Hydrogen, Innovation and the Future of Clean Energy

In this episode of SolPods Studio, student host Caxton Conner sits down with Bill Smith, Founder and President of Infinity Fuel Cell & Hydrogen, to discuss hydrogen fuel cells, clean energy, and how technology originally developed for space exploration is helping solve sustainability challenges here on Earth. Bill shares his journey through the fuel cell industry, the inspiration behind founding Infinity, and how his team is developing advanced hydrogen energy systems for applications ranging from spacecraft and lunar missions to underwater vehicles and remote power systems.

The conversation explores the growing role of hydrogen in the clean energy transition, why fuel cells offer a reliable way to store and deliver energy with low emissions, and how innovations supported by NASA are advancing the future of sustainable power. Bill also reflects on the importance of engineering, curiosity, and perseverance, offering advice to students interested in careers in clean technology and solving some of the world's most complex energy challenges.

Perfect for listeners interested in clean energy, hydrogen technology, aerospace, engineering, sustainability, or anyone curious about how breakthrough innovations developed for space are creating solutions for life on Earth.

Visit Infinity Fuel Cell & Hydrogen's website to learn more about the company's innovative fuel cell and hydrogen technologies.

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Transcript

00:00:00:01 - 00:00:17:20
Bill
Funded by NASA, we flew our equipment twice on Blue Origin's New Shepard launch vehicles. The same type of launch vehicle that William Shatner flew on, and we contacted him, and he was very enthusiastic to help spread the word.

00:00:17:22 - 00:00:40:19
Caxton
Hi everyone, and welcome back to another episode of SolPods Studio. I'm Caxton Conner, joining you from Madison, Connecticut, as a recent graduate from the University of New Haven. Today, we're diving into the future of clean energy with a guest whose work spans from the depths of the ocean to the surface of the moon. I'm joined by Bill Smith, the founder, president and CEO of Infinity Fuel Cell and Hydrogen.

00:00:40:20 - 00:00:50:14
Caxton
Based in Windsor, Connecticut, Bill has spent decades pioneering hydrogen technology that was once exclusive to NASA and is now being brought down to Earth. Bill, thank you so much for joining us.

00:00:50:16 - 00:00:59:06
Bill
Well, thank you Caxton. I look forward to the opportunity to share what we're doing here at Infinity. I think it's a pretty exciting story and I'm delighted to be here.

00:00:59:07 - 00:01:21:15
Caxton
Yeah, I'm excited to dive in. So, Bill, you've been in the fuel cell industry for a long time, even co-founding Proton Energy Systems before starting Infinity in 2002. For our audience of college students, many of whom who are just starting to find their spark, what was it about hydrogen and PEM technology that made you want to dedicate your career to it?

00:01:21:17 - 00:01:53:10
Bill
Well, that really began when I worked at United Technologies Hamilton Standard Division in their Space and Sea Systems department. And there we were developing systems that could generate oxygen for life support aboard nuclear submarines, and were developing fuel cells that NASA could use to generate power in space. And I was very taken, especially by electrolysis, where you can take electricity, which could come from renewables and water, and then break down that water to form hydrogen and oxygen.

00:01:53:10 - 00:02:27:00
Bill
And in doing so, create a clean fuel that you could use to generate electricity or were used for other purposes, that when you used it as a fuel, created clean water, again, as a byproduct. So I was very taken with the elegance of that reaction, the elegance of that technology and, you know, got hooked on it, began working on it then at United Technologies and then formed another commercial company, co-founded Proton Energy Systems, where we continued to do that commercially.

00:02:27:01 - 00:02:54:00
Caxton
Yeah, it's such an amazing process. Being able to create such clean energy just from water or oxygen, it's pretty cool. So Infinity's technology is often described as NASA technology brought down to Earth. And you recently achieved a major milestone, a 2600 hour NASA lunar fuel cell test. Can you explain for us non engineers what makes a space grade fuel cell different from what we might see in a car?

00:02:54:00 - 00:02:58:03
Caxton
And why is the moon such a critical testing ground for energy tech?

00:02:58:05 - 00:03:19:23
Bill
Sure, be glad to. Well first of all for use in space, there are several key factors that set any kind of a fuel cell apart for that application. First of all, a typical fuel cell used in a car runs on oxygen from the air because you're surrounded by air, makes sense. In space, of course, there is no air.

00:03:20:00 - 00:03:51:05
Bill
There is no oxygen. So that technology has to use pure hydrogen and pure oxygen in order to generate electricity. And you have to provide that. That means you take special design care when you're building those fuel cells to make sure they're compatible with pure oxygen. Another point is, if you're going to be operating in space in zero gravity, you have to be able to separate that water that I talked about earlier, the water that you make in the fuel cell reaction.

00:03:51:06 - 00:04:10:09
Bill
You have to be able to do that as the reaction is occurring, and you have to do it in zero gravity. And so you end up with a two phase separation problem in space. And that's a very common problem to NASA and one that they're always working to solve. We solve it with a special patented technology inside of each one of our fuel cell cells.

00:04:10:11 - 00:04:37:09
Bill
And thirdly, you have to operate in what's called a thermal vacuum. You have to operate in space in a pure vacuum and be able to survive, in the case of a lunar surface application, survive a two week long lunar night at -285°F. So it's a very, very, very severe environment. But that's what we're designing for. And our fuel cells, that's what sets our fuel cells apart.

00:04:37:10 - 00:04:55:01
Bill
You couldn't do this with a typical terrestrial fuel cell. It wouldn't operate on pure oxygen. It wouldn't operate in zero gravity. And good luck with -285 degrees for two weeks. So that's what we're focused on is that kind of technology that can be that rugged. And if we can do it there, we can really do it anywhere.

00:04:55:01 - 00:05:03:20
Bill
That's the technology that we can simplify and bring down to earth for its own very severe applications, but for wider applications as well as we commercialize it.

00:05:03:21 - 00:05:23:18
Caxton
Right. Yeah. So kind of jumping off of that, like you kind of already mentioned, it's not just about space what you guys are doing. Infinity is also working on uncrewed underwater vehicles. So how does a fuel cell design for the vacuum of space then translate to the high pressure environment of the deep ocean, and what are the parallels there?

00:05:23:20 - 00:05:51:00
Bill
Well, there are some differences, some parallels. The first parallel, though, is you're also working in an air independent environment. So everything you learn about operating with pure oxygen and pure hydrogen for space applies directly underwater, because there you run on pure oxygen as well. There is, obviously, no air down there that you could use. Also, thermally, the way you remove heat is very similar in both applications.

00:05:51:01 - 00:06:13:20
Bill
The fuel cell produces byproduct heat, and we typically have active cooling of that, that can then reject the heat either to space, in the case of a space fuel cell using a space radiator, or in the case of an underwater vehicle to the surrounding ocean. Now a difference, though, is you do have to survive the depths of the ocean.

00:06:13:20 - 00:06:41:00
Bill
And typically what's done is our fuel cell devices are placed in pressure containers that can be filled with nitrogen that are designed to withstand the very high pressure, so that allows it to survive in those environments. And then you have to do other little things, like you have to be able to make it run completely autonomously so the vehicles that we are going into are autonomous underwater vehicles.

00:06:41:00 - 00:07:10:01
Bill
They can go on missions of thousands of miles without any external input. So our fuel cells have to be able to communicate with the vessel and be able to survive in those environments and do the right thing at the right time. And along those lines, we just achieved an extremely important milestone. Our fuel cells operating in a Cellula Envoy vehicle, and Cellula is a partner of ours for underwater vehicles,

00:07:10:01 - 00:07:36:15
Bill
Just achieved continuous operation 40m underwater for 2000km over 1200 miles running on our fuel cells, using our fuel cells as primary propulsion. And so in doing that, we're running on hydrogen and oxygen, which could be made from electrolysis of water for that entire duration operating on our fuel cells, and their customers were very impressed with that.

00:07:36:15 - 00:07:42:06
Bill
And that's leading to continued work for our fuel cells and our business.

00:07:42:07 - 00:08:00:23
Caxton
Yeah, that's an amazing achievement. Yeah. So kind of as we were just talking about. So your guys' work, it really touches both space and sea. Two extremes of exploration. And so looking ahead, where do you see hydrogen technology having the biggest impact here on Earth in the next decade?

00:08:01:00 - 00:08:24:17
Bill
Well, you know, probably people don't really understand how much hydrogen touches their lives every single day. And I know for a fact everybody here in this planet is touched by that in some fashion. You may not think of it that way, though. But if you eat food, hydrogen is a key component of ammonia, which is a key component that's used in the manufacture of fertilizers.

00:08:24:17 - 00:08:51:16
Bill
If you drive a car, the steel in that car, the fuel in that car are touched by hydrogen in their manufacturing processes. The same with concrete and many other products. So hydrogen is a widely used commodity as it is and not just used for transportation fuel, but used for as a very, very critical, important and widespread feedstock for many industrial processes.

00:08:51:16 - 00:09:22:14
Bill
So as hydrogen moves ahead that is generated from renewable energy, we call that hydrogen green hydrogen. As green hydrogen is widely deployed, you can help decarbonize these major industries that really touch all of us and lead to improved climate change situations, reduce decarbonization of many industries. So I think that's a long term vision that can be very important to everyone in the future.

00:09:22:18 - 00:09:42:17
Caxton
Yeah, it's really fascinating to learn about how much hydrogen is a part of our daily lives, because I didn't really realize it until I learned a lot more about it. So it's really interesting to see how much it does impact our lives on a day to day basis. So I did see on your website that William Shatner is a brand ambassador for Infinity.

00:09:44:16 - 00:09:59:02
Caxton
And he's spoken about this silent revolution of renewable energy. So as someone who has been in the trenches of this revolution for 20 years, do you feel like we've finally hit a tipping point where hydrogen is ready for the mainstream?

00:09:59:04 - 00:10:27:23
Bill
I think we're getting very close to it, but first, a word about William Shatner and how we came to be in contact with him. As part of the demonstration of our technology to NASA, we were required to demonstrate or could operate in actual zero gravity conditions. And so, funded by NASA, we flew our equipment twice on Blue Origin's New Shepard launch vehicles, the same type of launch vehicle that William Shatner flew on.

00:10:27:23 - 00:10:54:03
Bill
And so that gave us a natural connection to him through that set of missions. And we contacted him, and he was very enthusiastic to help spread the word. When he, and he says this, you can look it up on the internet elsewhere, but he says that he was just so impressed when he flew about looking back at Earth, how fragile the Earth is and how much we need to take care of it.

00:10:54:03 - 00:11:16:17
Bill
And that was a mission that he really took to heart. And along those lines, he could recognize how hydrogen can help with decarbonization and wanted to do what he could to help. And so he's been our brand ambassador, and he is also an option holder in the company. So it's kind of cool to be working with Captain Kirk.

00:11:16:19 - 00:11:44:15
Bill
But to your question about the tipping point, I believe we are getting very close to it. There has been, under some administrations, more support than under others from this country, but that support has helped move the technology way ahead. There's companies that have, here in the United States, received billions of dollars worth of investment over time to advance the technology, and we've received considerable support from the US government as well.

00:11:44:17 - 00:12:13:23
Bill
And that support, that investment is bearing fruit. You have large companies that are generating, that are building large electrolyzers that generate green hydrogen, and that's good. But other countries around the world are doing even more now. China, which is famous for commercializing solar and commercializing wind and reducing the cost of those technologies, is now doing the same with hydrogen related technologies, fuel cells and electrolyzers.

00:12:14:01 - 00:12:44:12 t
Bill
So I can see that, just like they did with solar and wind, that the Chinese could lead the way on getting through that tipping point and really breaking free the commercialization of hydrogen technologies. And I hope that, you know, we can follow right along or side by side with Chinese technologies and Chinese markets. But it's not a bad thing that somebody at least is advancing the technology to make it even more widely spread.

00:12:44:12 - 00:13:08:14
Bill
And we have our own role to play in our markets. In fact, one of the things that we can do with our systems is we can combine fuel cells and electrolyzers to build what's called a regenerative fuel cell, which you can use as an energy storage system. So it's very compatible with renewables. If you want to store days or weeks or even months of energy, hydrogen can be a preferred way to do that.

00:13:08:14 - 00:13:24:11
Bill
That would allow you to use renewables in places where you thought you couldn't do it before. So I think we're getting very close to that tipping point. And you watch in the next coming years, we're going to start to see extremely widespread use of green hydrogen.

00:13:24:12 - 00:13:43:12
Caxton
Yeah, that's honestly really exciting. Definitely have to stay updated on, you know, what the US is doing, what other parts of the world are doing. It's really great how everybody is trying to have this shared common goal of just, you know, really making the world a greener place with more green energy. So you've led teams through decades of innovation.

00:13:43:12 - 00:13:52:00
Caxton
What has been the biggest leadership lesson from building technology that's always ahead of its time?

00:13:52:02 - 00:14:03:03
Bill
Darn ahead of our time. It is. That does happen though. I think the biggest, some of the biggest lessons I've taken away from that relate to

00:14:03:05 - 00:14:29:22
Bill
Being able to communicate, and this is where communication is extraordinarily important, how long term some of these activities can be, while inspiring people in the short term. And this is especially important with investors. Investors have different motivations. Some of them, some venture capitalists want to come in and get out within a few years. And that doesn't really suit a long term technology like this.

00:14:29:22 - 00:14:57:18
Bill
Others can be very dedicated to supporting a technology vision for many years, but you also need the company leadership to be prepared to balance those factors, keep the vision alive, inspire the company, inspire the workers, and inspire the investors to stay with it and actually make real progress too. But it takes time. We're not, you know, developing software code.

00:14:57:18 - 00:15:23:23
Bill
We're developing real hardware that is subject to the laws of physics, and the laws of physics sometimes can be tough to follow. But follow them, we do, and we're making a lot of progress there. But I'd say that's it, it is dedication to the long term vision and communication of the long term vision for both the workers, the market, and investors, and it pays off.

00:15:24:01 - 00:15:47:03
Bill
You know, there's companies like Bloom Energy that I'm quite familiar with. They work on a different type of fuel cell technology, a solid oxide fuel cell technology. And they were founded over 20 years ago and had over $1 billion worth of investment from major venture capital providers like Kleiner Perkins. And, you know, they had done quite well up until last year.

00:15:47:03 - 00:16:22:02
Bill
And then starting last year, they started to do phenomenally well, working on, in this case, a natural gas powered fuel cell, not pure hydrogen, but it allows you to generate large amounts of power for, guess what, data centers. So they are part of the data center revolution right now and making a tremendous impact. And that one of the benefits of a natural gas fuel cell compared to using diesel generation or gas turbine generation, is you can operate on natural gas.

00:16:22:02 - 00:16:52:10
Bill
You can get much more efficient than those other processes. And so it does its own part to help with decarbonization. Not as quite as far as pure hydrogen, but a lot better than other technologies. But that's a long term vision. That's over 20 years to get to that point, to be an overnight success. So it's that long term vision for the actual product, for the teams that you're working with and for the investors.

00:16:52:12 - 00:16:57:13
Bill
So that's what we try to do here to keep that balance as we go forward.

00:16:57:14 - 00:17:20:20
Caxton
Yeah. And speaking of that future vision, a lot of our listeners here are engineering policy or environmental science students, and they really want to work on projects that matter and make a difference. So what are the most important skills, both technical and soft skills, that you look for when hiring the next generation of innovators at Infinity?

00:17:20:22 - 00:17:42:19
Bill
I think really, you know, all of the areas that you just mentioned, we touch on. Obviously in the near term while developing the hardware technology, the science and engineering is emphasized. We need something that we're building, but it's just as important, again, to communicate the vision. Why is that hardware important? Where is it going to go? How is it going to get there?

00:17:42:20 - 00:18:10:12
Bill
And so communication is hugely important. And then on the manufacturing side, being able to build it is extremely important. It comes a little bit later in the cycle than the design and engineering. And then the financial side of it is always critical. So being able to have access to capital when you need it, being able to communicate with investors, to be able to sustain the capital needed to support the vision is extremely important.

00:18:10:12 - 00:18:28:21
Bill
So you named it. It's from science and engineering to operations to communications to finance. You know, all of that is extremely important. And people that are interested in this area, I'm sure will find a fair amount of opportunities in each one of them.

00:18:28:22 - 00:18:52:15
Caxton
Right? Yeah. It's cool to see how many different majors and different career paths there are that can all kind of lead around that same theme of sustainability and green energy. So that's a really cool point. So we do like to wrap up every episode with a little bit of fun. So our question for you is if you could have one sustainability superpower, what would it be and why?

00:18:52:16 - 00:19:20:11
Bill
Well, probably not surprisingly, the sustainability superpower I would like to have would be to have wide implementation of green hydrogen and to be able to help decarbonize the world, to be able to help reduce our dependence on fossil fuels that have to pass through such things as the Strait of Hormuz, and to provide a sustainable energy future for generations to come.

00:19:20:11 - 00:19:25:12
Bill
And I guess that would be the superpower. Just make this happen and make it happen faster. 

00:19:25:13 - 00:19:47:18
Caxton
Yes, that's a perfect answer. Well, Bill, thank you so much for sharing your journey from the moon to the deep sea. It's inspiring to see how a vision from 2002 is now pioneering the next generation of exploration. To learn more about Bill and his team's work, you can visit InfinityFuel.com. Thank you so much again, Bill, for joining us.

00:19:47:20 - 00:19:49:07
Bill
Okay. Thank you Caxton.

00:19:49:08 - 00:19:58:15
Caxton 
And to our listeners, thank you so much for tuning in. We'll see you in the next episodes of SolPods Studio. Don't forget to follow us on social and check out the links in the show notes.