resilience?

CW: 6:53

Human suffering and resilience. You know what I learned in Ecuador, South America, a different culture, right? And nothing, I really had anything, any contact with before I went there and what I learned was that people's hearts. Human hearts can connect with each other. Here I was a white woman traveling to South America, there to serve, right? Which is I'm putting in like mental air quotes there to serve and it was the heart connections that I noticed were just so profound that no matter where you go, no matter what your culture is, there can be connections of love between human hearts. And it was just so deeply profound to me that I had a little family, little community there in Quito, Ecuador, that I plopped myself into and those connections continue today and the deep, profound friendships that I developed. And I think that was just so pivotal. That the human connection, it didn't, people were very poor there. And some of the families I worked with just profound, like just living on the hillsides of like mountain sides in dwellings that you wouldn't even call houses. I was there with witnessing mothers carrying their 16 year old child with cerebral palsy to meet the van that would take the child to the daycare center where I served, just like walking on these steep mountain paths and yet so full of gratitude and so full of joy. It was just such a profound experience.

PMD: 8:28

I can totally empathize with that experience. I've had similar experiences like that in West Africa, where people were living in shacks with outside sewers and they had to walk miles to a well to get water. But the inner richness and the joy I'm not saying, sure they would love a faucet and they would love to have all of these things, but there was something about them it's difficult to describe. It was almost like the replacement of oxygen was with joy, was with gratitude, was for what they had, and the support they would give to each other as families was absolutely incredible. Armed with knowledge and empathy you delved into the world of therapy where you found your true calling in guiding individuals towards healing and growth and drawing upon your extensive training and your innate gift for compassion, clearly, to me, became a beacon of hope for those navigating the murky waters of mental health challenges and personal struggles. And during that time, I see that your fascination with archetypes began to blossom as you witnessed the profound impact of symbolic patterns in clients lives. Can you share a memorable experience from your early years as a therapist where transformative power of empathy and compassion and how did your interest in archetypes emerge?

CW: 10:00

To think about that one, early years as a therapist I've just had the privilege there's so many clients that now have crossed my path over the past 20 years. I've sat with families, I've sat with couples, I've sat with parents and their children. Now I work just mostly with adults. When people come and they're looking for help and they're looking for support, they're wanting something to hold on to, they're wanting some way to be able to manage their lives a little bit better. And the training that I've had, the hopefulness that I'm hoping continues that I can continue to provide for people. It's almost like what we were talking about before for the underserved communities in South America, that when people find that they can attach themselves to some thread of hope, some thread of hope that things are going to get better, some thread of hope that they actually have power in their lives to make the changes that they want, those are the things you can see it, you can see the connection that people make. You can see it in their eyes, you can feel it in their hearts over time that, Oh, I can be effective in my life. I can make things better for my family and my children. I just needed someone to talk to. I needed to take a deep breath. I needed to understand where my power lies and I think that is what I count on happening through my work with therapy clients, but also the archetypal consulting clients I work with. And what you said about the symbolism, that's what lights me up. That's what I get really jazzed with. Archetypes are universal. So when you talk about archetypes, especially the survival archetypes that Carolyn Myss outlines in her book, sacred contracts, those four survival archetypes are universal to everyone's human experience. Everyone can relate when I start talking about the victim archetype, for example, or the saboteur archetype or the child, everyone can relate to those and there's just such a deep resonance in people's hearts when they think, Oh yeah, I have those patterns. And not only do I have those patterns, through my own efforts, I can shift some of those. I can still stay within the same archetype, but archetypes are so dynamic that I can shift my thinking just a little bit to this way over here and I can have a completely different experience still within the realm of thinking about the same archetype and embodying the same archetype. And it just gives people that little bit of Oh, I can be more powerful in my life than I thought I could be, then I realized I could be, we don't have to stay stuck in our old patterns, we can move through them and create better realities. Even within the archetypes that we already have. We don't have to change archetypes. We just have to up lever our thinking about them within the ones we already have.

PMD: 12:54

You've encountered your fair share of challenges as we all have along the way from navigating the complexities of human relationships to confronting inner demons. And you've grappled with moments of doubt and uncertainty, but it was through those trials and tribulations that you discovered the resilience of the human spirit and the untapped potential within yourself. Can you share a personal challenge or setback that you faced during your journey and how it ultimately shaped your path towards becoming an archetypal consultant?

CW: 13:36

When I first started learning about archetypes I was in a marriage that was less than happy. I had two young children at the time, now they're big, one of those bigger than I am, and I started learning about, again, the survival archetypes, the four survival archetypes that Carolyn Myss outlines in her program, and those are the victim, the saboteur, the prostitute, and the child. I'm just going to say them because I talk about the survival archetypes a lot. And I started learning about the victim archetypes and it hit me in a place that was so profound because what I learned about that particular archetype is that they put the locus of why their lives aren't working out at the way they wanted it outside of themselves, a victim in the shadow. Every archetype has a shadow side and a light side, right? So the victim in the shadow blames everyone else around them or situations around them or the past or whatever, why their life isn't going the way they think it should be going and they're not taking full responsibility for why that is. And it was such an eye opening experience and then the program, the archetypal consulting program that I had just started outlined the path from this victim to developing some boundaries to being able to say, what is it the victim says I'm not allowed. So the victim in the shadow says, I'm not allowed to have this thing. Let's feel sorry for me. I'm not allowed and then as the victim starts to evolve, she starts to use the words like I will not allow. She gets stronger. She gets more grounded. She gets stronger. She can feel the roots coming down from the soles of her feet, grounded and tells herself, I will not allow. Now, whether that means she will not allow any harm to come toward her, she puts up her hands, she has boundaries, or she will not allow those negative thought patterns to continue within herself. I will not allow myself to continue thinking like a victim. I'm going to think about where I can actually have some power here. And just that shift in thinking was so deeply profound for me, using the symbol of the archetype and then as you continue on with that archetype, that's, something that we can all do. We can make that shift. We can start thinking that way. But, as you continue on your journey with this or any archetype, you start to enter what Carolyn Myss calls the cosmic level of consciousness. And the cosmic consciousness is where the divine part of the archetype comes to meet us in our efforts to try to think better, do better, right? She calls that when we try to do better, we try to change our thoughts, deliberately change something in their life. She calls that the Kairos level of consciousness. So through our efforts, we do a little bit better. It's like we give the divine permission to come into our lives through our efforts and the divine will bestow on us something better than we can imagine. So with the victim archetype, it becomes the light side of the victim is called the guardian of self esteem. And when you can stand in your self esteem, you can hold up one hand as a boundary and saying, I will not allow, whether it's your own thoughts or whether it's something coming towards you that you prefer not to have in your life, you can be strong and confident that you're allowed to say that you have permission to say that. And yet your other hand is turned upward like a cup and it is filled to overflowing with compassion. So you're not saying I will not allow as a boundary that's firm and angry. You're saying it with I'm not going to allow myself to be harmed, and I'm going to also offer compassion because I have the bigger perspective of where everyone else is coming from, and of their survival archetypes, and the ancestry that they have, and all of the traumas that have preceded them into this lifetime. I'm going to see it all and offer my compassion and love. So it goes from I'm not allowed to have good things and it's everyone else's fault to this beautiful trajectory of a divine compassionate being completely confident in herself to what can I offer the world with the love coming from my heart. You see how beautiful that is. And that's just one archetype. That's just one.

PMD: 17:53

I'm a great fan of Carolyn Myss's work. And it's clear that amidst the turbulence of these challenges and triumphs you experienced a profound epiphany with the rising realization that your true purpose lay in guiding others towards self discovery and empowerment. And it was possibly at that moment of clarity that propelled you towards you becoming an archetypal consultant where you found your truest expression of self and your deepest sense of fulfillment. Can you share a pivotal moment of clarity or realization that solidified your commitment to becoming an archetypal consultant?

CW: 18:38

I think learning about that one particular archetype, the victim archetype and its trajectory, and then embodying it and playing it out in my own life. So I took those three levels of the victim in the shadow and then the Kairos level of coming into more power on my own. And then the cosmic level, I took that and it took about a year of my truly working with just that one archetype to empower myself enough to leave my unhappy marriage. It doesn't seem like such a big deal now. People leave unhappy marriages all the time, right? It was one of the biggest things I didn't have the courage to do for so many years and just to develop the courage through cultivating my own sense of boundaries and groundedness and what I'm allowed to have in my life, what did I give myself permission to have and moving toward that and doing my very best. I didn't always get it right, but doing my very best to do it with compassion and kindness. I did not again do that perfectly. But ultimately to come to the side of how can I be the truest form of myself without selling myself out, without compromising myself too much and providing a life that I envisioned for myself and for my children in a way that made sense, in a way that was just a better way of living, a better life for ourselves, that I could actually create that. And I think through that trajectory, I could see how I might be able to be of help or service to other people who felt stuck in situations in their lives and really could use some universal truths to help them get unstuck and claim more of what's true for them.

PMD: 20:17

It's also the very fact that it's not only courage, it's being brave as well. It's having that bravery to be able to make that decision. How has your whole journey of self discovery and your personal growth? How's that influenced your approach to guiding others?

CW: 20:36

Archetypes are impersonal and also deeply personal. That's a quote from Carolyn. So I am someone who believes that everyone has an inner guru, right? I am not here to necessarily impart wisdom on people. Yes. I've studied the archetypes. I understand how they look through the different levels of consciousness, and I can speak to that. But when someone comes to me, I'm listening. I think more than I am telling. I'm listening to what they're saying. I'm listening to their words. And I can hear in their words which survival archetype is most present. Then I check in with them. I say, Oh for example, this is the prostitute archetype, which I've renamed the negotiator archetype because more people resonate with the word negotiator than prostitute. Someone with the negotiator archetype tends to be so fearful of someone's reaction to them that they keep their mouth shut, or they don't say what's true for them, they don't name their preferences, because they're afraid of some kind of fallout, if they do, which is understandable, I've been there. So if I'm hearing language. I am able to speak to the archetype that I'm hearing and I add a little bit more and I add a little bit more because I know these archetypes so well at this point and often people just the looks on their faces. They're like, yes, that's exactly that speaks to my experience and I can be confident that it can because these are universal archetypes. They touch every human's life. So through that, I think what if it could be that you took that one situation that you just discussed and said, Oh, yes, that resonates with me. And we shifted it over to this higher level of consciousness, this archetype in the Kairos. What if we employed some of those tactics and people think either well, that would be way too scary. I could never do that. And then we work with that for a little bit or yes, that seems like just the right next step. And then that's how I work with people. We think what's the next step? Okay, you're in this like stuck place or living in fear. How can we get to the point where you can trust yourself enough? What if we put trust out ahead of the situation and you could walk into the situation knowing that trust was leading the way instead of fear? How would that feel different? What if we tried that on even just for a few minutes? How would you approach the situation if you knew that you could trust yourself, and if something, say, a relationship did rupture because you were speaking your truth, just suppose it did, what if you could trust yourself that you had the capacity to figure it out? Clear out a response that was meaningful to you. What if you did lose some kind of social support in one area? What if you could create a different kind of support for yourself in a way that was better than what you have now? And then you can move forward that way. And we can think about all the ways that might look and then people start to realize, oh, there is some movement here. There's some movement. We can take a deep breath and think about options.

PMD: 23:32

Many people live in fear and in societal terms it's like below the line, there is suspicion and antagonism, whether it's outwardly or inwardly and above the line is trust and openness. And it's moving, people towards to being above the line rather than below the line. When we meet somebody even in our subconscious it's there's a narrative that says, what do they want? What do they want from me? Is there an agenda? There's all these noises of concern that go on until we establish trust and willingness and openness to trust our inner community, to trust our inner tuition. But we also need guidance, we need guidance to be able to access that part of us that has been so superimposed with blind paradigms of conditioning. I think the work you're doing is beautiful and I want to explore with you your journey of transitioning from a therapist to an archetypal consultant, and I want to understand more about your previous experiences, and how that informs your approach to this work, and what unique insights or perspectives do you believe archetypal consulting offers compared to traditional therapeutic modalities?

CW: 24:57

Yeah traditional therapeutic modalities, and someone might have a differing opinion than I do, but what I have found is true for me and my work is that often therapy is good and important and necessary and has helped many people many times over, including myself. A lot of times you're looking at past traumas trying to make sense of what happened in your past, trying to figure out why that there's a symptom that's present now, why there's anxiety, why there's depression. And you're going back into the past, maybe you're doing some trauma work, maybe you're changing some stories. People are able to tell their stories that they've never told anyone and they need a companion as they tell some stories. Very pivotal, important work. What I see in terms of archetypal consulting is the shadow side of archetypes we call Kronos. We call the Kronos. So when you're living in some kind of default mode, before you're bringing consciousness to what you're doing, you're in the Kronos level of consciousness. So we can think about that in terms of a depression or I'm living with too much depression or I'm living with too many feelings of anxiety or my relationships keep falling apart and what our type of consulting does is we name the archetypes the person actually themselves names their own archetypes and I provide them with how to do that right and then we look at the shadow sides of the archetypes and we think well where might these problems be stemming from? Which archetype is present? If your relationships keep falling apart maybe you have the bully archetype and the bullying archetype might be plowing over people. And if that happens to be one of that person's archetypes, they can see it maybe for the first time in terms of the symbolic perspective. And then we can think, okay. No shame you have this archetype or the addict archetype for example, it keeps tripping people up and tripping people up. But what's the trajectory of this archetype to move into a higher level of consciousness? And then you've got a path laid in front of you. It doesn't have to necessarily even come from the person. Yes, it should come from the person, but oh, you've got the addict archetype. Okay, I see that you do that. You like to sow chaos, or maybe you don't like to, but that's what happens. You sow chaos and you're wanting the high before you do the inner work. Okay that's the shadow pattern. But what about if you started to take control of your life and you started to think about what do I need to do to self regulate? What if some of the work that I needed to do, the inner work that I'm running from actually is going to hold the ultimate high for me and not this, it's not like a get rich quick scheme, I'm not trying to get there so fast, what if there's actually inner work involved here and that once you start to learn the joy and empowerment of self regulation, then you can reach back and hold the hands of the people who were still struggling and pull them along with you because you've walked the walk, you've talked the talk, you're walking in humility because you've been there. You're not here to judge anyone. You're actually here to offer people absolution for their own where they fall short. So the archetype has this like hope if they can see the trajectory of the addict archetype. This is just one example. They can see the trajectory then they're like, Oh, I could actually create that for myself. What is my individual personal path that I could take to create a higher level consciousness of this one particular archetype, not getting rid of the archetype, but moving through consciousness for it. That's where I see archetypal consulting being different. It provides a trajectory for how to up level the archetypes that we already have. We're not trying to change anyone's archetypes. We're helping them to live in a different version of them so that they can live a much happier, more profound life and then turn around and help other people who haven't quite gotten there yet, who need their help.

PMD: 28:44

It seems to me that you don't merely observe, you facilitate an active transformation through this process and through guided exploration of these archetypal patterns, you're empowering your clients to make conscious choices, to break free from those limiting beliefs and manifest lives filled with confidence and joy and fulfillment. How do you guide your clients in identifying and understanding their personal archetypes? Are there any particular techniques or exercises that you find most effective in this process?

CW: 29:24

No, I provide them with a list of about 72 archetypes. And of course, that's not a comprehensive list. There are hundreds of different archetypes. But what I find is that I don't have to work too hard to get people to identify their own personal archetypes. What I find is that people love this. People want to know about themselves. People want to understand themselves more. So if they come to me for archetypal consulting and I say, all right, you've got 12 personal archetypes that we're going to work through in this process. Here's your list. I'm going to give you a week. We'll come back in a week and look at the the ones that resonate with you. And they come back with a list of 25 and say, Oh, I think this might be me. And I think this is like me. And I think this is like me. And they're really enthusiastic because there's a validation there. There's a validation of, oh, this is why I've always felt the way I felt. I'm not crazy. I'm not weird. I just happen to have this particular archetype. Oh, it all makes sense now. And there's, even just having people go through and choosing their archetypes that resonate with them, that creates healing in itself. People are generally very happy to do that. There's not much I need to do. And because I understand the archetypes and the qualities that they have in the shadow and the light, then we talk about that a little bit more and then sometimes it's really hard for people to whittle it all down. We're only looking at 12 here when we're doing the actual archetypal consulting. And sometimes they feel some kind of grief at having to give up one that they really want it. And that's still there. We all can tap into any of the archetypes if we try, but when we really solidify their 12 and work with just those 12 over the course of some time it's like a relief to people to finally, to do that. It's not pulling teeth at all. There's a hopefulness and eagerness.

PMD: 31:10

And it gives them definition because people need definition in order not to feel insecure and when they get that, when they can define it, then they can, look at the predictability of that archetype, because they understand more of the characteristics of it. Can you share a specific case study or success story from your work as an archetypal consultant, highlighting the transformative power of this approach.

CW: 31:40

There's so many. I didn't say that. My goodness. There's just so many. Anything springs to mind? Yeah. I'm just thinking right now of a lovely woman that I work with who had some deep pain in her relationship with her mother, with her family of origin. So when I do archetypal consulting with people, we work with something called the archetypal wheel. And when we work with the archetypal wheel it's very similar to the astrological wheel. It's the same. I don't know if you're familiar with the astrological wheel has 12 different houses. And so the archetypal wheel has these 12 different houses, and these are the same for everyone. If you're doing astrology, they're different for everyone. They fall in different places. For the archetypal wheel, they're the same for everyone. And so when we're doing archetypal consulting, we notice what's in your fourth house, which is your house of home, house of the mother, the seat of your emotional development. And whatever is in that particular house has a great deal to do with how safe you're going to feel moving forward, becoming the adult, stepping into your powers as an adult and the woman I'm certainly thinking about just did some really deep, beautiful healing work. So she has the orphan child archetype, which she felt from her family. She has the mother archetype, which also includes her mothering, but also the way she was mothered and she has maybe even the saboteur archetype. Like we look at the House Oppositions, it can be a little bit complicated and so looking at the constellation of her archetypes, she decided that she was going to not only create space in her life for forgiveness of her mother, which is huge and courageous in itself, but she was so deep about her work and she had an artist archetype also that she was going to put this into writing. Because she sees how they all interconnect, so she was going to use her artist archetype to create some profound pieces of writing around the issues of emotional safety and mothering and how she was mothered. And the work that she came up with, she would start and then every session was saying, Oh, I did some more writing. Let me read it to you. And I was just blown away by the depth that was her springboard was the archetypes, but she was mining the depth of her own beautiful talents and skills and gifts and she's gone on to publish several pieces of work now because of the depth, the springboard, these archetypes provided for her. Even just her thinking about her own saboteur archetype and with the saboteur archetype, once you get out of the shadow of sabotaging yourself and getting the way of trying to, create the goals that you've set for yourself. The saboteur becomes this beautiful energy that supports your continual development and your continual sense of becoming. And you do this through the choices that you make. This endless becoming because once we stop blocking ourselves by sabotaging ourselves, then the possibilities can be endless. And then once you create the next goal, then you can do a little bit more work and stop blocking yourself again and go to the next goal. So there's this endless becoming when you're really working with the saboteur all the way through his trajectory from shadow to light and I just saw this woman take this work so seriously and create these beautiful profound pieces of writing that are now like actually out there and published journals and magazines and helping everyone else to open their eyes to some of these, the depth that this can provide. It's very deep work. It doesn't have to be. I don't want to scare people away. You don't have to take it to that level of depth, but I think that there's no end to the depth that people could create. With this work.

PMD: 35:19

That must be so satisfying for you as well in the work that you do because obviously the ripple effect of the work that you do has impacted someone else's life and then that continues, which is a beautiful thing.

CW: 35:32

It's jaw dropping sometimes. Yeah. Yeah. amazed people take this and run with it and their own beautiful gifts and talents take it to a place that I would have never thought that they would have gone.

PMD: 35:42

That's the beauty of it because it adds doesn't it to the body of work and it refines things and because everybody has a different energetic signature and different archetypes revolving around in their subconscious Can you share some of the personal challenges that you encountered on your journey, particularly those related to your own archetypal patterns. How did you navigate through those challenges and what role did your understanding of archetypes play in overcoming them?

CW: 36:15

Often when we're in the shadow side of our archetypes, we don't even realize that we are, we don't know that we are. Sometimes you can do this work on your own, but I have a group of dear friends. We meet every Tuesday night. There were all archetypal consultants and we work through different archetypes. Sometimes we talk about ourselves, sometimes we don't, but when we do get personal and we talk about our own problems, other people can see. where we're in the shadow. And this group has helped me tremendously because, when you're in the shadow, you're blind to what you, and there are people who courageously can call us out on our different stuff. One thing that I noticed for example, I have the sage archetype, cause I'm the stout of wisdom, right which I'm saying facetiously, but I have the sage archetype. People have always come to me since I was young. My friends will come to me with their problems in elementary school. I've always been this person that people with problems will come to because they needed help. They needed support. So I feel like I could claim that archetype and then I became a therapist. So people were like coming to me and saying, I have all this problem. So what I notice or what I wasn't noticing is that sometimes in the shadow, I can come across as a know it all, and I can come across as someone who thinks they might have the answer, and I can talk a good game, and I can talk about emotions, but I can really make people feel bad for maybe not knowing as much as I do, or for hurting me in some way. I'm able to use my skill and the way I speak to make it seem like they're wrong and I'm right and I can make people feel terribly guilty in the shadow, before I even realize what's happening. And I needed someone to show me that pattern that I have a tendency to do that sometimes. Not always, but it's there. I asked my ex husband, is that there? Yeah, that's there. So when I became aware of what the sage in the shadow can look like, especially in the seventh house of the archetypal wheel, which is where mine is. Seventh house is about one on one relationships. And my sage is right there, which is really helpful as a therapist, but it also has its shadow side too. And so I have to really be careful. that my sage doesn't fall into the shadow, then I'm here just for support and help and compassion and not because I know anything more than anyone else and to use my gift well the way it was intended. So maybe that speaks to answering your question about how some of my own work to improve my life and my relationships with others.

PMD: 38:44

If you don't have the right type of guidance, it's very easy to blur the lines between facilitation and manipulation because one will take you into either blame and avoidance or truth and responsibility and they live on the same line. It just depends which camp do you want to be in. You need an awakened awareness and the understanding of the knowledge and the practical toolkits of understanding to be able to discern those lines. Thinking about your your journey. How do you envision the future of archetypal consulting? How do you see it continuing to impact the lives of those you serve?

CW: 39:26

You mean individually or more collectively?

PMD: 39:29

Both

CW: 39:29

Right now my work is mostly one on one. I do one on one with people. I am interested and I've, there, I have a list of people who are also interested of my starting a group of people who work with me some already and there are groups I'm thinking about in my head that I haven't created yet. And I think that once I create groups of people who are interested in this work, there'll be different tiers. There'll be people who are new to this work, wanting to learn it in a group, but then there'll be people who've gone through my signature program and really have an idea of how their archetypes are functioning in their lives. And I'm thinking that we can create communities of people who can have exactly what I have. I'm so blessed to have my archetypal friends that kind of became a fluke how we all came together. That's a whole different story. But to provide a space for that, like they've been so pivotal for me and my growth. And I know that the rest of them could say the same for themselves, that maybe I could create something like this for other people who already have the knowledge and the expertise who just want to deepen and further and learn more and We're all the experts, there's not just one expert, leading the group where everyone can be there, be a pivotal piece of everyone's learning. And they can step into lifting others up and being open to being called out on some of their shadow, because that's part of the work. So it's humility and some humility and genius can really be so pivotal when we're talking about Using this work to support ourselves and others, making the world a better place, better for our families, our communities, our workplaces, bringing our ideas into fruition, the good ideas that we have. How do we use our archetypes to bring our ideas into the collective? It's just fascinating.

PMD: 41:15

and helping others to light up their own darkness. If they want to. If they want to.

CW: 41:21

It's all optional.

PMD: 41:23

Do you have any parting words and where can people find you?

CW: 41:27

Parting words is that if we all have access to our survival archetypes in the shadow, if we all have access to places where we self sabotage, where we conduct ourselves, make decisions from fear, where we behave in immature ways sometimes where we feel like we're blaming other people for our problems. We all have access to those, then we most definitely all have access to the light sides of those things where we can step into our power. We can make the choices that align us more toward our goals. We can think about what a more mature version of a relationship might look like and support our partners to step into that. We all have access to the light sides of our archetypes as much as we have access to the shadow. So that's the passing word that I would say. And I want people to feel inspired by that, that we can create better lives for ourselves and the people that we love and the people around us. And if people want to find me, you can find me on my website at yourradiantlife. net.

PMD: 42:30

That's beautiful. What a powerful message. And in wrapping up today's episode I really want to express my deepest gratitude to you, Carolyn, for your invaluable contributions to our exploration of archetypes and personal transformation. And for me, your insights have illuminated the path towards greater self discovery and empowerment. And I'm certain listeners will find immense value in this conversation. So thank you so much, Carolyn, for your wisdom, your guidance, and your unwavering commitment to helping others live lives of true purpose and fulfillment.

CW: 43:08

Well, Peter, thank you for having this platform. Many wonderful conversations happening. Thank you for contributing to the world in this way.

PMD: 43:16

You're most welcome.